| 00:01.53 | TCMAN | 2.4.22 isnt going to be out for couple years :) |
| 00:02.34 | George- | TCMAN: bah. |
| 00:02.37 | George- | Linux titanium 2.4.22-pre4-ben0 #1 Sun Jul 13 00:31:05 BST 2003 ppc 7450, altivec supported GNU/Linux |
| 00:02.38 | George- | :) |
| 00:02.46 | George- | I'm on 2.4.22 :) |
| 00:03.11 | TCMAN | George-: yeah, right, but remember how much it took 2.4.20 -> 21 :) |
| 00:03.21 | George- | and? |
| 00:03.22 | George- | :P |
| 00:04.06 | TCMAN | George-: so .22 isnt going to be soon :) |
| 00:04.18 | George- | you never know :P |
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| 00:04.45 | treke | .20 was 4 months after .19. .21 was 6 months after .20 :) |
| 00:05.08 | fliplap | you'll see more action on 2.6.0pre |
| 00:05.19 | George- | so .22 will be 8 months after .21 :) |
| 00:06.04 | fliplap | or 9 months, can't really establish a pattern from 2 values |
| 00:07.47 | George- | fliplap: yeh, it might be + 1/2 |
| 00:09.41 | George- | ibot buildroot |
| 00:09.42 | | i guess buildroot is a cool system for building embedded root file systems and can be found at http://uclibc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/buildroot/ or a heavily modified version used by the OpenZaurus project, or see oz buildroot |
| 00:09.50 | George- | ibot oz buildroot |
| 00:09.50 | | well, oz bk is bk clone bk://openzaurus.bkbits.net/buildroot buildroot-oz; cd buildroot-oz; bk -r co -q; cp def-configs/collie-opie .config (for zaurus 5000d/5500) .. make oldconfig; make; or see bitkeeper (free download but non-gpl) or see 'oz snapshot' if you either cannot or will not use bitkeeper. |
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| 00:14.40 | testingnickchang | well then |
| 00:14.47 | George- | testingnickchang: you suck |
| 00:15.17 | George- | ibot sucks |
| 00:15.18 | | If you got $5 I'll do more than that! |
| 00:15.24 | George- | grr |
| 00:15.27 | George- | fucking whore. |
| 00:16.26 | fliplap | ok, hmm |
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| 00:26.16 | fliplap | mmm, i love indian food |
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| 00:26.28 | fliplap | i bet George- does too |
| 00:27.18 | George- | I hate the stuff |
| 00:27.25 | ljp | George-: you wouldnt know what to do with buildroot if it hit you in th eface |
| 00:27.35 | George- | ljp: bastard |
| 00:27.38 | ljp | :) |
| 00:28.36 | fliplap | George-: dude, you live in england, there's cheap, yummy indian food all over the place there |
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| 00:46.03 | fliplap | that snes9x port is sweet, not really useable until it supports rotation |
| 00:46.41 | fliplap | it only runs at "full speed" because its dropping so many frames tho, thats rough in some games where 3 missed frames means you missed something :-) |
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| 02:01.14 | *** mode/#zaurus [+o kergoth] by ChanServ |
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| 02:50.36 | Pend-Gone | kergoth would you consider the c760 the best device to get to put OZ on? |
| 02:50.52 | Pend-Gone | or does a tablet system have better hardware |
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| 02:54.51 | fliplap | i didn't know the 760 was supported |
| 02:55.12 | kergoth | oz works on the c760 |
| 02:55.20 | kergoth | no releases have been made that include it as of yet |
| 02:55.33 | Pendalar | I'm really wondering if I should get a c760 or a tablet |
| 02:58.09 | fishy | Pendalar: tablet :D |
| 02:58.17 | fishy | you already have a PDA |
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| 03:01.36 | Pendalar | ye but I could have a better pda |
| 03:01.52 | Pendalar | which I would use more I think |
| 03:01.58 | Pendalar | because at home I have 2 pc's |
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| 03:10.00 | Pendalar | a simpad wouldn't be as fast as a c760 |
| 03:10.03 | TCMAN | and i havent touched it for like 1.5 years :) |
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| 03:14.59 | MobileZIM | hy |
| 03:23.00 | MobileZIM | lots of fun |
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| 04:18.24 | fliplap | man taking aprt the Z is no easy task |
| 04:18.43 | W8TVI | are you taking pictures? |
| 04:19.21 | treke|ho1e | nah |
| 04:19.25 | treke|ho1e | taking the Z apart is easy |
| 04:19.35 | fliplap | the lefdt side comes apart |
| 04:19.38 | fliplap | left rather |
| 04:19.41 | treke|ho1e | it's taking it apart in a manner that will let you put a working z back together that's hard |
| 04:19.48 | fliplap | but the right is proving more difficult |
| 04:20.13 | fliplap | treke|ho1e: the tip of my stylus broke off and is lodged in the silo |
| 04:21.26 | fliplap | the right side wont even budge, tho all the screws i've found are out, including under the battery |
| 04:23.19 | fliplap | has anyone posted a guide? |
| 04:26.09 | W8TVI | fliplap, did you take the one out in the hole next to the battery? |
| 04:26.24 | fliplap | yes |
| 04:26.30 | fliplap | and the one under the keyboard |
| 04:26.33 | W8TVI | brb |
| 04:28.55 | W8TVI | FYI: there are no screws IN the silo |
| 04:29.25 | fliplap | but it is 2 pieces yes? |
| 04:30.02 | W8TVI | think so... |
| 04:30.20 | fliplap | i must be missing a screw somewhere |
| 04:30.43 | W8TVI | there is a little tab/button at the bottom the hold the stylus in |
| 04:31.07 | W8TVI | I have a fiberlight guide for my minimag |
| 04:31.21 | fliplap | ? |
| 04:32.01 | W8TVI | a fiberoptic light guide for my minimag flahlight |
| 04:32.16 | W8TVI | goes on the end of the flashlight |
| 04:32.35 | fliplap | yea, but what tab? |
| 04:32.46 | W8TVI | took the two screws off the top? |
| 04:33.03 | fliplap | yeah |
| 04:33.12 | W8TVI | theres a tab in the silo to hold the bottm of the stylus |
| 04:34.08 | W8TVI | you took the keyboard off? |
| 04:34.23 | fliplap | yeah |
| 04:34.55 | W8TVI | you check in the cf and sd card slots? |
| 04:35.24 | W8TVI | and took the one out next to the ir port? |
| 04:35.39 | fliplap | i didn't see any |
| 04:36.21 | W8TVI | hmmm |
| 04:40.33 | W8TVI | I just can see anything else.... |
| 04:41.13 | W8TVI | do you have a flat blade VERY small screwdriver? |
| 04:41.30 | W8TVI | cant see anything else... |
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| 04:43.51 | *** mode/#zaurus [+o NeoTron] by ChanServ |
| 04:44.57 | fliplap | W8TVI: yes, i do have a couple of very small screw drivers |
| 04:45.44 | W8TVI | you could try to pry carefuly at the seam |
| 04:45.56 | fliplap | tried it |
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| 05:00.34 | fliplap | i guess i'll try to figure it out tomorrow |
| 05:00.45 | treke|ho1e | hehe |
| 05:00.50 | treke|ho1e | too hot to concentrate :) |
| 05:03.48 | fliplap | time for sleep, gonna go into work early tomorrow and cut out for the weekend :-) |
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| 05:08.29 | TCMAN | hi |
| 05:08.42 | TCMAN | kergoth: r u alive ? |
| 05:08.53 | kergoth | yeah |
| 05:09.35 | TCMAN | kergoth: you had something to test ? |
| 05:10.52 | kergoth | oh i needed someone to check something on a 2.4.6 collie Z wrt backlight |
| 05:10.58 | kergoth | but i already found the problem and fixed the bug |
| 05:10.58 | TCMAN | kergoth: a collie build ? |
| 05:10.59 | kergoth | :) |
| 05:11.11 | kergoth | yeah, 5500/5000d |
| 05:11.23 | kergoth | i'm fixing the remaining bugs in our 2.4.21 tree for collie |
| 05:11.50 | W8TVI | kergoth, and put in all new bugs? |
| 05:12.09 | TCMAN | cool |
| 05:12.27 | TCMAN | i volunteer for testing |
