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| 00:24.56 | Stanzilla | Shadowed: some guild mates are complaining that they don't see a bosses aura anymore after a SUF update, did you change some defaults there? |
| 00:40.05 | plaw | Cairenn: On behalf of my entire country, I apologise for inflicting our PM on you and yours |
| 00:40.26 | Ressy | ours is worse. |
| 00:40.59 | plaw | Ressy: who's yours? |
| 00:41.13 | Ressy | Harper. |
| 00:41.50 | plaw | has Harper called Australia 'Austria'? |
| 00:45.26 | Amarande | plaw, are you UK or Aus? |
| 00:45.39 | plaw | Amarande: Australia |
| 00:45.43 | Amarande | Ouch |
| 00:45.59 | Amarande | From what I hear about Aus, the Abbott administration practically makes the Tea Party here in the US seem sane. :| |
| 00:46.07 | plaw | Our PM, not so much burned but torched and graved danced upon, by John Oliver https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3IaKVmkXuk |
| 00:46.16 | plaw | Amarande: that's not far from the mark |
| 00:47.25 | Cairenn | plaw: heh, thanks ;) |
| 00:48.19 | plaw | Cairenn: what you need to understand while doing the ironing, is that pricing carbon will make your ironing bill go up! |
| 00:48.43 | Cairenn | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:48.44 | plaw | *housewives of Canadia need to understand... |
| 00:48.53 | plaw | (as told to Austria's housewives...) |
| 00:48.54 | Ressy | ... |
| 00:49.06 | plaw | seriously, watch that Oliver video if you've not... |
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| 00:50.53 | Shadowed | Stanzilla have them update to the latest alpha |
| 00:51.13 | Stanzilla | Shadowed: ok |
| 00:51.16 | Stanzilla | thanks |
| 00:52.05 | Cairenn | wow |
| 00:53.05 | Cairenn | okay, -now- I really do get it. |
| 00:53.25 | fewyn | what kind of map should i play in civ5? |
| 00:54.07 | nevcairiel | There is maps? |
| 00:54.17 | fewyn | yes |
| 00:54.20 | nevcairiel | Set the generator to large continents |
| 00:54.21 | fewyn | like pangea |
| 00:54.24 | fewyn | fractal |
| 00:54.28 | fewyn | "earth" |
| 00:54.54 | nevcairiel | We've mostly done large continents or however it's called |
| 00:55.22 | fewyn | huge continents sounds good |
| 00:56.23 | fewyn | let's see what random civ i play as |
| 00:56.32 | fewyn | moroccan |
| 00:56.38 | fewyn | bleh |
| 00:56.42 | fewyn | i'll deal |
| 01:03.17 | plaw | he's now as unpopular as the previous PM who he told (as Opp'n leader) should leave office because she was so unpopular |
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| 01:30.00 | Random | just got 12 people into the alpha i feel good about myself |
| 01:30.07 | Random | my good deed is done for the day |
| 01:32.29 | Neffi | Random: get a 13th in <--- |
| 01:44.24 | Wobin | plaw: Well, Canadians come from Canadia, clearly |
| 01:45.32 | plaw | Wobin: get it right, it's Canadaria |
| 01:48.55 | plaw | Wobin: also, (via the twooters) Richard Wilkins AM is reporting Tony Abbott PM has declared war on Cambodia |
| 01:49.13 | plaw | Wobin: wait hang on, that was you ... |
| 01:49.25 | Wobin | plaw: hahah =) |
| 01:50.20 | plaw | goes back to his "chemtrail absorbing drones" Kickstarter plans... |
| 02:02.48 | TC-Work | Arrowmaster: I got prorperly TPK'd on sunday. |
| 02:02.58 | Arrowmaster | nice |
| 02:03.14 | Arrowmaster | i havent played anything in fucking forever |
| 02:03.25 | TC-Work | Granted it was the most unrealistic and unbalanced module, but it was still fun. |
| 02:04.49 | TC-Work | We got to level 2 before getting smashed. |
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| 02:17.07 | Arrowmaster | which module? |
| 02:17.17 | TC-Work | Expedition to Undermountain |
| 02:17.45 | TC-Work | We fought a CR6 encounter with 5 level 2's. |
| 02:17.54 | TC-Work | and it was designed for 4 level 2's. |
| 02:18.39 | Arrowmaster | some of those encounters designed for lower level parties can destroy you if played right |
| 02:19.41 | Arrowmaster | like a pixel is a CR 4 but if played right by the DM will facerape a lvl 6 party |
| 02:19.45 | Arrowmaster | pixie |
| 02:19.58 | TC-Work | True. That being said, we have a lot of experiance. |
| 02:20.06 | Arrowmaster | do Rappan Athuk |
| 02:20.13 | Arrowmaster | ive heard its hard |
| 02:20.27 | TC-Work | It had 2 hp left when we all died. |
| 02:20.33 | Arrowmaster | lol |
| 02:21.24 | Arrowmaster | i dont think ive ever done an adventure path or module |
| 02:21.40 | Arrowmaster | its always been custom sandbox stuff the DM comes up with |
| 02:22.07 | TC-Work | http://www.bogleech.com/dnd/metalmaster.html That is what we fought. |
| 02:23.50 | Arrowmaster | my first campaign ever we had somebody (spiked) sheildboard down a giant purple worm after jumping from his flying mount, after a while you just get used to the strange and unusual |
| 02:25.02 | TC-Work | Yes, but you can still come across new things. |
| 02:25.19 | Arrowmaster | oh you would love the thing that happened in the first campaign after i started playing again, fighting pit with the enemy being this unstable polymorph spell crystal thingy, everytime we hit it we were polymorphed into something random |
| 02:25.35 | Arrowmaster | i was a small monkey for an entire session |
| 02:25.58 | Arrowmaster | and flung poo at the devil that controlled the fighting pit |
| 02:27.14 | Arrowmaster | gota run for a few |
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| 04:00.15 | kd3|hate`net | sending a message, perhaps? https://i.imgur.com/0UVAJOv.jpg |
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| 04:06.17 | karl_w_w | wait! waitwaitwait! the old content in wod alpha hasn't been stat squished yet? does that mean there's a sweet spot of old stuff that's just the right amount of challenge that we can go back and raid some old stuff? |
| 04:07.35 | kd3|hate`net | you may be able to do, say, wrath with our current health pools |
| 04:07.53 | kd3 | I doubt cataclysm will go all that well, and anything mists is right out |
| 04:08.01 | karl_w_w | damn that's a shame |
| 04:08.25 | karl_w_w | who'd want to go back to wrath that was horrible times :P |
| 04:16.10 | Mr_Rabies | but, but, but |
| 04:16.16 | Mr_Rabies | two expansions ago is always the best expansion |
| 04:16.27 | Mr_Rabies | the last one is the worst, obviously |
| 04:16.42 | Mr_Rabies | and the current one is either best or worst depending on expansion lifecycle |
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| 05:04.15 | karl_w_w | <watching ubisoft e3 conference> it seems odd to me that ubisoft of all companies couldnt manage to find french people to do the voice acting for assassins creed instead of having people do bad french accents |
| 05:19.56 | Neffi | Problem might be, the American audience might not recognize a real French accent <_< |
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| 05:20.42 | A-KO | what Neffi said |
| 05:20.49 | A-KO | Quebec French accents are...interesting :P |
| 05:21.23 | A-KO | But yes, ultimately, it would be nice to not have games go over the top with that stuff and just be normal. They'll catch up to movies eventually. |
| 05:21.45 | Neffi | Hopefully not. Movies seem to be getting more and more ridiculous |
| 05:22.06 | A-KO | well, with the exception of 47 Ronin, most movies I've seen generally do the language thing pretty decently these days |
| 05:22.31 | A-KO | Wolverine was decent on that aspect |
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| 05:22.40 | A-KO | Godzilla was so-so, when it was used. |
| 05:22.52 | Neffi | Don't hate on 47 Ronin. It's only right that the whole team tried their best to match Keanu's artistic range :P |
| 05:22.58 | A-KO | lol |
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| 05:23.39 | A-KO | I find the whole Quebec thing kind of odd...given the amount of work Quebecers do for companies in the states, and all of their press (like Ubisoft)...you would think they wouldn't be unknown to most Americans...buuuuuuuut they are. |
| 05:23.55 | A-KO | pretty sure you could convince the average American that Quebec is somewhere in the middle of Africa |
| 05:24.19 | Neffi | No. We have the sense that Quebec is somewhere in that place called Canada |
| 05:24.30 | A-KO | Perhaps I just know a lot of dumb idiots :P |
| 05:24.38 | Neffi | But whenever we think of Canada our minds are blinded by free healthcare |
| 05:24.41 | A-KO | haha |
| 05:24.55 | A-KO | I like Quebec a lot...if I spoke French I'd move there |
| 05:25.14 | A-KO | one of my favorite places to go |
| 05:25.31 | A-KO | great landscapes, great cities, great people. |
| 05:25.39 | A-KO | Extremely diverse in that aspect |
| 05:25.46 | Neffi | I must get up there one day then |
| 05:26.09 | A-KO | Montreal is a very cosmopolitan city. Very artsy-like. Very progressive, very modern. |
| 05:26.26 | A-KO | Quebec City is pretty much the only old European-style city you'll find in North America.... |
| 05:27.04 | Neffi | I hear the hipsters in San Fran like to think they're that |
| 05:27.20 | A-KO | Quebec has a drinking age of 18 and full touch strip clubs |
| 05:27.49 | A-KO | They pretty much converted many churches into libraries/etc. |
| 05:27.50 | Neffi | You had me at full touch strip clubs. Booking tickets when I get the cash ;) |
| 05:27.54 | A-KO | haha |
| 05:28.39 | A-KO | https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/t31.0-8/10273360_10152131889870267_4094888001780289662_o.jpg < A pic we took hiking up there a couple weeks ago (Memorial weekend)--that's me in the pic, ignore my nerd ass. |
| 05:29.01 | A-KO | nice 10 miles of hiking was done that day |
| 05:29.10 | Neffi | beautiful |
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| 05:29.56 | A-KO | https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/t1.0-9/10252039_10152124546285267_4870494534857186180_n.jpg < pic of Quebec City |
| 05:30.48 | A-KO | From the top of "Battlefield Park" (Parc des Champs-de-Bataille) |
| 05:31.08 | A-KO | actually, that might be from the citadel |
| 05:31.10 | A-KO | but close enough |
| 05:31.17 | A-KO | Just an incredible place IMO. |
| 05:31.44 | Neffi | There are too many nice places in the world |
| 05:31.58 | Neffi | Traveling needs to be a cheaper affair D: |
| 05:32.06 | A-KO | There are lots. But it's usually odd to find such variation in such a small area. |
| 05:32.14 | A-KO | And the people there are pretty damn nice |
| 05:32.59 | A-KO | I come from the Baltimore/DC area...so yeah....people here are a-holes to each other.... |
| 05:33.15 | A-KO | It's nice to go somewhere where a majority of people I've encountered are just nice |
| 05:33.30 | Neffi | When I went to DC, the people there made us NYers out to be saints |
| 05:33.55 | A-KO | You would think one would find that in the South, but my experiences have been different. Got yelled at by a lady for not acknowledging her in a convenience store |
| 05:34.00 | A-KO | ... |
| 05:34.13 | A-KO | lol |
| 05:34.17 | Neffi | Nah, I hear people in the South are very nice |
| 05:34.48 | A-KO | I dunno. I've met some decent people everywhere...just depends I guess, that experience was in Charleston |
| 05:34.50 | A-KO | SC |
| 05:35.01 | A-KO | Haven't gotten to GA so I have no opinion of that |
| 05:35.08 | A-KO | You in NYC? |
| 05:35.15 | A-KO | or upstate somewhere? |
