| 00:00:02 | Neo|Work | I'm kind of running dry of things to port so. :) |
| 00:00:16 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: I get a deal with them which gives me the source and right to port it |
| 00:00:21 | Cloudchaser | cool |
| 00:00:25 | inomine | you got a list of port you done? |
| 00:00:30 | Cloudchaser | how bout the millenium digger too? |
| 00:02:22 | Cloudchaser | ooh it started neo! |
| 00:02:26 | inomine | the main problem is that while ther are a number of games already there they are all short-term affairs |
| 00:02:28 | Neo|Work | inomine: http://eongames.com/ |
| 00:02:45 | Neo|Work | + RocketElite and Motocross Stunt Racer that will be coming soon |
| 00:02:53 | Neo|Work | MSR needs to be finished for PPC first though. :) |
| 00:03:04 | Cloudchaser | ooh that one sounds fun.. is there a demo for stunt racer? |
| 00:03:11 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: good. :) |
| 00:03:23 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: it's not done yet so no. Not even screenshots yet :) |
| 00:04:13 | inomine | oooh strategic assault |
| 00:05:10 | inomine | interstellar flames looks amazing |
| 00:05:23 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: Ok, sent those two as well |
| 00:05:31 | Cloudchaser | thanks neo |
| 00:05:32 | Neo|Work | inomine: SA now available for $6.99. :) |
| 00:05:45 | Cloudchaser | this rocket light looks cool.. just have to figure it out |
| 00:05:46 | Neo|Work | of coruse there's never any guarantee |
| 00:05:52 | inomine | you pay percentage to the org developer? |
| 00:06:16 | Neo|Work | more like they pay me a percentage (well, I pay them generally but they get the larger part) |
| 00:06:25 | inomine | oh ok |
| 00:07:12 | inomine | nice diary btw :P |
| 00:07:24 | Neo|Work | heh. Need to write some more |
| 00:07:35 | Neo|Work | other things that frustrate me (TM) :-) |
| 00:07:54 | inomine | yeah always interesting to read |
| 00:09:57 | Neo|Work | and at least the fullscreen one seems to be popular |
| 00:10:06 | inomine | :) |
| 00:10:38 | Neo|Work | I need to revise it some however |
| 00:10:53 | inomine | if you need any of your games beta testing btw im willing to help |
| 00:11:18 | Neo|Work | send a mail to info@eongames.com and I'll add you to the other person on the list. :)) |
| 00:11:26 | Neo|Work | that said, in GENERAL I do open testing in here. :) |
| 00:11:36 | inomine | lol |
| 00:14:05 | ljp | you mean you find guinea pigs here |
| 00:15:20 | inomine | right email sent |
| 00:15:41 | Neo|Work | ljp: hehe |
| 00:17:46 | Neo|Work | Wow. Got a response from the Dragon Bane 2 ppl already |
| 00:17:56 | Neo|Work | that was quick. |
| 00:17:59 | inomine | saying? |
| 00:18:06 | Cloudchaser | wow |
| 00:18:12 | Cloudchaser | and? |
| 00:18:22 | inomine | ... |
| 00:18:24 | Neo|Work | "sure" but I don't know if they expect me to pay for a license so I wrote a followup clarifying I can't afford to pay for it |
| 00:18:31 | Cloudchaser | hehe |
| 00:18:40 | Neo|Work | but instead do commissison stuff |
| 00:18:47 | Cloudchaser | hey neo.. can you do that for an application other than a game? |
| 00:18:58 | Cloudchaser | if its for ppc |
| 00:19:10 | inomine | port wince to familiar :) |
| 00:19:14 | Neo|Work | well, games are actually generally easier. :)) |
| 00:19:25 | Neo|Work | apps generally use MFC or crap (the GUI stuff) |
| 00:19:31 | Neo|Work | which I'm guessing will be painful to port |
| 00:19:38 | Neo|Work | any specific app in mind? |
| 00:19:42 | Cloudchaser | yes |
| 00:19:50 | Cloudchaser | term force by ruksun |
| 00:20:00 | Cloudchaser | i emailed them to see if they would port to z |
| 00:20:04 | Cloudchaser | they said they had no plans to |
| 00:20:09 | Cloudchaser | if i could, i'd do it myself |
| 00:20:15 | Cloudchaser | but i don't know how ;( |
| 00:20:28 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: what would the benefit be of it over say konsole? |
| 00:20:33 | Neo|Work | just a terminal right? |
| 00:20:43 | Cloudchaser | its a term emulator that logs sessions |
| 00:20:58 | Neo|Work | is it ment for serial stuff or? |
| 00:21:00 | Cloudchaser | vt100 serial |
| 00:21:01 | treke|home | I'm guessing its more like minicom + konsole than just konsole |
| 00:21:02 | Cloudchaser | yes |
| 00:21:20 | Neo|Work | what treke said - minicom might perhaps work |
| 00:21:33 | Cloudchaser | yes but i want it pretty and gui |
| 00:21:39 | treke|home | Cloudchaser: Have you tried minicom? It's not as z friendly, but it might work :) |
| 00:21:55 | Cloudchaser | i don't have serial cable yet.. cause i had no term app |
| 00:22:02 | treke|home | Dragon Bane 2 looks pretty cool |
| 00:22:21 | Cloudchaser | http://www.ruksun.com/mobile_computing/windowsce/Products/TermForce/index.html |
| 00:22:34 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: found the URL |
| 00:22:45 | Neo|Work | treke|home: it does. Hopefully they are reasonable. :-)) |
| 00:22:56 | Neo|Work | hate to get a "sure" followed by a 'never mind then" |
| 00:22:59 | treke|home | Cloudchaser: I think there actually is one |
| 00:23:11 | Cloudchaser | http://www.ruksun.com/mobile_computing/windowsce/Products/TermForce/screenshots.html |
| 00:23:13 | Cloudchaser | like that? |
| 00:23:33 | Cloudchaser | it logs too |
| 00:23:38 | Cloudchaser | thats important |
| 00:23:45 | treke|home | I dont know if it logs. Looking on handango |
| 00:23:52 | Cloudchaser | whats it called? |
| 00:24:06 | treke|home | Dont remember |
| 00:24:19 | Neo|Work | isn't there one that's expensive as hell? |
| 00:24:31 | treke|home | Thats what I was thinking |
| 00:24:33 | warmi | re |
| 00:24:40 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: but to answer your query, I'm sure there are easier Linux terminal apps to port |
| 00:24:42 | inomine | how about porting pocketdivx ? |
| 00:24:58 | Neo|Work | inomine: crossed my mind but I don't really care myself. |
| 00:25:13 | inomine | oh.. bugger |
| 00:25:19 | treke|home | inomine: Tkc is already doing something similar |
| 00:25:30 | treke|home | would be hell to compete with them. they own the zaurus market |
| 00:25:35 | Cloudchaser | i haven't found anything like that for linux |
| 00:25:45 | inomine | what divx? |
| 00:25:53 | Cloudchaser | no the term em |
| 00:25:57 | inomine | oh |
| 00:26:07 | Speedy2 | www.divx.com |
| 00:26:11 | treke|home | I'd be surprised if minicom cant log |
| 00:26:13 | Cloudchaser | damn battery barely lasts half hour any more |
| 00:26:17 | Cloudchaser | i don't like minicom |
| 00:26:43 | Cloudchaser | neo ports ppc stuff (games) so i thought i'd ask him if he could do other kinds of aps |
| 00:26:48 | Cloudchaser | i'd gladly buy it |
| 00:26:59 | Cloudchaser | i bought the term force ;) |
| 00:27:52 | Neo|Work | Ok, DB2 guy is reasonable. /me gives him a call. |
| 00:28:09 | warmi | DB2 ?? |
| 00:28:12 | Cloudchaser | yay! |
| 00:28:16 | warmi | you gonna port DB2 Neo ? |
| 00:28:18 | warmi | hehehe |
| 00:28:37 | treke|home | warmi: wrong db2 :) |
| 00:28:51 | Neo|Work | warmi: yes, as in Dragon Bane 2 |
| 00:28:57 | warmi | oh ok |
| 00:28:58 | warmi | hehe |
| 00:29:03 | Neo|Work | not as in the IBM database. :) |
| 00:29:38 | inomine | lol |
| 00:29:55 | warmi | is that some sort of RPG style game? |
| 00:29:59 | inomine | port oracle sql server to zaurus :) |
| 00:30:06 | inomine | warmi: yep |
| 00:30:08 | warmi | Oracle is working on it |
| 00:30:17 | warmi | I kid you not .. acording to JasonNJ |
| 00:30:24 | Neo|Work | warmi: looks like Bards Tale kinda |
| 00:30:30 | warmi | PocketORacle or whatever they call it |
| 00:30:40 | warmi | NeoTron: yeah, I am on their page now |
| 00:30:48 | warmi | looks like a Palm game |
| 00:30:56 | inomine | it is a palm game |
| 00:30:56 | treke|home | warmi: It is |
| 00:31:00 | treke|home | warmi: Palm and PPC |
| 00:31:02 | Cloudchaser | neo will rocketlite install to sd in final? |
| 00:31:31 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: yes |
| 00:31:39 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: the version you have SHOULD install to SD |
| 00:31:44 | Neo|Work | granted /tmp/ has enough space |
| 00:31:55 | Cloudchaser | ah ok i'll try that then .. |
| 00:32:00 | Cloudchaser | how much for full version? |
| 00:32:05 | inomine | how much you thinking rocket elite will cost? |
| 00:32:12 | Neo|Work | Cloudchaser: undetermined |
| 00:32:23 | Neo|Work | inomine: see answer to Cloudchaser. :-) |
| 00:32:26 | Cloudchaser | hehe |
| 00:32:27 | inomine | :) |
| 00:32:30 | Neo|Work | I migt make it < $10 |
| 00:32:36 | Neo|Work | depends on my experiement I guess |
| 00:32:49 | inomine | nice |
| 00:33:06 | treke|home | I think that means go buy lots of copies of SA at 6 bucks |
| 00:33:17 | warmi | NeoWork: maybe you should start porting stuff the other way ... like from Linux to Windows |
| 00:33:19 | warmi | hehe |
| 00:33:24 | inomine | noooooooooooo |
| 00:33:31 | inomine | blasphemy |
| 00:33:38 | treke|home | warmi: Oh yeah, that would give him what? 0 apps to port? |
| 00:33:43 | warmi | that's from purely financial perspective |
| 00:33:50 | warmi | I am not talking about games |
| 00:34:01 | warmi | there are other cools Unix apps |
| 00:34:05 | Speedy2 | grep |
| 00:34:08 | warmi | KDE perhaps or something like that |
| 00:34:10 | warmi | hehehe |
| 00:34:15 | Speedy2 | Hey warmi |
| 00:34:22 | warmi | hi Speedy2 |
| 00:34:23 | warmi | hehe |
| 00:34:24 | inomine | lol at kde |
| 00:34:34 | treke|home | http://kde-cygwin.sourceforge.net/ |
| 00:34:36 | warmi | I don't mean entire KDE |
| 00:34:36 | Neo|Work | warmi: there's like nothing to port to Windows. :) |
| 00:34:41 | warmi | just some KDE apps |
| 00:34:49 | Speedy2 | WOw |
| 00:34:52 | Speedy2 | KDE on Windows! |
| 00:34:53 | Speedy2 | Cool! |
| 00:34:57 | Neo|Work | but I will do porting of say Bust'em to Linux desktop but also to MacOS X |
| 00:35:02 | warmi | well, then just port Apache to PPC or something :-) |
| 00:35:07 | warmi | MacOSX ?? |
| 00:35:10 | warmi | you got one of these ? |
| 00:35:30 | Neo|Work | warmi: nah, but I'm porting to SDL so I just need to find someone to compile it for me |
| 00:35:38 | Neo|Work | SDLRoids compiled out-of-the-box for MacOS X |
| 00:35:56 | Neo|Work | and I want MacOS X because it has a fair chance of selling decently |
| 00:36:39 | Neo|Work | tham this guy is fast. As fast as me with emails. That usually surprises me. :) |
| 00:36:54 | warmi | NeoTron: that is a entirely different ball game .. on the desktop you are not going to compete vs creators of RocketElite or such but versus guys like EA, Activision etc |
| 00:36:54 | warmi | heeh |
| 00:37:26 | Neo|Work | warmi: MacOS X Shareware isn't bad |
| 00:37:27 | warmi | anyway, I am gonna stay with Z , perhaps port Puzz-le to PPC etc .. |
| 00:37:32 | Neo|Work | actually that's a good market |
| 00:37:43 | warmi | yeah, MacOSX is actually pretty good market at this point |
| 00:37:51 | Neo|Work | a word of advice from the insiders: puzzles don't sell, generally |
| 00:37:59 | Neo|Work | or MacOS in general |
| 00:38:11 | treke|home | yah, people who arent accustom to free software, but not as cheap as windows users |
| 00:38:26 | Neo|Work | indeed |
| 00:38:28 | warmi | well, I am not going to make business out of it .. maybe won't even bother with porting who knows |
| 00:38:37 | Neo|Work | and where software is limited |
| 00:38:52 | warmi | OS-X users are rich ! |
| 00:38:53 | Neo|Work | warmi: just saying that it might not be worth the trouble |
| 00:38:56 | Obsian | Hey, what's the info on the security problem with the Zaurus? |
| 00:39:00 | warmi | they have to be .. rich or stupid :-) |
| 00:39:08 | Neo|Work | warmi: nah, they bought the hardware and are now broke |
| 00:39:09 | treke|home | Obsian: not fixed yet |
| 00:39:16 | Obsian | How bad is it? |
| 00:39:16 | warmi | to pay that kind of money for what is an inferior hardware |
| 00:39:17 | warmi | hehe |
| 00:39:44 | Neo|Work | warmi: I'd love a MacOS X box |
| 00:39:53 | Neo|Work | for development but also for video editing and stuff |
| 00:40:07 | inomine | get a sgi box for vid editing |
| 00:40:07 | warmi | yeah. me to .. but not for that price .. |
| 00:40:26 | warmi | for that price I can get screaming dual Athlon with 1 GHz of mem |
| 00:40:48 | warmi | btw ...apropo Dragon Bane 2 .. |
| 00:40:53 | Obsian | Where is an article/info describing the security prob? I'd like to know more... |
| 00:40:58 | warmi | I never thought I would see RPM game for the PALM !! |
| 00:40:58 | zappin | You can get a Dual 1.3 Duron box for about $220 |
| 00:40:59 | inomine | yeah exactly, basicly pc are more powerfull than macs |
| 00:40:59 | warmi | uhu |
| 00:41:07 | warmi | RPG even |
| 00:41:10 | zappin | well not really |
| 00:41:20 | treke|home | Obsian: basically the problem is that the zaurus doesnt require a password to log in over ftp |
| 00:41:32 | warmi | zappin: I mean dual athlon MP |
| 00:41:47 | inomine | RPM game.. guess the correct install sequence of kde4 :) |
| 00:41:50 | treke|home | Obsian: And the encryption algorythm on the screen lock password isnt all that strong |
| 00:42:13 | Obsian | treke|home:Can ftp be disabled? |
| 00:42:21 | treke|home | Obsian: no |
| 00:43:14 | ljp | opie now does |
| 00:43:17 | Obsian | treke|home: So someone can ftp into my Z and access ??? |
| 00:43:25 | Neo|Work | warmi: I do remember testing Dragon Bane (first one) on PalmOS |
| 00:43:28 | treke|home | ljp: yean and now opie cant sync |
| 00:43:38 | ljp | heheh sure it can |
| 00:43:52 | ljp | ya have to use qtopiadesktop 1.5.1 |
| 00:43:58 | warmi | NeoWork:perhaps.. it is just Palm doesn't seem to be a perfect platform for RPG .. maybe it is just me |
| 00:44:06 | treke|home | well maybe if someone other than *you* had 1.5.1 |
| 00:44:11 | ljp | hahahaha |
| 00:44:15 | Neo|Work | warmi: it's really not that bad |
| 00:44:34 | ljp | I should check to see if it wil sync.. and has the password functions |
| 00:44:36 | treke|home | besides, If I'm gonna sync, I wanna go all the way and use outlook :) |
| 00:44:40 | Neo|Work | I mean, move with arrow keys and use stylus + onscreen buttons and other hardware buttons as the interfcce |
| 00:45:01 | ljp | but tonight I need to test some audio equipment.. :) |
| 00:48:01 | Cloudchaser | thanks neo :) you guys are great :) |
| 00:48:12 | Cloudchaser | like application genies |
| 00:48:42 | ljp | genies? |
| 00:48:48 | Cloudchaser | gets out the magic teapot and rubs it |
| 00:49:02 | Cloudchaser | out pops the developer.. your wish is my command! :) |
| 00:49:12 | inomine | oooh |
| 00:49:22 | inomine | commands genie to port divx |
| 00:49:28 | Cloudchaser | nono |
| 00:49:34 | Cloudchaser | you can't really command them |
| 00:49:37 | Cloudchaser | they hate that |
| 00:49:41 | inomine | ok ok |
| 00:49:47 | Cloudchaser | they like to think its their idea :) |
| 00:50:22 | ljp | yepp.. we hates that |
| 00:50:26 | Cloudchaser | nods |
| 00:50:27 | inomine | asks genie nicely to port divx (and tells him he is willing to pay for it) |
| 00:50:38 | Neo|Work | I like the idea that genies are damn evil beings (thats' the original myth is it not)? |
| 00:50:45 | ljp | divx is already ported.. where you been? |
| 00:50:52 | inomine | it is??? |
| 00:50:56 | ljp | sure |
| 00:50:56 | Neo|Work | inomine: tkc should (has?) come out with a plyer |
| 00:50:57 | inomine | url plz |
| 00:51:05 | ljp | not ready for prime time |
| 00:51:05 | inomine | no its still no there |
| 00:51:11 | ljp | and doesn't show video yet |
| 00:51:15 | Cloudchaser | likes evil genies |
| 00:51:16 | inomine | grr |
| 00:51:26 | ljp | but the audio works |
| 00:51:30 | inomine | evil genies toy with me :( |
| 00:51:42 | warmi | Neo|Work: you should really keep bothering Bejeweled guys .. |
| 00:51:50 | warmi | that would be a hit |
| 00:51:54 | Cloudchaser | hmm my z is getting very warm plugged in |
| 00:51:55 | Neo|Work | warmi: I don't know if I care. :P |
| 00:52:02 | Neo|Work | they didn't even answer me |
| 00:52:08 | darienm | Cloudchaser: I got REKALL working |
| 00:52:10 | Cloudchaser | don't remember that happening, but then i don't usually hold it when its plugged in |
| 00:52:12 | Cloudchaser | oooh |
| 00:52:14 | Neo|Work | I guess I could go directly to popcap rather than the palm porting house |
| 00:52:15 | Cloudchaser | you did/?? |
| 00:52:19 | Cloudchaser | what did you have eto do? |
| 00:52:27 | inomine | right tis 3 and im off to bed.. nn |
| 00:52:30 | darienm | Cloudchaser: You're gonna hate this |
| 00:52:37 | Cloudchaser | cringes |
| 00:52:43 | Cloudchaser | hard reset? |
| 00:52:44 | ljp | NeoTron: you porting palm games? |
| 00:52:52 | Neo|Work | ljp: nope |
| 00:52:56 | darienm | Cloudchaser: First, I manually ipkg install'ed all three packages to /mnt/card/<directory> |
| 00:53:07 | Cloudchaser | ack! |
| 00:53:07 | Neo|Work | I meant "pda porting house' rather |
| 00:53:10 | Neo|Work | they have palm and PPC |
| 00:53:12 | darienm | Cloudchaser: where <directory> was rekall, database, and python |
| 00:53:22 | Neo|Work | PalmOS stuff would be so unimpressive |
| 00:53:31 | Cloudchaser | just /mnt/card/rekall |
| 00:53:33 | Cloudchaser | like that? |
| 00:53:34 | darienm | Cloudchaser: then I manually symlink'ed all directories to /mnt/card (about 10 of them) |
| 00:53:40 | Cloudchaser | nooooo |
| 00:53:42 | Cloudchaser | cries |
| 00:53:55 | darienm | Cloudchaser: Then I copied only those files in /lib/ that NEEDED to be in /lib/ |
| 00:54:08 | Cloudchaser | sobs |
| 00:54:18 | darienm | Cloudchaser: Then I placed the .desktop file into one of my tabs, restarted qtopia |
| 00:54:37 | darienm | Cloudchaser: My goal was to put the absolute MINIMUM on RAM storage |
| 00:54:52 | darienm | Cloudchaser: I think I got away with about 1.6 megs, 95% of which are /libs/ |
| 00:54:54 | ljp | notes that cloudchaser cries alot |
| 00:55:14 | oGMo | crud, i'm totally missing where the latest 5500 rom is on sharp's site |
| 00:55:17 | darienm | Cloudchaser: so anyway, I havent USED it yet -- but it launches so I'm gonna play |
| 00:55:23 | darienm | Cloudchaser: I have all my history. You want a copy? |
| 00:55:42 | warmi | oGMo: http://www.myzaurus.com/ROMupdate3.asp |
| 00:56:01 | darienm | hands Cloudchaser a tissue |
| 00:56:06 | darienm | gives Cloudchaser a big hug |
| 00:56:08 | oGMo | warmi: thanks =) |
| 00:56:10 | darienm | its gonna be alright |
| 00:56:15 | Cloudchaser | yes please |
| 00:56:32 | darienm | Cloudchaser: Do you connect to your Z with ssh ? |
| 00:57:01 | Cloudchaser | no |
| 00:57:06 | Cloudchaser | samba |
| 00:57:17 | Cloudchaser | or ftp but i like samba better |
| 00:57:44 | ljp | do you listen to samba when youre using samba? |
| 00:57:54 | Speedy2 | Bye all |
| 00:58:13 | Cloudchaser | hehe bye speedy |
| 01:02:21 | ljp | hmmm that qtopiadesktop I have doesnt have any password features.. |
| 01:03:16 | Neo|Work | is away: home |
| 01:04:46 | warmi | ljp: today I proposed on this channel |
| 01:05:12 | warmi | to make you a person responsible for leading OPIE project |
| 01:05:27 | treke|home | ljp: He was shortly thereafter laughed out of the channel |
| 01:05:34 | warmi | OPIE needs someone like Linus .. |
| 01:05:38 | warmi | I am serious |
| 01:05:52 | ljp | laughed? |
| 01:05:55 | warmi | there is absolutely no guidlines, no future plans nothing |
| 01:06:01 | warmi | he is bullshiting you |
| 01:06:02 | warmi | ehehe |
| 01:06:02 | ljp | hmmm not true |
| 01:06:22 | warmi | there is no one who would look ever the code or even the app and said ... |
| 01:06:25 | ljp | its mor elike anarchy, really |
| 01:06:43 | ljp | someone feels lik efixing a bug, or doing something.. |
| 01:06:46 | warmi | you know what ? you app looks like nothing else in OPIE .. you cannot just have buttons all over the place ...e tc .. |
| 01:06:58 | ljp | what app? |
| 01:07:10 | warmi | no .. this is just a quote .. |
| 01:07:16 | ljp | hmmm |
| 01:07:17 | warmi | read my previous sentence |
| 01:07:25 | warmi | there is no one who would look ever the code or even the app and said ... |
| 01:07:31 | warmi | "you know what ? you app looks like nothing else in OPIE .. you cannot just have buttons all over the place ...e tc .." |
| 01:07:37 | ljp | oohhh.. |
| 01:07:51 | ljp | you mean to keep a opie standard type of thing |
| 01:07:57 | warmi | exactly |
| 01:08:07 | ljp | I would be laughed out |
| 01:08:07 | warmi | as I said to kergoth |
| 01:08:24 | warmi | if this continues then OPIE will be a nice "well" of ideas for other to use |
| 01:08:34 | warmi | but it will never be nice, unified desktop |
| 01:08:35 | ljp | people have even suggested that we implement some kind of coding standard |
| 01:08:39 | warmi | the way KDE is |
| 01:09:06 | warmi | coding standard is ok |
| 01:09:06 | ljp | but kde is huge and the pda is different |
| 01:09:18 | ljp | coding standard woul dnot owrk |
| 01:09:21 | ljp | not work |
| 01:09:30 | warmi | I know but even PDA needs some sort of GUI/usability guidlines |
| 01:09:41 | ljp | true |
| 01:09:51 | warmi | some sort of document that will specify what is the menu structure OPIE apps should use |
| 01:10:00 | ljp | there's sort of a look already in place |
| 01:10:03 | warmi | some standard set of icons .. where icons should be located |
| 01:10:04 | warmi | etc . |
| 01:10:20 | warmi | my impressions is that at this point people just tend to follow Qtopia guidelines |
| 01:10:23 | ljp | we have that.. but each app has its own icons |
| 01:10:37 | ljp | I can tell you what I do.. |
| 01:10:52 | ljp | I develop something that I can stand using |
| 01:11:03 | ljp | or try |
| 01:11:17 | ljp | no one wants to be the cop |
| 01:11:24 | warmi | hehehe |
| 01:11:25 | warmi | I know |
| 01:11:33 | Cloudchaser | i'll be the cop :) |
| 01:11:43 | Cloudchaser | j/k |
| 01:11:44 | ljp | so for coding standards.. its usually set by the author/maintainer |
| 01:12:11 | warmi | I wonder how KDE works |
| 01:12:12 | Cloudchaser | i see what warmi is saying |
| 01:12:13 | ljp | and if someone adds to some file.. it should stay in the style that it is |
| 01:12:21 | Cloudchaser | look what happened with the security patch |
| 01:12:25 | Cloudchaser | big oops there |
| 01:12:36 | ljp | welll... yes... the intentions were good |
| 01:12:45 | Cloudchaser | like the left hand didn't know what the right hand was doing |
| 01:12:55 | treke|home | Cloudchaser: The security patch doesnt seem to be an opps as much as syncing being less important to them than the security issue |
| 01:12:56 | ljp | but someone jumped the gun and was either too busy of forgot to test it |
| 01:12:57 | Cloudchaser | yes the intentions were good ;) |
| 01:13:43 | ljp | well.. the opps in the patch was that the security app et the allowed ip in one form, hex, and the patch read it in another, string |
| 01:14:14 | ljp | but |
| 01:14:34 | ljp | qtopiadesktop needs to catch up, |
| 01:14:50 | ljp | I think kergoth is going to roll back that area, tho |
| 01:14:56 | Cloudchaser | yes he said so |
| 01:15:17 | Cloudchaser | i think zecke has the new version of qtopia so it worked for him? |
| 01:15:21 | ljp | but going from no password to 'Qtopia' isnt really secure either |
| 01:15:29 | Cloudchaser | lol true |
| 01:15:36 | warmi | ljp: are you guys going to let Trolls dictate future look and general ideas how Qtopia/OPIE should work ? |
| 01:15:37 | Cloudchaser | specially since its public knowledge |
| 01:15:49 | warmi | I am just asking cause that would be one of possible solutions to that problem |
| 01:16:05 | treke|home | Cloudchaser: I dont think he ever uses qtopiadesktop |
| 01:16:12 | treke|home | Cloudchaser: He's probably using KitchenSync |
| 01:16:15 | ljp | warmi: that depends. Their ideas are usually good. like the new audiowidget skinning |
| 01:16:21 | Cloudchaser | oh |
| 01:16:28 | Cloudchaser | can we use kitchen sync? |
| 01:16:37 | treke|home | if you want to use kdepim |
| 01:16:39 | warmi | ljp: do you know how they are goin to solve document tab mess ? |
| 01:16:49 | ljp | I think the stumbling nblock with that is that kdepim is broken in cvs |
| 01:16:49 | warmi | kergoth had some very good ideas .. |
| 01:17:07 | treke|home | ah |
| 01:17:24 | warmi | for solving this issue .. like having easily accesible database of installed files so these can be skipped when scanning for documents |
| 01:17:41 | warmi | I wonder how trolls are going to solve this problem |
| 01:18:01 | warmi | haven't had a time too look into their latest Qtopia snapshots |
| 01:18:37 | warmi | man Config File Editor is an awesome app |
| 01:18:47 | warmi | especially for coders |
| 01:19:01 | treke|home | yeah |
| 01:19:08 | treke|home | I love that one |
| 01:19:24 | ljp | well |
| 01:19:34 | ljp | if you love it so much, why not marry it? ;) |
| 01:19:40 | treke|home | ljp: I will |
| 01:20:11 | treke|home | waits till warmi tries textedit |
| 01:20:31 | treke|home | curious what his reaction would be to its ui :) |
| 01:20:53 | warmi | you mean Text Editor ? |
| 01:20:53 | ljp | whats wrong with textedit? |
| 01:20:59 | treke|home | yeah |
| 01:21:11 | warmi | it looks reasonable .. Qtopia standards |
| 01:21:15 | roge99 | hey kergoth .... did you have any reports of sd not working in the new oz ? |
| 01:21:18 | warmi | menus on the left .. icons on the rights |
| 01:21:47 | treke|home | ljp: My typical compalint :) the desktop or linked file popup box. The prompt for setting permissions on the file |
| 01:21:48 | kergoth | roge99: no, worked fine for jason |
| 01:21:57 | warmi | treke: why did you ask about TextEdit ? |
| 01:22:00 | kergoth | roge99: cardmon now manages both cf and sd |
| 01:22:02 | warmi | anything special about it ? |
| 01:22:08 | roge99 | ok letmmeee look somemore |
| 01:22:57 | treke|home | warmi: It does some user unfriendly things. Like asks you to set the permissions on files when you save. Asks you whether you want to open the .desktop file or the linked file if you use the documents tab |
| 01:23:06 | kergoth | is watching Army Of Darkness |
| 01:23:12 | treke|home | and something else ticked me off, but I forgot what it was :) |
| 01:23:30 | warmi | treke: I bet Sharp folks wouldn't like this sort of "techie" stuff :-) |
| 01:23:35 | ljp | I absolutely hated the fact I couldnt edit .desktop files |
| 01:23:51 | ljp | and what about if you are writing a script? |
| 01:24:09 | warmi | I remember BigBoss was complaining that Sharp folks didn't really like his FileExlplorer cause it was giving too much "power" to the user |
| 01:24:15 | kergoth | ljp: hide them. "Advanced Options [ ]" |
| 01:24:17 | warmi | ljp: I agree |
| 01:24:18 | ljp | the texteditor on sharp will change permissions from and executable to nonexecutable |
| 01:24:25 | ljp | tried |
| 01:24:26 | treke|home | warmi: I still use the original notepad |
| 01:24:27 | kergoth | ljp: i hated that with a passion |
| 01:24:30 | treke|home | ljp: It shouldnt do that |
| 01:24:37 | warmi | this stuff should have some sort of switch ( advanced|simple) |
| 01:24:42 | kergoth | it did though, i rmeember it fucking up the permissions |
| 01:24:45 | kergoth | warmi: exactly |
| 01:24:49 | warmi | so people are not ask about permisions in simple mode |
| 01:24:51 | treke|home | ljp: But bringing up a permissions dialog is unfriendly |
| 01:25:11 | treke|home | other text editors manage to not blitz permissions. |
| 01:25:19 | warmi | uh .. OpieSheet looks like it was straight port from Qt .. |
| 01:25:26 | kergoth | "Shop Smart, Shop S-Mart" |
| 01:25:32 | warmi | including their Toolbar which can be moved around :-) |
| 01:25:32 | kergoth | warmi: opie-sheet IS sheet/qt. |
| 01:25:36 | kergoth | hah |
| 01:25:47 | warmi | yeah.. was that backported from Qt3 ? |
| 01:26:07 | kergoth | dont believe so.. ask him :-) |
| 01:26:30 | ljp | ahhh I see.. when I changed to opiefileselector.. I lost my set permissions check box |
| 01:26:45 | ljp | so now it asks always |
| 01:27:04 | treke|home | if its supposed to be a checkbox, thats ok. |
| 01:27:25 | treke|home | Now just find a way to disable the .desktop prompt and you'll see me shut up for a while :) |
| 01:27:43 | treke|home | then I dont have to bitch at kergoth to make .desktop files into conffiles :) |
| 01:28:00 | warmi | I think this advanced FileSelector ( in Text Edit) should work with single click |
| 01:28:14 | ljp | oohh.. well.. I'm not saying I'm going to work on it! ;) |
| 01:28:37 | warmi | is this fileSelector the same thing that was posted on zauruszone.com ? |
| 01:28:44 | ljp | no |
| 01:28:46 | warmi | I believe it was ljp who wrote it |
| 01:29:03 | ljp | I did the zz thing. .but opiefileselector was zecke |
| 01:29:15 | warmi | ah ok |
| 01:29:53 | warmi | man OPIE is huge :-) |
| 01:29:54 | warmi | so many apps |
| 01:29:57 | roge99 | kergoth sd isnt workn here |
| 01:30:04 | warmi | at least compared with Qtopia |
| 01:30:45 | ljp | roge99: is there any card applet showing up? |
| 01:30:53 | warmi | hehe .. TabManager picked up CVS dir as a tab |
| 01:31:34 | roge99 | yea works fine for cf |
| 01:31:47 | roge99 | crdctl shows 2 sockets |
| 01:32:10 | roge99 | but nada when i try cardctl insert 1 |
| 01:32:25 | roge99 | nothing in syslogd or dmesg |
| 01:32:45 | roge99 | like the card isnt in it |
| 01:33:04 | Rascal | try cardctl insert 0 |
| 01:33:22 | roge99 | Rascal: thats the cf slot |
| 01:33:40 | Rascal | oh you're trying sd slot? |
| 01:33:53 | Rascal | hey kergoth |
| 01:34:01 | kergoth | at&t broadband blows. |
| 01:34:03 | roge99 | sharp_mmcsd_m is the only module i need for that slot ... right ? |
| 01:34:06 | Rascal | lol |
| 01:34:10 | kergoth | roge99: yes |
| 01:34:18 | Rascal | benmeyer told me to pester you for the java scripts |
| 01:34:22 | kergoth | roge99: make sure sdmgr is running also |
| 01:37:45 | roge99 | ok this is interesting |
| 01:37:55 | roge99 | sdmgr isnt running |
| 01:38:12 | roge99 | so i run /sbin/sdmgr ... and it looks ok |
| 01:38:30 | roge99 | check /var/log/messages |
| 01:38:45 | kergoth | roge99: hmm it ran on bootup when i flashed on mine.. odd.. |
| 01:39:15 | roge99 | it says daemon.err sdmgr[pid] No such file or directory |
| 01:39:49 | roge99 | ill reflash just to make sure somthing didn't get fscked up |
| 01:39:54 | kergoth | weird. |
| 01:45:44 | ljp | hey! there was a contest announcement |
| 01:46:02 | ljp | http://www.zaurus.com/dev/challenge |
| 01:46:09 | kergoth | yep |
| 01:46:15 | treke|home | hehe it was on the zaurus-general list earlier :) |
| 01:46:30 | treke|home | and JasonNJ just confirmed the obvious reason for the prizes :) |
| 01:47:31 | ljp | heh they're fishing for apps |
| 01:47:43 | treke|home | and they've got unsold 5500s :) |
| 01:47:56 | warmi | wish these were 5500 |
| 01:48:10 | treke|home | er 500s |
| 01:49:16 | warmi | ljp: we are not eligible anyway |
| 01:49:29 | warmi | but I am sure ljp would not mind to get his 3rd (sic) 5000d |
| 01:49:34 | warmi | heh |
| 01:50:25 | ljp | invents an alias |
| 01:50:46 | ljp | registers his cat as developer |
| 01:51:07 | ljp | they're only gicing out 5000d's? |
| 01:51:13 | ljp | giving even |
| 01:51:29 | warmi | yeah |
| 01:51:51 | ljp | ha and there's no free commercial qtopia license |
| 01:51:56 | warmi | no |
| 01:52:15 | warmi | raw deal .. but if you are going to develop free software for the ZAurus anyway then this is not bad |
| 01:52:26 | warmi | at least you can get a free 5500d |
| 01:52:47 | ljp | ha better en=mail client hahahah |
| 01:52:56 | ljp | email even |
| 01:53:12 | Cloudchaser | how come you're not eligible warmi? |
| 01:53:36 | treke|home | Cloudchaser: Previous winners of the contest cant enter |
| 01:53:51 | ljp | he won (beta) in the last contest |
| 01:53:52 | warmi | cause I already won 5000d |
| 01:54:17 | warmi | and the idea here is to increase number of developers not to stuff me with additional Zs |
| 01:54:24 | warmi | althought, I wouldn't mind that at all |
| 01:54:25 | warmi | hehe |
| 01:54:44 | ljp | grabs his kitty and proceeds to teach her how to write code |
| 01:54:55 | warmi | there are couple of questionable requests like "stable VNC client" ?? |
| 01:55:10 | treke|home | keypebble is pretty crappy |
| 01:55:49 | warmi | it works , doesn't it ? |
| 01:55:54 | treke|home | some times |
| 01:56:35 | treke|home | I've seen it do things like display a plain white background or maybe it was black |
| 01:57:07 | treke|home | plus it doesnt do really cool things like scaling |
| 01:57:34 | roge99 | kergoth ... reflashed ... same thing |
| 01:57:54 | warmi | whops .. |
| 01:57:57 | warmi | that's viewer |
| 01:58:01 | ljp | I wonder if they will keep redating the due dates |
| 01:58:02 | warmi | I was thinking VNC server |
| 01:58:06 | warmi | never mind |
| 01:58:21 | warmi | ljp: Trolls disease ? |
| 01:58:25 | ljp | hahaa |
| 01:58:51 | warmi | I wonder if they are going to get many entries in the first place |
| 01:59:04 | warmi | 1 person flight simulator ? |
| 01:59:05 | ljp | is going to prod some German opie devs that dont own 5000d's |
| 01:59:06 | warmi | wtf |
| 01:59:39 | warmi | " Music theory with tones" - something down your alley ljp |
| 01:59:44 | treke|home | problem is that 5000s are pretty usesless |
| 01:59:56 | warmi | treke: they are better then qvfb |
| 02:00:15 | ljp | too bad their windows commercial license wasnt $195 |
| 02:00:35 | tux_mike | ugh. |
| 02:00:37 | ljp | warmi: ya.. maybe I shoudl develop one and then get someone else to ente it |
| 02:00:43 | ljp | since its gpl'd |
| 02:00:45 | tux_mike | i use too much paper when i cod |
| 02:00:45 | tux_mike | e |
| 02:00:47 | ljp | :)_ |
| 02:00:47 | warmi | zecke was actually got pissed when he saw that new contest anouncement |
| 02:00:50 | warmi | I am not sure why .. |
| 02:00:57 | ljp | hmm |
| 02:01:06 | warmi | was > dev/null |
| 02:01:34 | warmi | tux_mike: paper ? |
| 02:01:39 | warmi | doing what ? |
| 02:01:51 | tux_mike | warmi: header files. notes. all sorts of stuff |
| 02:02:01 | warmi | that's so 80s man .. |
| 02:02:06 | warmi | multiple windows !! |
| 02:02:07 | warmi | :-) |
| 02:02:07 | tux_mike | i went through almost a ream and i'm only about half done with one file :) |
| 02:02:18 | tux_mike | i can't write notes on a vim window |
| 02:02:26 | warmi | don't use VIM then |
| 02:02:27 | warmi | hehe |
| 02:02:42 | tux_mike | i cant write notes in any editor :P |
| 02:02:43 | kergoth_ | curses at&t |
| 02:02:44 | warmi | just kidding |
| 02:03:13 | tux_mike | hrm... and i hate it when i write notes that make no sense |
| 02:03:22 | tux_mike | or look like they make no sense |
| 02:04:57 | tux_mike | and this file is gonna blow up in my face |
| 02:05:38 | warmi | tux_mike: this contest is for you man |
| 02:06:03 | ljp | I wonder why zecke got pissed at the contest.. |
| 02:06:13 | tux_mike | i think i have a chance in finishing before then, but, i dunno. with the way TT was with the last contest... |
| 02:06:21 | warmi | I mean he was mad at Sharp .. |
| 02:06:32 | warmi | I know this is not the greatest contest |
| 02:06:54 | warmi | but it is not like Sharp has any obligation to anyone here or anything like that |
| 02:07:19 | tux_mike | i have a good chance finishing the program, but it actually working is another story. i'm afraid to compile battlemech.cxx |
| 02:08:10 | treke|home | warmi: I think he feels like sharp is sort of pissing the zauruses away insteaf of giving them to people who are doing things already |
| 02:09:19 | warmi | well, perhaps they don't consider OPIE to be a "right thing" to do ( usefull) |
| 02:09:21 | warmi | I don't know |
| 02:09:45 | warmi | anyway, zecke can buy himself the Zaurus |
| 02:09:46 | ljp | ahhh |
| 02:10:32 | warmi | treke: are you workin on OPIE ? |
| 02:10:39 | treke|home | not really |
| 02:11:12 | treke|home | I just follow it closely, and occaisionally try bug fixing |
| 02:11:53 | warmi | I am workin now on showimg ... just finished final specs for my new desing |
| 02:11:59 | warmi | getting ready to start coding |
| 02:12:20 | tux_mike | not gonna let us know what it is? |
| 02:12:40 | warmi | OPIE showimg |
| 02:13:00 | warmi | basically adding option to thumnail preview, bunch of other viewing options etc |
| 02:13:07 | tux_mike | cool |
| 02:13:14 | warmi | will be done by the end of the next week ( hopefully) |
| 02:13:19 | kergoth | warmi: did you use the thumbnail code in drawpad, filebrowser, or your own? |
| 02:13:37 | ljp | zecke owns a 5000d |
| 02:13:50 | warmi | not, this one will be different, I am thinking about displaying list of thumbails .. not just preview button |
| 02:13:55 | tux_mike | warmi: can you try some hacks to improve memory utilization, and add an option to not scale the image (pan view) |
| 02:14:07 | warmi | this is what I am planning: |
| 02:14:20 | warmi | Size to Screen (scale) will be options |
| 02:14:24 | warmi | optional |
| 02:14:31 | kergoth | warmi: taken a look at drawpad's thumbnail viewer? |
| 02:14:32 | warmi | if not selected you will get scrollbars etc |
| 02:14:34 | kergoth | cool |
| 02:14:38 | warmi | kergoth: yeah |
| 02:14:50 | warmi | Brightness/Contrast |
| 02:15:07 | warmi | Black and White |
| 02:15:16 | warmi | Slideshow |
| 02:16:23 | warmi | and full screen preview will not have scrollbars ( if image is too large) but instead will have like a little transparent overlayed panning area |
| 02:16:26 | kergoth | nifty |
| 02:16:28 | warmi | sort of like in RTS games |
| 02:16:33 | kergoth | hah |
| 02:16:38 | kergoth | cool idea |
| 02:16:48 | warmi | you got to have some fun , you know .. |
| 02:16:53 | warmi | all the other stuff is boring |
| 02:16:59 | warmi | this will be a cool thing to code |
| 02:17:00 | warmi | hehe |
| 02:17:30 | NeoTron | BigBoss: around? |
| 02:18:13 | NeoTron | seems to get seriously fucked up checks from handango. |
| 02:18:17 | treke|home | warmi: Thats a good idea |
| 02:18:33 | NeoTron | warmi, what is your experience? |
| 02:18:37 | warmi | treke|home: I don't if it is a good idea .. certainly a "cool" feature |
| 02:18:38 | warmi | hehe |
| 02:18:53 | warmi | I never had any problems |
| 02:19:05 | warmi | I got 2 checks so far with no problems |
| 02:19:12 | NeoTron | did you just receive june's? |
| 02:19:39 | warmi | I am not sure you know .. |
| 02:19:42 | warmi | hehe |
| 02:19:51 | NeoTron | seems like they are one month behind or forgot to pay one month... |
| 02:20:00 | warmi | I am not really all that concerned about this stuff. . peanut money :-) |
| 02:20:19 | warmi | could be ... ljp, you are getting handango checks as well .. |
| 02:20:22 | warmi | any problems ? |
| 02:21:51 | ljp | well.. I've gotten one check so far.. |
| 02:22:07 | ljp | that was about two months ago |
| 02:22:35 | tux_mike | no one like's ljp's software :( |
| 02:22:55 | ljp | last month a got an envelope from them that I thought was a check, but there was no money in there |
| 02:23:12 | ljp | ohh.. naa I havent been updating it enough |
| 02:23:48 | ljp | I've been working on something better than handango |
| 02:25:10 | warmi | yeah .. BigBoss would know |
| 02:25:22 | warmi | he and you are getting some real money from that place |
| 02:25:27 | warmi | so it is worth worrying |
| 02:25:31 | kergoth | damnit damnit damnit |
| 02:25:33 | kergoth | ucb1x00_init: mcp_enable() succeeded. |
| 02:25:33 | kergoth | mcp: read timed out |
| 02:26:00 | tux_mike | huh? |
| 02:26:15 | kergoth | I cant get erasing working on the Z flash :-( |
| 02:26:22 | kergoth | its being a bitch |
| 02:26:50 | ljp | hmm funny.. that letter I got from handango was postdated may 21, but had royality statement from March |
| 02:27:02 | tux_mike | kick it? |
| 02:28:42 | ljp | kergoth: I have a pencil erasure I can loan ya |
| 02:29:15 | tux_mike | i know a good way to erase it... find the nearest train track and set it there and wait for a train |
| 02:29:32 | kergoth | hah |
| 02:29:37 | kergoth | you wouldnt believe what a pain this is |
| 02:29:50 | NeoTron | they are definitely way off |
| 02:29:52 | ljp | we used to do that with double headed nails and made swords |
| 02:29:58 | tux_mike | ugh |
| 02:30:16 | tux_mike | i wish i could finish a few of these methods... but can't think, head hurts too much |
| 02:30:24 | kergoth | To set up flash erasing I need to supply Vpp power. to do that, I need to initialize the tc35143af chip. In order to get that chip up, i need to set up the MCP, and for that I need a clock generated by the Locomo chip. Shits so interconnected I cant test one thing before going on to the test. |
| 02:30:40 | kergoth | s/on to the test/on to the next/ |
| 02:30:42 | kergoth | hehe |
| 02:30:52 | NeoTron | or at least they are one month behind... |
| 02:32:08 | cdm | kergoth: MCP? |
| 02:33:06 | tux_mike | master control program? |
| 02:34:44 | warmi | NeoTron: they are always one month behind |
| 02:34:47 | warmi | that's their policy |
| 02:35:00 | NeoTron | warmi: one and a half or a half? |
| 02:35:02 | warmi | I got my Arils check in May etc |
| 02:35:15 | warmi | I think just one month |
| 02:35:17 | NeoTron | right |
| 02:35:27 | NeoTron | so It's july, I should have received June's |
| 02:35:29 | NeoTron | no? |
| 02:35:35 | NeoTron | and according to my numbers it is indeed June too. |
| 02:35:37 | tux_mike | warmi: it's amazing you're a programmer, you have horrible typing :) |
| 02:35:37 | warmi | well ... yeah |
| 02:35:42 | treke|home | NeoTron: That sounds right |
| 02:35:49 | warmi | I type fast .. |
| 02:35:49 | NeoTron | however that is now correct. :) |
| 02:35:55 | ljp | NeoTron: go to your handango account, you can view month to month sales revenues.... |
| 02:35:56 | treke|home | NeoTron: July hasnt ended, so they cant pay you for july yet :) |
| 02:35:59 | warmi | but I don't pau attention to this typing all that much |
| 02:36:02 | warmi | pay even |
| 02:36:06 | tux_mike | heh :) |
| 02:36:17 | warmi | I do pay when I code.. otherwise compiler will let me know |
| 02:36:21 | warmi | don't have a choice there |
| 02:36:24 | tux_mike | yah |
| 02:36:31 | NeoTron | I have calculated sales for everything until end of June and I'm missing 1/4 of the money owed |
| 02:36:31 | tux_mike | compilers are so friggin picky |
| 02:36:34 | warmi | you guys are way smarter than gcc .. you can figure out from the context |
| 02:36:39 | warmi | :-) |
| 02:36:45 | tux_mike | why cant they just do what I want them to |
| 02:36:55 | tux_mike | i don't care what i say, just do what i want |
| 02:37:01 | treke|home | #include <whateverlibrariesineed.h> |
| 02:37:07 | treke|home | int main (...) |
| 02:37:08 | treke|home | { |
| 02:37:16 | treke|home | #InsertCodeHere |
| 02:37:24 | ljp | aaaawwww.. I have 0 Frequent Buyer points |
| 02:37:24 | NeoTron | and that looks correct according to the csv file I downloaded and also if I count number of order emails receive |
| 02:37:28 | warmi | that's what MS stuff does |
| 02:37:42 | warmi | and even KDevelop will generate all kinds of "skeleton" code |
| 02:38:03 | tux_mike | doesn't MS force you to load the headers for all their APIs? |
| 02:38:22 | warmi | you even have an option" Do you want VC++ to insert comments" - "Yes, please" , "No, thank you" |
| 02:38:23 | treke|home | kdevelop looked kind of nifty when I tried it, no vi bindings though :) |
| 02:38:25 | warmi | I kid you not |
| 02:38:50 | warmi | tux_mike:yeah .. but it is all contained in one "windows.h" |
| 02:38:58 | kergoth | cdm: yeah, just muttering about things being so interconnected I cant test one thing before going on to the next. |
| 02:39:06 | treke|home | I wish other editors would automagically dump all the stray :w, a,i.and xs : |
| 02:39:16 | warmi | since their compiler supports precompiled headers, it doesn't matter |
| 02:39:17 | kergoth | hah, me too |
| 02:39:29 | tux_mike | warmi: what dlls does it force you to link to if you include that? |
| 02:39:38 | warmi | no |
| 02:39:43 | tux_mike | is one who has never developed outside of VB on a Windows machien |
| 02:39:46 | tux_mike | macine |
| 02:39:47 | warmi | including doesn't force dlls |
| 02:39:50 | tux_mike | machine |
| 02:40:04 | tux_mike | well, you need to link to the appropriate libraries |
| 02:40:07 | cdm | kergoth: what is the MCP? |
| 02:40:15 | warmi | you specify which dlls you are using lineker options |
| 02:40:20 | tux_mike | ok |
| 02:40:34 | kergoth | cdm: multimedia communications port. on the 4th serial port. mcp/ssp. |
| 02:40:48 | cdm | right - I thought it was some chip.... |
| 02:40:55 | warmi | tux_mike: I don't know if you ever used VC++ .. |
| 02:40:59 | cdm | to talk to the ubc1200 ripoff device. |
| 02:41:03 | tux_mike | nope, never |
| 02:41:13 | warmi | but this sucker is literally 10 times faster than gcc as far as compiling times are concernd |
| 02:41:17 | warmi | I kid you not |
| 02:41:26 | tux_mike | i don't doubt it |
| 02:41:36 | tux_mike | actually likes icc |
| 02:41:42 | tux_mike | nice fast code |
| 02:41:43 | warmi | intel stuff ? |
| 02:41:47 | tux_mike | yah |
| 02:42:00 | warmi | no shit .. |
| 02:42:07 | cdm | means to play with icc. |
| 02:42:08 | tux_mike | code is typically twice as fast as gcc, if not faster |
| 02:42:10 | warmi | after all they know their CPUs the best |
| 02:42:11 | warmi | hehe |
| 02:42:18 | tux_mike | true |
| 02:42:26 | tux_mike | it beats out MSVC++ too |