| 05:13.26 | kergoth | W8TVI: there are always bugs, just hoping any new ones are smaller than the old :) |
| 05:14.13 | W8TVI | :P |
| 05:17.13 | kergoth | TCMAN: you use irda at all? |
| 05:17.42 | TCMAN | i tried to connect to my other wince pda once and transfer a file and a contact |
| 05:17.45 | TCMAN | no go :( |
| 05:17.59 | kergoth | damn. need someone to test that eventually |
| 05:18.13 | kergoth | i could use a TS tester though |
| 05:18.20 | kergoth | my 5500's ts digitizer is busted |
| 05:18.22 | W8TVI | i only have a palm pda |
| 05:18.24 | kergoth | so i cant test |
| 05:18.49 | W8TVI | that is other than my-sl5500... |
| 05:19.00 | W8TVI | would a PC with a irport work?? |
| 05:19.23 | kergoth | probably.. i need someone who already has used a 5500 for irda before |
| 05:19.30 | kergoth | so they can sanely test 2.4.21 |
| 05:19.38 | W8TVI | heh |
| 05:19.40 | kergoth | I myself know little about irda, and have never used it on my Z |
| 05:19.49 | TCMAN | kergoth: i can try anything |
| 05:20.03 | W8TVI | Ive sent biz cards to my palm |
| 05:20.14 | kergoth | the images i'm using atm have no gui fyi, they're pure console minimal initrd.bin's |
| 05:20.25 | kergoth | let me toss the touchscreen test tools onto it and i'll upload em to experimental |
| 05:20.31 | W8TVI | ah |
| 05:20.48 | TCMAN | kergoth if you need me to test anything please just send me url |
| 05:20.51 | W8TVI | wish I had another Z |
| 05:20.51 | kergoth | opie *should* work if i apply the tslib and my keyboard patch, but i havent tested it yet |
| 05:20.54 | kergoth | k |
| 05:22.11 | W8TVI | kergoth, if you have anything that I can test on a OZ 3.2 rom, let me know |
| 05:22.34 | kergoth | not much can be tested on 3.2, other than newer versions of opie |
| 05:22.44 | kergoth | i'm currently hacking on kernel bits |
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| 05:24.58 | W8TVI | when I get back working again and I'm cought back up, i'll pick up a c7x0 and then I'll be able to test things like that... |
| 05:25.15 | W8TVI | but that ont be for HILE :( |
| 05:25.22 | W8TVI | opps |
| 05:25.35 | W8TVI | for a while |
| 05:25.35 | W8TVI | lol |
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| 07:02.41 | effy-kun | anyone know what tool burns ISOs? |
| 07:02.45 | effy-kun | in Windows, that is |
| 07:02.51 | W8TVI_ | I do... |
| 07:03.12 | W8TVI_ | let me look up the name |
| 07:03.17 | effy-kun | would you be so kind as to tell me? :) |
| 07:03.24 | sunil_ | hi |
| 07:03.43 | W8TVI_ | effy-kun, nope |
| 07:03.45 | W8TVI_ | :P |
| 07:03.47 | W8TVI_ | CDBurnerXP Pro |
| 07:03.51 | W8TVI_ | its free |
| 07:04.00 | W8TVI_ | i'll find you the url even |
| 07:04.11 | effy-kun | grrrrr |
| 07:04.12 | effy-kun | ;) |
| 07:04.15 | sunil_ | hello there |
| 07:04.27 | sunil_ | I want some help in buying a new zaurus |
| 07:04.41 | sunil_ | is it the right channel |
| 07:05.13 | sunil_ | to get advice |
| 07:05.13 | effy-kun | W8: I think I found it |
| 07:05.18 | W8TVI_ | http://w1.878.telia.com/~u87812405/ |
| 07:05.30 | effy-kun | ;) |
| 07:05.43 | effy-kun | works only on XP? hmmmmm |
| 07:06.02 | W8TVI_ | be sure to see if your drive is supported |
| 07:06.25 | W8TVI_ | you didn't say what version of windows you were using :P |
| 07:06.28 | kergoth | there are plenty of tools for burning isos. cdrwin, nero, alcohol, fireburner, etc etc |
| 07:06.41 | W8TVI_ | free? |
| 07:07.18 | effy-kun | nero? cool, I just downloaded it |
| 07:07.32 | effy-kun | ;) |
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| 08:12.24 | shanky | hi |
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| 08:25.41 | shanky | I just want to know if it's there any way of connecting a zaurus PDA via ethernet |
| 08:32.12 | yeiazel | yeah sure |
| 08:32.18 | yeiazel | CF ethernet adapters |
| 08:32.35 | shanky | let's gonna look for ot |
| 08:32.38 | shanky | thanks yeiazel |
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| 09:55.22 | rgrep | has any one got xmms to work on the C7x0? |
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| 10:16.12 | shing19m | hi |
| 10:18.18 | shing19m | <PROTECTED> |
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| 12:11.14 | George`ZZzz | brb - new kernel |
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| 13:18.29 | absentia | morn' |
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| 13:27.30 | sashz | evening |
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| 14:45.19 | smul | which toolchain to use for recompiling kernel of sharp rom 3.10 ? |
| 14:46.41 | smul | http://docs.zaurus.com/index.php?id=kernel_compile seems outdated ! |
| 14:47.02 | absentia | you think ? |
| 14:47.25 | smul | don't you ? |
| 14:47.32 | absentia | of course |
| 14:47.39 | absentia | the response is always "well, update it" |
| 14:47.49 | absentia | yup, just what we need... people who aren't experts writing documentation. |
| 14:48.05 | smul | update with ? |
| 14:48.35 | absentia | nevermind. just a general gripe against the typical open software mindset. |
| 14:49.31 | smul | i've tried the openzaurus chain - yet didn't help |
| 14:50.17 | smul | what do you mean by "typical open software mindset" ? |
| 14:51.43 | smul | fallen asleep ? |
| 14:52.56 | smul | despite, it should be updated by (un)SHARP |
| 14:53.23 | smul | feeling somehow "alone in the dark" |
| 14:54.48 | hardwire | absentia: you have a funky disposition don't you |
| 14:54.52 | smul | .. I would, if I could ... yeahh .. dubidu |
| 14:54.55 | hardwire | if it isn't easy for you to comprehend.. you gripe.. |
| 14:55.25 | hardwire | might just be me |
| 14:55.27 | smul | not really.. |
| 14:55.46 | hardwire | but everytime I peek at this channel you have issues with things ;) |
| 14:56.29 | smul | what's this channel for ? .. baking recipes |
| 14:56.38 | hardwire | exactly ;) |
| 14:56.46 | absentia | as far as I can tell, |
| 14:56.50 | smul | what's your favourite |
| 14:56.54 | hardwire | I like snickerdoodles |
| 14:57.08 | absentia | redhat doesn't give any information about mirror downloading of the isos, and redhat.com is so f'n slow. |
| 14:57.19 | hardwire | ah |
| 14:57.23 | hardwire | theres the thorn in your paw |
| 14:57.24 | absentia | smul: open source people tend to tell anyone who complains that the complainer should FIX the problem |
| 14:57.32 | hardwire | be smarter.. use debian or gentoo ;) |
| 14:57.49 | absentia | ie: if I say something isn't right in an app, the authors would say "submit a patch diff" ... |
| 14:57.56 | smul | im using debian already .. |
| 14:58.01 | absentia | it's like you don't have a right to talk about a bug unless you're a programmer. |
| 14:58.05 | absentia | very closed minded. |
| 14:58.11 | hardwire | absentia: thats sorta the point of having a large open project and version systems for software control. |
| 14:58.17 | hardwire | same with wikis |
| 14:58.20 | absentia | hard: wrong |
| 14:58.26 | absentia | wrong wrong wrong |
| 14:58.29 | hardwire | oh I would like to have you prove that ;) |
| 14:58.37 | absentia | the OZ faq has not old old information, but wrong and potentially dangerous information |
| 14:58.45 | absentia | but, I'm not an expert in putting in the right information |
| 14:58.48 | hardwire | absentia: so fix it ;) |
| 14:58.49 | absentia | but I can spot the wrong information |
| 14:58.53 | absentia | no |
| 14:59.03 | hardwire | ok.. might wanna like mention the specifics.. |
| 14:59.03 | hardwire | heh |
| 14:59.07 | hardwire | to whoever wrote the docs |
