| 00:02:59 | ljp | boo! |
| 00:10:24 | Neo|Work | is back (gone 02:21:30) |
| 00:21:37 | JasonNJ-home | heya. |
| 00:21:43 | JasonNJ-home | anyone run bsd on their box? |
| 00:23:50 | ljp | on my zaurus box? |
| 00:26:36 | ljp | ;) |
| 00:33:04 | JasonNJ-home | no on their pc |
| 00:35:04 | JasonNJ-home | although a zaurus port of a bsd would be pretty wild |
| 00:35:19 | JasonNJ-home | not sure if they ever ported the kernel to arm |
| 00:36:06 | nyargh | yes |
| 00:36:09 | nyargh | i'm running openbsd |
| 00:36:32 | JasonNJ-home | ny: did they ever get the current version of VMware to run on BSD |
| 00:36:47 | nyargh | i don't know |
| 00:36:55 | nyargh | i don't use vmware on any of my bsd boxes :/ |
| 00:39:13 | treke_ | JasonNJ-home : netbsd probably has an arm kernel |
| 00:39:28 | Neo|Work | I'm pretty darn sure it does |
| 00:39:41 | Neo|Work | netbsd is probably one of the most ported/portable unix kernels |
| 00:42:26 | ljp | porting the device drivers woul dbe apain most likely |
| 01:13:11 | surge | hallo |
| 01:14:46 | surge | im having immense troubles installing something(anything) on my sl-5500. any clues? anyone awake? |
| 01:15:01 | JasonNJ-home | jawohl |
| 01:15:58 | surge | when should i put the .ipk file so qtopia desktop can see it for example? |
| 01:16:06 | surge | where i meant |
| 01:17:03 | surge | oder ist hier ein deutch sprechen channel |
| 01:20:53 | Korpios | wakes up. |
| 01:21:08 | surge | jumps up and down |
| 01:21:17 | ApoXX | pokes korpios |
| 01:21:22 | surge | HEeeEeEelp! |
| 01:21:23 | Korpios | *sigh* Still no response from the PyQt mailing list :/ |
| 01:21:32 | Korpios | surge: What's going on with installs? |
| 01:21:49 | JasonNJ-home | surge: #zaurus.de |
| 01:22:08 | surge | Korpios: i cant get the .ipk file onto the damn pda so it can be installed |
| 01:22:15 | JasonNJ-home | surge: you can put a .ipk file in the root directory of a CF or SD card |
| 01:22:23 | JasonNJ-home | also in your Documents directory. |
| 01:22:24 | Korpios | surge: You don't have a CF card handy with a reader, do ya? |
| 01:22:29 | surge | Korpios: no |
| 01:22:32 | Korpios | Yeah, or SD... |
| 01:22:40 | Korpios | I could never get the cradle working under Linux. |
| 01:22:55 | Korpios | I do everything by swapping a CF card back and forth. |
| 01:22:57 | surge | Korpios: ive got a network going with the cradle |
| 01:23:01 | Korpios | Ah really? |
| 01:23:05 | surge | Korpios: yeh |
| 01:23:07 | Korpios | FTP to port... oh what was it again? |
| 01:23:13 | Korpios | 4xxx (something up there) |
| 01:23:18 | JasonNJ-home | 4242 |
| 01:23:22 | surge | Korpios: but i cant get the install files on it to install |
| 01:23:23 | Korpios | thx :) |
| 01:23:26 | Korpios | Ahhhh |
| 01:23:37 | Korpios | where'd you drop them into? |
| 01:23:56 | surge | Korpios: are you running linux as PC? i can probably help if you want |
| 01:24:01 | JasonNJ-home | - /home/QtPalmtop/Documents |
| 01:24:03 | JasonNJ-home | one of those |
| 01:24:22 | JasonNJ-home | I've never done it that way personally |
| 01:24:44 | surge | Could not connect to 192.168.3.7: Connection refused. |
| 01:24:53 | Korpios | surge: Yeah I'm using Linux on my desktop; I can get as far as my machine recognizing the cradel/Zaurus, but I can never make a network connection in or out.... |
| 01:24:54 | JasonNJ-home | thats a weird ip |
| 01:25:07 | Korpios | s/cradel/cradle/ blah |
| 01:25:12 | surge | Korpios: sounds like your firewall |
| 01:25:26 | Korpios | surge: How's that my firewall? It never gets that far :) |
| 01:25:42 | surge | Korpios: you get the usb connection ? |
| 01:25:54 | surge | Korpios: i.e. the device gets recognized? |
| 01:26:01 | Korpios | surge: I can get the kernel mod to get recognized, yup |
| 01:26:17 | surge | Korpios: hmm, kernel mod != device |
| 01:26:17 | Korpios | just can't ping, a full nmap doesn't show a damn port open, etc |
| 01:26:25 | Korpios | lol |
| 01:26:34 | Korpios | slip of the mind/keys |
| 01:26:42 | surge | Korpios: which one did you mean? |
| 01:26:57 | Korpios | I should've said, I got the kernel module to recognize the cradle/zaurus |
| 01:27:06 | surge | JasonNJ-home: so shoot me |
| 01:27:22 | surge | Korpios: hmm, better give me log results |
| 01:27:31 | surge | /msg if its long |
| 01:27:45 | Korpios | they're long gone, I just wiped my system in the last day or so with a different distro |
| 01:27:52 | surge | ouch |
| 01:27:54 | Korpios | I'll give it another crack some other time |
| 01:27:57 | surge | ok |
| 01:28:01 | Korpios | thanks anyway :) |
| 01:28:11 | jay | anyone program in perl here |
| 01:28:16 | Korpios | (the wipe was on purpose) ;) |
| 01:28:23 | surge | well, note that device != module, and also be aware firewalls can fuck things up |
| 01:28:26 | Korpios | jay: Used to, what's up? |
| 01:28:53 | Korpios | surge: I know, and I know (the only firewall I have running is my OpenBSD box, though, and we're only talking about a direct USB connex to my Linux box) |
| 01:29:12 | jay | gotta code a password program |
| 01:29:13 | surge | no one has used the cradle to "bootstap" a ssh/terminal program onto a zaurus???!!! |
| 01:29:29 | jay | what can i read or where can i go to see examples |
| 01:29:38 | Korpios | People have ported openssh and telnet to the zaurus.... |
| 01:29:51 | surge | Korpios: yeah, the firewall only on the directly connected box matters for the moment |
| 01:30:08 | warmi | ljp: God will punish you for every line of Perl code you write ... |
| 01:30:11 | Korpios | surge: I know, and there isn't one :) (I'm not clueless, don't worry) ;) |
| 01:30:27 | surge | Korpios: if you wanna write it down, ill give you my syslog output when i stick it in the cradle so you can compare |
| 01:30:33 | warmi | jay that is |
| 01:30:51 | jay | warmi: not my decision homework assignment |
| 01:30:52 | surge | Korpios: ok :) |
| 01:30:54 | Korpios | warmi: Yes, God prefers Python. I should know, being God. ;) |
| 01:31:27 | Korpios | Ahh homework. Okay, that's understandable. Drop the class, report the professor.... hehe |
| 01:31:34 | jay | hehe |
| 01:31:47 | jay | cant 2 weeks from graduation |
| 01:31:52 | jay | im sorta stuck |
| 01:32:04 | Korpios | Is this Perl on the zaurus or just perl in general? |
| 01:32:17 | surge | unbelievable |
| 01:32:28 | jay | perl in general....until i put perl somehow on the zaurus |
| 01:33:13 | Korpios | My top suggestion would be buying The Perl Cookbook put out by O'Reilly; if I remember, there's tons of example code and quite a bit should cover something along those lines... lemme go check my copy, brb |
| 01:33:30 | jay | cant due tomorrow :( |
| 01:33:40 | Korpios | ouchieee |
| 01:33:52 | jay | no all night perl joints available around here |
| 01:33:54 | jay | :) |
| 01:34:48 | Korpios | you have to authenticate vs /etc/passwd (or some other crypted database) or just throw up a little mock password prompt? |
| 01:34:59 | jay | mock password |
| 01:35:04 | Korpios | ahh okay |
| 01:36:32 | digiSilk | god I love my Zaurus... just installed zic and my SMC WLAN card... |
| 01:37:13 | digiSilk | has anyone done sync-ing via WLAN |
| 01:39:08 | surge | digiSilk: hey, how did you get your first application installed? |
| 01:39:19 | ljp | if you love it so much, why don't you marry it? |
| 01:39:29 | ljp | ;) |
| 01:39:35 | surge | ljp: dont push him |
| 01:39:44 | surge | i dont think its legal |
| 01:40:11 | digiSilk | sync'd via cradle.... then installed my NIC |
| 01:40:12 | surge | ...and we dont want laws saying you are allowed to marry a pda |
| 01:40:38 | surge | digiSilk: hmm, you used the NIC to install the 1st app? |
| 01:40:51 | surge | ... or the cradle |
| 01:41:08 | digiSilk | ljp: what makes you think I haven't? |
| 01:41:10 | digiSilk | lol |
| 01:41:21 | digiSilk | the cradle |
| 01:41:32 | surge | digiSilk: HOW!!!?? |
| 01:41:42 | surge | digiSilk: i need help with this |
| 01:42:09 | surge | digiSilk: qtopia? or...? |
| 01:42:14 | digiSilk | intellisych |
| 01:42:26 | surge | digiSilk: hmm, you got windows on the PC? |
| 01:42:45 | digiSilk | sorry if my typing is poor... big thumbs, little Zaurus |
| 01:42:59 | surge | or theres a intellisync for linux somewhere? |
| 01:43:03 | surge | digiSilk: hehe |
| 01:43:48 | digiSilk | I used Windoze.... as soon as I can synch w/o windows I,ll be too pleaesd with myself to stand it |
| 01:43:58 | surge | fuck |
| 01:44:05 | surge | this is crazy |
| 01:44:31 | surge | the damn thing RUNS linux, why the hell cant i sync with it |
| 01:44:44 | digiSilk | I captured the sync process with Etherpeek so I saw some og tthe commands used... |
| 01:44:53 | surge | hmm |
| 01:45:01 | digiSilk | I feel your pain... |
| 01:45:26 | digiSilk | I'd love to completely dump m$ |
| 01:45:32 | digiSilk | so close.... |
| 01:45:48 | surge | actually, ive managed to get the address book to sync with linux, but i cant install extra apps |
| 01:46:01 | digiSilk | gotta go..just wanted to try Zic on my Z |
| 01:46:36 | digiSilk | btw, 4242 is just plain ftp.... xfer apps thru that |
| 01:46:49 | surge | argh why dont that work |
| 01:46:56 | surge | i already tried it |
| 01:47:24 | digiSilk | without the .desktop extension they won,t show in the gui |
| 01:47:25 | surge | what user? |
| 01:47:45 | digiSilk | unfortunatyely... anon works :( |
| 01:48:05 | surge | Connecting to 192.168.3.7... Qtopia transfer service ready! |
| 01:48:06 | surge | Please login with USER and PASS |
| 01:48:10 | surge | hmm |
| 01:48:27 | digiSilk | wanna hear something really scary? |
| 01:48:31 | surge | what? |
| 01:48:36 | digiSilk | root pass is rootme |
| 01:48:38 | surge | but 1st, what user? |
| 01:48:44 | surge | i heard it was blank |
| 01:49:07 | digiSilk | the synch softwARe uses root/rootme |
| 01:49:32 | surge | root |
| 01:49:33 | surge | ok |
| 01:49:54 | surge | haha, it works |
| 01:50:06 | surge | shit, thats funny |
| 01:50:46 | digiSilk | yeah, friggin hilarious when I walk arounf with a wireless nic |
| 01:50:51 | digiSilk | :( |
| 01:51:08 | digiSilk | bye |
| 01:51:13 | surge | digiSilk: heh, thats your own stupidity |
| 01:51:44 | ApoXX | What is the dvorak keyboard input method? |
| 01:53:55 | surge | argh, ash is already in there |
| 01:54:09 | surge | but theres no stupid button to start it!! |
| 01:54:30 | surge | how frustrating!! |
| 02:01:30 | jay | is away: I'm busy |
| 03:01:48 | Neo|Work | is away: goes home |
| 04:01:47 | codemnky | yoyo |
| 04:02:02 | codemnky | what up Z geeks |
| 04:02:34 | roge99 | hey |
| 04:02:52 | jay | i hate programming |
| 04:02:55 | jay | aaaaaaaaah |
| 04:40:41 | obscurite | got nick collisioned |
| 04:40:45 | obscurite | eww. |