| 02:42:49 | warmi | could be |
| 02:43:01 | warmi | but , still, VC++ is faster then gcc |
| 02:43:22 | warmi | supposedly gcc on x86 is not bad as far as "gcc"s go .. |
| 02:43:32 | warmi | Alpha gcc is supposed to be bad |
| 02:43:33 | tux_mike | i heard, in most applications, the code outputted by gcc was marginally faster than MSVC++ |
| 02:43:46 | tux_mike | i wish there was an icc for arm :) |
| 02:43:48 | kergoth_ | cdm: the tc35143af gets its clock from the locomo g/a.. so i cant test the tc35143af without setting up the locomo.. and I'd been avoiding setting up locomo until i had to.. heh. |
| 02:43:51 | kergoth_ | curses at&t some more |
| 02:43:54 | warmi | there is |
| 02:44:02 | tux_mike | there is? |
| 02:44:06 | tux_mike | i musta missed it |
| 02:44:13 | warmi | well, ARM has its own C++ compiler |
| 02:44:20 | tux_mike | for linux? |
| 02:44:27 | warmi | I asume they would know how to optimize |
| 02:44:29 | warmi | I am not sure |
| 02:44:37 | warmi | Speedy2 has Arm development kit |
| 02:44:40 | warmi | ask him |
| 02:45:13 | roge99 | hey kergoth you still around |
| 02:45:21 | kergoth_ | yeah |
| 02:45:26 | kergoth_ | at least till my cable drops again |
| 02:45:27 | tux_mike | i want to try to build linux from scratch using icc. |
| 02:45:28 | kergoth_ | heheh |
| 02:45:44 | tux_mike | kergoth: i got a fix for that |
| 02:45:55 | roge99 | redownloaded reflashed same thing |
| 02:46:04 | kergoth_ | roge99: wtf |
| 02:46:24 | roge99 | is there anyway to put sdmgr in debug mode |
| 02:46:38 | roge99 | im running the zImage-32 rom |
| 02:46:38 | warmi | tux_mike: fuck man ... that's like two weeks of compiling time :-) |
| 02:46:40 | tux_mike | roge: what's the matter? |
| 02:46:42 | roge99 | err kernel |
| 02:46:48 | roge99 | hey tux |
| 02:46:52 | tux_mike | hey :) |
| 02:46:56 | kergoth_ | roge99: hell if i know, we dont have the code to sdmgr |
| 02:46:57 | roge99 | sd not workin in oz |
| 02:47:11 | kergoth_ | roge99: personally, i wish the sd module just called fucking hotplug, then we could do what we like |
| 02:47:15 | roge99 | hrm .... illl try a different kernel |
| 02:47:17 | tux_mike | warmi: bah, i've built linux from scratch before, and on a P2 400 |
| 02:47:18 | kergoth_ | roge99: whats odd is, jason tested sd. worked flawless |
| 02:47:36 | tux_mike | i don't care much about compile times, but more about the finished product |
| 02:47:56 | tux_mike | especially when it's known-good code |
| 02:48:12 | tux_mike | mostly bug free(tm) |
| 02:48:32 | NeoTron | unless the numbers I get from handango are wrong and they are like ghost buyers, they owe me |
| 02:48:51 | warmi | tux_mike: well, I reall dread time when I have to upgrade/recompile my KDE/Qt installation .. let alone entire Linux distro |
| 02:49:10 | tux_mike | don't get me started on recompile KDE!!! |
| 02:49:15 | roue | hi folks |
| 02:49:17 | kergoth_ | hehe |
| 02:49:22 | kergoth_ | kde takes a fucking long time to build |
| 02:49:28 | roue | anyone mind a newbie question? |
| 02:49:29 | kergoth_ | even downloading kde from cvs takes a long ass time |
| 02:49:31 | warmi | NeoTron: don't you get emailed with each purchase in addition to daily statements ? |
| 02:49:47 | tux_mike | i had to hack apart the RPMS and watch every min to make sure it didn't bomb out because of some fuggored redhat patch. |
| 02:49:54 | warmi | I never bother with cvs .. who knows what kind of crap is in there .. |
| 02:50:02 | roue | how do I use the qpe-rotation settings app? |
| 02:50:04 | warmi | only nice round release numbers for me :-) |
| 02:50:06 | tux_mike | this was for the 3.0.0->3.0.1 transition |
| 02:50:44 | warmi | #opie doesn't seem to get much traffic |
| 02:51:00 | warmi | I have heard there is another #opie channel on some kde irc server or something like that |
| 02:51:15 | tux_mike | none that i have heard of |
| 02:51:17 | treke|home | There is an opie devel channel somewhere |
| 02:51:28 | tux_mike | #opie-devel here |
| 02:51:34 | treke|home | You probably need to know the kde secret handshake though |
| 02:51:40 | tux_mike | but i keep forgetting about it :) |
| 02:51:57 | kergoth_ | wtf! |
| 02:51:58 | tux_mike | and it's less trafficed than #opie |
| 02:52:03 | kergoth_ | my rootfs mount HUNG |
| 02:52:06 | kergoth_ | shoots his Z |
| 02:52:15 | warmi | man .. on $opie-devel there are like 4 different kerghoths .. out of 5 people in the room |
| 02:52:16 | warmi | hehe |
| 02:52:30 | br33zy | warmi! |
| 02:52:36 | roue | so the qpe-*.ipks only work under opie? |
| 02:52:39 | warmi | hi br33zy |
| 02:52:43 | br33zy | warmi! |
| 02:52:47 | treke|home | or more like 2 |
| 02:52:52 | kergoth_ | fuck |
| 02:52:54 | kergoth_ | mcp: read timed out |
| 02:54:58 | kergoth_ | roue: they work fine on either opie or qtopia |
| 02:56:54 | | BigBoss was last seen on #zaurus 6 hours, 21 minutes and 22 seconds ago, saying: god save us [Thu Jul 18 21:35:32 2002] |
| 02:56:54 | darienm | ibot seen BigBoss |
| 02:57:09 | roue | kergoth_ : so I run the rotation app in the settings tab and nothing happens. didn't find any docs, so I'm not really sure how to rotate an app (say terminal). |
| 02:57:20 | roue | (I've had my zaurus about 2 hours now). |
| 02:57:28 | kergoth_ | roue: then you didnt install the qt-embedded rotation fonts. you need both to rotate |
| 02:57:46 | darienm | roue: After you rotate, only applications you launch AFTER appear rotated. |
| 02:58:00 | kergoth_ | yeah you're best off restart qtopia after rotation |
| 02:58:38 | roue | i installed qpe-rotation , qpe-settings-rotation and qt-embedded-rotation, isn't the 'embedded' one the fonts or have I missed it? |
| 02:58:51 | kergoth_ | yes, thats the fonts |
| 02:58:56 | kergoth_ | restart qtopia after changing rotation. |
| 02:59:24 | roue | i run rotation from the settings tab, it appears to load, but then nothing seems different? should I be looking for some new tiny widget somewhere? |
| 02:59:38 | kergoth_ | umm |
| 02:59:47 | kergoth_ | it pops up a dialog to oselect your rotation. |
| 02:59:50 | kergoth_ | you change it, hit OK, then restart |
| 02:59:59 | roue | (appears to load = I see the hourglass in the status bar at the bottom, then the hourglass disappears, then I'm back to the settings tab. |
| 03:00:21 | kergoth_ | no idea. somethings obvoiusly messed up. |
| 03:00:29 | kergoth_ | you're using the qpe-rotation off myzaurus.com? |
| 03:00:49 | tux_mike | hrm.... i wish i had a Qtopia license... i don't know if i want to release the source code for this program |
| 03:00:50 | roue | i'll uninstall what I've got and redownload it from there. |
| 03:01:07 | treke|home | tux_mike: did you sign up for the first contest? |
| 03:01:15 | tux_mike | not yet |
| 03:01:21 | treke|home | the original contest not this one |
| 03:01:41 | tux_mike | oh, that, i signed up, but never produced an application |
| 03:01:48 | Cloudchaser | grrr i can't close any apps on z |
| 03:01:50 | treke|home | then you have a commercial license |
| 03:01:52 | extremis | hrm, www.thekompany.com is having problems |
| 03:02:27 | tux_mike | treke: is it for one app, or all my apps? |
| 03:02:38 | treke|home | tux_mike: Pretty sure its for all apps |
| 03:02:59 | treke|home | maybe NeoTron did a bit more research on that :) |
| 03:03:01 | tux_mike | i'll prolly release the source anyway. |
| 03:03:03 | kergoth_ | the big hit. i love this movie. |
| 03:03:08 | tux_mike | it's just... odd |
| 03:03:30 | tux_mike | but then again, i'm adapting a paper and pencil game to a computer. it's gonna be odd, to say the least |
| 03:03:30 | tux_mike | :) |
| 03:03:34 | roue | rotation is on myzaurus.com? I look in downloads and can't seem to see it. |
| 03:05:59 | roue | i found it on the qpe.sourceforge.net site |
| 03:06:13 | tux_mike | i am getting irratated at the size of this one file though |
| 03:06:26 | roge99 | kergoth.. works in the 26-6 kernel |
| 03:06:40 | TrekCycling | anyone here use OpenZaurus? |
| 03:06:52 | tux_mike | roge: i think i had that problem on the previous version of OZ |
| 03:07:12 | kergoth_ | roge99: woah, thats fucked. |
| 03:07:18 | whardier | Warcraft 3 is warcraft 2 |
| 03:07:23 | kergoth_ | hah |
| 03:07:33 | tux_mike | Warcraft 3 is warcraft 2++ |
| 03:07:36 | whardier | heh |
| 03:07:41 | whardier | I was expecting like |
| 03:07:44 | whardier | 1st person |
| 03:07:48 | TrekCycling | I had an iPaq and returned it because I didn't need the keyboard anymore. I bought a Zaurus again, because it was just too cheap. ($313) |
| 03:08:00 | TrekCycling | now I'm wondering whether I should go with OpenZaurus or use the stock ROM. |
| 03:08:01 | roge99 | kergoth im gona re-flash again just to make shure i didnt fuck sumthin up |
| 03:08:13 | kergoth_ | roge99: k.. |
| 03:08:26 | tux_mike | oooh... blue man group music :) |
| 03:08:54 | icom1990 | Trek ... go for broke and use new kernel !!! |
| 03:08:54 | kergoth_ | this movie rocks |
| 03:08:56 | tux_mike | anyone ever see that show? |
| 03:09:04 | kergoth_ | i havent |
| 03:09:10 | tux_mike | you should |
| 03:09:19 | TrekCycling | icom1990: But that's the question. WHY go for broke? |
| 03:09:25 | TrekCycling | what's better with OZ? |
| 03:09:27 | tux_mike | it's quite entertaining |
| 03:09:59 | icom1990 | Been debating lately on that ... until you install new kernel you wont be able to compile new modules |
| 03:10:10 | kergoth_ | icom1990: huh? |
| 03:10:16 | TrekCycling | compile what new modules? |
| 03:10:16 | kergoth_ | icom1990: you can install modules into the sharp rom. |
| 03:10:17 | TrekCycling | huh? |
| 03:10:32 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: writable flash. opie rather than qtopia, to start with |
| 03:10:42 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: sane filesystem, no symlink madness |
| 03:10:47 | tux_mike | opie-theme-luna ^_^ |
| 03:10:53 | kergoth_ | hehe |
| 03:10:57 | kergoth_ | yeah, and liquid |
| 03:10:58 | icom1990 | I've been looking for the mppe that works on the 2.4-17 in order to do VPN into an MS network without much success |
| 03:11:10 | TrekCycling | I don't like liquid. |
| 03:11:12 | kergoth_ | icom1990: zaurus uses 2.4.6-rmk1-np2-embedix. |
| 03:11:14 | tux_mike | kergoth: liquid doesn't work with one of my staple apps, neocal |
| 03:11:26 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: there's liquid, metal, themes, and luna theme style |
| 03:11:39 | TrekCycling | Okay, a couple concrete questions. |
| 03:11:44 | kergoth_ | ask away |
| 03:11:53 | TrekCycling | Is power management better in the OZ kernel? |
| 03:11:55 | icom1990 | I can really patch any kernel of 2.4 but my zaurus is from JavaOne and I fear messing the LinkSys driver |
| 03:12:39 | icom1990 | What's on that 2.12 ROM upgrade anyway ? |
| 03:12:49 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: OZ uses the same kernel but with extra patches for various things. |
| 03:13:04 | kergoth_ | icom1990: i have the linksys driver fix, btw. |
| 03:13:17 | TrekCycling | okay, I thought OZ used a different kernel. So it uses the embedix kernel, then, still? |
| 03:13:17 | kergoth_ | icom1990: and 2.12 is a 5500 driver, and is old |
| 03:13:25 | TrekCycling | #2 - is it safe (to the flash rom) to use the OZ filesystem? |
| 03:13:29 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: for now. I'm porting it to 2.4.19 for the next version |
| 03:13:42 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: yes, it uses wear leveling. you wont wear out the flash. |
| 03:14:00 | NeoTron | figured it out |
| 03:14:08 | NeoTron | they just fucked up and confused me. :P |
| 03:14:12 | kergoth_ | hah |
| 03:14:13 | TrekCycling | #3 - Is it possible to use Java if you use OZ. I guess not, right? |
| 03:14:35 | icom1990 | so can I adapt the mppe for pptp kernel module and load it without having to recompile and messing my driver ? How do I do that ? |
| 03:14:36 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: you have a license to possess jeode. you can copy it off your sharp rom before you flash. |
| 03:14:55 | TrekCycling | it's not just one file, though, right? |
| 03:15:01 | kergoth_ | icom1990: i'm not in the business of explaining how to build kernel modules. http://www.kernelnewbies.org/ |
| 03:15:08 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: ? |
| 03:15:11 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: oh, no |
| 03:15:19 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: you need evm, the java classes, etc |
| 03:15:23 | TrekCycling | yeah |
| 03:16:00 | icom1990 | I do kernels AND drivers ... no need there ... the issue is how to match my kernel symbol table with the one for the new module I'll be compiling !!! |
| 03:16:38 | TrekCycling | It may not be a big deal, but it would be nice to have it. I have this idea that I might be able to compile on my Z someday |
| 03:17:03 | kergoth_ | icom1990: why's that an issue? you have the sharp kernel sources, AND the sharp .config used to build it. thats all you need to produce a matching symbol table. |
| 03:17:35 | icom1990 | wow ... that's what I need ... where do I get that ? |
| 03:17:41 | kergoth_ | icom1990: cp arch/arm/def-configs/sl5500 .config; make oldconfig; make dep; make clean; |
| 03:17:41 | roue | okay, I got the rotation working halfway ... I have the qt-embedded-rotation installed, but I see no fonts. |
| 03:17:41 | TrekCycling | anyway, maybe I'll just try it. It's always easy to flash back, right? |
| 03:17:50 | kergoth_ | icom1990: http://more.sbc.co.jp/slj/index.asp |
| 03:18:01 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: yep |
| 03:18:13 | icom1990 | nice ... Thanks for the info. |
| 03:18:17 | kergoth_ | np |
| 03:18:27 | TrekCycling | what did you say you used, kergoth_? |
| 03:18:32 | kergoth | TrekCycling: ? |
| 03:18:39 | TrekCycling | 40-24? |
| 03:18:51 | kergoth | TrekCycling: yeah I use 40-24. I find its a good balance. |
| 03:18:53 | TrekCycling | that's 40mb ram, right? |
| 03:18:56 | kergoth | yep |
| 03:18:59 | kergoth | 24mb ramdisk |
| 03:19:05 | TrekCycling | why are there two 40-24s? |
| 03:19:38 | roge99 | kergoth definetly not working on zImage 32 |
| 03:20:02 | tux_mike | kergoth: did you update the kernel images? |
| 03:20:25 | roge99 | i also noticed it didnt go thru its 'configig things' after a hard reset on the zImage-32 |
| 03:21:09 | warmi | tux_mike: you are using NeoCalc a lot ? |
| 03:21:26 | tux_mike | warmi: yes |
| 03:21:32 | roge99 | it pissed and moaned about not finding a mtdblock6 device though |
| 03:21:33 | kergoth | roge99: thats fucked up. hmm. let me dig. its reacting badly to the lack of a ramdisk.. and the failure to reconfigure the packages is why sdmgr didnt start. |
| 03:21:41 | tux_mike | as a calculator i love it |
| 03:21:42 | warmi | tux_mike: schools stuff ? |
| 03:21:49 | roge99 | thats what im thinkin |
| 03:21:50 | kergoth | NeoCalc is nice. |
| 03:21:51 | tux_mike | yes and no. |
| 03:21:54 | kergoth | tux_mike: yes I did |
| 03:22:12 | roge99 | make a 31-1 kernel |
| 03:22:15 | roge99 | :-) |
| 03:22:16 | kergoth | lol |
| 03:22:17 | tux_mike | i use it for anything mathematical. i can do these things in my head, i'm just slow :) |
| 03:22:33 | roge99 | 31.99999 - 0.00001 |
| 03:22:40 | kergoth | tux_mike: the new kernel images just have fixed linksys driver for the new cards, and a slightly animated boot logo |
| 03:22:43 | TrekCycling | once OZ is installed you can install and uninstall packages from the opie.info feed, right? |
| 03:23:01 | tux_mike | kergoth: how about updated jffs2 drivers? |
| 03:23:05 | kergoth | TrekCycling: no, you install/update packages from the oz3 feed, or the opie.wox.org feed |
| 03:23:14 | kergoth | tux_mke: couldnt. new drivers wont compile on 2.4.6 cleanly |
| 03:23:22 | tux_mike | ugh |
| 03:23:33 | TrekCycling | oh, okay |
| 03:23:45 | | oz3 feed is at http://openzaurus.sourceforge.net/feeds/3.0/ |
| 03:23:45 | kergoth | ibot: oz3 feed? |
| 03:24:00 | TrekCycling | is the oz3 feed as up to date (in terms of the opie components) as opie? |
| 03:24:04 | TrekCycling | or is it another fork? |
| 03:24:08 | kergoth | TrekCycling: huh? |
| 03:24:12 | kergoth | TrekCycling: it IS opie |
| 03:24:18 | TrekCycling | got it |
| 03:24:31 | kergoth | TrekCycling: its just a set of packages for OZ. there's a slight difference in the startup scripot |
| 03:24:48 | kergoth | TrekCycling: the opie.info feed is for ipaq... |
| 03:24:55 | TrekCycling | got it |
| 03:25:44 | warmi | see you later folks |
| 03:25:46 | warmi | g'night |
| 03:25:49 | kergoth | night warmi |
| 03:27:13 | NeoTron | handango overpaid the first two months which made me confused about payments. I also missed the first (overpaid) check which is exactly what was missing. |
| 03:28:47 | tux_mike | well, i should get to bed |
| 03:29:37 | treke|home | ah |
| 03:29:40 | treke|home | makes sense |
| 03:35:12 | extremis | What is the diff from b10 to b10.4 (changelog) |
| 03:36:09 | kergoth_ | extremis: new linksys driver fix for new cards, ssh 3.4, atd fix so no time loss on resume, animated bootlogo, updated pcmcia-cs version, new socket/symbol driver with monitor support (so kismet'll work), etc |
| 03:36:25 | kergoth_ | extremis: not to mention the absolute latest opie build. thats t he biggest thing you'd notice. |
| 03:36:50 | extremis | stable? |
| 03:36:58 | kergoth_ | yeah |
| 03:37:01 | extremis | b10 sucked |
| 03:37:07 | kergoth_ | sync issue though due to a security fix from trolltech that we applied. |
| 03:37:16 | extremis | whats the issue? |
| 03:37:25 | kergoth_ | ftp on 4242 now requires a password to login |
| 03:37:41 | kergoth_ | as does the sync port. sync with qtopia desktop wont work until trolltech releases v1.5.1 of qtopia desktop |
| 03:37:49 | kergoth_ | so I'll be reverting the patch soon to gain sync back |
| 03:38:12 | kergoth_ | everything else seems to work |
| 03:38:32 | kergoth_ | though the nomtdram kernels are still flaky, so if you want a paul's sd rom style setup you'd be best waiting |
| 03:38:57 | kergoth_ | there were numerous fixes adn feature adds in opie, and new opie apps available as well |
| 03:40:21 | extremis | how do I sync? |
| 03:40:36 | extremis | are there modifications to the desktop client which can be made? |
| 03:40:41 | kergoth_ | how would you do that? |
| 03:40:48 | kergoth_ | trolltech hasnt released the source to qtopia desktop. |
| 03:40:49 | TrekCycling | just came back from the web |
| 03:40:51 | kergoth_ | heh |
| 03:41:03 | treke|home | kergoth_: Well not purposefully :) |
| 03:41:04 | TrekCycling | kergoth_: are you saying there's a problem with the current OZ rom? |
| 03:41:08 | extremis | so no sync? |
| 03:41:23 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: syncing with qtopia desktop and intellisync doesnt work until i release a maintainance release. |
| 03:41:28 | TrekCycling | ah |
| 03:41:38 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: personally i dont use it anyway, i use scp |
| 03:41:38 | kergoth_ | heh |
| 03:41:42 | extremis | kergoth_: I like having a password |
| 03:41:43 | TrekCycling | I use linux, so there's no sync anyway |
| 03:41:46 | kergoth_ | but i'll get the maintainance release out in a few days |
| 03:41:53 | treke|home | extremis: This isnt something you can change |
| 03:41:54 | kergoth_ | extremis: well the ftp and sync ports have never had a password at all. |
| 03:42:05 | TrekCycling | the password issue is funny. When I saw the report on the FTP issue it was like "duh" |
| 03:42:08 | kergoth_ | extremis: if you want a password on those ports, sync will break until they release a new version, thats all there is to it. |
| 03:42:13 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: yes, it is stupid. |
| 03:42:34 | TrekCycling | of course someone could figure out from browser detection that you were using a Zaurus. |
| 03:42:55 | TrekCycling | That's why I personally thought it should have ALWAYS been SSH, not FTP. |
| 03:43:11 | treke|home | how many people have their zaurus directly on the internet though? |
| 03:43:23 | extremis | so, does network sync work? |
| 03:43:24 | TrekCycling | not many, but wlans, you know. |
| 03:43:39 | TrekCycling | Internet Cafes, etc. |
| 03:43:43 | treke|home | For the most part your mostly at risk of your local lan ( which may be very large) |
| 03:43:53 | TrekCycling | It's not a serious risk, but still silly to leave it THAT open. |
| 03:44:12 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: so use opie. you can limit it by ip/mask |
| 03:44:14 | kergoth__ | hey hunger |
| 03:44:28 | extremis | kergoth`work: what does it take to revert the patch? |
| 03:44:50 | TrekCycling | ip/mask? |
| 03:45:09 | TrekCycling | iptables or something like that? |
| 03:45:58 | kergoth__ | extremis: a patch to the opie sources. specifically core/launcher/transferserver.cpp |
| 03:46:12 | kergoth__ | extremis: or rather, the reverting of a patch that was applied to that file |
| 03:47:20 | extremis | yous aid a few days |
| 03:47:23 | extremis | why not now :) ? |
| 03:48:06 | kergoth__ | ? |
| 03:48:20 | kergoth__ | oh the maintainance release? |
| 03:48:23 | extremis | yes |
| 03:48:37 | extremis | I want to flash tonight |
| 03:49:15 | extremis | or make an ipk |
| 03:49:23 | kergoth__ | flash then, and build a new ipk of opie-base |
| 03:49:35 | kergoth__ | I'm not doing it tonight. right now I'm deep in debugging 2.5.21-rmk1-cl1 on my Z |
| 03:51:03 | extremis | isn't there already a snapshot of opie-base (ipk) ? |
| 03:51:18 | kergoth__ | you're not listening |
| 03:51:22 | kergoth__ | of course there are ipks |
| 03:51:23 | kergoth__ | of the latest cvs |
| 03:51:28 | kergoth__ | latest cvs = no sync |
| 03:51:37 | kergoth__ | i have to REMOVE a patch that was applied previously in the sources |
| 03:51:39 | extremis | ahh, so I would need to remove it then build my own ipk |
| 03:51:42 | kergoth__ | yes. |
| 03:51:45 | kergoth__ | exactly |
| 03:52:01 | TrekCycling | kergoth__: I don't see a bootflag.txt. |
| 03:52:31 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: erm, echo OZ30 > bootflag.txt |
| 03:52:35 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: I'll add that to INSTALL |
| 03:53:08 | TrekCycling | oh, wait, which one should I be trying? |
| 03:53:11 | kergoth__ | ? |
| 03:53:19 | TrekCycling | 2.9.4? |
| 03:53:26 | kergoth__ | thats the only one there is |
| 03:53:31 | kergoth__ | on SF anyway |
| 03:53:31 | TrekCycling | http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=43045&release_id=100119 |
| 03:53:34 | kergoth__ | yes, 2.9.4 |
| 03:53:34 | TrekCycling | oh, okay |
| 03:53:46 | kergoth__ | yes, xactly. one section, 2.9.4 |
| 03:53:50 | TrekCycling | oh yeah, that's the same |
| 03:53:53 | TrekCycling | I went to this page first |
| 03:53:53 | TrekCycling | http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=43045 |
| 03:53:59 | TrekCycling | and the pages looked different |
| 03:54:19 | TrekCycling | so the file bootflag.txt should just be OZ30? |
| 03:54:22 | kergoth__ | pick a kernel, rename to zImage. grab initrd.bin . echo OZ30 > bootflag.txt. copy all 3 to cf, and follow flash instructions |
| 03:54:23 | kergoth__ | yes. |
| 03:56:37 | extremis | so kergoth: pardon my ignorance, but why would you build an OZ image after allt his time which didn't sync? |
| 03:58:37 | kergoth__ | huh? |
| 03:58:40 | kergoth__ | after all this time? |
| 03:58:50 | kergoth__ | all what time? |
| 03:59:09 | kergoth__ | it worked in b10, and a recent cvs commit by zecke broke syncing. no one noticed it till the current OZ released. |
| 03:59:39 | extremis | don't you test them before release? |
| 04:00:23 | kergoth__ | yes, and i didnt test sync |
| 04:00:24 | kergoth__ | deal with it |
| 04:00:37 | TrekCycling | who pays you, kergoth__? |
| 04:00:38 | kergoth__ | there is no official test plan. I'm the only person working on OZ. |
| 04:00:38 | TrekCycling | :-) |
| 04:00:49 | TrekCycling | where's your check, extremis, for this month? |
| 04:00:50 | extremis | kergoth`work: what kind of shit is that |
| 04:00:52 | extremis | you need help |
| 04:00:53 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: Digi International, to do unix tech support. this is all on the side. |
| 04:00:55 | kergoth__ | extremis: no shit |
| 04:01:06 | kergoth__ | extremis: opie has numerous developers, but the distro is just myself |
| 04:01:28 | | Cloudchaser was last seen on #zaurus 59 minutes and 40 seconds ago, saying: grrr i can't close any apps on z [Fri Jul 19 04:01:48 2002] |
| 04:01:28 | darienm | ibot seen Cloudchaser |
| 04:01:53 | darienm | Anybody here wanted to try tkcRekall but didn't take the plunge yet ? |
| 04:02:01 | TrekCycling | what's the shell, kergoth__? |
| 04:02:23 | TrekCycling | I'm running it right now and wondering whether I should install bash, but this shell looks pretty good. |
| 04:02:45 | extremis | will the xml confs from sharp rom work in oz? |
| 04:07:06 | oGMo | uh... hrmm |
| 04:07:17 | TrekCycling | anyone know where the ipkg feed file is in OZ? |
| 04:07:30 | TrekCycling | or maybe I can just use oipkg |
| 04:08:05 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: remember in OZ you install to flash by default. |
| 04:08:16 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: to install anywhere else (like your ramdisk) you need to install with oipkg. |
| 04:08:23 | TrekCycling | yeah |
| 04:08:27 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: and the conf file for feeds is /etc/ipkg.conf :-) |
| 04:08:27 | oGMo | cripe, why didn't this thing flash |
| 04:08:35 | TrekCycling | I just realized I could use oipkg and the feed's already there. |
| 04:08:37 | TrekCycling | Cool |
| 04:10:15 | [DrEvil] | growls |
| 04:10:16 | TrekCycling | doesn't oipkg list files you CAN install? |
| 04:10:46 | [DrEvil] | nothing wants to install where I want it to install with OZ |
| 04:11:07 | oGMo | wtf, this sits here for about 20 seconds with the lights on then they go off |
| 04:11:16 | oGMo | AC is in, switch is in the rihgt position, etc. |
| 04:11:22 | oGMo | 'ospack |
| 04:11:30 | oGMo | err 'ospack' is in the root fs |
| 04:12:28 | kergoth_ | you mean the root of /mnt/cf righT? |
| 04:12:28 | kergoth_ | heh |
| 04:12:39 | kergoth_ | TrekCycling: if you run ipkg update, yes. |
| 04:12:42 | kergoth_ | [DrEvil]: ? |
| 04:13:11 | [DrEvil] | ipkg is showing a read only filesystem when I try to install to mtdram |
| 04:13:19 | oGMo | kergoth_: well, yeah |
| 04:13:25 | oGMo | root of the cf card |
| 04:13:40 | kergoth_ | [DrEvil]: "ipkg is showing a read only filesystem" <-? whats the error? |
| 04:13:44 | oGMo | although... it's not the only thing on there |
| 04:14:48 | [DrEvil] | ipkg_conf_write_staus_files: Can't open for writing: Read-only file system |
| 04:15:05 | extremis | interesting, after flashing oz 2.9.4 it boots up with the sharp logo |
| 04:15:07 | extremis | and hangs |
| 04:15:12 | kergoth_ | extremis: it didnt flash. |
| 04:15:17 | kergoth_ | extremis: or you didnt rename zImage-blah to zImage |
| 04:15:21 | extremis | haha |
| 04:15:22 | extremis | duh |
| 04:15:24 | kergoth_ | extremis: oz doesnt show a sharp logo |
| 04:15:26 | kergoth_ | :-) |
| 04:15:53 | kergoth_ | after the maintainance release cloudchaser will probably help me with the docs. improve the install guide and stuff for you guys |
| 04:16:04 | kergoth_ | ive only got so much time, you know |
| 04:16:04 | kergoth_ | heh |
| 04:17:21 | ][N-Flux | is away: ZZZ's |
| 04:19:08 | | darienm: huh? |
| 04:19:08 | darienm | ibot rekall |
| 04:19:15 | | darienm: huh? |
| 04:19:15 | darienm | ibot tkcrekall |
| 04:19:44 | | tkc is at http://www.thekompany.com/embedded |
| 04:19:44 | darienm | ibot tkc |
| 04:20:04 | darienm | site down ? |
| 04:20:16 | darienm | responsive for anyone else? |
| 04:20:54 | [DrEvil] | kergoth_: can you make it so the themes are in the opie-theme-NAME format on the feed? |
| 04:21:14 | kergoth_ | [DrEvil]: uhh only one of them is a theme. |
| 04:21:27 | kergoth_ | [DrEvil]: the rest are styles. there's a diff, needs to be handled that way |
| 04:21:27 | [DrEvil] | liquid |
| 04:21:28 | [DrEvil] | metal |
| 04:21:31 | [DrEvil] | luna |
| 04:21:32 | kergoth_ | liquid is a style, not a theme |
| 04:21:32 | [DrEvil] | ahh |
| 04:21:44 | kergoth_ | only luna is a theme, and it requires opie-theme. the rest dont require opie-theme |
| 04:21:54 | kergoth_ | i'm not sure how to best handle that |
| 04:22:40 | [DrEvil] | why is wlan-ng in the feed? |
| 04:22:48 | [DrEvil] | oh |
| 04:22:53 | kergoth_ | in case people want it |
| 04:23:01 | kergoth_ | the whole point is flexibility you know :-) |
| 04:23:11 | [DrEvil] | and task-opie-complete wont install without gzip |
| 04:23:15 | [DrEvil] | which isn't in the feed |
| 04:23:25 | kergoth_ | k, i'll look into that |
| 04:23:34 | kergoth_ | see OZ has gzip, but its a part of busybox.. but ipkg doesnt know that.. |
| 04:23:44 | [DrEvil] | someone is going to install wlan-ng and screw up their system |
| 04:23:47 | kergoth_ | stupid ipkg doesnt support Provides yet so i cant just make busybox Provide gzip and be done with it |
| 04:23:52 | [DrEvil] | I think it already happened once |
| 04:24:14 | [DrEvil] | how about a bogus ipk |
| 04:24:42 | [DrEvil] | something that leaves maybe a 1 byte file |
| 04:24:52 | [DrEvil] | but adds gzip to the database |
| 04:24:56 | oGMo | ok good, OZ flashed back on |
| 04:25:09 | oGMo | so does the cf card need to be clear of everything but 'ospack'? |
| 04:26:14 | [DrEvil] | are you trying to flash the sharp ROM or OZ? |
| 04:26:24 | oGMo | sharp |
| 04:26:42 | [DrEvil] | then ospack is all you need |
| 04:27:11 | kergoth__ | stupid at&t broadband |
| 04:27:15 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: can you email me your concerns with OZ so I have it written down somewhere? |
| 04:27:36 | [DrEvil] | I'll make a list |
| 04:27:37 | [DrEvil] | heh |
| 04:27:51 | oGMo | sigh.. it looks so pretty, too ;) |
| 04:28:41 | [DrEvil] | ok |
| 04:28:45 | [DrEvil] | here is another question |
| 04:28:59 | [DrEvil] | to setup an IR connection to my cell phone.... |
| 04:29:11 | [DrEvil] | in the sharp rom I set up an IrDA network |
| 04:29:17 | [DrEvil] | and gave it the special phone number |
| 04:29:43 | [DrEvil] | then I would click on the connect icon on the taskbar |
| 04:29:46 | [DrEvil] | and it would connect |
| 04:29:51 | [DrEvil] | so |
| 04:30:00 | [DrEvil] | how do I make it do that in OZ? |
| 04:30:08 | [DrEvil] | setup a dialup connection? |
| 04:31:49 | TrekCycling | what problems, [DrEvil]? |
| 04:32:05 | [DrEvil] | grrrrr |
| 04:32:11 | RiPPdJack | whats a zaurus? |
| 04:32:15 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: you want to do ppp to it? |
| 04:32:29 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: tap the ira applet, hit connect to start |
| 04:32:30 | kergoth__ | heh |
| 04:32:30 | [DrEvil] | it is a GPRS phone |
| 04:32:35 | kergoth__ | ah |
| 04:32:36 | RiPPdJack | is it a palm wanna be? |
| 04:32:52 | kergoth__ | RiPPdJack: rtfm. http://myzaurus.com/ |
| 04:32:52 | [DrEvil] | I wont be actually dialing anything |
| 04:33:00 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: so you beam stuff right? |
| 04:33:03 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: that'll work in OZ |
| 04:33:09 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: hit connect on the irda applet |
| 04:33:20 | kergoth__ | brb |
| 04:33:24 | oGMo | wtf, this card keeps getting remounted ro |
| 04:33:41 | oGMo | is just having no end to stupid issues, isn't he |
| 04:33:49 | TrekCycling | kergoth__: where do the cache files for konqueror go? |
| 04:34:29 | [DrEvil] | ok |
| 04:34:31 | [DrEvil] | I did enable irda |
| 04:34:35 | [DrEvil] | then discover |
| 04:35:09 | RiPPdJack | i want to put wince on the zaurus |
| 04:35:18 | [DrEvil] | it finds my phone |
| 04:35:23 | [DrEvil] | but |
| 04:35:24 | TrekCycling | why? |
| 04:35:27 | RiPPdJack | someone tell me how please? |
| 04:35:31 | TrekCycling | that's backwords |
| 04:35:37 | RiPPdJack | because linux is flawed |
| 04:35:39 | TrekCycling | you put LInux on a WinCE, not the other way around |
| 04:35:45 | TrekCycling | WinCE is flawed |
| 04:35:48 | [DrEvil] | I need to send this special number that causes the phone to start a GPRS connection |
| 04:36:09 | RiPPdJack | no no no linux is. |
| 04:36:24 | TrekCycling | uh, okay |
| 04:37:05 | RiPPdJack | i bought the zaurus for $50 |
| 04:37:09 | oGMo | 's trollometer suddenly rings raucously from the back corner |
| 04:37:38 | [DrEvil] | grrr |
| 04:37:44 | [DrEvil] | my taskbar is full |
| 04:38:38 | TrekCycling | are you installing the regular Rom again, [DrEvil]? |
| 04:39:21 | oGMo | if he's not, i am ;) |
| 04:39:26 | [DrEvil] | I am evaluating the current OZ |
| 04:39:42 | [DrEvil] | and I don't use a regular rom |
| 04:39:46 | [DrEvil] | I use EvilROM 1.0 |
| 04:39:59 | TrekCycling | ah. I'm just checking out OZ, debating which to use. |
| 04:40:40 | [DrEvil] | kergoth__: did you ever add a hostname setting anywhere? |
| 04:40:43 | TrekCycling | OZ looks good, but I'm concerned about the life of the flash and I'm wondering about the flash ROM filling up (it's already full) |
| 04:40:50 | oGMo | oz is really nice and looks pretty and has lots of nice features but... the stuff i bought the Z to use it for doesn't work :) |
| 04:41:08 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: hostname for what? |
| 04:41:16 | TrekCycling | oGMo: Like what? |
| 04:41:18 | [DrEvil] | to set the hostname for the Z |
| 04:41:21 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: as i said, you need to write some terabyte of data to the flash to wear it out |
| 04:41:27 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: ah, iirc its /etc/hostname |
| 04:41:49 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: and as i said, start installing apps to ram |
| 04:41:56 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: you've got a 24mb ramdisk sitting empty. use it. |
| 04:41:56 | [DrEvil] | I thought you were going to add a tab somewhere to make it easy to set |
| 04:42:09 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: someone else is already rewriting netsetup and wlansetup completely |
| 04:42:13 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: not going to step on toes |
| 04:42:20 | [DrEvil] | ahh |
| 04:42:20 | [DrEvil] | ok |
| 04:42:27 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: the new netsetup will have wireless built in, and a working network monitor applet. |
| 04:42:33 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: not to mention usb and irda and bluetooth |
| 04:42:43 | TrekCycling | I know I've got the 24mb ramdisk |
| 04:42:57 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: install stuff to it then. the sharp rom starts with flash completely full. |
| 04:42:58 | oGMo | TrekCycling: well, the media player crashes, konqueror is huge, the calendar isn't quite as functional, and i've got to install the hancom stuff again... |
| 04:43:11 | [DrEvil] | TrekCycling: are you worried about the jffs2 partition? |
| 04:43:19 | TrekCycling | yeah |
| 04:43:24 | [DrEvil] | I wouldn't worry |
| 04:43:25 | TrekCycling | Problem is aren't some programs going to try to put stuff on that partition? |
| 04:43:26 | kergoth__ | oGMo: tell sharp to release their calandar changes and it'll be as functional. |
| 04:43:33 | [DrEvil] | there isn't that much space to use |
| 04:43:33 | oGMo | kergoth__: ya ;/ |
| 04:43:37 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: no |
| 04:43:43 | [DrEvil] | I would only put system stuff that you wont be changing in there |
| 04:43:50 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: /tmp for example is a dynamic ramdisk, as is /var |
| 04:44:54 | TrekCycling | ah |
| 04:45:19 | TrekCycling | what's the biggest advantage of OZ, then? Just updated packages, being able to uninstall or upgrade packages? |
| 04:45:27 | RiPPdJack | hehe, vnc makes spying no people a snap :) |
| 04:45:41 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: i already answered that question. |
| 04:45:55 | TrekCycling | :-) |
| 04:45:56 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: writable flash, and opie are the biggest advantages |
| 04:46:01 | | i guess opie is the Open Palmtop Integrated Environment. More info can be found at http://opie.handhelds.org or in the #opie channel. or at http://www.opie.info or at http://www.opie.us or most important at http://www.opie.info |
| 04:46:01 | kergoth__ | ibot: opie? |
| 04:46:15 | TrekCycling | I'm just debating, don't mind me. |
| 04:46:19 | kergoth__ | hehe |
| 04:46:19 | kergoth__ | k |
| 04:46:30 | TrekCycling | Is this kernel file setup more standard, probably? |
| 04:46:41 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: its got issues, thats a given. but at least with opie its truely open source, you could go fix a bug yourself |
| 04:46:56 | kergoth__ | TrekCycling: the filesystem is more sane. the kernel is the kernel. |
| 04:47:54 | TrekCycling | yeah |
| 04:48:29 | TrekCycling | I don't care about sane, just functional, since I'm not developing for it, really. |
| 04:48:34 | TrekCycling | or on it |
| 04:48:35 | [DrEvil] | I wouldn't say it is more sane |
| 04:48:53 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: look at the sharp rom's mess of symlinks again ;-) |
| 04:48:58 | [DrEvil] | red hat vs debian filesystem structure |
| 04:49:00 | kergoth__ | no |
| 04:49:11 | kergoth__ | i'm referring to the s ymlink madness as a result of the ro filesystem |
| 04:49:16 | kergoth__ | not the rh vs deb thing |
| 04:49:22 | kergoth__ | you're right there of course |
| 04:49:44 | kergoth__ | i need a drink. and i'm COMPLETELY out of alcohol |
| 04:49:44 | oGMo | the filesystem would be a lot more sane if the desktop sucked just a little bit less |
| 04:49:45 | kergoth__ | sniflfe |
| 04:49:51 | kergoth__ | oGMo: huh? |
| 04:50:06 | kergoth__ | oGMo: what problems have you seen? |
| 04:50:18 | oGMo | it's all a result of the fact the desktop thingie doesn't look in more than one place |
| 04:50:20 | kergoth__ | oGMo: as i said, if you want a more functional calander bitch at sharp to start releasing their code. |
| 04:50:25 | kergoth__ | oGMo: huh? |
| 04:50:26 | oGMo | kergoth__, no no |
| 04:50:44 | oGMo | the whole filesystem mess is due to trying to get the rom stuff and the ram stuff to integrate without having the rom +rw |
| 04:50:50 | [DrEvil] | kergoth__: just write a better calendar |
| 04:51:01 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: oh yes with my copious free time ;-) |
| 04:51:01 | oGMo | well, that and Lineo sucking, but |
| 04:51:03 | oGMo | ;) |
| 04:51:10 | kergoth__ | oGMo: hah. |
| 04:51:20 | [DrEvil] | just get ljp to clone them |
| 04:51:27 | kergoth__ | oGMo: lineo japan pisses me off. lineo us has been helpful. |
| 04:51:51 | oGMo | it'd be pretty easy to make it all work if it just looked in a couple different places and merged the results |
| 04:51:54 | kergoth__ | [DrEvil]: ah yes, clonelib.. heheh |
| 04:52:08 | oGMo | kergoth__: there's a lineo japan? i thought lineo was just a little spinoff of caldera |
| 04:52:15 | kergoth__ | oGMo: nope |
| 04:53:19 | kergoth__ | oGMo: pester bzflag, he could tell you more about how their structured, i only picked up that tidbit of info |
| 04:53:20 | kergoth__ | heh |
| 04:53:32 | kergoth | curses at&t some more |
| 04:53:51 | [DrEvil] | does oipkg have a way to filter installed vs not installed packages? |
| 04:53:57 | oGMo | hrm, too bad the tkc* stuff isn't free |
| 04:54:22 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: dont think so. oipkg is the biggest problem in opie atm. |
| 04:55:24 | oGMo | er, oh yeah, does the CF card have to be fat16? |
| 04:55:42 | oGMo | this one's vfat |
| 04:55:59 | kergoth | oGMo: no.. but if you change it i'd recommend editing fstab, as the 2.4.6 kernel's auto fs type appears to suck |
| 04:56:06 | kergoth | vfat is fine out of the box |
| 04:56:11 | oGMo | kergoth: i mean for flashing, actually |
| 04:56:14 | kergoth | ah |
| 04:56:19 | kergoth | it has to be vfat |
| 04:56:24 | kergoth | so either fat16, fat32.. |
| 04:56:30 | kergoth | as i understand it |
| 04:56:38 | oGMo | k |
| 04:56:42 | kergoth | hm, caffeine will do. brb |
| 04:59:41 | oGMo | uh... fuck, i forgot to unmount the cf card, i hope it synced |
| 04:59:59 | oGMo | i did say terminate opie but i doubt ;P |
| 05:00:33 | oGMo | maybe that's why things didn't "stick" last time |
| 05:01:25 | kergoth | hey tim |
| 05:04:36 | kergoth | BZFlag: LoCoMo likes me again. finally have flow control signals on the serial console. :-) |
| 05:04:53 | [DrEvil] | let's see if tkc stuff functions with opie |
| 05:06:07 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: should.. let me know how it goes |
| 05:06:17 | [DrEvil] | I just tried a mass install |
| 05:06:32 | [DrEvil] | the libs and mahjong were the only ones to install |
| 05:07:30 | kergoth | installing to somewhere other than flash? |
| 05:07:42 | kergoth | tkc's apps are notorious for problems installing to ram/cf/sd |
| 05:07:47 | kergoth | annoying |
| 05:08:13 | [DrEvil] | I was just installing to root |
| 05:08:16 | oGMo | kergoth: glad i haven't shelled out ;) |
| 05:09:08 | oGMo | man. i had 80+ games of mindbreaker down before all this too ;) |
| 05:11:32 | [DrEvil] | I am not going to use wget |
| 05:11:42 | [DrEvil] | I am going to use emirror for mirroring feeds |
| 05:12:38 | [DrEvil] | wow |
| 05:12:41 | [DrEvil] | found another bug |
| 05:12:57 | [DrEvil] | you can't turn off WEP once you have enabled it |
| 05:13:09 | kergoth | using wlansetup? |
| 05:13:17 | [DrEvil] | yeah |
| 05:13:23 | kergoth | http://opie.info/mantis |
| 05:13:23 | [DrEvil] | the config util |
| 05:13:29 | kergoth | you can login as guest/guest or create an acct |
| 05:13:33 | kergoth | report the bug with wlansetup |
| 05:13:36 | kergoth | and any other opie bugs you find |
| 05:13:42 | kergoth | er |
| 05:13:47 | kergoth | http://opie.info/bugs |
| 05:13:50 | kergoth | yeah, its late |
| 05:13:50 | kergoth | hehe |
| 05:14:26 | [DrEvil] | not found |
| 05:15:03 | kergoth | stupid shit |
| 05:15:03 | kergoth | here |
| 05:15:04 | kergoth | http://131.152.105.154/~opie/mantis/ |
| 05:15:12 | kergoth | thats the opie bugtracker. bookmark :-) |
| 05:16:59 | jmhodges | yello |
| 05:17:55 | oGMo | You Know You're a Zaurus Developer when.... The Opie bugtracker isn't bookmarked. It's your homepage. |
| 05:18:04 | jmhodges | lol |
| 05:18:07 | jmhodges | nice oGMo |
| 05:18:17 | oGMo | ;) |
| 05:21:22 | codemnky | hello |
| 05:21:46 | | roge99 was last seen on #zaurus 1 hours, 59 minutes and 13 seconds ago, saying: 31.99999 - 0.00001 [Fri Jul 19 04:22:33 2002] |
| 05:21:46 | codemnky | ibot seen roge99 |
| 05:22:08 | kergoth | hey codemnky |
| 05:22:17 | [DrEvil] | ok |
| 05:22:20 | [DrEvil] | that bug is reported |
| 05:22:23 | codemnky | yo |
| 05:22:24 | kergoth | great |
| 05:22:25 | jmhodges | hey codemnky |
| 05:22:28 | kergoth | thanks dr |
| 05:22:32 | kergoth | heh |
| 05:22:33 | kergoth | re jmhodges |
| 05:22:38 | codemnky | what b up |
| 05:22:39 | jmhodges | heya kergoth |
| 05:22:48 | codemnky | i can't sleep |
| 05:23:02 | codemnky | you guys know anyone who can make me one of these: |
| 05:23:07 | codemnky | toolbar.google.com |
| 05:23:08 | jmhodges | sigh.. havent played with the new apps much :( stupid nwn making me addicted |
| 05:23:43 | jmhodges | codemnky: theres something close builtin by default in galeon ;) |
| 05:23:53 | [DrEvil] | tkc needs to add picture support to their addressbook |
| 05:24:08 | codemnky | i need it for IE |
| 05:24:26 | jmhodges | codemnky: bah.. theres already one made for IE isnt there? |
| 05:24:36 | codemnky | i need one for me for IE |
| 05:24:45 | codemnky | instead of google |
| 05:24:45 | jmhodges | theres already one for IE |
| 05:24:52 | codemnky | i want it to be something else |
| 05:24:54 | jmhodges | oh...k..... |
| 05:24:57 | jmhodges | ah |
| 05:24:58 | jmhodges | i see |
| 05:25:15 | codemnky | i'm seen the instruction on how to do it |
| 05:25:18 | codemnky | it's visual basic |
| 05:25:26 | codemnky | which i no less than nothing about |
| 05:25:56 | codemnky | is there a visual basic irc channel? |
| 05:26:00 | [DrEvil] | this is not my night |
| 05:26:02 | jmhodges | heh |
| 05:26:03 | jmhodges | no |
| 05:26:07 | [DrEvil] | so I am going to shower so I can think |
| 05:26:12 | jmhodges | not on openprojects at least |
| 05:26:15 | codemnky | or can you recommed a channel where i might find someone |
| 05:26:37 | codemnky | maybe #winblows |
| 05:26:40 | codemnky | :) |
| 05:26:49 | jmhodges | uh.. nope not from me sorry |
| 05:26:51 | codemnky | or #crashalot |
| 05:28:07 | codemnky | oh well |
| 05:28:23 | codemnky | you guys used the sharpmobile thingy yet |
| 05:28:27 | codemnky | or know anything about it? |
| 05:29:49 | kergoth | codemnky: didnt peanut try it> |
| 05:33:48 | codemnky | not sure |
| 05:33:52 | codemnky | what's he say about it |
| 05:36:33 | codemnky | brb |
| 05:38:21 | zwelch | One of the 2.6 kernel line items is "usb gadget support", anyone live that |
| 05:38:36 | zwelch | knows what exactly that means?? |