| 05:35.30 | Neffi | I've only got friends in GA and FL, so that's where I hear about. And yeah, NYC. Staten Island specifically |
| 05:35.41 | A-KO | If in NYC, the Adirondack Amtrak route is rated one of the nicest train rides in the world. I learned this after I had ridden it in awe for years.... |
| 05:35.45 | A-KO | nicest/beautiful |
| 05:36.02 | A-KO | I've seen everything from bald eagles, to people ice fishing on Lake Champlain, to the fall foliage along the Hudson River |
| 05:36.17 | Neffi | Must be a rare delight. Most of NYC is ugly. I can't imagine how people consider it beautiful |
| 05:36.18 | A-KO | pretty much an incredible train ride, well worth it at least once. |
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| 05:36.54 | A-KO | the train route goes up the Hudson, into Albany, then slides along the west side of Lake Champlain until you get to the border, then it's mostly farmland until city. It's like the drive, except much, much nicer. |
| 05:36.57 | A-KO | I usually drive now |
| 05:37.20 | Neffi | That actually sounds quite nice. I hear those are all great places |
| 05:37.42 | Neffi | Only been to Rochester, Hudson River area and Catskills/Peakskills as far as NY state goes |
| 05:37.59 | A-KO | Then you get into Montreal and it's major culture shock to most Americans... |
| 05:38.44 | Neffi | Well anyway, back to watching my backlog of Cosmos before bed. 'ta |
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| 06:04.17 | pompy1 | kotaku.com/dota-2-player-apparently-gets-robbed-at-gunpoint-while-1588059399 :O |
| 06:04.28 | pompy1 | http://kotaku.com/dota-2-player-apparently-gets-robbed-at-gunpoint-while-1588059399 |
| 06:05.25 | pompy1 | karl_w_w: how's Euro Truck Simulator 2 treating you? |
| 06:08.34 | karl_w_w | well |
| 06:08.42 | karl_w_w | like a warm and caring parent |
| 06:10.27 | karl_w_w | that's old news btw pompy1 |
| 06:15.30 | Shirik | ~ping |
| 06:15.30 | purl | ~pong |
| 06:20.52 | pompy1 | :O |
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| 06:44.13 | pompy1 | ~lart t |
| 06:44.13 | purl | blasts t to oblivion with a kamehameha wave |
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| 07:20.46 | karl_w_w | It’s hella fuckin smokey as shit, apparently it’s 420 in this bitch |
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| 07:22.55 | karl_w_w | that was the fedora-shaking highlight of the ubisoft conference |
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| 07:37.12 | Shirik | I have determined United treats me as a god |
| 07:42.48 | haste | they let you fly the plane? |
| 07:44.22 | Kalroth | "Of course you can pilot the plane, sir. Please take my seat." |
| 07:45.04 | Kalroth | "Good work, Sir. I've never seen a Boing 747 fly below the radar." |
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| 08:01.18 | Shirik | Kalroth: only one other has managed to do so |
| 08:01.29 | Shirik | too soon? |
| 08:01.42 | Shirik | Also, haste, I accidentally booked my flight for 11:30 PM instead of 11:30 AM |
| 08:01.48 | Shirik | a flight today (Tuesday) |
| 08:02.00 | Shirik | so I just called them, and they adjusted my flight to one that leaves in 9 hours, for free |
| 08:02.17 | Shirik | also I'm #1 on the upgrade list :P |
| 08:05.57 | haste | they have a upgrade list? |
| 08:06.17 | Shirik | yeah for first class upgrades |
| 08:06.21 | Shirik | doesn't every airline? |
| 08:06.27 | Shirik | except southwest I guess because they're terrible |
| 08:07.18 | haste | free upgrade :P ? |
| 08:07.38 | haste | because I've only seen the "you can buy upgrade"-type |
| 08:08.11 | Shirik | I get free upgrade eligibility on all domestic flights, assuming they don't sell out |
| 08:10.42 | haste | hacks |
| 08:11.33 | haste | flew with United to SF last month |
| 08:11.58 | haste | they fucked up economy plus for two of the flights which was horrible |
| 08:12.13 | haste | and having a connection at newark was terrible |
| 08:12.21 | nevcairiel | Shirik shouldn't you be sleeping |
| 08:12.37 | Shirik | meh |
| 08:12.51 | Shirik | haste: newark is always terrible |
| 08:12.59 | haste | I noticed! |
| 08:13.07 | haste | nothing like 4 hours delay |
| 08:13.11 | haste | giving us a total travel time of 23 hours |
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| 08:29.17 | Workfoz | Happy birthday, Jeremy! \o/ *pokes Arrowmaster* |
| 08:35.55 | karl_w_w | Arrowmaster is jeremy clarkson? |
| 08:36.29 | karl_w_w | did he catch any african americans by the foot appendage? |
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| 13:10.10 | Lopeppeppy | I've been eaten by a grue. |
| 13:10.25 | nevcairiel | That's unfortunate |
| 13:10.36 | nevcairiel | Anything we can do? |
| 13:11.17 | Kalroth | How are you online? WiFi? 4G? A long ethernet cable stick between its teeth? |
| 13:11.52 | nevcairiel | WiFi in the hotel |
| 13:13.00 | Kalroth | vacation? permanent stay? should i trigger a lot of NSA keywords?! |
| 13:13.46 | nevcairiel | I wouldn't want to live in the US permanently |
| 13:14.02 | Fisker | Heist Lopeppeppy |
| 13:14.07 | Kalroth | there are good places in the US |
| 13:14.13 | Kalroth | like the border to Canada |
| 13:14.22 | Fisker | Only silly people would want to live in the US permanently |
| 13:14.31 | nevcairiel | I'm pretty close to that border |
| 13:15.35 | nevcairiel | Close in US terms I guess. Probably still a couple hundred miles |
| 13:15.36 | karl_w_w | implying the US cares about the limits of their borders |
| 13:16.12 | jleclanche | airtonix: ping |
| 13:16.17 | karl_w_w | why do you think there's a bloke in london who has to hide out in the equador embassy? |
| 13:16.27 | karl_w_w | also why can't I spell? |
| 13:16.58 | karl_w_w | and why do you think a bloke in new zealand was arrested for annoying some hollywood studios? |
| 13:26.30 | Lopeppeppy | nevcariel, you can come kill it, since you're temporarily in the states anyway. Fisker won't get here for months. |
| 13:26.32 | Lopeppeppy | Avenge me! |
| 13:27.24 | Fisker | I could go to the states right now Lopeppeppy |
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| 13:35.02 | Lopeppeppy | I think you'd be too late, the digestion process is fast. |
| 13:47.13 | Workfoz | dentist appointment :OOO pray for me |
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| 15:06.10 | karl_w_w | damn, 99.98% explored on euro truck sim 2 and I can't find anything else unexplored |
| 15:06.18 | A-KO | lol |
| 15:11.53 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 15:12.49 | Semlar | maybe it's a rounding error and you'll never find the last .02% |
| 15:14.52 | karl_w_w | nah apparently its possible |
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| 15:49.03 | Fisker | Little did Lopeppeppy I actually travel back in time when flying to the US |
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| 16:03.47 | pompy1 | https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152448234071772&set=a.67899501771.69169.54971236771&type=1 dayum |
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| 16:53.58 | Fisker | I ate food lop |
| 16:54.01 | Fisker | damnit |
| 16:54.03 | Fisker | daaaaaaamnit |
| 17:00.41 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 17:00.44 | TC-Work | ~calm Fisker |
| 17:00.44 | purl | ACTION sooths Fisker, offers a backrub, tea, a jacuzzi and anything else that might help calm Fisker down. |
| 17:06.55 | *** join/#wowuidev cogwheel (~cogwheel@WoWUIDev/WoWProgramming/morlando/cogwheel) |
| 17:10.25 | Fisker | another school shooting :o |
| 17:10.41 | Peppy-Away | I just had some food too. What a lunchtime coincidence! |
| 17:11.19 | pompy1 | Fisker: yep, le sigh. |
| 17:12.31 | Fisker | more like dinner Peppy-Away but yeah |
| 17:13.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande (~Amarande@24-151-100-63.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 17:16.08 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO^^ (as@2601:a:f00:465:3867:b35:3f4a:7dd3) |
| 17:16.43 | Peppy-Away | Das foodz |
| 17:19.06 | karl_w_w | you know what they say, guns don't kill people, people kill people |
| 17:20.01 | karl_w_w | also inexperienced handling kills people, and kids who get bullied too much, and mental health issues, or somebody who just had a bad day |
| 17:20.01 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 17:20.11 | karl_w_w | if only there was some way to avoid those things killing people |
| 17:20.13 | *** join/#wowuidev g0urra (~g0urra@unaffiliated/gourra) |
| 17:20.27 | Peppy-Away | Not f'ing make them. *sigh* |
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| 17:22.02 | karl_w_w | http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_vd_zVJKziTE/THvgJu40HxI/AAAAAAAAAhs/fbYWGVnqkVE/s1600/not_going_to_end_well13-620x460.jpg I approve of this message |
| 17:24.13 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 17:26.49 | Ackis | I have a dhcp server listening on eth0 and I just added a usb wireless thingy and it's wlan0... when wlan0 tries to get a dhcp address nothing happens but I can assign it a static IP with no problem, what am I doing wrong? |
| 17:27.51 | Gnarfoz | nothing? why would the wifi interface be able to get an IP from the DHCP server on the eth interface? |
| 17:28.05 | Gnarfoz | they are not connected to another |
| 17:28.26 | Ackis | they're on the same network |
| 17:28.28 | Gnarfoz | (unless you make it so, which, from your description, you didn't) |
| 17:28.40 | Gnarfoz | meaning what? |
| 17:28.42 | Ackis | both are on 192.168.0.0/24 |
| 17:28.44 | Gnarfoz | so? |
| 17:28.54 | Gnarfoz | what's the wlan interface connected to |
| 17:28.55 | karl_w_w | the problem with knowing straight away when windows updates come out is that the KB articles aren't up yet |
| 17:29.28 | Ackis | eth0 and wlan0 are on the same machine, a headless ubuntu server |
| 17:29.32 | Gnarfoz | yes |
| 17:29.40 | Gnarfoz | what is the wifi device connected to |
| 17:29.48 | Gnarfoz | is it connected to a wifi network |
| 17:29.59 | Ackis | ahh derp yes it is |
| 17:30.18 | Gnarfoz | is the eth interface connected to that same network and is providing IPs for it via DHCP? |
| 17:30.28 | Ackis | yes |
| 17:32.10 | Gnarfoz | mhhh. |
| 17:32.26 | Gnarfoz | I'm not sure if that's supposed to work |
| 17:33.51 | Gnarfoz | time for tcpdump, Ackis ;-) |
| 17:34.03 | Gnarfoz | listen on eth0 if the DHCPDISCOVER packets get there |
| 17:34.21 | Gnarfoz | (and/or listen on wifi0 to see if any replies get there) |
| 17:35.18 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 17:36.33 | TC-Work | I would have thought you needed to configure it. |
| 17:36.45 | Gnarfoz | configure what, is the question, tbh :D |
| 17:37.00 | TC-Work | the DHCP server? |
| 17:37.01 | Gnarfoz | Ackis: also maybe http://www.linuxhomenetworking.com/wiki/index.php/Quick_HOWTO_:_Ch08_:_Configuring_the_DHCP_Server#DHCP_Servers_with_Multiple_NICs can give some insight |
| 17:37.06 | Gnarfoz | well he didn't say it was unconfigured |
| 17:37.08 | TC-Work | Since it is USB |
| 17:37.11 | Gnarfoz | no |
| 17:37.19 | TC-Work | if it was a PCI wireless it might work better. |
| 17:37.24 | Gnarfoz | he has a working dhcp server that he recently added a wifi thing to |
| 17:37.26 | Gnarfoz | why? |
| 17:37.29 | Gnarfoz | why would that matter |