| 14:59.09 | absentia | hardwire: I figure you're just pulling my leg, because you just don't get it. |
| 14:59.13 | smul | oh I unserstood, a META-discussion .. |
| 14:59.17 | hardwire | absentia: I just don't get it |
| 14:59.29 | hardwire | thats so terrible to say.. you little turd |
| 14:59.35 | absentia | :-) |
| 14:59.49 | absentia | uh huh |
| 15:00.09 | hardwire | I have no idea who I am talking to here.. respectively neither do you.. so.. GOOD DAY! ;) |
| 15:00.19 | absentia | that doesn't change the fact that I or anyone should be able to point out issues with software or docus without being required to give a code diff patch. |
| 15:00.25 | absentia | no |
| 15:00.38 | absentia | don't confuse your confusion with confusion on my part. |
| 15:00.41 | hardwire | absentia: so you are just lazy? |
| 15:00.47 | absentia | I am stating.. that *I* do know what *I* am talking about. |
| 15:00.54 | absentia | hard: are you a programmer? |
| 15:00.56 | smul | get the book : Sharp Zaurus wizardry in 21 days |
| 15:01.04 | fliplap | maybe no one else knows what you're talking about |
| 15:01.14 | hardwire | youa re just too *lazy* yo fucking *diff* changes to something you *think* *are* *important* *** |
| 15:01.22 | absentia | ya |
| 15:01.23 | hardwire | s/yo/to/ ;) |
| 15:01.27 | absentia | you aren't listening. |
| 15:01.31 | hardwire | sure I am |
| 15:01.33 | absentia | both of you. |
| 15:01.40 | hardwire | are you seeing two of me? |
| 15:01.57 | absentia | flip |
| 15:02.00 | hardwire | flop |
| 15:02.04 | absentia | now you're just being stupid. |
| 15:02.10 | hardwire | its what I do. |
| 15:02.14 | absentia | if you care to have an intelligent conversation, please let me know. |
| 15:02.20 | fliplap | its not that i'm not listening, its that i just don't care |
| 15:02.22 | hardwire | ditto |
| 15:02.27 | absentia | otherwise, you're just wasting my time. |
| 15:02.32 | hardwire | hah! |
| 15:02.34 | hardwire | wasting time? |
| 15:02.37 | absentia | flip: exactly. |
| 15:02.40 | hardwire | you came on here to bitch that XF86 sucked.. |
| 15:02.42 | hardwire | talk about a waste of time |
| 15:02.43 | absentia | can't help... don't care. |
| 15:02.54 | absentia | I didn't say sucked |
| 15:02.57 | absentia | with freebsd |
| 15:03.04 | absentia | there are 4 ways to configure the xfree86 |
| 15:03.05 | fliplap | hell, i've only read like the last 15 lines |
| 15:03.13 | fliplap | i don't even know what we're talking about |
| 15:03.14 | hardwire | absentia: and most of us do it manually ;) |
| 15:03.14 | absentia | xf86cfg, something else, something else -curses... |
| 15:03.23 | absentia | all *3* of them make INVALID config files |
| 15:03.33 | absentia | but there isn't one that is "XFree86 -configure" |
| 15:03.40 | absentia | which makes at least a file that isn't invalid.. that can be updated. |
| 15:03.44 | absentia | that's my point |
| 15:03.53 | fliplap | scripts don't make invalid config files |
| 15:03.55 | fliplap | users do |
| 15:03.59 | hardwire | exactly |
| 15:04.04 | absentia | I should be able to say "you know, selection 3 makes a file that won't even allow X to run... the stuff it puts into the file is outdated! " |
| 15:04.07 | fliplap | pebkac |
| 15:04.16 | absentia | but instead I have to show a patch difference.... hope I can program in the language |
| 15:04.18 | absentia | ya know? |
| 15:04.25 | absentia | flip: no, scripts do. |
| 15:04.28 | hardwire | absentia: pull up the logs.. you were badmouthing and bitching like a kid with no lollipop |
| 15:04.35 | absentia | if you run a script... and it says there are invalid components... missing parts. |
| 15:04.38 | absentia | the scrpt is broken |
| 15:04.44 | fliplap | absentia: the script it a good starting point |
| 15:04.49 | hardwire | absentia: so fix it ;) |
| 15:04.55 | absentia | flip: not when it makes totally invalid files. |
| 15:04.57 | absentia | ya |
| 15:04.58 | absentia | so fix it |
| 15:05.01 | smul | so I repeat: has someone one slight idea of compiling kernel 2.4.17 of the new sharp rom 3.10 - please don't mind |
| 15:05.04 | absentia | THAT is the midsent I was talking about to smul |
| 15:05.11 | absentia | you guys have it.... you refguse to change |
| 15:05.14 | hardwire | well you expect other people to labor for you? |
| 15:05.15 | fliplap | smul: likely, no |
| 15:05.17 | hardwire | on your very whim? |
| 15:05.18 | absentia | you think you're so high and mighty with the response. |
| 15:05.24 | absentia | but you don't realize that it just hurts open source. |
| 15:05.36 | hardwire | hah |
| 15:05.38 | hardwire | do you work? |
| 15:05.38 | fliplap | smul: people don't really do kernel updates for the sharp rom |
| 15:05.42 | absentia | hard: no.... please... please... please... stop saying that I am saying or asking things. |
| 15:05.48 | hardwire | like.. do you have a job.. do you go to it every day? |
| 15:06.02 | absentia | hardwire: I asked you a question.. you did not answer it |
| 15:06.14 | absentia | should I be a better man and answer your question? or should I just ignore you as you ignored me? |
| 15:06.18 | absentia | hardwire: are you a programmer? |
| 15:06.23 | hardwire | hell yes ;) |
| 15:06.24 | fliplap | absentia: i am |
| 15:06.28 | absentia | what languages? |
| 15:06.32 | hardwire | * |
| 15:06.39 | absentia | flip: one croney at a time, please. |
| 15:06.43 | *** join/#zaurus tomimo (~kurre@ncircle.nullnet.fi) |
| 15:06.46 | hardwire | it doesn't matter what languages .. I am a programmer |
| 15:06.54 | absentia | cobol? |
| 15:06.57 | tux_mike | no you're not |
| 15:07.00 | fliplap | c/c++/perl/php/java/prolog/smalltalk |
| 15:07.01 | smul | flipflap: thanks - it's only a hardware issue i want to correct - compiling serial_cs as module - maybe giving it away for others needing it too |
| 15:07.04 | hardwire | tux_mike: wanna bet ;) |
| 15:07.30 | fliplap | i'm sure there's more i can't remember but if you sat me down in front of them i could help you at least a little |
| 15:07.40 | hardwire | absentia: if I needed to do a job in cobol.. and they refused to think about the next century.. then I would learn cobol |
| 15:07.47 | hardwire | I would most likely not take on a job like that however ;) |
| 15:07.48 | absentia | right! |
| 15:08.07 | tux_mike | job like what? |
| 15:08.09 | hardwire | but.. those people have money to hire somebody else to work on the isssue |
| 15:08.18 | absentia | so, now you are not an expert in cobol... BUT, if you used a cobol system that had a bug... don't you think you should be able to talk to someone or report the bug without giving them COBOL CODE to fix the bug? |
| 15:08.20 | hardwire | not exactly like those open source programmers.. who can't just hire a team |
| 15:08.21 | absentia | think about it. |
| 15:08.30 | absentia | expand your mind. |
| 15:08.39 | hardwire | expand yours!.. seriously.. |
| 15:08.43 | fliplap | absentia: or, if it was that much of a personal concern to him, he would learn cobol |
| 15:08.51 | hardwire | hehe |
| 15:09.03 | absentia | ah |
| 15:09.09 | absentia | always attacking me... never talking about the subject. |
| 15:09.23 | absentia | ok, flip, would you like to try to talk? hardwire doesn't seem like he's taking this seriously. |
| 15:09.31 | hardwire | absentia: "so fix it" is such a common answer because thats how people become interested in projects.. and continue maintaining them |
| 15:09.32 | fliplap | i'm not sure this conversation makes any sense |