| 05:38:49 | zwelch | (darn that premature newline...) |
| 05:39:29 | jmhodges | hehe |
| 05:39:41 | zwelch | (the maintainer, Greg GH, specifically mentioned the Zaurus as one of the devices |
| 05:39:41 | jmhodges | sorry cant help ya zwelch |
| 05:39:48 | zwelch | (doh!) |
| 05:40:00 | jmhodges | oooh |
| 05:40:01 | zwelch | supported by that feature |
| 05:40:05 | jmhodges | hmm.. |
| 05:40:49 | kergoth | zwelch: whats the question? |
| 05:42:26 | BZFlag | 2.6? |
| 05:43:12 | kergoth | i'd assume he's reading the kernel status page |
| 05:43:34 | zwelch | actually, i'm getting real sick and reading lkml.... |
| 05:43:51 | kergoth | ha |
| 05:43:52 | zwelch | this is wrt the Halloween feature freeze |
| 05:43:57 | kergoth | i'm 388 messages behind |
| 05:44:00 | kergoth | grumbles |
| 05:44:27 | zwelch | that'll happen after a day of slack... :) |
| 05:44:32 | kergoth | exactly |
| 05:44:48 | kergoth | too bad my work wouldnt let me spend 2 hours a day on reading lkml :-) |
| 05:45:21 | zwelch | yah, I'm rediscovering my proficiency for skimming... |
| 05:45:25 | kergoth | hehe |
| 05:46:14 | zwelch | so what exactly does usbdnet offer for the Zaurus that is not already available with the current software? |
| 05:47:42 | BZFlag | zwelch: nothing. but the you need to patch a kernel now, and with that presumably it will be included. |
| 05:47:47 | kergoth_ | fuckers at at&t.. i swear.. |
| 05:51:14 | jmhodges | :( |
| 05:51:52 | kergoth_ | i need my laptop to arrive. coding on remote boxen while at&t is dropping my connection left and right is pissing me off. |
| 05:53:16 | jmhodges | :( |
| 05:53:27 | jmhodges | why are you having to code on a remote box? |
| 05:55:13 | BZFlag | kergoth_: "screen" is your buddy. |
| 05:55:31 | jmhodges | lol |
| 05:55:40 | jmhodges | suck kergoth |
| 05:55:49 | jmhodges | er.. suck kergoth_ |
| 05:55:54 | jmhodges | why are you having to code on a remote box? |
| 05:56:21 | kergoth_ | need this box for other things. i've only got a single desktop box here. |
| 05:57:21 | jmhodges | hm... ok im sure if i knew more about your situation that would make sense :) |
| 06:01:01 | BZFlag | kergoth_: "screen" is your buddy. |
| 06:01:32 | kergoth_ | true that. I pick up where i left off, but it throws off my concentration |
| 06:05:12 | kergoth_ | BZFlag: bit OT, but do you have a degree, tim? I'm thinking about going back to college myself, perhaps for EE |
| 06:05:46 | codemnky | hello |
| 06:05:52 | codemnky | anyone here |
| 06:05:57 | jmhodges | yes |
| 06:06:00 | jmhodges | a few |
| 06:06:02 | codemnky | what's the new ip |
| 06:06:17 | codemnky | i did an ifconfig on the Z and i don't see the 192... |
| 06:06:27 | codemnky | should i? |
| 06:06:41 | codemnky | just the lo shows up |
| 06:07:28 | codemnky | do you know the new IP sharp is using? |
| 06:07:32 | codemnky | i forgot it |
| 06:08:18 | kergoth_ | codemnky: for what? usb networking? |
| 06:08:54 | codemnky | i'm trying to scp to it from my usb |
| 06:09:02 | codemnky | sshd is on |
| 06:09:15 | kergoth_ | 192.168.129.201 on the Z, 192.168.129.1 on the desktop |
| 06:09:42 | codemnky | thx that worked |
| 06:09:50 | codemnky | why can't i see it with ifconfig? |
| 06:10:42 | jmhodges | codemnky: see waht? |
| 06:10:57 | codemnky | see the 192.168.129.201 turned up |
| 06:11:11 | codemnky | i just see local loop |
| 06:11:45 | kergoth_ | maybe the interface is down. try ifconfig -a |
| 06:11:56 | codemnky | i was able to scp/ssh to it |
| 06:11:59 | codemnky | from my desktop |
| 06:12:08 | codemnky | but ifconfig only shows lo |
| 06:12:09 | kergoth_ | ah |
| 06:12:11 | kergoth_ | odd |
| 06:12:14 | kergoth_ | no idea |
| 06:12:22 | codemnky | weird |
| 06:13:24 | jmhodges | wow.. i just saw the first funny skit on MadTV.. ever |
| 06:13:31 | kergoth_ | lol |
| 06:13:37 | kergoth_ | mark it on the calandar |
| 06:13:40 | kergoth_ | or something |
| 06:14:01 | codemnky | hmm |
| 06:14:07 | codemnky | i can scp but not ssh |
| 06:14:15 | jmhodges | well shit.. |
| 06:14:16 | jmhodges | DAMMIT |
| 06:14:19 | jmhodges | getting mem errors |
| 06:14:25 | codemnky | what rom do you guys use? |
| 06:14:27 | jmhodges | while installing kernel modules |
| 06:14:29 | jmhodges | fuuuck |
| 06:14:40 | kergoth_ | eh thats not good jmhodges |
| 06:14:54 | jmhodges | no its not |
| 06:14:57 | kergoth_ | codemnky: i think you know what rom i use :-) |
| 06:15:05 | codemnky | there it is |
| 06:15:11 | codemnky | hehe |
| 06:15:18 | jmhodges | apparently ipkg upgrade doesnt like kernel modules.. so i tried with oipkg .. and badness ensued |
| 06:15:23 | codemnky | it'slate |
| 06:15:27 | codemnky | now i se it |
| 06:15:30 | codemnky | 192 |
| 06:15:33 | codemnky | very weird |
| 06:15:42 | codemnky | i have the damn sharp rom installed - sorry |
| 06:15:45 | kergoth_ | jmhodges: hmm. people did report problems with the upgrade.. what rom are you on? |
| 06:15:47 | kergoth_ | ah |
| 06:15:50 | codemnky | switching back to OZ |
| 06:15:56 | kergoth_ | jmhodges: dont install kernel-modules on the sahrp rom. :-P |
| 06:15:56 | kergoth_ | hehe |
| 06:16:07 | codemnky | i tested it out for the hell of it |
| 06:16:09 | kergoth_ | jmhodges: you on OZ? |
| 06:16:10 | codemnky | no disrespect |
| 06:16:12 | jmhodges | kergoth_: im trying to do and upgrade on the oz rom |
| 06:16:20 | kergoth_ | jmhodges: ah. hm. what ver of oz did you start with? |
| 06:16:26 | jmhodges | kergoth_: beta7 |
| 06:16:51 | kergoth_ | jmhodges: do this. ipkg rmeove orinoco-cs spectrum-cs; ipkg upgrade; |
| 06:17:09 | kergoth_ | jmhodges: i moved the orinoco and spectrum modules directly into kernel-modules, they're part of my kernel tree now |
| 06:19:38 | kergoth_ | <kergoth_> jmhodges: do this. ipkg rmeove orinoco-cs spectrum-cs; ipkg upgrade; |
| 06:19:38 | kergoth_ | <kergoth_> jmhodges: i moved the orinoco and spectrum modules directly into kernel-modules, they're part of my kernel tree now |
| 06:19:40 | jmhodges_ | ARGH |
| 06:19:41 | jmhodges_ | usb-uhci freezes my comp once in a while |
| 06:19:45 | kergoth_ | weird |
| 06:19:47 | jmhodges_ | thanks kergoth |
| 06:19:49 | kergoth_ | np |
| 06:20:22 | jmhodges_ | also ... the security app has no icon (on my z) any fix? or is it just some bad data? |
| 06:20:42 | kergoth_ | hm, probablyi corruption |
| 06:20:47 | kergoth_ | i tested the latest from the feed, seems fine |
| 06:20:53 | jmhodges_ | sweet |
| 06:21:04 | jmhodges_ | ill rm and reinstall |
| 06:21:36 | kergoth_ | yeh that should do |
| 06:24:59 | jmhodges | ok modules installed fine |
| 06:25:25 | codemnky | later yall |
| 06:25:50 | jmhodges | but ipkg is claiming opie-base needs qpe-base |
| 06:26:10 | jmhodges | and that opie-qpdf requires 'gzip' |
| 06:26:14 | jmhodges | and |
| 06:26:20 | jmhodges | ERROR: The following packages conflict with opie-opiealarm: |
| 06:26:21 | jmhodges | opie-opiealarm |
| 06:26:27 | jmhodges | now.. wtf? on that last one :D |
| 06:26:29 | jmhodges | anyways |
| 06:26:37 | jmhodges | ill force depends the first two |
| 06:26:43 | jmhodges | and rm and reinstall the last |
| 06:28:49 | jmhodges | LOL |
| 06:28:53 | jmhodges | ipkg upgrade opie-base -force-depends |
| 06:28:53 | jmhodges | Warning: The following packages conflict with opie-base: |
| 06:28:53 | jmhodges | qpe-base |
| 06:29:37 | jmhodges | ok well rm'd qpe-base (wonder how that got there.. |
| 06:29:52 | jmhodges | ok sorry for the spam |
| 06:29:57 | jmhodges | gnight folk |
| 06:29:57 | jmhodges | s |
| 06:38:12 | jmhodges | hm.. |
| 06:39:14 | jmhodges | opikg is trying to install opie-clock on both the normal ram and on /mnt/card! same with opie-tetrix! and i cant deselect them! |
| 06:39:16 | jmhodges | :/ |
| 06:48:27 | jmhodges | kergoth_: oipkg keeps defaulting to try and install opie-clock and opie-tetrix in two positions at startup and i cant deselect them |
| 06:48:33 | jmhodges | is there anyway to remove them? |
| 06:48:51 | jmhodges | i tried rming and then installing again but tahat didnt work |
| 06:50:02 | jmhodges | it also thinks theres an old installation on /mnt/card |
| 06:50:38 | jmhodges | hm.. segfault |
| 06:50:39 | jmhodges | fun! |
| 06:53:54 | jmhodges | ok |
| 06:59:05 | kergoth_ | woo hoo! |
| 06:59:11 | kergoth_ | the lcd turned on! |
| 06:59:13 | kergoth_ | i see a penguin! |
| 06:59:16 | kergoth_ | on 2.5.21-rmk1-cl1 |
| 07:02:35 | NeoTron | heh |
| 07:02:37 | NeoTron | whee for you |
| 07:02:47 | kergoth_ | :-) |
| 07:02:52 | kergoth_ | big step, man. one less thing to do |
| 07:03:05 | kergoth_ | course its rotated wrong.. |
| 07:03:19 | kergoth_ | you know cause the Z has its console rotated 270 degrees by default |
| 07:03:25 | kergoth_ | this kernel is at 0 |
| 07:03:26 | kergoth_ | heh |
| 07:05:14 | jmhodges | cool kergoth :) |
| 07:05:37 | jmhodges | thinks about scrapping his pim data and go for the new rom |
| 07:08:05 | jmhodges | goes for it |
| 07:08:16 | jmhodges | hopefully i wont be wrangling with oipkg aftwerwards |
| 07:10:56 | jmhodges | gnight for real |
| 07:15:16 | kergoth_ | hm |
| 07:15:19 | kergoth_ | i shouldnt be awake |
| 07:15:30 | Nadav | what's the time |
| 07:15:31 | Nadav | ? |
| 07:15:36 | kergoth_ | 3:20am here |
| 07:15:44 | Nadav | heh |
| 07:15:48 | Nadav | i just woke up |
| 07:15:53 | Nadav | 11:20am |
| 07:16:15 | kergoth_ | heh. well its friday, not like i need to be entirely awake at work or anything. hehe. |
| 07:16:18 | kergoth_ | good morning |
| 07:16:38 | Nadav | thanks |
| 07:59:33 | Jerakeen | Is there a way of simulating the 'link to root' feature of opikg using ipkg? |
| 08:53:39 | giuppi | does zaurus include nfs support ? can i mount a directory via nfs ? |
| 08:57:04 | Jerakeen | which rom? |
| 08:57:57 | giuppi | Jerakeen ok just mounted it :) |
| 09:24:14 | George- | hi Cloudchaser |
| 09:24:34 | Cloudchaser | hi |
| 09:36:23 | whardier | that was. 5 too many hours of armagetron |
| 09:36:25 | whardier | thats totally fucked up |
| 11:10:04 | George- | omg |
| 11:10:14 | George- | kergoth_: You forgot something! |
| 11:10:20 | George- | kergoth_: In the release of beta 10.4 |
| 11:10:30 | George- | kergoth_: The, er, bootflag.txt |
| 11:14:43 | ljp | http://www.opie.us/opie/devZone.php/OpenZaurus/bootflag.txt |
| 11:15:28 | thefly | hello |
| 11:15:51 | thefly | i downloaded openssh from zauruszone.com but when i try to ssh out to my server it says bad packet length, any idea? |
| 11:18:21 | ljp | I'm not sure, but you may want to ask that in a few hours, when it starts hopping here more |
| 11:18:36 | thefly | ah ok |
| 11:18:43 | thefly | it is strange |
| 11:18:56 | thefly | because if i ssh to the zaurus and then from there out it works |
| 11:19:09 | thefly | if i try ssh from ope-sh->ssh out it give this error |
| 11:24:39 | Jerakeen | I wrote a couple of scripts that do magic linking to root so you can use ipkg to install packages to other dests |
| 11:24:44 | Jerakeen | http://jerakeen.org/zaurus/ |
| 11:24:53 | Jerakeen | look at and edit these before using! |
| 11:31:46 | thefly | any good repositories except zauruszone.com/feed/ ? |
| 11:32:24 | | zsi is http://killefiz.de/zaurus/ |
| 11:32:24 | ljp | ibot: zsi |
| 11:32:37 | | feed is a package repository or http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/IpkgFeeds or http://www.zauruszone.com/feed/ or http://openzaurus.sf.net/feeds/3.0/ for OpenZaurus |
| 11:32:37 | ljp | ibot: feed |
| 11:44:50 | Jerakeen | oh, note. don't use those scripts unless you want to TOTALLY DESTROY YOUR OPIE INSTALL. |
| 11:44:53 | Jerakeen | oops. |
| 11:46:31 | benmeyer | Morning |
| 12:15:35 | bipolar | is away: not really.... |
| 12:15:44 | bipolar | is back (gone 00:00:02) |
| 12:17:03 | benmeyer | Does anyone know of a revolving icon? |
| 12:17:07 | benmeyer | i.e. several icons |
| 12:17:18 | benmeyer | that make an anitmated icon |
| 12:17:28 | benmeyer | for a web browser |
| 12:17:36 | benmeyer | i.e. downloading something |
| 12:20:45 | numatrix | Morning everyone. |
| 12:21:36 | benmeyer | morning |
| 12:21:43 | [George] | hi |
| 12:22:31 | ljp_ | benmeyer: wheres your ftp thingy? |
| 12:22:40 | numatrix | Anyone found any cheap sources for the zaurus serial cable? |
| 12:22:51 | benmeyer | running on my desktop |
| 12:23:05 | numatrix | Or know about a different serial cable that doesn't block the keyboard? |
| 12:23:06 | benmeyer | want a bin? |
| 12:23:23 | benmeyer | no icons needed |
| 12:24:03 | ljp_ | is it a qpe app? |
| 12:24:09 | benmeyer | yah |
| 12:24:16 | benmeyer | what is your e-mail? |
| 12:24:31 | ljp_ | I'd rather look at what you did woth qftp |
| 12:24:40 | ljp_ | llornkcor@handhelds.org |
| 12:25:12 | ljp_ | I tried porting that and it seemed I had to port wayy to much other stuff to get it working |
| 12:26:03 | BigBoss | whatcha doing with ftp? |
| 12:26:19 | ljp_ | ben's got an ftp client |
| 12:26:32 | benmeyer | send |
| 12:26:33 | benmeyer | sent |
| 12:28:55 | ljp_ | is funny, since sharp announced the dev contest, my cat suddenly took up qtopia developement ;) |
| 12:32:01 | darienm | benmeyer: You need progression icons? |
| 12:32:06 | benmeyer | yah |
| 12:32:11 | darienm | benmeyer: dimensions? |
| 12:32:13 | benmeyer | for downloading |
| 12:32:16 | benmeyer | 16x16? |
| 12:32:20 | benmeyer | 12x12 |
| 12:32:21 | darienm | heh, tiny. |
| 12:32:22 | benmeyer | something like that |
| 12:32:26 | benmeyer | yah |
| 12:32:26 | darienm | very tiny |
| 12:32:30 | benmeyer | doens't have to be anything |
| 12:32:31 | ljp_ | 4x4 |
| 12:32:32 | darienm | one or both of them? |
| 12:32:37 | benmeyer | wait maybe 32x3 |
| 12:32:39 | darienm | 4x4 is easy |
| 12:32:45 | benmeyer | the normal toobar icon size |
| 12:32:54 | darienm | I'll look it up. |
| 12:33:00 | benmeyer | like the up.png icon in opie |
| 12:33:08 | darienm | what format? individual png's or animated gif? |
| 12:33:16 | darienm | I dont use opie |
| 12:33:19 | darienm | (yet) |
| 12:33:33 | benmeyer | pngs |
| 12:33:46 | darienm | Certain number of frames you looking for? And what naming scheme? |
| 12:35:07 | benmeyer | nope nothing inperticular |
| 12:35:24 | darienm | alright, gimme a little time. |
| 12:35:55 | benmeyer | was simply going to use the up/right/down/left icons, but anything would probably be better :-D |
| 12:37:36 | JasonNJ | good mornink |
| 12:37:46 | [George] | http://www.handango.com/sharp/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?catalog=80&jid=X76EBB7EXC6BX76472E277BD51536F67&platformId=9&productId=34081&productType=2§ionId=0&siteId=423&zsortParams=true |
| 12:37:52 | [George] | WTF is that? |
| 12:38:05 | thefly | is there already a openzaurus kernel project? |
| 12:38:17 | thefly | i mean, is there already some code for the kernel? |
| 12:39:11 | Cloudchaser | 'mornin everyone |
| 12:39:15 | darienm | [George]: its another program that got put in the wrong category |
| 12:39:20 | JasonNJ | danielle edwards huh |
| 12:40:19 | darienm | benmeyer: how about a nuclear symbol rotating in 3d space? |
| 12:41:01 | benmeyer | sure |
| 12:41:06 | benmeyer | hmm |
| 12:41:14 | benmeyer | actually that might be the best |
| 12:41:27 | benmeyer | a rotation ball or clock |
| 12:42:01 | benmeyer | http://www.handango.com/sharp/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?catalog=0&jid=A87XEFBACFBEXEC4X1C6B1237X67EADX&platformId=9&productId=35077&productType=2§ionId=0&siteId=423&zsortParams=true |
| 12:42:09 | benmeyer | swimsuit calender |
| 12:42:10 | benmeyer | haha |
| 12:43:30 | darienm | benmeyer: ball or clock? I lost you. |
| 12:44:14 | benmeyer | actually I probably could just take the icon for the cursor wait symbol |
| 12:44:21 | benmeyer | and use that.. |
| 12:45:04 | darienm | :( no radioactive symbol? |
| 12:45:09 | benmeyer | na |
| 12:45:16 | darienm | I'm almost done, too. |
| 12:45:40 | BigBoss | the myzaurus site is kind of a bitch to navigate. There isn't an option for browsing 'all' software, just best selling, and no link to see all software by that contributor. you can do those on the handango site directly though |
| 12:46:16 | benmeyer | oh? |
| 12:46:22 | benmeyer | I was never able to browse all |
| 12:46:28 | benmeyer | even via handango |
| 12:46:32 | benmeyer | maybe they changed that |
| 12:48:18 | ljp_ | ben: was that an arm binary? |
| 12:48:41 | benmeyer | yup |
| 12:48:45 | benmeyer | runs on the z |
| 12:48:56 | benmeyer | I run it via nfs on my z |
| 12:49:03 | benmeyer | ( but on my desktop still) |
| 12:52:39 | ljp_ | ben: is that going to be gpl'd? |
| 12:54:11 | benmeyer | yah has to be |
| 12:54:19 | benmeyer | well actually it doesn't.... |
| 12:54:21 | benmeyer | hmmm |
| 12:54:23 | benmeyer | yah I figured |
| 12:54:39 | benmeyer | I used the qftp class |
| 12:54:47 | benmeyer | which ontop says you can use it for anythig you wan |
| 12:54:48 | benmeyer | t |
| 12:54:51 | benmeyer | it is gpl |
| 12:54:54 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 12:55:09 | benmeyer | but I used qinfo witch is gpl, thus the app is gpl |
| 12:55:23 | benmeyer | did you get it to work |
| 12:55:30 | benmeyer | ? |
| 12:56:22 | ljp_ | well, it runs.. but I havent really tried to make the Z see the network.. |
| 12:56:28 | ljp_ | looks nice, tho |
| 12:56:39 | benmeyer | you could ftp to itself |
| 12:56:45 | benmeyer | i.e. localhost:4242 |
| 12:56:51 | ljp_ | ahhh true |
| 12:57:34 | benmeyer | going to add cut/copy/paste in 5. Forget to put in the menu in the toolbar |
| 12:57:40 | benmeyer | i.e. the Edit menu |
| 13:00:33 | ljp_ | why double clicks? |
| 13:00:47 | benmeyer | so you can select Dir's |
| 13:01:02 | benmeyer | just can't download/upload them yet (need to change 1 thing) |
| 13:01:29 | benmeyer | was thinking of having a + and if you hit the + it goes into the dir and if you click on the dir icon it would select |
| 13:01:32 | benmeyer | that sound good? |
| 13:01:56 | ljp_ | double clicks are a pain, tho.. opieftp was originally double click, but that got old |
| 13:02:16 | benmeyer | remember this is just 1 1/2 days work |
| 13:02:20 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 13:02:29 | benmeyer | but yes I agree that moving to somethign else would be better |
| 13:02:59 | ljp_ | ya.. I threw together opieftp in an afternoon, originally |
| 13:03:20 | benmeyer | The only dialog that is finished is the server selecting dialog |
| 13:03:21 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 13:03:29 | benmeyer | working my way through the system |
| 13:04:54 | ljp_ | did you have to change qftp at all? |
| 13:05:40 | benmeyer | just 1 line |
| 13:05:47 | benmeyer | to do a LIST -a |
| 13:05:50 | benmeyer | rather then LIST |
| 13:06:34 | ljp_ | hmm |
| 13:07:33 | numatrix | Are .desktop files used in gnome? |
| 13:08:06 | numatrix | Nevermind; answered his own question. |
| 13:10:28 | ljp_ | ben: what about URLOperator.. didnt you have to port all that also? |
| 13:11:06 | benmeyer | cp /usr/local/qt/src/network/qurl* ./ |
| 13:11:09 | benmeyer | All done |
| 13:11:11 | benmeyer | :) |
| 13:11:40 | benmeyer | 2 classes |
| 13:11:51 | benmeyer | QUrl and QUrlOperator |
| 13:12:01 | benmeyer | there were a few classes I copeid right out of qt |
| 13:12:07 | benmeyer | the qftp was the only one I changed |
| 13:12:38 | ljp_ | hmmm. |
| 13:12:46 | benmeyer | spiffy no? |
| 13:13:22 | BigBoss | qftp is trash - that is why we had to write new network code for it |
| 13:13:36 | BigBoss | tkcFTP comes from the FTP client in QuantaGold |
| 13:13:44 | benmeyer | cool |
| 13:13:48 | BigBoss | we tried to use qftp and it was just trash |
| 13:13:57 | BigBoss | the #1 complaint we had for bugs was related to it |
| 13:14:15 | benmeyer | yah qftp isn't the best in the world, but work ok for moving simple ipk files which is all I do |
| 13:14:58 | JasonNJ | what I would like to see is a client that works like Explorer on Windows... FTP/SSH transfers as well as browse NFS and Samba mounted fileysystems. |
| 13:15:12 | JasonNJ | and of course local fileystem stuff |
| 13:15:22 | BigBoss | cough up some cash then :) |
| 13:15:24 | ljp_ | cool, when I tried months ago.. I had a devil of a time. Maybe I'll try again, tho. I'd much rather use QFtp than ftplib |
| 13:15:35 | BigBoss | we made tkcFTP work like tkcExplorer, but we didn't integrate them |
| 13:15:46 | JasonNJ | BigBoss: you should do that. |
| 13:16:07 | benmeyer | yah I relized that with just an 2 or three ifdefs I had a file explorer |
| 13:16:46 | benmeyer | a pretty lame explorer, but still better then the junk that comes with the 5000D by default |
| 13:17:15 | Sniper | hello |
| 13:17:19 | JasonNJ | yo Snipe. |
| 13:17:26 | Sniper | we have over 25 people signed up so far |
| 13:17:28 | Sniper | :-) |
| 13:17:33 | JasonNJ | Sniper: thats awesome. |
| 13:17:41 | BigBoss | JasonNJ: If I integrate them, then I have to double the price |
| 13:17:47 | ljp_ | my cats learning qt development ! ;) |
| 13:18:05 | BigBoss | Sniper: am I correct in assuming that the prize is a 5000D? |
| 13:18:48 | numatrix | Since no prizes are listed, that's a good question. |
| 13:19:31 | ljp_ | prise is you get to buy a 5000d |
| 13:19:47 | ljp_ | prize even |
| 13:20:13 | BigBoss | right, you have to pay for the Qtopia SDK and then you can get a free 5000d |
| 13:22:59 | Sniper | you mean the challenge? |
| 13:23:02 | Sniper | you get a free 5000D |
| 13:23:14 | Sniper | no, you can develop using the FREE Qtopia SDK |
| 13:23:39 | numatrix | So only one winner get sthe 5000, or anyone who submits a valid app does? I'm a little confused. |
| 13:24:02 | Sniper | anyone who builds the app on the list gets a 5000D |
| 13:24:12 | numatrix | Excellent. That's what I was hoping. |
| 13:24:24 | Sniper | hehe we're only giving away 1 5000D |
| 13:24:27 | Sniper | j/k |
| 13:24:45 | numatrix | ;-) |
| 13:24:47 | BigBoss | but if you want to commercialize your product afterward, you have to buy the SDK right? and you have to decide ahead of time |
| 13:24:48 | ljp_ | ahh Sharp is fishing for apps, eh? |
| 13:24:56 | numatrix | It's a good list of apps. |
| 13:25:04 | numatrix | I'm hoping to see most of them developed. |
| 13:25:06 | Sniper | i'm always fishing for apps |
| 13:25:14 | Sniper | i tried to brainstorm of stuff that i'd like to see.. |
| 13:25:15 | Sniper | :-) |
| 13:25:31 | numatrix | So are there other prizes then for the best apps? |
| 13:25:45 | benmeyer | Sniper where is the webpage? |
| 13:25:59 | | well, contest is http://www.zaurus.com/dev/challenge/ |
| 13:25:59 | numatrix | ibot: contest |
| 13:25:59 | Sniper | basically here's the deal - i had a few 5000Ds sittiing in my office and as opposed to sending them back to the warehouse or selling them, i decided to make a small challenge and offer it to our developers |
| 13:26:01 | BigBoss | While I certainly love to see images of my app on the screen there with the app list, did you guys get permission to *use* those screenshots from the authors? Trolltech always asks me before they use my stuff |
| 13:26:05 | Sniper | http://www.zaurus.com/dev/challenge/ |
| 13:26:15 | Sniper | bb: you were sent an email... |
| 13:26:16 | ljp_ | DOH |
| 13:26:24 | BigBoss | Sniper: no I wasn't |
| 13:26:28 | Sniper | bb: i dont think we heard back from you |
| 13:26:44 | BigBoss | which doesn't imply permission |
| 13:26:44 | numatrix | So no response = consent? Whoops. |
| 13:26:49 | Sniper | bb: but i thought it was cool to feature you.. didnt think you would mind.. but if you have a problem, i'll take it off |
| 13:26:51 | BigBoss | like I said, I don't mind, but there are laws |
| 13:27:00 | Sniper | bb and i are tight.. errr.. at least i thought we were |
| 13:27:02 | benmeyer | Star Trek Simulator |
| 13:27:02 | benmeyer | |
| 13:27:04 | benmeyer | hahahaha |
| 13:27:05 | Sniper | ok i'll take it off |
| 13:27:14 | BigBoss | if I was a dick, and did mind, then it would have been a problem |
| 13:27:20 | BigBoss | I said I didn't mind, I just found it pecular |
| 13:27:38 | Sniper | bb: ok .. |
| 13:27:40 | BigBoss | especially because we are tight and talk all the time |
| 13:27:53 | Sniper | bb: by the way - im processing the paperwork today |
| 13:28:09 | BigBoss | so soon? :) |
| 13:28:18 | Sniper | bb: but then it needs to get faxed to japan |
| 13:28:49 | BigBoss | so that will be another week - hahahaha |
| 13:29:10 | Sniper | bb: most likely.. did u hear back from TT regarding the $$? |
| 13:29:36 | BigBoss | oh yea, sorry - I got it the next day, but no further correspondance from them |
| 13:31:28 | Sniper | bb: so you got the $$? |
| 13:31:51 | JasonNJ | Sniper: what is your AOL IM address |
| 13:31:55 | Sniper | Im happy that my beating on them has helped |
| 13:32:53 | BigBoss | yes, got it, and depostied it :) |
| 13:32:54 | BigBoss | thanks |
| 13:33:06 | Sniper | I think you need to take me, Jason, and Ben out sometime |
| 13:34:43 | BigBoss | sure - fly on out here and we can have beer on the lake :) |
| 13:35:04 | benmeyer | going to Linux Expo in San Fran? |
| 13:36:10 | BigBoss | hell no |
| 13:36:29 | BigBoss | Hancom offered to let me use 25% of their booth and I told them I wasn't going to hang out with thieves and liers |
| 13:36:40 | BigBoss | was that harsh? |
| 13:36:52 | benmeyer | why are they thieves and liers? |
| 13:37:34 | George- | BigBoss: theives and liars? |
| 13:37:36 | George- | BigBoss: Hancom? |
| 13:37:46 | BigBoss | let's see - bounced pay checks, bounced royalty checks, continued promises that are unfulfilled |
| 13:37:55 | George- | when? |
| 13:38:01 | benmeyer | where you under their pay? |
| 13:38:10 | BigBoss | promising to get my name off their contracts in the US, and then not doing it and letting the collection agencies come to me |
| 13:38:17 | BigBoss | I was their freaking US CEO |
| 13:38:30 | BigBoss | there wasn't a single month that they paid on time, when they were paying at all |
| 13:38:31 | benmeyer | ah |
| 13:38:53 | BigBoss | anyone notice that Bart Decrem left Hancom after just a few months? |
| 13:38:57 | BigBoss | he wasn't getting paid either |
| 13:39:00 | George- | BigBoss: you used to work for Hancom? |
| 13:39:13 | BigBoss | we had a partnership that *they* offered |
| 13:39:17 | BigBoss | 1 year ago |
| 13:39:28 | BigBoss | they've now given up on the US market because they don't understand it |
| 13:39:50 | BigBoss | they illegally send a korean here to work, and he sits in a 10 foot room and waits for people to call him and make big orders |
| 13:39:56 | BigBoss | which of course doesn't happen |
| 13:40:19 | George- | I used to live in Korea |
| 13:40:24 | George- | it's a very corrupt country |
| 13:40:52 | George- | damn cheap though :) |
| 13:41:01 | BigBoss | outside of Seoul I guess |
| 13:41:20 | BigBoss | is it just me, or do they view non-koreans as non-people? |
| 13:41:39 | George- | outside of Seoul? |
| 13:41:44 | George- | What is? |
| 13:42:16 | George- | no, they worship the english/americans |
| 13:42:30 | George- | when I lived there, if you broke any rules/regulations or anything |
| 13:42:45 | George- | all you had to do was say you are english/american, and they let you go, and forget about it |
| 13:43:06 | JasonNJ | in 50 years or so the koreans will be assimilated into american society as much as the chinese or japanese are now |
| 13:43:43 | JasonNJ | in NJ we have a situation where the koreans isolate themselves from the rest of the community. They have their own supermarkets, own stores, own schools, everything |
| 13:43:57 | George- | heh |
| 13:44:06 | George- | I never want to go back to S.Korea, though |
| 13:44:09 | George- | I really hated it |
| 13:44:09 | BigBoss | my experience with them in business was that if you were korean, you were qualified, didn't matter the job - if you were american, you were suspect, but that might just have been because we were remote |
| 13:44:31 | BigBoss | JasonNJ: we have the same situation in Los Angeles. |
| 13:44:51 | JasonNJ | yes, from what I understand your Korean community is as big as NY/NJ's |
| 13:44:54 | BigBoss | The CFO the stuck me with had lived here for 15 years, but was in Koreatown and spoke worse english than the guys from Korea, and that is saying a lot |
| 13:45:06 | BigBoss | she never spoke english - she might as well have lived in Korea |
| 13:46:10 | JasonNJ | One of my best friends is a 1st generation Korean-american, he was born there but came here when he was very young. He ended up marrying a chinese girl and his family disowned him. |
| 13:46:25 | JasonNJ | He tried going back to korea to find a wife, but he had nothing in common with them |
| 13:47:08 | JasonNJ | He has a 1 year old baby girl and his wealthy parents want nothing to do with him. He's a VP of technology at a big international swiss bank. |
| 13:47:16 | BigBoss | Other than Vietnam, I can't grok the asian cultures very well |
| 13:47:18 | JasonNJ | Its messed up. |
| 13:47:23 | BigBoss | vietnamese are similar in that regard |
| 13:47:30 | BigBoss | and it is stupid as hell |
| 13:47:45 | JasonNJ | Although, my own culture would have disowned someone for marrying outside our religion 50 years ago. |
| 13:47:55 | ljp_ | wants a Scandinavian wife |
| 13:48:27 | George- | JasonNJ: what's this about a SL-5600? |
| 13:48:41 | BigBoss | shhhhhh |
| 13:48:46 | JasonNJ | Its in the design stages. |
| 13:48:46 | BigBoss | it doesn't exist |
| 13:48:49 | BigBoss | don't even speak it |
| 13:49:03 | ljp_ | itd got 256 mb flash |
| 13:49:04 | George- | JasonNJ: ahh |
| 13:49:12 | George- | ljp_: ur kidding? |
| 13:49:14 | numatrix | Dang it. Wait a minute, I just thought of something. If Bestbuy isn't going to be selling the zaurus anymore, I won't be able to capitalize on my extended warranty. Crap, crap, crap. |
| 13:49:16 | ljp_ | hehehe |
| 13:49:17 | JasonNJ | thats the working model number but I am not sure that is what they will call it. |
| 13:49:29 | JasonNJ | ljp: he is kidding |
| 13:49:53 | ljp_ | George: most of what I say is usually in jest... |
| 13:50:00 | JasonNJ | numatrix: if it breaks they have to give you a comparable PDA |
| 13:50:03 | George- | ljp_: I gathered :) |
| 13:50:12 | George- | JasonNJ: Will it be Xscale based? ie - 400MHz? |
| 13:50:18 | numatrix | JasonNJ: Right, but if they're not selling the zaurus, that would mean switching to different pda. |
| 13:50:22 | JasonNJ | George-: that much has been said publically, yes. |
| 13:50:56 | JasonNJ | all the other specs are kind of in flux, though. |
| 13:50:57 | BigBoss | please don't use an xScale for the love of god |
| 13:50:58 | George- | JasonNJ: ahh, cool |
| 13:51:17 | George- | BigBoss: hasn't AMD got a 400MHz embedded CPU? |
| 13:51:17 | BigBoss | buy up all the Z's at bestbuy and then go to england and sell them for $500 :) |
| 13:51:20 | JasonNJ | BigBoss: the xscale actually performs well when code is optimized for it. |
| 13:51:23 | George- | BigBoss: MIPS based iirc |
| 13:51:34 | BigBoss | it's buggy as hell though |
| 13:51:35 | JasonNJ | George-: the Alchemy. Yeah its a nice chip. |
| 13:51:54 | George- | JasonNJ: ahh, ok |
| 13:51:58 | BigBoss | and who is going to dick around and optimize their code for it? It's bad enough we are going to have to produce like 3 or 4 versions of our apps for the different chips |
| 13:52:01 | ljp_ | what? no transmeta chip? |
| 13:52:23 | JasonNJ | BigBoss: its called a compile time switch. Its not like you need to recode them. |
| 13:52:52 | BigBoss | I hope someone is going to actually test code on the chip first before committing to it |
| 13:52:52 | JasonNJ | the compiler you already have can optimize for ARM V5 |
| 13:52:58 | George- | JasonNJ: that doesn't alter the fact that you need several different versions |
| 13:53:21 | JasonNJ | George-: You already need to do that for Windows CE. And you'll need to do that for Palm. |
| 13:53:41 | JasonNJ | But the Xscale can run ARM V4 apps. |
| 13:53:42 | BigBoss | so? |
| 13:53:51 | BigBoss | really poorly and slowly from what I've read |
| 13:53:55 | JasonNJ | Whats the big deal about providing 2 binaries? |
| 13:53:59 | George- | JasonNJ: yes, especially with the release of PalmOS 5, which is ARM |
| 13:54:14 | BigBoss | we're supporting the A-300 too |
| 13:54:22 | BigBoss | so now that is 3 binaries of 20 different apps |
| 13:54:24 | George- | BigBoss: A300? |
| 13:54:28 | JasonNJ | No its the same |
| 13:54:32 | BigBoss | then whatever Royal comes out with, and possibly the Kaii |
| 13:54:33 | JasonNJ | the A300 is an Xscale |
| 13:54:35 | BigBoss | it's 200mhz chip |
| 13:54:36 | George- | BigBoss: is that the Xscale 200MHz model? |
| 13:54:41 | BigBoss | and then Vercel |
| 13:54:45 | ljp_ | looks like SHarp needs to hire more developers.... |
| 13:54:57 | George- | surely the A300 uses the same compile-time switches as the Xscale 400? |
| 13:55:08 | JasonNJ | Royal is Strongarm, standard qtopia and vercel is strongarm with a modified qtopia |
| 13:55:18 | JasonNJ | George-: identical switches. |
| 13:55:28 | George- | JasonNJ: thought so |
| 13:55:33 | BigBoss | how do you know that since neither one has actually settled on a spec? |
| 13:56:13 | JasonNJ | Youre going to need different versions but its not like you need to really make major code changes |
| 13:56:38 | JasonNJ | I'm sure a lot of your apps will run fine without any modification at all |
| 13:56:47 | George- | BigBoss: what do you expect the next Z to be based on? |
| 13:56:52 | George- | BigBoss: a *totally* different arch? |
| 13:56:58 | BigBoss | I'd like to see PPC or maybe AMD |
| 13:57:11 | BigBoss | if I'm gonna have to recompile I'd like to see a *good* chip with built in fp |
| 13:57:12 | George- | PPC means PowerPC in this case, right? |
| 13:57:17 | benmeyer | ppc or AMD???? |
| 13:57:18 | JasonNJ | BigBoss: and that wouldnt inconvenience you more than a compile time switch? |
| 13:57:26 | George- | PPC is nice |
| 13:57:30 | BigBoss | all these guys want multi-media on these devices and then they give you a crap chip for it |
| 13:57:36 | George- | long batt life, seriously powerful |
| 13:57:54 | BigBoss | if I gotta be inconvenienced, I'd like to see something for it, like not having to spend huge amounts of time writing integer floating point |
| 13:57:55 | benmeyer | personally I would like to see the colors reduced to 4K |
| 13:58:01 | JasonNJ | I like PPC but the power utilization curve is really high. |
| 13:58:01 | George- | benmeyer: why? |
| 13:58:11 | benmeyer | battery life |
| 13:58:16 | George- | benmeyer: ahh |
| 13:58:19 | JasonNJ | also cost factor |
| 13:58:23 | George- | benmeyer: I've never had a problem with batt life |
| 13:58:29 | benmeyer | other then movies have you ever used all fo the colors? |
| 13:58:33 | George- | JasonNJ: Power Utilization curve? |
| 13:58:36 | benmeyer | batt life isn't that great |
| 13:58:50 | benmeyer | I am coming from my palm where it lasted for 2 months... |
| 13:58:50 | numatrix | Yeah, I'm looking forward to a third party in-zaurus extended life battery. |
| 13:59:02 | JasonNJ | George-: the PPC can throttle its power utiliztion but its not well suited to a PDA |
| 13:59:33 | BigBoss | yea, I can get like 2 hours on my battery at best |
| 13:59:33 | JasonNJ | even the lowest voltage PPC eats more juice than a ARM-based proc |
| 13:59:37 | BigBoss | my visor goes for months |
| 13:59:46 | George- | my Psion 5mx goes for months as well |
| 13:59:57 | George- | that runs off 2 AA batts, and it's ARM |
| 14:00:00 | BigBoss | but think about what you use it for |
| 14:00:12 | BigBoss | look up an address, turn it off, set an alarm, turn it off |
| 14:00:21 | George- | yes |
| 14:00:30 | BigBoss | I use my Z to play media files, do Jabber with wireless networking and other stuff |
| 14:00:31 | George- | continously, my psion runs for about 12 hours at most |
| 14:00:39 | BigBoss | but it needs better battery life |
| 14:01:35 | JasonNJ | The psion doesnt have an active matrix LCD does it |
| 14:01:38 | JasonNJ | isnt it a greyscale |
| 14:01:45 | George- | yes, a greyscale |
| 14:01:48 | George- | 16 shades |
| 14:02:01 | JasonNJ | that makes all the difference in the world |
| 14:02:46 | George- | my TiBook, though, has a batt life of 5 hours, and it has a large TFT screen etc |
| 14:02:56 | George- | surely PPC can't be that much of a power-guzzler? |
| 14:03:08 | JasonNJ | yeah but whats the mA rating on that battery |
| 14:03:13 | George- | hang on |
| 14:03:56 | JasonNJ | the Z battery is rated at 950Ma |
| 14:03:58 | George- | doesn't say |
| 14:04:05 | BigBoss | yea, I can watch 2 DVD's on my tiBook |
| 14:04:19 | JasonNJ | A laptop battery is probably like 3000-4000Ma |
| 14:04:25 | JasonNJ | if its lithium ion |
| 14:04:34 | George- | yes, but the diff is that the Zaurus uses much less power than the tiBook |
| 14:04:36 | JasonNJ | maybe nmore |
| 14:04:41 | George- | because it has a smaller screen |
| 14:04:53 | George- | and it doesn't have a hard disk, nor an optical drive |
| 14:05:16 | George- | so, it could probably still get a good 3 hours out of it, if you shove a slightly larger battery in it |
| 14:05:19 | JasonNJ | you would be surprised how much power a small active matrix screen eats |
| 14:05:40 | JasonNJ | well, a 1700-2000Ma battery would probably yeild double |
| 14:05:47 | JasonNJ | with an xscale chip |
| 14:05:56 | George- | the batt in the yopy is ~1400Ma batt, why can't the Z use a batt like that? |
| 14:06:00 | George- | (iirc) |
| 14:06:02 | JasonNJ | Sure it can. |
| 14:06:07 | JasonNJ | But the Yopy has no backlight. |
| 14:06:19 | George- | doesn't it? |
| 14:06:24 | JasonNJ | No it doesnt. |
| 14:06:59 | JasonNJ | All this stuff adds up. |
| 14:07:06 | treke|home | George-: The ipaq 3800 also as a ~1400, and its battery life isnt extrodinarily better than a Zaurus |
| 14:07:13 | JasonNJ | plus the yopy doesnt have a CF slot |
| 14:07:23 | JasonNJ | CF devices have a HUGE power draw |
| 14:07:27 | George- | treke|home: doesn't the iPaq 3800 have a bluetooth etc as well? |
| 14:07:36 | treke|home | George-: Some do. Mine doesnt |
| 14:07:49 | George- | treke|home: ah yes, only the 3870 does right? |
| 14:08:02 | treke|home | Not sure the specific model version |
| 14:08:38 | treke|home | JasonNJ: Dont forget SD |
| 14:08:41 | JasonNJ | the answer to your question though about the Z... yes we are planning a bigger battery. |
| 14:08:50 | George- | good :) |
| 14:09:02 | George- | Is it possible to get a bigger batt some day for the 5x00? |
| 14:09:02 | BigBoss | I think a fusion power source :) |
| 14:09:07 | George- | BigBoss: haha |
| 14:09:13 | JasonNJ | George-: we're considering it |
| 14:09:16 | ljp_ | solar power would be nice |
| 14:09:27 | George- | ljp_: yeh, driven off that screen! :) |
| 14:09:38 | warmi | hi |
| 14:09:43 | George- | JasonNJ: that'd be cool |
| 14:10:02 | treke|home | man, the zaurus-general list is hilarious |
| 14:10:07 | benmeyer | indeed |
| 14:10:28 | treke|home | I've never seen people complain so much about what is essentially a nice gesture on sharps part |
| 14:10:42 | George- | treke|home: hm? |
| 14:10:55 | George- | treke|home: referring to this argument here, or the zaurus-general list? |
| 14:11:05 | treke|home | George-: zaurus-general |
| 14:11:21 | warmi | heheh |
| 14:11:27 | warmi | treke: true that |
| 14:11:51 | treke|home | The only point he's somewhat right on is the device drivers. Writing a beta of the driver without a device could be tough :) |
| 14:11:55 | JasonNJ | treke: the 5000D rom IS coming. We're not going to leave those users out in the cold. But sometimes stupid little issues can hold up a release |
| 14:12:20 | ljp_ | I'm just pissed I have to teach my cat how to program |
| 14:12:24 | treke|home | JasonNJ: Never thought you would |
| 14:12:35 | George- | ljp_: are you just a quoting bot? :P |
| 14:12:43 | ljp_ | hahah nope |
| 14:13:12 | JasonNJ | we are at some point, going to have to make an end of life announcement for the 5000D and 5500 |
| 14:13:26 | JasonNJ | simply because the devices might not be able to support stuff in the newer roms for newer units |
| 14:13:33 | JasonNJ | I dont see that happening for a while though |
| 14:13:49 | treke|home | even Microsoft does that with wince |
| 14:14:02 | JasonNJ | also, if we release source, the community will be capable of adapting those changes to unofficial rom releases |
| 14:14:11 | JasonNJ | that is something we are working on now. |
| 14:14:31 | treke|home | Palm will probably do the samething once they actually change the hardware :) |
| 14:14:41 | JasonNJ | that will allow projectss like Opie and Openzaurus to continue to support older models with new enhancements |
| 14:15:31 | Rascal | sharp just needs to market the zaurus more heavily |
| 14:15:39 | JasonNJ | Rascal: true |
| 14:15:48 | ljp_ | if you cant get Sharp to release source,maybe they could better document the API's that _are_ used on it |
| 14:15:53 | JasonNJ | but right now our efforts are more focused on teh enterprise |
| 14:16:41 | Rascal | are the projected figures on the zaurus being met? |
| 14:17:00 | warmi | Rascal: hahaha |
| 14:17:01 | numatrix | By the way, about solar power? Try this: http://www.aurorasolar.com/ |
| 14:18:35 | bipolar | is away: lunch... |
| 14:18:52 | catalin | ya, replace the flip cover with a solar panel |
| 14:19:03 | George- | JasonNJ: end-of-life announcement? |
| 14:19:05 | George- | JasonNJ: wtF? |
| 14:19:08 | George- | catalin: haha |
| 14:19:23 | catalin | George-: did I sound funny by any chance ? |
| 14:19:27 | Rascal | george, the xscale version will be coming out |
| 14:19:37 | George- | Rascal: I know |
| 14:19:49 | warmi | George-: yeah ... you can't have 5500 being supported forever :-) |
| 14:20:21 | warmi | catalin: yeah .. solar panel on the cover ... hehe |
| 14:20:30 | warmi | aren't these things fragile ? |
| 14:20:36 | George- | warmi: hmm, Compaq have been supporting the H3630 for *ages* |
| 14:20:39 | ciaolinux | is it possible to use zaurus to surf on the internet, without a phone commenction? |
| 14:20:44 | George- | what's the difference? |
| 14:21:11 | ciaolinux | George within what? |
| 14:21:13 | warmi | ciaolinux: well.. yeah, using wireless ethernet or just ethernet .. |
| 14:21:27 | Jerakeen | where's zaurus-general live? |
| 14:21:27 | George- | ciaolinux: ? |
| 14:21:29 | warmi | or perhaps even ethernet over USB |
| 14:21:41 | ciaolinux | warmi, there is nothing like a device to add to make it like a cellphone of stuff like that? |
| 14:21:41 | treke|home | George-: The difference is that WindowsCE has stabilized |
| 14:21:59 | George- | treke|home: yes... Embedded linux is stable, thanks to Compaq Research |
| 14:22:06 | ciaolinux | warmi: i think that on palm, it exists |
| 14:22:26 | warmi | George-: beside: MS has an excelent history of support binary compatibility accross different revisions of OS |
| 14:22:42 | warmi | supporting even |
| 14:22:43 | treke|home | George-: I'd disagree. It's not stable in the sense that all the UI questions and hardware requirements have been set down in stone |
| 14:22:50 | Speedy2 | re |
| 14:23:59 | JasonNJ | George-: I would really like to see HP release a Linux PDA. |
| 14:24:09 | George- | JasonNJ: yes.. |
| 14:24:10 | treke|home | Georg/away off to work |
| 14:24:10 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Why? |
| 14:24:18 | warmi | ciaolinux: I am not sure about that cellphone thingy |
| 14:24:25 | George- | JasonNJ: The iPaqs are damn good |
| 14:24:42 | JasonNJ | Because, I think it would lend more credence to Linux as a PDA OS |
| 14:24:46 | Speedy2 | heh |
| 14:24:53 | JasonNJ | The 3900 is a really nice unit |
| 14:24:54 | Speedy2 | HP killed Jordana |
| 14:24:57 | treke|home | George-: Except a linux using ipaq isnt as useable to a consumer as a zaurus |
| 14:24:59 | Speedy2 | And they're pushing iPaq |
| 14:25:01 | warmi | the world is watching .. if Zaurus sinks that is going to be it |
| 14:25:08 | JasonNJ | if they offered Linux as an option on Ipaq that would be nice |
| 14:25:11 | warmi | people won't touch Linux for PDA for a long time |
| 14:25:13 | JasonNJ | with official support for ti |
| 14:25:31 | Speedy2 | Linux makes not a good PDA OS. |
| 14:25:36 | treke|home | they'd have to finish up a lot of things, like ram disk support. Driver support |
| 14:25:42 | JasonNJ | warmi I disagree... corporations are interested in it for vertical apps. |
| 14:25:43 | warmi | Speedy2: niether does Windows |
| 14:25:44 | George- | Speedy2: better than WinCE |
| 14:25:48 | George- | Speedy2: I *hate* WinCE |
| 14:25:53 | Speedy2 | So do I. |
| 14:26:00 | Speedy2 | But Linux doesn't fair much better. |
| 14:26:05 | warmi | JasonNJ: well, I should have been more precise ... "as a consumer PDA" |
| 14:26:06 | Speedy2 | It's the wrong tool for the job |
| 14:26:08 | JasonNJ | most of the interest in Zaurus right now is in Zaurus or specialized applications. |
| 14:26:20 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: Linux is one of the best embedded OSes there is. |
| 14:26:26 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Not really. |
| 14:26:35 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: whats better then? |
| 14:26:39 | Speedy2 | QNX is much better |
| 14:26:45 | Speedy2 | There are others. |
| 14:26:54 | ciaolinux | warmi: so basically if you want to connect, you need to be phisically close to a pc or a phone plug? |
