| 00:07.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Semlar2 (~semlar@142-196-139-80.res.bhn.net) |
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| 00:21.45 | Semlar2 | neffi you get to go first in final jeopardy |
| 00:23.13 | Neffi | I'll wager 10 qutintilion dollars |
| 00:25.26 | Semlar2 | you don't have that many neffi |
| 00:25.40 | Neffi | you don't know that |
| 00:25.46 | Neffi | are you calling me a liar? |
| 00:26.32 | Semlar2 | there isn't that much money on the board |
| 00:27.13 | mckenziemc | steals all of Semlar2's money. |
| 00:30.17 | Neffi | no its, like, secret money, OK? |
| 00:31.57 | Neffi | (don't tell anyone) |
| 00:36.04 | mckenziemc | steals all of Neffi's secret money. |
| 00:38.24 | Neffi | plz |
| 00:48.31 | Torhal | That money was marked, mckenziemc. Now Neffi gets to send you to his secret prison. |
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| 00:52.03 | Unkle | Secret Code Prison |
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| 01:08.16 | Unkle | Would Lua prision be a violation of the Geneva Convention, since it only provides tables? |
| 01:24.14 | Gnarfoz | sets Unkle's ## Interface: number to 1300 |
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| 02:36.48 | emihir0 | is there a way to find which battle pet is in guildbank at a given position? (ie. the way i do it returns 'pet cage' only) |
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| 02:40.00 | Amarande | emihir0: I'm a bit foggy on that ... battle pets seem to work seriously strange item wise |
| 02:40.12 | Amarande | I'm actually also foggy on if Auctioneer was ever fixed to deal with that, too |
| 02:40.44 | Amarande | my recollection was that it seemed to treat all battle pets as the same item |
| 02:43.07 | emihir0 | yes, 'pet cage' |
| 02:43.27 | emihir0 | but i'm sure there is a way because TSM keeps track of how many of what pet there are in mail/ah/bag/other char/and guilds |
| 02:43.44 | emihir0 | so i'm assuming they dont just 'count++' when you put one it... that could be very inaccurate |
| 02:46.51 | Amarande | yeah, I'm not quite sure |
| 02:47.15 | Amarande | I've always used ArkInventory as my inventory management addon of choice |
| 02:49.23 | emihir0 | does it keep track of stuff in guild? |
| 02:50.15 | emihir0 | i guess alcoholic has a way to do it, i'll have a look into that |
| 02:50.33 | Amarande | yeah, arkinventory keeps track of guild banks |
| 02:50.50 | Amarande | (well, as far as any addon can of course) |
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| 03:17.00 | fewyn | oh god |
| 03:17.02 | fewyn | deadpool |
| 03:17.04 | fewyn | so good |
| 03:17.51 | Gnarfoz | huh, I didn't realize that was due this earl |
| 03:17.52 | Gnarfoz | y |
| 03:17.56 | Gnarfoz | thought it was later in the year |
| 03:17.59 | fewyn | it came out tonight |
| 03:18.34 | Gnarfoz | yesterday here, even |
| 03:18.50 | fewyn | it went to the first showing here |
| 03:19.00 | fewyn | 7:45 pm gmt -5 |
| 03:20.13 | emihir0 | i'm refreshing piratebay like a madman >.< |
| 03:20.24 | emihir0 | wanna see it hard but there is no cinemy closeby =( |
| 03:21.00 | emihir0 | anyway, seems like you have to use GameTooltip:SetGuildBankItem(tab, slot) to get the info about pet |
| 03:21.28 | Gnarfoz | derp, local cinemas still keeping up their idiotic "let's show original versions on Wednesday afternoons, when nobody can come see them" thing |
| 03:21.40 | Amarande | Wednesday? |
| 03:21.47 | Amarande | here in the States movies pretty much always come out on Fridays |
| 03:22.10 | Amarande | with very few exceptions (usually ones that open on Christmas Day) |
| 03:25.39 | fewyn | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1UgcMrhW3c |
| 03:41.06 | Semlar | here neffi http://gfycat.com/RealisticBaggyDarklingbeetle |
| 03:41.11 | Semlar | finnaly |
| 03:41.17 | Semlar | i mean.. finally |
| 03:42.14 | emihir0 | is there a function which withdraws from a guild (given tab + slot indexes)? |
| 03:43.43 | emihir0 | nvm found it |
| 03:51.39 | emihir0 | (p.s.: AutoStoreGuildBankItem(tab,slot) doens't seem to be a 'withdraw item' by intuition) |
| 03:56.58 | fewyn | i almost want to go see deadpool again |
| 04:01.01 | Fisker | Good |
| 04:01.03 | Fisker | you should |
| 04:18.22 | emihir0 | hmm i made a function which withdraws items from guild, but (even with artificial delay) it withdraws only 4 items at a time, any idea why? https://i.gyazo.com/3bf79ea5260618224d45a1b226f662fd.png this is the function, this is the behaviour: https://i.gyazo.com/32d945ebb1f52e715128f7764fe4e658.gif |
| 04:19.10 | emihir0 | (there are 10 items in total in the table to be withdrawn and it's no particular pet 'breaking' it, i tried switching order of them and it still withdraws only 4) |
| 04:21.06 | Semlar | all you're doing is delaying when your loop starts, it's still withdrawing everything instantly |
| 04:21.58 | emihir0 | oh, goddamn, sec |
| 04:23.49 | Semlar | are you sure your script is even trying to withdraw more than 4 pets |
| 04:23.50 | emihir0 | https://i.gyazo.com/7d14da9589825e2d789aa003701e51ab.png thanks, works now |
| 04:24.08 | emihir0 | yes, the input is a table with every pet that is supposed to be withdrawn |