| 17:37.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Gethe (~quassel@cpe-70-116-41-47.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 17:37.37 | TC-Work | The way the system integrates them, |
| 17:37.40 | TC-Work | -, |
| 17:37.44 | Gnarfoz | meaning what? |
| 17:37.55 | Gnarfoz | they both end up as wifi interfaces, don't they |
| 17:39.20 | Amarande | part of me wants to say 'linux can just be very finicky in the DHCP client role' |
| 17:39.26 | TC-Work | Yes, but it is how the system adds them. In the same way that esta is picked up as an internal drive and a usb is picked up as a removeable one. |
| 17:39.29 | TC-Work | esata* |
| 17:39.30 | TC-Work | bah |
| 17:39.37 | Amarande | I recently set up a Debian VM on this Win8.1 box through Hyper-V |
| 17:39.44 | Gnarfoz | you're still not explaining "how" further than before :( |
| 17:39.45 | Amarande | I can assign it a static IP just fine and it accesses the Internet no problems |
| 17:39.53 | Amarande | but it CANNOT manage to acquire an IP via DHCP, it just sits there and fails |
| 17:39.59 | TC-Work | You never asked how |
| 17:40.00 | Gnarfoz | who cares how they are added when you only start dealing with them when the adding is done? |
| 17:40.28 | TC-Work | Right, All I am saying is that dealing with them may be different. |
| 17:40.34 | TC-Work | because of how they are added |
| 17:40.40 | Amarande | the host machine can get a DHCP address just fine, my phone and tablet can get a DHCP address just fine, the family PC downstairs and my sister's laptop and ipod can get a DHCP address just fine |
| 17:40.46 | Amarande | but the VM just sits there and can't acquire one |
| 17:40.59 | Amarande | even though it has no-problems network connectivity otherwise |
| 17:41.01 | kd3 | is your vm set up to bridge/nat? |
| 17:41.09 | Amarande | I'm beginning to suspect DHCP is just weird |
| 17:41.16 | Gnarfoz | that shouldn't be necessary, should it |
| 17:41.20 | Amarande | kd3: it's set up as a "legacy network adapter" through a virtual switch |
| 17:41.28 | Amarande | which is how you're recommended to set up linux in a VM in hyper-V |
| 17:42.13 | Gnarfoz | and I don't think dhcpd deals with anything below netdev level, so I'd hope any usb/pcie/pci differences should be hidden below that :o but that's just my assumption \o/ |
| 17:42.35 | Gnarfoz | we need more input from Ackis anyway :D |
| 17:42.57 | Gnarfoz | tpcdump away and see what's actually happening ("nothing happens" is not an error report, as we all know :P) |
| 17:45.45 | Ackis | Gnarfoz: nothing happens at least got me to the step where I can start figuring out what is happening :P |
| 17:46.03 | TC-Work | shouldn't a simple 'ifconfig' show if it is just like all the other interfaces? |
| 17:46.11 | Gnarfoz | you mean "if I hadn't had a problem, I wouldn't be looking"? :D |
| 17:46.35 | pompy1 | happy birthday Arrowmaster |
| 17:47.27 | Fisker | Firewall? :P |
| 17:47.34 | Arrowmaster | how the fuck do you people always know when ive just gotten up an im eating breakfast on my day off |
| 17:48.34 | Gnarfoz | Arrowmaster: I guess mine reached you when you were sleepy-sleeping, then! So I'll just repeat myself: Happy Birthday! :D |
| 17:59.26 | TC-Work | Arrowmaster: Well for one thing, most people take off for their birthday. |
| 18:00.10 | Arrowmaster | i dont get that luxury i get the midnight shift tonight |
| 18:00.32 | pompy1 | http://store.steampowered.com/news/13608/ |
| 18:01.58 | Amarande | TC: that must be a Europe thing |
| 18:02.40 | *** join/#wowuidev trond-- (~Trond@unaffiliated/trond--) |
| 18:03.38 | Amarande | Hrm, speaking of birthdays, I wonder what I'll get for my birthday this year ... ahh! I get to start off with the inability to play WoW for eight hours of the day! Sweet! LOL |
| 18:18.02 | Ackis | Gnarfoz: it looks like my wpa_supplicant is all sorts of fucked up |
| 18:18.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (~Daniel@c-50-181-188-143.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 18:18.27 | Gnarfoz | ok, you've got bigger problems than DHCP then |
| 18:18.27 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 18:18.44 | Ackis | aye |
| 18:18.51 | Ackis | but it explains why dhcp isn't working :P |
| 18:22.56 | Dagmar | Probably ran out of virgins in the log somewhere |
| 18:25.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~Funkeh`@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
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| 18:32.37 | ccox | Cairenn: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_2jsYsAy6Y |
| 18:37.36 | alestane | I amazed he (or she) lets that creature sit on his/her bare hand. |
| 18:37.40 | alestane | I'm* |
| 18:40.42 | Gnarfoz | owls |
| 18:40.42 | Gnarfoz | ftw |
| 18:41.42 | Arrowmaster | but owls need a lot of room to fly around compared to other small birds kept as pets |
| 18:42.36 | Gnarfoz | Arrowmaster: btw... is your username on curse still dhedbor? :D |
| 18:42.46 | Arrowmaster | mine? it never was |
| 18:47.50 | Gnarfoz | hrm |
| 18:48.05 | Gnarfoz | it's someone else long vanished, then |
| 18:48.10 | Gnarfoz | guy who made MagicTargets |
| 18:49.19 | Gnarfoz | ah, NeoTron |
| 18:49.34 | Gnarfoz | NeoTron_: |
| 18:49.41 | Gnarfoz | still around, apprently |
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| 19:00.41 | jleclanche | Civ 5 is available on Linux |
| 19:00.43 | jleclanche | YES. |
| 19:00.56 | jleclanche | i had heard it was getting there but wow, already |
| 19:01.03 | kd3 | ! |
| 19:04.31 | fewyn | they just announce that jleclanche? |
| 19:04.36 | jleclanche | an hour ago |
| 19:05.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (4058e386@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
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| 19:08.58 | Simca_ | amazing bug: "The Jade Serpent Statue will end up going turbo when casting soothing mist. It will heal all the things...so hard that it causes WoW to stop responding for anyone in range." |
| 19:09.35 | Simca_ | Monks can AoE crash other people's clients, A+ |
| 19:12.16 | jleclanche | Simca_: alpha bug? |
| 19:12.26 | jleclanche | Death Knights used to be able to do that in WLK alpha |
| 19:12.33 | Simca_ | yeah |
| 19:12.36 | jleclanche | death & decay rank 2 i believe |
| 19:12.45 | nevcairiel | anything wow related being discussed here for the next time is going to be pretty much alpha :p |
| 19:12.51 | jleclanche | haha |
| 19:13.00 | nevcairiel | live is just dead |
| 19:13.18 | jleclanche | well it could be dead enough that nobody noticed monks could crash everything :) |
| 19:13.26 | Fisker | Hi nevcairiel |
| 19:14.10 | nevcairiel | hi Fisker |
| 19:14.22 | Fisker | ;) |
| 19:16.56 | karl_w_w | don't be silly nevcairiel, we never discuss wow in here |
| 19:18.27 | karl_w_w | so all afternoon i felt really congested and had a steadily-worsening headache, then i watched the illusionist and by the end the headache was gone and I was much better |
| 19:18.35 | karl_w_w | what is this magik? |
| 19:19.10 | Gnarfoz | watch it in reverse, see if the symptoms come back |
| 19:20.18 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: Im guessing you don't mean this one, but the other: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Illusionist_(2010_film) |
| 19:20.34 | karl_w_w | nah not that one, the good one ;) |
| 19:20.41 | karl_w_w | with edward norton |
| 19:20.51 | jleclanche | there's the good one, and there's the great one |
| 19:20.54 | jleclanche | watch the one I linked |
| 19:21.23 | karl_w_w | i saw the first 10 minutes of it once, didnt grasp me |
| 19:21.33 | jleclanche | wtf you dont watch 10 mins of a tati |
| 19:24.04 | karl_w_w | I assume you don't mean an indian word for shit |
| 19:28.47 | karl_w_w | "Fixed WEB IOT issue with FireFox v15" modem firmware release notes |
| 19:32.05 | Amarande | Webiot: someone who's still running Firefox 15? :) |
| 19:33.09 | karl_w_w | well it is from january 2013 :P |
| 19:33.12 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: the illusionist was written by Jacques Tati |
| 19:34.34 | Humbedooh | Tati rocks! |
| 19:34.46 | jleclanche | thank you |
| 19:34.51 | Humbedooh | I was at a Tati exhibition in Paris last month! |
| 19:35.06 | karl_w_w | tati rocks? sounds like constipation |
| 19:35.37 | Humbedooh | if y'all haven't seen his movies, you're missing our on some great stuff |
| 19:35.57 | Humbedooh | Playtime being my absolute favorite |
| 19:36.30 | jleclanche | Humbedooh: I thought I had seen all of his films and then I found out about the illusionist |
| 19:36.36 | jleclanche | did you watch it? |
| 19:37.11 | Humbedooh | no, I have yet to see it in fact - but I did read about it when it came out |
| 19:37.26 | Humbedooh | didn't air in any of my local cinemas :( |
| 19:37.29 | jleclanche | its quite fantastic |
| 19:37.33 | Humbedooh | I bet |
| 19:37.39 | Gnarfoz | magical, even? |
| 19:37.46 | jleclanche | its the weirdest experience |
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| 19:38.18 | Humbedooh | hah, all his films are that imho :P |
| 19:38.28 | jleclanche | well no this is weirder |
| 19:38.38 | Humbedooh | oooo, I better watch it then |
| 19:38.44 | Rythal | Non-Wow question :P but a lot of you might weight in... if you have a PHP class file for accessing a REST server easily (via PHP) and started offering email over API, would you modify the current class to accept the new Send API calls in the same format as the REST calls.... or would you try and reproduce PHPMailer, so people who are currently using SMTP, can just change 'include class.smtp.php' |
| 19:38.44 | Rythal | to 'class-sendapi.php' and instantly have old scripts sending over HTTP instead of SMTP :| |
| 19:38.51 | jleclanche | its not the movie itself, its the fact its an animated movie |
| 19:39.18 | jleclanche | completely different to tati's style at the time, but the actual movie itself feels like an authentic tati |
| 19:40.02 | jleclanche | Rythal: do you have to work with php? |
| 19:40.50 | Rythal | No, our API and documentation on it is fully restful, the php is just my own wrapper to make the curl calls easier for people. |
| 19:40.51 | *** join/#wowuidev d[karl]b (~Karl@61.116.96.58.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 19:41.00 | jleclanche | uhu |
| 19:41.05 | jleclanche | so nobody's holding you captive then? |
| 19:41.13 | jleclanche | forcing you to work in php |
| 19:41.29 | *** join/#wowuidev NickoTavers (~Nicko@cpc67216-ely07-2-0-cust169.5-1.cable.virginm.net) |
| 19:41.39 | Rythal | the company that pays my salary is forcing me to :P |
| 19:41.48 | NickoTavers | Hellos XD |
| 19:41.56 | Humbedooh | poor, poor Rythal :( |
| 19:42.08 | karl_w_w | there are people that use php by choice? :o |
| 19:42.09 | Humbedooh | you should liek...do it in Lua |
| 19:42.18 | Semlar | haters gonna hate |
| 19:42.21 | haste | karl_w_w: ofc there are |
| 19:43.38 | Shirik_ | bah |
| 19:43.50 | karl_w_w | https://i.imgur.com/NOECI0s.gif <- php |
| 19:43.54 | Shirik_ | so I was supposed to receive a package from UPS today, but I'm out of town |
| 19:43.59 | Shirik_ | so I rescheduled it with UPS to next week |
| 19:44.06 | Shirik_ | turns out I accidentally clicked the 24th |