| 14:27:11 | warmi | ciaolinux: check this one out ... |
| 14:27:29 | JasonNJ | QNX is a good embedded OS for realtime applications but its not better than Linux overall. |
| 14:27:33 | Speedy2 | Oh yes it is |
| 14:27:34 | George- | to be honest, I'd like to see Sharp release a ROM that doesn't use Qtopia |
| 14:27:38 | warmi | what was that Sharp mobile link ? |
| 14:27:47 | George- | like, uses Matchbox, or KDE1 or IceWM |
| 14:27:53 | Rascal | sharp is releasing mobilewireless |
| 14:27:54 | Speedy2 | Linux was not designed an an embedded OS...and everything to make it such is just a bunch of hacks |
| 14:28:01 | warmi | George-: you must be insane :-) |
| 14:28:08 | George- | warmi: yep |
| 14:28:18 | warmi | niether of these was designed to be run on 320x200 screen |
| 14:28:21 | treke|home | why in hell would sharp do that? Thats for openzaurus |
| 14:28:21 | George- | warmi: but to be honest, KDE1 ran OK on my P-120 w/16MB RAM |
| 14:28:34 | George- | warmi: and if I can get KDE1 to work in 320x240 |
| 14:28:35 | George- | ... |
| 14:28:42 | George- | warmi: it'd be *faster* than Qtopia |
| 14:28:44 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: the draw to Linux is the avaliablity of tools and open code. |
| 14:28:47 | Speedy2 | An embedded OS, like a PDA OS should not need more than 2-4MB RAM... |
| 14:28:50 | treke|home | George-: THe interface isnt suitdef for a pda. Thats the difference |
| 14:28:59 | warmi | ciaolinux: there is a sharpmobile program where you can get some sort of wireless modem .. I don't remember URL though |
| 14:29:00 | George- | and matchbox |
| 14:29:02 | JasonNJ | If QNX was as open as Linux, I could see QNX suceeding far more than it does now. |
| 14:29:05 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Yeah, but that doesn't make it a good embedded OS, that just makes it more available. |
| 14:29:06 | warmi | George-: it would be not |
| 14:29:06 | George- | that *is* suited to a PDA |
| 14:29:15 | ciaolinux | warmi: ok.. i will use google...thanks |
| 14:29:18 | George- | what I don't understand it |
| 14:29:19 | George- | is |
| 14:29:23 | treke|home | George-: That is, now find decent apps |
| 14:29:27 | George- | that Qtopia is based on Qt2 |
| 14:29:28 | warmi | George-: Qtopia is quite lean .. what's slowing Zs is lack of hardware acceleration |
| 14:29:31 | Rascal | ciaolinux: go to myzaurus.com and select mobile wireless |
| 14:29:32 | George- | which is very memory hungry |
| 14:29:46 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: eCos also has not proven itself |
| 14:29:47 | treke|home | George-: Because qt2 is far nicer than qt1? |
| 14:29:47 | warmi | George-: X is memory hungry as well |
| 14:29:49 | Speedy2 | warmi: Why should the Z NEED hardware acceleration for these things? I mean it's a PDA...seems like Qtopia is a bit bloated. |
| 14:29:59 | JasonNJ | But, I am glad you are porting it just the same. :) |
| 14:30:04 | George- | treke|home: usability over UI |
| 14:30:06 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: That's because people scream Linux without know what the hell they're talking about. |
| 14:30:14 | Rascal | sure everyone.. let's get nvidia to make a graphics chip for the zaurus |
| 14:30:17 | toolafial | 25 kB/s is no way to download an ISO |
| 14:30:17 | Speedy2 | People without any real hardware OR software experience |
| 14:30:18 | Rascal | and screw framebuffer |
| 14:30:21 | warmi | Speedy2: Qtopia is not bloated .. Qt might a bit but I would rather have that then code to bare API like X |
| 14:30:25 | Rascal | we can have hardware acceleration |
| 14:30:29 | Speedy2 | warmi: Agreed. |
| 14:30:40 | treke|home | George-: Uh. I'm talking about the usability of QT2, not its appearance |
| 14:30:56 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: eCos IS a MUCH better solution, anyone with real embedded experience says so. But Linux is a buzzword, and generates hype. |
| 14:31:06 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: for the most part I dont consdier the Zaurus an "embedded" type machine. Its a full blown computer. So Linux suits it well. |
| 14:31:08 | George- | treke|home: my definition of usability is not just how the buttons etc are laid out, also it's speed |
| 14:31:20 | warmi | George-: Qtopia is not all that slow |
| 14:31:25 | George- | treke|home: my Psion 5mx which runs a 36MHz CPU is lightning fast... |
| 14:31:26 | warmi | is not much slower than PPC |
| 14:31:28 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: It's not a full blown computer, it's an embedded system, the CPU does not have features of modern desktop processors |
| 14:31:36 | Speedy2 | It was never meant to |
| 14:31:44 | Speedy2 | It was meant to be a PDA/embedded CPU |
| 14:31:47 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: it is not an embedded system in the traditional sense. |
| 14:31:48 | warmi | George-: so was my commodore-64 when running in command line |
| 14:31:54 | George- | warmi: haha |
| 14:31:54 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Why not? |
| 14:32:09 | Rascal | George-: last I used an ipaq. the apps were sluggishly slow |
| 14:32:10 | warmi | I am serious George |
| 14:32:10 | JasonNJ | Embedded systems typically have application specific functions, and are designed to be mission critical. |
| 14:32:15 | Speedy2 | The SA does not superscalar, it does not have a huge cache, it doesn't have a huge TLB, etc. |
| 14:32:21 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: No, that's not a fair definition. |
| 14:32:27 | George- | and to be honest, Qtopia on the Zaurus which is 206MHz, isn't much faster than Qtopia on the Psion 5mx, which is 36MHz |
| 14:32:32 | warmi | Qtopia is way more "flashy" than your old Psion stuff |
| 14:32:46 | Speedy2 | George-: Qtopia is running on the Psion? Wow |
| 14:32:48 | warmi | George-nah .. that's just not true |
| 14:32:56 | George- | warmi: trust me |
| 14:32:59 | warmi | unless your Psion had some sort of hardware acceleration |
| 14:33:12 | George- | Speedy2: screenshots.tader.net |
| 14:33:13 | warmi | what kind of CPI does your Psion have ? |
| 14:33:14 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: An embedded system is typically one that's resource constrained and performs a limited set of functions |
| 14:33:25 | warmi | CPU even |
| 14:33:27 | Speedy2 | warmi: It's an ARM6 based processor |
| 14:33:27 | George- | warmi: It was an ARM 710T, ARMv4l, 36MHz |
| 14:33:30 | Speedy2 | err, ARM7 |
| 14:33:39 | George- | Speedy2: that's the Psion Series 7 |
| 14:33:42 | JasonNJ | embedded OSes make a lot of sense in things like microcontroller type things or in appliance type things -- yes with limited resoruces. I'd hardly call the Zaurus a resource limited machine |
| 14:33:47 | ciaolinux | is there a zaurus emulator for pc? |
| 14:33:49 | George- | Speedy2: er... wait |
| 14:33:54 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Umm, 16MB ROm, 32MEG RAM IS limited |
| 14:34:06 | George- | Speedy2: ARM7 might have been for the 5 |
| 14:34:06 | BigBoss | I'd agree with jason, the Zaurus isn't the traditional sense of an embedded type device |
| 14:34:09 | warmi | George-: so unless gcc or whatever compiler they used for that CPU is like 10 times faster than ARM gcc , it just can't be Geore |
| 14:34:09 | Speedy2 | And most micrcontrollers do not run real OSes with MMU/TLB support |
| 14:34:11 | BigBoss | it's a functional computer |
| 14:34:12 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: Thats what we used to call a PC 4 years ago |
| 14:34:18 | George- | warmi: I promise you |
| 14:34:38 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Yeah, but even those desktops were plugged into the wall and had 128KB L2 cache, etc. |
| 14:34:40 | JasonNJ | and the next Zaurus is closer to a PC we have today. |
| 14:34:47 | Speedy2 | sigh |
| 14:34:50 | warmi | George-: well, just think about it .. why would people bother with 200 mhz if they can all run old 36 MHz CPu ? |
| 14:34:59 | Speedy2 | George-: ARM7 == ARM version 4 ISA |
| 14:34:59 | warmi | I mean Qtopia code is the same on both, is it not ? |
| 14:35:15 | Speedy2 | BigBoss: It maybe a functional computer, but that doesn't mean Linux is well suited for it. |
| 14:35:26 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: my point is, with the advancement of lower power processors and the fact that memory is becoming cheaper and smaller, an embedded OS doesnt necessarily make sense on a PDA |
| 14:35:36 | George- | warmi: I never said that Qtopia was speedy on it |
| 14:35:41 | George- | warmi: In fact, Qtopia is damn slow |
| 14:35:43 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: What would an embedded OS on the Z not be able to do? |
| 14:35:49 | George- | warmi: but not much different to the 206MHz |
| 14:35:58 | George- | warmi: Not as much of a performance gap than I was expecting |
| 14:36:08 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: exactly what they cant do on PC's now. |
| 14:36:09 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: But I can clearly show you how fat and bloated Linux is for this application |
| 14:36:14 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: That is? |
| 14:36:17 | George- | warmi: It might have been, though, that the computer was running on 2.4.18? |
| 14:36:25 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: QNX seems to be able to do everything Linux can do and more... |
| 14:36:45 | warmi | George-: .. well, then obviously either they coded Qtopia for Psion in ASM .. or Qtopia on ARM has intentional busy loops to slow it down .. or Psion CPU at 36 Mhz is just as fast as ARM 1100 at 200 MHZ .. there can be no other explanation |
| 14:36:59 | Speedy2 | I just don't accepting the bloat on my PDA...it's not neccessary, the OS should be small and minimal, and provide support for what is needed. |
| 14:37:04 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: I understand what you are drivng at. I have used QNX Photon on the desktop, but its not ideal for everything |
| 14:37:08 | Speedy2 | err...don't want to accept... |
| 14:37:13 | George- | warmi: or the SA1110 is shit? |
| 14:37:20 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Right, well Linux is not ideal for everything a PDA needs. |
| 14:37:28 | JasonNJ | Why not? |
| 14:37:28 | Jerakeen | warmi: Or maybe the psion screen depth is 4 bits and qtopis is screen bandwidth limited? |
| 14:37:39 | warmi | George-: yeah .. I said that |
| 14:37:52 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Have you ever ported or tried to do anything with the Linux kernel itself? I mean how much experience do you have working with real embedded systems? |
| 14:37:54 | Speedy2 | (no offense) |
| 14:38:09 | JasonNJ | Speedy... the Zaurus is what it is... its a Linux machine. |
| 14:38:13 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I said you. |
| 14:38:15 | warmi | Jerakeen: if that is the case then one cannot compare 16 bit Qtopia to 4 bit Qtopia .. |
| 14:38:37 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: I am not an embedded programmer, but I have worked with embedded systems before. |
| 14:38:38 | toolafial | I wanted the zaurus because it was a linux machine |
| 14:38:47 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: What have you done with them before? |
| 14:38:50 | warmi | it is like trying to compare a version of game for GameBoy and the same game running on Playstation 2 |
| 14:38:53 | toolafial | I like the tools on my desktop and laptop, why not in my pocket too? |
| 14:38:56 | George- | Jerakeen: yes, but the Psion has twice as many pixels |
| 14:39:05 | George- | Jerakeen: It's processing twice as much screen space |
| 14:39:05 | Speedy2 | toolafial: You can have those tools w/o LInux is the damn point. |
| 14:39:07 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: in a previous lifetime, I used to service them in the field |
| 14:39:22 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Ok, but no offense, service and design are not the same thing. |
| 14:39:29 | toolafial | Speedy2 : ok |
| 14:39:53 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: they arent, but I understand the principles behind them quite well. |
| 14:40:08 | Speedy2 | If you did, you might realize how flawed some of the statements you are making are. |
| 14:40:25 | Rascal | George you obviously don't understand the concept of color depth |
| 14:40:31 | JasonNJ | I think what you are proposing here are quasi-religious sort of things. |
| 14:41:10 | warmi | Speedy2: QNX is real time OS .. PDA does not need that kind of capability .. if you buy QNX you are paying for stuff you won't be able to utilize anyway .. maybe it is as simple as that |
| 14:41:11 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: The battery life of the Z is quite important. It makes not sense to have a desktop OS that has no concept or care of minimal to be running on such a device. |
| 14:41:13 | George- | Rascal: that's correct :) |
| 14:41:35 | Speedy2 | warmi: Granted the Real-Time aspect isn't always needed, but that can be overlooked by the application priority, etc. |
| 14:41:43 | warmi | heeh |
| 14:41:48 | warmi | well, QNX is expensive |
| 14:41:51 | warmi | you cannot deny that |
| 14:41:59 | JasonNJ | I'm not saying your viewpoints are wrong either, but I think embedded OS are on their way out on anything but the smallest of machine architectures |
| 14:42:02 | Speedy2 | warmi: It still has a much smaller foot-print and much smaller requirements. Overhead is really low |
| 14:42:46 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I don't agree. Linux's overhead for a PDA is just *not needed*. It's fine for a desktop when you might have hundreds of threads and processes...but on a PDA? Really |
| 14:43:12 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: Who is to say PDAs and wearble computers arent going to replace traditional PC's with 5 years? |
| 14:43:17 | warmi | Speedy2: well .. the flipside of this is that you can run Apache on your Z :-) |
| 14:43:18 | warmi | hehe |
| 14:43:19 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: That's not to mention, if the SA wasn't around, performance would be so terrible, everyone would re-consider...and it's also why battery life sux...you have to push it as 206MHz+ to get any real performance |
| 14:43:20 | George- | hah, is it possible to put PPC 2002 on a Z? :) |
| 14:43:25 | Speedy2 | warmi: you can run apache on QNX :) |
| 14:43:42 | Speedy2 | George-: Yeah, technically it's possible |
| 14:43:52 | George- | Speedy2: of course |
| 14:44:00 | George- | Speedy2: But would the keyboard be supported etc? |
| 14:44:05 | warmi | George-: you would have to write bunch of drivers etc .. |
| 14:44:07 | Rascal | why the hell would any one run apache off a pda? |
| 14:44:10 | Speedy2 | George-: No...you could go write that |
| 14:44:21 | Speedy2 | Rascal: Why would anyone want to put Linux on a PDA? Well, never mind... |
| 14:44:23 | warmi | Rascal: beats me .. I was kidding |
| 14:44:28 | Speedy2 | NetBSD makes a better embedded UNIX anyway! |
| 14:44:41 | George- | Speedy2: go away *BSD lover |
| 14:44:44 | George- | Speedy2: DIE! :) |
| 14:45:01 | warmi | Speedy2: linux is known .. there are many developers who are familiar with Linux etc .. buzzword factor .. I guess it all counts |
| 14:45:06 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: in any case, this is a Linux related discussion channel. I'm glad youre porting eCos to the unit, cause it will make it that more attractive to those who want it. |
| 14:45:09 | Speedy2 | warmi: It's all buzz-words |
| 14:45:17 | Rascal | Speedy2: I believe there is more market familiarity with linux as an alternative OS vs a BSD-ish unix flavor |
| 14:45:25 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: This is a Zaurus channel...not Linux related...only by association. |
| 14:45:42 | Speedy2 | Rascal: You shouldn't *NEED* os familiairty on damned PDA! |
| 14:46:01 | Rascal | lol well look at the pocket pc's |
| 14:46:10 | Speedy2 | And if you want to go uber-l33t and go command line, BASH runs on most UNIX / QNX / etc |
| 14:46:19 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: yes, but by far most of us are going to be Linux users. |
| 14:46:20 | Speedy2 | Rascal: Yeah, same GUI, not same core |
| 14:46:26 | Rascal | they didn't get their market share's because of their pretty looks.. |
| 14:46:30 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: Can you provide stats to back up your claim that linux has overhead? |
| 14:46:39 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: Yeah, but not at the moment |
| 14:47:00 | Speedy2 | (I have some nice numbers sitting around somewhere, must go look for them) |
| 14:47:13 | Rascal | Speedy2: I think the decision to go with embedded linux was a marketing decision in a sense. |
| 14:47:41 | Speedy2 | I recall a friend who worked for an RTOS company telling me how many people would call asking for embedded Linux, and when they sat down with them, they found that "embedded" Linux wouldn't have supported any of their requirements...people just got suckered in. |
| 14:47:43 | warmi | Oh I am sure linux is bloated as compared to QNX but then again .. I am sure there are ver specialized OS that make QNX look bloated |
| 14:47:45 | warmi | heeh |
| 14:47:58 | Speedy2 | warmi: Well, eCos is not bloated compared to Linux and it's free. |
| 14:48:15 | warmi | Speedy2: who knows eCos ? does Qt run on it ? |
| 14:48:17 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: 'free' or free? |
| 14:48:25 | warmi | does it support posix ? |
| 14:48:29 | Speedy2 | warmi: Yes, it has framebuffer support, Microwindows runs on it |
| 14:48:29 | Speedy2 | YES |
| 14:48:34 | Speedy2 | Jesus, don't you people ever read? |
| 14:48:57 | Rascal | Speedy2: Big corporations packaging something like the Zaurus are afraid of the words "Free OS" |
| 14:49:11 | Speedy2 | Rascal: Uhh...what the hell do you call Linux? |
| 14:49:20 | Rascal | embedix is not free |
| 14:49:26 | Rascal | if something goes wrong blame them |
| 14:49:28 | Speedy2 | Rascal: eCos was funded by Red Hat, but it's "open source" |
| 14:49:29 | Rascal | not sharp |
| 14:49:37 | Speedy2 | Red Hat bought Cygnus who started the project |
| 14:49:38 | warmi | The Environmental Council of the States (ECOS) is the national non-profit, non-partisan association of state and territorial environmental commissioners. <- I guess I got the wrong URL .. |
| 14:49:42 | Speedy2 | sources.redhat.com/ecos |
| 14:49:54 | Speedy2 | sources.redhat.com/ecos |
| 14:49:54 | Speedy2 | sources.redhat.com/ecos |
| 14:49:55 | Speedy2 | sources.redhat.com/ecos |
| 14:50:15 | JasonNJ | ecos is definitely an interesting OS, the question is whether the industry cares enough about it to condsider it for any consumer application |
| 14:50:23 | Jerakeen | 'eCos provides the basic runtime infrastructure necessary to support devices with memory footprints in the 10's to 100's of kilobytes, or with real-time requirements.' |
| 14:50:28 | Speedy2 | It has a free bootloader that does DHCP, boot from CompactFlash, MMU support, etc. |
| 14:50:29 | Jerakeen | Yep, absolutely what we need here. |
| 14:50:34 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: Yup |
| 14:50:49 | Speedy2 | Has the FreeBSD stack, support for SA-1110 framebuffer, UARTs, etc. |
| 14:50:55 | Speedy2 | Everything is there |
| 14:50:58 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: So, it's optimised for seomthing several orders of magnitude smaller than the Zaurus. |
| 14:51:03 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: It *CAN BE* |
| 14:51:18 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: Sorry. I'm grouchy today. Anytihng I can actually play with? |
| 14:51:19 | Speedy2 | And Linux is not optimized for anything...it's fat and ugly |
| 14:51:27 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: Why don't you get the x86 version and try it out? |
| 14:51:40 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: All the documentation is there. |
| 14:52:07 | toolafial | Something I found interesting about eCos: "eCos is a single process, multiple thread operating environment." |
| 14:52:12 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Who cares about "industry"? The idea is to go with what's the best solution. If a programmer doesn't have to bother if he's writing for Linux or eCos...so what? |
| 14:52:17 | warmi | Speedy2: who knows how to code to Microwindows ? If Sharp went with that, they wouldn't even have half of the apps they have now .. |
| 14:52:41 | Speedy2 | warmi: Well, Qtopia touches the framebuffer, so you would expect it to be ported w/o much issue if Microwindows could |
| 14:52:51 | Speedy2 | Qtopia doesn't do too much other funny stuff... |
| 14:52:51 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: Hello, remember what happened with OS/2. |
| 14:53:01 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Yeah, but that's because an OS had to be compiled to run with OS/2 |
| 14:53:01 | warmi | frankly, the best solution would be to port entire qte to it |
| 14:53:09 | warmi | but I am biased .. I love qte |
| 14:53:13 | Speedy2 | If a programmer just writes for Qtopia and doesn't care about the under-pinnings, where is the loss? |
| 14:53:24 | Jerakeen | I'm tepted to use the system we have at the moment, and that works and that runs lots of apps, as opposed to getting all excited about a potentially hypothetical speed increae we'd get switching to an os that isnt written yet. |
| 14:53:26 | Speedy2 | With OS/2 it was not that simple. |
| 14:53:38 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: so what youre suggesting then, is running Qtopia with Qt on eCos |
| 14:53:42 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: Then you're a fool since the OS is written and products have shipped with it |
| 14:53:45 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Of course |
| 14:53:50 | Rascal | Speedy2: How far away are you guys from porting over eCos to the Zaurus? |
| 14:53:52 | JasonNJ | well, it would be interesting to see. |
| 14:54:05 | toolafial | but what about portability? that's what's great about the Z and writing for qte |
| 14:54:08 | Speedy2 | Rascal: I need a Z and some time to get a bootloader going...I'll work with the *IPAQ* port that's already there |
| 14:54:18 | warmi | Speedy2: I don't reall care what OS is underneath that .. as long as it is fast and provides reasonable services ( IP stack etc ..) |
| 14:54:26 | Speedy2 | toolafial: What portability? Are you on drugs? It does POSIX, TCP/IP, etc. |
| 14:54:30 | warmi | and as long as I have a nice user space API to code to |
| 14:54:32 | warmi | hehe |
| 14:54:40 | Speedy2 | warmi: Right...but if it's shit fast and doesn't use much battery, I bet you'd care. |
| 14:54:50 | Speedy2 | In a positive sense. |
| 14:55:02 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: I will note however, that zealous evangelism never really gets one anywhere |
| 14:55:04 | toolafial | Speedy2 : yes but if qte is ported to another os data types like Qstring get ported to the new underlying OS |
| 14:55:15 | Speedy2 | huh? |
| 14:55:37 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: That's funny, seems like every Linux user IS an zealout evangalist. |
| 14:55:43 | Speedy2 | an == a. |
| 14:55:49 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: Thats not true. |
| 14:56:06 | warmi | man .. this eCod is lean !! |
| 14:56:07 | warmi | hehe |
| 14:56:13 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Oh? Scroll back and see how many people have talked about how great Linux makes as an embedded OS with w/o any real knowledge |
| 14:56:38 | warmi | "memory footprints in the 10's to 100's of kilobytes" |
| 14:56:45 | Speedy2 | warmi: Yeah, that's the point, use what you need and don't keep all the fluff. It uses the FreeBSD TCP/IP stack and it's been optimized for low-overhead |
| 14:57:01 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: insulting other people for their lack of knowledge though, is really not the best way to endorse your choice of platform |
| 14:57:04 | Speedy2 | warmi: Exactly. And if it gives you all the hooks you need...why keep an OS+Ramdisk that eats up half your damned RAM |
| 14:57:11 | JasonNJ | and that goes for linux people as well |
| 14:57:18 | warmi | Speedy2: you are porting it for the ZAurus ? |
| 14:57:19 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I'm not insulting anyone, I'm simply stating that people making claims without any real knowledge is the norm. |
| 14:57:24 | Speedy2 | warmi: Going to try. |
| 14:58:08 | Speedy2 | warmi: QNX is free for non-commercial use BTW. |
| 14:58:29 | JasonNJ | if technical merit was the only qualifier for making a choice of OSes or standards used in any product, there'd likely to be a lot of different standards in use than whats prevalent now. but thats not how the world works, unfortunately |
| 14:58:52 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I agree. But we should be able to make reasonable choices without using the "Linux blur transform" |
| 14:59:16 | warmi | Speedy2: I know about QNX .. I run it for a while on my spare box |
| 14:59:22 | Speedy2 | warmi: Cool =) |
| 14:59:28 | warmi | but there is no point using OS with almost no application support |
| 14:59:31 | JasonNJ | As far is linux is concerned though... An embedded OS it was not designed from the ground up, it is not. but its much better suited as an embedded Os than a lot of other choices out there. |
| 14:59:42 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Show me a "lot of other" choices. |
| 14:59:57 | Speedy2 | WinCE is the only one that really comes to mind... |
| 15:00:00 | JasonNJ | Windows CE. Palm OS. VxWorks. |
| 15:00:09 | Speedy2 | VxWorks is an embedded OS |
| 15:00:14 | George- | how do I generate the keys on OpenZaurus? |
| 15:00:16 | George- | for ssh? |
| 15:00:17 | JasonNJ | Yeah, but would it work well in a PDA? |
| 15:00:33 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: It potentially could |
| 15:00:38 | Speedy2 | At least as well as Linux IMO> |
| 15:00:52 | Speedy2 | Palm OS is not a fair choice...it doesn't run on anything other than Palm compatible hardware |
| 15:01:02 | Speedy2 | It's not an OS you just go and buy / download. |
| 15:01:03 | JasonNJ | ok but Palm OS uses Kadak. |
| 15:01:34 | JasonNJ | Kadak/Palm OS has proven to have limitations. |
| 15:01:45 | JasonNJ | Thats why they dont want to use it anymore. |
| 15:01:55 | Speedy2 | Ok, but the plethora of applications for Palm might mitigate the crappy OS |
| 15:01:57 | Speedy2 | Ala x86 / Windows |
| 15:01:58 | Rascal | George-: ssh-keygen in terminal |
| 15:02:27 | Speedy2 | But from ground up, Kadak may not be a good choice. |
| 15:02:35 | Speedy2 | So, that's like 1.5 choices...show me some more. |
| 15:04:01 | Speedy2 | Silence, or netsplit? |
| 15:04:04 | Wembly | hihi |
| 15:04:09 | Speedy2 | Hey Wembly |
| 15:04:23 | George- | Rascal: thx |
| 15:04:23 | Wembly | speedy: what are you going on about now? hehe |
| 15:04:29 | Speedy2 | bah |
| 15:04:50 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: Machine language, lol |
| 15:05:03 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: That's not an OS, that's a programming "language" |
| 15:05:21 | JasonNJ | I'm referring to devices that are firmware only |
| 15:05:32 | Speedy2 | Huh? |
| 15:06:00 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: What is your traditional definition of an OS? |
| 15:06:05 | JasonNJ | does a digital watch have an OS? |
| 15:06:05 | George- | Rascal: doesn't do much :) |
| 15:06:11 | warmi | heh |
| 15:06:15 | George- | JasonNJ: hah, mine does =P |
| 15:06:25 | JasonNJ | does a 1980's-style coin op arcade game have an OS? |
| 15:06:28 | George- | (well, it has an addressbook) |
| 15:06:32 | Rascal | George-: what does it do? That's how you create ssh keys |
| 15:06:33 | Jerakeen | development time is, in some cases, considerably more important that speed. OSes are good for this sort of thing. |
| 15:06:34 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Possibly |
| 15:06:39 | George- | JasonNJ: that IBM Linux watch has an OS |
| 15:06:42 | Wembly | speedy2: ocisiscope (which i cant spell) and some wire :) |
| 15:06:43 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I would say an OS provides hardware abstraction, ability to seamlessly load applications and one that provides ore services |
| 15:06:50 | George- | Rascal: I'm not sure how to use it |
| 15:06:57 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: thats pretty loose |
| 15:06:59 | Wembly | jasonNJ: i dunno does a vcr? |
| 15:07:01 | George- | Rascal: why doesn't OZ allow me to SSH to it anyway :(* |
| 15:07:03 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: So? |
| 15:07:08 | Wembly | jasonnj: does a tv? |
| 15:07:10 | George- | Rascal: beta 10 allowed me to ssh in... |
| 15:07:10 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: But your knitpicking since you have no real examples of how Linux is better than "many" other OSes |
| 15:07:15 | warmi | JasonNJ: 1980s arcade machines used to be powered by some sort of OSes written in Forth |
| 15:07:21 | Rascal | go to terminal and type sshd |
| 15:07:22 | JasonNJ | ok, so doesnt a VCR or a DVD player not have an OS? |
| 15:07:29 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: DVD players do |
| 15:07:38 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: But you're again avoiding the issue |
| 15:07:41 | Wembly | speedy2: linux is better in platform support and general knowlage/acceptance in the public :) |
| 15:07:43 | JasonNJ | not in the traditional sense |
| 15:08:03 | Rascal | wembly, that's what I said but he don't wanna hear it.. |
| 15:08:03 | George- | JasonNJ: Does my toilet has an OS? |
| 15:08:04 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Enumerate all the OSes Linux is better than for embedded use. |
| 15:08:14 | Wembly | rascal: who dosnt? hehe |
| 15:08:14 | Speedy2 | Rascal: I agree |
| 15:08:23 | Speedy2 | Rascal: Linux of course has hype and marketting around it |
| 15:08:31 | Speedy2 | (and name association) |
| 15:08:33 | Speedy2 | etc |
| 15:08:44 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: linux has a massive number of developers, libraries and apps for it. |
| 15:08:58 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: So? If they're POSIX libs, they go on other OSes too |
| 15:09:01 | Wembly | technicaly linux was designed for one platform.. the x86 desktop... and as an afterthought they added support for other platforms and eventually got around to the idea of useing it as an embedded os |
| 15:09:06 | Speedy2 | Compliant... |
| 15:09:08 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: I am under the deluded view that the Z is not an embedded application. Its a computer. |
| 15:09:15 | George- | there's prolly more apps for the Z than there are for the PPC now :) |
| 15:09:37 | Wembly | but with that comes the same power/flexablity as you get on the x86 desktop. |
| 15:09:40 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Fine. But you still have no claims to backup your statements about Linux being better than many other OSes for embedded use, so you can very easily tip-toe around by claiming Z is not an embedded computer. |
| 15:09:45 | whardier | I just let loose the save ass winds of dark waters |
| 15:09:50 | whardier | savage |
| 15:09:52 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: I think you'll find that 90% of the bloat you're so unhappy with is in these libs, etc. |
| 15:09:52 | whardier | heh |
| 15:09:53 | whardier | duck |
| 15:10:00 | treke | JasonNJ: is the contest@zaurus.com Address read by anyone who knows about the requested apps? |
| 15:10:02 | Wembly | unlike other embedded os's where you go into the equation with an assumption of sacrificeing power/flexablity for embedablity |
| 15:10:03 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: And FYI, most desktop computers have 20GB+ storage, CD-ROMs, PCI, etc. The Z has all that, right? |
| 15:10:15 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: konqueror for the z is 2 megs, for instance. That's presumably mostly object code. THat's insane. |
| 15:10:16 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: then explain the HUGE industry backing of Linux if its not as good as say, QNX or eCos |
| 15:10:18 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: No, the OS itself has a lot of fluff (not needed for embedded use) |
| 15:10:36 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Explain the HUGE industry backing of x86 over Alpha, PowerPC, etc |
| 15:10:41 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: You can't, because x86 is shit |
| 15:10:47 | Wembly | speedy2: are we talking kernel + utils? or are we talking just kernel here btw? |
| 15:10:49 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: but of course, it has legacy around it |
| 15:10:53 | Speedy2 | Wembly: Kernel even. |
| 15:10:56 | JasonNJ | the X86 has been around longer than dirt thats why |
| 15:10:58 | warmi | what a change from the usual boredom on this channel |
| 15:11:07 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Yeah, but it's not "better" than any of those...it's horrible |
| 15:11:08 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: Whis is in itself a good example of the fact that technical elegance is not important for success. |
| 15:11:16 | Wembly | speedy2: x86 has market power. |
| 15:11:22 | Speedy2 | Jerakeen: Success? hehe |
| 15:11:26 | Speedy2 | Wembly: I know. |
| 15:11:33 | Jerakeen | Speedy2: the x86 is successful. |
| 15:11:38 | Wembly | speedy2: and a mini-monoply. |
| 15:11:42 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: may I ask you, what the benefit there is to this sort of discussion on this channel? |
| 15:11:59 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Aren't we supposed to be able to discuss things here? |
| 15:12:09 | JasonNJ | Yes if its relevant |
| 15:12:13 | Wembly | speedy2: the only way another platform can gain some ground is if it a: is already somewhat established or b: has a compatablity layer to x86 |
| 15:12:21 | Wembly | atleast on desktops and such. |
| 15:12:22 | Speedy2 | I think this conversation is relevant. |
| 15:12:27 | Wembly | but.. marketing is everything. |
| 15:12:30 | George- | kergoth_: ping |
| 15:12:33 | Speedy2 | Or are we Linux borg now? |
| 15:12:37 | JasonNJ | Are you gonna spend all day on it? |
| 15:12:39 | Speedy2 | No |
| 15:12:40 | Speedy2 | Are you? |
| 15:12:48 | Wembly | you can sell freezers to people in antartica with enough marketing. |
| 15:12:52 | Speedy2 | lol |
| 15:13:08 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I didn't see you bring up any other topic to discuss... |
| 15:13:15 | Wembly | speedy2: its not so much relevant to anything importent... hehe its just.. a boardem killer |
| 15:13:28 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: I'm glad youre porting eCos. Show us the money. :) |
| 15:13:31 | Wembly | speedy2: something to do while sitting around on irc attempting to look like your doing something somewhere hehe |
| 15:13:44 | Jerakeen | essentially, a) speedy2 is right. qnx, etc is smaller, better for embedded, etc, but b) technical merit doesn't actually change the fact that you can't but a device with this os on it, and we're a long way from having anything as convenient to install as oz. |
| 15:13:45 | JasonNJ | its one of serveral OSes that are being ported |
| 15:13:46 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Show me a Zaurus |
| 15:13:56 | JasonNJ | if its sells more Z's, I think thats great |
| 15:14:02 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: Then give me a Z. |
| 15:14:12 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: talk to Sniper |
| 15:14:27 | Wembly | jerakeen: you also have the fact that qnx and such isnt as established. |
| 15:14:36 | Speedy2 | Wembly: 20 years... |
| 15:14:45 | Wembly | speedy2: as far as applications and such. |
| 15:14:49 | Speedy2 | Yeah... |
| 15:14:55 | Speedy2 | I wish cdm were alive |
| 15:15:00 | Speedy2 | Or maybe he is and he's just ducking |
| 15:15:00 | Speedy2 | heh |
| 15:15:07 | Wembly | and just my personal view... |
| 15:15:07 | JasonNJ | Wembly: QNX is very established. |
| 15:15:09 | Jerakeen | Wembly: The large number of developers, etc familiar with the platform is a good pointas well, but POSIX being what it is, I doubt that's a berier. it's not like the stuff we're getting is all straight ports from desktop systems,... |
| 15:15:17 | JasonNJ | I mean, its older than Linux. |
| 15:15:42 | Wembly | qnx along with alot of other embedded kernel/platforms seems to go into the equation with the concept of 'sarifice the power and usablity of a pc' concept. |
| 15:15:44 | NeoTron | hrm. What the heck |
| 15:15:50 | JasonNJ | QNX is used in a ton of applications, although you never hear about them |
| 15:16:02 | Wembly | jasonnj: im not saying it isnt used. |
| 15:16:16 | Wembly | im saying there is no real establishment in the development side of it. |
| 15:16:19 | NeoTron | http://eongames.com/games/re/download.html |
| 15:16:22 | NeoTron | RocketElite demo download |
| 15:16:23 | Wembly | its kinda chicken & egg thing. |
| 15:16:31 | NeoTron | demo build not tested by me. :))untest |
| 15:16:34 | Speedy2 | Wembly: It uses GNU/GCC...what do you mean? |
| 15:16:43 | warmi | hehe |
| 15:16:51 | Wembly | speedy2: what of it? |
| 15:16:52 | JasonNJ | I'm actually quite interested in seeing what the QNX port to the Z will be like |
| 15:17:04 | Speedy2 | Wembly: Well..you said no real establishmento n the developer side |
| 15:17:05 | NeoTron | qnx is quite nice |
| 15:17:09 | Speedy2 | on the developer side... |
| 15:17:13 | treke | JasonNJ: you could try the ipaq port if you have one around |
| 15:17:22 | Wembly | speedy2: herm true. |
| 15:17:23 | Speedy2 | Or the iPaq port of eCos |
| 15:17:32 | JasonNJ | treke: I dont unfortunately |
| 15:17:43 | treke | JasonNJ: Ah, thought you had all kinds of funky pdas |
| 15:17:57 | Wembly | why couldnt compaq put a keyboard on their pda.. :/ |
| 15:17:59 | JasonNJ | well, we do have one in house but its in use by the marketing folk |
| 15:18:09 | JasonNJ | we dont have the special serial cable though |
| 15:18:11 | Speedy2 | Wembly: If they do... |
| 15:18:20 | Speedy2 | JasonNJ: I'll do an even exchange for you |
| 15:18:22 | Wembly | then we could all be nice and happy with 10 differnt os's running on their system. |
| 15:18:24 | Speedy2 | iPaq cable for Z cable. |
| 15:18:29 | Speedy2 | :) |
| 15:18:52 | JasonNJ | Speedy2: email huangs@sharpsec.com, spencer will get you a unit |
| 15:18:54 | NeoTron | heh. installing ipkgs from the network requires 2x the internal storage as the package requires, more or less |
| 15:18:54 | Wembly | but then itd be big and bulky too. |
| 15:19:12 | Wembly | neotron: what you expect it to do it via a stream? :) |
| 15:19:25 | NeoTron | Wembly: well, it's just funny. :) |
| 15:19:46 | George- | scp: error while loading shared libraries: libz.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 15:19:47 | George- | damn |
| 15:19:48 | NeoTron | especially if people want to try to install to CF/SD because internal storage is lacking. :) |
| 15:22:47 | darienm | BigBoss ? |
| 15:22:53 | Jerakeen | NeoTron: How much memory is this thing wanting? |
| 15:23:10 | Rascal | George-: install libz to root |
| 15:23:25 | George- | Rascal: this is on my powerbook |
| 15:23:32 | George- | trying to scp from the zaurus to it |
| 15:23:53 | treke | JasonNJ: is the contest@zaurus.com Address read by anyone who knows about the requested apps? |
| 15:23:55 | benmeyer | George-: what are you trying to instlal? |
| 15:24:00 | benmeyer | treke: yes |
| 15:24:06 | treke | ah good |
| 15:24:16 | benmeyer | And if they don't they forward it to me |
| 15:24:17 | benmeyer | :_D |
| 15:24:19 | treke | has a couple of questions for them :) |
| 15:24:21 | Wembly | it just lookds kinda... i dunno not smooth and 'machined' |
| 15:24:24 | BigBoss | darienm: yes? |
| 15:24:32 | Speedy2 | Wembly: No, it was not machined |
| 15:24:44 | darienm | BigBoss: are tkcRekall sales starting to pick up yet? |
| 15:24:58 | darienm | BigBoss: and if not, WHY THE HELL NOT. It roxors ! |
| 15:25:10 | BigBoss | darienm: tell people about it then :) |
| 15:25:27 | BigBoss | it's selling, it's a more expensive and more specialized app, I wasn't expecting to sell hundreds the first week |
| 15:25:28 | darienm | BigBoss: trying to. Gonna try and build an example or two for my site. |
| 15:25:30 | Speedy2 | BigBoss: I noticed you steered clear of our earlier discussion, heh. |
| 15:25:36 | Rascal | oh hell my SSH package on my Ibook seems to work fine. |
| 15:25:52 | George- | benmeyer: I'm trying to use the SD card slot to get images from my digicam :) |
| 15:26:08 | BigBoss | Speedy2: I've been having a crises with my server since 18 hours ago that just cleared 2 minutes ago - I missed most of what was going on |
| 15:26:28 | Speedy2 | BigBoss: Everything resolved OK? |
| 15:27:38 | BigBoss | not sure, the colo hasn't called back, but the slow down is resolved at the moment |
| 15:27:45 | BigBoss | our system was 98.4% idle and barely moving |
| 15:28:18 | Rascal | ouch. |
| 15:28:28 | Rascal | what colo? |
| 15:29:06 | fariseo | anybody lives in/near washington DC? |
| 15:29:43 | BigBoss | Co Location - where our server is at |
| 15:29:47 | BigBoss | so what did I miss earlier? |
| 15:29:53 | Speedy2 | heh |
| 15:29:59 | Speedy2 | A heated discussion |
| 15:30:30 | George- | hi kergoth`home |
| 15:30:48 | kergoth`home | man, what a fucking day |
| 15:30:52 | kergoth`home | i'm .. 2 1/2 hours late for work |
| 15:31:00 | kergoth`home | alarm didnt go off, and i just kept sleeping... |
| 15:31:02 | kergoth`home | hehe |
| 15:31:04 | kergoth`home | agh |
| 15:31:16 | kergoth`home | k i go to work now. bye |
| 15:31:23 | Speedy2 | (tell them your car broke down) |
| 15:33:14 | Rascal | tell them the hooker you had last night turned out to be a man and you got into a squabble with him.. |
| 15:33:20 | Rascal | they neighbors called the police |
| 15:33:35 | Rascal | and then you had to sort the whole sordid affair at the police station.. |
| 15:33:51 | Rascal | you didn't get out untill this afternoon after your mom posted bail. |
| 15:33:55 | Rascal | that always works for me |
| 15:39:37 | benmeyer | BigBoss: how did you get the the specs to the PIM xml format? |
| 15:41:28 | BigBoss | did someone send them to me? |
| 15:43:56 | benmeyer | no clue |
| 15:44:00 | benmeyer | just curius |
| 15:44:05 | benmeyer | sense I can't find them here |
| 15:44:15 | benmeyer | Wanted to add them to the howtos to help developers |
| 15:45:03 | darienm | How-to interact with existing PIM data on the Zaurus: Step 1, reverse-engineer the XML format, we lost it. |
| 15:45:26 | Wembly | eek |
| 15:45:37 | [DrEvil] | BigBoss: are picture entries in the tkcaddressbook in the works? |
| 15:45:39 | Wembly | darienm: one would think that the source would have the xml format. |
| 15:45:42 | BigBoss | well that is apprently the correct answer |
| 15:45:49 | BigBoss | DrEvil: did you put it in Mantis? |
| 15:45:54 | Wembly | darienm: or atleast some of it. |
| 15:46:00 | [DrEvil] | no |
| 15:46:08 | Wembly | darienm: then for some of it im shure strings would help |
| 15:46:14 | [DrEvil] | I thought mantis was for opie |
| 15:46:14 | Wembly | and for the rest you always have disassembly :) |
| 15:46:27 | Speedy2 | bbl all |
| 15:46:58 | [DrEvil] | Hail CloneMaster] |
| 15:47:39 | Wembly | gawd darnit i wish i had a dvd player :/ |
| 15:47:58 | [DrEvil] | I have 5 |
| 15:48:16 | BigBoss | DrEvil: https://www.thekompany.com/mantis/login_page.php |
| 15:48:34 | darienm | Wembly: use your playstation |
| 15:48:43 | Wembly | i dont have that ether. |
| 15:48:51 | Wembly | besides a playstation cant play dvd's :P |
| 15:48:54 | [DrEvil] | I also noticed that tkcrekall does not hide your password |
| 15:49:02 | darienm | Take my son's. He plays on it too much. |
| 15:49:08 | Wembly | they took my playstation orignal and my dvd :/ |
| 15:49:12 | Wembly | err dvd player |
| 15:49:40 | Wembly | and gosh darnit that was a modded psx too :/ |
| 15:49:56 | Wembly | @#$#@ region encodeing bs.. :/ |
| 15:51:06 | [DrEvil] | waits for the sharp rom to download |
| 15:52:12 | darienm | waits for the next release... |
| 15:52:51 | Wembly | waits to find enough money to buy a cf card |
| 15:53:06 | darienm | cf for storage? why not sd for storage? |
| 15:53:19 | BigBoss | DrEvil: you have a copy of tkcRekall? |
| 15:53:21 | Wembly | darienm: so i can flash my zaurus to the newest ver or whatever. |
| 15:53:29 | Wembly | and also so i can check out oz |
| 15:53:31 | Wembly | herm. |
| 15:53:34 | [DrEvil] | a demo |
| 15:53:38 | Wembly | whats the diff between cf card type 1 and type 2? |
| 15:53:40 | darienm | Wembly: I dont think you are required to have a cf annymore. |
| 15:53:43 | bipolar | is back (gone 01:35:08) |
| 15:53:52 | Wembly | darienm: herm. i thought you were.. |