| 05:08:47 | Guru | Hello |
| 05:09:43 | Guru | whats new? |
| 05:09:49 | roge99 | is away: zzzzz |
| 05:11:19 | Guru | anyone seen thê new X server for Qtopia? |
| 05:34:33 | W|GGL|T | is trying to figure out how he lost his Zaurus SL-5500 USB driver in XP |
| 05:35:10 | W|GGL|T | can't figure out how to reinstall it, as its not saying that there's a new device being detected (its connected via cradle) |
| 05:52:39 | Bala | try connecting it to another usb port |
| 06:05:08 | W|GGL|T | ok...its up...that was very weird |
| 06:05:43 | W|GGL|T | i changed to a different usb port and it then detected the Z, but i had to reinstall the USB driver for it |
| 06:05:59 | W|GGL|T | then it wouldn't give me the same IP for the device |
| 06:06:16 | W|GGL|T | i had to change it...it's like XP is reserving the IP i was using |
| 06:08:27 | W|GGL|T | thanks for the help, Bala |
| 06:08:42 | W|GGL|T | i just hope that isn't a common problem |
| 07:33:00 | W|GGL|T | is away: I'm busy smoking a blunt or sleeping or something |
| 07:35:53 | whardier | w3rd |
| 07:40:13 | whardier | heh |
| 07:40:19 | whardier | I just covered an island in wireless |
| 07:40:22 | whardier | happy |
| 07:40:23 | whardier | happy |
| 07:40:24 | whardier | joy |
| 07:40:25 | whardier | joy |
| 07:56:01 | henrik | cool. my microdrive works in the z. |
| 07:57:39 | henrik | 1 gb disk, 32 mb memory, 200 mhz processor. That's almost as good as my last computer :) |
| 09:16:01 | trebb | Gentlemen, anybody heard when the TT-contest winners will be announced? |
| 10:24:34 | voxvirus | hello ppl |
| 10:25:17 | voxvirus | can someone tell me were can i buy the sharp sl-5000D ? |
| 10:26:54 | hunger | voxvirus: Afaik you can't buy the 5000D anymore. |
| 10:27:15 | hunger | voxvirus: That was a developers only version. Now the consumer version is out (5500) |
| 10:27:58 | voxvirus | oops |
| 10:28:04 | voxvirus | damn |
| 10:28:21 | hunger | voxvirus: The 5500 has twice the RAM, so I'd go for that one anyway. |
| 10:28:37 | voxvirus | :) |
| 10:28:42 | voxvirus | lucky me |
| 10:29:07 | voxvirus | recomended stores/e-stores? |
| 10:29:29 | hunger | shrugs. |
| 10:29:53 | hunger | voxvirus: Dunno of any stores in your country. |
| 10:30:44 | voxvirus | e-stores? |
| 10:31:08 | hunger | voxvirus: I got mine at www.xtops.de. |
| 10:31:28 | hunger | voxvirus: But they have the model with the german localisation only afaik. |
| 10:32:09 | voxvirus | what differences are there with sharp sl-5000D? |
| 10:32:19 | voxvirus | is it just the ram amount? |
| 10:32:31 | hunger | voxvirus: The 5500 has 64MB RAM, the 5000 32MB. |
| 10:32:57 | hunger | voxvirus: That's it. There might be some diffrences wrt the installed software, but I don't know for sure. |
| 10:33:47 | voxvirus | if the differences are just software i think i can take it, heh |
| 10:33:51 | voxvirus | :) |
| 10:34:36 | voxvirus | i loved the hardware |
| 10:35:12 | voxvirus | it's rare 2 see that quality in linux pdas |
| 10:35:14 | Twiun | Hehe, don't forget the stylus ;-) the 5500 one is better quality |
| 10:35:14 | hunger | voxvirus: 'Upgrade' the SW to OpenZaurus;-) |
| 10:35:22 | voxvirus | at least arround here |
| 10:35:27 | voxvirus | :) |
| 10:35:37 | voxvirus | 4sure |
| 10:35:59 | voxvirus | i loved qt's look on the damn pda |
| 10:36:02 | voxvirus | :) |
| 10:36:28 | voxvirus | i got in love, love at 1st sight |
| 10:44:44 | voxvirus | well thanks |
| 10:44:54 | voxvirus | gotta split |
| 10:44:56 | voxvirus | ! |
| 10:44:59 | voxvirus | bye |
| 11:38:43 | neophyte | hi folks |
| 11:41:30 | neophyte | yesterday there was a mistake in a german online shop due to which they offered 64 MB CF for EUR 0,44 |
| 11:42:09 | neophyte | I ordered some, but I doubt I'll get them |
| 11:43:39 | NetAmp | "First OLED Screens To Be Available this Fall |
| 11:43:39 | NetAmp | " |
| 11:43:44 | NetAmp | http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=3354&MODE=FLAT |
| 11:48:40 | NetAmp | "The main advantages of OLED screens over current ones is the screen itself glows so there is no need for a back- or side-light. This means they require less power and take up less space, two important factors in a handheld. They also cost less to make." |
| 11:48:48 | NetAmp | You hear that Sharp? :P |
| 11:48:50 | NetAmp | ;-) |
| 11:50:13 | hunger | NetAmp: Too late now. Most people here have their Z allready. |
| 11:50:28 | NetAmp | heh ;) |
| 11:50:39 | NetAmp | Well, this technology is too new anyway |
| 11:50:51 | NetAmp | but maybe in a later version of the Z |
| 11:51:13 | NetAmp | probably even beyond the next release following up the 5500 |
| 11:51:20 | NetAmp | who knows... |
| 11:51:51 | NetAmp | But it'd be great to save battery life in any way they can :) |
| 11:51:54 | hunger | NetAmp: Yeap. I wonter when the PDAs will finally have a FPU unit. Right now all the CPU vendors seem to focus on multimedia stuff. |
| 11:52:13 | NetAmp | And ofcourse less space means smaller device... or a larger keyboard *lol* ;) |
| 11:52:26 | NetAmp | hunger: yeah they are indeed |
| 11:53:48 | neophyte | multimedia stuff is what people around me understand about the Z |
| 11:53:51 | neophyte | *sigh* |
| 11:55:22 | hunger | neophyte: But they'd understand a nice 3D shooter too I guess:-) |
| 11:55:35 | NetAmp | hah |
| 11:57:53 | neophyte | some yes |
| 11:58:56 | NetAmp | Oh, the HORROR!! |
| 11:58:57 | NetAmp | http://www.palminfocenter.com/graveyard/ |
| 11:59:02 | neophyte | still no call or mail that canceled my order my order |
| 11:59:47 | NetAmp | I just can't stand reading the horrible ways in which those Palms died :S |
| 12:00:06 | neophyte | I want a case for mine |
| 12:03:39 | NetAmp | nnnoooo one guy even put his Clié in the washer, ouch |
| 12:04:11 | neophyte | I always said the Clie is too small, you'd leave it in your pocket one day |
| 12:04:17 | NetAmp | heh |
| 12:04:25 | NetAmp | scary |
| 12:05:14 | neophyte | pretty common one is that one with the shirt pocket and wanting to pick something up from the ground |
| 12:08:29 | NetAmp | Oh man, I just hope the Z isn't as 'breakable' as these Palms ;) |
| 12:10:48 | NetAmp | gah! A dead Palm turned into a picture frame: http://www.palminfocenter.com/graveyard/dead.asp?ID=62 |
| 12:11:07 | NetAmp | oh well... better than just throwing it away ;) |
| 12:11:46 | neophyte | right |
| 12:12:24 | neophyte | hm, they wouldn't ignore an order just because they had the wrong price in their system? |
| 12:13:09 | NetAmp | neophyte: who would? |
| 12:13:31 | hunger | NetAmp: Those guys selling 64MB CF cards for 0.44EUR |
| 12:13:33 | neophyte | online shop of karstadt de |
| 12:13:42 | NetAmp | hahaha |
| 12:13:44 | neophyte | not any more, hunger |
| 12:13:56 | hunger | neophyte: I have all the cards I need anyway:-) |
| 12:13:57 | neophyte | they corrected them to be 44Euro now |
| 12:14:10 | neophyte | really hunger? |
| 12:14:48 | hunger | neophyte: Got more cards then I have slots in the Z;-) |
| 12:14:59 | neophyte | I only got one card |
| 12:16:18 | NetAmp | I got none ;) |
| 12:16:45 | neophyte | and I thought at 0,44 EUR I could order some |
| 12:17:01 | neophyte | now I'm waiting for karstadt to cancel |
| 12:17:05 | NetAmp | hah that would be a stunt |
| 12:18:10 | neophyte | yeah |
| 12:18:24 | NetAmp | It'd be sweet to buy for 0,44 and sell some EUR's below the normal price *lol* |
| 12:18:57 | neophyte | they haven't informed me on any error and it was under their best buys section |
| 12:25:25 | NetAmp | "A script is what you give the actors. A program is what you give the audience." ~ Larry Wall |
| 12:25:27 | NetAmp | hah ;) |
| 12:25:57 | neophyte | will have the pleasure of hearing LW live |
| 12:26:00 | NetAmp | Well I like scripting :P |
| 12:26:03 | NetAmp | LW? |
| 12:26:06 | NetAmp | ow |
| 12:26:07 | neophyte | Larry Wall |
| 12:26:10 | NetAmp | Larry, duh, haha |
| 12:26:23 | NetAmp | where? |
| 12:26:36 | neophyte | YAPC::Europe in Munich |
| 12:27:10 | NetAmp | cool |
| 12:27:30 | NetAmp | Programmer's Convention I guess? |
| 12:27:38 | neophyte | Perl Conference |
| 12:28:21 | NetAmp | hm I should've guessed by the :: ;-) |
| 12:28:56 | neophyte | lots of well known Perlers there |
| 12:29:21 | neophyte | Conway, Schwartz ... |
| 12:30:16 | neophyte | nearly everyone envolved in Perl 6 developement |
| 12:30:54 | NetAmp | hm... I haven't really been into Perl lately... only doing some Forum mods |
| 12:30:59 | NetAmp | loves PHP ;) |
| 12:31:18 | neophyte | PHP is nice as well |
| 12:31:25 | neophyte | I use both |
| 12:31:29 | NetAmp | I do use the preg functions for Perl compatible RegEx |
| 12:31:47 | neophyte | so do I |
| 12:31:49 | NetAmp | even though I'm still kinda freaked out by long regex's ;-) |
| 12:32:27 | neophyte | regex is complex |
| 12:34:05 | NetAmp | haha sure is |
| 12:35:26 | neophyte | when I first saw a Schwartzian Transform I was utterly confused |
| 12:35:49 | NetAmp | whoa.. even that name is scary |
| 12:36:59 | neophyte | its 3 list operations first a map then a sort, and then you map the result again |
| 12:37:06 | neophyte | ouch |
| 12:38:14 | NetAmp | :) |
| 12:38:47 | neophyte | I simply went cross eyed and in state of shock for a while |
| 12:38:54 | NetAmp | *lol* |
| 12:40:17 | NetAmp | *argh* I gotta rewrite some php scripts |
| 12:40:45 | NetAmp | I've been using mysql_db_query() which turns out to be deprecated since PHP 4.0.6 |
| 12:40:49 | NetAmp | :S |
| 12:41:42 | neophyte | the world changes, so we get to change our scripts |
| 12:41:48 | neophyte | *sigh* |
| 12:42:00 | NetAmp | :( |
| 12:43:34 | NetAmp | I made a 'portal'/start page from scratch, but it needs some polishing ;) |
| 12:43:56 | NetAmp | So I'll just change the functions while I'm at it... |
| 12:46:37 | neophyte | better than going back to them later |
| 12:46:46 | NetAmp | yeah exactly |
| 12:57:47 | benmeyer | Does dhcpd come on the z by default? |
| 12:58:21 | benmeyer | woho 140 apps |
| 13:03:21 | NetAmp | 140? :) |
| 13:03:43 | benmeyer | on zsi |
| 13:05:09 | benmeyer | dang dhcpd is on the default rom |
| 13:05:19 | benmeyer | seems kinda odd |
| 13:06:20 | benmeyer | the isc version too... |
| 13:09:02 | ljp | heheheh there's lots of odd things about the Z ;) |
| 13:10:36 | benmeyer | hmm, maybe it is for adhoc mode |
| 13:14:59 | benmeyer | Can you have token-ring on the z? |
| 13:18:13 | Twiun | heya ben |
| 13:20:03 | zuerdsch | haha! |
| 13:20:08 | zuerdsch | ive got it! |
| 13:20:45 | zuerdsch | anyone found a mp3 player yet? |
| 13:20:59 | ljp | uhh, it comes with one |
| 13:21:16 | zuerdsch | an mp3 player?!? |
| 13:21:19 | zuerdsch | hell! |
| 13:21:20 | ljp | yes |