| 15:09.41 | *** join/#zaurus warmi (~a3c01502@dsl092-131-081.chi1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 15:09.54 | hardwire | the open source world isn't run by commercial companies that continually publish updates to things they make no money off of |
| 15:09.59 | absentia | hardwire: I don't have time.... to code yet another piece of shit software... I just want to be a user for once. |
| 15:09.59 | fliplap | absentia: i don't think there are as many developers with as much time as you think there are |
| 15:10.19 | absentia | however, AS a programmer, my standards appear to be much higher than those of those people who I talk to here and elsewhere who will release any old crap. |
| 15:10.24 | fliplap | absentia: why are you coding peices of shit anyway? |
| 15:10.28 | absentia | flip: no kidding! |
| 15:10.29 | hardwire | absentia: if you just wanna be a user.. feel free to bitch.. to a whole hell of a lot of not just users.. talk about a waste of time. |
| 15:10.31 | absentia | I am one of them. |
| 15:10.42 | *** join/#zaurus effy-kun (effy@t107150.ipgw.phs.yoyogi.mopera.ne.jp) |
| 15:10.53 | absentia | flip: becuase I am not an expert.... in the system that I am using |
| 15:11.04 | absentia | but the authors of those systems that I am using... want me to give them code to fix issues... |
| 15:11.09 | hardwire | well if you stated fixing stuff you would become one ;) |
| 15:11.10 | fliplap | ok, look, what is it exactly that you want fixed |
| 15:11.16 | absentia | so, I'm forced to contribute shitty code... |
| 15:11.34 | fliplap | no one is forcing you to contribute anything |
| 15:11.41 | absentia | flip: the mindset that open source people always say "submit source code diffs" whenever anyone has any feedback |
| 15:11.45 | hardwire | its neat that your standards are much higher than everybody else in here.. absentia |
| 15:11.53 | absentia | hardwire: thank you. |
| 15:12.05 | absentia | look at oz for c700 |
| 15:12.08 | fliplap | absentia: thats not going to happen |
| 15:12.10 | absentia | sure, it's experimental |
| 15:12.13 | hardwire | it definatly coins you as an individual among all of os nameless faces |
| 15:12.19 | hardwire | os ;) us |
| 15:12.20 | absentia | but the latest feed up doesn't have keyboard or system as part of the image |
| 15:12.25 | absentia | 3 seconds to fix and then upload |
| 15:12.28 | hardwire | or rather.. faceless names |
| 15:12.30 | absentia | instead, it stays broken for months. |
| 15:12.34 | fliplap | oh, don't even get started on that. People have _real_ jobs here absentia |
| 15:12.43 | absentia | flip: get real |
| 15:13.00 | absentia | if you can upload a broken system, you can upload a quick upgrade... change |
| 15:13.11 | hardwire | absentia: fuck off man |
| 15:13.16 | fliplap | seriously |
| 15:13.17 | hardwire | you are a newb here.. but wow.. |
| 15:13.21 | absentia | expecially since there were versions going up almost nightly for a few nights (previously) that worked... but the last one up is horribly broken. |
| 15:13.45 | fliplap | don't use the experimental images then |
| 15:13.46 | absentia | do you nkow how many times I've downloaded a project, done a ./configure; make... only to have the make FAIL with "syntax errors" in the C code... |
| 15:13.58 | absentia | it's as if the people releasing the code didn't even ATTEMPT to QA it... to compile it. |
| 15:14.01 | fliplap | ok, _that happens_ |
| 15:14.07 | absentia | I'm a newb here |
| 15:14.23 | absentia | because I got fucking tired of IRC... I was tired of it after 3 years in '91... and it has gotten much worse since then. |
| 15:14.33 | absentia | I only came in here because I was excited about the zaurus |
| 15:14.37 | hardwire | cause you are a bitchy little turd! |
| 15:14.38 | absentia | but it's typical linux |
| 15:14.39 | fliplap | i won't like, if you trying to compile cvs nightlies, yeah, thats going to happen |
| 15:14.43 | absentia | how many ipkgs are there? |
| 15:14.46 | absentia | how many work? |
| 15:14.50 | absentia | how many ipkgs are broken? |
| 15:14.59 | absentia | pyqt? I'm learning python... just so I can program on this thing... |
| 15:15.11 | absentia | does pyqt work under sharp? no idea... any feedback? "try it and see" |
| 15:15.17 | hardwire | exactly ;) |
| 15:15.20 | absentia | yup. lets break a system just to "see" |
| 15:15.30 | hardwire | if you care this deeply.. start talking on the wikis.. |
| 15:15.40 | fliplap | why don't you go find out and then tell us. A lot of us have our own jobs, we contribute to a small part of OZ or other projects |
| 15:15.41 | absentia | ya? where? |
| 15:15.43 | hardwire | that way when people just like you search out this information.. they get your pages under google |
| 15:15.44 | absentia | I'm on externe.net |
| 15:15.49 | absentia | where else is there? |
| 15:16.02 | absentia | but it's more than zaurus, it's much of opensource |
| 15:16.14 | fliplap | we don't have the time to check everything, if something is broken, don't come on irc and bitch, fill out a bug report |
| 15:16.33 | fliplap | on top of all that, yes, developers get really busy with real work. They forget about projects |
| 15:16.38 | fliplap | it happens |
| 15:16.41 | absentia | this is somewhat funny. |
| 15:16.49 | absentia | is there an impression that I do not have real work? |
| 15:17.05 | fliplap | you obviously do |
| 15:17.11 | fliplap | or you would have already fixed these things |
| 15:17.24 | fliplap | you also, are too busy to do everything |
| 15:17.26 | hardwire | absentia: google for openzaurus and wiki.. |
| 15:17.38 | hardwire | eventually.. you will find what you are looking for.. a good place to bitch static content too |
| 15:17.59 | hardwire | even tho most of us would rather you said diddly squat.. your opinions are still quite valid. |
| 15:18.11 | absentia | hardwire: that I respect. |
| 15:18.14 | absentia | thank you. |
| 15:18.18 | effy-kun | I can understand criticism, but useless bitching is just that |
| 15:18.32 | absentia | but... sometimes.. the bitching can effect changes. |
| 15:18.41 | fliplap | or just annoy people |
| 15:18.43 | hardwire | yeah.. usually in ones mortality.. |
| 15:18.54 | absentia | ah, mickeyl... |
| 15:18.59 | fliplap | until they decide that don't want to put up with the bitching anymore |
| 15:19.04 | absentia | flip: yes, unfortunately, I tend mostly only to annoy. |
| 15:19.06 | absentia | :-/ |
| 15:19.10 | effy-kun | if you choose to use OZ, you are on your own. read the warranty |
| 15:19.24 | hardwire | haha.. warranty.. classic |
| 15:19.31 | effy-kun | ;) |
| 15:19.36 | absentia | yer right. |
| 15:19.39 | hardwire | anypoot.. |
| 15:19.46 | absentia | if i choose to eat shit, I shouldn't complain that it tastes like shit. |
| 15:19.54 | absentia | btw: I don't use oz |
| 15:19.56 | absentia | it's unusable. |
| 15:19.58 | fliplap | OZ is a community based project, the Sharp Rom is a corperated backed one. See which gets fixed faster |
| 15:19.59 | effy-kun | I have a C700 and it works just as I need it and I have other stuff to worry about, so I dont use OZ. |
| 15:19.59 | hardwire | time to go to the bank.. watch a movie.. chill out.. |
| 15:20.28 | absentia | but that's neither here nor there. |
| 15:20.34 | hardwire | true that |
| 15:20.55 | effy-kun | btw, does anyone have the update page for the C700? |
| 15:21.13 | hardwire | absentia: we can handle bitching.. but redhat.. I dunno how long you are gonna last in this world ;) |
| 15:21.16 | effy-kun | absentia: any chance you're putting it on an IBM eServer? |
| 15:21.23 | effy-kun | LOL, hardwire |
| 15:21.26 | absentia | effy: soon. |