| 19:44.09 | Rythal | was just having the debate, because one of the other dev's came to me this morning saying they were going to update my class to support the new api, and they went the route of making it work the exact same as the old... when I was pushing for drop in mailer replacement... so debating on leaving it alone since he's done.... or rewriting it to how I wanted >.> lol |
| 19:44.17 | Shirik_ | how to turn Amazon Prime into one-month shipping... |
| 19:44.37 | Dagmar | You should be able to change that again to a closer date |
| 19:44.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Mihau (~Mihau@76.164.170.2) |
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| 19:45.59 | karl_w_w | Shirik_, be glad you live in a country where amazon shipping takes less than 2 weeks |
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| 19:46.06 | Amarande | Shirik: just wait till the holidays when apparently it CAN become one-month shipping :) |
| 19:46.22 | Amarande | Shirik: as can a lot of places in general thanks to FedEx Smart, or should I say Dumb-as-a-Post |
| 19:46.33 | Shirik_ | Dagmar: pretty sure it would charge me again :P |
| 19:46.41 | Shirik_ | costs $5 to change the delivery date |
| 19:46.52 | Shirik_ | I mean it's just $5 but I don't care enough about that package to pay it again |
| 19:47.02 | Shirik_ | it's just a belt clip for my phone |
| 19:47.03 | Amarande | though actually, the problem is more with the USPS than FedEx's end anyway :S |
| 19:47.30 | Amarande | apparently around the holidays you basically *have* to shell out for overnight shipping if you want to be sure to see your package anytime soon |
| 19:47.36 | Amarande | (even 2 day can apparently be sent through smartpost) |
| 19:48.24 | Rythal | tell me about it... last time I used Fedex smart post... the package arrived in ohio (destination state), sat there for 3 days, went to pensylvania, sat there 2 days, back to ohio for 2 days, then finally to destination. |
| 19:48.38 | Amarande | Rythal: oh, that's a minor little bloop |
| 19:48.43 | Shirik_ | I'm fortunate enough to have a fedex facility literally right next to my house |
| 19:48.47 | NickoTavers | In lua is ~= the same as Not equal to for example != in c++? |
| 19:48.51 | Amarande | Rythal: the holiday nightmares are usually "package sits at destination for days or even weeks but cannot be picked up" |
| 19:48.53 | *** join/#wowuidev karl_w_w (~Karl@61.116.96.58.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 19:49.00 | Shirik_ | even fedex smart post ends up using their own trucks |
| 19:49.11 | Shirik_ | NickoTavers: yes |
| 19:49.12 | Rythal | Nicko: yes |
| 19:49.13 | Amarande | because the postal workers are NOT ALLOWED to touch your package or anything else on that pallet, due to postal classing |
| 19:49.17 | karl_w_w | there's something about the colour of the windows 8 shutdown screen that makes me want to sneeze |
| 19:49.37 | foxlit | I demand an approximately-equal-to operator. |
| 19:49.39 | Amarande | Smartpost is the lowest class of mail, every one of those trite overpriced Hallmark greetings in the mailbag gets priority OVER it |
| 19:49.43 | NickoTavers | Thats good, never heard it called "negation of equality" thus confused me |
| 19:50.06 | Shirik_ | foxlit: Implement a floating point classifier? |
| 19:50.36 | nevcairiel | foxlit: you mean like PHPs == ? |
| 19:50.41 | karl_w_w | ≈ |
| 19:50.47 | Amarande | so basically, get it smartpost in december, you get to wait and hope that they actually have few enough christmas cards on a given day to actually be able to unwrap the pallet that your stuff is rotting in :p |
| 19:51.01 | foxlit | nevcairiel: no, that’s not approximate enough. |
| 19:51.06 | Amarande | I'm still really not quite sure why typical consumer mail is made First Class anyway, tbh |
| 19:51.12 | Shirik_ | setmetatable({_value=0.1}, {__tonumber=function(self) return self._value; end, __eq = function(lhs, rhs) return math.abs(lhs-rhs) < 0.000001; end}) |
| 19:51.15 | foxlit | 7 ≈ 8, because who can count past 3 anyway? |
| 19:51.20 | Shirik_ | Amarande: because it's not |
| 19:51.23 | Amarande | in almost every other classification system, typical consumer stuff is bottom class and you have to pay a premium for better priority |
| 19:51.27 | Shirik_ | well it depends on how you define "consumer" then |
| 19:51.39 | Shirik_ | typical mail delivered is not first class |
| 19:51.57 | Amarande | Shirik: yeah, but you'd think that a consumer tier stamp would be more like, third class, heh |
| 19:52.09 | Amarande | and first class would be used for business mailings |
| 19:52.15 | Dagmar | 'cuz simple letters are easy to ship around |
| 19:52.21 | Amarande | that's how it tends to work in *most* walks of life, anyway |
| 19:52.36 | Shirik_ | funny thing is that going lower than first class is actually hard to do, which is kinda weird |
| 19:52.37 | Amarande | not that it would help smartpost any, even effing third class mail takes priority over smartpost packages apparently |
| 19:52.50 | Shirik_ | like using media mail instead requires that you meet some restrictions |
| 19:52.57 | Dagmar | The stamp has phosphorescent ink on it so the scanners can figure out where it is, and from there the vast majority of the addresses are machine-readable, after which point they get their magic barcode and they're on their way |
| 19:53.13 | Dagmar | ZIP+4 practically puts mail on the right mail carriers truck |
| 19:53.29 | Amarande | Dagmar: yeah, but you'd think that typical consumer letters should receive bottom priority |
| 19:53.37 | Amarande | given the usual placement of 'consumer' tier stuff on the ladder |
| 19:53.38 | Shirik_ | I'm still amazed that we're able to sort hand-written addresses quickly |
| 19:53.40 | Dagmar | They don't need to have lower priority |
| 19:53.45 | Dagmar | Humans barely have to touch them |
| 19:54.18 | Dagmar | The ones that can't be machine read get imaged and manually read by humans via a contractor like Lockheed |
| 19:54.19 | Amarande | mind you I know one group of powerful people who'd love to have that happen, LOL, so maybe we should keep our mouths shut about the idea :S |
| 19:54.21 | Amarande | namely, "banks" |
| 19:54.39 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 19:54.45 | Amarande | Banks would love it dearly if consumer letters got terrible prioritisation, it would mean they can mete out more late fees, then credit hits and corresponding worse interest rates for more money |
| 19:55.04 | Dagmar | If there were a giant pneumatic tube system in place humans pretty much wouldn't need to be involved in delivering letters at all |
| 19:55.07 | Semlar | but.. the postmark.. |
| 19:55.52 | Shirik_ | "contractor like Lockheed" |
| 19:56.04 | Dagmar | I say that because there's one such office here. |
| 19:56.10 | karl_w_w | having different classes of mail seems like a stupid idea |
| 19:56.20 | Shirik_ | karl_w_w: why? people care about different things |
| 19:56.33 | Semlar | yeah, there has to be a priority system |
| 19:56.33 | Shirik_ | for example, if you're sending out a mass mailing, do you really care about auto-forwarding and return mail service? |
| 19:56.39 | Shirik_ | no, so why should you pay for it? |
| 19:57.21 | karl_w_w | mass mailings? what is this the 20th century? |
| 19:57.33 | Amarande | And if you're sending out cheques for mail in rebates, do you really care if they even get there? |
| 19:57.47 | Amarande | (From what I've seen from most companies that offer MIRs, no they don't, and I think they even prefer you not to get it. LOL) |
| 19:57.48 | Shirik_ | do you not get mass mailings? |
| 19:57.51 | Shirik_ | I do... |
| 19:58.00 | Shirik_ | My favorite are the little scratchoffs from car dealerships that I ALWAYS win |
| 19:58.09 | karl_w_w | not in years |
| 19:58.10 | Shirik_ | if I had just gone to those dealerships I would have like 20 cars by now |
| 19:58.21 | Amarande | Shirik: if only they actually let you win the zero percent financing? :) |
| 19:58.22 | karl_w_w | but anyway im talking about classes that joe public uses |
| 19:58.47 | Amarande | heh. from what I understand those car ads practically skirt the very border of false advertising |
| 19:58.48 | Shirik_ | tbh I really don't think joe public uses usps anymore :) |
| 19:59.12 | karl_w_w | so how do they send mail? :P |
| 19:59.19 | Shirik_ | with gmail |
| 19:59.20 | Semlar | i use usps.. |
| 19:59.22 | Amarande | from what I hear anyway, they basically set the credit requirements high enough so they can give out the advertised financing terms to just enough people that people can't reasonably claim it's a lie, but no more |
| 19:59.25 | Shirik_ | packages, fedex and ups |
| 19:59.47 | Amarande | joe public, even if they thought they had good credit, generally doesn't have quite good *enough* credit |
| 20:00.04 | nevcairiel | usps sounds like the thing you would send normal letters with, just from their name :p |
| 20:00.06 | Semlar | who sends a letter through fedex or ups |
| 20:00.09 | Amarande | mind you, given that credit works like light and dark side points in KOTOR 2, that's not very surprising LOL |
| 20:00.16 | foxlit | step 1: who sends letters? |
| 20:00.21 | Shirik_ | exactly |
| 20:00.26 | Shirik_ | hence, why nobody uses usps |
| 20:00.38 | Semlar | you think nobody sends normal mail? |
| 20:00.40 | karl_w_w | people send things in the mail |
| 20:00.47 | Amarande | heh |
| 20:00.51 | Amarande | the main things sent USPS, far as I'm aware |
| 20:00.52 | Shirik_ | obviously that was an exaggeration |
| 20:00.55 | Amarande | rent, doctor bills, and christmas cards |
| 20:01.16 | Amarande | just about everything else gets paid or done online anymore (even many doctor bills can be paid online now too) |
| 20:01.19 | Shirik_ | I do feel like I'm doing my part to keep USPS alive, though |
| 20:01.26 | nevcairiel | you send rent via mail`? |
| 20:01.30 | Shirik_ | I still get a letter from Fidelity every time I make a stock trade |
| 20:01.34 | Amarande | nevcairiel: I don't, I hand mine in personally |
| 20:01.37 | foxlit | nevcairiel: the cheque is in the mail! |
| 20:01.40 | nevcairiel | thats even worse |
| 20:01.47 | Amarande | but apparently a lot of people do, since there's always a big rush at the store for stamps still right around the end of the month |
| 20:01.50 | Shirik_ | nevcairiel: that's what I do :( |
| 20:02.00 | nevcairiel | cant you pay electronically |
| 20:02.02 | Semlar | a ton of places REQUIRE rent to be paid via check |
| 20:02.09 | Shirik_ | not easily |
| 20:02.18 | foxlit | backwards bank system, really. |
| 20:02.18 | Shirik_ | theoretically I could have my bank send them a check |
| 20:02.30 | nevcairiel | we europeans pay all such things just via wire transfer |
| 20:02.35 | Shirik_ | yeah |
| 20:02.36 | Shirik_ | about that |
| 20:02.40 | Amarande | mind you, I live at home and pay the parents rent in cash, heh |
| 20:02.41 | karl_w_w | yeah rent payment is probably the most archaic in terms of method |
| 20:02.49 | Shirik_ | in the US wire transfers are a great way to waste tons of money |
| 20:03.04 | nevcairiel | high fees or what? |
| 20:03.06 | Shirik_ | most banks charge both the transmitter and the receiver like $20 |
| 20:03.29 | Amarande | nevcairiel: yeah, we have a nickname for America these days |