| 04:26.29 | emihir0 | https://i.gyazo.com/0a615edeef3d0129fc7cdd24da4511a1.gif <3 |
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| 04:47.32 | Fisker | makes a fine drawing of me hugging Cairenn |
| 04:47.38 | Cairenn | hugs Fisker |
| 04:47.40 | Fisker | Hi I'm Fisker |
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| 04:53.17 | FireSiku | <PROTECTED> |
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| 04:56.30 | Semlar | <PROTECTED> |
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| 05:19.29 | karl_w_w | yes, that's right Semlar |
| 05:20.05 | Semlar | i need an english dictionary |
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| 05:25.27 | Semlar | alright, here Stanzilla http://pastebin.com/N2w3miBP |
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| 05:44.58 | Semlar | just kidding, i meant http://pastebin.com/2ekWh40c |
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| 06:55.13 | mckenziemc | disposes of Fisker and hugs Cairenn. |
| 06:56.43 | Cairenn | hugs mckenziemc |
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| 12:23.02 | emihir0 | hi guys. can someone help me out with setting up a hardware event function? that is, i need to 'learn pet' in inventory type of button and have no idea where to begin tbh. alternatively, can you tell me some of the standard functions that are used (so i can do some reading on it)? |
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| 13:00.32 | nevcairiel | there is no magic to hardware event functions, all you need to do is run your code in any sort of event handler thats called from a hardware event, ie. a OnClick or anything that otherwise directly maps to the user pressing a button |
| 13:06.41 | emihir0 | from my understanding you can use 'PROTECTED CastSpellByName' as provided in the example here: https://i.gyazo.com/7678cf72626395e0d9f14a13947df17c.png |
| 13:07.13 | emihir0 | but how does one use the "item" function below it? i thought i could use UseContainerItem function for it |
| 13:07.29 | nevcairiel | you cant call that function directly, you have to use the secure templates this list comes form |
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| 13:11.18 | emihir0 | so if i wanted to use item (0, 1) -- ie. hearthstone in most of the cases, i would so something like: https://i.gyazo.com/bd23c675426b6cbc990b9421eb05e387.png if i understand correctly? |
| 13:11.58 | nevcairiel | that looks like it could work |
| 13:15.44 | emihir0 | so any idea on how can I add this functionality (setAttribute) with Ace3? they must have some function for it for sure and i cannot find it in http://www.wowace.com/addons/ace3/pages/ace-gui-3-0-widgets/ |
| 13:16.15 | nevcairiel | secure buttons are not supported in acegui, you would need to either define your own widget or manually position them |
| 13:16.34 | emihir0 | oh, i see |
| 13:17.02 | Stanzilla | Semlar: thank you! |
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| 15:24.10 | Fisker | attackhuggles Lopeppeppy |
| 15:27.53 | Lopeppeppy | Good morning, kind sir. Can you spare a pair of woolen socks? My youngest cat stole mine and I cannot find them. |
| 15:32.23 | Fisker | I have socks |
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| 15:50.15 | Simca | bans Fisker's socks |
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| 16:41.46 | karl_w_w | socks Simca |
| 16:43.06 | Amarande | hmm, to wine or not to wine |
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| 17:51.08 | VIad | :o |
| 17:51.18 | VIad | http://www.secretgoldguide.com |
| 17:51.36 | VIad | regular price $57 but for me, just $5! |
| 17:51.53 | MiRai | I'm not sure how you could pass that up |
| 17:53.03 | VIad | "unlike other guides, this one is 100% legal and works, satisfaction guaranteed!" |
| 17:53.56 | VIad | found it by clicking someones link on wowi forums then clicking gold ad on the side because it had a girl on it and everyone knows that means its a scam site |
| 17:54.14 | Amarande | heh, it might well be 100% legal |
| 17:54.26 | Ressy | o.O |
| 17:54.31 | Ressy | excuse me? |
| 17:54.40 | Amarande | kinda like those scams where they sell you a book about how to claim "unclaimed government money!" |
| 17:54.50 | Amarande | the unclaimed government money is actually, in most cases, real |
| 17:55.04 | Amarande | it's just that you either don't qualify for it, or it's peanuts, and meanwhile they tricked you into paying forty bucks for the book |
| 17:55.20 | Amarande | (which, to add insult to injury, is usually a bunch of publicly available information cribbed from the web anyway :p) |
| 17:55.29 | VIad | I guess you didn't get 100% satisfaction guarantee on your deal |
| 17:56.26 | Amarande | Ressy: well, it'd be a pretty simple matter to analyse, say, the most efficient way to do your dailies and put in a footnote about how to arbitrage on the AH, and then trick some doofus into paying money for it as a "super duper gold making guide" heh |
| 17:57.13 | Amarande | keep in mind that there's also an apparently ingrained human tendency to equate price with quality too |