| 15:54:17 | Wembly | cus you need to update the flashrom and to do that without updating the whole flashrom is to let the bootloader do it. which it does it via cf |
| 15:54:21 | Wembly | atleast last i knew hehe |
| 15:56:51 | cranch | Big Boss..you here? |
| 16:00:22 | [DrEvil] | why does installing stuff on opie have to be so hard |
| 16:02:28 | George- | brb |
| 16:02:42 | Wembly | installing stuff on opie is hard? |
| 16:03:35 | JasonNJ | Evil: the package manager needs to be redone |
| 16:03:45 | JasonNJ | its horrendous, I agree |
| 16:04:02 | treke | [DrEvil]: Not hard, just use the console installer :) |
| 16:06:38 | treke | oipkg seems to have been broken for a while |
| 16:07:55 | [DrEvil] | one feature that would be nice is to be able to beam a package....but wait |
| 16:08:06 | [DrEvil] | say you don't have the ipk |
| 16:08:17 | [DrEvil] | it would create an ipk from your Z and beam it to another Z |
| 16:09:07 | [DrEvil] | of course there would have to be some "protection" for commercial apps |
| 16:11:14 | benmeyer | DrEvill: see my plan for packages that are directories |
| 16:11:15 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 16:12:05 | Wembly | *sigh* |
| 16:12:22 | Wembly | drevil: as long as we dont do what hollywood and friends is doing in congress. |
| 16:12:32 | [DrEvil] | going to do the Macintosh thing? |
| 16:12:42 | Wembly | benmeyer: packages that are directories? |
| 16:12:48 | Wembly | benmeyer: are we going to have a /opt? :) |
| 16:12:51 | benmeyer | no |
| 16:12:54 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 16:12:59 | benmeyer | just / whahahah |
| 16:13:00 | benmeyer | jk |
| 16:13:42 | [DrEvil] | benmeyer: when is your hancom script going to rip out Opera and Jeode? |
| 16:14:29 | benmeyer | when kergoth gives me the list of files |
| 16:14:56 | [DrEvil] | dammit |
| 16:14:56 | [DrEvil] | all this fingerpointing |
| 16:15:22 | [DrEvil] | I ask kergoth |
| 16:15:22 | [DrEvil] | he says ask you |
| 16:15:23 | benmeyer | what do you mean? |
| 16:15:29 | benmeyer | Yes, I will make them |
| 16:15:33 | benmeyer | but I need to know what files to copy |
| 16:15:40 | benmeyer | and he said that he had a list |
| 16:15:43 | benmeyer | somewhere |
| 16:16:02 | benmeyer | so once he finds it I will use it to make a ipk that will make opera and jeod apps |
| 16:16:05 | [DrEvil] | he said he had an old script |
| 16:16:10 | benmeyer | yes |
| 16:16:11 | benmeyer | that was it |
| 16:16:18 | [DrEvil] | which he says doesn't work anymore |
| 16:16:31 | [DrEvil] | and that you were working on new scripts |
| 16:16:31 | benmeyer | I don't care I will rip it apart anyway for my new one |
| 16:16:34 | br33zy | ls warmi |
| 16:16:34 | benmeyer | I just need the files |
| 16:16:47 | benmeyer | what files does opera install |
| 16:16:51 | benmeyer | what files to jeod install |
| 16:16:56 | benmeyer | get me that I will do the rest |
| 16:16:57 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 16:16:58 | br33zy | ls: warmi: No such person or person found. |
| 16:17:05 | [DrEvil] | he didn't say that you needed something from him |
| 16:17:07 | br33zy | damn it! |
| 16:17:44 | [DrEvil] | I might have a partial file list to work from |
| 16:17:55 | benmeyer | ok |
| 16:18:11 | [DrEvil] | all my work on EvilROM |
| 16:18:24 | [DrEvil] | ripping out Jeode and Opera |
| 16:19:09 | [DrEvil] | hrmmm |
| 16:20:16 | [DrEvil] | ipkg in OZ doesn't appear to have a command line create symlinks switch |
| 16:20:42 | [DrEvil] | gets flustered |
| 16:21:24 | benmeyer | no it doesn't |
| 16:21:30 | benmeyer | But I wrote a script to do it for me |
| 16:21:34 | benmeyer | based on the lists file :-D |
| 16:21:49 | benmeyer | app=$1 |
| 16:21:49 | benmeyer | location=$2 |
| 16:21:49 | benmeyer | root=$3 |
| 16:21:49 | benmeyer | for file in `cat app`; do |
| 16:21:49 | benmeyer | ln -s $location/$file root/$file |
| 16:21:50 | benmeyer | done |
| 16:23:13 | [DrEvil] | you run that after you install? |
| 16:24:07 | benmeyer | no |
| 16:24:15 | benmeyer | well you can |
| 16:24:17 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 16:24:21 | benmeyer | run it on a list file |
| 16:24:27 | benmeyer | that is installed to cf/sd etc |
| 16:29:12 | [DrEvil] | hand installs every tkc app |
| 16:29:38 | benmeyer | meyerb@sharpsec.com |
| 16:29:44 | benmeyer | that is where you can send me the opera lsit |
| 16:29:45 | benmeyer | list |
| 16:29:48 | benmeyer | and jeod |
| 16:30:30 | [DrEvil] | glares at his download rate for the sharp ROM |
| 16:30:34 | treke | benmeyer: In your new package manager, are you going to make provisions for moving the equivalen of a .desktop file without breaking the package? |
| 16:30:42 | [DrEvil] | let me see where I put it |
| 16:30:52 | benmeyer | you mean my tab manager? |
| 16:30:54 | [DrEvil] | my Z lv is cluttered |
| 16:30:55 | benmeyer | it already does |
| 16:31:36 | treke | benmeyer: Arent you writing a new launcher and package manager? or at least looking into it |
| 16:31:49 | benmeyer | oh yes |
| 16:31:59 | benmeyer | think 3 month time frame |
| 16:32:09 | treke | i'm in no hurry :) |
| 16:32:48 | George- | starts a holy war |
| 16:32:58 | George- | Sharp Sucks! Wintel all the way! :) |
| 16:33:20 | benmeyer | yah, I figured I would design it correctly first rather then just jump into it |
| 16:33:42 | treke | benmeyer: Just wanted to make sure you'd be able to change categories/folders/tabs without the package manager reinstalling it to the original tab with the next update |
| 16:33:49 | benmeyer | yah |
| 16:34:08 | benmeyer | you will be able to move/catigorize/priorities/rename/beam/etc apps |
| 16:34:19 | benmeyer | without worry |
| 16:34:33 | VanDerVek | crap |
| 16:37:08 | treke | waiting sucks, but its worth it for a good product |
| 16:37:56 | BigBoss | tkcToDo is now officially in beta test |
| 16:38:17 | ]EvilDr[ | yay |
| 16:38:30 | benmeyer | yah it does suck, but better wait 6 months then wait 3 and then spend the next 8 waitin for 2.0 |
| 16:38:34 | benmeyer | while it is re-written |
| 16:38:36 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 16:39:44 | ]EvilDr[ | this is weird |
| 16:39:52 | ]EvilDr[ | I can't install tkccalendar on opie |
| 16:40:04 | JasonNJ | man last night's southpark was totally wacked |
| 16:40:26 | ]EvilDr[ | it says that it is trying to install something that the kompany libs already installed |
| 16:40:30 | benmeyer | indeed it was |
| 16:40:34 | ]EvilDr[ | yes it was |
| 16:40:51 | JasonNJ | I feel like for my mental health I shouldnt watch it anymore |
| 16:41:05 | BigBoss | 2 nights ago wasn't it? |
| 16:41:05 | benmeyer | but it is so funy |
| 16:41:11 | benmeyer | funny |
| 16:41:13 | JasonNJ | yeah but my PVR taped it |
| 16:41:18 | benmeyer | damm wacky keyboard |
| 16:41:28 | JasonNJ | "playing lambs" |
| 16:41:28 | benmeyer | yah I only watched it last night too via tivo |
| 16:41:31 | JasonNJ | thats to messed up |
| 16:41:43 | BigBoss | it was less gross than the others this season |
| 16:41:49 | JasonNJ | true |
| 16:41:53 | BigBoss | yea, it took me a minute to get that "playing lambs" reference |
| 16:41:56 | benmeyer | the shit one.... |
| 16:42:03 | BigBoss | the "Sea People" one was way sick |
| 16:42:06 | JasonNJ | yeah the one when cartman hides inside mrs choksondik |
| 16:42:15 | JasonNJ | the Sea Men episode |
| 16:42:36 | Fluxwerk | that is a great one |
| 16:42:43 | Fluxwerk | Sea people |
| 16:43:14 | JasonNJ | that was totally wacked |
| 16:43:22 | toolafial | the sea ppl was was totally messed up |
| 16:43:24 | Fluxwerk | Simpson's did it |
| 16:43:33 | JasonNJ | I think they are actually trying to get kicked off the air now |
| 16:43:35 | toolafial | but this week's one was way funny |
| 16:43:38 | BigBoss | the simpsons tie in was awesome |
| 16:43:48 | BigBoss | but the "love batter" was gross |
| 16:43:50 | Fluxwerk | JasonNJ: kicked off for what? |
| 16:44:03 | Fluxwerk | I had to close my eyes and suck it out of a hoe |
| 16:44:07 | ]EvilDr[ | SP has lost it's luster |
| 16:44:14 | benmeyer | hahaha |
| 16:44:19 | ]EvilDr[ | there are some funny episodes |
| 16:44:31 | ]EvilDr[ | but not many |
| 16:44:36 | JasonNJ | scott teneman must die |
| 16:44:39 | JasonNJ | that one was wacked |
| 16:44:48 | BigBoss | oh that was awesome |
| 16:44:52 | BigBoss | "you ate your parents" |
| 16:45:03 | ]EvilDr[ | the IT one was funny |
| 16:45:07 | BigBoss | but Mr. Garrison and his dad - that was way sick |
| 16:45:19 | JasonNJ | seriosuly one of these days we are going to have a south park murder |
| 16:45:43 | JasonNJ | Evil: IT was hillarious |
| 16:47:39 | Wembly | anyone know why there is a sync issue with voice/video on the Z? |
| 16:49:05 | ]DrEvil[ | I thought the jab at the airline industry was right on the mark |
| 16:49:21 | BigBoss | all of their jabs are awesome - that is what is great about it |
| 16:49:28 | BigBoss | the movie was the smartest thing ever written |
| 16:49:38 | JasonNJ | I'd love to see them jab at linux |
| 16:49:40 | JasonNJ | would be funny |
| 16:49:46 | kergoth`work | man |
| 16:49:48 | kergoth`work | what a fucking day |
| 16:50:10 | JasonNJ | kergoth`home: wish I could have sex at work |
| 16:50:18 | kergoth | hah |
| 16:50:21 | kergoth | wish i could drink at work |
| 16:50:29 | JasonNJ | why cant you |
| 16:50:32 | kergoth | JasonNJ: lcd powered up! i see a penguin! muahaha |
| 16:50:34 | JasonNJ | just not IN the building |
| 16:50:38 | kergoth | true that |
| 16:50:52 | JasonNJ | kergoth`home: you got framebuffer? |
| 16:50:56 | kergoth | JasonNJ: yes |
| 16:51:08 | kergoth | JasonNJ: still having quirks with the flash access.. but i'm well on my way... |
| 16:51:12 | JasonNJ | rrgh |
| 16:51:22 | kergoth | JasonNJ: i decided to take a break from that and play with the framebuffer, which is why it works |
| 16:51:23 | kergoth | heh |
| 16:51:29 | kergoth | :-) |
| 16:51:39 | JasonNJ | sounds like we are close to a breakthrough |
| 16:51:44 | kergoth | indeed |
| 16:51:55 | kergoth | once the flash is behaving itself, i can jump to smaller things |
| 16:51:59 | JasonNJ | this is with 2.5.x ? |
| 16:52:02 | kergoth | like keymaps for the hw keyboard, audio, etc |
| 16:52:06 | kergoth | yes, 2.5.21-rmk1-cl1 |
| 16:52:09 | JasonNJ | wow |
| 16:52:11 | kergoth | (cl = chris larson) |
| 16:52:12 | kergoth | hehe |
| 16:52:14 | JasonNJ | bleeding freakin edge |
| 16:52:17 | kergoth | oh yeah |
| 16:52:22 | kergoth | wait till i up it to 2.5.24-rmk1 |
| 16:52:24 | kergoth | ;-) |
| 16:52:26 | kergoth | fun stuff |
| 16:53:05 | treke | kergoth: 2.5 starting to stabilize at all? |
| 16:53:16 | ]DrEvil[ | any trick to getting Hancom to install on the OZ? |
| 16:53:19 | kergoth | JasonNJ: i think we should pursue getting the orinoco driver fixes incorporated into the kernel tree. |
| 16:53:29 | kergoth | JasonNJ: as well as spectrum-cs.. imo.. i should ping the author |
| 16:53:30 | treke | ]DrEvil[: Delete files it says it conflicts with |
| 16:53:30 | JasonNJ | thats a good idea |
| 16:53:37 | Neo|Work | gday |
| 16:53:40 | kergoth | hey neo |
| 16:54:04 | fusion94 | who here is going to LWCE next month ? |
| 16:54:24 | kergoth | treke: yes 2.5 is improving fast. though ide is still broken as all hell, at least you can choose to use the old 2.4 ide subsystem for now |
| 16:54:25 | JasonNJ | we should see some nice little improvements running on a more modernized kernel |
| 16:54:31 | kergoth | JasonNJ: yes, like battery usage |
| 16:54:41 | JasonNJ | the newer VM is a plus |
| 16:54:48 | treke | kergoth: cool. my home system is getting to stable :) need something bleeding edge |
| 16:54:50 | kergoth | ahhhh i'm beind 677 messages on linux-kernel |
| 16:54:51 | JasonNJ | might see some weird behavior though |
| 16:55:23 | Jerakeen | kergoth: What, a good half-hour's worth, then? :-) |
| 16:55:36 | [DrEvil] | hancom bitches about not being able to create symlinks |
| 16:56:39 | kergoth | Jerakeen: half hour? i'm not NEARLY that good at skimming ;-) |
| 16:56:46 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: where you installing them to? |
| 16:56:53 | [DrEvil] | damn SD card |
| 16:56:57 | kergoth | what filesystem? |
| 16:57:10 | kergoth | pester bigboss :-) |
| 16:57:15 | [DrEvil] | glares |
| 16:57:15 | [DrEvil] | SD |
| 16:57:40 | [DrEvil] | standard fat |
| 16:57:40 | [DrEvil] | I know it can't do symlinks there |
| 16:57:46 | kergoth | JasonNJ: bipolar was talking to jamey about getting the symlinking functionality into ipkg itself. |
| 16:57:51 | [DrEvil] | but in the sharp rom I installed it to SD and it worked |
| 16:58:01 | kergoth | JasonNJ: jamey was okay with it. didnt adamently refuse it. So I'm going to write up a proposal. |
| 16:58:31 | JasonNJ | thats cool |
| 16:58:45 | kergoth | JasonNJ: then people could at least use ipkg when oipkg is being a bitch ;-) |
| 16:59:32 | treke | kergoth: so, like all the time? :) |
| 16:59:34 | kergoth | JasonNJ: which i would do most of the time anyway.. you could easily install apps to sd/whatever from ssh :-) |
| 16:59:37 | kergoth | treke: exactly. hehe |
| 16:59:44 | Neo|Work | So I did a quiet release of RocketElite demo |
| 16:59:52 | [DrEvil] | I don't think I want to tempt fate on SD and format it with ext2 |
| 16:59:59 | Neo|Work | so feel free to try it out |
| 17:00:14 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: so pester bigboss. they're notorious for packaging problems |
| 17:00:24 | treke | Neo|Work: rotation support in it? |
| 17:00:27 | kergoth | Neo|Work: nice. when my Z boots again i'll play :-) |
| 17:00:58 | BigBoss | our stuff packages fine, just install it to RAM |
| 17:01:06 | BigBoss | we had one major snafu recently |
| 17:01:09 | [DrEvil] | kergoth: I got tkccalendar to install by deleting confilicting files |
| 17:01:13 | darienm | * cough * RAM space is limited |
| 17:01:19 | kergoth | JasonNJ: hehe. 2.5.x .. the framebuffer is rotatedd... remember the Z's lcd is flipped.. to see it normally you need a 270 degree rotation |
| 17:01:21 | [DrEvil] | but I am trying to install Hancom stuff now |
| 17:01:25 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: ah, gotcha. |
| 17:01:30 | Neo|Work | treke: hrm. No, sorry. Thanks for remindingme |
| 17:01:32 | BigBoss | why would you soil your Z with Hancom software? |
| 17:01:33 | [DrEvil] | and it wants to create symlinks |
| 17:01:38 | kergoth | stupid shit |
| 17:01:43 | kergoth | people need to learn to package their shit right |
| 17:01:45 | kergoth | actually |
| 17:01:57 | kergoth | hp/compaq needs to establish a packaging policy for familiar. then we just follow that. |
| 17:01:58 | kergoth | hheh |
| 17:01:59 | treke | Neo|Work: no problem, cc is keeping me plenty happy? |
| 17:02:08 | [DrEvil] | it is trying to create the lib symlinks |
| 17:02:14 | kergoth | ahh yeah |
| 17:02:23 | kergoth | libs dont work well on vfat |
| 17:02:25 | Neo|Work | treke: I'll look at that tonight if time permits |
| 17:02:25 | [DrEvil] | switch to RPM |
| 17:02:37 | [DrEvil] | *duck* |
| 17:02:39 | treke | crack cruncher |
| 17:02:40 | kergoth | unless the packager named the actual file libblah.so and symlinked to the rest, rather than vice versa which is more common |
| 17:02:43 | kergoth | smacks [DrEvil] |
| 17:02:56 | Neo|Work | it's rendered 270 degree natively, so I need to do a 180 degree flip |
| 17:03:14 | Neo|Work | treke: hehe. Drug-themed candy cruncher? :P |
| 17:03:19 | treke | hehe |
| 17:03:39 | [DrEvil] | rpm --relocate |
| 17:03:58 | Wembly | what themeing ablity does qtopia have? |
| 17:03:59 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: ipkg still needs a lot of functionality.. and i've got like 8 bug reports pending.. |
| 17:04:00 | kergoth | heh |
| 17:04:16 | JasonNJ | wow this sierra mist soda is way better than sprite or 7up. |
| 17:04:25 | kergoth | JasonNJ: it is? ive never tried it |
| 17:04:28 | Wembly | jasonnj: omg i cant stand that soda |
| 17:04:29 | benmeyer | eh |
| 17:04:31 | BigBoss | yea, I've really been digging it lately |
| 17:04:33 | Wembly | jasonnj: it takes horrid. |
| 17:04:33 | kergoth | ljp_: ! i have lcd! i see a penguin! |
| 17:04:38 | Wembly | err tastes |
| 17:04:40 | JasonNJ | they just started stocking the machine with it |
| 17:04:42 | ljp_ | sweet |
| 17:04:45 | BigBoss | it's got a snappier taste to it |
| 17:04:46 | Neo|Work | Jolt all the way |
| 17:04:50 | JasonNJ | it tastes more natural |
| 17:04:52 | Neo|Work | although I can't fricking find it anymore |
| 17:04:52 | BigBoss | kind of like Barqs root beer |
| 17:04:53 | ljp_ | is that penguin dancing? |
| 17:04:54 | kergoth | ljp_: course its 0 degree rotation, which is sideways... |
| 17:04:56 | Neo|Work | so disappointing |
| 17:04:59 | kergoth | ljp_: hah, in my mind, yes |
| 17:05:05 | ljp_ | hehe |
| 17:05:17 | JasonNJ | my favorite lemon soda is pellgrino limonata |
| 17:05:17 | ljp_ | not rotated.. well.. thats a start |
| 17:05:20 | JasonNJ | that stuff is TART |
| 17:05:30 | kergoth | ljp_: yes, definately.. |
| 17:05:32 | hunger | kergoth: Congratulations! |
| 17:05:33 | JasonNJ | made with the juice of amalfi lemons |
| 17:05:42 | whardier | woot |
| 17:05:45 | whardier | I have grant writers now |
| 17:05:45 | kergoth | ljp_: i'll add rotation later. i've got higher priorities, like being able to erase flash. hehe |
| 17:05:46 | whardier | real ones |
| 17:05:50 | kergoth | whardier: sweet |
| 17:05:52 | kergoth | hunger: thanks ;-) |
| 17:05:56 | George- | kergoth: uhm |
| 17:06:01 | kergoth | George-: ? |
| 17:06:01 | whardier | looks like lots more trips to hawaii/alaska/indian reservations |
| 17:06:07 | George- | kergoth: the ssh on beta 10.4 is b0rked |
| 17:06:08 | kergoth | whardier: have fun |
| 17:06:13 | kergoth | George-: works flawless here. |
| 17:06:14 | George- | kergoth: It doesn't generate any keys :) |
| 17:06:16 | toolafial | kergoth: do you care what format the isntall doc for OZ is in? |
| 17:06:29 | George- | (I'm lazy) |
| 17:06:30 | kergoth | George-: yes it does, unless you use the zImage-32 or zImage-64. there's a bug in my full reset script. |
| 17:06:36 | toolafial | kergoth: I mean do you want html, txt, pdf etc? |
| 17:06:38 | ljp_ | kergoth: what happens when sonmeone erases flash 10000000 times? ;) |
| 17:06:38 | George- | crap |
| 17:06:39 | George- | ok |
| 17:06:41 | JasonNJ | oh freakin cool. |
| 17:06:46 | kergoth | toolafial: doesnt matter |
| 17:06:46 | George- | I used zImage-32 |
| 17:06:55 | JasonNJ | HP is sending me a Itanium 2 to play with for a linux magazine review |
| 17:07:03 | kergoth | George-: yeah roge99 reported that last nigth.. sd didnt work because it didnt configure the sd package on full reset |
| 17:07:07 | kergoth | George-: same for ssh |
| 17:07:07 | George- | JasonNJ: lucky bastard! |
| 17:07:09 | BigBoss | so that will be one of the 5 that ships this year :) |
| 17:07:13 | toolafial | kergoth: I'll do it in html therefor it can be put in the wiki |
| 17:07:19 | George- | kergoth: yes, SD most certainly doesn't work |
| 17:07:25 | George- | cries |
| 17:07:27 | JasonNJ | George-: not sure what the hell I will run on it though |
| 17:07:28 | kergoth | George-: for i in /usr/lib/ipkg/info/*postinst; do sh $i configure; done; |
| 17:07:33 | kergoth | George-: that should solve it. |
| 17:07:44 | JasonNJ | heh, I know, SETI |
| 17:07:49 | George- | kergoth: that'll solve everything? |
| 17:08:01 | kergoth | George-: yes. that'll do the "REconfiguring packages..." step that you'd normally see on boot. |
| 17:08:11 | George- | ok |
| 17:08:13 | George- | whoopppieee |
| 17:08:17 | kergoth | George-: i'll add a note under Caveats to the release notes / README |
| 17:08:30 | kergoth | anyone feel like hosting www.openzaurus.org for me? |
| 17:08:31 | JasonNJ | I bet it can encode MP3's hella fast |
| 17:08:31 | kergoth | heh |
| 17:08:38 | JasonNJ | kergoth`home: sure |
| 17:08:40 | toolafial | man I am so lazy, I installed vnc on a machine that is a cube down from me, just so I wouldn't have to walk to it |
| 17:08:48 | JasonNJ | kergoth`home: how much space do you need |
| 17:08:51 | kergoth | toolafial: aha |
| 17:08:55 | JasonNJ | I have a big ass server I run things on |
| 17:08:58 | kergoth | JasonNJ: no idea, I have no content to put there yet. hehe |
| 17:09:05 | whardier | big ass mofo server |
| 17:09:14 | kergoth | JasonNJ: I want to have a page to put current issues and resolutions .. workarounds basically |
| 17:09:24 | JasonNJ | actually I have 2, one that ZaurusZone runs on and one that my food site eGullet.com runs on |
| 17:09:27 | kergoth | JasonNJ: among other things. does it have php+mysql support? |
| 17:09:32 | George- | kergoth: sh: Can't open configure |
| 17:09:34 | JasonNJ | both do |
| 17:09:43 | kergoth | George-: uhh you didnt get the script right |
| 17:09:57 | ljp_ | kergoth: talk to whardier about hosting..he may know |
| 17:10:00 | kergoth | George-: for i in /usr/lib/ipkg/info/*postinst*; do sh $i configure; done; <-slightly altered, try that |
| 17:10:02 | George- | kergoth: it's strange, cos my 32M kernel worked with the last release of OZ, with that Reconfiguring packages stuff |
| 17:10:03 | kergoth | ljp_: oh could do that |
| 17:10:23 | kergoth | George-: hm, thats really weird since i didnt change anything in that part of the package.. |
| 17:10:28 | kergoth | George-: oh well, i'll dig. |
| 17:10:57 | George- | kergoth: I'll boot my own kernel, and see what happens, ok? |
| 17:10:58 | kergoth | ahhhh i dont have time to go through linux-kernel |
| 17:11:03 | kergoth | i'm going to be 900 messages behind |
| 17:11:05 | kergoth | somebody shoot me |
| 17:11:10 | George- | kergoth: Then I'll send you my .config :) |
| 17:11:17 | kergoth | George-: go ahead. your kernel doesnt have a mtdram right? |
| 17:11:19 | George- | kergoth: btw - what's up with the new *nifty* start logo? :) |
| 17:11:24 | George- | kergoth: yes, no mtdram |
| 17:11:32 | kergoth | George-: hehe. whardier's animation |
| 17:11:40 | kergoth | George-: cool, let me know how it goes |
| 17:11:54 | kergoth | pfft |
| 17:11:55 | kergoth | CIBT has received confirmation of the upcoming increased U.S. passport |
| 17:11:55 | kergoth | processing fees, which will take effect August 19, 2002. |
| 17:13:24 | whardier | ? |
| 17:13:47 | whardier | nifty |
| 17:13:49 | whardier | dies happy |
| 17:13:54 | kergoth | whardier: ? |
| 17:14:12 | kergoth | whardier: OZ 2.9.4 (aka oz3b10.4) is out |
| 17:14:16 | kergoth | whardier: fyi |
| 17:14:32 | George- | whardier: haha |
| 17:14:34 | thefly | hello |
| 17:14:53 | thefly | do you know if SL-5500 has got netfilter support compiled? |
| 17:14:59 | kergoth | thefly: not out of the box |
| 17:15:07 | thefly | what do you mean? |
| 17:15:08 | kergoth | thefly: OZ supports it though. has the modules and a package with the utisl |
| 17:15:22 | whardier | kergoth: damnit.. |
| 17:15:26 | whardier | I need a better cf card writer |
| 17:15:28 | thefly | ok but if i want it on zaurus? |
| 17:15:39 | thefly | i mean the official rom |
| 17:15:52 | kergoth | thefly: then build the modules and build th eutils and install them. |
| 17:16:08 | kergoth | thefly: the kernel sources are available. |
| 17:16:22 | | speedy2 was last seen on #zaurus 1 hours, 29 minutes and 55 seconds ago, saying: bbl all [Fri Jul 19 16:46:27 2002] |
| 17:16:22 | kergoth | ibot: seen speedy2? |
| 17:16:34 | thefly | kergoth: where are official rom's kernel source? |
| 17:16:40 | whardier | cvs |
| 17:16:46 | kergoth | thefly: http://more.sbc.co.jp/slj/index.asp |
| 17:16:51 | kergoth | re warmi |
| 17:16:55 | warmi | re |
| 17:16:56 | thefly | that's official source? |
| 17:17:02 | kergoth | JasonNJ: so you guys are working with cdm to get qnx ported eh? |
| 17:17:03 | whardier | fires a cold at warmi |
| 17:17:03 | kergoth | thefly: yes |
| 17:17:13 | thefly | ok |
| 17:17:19 | kergoth | thefly: thats the official developer site, from back when the 5000d came out. |
| 17:17:20 | JasonNJ | kergoth`home: yep |
| 17:17:26 | whardier | qnx would be interesting |
| 17:17:33 | warmi | whardier: thank you .. actually this is what I need |
| 17:17:45 | kergoth | JasonNJ: nifty. I've always liked that OS. |
| 17:17:57 | George- | http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1367852491 <--- if anyone wants to buy a camera =P |
| 17:18:03 | JasonNJ | its fast, if anything else |
| 17:18:24 | JasonNJ | ugh, I tried to sell my camera last week |
| 17:18:30 | kergoth | well, it'll be nice for niche apps |
| 17:18:32 | George- | kergoth: Ok I'm gonna flash my kernel on |
| 17:18:34 | JasonNJ | was a great deal and nobody bought it |
| 17:18:42 | kergoth | George-: k |
| 17:19:05 | kergoth | George-: I'm up to like 10 patches being applied to my sources prior to build, including the rmk and np patches. nuts |
| 17:20:04 | George- | man, I wanna upgrade the mem in my Z to 256M! :) |
| 17:20:42 | toolafial | does the zaurus use regular SDRAM? |
| 17:20:48 | George- | no |
| 17:20:50 | ljp_ | heh script for run all the patchs |
| 17:21:08 | toolafial | is it a special ram for the ARM platform? |
| 17:21:11 | George- | toolafial: It uses ram soldered on the m-board |
| 17:21:22 | George- | er, yes, it's SD ram, but it's not in a standard package |
| 17:21:28 | Neo|Work | Sniper: g'day |
| 17:21:32 | George- | ie - it isn't removable |
| 17:21:46 | toolafial | George- : yea, I realized that they were't dimm's in there |
| 17:21:51 | JasonNJ | yo homey. |
| 17:21:55 | George- | toolafial: haha |
| 17:21:55 | George- | ;) |
| 17:21:58 | Sniper | neo:hello |
| 17:22:11 | George- | Neo|Work: What's up with the discounts? :) |
| 17:22:17 | toolafial | my laptop takes micro dimm's and they are expensive |
| 17:22:21 | George- | Neo|Work: I'm tempted to buy SA |
| 17:22:24 | Neo|Work | George-: sale if you wish. :) trial oif you wish |
| 17:22:27 | br33zy | is a 1.2 meg program big? |
| 17:22:35 | George- | br33zy: yes |
| 17:22:35 | treke | br33zy: yes |
| 17:22:39 | Neo|Work | an experiment perhaps |
| 17:22:42 | br33zy | i see |
| 17:22:44 | George- | Neo|Work: trial? :) |
| 17:22:55 | Neo|Work | a test to see how lower prices work |
| 17:23:11 | br33zy | how about a 900k program? |
| 17:23:13 | George- | Neo|Work: at those prices, are you actually making a profit? :) |
| 17:23:20 | George- | br33zy: still pretty big |
| 17:23:25 | treke | br33zy: thats big too |
| 17:23:42 | br33zy | I mean |
| 17:23:54 | br33zy | 900k, with the binary, and the xpms and stuff |
| 17:24:03 | br33zy | is that big? |
| 17:24:13 | George- | oh shit |
| 17:24:14 | Neo|Work | George-: electronic distribution has it's benefits |
| 17:24:17 | treke | br33zy: yes thats still big |
| 17:24:19 | br33zy | binary is only about 100k |
| 17:24:28 | br33zy | warmi! |
| 17:24:39 | George- | Neo|Work: yeh, I suppose :) |
| 17:24:52 | Neo|Work | br33zy: to give you an idea, Rocket Elite will probably end up at about 5 MB |
| 17:24:53 | Neo|Work | or so |
| 17:25:01 | br33zy | Rocket Elite? |
| 17:25:02 | br33zy | whats that |
| 17:25:06 | treke | br33zy: I'd call anything under 400k in an ipkg fairly small |
| 17:25:15 | George- | heh |
| 17:25:22 | George- | my only Qtopia program is about 11K |
| 17:25:24 | George- | or something |
| 17:25:25 | | OK, Neo|Work. |
| 17:25:25 | Neo|Work | ibot rocketelite is http://eongames.com/games/re/ |
| 17:25:34 | | ...but rocketelite is http://eongames.com/games/re/... |
| 17:25:34 | Neo|Work | ibot rocketelite is als http://www.rocketelite.com/ |
| 17:25:38 | | okay, Neo|Work. |
| 17:25:38 | Neo|Work | ibot rocketelite is also http://www.rocketelite.com/ |
| 17:25:41 | | George-: i'm not following you... |
| 17:25:41 | George- | ibot rockelite sucks arse |
| 17:25:45 | George- | :) |
| 17:25:57 | treke | George-: kinda depends on what type of app it is. |
| 17:25:59 | George- | no, ibot rockelite sucks arse |
| 17:26:06 | Neo|Work | George-: have you tried it or are you just being anal? :P |
| 17:26:06 | Neo|Work | it rocks |
| 17:26:10 | George- | treke: unit converter |
| 17:26:16 | br33zy | hmm |
| 17:26:19 | George- | Neo|Work: I like fucking up bots :) |
| 17:26:21 | br33zy | rocketelite looks like xpilot |
| 17:26:30 | tboc | hmm, reminds me of roketz |
| 17:26:46 | br33zy | uh huh |
| 17:26:51 | | ibot's name is Billy |
| 17:26:51 | br33zy | ibot whats your name? |
| 17:26:58 | | i am "the" bot around |
| 17:26:58 | br33zy | ibot how old are you? |
| 17:27:00 | tboc | was freeware iirc ;) |
| 17:27:04 | | br33zy: what? |
| 17:27:04 | br33zy | ibot ya right |
| 17:27:07 | | wish i knew, br33zy |
| 17:27:07 | br33zy | ibot who? |
| 17:27:09 | JasonNJ | rocketelite is cool |
| 17:27:12 | | br33zy: i don't know |
| 17:27:12 | br33zy | ibot where? |
| 17:27:19 | | br33zy: sorry... |
| 17:27:19 | br33zy | ibot me either, thats why im asking you |
| 17:27:24 | George- | oh shit |
| 17:27:26 | | br33zy: huh? |
| 17:27:26 | br33zy | ibot you should be |
| 17:27:33 | JasonNJ | frickin hard to fly that little spaceship though |
| 17:27:34 | George- | I've just flashed on a kernel config, instead of the friggin' kernel |
| 17:27:34 | | br33zy: what? |
| 17:27:34 | br33zy | ibot yeah, you act like your innocent |
| 17:27:36 | George- | ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 17:27:38 | | br33zy: what? |
| 17:27:38 | br33zy | ibot sure |
| 17:27:46 | | br33zy: bugger all, i dunno |
| 17:27:46 | br33zy | ibot uh huh, thats what they all say |
| 17:27:50 | br33zy | lol |
| 17:27:59 | | br33zy: i haven't a clue |
| 17:27:59 | br33zy | ibot can you laugh? |
| 17:28:06 | br33zy | ;-) |
| 17:28:09 | br33zy | brb |
| 17:28:09 | | George-: sorry... |
| 17:28:09 | George- | ibot ahgfoad |
| 17:28:12 | George- | shit |
| 17:28:17 | George- | it doesn't work on infobot |
| 17:28:18 | George- | damn |
| 17:28:20 | George- | damn damn damn |
| 17:28:28 | br33zy | infobot? |
| 17:28:58 | | George-? |
| 17:28:58 | George- | ibot |
| 17:29:21 | BigBoss | Ogg Vorbis 1.0 is now finally out |
| 17:29:26 | George- | BigBoss: cool |
| 17:29:36 | George- | BigBoss: now go make an Ogg Vorbis player, and gimme it :) |
| 17:29:45 | JasonNJ | George-: he made one |
| 17:29:48 | JasonNJ | tkcplayer |
| 17:29:49 | jmhodges | hyea |
| 17:30:15 | George- | JasonNJ: damn :) |
| 17:30:25 | jmhodges | hey how do i get into my z with sftp/ftp with oz? something has changed in the setup? are there docs i can read? |
| 17:30:57 | ljp_ | yes.. there is a post on zauruszone in the openzaurus section about it |
| 17:31:37 | jmhodges | thanks ljp_ |
| 17:31:55 | ljp_ | sure |
| 17:33:17 | [DrEvil] | shit |
| 17:33:24 | [DrEvil] | opie is giving me a buss error |
| 17:33:25 | George- | JasonNJ: What do I do when my Z doesn't boot? :) |
| 17:33:29 | [DrEvil] | bus |
| 17:33:51 | JasonNJ | George-: even after a hard reset? |
| 17:34:07 | George- | JasonNJ: I just tried reflashing |
| 17:34:18 | JasonNJ | did you hard reset after you reflashed |
| 17:34:21 | George- | JasonNJ: first time I accidently flashed a kernel config on instead of an actual kernel |
| 17:34:24 | George- | JasonNJ: yes |
| 17:34:32 | George- | JasonNJ: then I flashed a proper kernel on |
| 17:34:33 | JasonNJ | did you flip the battery lock up |
| 17:34:37 | George- | yes |
| 17:34:47 | JasonNJ | try pulling the battery out |
| 17:34:50 | JasonNJ | and replacing it |
| 17:34:53 | George- | did that |
| 17:34:55 | George- | ok |
| 17:34:58 | George- | I'll replace it now |
| 17:36:01 | George- | hmm |
| 17:36:02 | George- | ok |
| 17:36:11 | George- | I'll flash it now with ROMIMAGE from the 113 update |
| 17:36:14 | George- | then I'll put OZ on |
| 17:36:25 | George- | I must have screwed something up when I flashed on a kernel config |
| 17:38:04 | George- | JasonNJ: Are the sharp rom updates "safe" in that they overwrite *all* the flash rom, and get rid of any artifacts that may reside in there? |
| 17:38:20 | JasonNJ | yes |
| 17:38:25 | George- | ok |
| 17:38:31 | George- | I'll flash a sharp ROM, then flash OZ :) |
| 17:39:17 | ljp_ | flashing oz is safer than flashing sharp rom, cause oz doesnt touch bootloader |
| 17:39:34 | ljp_ | make sure you also have bootflag.txt |
| 17:39:48 | George- | yes |
| 17:39:58 | George- | but Sharp ROM overwrites everything :) |
| 17:40:03 | George- | and it's got my damn Z booting again =P |
| 17:40:07 | JasonNJ | George-: one way of testing to see if the unit is in fact hosed is to see if you can go into diags mode |
| 17:40:17 | giminy | question, the zaurus uses eeprom for its flash right? |
| 17:40:18 | George- | diags mode? |
| 17:40:28 | JasonNJ | yes, hard reset button and p + d |
| 17:40:31 | KhensU_work | JasonNJ: did you ever figure out how to exit it? |
| 17:40:49 | JasonNJ | or was it s plus d |
| 17:40:50 | George- | JasonNJ: what does that do? |
| 17:40:52 | sjohnson | giminy: No it's flash memory. I't differnet technology |
| 17:40:52 | Speedy2 | giminy: Flash is a type of non-volatile memory |
| 17:40:58 | KhensU_work | d+p |
| 17:41:04 | JasonNJ | kensu: yeah you have to set it to boot os flag, and then hit hard reset |
| 17:41:36 | ljp_ | c + d I thought |
| 17:41:45 | George- | *WOW* |
| 17:41:47 | JasonNJ | ljp_: p + d fpr diags |
| 17:41:48 | [DrEvil] | what is the command to start opie from the command line? |
| 17:41:49 | George- | I never knew that :) |
| 17:41:49 | giminy | okay so it doesn't have the limited writes problems then? |
| 17:41:57 | ljp_ | oo |
| 17:42:00 | Speedy2 | giminy: It does. 1,000,000 on averagwe |
| 17:42:05 | giminy | like older flash roms you could only write to 10,000 times or so |
| 17:42:12 | Jerakeen | [DrEvil]: /etc/init.d/opie start shoudl do it. |
| 17:42:14 | sjohnson | Speedy2: No closers to 100,000 |
| 17:42:20 | Speedy2 | sjohnson: 1,000,000 on average. |
| 17:42:22 | JasonNJ | the only way to exit is to hard reset, so dont do it unless you want to lose ALL of your shit |
| 17:42:28 | ljp_ | thats complete erases |
| 17:42:31 | giminy | ah okay, thanks for the info |
| 17:42:50 | Speedy2 | And it depends what Flash you're talking about...NAND, NOR, CompactFlash, FlashROM chips, etc. |
| 17:42:57 | giminy | so pounding on a byte of flash is probably bad |
| 17:43:20 | George- | JasonNJ: that diags mode is nifty |
| 17:43:25 | George- | JasonNJ: now, what's the point in it? :) |
| 17:43:28 | JasonNJ | yes |
| 17:43:29 | Speedy2 | giminy: I don't think it's a good thing if it's avoidable |
| 17:43:29 | sjohnson | giminy: You ahve to erase an entire sector in order to write on byte |
| 17:43:34 | ljp_ | http://sources.redhat.com/jffs2/jffs2.pdf |
| 17:43:36 | [DrEvil] | crap |
| 17:43:46 | Speedy2 | George-: Well...how do you think Sharp tests units? |
| 17:43:48 | giminy | sjohnson: right |
| 17:43:49 | [DrEvil] | it's segfaulting |
| 17:45:19 | George- | I'm checking my flash |
| 17:45:27 | George- | can it tell me how many times I've written to flash? |
| 17:46:05 | Speedy2 | George-: I don't think so. |
| 17:46:08 | ljp_ | read that pdf |
| 17:46:08 | br33zy | be back ina while |
| 17:46:09 | whardier | who beeped? |
| 17:46:21 | whardier | I guess I did |
| 17:46:22 | whardier | doh |
| 17:46:25 | whardier | I hate beeping |
| 17:46:31 | ljp_ | you dont need to worry about writing to your flash too much. |
| 17:46:44 | ljp_ | beeped? |
| 17:47:13 | thefly | isn't official's kernel .config available? |
| 17:47:50 | ljp_ | in the kernel source from sharp |
| 17:47:57 | thefly | no |
| 17:47:59 | mtm | JasonNJ: Can you clarify something about the availability of Zaurus source code? |
| 17:48:00 | thefly | it isn't there |
| 17:48:06 | JasonNJ | mtm: shoot |
| 17:48:30 | George- | JasonNJ: is it ok to stop the "Ageing" tab in the middle by hitting full reset? |
| 17:48:46 | JasonNJ | George-: dunno, never tried it |
| 17:48:49 | George- | it's screwing around with my flash and my display and my RAM at the moment |
| 17:48:54 | ljp_ | thefly: yes it is |
| 17:48:57 | mtm | the "security bug" article on CNET last week said something about source not being available, and then earlier today you said "<JasonNJ> also, if we release source ..." |
| 17:49:04 | mtm | so, what source isn't available? |
| 17:49:13 | JasonNJ | mtm: the Sharp implementation of Qtopia |
| 17:49:13 | mtm | I see kernel source, qtopia source, etc. |
| 17:49:17 | bipolar | is anyone here using qpose? |
| 17:49:25 | JasonNJ | mtm: qtopia source from sharp is not avalaible |
| 17:49:27 | ljp_ | arch/arm/def-configs/collie |
| 17:49:31 | JasonNJ | Trolltech's qtopia is avalaible |
| 17:49:32 | mtm | how much different is that than regular qtopia? |
| 17:49:36 | JasonNJ | different enough |
| 17:49:39 | mtm | ok |
| 17:50:02 | mtm | has none of it been merged back? |
| 17:50:09 | darienm | bipolar: Yes, qpose is great |
| 17:50:10 | JasonNJ | that is correct |
| 17:50:13 | mtm | ok |
| 17:50:14 | mtm | thanks |
| 17:50:23 | darienm | bipolar: See my notes at http://zaurus.kruss.com/ |
| 17:50:23 | bipolar | darienm: I cant get it to work |
| 17:50:57 | darienm | bipolar: Catalin even put up a link to my instructions on climov.com last nite |
| 17:51:22 | George- | how do I get out of diags?! |
| 17:51:22 | bipolar | darienm: my problem is that it won't open a rom file. The rom works fine on my desktop |
| 17:51:27 | thefly | ljp_: it's called .config? |
| 17:51:39 | darienm | bipolar: where did you get your rom? I provide links to those also |
| 17:51:50 | Speedy2 | BTW, I've heard that Walmart vinyl material works perfectly as screen protector and is cheap too boot! |
| 17:51:56 | darienm | bipolar: really, read my instructions -- they are soup to nuts (whatever that means) |
| 17:51:57 | bipolar | darienm: I downloaded it from some site. |
| 17:52:05 | bipolar | darienm: I read them |
| 17:52:05 | ljp_ | thefly: it's arch/arm/def-configs/collie |
| 17:52:21 | thefly | ahh |
| 17:52:21 | thefly | tnx |
| 17:53:30 | darienm | bipolar: so what happens when you upload the rom to the Zaurus, does it show in the documents tab? with a custom icon? |
| 17:53:54 | bipolar | darienm: yes |
| 17:54:07 | darienm | bipolar: tapping on it launches qpose? |
| 17:54:13 | bipolar | darienm: when I click on it, it opens qpose and says: |
| 17:54:17 | Neo|Work | is QPose fast enough yet? |
| 17:54:40 | darienm | Neo|Work: fast enough for what? Yes for some things.. |
| 17:55:17 | bipolar | could not complete the operation becouse the emulator does not support the file you just draged into it's window |
| 17:55:28 | darienm | Speedy2: best screen protector at www.pdascreenprotectors.com |
| 17:55:45 | bipolar | darienm: but it's a IIIc ROM |
| 17:55:46 | darienm | bipolar: that's an odd one. which rom are you trying to use? |
| 17:55:46 | Neo|Work | darienm: to run PalmOS apps at "good enough" speed |
| 17:55:49 | Neo|Work | i.e usable speed |
| 17:55:54 | darienm | bipolar: Suggest you run the PalmM100.rom |
| 17:56:13 | bipolar | darienm: do you have one? |
| 17:56:15 | Speedy2 | darienm: I'm readnig your website, but $7/sheet is expensive |
| 17:56:26 | darienm | Neo|Work: different palm apps require different speed. The ePocrates medical database runs fine, as an example |
| 17:56:38 | darienm | bipolar: Theres a link on http://zaurus.kruss.com/software.php#10 |
| 17:56:54 | Speedy2 | What would be cool is if the Palm emulator became integrated into Qtopia... |
| 17:57:04 | Speedy2 | (integrated meaning you can run a Palm app seamlessly) |
| 17:57:30 | darienm | Speedy2: you only need one sheet of this kind of protector -- it doesnt seem to wear... |
| 17:58:08 | Speedy2 | darienm: You haven't had it for a year...in a year's time it will wear... |
| 17:58:34 | darienm | Speedy2: and $7 for a year, or even $7 for 6 months is expensive for the protection it provides? |
| 17:58:36 | bipolar | darienm: I'll try it with that rom.... |
| 17:58:50 | darienm | bipolar: are you using swap space also? |
| 17:59:04 | Neo|Work | I can't for the life of me put on one of those screen protectors |
| 17:59:15 | Neo|Work | they get all bubbly, uneaven etc |
| 17:59:17 | Neo|Work | so I gave up |
| 17:59:18 | darienm | that brand, in particular? |
| 17:59:43 | kergoth | hey Speedy2 |
| 17:59:44 | kergoth | how goes it |
| 17:59:54 | Speedy2 | Hi kergoth |
| 18:00:00 | bipolar | darienm: no. I've got Openzaurus set to a 42/12 memory split |
| 18:00:01 | Speedy2 | You missed the firefight, that's all : |
| 18:00:01 | kergoth | mcp doesnt like me |
| 18:00:02 | Speedy2 | :) |
| 18:00:10 | Speedy2 | kergoth: Did you get in trouble at work |
| 18:00:12 | darienm | bipolar: ooohh, nice |
| 18:00:13 | kergoth | Speedy2: hehe. i mulled it over before i went to work.. |
| 18:00:16 | Speedy2 | kergoth`home: mcp ?? |
| 18:00:18 | kergoth | Speedy2: yeah a bit.. oh well |
| 18:00:23 | benmeyer | ljp_: got the wait curser in the tab widget with downloading |
| 18:00:24 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 18:00:25 | Speedy2 | kergoth: Mulled what over? |
| 18:00:30 | kergoth | Speedy2: the argumetns |
| 18:00:36 | Speedy2 | kergoth: And? |
| 18:00:53 | darienm | bipolar: some roms are different -- little endian vs big endian. Not sure of the implications, but it affects compatibility apparently |
| 18:01:10 | kergoth | Speedy2: well personally I wouldnt say linux is better than anything else in the embedded space, but thats because I've never seen or used other embedded OS's, so I have no knokwledge with which to compare. |
| 18:01:13 | Speedy2 | Big endian / little endian refers to byte ordering. =) |
| 18:01:26 | Speedy2 | kergoth: That's a safe path to take :) |
| 18:01:29 | kergoth | Speedy2: yeah mcp, i'm speaking to the tc35143af .. getting timeouts |
| 18:01:31 | George- | darienm: I'd take off that comment about you not having had any PDAs before the Z on that site |
| 18:01:31 | kergoth | Speedy2: true that. |
| 18:01:42 | darienm | George-: why is that? |
| 18:01:44 | Speedy2 | kergoth: Hrm, that sux. Is MCP properly initialized? |
| 18:01:53 | George- | darienm: cos some clever person could look, see that you have QPose running, and that you don't have a Palm Pilot, and go schitz :) |
| 18:02:05 | Speedy2 | George-: Agreed! |
| 18:02:20 | George- | Speedy2: ? |
| 18:02:21 | Speedy2 | darienm: Say that you were given a Palm, but never used it. |
| 18:02:29 | George- | Speedy2: hahaha |
| 18:02:34 | kergoth | Speedy2: I believe so. I'm relying on the existing mcp code, and currently I'm going through it ensuring its doing what it should. it sets MXE, it sents it to external clock via GPIO21, which is what i want.. everything seems good.. i'm thinking that the LoCoMo may not be providing the clock as it should. |
| 18:02:34 | Speedy2 | George-: That saying I had no PDA but running Palm emu would get you in trouble |
| 18:02:35 | treke | well he could be in the palm developer program |
| 18:02:38 | darienm | George-: My father owns 2 palm devices, one he uses and the other is broke in a drawer. |
| 18:02:48 | darienm | George-: I can show it to anyone who wants to see it |
| 18:02:54 | George- | darienm: ahh, ok :) |
| 18:02:55 | bipolar | darienm: that rom does not work either |
| 18:03:00 | treke | Which gives you a legitimate reason to run palm emulator |
| 18:03:02 | Speedy2 | kergoth: Hrm...can you probe the pin with scope to see if clocks are coming? |
| 18:03:02 | George- | darienm: is that an m100? :) |
| 18:03:05 | Speedy2 | heh |
| 18:03:19 | kergoth | Speedy2: hm, good idea, too bad I've got jack for equipment for such things. |
| 18:03:23 | kergoth | Speedy2: :-) |
| 18:03:24 | darienm | treke: Yeah - I like that answer too, in the palm developer program |
| 18:03:32 | kergoth | Speedy2: so i'm just going to go over my code and compare to the code in 2.4.6, which i knkow works. |
| 18:03:33 | Speedy2 | kergoth: Hrm, I'll try in a few days, but I suspect you want something faster. |
| 18:03:42 | treke | darienm: Plus you get to download roms from a reliable source :) |
| 18:03:57 | darienm | treke: My source is reliable |
| 18:03:59 | Speedy2 | kergoth: When it doubt, just write all FlashROM to 0 and say that you're ready to start over. |
| 18:04:06 | bipolar | pwd |
| 18:04:10 | bipolar | focus! |
| 18:04:17 | treke | darienm: Reliable as in easy to find without hunting :) |
| 18:04:18 | darienm | bipolar: I know that rom works, there must be something else |
| 18:04:25 | kergoth | Speedy2: heh. hey i got the lcd power up and framebuffer working in 2.5.21-rmk1-cl1 :-) |
| 18:04:32 | kergoth | s/power/powered/ |
| 18:04:38 | Speedy2 | kergoth: That's awesome. I'll get that code from you soon. |
| 18:04:43 | Speedy2 | cl1 =) |
| 18:04:47 | Speedy2 | That must make you proud |
| 18:05:20 | bipolar | darienm: is there a pose config file somewhere? |
| 18:05:26 | kergoth | Speedy2: trying to glean some sanity from the hacks in the code is interesting |
| 18:05:33 | darienm | bipolar: yes there is |
| 18:05:37 | kergoth | Speedy2: trying to remove the gross hacks and reduce it to something simple and clean |
| 18:05:40 | darienm | bipolar: getting path.... |
| 18:05:43 | bipolar | darienm: k |
| 18:06:18 | darienm | bipolar: in /home/root/ there is the .poserc directory |
| 18:06:29 | darienm | bipolar: er, file |
| 18:06:34 | noidd | kergoth: problem with removing bugs from code is that there usually isn't anything left but whitespace. |
| 18:06:40 | kergoth | gah I need better filters and shit for managing linux-kernel. i'm 679 messages behind |