| 13:21:57 | ljp | opie's mediaplayer and libmad plugin can stream mp3's |
| 13:22:03 | voxvirus | hello again everyone |
| 13:25:22 | zuerdsch | ljp: yep thanks... could have sworn it didnt like the format before *shrug* |
| 13:26:17 | zuerdsch | i suppose theres no chance of divx on it ? |
| 13:31:45 | benmeyer | not yet, but coming |
| 13:31:54 | zuerdsch | oh nice |
| 13:32:06 | benmeyer | cough didn'thearitfromme cough |
| 13:32:20 | BigBoss | yo yo yo |
| 13:32:22 | surge | heh |
| 13:33:27 | Twiun | Hey bb |
| 13:35:09 | surge | hmm, the other thing i wanna do is change the language of this thing... anyone have clues? |
| 13:35:24 | benmeyer | not sure on that one |
| 13:35:43 | surge | can i get an english rom from somewhere and do a full reset for example? |
| 13:36:16 | benmeyer | it will make it english |
| 13:36:35 | surge | yeh its now german, i want it english |
| 13:37:18 | hunger | surge: Flash with OZ. |
| 13:37:30 | surge | hunger: where and what is that? |
| 13:37:42 | hunger | surge: It will change your keyboard layout to QWERTY though. |
| 13:37:50 | | openzaurus is a Community version of the operating environment for the Sharp Zaurus SL-5x00[d] PDA. See http://openzaurus.sf.net/. or http://openzaurus.sf.net/feeds/3.0/ |
| 13:37:50 | hunger | ibot: openzaurus |
| 13:37:52 | surge | hmm, shit |
| 13:40:20 | surge | ah hell i need a cf card |
| 13:43:22 | surge | hmm, anyone got a sample movie i can borrow? |
| 13:43:32 | benmeyer | Hey where is the 1.13 rom? |
| 13:43:34 | benmeyer | 404 |
| 13:44:04 | benmeyer | ditto with 1.12 |
| 13:44:05 | benmeyer | hmmm |
| 13:52:14 | Twiun | Woohoo... payslip time! |
| 13:53:13 | Twiun | opens the enveloppes.... |
| 13:53:19 | Twiun | sighs |
| 13:53:24 | NetAmp|brb | I really hope we'll get English ones too here in NL |
| 13:53:27 | Twiun | No suprise there |
| 13:53:46 | Twiun | I was hoping to get somebody elses pay by mistake ;-) |
| 13:56:16 | NetAmp | heh |
| 13:57:20 | Twiun | Oh well... at least I got a payrise this year |
| 13:57:30 | Twiun | could be worse |
| 14:06:34 | warmi | hi |
| 14:06:42 | BigBoss | don't forget to tune into the linux show tonight |
| 14:07:15 | surge | hmm, what format does the movie player need? |
| 14:09:42 | Twiun | surge: It handles mpg ok |
| 14:10:00 | Twiun | benmeyer:ping |
| 14:10:14 | kergoth | hey |
| 14:10:22 | surge | Twiun: what sort of mpeg? ive encoded a small movie in mpeg1 at 300Kb/s but it wont play it |
| 14:10:44 | Twiun | surge: try mpeg2, i've had no problems with those |
| 14:11:03 | surge | hmm |
| 14:11:05 | surge | ok |
| 14:11:42 | BigBoss | you all see this? |
| 14:11:43 | BigBoss | http://www.linuxgram.com/article.pl?sid=02/04/26/0827253§ion=newsflash |
| 14:11:51 | BigBoss | the soap opera otherwise known as lineo |
| 14:12:04 | kergoth | ah |
| 14:13:36 | kergoth | "Despite the obvious loss of credibility all round, Harris has also said he believes he can attain a Microsoft-like status in embedded Linux. " |
| 14:13:41 | kergoth | hah |
| 14:14:20 | BigBoss | just like Linux, embedded Linux is something almost anyone can do |
| 14:14:29 | warmi | so now what ? |
| 14:14:37 | warmi | does Sharp have anyone else to go to ? |
| 14:14:38 | BigBoss | gotta give Lineo credit for having spear headed the Zaurus gig with sharp though |
| 14:14:43 | kergoth | yep |
| 14:14:45 | BigBoss | sure - monta vista, code host, and others |
| 14:15:14 | BigBoss | redhat seems to be backing out of the space |
| 14:15:19 | BigBoss | ibm might be getting into the space |
| 14:15:37 | warmi | I am sure MS will included Lineo as an example of just how fucked up Linux embedded market is |
| 14:15:42 | warmi | hehe |
| 14:15:57 | NetAmp | "Observers and former staff believe the place is toast and that Canopy and Egan really intend to sell parts of the remains off. |
| 14:15:57 | NetAmp | " |
| 14:15:58 | BigBoss | but the real point is that it doesn't really bother anyone if lineo does go under |
| 14:15:59 | NetAmp | ouch? |
| 14:16:07 | BigBoss | however if MS goes under, then everyone is fucked |
| 14:16:16 | BigBoss | of course that isn't likely to happen, but it is a single source problem |
| 14:16:20 | Twiun | BigBoss: For a while at least |
| 14:16:36 | Twiun | BigBoss: that kind of void would soon be filled in |
| 14:16:45 | BigBoss | Sharp could just hire the Lineo developers if they cared to |
| 14:16:48 | warmi | no, but , recently, MS has been attacking embedded Linux and this is just another negative example for the to use |
| 14:17:04 | BigBoss | I still think you can make a positive out of it |
| 14:17:21 | BigBoss | if Lineo had actually focused for its life on what it was doing the last year, then it would have been in good shape |
| 14:17:28 | BigBoss | but they sure as hell didn't need 20 offices |
| 14:17:46 | warmi | hehe |
| 14:20:06 | ][N-Flux | hrmmmmm |
| 14:23:17 | kergoth | finally... openssh built properly |
| 14:23:32 | benmeyer | yah :) |
| 14:24:15 | kergoth | packages into PROPER packages |
| 14:24:21 | kergoth | bbiaf, need caffeine |
| 14:24:43 | Twiun | benmeyer: did you try that rounded table stuff with only two tables onscreen? |
| 14:24:55 | benmeyer | Hi ther |
| 14:24:59 | benmeyer | two tables? |
| 14:25:15 | Twiun | benmeyer: because that seems the only time I can duplicate the funky crap Mozilla displays |
| 14:25:22 | benmeyer | the problem is that you have a space between </a> <br> |
| 14:25:24 | Twiun | (two fancy tables) |
| 14:25:38 | benmeyer | it is a space problem |
| 14:25:50 | benmeyer | at least that is what it was for me |
| 14:25:55 | Twiun | let me check my code ;-) |
| 14:26:33 | Twiun | hang on a sec... I don't use <br> in the SSI page |
| 14:27:18 | benmeyer | maybe it was <tr> |
| 14:27:22 | Twiun | you mean for the middle cell? |
| 14:27:27 | Twiun | when I use nbsp? |
| 14:27:28 | benmeyer | top cell |
| 14:27:31 | benmeyer | nope |
| 14:27:34 | benmeyer | that is find |
| 14:27:38 | benmeyer | there is a line break |
| 14:27:41 | benmeyer | dine |
| 14:27:43 | benmeyer | fine |
| 14:28:15 | Twiun | a line break in the top cell... the one with the N.gif backgroundimage, right? |
| 14:28:28 | NetAmp | ? |
| 14:28:29 | kergoth | k |
| 14:28:56 | benmeyer | hmm, looking at your code right now |
| 14:29:01 | benmeyer | not sure what it is |
| 14:29:15 | Twiun | same here... the problem doesn't arise on the faq pages |
| 14:29:21 | benmeyer | yah |
| 14:29:22 | Twiun | which have three tables |
| 14:29:36 | kergoth | hunger: it built |
| 14:30:00 | hunger | kergoth: Congratulations! |
| 14:30:14 | kergoth | thanks :-) |
| 14:30:38 | kergoth | thatll teach me to let it call ld directly... it wasnt linking in libgcc.a on its own |
| 14:31:51 | Twiun | benmeyer: hell, I can't be bothere with that crap, I'll just stick a third table in there somewhere |
| 14:34:48 | Twiun | hrm... doesn't fix it |
| 14:36:09 | Twiun | css doesn't either |
| 14:40:05 | ljp_work | kergoth: have you had any problems using fbvnc on Oz? |
| 14:41:49 | kergoth | ljp_work: never tried it on oz3 yet.. I'll be adding it to the buildsystem and default initrds today most likely |
| 14:43:38 | NetAmp | bbl :) |
| 14:43:48 | ljp_work | I tried it yesterday, and it crashed opie.. but that might be because og zlib |
| 14:43:57 | ljp_work | of zlib |
| 14:44:12 | kergoth | hmm |
| 14:45:35 | ljp_work | I'll try it again.. |
| 14:50:53 | ljp_work | kergoth: you have the sources? |
| 14:51:13 | ljp_work | dangit |
| 15:05:49 | hunger | kergoth: I just send in some patches for GGI to work on the Z. Do you mind adding .mk's for that once those patches are in GGI's CVS to buildroot-oz? |
| 15:06:02 | kergoth | yep, no problem |
| 15:06:08 | ljp_work | kergoth: you have the sources for fbvnc? |
| 15:06:11 | kergoth | just email em over |
| 15:06:18 | kergoth | ljp_work: they're back up on oss.lineo.com |
| 15:06:19 | hunger | kergoth: Cool:-) |
| 15:06:31 | kergoth | ljp_work: i also committed them into oz cvs for safekeeping |
| 15:07:00 | W|GGL|T | is back (gone 07:33:58) |
| 15:07:53 | ljp_work | cool.. ahhh.. the fbvnc package is not putting its stuff in proper Oz places.. hehehe |
| 15:08:06 | kergoth | ah.. well wait for the new package then :-) |
| 15:08:21 | ljp_work | Ya, I contacted Fastolfe |
| 15:08:27 | kergoth | got his contact info? |
| 15:09:02 | ljp_work | ya.. BUT.. ipkg remove: fbvnc.. is not installed.. ipkg install fbvnc... fbvnc is already installed |
| 15:09:19 | ljp_work | yes.. you want his email? |
| 15:09:29 | kergoth | yeah, please |
| 15:09:34 | kergoth | hmm thats odd, ipkg shouldnt do that |
| 15:10:26 | ljp_work | hehehhe.. that's an rpm'ism |
| 15:10:32 | kergoth | hehe |
| 15:10:55 | ljp_work | what file does ipkg look at fr installed stuff? |
| 15:11:14 | kergoth | /usr/lib/ipkg/ contains its database.. its in numerous files.. |
| 15:11:16 | kergoth | take a look |
| 15:11:16 | ljp_work | I don't have Fastolfe's email here.. I gave it to JasonNJ also |
| 15:11:26 | kergoth | k. email it to me when you have a chance |
| 15:14:39 | ljp_work | ahhh haaa! ipkg keeps files on the cf also.... |
| 15:14:44 | kergoth | yep |
| 15:14:52 | kergoth | the database resides on the dest used |
| 15:15:07 | kergoth | which is as it should be.. so i could give you a CF with shit installed on it.. and itd make sense in your unit |
| 15:15:09 | kergoth | :-) |
| 15:15:20 | ljp_work | but it doesn't seem to check all places when removing |
| 15:15:27 | kergoth | hmm |
| 15:15:35 | kergoth | i bet you have to ipkg -d cf remove blah |
| 15:15:37 | kergoth | or what have you |
| 15:15:39 | kergoth | specify the dest |
| 15:15:55 | kergoth | fyi, theres a new version of oipkg avail. tille has made some changes recently |
| 15:17:11 | kergoth | does the Z have tcp wrappers installed? |
| 15:17:41 | kergoth | /usr/sbin.rom/tcpd |
| 15:17:42 | kergoth | yep |
| 15:17:43 | kergoth | heh |
| 15:17:45 | ljp_work | nopeoh.. heh I was using the filename instead of the package name |
| 15:17:51 | kergoth | ah |
| 15:18:32 | ljp_work | hmm but it didn't remove it really |
| 15:18:39 | kergoth | try with -d |
| 15:19:53 | kergoth | hmm i should add tcp wrappers to the buildsystem eh? |
| 15:21:13 | ljp_work | nope -d didn't work |
| 15:21:27 | kergoth | hmm |
| 15:21:33 | kergoth | this on a sharp rom or oz? |
| 15:22:37 | ljp_work | Oz.. just found a .jar file in a vnc directory under /usr |
| 15:23:18 | Twiun | Yup, that's normal |
| 15:23:27 | Twiun | not really required I suppose on a Zaurus |
| 15:23:31 | ljp_work | heh ya but Oz doesn't have java |
| 15:23:41 | Twiun | it's not for running on the Zaurus |
| 15:23:55 | Twiun | vncserver launches a minimal httpd to serve that jar |