| 17:57.40 | Amarande | (= a corresponding ease in getting people to pay for things that you can actually fairly easily get for free, because they assume that the free source must not be as good quality as the one that you have to buy) |
| 17:57.49 | VIad | Amarande: I can sell you my awesome guide that tells you the road to success for just $49.99! in short, go to school, get higher education, find a job, work until rich, there. 100% satisfaction guarantee as long you follow my steps. |
| 17:57.56 | Torhal | You really have no idea how many people have you on ignore, do you? |
| 17:58.07 | VIad | Amarande, me or both? :p |
| 17:58.14 | Torhal | The former. |
| 17:58.53 | VIad | free Amarande movement starts tonight |
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| 18:00.58 | Ressy | I objected to the "Theres a female on it, therefore it must be a scam" bit. |
| 18:01.23 | VIad | looked like obvious click bait, so had to click it |
| 18:01.39 | VIad | even watched the youtube video for fun |
| 18:01.57 | VIad | don't take it personally, Ressy |
| 18:02.54 | Primer | She just did |
| 18:03.17 | Ressy | :P |
| 18:05.20 | Amarande | me, I tend to be an inherent skeptic about pretty much any MMO guide that asks you to pay, though |
| 18:05.20 | VIad | is there any hope for the windows shop? |
| 18:05.38 | Amarande | as in, "what can you possibly have to offer me that I can't read up on for free somewhere else?" |
| 18:06.11 | Amarande | actually make that gaming guides in general in many cases (given how much even official game guides tend to suck lately compared to fan guides on GameFAQs) |
| 18:06.38 | VIad | :D |
| 18:07.16 | Amarande | VIad: I doubt the Windows Store will be successful in the long run |
| 18:07.25 | VIad | found the app called "7z ZIP RAR" |
| 18:07.32 | VIad | I bet its just 7z with a GUI he made |
| 18:07.40 | VIad | let's slap $5 on that |
| 18:07.54 | Amarande | unless we get some kind of perfect storm, like MS unilaterally deciding to force people to use the Store only, combined with (it could really only be successful in this sort of case) some kind of unforeseen legal mandate that makes it impossible to use Linux or BSD in the USA |
| 18:08.39 | VIad | I just dont like copycats or people imitating existing software |
| 18:08.42 | Amarande | (well, impossible to *use* Linux or BSD might still be impossible, but a sufficient interdiction against distribution would essentially do it, as you'd be left unable to readily keep up with security) |
| 18:09.58 | Amarande | MS has pretty much got about as heavy handed about the store as I think they reasonably can |
| 18:10.20 | Amarande | specifically, in an oblique fashion, through more strongly recommending Refresh as a solution to system issues |
| 18:10.48 | VIad | they already suffered from one store going down the drain |
| 18:10.51 | Amarande | (used to be you only really saw the option as a last resort, now I've seen screenshots where in some cases if an app isn't working it goes straight to recommending a refresh) |
| 18:10.53 | VIad | I hope they do better with this one |
| 18:11.13 | Amarande | i.e., the more people are encouraged to use Refresh, the more popular it would seem the store would get |
| 18:11.17 | VIad | the whole app idea is neat, but it should be safe to browse and use |
| 18:11.46 | Amarande | (since every time you refresh, all your non-store apps are nuked, so if you have to do it often enough you'll start to get annoyed at having to keep reinstalling so many apps by hand and might warm up to the store more) |
| 18:12.23 | Amarande | hmmm |
| 18:12.28 | Amarande | how well is wow doing in wine these days, btw? |
| 18:13.23 | Amarande | still good enough to just install wine and jump in, or had I better fork out for a proper windows licence for this machine? |
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| 18:17.58 | Primer | I use wine to play at work where I only have Linux and because I use a raid frame addon, I can't raid |
| 18:18.01 | Primer | 1 FPS |
| 18:18.15 | Primer | but if I turn off PB4, it's almost OK |
| 18:18.36 | Primer | I have a very decent CPU and 16g of ram on the machine, but only an nvidia 650 |
| 18:18.49 | Primer | I don't think it's a GPU bottleneck |
| 18:19.18 | Primer | But the CPU meters aren't pegged when I play |
| 18:19.44 | fewyn | https://emoji.rodeo/ |
| 18:19.48 | mckenziemc | it's an emulation bottleneck! (/sarcasm) |
| 18:20.00 | Primer | In fact the load is spread pretty evenly across all 4 cores with the config.wtf setting that forces it to use X number of cores |
| 18:20.09 | Amarande | huh, that's weird |
| 18:20.16 | Amarande | I'm assuming you have direct rendering properly enabled |
| 18:20.19 | Primer | I've often wondered about that. Did they really code the game to be multi-threaded? |
| 18:20.26 | Primer | Because the spread is totally even |
| 18:20.43 | Primer | At least according to gkrellm2's CPU monitors |
| 18:20.53 | Amarande | actually I guess it couldn't be a lack of DRI |
| 18:20.59 | Primer | nvidia |
| 18:21.02 | Primer | 'nuff said |
| 18:21.04 | Amarande | I actually ran WoW under Wine once on a machine that lacked direct rendering |
| 18:21.19 | Amarande | and ... it actually did start and run, but the framerate quite literally reported as zero |