| 15:21.30 | effy-kun | SuSE is the way to go ;) |
| 15:21.38 | absentia | actually, I prefer freebsd |
| 15:21.46 | absentia | the winderz dude next to me likes suse |
| 15:21.48 | effy-kun | absentia: any chance you're going to slap a ATA133 RAID card in it? |
| 15:21.55 | absentia | but managers want to see redhat |
| 15:22.06 | absentia | effy: no, we use symm storage. |
| 15:22.14 | tux_mike | now, theres the problem. freebsd |
| 15:22.18 | effy-kun | SuSE is pretty nice. I havent messed with FreeBSD because I already became somewhat of a specialist in Linux. |
| 15:22.42 | absentia | tux_mike: like, my freebsd 5.1 ... takes 45 seconds to launch emacs.. 5.0 didn't take more than a few seconds... |
| 15:23.05 | absentia | tasks launched via the menus in kde, give me a busy icon, and then nothing is launched.... or it takes 20 minutes to launch an xlogo |
| 15:23.14 | absentia | yet, cc on the console is FAST (faster than 5.0) |
| 15:23.20 | absentia | seems borqed, no? |
| 15:23.31 | tux_mike | ah, emacs. theres another problem |
| 15:23.34 | effy-kun | freeware for ya ;) |
| 15:24.12 | absentia | so, now I get to (1) search the web for similar experiences, see if there's a known issue and resolution, and if not (2) investigate it myself and see WTF they HOSED.... and try to fill out a bug report or something... |
| 15:24.21 | absentia | this is why freebsd/linux isn't ready for prime time. |
| 15:24.30 | absentia | not just emacs |
| 15:24.34 | effy-kun | I just wish my Power Designer would hurry up and finish downloading |
| 15:24.39 | absentia | why does kde take 12 minutes to start? |
| 15:24.48 | effy-kun | Linux is ready for primetime, just not for every single task |
| 15:24.51 | absentia | and things launched in kde not work... at all? |
| 15:25.00 | absentia | but things launched from command line in a shell IN KDE work.. |
| 15:25.05 | effy-kun | abs: you running on a 386 or something? |
| 15:25.09 | absentia | well, I'm gonna try redhat here... |
| 15:25.15 | absentia | management wants to dump as much MS as possible... |
| 15:25.26 | absentia | and so we're (I'm) investigating linux on the desktop |
| 15:25.32 | effy-kun | dude, go with SuSE if you have any respect at all |
| 15:25.40 | absentia | at least I get paid to waste my time with linsux installs of various dists. |
| 15:25.47 | absentia | why? |
| 15:26.03 | absentia | what makes suse-shit anybetter than redhat-shit or debian-shit ? |
| 15:26.04 | effy-kun | Redhat is insecure, and I just dont like it anymore hehe |
| 15:26.09 | effy-kun | SuSE is just simply cool |
| 15:26.21 | effy-kun | it has YaST2, which runs WELL |
| 15:26.27 | absentia | yast2? |
| 15:26.29 | *** join/#zaurus `Leaves (Leaves@l-031-187.sheridanc.on.ca) |
| 15:26.32 | absentia | (please don't say search the web) |
| 15:26.43 | effy-kun | it's the admin tool for doing most things |
| 15:26.45 | effy-kun | LOL |
| 15:26.50 | effy-kun | "search the web" |
| 15:26.53 | effy-kun | for more info ;) |
| 15:27.26 | effy-kun | it's prolly best to still hack away at some scripts/files for the system, however, YaST2 can pretty much do it all. |
| 15:27.40 | absentia | ah. |
| 15:27.52 | absentia | I don't typically have too many issues -- when man pages... are actually correct. |
| 15:28.04 | effy-kun | and it's GERMAN, which means it's well engineered ;) |
| 15:28.09 | absentia | oh.. |
| 15:28.14 | absentia | you've simply... got to be kidding. |
| 15:28.23 | effy-kun | I'm fucking with you hehe |
| 15:28.32 | absentia | (for now) |
| 15:28.34 | effy-kun | Deutsch Bank? |
| 15:28.35 | fliplap | can't wait until the italians release a distro then |
| 15:28.42 | effy-kun | say hello to those fucks for me ;) |
| 15:28.55 | absentia | no, they asked me how to solve an issue... they were having... with perl. |
| 15:29.06 | absentia | I gave them 6 answers... off the top of my head.... they wanted the 7th |
| 15:29.12 | absentia | (which was so bad, I wouldn't even suggest it) |
| 15:29.26 | effy-kun | DB engineered the demise of my career at my previous company hehe |
| 15:29.29 | absentia | they asked me.. in the interview "what year was the first year that unix was released that included AWK" |
| 15:29.45 | effy-kun | flip: I hear the French have a release, but no one cares outside of France haha |
| 15:29.57 | absentia | plus, I was thinking about suing DB for IP infringement... so it might have been a conflict of interest. |
| 15:30.02 | effy-kun | abs: wtf point is there in asking that??? |
| 15:30.09 | absentia | effy: ya, but it's restricted to only the french language |
| 15:30.14 | absentia | ie: it's useless for just about everyone. |
| 15:30.25 | absentia | effy: my point exactly |
| 15:30.41 | absentia | they didn't care for my ability to think, they just wanted a monkey to do jumpstart installed. |
| 15:30.44 | absentia | er, installs... |
| 15:30.55 | effy-kun | abs: I wondered if they even bothered to export it. undoubtedly yeah, seeing how they still think French is the second most widely used language in the world haha |
| 15:31.11 | absentia | effy: exactly. |
| 15:31.19 | absentia | you can't FORCE someone to want something. |
| 15:31.30 | absentia | french may have been universal in the late 1800s, etc... |
| 15:31.33 | absentia | but it's mostly useless now. |
| 15:31.38 | absentia | they keep trying to force it on the world. |
| 15:31.39 | absentia | sad. |
| 15:31.39 | *** join/#zaurus kyngel (~kyngel@12.4.214.98) |
| 15:31.49 | effy-kun | shhhh, there might be some frenchies around here ;) |
| 15:31.51 | kyngel | Okay, question: Is the Z big-endian or little-endian? |
| 15:32.04 | *** join/#zaurus fateagk (~zic@6535145hfc60.tampabay.rr.com) |
| 15:32.14 | kyngel | And, in case that weren't basic enough, what's the size of a float variable on the Z? |
| 15:32.20 | effy-kun | kyngel: since it's made by Intel, chances are it is little-endian |
| 15:32.39 | effy-kun | kyngel: LOL, try writing a simple program to do that for you |
| 15:33.04 | kyngel | Just wondered if anyone had the knowledge handy. I'm not the greatest of programmers, and I'm trying to track down a bug. :) |
| 15:33.04 | absentia | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:33.05 | effy-kun | kyngel: that is, the processor is made by intel |
| 15:33.06 | absentia | weeeee |
| 15:33.09 | absentia | and we're off |
| 15:33.30 | absentia | kyngel: please submit a source code diff patch.... for the endianness that you desire. |
| 15:33.55 | effy-kun | kyngel: if you're worrying about the size of a variable, you better learn to be a better programmer very quickly. |
| 15:34.23 | effy-kun | absentia: if you want to live a simpler existence, I suggest getting RH8 if you're going with RH on an IBM |
| 15:34.23 | bflong | the Z is little endian, kindof. |
| 15:34.37 | effy-kun | I dont think IBM has any drivers to help with your RH9 just yet |
| 15:34.42 | bflong | IIRC, you can program either little or big. |
| 15:34.44 | effy-kun | I know I wasnt able to use it |
| 15:34.56 | bflong | But everything must be one or the other, obvously. |
| 15:35.01 | effy-kun | bflong: why would they bother making a chip both big and little endian? |
| 15:35.26 | bflong | effy-kun: I don't know. I didn't design it. |
| 15:35.50 | kyngel | Right. And I'm just starting to program, Effy, so yes, I had better learn. :) |
| 15:35.53 | effy-kun | I've never heard of a practical reason for making a proc both big and little endian. LOL |
| 15:36.01 | bflong | effy-kun: it's a RISC chip, and can do either one. But for practicalitys sake, it's all little. |