| 15:23:59 | Twiun | to browsers |
| 15:24:44 | Twiun | so you can vnc into your Zaurus without having a vnc client installed on the desktop |
| 15:30:38 | kergoth | woot, openssh ipk built.. time to test it |
| 15:31:30 | kergoth | hunger: want to test out the openssh package? (namely, i want to know whether the postinst & prerm scripts work out of the box from debian. |
| 15:32:21 | hunger | kergoth: Not right now:-) |
| 15:32:29 | kergoth | np :-) |
| 15:32:47 | roge99 | hey kergoth |
| 15:32:54 | roge99 | how goes it |
| 15:33:02 | hunger | kergoth: I'm stuck in fbdev again, don't want to stop ssh just now or I'll have to do a softreset. |
| 15:33:18 | kergoth | ah, gotcha |
| 15:33:24 | kergoth | roge99: not bad.. you? |
| 15:33:30 | roge99 | not too bad |
| 15:34:16 | kergoth | gah i need to split out the openssl package into libcrypto and libssl packages |
| 15:34:23 | kergoth | then i need to split openssh package into ssh and sshd |
| 15:34:37 | kergoth | but this'll do for now |
| 15:37:29 | kergoth | ah shit.. my build linked staticly against libssl.. we need that as a shared lib for konq/e |
| 15:37:36 | kergoth | mutters |
| 15:38:30 | Twiun | Hehe, might as well split them up now rather than later ;-) |
| 15:38:34 | kergoth | yep |
| 15:38:42 | kergoth | oh well |
| 15:38:59 | kergoth | I'm tired of this, i want to go back to finishing up adding usb configuration to the network settings app |
| 15:38:59 | Twiun | Seeing v1.0 on the horizon yet? |
| 15:39:04 | kergoth | yep, definately |
| 15:41:02 | kergoth | yawns |
| 15:41:04 | kergoth | quiet chan today |
| 15:41:40 | Twiun | Yeah, probably busy days at work |
| 15:54:01 | bipolar | yeah... busy |
| 16:06:45 | benmeyer | http://www.google.com/intl/xx-klingon/ |
| 16:06:47 | benmeyer | wow |
| 16:08:19 | BigBoss | what will those google guys do next |
| 16:10:26 | benmeyer | I would like to see a search that would search companies websites, grab job postings and then let you search them |
| 16:10:36 | kergoth | that would rock. |
| 16:10:37 | kergoth | re ljp |
| 16:10:38 | benmeyer | That would be some cool google-database searching |
| 16:11:01 | benmeyer | win the 10K |
| 16:12:20 | ljp_work | hi |
| 16:13:04 | ljp_work | kergoth: have you heard of the Z app 'keyring'? |
| 16:13:17 | kergoth | is that the one that manages passwords? |
| 16:13:25 | ljp_work | yes |
| 16:13:31 | kergoth | remember seeing it, but never used it |
| 16:13:54 | benmeyer | kergoth: do you have dhcpd on openz? |
| 16:14:01 | NeoTron | benmeyer: there is a site that does just that |
| 16:14:02 | kergoth | dhcpd? no. |
| 16:14:04 | ljp_work | mind if I add it to opie? and could you give the author cvs access? hehhe |
| 16:14:07 | kergoth | there is dhcpcd though |
| 16:14:20 | kergoth | ljp_work: ah, go right ahead. seems a useful app. noncore though |
| 16:14:22 | ljp_work | http://www.scrypt.net/~celer/kweb/ |
| 16:14:24 | kergoth | ljp_work: who's the author? |
| 16:14:26 | kergoth | ljp_work: ah, k |
| 16:14:29 | ljp_work | of course |
| 16:14:32 | benmeyer | I just relized that the offical rom has a dhcpd on it |
| 16:14:40 | kergoth | benmeyer: lmao |
| 16:14:49 | benmeyer | for ad-hoc mode was the only reason I could come up with |
| 16:14:51 | benmeyer | lmao? |
| 16:15:25 | benmeyer | lineo made a very small dhcpd that could be put on |
| 16:15:28 | kergoth | shouldnt need it even for ad-hoc.. course you could use if you were to use the prism2 driver from the familiar kernel that supports host AP mode |
| 16:16:07 | kergoth | pfft. had to patch the Makefile.org in openssl to build the shared libs. how annoying. |
| 16:16:11 | benmeyer | when doing ad-hoc will it automaticly give you ip's? |
| 16:16:34 | kergoth | dont know, not my forte |
| 16:16:40 | benmeyer | ditto |
| 16:16:42 | kergoth | i need to learn more wireless shit |
| 16:18:58 | benmeyer | I am starting to get a number of wireless type hardware coming through my desk so i was curius in getting it all working |
| 16:19:10 | kergoth | ah cool... |
| 16:22:00 | benmeyer | The nicest one is sockets 802.11 card. Don't have drivers yet, but :) |
| 16:22:34 | benmeyer | They have a bluetooth card that is the same as a cf card. Doesn't go above the z. Quite nice |
| 16:29:32 | Mr__X | anyone try bluetooth with the z ? |
| 16:36:21 | kergoth | whew, almost done setting up the split up ssl and ssh packages.. |
| 16:43:07 | hunger | kergoth: Forget those mk's I mailed you... they are broken:-( |
| 16:43:22 | kergoth | k |
| 17:01:52 | benmeyer | kergoth: can you split ssh to 2 packages, server and client? |
| 17:02:03 | benmeyer | i.e. client has sftp etc |
| 17:02:13 | kergoth | benmeyer: thats what i'm doing right now.. along with splitting out openssl into libssl and openssl rather than being one large ass package |
| 17:02:15 | benmeyer | sense for the most part you really only want to get in not out |
| 17:02:22 | benmeyer | very nice |
| 17:06:17 | kergoth | ack |
| 17:06:18 | kergoth | ../libcrypto.so: undefined reference to `dlclose' |
| 17:06:18 | kergoth | ../libcrypto.so: undefined reference to `dlopen' |
| 17:06:18 | kergoth | ../libcrypto.so: undefined reference to `dlsym' |
| 17:10:50 | ljp_work | QFileInfo::isExecutable doesn't like jffs |
| 17:11:18 | kergoth | really? |
| 17:11:37 | kergoth | hmm |
| 17:12:19 | ljp_work | heh ya but QFileInfo::permission works fine.. go figure |
| 17:12:30 | kergoth | hmm you sure its jffs2 causing it? |
| 17:12:43 | kergoth | thats so odd. |
| 17:12:45 | kergoth | heh |
| 17:12:52 | ljp_work | pretty sure |
| 17:14:05 | kergoth | do a ltrace or strace.. find out what its doing that isnt behaving properly.. or check the code.. thats an interesting behavior |
| 17:16:21 | ljp_work | ya its weird.. isExecutable always returns true on jffs.. but if I use the permission method it works |
| 17:17:35 | kergoth | heh.. strange.. you'd think they'd both just run a stat() at the lowest level.. |
| 17:17:43 | W|GGL|T | is away: I'm busy smoking a blunt or sleeping or something |
| 17:17:53 | ljp_work | I should see what qt is doing there |
| 17:18:19 | kergoth | yeah. could certainly be a prob with jffs2.. but we cant know what without having details |
| 17:18:24 | kergoth | woot, libssl0.9.6 built |
| 17:18:27 | kergoth | next.. |
| 17:20:44 | kergoth | "You may get an error following this line. Please ignore it." |
| 17:20:46 | kergoth | hah |
| 17:20:52 | kergoth | isnt that what 2>/dev/null is for? |
| 17:20:54 | benmeyer | woho |
| 17:21:01 | benmeyer | I had that once |
| 17:21:13 | benmeyer | I found that if I didn't have a comment the compiler would barf |
| 17:21:32 | kergoth | hah |
| 17:21:36 | benmeyer | so the comment was /* remove this comment and the DVD player wont work!! */ |
| 17:21:47 | kergoth | thats nuts |
| 17:21:51 | benmeyer | yah |
| 17:22:07 | benmeyer | Didn't know enough about gcc at the time to track it down |
| 17:22:43 | benmeyer | ok I am going into no-mans land. |
| 17:22:57 | benmeyer | going to try to get printer support on my linux box |
| 17:22:59 | kergoth | good luck |
| 17:23:52 | ljp_work | that's odd.. qfilinfo uses ::access() which itself uses system(access); call |
| 17:24:09 | ljp_work | which isn't in Oz |
| 17:24:33 | ljp_work | god how frickin stupid of Qt to do it that way |
| 17:24:46 | kergoth | lol |
| 17:24:54 | kergoth | thats so.. inefficient |
| 17:25:08 | benmeyer | e-mail kent@trolltech.com |
| 17:25:15 | benmeyer | tell him a better way :) |
| 17:25:39 | ljp_work | you should see how it accesses it.. goes through 4 different functions that all return the next function |
| 17:25:46 | kergoth | hah |
| 17:26:08 | ljp_work | havne't they heard of stat()? |
| 17:26:14 | kergoth | precisely |
| 17:26:16 | ljp_work | or lstat() |
| 17:26:19 | kergoth | st_mode man |
| 17:26:29 | kergoth | oh well |
| 17:26:34 | kergoth | we should expect this shit by now |
| 17:26:35 | kergoth | lol |
| 17:26:41 | ljp_work | instead of relying on an outside executable for file permissions |
| 17:27:01 | kergoth | what package is 'access' from anyway? |
| 17:27:02 | benmeyer | well they also have to have it work for osx and windows |
| 17:27:20 | kergoth | osx is no problem.. posix compliant, right? |
| 17:27:32 | benmeyer | yah, but windows... |
| 17:27:36 | ljp_work | they have system specific files for file access |
| 17:27:39 | kergoth | i know jack shit about windows |
| 17:27:41 | kergoth | heh |
| 17:27:53 | kergoth | ljp_work: well then, stat()/lstat() all the way |
| 17:27:54 | kergoth | heh |
| 17:27:57 | BigBoss | all you need to know about Windows is that it can and should be rebooted hourly |
| 17:28:04 | kergoth | BigBoss: hah |
| 17:29:01 | W|GGL|T | is back (gone 00:11:18) |
| 17:29:04 | kergoth | oh my |
| 17:29:07 | kergoth | dpkg -S /usr/bin/access |
| 17:29:07 | kergoth | tetex-bin: /usr/bin/access |
| 17:29:10 | kergoth | is that right? |
| 17:29:17 | ljp_work | but I would like relying on an executable for file permissions is the most UN cross platform was to do it |
| 17:29:41 | ljp_work | eessh |
| 17:29:51 | kergoth | tetex-bin??? argh |
| 17:29:55 | kergoth | shoots TT |
| 17:30:40 | kergoth | i'm NOT adding that to the buildsystem. i'll steal the access binary and stuff it into oz-base |
| 17:30:43 | kergoth | grr |
| 17:31:48 | ljp_work | hmm access isn't on the SHarp rom, either |
| 17:31:52 | kergoth | err |
| 17:32:18 | kergoth | but isExecutable() works on the sharp rom? |
| 17:32:44 | ljp_work | lemme see |
| 17:33:56 | ljp_work | no |
| 17:33:59 | kergoth | ah |
| 17:34:05 | ljp_work | hahahahahahahahhahahah |
| 17:34:14 | kergoth | thats pathetic, you know that? |
| 17:34:15 | kergoth | sheesh |
| 17:34:20 | ljp_work | true |
| 17:34:47 | ljp_work | hmm should I report this, or let them suffer..... |
| 17:35:16 | benmeyer | kergoth: where do I co cvs? |
| 17:35:21 | ljp_work | I bet it would work with the access executable on board |
| 17:35:26 | kergoth | benmeyer: of what? |
| 17:35:32 | kergoth | ljp_work: hehe |
| 17:35:33 | benmeyer | opie |
| 17:35:36 | benmeyer | openz |
| 17:35:38 | benmeyer | :) |
| 17:36:02 | ljp_work | checks qt3 fileinfo |
| 17:36:05 | kergoth | cvs -z3 -d:pserver:anoncvs@cvs.handhelds.org:/cvs co -P opie; |
| 17:36:24 | kergoth | cvs -z3 -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.openzaurus.sf.net:/cvsroot/openzaurus co -P buildroot-oz; |
| 17:38:00 | benmeyer | What does oz have the opie doesn't? |
| 17:38:04 | kergoth | hmm? |
| 17:38:19 | kergoth | oz = linux distro, opie = qtopia fork. oz = opie + ssh + qt + ... |
| 17:38:33 | benmeyer | ok |
| 17:38:59 | benmeyer | guess I need qpe also, but I know where to get that one at lease :) |