| 18:21.27 | Amarande | heh |
| 18:21.54 | Amarande | Primer: yeah, wow is multithreaded |
| 18:21.57 | Primer | The problem is no a GPU bottleneck. I've been in Ashran when it was 200v200, I could observe all the action going down just fine, but as soon as combat starts, FPS goes to shit. |
| 18:22.07 | Primer | s/no/not/ |
| 18:22.15 | Amarande | that's weird |
| 18:22.20 | Amarande | actually, that's doubly weird |
| 18:22.29 | Amarande | one, I'm not sure why your FPS would go to shit in Wine but not in real Windows |
| 18:22.29 | Primer | It's something I'd like to resolve |
| 18:22.38 | Amarande | and two, four hundred people actually cared that much about ashran? :) |
| 18:22.40 | Primer | Well, I don't have real windows on that machine |
| 18:22.47 | Primer | It only has Linux |
| 18:23.09 | Amarande | I thought Ashran had about all the popularity of the Martin O'Malley campaign, LOL |
| 18:23.11 | Semlar | you sure your addon isn't broken |
| 18:23.12 | Primer | I would lose all credibility as a Linux zealot if I put windows on that machine |
| 18:23.17 | Primer | my addon? |
| 18:23.32 | Primer | Not sure what that has to do with anything |
| 18:23.33 | Primer | but |
| 18:23.34 | Semlar | you said disabling it resolves your framerate issues |
| 18:23.44 | Primer | you wrote "your addon" |
| 18:23.47 | Primer | PB4 is not my addon |
| 18:23.56 | Primer | PB4_Arrow is, though :) |
| 18:23.57 | Amarande | Primer: do you ever play wow on a windows machine with that addon, I meant |
| 18:24.09 | Amarande | if so, it's weird that it would only act up on the wine install |
| 18:24.12 | Primer | and yes, that's one of the first things I tested. Disabling just the arrow addon |
| 18:24.34 | Primer | Amarande: yes, I play with the exact same set of addons here at home, on a machine with a lesser CPU, but with an nvidia 770 |
| 18:24.39 | Amarande | last time I recall an addon slowing things to shit was MonkeyQuest when Cataclysm was new |
| 18:24.48 | Primer | and 1920x1080 with ultra |
| 18:24.53 | Amarande | whenever one had any quest that had a quest item clickable from the questlog, it would slow to crap |
| 18:25.23 | Primer | I'm on said machine now |
| 18:25.23 | Amarande | Primer: and it works perfectly at home, that's odd then |
| 18:25.34 | Primer | I've hesitated trying wow in wine here though |
| 18:25.35 | Amarande | mind you, I'm not sure how many addons I will get to run on this machine |
| 18:25.42 | Primer | Ok, at home I use windows |
| 18:25.45 | Primer | and it's fine |
| 18:25.50 | Amarande | the monitor on this laptop is only 1366x768, which doesn't leave a lot of real estate for addon widgets |
| 18:25.55 | Primer | CC says I have 122 addons installed |
| 18:26.35 | VIad | I'm just sad that the game doesn't utilize more GPU cores, load is basically on the main core, even when I notice some fps drops due to visual effects in raids, core 2 never fills up on stuff to do, not to mention the other lik 16 cores just idling |
| 18:26.38 | Primer | Semlar: Plus I never said disabling resolves the issues, it only makes the issue less pronounced |
| 18:26.43 | Amarande | heh, I love this: "Solitaire, Minesweeper, and Hearts Games that come pre-installed on Windows 7 will be removed as part of installing the Windows 10 upgrade. Microsoft has released our version of Solitaire and Minesweeper called the âMicrosoft Solitaire Collectionâ and âMicrosoft Minesweeper."" |
| 18:26.50 | VIad | hope legion brings more GPU (and CPU fo those with a lot of cores) utilization |
| 18:26.52 | Amarande | No more Hearts, they've finally kicked that cheating bastard to the curb :D |
| 18:27.13 | Amarande | VIad: at the moment I'm wondering if legion will still work on wine |
| 18:27.19 | Semlar | you said it goes from "1 FPS" to "almost OK" |
| 18:27.21 | Amarande | although by then I should be back on my Xeon gaming tower |
| 18:27.34 | Amarande | especially since it seems like legion isn't going to come out till summer |
| 18:27.38 | Primer | Amarande: when I start wow in wine there's a big fat warning about my card not supporting shaders 3.0 |
| 18:27.51 | Primer | which "will be a requirement in the next expansion" (or some such) |
| 18:28.05 | Primer | I'm sure the card supports it |
| 18:28.10 | Primer | But just not in wine |
| 18:28.44 | Primer | I could just reboot now and test with my home rig |
| 18:28.44 | Amarande | good grief, how ancient is your card anyway |
| 18:28.51 | Amarande | even hd3000 intel supports shader 4.1 |
| 18:28.57 | Primer | sigh, I've detailed everything here... |
| 18:29.02 | Primer | all you have to do is pay attention |
| 18:29.17 | Primer | Like I said, at the office I have an nvidia 650 |
| 18:29.20 | Amarande | oh, nvidia 650 |
| 18:29.28 | Amarande | that's probably some bullshit to do with the drivers |
| 18:29.33 | Amarande | you using nouveau or binary blob? |
| 18:29.33 | Primer | no |
| 18:29.37 | Primer | it's more likely to do with wine |
| 18:29.53 | Primer | because wine was doing dx9 or GL |
| 18:30.08 | Primer | I'm guessing wow's gonna drop GL in legion |
| 18:30.17 | Primer | Or can they? |
| 18:30.21 | Primer | Don't macs use GL? |