| 15:36.26 | kyngel | I just wondered if the Z used a different size for floats than this MPC hardware I'm using. |
| 15:36.37 | effy-kun | kyngel: the kind of program you would write would have been expected of you in a first programming course of Pascal or C ;) |
| 15:36.38 | bflong | making everything little makes the cross compiling easier. :) |
| 15:36.50 | effy-kun | bflong: being RISC has nothing to do with big or little endian |
| 15:37.09 | bflong | effy-kun: I didn't say it did. :) |
| 15:37.09 | kyngel | well, obviously now I'm going to have to write one to find out. |
| 15:37.20 | kyngel | I just wondered if I could save myself the trouble, that's all. |
| 15:37.39 | bflong | kyngel: it's little endin. Just use little endin. |
| 15:37.40 | effy-kun | kyngel: do yourself a favor and create a library of useful programs |
| 15:38.16 | effy-kun | kyngel: it being little endian or big endian should only matter to a compiler-writer or a hardware designer |
| 15:38.19 | bflong | kyngel: if you use big endin, you would have to set the cpu to use it and change everything to use big endin. :p |
| 15:38.25 | effy-kun | to a programmer it is meaningless to need to know |
| 15:38.37 | kyngel | Okay... that's just eliminating a possible source of the bug. I'm transferring a variable from a program that logs GPS data to a monitoring/parsing program and getting lots of 0s and infinites where I should be getting reasonable values. |
| 15:38.59 | kyngel | effy-kun, we're working with custom GPS hardware. |
| 15:39.11 | effy-kun | kyngel: could it be you're not type-casting your ints and floats correctly? |
| 15:39.22 | kyngel | I'm just trying to get the Z to properly monitor/display a variable from the GPS over a serial connection. |
| 15:39.41 | effy-kun | I'm not sure about GPS, but if it is like any other communications protocol, it is declared big or little endian and there is no if and or but about it |
| 15:39.49 | kyngel | It would be no problem to flip it around from little to big endian, if that was the problem. |
| 15:39.59 | kyngel | But it's not, so I'll look elsewhere. |
| 15:40.05 | effy-kun | your compiler and libraries should be handling it all |
| 15:40.19 | kyngel | The program works fine on an x86, effy-kun. |
| 15:40.29 | kyngel | So it's something quirky with either the Z or my setup there. |
| 15:41.07 | absentia | good... nearly 600K/sec download from duke |
| 15:41.24 | effy-kun | kyngel: only time I ever saw this quirkiness in relation to big or little endinanness, I was programming an 8051 microcontroller and trying to read the output |
| 15:41.33 | effy-kun | absentia: RH8.0!!!! |
| 15:41.39 | absentia | oh, btw.. the worst software/documentation is openldap. |
| 15:41.44 | absentia | 9.0 |
| 15:41.49 | effy-kun | I'm serious, I had a driver problem with IBM hw today because of 9.0 |
| 15:41.55 | effy-kun | no drivers available for 9.0 yet |
| 15:41.59 | kyngel | Okay, then I'll rule it out, effy-kun. |
| 15:42.04 | absentia | ya |
| 15:42.21 | absentia | we're just investigating linsux for the desktop ... with gnome, kde and/or ximian2 |
| 15:42.31 | absentia | I'm gonna put up a 9.0 with ximian2.. etc. |
| 15:42.36 | effy-kun | kyngel: and I sincerely doubt switching a zero back wards in binary is going to produce extraneous values. |
| 15:42.37 | effy-kun | could be somewhere else |
| 15:42.42 | kyngel | What would yu say is more likely? In floats that normally should read fairly reasonably, I'm getting lots of values that read 0.000000 or inf. |
| 15:43.05 | effy-kun | kyngel: which cross-compiler are you using? |
| 15:43.45 | effy-kun | absentia: do you know what the latest version of RH that IBM sells is? |
| 15:43.55 | kyngel | 2.95.3 |
| 15:44.03 | effy-kun | gcc? |
| 15:44.05 | kyngel | Yeah. |
| 15:44.33 | absentia | not offhand, sorry. |
| 15:44.40 | effy-kun | were you able to check the data you're sending and receiving? Is it in correct form? Could there be a bug in the driver? |
| 15:44.50 | absentia | anyone here use mame on their zaurus c700 ? |
| 15:44.52 | effy-kun | absentia: if you're slapping it on a server, stick to 8.0 for now hehe |
| 15:44.57 | absentia | ok |
| 15:45.00 | absentia | I hear ya, man, i hear ya |
| 15:45.08 | effy-kun | spent all day screwing with 9.0 and finally decided IBM isnt up on their RH shit |
| 15:45.14 | effy-kun | what is mame? |
| 15:45.21 | kyngel | No, the binary data itself is logging fine. |
| 15:45.26 | absentia | multi arcade machine emulator |
| 15:45.31 | absentia | just slow as shut on the c700 |
| 15:45.36 | absentia | sh!t |
| 15:45.41 | kyngel | I can sit there and watch 'cat /dev/ttyS0 | strings' and it looks all right. |
| 15:45.49 | effy-kun | kyngel: add printf's and find out where your values are going haywire. |
| 15:46.31 | kyngel | They're slipping when this parsing program uses shared memory to try and retrieve the variable. |
| 15:46.55 | effy-kun | but I wouldnt believe at all that big endian or little endian has anything to do with it. Hmmmmm, though, with floats, there is a possibility I guess |
| 15:47.33 | kyngel | Well, I'm not grabbing too tightly on that endian thing. It's just an idea. |
| 15:47.38 | kyngel | And apparently a bad one. :) |
| 15:48.59 | effy-kun | check with the floats, hmmmmm, geez, I wish I had better info. |
| 15:49.27 | effy-kun | dont rule out the endian thing heh. It might be that after all, but for some reason I just doubt it. But then again, I'm not looking at your code. |
| 15:49.30 | absentia | anyone know a decent ircd version ? |
| 15:49.34 | kyngel | And obviously, I'm not up to the level of a first-year programmer, or I wouldn't be here asking. :) |
| 15:49.59 | effy-kun | haha, I've met programmers who never made it to college, and they do just fine |
| 15:50.22 | effy-kun | Ive gotta sleep, it's almost 1am |
| 15:50.22 | kyngel | Well, to put it in perspective, I'm on my way to college now. :) |
| 15:50.44 | kyngel | Before now, I've only worked doing scripting and parsing stuff; this is some of the first real code I've gotten into. |
| 15:51.02 | kyngel | Okay, thanks for your help, effy-kun. |
| 15:51.06 | effy-kun | night |
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| 15:51.29 | \Kritikal\ | is there a rom other than OZ that will allow you to write to the file system? |
| 15:54.13 | kyngel | Hm, yeah... the monitor doesn't get the right thing from shared memory. It must be something with variable size or endian-ship. |
| 15:59.54 | effy-kun | damn, the newest ROM for the C700 is still only 1.2 |
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| 16:05.05 | kyngel | Welcome back, Kergoth. |
| 16:05.08 | George`NotHere | argh, no |
| 16:05.11 | George`NotHere | noooo pleasee!! |
| 16:05.18 | George`NotHere | not kergoth! |
| 16:05.30 | George`NotHere | kergoth: has sharp's 2.4.18 been known to work on OZ? |
| 16:07.12 | kergoth | George`NotHere: sashz has used it with an oz rootfs |
| 16:07.21 | George`NotHere | nice |
| 16:07.24 | kergoth | hardly worth bothering with though |
| 16:07.28 | kergoth | since 2.4.21 is nearing completion |
| 16:07.28 | George`NotHere | why? |
| 16:07.33 | George`NotHere | hrmm. |
| 16:07.35 | George`NotHere | eta? |
| 16:08.12 | treke | right about the time you cease to be annoying |
| 16:08.24 | fliplap | oh good, more vaporware |
| 16:08.26 | George`NotHere | treke: hrmm, better install 2.4.18 then :) |
| 16:09.57 | kergoth | I think i'll test an insmod -f of the sd module in 2.4.21 today |
| 16:10.04 | kergoth | if that works, only TS is holding us up, and i cant test that |