| 20:03.30 | Amarande | it's called the land of the fee |
| 20:03.30 | Amarande | :( |
| 20:03.37 | Shirik_ | We have ACH, but that's not an easily accessible form of transfer for non-financial entities |
| 20:04.04 | nevcairiel | i get a monthly wire transfer from the US these days, and there is around $20 or so fee. but i blamed that on it being an international transfer |
| 20:04.23 | nevcairiel | in europe we just have SEPA these days, sending money all over europe is trivial now |
| 20:04.35 | Shirik_ | in the US we have BItcoin now |
| 20:04.38 | Shirik_ | and so the banks are freaking out |
| 20:04.59 | foxlit | hm, this font. |
| 20:05.01 | nevcairiel | no wonder my employer was kinda struggling to get the wire transfer setup for my payments |
| 20:05.02 | karl_w_w | in australia we have this thing called debit cards |
| 20:05.06 | Shirik_ | but yeah ACH is the closest thing we have to SEPA |
| 20:05.16 | Shirik_ | but it's really only for financial institutions |
| 20:05.21 | karl_w_w | you get a piece of flat plastic with a number printed on it |
| 20:05.23 | Shirik_ | like that's how we get our paychecks typically, etc. |
| 20:05.24 | nevcairiel | then its not very close :p |
| 20:05.28 | karl_w_w | and that number lets you pay for things |
| 20:05.53 | nevcairiel | karl_w_w: that could also describe credit cards, which the USians do use |
| 20:05.55 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 20:06.02 | Semlar | we also use debit cards |
| 20:06.05 | karl_w_w | yeah its the same system |
| 20:06.10 | Shirik_ | my credit card even has a chip on it |
| 20:06.15 | Shirik_ | it's almost like we're part of the rest of the world! |
| 20:06.22 | nevcairiel | i heard the chip is unusual for USians |
| 20:06.24 | karl_w_w | whoa that's crazy my debit card has a chip! |
| 20:06.28 | Shirik_ | I was even forced to USE the chip a few weeks ago |
| 20:06.38 | Semlar | what did it taste like |
| 20:06.43 | kd3|hate`net | the chip's unusual until next year |
| 20:06.58 | Shirik_ | when I swiped my card the cashier was confused |
| 20:07.04 | nevcairiel | it must be even more annoying for you US people to travel the world than the other way around |
| 20:07.12 | Shirik_ | and then she realized my card had a chip on it and it got rejected because I didn't use it |
| 20:07.22 | Ressy | o.O |
| 20:07.25 | karl_w_w | really? pretty much all cards use a chip here now, i havent seen somebody swipe in ages |
| 20:07.31 | Ressy | All of our credit cards here have chips |
| 20:07.38 | Semlar | mine doesn't have a chip :( |
| 20:07.45 | Semlar | what's a chip |
| 20:07.47 | Shirik_ | pretty sure Walmart is the only store near me that has the chip reader |
| 20:07.51 | nevcairiel | we have one supermarket chain who still use swipe+signature instead of the chip and pin system |
| 20:07.53 | Shirik_ | Semlar: I have a pic on facebook somewhere |
| 20:07.54 | foxlit | name a reasonable non-monospace font that has different glyphs for I and l. |
| 20:07.58 | karl_w_w | in fact paywave has really taken off here |
| 20:08.00 | Semlar | the magnetic things? |
| 20:08.01 | Shirik_ | omg nevcairiel |
| 20:08.03 | Shirik_ | when I worked at Best Buy |
| 20:08.04 | nevcairiel | but otherwise it pretty much disappeared |
| 20:08.09 | Shirik_ | I had to break out the imprint thing |
| 20:08.12 | Ressy | They're replacing them to the chip cards, because if there's a chip and a fraud alert, they can deny refunding the money |
| 20:08.17 | Shirik_ | where you put it on the device and slide it back and forth |
| 20:08.20 | Shirik_ | and it makes an ink imprint |
| 20:08.20 | nevcairiel | Shirik_: that still exists o.o |
| 20:08.24 | Shirik_ | yes |
| 20:08.34 | Shirik_ | the card wouldn't swipe so I had to hand-key the card |
| 20:08.38 | kd3 | they existed at target until 2010 or so when we finally got rid of them |
| 20:08.43 | Shirik_ | and because the purchase was over a certain amount it forced me to take an imprint |
| 20:08.47 | nevcairiel | iremember them from way back |
| 20:08.53 | nevcairiel | but didnt know they were still in use |
| 20:09.15 | nevcairiel | I should start visiting local businesses and collect funny stories while i'm in the US |
| 20:10.07 | karl_w_w | we have a bank that has implemented a new system which i dont understand |
| 20:10.18 | karl_w_w | but their smartphone acts as a credit card |
| 20:10.30 | karl_w_w | as their bank card |
| 20:10.38 | nevcairiel | some banks in germany hand out V-Pay cards now, which apparently dont work in the US at all |
| 20:10.53 | Amarande | though imprints are getting really rare, heh |
| 20:10.55 | karl_w_w | so you can use your phone to get money out of the atm |
| 20:10.56 | nevcairiel | (contrary to the Maestro debit cards before) |
| 20:11.06 | Amarande | think the last time I got an imprint was when I bought jewelry at Badali at Dragon Con a couple years ago |
| 20:11.06 | foxlit | nevcairiel: the new Electron? |
| 20:11.09 | karl_w_w | or pay for things |
| 20:11.21 | Shirik_ | Semlar: https://www.facebook.com/matt.d.buono/posts/10100327695941898 |
| 20:11.24 | Shirik_ | there's a pic in the comments |
| 20:11.26 | Amarande | even at conventions lately the smaller merchants don't even use imprints much anymore like they used to |
| 20:11.34 | nevcairiel | foxlit: i guess, its visas answer to maestro |
| 20:11.45 | Amarande | now they use this doohickey that goes into the headphone port on their iPhone and swipe your card through that |
| 20:11.53 | Semlar | i think the only place i've seen a reader for one of these things is on some gas pumps |
| 20:11.56 | foxlit | I think it got a chip and a name change. |
| 20:12.12 | nevcairiel | its a pure debit card though, not a prepaid credit or anything |
| 20:12.34 | nevcairiel | and in germany also a "Giro"-Card, ie. an ATM card |
| 20:12.35 | Shirik_ | as far as I know it's still the same chip |
| 20:12.37 | foxlit | that’s basically Visa Electron. |
| 20:12.39 | Shirik_ | it's just a shrunken version |
| 20:12.54 | nevcairiel | wasnt visa electron their brand of pre-paid cards |
| 20:13.00 | Shirik_ | oh |
| 20:13.04 | Shirik_ | we're talking about two different things |
| 20:13.21 | Amarande | nevcairiel: what is it, one of those crappy cards like you can sometimes get from the banks here in the US too |
| 20:13.30 | Amarande | where it's only usable as an ATM money card and can't be used for any kind of visa/mc purchases? |
| 20:13.32 | karl_w_w | do you have paywave Shirik? |
| 20:13.32 | Amarande | those are junk |
| 20:13.34 | Shirik_ | what we REALLY need is these chips on driver's license |
| 20:13.53 | Shirik_ | karl_w_w: don't know what that is |
| 20:14.03 | Semlar | what we really need are chips embedded into people |
| 20:14.07 | foxlit | nevcairiel: no; could also be tied to bank accounts; they just require the transaction to be validated immediately. |
| 20:14.07 | Semlar | like my cat |
| 20:14.15 | karl_w_w | you pass your card over the reader and it uses rfid |
| 20:14.18 | Shirik_ | like, why should my employee badge be more secure than the thing I use to prove my identity to anyone |
| 20:14.36 | Semlar | then i could just swipe my hand at the card reader |
| 20:14.37 | Shirik_ | karl_w_w: oh I have that on my amex card |
| 20:14.38 | nevcairiel | Amarande: in germany (and europe in general), its pretty common NOT to have a credit card, so you only have a debit card, typically one of the Maestro chain, you can pay with them in stores just the same around europe, just not all over the world |
| 20:14.38 | Shirik_ | not on visa |
| 20:14.53 | karl_w_w | ever had a chance to use it? :P |
| 20:14.58 | Shirik_ | no :( |
| 20:15.05 | Amarande | nevcairiel: here in the US the debit cards normally have a credit card logo |
| 20:15.09 | Shirik_ | mcdonalds has the readers but I'm not going to go to mcdonalds and use a redit card |
| 20:15.10 | Shirik_ | lol |
| 20:15.19 | Shirik_ | my phone has nfc though |
| 20:15.22 | karl_w_w | it took like a year for that to go from never-heard-of to it being everywhere |
| 20:15.22 | Semlar | how hard would it be to get one of these chips embedded in my palm |
| 20:15.23 | Amarande | and can be used exactly the same as actual credit cards, just the money comes out of your bank account instead of on loan |
| 20:15.29 | Amarande | so they are very useful |
| 20:15.42 | Shirik_ | Semlar: well we already do it to animals |
| 20:15.47 | Shirik_ | so it can't be that hard |
| 20:15.50 | nevcairiel | our IDs in germany have a rfid data chip now, but i didnt get a new one yet, i managed to renew mine one month before they started handing out new ones |
| 20:16.07 | Amarande | about the only things you really can't do with them are rent cars (you generally have to have actual credit cards for that), and it's not so great for hotel rooms because a lot of extra money gets put on temporary hold and it can take a week or two to get it back after you leave |
| 20:16.08 | karl_w_w | awesome :P |
| 20:16.09 | Shirik_ | oh come to think about it, I think my global entry card has an rfid chip in it |
| 20:16.17 | Jamash | Shirik_, Semlar: but rfid implants are the number of the beast 666 yadda yadda |
| 20:16.24 | Semlar | :( |
| 20:16.31 | nevcairiel | my passport has a chip tho, couldnt enter the US otherwise |
| 20:16.38 | Shirik_ | psh |
| 20:16.42 | Shirik_ | who uses passports to enter the US |
| 20:16.48 | nevcairiel | non-US people :P |
| 20:16.55 | Semlar | foreigners |
| 20:17.02 | Jamash | just about anyone who enters legally? |
| 20:17.39 | Arrowmaster | i got an rfid blocking wallet, im not sure which if any of my cards have rfid but i have the wallet anyway |
| 20:18.02 | Gnarfoz | Arrowmaster: use your phone to check them out one by one! \o/ |
| 20:18.06 | Shirik_ | global nexus/sentri/nexus is so much easier Jamash |
| 20:18.09 | Shirik_ | global entry* |
| 20:18.29 | Arrowmaster | phone doesnt even detect my building IDs which i know are rfid |
| 20:18.40 | Gnarfoz | if I forget to turn off NFC and put my unlocked phone on top of my wallet, it reacts to my bank card >_> |
| 20:18.55 | Shirik_ | how o.o |
| 20:19.02 | Shirik_ | aren't they both passive devices? |
| 20:19.06 | Gnarfoz | uh, no? |
| 20:19.11 | Arrowmaster | phone is active |
| 20:19.11 | Jamash | Shirik_: how do you prove you're in the program? |
| 20:19.13 | Gnarfoz | the phone is obviously an active part |
| 20:19.15 | Shirik_ | there's no reason for your phone to be interrogating for RFID |
| 20:19.20 | Gnarfoz | of course there is? |
| 20:19.21 | Arrowmaster | NFC |
| 20:19.23 | Gnarfoz | "NFC support" |
| 20:19.23 | Shirik_ | Jamash: fingerprints + a card |
| 20:19.35 | Gnarfoz | everywhere you read this, it means that ^ |
| 20:19.37 | Jamash | Shirik_: ah, I see, you replaced your passport with a different passport |
| 20:19.41 | Shirik_ | yes :P |
| 20:19.45 | Jamash | cool story bro :) |
| 20:19.51 | Gnarfoz | and I'm in the same situation as nev, renewed my ID *just* before the new ones w/ included rfid came out :D |
| 20:20.07 | Amarande | Shirik: pretty much everyone coming into the country uses them? :) |
| 20:20.18 | Amarande | you even need one to go to canada these days, because you can't get back into the US without it |