| 18:30.32 | Primer | They'd have to...there's no DX on mac...right? |
| 18:30.33 | Amarande | pretty sure they do, seeing that DirectX is not an OSX feature |
| 18:30.33 | Torhal | They probably will drop it, because they're using Mac's Metal API. |
| 18:30.34 | nevcairiel | mac client is quite a different beast |
| 18:30.46 | nevcairiel | and yeah they introduced metal there |
| 18:30.50 | Amarande | hmm |
| 18:30.56 | Amarande | will legion still have DX9 or will DX11 be a must then? |
| 18:31.11 | Primer | My guess is the latter |
| 18:31.16 | Torhal | They already said they'll support Metal for Legion. Though I'm not sure if they'll drop OpenGL altogether because older Macs probably won't support Metal. |
| 18:31.19 | Amarande | a quick check shows the GPU on this laptop only has DX10.1 |
| 18:31.44 | Primer | wine 1.8 supports dx11 though, IIRC |
| 18:31.48 | nevcairiel | so far dx9 is still there, and blizzard has usually not required top of the line hardware |
| 18:32.23 | Primer | Or maybe that's 1.9 (development) |
| 18:32.35 | Amarande | also I'm not sure blizzard understands their product sometimes |
| 18:32.37 | Primer | 1.8 is now the stable release |
| 18:32.40 | Amarande | "The system requirements for Legion are much higher than the requirements for Warlords of Draenor. Make sure your computer meets these requirements before purchasing the Legion expansion." |
| 18:33.03 | Amarande | whoever wrote this appears to have forgotten that everyone gets the same client version pushed no matter what expansions they've got on account LOL |
| 18:33.31 | nevcairiel | https://eu.battle.net/support/en/article/world-of-warcraft-legion |
| 18:33.32 | nevcairiel | anyway |
| 18:33.33 | Amarande | also hrm what wine do I get on my current distro |
| 18:33.44 | Primer | just use the wine repo |
| 18:33.50 | Primer | presuming you use a Debian based distro |
| 18:34.06 | Amarande | 1.6.2 apparently |
| 18:34.42 | nevcairiel | all the cards they list as supported for legion do have dx11 |
| 18:34.48 | nevcairiel | as far as i can tell anyway |
| 18:34.49 | Amarande | 1.8.1 in stretch |
| 18:35.06 | nevcairiel | its definitely their first huge bump in minimum requirements for wow |
| 18:35.30 | Amarande | nevcairiel: yeah they're going to lose subscribers big time with this :( |
| 18:35.39 | nevcairiel | nonsense |
| 18:35.44 | Amarande | because loads of people will no longer meet the requirements |
| 18:35.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Trela (~Erza@2607:f298:6050:5f75:917:38b8:ef0c:36f6) |
| 18:36.00 | Amarande | nevcairiel: keep in mind that technically, you can't not get legion, you're going to get 7.0.x pushed to you regardless |
| 18:36.05 | nevcairiel | their minimum requirements are still like 6 year old PCs |
| 18:36.22 | Amarande | and presumably 7.0.x will require this regardless of whether or not you paid for legion |
| 18:36.40 | Primer | wah wah wah |
| 18:37.17 | Amarande | nevcairiel: laptop users that have integrated graphics and don't have a hoity toity MXM slot to upgrade that |
| 18:37.23 | Primer | But they're probably in cahoots with hardware manufacturers :) |
| 18:37.29 | nevcairiel | Amarande: buy a new one then |
| 18:37.34 | nevcairiel | 6 years is plenty =p |
| 18:37.48 | Primer | Amarande: integrated graphics (read: intel) was never good enough to play wow |
| 18:37.56 | nevcairiel | you would probably run against cpu or memory limits as well |
| 18:38.04 | Simca | from what i've heard from people that pay attention to gapis in WoW, they were playing with OpenGL 4.2 and they've dropped it. Legion seems to support: DX9, DX11, OpenGL 1.5, and Metal |
| 18:38.08 | Primer | heck, even my old core 2 duo laptop with nvidia stopped being able to play wow decently a long time ago |
| 18:38.43 | nevcairiel | I managed to "play" on my ivy bridge intel iGPU laptop for a bit |
| 18:38.44 | Primer | Simca: I'm guessing that I get that warning in wine because it's using opengl |
| 18:38.52 | nevcairiel | it wasnt great, but enough for basic solo play |
| 18:39.00 | Simca | yes, sounds likely, Primer |
| 18:39.22 | Amarande | nevcairiel: hell, it looks like even Haswell's integrated graphics don't even cut it for 7.0 |
| 18:39.25 | Simca | the people getting the shit end of the stick for them going with Metal over OpenGL 4.2 are the linux people |
| 18:39.42 | Amarande | and Haswell is still quite recent |
| 18:39.51 | nevcairiel | mac is like 5% of their playerbase, linux will be like 0.5% |
| 18:39.55 | nevcairiel | they dont really care =p |
| 18:39.56 | Amarande | haswell = 4xxx series, the site's listing 5000 series |
| 18:40.25 | Amarande | 5000 series means either Broadwell or Skylake, both of which are still "really recent" (unless you got that weird Gigabyte Brix with the 4770R) |
| 18:40.53 | nevcairiel | its just about raw speed, and those iGPUs are just not build for gaming |
| 18:41.08 | nevcairiel | I doubt it will error out or anything, but it will probably run very shitty |
| 18:41.20 | nevcairiel | and Blizzard wants their options open to say "we told you it would" |
| 18:41.33 | Primer | I don't get this. There's really nothing wrong with OpenGL. The standard is open, flexible. Why do people feel the need to re-invent the wheel? |