| 17:40:49 | ljp_work | dang it.. I don't have qt3 here... hmpppft |
| 17:41:32 | ljp_work | anyone here have qt3 source want to grep for something? |
| 17:42:58 | benmeyer | will calling invoke pull up the little "processing ..." widget? |
| 17:43:30 | whardier | downs some tang |
| 17:43:31 | ljp_work | I think invoke is private function |
| 17:43:38 | benmeyer | global |
| 17:43:43 | benmeyer | void Global::invoke ( const QString & c ) [static] |
| 17:43:49 | whardier | its a personal function |
| 17:43:55 | whardier | heads off to the bathroom too invoke |
| 17:46:54 | tux_mike | anyone know how to make sendmail require authentication to relay? |
| 17:47:17 | benmeyer | sorry havn't done that in a long time |
| 17:54:59 | roge99 | tux_mike: sasl |
| 17:55:23 | tux_mike | sasl? |
| 17:56:24 | roge99 | http://www.sendmail.org/~ca/email/auth.html |
| 17:57:10 | kergoth | does familiar split ssh into ssh/sshd packages? |
| 17:57:14 | | unstable feed is at http://familiar.handhelds.org/familiar/feeds/unstable/packages/armv4l/ |
| 17:57:14 | kergoth | ibot: unstable feed? |
| 17:57:50 | kergoth | yes they do.. |
| 17:58:04 | kergoth | thats not happy.. debian expects a single 'ssh' package that contains everything |
| 17:58:11 | kergoth | I'd prefer to retain compatibility with debian |
| 17:58:12 | kergoth | hmm |
| 17:58:28 | kergoth | perhaps ssh-server and ssh-client which are Depends of the 'ssh' package |
| 18:01:17 | benmeyer | sounds good |
| 18:01:34 | benmeyer | ssh containing keygen or whatnot |
| 18:03:12 | ljp_work | bbl |
| 18:04:09 | kergoth | benmeyer: hmm good point. both ssh server and client need the keygen |
| 18:04:11 | kergoth | benmeyer: hmm |
| 18:04:37 | kergoth | benmeyer: if i make ssh provide them, both ssh-server and ssh-client would break without having the entire thing installed |
| 18:04:55 | kergoth | benmeyer: i'll probably break down and create ssh-common while i'm at it, which both ssh-server and ssh-client depend on |
| 18:04:56 | kergoth | heh |
| 18:10:12 | kergoth | hmm |
| 18:10:13 | kergoth | arm-linux-gcc -o ssh ssh.o sshconnect.o sshconnect1.o sshconnect2.o sshtty.o readconf.o clientloop.o -L. -Lopenbsd-compat/ -L/home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/usr/lib -lssh -lopenbsd-compat -lutil -lz -lnsl -lcrypto |
| 18:10:22 | kergoth | /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/usr/lib/libcrypto.so: undefined reference to `dlsym' |
| 18:10:29 | kergoth | etc etc.. dlopen and dlclose also. |
| 18:10:30 | kergoth | ideas? |
| 18:13:41 | whardier | bitch get out of my airspace |
| 18:13:58 | whardier | my 2.4ghz waveness cannot penetrate you! |
| 18:14:38 | kergoth | heh |
| 18:15:12 | scanline | is away: ZzZz |
| 18:25:12 | kergoth | hunger: I just realized the builds in the buildsystem still depend on the existance of a glibc in your crosscompilation toolchain... it uses those startfiles to link rather than the new ones in the libc build in the system... |
| 18:27:26 | kergoth | so the only reason everything is working happily is that the glibc we're building is compatible with the libc in the toolchain.. not good |
| 18:38:54 | kergoth | gah |
| 18:38:58 | kergoth | /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc.so.6: undefined reference to `_dl_debug_mask@GLIBC_2.2.3' |
| 18:39:04 | kergoth | wtf is that? |
| 18:47:03 | peanut | waves |
| 18:48:16 | peanut | hows oz3 coming along? is beta 8.5 looking good? |
| 18:51:39 | Neo|Work | OZ3b8.5: Your instant memory upgrader |
| 18:51:41 | Neo|Work | heh |
| 18:52:42 | peanut | huh? |
| 18:54:00 | Neo|Work | I installed OZ, which kindly made my SL-5000D have 64 MB of memory |
| 18:54:12 | Neo|Work | but of course, it only has 32 MB so things got bad real fast |
| 18:54:29 | Neo|Work | the nomtdram image apparently thinks 64 MB is always good or so |
| 18:56:57 | Neo|Work | JasonNJ-home: hey |
| 18:57:08 | kergoth | hey jason |
| 18:57:08 | JasonNJ-home | yo neo |
| 18:57:23 | Twiun | Heya |
| 18:57:28 | kergoth | re Twiun |
| 18:57:34 | ljp_work | kergoth: Do you know what the .c file fro unistd.h is in what package? |
| 18:58:06 | kergoth | ljp_work: unistd is part of libc |
| 18:58:16 | JasonNJ-home | yo kergoth. |
| 18:58:19 | JasonNJ-home | whats new in OZ |
| 18:58:42 | kergoth | i beat ssh over the head and am about done with packaging it and incorporating it into the buildsystem.. so we wont be using familiar's anymore |
| 18:58:56 | JasonNJ-home | what ssh are we at |
| 18:58:57 | JasonNJ-home | 3.1? |
| 18:59:17 | kergoth | 3.0.2p1 iirc |
| 19:00:02 | Twiun | JasonNJ-home: Looks like Sun are prepping for a summer release of the cvm-arm stuff |
| 19:01:07 | JasonNJ-home | cool. |
| 19:01:10 | Neo|Work | kergoth: no offense, but why such an old version? |
| 19:01:13 | JasonNJ-home | whered you hear that? |
| 19:01:35 | Twiun | from the J2ME-CVM-INTEREST list, some Sun employee said it |
| 19:01:38 | JasonNJ-home | cause thats what they basically told me |
| 19:01:39 | JasonNJ-home | ok |
| 19:01:41 | Twiun | doh, not CVM, CDC |
| 19:02:24 | Twiun | Their arm team are apparently so busy with it they can't assist with porting queries ;-) |
| 19:02:25 | kergoth | Neo|Work: because I didnt know what the latest ver was? ;-) |
| 19:02:47 | JasonNJ-home | they have a lot of their devices internally |
| 19:02:56 | JasonNJ-home | we sold a lot of zauruses to sun employees |
| 19:03:11 | benmeyer | hi Jason |
| 19:03:12 | Twiun | Hehe, at least they'll have plenty of test harnesses |
| 19:03:19 | JasonNJ-home | ben I just sent you a email |
| 19:03:24 | kergoth | ack |
| 19:03:29 | kergoth | who knows a lot about the link process? |
| 19:03:30 | JasonNJ-home | ben jump on to aim please |
| 19:03:34 | kergoth | /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc.so.6: undefined reference to `_dl_debug_mask@GLIBC_2.2.3' |
| 19:03:49 | kergoth | that function is defined in the dynamic linker (ld-2.2.4.so) |
| 19:04:19 | ljp_work | hmm ok |
| 19:04:35 | Neo|Work | kergoth: you might want to upgrade for security reasons... |
| 19:04:37 | Neo|Work | # OpenSSH 3.1 and newer are not vulnerable to "March 7, 2002: Off-by-one error in the channel code", OpenSSH Security Advisory. |
| 19:04:37 | Neo|Work | # OpenSSH 3.2.1 and newer are not vulnerable to "April 21, 2002: Buffer overflow in AFS/Kerberos token passing code", OpenSSH Security Advisory: Versions prior to OpenSSH 3.2.1 allow privileged access if AFS/Kerberos token passing is compiled in and enabled (either in the system or in sshd_config). |
| 19:04:38 | kergoth | ideas? i thought ld was only used at runtime? |
| 19:04:50 | kergoth | Neo|Work: I'll switch to the latest once i have this one cooperating :-) |
| 19:05:08 | kergoth | but kerberos wont be enabled in my build regardless |
| 19:05:11 | kergoth | hehe |
| 19:05:39 | Neo|Work | well, the first one is a different bug. :P |
| 19:05:46 | kergoth | yep i know |
| 19:05:49 | kergoth | hmm |
| 19:05:57 | kergoth | anyone have any ideas on the link problem? |
| 19:05:57 | Neo|Work | http://www.openbsd.org/advisories/ssh_channelalloc.txt |
| 19:06:49 | Neo|Work | link with -ldl? I have no idea, really |
| 19:06:54 | kergoth | well i added the full path to my ld-2.2.4.so to link it in... what a pain in the ass. it appeared to work, but I bet the binaries will be bloated as hell until i strip |
| 19:06:59 | kergoth | it worked anyway |
| 19:07:24 | kergoth | ls ld, not dl.. and -lld doesnt work, because its not libld.so.2.2.4, its ld-2.2.4.so :-) |
| 19:07:25 | kergoth | grr |
| 19:07:30 | macro | hello |
| 19:07:37 | macro | I am thinking of getting a zaurus |
| 19:07:49 | Neo|Work | good choice. :) |
| 19:08:01 | macro | so far what I read, the zaurus looks like the awesomust gizmo ever |
| 19:08:24 | kergoth | heh. |
| 19:08:24 | macro | the only thing I was thinking of changing is installing X11 rather then using qtopia |
| 19:08:26 | Neo|Work | it is, and especially so if you use Linux on a regular basis |
| 19:08:30 | kergoth | make -f Makefile.ssl DIRS="crypto ssl" EX_LIBS="-v -nodefaultlibs -lc -lgcc $(STAGING_DIR)/lib/ld-2.2.4.so -L$(STAGING_DIR)/usr/lib" CC="$(CC) -fPIC" RANLIB="$(RANLIB)" all; <-messy |
| 19:08:34 | Neo|Work | actually, qtopia is pretty good |
| 19:08:40 | Neo|Work | and you can run both |
| 19:08:40 | kergoth | macro: thats no problem, X is available |
| 19:08:55 | Neo|Work | of course you can build your own ROM image replacing all Qtopia stuff with X11 |
| 19:08:59 | macro | The thing is, I wanna easily develop for my desktop and the zaurus |
| 19:09:20 | Neo|Work | true, but if you develop for X11 not many people will use it on their Z's |
| 19:09:34 | macro | true |
| 19:09:44 | macro | hows the qtopias SDK ? |
| 19:09:51 | Neo|Work | fine |
| 19:10:01 | Neo|Work | I mean, you really just develop for Qt on the desktop more or less |
| 19:10:28 | macro | can qtopia apps easily run / compile over X11 with troll tech libs ? |
| 19:10:46 | Neo|Work | well, you can use Qt and in general most code could be shared |
| 19:11:13 | macro | qtopia written apps should compile with qt ? |
| 19:11:17 | Neo|Work | there's some specific QPE (qtopia) code you need, like QPEApplication but it'd be easy to abstract to make a desktop version and a X version |
| 19:11:29 | Neo|Work | but more or less, yes |
| 19:11:35 | macro | cool |
| 19:11:48 | Neo|Work | I will probably make a desktop version of my eDict |
| 19:12:42 | ljp_work | kergoth: does the Z use a slimmed down libc? |
| 19:13:35 | macro | also hows the wireless 802.11b support on the zaurus |
| 19:13:43 | macro | ? |
| 19:14:17 | Neo|Work | I believe good but I'm no expert since I don't have one mysef |
| 19:14:21 | macro | cause I got linksys pci wmp11 nic on my firewall and its sharing internet via adhoc, would I be able to link up my zaurus through that? |
| 19:15:45 | killefiz | macro: i'm doing exactly that right now ... works quite good so far |
| 19:15:51 | macro | ohohohohooh |
| 19:16:03 | macro | thats soo kick ass |
| 19:16:33 | killefiz | i got a tekram pci card and cf-wlan card - both work |
| 19:16:43 | macro | sweet |
| 19:16:52 | Neo|Work | is away: food |
| 19:17:15 | macro | killefix: you ever telnet/ssh out from your zaurus ? |
| 19:19:49 | macro | if I insert a sd memory card would I be able to mount it like a regular drive? |
| 19:20:14 | kergoth | you can telnet or ssh in or out, if you have the necessary packages installed. yes you mount a sd card like you would anything else |
| 19:20:26 | kergoth | ljp_work: I have no idea... |
| 19:20:30 | kergoth | ljp_work: whats failing? |
| 19:20:31 | roge99 | http://www.killercartoons.com/wldo.html |
| 19:20:32 | roge99 | lol |