| 20:20.24 | Arrowmaster | i added this to one of my orders a year or so ago and it works and i like the layout http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/8cdd/ |
| 20:20.27 | Shirik_ | Gnarfoz: I just don't understand why your phone would be looking for an RFID signal |
| 20:20.31 | nevcairiel | Gnarfoz: i was like in october, and november the new ID came out, i think |
| 20:20.37 | Jamash | Did anyone else here read Mostly Harmless? It's mostly boring and terrible but I liked the personal data card that stores all your biometrics on it so you don't have to bother with iris scans/fingerprints/dna/etc |
| 20:20.40 | Arrowmaster | Shirik_: NFC is rfid |
| 20:20.43 | Shirik_ | yes |
| 20:20.45 | Gnarfoz | Shirik_: because my phone (like many other modern smartphones) is an RFID reader? |
| 20:20.54 | Shirik_ | but at all times? |
| 20:20.57 | Gnarfoz | and the default behaviour is to be active when the phone is unlocked |
| 20:20.59 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 20:20.59 | Shirik_ | like, that seems like something that should be on demand |
| 20:21.00 | Gnarfoz | i.e. screen on |
| 20:21.03 | Shirik_ | that's weird |
| 20:21.09 | Gnarfoz | no, that should not be on demand |
| 20:21.13 | Gnarfoz | that'd be a horrible user experience |
| 20:21.15 | Shirik_ | like even if it did detect and RFID chip, what would its purpose be? |
| 20:21.18 | Jamash | Shirik_: haven't you seen the tv ads where you fistbump phones to send photos? |
| 20:21.30 | Gnarfoz | Shirik_: read whatever is on it? |
| 20:21.30 | Amarande | Shirik: wouldn't be surprised if a large percentage of West Coast truckers use passports, especially, even if they don't vacation abroad often :) |
| 20:21.32 | nevcairiel | its just easier to use that way, you can unlock your phone and directly interact with stuff, instead of finding the app to enable it or some shit |
| 20:21.34 | Shirik_ | sure, I always assumed there would be an app loaded |
| 20:21.37 | Gnarfoz | Shirik_: for my bank card, it launches the app to read the money chip on it |
| 20:21.48 | Gnarfoz | well no, I get to pick, actually |
| 20:21.59 | Shirik_ | I only now got an android phone |
| 20:22.03 | Shirik_ | so I'm just now getting into this whole NFC thing |
| 20:22.11 | Shirik_ | Apple has blocked me off from the rest of the world :( |
| 20:22.26 | Jamash | in the future you will be able to use your phone to steal people's bitcoins wirelessly, and by in the future I mean right now |
| 20:22.31 | nevcairiel | ive never actually used this NFC thing for anything useful |
| 20:22.39 | Gnarfoz | Shirik_: haha, welcome to ze future! |
| 20:22.39 | Shirik_ | to say that you used NFC? |
| 20:22.40 | nevcairiel | its not really used in germany commercially much yet |
| 20:22.41 | Jamash | damn, is it tekwar already |
| 20:22.57 | Gnarfoz | I've only used it to shock people that I can read their passports |
| 20:23.06 | Gnarfoz | and to check the balance on the money chip on my bank card |
| 20:23.16 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@c83-250-213-196.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 20:23.16 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 20:23.16 | Jamash | if only we'd listened to the all too prescient predictions of william shatner's ghostwriter |
| 20:23.19 | nevcairiel | ive also never used my money chip |
| 20:23.43 | Jamash | Gnarfoz: I love the idea of making a new sooper seecure passport and then putting a giant security hole in it |
| 20:23.47 | Gnarfoz | oh and I put a sticky NFC label somewhere in my parent's house with an URL to the foursquare venue |
| 20:23.57 | Gnarfoz | so I can just hold my phone to it and check in to "mom & dad" |
| 20:24.06 | Jamash | Gnarfoz: you are what's wrong with western civilization |
| 20:24.07 | Gnarfoz | Jamash: securelol! yeah. |
| 20:24.13 | Gnarfoz | I totally am |
| 20:25.12 | Amarande | Jamash: actually, it's probably better that goofsters like Gnarfoz shock people like that |
| 20:25.19 | Amarande | otherwise, nobody would know about that and scan&steal would be an issue |
| 20:25.39 | Jamash | Amarande: I meant using NFC to check in to his parents' house |
| 20:25.43 | Amarande | speaking of RFID, remember the real howler that the EU parliament almost actually implemented? :) |
| 20:25.54 | Jamash | demonstrating security flaws is a public service |
| 20:26.12 | Amarande | apparently, they were going to put RFID chips in the new 100 and 500 euro bills |
| 20:26.22 | Amarande | can we say that that would have been a really, really, really dumbass idea? :) |
| 20:26.24 | Shirik_ | I think that's a great idea |
| 20:26.25 | Gnarfoz | I haven't really found a use for the other 11 sticky NFC labels I got :\ |
| 20:26.29 | Shirik_ | why not |
| 20:26.31 | Amarande | Shirik: it seems a great idea at first |
| 20:26.45 | Amarande | Shirik: because someone can just go around a crowd with a scanner covertly and be able to tell good targets to mug |
| 20:26.47 | Dagmar | Gnarfoz: Yes you do. :) |
| 20:26.47 | kd3 | hey this guy's got a $500 in his wallet. let's nab him |
| 20:26.56 | Shirik_ | oh don't do it like THAT |
| 20:27.02 | Shirik_ | you need to implement it as a PKI system |
| 20:27.07 | Shirik_ | much like how smartcards work |
| 20:27.13 | Dagmar | Make 'em link to something like Goatse and then put them on any political posters you don't like |
| 20:27.16 | nevcairiel | barely anyone even uses 100 euro bills, not to mention 500 |
| 20:27.19 | Shirik_ | like each bill would have a certificate |
| 20:27.41 | Gnarfoz | kd3: $500? where did that come from |
| 20:27.59 | nevcairiel | he has no euro sign on his keyboard |
| 20:28.04 | kd3 | ^ |
| 20:28.11 | Gnarfoz | no I mean... what are you even talking about? :o |
| 20:28.17 | Shirik_ | Amarande's comment |
| 20:28.19 | nevcairiel | he responded to Amarande |
| 20:28.22 | Gnarfoz | oh, I don't read those. |
| 20:28.23 | Gnarfoz | :p |
| 20:28.23 | Amarande | yeah, Gnarfoz has me on ignore, heh |
| 20:28.26 | kd3 | putting RFIDs in high-value bills |
| 20:28.27 | Gnarfoz | (or well, see) |
| 20:28.37 | nevcairiel | <Amarande> apparently, they were going to put RFID chips in the new 100 and 500 euro bills |
| 20:28.46 | Gnarfoz | Dagmar: well, I doubt anyone would scan a tiny ~3 cm stickythingy :D but over-labeling QR codes... is the current sport, is it not? :D |
| 20:28.57 | Shirik_ | omg Gnarfoz |
| 20:29.06 | Dagmar | Hell I add completely new QR codes |
| 20:29.09 | Shirik_ | on our aircraft, almost every single part has a tiny-ass QR code on it |
| 20:29.13 | Dagmar | ...but the same can be said of both. |
| 20:29.17 | Jamash | sick of political corruption? join the lemon party [qr code] |
| 20:29.19 | Shirik_ | I didn't even know they could print them that small |
| 20:29.20 | Shirik_ | it's insane |
| 20:29.23 | karl_w_w | are the ducks bothered by the implantation procedure? |
| 20:29.24 | nevcairiel | Shirik_: do you also get tiny-ass scanners? |
| 20:29.33 | Dagmar | If you put a "Touch Your Phone Here For More Info" sticker over an NFC tag, people will do it and they won't even question where the URL is going |
| 20:29.41 | Gnarfoz | Shirik_: haha, same on Dell server parts (i.e. open the lid... everything has a fucking qr code) |
| 20:29.43 | Jamash | Shirik: There was a science experiment that involved bar-coding bees so that doesn't surprise me |
| 20:29.59 | Gnarfoz | Dagmar: best use: to that USSC code that just wipes the phone (yeah, already fixed, but...) |
| 20:30.03 | Amarande | Jamash: don't bees already come bar-coded for our convenience? :) |
| 20:30.09 | Shirik_ | lol |
| 20:30.09 | karl_w_w | nobody cared about my joke :( |
| 20:30.12 | jleclanche | kd3: use my keyboard layout |
| 20:30.12 | nevcairiel | Dagmar: we've had entire billboards with nothing except a huge QR code on it, and of course people scan it :p |
| 20:30.17 | jleclanche | euro sign is altgr e |
| 20:30.18 | Dagmar | heheh |
| 20:30.21 | Jamash | Amarande: well, ye...no...uh |
| 20:30.21 | Shirik_ | I didn't undersatnd it karl_w_w |
| 20:30.29 | Amarande | jleclanche: american keyboards don't have AltGr, either |
| 20:30.32 | Amarande | except maybe a few laptops |
| 20:30.39 | Shirik_ | nevcairiel: there's also "the algorithm" |
| 20:30.40 | Jamash | they do if you enable it in the OS |
| 20:30.42 | Arrowmaster | Shirik_: is it a QR code or a DataMatrix? |
| 20:30.42 | jleclanche | altgr is modifier level 3 |
| 20:30.44 | jleclanche | thats all |
| 20:30.46 | karl_w_w | because they were going to put rfid chips in their bills, Shirik_ |
| 20:30.53 | nevcairiel | Amarande: its right alt |
| 20:30.53 | Shirik_ | Arrowmaster: pretty sure it's QR, but I wouldn't know |
| 20:30.59 | kd3 | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:31.03 | Shirik_ | our software doesn't have QR codes printed on it :P |
| 20:31.05 | jleclanche | its mac keyboards that dont have altgr |
| 20:31.06 | Shirik_ | so I don't have to deal with it |
| 20:31.20 | karl_w_w | my windows keyboard has no altgr |
| 20:31.29 | Arrowmaster | Shirik_: DataMatrix seems to be used more for internal part tracking and is made really small |
| 20:31.45 | Jamash | you can turn right alt into altgr with keyboard settings I think |
| 20:31.50 | Shirik_ | is it visually distinguishable? because it definitely LOOKS like a qr code |
| 20:31.59 | Shirik_ | it's got the typical calibration boxes, etc. |
| 20:32.03 | Arrowmaster | jleclanche: altgr-e on us-intl is é |
| 20:32.13 | kd3 | not all 2d barcodes are qr |
| 20:32.15 | jleclanche | Arrowmaster: which is why i said use my layout |
| 20:32.20 | Arrowmaster | oh missed that |
| 20:32.24 | karl_w_w | Jamash, yeah, but I'm pretty sure no layout has everything in the same place as well as altgr enabled |
| 20:32.25 | jleclanche | Arrowmaster: that letter on my layout is altgr 3 shift e |
| 20:32.31 | jleclanche | dead accents ftw |
| 20:32.34 | jleclanche | i also have a compose key. |
| 20:32.39 | nevcairiel | Shirik_: QR has the three boxes, DataMatrix has two solid lines forming one corner |
| 20:32.50 | Arrowmaster | i have a compose too, its set to altgr-menu |
| 20:33.11 | karl_w_w | in fact i dont actually know what keyboard layout this is |
| 20:33.27 | Jamash | us-international |
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| 20:33.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Semlar (~chatzilla@142.196.185.93) |
| 20:33.53 | Jamash | right alt 5 is € |
| 20:34.14 | Shirik_ | ∞ |
| 20:34.17 | Shirik_ | :( |
| 20:34.18 | foxlit | alt-3: £. |
| 20:34.21 | nevcairiel | right alt e is € |
| 20:34.22 | Shirik_ | £ |
| 20:34.30 | Shirik_ | ´ |
| 20:34.34 | nevcairiel | 3 is ³ |
| 20:34.34 | Shirik_ | why do you guys lie to me |
| 20:34.36 | nevcairiel | :p |
| 20:34.42 | foxlit | Shirik_ is clearly on a mac. |
| 20:34.46 | Shirik_ | ^ |
| 20:34.48 | karl_w_w | alt and other keys dont give me any characters at all |
| 20:34.49 | Jamash | altgr-e = é on windows 7 us-international |
| 20:35.01 | nevcairiel | macs have it out for PC users anyway |
| 20:35.08 | nevcairiel | alt q is @ |
| 20:35.17 | nevcairiel | altgr-q that is |
| 20:35.27 | Shirik_ | with all of these useless symbols like ¶ you would think that the euro sign would be more accessible |
| 20:35.51 | Shirik_ | ∂ |
| 20:36.00 | Shirik_ | o.o there's a partial derivative symbol |