| 18:41.47 | Amarande | as for cpu and memory, got 16GB, and the i5-2520M is known for being an unusually performant CPU for its tier |
| 18:42.05 | Amarande | we're talking "compiles kernel about as fast as my old superclocked FX-6300 tower did, if not faster" |
| 18:42.18 | nevcairiel | Primer: Apple never liked OpenGL, their support for it was shitty at best, hence nothing newer than the ancient OpenGL we have now, instead they like APIs that lock you into their eco-system, and if a game wants to run properly, they just have to adapt |
| 18:42.27 | Amarande | Primer: also OpenGL 4 is apparently patent encumbered |
| 18:42.58 | Primer | How can an open standard be "patent encumbered"? |
| 18:43.12 | Primer | Not like SGI is still in the picture |
| 18:43.20 | Amarande | Primer: features of an open standard can be subject to patents, and said patents don't necessarily have to licence for free |
| 18:43.29 | Amarande | they only have to be "fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory", but they don't have to be free |
| 18:44.02 | nevcairiel | Primer: just because someone deemed it to be an open standard doesnt mean someone else didnt patent it |
| 18:44.37 | Amarande | you also have unscrupulous companies sometimes that don't fully disclose patents before getting their technology incorporated into standards |
| 18:44.41 | Primer | That's fucking ridiculous |
| 18:44.42 | Amarande | then once it's all accepted, they drop the other shoe |
| 18:44.59 | Amarande | the standards process is supposed to specifically forbid this, but it barely ever has real teeth compared to East Texas |
| 18:45.14 | Amarande | keep in mind that in the USA, to make the patent situation a million times worse |
| 18:45.33 | Amarande | everyone knows that when you litigate your patent, you do it in East Texas, which virtually ALWAYS votes in favour of the patent holder, no matter how crappy their case |
| 18:46.17 | Amarande | the prevailing theory (which at this point is widespread enough to not really count as cuckoolander conspiracy) is that essentially this is how that part of Texas runs its economy |
| 18:46.47 | Amarande | they roll over for patent plaintiffs, and big patent holders' lawyers keep coming in to present cases and support local restaurants and hotels and the like |
| 18:47.26 | Amarande | Primer: the upshot is to get a fair shake in a patent case you not only need to have a case, but you're going to more or less 100% going to have to be able to appeal it too |
| 18:47.36 | Amarande | hence, patents suck, big time |
| 18:47.41 | Primer | duh |
| 18:47.46 | mckenziemc | so does reading Amarande |
| 18:47.46 | nevcairiel | those cases get appealed everytime anyway |
| 18:48.40 | Amarande | but yeah, last I'd read, OpenGL 4 contains features that require non-free patent licencing |
| 18:49.04 | Amarande | hence why the open source drivers for nVidia and AMD only support OpenGL 3, and Intel only supports OpenGL 3 on Linux at all last I'd looked |
| 18:49.12 | Amarande | (as Intel has open source drivers only on Linux) |
| 18:50.10 | Amarande | Primer: also, SGI still being in the picture might have even helped things |
| 18:50.32 | Amarande | keep in mind that when big tech companies like that go under, the patent trolls are there to see what they can scoop up to hold the tech world for ransom via |
| 18:50.51 | Simca | wouldn't be too surprised tbh if Blizzard drops DX9 in a couple expansions |
| 18:51.17 | nevcairiel | with their new minimum requirements it would be possible |
| 18:51.29 | Stanzilla | the remaining 3 players might not care |
| 18:51.30 | nevcairiel | they still list XP as a supported OS though |
| 18:51.39 | nevcairiel | no 11 there |
| 18:51.48 | Amarande | nevcairiel: or on vista for that matter |
| 18:51.49 | Simca | pretty much everywhere you hear devs complaining about the tedium of maintaining DX9 code |
| 18:51.53 | Amarande | 11 came with 7, IIRC |
| 18:52.09 | nevcairiel | Amarande: they backported 11 to vista |
| 18:52.17 | Amarande | but barely anyone runs xp or vista on a serious computer anymore |
| 18:52.36 | Amarande | the bigger issue is graphics cards, still plenty of 10.1 GPUs around |
| 18:53.02 | nevcairiel | so upgrade already =p |
| 18:53.03 | Simca | though, I suppose having to support an ancient version of OpenGL may make them more tolerant |
| 18:53.08 | Amarande | hell, with the T420 thinkpad (which is the very model I'm on right now) selling at such sweet-spot prices recently, there's probably even plenty of folks just buying into a 10.1 GPU |
| 18:53.34 | nevcairiel | Legion Minimum System Requirements already list only DX11 capable GPUs |
| 18:53.45 | nevcairiel | if you now buy something older, its your own damn fault |
| 18:53.55 | Amarande | over in ##hardware we even still actively recommend sandy bridge laptops |
| 18:54.09 | mckenziemc | well, you're there |
| 18:54.10 | nevcairiel | as long as you dont plan on gaming on those its fine |
| 18:54.14 | Amarande | because with the newer gens you pretty much have a choice between cheap ass craptop or getting reamed out the ass on prices |