| 19:20:58 | macro | anyone here know a good online store where I can order a zaurus for a good price, and fast service and to canada ? |
| 19:21:00 | killefiz | i just checked - i can access the web from my bathroom now ;) |
| 19:21:07 | kergoth | killefiz: hah |
| 19:21:27 | macro | killefiz: I am soo jealous of you now :) |
| 19:21:40 | kergoth | just wait till we have multiplayer games on the Z.. you could fight and defeat someone on the toilet ;-) |
| 19:21:48 | ljp_work | kergoth:I'm still investigating the QFileInfo thing. I was reading the wrong man page.. access() is in unistd.h |
| 19:21:59 | kergoth | ljp_work: ah, gotcha |
| 19:22:04 | killefiz | macro: you've saved a lot of money - that's for sure |
| 19:22:06 | macro | damn vgames on the can, now thats technology at its finest :) |
| 19:22:32 | kergoth | yeah i can see explaining that one to the girlfriend |
| 19:22:40 | macro | lol |
| 19:22:44 | kergoth | 'well you see.. THIS is why i bought this expensive tool!' |
| 19:22:47 | ljp_work | kergoth: but Im just going to send a bug report, and move on to something else. It's TT's problem |
| 19:22:50 | kergoth | *slap* |
| 19:22:57 | kergoth | ljp_work: good idea. far better things to be doing. |
| 19:23:16 | kergoth | I'm fighting gcc |
| 19:23:27 | ljp_work | hahahaha |
| 19:24:07 | kergoth | how do i tell ld where the dynamic linker is? without screwing up the search paths hardcoded in the file (its still in /lib on the Z) |
| 19:24:22 | macro | killefiz: what you mean I saved a lot of money ? |
| 19:24:30 | kergoth | and does ld check ld-2.2.4.so for symbols automatically? |
| 19:24:31 | ljp_work | just don't use a variable named 'or' in the constructor of an inheireted QSlider with gcc 2.96, and you'll be ok |
| 19:24:34 | killefiz | by not owning a zaurus |
| 19:24:36 | kergoth | ljp_work: hah |
| 19:25:11 | kergoth | does -dynamic-linker hardcode a value in the linked binary? |
| 19:25:23 | nyargh | no |
| 19:25:23 | macro | killefiz: I think keeping my money in the bank is a waste compared to actually getting a zaurus :) |
| 19:25:30 | nyargh | it doesn't |
| 19:25:48 | nyargh | it looks in the ld.so.hints file for the library that matches |
| 19:25:58 | nyargh | or it looks in the paths in LD_LIBRARY_PATH |
| 19:26:14 | kergoth | well, how do i tell it to link in ld-2.2.4.so? |
| 19:26:28 | kergoth | -lld wouldnt work, as it doesnt fit the libX.so.[ver] paradigm |
| 19:26:33 | nyargh | i believe you can specify -lld-2.2.4 |
| 19:26:38 | kergoth | the symbols i need are defined in it.. |
| 19:26:39 | kergoth | hmm |
| 19:26:41 | kergoth | i'll try that |
| 19:27:19 | kergoth | /opt/Embedix/tools/arm-linux/bin/ld: cannot find -lld-2.2.4 |
| 19:27:22 | kergoth | grr |
| 19:27:27 | nyargh | hrm |
| 19:27:43 | kergoth | ideas? I need it to find the newly built dynamic linker, but i cant hardcode the path to it in the linked binary |
| 19:27:46 | kergoth | grumbles |
| 19:28:02 | nyargh | you won't hardcode the path |
| 19:28:06 | nyargh | try |
| 19:28:10 | kergoth | does -dynamic-linker hardcode it? |
| 19:28:12 | kergoth | k |
| 19:28:35 | nyargh | gcc foo.o foo2.o -o foo -lld-2.2.4 -L/path/to/your/libs |
| 19:28:42 | kergoth | that doesnt work for me |
| 19:28:49 | kergoth | says it cant find ld-2.2.4 |
| 19:29:00 | nyargh | well if you just need the symbols |
| 19:29:12 | nyargh | what is the filename? |
| 19:29:16 | kergoth | yeah, its giving me undefined references, but they're in the dynamic linker on the unit.. |
| 19:29:18 | kergoth | of what? |
| 19:29:24 | nyargh | your library |
| 19:29:34 | nyargh | the ld |
| 19:29:35 | nyargh | library |
| 19:29:39 | kergoth | ah |
| 19:29:42 | kergoth | ld-2.2.4.so |
| 19:30:01 | kergoth | it resides in /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/ on my dev box, and will reside in /lib on the dest box |
| 19:30:09 | kergoth | i'm linking the 'openssl' binary atm |
| 19:30:13 | nyargh | no, what is the filename |
| 19:30:20 | nyargh | because for one |
| 19:30:24 | nyargh | it's not ld |
| 19:30:24 | nyargh | it's dl |
| 19:30:31 | kergoth | huh? |
| 19:30:34 | nyargh | that you want to link in |
| 19:30:35 | nyargh | yes |
| 19:30:39 | kergoth | its defined in ld-2.2.4.so |
| 19:30:47 | kergoth | add -ldl does not eliminate the undefined references. |
| 19:30:51 | kergoth | s/add/adding/ |
| 19:31:21 | nyargh | what is libdl.so linked to? |
| 19:31:34 | kergoth | libdl-2.2.4.so |
| 19:31:46 | nyargh | ok |
| 19:31:50 | nyargh | what are you building anyhow? |
| 19:31:57 | kergoth | /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc.so.6: undefined reference to `_dl_debug_printf@GLIBC_2.2.3' |
| 19:31:59 | kergoth | openssl |
| 19:32:10 | kergoth | and I'm building it against a glibc that i built.. |
| 19:32:24 | kergoth | which is why i'm using -nodefaultlibs and specifying -lc -lgcc and the path to the newly build glibc |
| 19:33:20 | kergoth | i really need to understand the link process better |
| 19:33:20 | kergoth | ~/buildroot-oz$ arm-linux-objdump -x staging/lib/ld-2.2.4.so | grep _dl_debug_printf |
| 19:33:20 | kergoth | 0000e4ac l F .text 00000044 _dl_debug_printf_c |
| 19:33:21 | kergoth | 0000e468 g F .text 00000044 _dl_debug_printf |
| 19:34:04 | nyargh | hrm |
| 19:34:20 | nyargh | try just putting staging/lib/ld-2.2.4.so on the gcc command line |
| 19:34:21 | kergoth | I'm tempted to say fuck openssl anyway.. but I suspect i'll see this behavior in the openssh link as well |
| 19:34:27 | nyargh | like gcc foo.o foo2.o staging/lib/ld-2.2.4.so -o foo |
| 19:34:32 | kergoth | nyargh: that solves it. but I'm not certain if thats the preferred way |
| 19:34:35 | kergoth | nyargh: :-) |
| 19:34:37 | nyargh | heh |
| 19:34:53 | nyargh | well run ldd on it on your arm box and see what its looking for :) |
| 19:35:08 | kergoth | ldd on what? |
| 19:35:22 | nyargh | copy your binary and libs over to the zaurus |
| 19:35:28 | nyargh | and run ldd on the binary |
| 19:35:38 | nyargh | to see what its linked to |
| 19:35:50 | nyargh | and how the links resolve |
| 19:35:55 | kergoth | heh i doubt itll tell me anything useful |
| 19:35:55 | nyargh | unfortunately you kind of have to run it on your zaurus |
| 19:36:04 | nyargh | well, it well answer your question |
| 19:36:12 | kergoth | it'll certainly link against ld-linux.so.2 |
| 19:36:13 | nyargh | of wether or not it's the right way to do it |
| 19:36:19 | kergoth | ah |
| 19:36:24 | kergoth | i'll try it |
| 19:37:06 | kergoth | stupid linker needs to stop looking at my dynamic linker and look at the one for the crosscompile :-) |
| 19:37:21 | nyargh | anyhow, i've never had to link in symbols for a linker outside of libdl |
| 19:37:24 | kergoth | i'm tempted to add a build of a crosscompiler toolchain to the buildsystem so I have a compiler that is built to use the glibc in question |
| 19:37:29 | kergoth | hm |
| 19:37:35 | nyargh | also |
| 19:37:49 | nyargh | every symbollically linked binary is linked to ld-linux.so |
| 19:37:53 | kergoth | yep, i know |
| 19:37:55 | nyargh | or some ld.so |
| 19:38:02 | nyargh | so it should find your symbols somewhere |
| 19:38:11 | nyargh | you may just have to update your ld.so |
| 19:38:22 | kergoth | but at linktime it doesnt know where to find the ld.so it'll be using at runtime |
| 19:38:31 | nyargh | right |
| 19:38:42 | nyargh | that's the danger of symbollically linked bins |
| 19:38:47 | kergoth | yep |
| 19:38:52 | nyargh | all you can specify is version #s |
| 19:39:04 | nyargh | and i'm curious if that'll do it, but i suspect that it won't |
| 19:41:35 | mark | kergoth: commit kvim/e code to kvim cvs - it shall be released when they fix their qt2 problems |
| 19:41:49 | surge | what does the package server want for a server? |
| 19:43:24 | kergoth | nyargh: well screw it, i'm specifying the full path to the dynamic linker on the link line and leaving it at that for the moment. would be nice if there was a convenient way to handle this |
| 19:43:27 | kergoth | mark: nice |
| 19:43:51 | mark | kergoth: when is OZb9 likely to be released |
| 19:44:19 | kergoth | mark: not certain. I want properly built openssl and openssh packages, as well as inclusion of the fbvncserver and fixed timezones/citytime prior to release |
| 19:55:01 | killefiz | which one is the best irc-client for the Z? ZIC? |
| 19:55:54 | Mr__X | zic, the only one ? |
| 19:56:14 | killefiz | hmm ... wasn't there another one? |
| 19:56:53 | kergoth | just tkcJabber .. with the irc jabber transport |
| 19:56:54 | kergoth | iirc |
| 19:57:04 | kergoth | or bitchx in embeddedkonsole ;-) |
| 19:57:47 | killefiz | bitchx sounds cool ... but unlikely |
| 19:58:07 | kergoth | it runs.. havent checked how the interface is with so few columns though |
| 19:58:08 | Mr__X | zic is freeware, tkcjabber not ..... |
| 19:58:14 | kergoth | Mr__X: yep, and? |
| 19:58:36 | Mr__X | i need a freeware icq client ... |
| 19:58:49 | kergoth | one doesnt exist yet to my knowledge |
| 19:58:50 | killefiz | i bought two tkc apps but I don't think i'll buy an irc client |
| 19:58:59 | kergoth | i bought tkcmahjonng myself |
| 19:59:03 | finkployd | well, that is legit criteria |
| 19:59:05 | bipolar | tckJabber stinks |
| 19:59:08 | kergoth | and going to buy the editor |
| 19:59:09 | bipolar | sorry to say |
| 19:59:14 | bipolar | it's hard to use |
| 19:59:17 | kergoth | bipolar: does it? ive never used it myself. |
| 19:59:26 | bipolar | I could not even use it |
| 19:59:29 | killefiz | i basically like the tkc-apps |
| 19:59:40 | killefiz | what I hate is that they're slow and look like windows xp |
| 19:59:55 | kergoth | i like their QStyle myself |
| 20:00:03 | bipolar | there is another jabber client that will be released when the contest is over. |
| 20:00:05 | kergoth | i was even tempted to use it as default in opie on oz3 ;-) |
| 20:00:10 | bipolar | it looks much better |
| 20:00:17 | kergoth | bipolar: yeah i heard about that... looks cool |
| 20:00:20 | killefiz | i don't - it's soooo slow :( |
| 20:00:51 | killefiz | speed is much more important than look IMO |
| 20:02:12 | Neo|Work | is back (gone 00:45:19) |
| 20:07:43 | bipolar_away | is away: I'm not here... Really.... |
| 20:18:06 | treke | would have no beef with the tkc theme if it was optional |
| 20:18:33 | ljp_work | hehehe |
| 20:19:39 | killefiz | treke: exactly |
| 20:20:50 | kergoth | gah! |
| 20:20:57 | kergoth | it feels like a monday |
| 20:21:03 | treke | one of these days I'm gonna see if I can break force another theme through qt |