| 18:06:43 | kergoth | noidd: hah |
| 18:06:50 | darienm | bipolar: maybe you should nuke that, or resintall, or both |
| 18:07:11 | noidd | good evening all btw :-) |
| 18:07:37 | Speedy2 | kergoth: The Source Navigator is a good tool for messing with kernel |
| 18:07:54 | Speedy2 | It at least lets you have some kind of grasp of what's going on. |
| 18:07:58 | kergoth | Speedy2: i meant the ML :) |
| 18:08:03 | Speedy2 | hah! |
| 18:08:15 | kergoth | Speedy2: but ill play with source navigator. that on redhat's site right? |
| 18:08:15 | Speedy2 | You're surprised to find ugly hacks in the kernel code?? |
| 18:08:23 | kergoth | hah, no, not surprised |
| 18:08:25 | | contest is http://www.zaurus.com/dev/challenge/ |
| 18:08:25 | darienm | ibot, contest |
| 18:08:27 | Speedy2 | kergoth: Not anymore, it's on Sourceforge |
| 18:08:32 | kergoth | Speedy2: oh cool |
| 18:09:03 | kergoth | Speedy2: maybe that'll help me spend less time trying to understand how everything fits together. that tends to occupy most of my time |
| 18:09:10 | Speedy2 | Yeah, totally |
| 18:09:15 | Speedy2 | I used it when I was kernel hacking |
| 18:09:20 | Speedy2 | hacking/porting |
| 18:09:22 | bipolar | darienm: I rm'ed the file and tried again. same deal |
| 18:09:40 | kergoth | Speedy2: sweet. if i can reduce that time i can spend more actually doing something productive |
| 18:09:40 | darienm | bipolar: you have the most recent qpose? |
| 18:09:52 | numatrix | Sniper: you around? |
| 18:09:59 | bipolar | darienm: I just downloaded it again |
| 18:10:14 | bipolar | qpose-bin_3.5-0.2-1_arm.ipk |
| 18:10:54 | darienm | bipolar: hrm.. your rom file has the custom icon, so its in /Documents/applications/x-rom and is named PalmM100.ROM ? |
| 18:11:06 | darienm | bipolar: yes, I'm reaching a bit here.. |
| 18:11:17 | darienm | bipolar: I wonder if its an OZ issue. |
| 18:11:22 | George- | wth is the intentOS amiga thing? |
| 18:11:48 | NetAmp | what the name already says ;) |
| 18:12:04 | ApoXX | Anyone know what's up with TheKompany's jabber server? |
| 18:12:12 | ApoXX | points at BigBoss |
| 18:12:18 | bipolar | darienm: I don't see how.... qpose des run. |
| 18:12:23 | bipolar | shit |
| 18:12:47 | bipolar | it just started working.... :\ |
| 18:13:05 | thefly | isn't there a way to test a kernel-rom-image without upgrading zaurus' kernel rom? |
| 18:13:05 | darienm | bipolar: it takes a while to get going.... up to a minute or two the first time |
| 18:13:05 | George- | NetAmp: ? |
| 18:13:18 | darienm | bipolar: did you get the error this time as well? |
| 18:13:19 | NetAmp | George: running amiga stuff :) |
| 18:13:39 | bipolar | darienm: nope. I think I know the problem. |
| 18:13:46 | bipolar | darienm: well, one of them, anyway |
| 18:13:55 | Speedy2 | thefly: Not at the moment |
| 18:13:56 | darienm | bipolar: do share |
| 18:14:06 | Speedy2 | thefly: Technically it's very possible, but ... |
| 18:14:21 | NetAmp | George: huh seems like it's java though... http://sl.yunimo.com/SL/SL-5000D/index.html |
| 18:14:25 | bipolar | darienm: if you have the rom image as a LINK to the documents folder, it tries to open the .desktop file instead of the acutal rom image. |
| 18:14:43 | thefly | i understand |
| 18:14:56 | thefly | but i will never change the official rom with a testing rom on my 5500 |
| 18:15:03 | kergoth | Speedy2: whats he want to do, boot a zImage off cf? |
| 18:15:13 | Speedy2 | kergoth: More than likely |
| 18:15:17 | kergoth | ah |
| 18:15:21 | Speedy2 | Which is not hard, the kernel gets copied to the same spot |
| 18:15:22 | kergoth | we need a new bootloader :-) |
| 18:15:24 | kergoth | yeah |
| 18:15:25 | Speedy2 | yes |
| 18:15:29 | Speedy2 | kergoth: I know, I know! |
| 18:16:01 | kergoth | hehe |
| 18:16:03 | NetAmp | thefly: neither will I ;) |
| 18:20:18 | kergoth | wonders if his boss would mind if he documents 2 hours of time to going through lkml in his time tracking |
| 18:20:21 | kergoth | hehe |
| 18:21:52 | treke | kergoth: probably not a great idea if you were 3 hours late :) |
| 18:22:58 | bipolar | well.. it woeks but it's damned slow |
| 18:23:30 | kergoth | treke: true that ;-) |
| 18:23:42 | kergoth | treke: man, thatd make it.. 3 hours of actual real work |
| 18:23:43 | kergoth | hehe |
| 18:24:06 | kergoth | treke: that reminds me of office space.. "Yeah Bob, I'd say I only do about 15 minutes of actual real work in a day." |
| 18:24:56 | treke | hehe |
| 18:25:15 | whardier | aaah |
| 18:25:16 | whardier | clean! |
| 18:26:53 | kergoth | whardier: ? |
| 18:27:19 | bipolar | darienm: thanks for the help! I just hope that qpose gets faster so that it's more useable... |
| 18:27:26 | kergoth | mman, reading lkml makes me wish I understood VM better |
| 18:27:35 | darienm | bipolar: catalin says its being actively developed |
| 18:27:36 | bipolar | darienm: BTW... can you beam/recieve from qpose? |
| 18:27:47 | darienm | bipolar: there is no connection to the IR yet |
| 18:27:51 | bipolar | darienm: ok. |
| 18:28:00 | kergoth | whew, down to 488 messages |
| 18:28:02 | kergoth | still going.. |
| 18:28:03 | darienm | bipolar: but you can receive from your native Zaurus |
| 18:28:08 | bipolar | darienm: yeah |
| 18:28:36 | bipolar | darienm: now if the addressbook/todo/etc were linked to the Zaurus, hat would rock |
| 18:29:13 | darienm | bipolar: that would not be hard (address, that is - calendar is a bitch) |
| 18:30:01 | whardier | my neighbors are probably sick of me singing in the shower |
| 18:30:05 | kergoth | hah |
| 18:30:09 | kergoth | you must sing loud |
| 18:30:13 | whardier | that I do! |
| 18:30:31 | whardier | is happy |
| 18:30:36 | kergoth | bk rules |
| 18:30:40 | kergoth | whardier: its friday. |
| 18:30:43 | kergoth | !! |
| 18:30:44 | whardier | woot |
| 18:30:44 | kergoth | heh |
| 18:30:47 | whardier | time to call the ex |
| 18:30:52 | kergoth | whardier: i see a penguin. |
| 18:31:01 | kergoth | whardier: lcd poweredd up in 2.5.x :-) |
| 18:31:02 | whardier | dude |
| 18:31:04 | whardier | you suck at I spy |
| 18:31:08 | kergoth | hah |
| 18:31:15 | kergoth | i see something black and white |
| 18:31:20 | whardier | hmm |
| 18:31:23 | kergoth | i see water. i drink water. |
| 18:31:24 | whardier | is it a penguin! |
| 18:31:28 | kergoth | hey you got it! |
| 18:31:29 | kergoth | you're good |
| 18:31:31 | whardier | woot! |
| 18:31:41 | whardier | ok |
| 18:31:46 | whardier | so you are using the defacto boot logo |
| 18:32:07 | whardier | we should split tux in half and put a keyboard in the middle |
| 18:32:16 | NetAmp | noooo |
| 18:32:22 | NetAmp | you cannot split tux! |
| 18:32:28 | NetAmp | that would start a religious war! |
| 18:32:30 | whardier | hah |
| 18:32:34 | NetAmp | ;) |
| 18:32:37 | whardier | WHERE ARE MY DAMN EMAILS |
| 18:32:39 | treke | find a way to blend tux and pinguzaurii |
| 18:32:44 | NetAmp | hehe |
| 18:32:44 | whardier | blend? |
| 18:32:52 | NetAmp | half/half or a mix |
| 18:32:58 | treke | I dunno merge. do something funky |
| 18:32:59 | whardier | dalmation pingizauru |
| 18:33:03 | NetAmp | *lol* |
| 18:33:04 | kergoth | treke: bah, pingizauru is a godzilla penguin. he's already a penguin for gods sake |
| 18:33:07 | NetAmp | with a beak |
| 18:33:11 | kergoth | i see something green |
| 18:33:12 | treke | I aint no freaking artist |
| 18:33:12 | whardier | that breathes fire |
| 18:33:29 | treke | maybe draw pingizauru sitting like tux |
| 18:33:32 | whardier | I want my clothes to be dry |
| 18:33:39 | kergoth | whardier: today i came into work 3 hours late because i overslept, then spent hours going through lkml instead of working |
| 18:33:39 | whardier | the kitties are mocking me in my undees |
| 18:33:42 | JasonNJ | pingizaru is not tux! |
| 18:33:44 | kergoth | whardier: i'm gonna get canned :-\ |
| 18:33:50 | kergoth | heheh |
| 18:33:52 | whardier | kergoth: we had a lan party last night |
| 18:33:55 | kergoth | whardier: nice |
| 18:33:57 | whardier | most everybody came in 3 hours late here |
| 18:33:59 | benmeyer | anyone have gdb for the z? |
| 18:34:00 | kergoth | i havent had one of those in a long ass time |
| 18:34:03 | whardier | hah |
| 18:34:03 | whardier | well |
| 18:34:07 | whardier | we played Armagetron for 5 hours |
| 18:34:08 | kergoth | benmeyer: steal it from teh skiffs |
| 18:34:12 | whardier | that hurt |
| 18:34:15 | benmeyer | the skiffs? |
| 18:34:20 | | well, skiffcluster is at http://handhelds.org/projects/skiffcluster.html |
| 18:34:20 | kergoth | ibot: skiffcluster? |
| 18:34:22 | whardier | then Ihad to hitch a ride home with a new armagetron addict |
| 18:34:26 | whardier | he forgot how to drive normally |
| 18:34:34 | kergoth | benmeyer: a set of native arm machines for compilation |
| 18:34:39 | treke | benmeyer: or steal the package from familiar |
| 18:34:42 | kergoth | yeah that too |
| 18:34:46 | kergoth | or debian's arm tree |
| 18:35:09 | kergoth | whardier: he forgot how to drive normally? i hate that |
| 18:35:41 | George- | whardier: haha |
| 18:35:51 | NetAmp | lol |
| 18:36:56 | benmeyer | cool |
| 18:36:58 | benmeyer | got it |
| 18:37:08 | benmeyer | bla need libncurses |
| 18:38:10 | krow | What is a good package server to pull from? |
| 18:38:24 | benmeyer | zz/feed |
| 18:39:42 | wildwildwes | I got a zaurus yesterday and I have a couple questions |
| 18:40:04 | darienm | wildwildwes: we have answers, they may not be correct, but we'll throw them at you. |
| 18:40:10 | wildwildwes | thanks |
| 18:40:21 | wildwildwes | Is there anything in the kernel that's proprietary or patched? |
| 18:40:36 | darienm | There are many kernels to choose from. |
| 18:40:50 | darienm | some are proprietary, some are patched. You have a choice. |
| 18:41:09 | kergoth | grr |
| 18:41:10 | toolafial | isn't the only proprietary stuff the SD stuff? |
| 18:41:10 | kergoth | get: can't plock arch/arm/tools/mach-types |
| 18:41:15 | wildwildwes | i guess what i mean to ask is if there's anything that would be unsupported if I were to compile my own |
| 18:41:34 | darienm | ahh, you want to talk to the kernel hackers in the crowd. |
| 18:42:18 | toolafial | One thing you will lose is SD card support |
| 18:42:23 | Jerakeen | wildwildwes: I think it's only the SD stuff. |
| 18:42:34 | wildwildwes | if the SD is proprietary, would an mmc card still work? |
| 18:42:44 | kergoth | wildwildwes what do ya need? you can build the kernel and make the original sd binary module still load. |
| 18:42:45 | wildwildwes | from what i've seen they're a little cheaper anyway |
| 18:42:55 | kergoth | wildwildwes mmc would work, but the open source mmc driver hasnt been ported to the Zaurus yet |
| 18:43:09 | Jerakeen | wildwildwes: (that's a no. :-) ) |
| 18:43:14 | George- | kergoth: y'know that mem=32M problem? |
| 18:43:32 | George- | kergoth: well, on Beta 10.4, with my own home-brewed kernel, it doesn't work |
| 18:43:42 | benmeyer | dammm gdb is a memory hog |
| 18:43:42 | George- | kergoth: but it worked with exactly this kernel on Beta 10 |
| 18:44:16 | wildwildwes | i think i read that you should use the wireless stuff with a kernel > 2.4.16 |
| 18:44:35 | kergoth | George- something must've changed in the filesystem.. i didnt think so |
| 18:44:36 | wildwildwes | ideally i'd like to use the cf slot for 802.11b and the sd/mmc slot for storage |
| 18:44:38 | noidd | anyone here use the skiffcluster to compile? i seem to be having build environment issues :-P |
| 18:44:46 | kergoth | wildwildwes: well 2.4.16 has a newer version of wireless extensions |
| 18:44:55 | kergoth | wildwildwes: the Z uses 2.4.6-rmk1-np2-embedix |
| 18:45:25 | wildwildwes | hmm |
| 18:45:28 | Jerakeen | kergoth: were you getting the SD modules compiled against a newer 2.4 at some point? |
| 18:46:00 | kergoth | Jerakeen: tim riker at lineo has committed to producing me a new binary module |
| 18:46:28 | noidd | kergoth: with the timing fix?? :-) |
| 18:46:50 | kergoth | noidd: i wish, i dont think they're done with that yet |
| 18:47:05 | noidd | kergoth: its a lineo as opposed to sharp problem then? |
| 18:47:08 | kergoth | noidd: I'll port the mmc driver for those with mmc cards who want to run totally open source |
| 18:47:16 | kergoth | noidd: i dont know who's hands the problem lies. ask jason |
| 18:47:24 | kergoth | s/who's/in who's/ |
| 18:47:38 | noidd | kergoth: this is a silly question - but dont SD cards run with mmc drivers - just slower? |
| 18:47:42 | NetAmp | damn battery status, it jumped from "good" to "low" :S |
| 18:47:47 | krow | benmeyer: What is the URL for zz/feed? |
| 18:47:52 | wildwildwes | so the SD module would load with a regular kernel? |
| 18:47:55 | | well, feed is a package repository or http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/IpkgFeeds or http://www.zauruszone.com/feed/ or http://openzaurus.sf.net/feeds/3.0/ for OpenZaurus |
| 18:47:55 | NetAmp | ibot: feed |
| 18:48:14 | treke | noidd: No, sd wont rung with mmc drivers |
| 18:48:29 | noidd | :-( shame. |
| 18:48:30 | kergoth | wildwildwes: what do you mean regular? you'd compile the existing kernel sources from sharp. the existing binary module will work with it |
| 18:48:35 | noidd | thought that was asking too much :-) |
| 18:48:39 | kergoth | hehe |
| 18:49:00 | kergoth | hmmm s/[patch]*//gi; |
| 18:49:10 | kergoth | that ought to shrink my lkml messages some |
| 18:49:16 | Jerakeen | kergoth: t'other question I had was the apm - is the 0%/10%/80%/100% steps I'm getting a hardware limit or a software thing? |
| 18:49:18 | kergoth | i dont have time to look through all the damn patches |
| 18:49:28 | kergoth | Jerakeen: not certain. i know for a fact the driver locks you down to those |
| 18:49:28 | wildwildwes | i was under the impression that the source for the sd module was unavailable |
| 18:49:42 | kergoth | Jerakeen: i dont, however, know if the hardware is ALSO limited in that manner |
| 18:49:52 | Jerakeen | kergoth: I had a thinkpad for which I got that, and that was a hardwar issue - the battery just doesn't report it.. |
| 18:50:02 | kergoth | wildwildwes: it isnt. you arent listening. if you build a kernel with the sharp kernel sources minus the sd driver, the existing BINARY sd module will load into your kernel |
| 18:50:15 | kergoth | Jerakeen: we'll find out when i remove the driver limitation. |
| 18:50:20 | kergoth | Jerakeen: which should be soon |
| 18:50:41 | Jerakeen | But it's the MMC thing that's annoying now. With that working, I'll be a most happy bunny. the 5000D just doesn't have enough memory for me to be relying on a ramdisk like this. |
| 18:53:56 | kergoth | Jerakeen: the mmc support isnt working? |
| 18:54:41 | sjohnson | kergoth: Some MMC cards are un mounted after a resume |
| 18:55:23 | Jerakeen | kergoth: Yeah, its the corruption thing. |
| 18:55:40 | whardier | <Galen> it's always nice then the boss looks around, smiles, laughs, and says, "you guys are fucked" |
| 18:55:40 | whardier | <Galen> he said this becasue 3 out of the 6 programmers will be on vacation at the same time |
| 18:55:40 | whardier | <Galen> of course it was he who authorized this in the first place. he just wasn't checking his calendar when he did so |
| 18:55:56 | whardier | thats funny |
| 18:57:11 | XavierXeon | whardier: were's that quote from ? |
| 18:57:53 | toolafial | my boss just got layed off |
| 18:58:04 | BigBoss | does that make you happy or sad? |
| 18:58:12 | toolafial | I don't know |
| 18:58:20 | wildwildwes | kergoth: thanks, but i'm a little confused -- i would expect that the SD driver will work with the sharp kernel, but what I meant to ask is whether it will work with a new kernel -- say 2.4.18? |
| 18:58:21 | toolafial | I'm leaving in the middle of august |
| 18:58:39 | toolafial | so I don't really care that much |
| 18:58:43 | toolafial | I just think it's funny |
| 18:58:57 | toolafial | now, who's my boss? is the question I find myself asking |
| 19:00:32 | BigBoss | now's the time to fart around while everyone is confused |
| 19:00:34 | Jerakeen | wildwildwes: I think it won't, otherwise I assume we'd be using a later kernel now. |
| 19:00:37 | XavierXeon | will watch "requiem for a dream" |
| 19:00:37 | Neo|Work | Obligatory super-goodlooking girl photo: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&u=/020718/170/1vfn3.html&e=6&ncid=707 |
| 19:00:47 | Neo|Work | and no, it's not a naked homo spiderman |
| 19:01:38 | XavierXeon | Neo|Work: hey you can look at the pic without feeling sick ! |
| 19:01:41 | warmi | no frigging fat spiderman this time ? |
| 19:01:41 | jmhodges | hrm.. cant find that sftp mention in zauruszone |
| 19:02:04 | jmhodges | is happy hes never seen it.. |
| 19:02:17 | roue | hi folks |
| 19:02:40 | Neo|Work | warmi: definitely anything but |
| 19:02:48 | roue | any solutions to the document tab billions of files on my cf and they all show up problem? |
| 19:03:09 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: what is the required setup for sftp? what port i should say? |
| 19:03:30 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: linux pc ? |
| 19:03:45 | jmhodges | yeah XavierXeon |
| 19:04:04 | XavierXeon | sftp://root@[ip_of_zaurus] |
| 19:04:09 | XavierXeon | should work |
| 19:04:11 | kergoth | wildwildwes: I'm porting the zaurus stuff to a newer kernel noww. |
| 19:04:16 | kergoth | wildwildwes: until i'm done, no |
| 19:04:24 | jmhodges | ack ok thanks XavierXeon |
| 19:04:46 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: hang on thats konqueror |
| 19:04:48 | wildwildwes | kergoth: thanks |
| 19:04:58 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: right |
| 19:05:08 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: i was hoping for a cli :/ |
| 19:05:15 | kergoth | jmhodges: sftp root@ip; |
| 19:05:20 | kergoth | thats all |
| 19:05:21 | kergoth | heh |
| 19:05:22 | jmhodges | dammit i did that |
| 19:05:24 | jmhodges | fuck |
| 19:05:29 | kergoth | well thats the correct syntax |
| 19:05:36 | jmhodges | do i need to run that sftp-server prog? |
| 19:05:45 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: tried nmap on the ip of the Z? |
| 19:05:45 | jmhodges | if so what args do i need to give? |
| 19:05:48 | jmhodges | yeah |
| 19:05:49 | kergoth | i dunno, i never use sftp, i use scp |
| 19:05:54 | jmhodges | ... |
| 19:06:01 | jmhodges | dunno the difference i gusess |
| 19:06:10 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: sftp automatically gets executed by sshd |
| 19:06:25 | jmhodges | Port State Service |
| 19:06:25 | jmhodges | 9/tcp open discard |
| 19:06:25 | jmhodges | 13/tcp open daytime |
| 19:06:25 | jmhodges | 22/tcp open ssh |
| 19:06:25 | jmhodges | 37/tcp open time |
| 19:06:29 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: thats what i thought |
| 19:07:17 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: just rebboting z. will try then |
| 19:07:24 | jmhodges | dammit i did that too.. fsck |
| 19:07:26 | jmhodges | :) |
| 19:07:31 | jmhodges | ill give it another go |
| 19:07:50 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: sorry. I am rebooting my Z now |
| 19:08:10 | jmhodges | no problem XavierXeon :) |
| 19:08:29 | jmhodges | im just grateful i get any help after i ask so many bad bad questions in here :P |
| 19:08:51 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: works for me. can you ssh to the Z ? |
| 19:08:55 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: yep |
| 19:10:24 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: is there a sftp-server file on the Z ? |
| 19:10:28 | jmhodges | yes XavierXeon |
| 19:10:31 | jmhodges | in /usr/sbin |
| 19:10:34 | jmhodges | heres the error |
| 19:10:36 | jmhodges | sftp root@192.168.129.201 |
| 19:10:36 | jmhodges | Connecting to 192.168.129.201... |
| 19:10:36 | jmhodges | Request for subsystem 'sftp' failed on channel 0 |
| 19:10:36 | jmhodges | Couldn't read packet: Connection reset by peer |
| 19:10:44 | George- | atd is what is needed to keep time between sleeps, right? |
| 19:10:54 | JasonNJ | this worldcom stuff is very bad mojo |
| 19:11:07 | MickeyL | George-: yes |
| 19:11:17 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: have you tries scp ? |
| 19:11:28 | George- | MickeyL: and to allow the alarm clock to wake up the computer for alarms? |
| 19:11:36 | noidd | JasonNJ: yes, but at 0.02$ a share, its worth risking 100$ :-) |
| 19:12:09 | MickeyL | George-: dunno. Didn't have this working here yet. It's maybe an Opie problem. |
| 19:12:10 | JasonNJ | I'm not referrign to the state of the stock |
| 19:12:18 | JasonNJ | I'm referring to the net infrastructure |
| 19:12:19 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: no |
| 19:12:22 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: not yet |
| 19:12:39 | George- | kergoth: ping |
| 19:12:56 | XavierXeon | try it ! |
| 19:13:12 | kergoth | George-: yes atd is needed. the atd postinst script creates the symlinks to make it boot on rebooot. |
| 19:13:35 | JasonNJ | I mean, wcom moves 50 percent of the nets traffic |
| 19:13:47 | JasonNJ | if nobody comes forward to buy its assets thats a bad, bad problem |
| 19:13:48 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: that works |
| 19:13:57 | George- | kergoth: ahh, cool |
| 19:14:11 | George- | kergoth: and, er, what's that command line that you said to do all the postinsts? |
| 19:14:12 | nadav | ][JasonNJ][ Indeed. |
| 19:14:20 | George- | kergoth: because the 32M kernel is borked |
| 19:14:22 | nadav | eek, nick comp.? |
| 19:14:36 | MickeyL | kergoth: how does this work? what symlinks are called upon resume? |
| 19:15:24 | jmhodges | ok so whats up with sftp? |
| 19:15:31 | XavierXeon | is googling sfto error message |
| 19:15:43 | jmhodges | oh whoops coulda done that XavierXeon :/ |
| 19:16:35 | Neo|Work | sugar quote wcome |
| 19:16:35 | Sugar | Neo|Work: WCOME @ 4:21pm: 0.107 (+0.017 +18.89%) Bid: +0.017 Ask: +18.89% |
| 19:18:30 | kergoth | MickeyL: hmm/ |
| 19:18:34 | kergoth | MickeyL: what symlinks? |
| 19:18:50 | kergoth | George-: for i in /usr/lib/ipkg/info/*postinst*; do sh $i configure; done; |
| 19:19:26 | MickeyL | kergoth_: ok, not 'what symlinks', but what apps or scripts are called on resume? |
| 19:19:29 | George- | kergoth: thanks |
| 19:20:04 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: sftp needs line "sftp 115/tcp" in /etc/services |
| 19:20:13 | Sniper | has anyone tried the J2ME CDC implemetation? |
| 19:20:18 | kergoth | MickeyL: none |
| 19:20:25 | kergoth | MickeyL: unlike the ipaq there are no resume/suspend scripts. |
| 19:20:35 | kergoth | MickeyL: obviously hotplug is called for hotplug'd stuff |
| 19:20:44 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: ah ok then .. |
| 19:20:57 | MickeyL | kergoth: hmm... so how does Opies "today" work then on Zaurus? |
| 19:21:00 | Sniper | http://wwws.sun.com/software/communitysource/j2me/cdc/download.html ? anyone? anyone? |
| 19:21:08 | jmhodges | is that a bug? im guessing the rom contains it but not when i do and ipkg upgrade :| |
| 19:21:40 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: don't know i am currently using sharp rom again |
| 19:23:29 | toolafial | MickeyL : yea I use opie today on my zaurus rom |
| 19:24:00 | warmi | NeoWork: I just got another check from Handango |
| 19:24:00 | toolafial | but it doesn't come up automatically after a resume |
| 19:24:03 | jmhodges_ | dammit |
| 19:24:05 | warmi | if you care |
| 19:24:08 | jmhodges_ | usb-uchi sucks :) |
| 19:24:09 | kergoth | MickeyL: it registers a callback in the opie launcher. |
| 19:24:42 | MickeyL | kergoth: and how does the opie launcher 'know' that he is just beeing resumed? |
| 19:24:56 | kergoth | MickeyL: not certain. check the launcher code :-) |
| 19:25:00 | XavierXeon | its magic |
| 19:25:08 | MickeyL | kergoth_: ok :) |
| 19:25:11 | kergoth | XavierXeon: if that services line isnt in there in the latest i'll add it. thanks |
| 19:27:30 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: yeah |
| 19:27:36 | jmhodges | dammit that line is already there! |
| 19:27:42 | jmhodges | fsck |
| 19:27:42 | jmhodges | thinks |
| 19:32:07 | XavierXeon | jmhodges: have you tried ftp the way ljp described on ZZ ? |
| 19:32:34 | kergoth | sticks to scp |
| 19:32:56 | jmhodges | XavierXeon: i couldnt find that info.. the most i found in the forums (the only oz part i could find) was you saying to use sftp :/ |
| 19:33:36 | warmi | crap I missed end of that heated Linux vs other embedded system discussion this morning |
| 19:33:37 | XavierXeon | http://www.zauruszone.farplanet.net/invboard/index.php?act=ST&f=11&t=2153&s=c445a05c1e93cd71d80f398b29f11c8e |
| 19:34:00 | nadav | warmi: hm? |
| 19:34:25 | | netamp was last seen on #zaurus 46 minutes and 30 seconds ago, saying: ibot: feed [Fri Jul 19 19:47:55 2002] |
| 19:34:25 | nadav | ibot seen netamp |
| 19:34:30 | warmi | Speedy2 and JasonNJ were arguing about merits of using Linux as an OS for a PDA device |
| 19:34:31 | jmhodges | thanks XavierXeon |
| 19:34:35 | Neo|Work | Sniper: what is the fascination with Java anyway? That people can write for PPC and Zaurus would get it for free? |
| 19:34:45 | NetAmp | I miss the good old DOS times *sigh* |
| 19:34:48 | Neo|Work | I am too interested in seeing QNX on it though |
| 19:34:51 | nadav | warmi: ah |
| 19:34:51 | Neo|Work | QNX is rather cute |
| 19:34:57 | Neo|Work | and might be more suitable honestly |
| 19:35:01 | warmi | I understand Speedy2 is porting eC...something ( embedded OS) to the ZAurus |
| 19:35:05 | nadav | I've never seen qnx in action |
| 19:35:13 | nadav | NetAmp: did you ever get your z?! |
| 19:35:19 | warmi | I had it on my x86 box ... it is ok but what's the point ? |
| 19:35:21 | NetAmp | nadav: sure did! :D |
| 19:35:25 | NetAmp | nadav: it's cute ;) hehe |
| 19:35:35 | nadav | NetAmp: :) |
| 19:35:40 | nadav | I should get one someday ;) |
| 19:35:50 | NetAmp | yeah you should :) |
| 19:35:53 | warmi | I mean it is real-time OS .. we are paying for capabilities we will never use on our PDAs |
| 19:35:56 | nadav | heh |
| 19:36:00 | nadav | after i buy my 17" imac |
| 19:36:36 | NetAmp | nadav: it's actually smaller than I thought, which is good |
| 19:36:36 | warmi | kergoth_: did you get ARM dev kid from Speedy2 yet ? |
| 19:36:54 | NetAmp | NeoTron: I installed the GameBoy emulator, pretty cool but I need to find some ROMs |
| 19:37:03 | nadav | NetAmp: Yeah, i was surprised at the size when I saw it at BestBuy |
| 19:37:09 | NetAmp | s/NeoTron/nadav |
| 19:37:15 | kergoth | warmi: no, not yet |
| 19:37:18 | kergoth | warmi: you? |
| 19:37:25 | warmi | I just got them |
| 19:37:29 | NetAmp | nadav: you already saw it? heh, even harder to resist now or is it? ;) |
| 19:37:31 | warmi | my wife just called me |
| 19:37:32 | nadav | even though i couldn't play with it :( it was in a glass cage and nobody was around that i could ask |
| 19:37:36 | kergoth | warmi: oh nice. wonder if i got it today then |
| 19:37:51 | kergoth | warmi: let me know how it is.. i want to read the documentation and play with the emulation.. hehh |
| 19:37:55 | kergoth | warmi: he's porting eCos |
| 19:37:55 | warmi | minnesota .. hmm .. no . next week :-) |
| 19:37:58 | kergoth | hah |
| 19:38:03 | warmi | yeah, eCos |
| 19:38:11 | warmi | supposedly very lean OS |
| 19:38:11 | nadav | NetAmp: All the sales-fools died so i couldn't ask anyone to let me play with it |
| 19:38:20 | NetAmp | nadav: ah :( |
| 19:38:27 | warmi | if they could only get Qt running on it .. I am all for that |
| 19:38:28 | warmi | hehe |
| 19:38:32 | kergoth | hehe |
| 19:38:35 | kergoth | i'd like to play with it |
| 19:38:39 | kergoth | if only cause i've never used it before |
| 19:38:55 | W|GGL|T | is back (gone 24:47:03) |
| 19:39:00 | nadav | NetAmp: I'll go again when I go back to the US in a week. I wonder what the price is right now |
| 19:39:01 | warmi | I never even heard about that one .. which is strange considering it is being promoted by RedHat |
| 19:39:04 | W|GGL|T | damn Z keeps losing time |
| 19:39:16 | nadav | it was $360 a while back, when bestbuy.com listed $400 |
| 19:39:17 | kergoth | warmi: redhat ditched em |
| 19:39:21 | kergoth | warmi: you hear about that/ |
| 19:39:36 | warmi | I just went to RH site today and they still seem to support it |
| 19:39:38 | NetAmp | nadav: pretty nice price |
| 19:39:46 | warmi | when did they ditch it ? |
| 19:39:48 | jmhodges | decides to stick with scp |
| 19:39:58 | nadav | NetAmp: how much did you pay for yours? |
| 19:40:11 | NetAmp | nadav: cost me 500+ because of intl. shipping.. oh well, the dollar exchange rate is quite good atm :) |
| 19:40:29 | warmi | kergoth_: as far as ARM dev .. I won't know until I get home tonight.. |
| 19:40:31 | NetAmp | nadav: I bought it at Fry's (outpost.com) |
| 19:40:44 | warmi | I think it is an emulator + Assembler and perhaps C/C++ compiler |
| 19:40:48 | NetAmp | nadav: which was pretty much the only one shipping them over :( |
| 19:40:51 | nadav | NetAmp: really? the dollar-NIS (new israeli shekel) rate is terrible |
| 19:41:07 | NetAmp | nadav: yeah dollar-euro rate is quite good |
| 19:41:20 | Neo|Work | warmi: realtime might be nice on a PDA actially. You generally don't multitask much so with realtime your apps might run bette |
| 19:41:34 | nadav | NetAmp: Jesus, i forgot all about the euro ;) |
| 19:41:35 | warmi | nadav: can you buy Zs in Israel ? |
| 19:41:41 | Neo|Work | Qnx makes more sense on a PDA than on the desktop though |
| 19:41:49 | nadav | warmi: no. |
| 19:41:58 | nadav | warmi: i don't live in israel though. Atlanta, GA |
| 19:42:00 | Neo|Work | if I had a whole bunch of money and some cool partners I might actually try to make QNX PDA platform |
| 19:42:02 | nadav | been out of israel for 3 years |
| 19:42:17 | warmi | Neo|Work: hehe .. nice dream |
| 19:42:24 | jmhodges | going off to try the new rom |
| 19:42:25 | warmi | nadav: ah ok |
| 19:42:29 | Neo|Work | and it's close enough to, say, Linux for a lot of things to port by a simple make (not including video api of course) |
| 19:42:43 | warmi | Qt runs on QNX |
| 19:43:00 | warmi | nadav: were you born in Israel ? |
| 19:43:07 | nadav | Yeah |
| 19:43:13 | nadav | lived there all my life, except for 3 years |
| 19:43:19 | warmi | ah ok |
| 19:43:19 | George- | kergoth: Do I need to repeat that command every time I do a hard reset? |
| 19:43:21 | nadav | 2 in germany, 1 in america (so far) |
| 19:43:31 | warmi | so how do you like USA ? |
| 19:43:32 | warmi | hehe |
| 19:43:38 | warmi | it was a bit of a shock when I came here |
| 19:43:40 | wildwildwes | how legal would it be to release a modified version of the sharp ospack? |
| 19:43:44 | jmhodges | uh.. great |
| 19:43:49 | wildwildwes | one that still had java + opera |
| 19:43:55 | warmi | especially architecture is soo ... well, boring compared to US |
| 19:43:56 | nadav | warmi: where'd you come from? ;) |
| 19:44:01 | warmi | to Europe, that is |
| 19:44:07 | warmi | Poland |
| 19:44:19 | nadav | oh. |
| 19:44:28 | XavierXeon | warmi: how ling have you been to the us |
| 19:44:31 | nadav | well, both europe and america are VERY different from israel |
| 19:44:33 | XavierXeon | long |
| 19:44:46 | nadav | the cultures are so different |
| 19:44:51 | warmi | 9 years I think |
| 19:44:54 | nadav | I like europe better than the US though |
| 19:45:12 | kergoth | George-: yes. |
| 19:45:13 | XavierXeon | nadav: culteres within europe are very different |
| 19:45:22 | kergoth | George-: its part of the full reset sequence to reconfigure packages. |
| 19:45:29 | George- | kergoth: what about a soft reset? |
| 19:45:33 | kergoth | George-: actually no, i'm wrong. you dont have to on any reset. |
| 19:45:34 | nadav | XavierXeon: true |
| 19:45:37 | warmi | nadav: I like Europe better as far as architecture, food .. but I hate their stupid leftist leanings |
| 19:45:39 | kergoth | George-: heh. sorry, its friday |
| 19:45:45 | kergoth | George-: full reset is just a reboot, fyi |
| 19:46:07 | warmi | XavierXeon: you are from Germany right ? |
| 19:46:47 | warmi | yeah, I used to speak German ( my father was German) but not anymore ... |
| 19:46:51 | warmi | . |
| 19:46:56 | George- | kergoth: hah, screw you! :) |
| 19:47:01 | XavierXeon | warmi: i am polish/german/dutch/french/british/italian but i live in germany |
| 19:47:05 | warmi | I can still read but that's about it |
| 19:47:20 | nadav | warmi: heh, moving to america was quiet a shock. Being Israeli, the space in america was amazing |
| 19:47:25 | nadav | israel = tinnnyyy |
| 19:47:34 | warmi | XavierXeon: uh .... that's quite of heritage |
| 19:47:35 | warmi | hehe |
| 19:47:40 | warmi | nadav: yeah , I know .. |
| 19:47:42 | XavierXeon | indeed |
| 19:47:59 | nadav | hehe |
| 19:48:04 | nadav | heya Cloudchaser |
| 19:48:20 | George- | kergoth: you remember that kernel automounting feature that I was bitching about? |
| 19:48:22 | warmi | nadav: I have read about problems Israel military pilots have when going on training missions .. |
| 19:48:27 | George- | kergoth: where ext2 wouldn't load properly |
| 19:48:35 | George- | kergoth: well, it seems to be fixed in 10.4 |
| 19:48:39 | jmhodges | oooo.. i like the way the Open zaurus on the boot screen is written on.. |
| 19:48:43 | Cloudchaser | happy friday everyone!!! |
| 19:48:53 | George- | Cloudchaser: huh? :) |
| 19:49:04 | NetAmp | XavierXeon: dutch? I'm Dutch! hehe ;) |
| 19:49:09 | warmi | they have to watch all the time .. couple of seconds of not paying attention and they are out of Israeli air space |
| 19:49:11 | warmi | hehe |
| 19:49:18 | nadav | warmi: haha |
| 19:49:21 | nadav | Very true. |
| 19:49:42 | XavierXeon | ok i will watch my dvd now |
| 19:49:49 | NetAmp | have fun |
| 19:49:56 | jmhodges | hey Cloudchaser |
| 19:50:14 | NetAmp | hm maybe the Z should have a DVD drive :P :P |
| 19:50:18 | NetAmp | *grin* |
| 19:50:33 | warmi | NetAmp: how's it going ? |
| 19:50:39 | NetAmp | yo dev ppl, what's the easiest way to parse a directory tree? |
| 19:50:41 | warmi | still enjoying your little Z ? |
| 19:50:51 | warmi | NetAmp: in what language ? |
| 19:50:52 | NetAmp | warmi: yeah :D it's so cool :) |
| 19:51:03 | benmeyer | NetAmp: QDir recursivly |
| 19:51:04 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 19:51:08 | benmeyer | QDir.list() |
| 19:51:10 | benmeyer | i think |
| 19:51:18 | W|GGL|T | wonders if a Linksys CF card will work OK with the Z |
| 19:51:25 | NetAmp | yeah recursive function... I was thinking of that |
| 19:51:34 | NetAmp | well I just wanna make a tree outline of a drive |
| 19:51:43 | NetAmp | like TREE.COM did in early DOS days |
| 19:51:44 | benmeyer | what for? |
| 19:51:48 | NetAmp | or XTREE (Gold) |
| 19:51:54 | benmeyer | XTree? |
| 19:52:01 | ljp_ | oh ya xtree |
| 19:52:15 | NetAmp | yeah just the dir names connected my lines |
| 19:52:18 | ljp_ | I ported linuxtree to the z |
| 19:52:38 | warmi | NetAmp: use Qdir::entryInfoList(); and work recursively off of that |
| 19:52:40 | kergoth | George-: woah. ext2 works now? dood, i didnt change anything.. lol |
| 19:52:44 | kergoth | George-: i need a drink |
| 19:52:45 | NetAmp | I wanted to do it at work using VBA code (uch!! only thing avail. there :( |
| 19:52:53 | George- | kergoth: heh, I dunno, it definitely works :) |
| 19:52:57 | NetAmp | warmi: hm at least Qt supports it ;) |
| 19:52:58 | kergoth | George-: sweet |
| 19:53:01 | kergoth | George-: i'm not complaining |
| 19:53:07 | George- | At least, on SD it does |
| 19:53:15 | George- | I'll check CF in a couple of millenia |
| 19:53:17 | kergoth | George-: can you do me a favor and check if thats listed as a bug report on sf? |
| 19:53:19 | kergoth | George-: k |
| 19:53:26 | George- | kergoth: it was |
| 19:53:40 | George- | kergoth: and your reply was "Same behavior on my desktop machine" |
| 19:54:01 | NetAmp | Actually I wasn't planning to use Qt cuz it's for a Windoze PC at work, but I'll just have to write my own recursive function.. |
| 19:54:05 | kergoth | George-: hah. well i'll close it |
| 19:54:10 | kergoth | George-: if it isnt closed already |
| 19:54:34 | NetAmp | hm maybe I could use that function's source anyway for reference... |
| 19:54:43 | George- | http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=544758&group_id=43045&atid=434956 |
| 19:54:47 | George- | kergoth: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=544758&group_id=43045&atid=434956 |
| 19:55:03 | George- | Date: 2002-05-28 22:27 |
| 19:55:03 | George- | Sender: kergoth |
| 19:55:03 | George- | Logged In: YES |
| 19:55:03 | George- | user_id=407327 |
| 19:55:03 | George- | This seems to occur with the auto fs type on my desktop too.... |
| 19:55:36 | kergoth | George-: heh. k |
| 19:55:50 | nadav | [22:16] <noidd> JasonNJ: yes, but at 0.02$ a share, its worth risking 100$ :-) |
| 19:55:54 | nadav | I might do that. |
| 19:56:01 | siriusnova | yo |
| 19:56:07 | nadav | Would probably be a stupid idea.. |
| 19:56:11 | nadav | but why not? ;) |
| 19:56:12 | siriusnova | wassup |
| 19:56:24 | siriusnova | :oP |
| 19:56:31 | nadav | hi siriusnova |
| 19:56:49 | siriusnova | hey |
| 19:57:03 | siriusnova | what`s new? |
| 19:57:14 | nadav | not much around here |
| 19:57:17 | nadav | surviving the heat |
| 19:57:20 | nadav | you? |
| 19:57:22 | NetAmp | heat? |
| 19:57:28 | NetAmp | it's no longer hot here |
| 19:57:31 | siriusnova | same hehe |
| 19:57:37 | nadav | it's always hot in israel |
| 19:57:54 | siriusnova | well it is the ME |
| 19:58:05 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 19:58:14 | George- | kergoth: are you one of these developers that just breaks things and fixes things without knowing what the heck you are doing? :) |
| 19:58:28 | NetAmp | hah |
| 19:58:29 | siriusnova | lol George |
| 19:58:33 | kergoth | George-: hah. no, if i break something i know why. |
| 19:58:33 | nadav | haha |
| 19:58:48 | kergoth | George-: but its like when customers call me.. "hi this is broken.. hey wait, now its working fine.. thanks!" |
| 19:58:52 | kergoth | lol |
| 19:59:00 | siriusnova | heh |
| 20:00:25 | siriusnova | hey what stuff runs on ports 111, 4243 and 4992 on the z |
| 20:00:36 | siriusnova | mine are open |
| 20:00:58 | warmi | kergoth_: are you doing Windows OS support ? |
| 20:01:14 | tux_mike | anyone here read fark? |
| 20:01:23 | siriusnova | ya me |
| 20:01:46 | warmi | http://www.fark.com/ |
| 20:01:47 | tux_mike | my aunt has 3 cats that look just like cliche kitty :) |
| 20:01:49 | warmi | this one ? |
| 20:01:56 | tux_mike | that fark |
| 20:02:10 | warmi | KittyPorn |
| 20:02:13 | warmi | huh |
| 20:02:36 | tux_mike | that ad? it's for a t-shirt place |
| 20:02:55 | warmi | yeah, I went there |
| 20:03:14 | NetAmp | l8r :) |
| 20:03:39 | tux_mike | http://www.arabnews.com/Article.asp?ID=17038n - Can we say /spoiled/ |
| 20:03:58 | siriusnova | yeah i read that hehe |
| 20:04:05 | darienm | I'm getting an asperror |
| 20:04:27 | darienm | Microsoft VBScript runtime error '800a000d' |
| 20:04:27 | darienm | Type mismatch: 'CInt' |
| 20:04:35 | tux_mike | http://www.arabnews.com/Article.asp?ID=17038 |
| 20:04:36 | warmi | http://www.arabnews.com/Article.asp?ID=17038 |
| 20:04:46 | darienm | well then.... |
| 20:04:48 | tux_mike | i have no idea how the n got in there |
| 20:04:55 | warmi | man these Arabs are .. well so stupid .. |
| 20:05:02 | siriusnova | hey |
| 20:05:02 | tux_mike | yah |
| 20:05:04 | warmi | they have all this money .. |
| 20:05:07 | siriusnova | fuck u chap |
| 20:05:16 | benmeyer | ljp_: I will have a ftp client for you monday |
| 20:05:17 | warmi | and yet they continue to just blow it off |
| 20:05:20 | tux_mike | http://apnews1.iwon.com/article/20020719/D7KRVCEO1.html i like this one. d'oh |
| 20:05:21 | benmeyer | and maybe a explorer too |
| 20:05:23 | benmeyer | night all |
| 20:05:25 | siriusnova | im arab |
| 20:05:29 | warmi | there is no real investment in the education nothing |
| 20:05:54 | tux_mike | siriusnova: i think he's refering to the oil barrons of arabia |
| 20:06:01 | siriusnova | ok |
| 20:06:05 | warmi | I refer to folks who run the place |
| 20:06:12 | siriusnova | thats fine |
| 20:06:18 | tux_mike | warmi: yah, the oil barrons |
| 20:06:18 | siriusnova | diss em all u want |
| 20:06:19 | mudcrawl | I love my zaurus , what about you? |
| 20:06:33 | warmi | they keep building all these residents |
| 20:06:39 | warmi | buy countless mercedeses |
| 20:06:50 | nadav | and X5's! |
| 20:07:15 | siriusnova | nobody ever buys me a car :( |
| 20:07:21 | George- | kergoth: ping |
| 20:07:36 | kergoth | George-: pong. man its busy has hell here today. call after call after call |
| 20:07:42 | George- | ? |
| 20:07:46 | George- | from me? :) |
| 20:07:51 | kergoth | nah, i'm in tech support |
| 20:07:51 | siriusnova | lol kergoth |
| 20:07:52 | kergoth | :-) |
| 20:07:56 | nadav | heh |
| 20:08:01 | kergoth | goes on a rampage |
| 20:08:01 | treke | poor kergoth |
| 20:08:03 | George- | kergoth: oh right |
| 20:08:09 | siriusnova | u work at sharp kergoth? |
| 20:08:18 | George- | kergoth: erm, how do I get this damn zaurus to wake up for an alarm? |
| 20:08:27 | George- | kergoth: I have atd up and running... |
| 20:08:33 | kergoth | siriusnova: nah |
| 20:08:47 | kergoth | George-: err if you have atd running it should work fine. |
| 20:08:56 | siriusnova | ok |
| 20:09:01 | George- | kergoth: well, it's not :) |
| 20:09:17 | Oriumpor | why! why must I be tortured with a program with an open button but no save button :P |
| 20:09:30 | siriusnova | lol |
| 20:09:34 | nadav | haha |
| 20:10:01 | treke | hmmm. anyone know apps on the contest page are being crossed out |
| 20:10:18 | Oriumpor | treke: url> |
| 20:10:24 | treke | http://www.zaurus.com/dev/challenge/registration.php |
| 20:10:35 | warmi | tux_mike: how's your game ? |
| 20:12:13 | darienm | treke: YIKES ! |
| 20:12:41 | tux_mike | haven't worked on it today, been working on my aunt's fence, but it's coming along. this one file is up to 55k |
| 20:13:09 | kergoth | George-: did you run the datetime app to set your clock while atd was running? |
| 20:13:15 | George- | kergothyes |
| 20:13:18 | warmi | he ... seriousnova got pissed. ... well, he was kind of right .. I should have been more specific with my dissing of their multibillion kings and sultans |
| 20:13:23 | kergoth | George-: no idea then. reboot? lol |
| 20:13:23 | George- | kergoth: yes |
| 20:13:31 | kergoth | brb, more real work |
| 20:13:32 | George- | kergoth: heh, shut up |
| 20:13:34 | warmi | tux_mike: 55 K of code ?? |
| 20:13:52 | tux_mike | yup |
| 20:13:55 | warmi | man, you are fast |
| 20:14:07 | kergoth | 55k? |
| 20:14:08 | kergoth | shit |
| 20:14:10 | tux_mike | a lot was copy/paste/modify |
| 20:14:14 | kergoth | i wish i could get my shit together that fast |
| 20:14:21 | tux_mike | didn't think he was that fast... |
| 20:14:47 | tux_mike | the header file alone is 14k |
| 20:15:17 | kergoth | how much is comments? :-P |
| 20:15:27 | kergoth | man, i'm so glad its firday |
| 20:15:29 | kergoth | friday too |
| 20:15:30 | tux_mike | um less than one hundred bytes |
| 20:15:33 | Oriumpor | ditto |
| 20:15:37 | Oriumpor | friday is the good day |
| 20:15:39 | warmi | Puzz-le altogether has about 133 KB worth of code |
| 20:15:42 | Oriumpor | friday is the day I get to go home |
| 20:15:43 | tux_mike | friday is good |
| 20:16:09 | tux_mike | warmi: keep in mind, this is the adaptation of a paper and pencil game, they usually take a lot of code to work right :) |
| 20:16:46 | warmi | but this one will have graphics and stuff right ? |
| 20:16:51 | warmi | not just numbers and stats? |
| 20:16:55 | tux_mike | oh, yeah. |
| 20:17:12 | tux_mike | i'm having a friend of mine work on the graphics |
| 20:17:43 | warmi | any dates as far as alpha demo ? |
| 20:17:44 | warmi | hehe |
| 20:19:41 | George- | kergoth: Do I need ipaqalarm or anything? |
| 20:19:50 | George- | kergoth: Or is it an Opie problem? |
| 20:21:09 | tux_mike | um... it should only take me a week more to finish this file, then comes the qt code, that shouldn't take too long to get working. i'll prolly have an editor-only alpha in 2.5-3 weeks, granted everything goes smoothly |
| 20:21:23 | warmi | not bad |
| 20:21:38 | warmi | is this going to be multiplayer ? |
| 20:21:58 | nadav | what kind of game is this? |
| 20:22:47 | warmi | so far only 5 people signed up for Sharp's new contest |
| 20:23:46 | NetAmp | Damn them! |
| 20:23:49 | NetAmp | Forgent |
| 20:23:59 | warmi | NetAmp: are you going to sign up for the contest ? |
| 20:24:06 | NetAmp | they wannna start charging for JPEG licensing :o |
| 20:24:36 | nadav | fs |
| 20:24:38 | NetAmp | warmi: nah don't think so... I'm not that good at dev'ing :( |
| 20:24:42 | nadav | ambulance scared the shit outta me |
| 20:24:45 | JasonNJ | jeus |
| 20:24:47 | JasonNJ | christ |
| 20:24:53 | JasonNJ | stock market mega tankage |
| 20:24:56 | warmi | NetAmp: yeah .. I know ... Unisys style trick |
| 20:24:56 | nadav | jeus? |
| 20:24:59 | JasonNJ | down is down 390 points |
| 20:25:09 | tux_mike | warmi: yah it's gonna be multiplayer |
| 20:25:14 | tux_mike | 390 O_O |
| 20:25:16 | warmi | JasonNJ: 1998 levels . |
| 20:25:20 | tux_mike | good lord |
| 20:25:33 | JasonNJ | thats the lowest it ever went post sept 11 |