| 18:54.25 | Primer | heh, my desktop is sandy bridge :) |
| 18:54.35 | Primer | Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-2600 CPU @ 3.40GHz |
| 18:54.42 | nevcairiel | but gaming on laptops requires an actual gaming laptop (who knew?!?), the intel gpus in the "normal" variants just dont cut it |
| 18:55.04 | Amarande | nevcairiel: hah, the consensus among gamers in ##hardware has traditionally been that "gaming laptops" are a waste of money |
| 18:55.11 | Amarande | and more or less have been since GMA gave way to HD |
| 18:55.22 | Amarande | GMA was shit, literally the kind of graphics only suitable for your gma |
| 18:55.23 | nevcairiel | I agree, buy a desktop instead |
| 18:55.23 | Primer | I have a "gaming laptop" |
| 18:55.29 | Primer | a lenovo y50 |
| 18:55.30 | nevcairiel | but some people like to have a laptop |
| 18:55.40 | Primer | I've been able to game on it quite well |
| 18:55.50 | Primer | on Linux too, even! |
| 18:55.54 | Amarande | my desktop's already at the fiancee's place, I don't get to see it again till april briefly and then in may when I finally move out there for good |
| 18:56.24 | Primer | In fact, because of optimus, running 3D apps is simple on Linux. I understand that it's quite a piece of shit some times on windows |
| 18:56.36 | Primer | because it relies on detection, which doesn't always work |
| 18:56.52 | nevcairiel | didnt linus curse at optimus once quite publicly |
| 18:57.04 | Primer | It would not surprise me |
| 18:57.15 | nevcairiel | probably because it requires the binary blob driver to functioin |
| 18:57.20 | Amarande | nevcairiel: far as I know Linus has always got along with nVidia about as well as Yankees and Red Sox fans get along :p |
| 18:57.22 | nevcairiel | but really nouveau is just not usable |
| 18:57.35 | nevcairiel | not for gaming in any case |
| 18:57.45 | Amarande | yeah nouveau is laughable |
| 18:57.54 | Amarande | I've heard reports of Fermi GTX units running as well as Intel IGPs under it |
| 18:58.39 | nevcairiel | Primer: but yeah I wouldnt personally buy s uch a device since I cna probably get more out of a desktop for the same money, but they are not too bad performance wise .. not high-end of course, but usable |
| 19:00.05 | Amarande | mostly at the moment, until may, I pretty much have to have a laptop :S |
| 19:00.06 | Primer | nevcairiel: I needed a laptop because my old one died and I was going on vacation, and I talked my boss into paying for it as a "work expense" because I'm on call 24/7 |
| 19:00.14 | nevcairiel | hehe |
| 19:00.29 | Primer | So work pitched in $1k, and I paid the remaining...$150 or so |
| 19:00.31 | Amarande | wonder if 7.0 will drop before or after then |
| 19:00.37 | Primer | But I got the one with 16g of ram too |
| 19:00.47 | nevcairiel | I have an ultrabook, decent CPU power since its intel, but gaming is out, i just use it for work and some movies when traveling |
| 19:00.53 | Primer | I've also since put a 500g SSD in it too. It's extremely fast |
| 19:01.16 | nevcairiel | Amarande: current predictions have it end of may/early june, but we'll have to wait and see |
| 19:01.23 | Primer | I'm at the Linux boot screen mere seconds from pressing the power button |
| 19:01.54 | Primer | err |
| 19:02.01 | Primer | s/boot screen/login screen/ |
| 19:02.11 | Primer | X login, mind you |
| 19:02.52 | Amarande | also hmm, does installing wine suddenly mean that everywhere you go on the web in your linux browser you now have to worry about attempts to inject windows malware, as you do when browsing in windows? |
| 19:03.02 | Amarande | or does that only happen if you were to actually run a windows browser under wine |
| 19:03.47 | Amarande | that's one thing that's always bugged me about wine, I'm never quite sure how much it impacts one's attack surface |
| 19:05.41 | *** join/#wowuidev FireSiku (~FireSiku@216.228.216.83) |
| 19:06.55 | Primer | uhhh |
| 19:06.57 | Primer | serious? |
| 19:07.04 | nevcairiel | unfortunately he is |
| 19:07.31 | Torhal | Mah brain. |
| 19:07.35 | Torhal | Hurtzzz. |
| 19:07.41 | Primer | I feel like I've traversed into the bizzaro world all of a sudden |
| 19:07.44 | mckenziemc | hurts Torhal all over. |
| 19:07.48 | Ressy | You're not used to this thing called "coding" Torhal |
| 19:08.04 | Torhal | Ressy: No, you have Amarande on ignore so didn't see what was said. |
| 19:08.08 | VIad | http://imgur.com/gallery/NFv2EHm |
| 19:08.16 | Ressy | Oh no.. Work I don't have him on ignore. |
| 19:08.17 | Primer | poor Amarande |
| 19:08.24 | Ressy | But I'm just ignoring most of this channel. |
| 19:08.25 | Torhal | Ah |
| 19:08.29 | Primer | I wonder how soon before I'm globally on ignore :( |
| 19:08.49 | Torhal | o.O |
| 19:08.49 | Primer | can relate to Amarande...in the sense that I talk too much at times |
| 19:08.54 | *** join/#wowuidev cawaker (~cawaker@64.135.177.114) |
| 19:08.55 | Torhal | Heh. |
| 19:09.06 | Primer | Plus I tend to rant |
| 19:09.09 | VIad | Amarande: are you trolling? :D |
| 19:09.10 | Ressy | Oh.. Not actually have people set on ignore. |
| 19:09.21 | Ressy | just not bothering to look at channel |