| 20:21:09 | kergoth | configure:6781: arm-linux-gcc -o conftest -I/home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/usr/include -Wall -Wpointer-arith -Wno-uninitialized -I/home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/usr/include -I/home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/usr/include /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc_nonshared.a -nodefaultlibs -lc -lgcc -L/home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/ld-linux.so.2 -L/home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/usr/lib conftest. |
| 20:21:17 | kergoth | /tmp/ccXRETLJ.o(.text+0x24): undefined reference to `atexit' |
| 20:21:22 | kergoth | grr! |
| 20:22:20 | kergoth | and now someone says this is a known bug in 2.95.2 gcc! |
| 20:22:31 | ljp_work | hmm |
| 20:22:31 | kergoth | grumbles and starts adding the crosscompiler build to the buildsystem |
| 20:22:46 | Twiun | ack |
| 20:22:57 | kergoth | shit this'll be totally selfreliant and you wont even need a crosscompiler setup to use it |
| 20:22:58 | kergoth | hah |
| 20:23:04 | Twiun | Like I said... you'll end up with a 3-cd set and a full distro ;-) |
| 20:23:10 | kergoth | hehe. no shit.. |
| 20:23:20 | kergoth | why oh why did i decide to create a linux distro in my spare time |
| 20:23:27 | kergoth | hunger: your feature request will likely be fulfilled soon |
| 20:23:33 | Twiun | because you have spare time? |
| 20:23:47 | kergoth | but i dont! thats the problem! |
| 20:24:01 | kergoth | I'm building openssh .. at work, when i shoudl be taking support calls.. lol |
| 20:25:35 | ljp_work | which is more fun.. fighting gcc or support calls? |
| 20:25:52 | kergoth | fighting gcc of course :-) |
| 20:26:16 | Twiun | and realistically, how many calls do you get? |
| 20:26:29 | kergoth | personally? or globally? |
| 20:26:33 | Twiun | it's obvious that whatever you're supporting is perfect ;-) |
| 20:26:37 | kergoth | hah |
| 20:30:02 | benmeyer | kergoth: ever get your 5500? |
| 20:30:47 | killefiz | hmm .. i keep getting ~50% package loss on the wireless connectioin now but the wlan-mon tells me that reception is good. Any hints? |
| 20:31:08 | killefiz | wrong data byte #18 should be 0x12 but was 0x14 |
| 20:31:11 | killefiz | and the like |
| 20:31:23 | benmeyer | wlan-mon is very inacurate/sample date |
| 20:31:25 | benmeyer | data |
| 20:32:03 | kergoth | hmm |
| 20:32:10 | kergoth | i hate it when things are in a man page, but actually arent valid |
| 20:32:13 | killefiz | hmm .. i'm sitting right next to the other end of the wireless connection |
| 20:32:27 | kergoth | is --enable-stdcall-fixup a valid cmdline opt in your gnu ld, people? |
| 20:33:04 | Neo|Work | no |
| 20:33:15 | kergoth | hmm, so whys it in the man page? damnit |
| 20:33:18 | kergoth | I needed that function |
| 20:33:23 | kergoth | even though its a hack |
| 20:34:58 | kergoth | can someone write a test app to confirm that atexit() functions with the lineo toolchain? fucking thing is giving me undefined references |
| 20:34:59 | kergoth | grr |
| 20:39:37 | benmeyer | kergoth: where do you get the cd card driver and the proxim openair driver? |
| 20:40:27 | benmeyer | Do you pretty much follow: http://more.sbc.co.jp/slj/source/build_image.asp for building an image? |
| 20:44:31 | kergoth | benmeyer: I swiped the binary module for sd/mmc .. i havent grabbed the proxim driver yet |
| 20:44:44 | kergoth | benmeyer: no not at all... different process completely |
| 20:44:50 | benmeyer | so you just modeprobe it on boot? |
| 20:44:57 | kergoth | yep |
| 20:45:09 | kergoth | /etc/modules contains the sdmmc module and the usbdmonitor |
| 20:45:13 | benmeyer | Care to write up a howto for me? |
| 20:45:22 | kergoth | On creating custom romimages? |
| 20:45:31 | benmeyer | or just the kernel |
| 20:45:57 | benmeyer | If yours is a lot different I trust your howto more then a 5 months old one on Sharp Japan :-D |
| 20:46:19 | kergoth | K, i'll do the writeup. There are a few different approaches. I'll cover them all |
| 20:46:52 | benmeyer | Many thanks |
| 20:47:03 | benmeyer | I am slowly pushing through this list |
| 20:47:08 | kergoth | np.. |
| 20:47:08 | kergoth | nice |
| 20:47:18 | kergoth | the howtos page is looking good |
| 20:47:28 | benmeyer | Might even get them done before the wedding which would be nice |
| 20:47:32 | benmeyer | Thanks |
| 20:52:28 | kergoth | wedding? |
| 20:52:29 | kergoth | np |
| 20:52:35 | benmeyer | Yup, May 11th |
| 20:52:37 | benmeyer | :) |
| 20:52:56 | kergoth | ah, congrats :-) |
| 20:53:02 | benmeyer | Going to be gone for about 2 weeks for it and honeymoon |
| 20:53:07 | benmeyer | :) |
| 20:53:13 | fusion94 | benmeyer: you're getting married ? |
| 20:53:23 | kergoth | benmeyer: nice, where ya headin? |
| 20:53:28 | benmeyer | to Aruba |
| 20:53:51 | benmeyer | nice and warm |
| 20:53:55 | fusion94 | benmeyer: RUN FOR YOUR LIFE..... |
| 20:53:58 | benmeyer | haha |
| 20:53:59 | kergoth | nice.. have a good time |
| 20:54:00 | kergoth | aha |
| 20:54:14 | kergoth | ack, ld --verbose was far more information that i was hoping for |
| 20:54:34 | whardier | hihihihihi |
| 20:54:35 | whardier | hi |
| 20:54:36 | whardier | hihihi |
| 20:54:36 | whardier | hi] |
| 20:54:40 | whardier | hihihihihi |
| 20:54:46 | whardier | thats my SoS! |
| 20:54:50 | kergoth | grr |
| 20:54:51 | whardier | SAVE ME FROM THIS ISLAND |
| 20:54:55 | kergoth | attempt to open /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc.so.6 succeeded |
| 20:54:55 | kergoth | /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc.so.6 |
| 20:54:55 | kergoth | attempt to open /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/staging/lib/libc_nonshared.a succeeded |
| 20:54:55 | kergoth | a/tmp/ccz36dlu.o: In function `main': |
| 20:54:55 | kergoth | /home/kergoth/buildroot-oz/build/openssh-3.0.2p1/configure:6771: undefined reference to `atexit' |
| 20:54:56 | whardier | too many fake teeth! |
| 20:55:12 | kergoth | but libc_nonshared.a defines atexit |
| 20:55:20 | whardier | :( |
| 20:55:26 | whardier | fake it |
| 20:55:37 | whardier | break it |
| 20:55:39 | whardier | shake it |
| 20:55:41 | whardier | snake it |
| 20:55:47 | whardier | whardier it |
| 20:55:48 | benmeyer | http://www.csh.rit.edu/~benjamin/whoisben/photoalbum/2001newYears/01010002.JPG (Jenny is in yellow and I am talking the pic so not there) |
| 20:55:50 | kergoth | whardier: it turns out that our buildsystem is still building 99% of the items against the glibc in the toolchain, not against our new one |
| 20:56:03 | whardier | oh shit dude |
| 20:56:05 | whardier | I am sooo sorry |
| 20:56:08 | benmeyer | bad photo, but quickest one I could find |
| 20:56:11 | whardier | I wish I was smart |
| 20:56:31 | whardier | I also wish I had starband right about now |
| 20:56:50 | kergoth | shit shit shit |
| 20:56:54 | kergoth | this is really really pissing me off |
| 20:57:12 | kergoth | I'm tired of trying to make the openssh build actually link against our glibc |
| 21:03:38 | kergoth | 3.23. I get "undefined reference to `atexit'" |
| 21:03:38 | kergoth | {UD} This means that your installation is somehow broken. |
| 21:03:42 | kergoth | oh THAT helps |
| 21:04:37 | Neo|Work | "A prominent review published shortly after the product launch mentioned difficulties in synchronization with a PC, but we synchronized address, calendar, and task-list data from Microsoft Outlook 2002 with no problems. " |
| 21:05:43 | Arrgh | Okay, so why is jikes so big? :) |
| 21:06:00 | Arrgh | It's only 2.6MB in the RH7.x package |
| 21:06:08 | Neo|Work | what is jikes? |
| 21:06:25 | Arrgh | The IBM Java compiler |
| 21:06:48 | Arrgh | The Z one is 13MB |
| 21:07:14 | Arrgh | At least the www.micronova.com one is |
| 21:08:32 | Arrgh | Oh, I've found a smaller one... |
| 21:09:06 | Twiun | Yeah, there's that 2mb one (expanded) on sf |
| 21:09:08 | kergoth | its right there! grr! |
| 21:09:09 | kergoth | ~/buildroot-oz/build/openssh-3.0.2p1$ nm -o --defined-only ../../staging/lib/libc_nonshared.a|grep atexit |
| 21:09:09 | kergoth | ../../staging/lib/libc_nonshared.a:atexit.oS:00000000 T atexit |
| 21:10:09 | Arrgh | beats prdownloads.sf.net about the head and neck |
| 21:10:55 | Twiun | Arrgh: Yeah, sf is really slow nowdays |
| 21:11:06 | Twiun | should probably mirror the java stuff from sf |
| 21:14:39 | Arrgh | So does Jikes *need* the JDK 1.1.8 classes.zip or can it use the nice little gclasses.zip that someone else packaged? |
| 21:15:11 | Twiun | probably can get away with using the gclasses.zip... never tried it though |
| 21:15:34 | Twiun | hehe, tell me if it works ;-) |
| 21:16:46 | Twiun | gotta love wget |
| 21:17:28 | Arrgh | SFSG, it compiled my little AWT test app |
| 21:18:08 | Arrgh | Compilation is faster than execution now! Woo! :) |
| 21:18:52 | benmeyer | haha |
| 21:19:37 | Twiun | Hehe, anyone else heard of PERC (seems to be a Java VM) |
| 21:21:51 | ljp_work | thinks the 5000d and 5500 block diagams aren't very acurate as they are exactly the same.... |
| 21:22:29 | Twiun | rofl |
| 21:23:06 | ljp_work | 128 Mb SDRAM * 2 << ?!? |
| 21:28:20 | Arrgh | Those are megabits, not megabytes |
| 21:30:38 | kergoth | shit! |
| 21:30:46 | kergoth | this is annoying the hell out of me |
| 21:30:47 | kergoth | wtf |
| 21:34:24 | ljp_work | are yo STILL on ssh? |
| 21:34:48 | kergoth | not ssh specifically, this is a problem i'm seeing regardless of which of the items in the system i try to build |
| 21:34:59 | ljp_work | arrgh: 64 Mb Flash |
| 21:35:03 | kergoth | its just aprob with me trying to get it to link against the glibc we build instead of the one in the toolchain |
| 21:37:04 | ljp_work | in fact.. it shows it has 2 64 Mb Flash chips.. same exact for 5000d as 5500 |
| 21:37:54 | benmeyer | Does anyone know of a way to get the documents folder to refresh? |
| 21:38:02 | benmeyer | without restarting? |
| 21:38:20 | kergoth | benmeyer: theres probably a QCop call for that |
| 21:38:57 | ljp_work | ohhh there IS adifference in the block diagrams.. the 5500 has 256 Mb SDRAM *2 |
| 21:39:22 | kergoth | yep, whatever that refers to |
| 21:39:23 | kergoth | heh |
| 21:40:49 | ljp_work | benmeyer: anyway you might be able to dig up specs on the TC35143AF, as there's about nothing on the net about that ? :D |
| 21:41:11 | kergoth | good idea |
| 21:41:15 | kergoth | thatd be damn useful |
| 21:42:15 | ljp_work | funny, in the block diagram, its labelled "Touch Control" |
| 21:42:25 | kergoth | one of its many functions eh |
| 21:42:29 | benmeyer | I can see what I can do |
| 21:42:39 | kergoth | are they using the tc35143af to interface with the touchscreen controller? |
| 21:42:44 | ljp_work | I suppose so |
| 21:42:51 | ljp_work | yes looks like it |
| 21:42:51 | benmeyer | What is it? |