| 16:10.35 | George`NotHere | if that doesn't work, you're fucked |
| 16:10.36 | George`NotHere | ;) |
| 16:10.55 | kergoth | no, absolute worst case we forward port sharp's shitty ucb1200 drivers and use them, which are known to work |
| 16:10.59 | kergoth | *worst* case |
| 16:11.09 | George`NotHere | ucb1200? |
| 16:11.18 | treke | George`NotHere: If the sd driver doesnt work it just means kergoth has to port the hh.o driver |
| 16:11.23 | kergoth | yeah |
| 16:11.29 | kergoth | which i'll do eventually anyway, itll just take a bit longer |
| 16:11.32 | George`NotHere | does that support SD though? |
| 16:11.36 | treke | yes |
| 16:11.36 | George`NotHere | as opposed to MMC |
| 16:11.42 | George`NotHere | oh right |
| 16:12.08 | treke | it wouldnt be much of a solution if it didnt support sd |
| 16:12.22 | George`NotHere | and it's opensource? |
| 16:12.33 | kergoth | yep |
| 16:15.48 | George`NotHere | how'd that work? |
| 16:16.08 | treke | well first someone wrote SD support |
| 16:16.15 | treke | then someone else commited it to CVS |
| 16:16.26 | George`NotHere | DMCA? |
| 16:17.11 | *** join/#zaurus bflong (~bflong@24.229.103.140) |
| 16:17.12 | George`NotHere | that scared him off :( |
| 16:21.22 | George`NotHere | ibot oz buildroot |
| 16:21.23 | | oz bk is, like, bk clone bk://openzaurus.bkbits.net/buildroot buildroot-oz; cd buildroot-oz; bk -r co -q; cp def-configs/collie-opie .config (for zaurus 5000d/5500) .. make oldconfig; make; or see bitkeeper (free download but non-gpl) or see 'oz snapshot' if you either cannot or will not use bitkeeper. |
| 16:27.43 | treke | what change? |
| 16:31.04 | fliplap | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:32.39 | George`NotHere | http://treke.net/oz/kernel-headers-2.4.18.tar.bz2 |
| 16:32.40 | George`NotHere | arrrghh |
| 16:32.47 | George`NotHere | I just connected to an evil site!! |
| 16:34.49 | fliplap | w00t. disassembled and reassembled my Z and it still works |
| 16:36.02 | George`NotHere | uh |
| 16:36.07 | George`NotHere | I did that like 8 times. |
| 16:36.09 | George`NotHere | :) |
| 16:36.18 | fliplap | yeah, it took my awhile |
| 16:36.30 | fliplap | to find all the screws and to pry the right side apart |
| 16:36.48 | George`NotHere | ibot zaurus |
| 16:36.49 | | hmm... zaurus is at http://developer.sharpsec.com/index.cfm or the closest thing to sex I can get in the palm of ibot's hand. or the Sharp PDA brand name. The SL-5000, SL-5500 and A300 run Linux. There are also other Japanese models running a proprietary operating system. or there are 12 screws holding it together - pop off th ekeyboard and the hidden one is beneath the email key |
| 16:37.08 | fliplap | the stylus tip had broken off and was lodged in the bottom of the stylus silo |
| 16:37.32 | fliplap | yeah, i found that one |
| 16:38.08 | George`NotHere | is ftp.gnu.org down? |
| 16:38.13 | George`NotHere | ibot test ftp.gnu.org |
| 16:38.14 | | George`NotHere: I wish you would RTFM. |
| 16:38.19 | George`NotHere | fucker. |
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| 17:33.13 | smul | ibot do yodeln |
| 17:33.13 | | smul: I give up, what is it? |
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| 17:54.34 | kergoth | anyone here on a 3.1 sharp rom? |
| 17:54.39 | kergoth | i need someone to check something out for me |
| 17:56.25 | hcarty | I'm running it |
| 17:57.02 | hcarty | I can check on something as long as it doesn't require much more than the base rom + terminal...I haven't messed with it much yet |
| 18:00.00 | kergoth | go out in /proc |
| 18:00.01 | kergoth | do an ls |
| 18:00.10 | kergoth | is lock_fcs listed? |
| 18:00.19 | hcarty | One sec... |
| 18:00.43 | hcarty | yep |
| 18:01.52 | hcarty | It's root.root and +r for all if that's important at all |
| 18:04.11 | kergoth | cat it |
| 18:04.15 | kergoth | lock_fcs i mean |
| 18:04.49 | hcarty | 0x00000000 |
| 18:06.21 | kergoth | hmm k |
| 18:06.37 | kergoth | do you have an sd or mmc card,and if so, is it inserted? |
| 18:06.47 | hcarty | sd, and yes it is inserted |
| 18:07.13 | kergoth | hmm k |
| 18:07.14 | kergoth | thanks |
| 18:07.18 | hcarty | np |
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| 18:23.48 | kyngel | Beautiful. I now have a box with eight boxes in, which each have an SL-5500 in. That made my day. :) |
| 18:24.39 | kyngel | Surprisingly fast, too, only ordered yesterday. They were on the ball, I'm impressed. |
| 18:25.00 | hcarty | Does anyone here know if it is possible to run the opie pim apps on the 3.1 sharp rom? |
| 18:25.15 | kergoth | i saw a news item on zaurus.com mentioning someone portedsome opie apps to 3.1 |
| 18:25.21 | kergoth | check it out, ihavent yet |
| 18:25.26 | hcarty | Ok, thanks |
| 18:26.08 | Neo|Work | gotta love the fact that cvs.zaurus.com doesn't workj |
| 18:26.16 | Neo|Work | good thing they had this contest to add stuff |
| 18:26.20 | Neo|Work | when you,w ell, can't |
| 18:26.22 | *** join/#zaurus bflong (~bflong@24.229.103.140) |
| 18:26.59 | hcarty | Hmm...looks like they haven't done the pim apps yet |
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| 18:32.42 | kyngel | Hmm... now that I get my personal Z back, how should I re-flash? OZ 3.3.1, or tkC RC4? |
| 18:34.18 | hcarty | I'm interested in seeing what the tkc rom is like, I really like the boost in speed with the sharp 3.1 rom |
| 18:34.40 | hcarty | Though I miss some of the extra nifties in OZ, and I can't sync with linux |
| 18:34.50 | fliplap | afaik 3.3.1 isn't out yet |
| 18:34.51 | kergoth | 3.3.2 of OZ will release pretty soon here with 2.4.21-cl1 |
| 18:35.26 | fliplap | but maybe i just wasn't paying attention |
| 18:35.37 | kergoth | nah 3.3.1 never released |
| 18:35.45 | kergoth | but it was the version string in some experimental c700 roms |
| 18:35.49 | kergoth | so i'm just bumping the revision |
| 18:36.24 | hcarty | kergoth: Is the kernel version largely responsible for the better speed? |
| 18:36.31 | kergoth | probably |
| 18:36.42 | kergoth | the bootup time alone is cut *big time* due to jffs2 mount time andt he like |
| 18:36.56 | hcarty | Cool |
| 18:37.02 | TheMasterMind1 | isn't there another cl too/ |
| 18:37.14 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: ? |
| 18:37.23 | kergoth | hmm, not afaik |
| 18:38.02 | TheMasterMind1 | hm. must just be me then |
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| 18:53.02 | kergoth | so yeah, sd on 2.4.21 is a ways off yet |
| 18:53.16 | fliplap | heh, suck |
| 18:54.01 | George`NotHere | kergoth: won't the 2.4.18 driver load? |
| 18:54.10 | kergoth | null pointer deref in the module init function |
| 18:54.16 | kergoth | when parsing the partition table |
| 18:54.26 | kergoth | *identical* behavior to when i made the 2.4.6 driver load in 2.4.19 |
| 18:54.38 | kergoth | i guarantee sharp patched 2.4.18 to undo the block layer changes that occurred in 2.4.10 |
| 18:54.42 | kergoth | which is why they're behaving the same |
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| 18:57.19 | fliplap | bah, i don't want to goto work |
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| 18:58.30 | ljp-laptop_ | I do. but I have a long commute ahead |
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| 19:06.03 | *** join/#zaurus flipPDA (~flipPDA@ip68-2-32-53.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 19:06.17 | absentia | oss example: |
| 19:06.30 | absentia | checking for gmp library matching with header... problem! |
| 19:06.30 | absentia | Link failure! Look for stale libgmp.so in your dynamic link path! |