| 19:09.27 | Amarande | also why does playonlinux have separate listings for wow, bc, and wrath (never mind why do they even still have listings for bc and wrath) |
| 19:09.32 | Fisker | Ignore is kind of bad |
| 19:09.42 | Amarande | you install wow, you install the latest client, no matter what you've paid for :p |
| 19:10.02 | Primer | Amarande: no idea, I don't know what playonlinux is |
| 19:10.17 | Amarande | Primer: it's a tool for wine that assists in installing games easily under it |
| 19:10.22 | Amarande | oh, here's one for the bnet client too |
| 19:10.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (~RyanNL@104-180-66-29.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net) |
| 19:10.37 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 19:11.31 | Fisker | Hey Seerah |
| 19:11.38 | Fisker | I see what you did |
| 19:11.41 | VIad | old but amusing http://archive09.linux.com/articles/42031 |
| 19:11.49 | Seerah | hi, Fisker |
| 19:12.31 | Fisker | Uh oh my cover is compromised |
| 19:13.03 | Amarande | ah, apparently your actual wine version matters little when you use playonlinux |
| 19:13.06 | Amarande | it'll pull the one it wants anyway |
| 19:13.20 | Amarande | makes me wonder why the package even depends on wine, then *shrug* |
| 19:14.27 | Amarande | VIad: the good thing is that windows viruses these days aren't so hell-bent on screwing up your system |
| 19:14.48 | VIad | problem is they dont expect to be running on linux so they probably try do stuff they can't do, registry, windows folders, e.g. |
| 19:15.09 | Amarande | VIad: the bad thing is that this also means they need very little system access to fuck you over (e.g., cryptolocker only needs to find and rewrite your documents, which it won't even need to ask for elevated access to do) |
| 19:15.20 | VIad | I wouldn't worry about using internet explorer 6 on wine if you want, go for it :p |
| 19:15.58 | Amarande | now hopefully this tablet's battery isn't dead, heh |
| 19:16.08 | FireSiku | Channel sure is lively this morning. |
| 19:16.45 | VIad | it all started with me posting about a gold guide and girls then all hell broke loose and now we are at running wine and getting viruses |
| 19:17.24 | FireSiku | You must be trying real hard if you're getting viruses on linux. Goddamn. |
| 19:17.39 | VIad | through wine, mind you |
| 19:18.12 | Amarande | yeah, the question was how vulnerable wine makes you to windows viruses, and particularly if it only does so while you're running windows apps or if it increases the vulnerability of the whole linux box |
| 19:18.27 | VIad | very low Amarande, relax |
| 19:18.40 | Primer | and by low he means zero |
| 19:19.11 | FireSiku | That's an interesting question. Yay for science! |
| 19:19.48 | *** join/#wowuidev cawaker (~cawaker@64.135.177.114) |
| 19:20.25 | foxlit | in unrelated news, /framexml/ finally updates without my intervention. |
| 19:20.31 | Amarande | hrm |
| 19:20.35 | Amarande | actually, fuck |
| 19:20.41 | Amarande | I can't seem to login to the bnet app |
| 19:20.48 | Fisker | That's unhealthy foxlit |
| 19:20.49 | Amarande | it tells me I need to pick a region, and the region pick thing isn't doing anything |
| 19:20.57 | VIad | foxlit: what did you write that in? |
| 19:21.55 | Primer | Lua |
| 19:22.03 | foxlit | Fisker: sure it is, more time to drink! |
| 19:22.44 | VIad | document.getElementById vs document.querySelector discuss |
| 19:26.32 | Primer | jquery |
| 19:26.35 | Primer | problem solved |
| 19:26.40 | VIad | >_> |
| 19:26.51 | VIad | /me hands foxlit a blunt object. |
| 19:27.12 | Amarande | ah, workaround on winehq |
| 19:27.16 | Amarande | aaaand time to get to work. heh |
| 19:27.29 | Primer | poor guy |
| 19:27.37 | Primer | just puts his foot in his mouth |
| 19:29.08 | VIad | regardless, we need to try provide a good environment for him to grow up in. |
| 19:29.45 | Primer | for you too |
| 19:29.56 | VIad | for me too |
| 19:30.00 | VIad | nice of you to care |
| 19:30.12 | VIad | here is your reward http://imgur.com/gallery/6PxQAYk |
| 19:37.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~Funkeh`@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 19:40.35 | FireSiku | You're an evil person VIad :( |
| 19:42.13 | VIad | sorry :< |
| 19:54.52 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (~nevin@c-71-232-236-233.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 19:54.52 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 19:57.31 | *** join/#wowuidev cawaker_ (~cawaker@64.135.177.114) |
| 20:10.33 | mckenziemc | sends headcrabs after VIad. |
| 20:10.38 | VIad | ! |
| 20:10.41 | VIad | lemar, no! |
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| 20:42.26 | kd3 | heh. I never really stopped to think about how heavy EV charge cables are until I moved 20 of them around in one go... http://twitter.com/Kaydeethree/status/698245264017137664 |
| 20:44.46 | nevcairiel | Cooper is heavy yo |
| 20:44.55 | nevcairiel | Copper* |
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| 22:45.11 | foxlit | meh, bsdtar doesn't support deleting files after archiving them, and unzip cannot extract multiple files from stdin. |
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