| 21:43:11 | benmeyer | controller? |
| 21:43:14 | benmeyer | bridger? |
| 21:43:19 | ljp_work | well for one, its the chip that houses the /dev/sharp_buz |
| 21:43:36 | benmeyer | ok |
| 21:43:39 | benmeyer | Will ask Japan |
| 21:44:00 | ljp_work | not sure exactly what it is cause there's no specs really anywhere |
| 21:44:24 | benmeyer | np, someone at the factory should know |
| 21:44:36 | benmeyer | Should get an e-mail back tomarrow for you |
| 21:45:00 | ljp_work | cool, that would be great |
| 21:46:01 | ljp_work | I also checked out the 'headphones' chip.. its overkill for a pda.. heheh |
| 21:47:07 | ljp_work | hmm |
| 21:50:01 | ljp_work | is going to take apart a zaurus tonight.... |
| 21:51:09 | kergoth | son of a bitch |
| 21:51:18 | kergoth | ljp_work: i'm going to have to make the buildsystem build a new crosscompiler! |
| 21:51:21 | ljp_work | is going to add a micrphone to his Oz Z... |
| 21:51:30 | kergoth | hah |
| 21:51:32 | ljp_work | hehehhe.. hmm |
| 21:51:39 | kergoth | shoots self |
| 21:52:04 | ljp_work | so the new buildsystem is going to build everything, completely? |
| 21:52:07 | kergoth | yes |
| 21:52:13 | kergoth | completely self sufficient, really |
| 21:52:17 | ljp_work | everytime?? |
| 21:52:29 | kergoth | no, i'll make it smart enough to see if you've done it once already |
| 21:52:35 | kergoth | :-) |
| 21:52:38 | ljp_work | hehehe |
| 21:53:14 | kergoth | hunger already added binutils to the buildsystem |
| 21:53:17 | kergoth | so i'm on my way |
| 21:53:46 | ljp_work | if there was room to also add a mic AND a diode or something er other..... I would... |
| 21:54:19 | ljp_work | or a mini button for the mic |
| 21:54:21 | kergoth | pretty tight fit eh? |
| 21:54:37 | ljp_work | looks like it, I have taken one apart yet |
| 21:54:47 | kergoth | hey.. my dad.. he's a toolmaker.. he's going to make me a slide on stainless steel cover for my Z |
| 21:54:55 | kergoth | with a etched pingizauru on the cover |
| 21:54:56 | kergoth | ;-) |
| 21:55:03 | ljp_work | heheheh cool! |
| 21:55:14 | kergoth | then I'll paint into the etching.. |
| 21:55:59 | tux_mike | JasonNJ: ping |
| 21:57:09 | ljp_work | br |
| 22:00:32 | kergoth | hmm I'll make a current OZ toolchain available for download, to prevent everyone having to build it independently.. |
| 22:01:40 | Arrgh | There are too many classes that are purely native, not even stubs in the core.jar, to be able to compile everything; I had to use the jdk118 rt.jar |
| 22:04:03 | Twiun | Arrgh: was that trying to use the gclasses.zip from kopi, or the classes.zip from jdk1.1.8? |
| 22:04:17 | Arrgh | gclasses.zip wasn't enough; I had to use the 1.1.8 one. |
| 22:05:14 | Arrgh | gclasses.zip only contains the visible API, not the implementation classes (i.e. sun/io/CharToByteConvertor etc.) |
| 22:06:35 | Twiun | Arrgh: I would've thought that would be enough (just for compilation) |
| 22:06:36 | Arrgh | jikes digs deeper than Kopi; it actually tests whether the dependencies are present |
| 22:06:54 | Twiun | Hmmm, can't you make it behave like javac? *grin* |
| 22:07:00 | Arrgh | Maybe, dunno |
| 22:16:36 | Arrgh | How do you paste in Terminal again? |
| 22:16:45 | Arrgh | Oh right, the button. Duh. |
| 22:19:55 | benmeyer | Ok wrote a long UI howto that is being reviewed and shoul be up tomarrow |
| 22:20:11 | benmeyer | And with that I am off to dinner. yummy yummy ramean noodles here I come! |
| 22:20:20 | scanline | is back (gone 04:05:08) |
| 22:29:35 | W|GGL|T | is away: Watching Batman Beyond :o) |
| 22:39:01 | Twiun | How's this for scary... found a Java VM that seems to be able to work straight to the framebuffer ;-) |
| 22:45:19 | Arrgh | Which one? |
| 22:53:00 | BigBoss | yo home girls |
| 22:53:08 | Twiun | Hey BB |
| 22:53:46 | kergoth | hey |
| 22:54:09 | BigBoss | 2 hours to the linux show |
| 22:54:46 | ljp | ok got my 270-084 and ready (almost) to start hardware hackin'! |
| 22:55:02 | ljp | the linux show? |
| 22:55:10 | BigBoss | www.thelinuxshow.com |
| 22:55:17 | BigBoss | streaming internet audio |
| 22:55:20 | BigBoss | and irc |
| 22:55:27 | ljp | ahh I'd forotten about this |
| 22:55:32 | kergoth | 270-084? |
| 22:55:33 | BigBoss | i've been on it before, but we are talking about the zaurus tonight |
| 22:56:12 | ljp | BB: do your guys find alot of bugs in Qt? |
| 22:56:33 | ljp | 270-084 = RS mini mic |
| 22:57:14 | BigBoss | ljp: all too often |
| 22:57:25 | BigBoss | we've been struggling with problems in QSocket and QURL recently |
| 22:57:25 | ljp | hmm, suppose I should include an example app in my bug report.... |
| 22:57:41 | BigBoss | we had to totally write a new FTP module for Quanta, which we used in tkcFTP |
| 22:57:44 | ljp | heh try QFileInfo::isExecutable() on the Z.. |
| 22:57:48 | BigBoss | and we just had to rewrite QSocket |
| 22:58:32 | gash | BigBoss: good luck tonight |
| 22:58:56 | BigBoss | gash: thanks :) |
| 22:59:02 | BigBoss | should be a softball conversation |
| 22:59:13 | BigBoss | gotta think of something controversial to say :) |
| 22:59:25 | gash | hehe shouldn't be too hard |
| 22:59:25 | ljp | they mis spelled zaurus on their web site |
| 23:00:40 | BigBoss | yea, and some other things as well |
| 23:02:05 | Twiun | ugh... their streaming site is slow |
| 23:02:58 | MetaCosm_ | is this the "already converted" users? I was wondering how everyone felt about thier Zaurus.. issues, wireless card recommendations, etc |
| 23:05:10 | ljp | converted? |
| 23:06:52 | digiSilk | <- loves his (no marriage comments from ljp!!!) |
| 23:07:03 | kergoth | loves his? |
| 23:07:26 | kergoth | i assume you mean loves his wife, not just loves his. :-P |
| 23:07:58 | Twiun | that's such a loaded statement, digiSilk ;-) |
| 23:08:15 | digiSilk | MetaCosm: I use the SMC wireless NIC... doesn't block the stylus |
| 23:08:17 | ljp | hehehe |
| 23:08:22 | Twiun | I'm happy with my Zaurus, the hardware has a LOT of potential |
| 23:08:45 | digiSilk | I'm always loaded...er, saying crap like that |
| 23:09:40 | kergoth | watches the oz buildsystem start the gcc crosscompiler build |
| 23:10:17 | digiSilk | gotta love a device that has so much software available even though it's new |
| 23:10:37 | digiSilk | and to get a bash shell!!! that rocks |
| 23:11:01 | gash | sshing into my Z over the wlan is kick ass (and yes, of course bash!) |
| 23:11:15 | kergoth | scp. got to love scp |
| 23:11:37 | kergoth | Twiun: hehe. just wait till the drivers catch up ;-) |
| 23:11:37 | digiSilk | I avoided visor/palm 'cuz I didn't want a glorified day planner |
| 23:11:53 | kergoth | digiSilk: you wanted a handheld computer, not a pda, eh? |
| 23:12:22 | digiSilk | now I have a real computer in my pocket (nort just happy to see you) |
| 23:12:34 | digiSilk | kergoth: exactly! |
| 23:13:47 | digiSilk | fun for wardriving (war-striding?) |
| 23:14:02 | MetaCosm_ | digiSilk: what is the battery life like with the SMC in? |
| 23:14:06 | gash | doh |
| 23:14:32 | MetaCosm_ | digiSilk: what do you use to stumble on the Z? |
| 23:14:49 | MetaCosm_ | also... how hard is it to build apps and compile them for the little bugger? |
| 23:14:55 | MetaCosm_ | has never cross-compiled anything. |
| 23:14:56 | digiSilk | Meta: depends on if I'm running kismet... not great (low: 1.5h) |
| 23:15:18 | kergoth | MetaCosm_: relatively easy.. if you follow the howto on setting up the environment. |
| 23:15:30 | W|GGL|T | is back (gone 00:45:54) |
| 23:15:46 | digiSilk | but with a cradle at work and home plus a charger in the car... not a limiting factor |
| 23:16:21 | digiSilk | dept meeting....bye |
| 23:16:41 | MetaCosm_ | kergoth: ahhh... do you build many apps for it? |
| 23:16:43 | MetaCosm_ | success rate? |
| 23:16:48 | MetaCosm_ | ... ... |
| 23:17:22 | kergoth | MetaCosm_: well, i'm quite close to having built every included application (that we have the source to) from source |
| 23:17:38 | ljp | heheh he builds alot of apps for it.. but does he have time to code anything yet?? is the real question |
| 23:17:45 | kergoth | ljp: shush |
| 23:17:47 | kergoth | heheh |
| 23:18:05 | MetaCosm_ | hehe |
| 23:18:11 | MetaCosm_ | brb |
| 23:18:22 | ljp | kergoth enslaves little elves to do his coding for hime |
| 23:19:28 | kergoth | whips the elves |
| 23:20:05 | fusion94 | is away: off drinking pints of guinness |
| 23:21:14 | roge99 | mmmmmmm guinness |
| 23:27:10 | MetaCosm_ | well -- I like QT .. so I might try building a few apps |
| 23:28:26 | ljp | me too |
| 23:30:12 | scanline | is away: I'm busy |
| 23:30:21 | scanline | is back (gone 00:00:03) |
| 23:35:28 | ljp | I especially like finding bugs in Qt and sending bug reports complete with bug proving example apps |
| 23:36:25 | Twiun | ljp: Hehe, sounds like fun |
| 23:36:41 | ljp | oh ya! |
| 23:37:03 | Twiun | tell us all about the last bug you found... did you get a ticket number for it? |
| 23:37:03 | MetaCosm_ | hehe |
| 23:37:13 | ljp | doesn't send bug fixes.. thats their JOB |
| 23:37:30 | Twiun | Hahahaha |
| 23:38:06 | Twiun | Fixing bugs? Bah! we just sweep them under the carpet! |
| 23:38:14 | Twiun | no-one ever notices ;-) |
| 23:40:14 | ljp | well.. I reported a bug that supposedly got fixed, and I never got around to checking it until about three weeks ago. and it wasnt fixed |
| 23:40:29 | ljp | the one I am about to send is different |
| 23:40:54 | kergoth | k i'm headin home. ttyl people |
| 23:43:19 | Twiun | I'll be off too... time for some serious sleep, see ya all tomorrow ;-) |
| 23:50:46 | BigBoss | hey if anyone cares, we got Rekall working on the Zaurus today |
| 23:50:56 | BigBoss | imagine MS Access type application |
| 23:53:46 | mtm | BigBoss: thelinuxshow is on IRC? Is somebody transcribing in realtime, or is it just for asking questions? |
| 23:53:59 | BigBoss | you can ask questions and talk in there at the same time |
| 23:54:08 | BigBoss | they save the audio and transcribe it later |
| 23:54:13 | BigBoss | and you can listen to it again |
| 23:54:19 | BigBoss | what kind of accent should I talk in? |
| 23:54:24 | BigBoss | I'm thinking a deep russian style |
| 23:54:41 | mtm | sure, like all your employees :) |
| 23:55:19 | BigBoss | I've got a bunch of british ones too |
| 23:55:31 | BigBoss | maybe redneck style |
| 23:55:39 | Neo|Work | notes that he just received yet another port |
| 23:56:45 | mtm | what's your normal style? SoCal? How about Valley? Can you do a Jeff Spiccoli? |
| 23:57:08 | BigBoss | I could do Spiccoli |
| 23:57:13 | mtm | :) |
| 23:57:22 | BigBoss | :0 |
| 23:57:48 | mtm | Yes, Microsoft could play that at the next pep rally |
| 23:57:58 | mtm | "Have no fear -- This is what we're up against ..." |