| 20:25:47 | tux_mike | almost below 8k |
| 20:25:51 | warmi | frankly, some people say this is the level it should have been at in the first place |
| 20:26:05 | tux_mike | warmi: then why is it still going down? |
| 20:26:24 | warmi | it is like a swing .. |
| 20:26:28 | warmi | if you know what I mean |
| 20:26:38 | tux_mike | i just hope it swings back up |
| 20:26:42 | treke | warmi: Where did you get the 5 people sign up? |
| 20:26:46 | warmi | it has to bounce back to the other extreme before stabilizing |
| 20:27:06 | warmi | treke|home: "-Crossed out applications are no longer available" |
| 20:27:17 | warmi | http://www.zaurus.com/dev/challenge/registration.php |
| 20:27:19 | treke | warmi: It isnt accurate |
| 20:27:29 | warmi | treke|home: why ? |
| 20:27:35 | treke | warmi: I'm signed up and my app isnt crossed out. I think thats apps that have been submitted |
| 20:27:48 | ljp_ | I hate insurance companies.. |
| 20:28:01 | warmi | well, I am sure they have some lag |
| 20:28:16 | warmi | treke|home: care to mention which one is yours ? |
| 20:28:20 | treke | vnc viewer |
| 20:28:39 | darienm | gonna fix keypebble :) |
| 20:28:43 | warmi | treke|home: whoa .. that is a quite big one |
| 20:28:56 | treke | darienm: probably not |
| 20:29:02 | treke | darienm: probably gonna start fresh |
| 20:29:32 | warmi | treke|home: you mean fresh from X based VNC viewer ? |
| 20:29:33 | darienm | treke: well, most important thing (besides the fact that it connects) is that there is a way to send a right-click |
| 20:29:40 | tux_mike | warmi: i don't get that page.... they want you to make those apps for the Z? |
| 20:29:58 | treke | warmi: Not sure yet. They all seem to share a lot of code |
| 20:30:00 | NetAmp | warmi: huh? why would they be unavailable? |
| 20:30:00 | warmi | tux_mike: yeah .. and for each app they will give you 5000d |
| 20:30:17 | treke | at least from what I've seen of the linux, keypebble, and palm vnc viewer source |
| 20:30:19 | tux_mike | and this is a contest, how? |
| 20:30:29 | treke | tux_mike: It isnt really |
| 20:30:34 | treke | more of a "challenge" |
| 20:30:38 | warmi | well, they call it " a challenge" |
| 20:30:42 | ljp_ | I need to go sit in my car tonight and list to some loud music to make my car feel better |
| 20:31:03 | ljp_ | poor thing |
| 20:31:13 | warmi | ljp_: hehehe .. still struggling with this parking lot mishap ? |
| 20:31:23 | ljp_ | ya, of course |
| 20:31:48 | ljp_ | but I have a friend that does body work on race cars.. so I'll be in good hands |
| 20:31:48 | warmi | ljp_: I know .. pain in the ass .. |
| 20:31:58 | warmi | but at least you won't have to pay a dime |
| 20:32:05 | ljp_ | ya.. I hope not |
| 20:32:20 | warmi | ljp_: well, you said it was a clear cut case |
| 20:32:38 | ljp_ | ya. he even admitted fault and apolgized |
| 20:32:54 | warmi | tux_mike: thinking about jumping in into that Sharp's "challenge" |
| 20:33:02 | ljp_ | still.. ya never know with insurance companies |
| 20:33:12 | warmi | ljp_: hehe |
| 20:33:13 | jmhodges | hm.. anyone else having trouble selecting any American city in that world time app ? |
| 20:33:18 | warmi | they are there to make money .. |
| 20:33:21 | jmhodges | this is with the new rom |
| 20:33:26 | warmi | so you have to watch your back all the time |
| 20:33:42 | ljp_ | yep.. |
| 20:33:57 | ljp_ | wants to drive my car |
| 20:34:05 | warmi | does it still run ? |
| 20:34:38 | ljp_ | yes.. but its a sporty car, and its embarassing to drive with the door all mucnched in |
| 20:34:50 | ljp_ | :D |
| 20:34:54 | NetAmp | hehe |
| 20:35:13 | warmi | ljp_: heheh |
| 20:35:18 | jmhodges | guess not |
| 20:35:33 | warmi | frankly, same goes for any kind of car |
| 20:35:55 | ljp_ | heheh ya |
| 20:35:56 | warmi | jmhodges: just last night I selected Chicago |
| 20:36:11 | warmi | cause for some reason my Z was set up for NYT time zone |
| 20:36:18 | warmi | I had not problem whatsoever |
| 20:36:43 | jmhodges | well damn |
| 20:37:16 | warmi | just use the listbox if the map doesn't work for you :-) |
| 20:37:18 | warmi | who cares .. |
| 20:37:19 | warmi | hehe |
| 20:37:30 | warmi | it will work anyway |
| 20:37:51 | jmhodges | :) |
| 20:37:52 | [DrEvil] | is there a backup app for opie? |
| 20:37:52 | treke | ugh. qt hates me today |
| 20:38:15 | ljp_ | Dr: theres a backup app at zsi |
| 20:38:16 | jmhodges | hm.. my time didnt get kept.. well.. lets see what i can do about that |
| 20:38:46 | warmi | treke|home: already working on the viewer ? |
| 20:38:46 | treke | no matching function for call to `QPainter::scale (double, double)' |
| 20:38:49 | [DrEvil] | I searched for "backup" at ZSI and it didn't find anything |
| 20:38:55 | treke | warmi: Playing around a bit. nothing serious yet |
| 20:39:38 | treke | warmi: Just trying to see what a perfomance hit client side scaling would be since server side scaling requires a patched vncserver |
| 20:39:44 | warmi | treke... how about #include <qpainter.h> |
| 20:39:44 | ljp_work | oh.. maybe its int he ZZ feed |
| 20:40:00 | treke | I will be surprised if it isnt there :) |
| 20:40:04 | warmi | hehee |
| 20:40:28 | treke | it is, the qpainter object is being used already |
| 20:40:34 | treke | doubts it will be usably fast |
| 20:40:36 | [George] | kergoth: does the opie-alarm wake up work for you? |
| 20:40:53 | warmi | treke|home: it could work .. |
| 20:41:08 | warmi | treke|home: you would be drawing to a pixmap .. |
| 20:41:11 | [DrEvil] | there is a databackup ipk in the ZZ feed |
| 20:41:15 | warmi | and then scale parts of it right ? |
| 20:41:16 | treke | warmi: Thats why I'm at least giving it a shot |
| 20:41:17 | [DrEvil] | but it doesn't work |
| 20:41:26 | treke | warmi: yeah |
| 20:41:29 | kergoth | [George]: opie-alarm is ipaq specific. |
| 20:41:42 | [DrEvil] | unless it manages to compress everything down to a 136 byte file |
| 20:41:43 | warmi | treke|home: I asume it would be scaling down right ? |
| 20:41:44 | [George] | kergoth: it is? |
| 20:41:45 | treke | right now I'm just poking about keypebble since it gives me a usable client to experiment with |
| 20:41:45 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: well not technically, but it requires a feature we dont have. |
| 20:41:47 | [George] | kergoth: wth? |
| 20:41:48 | treke | warmi: Yeah |
| 20:41:51 | jmhodges | warmi: the list just has the "pre-selected" cities |
| 20:41:56 | NetAmp | warmi: What do you think of making for the contest? |
| 20:41:59 | [George] | kergoth: why, what does it do that is iPaq specific? |
| 20:42:05 | kergoth | [George]: it requires suspend/resume scripts |
| 20:42:15 | warmi | NetAmp: actually that was a question for tux .. I forgot to add the question mark :-) |
| 20:42:19 | kergoth | [George]: we dont have suspend/resume scripts. |
| 20:42:19 | [George] | kergoth: don't you have suspend/resume scripts? |
| 20:42:20 | ljp_work | DrEvil: http://www.zauruszone.com/feed/databackup_1.0_arm.ipk |
| 20:42:28 | [George] | damn...damn...damn...damn |
| 20:42:29 | kergoth | [George]: we never have. teh ipaq suspend/resume scripts are a gross hack |
| 20:42:29 | [DrEvil] | I guess that means back to the sharp ROM |
| 20:42:37 | [DrEvil] | ljp_work: I already tried it |
| 20:42:41 | [DrEvil] | and it doesn't work |
| 20:42:44 | MickeyL | [George]: just checked ... my Zaurus wakes up. I had - however to upgrade to atd-1.1-3 |
| 20:42:52 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: ben really really needs to rewrite databackup and add it to opie. |
| 20:42:57 | [George] | kergoth: isn't there a way to get the friggin' thing to wake up? |
| 20:43:01 | kergoth | [George]: install atd. |
| 20:43:03 | [George] | MickeyL: which OZ? |
| 20:43:04 | kergoth | [George]: thats all. |
| 20:43:10 | [George] | kergoth: I have atd running... |
| 20:43:12 | kergoth | [George]: latest OZ works, ljp confirmed it wakes up. |
| 20:43:20 | [George] | kergoth: but opie-alarm doesn't wake it up |
| 20:43:25 | MickeyL | [George]: 3b10 |
| 20:43:26 | kergoth | [George]: NO. ATD wakes it up |
| 20:43:34 | [George] | uhm |
| 20:43:34 | [George] | ok |
| 20:43:38 | kergoth | [George]: opie-alarm. UNINSTALL it. it doesnt work on the Z, just said that |
| 20:43:42 | ljp_work | opie-alarm if for ipaqs.. I thought |
| 20:43:44 | [George] | How do I set an alarm with atd? |
| 20:43:44 | warmi | treke|home: VNC viewer sends images over the wire right ? |
| 20:43:49 | warmi | it is not event based ? |
| 20:43:54 | kergoth | [George]: huh? |
| 20:44:00 | [George] | wait |
| 20:44:01 | treke | warmi: Yeah it sends an image |
| 20:44:07 | kergoth | [George]: opie uses atd. when you set up an alarm in calander, it uses atd. |
| 20:44:11 | [George] | this is the opie clock with built in alarm features, is that opie-alarm? |
| 20:44:21 | kergoth | [George]: no. thats opie-clock |
| 20:44:23 | kergoth | BZFlag: hey tim |
| 20:44:30 | jmhodges | goddammit why can i not get my cities to work!? this makes no sense.. i just fscking reinstall opie-citytime too |
| 20:44:31 | jmhodges | dammit |
| 20:44:33 | [George] | hmm, I've been getting more and more confused |
| 20:44:40 | kergoth | jmhodges: dont have timezones installed? |
| 20:44:40 | treke | warmi: eew I see whats happening |
| 20:44:42 | [George] | So.... opie-clock won't wake it up! |
| 20:44:50 | kergoth | [George]: have you tested anything else? |
| 20:45:07 | kergoth | [George]: you seem to think opie-clock does something on its own. all of opie manages alarms through the alarmserver, which uses atd |
| 20:45:13 | jmhodges | kergoth: doesnt that come default with the new rom? and i do have citytime installed.. but ok |
| 20:45:17 | kergoth | jmhodges: yeah, should |
| 20:45:32 | kergoth | Anyone here good with test processes? |
| 20:45:32 | treke | warmi: Qtopias QT is built with QT_NO_TRANSFORMATIONS :) |
| 20:45:37 | kergoth | I need a test plan for OZ releases. |
| 20:45:41 | jmhodges | kergoth: its installed |
| 20:45:50 | kergoth | jmhodges: well that exhausts my ideas then |
| 20:45:51 | kergoth | heh |
| 20:45:54 | ljp_work | kergoth: didnt you get the time on resume thing fixed. I just notcied my time got reset |
| 20:45:57 | jmhodges | is beginning to become enraged at his Z |
| 20:46:04 | [George] | kergoth: how do I check that atd is running? |
| 20:46:04 | kergoth | ljp_work: yes, its fixed |
| 20:46:17 | kergoth | [George]: with ps, or sysinfo |
| 20:46:24 | kergoth | i need a drink. |
| 20:46:34 | kergoth | tech support on the phones... to tech support on irc |
| 20:46:34 | kergoth | :-P |
| 20:46:37 | extremis | hrm, after installing tkcaddressbook, clicking on the new icon opens the old contacts |
| 20:46:38 | ljp_work | kergoth: no its not |
| 20:46:43 | extremis | in oz3 |
| 20:46:44 | [George] | kergoth: before you dehydrate shouting at me? :) |
| 20:46:47 | kergoth | ljp_work: if atd's running, thats all you need |
| 20:46:51 | kergoth | ljp_work: atd manages it |
| 20:47:10 | kergoth | ljp_work: make sure the atd trigger file exists and is a pipe and all that good stuff |
| 20:47:16 | ljp_work | well atd is running now.. |
| 20:47:16 | [George] | oh FUCK |
| 20:47:21 | [George] | that's why it's not working |
| 20:47:22 | [George] | grrrr |
| 20:47:23 | kergoth | shoots self |
| 20:47:26 | ljp_work | but somehow the time got reset at somepoint |
| 20:47:26 | [George] | so friggin SIMPLE |
| 20:47:27 | warmi | treke|home: yeah .. but that's different than scaling |
| 20:47:39 | warmi | oh .. so you saying scale doesn't work either ? |
| 20:47:44 | warmi | huh .. that sucks then |
| 20:47:47 | NetAmp | dozes off... |
| 20:47:48 | ljp_work | I'll keep an eye out for it |
| 20:47:50 | NetAmp | *yawn* |
| 20:47:56 | [George] | grrrrrrr |
| 20:48:03 | kergoth | [George]: wahtd ya do? |
| 20:48:07 | treke | warmi: Yeah compiling without transformations ifdefs out the scaling stuff |
| 20:48:08 | [George] | kergoth: it was cos, er, my system clock was set to AM, and my alarm to PM |
| 20:48:11 | kergoth | smacks george |
| 20:48:14 | [George] | jumps off a cliff |
| 20:48:14 | treke | which means I do it myself :) |
| 20:48:24 | nadav | lol |
| 20:48:25 | [George] | kergoth: you're kind :) |
| 20:48:30 | warmi | treke|home: the only choice left is to keep your image in internal format .. scale that yourself and use QdirectPainter to draw it |
| 20:48:37 | kergoth | hm |
| 20:48:38 | warmi | it would be even faster then using QPixmap |
| 20:48:48 | kergoth | anyone have a good recipe for a long island iced tea? i could use one of those |
| 20:48:50 | kergoth | or three |
| 20:49:00 | extremis | mmmm |
| 20:49:04 | extremis | I love long islands |
| 20:49:07 | kergoth | me too |
| 20:49:16 | kergoth | my personal favorite drink. i'm not a fan of beer |
| 20:49:16 | Neo|Work | kergoth: ever figured out how to force a refresh of the document tab (or how to add a new document ) |
| 20:49:18 | ljp_work | ya.. walk to a bar.. and say "gimme a long island ice tea, please' |
| 20:49:30 | kergoth | ljp_work: hah, no i'm broke. i'll mix my own ;-) |
| 20:49:35 | nadav | hah |
| 20:49:50 | treke | warmi: yup. scale and rotate ( the platform I want it on is rotated 270 ) |
| 20:49:52 | kergoth | hops over to idrink.com/ |
| 20:50:26 | ljp_work | isnt there a bar tender app for the Z yet? |
| 20:50:36 | kergoth | good question |
| 20:50:38 | kergoth | thatd be useful |
| 20:50:43 | Neo|Work | for any kinds of reasonable blitting speed, QDirectPainter and your own blitting routines are the only way to go |
| 20:50:48 | kergoth | then you could tell the bar tender how to mix a drink when he doesnt know how |
| 20:51:03 | Neo|Work | Bust'em (2Dream engine) does it right - rotate on load, simple blits after that |
| 20:51:14 | treke | hmm. alrighty. |
| 20:51:40 | jmhodges | well.. a reinstall or a reboot fixed it |
| 20:51:41 | jmhodges | damn |
| 20:52:20 | kergoth | woo |
| 20:52:22 | kergoth | i got paid today |
| 20:52:24 | kergoth | and its friday |
| 20:52:26 | kergoth | woot |
| 20:52:43 | jmhodges | lol |
| 20:53:20 | Jerakeen | scribot: http://idrink.com/ |
| 20:53:23 | Jerakeen | gah. |
| 20:53:33 | kergoth | idrink.com is sweet |
| 20:53:35 | Jerakeen | I give up. No more irc for me today. |
| 20:53:37 | | ACTION staggers around drunk and then pukes all over kergoth. |
| 20:53:37 | kergoth | ibot: drink? |
| 20:53:39 | kergoth | lol |
| 20:53:51 | | i haven't a clue, kergoth |
| 20:53:51 | kergoth | ibot: drinks? |
| 20:53:58 | | OK, kergoth. |
| 20:53:58 | kergoth | ibot: drinks is http://idrink.com/ |
| 20:54:03 | kergoth | there we go |
| 20:54:07 | kergoth` | hi me |
| 20:54:13 | [George] | kergoth: heh, no, atd kept setting the time to the equiv time AM |
| 20:54:24 | [George] | kergoth: So it kept screwing up |
| 20:54:27 | kergoth | ah |
| 20:54:29 | kergoth | doh |
| 20:54:31 | [George] | kergoth: I finally got it to wake though :) |
| 20:54:59 | [George] | kergoth: stop cloning! |
| 20:55:08 | [George] | "Attack of the kergoth`clones" |
| 20:55:29 | kergoth | hehe |
| 20:55:38 | kergoth | i need clones |
| 20:55:41 | kergoth | then i can support you all |
| 20:55:42 | kergoth | :-P |
| 20:55:43 | [George] | hehe |
| 20:55:56 | jmhodges | hehehe |
| 20:56:16 | Jerakeen | Which one gets to be the evil one and grow a goatee? |
| 20:56:37 | kergoth | the one at home. its evil |
| 20:56:50 | jmhodges | hehehe |
| 20:56:51 | kergoth | shit |
| 20:56:52 | kergoth | you know |
| 20:56:56 | kergoth | i just realized i dont own a blender |
| 20:56:56 | | okay, darienm. |
| 20:56:56 | darienm | ibot drinks is also http://www.webtender.com/ |
| 20:57:01 | [George] | anyone managed to hack the cradle yet to draw power from the USB? |
| 20:57:24 | kergoth | darienm: ah never been to that one :-) |
| 20:57:38 | darienm | 37 variations of Long Island Iced Tea |
| 20:57:41 | kergoth | ackk |
| 20:57:44 | kergoth | hehe |
| 20:57:51 | kergoth | now to pick one |
| 20:57:53 | jmhodges | lol |
| 20:58:05 | jmhodges | theres one version that is really close to being in the top ten |
| 20:58:09 | kergoth | long island milkshake? odd |
| 20:58:13 | kergoth | jmhodges: ? |
| 20:59:25 | kergoth | get: can't plock include/asm-arm/arch-sa1100/m62332.h |
| 20:59:26 | kergoth | wtf |
| 21:00:16 | ljp_work | there's NO bartender app on freshmeat |
| 21:00:31 | [DrEvil] | were you going to clone it if there were? |
| 21:00:40 | kergoth | hehe |
| 21:00:42 | treke | wasnt there one a request for one on the contest page? |
| 21:00:47 | kergoth | treke: was there? |
| 21:00:49 | kergoth | i dont remember |
| 21:00:51 | treke | dont know |
| 21:00:54 | kergoth | i want one though |
| 21:00:57 | treke | thought so |
| 21:01:13 | kergoth | there is? |
| 21:01:16 | [DrEvil] | create a server called IDDB |
| 21:01:22 | [DrEvil] | International Drinks Database |
| 21:01:25 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: hehe. i like that! |
| 21:01:26 | [DrEvil] | then write a client |
| 21:01:44 | [DrEvil] | they you would use WiFi or some other wireless data on the road |
| 21:02:01 | BigBoss | the app is evil, the data is the bitch |
| 21:02:14 | kergoth | heheh |
| 21:02:20 | [DrEvil] | people can add to it like they did with cddb once |
| 21:02:25 | kergoth | yeah |
| 21:02:28 | kergoth | thatd be nifty |
| 21:02:33 | [DrEvil] | then you sell out |
| 21:02:37 | [DrEvil] | to some booze company |
| 21:02:59 | [DrEvil] | we should start the freshmeat and sourceforge project pages |
| 21:03:00 | [DrEvil] | heh |
| 21:03:20 | ljp_work | ohh sure.. theres a blood/alcohol app.. but no drink receipe |
| 21:03:28 | kergoth | ljp_work: heh, thats messed up |
| 21:03:28 | [DrEvil] | hrmmm |
| 21:03:32 | [DrEvil] | that has possibilty |
| 21:03:35 | BigBoss | I think you have a weener here |
| 21:03:44 | BigBoss | make the app so it can submit recipies as well |
| 21:03:49 | kergoth | yeah |
| 21:03:57 | treke | BigBoss: bah, your the one with the software company |
| 21:04:08 | BigBoss | shit, I like this - we'll have it by tomorrow and call it tkcDrunk |
| 21:04:12 | kergoth | aha |
| 21:04:18 | [DrEvil] | add a feature to the BAC program that tells you what to drink to get to a certain BAC |
| 21:04:19 | kergoth | i'd buy it |
| 21:04:25 | BigBoss | hahaha |
| 21:04:26 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: lol |
| 21:04:34 | ljp_work | haha |
| 21:04:42 | ljp_work | opie-drunk |
| 21:04:45 | kergoth | "hmm.. lets see <clicks the REALLY DRUNK button> ." |
| 21:04:49 | ljp_work | haha |
| 21:05:01 | BigBoss | put recipies, alcohol content and how many it takes to get to a certain BAC within a certain amount of time |
| 21:05:08 | [DrEvil] | and ho about a review section |
| 21:05:16 | [DrEvil] | so it has possibilities like Vindigo |
| 21:05:21 | kergoth | hah. put cost. how much $ it'd cost you for a night out to get to a certain BAC :-P |
| 21:05:24 | BigBoss | what is vindigo |
| 21:05:32 | BigBoss | hahaha |
| 21:05:37 | [DrEvil] | a program for the Palm and PPC |
| 21:05:41 | BigBoss | so sit down and plan your drinking evening in advance |
| 21:05:45 | [DrEvil] | that deals with entertainment |
| 21:05:56 | [DrEvil] | wait |
| 21:06:00 | [DrEvil] | another thought has struck |
| 21:06:03 | kergoth | lets see... <checks really drunk> .. <checks strip club> ... that adds up to ... $blah!" |
| 21:06:06 | [DrEvil] | we tie in GPS |
| 21:06:08 | kergoth | hehe |
| 21:06:14 | BigBoss | hahaha |
| 21:06:24 | [DrEvil] | you want to find the best drink in your area |
| 21:06:28 | [DrEvil] | it shows you directions |
| 21:06:29 | nadav | hah |
| 21:06:39 | kergoth | hah |
| 21:06:42 | kergoth | thatd be sweet |
| 21:06:45 | nadav | ok, gonna go watch tv |
| 21:06:49 | kergoth | lets see, wheres the best long island in town.. |
| 21:06:54 | [DrEvil] | of course it would also tell you how to find your car after |
| 21:06:58 | kergoth | lol |
| 21:06:59 | jmhodges | lol |
| 21:07:26 | kergoth | seriously, a IDDB would be sweet. |
| 21:07:26 | [DrEvil] | but you would have to add some protection that only a sober person could manage |
| 21:07:50 | warmi | drunks |
| 21:07:54 | BigBoss | a CF based breathalizer :) |
| 21:07:58 | kergoth | BigBoss: lol |
| 21:07:59 | warmi | hehehe |
| 21:07:59 | jmhodges | lol |
| 21:08:04 | ljp_work | need to find a free drink receipe database |
| 21:08:15 | warmi | ljp_work:just wait a bit |
| 21:08:17 | kergoth | ljp_work: yeah, use it as a base for the IDDB heh |
| 21:08:26 | warmi | someone is workin on "Cocktail Recipes" app |
| 21:08:33 | ljp_work | opendrink databse |
| 21:08:34 | warmi | unless it is you in disguise |
| 21:08:37 | warmi | hehe |
| 21:08:39 | kergoth | hah |
| 21:08:44 | kergoth | as if i have time for another project |
| 21:08:48 | [DrEvil] | it has to be mobile |
| 21:09:00 | [DrEvil] | one more waffer thin mint? |
| 21:09:01 | kergoth | ljp_work: see what the license is on the information at idrink.com or webtender.com ... |
| 21:09:09 | kergoth | ljp_work: :-) |
| 21:09:17 | warmi | idrink.com |
| 21:09:19 | warmi | hehehe |
| 21:09:20 | kergoth | ljp_work: you could script the stuffing into the database |
| 21:09:22 | Rascal | kergoth: Benmeyer told me to pester you about java and opera scripts |
| 21:09:33 | [DrEvil] | hahaha |
| 21:09:36 | BigBoss | oh many this is so cool |
| 21:09:36 | kergoth | idrink.com is sweet. you can plug in the ingredients you have laying around and it tells you what you can make :-) |
| 21:09:36 | treke | wow. debian woody has been released |
| 21:09:41 | kergoth | treke: woah |
| 21:09:44 | treke | a fricken mazing |
| 21:09:46 | Rascal | treke: frozen? |
| 21:09:51 | [George] | back |
| 21:09:51 | BigBoss | I was listening to a song I wrote a while back, and a flash plug in started playing at the same time |
| 21:09:51 | ljp_work | well you cant copyright receipes |
| 21:09:52 | treke | Released |
| 21:09:52 | kergoth | Rascal: k |
| 21:09:55 | KhensU_work | treke: yup |
| 21:09:55 | [DrEvil] | kergoth will tell you to speak to benmeyer |
| 21:10:01 | BigBoss | the loop on the flash audio perfectly worked with my song |
| 21:10:01 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: lol |
| 21:10:07 | BigBoss | now I have to go back and re-record it |
| 21:10:07 | tux_mike | `ugh |
| 21:10:24 | kergoth | ljp_work: so then. write a perl script to grab the data from both webtender and idrink.com into a mysql database |
| 21:10:30 | kergoth | ljp_work: :-) |
| 21:10:41 | BigBoss | http://www.barbug.com/ |
| 21:10:55 | | okay, kergoth. |
| 21:10:55 | kergoth | ibot: drinks is also http://www.barbug.com/ |
| 21:10:58 | | drinks is http://idrink.com/ or http://www.webtender.com/ or http://www.barbug.com/ |
| 21:10:58 | kergoth | ibot: drinks? |
| 21:10:59 | warmi | the alternative is walk from bar to bar and ask ... |
| 21:11:00 | kergoth | sweet |
| 21:11:08 | [DrEvil] | ok |
| 21:11:16 | [DrEvil] | found a bug with tkcPlayer and Opie |
| 21:11:20 | | no idea, rascal |
| 21:11:20 | Rascal | ibot Gay midget porn? |
| 21:11:24 | | okay, kergoth. |
| 21:11:24 | kergoth | ibot: drinks is also whee |
| 21:11:28 | kergoth | I'm bored, can ya tell? |
| 21:11:32 | [DrEvil] | the cursor button doesn't work for volume |
| 21:11:35 | warmi | http://www.acebartender.com/ |
| 21:11:37 | warmi | PPC app |
| 21:11:54 | Rascal | anyone have problems with playing mp3s through opieplayer? |
| 21:12:06 | kergoth | warmi: hehe. we need a open database though :-) |
| 21:12:14 | BigBoss | opieplayer sucks |
| 21:12:16 | BigBoss | :) |
| 21:12:18 | kergoth | bah :-P |
| 21:12:24 | BigBoss | DrEvil, then it's a bug in opie |
| 21:12:25 | warmi | hahaha |
| 21:12:29 | Rascal | BigBoss: what's a beter software? |
| 21:12:32 | BigBoss | but are you sure you have it on the right screen? |
| 21:12:34 | ljp_work | welp.. gotto go.. bbl |
| 21:12:34 | BigBoss | tkcPlayer |
| 21:12:37 | darienm | http://www.freewarepalm.com/database/drinkrecipesdatabase.shtml |
| 21:12:45 | BigBoss | www.thekompany.com/embedded/tkcplayer |
| 21:12:46 | [DrEvil] | I have it on the player screen |
| 21:12:46 | tux_mike | anyone try vanilla coke? |
| 21:12:51 | KhensU_work | tux_mike: yup |
| 21:12:57 | BigBoss | so you have the graphic visualizer up? |
| 21:12:59 | [DrEvil] | with the cursor pad in the middle |
| 21:13:00 | [DrEvil] | yeah |
| 21:13:01 | warmi | darienm: great |
| 21:13:01 | jmhodges | tux_mike: yeah pretty good |
| 21:13:03 | kergoth | tux_mike: its not bad |
| 21:13:09 | tux_mike | yah, it's good |
| 21:13:14 | warmi | this is precisely what ljp needs for the contents |
| 21:13:16 | tux_mike | i like it a lot :) |
| 21:13:17 | warmi | contest |
| 21:13:20 | kergoth | i still prefer pepsi twist :-) |
| 21:13:20 | warmi | hehe |
| 21:13:27 | [DrEvil] | I would just create an empty iddb |
| 21:13:35 | [DrEvil] | and let people add their own recipies |
| 21:13:37 | tux_mike | the problem with pepsi twist is, i hate lemons |
| 21:13:46 | kergoth | whats that open cd database online again? |
| 21:13:49 | kergoth | tux_mike: lol |
| 21:13:54 | [DrEvil] | freedb |
| 21:13:57 | darienm | http://www.barnonedrinks.com/offline/ |
| 21:13:59 | kergoth | ah yeah |
| 21:13:59 | kergoth | thats right |
| 21:14:03 | darienm | The shareware version of BarBack has a drink database with over 3000 drinks. |
| 21:14:05 | kergoth | darienm: googling? |
| 21:14:13 | tux_mike | mmmm egg roll |
| 21:14:14 | darienm | kergoth: yeah |
| 21:14:20 | darienm | 3000 drinks, sharewae database |
| 21:14:39 | kergoth | darienm: hm progress... i like drevil's idea. create a iddb.. |
| 21:15:07 | darienm | kergoth: yeah - that's neat too, but would need to be able to download as well/store in cache, not everyone is connected |
| 21:15:13 | kergoth | darienm: exactly |
| 21:15:25 | [DrEvil] | darienm: that would be on the client side |
| 21:15:26 | kergoth | darienm: you have a local file version of the database that you can sync with online when you're connected, if ever |
| 21:15:30 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: yeh |
| 21:15:46 | [DrEvil] | the server just provides the recipes and related stuff |
| 21:15:58 | kergoth | yeah |
| 21:16:04 | kergoth | look at freedb as a model |
| 21:16:38 | kergoth | extend the cddb protocol to support drink information.. or start a new protocol |
| 21:16:47 | BigBoss | DrEvil: then it is an opie bug |
| 21:16:59 | BigBoss | yea, just use freedb |
| 21:17:07 | BigBoss | except that only partially makes sense |
| 21:17:10 | kergoth | hehe |
| 21:17:11 | [DrEvil] | well |
| 21:17:14 | BigBoss | with a CD it has information to look it up |
| 21:17:16 | kergoth | yeah the protocol has cd specific functions |
| 21:17:20 | kergoth | i.e. lscat |
| 21:17:31 | BigBoss | with a drink you are doing a search by alcholo type |
| 21:17:42 | kergoth | or by other things.. ingredients for example |
| 21:17:45 | [George] | kergoth: closed that bug now? :) |
| 21:17:47 | [DrEvil] | you would have to come up with categories |
| 21:17:52 | BigBoss | find all drinks that use a Lime |
| 21:17:54 | [DrEvil] | ingredients |
| 21:18:01 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: we'd have to handle the fact that you can have more than one recipe for a given drink. |
| 21:18:20 | kergoth | a rating system would be necessary for sure, similar to how idrink.com does it |
| 21:18:21 | BigBoss | just like having more than one album from an artist |
| 21:18:28 | [DrEvil] | it just gets a new UUID |
| 21:18:32 | kergoth | yeah |
| 21:18:36 | BigBoss | see, now this is a better use of your skills than Oz or Opie :) |
| 21:18:40 | kergoth | aha |
| 21:18:41 | warmi | hehehe |
| 21:18:53 | BigBoss | So a category of Martini with 'n' levels of sub-categories |
| 21:18:59 | kergoth | yeah |
| 21:19:12 | tux_mike | mmmm alcohol |
| 21:19:13 | [DrEvil] | gin or vidka |
| 21:19:26 | tux_mike | i'll have a long island iced tea please :) |
| 21:19:26 | kergoth | k who wants to draft a IDDB protocol spec? ;-) |
| 21:19:38 | [DrEvil] | I am going over it in my head |
| 21:19:40 | kergoth | tux_mike: this all started cause i wanted a damn long island recipe. hehe |
| 21:19:51 | tux_mike | kergoth: the problem is, you'd get drunk designing it :) |
| 21:19:53 | [DrEvil] | that'll teach you |
| 21:19:58 | kergoth | tux_mike: thats a problem? |
| 21:20:07 | [DrEvil] | let's start the iddb channel |
| 21:20:08 | [DrEvil] | heh |
| 21:20:14 | warmi | drinks . margarita-shmargarita ..... vodka is all one needs |
| 21:20:18 | tux_mike | in a manner of speaking |
| 21:20:25 | tux_mike | rum |
| 21:20:26 | kergoth | [DrEvil]: i actually think there's potential for this.. a central db |
| 21:20:28 | kergoth | heh |
| 21:20:35 | BigBoss | I'm drinking gin right now I was so inspired :) |
| 21:20:39 | kergoth | hah |
| 21:20:41 | kergoth | bastard |
| 21:20:43 | kergoth | i'm stuck at work still |
| 21:20:48 | BigBoss | if I had this program then I might have mixed it with something |
| 21:20:54 | BigBoss | straight gin is still yummy though |
| 21:21:00 | kergoth | BigBoss: yeah you'd plug in whats in your fridge.. |
| 21:21:05 | kergoth | BigBoss: and it'd tell you what to do |
| 21:21:06 | tux_mike | damn soy sauce packet with no perforation!!! |
| 21:21:11 | kergoth | lol mike |
| 21:21:22 | tux_mike | fights with the packet |
| 21:21:26 | jmhodges | lol |
| 21:21:29 | BigBoss | pull really hard on it until it tears open and spalshes everywhere :) |
| 21:21:49 | tux_mike | yay! it's open! and not on my clean shirt! |
| 21:22:21 | Cloudchaser | hiya everyone |
| 21:22:40 | kergoth | hey Cloudchaser |
| 21:22:47 | Cloudchaser | thinks she'll have a drink too |
| 21:22:49 | kergoth | welcome to #drunks |
| 21:22:53 | Cloudchaser | haha |
| 21:23:01 | Cloudchaser | sounds like a plan to me ;) |
| 21:23:23 | Cloudchaser | what are we drinking to? |
| 21:23:35 | [George] | bah, I'm too young to drink :) |
| 21:23:52 | Cloudchaser | ok you have to go to #tooyoungtodrink then |
| 21:23:53 | kergoth | Cloudchaser: life. |
| 21:24:00 | Cloudchaser | life is good ;) |
| 21:24:03 | kergoth | Cloudchaser: or anything else that comes to mind |
| 21:24:03 | Cloudchaser | i'm on vacation! |
| 21:24:05 | kergoth | sweet |
| 21:24:22 | tux_mike | to the fact that we have nothing to drink to! |
| 21:24:27 | [George] | Cloudchaser: grrrr |
| 21:24:29 | [DrEvil] | drat |
| 21:24:33 | [DrEvil] | iddb.org is taken |
| 21:24:35 | tux_mike | i've used that toast before :) |
| 21:24:45 | treke | when did being to young become a problem? |
| 21:24:59 | kergoth | iadb? internet alcohol database? |
| 21:25:17 | BigBoss | I just think that is too damn cool |
| 21:25:17 | tux_mike | oddb? |
| 21:25:22 | BigBoss | is anyone actually going to do it? |
| 21:25:24 | kergoth | oddb? lol |
| 21:25:27 | Cloudchaser | hehe treke its no problem |
| 21:25:27 | kergoth | BigBoss: yeah |
| 21:25:31 | BigBoss | Cause I'll put up the DB if you want |
| 21:25:39 | BigBoss | just let me sell the app :) |
| 21:25:44 | kergoth | BigBoss: drevil and i are looking into it. |
| 21:25:49 | kergoth | BigBoss: the protocol spec will be open |
| 21:25:53 | BigBoss | keep me in the loop, if you want |
| 21:25:54 | kergoth | BigBoss: so write an app if you like ;-) |
| 21:25:55 | Cloudchaser | i want to make an app to get a z ; |
| 21:26:02 | Cloudchaser | oooh |
| 21:26:11 | Cloudchaser | huge thunderstorm rolling in |
| 21:26:29 | kergoth | fun |
| 21:26:30 | tux_mike | lucky |
| 21:26:31 | kergoth | watch the storm |
| 21:26:33 | kergoth | i love watching storms |
| 21:27:18 | [George] | Cloudchaser: go chase the cloud that's making the storm ;) |
| 21:27:23 | kergoth | hah |
| 21:27:24 | Cloudchaser | hehe |
| 21:27:25 | [George] | admires his crap joke |
| 21:27:35 | kergoth | smacks george again for good measure |
| 21:27:45 | tux_mike | it hasn't rained here in such a long time |
| 21:27:47 | [George] | kergoth: blah |
| 21:27:53 | [George] | kergoth: you ain't my dad, y'know :) |
| 21:28:04 | kergoth | smacks george anyhow |
| 21:28:16 | warmi | tux_mike: it will this evening |
| 21:28:21 | [George] | you've smacked me 3 times now |
| 21:28:22 | tux_mike | good |
| 21:28:26 | [George] | grrr |
| 21:28:27 | warmi | at least that's what they say |
| 21:28:32 | [George] | sticks drawing pins out of him all over |
| 21:28:34 | tux_mike | smacks [George] for good measure |
| 21:28:40 | [George] | mwahaha, smack me now |
| 21:28:49 | tux_mike | warmi: they said the same about yesterday |
| 21:28:56 | warmi | tux_mike: yeah |
| 21:29:09 | warmi | so draw your own conclusions |
| 21:29:59 | [George] | tux_mike: having fun with your hand full of holes? :) |
| 21:30:00 | kergoth | brb |
| 21:30:25 | tux_mike | bah, holes don't bother me |
| 21:31:36 | Neo|Work | so what do you think about this planned app: EonConf - allows you to set Eon Games specific featurs that affect 1 or more of my products |
| 21:31:57 | Neo|Work | first option (and only one I can think of so far) would enable/disable key grabbing |
| 21:32:18 | kergoth | aha lets crossref the drinks db with freedb.. "I'm listening to Dr Dre. What shoudl i drink?" |
| 21:32:25 | jmhodges | hehehe |
| 21:32:30 | tux_mike | neo: how about tabs for each game installed? |
| 21:32:57 | Neo|Work | tux_mike: well thing is I only have one optiion yet. are you saying disable/enable grabbing per game rather? |
| 21:33:00 | kergoth | Neo|Work: just create a global eongames config file. |
| 21:33:01 | Neo|Work | if so, perhaps not a bad idea |
| 21:33:09 | Neo|Work | kergoth: right that is my plan |
| 21:33:16 | tux_mike | no, put a common tab, and individual tabs |
| 21:33:18 | [DrEvil] | thinks of synonyms |
| 21:33:24 | kergoth | Neo|Work: cool. then i wouldnt NEED your config app, but coudl just edit the file |
| 21:33:29 | kergoth | opie-confedit is sweet btw |
| 21:33:29 | warmi | Neo|Work: you could probably introduce another one .. enabling/disabling sound and music |
| 21:33:35 | Neo|Work | tux_mike: If I can figure out more stuff to put in there, sure. :) |
| 21:33:46 | Neo|Work | kergoth: yes |
| 21:33:57 | Neo|Work | EonGames.conf, normal "Config" format |
| 21:34:04 | Neo|Work | in /home/root/Settings |
| 21:34:10 | kergoth | Neo|Work: cool, i like the idea |
| 21:34:12 | Neo|Work | with documented flags |
| 21:34:33 | Neo|Work | because I find that, especially on say OPIE on ipaq, you might HAVE to grab the keys to be able to configure all keys needed |
| 21:34:35 | warmi | how about a flag named "registered=0" |
| 21:34:37 | warmi | hehehe |
| 21:34:39 | [DrEvil] | is a cocktail a specific type of drink? |
| 21:34:49 | Neo|Work | warmi: GREAT IDEA! :) |
| 21:34:58 | tux_mike | evil: it's any mixed drink |
| 21:35:28 | Neo|Work | but I figured a GUI is EASY to make so I might as well make one and ship it with all my games |
| 21:35:32 | Neo|Work | or perhaps separately |
| 21:35:37 | [George] | i'm off |
| 21:35:43 | warmi | well, doesn't even have to be "drinkable" ( eg ... Molotov Coctail) |
| 21:35:46 | Neo|Work | but what I am worried about is, for downloads, make a zip file |
| 21:35:50 | kergoth | warmi: lol |
| 21:35:56 | Neo|Work | will people handle that fine in general? |
| 21:35:57 | kergoth | warmi: good point |
| 21:36:14 | Neo|Work | Does tkc use zip files for it's stuff (since it has the library too)? |
| 21:37:19 | Neo|Work | BTW, after a long wait Interstellar Flames grows near |
| 21:38:04 | kergoth | nice neo |
| 21:38:07 | jarjarbinks | hey |
| 21:38:25 | jarjarbinks | is the new rom out yet? |
| 21:38:52 | kergoth | man now i can bitch at at&t from work! |
| 21:38:53 | jarjarbinks | the oz rom? |
| 21:38:55 | kergoth | curses at&t |
| 21:38:57 | kergoth | jarjarbinks: yes |
| 21:39:06 | jarjarbinks | cool thx |
| 21:39:08 | kergoth | jarjarbinks: it doesnt sync anymore though due to a security patch's effects |
| 21:39:18 | kergoth | jarjarbinks: i'll have a maintainance release out soon that reverts it |
| 21:39:21 | kergoth | heh |
| 21:41:30 | warmi | http://www.killefiz.de/zaurus/showdetail.php?app=327 |
| 21:41:41 | warmi | that has to be the most expensive Zaurus app so far |
| 21:42:11 | warmi | very specialized though |
| 21:43:00 | Neo|Work | warmi: wtf is it? :) |
| 21:43:13 | warmi | NeoTron: barcode scanner interface .. |
| 21:43:15 | warmi | I thin |
| 21:43:18 | warmi | think |
| 21:43:31 | Neo|Work | aha |
| 21:43:46 | Neo|Work | the "scan" in scanchamp might impy that |
| 21:44:33 | warmi | "ScanChamp(tm) Professional povides extreamly quick, easy, and robust way to program, or read scans from the CS-1504 and CS-2000 using any computing platform supported by SerialPort." |
| 21:44:46 | tux_mike | one sale makes up for their SDK :) |
| 21:44:56 | Neo|Work | riht |
| 21:45:12 | Neo|Work | but it doesn't specify what CS-1504 and CS-2000 is. :) |
| 21:45:30 | warmi | uh .. it is a Java app |
| 21:45:34 | warmi | phew |
| 21:45:44 | Neo|Work | probably multi-platform yes |
| 21:45:47 | tux_mike | well, if you don't know, you obviously dont need it |
| 21:45:53 | Neo|Work | way too involved to be a Zaurus binary app imho. :) |
| 21:45:55 | warmi | "let's go home ... nothing interesting here " |
| 21:46:00 | Neo|Work | I've noticed a bunch of apps like that |
| 21:46:13 | tux_mike | warmi: well, i guess they didn't need to make up the money |
| 21:46:19 | warmi | hehe |
| 21:46:23 | warmi | I am just kidding |
| 21:46:39 | warmi | this is the kind of app . Sharp needs to make it on the corporate market |
| 21:47:31 | sjohnson | Neo|Work: IIRC, Those CS-* are handheld Symbol Barcode scanners |
| 21:47:50 | warmi | blah .. weekend is here |
| 21:47:54 | warmi | time to go home |
| 21:47:59 | warmi | see you later |
| 21:59:10 | kergoth`work | im out |
| 22:01:03 | noda | Is there a free Ogg Vorbis player for the Zaurus? |
| 22:01:13 | Oriumpor | libvorbis right? |
| 22:01:26 | noda | Er... dunno, that's why I'ma sking :P |
| 22:01:56 | noda | So far all I can see is http://www.thekompany.com/embedded/tkcplayer/ -- I love the quote "but Ogg doesn't have any nasty license restrictions" when they charge $9.99 for it ;) |
| 22:02:36 | BigBoss | noda: how about shelling out $10 and helping to support Ogg? |
| 22:02:42 | BigBoss | part of the price goes back to Xiph |
| 22:02:54 | noda | BigBoss: But that costs $10 :) |
| 22:03:38 | noda | Honorable as The Kompany is, I still prefer free software :) |
| 22:05:27 | Neo|Work | the 9.99 is partially because it's using a good integer version of the codec made by Xiph |
| 22:05:37 | noda | That's what I figured. |
| 22:06:45 | noda | So I take it there's no other player so far... hrm. Sounds like a challenge ;) |
| 22:06:45 | Neo|Work | if I every used my zarus to play media (which I do not) I'd buy it probably |
| 22:06:55 | Neo|Work | there are |
| 22:07:02 | noda | For the zaurus? |
| 22:07:02 | Neo|Work | like command line prompt ones |
| 22:07:15 | Neo|Work | ogg123 ... |
| 22:07:15 | Neo|Work | yes |
| 22:07:24 | Neo|Work | but I don't know quality, source, performance etc |
| 22:07:26 | noda | And they decode realtime? |
| 22:07:27 | noda | Oh. |
| 22:07:40 | BigBoss | noda: what do you do for a living? |
| 22:07:47 | noda | BigBoss: Network Admin, why? |
| 22:07:55 | BigBoss | do you charge for your work? |
| 22:08:00 | noda | BigBoss: Yes. |
| 22:08:07 | BigBoss | then you've made my case |
| 22:08:36 | noda | BigBoss: I never said I don't code for free. |
| 22:08:36 | inomine | hi all |
| 22:08:49 | Neo|Work | I understand both sides in this discussion for sure. On one hand I know and support selling software, on the other hand I know and support opensource/freeware type stuff |
| 22:08:57 | noda | BigBoss: I have nothing at all against the Kompany. But I prefer GPL. |
| 22:09:41 | BigBoss | Neo: that is exactly what we do, but if people never want to pay for stuff, then the support of the free stuff is gonna go away |
| 22:09:45 | BigBoss | *someone* pays for it |
| 22:09:49 | BigBoss | somehow |
| 22:10:03 | inomine | i like the transgaming.com policy if heres the source for free but if you want it in a nice packe you need to pay |
| 22:10:05 | BigBoss | GPL for applications blows major donkey weenie |
| 22:10:17 | noda | Hehehe. I most heartily disagree. |
| 22:10:31 | Neo|Work | However transgaming adds value to the binary version |
| 22:10:38 | noda | And consequently, I have a fully functional and full-featured computer software system for a grand total of $0. |
| 22:10:47 | Neo|Work | so perhaps a free tkcPlayer but pay if you want codec support? :-))) |
| 22:11:10 | inomine | yeah ok know and something like that is cool, a lite free ver and a full blown ver you have to pay for |
| 22:11:36 | BigBoss | noda: there is no model where a GPL commercial app is going to make a profit |
| 22:11:37 | noda | Neo|Work: I dunno, I think it's all-or-nothing with that kind of app. It's certainly not a large project (though of course I'm not talking from experience, just from screenshots) |
| 22:11:46 | noda | BigBoss: I never said there was :) |
| 22:11:55 | BigBoss | you just said you disagree |
| 22:12:18 | inomine | Neo|Work: you gonna do dragon bane 2 ? |
| 22:12:20 | BigBoss | sure we could give away tkcPlayer but it wouldn't do anything until you paid for the codecs |
| 22:12:31 | BigBoss | or you can just pay for the app with the codecs in it already |
| 22:12:45 | BigBoss | but then we couldn't make the app GPL because it uses commercial codecs |
| 22:12:57 | inomine | let ppl develop theyre own codecs :) |
| 22:12:59 | noda | BigBoss: I disagreed that GPL for applications blows major donkey weenie :) |
| 22:13:17 | treke | GPL for applications you want to sell blows major donkey weenie |
| 22:13:30 | noda | That's the difference, a most important one. |
| 22:14:00 | Neo|Work | inomine: perhaps so |
| 22:14:30 | Neo|Work | and btw, I was pretty much not serious. :) |
| 22:14:48 | inomine | :) |
| 22:15:12 | Morgaine | ROFL. When will people learn that you can't sell personal apps anymore in the open arena, only corporate ones. That time is long gone. |
| 22:15:50 | treke | Morgaine: tell that to microsoft :) |
| 22:15:59 | noda | BigBoss: Also, you're the second person from that organization to try and push software on me after I made it rather clear I wasn't interested. Or at least, that's my impression :) |
| 22:16:04 | Morgaine | I said in the open arena |
| 22:16:07 | inomine | i think the biggest problem with gnu/linux is that ppl will want ALL apps to be free and realisticly that is not going to happen, so we have to accept that we HAVE to pay for software but just not extorcionate prices |
| 22:16:10 | treke | Morgaine: good point :) |
| 22:16:21 | treke | doesnt mind paying for software |
| 22:16:22 | noda | inomine: That's because realistically it CAN happen :) |
| 22:16:27 | noda | inomine: Which is the entire point. |
| 22:16:33 | treke | I just want source I can modify |
| 22:16:41 | BigBoss | noda: it can't and it won't |
| 22:16:47 | Neo|Work | inomine: indeed |
| 22:16:47 | noda | BigBoss: Only time will tell :) |
| 22:16:52 | BigBoss | you ever notice how many OSS apps never hit 1.0? |
| 22:17:08 | noda | Ever notice how version numbers mean absolutely nothing? |
| 22:17:08 | Rince | is still waiting for a news client for the Zaurus... |
| 22:17:16 | BigBoss | you know how many people tell me they are going to do an OSS version of one of our apps and give it away and put us out of business? and of course nothing ever happens |
| 22:17:37 | BigBoss | a huge majority of OSS apps are never finished because they are written for fun and the final 10% is not fun |
| 22:17:38 | treke | a better question would be how many oss apps reach a level equivalent to 1.0 commercial software |
| 22:17:46 | BigBoss | and if you aren't getting paid, why do it for fun? |
| 22:17:53 | inomine | i would dearly love for there to be a pro class 3d graphics app for linux but that will never happen as the devolpmetn time and effort is huge. hence i have to use 3dmax under windows |
| 22:17:56 | noda | treke: If you're comparing to Windows, for example... lots ;) |
| 22:18:01 | BigBoss | why rely on the sweat of others with no contribution of your own? |
| 22:18:12 | Morgaine | You'll be able to sell a few copies to those people that want a printed manual and a pretty CDROM. You won't be able to sell just the software though, or at least not enough to make a profit. Make corporate apps for profit, you're never going to make useful money from personal peeps' wallets. |
| 22:18:20 | BigBoss | inomine: and there are good starts like k3studio, but they never get done |
| 22:18:33 | BigBoss | I have one app we sell that is GPL, and it does pretty well overall |
| 22:18:46 | BigBoss | but it's a pain to deal with the license zealots - not at all worth it |
| 22:18:55 | noda | BigBoss: Isn't that exactly what TheKompany does? It wouldn't *be* without Linux (and KDE, iirc)... doesn't that mean that at least to some extent it is taking advantage of free software? |
| 22:19:09 | BigBoss | noda: except that we also give back |
| 22:19:25 | Neo|Work | inomine: there are a couple of professional 3D apps for Linux |
| 22:19:27 | Neo|Work | just not free |
| 22:19:29 | BigBoss | we have free projects and free apps and we work on kde as well |
| 22:19:33 | Neo|Work | but they sure as heck exist |
| 22:19:44 | BigBoss | that is how we pay back |
| 22:19:51 | BigBoss | what do you pay back? |