| 20:36.02 | foxlit | € shift-alt-2 |
| 20:36.07 | Jamash | however, windows seems to map altgr internally to Ctrl+Alt which then conflicts with my global keybindings |
| 20:36.08 | Shirik_ | € |
| 20:36.09 | Shirik_ | yay |
| 20:36.18 | Shirik_ | is there any easy way to find this out, anyway? |
| 20:36.46 | nevcairiel | dunno, € is printed on my keyboard |
| 20:37.08 | karl_w_w | well i changed my layout to US international and i still dont get euro from right alt e |
| 20:37.08 | *** join/#wowuidev vhhmzyyhafpt (iamparadox@c-71-56-171-154.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 20:37.13 | nevcairiel | lower right corner is the char on altr-gr on german layouts |
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| 20:37.16 | Jamash | karl_w_w: what OS? |
| 20:37.23 | karl_w_w | 8.1 |
| 20:37.33 | Jamash | karl_w_w: try rightalt-5 |
| 20:37.41 | karl_w_w | nothing |
| 20:37.43 | foxlit | Shirik_: http://support.apple.com/kb/PH13746 |
| 20:37.48 | Jamash | karl_w_w: idk then |
| 20:39.00 | karl_w_w | right alt 3 opens explorer |
| 20:39.23 | nevcairiel | thats win-e for me |
| 20:39.28 | karl_w_w | but not always |
| 20:39.41 | karl_w_w | when im using hexchat right alt 3 opens vent |
| 20:39.47 | nevcairiel | lol |
| 20:39.53 | Shirik_ | win-e is best |
| 20:40.09 | nevcairiel | not if youre on an apple |
| 20:40.14 | karl_w_w | when im in notepad right alt 3 gives me superscript 3 |
| 20:40.31 | Shirik_ | ok, the TWO most important shortcuts |
| 20:40.35 | Shirik_ | win-e and command-space |
| 20:40.39 | Shirik_ | depending on which computer you're on |
| 20:40.43 | Shirik_ | and if you're on linux you're fucked |
| 20:41.09 | karl_w_w | ¡²³¤€¼½¾‘’ <- right alt and the numbers 1 to 0 in notepad |
| 20:41.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Gintaro_ (~gintaro@geertswei.nl) |
| 20:41.19 | karl_w_w | they just dont work in hexchat |
| 20:41.43 | Shirik_ | wtf is that star thingy |
| 20:41.58 | Shirik_ | I don't even know the purpose for that symbol |
| 20:42.09 | karl_w_w | i've seen it before, no idea what it's for |
| 20:42.19 | Shirik_ | like there are a lot of symbols we never use that I at least know what they are supposed to mean, but I have no idea what that is |
| 20:43.19 | karl_w_w | im surprised you've never seen it |
| 20:43.29 | Shirik_ | damnit |
| 20:43.34 | Shirik_ | someone actually DID die today at that shooting |
| 20:43.43 | Shirik_ | (other than the shooter) |
| 20:44.16 | Shirik_ | I know a lot of people that live in that neighborhood |
| 20:44.31 | karl_w_w | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C2%A4 Shirik_ |
| 20:45.51 | Shirik_ | karl_w_w: weird |
| 20:47.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande_ (~Amarande@24-151-100-63.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 20:48.19 | karl_w_w | oh god my ` key has gone crazy |
| 20:48.46 | karl_w_w | and hexchat responds differently to everything else to key presses |
| 20:49.01 | karl_w_w | I can't even use alt codes here |
| 20:49.12 | foxlit | how will you ever manage? |
| 20:49.33 | karl_w_w | equal parts panic and violence |
| 20:50.32 | Amarande | heh, you know what gets really fun with alt codes |
| 20:50.42 | Amarande | the fact that I have to actually type numbers to tell if my numpad is on numbers or arrows |
| 20:51.07 | karl_w_w | you don't have a light? |
| 20:51.11 | Amarande | karl_w_w: nope |
| 20:51.12 | Shirik_ | I never understood why it even bothers to check |
| 20:51.13 | Shirik_ | like |
| 20:51.17 | Shirik_ | alt+arrow doesn't even mean anything |
| 20:51.18 | Amarande | and apparently it's more facepalmy than I thought |
| 20:51.20 | Shirik_ | why should num lock matter |
| 20:51.35 | Amarande | I thought my num lock light was dead ... turns out I have a caps lock light only on this keyboard, I never HAD a num lock light to begin with ROFL |
| 20:51.37 | karl_w_w | also I bet you can get something to force it to numlock on always |
| 20:51.51 | Shirik_ | yeah user-mode apps have control over num lock |
| 20:51.54 | karl_w_w | cos when the hell has anyone ever used a numpad for the arrows |
| 20:51.57 | Shirik_ | so you could just write a program to turn it back on |
| 20:52.31 | Shirik_ | hell I bet AutoHotKey could disable the button |
| 20:52.56 | Shirik_ | ok landing now |
| 20:53.00 | Shirik_ | bai! |
| 20:53.05 | karl_w_w | there was probably some game in the dos era that used the numpad for arrows and that's the only time ever |
| 20:53.23 | Shirik_ | two-player tetris |
| 20:53.38 | karl_w_w | wasd and the regular arrows :P |
| 20:53.39 | Rythal | :/ I use numpad as arrows in most games |
| 20:53.48 | Shirik_ | what |
| 20:54.05 | karl_w_w | maybe rythal has huge hands |
| 20:54.06 | Shirik_ | how does your hand even get there |
| 20:54.07 | Shirik_ | like |
| 20:54.18 | Amarande | karl_w_w: back in the day some keyboards only had the main letter area and the numpad and lacked the arrow keys in between, I believe |
| 20:54.30 | Amarande | so the numpad WAS your arrow keys |
| 20:54.34 | Rythal | I find it easier to move using numpad, and arrange 7 and 9 as strafe, 1 and 3 as crouch/leans |
| 20:54.39 | Shirik_ | Amarande: that's actually why vim uses hjkl |
| 20:54.40 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@2601:a:f00:465:e161:da50:5878:9aff) |
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| 20:54.48 | Shirik_ | because the arrow keys were printed on hjkl |
| 20:54.57 | karl_w_w | Q/E is strafe everyone knows that :P |
| 20:55.02 | Shirik_ | incorrect |
| 20:55.04 | Shirik_ | A/D is strafe |
| 20:55.07 | kd3 | ^ |
| 20:55.07 | Shirik_ | Q/E is turn |
| 20:55.11 | karl_w_w | well depends on the game |
| 20:55.15 | Shirik_ | no |
| 20:55.17 | kd3 | you're landing, get off the laptop |
| 20:55.21 | Shirik_ | every game that is not this way is instantly changed |
| 20:55.25 | Shirik_ | I refuse until they kick off the wifi! |
| 20:55.31 | Shirik_ | aka 10000 feet |
| 20:55.37 | Shirik_ | which based on the flaps should be pretty soon |
| 20:55.42 | Rythal | if i'm using a mouse.. then yes, wasd is better... but if the game doesn't use mouse... numpad is better |
| 20:55.46 | Amarande | kd3: actually I've heard of some flights now where you don't have to turn off electronics when landing |
| 20:55.53 | Amarande | I think the last delta flight I was on was that way, actually |
| 20:55.58 | nevcairiel | games without a mouse are kinda rare these days |
| 20:55.59 | Shirik_ | you have to turn off laptops |
| 20:56.03 | kd3 | small things like phones? sure. big things like laptops, still have to turn off |
| 20:56.05 | Shirik_ | that's not an electronics thing, that's a safety thing |
| 20:56.23 | nevcairiel | yeah they dont want you having your laptop in front of you during landing |
| 20:56.25 | Rythal | my American flight last month they made us turn off while in canada due to regulations... but while in the US we did not. |
| 20:56.26 | kd3 | flew a few days after the fcc passed that |
| 20:57.29 | Amarande | and actually, I'm beginning to think what I really should get is one of those small razer blackwidow keyboards or the like |
| 20:57.32 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (~Mike@c-50-166-85-212.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:57.32 | Amarande | the kind that don't HAVE a num pad |
| 20:57.42 | Amarande | the num pad is a BAD thing, on balance, when I really think about it ... |
| 20:58.07 | karl_w_w | you can get tenkeyless boards without having to buy a piece of shit from razer |
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| 20:58.36 | Rythal | I'm very picky on my keyboards... if it's not logitech, I won't touch it |
| 20:58.36 | karl_w_w | i use my numpad though |
| 20:59.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Semlar (~chatzilla@142.196.185.93) |
| 20:59.15 | karl_w_w | if i need a keybind for something on the fly -> numpad |
| 21:00.08 | karl_w_w | otherwise it gets used for... typing numbers |
| 21:00.48 | Amarande | karl_w_w: yeah, "or the like" |
| 21:01.00 | Amarande | although a lot of the "like"s seem to be even more friggin expensive than razer |
| 21:01.27 | *** join/#wowuidev MiRai (~MiRai@unaffiliated/mirai) |
| 21:01.32 | Amarande | but yeah, I can think of a very good reason the numpad is bad |
| 21:01.36 | karl_w_w | well you need to look better then! |
| 21:01.44 | Amarande | the numpad is the main reason you have to key one handed most of the time in combat |
| 21:02.03 | Amarande | and thus have trouble using key combinations that rely heavily on the right hand side of the keyboard |
| 21:02.12 | Amarande | (assuming you're a right handed mouser like most of us are) |
| 21:02.35 | Amarande | you have to key one handed because it would be fatal in most fights like your typical wow battle to stop moving for too long |
| 21:02.37 | karl_w_w | I don't understand what you just said |
| 21:02.49 | Amarande | karl_w_w: you have to keep your right hand on or near enough to the mouse to move on a moment's notice when you're raiding |
| 21:02.55 | Amarande | therefore you're only able to type one handed |
| 21:02.56 | Esamynn|work | lost me too |
| 21:03.09 | karl_w_w | how does the numpad cause that? |
| 21:03.10 | Amarande | the num pad is bad because it increases the distance between the mouse and the right hand side of the main keyboard |
| 21:03.21 | Gethe | they ar adding a [talent] macro condition |
| 21:03.31 | Amarande | if you didn't have one, the main keyboard area would be right next to your mouse hand, so it would be faster to quickly hit a key and get back to the mouse |
| 21:03.35 | karl_w_w | i guess that makes a little sense |
| 21:03.46 | karl_w_w | but it's gotta be the tiniest amount of time |
| 21:03.56 | Stanzilla | @Celestalon: Handy macro conditional added in 6.0: #showtooltip /cast [talent:3/1] Ring of Frost; [talent:3/2] Ice Ward; [talent:3/3] Frostjaw |
| 21:03.58 | Stanzilla | finally |
| 21:04.01 | Esamynn|work | I don't think I'd take my hand of my mouse regardless, most of the time |
| 21:04.08 | karl_w_w | yeah |
| 21:04.23 | karl_w_w | you dont type when important stuff is going on |
| 21:04.38 | foxlit | STAB STAB STAB at that syntax. |
| 21:04.39 | Amarande | karl_w_w: well not just type, but also ready access to keyboard shortcuts that rely on the right hand side of the keyboard |
| 21:04.42 | Esamynn|work | it's not the distance that is the time consuming part about hitting a key with your right hand, it's finding the rigth placeo nthe keyboard when it wasn't already situated |
| 21:04.42 | karl_w_w | you use voice chat or just do without saying anything |
| 21:04.43 | foxlit | 3/1? wtf is that. |
| 21:04.47 | Amarande | especially ones that require the use of one or (gods) multiple meta keys |
| 21:04.48 | kd3 | row 3 col 1? |
| 21:04.51 | Simca_ | ^ |
| 21:04.53 | nebula169 | row/col i'd imagine |
| 21:04.59 | foxlit | yeah, but / is typically OR. |
| 21:05.01 | Amarande | ever try to hit ctrl-alt-9 with your left hand, say? :) |
| 21:05.09 | foxlit | as in mod:alt/shift |
| 21:05.16 | foxlit | or button:1/3 |
| 21:05.23 | foxlit | or pet:Voidwalker/Imp |
| 21:05.39 | karl_w_w | foxlit, but comma is taken |
| 21:06.08 | karl_w_w | most things are even |
| 21:06.09 | Gnarfoz | blurgh someone help me out |