| 19:06.30 | absentia | Your gmp library either has no version symbols, is not the correct 'gmp', |
| 19:06.30 | absentia | or the major versions of your gmp library and gmp header differ. |
| 19:06.30 | absentia | You cannot have two versions of the gmp library in your dynamic (.so) |
| 19:06.30 | absentia | library search path, this may be your problem. |
| 19:06.44 | absentia | You should upgrade gmp from the URL below. |
| 19:06.44 | absentia | If you do not want to upgrade gmp system wide: |
| 19:06.44 | absentia | You may make a directory "gmp" in the current directory |
| 19:06.44 | absentia | and place libgmp.a and gmp.h in that directory, and I will |
| 19:06.44 | absentia | autodetect it next time you run configure. |
| 19:06.45 | absentia | ok |
| 19:06.55 | absentia | I got the latest from the url... intaslled. same error |
| 19:07.09 | absentia | I made ./gmp ... put in gmp.h and libgmp.a in ./gmp/ ... same error |
| 19:07.34 | absentia | the code released that says get the latest version was released just recently, AFTER the release of the gmp |
| 19:07.38 | absentia | yet, it doesn't work |
| 19:07.54 | fliplap | wow, scrolly |
| 19:08.52 | absentia | so, what does someone do? hmmmm. |
| 19:08.53 | fliplap | i'm still not sure exactly why you think this is place to vert your frustration with open source software |
| 19:09.05 | absentia | flip: nice try. |
| 19:09.16 | absentia | I was chatting on OZ 'bout oz, but was told that OZ is now OE so I went to OE |
| 19:09.28 | absentia | then I was told that OE was just for developer talk, not chit chat, so I went to #Zaurus. |
| 19:09.50 | absentia | I was talking about zaurus stuff... zaurus related.. but then I got annoyed that it seemed it was the same/typical linsux mindset shit. |
| 19:10.11 | *** join/#zaurus [iago] (don@cluefone.com) |
| 19:11.12 | fliplap | ok, so what does that 13 lines of scrolling error have todo with the zaurus |
| 19:11.29 | kergoth | absolutely nothing, clearly |
| 19:11.52 | [iago] | i just purchased a zaurus, do you recommend upgrading to OZ? |
| 19:11.55 | absentia | Zzz |
| 19:12.00 | absentia | no |
| 19:12.28 | fliplap | [iago]: i like it better than the sharp rom, some don't |
| 19:12.32 | [iago] | upgrading is the wrong word methinks, recommend using OZ? |
| 19:12.47 | kergoth | You're best off trying out your various options, then decide what you prefer. |
| 19:12.48 | fliplap | [iago]: since you just got your Z, you might try it, you can always go back |
| 19:12.51 | [iago] | fliplap: would a longtime debian user like it more than the flash rom? |
| 19:13.10 | fliplap | [iago]: i'm a long time debian user, and i like it better |
| 19:13.15 | kergoth | most likely, OZ uses debian's distributionisms, like /etc/network/interfaces, updater-alternatives, etc |
| 19:14.35 | [iago] | fliplap: how does kaffe compare to sharp's implementation of java? |
| 19:14.52 | [iago] | fliplap: or can i use 'personal java' ? |
| 19:14.53 | fliplap | can't really tell you, i don't use java on the Z |
| 19:15.04 | [iago] | fliplap: groovy |
| 19:16.00 | absentia | yup... code blew up compiling first .c .... knew it was shit. |
| 19:17.04 | treke | of course you may have fucked it up when you hacked the configure script |
| 19:17.33 | fliplap | he's taking the Max Power approach |
| 19:17.45 | absentia | treke: Bzzzt. good fucking try |
| 19:17.56 | fliplap | doing it the wrong way....but faster! |
| 19:17.58 | absentia | that's another fucking oss thing. now it's my fault. |
| 19:18.10 | treke | It probably is your fault |
| 19:18.23 | kergoth | absentia: supply a config.cache, thats always the preferred method for bypassing tests. |
| 19:18.29 | fliplap | i'm gonna go with absolutely your fault |
| 19:18.33 | kergoth | absentia: and this is highly offtopic. |
| 19:18.43 | absentia | ../include/config.h:42:21: options.h: No such file or directory |
| 19:18.43 | absentia | ../include/config.h:296:22: warning: extra tokens at end of #undef directive |
| 19:18.43 | absentia | ../include/config.h:297:22: warning: extra tokens at end of #undef directive |
| 19:18.51 | absentia | ../include/struct.h:650: syntax error before "u_int32_t" |
| 19:18.59 | absentia | that's not gmp. |
| 19:19.02 | kergoth | so email the maintainer and bitch |
| 19:19.05 | absentia | that's LOCAL to this app. |
| 19:19.07 | fliplap | offtopic isn't always bad tho, only when its _really annoying_ |
| 19:19.15 | kergoth | fliplap: oh, like this you mean? |
| 19:19.26 | fliplap | exactly |
| 19:19.38 | absentia | kergoth: ya, I know. I'm gonna go get another dit... this code.. although it's the "best" one... seems too linsuxed. |
| 19:20.16 | absentia | btw: I was trying to compile the dalnet ircd. |
| 19:20.26 | absentia | bahamut-1.4.35 |
| 19:20.30 | fliplap | haha |
| 19:20.44 | fliplap | someone's having a problem compiling ircd, there's a suprise |
| 19:21.31 | absentia | typical :-) |
| 19:22.37 | fliplap | yes, advanced ircd's, like dalnets, have always been a pita |
| 19:23.08 | fliplap | they don't expect normal users, or very early users, to run them |
| 19:23.20 | absentia | ok, try next devel release... .46 |
| 19:23.21 | absentia | checking for posix (O_NONBLOCK) nonblocking sockets... no |
| 19:23.21 | absentia | checking for bsd (O_NDELAY) nonblocking sockets... no |
| 19:23.21 | absentia | checking for sysv (FIONBIO) nonblocking sockets... no |
| 19:23.21 | absentia | configure: error: No nonblocking socket implementation found. ircd requires nonblocking sockets. |
| 19:23.28 | absentia | of course, it pased those checks for the .45 version |
| 19:23.28 | treke | hehe |
| 19:23.30 | fliplap | thats like bitching that all cars suck because you can't figure out how to assemble and Audi |
| 19:23.33 | treke | defintily looks ike user error |
| 19:23.34 | absentia | ok, now for the super experimental version.. |
| 19:23.47 | treke | absentia probably didnt read the INSTALL file |
| 19:23.56 | fliplap | treke: pebkac |
| 19:24.12 | absentia | that was .36, this is .35 |
| 19:24.13 | absentia | checking for posix (O_NONBLOCK) nonblocking sockets... O_NONBLOCK |
| 19:24.15 | absentia | woot! |
| 19:24.28 | absentia | INSTALL files now say: |
| 19:24.28 | fliplap | absentia: why don't you go on dalnet and complain? |
| 19:24.38 | absentia | ./configure; make ... "GOOD LUCK" .. the |
| 19:24.41 | treke | cd .. |
| 19:24.43 | absentia | only part that's relevant is the "GOOD LUCK" part. |
| 19:25.04 | absentia | ya, I haven't had a good bitchfest with diana in about 8 years. |
| 19:25.05 | kergoth | absentia: stop spamming the channel with your bitching. |
| 19:25.36 | kyngel | Can I flash with a FAT32-formatted card, or does it have to be plain FAT? |
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| 19:31.05 | Lolo- | hello |
| 19:32.38 | kyngel | Good afternoon. |
| 19:33.55 | fliplap | kyngel: i couldn't tell ya, probably better off with plain fat tho |
| 19:36.28 | kyngel | Thanks... I went ahead and formatted the card as FAT anyway. |
| 19:36.39 | kyngel | So I'm probably better off, since some people do specify FAT16. |
| 19:37.38 | fliplap | yeah |
| 19:38.49 | kyngel | Hmm... I wonder if I should swap my old Z for one of the ones we just got in. :) |
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| 20:35.42 | George- | sorry about all those nick changes ;) |
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| 21:37.09 | absentiaS | re |
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| 21:38.33 | absentiaS | hmm |
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