| 22:19:53 | Neo|Work | Linux is starting to get a foothold in traditional SGI markets in this case |
| 22:20:03 | noda | Bug reports, minor hacks, testing, etc. |
| 22:20:03 | inomine | yeah i know |
| 22:20:06 | Neo|Work | unless, of course, you mean free |
| 22:20:15 | BigBoss | noda: yea, sure |
| 22:20:15 | noda | Hopefully more code in the future. |
| 22:20:18 | Neo|Work | then yes, it's nothing you'd get for free |
| 22:20:22 | inomine | but as soon as i shell out 3000 for max... theres no money left :( |
| 22:20:24 | Neo|Work | way to much time and money needed |
| 22:20:28 | noda | BigBoss: Erm. You saying I'm a liar? |
| 22:20:30 | Rascal | DAMN 14.95 for tckEditor |
| 22:20:44 | BigBoss | think of how much it would cost you in hours to write tkcEditor? |
| 22:20:55 | Rascal | someone just needs to port vim to Zaurus |
| 22:20:59 | Morgaine | Professional/commercial is fine, money to be made. But to expect a large number of your typical Slashdotting teccies to pay cash is not realistic. |
| 22:21:02 | treke | Rascal: in progress :) |
| 22:21:03 | noda | Rascal: Bah, vi is enough! :P |
| 22:21:09 | Rascal | ty treke. |
| 22:21:10 | treke | Rascal: mark_ was doing it :) |
| 22:21:22 | Rascal | noda: I just miss my syntax highlighting |
| 22:21:23 | Neo|Work | Slashdotters are the bottom scrappings of the Linux society |
| 22:21:28 | treke | Rascal: he had kvim_ partially working |
| 22:21:29 | Neo|Work | unfortunately the ones that are heard the most too |
| 22:21:30 | noda | Rascal: Ah, good point :) |
| 22:21:34 | tux_mike | 14.95 is nothing. i'm broke and unemployed and i still payed it |
| 22:21:44 | BigBoss | a huge amount of the email we get is from people saying "I'm glad to pay for solid and supported software" |
| 22:21:53 | inomine | if linux is to gain a market foothold it needs proper apps and that means develpoment and that needs paying |
| 22:21:56 | BigBoss | you'll spend that going out to dinner once |
| 22:22:12 | noda | BigBoss: I agree. I never said it's not. I said I prefer my apps to be GPL. That's all. |
| 22:22:16 | BigBoss | but it's much better to wait a few months and try to convince other people to spend their free time to give you a free app |
| 22:22:41 | Rascal | boss the only problems I Have with the tkc-apps are there are no demos |
| 22:22:49 | BigBoss | noda: and you prefer to not pay for them either |
| 22:22:55 | inomine | yeah demos would be good |
| 22:22:57 | noda | BigBoss: Yes, wouldn't you? |
| 22:23:06 | Rascal | I don't mind paying just would like to try before I buy |
| 22:23:11 | BigBoss | GPL isn't really your issue then, it's a matter of paying |
| 22:23:38 | BigBoss | Rascal: there is a demo version of tkcRekall, but it's the only one at the moment - it's a matter of time and resources |
| 22:23:57 | Rascal | BigBoss: It's ok. I totally understand.. |
| 22:24:01 | Morgaine | Sigh, that's the old view of propietary systems and closed development. If you haven't accepted that it's been discreditted by Linux and the whole open movement, then nothing we say here will change your mind ;-) |
| 22:24:06 | BigBoss | but I suppose if I gave everything away and made it GPL, then people would give me money for no reason and then we could do it |
| 22:24:26 | noda | BigBoss: I prefer GPL. Nothing annoys me more than having an app that a friend sees and saying, "Well, it's illegal for me to give this to you." Or not being able to look at/modify the source (though I seem to recall TheKompany lets you do that, I've slightly forgotten) |
| 22:24:52 | BigBoss | 99% of our customers never crack the source, and that includes all the development tools. |
| 22:25:00 | BigBoss | it's a false argument for the most part |
| 22:25:24 | BigBoss | now what I'd like to see is RMS get married, have 2 kids, work 8 to 6 for 3 years and then come back and spout his workers paradise |
| 22:25:27 | noda | Well, I guess I'm part of the 1%. I often crack source code. |
| 22:26:02 | tux_mike | i want something that i know will work, and usually commercial softare is that something |
| 22:26:08 | Rascal | does anyone know where the data for the Calendar, todo list, and contacts are stored? |
| 22:26:22 | Rince | addressbook.xml |
| 22:26:26 | Rince | calendar.xml |
| 22:26:33 | Rascal | thx rince |
| 22:26:40 | shikala | Anyone know if the Sync settings in Security.cfg were enabled in 2.37? |
| 22:26:42 | tux_mike | 90% of all GPL software is crap. |
| 22:26:54 | noda | tux_mike: 95% of statistics are made up on the spot |
| 22:27:03 | inomine | 98 % all gpl software is abandonware |
| 22:27:16 | noda | See, I see that and I *laugh*. |
| 22:27:47 | BigBoss | you laugh because you know it is true |
| 22:27:51 | BigBoss | browse through sourceforge |
| 22:28:00 | treke | BigBoss: But not all of us care more about the app being free than getting the source. I've paid for a lot of software for linux, and usually I dont need to look at the source. On occaision I've wanted to though, and with gpl/other open source licenses I have that option. |
| 22:28:08 | noda | I've yet to see something Windows users who spend thousands of dollars do something I can't do on my system on which I have spent 0 dollars (besides annoying little things, like gifs and Sorensen). Mine looks nicer, too. |
| 22:28:10 | tux_mike | try some of the crap on sf. you'll soon know what i mean |
| 22:28:17 | inomine | ok not that much but i do wish pl would COLABORATE rather than start on their own little plan to chanhe the world |
| 22:28:17 | Morgaine | 99% of all software is crap, not just the GPL stuff. At least you get to see the GPL crap for what it is. |
| 22:28:27 | treke | It may not make sense to sell a gpl app, but dont discount that for some people that matters |
| 22:28:27 | tux_mike | i cannot find a decent IM client that does what i want it to do. |
| 22:28:34 | shikala | oh crap...here it comes...Good Z discussion guys... |
| 22:28:38 | BigBoss | use tkJabber under Aethera |
| 22:28:40 | noda | tux_mike: Ever seen freshmeat.net? That is a nice big list, daily, of software which is NOT abandonware. |
| 22:28:45 | noda | tux_mike: gaim |
| 22:28:46 | noda | gaim.sf.net |
| 22:29:08 | Morgaine | He's right, this is the wrong forum for this. Let's stick to Z stuff. |
| 22:29:13 | Rascal | isnt mozilla gpl? |
| 22:29:19 | tux_mike | gaim doesnt work unless i am in gnome. plus i don't like the way it works |
| 22:29:22 | noda | No, it's Mozilla Public License. But they're compatible |
| 22:29:27 | BigBoss | yea, what bugs me most about OSS is you can't get people to work together, they'd prefer to start the 50th CD burner for KDE because their idea is better than the other 49 |
| 22:29:30 | noda | tux_mike: It works great for me in KDE and blackbox. And it's themeable :) |
| 22:29:32 | treke | tux_mike: gaim works without gnome |
| 22:29:49 | inomine | noda: i can do radiosity rendering from a object orientated 3d modeler with v high quality output |
| 22:30:49 | BigBoss | thank goodness |
| 22:30:56 | inomine | :) |
| 22:31:00 | tux_mike | treke: well, i just never liked the feel of the app |
| 22:31:11 | treke | tux_mike: fair enough |
| 22:31:43 | tux_mike | closest thing i like is kopete, but it's buggy and drops my AIM connection without telling me |
| 22:31:51 | inomine | plz lets not start a gnome vs kde argument now |
| 22:32:15 | tux_mike | inomine: i'm talking about IM clients, but if you want to go there.... :) |
| 22:32:27 | inomine | :) |
| 22:32:32 | BigBoss | seriously our tkJabber plug if for Aethera is really cool |
| 22:33:08 | tux_mike | how is aethera coming along. i haven't tried it in almost a year, since evolution became stable first :) |
| 22:33:42 | BigBoss | we had a new beta last week and it's really looking sweet |
| 22:33:45 | BigBoss | lots of cool new features |
| 22:33:50 | tux_mike | really doesn't like the open source or nothing type people |
| 22:34:06 | BigBoss | like in the contact system you click on their address and it pulls it up in mapquest |
| 22:34:16 | tux_mike | BigBoss: does it work with IMAP well |
| 22:34:33 | BigBoss | yep |
| 22:34:39 | BigBoss | has SSL as well |
| 22:34:58 | zecke | wonders about the ssl version... |
| 22:35:04 | tux_mike | i'll try it out next week and see if i like it :) |
| 22:35:13 | tux_mike | is it QT or KDE? |
| 22:35:21 | BigBoss | Qt |
| 22:35:26 | tux_mike | hrmmm |
| 22:35:52 | BigBoss | now who remembers that Aethera was a fork of Magellan? |
| 22:36:04 | tux_mike | i would like it to follow my KDE style :) |
| 22:36:12 | tux_mike | magellan? never heard of it |
| 22:36:13 | BigBoss | Aethera would have been done a year ago if we had started from scratch instead of using that crap code |
| 22:36:19 | zecke | tux_mike: use qtconfig |
| 22:36:22 | Rascal | does opie-mail work for anyone else? |
| 22:36:37 | tux_mike | opie-mail is obsolete |
| 22:36:37 | BigBoss | Magellan was supposed to be the savior - we worked with the author for months and he suddenly pulled everything, so we forked it |
| 22:36:56 | BigBoss | some people were upset, but Magellan then disappeared a year ago, and AEthera is still alive |
| 22:36:56 | Rascal | tux_mike: what's being used currently? |
| 22:36:56 | tux_mike | opie-mail2 is the current. but it's not usable, save for sending messages |
| 22:36:59 | BigBoss | so we saved it |
| 22:37:26 | Rascal | tux_mike: opie-mail2 only accepts imap mail |
| 22:37:38 | treke | in theory it does :) |
| 22:37:46 | tux_mike | BigBoss: did you make aethera extensible, i.e. alternative options for contact store and calendar and the like? |
| 22:38:18 | tux_mike | Rascal: switch to imap. it's better. :) anyway, that's the current opie-mail, it only does imap. doesn't fully work |
| 22:38:21 | BigBoss | actually Aethera is really cool in terms of the technology we developed for it and how it is implemented - let me give you an example |
| 22:38:39 | BigBoss | the calendar is actually KOrganizer |
| 22:38:51 | BigBoss | we made code so that it will work on Windows under Aethera as well |
| 22:38:53 | tux_mike | yay! updated tkcEditor has *tabs*!!! :) |
| 22:39:01 | Rascal | I don't think my current mail servers use imap but I can try to find out |
| 22:39:05 | BigBoss | it looks like a native component of Aethera, but is the original code |
| 22:39:12 | BigBoss | we are looking at doing that with knode as well |
| 22:39:23 | BigBoss | this is part of that whole cooperation thing |
| 22:39:45 | BigBoss | could hardly get anyone interested in it because we were a company, even though the app is GPL, so we had to do almost all of it ourselves |
| 22:40:07 | tux_mike | BigBoss: well, for now, i'd like to set something up that has my contacts in an LDAP database |
| 22:40:35 | Neo|Work | likes the tux_mike type people who doesn't like the OSS or nothing type people. :) |
| 22:41:06 | BigBoss | agrees |
| 22:41:08 | tux_mike | neo: :) |
| 22:41:23 | Oriumpor | wow... simplecdr-x is pretty good |
| 22:41:26 | BigBoss | mike: I can't remember what the deal is with ldap and aethera, we discussed so many different things |
| 22:41:42 | tux_mike | if it wasn't for commercial software we wouldn't have the tech we have now |
| 22:41:49 | Oriumpor | tux_mike: true enough |
| 22:41:51 | treke | ooh tabs in tkcEditor? |
| 22:41:55 | treke | reinstalls it |
| 22:42:25 | tux_mike | and let's face it, windows had one hell of a part of computers, even though it is an evil thing. kinda like gollum in LotR:TTT |
| 22:42:25 | Rascal | tux_mike: there are exceptions |
| 22:42:40 | tux_mike | rascal: i'm speaking as a whole |
| 22:43:17 | Rascal | tux_mike: ok |
| 22:43:39 | BigBoss | we have tabs? I thought we always had tabs |
| 22:43:42 | tux_mike | zecke: ping |
| 22:43:44 | BigBoss | shit, I can't keep up with all of it |
| 22:43:50 | tux_mike | BigBoss: tab char when you press tab key |
| 22:43:54 | Oriumpor | speaking from a purely philisophical point of view... I'd say, without windows. We wouldn't have the market penetration needed for linux to be successful |
| 22:43:56 | tux_mike | first thing i complained about :) |
| 22:44:05 | BigBoss | mike: did people want that? |
| 22:44:07 | Oriumpor | that is... at least on the x86 processor |
| 22:44:23 | tux_mike | BigBoss: i know i did, i do all my code with tabs, not spaces |
| 22:44:28 | treke | now when can we get a themeless version of it :) |
| 22:44:32 | Oriumpor | if it weren't for gates we'd either be running big blue... or Imacs |
| 22:44:40 | treke | than I'll be happy as a puppy with two peters |
| 22:44:42 | BigBoss | it's not a theme - it's a style :) |
| 22:44:46 | zecke | tux_mike: pong |
| 22:44:49 | tux_mike | treke: good question :) i like a common style |
| 22:44:51 | BigBoss | seriously, other than the scroll bar, what is different? |
| 22:45:02 | BigBoss | only use tkc apps and you will have a common style |
| 22:45:04 | treke | BigBoss: Colorscheme |
| 22:45:05 | tux_mike | zecke: with qtconfig, can i tell it to use a kde-style? |
| 22:45:07 | Neo|Work | Oriumpor: if it wasn't for Gates we'd have no idea what the world would be today actually |
| 22:45:11 | treke | hehehe now thats an idea |
| 22:45:22 | Neo|Work | might have been better, might have been worse, might have been the same |
| 22:45:23 | tux_mike | BigBoss: you won't because you need to use qpe to launch them :P |
| 22:45:25 | zecke | tux_mike: yup set the Plugin dir to $KDEDIR/lib/plugins |
| 22:45:32 | tux_mike | zecke: cool :) |
| 22:45:34 | zecke | tux_mike: and then you're able to use KDE Styles |
| 22:45:36 | treke | I actually use a rather dark color scheme so its odd switching to a grey application |
| 22:45:53 | zecke | tux_mike: and move the window inside qt config and follow the white rabbit |
| 22:46:16 | treke | BigBoss: If you got it to respect the running color scheme, that would also be fine |
| 22:47:00 | tux_mike | now all i need to do is get a graphic artist to do my leaves ;) |
| 22:49:08 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: true enough |
| 22:49:26 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: I'd probably still have a sparc at home tho |
| 22:50:48 | siriusnova | wassup |
| 22:50:59 | siriusnova | BigBoss when are you releasing new stuff? |
| 22:51:10 | siriusnova | and when do i get a free app? =P |
| 22:51:12 | Neo|Work | I'm actually about to get a couple of sun's for free |
| 22:51:22 | siriusnova | Neo send some my way |
| 22:51:25 | BigBoss | next week we've got some stuff |
| 22:51:31 | siriusnova | BigBoss like what? |
| 22:51:31 | BigBoss | put tkcToDo into beta today |
| 22:51:33 | treke | anything cool next week? |
| 22:51:34 | inomine | yes plz do |
| 22:51:38 | Neo|Work | speed monsters too. Sparc 20 and, I think and IPC, IPX or similar. :) |
| 22:51:39 | tux_mike | neo: good suns? |
| 22:51:44 | siriusnova | heh |
| 22:51:47 | BigBoss | so that should be done next week as tkcVideo (finally got the memory leak) |
| 22:51:52 | tux_mike | wow :) |
| 22:51:59 | siriusnova | kewl |
| 22:52:04 | siriusnova | what can tkcvideo play? |
| 22:52:11 | inomine | BigBoss: when is something that can play divx gonna come out... then my money is yours |
| 22:52:20 | siriusnova | yeah seriousaly |
| 22:52:26 | Neo|Work | so personally I'm releasing PurpleBlaster and RocketElite perhaps this week |
| 22:52:36 | treke | and bundle it with tkcBatteryEnlarger |
| 22:52:36 | Neo|Work | then Interstellar Flames soon thereafter I hope |
| 22:52:37 | siriusnova | nothing like mounting my divx dir over via samba |
| 22:52:39 | BigBoss | inomine: that is tkcVideo, next week |
| 22:52:47 | siriusnova | then watching divx pr0n on my Z |
| 22:52:50 | siriusnova | in a boring meeting |
| 22:52:51 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 22:52:52 | inomine | BigBoss: how much? |
| 22:53:04 | tux_mike | siriusnova: good thing there is no speaker on the Z |
| 22:53:06 | Neo|Work | siriusnova: bah, play fun games instead. |
| 22:53:08 | siriusnova | lol Neo |
| 22:53:14 | BigBoss | actually haven't settled on a price yet - what sounds fair for mpeg1, mpeg2, avi, mpeg4, divx - maybe some other stuff |
| 22:53:19 | siriusnova | $1 |
| 22:53:19 | Neo|Work | even though I wonder how people can actually do stuff like that and get away with it. :P |
| 22:53:23 | siriusnova | actually |
| 22:53:26 | siriusnova | i should get it for free |
| 22:53:27 | tux_mike | three fiddy |
| 22:53:34 | siriusnova | since Ive spent way too much money on your company hehe |
| 22:53:36 | siriusnova | =P |
| 22:53:40 | Neo|Work | BigBoss: what I would pay is nothing because to me that is worthless on the Zaurus. :-))) |
| 22:53:49 | treke | BigBoss: 30-35 sounds fair to me |
| 22:53:54 | siriusnova | treke are u nuts |
| 22:54:01 | siriusnova | cant afford $30 bucks |
| 22:54:06 | siriusnova | id say 9.95 |
| 22:54:08 | siriusnova | ;) |
| 22:54:11 | Neo|Work | so make it 16.95 and it's all good :P |
| 22:54:11 | inomine | ill pay $10 for it |
| 22:54:16 | BigBoss | treke is close to what I'm thinking |
| 22:54:22 | siriusnova | yeah $10 bucks seems to be abour right |
| 22:54:24 | BigBoss | the same apps on PocketPC are $50 or more |
| 22:54:28 | siriusnova | how about $19.95 |
| 22:54:33 | inomine | pocketdivx is free.... |
| 22:54:36 | siriusnova | yeah |
| 22:54:39 | siriusnova | you cant beat that |
| 22:54:40 | BigBoss | so use that then |
| 22:54:45 | inomine | ;( |
| 22:54:48 | siriusnova | no port on the Z :( |
| 22:54:51 | tux_mike | lol |
| 22:54:53 | tux_mike | then port it |
| 22:54:54 | treke | siriusnova: so port it |
| 22:55:08 | siriusnova | I couldnt write a hello world program in basic to save my life |
| 22:55:11 | siriusnova | =P |
| 22:55:12 | inomine | dejavu any1? |
| 22:55:19 | tux_mike | then learn some coding :) |
| 22:55:23 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 22:55:28 | siriusnova | u suck =P |
| 22:55:29 | BigBoss | you have any idea how freaking hard it was to get those codecs working with no floating point? |
| 22:55:40 | siriusnova | 19.95 |
| 22:55:44 | siriusnova | is a good price me thinks |
| 22:55:48 | siriusnova | if it plays without dropping frames |
| 22:55:58 | Neo|Work | I think anything over $20 will be a hard sell in the Zaurus |
| 22:55:59 | inomine | at a bitrate of 200... |
| 22:56:04 | tux_mike | throws "Teach yourself C in 21 days" "C in 24 hours" and "ANSI C++ in 21 days" at siriusnova |
| 22:56:15 | siriusnova | yeah more then $20 is gonna be a hard sell |
| 22:56:29 | siriusnova | reads the books and cries |
| 22:56:48 | Neo|Work | So, what are good, advanced Java books? |
| 22:56:52 | BigBoss | but you'll spend hundreds on the porn to watch on it :) |
| 22:57:06 | inomine | lol |
| 22:57:08 | Neo|Work | i.e not JAva in 21 days but java for someone like me with plenty of C, C++ and Pike skills |
| 22:57:08 | tux_mike | i got more for other languages, java, php, sql, linux app dev, and much more |
| 22:57:08 | siriusnova | not really |
| 22:57:18 | siriusnova | i leech all my pr0n off of Gnutella |
| 22:57:35 | Neo|Work | man, portable porn so valuable eh? :) |
| 22:57:36 | tux_mike | neo: i dunno |
| 22:57:42 | tux_mike | i don't like java |
| 22:58:18 | Neo|Work | I want/need to learn it |
| 22:58:23 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: alt.binaries.ebooks.technical |
| 22:58:24 | Neo|Work | both for work and because it's time |
| 22:58:33 | Neo|Work | Oriumpor: I don't like ebooks for learning |
| 22:58:54 | siriusnova | Neo, you got a printer? :) |
| 22:58:54 | Neo|Work | until there is a good book-format reader that has black text on white background without flicker or glare that is |
| 22:58:59 | tux_mike | java's a good idea, bad implementation |
| 22:59:01 | Neo|Work | yeah, not usable. :) |
| 22:59:04 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 22:59:10 | Neo|Work | for this |
| 22:59:12 | siriusnova | I use my Univs Computer Lab printer |
| 22:59:17 | siriusnova | print out 500 pages |
| 22:59:19 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 22:59:35 | siriusnova | print 100 pages on each printer |
| 22:59:40 | siriusnova | and then collect from all 5 |
| 22:59:53 | tux_mike | lol |
| 22:59:58 | Neo|Work | hrm. Amazon.com has book page samples now. quite a good idea really |
| 23:00:10 | treke | Neo|Work: yeah, its rather cool |
| 23:00:14 | Neo|Work | damn. Core Java, chapter 4: Objects and classes |
| 23:00:14 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: background.colour(white)^H^H^H^H^H^Hblack) textfont.colour(black)^H^H^H^H^H^Hwhite) |
| 23:00:26 | Neo|Work | chapter 4 is the first object chapter in a JAVA BOOK?! |
| 23:00:29 | Neo|Work | what the fuck |
| 23:00:37 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: TIJ is a good one |
| 23:00:42 | Oriumpor | thinking in java |
| 23:00:51 | Oriumpor | chapter 1 OOP |
| 23:00:53 | Neo|Work | I need something heavier than that. :) |
| 23:00:54 | treke | trys out rekall |
| 23:01:00 | tux_mike | yah, the thinking in C++ was really good |
| 23:01:15 | darienm | likes rekall |
| 23:01:17 | Neo|Work | I learned C++ from "The C++ Programming Language" |
| 23:01:49 | tux_mike | i learned C++ from a class at school. i learned reall C++ from thinking in C++ :) |
| 23:01:53 | Neo|Work | so is there "The Java Programming Language"? :) |
| 23:02:04 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: java.sun.com/apis.html |
| 23:02:05 | Neo|Work | good one there |
| 23:02:07 | treke | tkerekall looks kinda cool, and I've got some stuff I'd like to do with it. Bordering on too pricy though :) |
| 23:02:15 | Neo|Work | Oriumpor: yeah, but in book form please. :) |
| 23:02:34 | Neo|Work | maybe I'll stop by the book store and browse some |
| 23:02:51 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: Advanced Java Programming is like 160 bucks |
| 23:03:08 | Oriumpor | I'm sure the book you're looking for is comparable |
| 23:03:13 | Neo|Work | fuck man |
| 23:03:24 | Neo|Work | even though I'm guessing work will pay |
| 23:03:30 | BigBoss | treke: it's a freaking RAD IDE for database development |
| 23:03:30 | inomine | eek what is it printed on gold leaf??? |
| 23:03:36 | BigBoss | works on local or remote databases |
| 23:03:37 | Oriumpor | Neo|Work: take an ebook to kinkos :P |
| 23:03:43 | BigBoss | develop or deploy on your Z or desktop |
| 23:03:48 | BigBoss | SHEESH :) |
| 23:03:50 | treke | BigBoss: I know. Its a matter of justifying using it vs the web based interface to myself :) |
| 23:04:10 | treke | BigBoss: I know its a fair price, its just wether or not its that valuable to me |
| 23:04:40 | BigBoss | of course it is - if you don't buy it, we both loose money :) |
| 23:04:44 | siriusnova | haha |
| 23:05:05 | treke | uh oh. Is big boss gonna jack me if I dont buy it? |
| 23:05:13 | treke | :) |
| 23:05:14 | Oriumpor | is clueless on rekall and would like to know what it is |
| 23:05:18 | siriusnova | I dunno |
| 23:05:23 | treke | Oriumpor: Think MS Access |
| 23:05:23 | BigBoss | www.thekompany.com/products/rekall |
| 23:05:23 | siriusnova | hehe |
| 23:05:29 | Oriumpor | ohhhh |
| 23:05:30 | treke | but with a decent programming language |
| 23:05:30 | Oriumpor | ok |
| 23:05:30 | BigBoss | using Python as a scripting language |
| 23:05:35 | Oriumpor | sweet |
| 23:05:42 | BigBoss | and selectable databases, it doesn't have a native database, it has a default |
| 23:05:48 | siriusnova | so its basically a database front end |
| 23:05:49 | BigBoss | does xbase by default, mysql and postgresql |
| 23:05:58 | tux_mike | treke: think MS Access, but implemented well :) |
| 23:06:00 | BigBoss | full forms development and scripting |
| 23:06:03 | BigBoss | thanks mike :) |
| 23:06:09 | kergoth | curses at&t some |
| 23:06:15 | siriusnova | thats tite |
| 23:06:15 | BigBoss | also see www.thekompany.com/embedded/tkcrekall |
| 23:06:17 | bipolar | hiya everyone |
| 23:06:25 | BigBoss | hey, bipolar |
| 23:06:36 | kergoth | BigBoss: i should buy that to design the iddb thing. ;-) |
| 23:06:40 | tux_mike | kergoth: i got a fix for your cable problems :) |
| 23:06:41 | treke | hmm, I beter rename this python package :) |
| 23:06:45 | kergoth | tux_mike: dsl? |
| 23:06:45 | kergoth | heh |
| 23:06:49 | tux_mike | quite :) |
| 23:06:50 | Oriumpor | at&t rock... for wireless, in like a 20 mile radius around their points of sales... |
| 23:06:51 | BigBoss | kergoth: it would make things easier for you I'm sure :) |
| 23:06:54 | kergoth | tux_mike: cant get dsl here |
| 23:06:58 | tux_mike | pu |
| 23:07:03 | tux_mike | too far? |
| 23:07:03 | BigBoss | DataArchitect is also good in that regard (another of our products) |
| 23:07:05 | kergoth | i wanted to.. |
| 23:07:05 | kergoth | yeaha |
| 23:07:07 | kergoth | eyah |
| 23:07:11 | kergoth | jeeze screw typing |
| 23:07:14 | BigBoss | it does ERD's and generates scripts for designs and all that fun stuff |
| 23:07:17 | kergoth | oh nice |
| 23:07:25 | tux_mike | or is your phone company a bunch of retards too? |
| 23:07:27 | Oriumpor | yeah typing is for newbies |
| 23:07:32 | kergoth | i usually use vim & mental imagery for database design. hehe |
| 23:07:37 | tux_mike | thinks the words in |
| 23:08:00 | Oriumpor | I really like the laser mouse... I just wish they were cheaper |
| 23:08:06 | tux_mike | but i have to have my fingers on the keyboard in order to make it work for some odd reason :)_ |
| 23:08:09 | Oriumpor | and less ugly when you put em on your monitor |
| 23:08:13 | treke | hmmm, installing this is gonna be tough. 8 megs free :) |
| 23:08:33 | tux_mike | treke: that better be on your Z :) |
| 23:08:39 | BigBoss | darien gave me a script and instructions for getting it on SD |
| 23:08:45 | BigBoss | I need to load those in the demo directory |
| 23:08:47 | BigBoss | I'll do that now |
| 23:09:30 | kergoth | decides to try building a arm crosscompiler toolchain in cygwin again |
| 23:09:39 | Oriumpor | anyone remember the market title for those things? |
| 23:09:43 | tux_mike | ducks and covers |
| 23:10:02 | treke | kergoth: I sense some violence |
| 23:10:04 | treke | hides |
| 23:10:15 | kergoth | heheh |
| 23:10:21 | BigBoss | done |
| 23:10:26 | tux_mike | there is a great distubance in the force |
| 23:10:27 | kergoth | maybe i'll hit up the liquor store first ;-) |
| 23:10:29 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:10:35 | treke | BigBoss: any eta on a runtime environment? |
| 23:10:36 | tux_mike | good idea |
| 23:11:00 | BigBoss | treke: next month sometime, but we are going to charge for it, just not sure exactly how much or how many |
| 23:11:21 | treke | ah |
| 23:11:21 | BigBoss | kergoth: we already finished the IADB and tkcLush - we will release it tomorrow |
| 23:11:28 | tux_mike | BigBoss: a viewer for rekall? |
| 23:11:32 | kergoth | BigBoss: hah, i wish ;-) |
| 23:11:43 | BigBoss | mike: a run time so you don't have to have Rekall to run an app |
| 23:11:55 | BigBoss | we'll do it after we finish the 1.1 release of Rekal which is in beta now |
| 23:12:07 | tux_mike | hrm.. i guess that's better than just a viewer |
| 23:12:33 | BZFlag | ljp: qpe/ir.h ? |
| 23:12:34 | BigBoss | we're thinking like 10 or 20 for $50, and you get the first pack with your initial purchase |
| 23:12:59 | treke | sounds fair to me |
| 23:13:21 | tux_mike | BigBoss: can you distribute the rte+db? |
| 23:13:31 | BZFlag | ljp: hmm.. looks like it's there, but not found by my build. checking. |
| 23:13:36 | treke | particularly since I wouldnt have to by any extr rt licenses :) |
| 23:13:54 | darienm | treke: want a script to install tkcRekall mostly on SD and makes all symlinks? |
| 23:14:01 | treke | darienm: nope. no sd |
| 23:14:11 | darienm | treke: er, poop |
| 23:14:24 | siriusnova | man i love FreeBSD ;) |
| 23:14:25 | treke | one of these days I'll buy one |
| 23:14:36 | treke | so far I havent need it. I dont keep multimedia stuff |
| 23:14:42 | darienm | treke: any storage besides RAM ? |
| 23:14:47 | treke | darienm: nope |
| 23:14:55 | | hunger was last seen on #zaurus 6 hours, 9 minutes and 23 seconds ago, saying: kergoth: Congratulations! [Fri Jul 19 18:05:32 2002] |
| 23:14:55 | kergoth | ibot: seen hunger? |
| 23:15:02 | kergoth | hunger: ping |
| 23:15:12 | | owner is, like, zwampy |
| 23:15:12 | darienm | ibot owner |
| 23:15:16 | | zwampy was last seen on #tuxboxproject 1 days, 11 hours, 58 minutes and 10 seconds ago, saying: ibot seen travis [Thu Jul 18 12:17:06 2002] |
| 23:15:16 | darienm | ibot seen zwampy |
| 23:15:20 | darienm | omg |
| 23:15:23 | kergoth | woah |
| 23:15:31 | | siriusnova: what? |
| 23:15:31 | siriusnova | ibot FreeBSD kicks Linux arse |
| 23:15:33 | siriusnova | ;) |
| 23:15:37 | siriusnova | hides |
| 23:15:45 | | kergoth: I forgot owner |
| 23:15:45 | kergoth | ibot: forget owner |
| 23:15:47 | kergoth | hah |
| 23:15:53 | darienm | er |
| 23:15:55 | | OK, kergoth. |
| 23:15:55 | kergoth | ibot: owner is <reply> me! muahahaha! |
| 23:15:58 | | me! muahahaha! |
| 23:15:58 | kergoth | ibot: owner? |
| 23:16:02 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:16:07 | siriusnova | lol |
| 23:16:12 | | tux_mike: I forgot owner |
| 23:16:12 | tux_mike | ibot forget owner |
| 23:16:14 | darienm | :( |
| 23:16:16 | kergoth | lol |
| 23:16:31 | darienm | does that mean zwampy really wasn't the owner? |
| 23:16:32 | | OK, tux_mike. |
| 23:16:32 | tux_mike | ibot owner is TEH 1337 HAX0R! |
| 23:16:37 | kergoth | darienm: who knows |
| 23:16:41 | | ...but owner is TEH 1337 HAX0R!... |
| 23:16:41 | Rascal | ibot: owner is deez nutZ |
| 23:16:42 | tux_mike | hehehehe :) |
| 23:16:44 | kergoth | darienm: i'd say probably not |
| 23:16:54 | darienm | then who's running it ? |
| 23:16:58 | kergoth | no idea |
| 23:17:15 | | kergoth is available at mailto:kergoth@digitalnemesis.net |
| 23:17:15 | darienm | ibot kergoth |
| 23:17:30 | | zwampy is gay |
| 23:17:30 | darienm | ibot zwampy |
| 23:17:38 | kergoth | ha |
| 23:17:39 | darienm | * sigh * |
| 23:17:41 | | Since Mon Jul 15 23:58:12 2002, there have been 195 modifications and 501 questions. I have been awake for 4 days, 19 minutes, 29 seconds this session, and currently reference 6636 factoids. Addressing is in require mode. |
| 23:17:41 | kergoth | ibot: status? |
| 23:17:44 | kergoth | hm |
| 23:17:55 | | Since Mon Jul 15 23:58:12 2002, there have been 195 modifications and 502 questions. I have been awake for 4 days, 19 minutes, 43 seconds this session, and currently reference 6636 factoids. Addressing is in require mode. |
| 23:17:55 | zappin | ibot status |
| 23:18:10 | | siriusnova: i'm not following you... |
| 23:18:10 | siriusnova | ibot porn |
| 23:18:11 | | darienm: what? |
| 23:18:11 | darienm | ibot factoids |
| 23:18:23 | | i haven't a clue, siriusnova |
| 23:18:23 | siriusnova | ibot where do I find good porn |
| 23:18:28 | | head is HEAD |
| 23:18:28 | zappin | ibot head |
| 23:18:29 | | siriusnova: huh? |
| 23:18:29 | siriusnova | ibot you suck dick |
| 23:18:31 | siriusnova | =P |
| 23:18:43 | zappin | ibot is gay |
| 23:18:54 | | kergoth: I forgot owner |
| 23:18:54 | kergoth | ibot: forget owner |
| 23:19:15 | tux_mike | no leet hacker? :) |
| 23:19:16 | Neo|Work | tkcLush? like whee man. Not that I know whjat it is |
| 23:19:17 | | i think sex is updatedb; locate blonde; talk; date; cd; strip; look; touch; finger; unzip; uptime; gawk; ipkg install condom; mount; fsck; gasp; more; yes; yes; yes; more; umount; ipkg remove condom; make clean; sleep |
| 23:19:17 | zappin | ibot sex |
| 23:19:24 | | Speedy2 was last seen on #zaurus 5 hours, 3 minutes and 55 seconds ago, saying: kergoth: I know, I know! [Fri Jul 19 19:15:29 2002] |
| 23:19:24 | cdm | ibot: seen Speedy2 |
| 23:19:25 | | OK, kergoth. |
| 23:19:25 | kergoth | ibot: owner is me! muahahaha!|TEH 1337 HAX0R!|deez nutZ |
| 23:19:29 | | it has been said that owner is deez nutZ |
| 23:19:29 | kergoth | ibot: owner? |
| 23:19:31 | | owner is, like, deez nutZ |
| 23:19:31 | kergoth | ibot: owner? |
| 23:19:33 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:19:35 | | owner is deez nutZ |
| 23:19:35 | kergoth | ibot: owner? |
| 23:19:36 | kergoth | bitch |
| 23:19:38 | kergoth | be random |
| 23:19:42 | kergoth | beats ibot into submission |
| 23:19:52 | | it has been said that i am "the" bot around |
| 23:19:52 | tux_mike | ibot ibot |
| 23:20:03 | | sex is probably updatedb; locate blonde; talk; date; cd; strip; look; touch; finger; unzip; uptime; gawk; ipkg install condom; mount; fsck; gasp; more; yes; yes; yes; more; umount; ipkg remove condom; make clean; sleep |
| 23:20:03 | zappin | ibot sex |
| 23:20:13 | | zappin: i'm not following you... |
| 23:20:13 | zappin | ibot ipkg remove condom |
| 23:20:37 | | zappin: excuse me? |
| 23:20:37 | zappin | ibot locate blonde; |
| 23:20:50 | | siriusnova: huh? |
| 23:20:50 | siriusnova | ibot find us nerds with no lives some chicks |
| 23:20:55 | siriusnova | ;) |
| 23:21:00 | | zappin: huh? |
| 23:21:00 | zappin | ibot fuck you |
| 23:21:06 | | zappin: excuse me? |
| 23:21:06 | zappin | ibot fuck you |
| 23:21:15 | | OK, kergoth. |
| 23:21:15 | kergoth | ibot: find us nerds with no lives some chicks is <reply>Oh, like thats possible! |
| 23:21:23 | | Oh, like thats possible! |
| 23:21:23 | kergoth | ibot find us nerds with no lives some chicks |
| 23:21:26 | kergoth | hehehe |
| 23:21:28 | siriusnova | haha |
| 23:21:52 | br33zy | ls warmi |
| 23:21:58 | | tux_mike: i'm not following you... |
| 23:21:58 | tux_mike | ibot find me a vanilla coke |
| 23:22:09 | kergoth | bash: warmi: no such file or directory |
| 23:22:13 | kergoth | quotes ljp |
| 23:22:14 | kergoth | heh |
| 23:22:20 | br33zy | kergoth |
| 23:22:25 | br33zy | I was actually thinking |
| 23:22:25 | | OK, tux_mike. |
| 23:22:25 | tux_mike | ibot vanilla coke is your god |
| 23:22:31 | siriusnova | vanilla coke, is that any good? |
| 23:22:34 | br33zy | bash: warmi: No such person or person |
| 23:22:35 | siriusnova | ive thought about trying it |
| 23:22:39 | tux_mike | it's awesome :) |
| 23:22:39 | br33zy | I dont like viilla cokie |
| 23:22:41 | | rumour has it neotron is http://david.hedbor.org or http://eongames.com/ or mailto:david@eongames.com or mailto:david@hedbor.org |
| 23:22:41 | Neo|Work | ibot neotron |
| 23:22:43 | br33zy | vanilla coke |
| 23:22:53 | | kergoth: I forgot kergoth |
| 23:22:53 | kergoth | ibot: forget kergoth |
| 23:22:55 | treke | hmmm, rekall uses xbase |
| 23:22:58 | treke | has an idea |
| 23:23:03 | | bugger all, i dunno, br33zy |
| 23:23:03 | br33zy | ibot what time is it? |
| 23:23:06 | | OK, kergoth. |
| 23:23:06 | kergoth | ibot: kergoth is <reply>Go away or I'll replace you with a very small shell script. |
| 23:23:06 | Neo|Work | http://david.hedbor.org/ <-- the typical very out of date website |
| 23:23:10 | | ibot is, like, "the" bot around |
| 23:23:10 | br33zy | ibot where are you |
| 23:23:15 | tux_mike | trying to hide? |
| 23:23:19 | | Go away or I'll replace you with a very small shell script. |
| 23:23:19 | kergoth | ibot: kergoth? |
| 23:23:39 | | tux_mike: I forgot kergoth |
| 23:23:39 | tux_mike | ibot forget kergoth |
| 23:23:49 | | br33zy: huh? |
| 23:23:49 | br33zy | ibot watch out, i will replace you with a trojan! |
| 23:23:55 | | OK, tux_mike. |
| 23:23:55 | tux_mike | ibot kergoth is a small shell script running on my Mac IIsi |
| 23:23:57 | | YOW!! What should the entire human race DO?? Consume a fifth of |
| 23:23:57 | kergoth | ibot: yow |
| 23:24:02 | | br33zy: excuse me? |
| 23:24:02 | br33zy | ibot yeah, sure.. thats waht they all say |
| 23:24:03 | kergoth | hah |
| 23:24:06 | | Boy, am I glad it's only 1971... |
| 23:24:06 | kergoth | ibot: yow |
| 23:24:14 | | br33zy: what? |
| 23:24:14 | br33zy | ibot uh huh |
| 23:24:14 | Neo|Work | dammit I hate receiving emails with CC recipients that lack a domain name |
| 23:24:16 | | br33zy: excuse me? |
| 23:24:16 | br33zy | ibot sure.. |
| 23:24:23 | | br33zy: sorry... |
| 23:24:23 | br33zy | ibot your just acting innocent |
| 23:24:33 | | br33zy: what? |
| 23:24:33 | br33zy | ibot you know you took my vanilla coke |
| 23:24:34 | kergoth | i love spamassassin |
| 23:24:35 | kergoth | i really do |
| 23:24:35 | | siriusnova: what? |
| 23:24:35 | siriusnova | ibot your a whore |
| 23:24:39 | | no idea, br33zy |
| 23:24:39 | br33zy | ibot guess, where your going |
| 23:24:42 | BZFlag | ok, lay off the bot? |
| 23:24:45 | tux_mike | sugar quote wcome |
| 23:24:45 | Sugar | tux_mike: WCOME @ 7:31pm: 0.083 (-0.007 -7.78%) Bid: -0.007 Ask: -7.78% |
| 23:24:46 | | br33zy: i'm not following you... |
| 23:24:46 | br33zy | ibot TO BOT PRISON!!! |
| 23:24:46 | | siriusnova: huh? |
| 23:24:46 | siriusnova | ibot im going to kill you |
| 23:24:47 | treke | siriusnova: please leave he bot alone |
| 23:24:52 | siriusnova | ;) |
| 23:24:53 | | br33zy: huh? |
| 23:24:53 | br33zy | ibot you dont have to |
| 23:24:54 | tux_mike | 8 cents! :) |
| 23:25:03 | | br33zy: excuse me? |
| 23:25:03 | br33zy | ibot your such an idiot |
| 23:25:06 | Neo|Work | sugar make ibot a garge |
| 23:25:07 | tux_mike | can we say ka-boom? |
| 23:25:08 | Neo|Work | sugar make ibot a gargle |
| 23:25:09 | Sugar | pours "the juice" from one bottle of janx spirit in a towel, pours in santraginus v seawater, melts in arcturan mega-gin, bubbles fallian marsh gas through it, floats qualactin hypermint extract off the back of a silver spoon, drops in the tooth of an algolian suntiger, sprinkles zamphuor, pours it into a folded leaf then garnishes with an olive and serves it to ibot. |
| 23:25:10 | | br33zy: bugger all, i dunno |
| 23:25:10 | br33zy | ibot think im impolite? |
| 23:25:42 | kergoth | Neo|Work: is that a pan galactic gargle blaster? |
| 23:25:42 | tux_mike | i'd like a holy bartender |
| 23:26:00 | Neo|Work | sugar, how you make a gargle |
| 23:26:01 | Sugar | Neo|Work: Ingredients for Pan-Galactic Gargle Blaster: "the juice" from one bottle of Janx Spirit, a measureSantraginus V seawater, 3 cubes Arcturan Mega-Gin, 4 L Fallian marsh gas, a measure Qualactin Hypermint extract, the tooth of an Algolian Suntiger, Zamphuor and 1 olive |
| 23:26:01 | Sugar | Neo|Work: Pour "the juice" from one bottle of Janx Spirit in a towel. Pour in Santraginus V seawater. Melt in Arcturan Mega-Gin. Bubble Fallian marsh gas through it. Float Qualactin Hypermint extract off the back of a silver spoon. Drop in the tooth of an Algolian Suntiger. Sprinkle Zamphuor. Serve in a folded leaf, garnished with an olive. |
| 23:26:09 | kergoth | sweet |
| 23:26:12 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:26:18 | treke | kergoth: there is your idd right there :) |
| 23:26:21 | kergoth | haha |
| 23:26:23 | kergoth | no shit |
| 23:26:28 | kergoth | Sugar: how you make a long island? |
| 23:26:28 | Neo|Work | you have no idea the number of special cases I had to add for her to do that correctly |
| 23:26:28 | Sugar | kergoth: Ingredients for Long Island Ice Tea: 1/2 oz Vodka, 1/2 oz Gin, 1/2 oz Light Rum, 1/2 oz Tequila, Juice of 1/2 Lemon and 1 dash Cola |
| 23:26:28 | Sugar | kergoth: Combine ingredients and pour over ice in highball glass. Add cola for color and garnish with slice of lemon. |
| 23:26:32 | kergoth | ahaa |
| 23:26:34 | kergoth | thats hilarious |
| 23:26:38 | kergoth | it was right there the whole damn time |
| 23:26:41 | kergoth | i needed that |
| 23:26:56 | tux_mike | kergoth: you usually use sour mix |
| 23:26:57 | Neo|Work | quite handy if you want drinks |
| 23:27:01 | tux_mike | not lemon juice |
| 23:27:03 | kergoth | tux_mike: yeah i'd heard |
| 23:27:09 | Neo|Work | the source data is a html page. loaded and parsed. : |
| 23:27:13 | kergoth | tux_mike: some leave out or shrink the amount of tequila also |
| 23:27:23 | tux_mike | i like to shrink the gin |
| 23:27:34 | Neo|Work | sugar how do you make rum |
| 23:27:34 | Sugar | You have to tell me which one. I know of 21 different, for instance Rum Swizzle, Rum Martini, rum coke, Rum Toddy, Rum Runner and Chocolate Rum. |
| 23:27:47 | Neo|Work | 21 different rums. quite nice |
| 23:27:50 | Neo|Work | sugar how do you make vodka |
| 23:27:51 | Sugar | You have to tell me which one. I know of 14 different, for instance Vodka and Apple Juice, Vodka Cooler, Vodka Sour, Vodka Daisy, Vodka Collins and Vodka Salty Dog. |
| 23:28:00 | Neo|Work | sugar how do you make tequila |
| 23:28:11 | Neo|Work | nothing with tequila in the name I guess |
| 23:28:18 | Neo|Work | sugar how do you make gin |
| 23:28:18 | Sugar | You have to tell me which one. I know of 31 different, for instance Gin Milk Punch, Gin Smash, Gin Cooler, Gin Sling, Sloe Gin Rickey and Hot Gin Toddy. |
| 23:28:22 | Neo|Work | heh |
| 23:28:29 | kergoth | man, if i'm going to mix a long island i need to buy a lot of shit. hehe |
| 23:29:08 | tux_mike | rum is good |
| 23:29:33 | tux_mike | sugar how do you make a holy bartender |
| 23:29:45 | Neo|Work | sugar how do you make holy |
| 23:29:50 | Neo|Work | guess that is not in there |
| 23:30:00 | tux_mike | damn |
| 23:30:08 | inomine | sugar how do you make holly |
| 23:30:09 | kergoth | yeah, we still need iadb |
| 23:30:10 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:30:12 | inomine | :) |
| 23:30:14 | tux_mike | proper respons is *blam* :) |
| 23:30:27 | Neo|Work | http://david.hedbor.org/tmp/drinks.html |
| 23:31:00 | Neo|Work | source data |
| 23:33:07 | kergoth | bbiaf, liquor run |
| 23:33:43 | tux_mike | booze! :) |
| 23:33:44 | inomine | any1 ported doom to zaurus? |
| 23:33:48 | tux_mike | pick me up some rum |
| 23:34:02 | tux_mike | points to neo and stares |
| 23:34:35 | treke | the next oz is going to be the buggiest one ever thanks to Neo|Work |
| 23:34:36 | Neo|Work | inomine: actually I looked at it and stopped but someone else is doing prboom now. It was mentioned on zaurus general I believe. and porting means "make" more or less |
| 23:34:45 | Neo|Work | treke: hehe |
| 23:35:01 | inomine | oh ok |
| 23:35:09 | tux_mike | treke: why is that? |
| 23:35:23 | Neo|Work | What schood I doo wihthc schee kernl tody... |
| 23:36:14 | theKompany | is really BigBoss, but roaming the house on his wireless laptop |
| 23:36:34 | tux_mike | has always wanted to know how he would program drunk :) |
| 23:36:44 | tux_mike | watch, i actually program better while drunk :) |
| 23:36:49 | theKompany | not that great, I've tried |
| 23:36:53 | theKompany | :) |
| 23:37:04 | ou812 | hey guy, just got a zaurus, having problems dialling via 6210 to internet, can anyone help? |
| 23:37:19 | tux_mike | every geek has to try once in their lives. otherwise they aren't geeks :) |
| 23:37:30 | ljp | once? |
| 23:37:42 | ljp | I try it once alot |
| 23:37:45 | tux_mike | at least |
| 23:38:51 | tux_mike | ljp: well, at least you have booze at your disposal |
| 23:38:57 | tux_mike | all that's in my house is crap wine |
| 23:39:13 | Cloudchaser | i just signed up :) |
| 23:39:33 | Cloudchaser | but don't know if they'll approve my suggestion |
| 23:39:38 | Cloudchaser | for the sharp challenge |
| 23:39:52 | tux_mike | i should try to suggest my app |
| 23:39:57 | tux_mike | and then take it :) |
| 23:40:00 | Cloudchaser | i have a friend who said he'd help ;) |
| 23:40:27 | tux_mike | what app you making? |
| 23:40:42 | Cloudchaser | well i suggested something.. |
| 23:40:50 | Cloudchaser | guess i have to wait to see if they approve it |
| 23:40:55 | Cloudchaser | then i'll tell ;) |
| 23:41:29 | tux_mike | bah. tell meeeee! |
| 23:51:02 | theKompanyRulez | l |
| 23:51:13 | theKompanyRulez | ok, whoever PM'd me earlier, I lost them |
| 23:51:56 | tux_mike | hrmmm... |
| 23:52:34 | tux_mike | damnit. i don't remember my stuff on recursive methods... are there any caveats besides an infinite loop? |
| 23:53:25 | EonGamesRulez | hah. :) |
| 23:53:47 | TuxnamiRules | ha! |
| 23:54:09 | EonGamesRulez | NICK WARZ! |
| 23:54:19 | EonGamesRulez | Maybe I should make a Personal Neo app |
| 23:54:29 | EonGamesRulez | seems like a popular thing these days |
| 23:54:41 | EonGamesRulez | you could feed me, play with me, exercise me and stuff. hehe |
| 23:54:52 | TuxnamiRules | i'd make a personal mike app, but i'd crash the Z |
| 23:54:54 | theKompanyRulez | and give you a red rocket? :) |
| 23:55:05 | inomine | im off boodbye |
| 23:55:08 | EonGamesRulez | race me against other neos |
| 23:55:19 | EonGamesRulez | but in more than one 1 FPS. :) |
| 23:55:40 | TuxnamiRules | Virtual Programmer |
| 23:55:43 | TuxnamiRules | that's it :) |
| 23:56:38 | theKompanyRulez | see which virtual neo will premature first? |
| 23:56:51 | Rascal | does anyone know how to get java on OZ? |
| 23:57:08 | EonGamesRulez | Rascal: copy from a Sharp rom? |
| 23:57:17 | Rascal | what files and where? |
| 23:57:36 | theKompanyRulez | just flash the rom |
| 23:57:42 | Rascal | lol |
| 23:58:07 | EonGamesRulez | Rascal: that you need to figure out and yes, from a flashed ROM. :)) |
| 23:58:13 | treke | theKompanyRulez: When you putting out your own tkc rom? |
| 23:58:25 | TuxnamiRules | tkcBigBoss? |
| 23:58:34 | Cloudchaser | hehe i asked him that too |
| 23:58:41 | treke | nah. An oz based rom image, substituting tkc apps where applicable |
| 23:58:44 | EonGamesRulez | tkcRum |
| 23:59:45 | Cloudchaser | when i get oz again i'm going to remove defaults and put tkc apss on the rom |
| 23:59:49 | krow | Is there an easy way to set the Zaurus back to factory default? |
| 23:59:52 | Cloudchaser | we can do that kergoth said ;) |