| 21:06.11 | foxlit | a minus would’ve made more sense. Or a dot. |
| 21:06.26 | kd3 | you read my mind: https://twitter.com/Kaydeethree/status/476470338071855106 |
| 21:06.50 | Amarande | I'm still wondering if the stat squish will straighten out some other matters or not. Any word? |
| 21:06.56 | Gnarfoz | wasn't there some other notation to represent /run set(x, not get(x)) (for a simple bool toggle) |
| 21:07.23 | Amarande | (most particularly, whether they're going to rebalance lower level healing potions and especially bandages, so leveling first aid doesn't feel like throwing away cloth for nothing even more than it already did) |
| 21:07.39 | nebula169 | doubt they care much about low level balance. |
| 21:07.41 | karl_w_w | oh yes i forgot! newegg has an australian division now! |
| 21:07.53 | Amarande | nebula169: they changed it before, when 5.0 came out |
| 21:08.00 | Amarande | and basically made lower level bandages worthless altogether |
| 21:08.09 | karl_w_w | lets do some price comparison |
| 21:08.13 | Amarande | since they heal so little compared to how much health you have now |
| 21:08.18 | nevcairiel | Gnarfoz: thats how you would usually do it, what kind of other notation do you want |
| 21:08.28 | Amarande | but since 6.0 is squishing things and your health will be smaller numbers again, perhaps they might fix the bandage thing too |
| 21:08.52 | nebula169 | should just scrap first aid as a profession! it was actually useful leveling in vanilla/tbc, not so much anymore |
| 21:09.18 | Amarande | nebula169: it's apparently still of its usual use at max level, but the low level stuff is off kilter |
| 21:09.25 | Gnarfoz | nevcairiel: something involving ~ ? maybe I'm misremembering |
| 21:09.27 | Amarande | same with potions, it barely heals a hit or two anymore |
| 21:10.04 | Gethe | health pots will == lock rocks |
| 21:10.18 | Gnarfoz | "not" works just fine, my weird brain tried several variations of ~, ! and such before that, though :D |
| 21:10.26 | nevcairiel | Gnarfoz: in lua there is no such operator |
| 21:10.33 | Gnarfoz | ok, I must be insane then |
| 21:10.36 | Gnarfoz | (nothing new here) |
| 21:10.56 | Gethe | ~= works in lua |
| 21:11.25 | Gnarfoz | that's not for what I asked, though |
| 21:11.28 | *** join/#wowuidev dano5 (~dano5@208.79-160-124.customer.lyse.net) |
| 21:11.46 | Gethe | oh, that carry on |
| 21:11.50 | Gethe | then* |
| 21:26.56 | Gnarfoz | Netflix doesn't want to be pushed around http://www.scribd.com/doc/228871116/Response-to-Demand-Letter |
| 21:27.35 | Stanzilla | http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/06/10/the-great-crt-refactoring.aspx < finally |
| 21:29.42 | Gnarfoz | I thought this was about CRTs :( |
| 21:30.00 | Stanzilla | haha |
| 21:30.00 | Stanzilla | (2) In Visual Studio 2013 there are 6,830 #if, #ifdef, #ifndef, #elif, and #else directives in the sources that we ship with the product; in the Visual Studio "14" CTP there are 1,656. |
| 21:30.02 | Stanzilla | that is impressive |
| 21:30.37 | Gnarfoz | man I still hate those companies for giving up on SED/FED displays |
| 21:30.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Trond- (~Trond@158.81-167-232.customer.lyse.net) |
| 21:33.00 | Dagmar | Definitions for 64-bit false, too. ;) |
| 21:33.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Trond-- (~Trond@unaffiliated/trond--) |
| 21:35.16 | pompy | http://blog.malwarebytes.org/security-threat/2014/06/senpai-has-noticed-me-and-swiped-my-login/ |
| 21:35.45 | kd3 | bahahaha |
| 21:36.44 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 21:39.30 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 21:41.29 | Amarande | also regarding wod: based on alpha so far ... is the monk being integrated into the ongoing game better than the death knight was, I hope? :) |
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| 21:45.24 | Torhal | Esamynn|Away: I have no words - http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/gatherer#c3907 |
| 21:45.28 | Torhal | MentalPower|Work: ^ |
| 21:54.12 | Amarande | Torhal: heh. find his favourite addon that has ace in it and unbundle ace |
| 21:54.27 | Amarande | then watch him squirm and say "but Ace should have been bundled with it!" |
| 21:55.13 | Amarande | though tbh, he has a bit of a point |
| 21:55.31 | Amarande | in particular, I start to regularly feel like it's time that the Norganna slidebar be a completely separate download |
| 21:55.55 | Amarande | it's becoming more and more of niche usefulness, especially given that if you have an LDB panel you get the buttons there too |
| 21:56.55 | Semlar | i swear to god this exact message was posted months ago |
| 21:59.01 | Semlar | we had a discussion about whether the addons should be bundled |
| 22:00.20 | Semlar | http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/gatherer#c3894 yep |
| 22:00.50 | nevcairiel | reads like thats the same dude |
| 22:01.14 | TC-Work | it does but the accounts were opened 2007 and 2012 |
| 22:01.19 | Torhal | Completely different IP addresses as well. |
| 22:01.26 | Torhal | Like, not even close. |
| 22:01.27 | Semlar | http://infobot.rikers.org/%23wowuidev/20140212.html.gz >_> |
| 22:01.41 | TC-Work | That one is easy |
| 22:01.47 | TC-Work | IP spoofing I mean |
| 22:01.47 | Semlar | search for gatherer |
| 22:04.52 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 22:07.15 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 22:34.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik|Droid (~Shirik@84.sub-70-194-104.myvzw.com) |
| 22:34.09 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 22:34.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik|Droid (~Shirik@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 22:34.54 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik|Droid] by ChanServ |
| 22:36.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (~Kraps@unaffiliated/kraps) |
| 23:07.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Sintacks (Syntax@173-80-113-154-swby.atw.dyn.suddenlink.net) |
| 23:10.50 | pompy | hey Shirik, how about that Frequent Flyer change? |
| 23:11.19 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@c83-250-213-196.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 23:11.26 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 23:11.44 | Shirik|Droid | Pompy: not particularly surprised |
| 23:12.15 | Shirik|Droid | ff programs have been deteriorating at an alarming rate for years now |
| 23:13.44 | Shirik|Droid | United now feels that passengers that fly 25000-50000 miles are just as good as those that have their credit card |
| 23:14.18 | Shirik|Droid | And those at the 50000-75000 bracket aren't much better |
| 23:20.49 | TC-Work | Why should you get rewarded for flying a lot? You only get shit for driving a lot. |
| 23:22.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Simca__ (~Simca@c-76-123-93-232.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 23:24.05 | kd3 | oh geesh, 1.65GB patch |
| 23:24.05 | TC-Work | jleclanche: Do you know a way to completly disable csrf for a project? |
| 23:24.55 | jleclanche | TC-Work: yes and I wont tell you because you fucking shouldnt |
| 23:25.03 | jleclanche | its hard to for an excellent reason |
| 23:25.09 | jleclanche | fix your stuff, dont work around it |
| 23:25.42 | TC-Work | I'll just exempt it then |
| 23:26.05 | jleclanche | TC-Work: what are you exempting? |
| 23:26.13 | Amarande | I apparently have something over 30,000 Delta miles and no idea what I can even actually do with them |
| 23:26.17 | TC-Work | An ajax call |
| 23:26.24 | TC-Work | well, get |
| 23:26.25 | Amarande | in fact, I'm not even sure I can even DO anything with Delta miles anymore unless I get their branded American Express card :| |
| 23:26.27 | TC-Work | nope, post |
| 23:26.28 | A-KO | Amarande: I've always felt those miles were misleading |
| 23:26.40 | jleclanche | TC-Work: ajax calls can be exempt if they are APIs. if they are use internally, pass the csrf cookie |
| 23:26.41 | Amarande | A-KO: oh, the miles themselves are logical enough, you get one for each mile you actually fly |
| 23:26.47 | Amarande | what they're good for, that's always foggy as all get out |
| 23:26.58 | A-KO | yeah, but do you really think they'll give you 30,000 miles worth of free flights? lol |
| 23:27.03 | Amarande | it's like those mysterious "Points" that all and sundry businesses offer you lately :P |
| 23:27.06 | A-KO | yeah |
| 23:27.12 | jleclanche | kd3: what game? |
| 23:27.26 | Amarande | they might even be only about as worthful as my Battle.net achievement score, heh |
| 23:27.27 | A-KO | I've considered getting an air miles credit card |
| 23:27.47 | Amarande | I have a regular green American Express card, and a Delta frequent flyer number, but they're separate |
| 23:27.58 | Amarande | And I'm not 100% sure what you can do with Delta miles that aren't ON the SkyMiles American Express Card |
| 23:28.51 | TC-Work | jleclanche: How? the docs say how to do it as part of a form, but this is a js popup. |
| 23:29.11 | jleclanche | TC-Work: you can use the csrf_cookie variable if you want just the string |
| 23:29.25 | jleclanche | TC-Work: {% csrf_cookie %} is the full input hidden |
| 23:29.27 | Amarande | speaking of which, my achievement score feels low |
| 23:29.31 | jleclanche | {{ csrf_cookie }} is just the string |
| 23:29.54 | Amarande | how many points are available atm, anyways? |
| 23:29.55 | pompy | jleclanche: new WoD alpha build i believe |
| 23:30.15 | Shirik|Droid | Tc you do get stuff for driving a lot; or at least I do |
| 23:30.30 | Shirik|Droid | 3% back on gas |
| 23:31.05 | Shirik|Droid | The problem is that that's the only industry that really makes any money off you driving a lot |
| 23:32.30 | Shirik|Droid | whereas airlines make a hell of a lot more money off flights |
| 23:33.39 | Shirik|Droid | I think the real reason for that is that flights for frequent flyers is paid through expense reports |
| 23:34.04 | Shirik|Droid | It's allot easier to get people to spend money when it isn't theirs |
| 23:37.42 | Torhal | jleclanche: Assuming Alpha WoD. I have an update I can't apply for some reason :/ |
| 23:37.50 | kd3 | http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/13087129062 |
| 23:38.06 | kd3 | (yes, warlords) |
| 23:38.16 | kd3 | torhal, that link is relevant to your interests |
| 23:38.25 | TC-Work | (porn) |
| 23:38.37 | Torhal | kd3: Yay! |
| 23:41.04 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 23:46.04 | *** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@unaffiliated/stolenlegacy) |
| 23:52.08 | Gnarfoz | kd3|hate`net, Torhal: for me, exiting the BDA and killing agent.exe also worked :] |
| 23:52.28 | kd3|hate`net | the blue on the forums said they screwed up the upload and fixed it on their end too |
| 23:52.33 | Torhal | Gnarfoz: Owell, kd3|hate`net 's method worked. |
| 23:52.48 | Gnarfoz | all's well that ends well |
| 23:53.39 | Gnarfoz | tells cogwheel about just how alpha Torhal is |
| 23:54.04 | Torhal | o.O |
| 23:54.20 | Gnarfoz | embrace the randomness |
| 23:56.51 | Gethe | new files in this build: SplashFrame and GarrisonMonumentUI |
| 23:57.32 | kd3 | I'm still chugging along on the download... |
