| 00:14.45 | *** join/#wowuidev cogwheel (~Cogwheel@WoWUIDev/WoWProgramming/morlando/cogwheel) |
| 00:21.22 | kullervo | oh but this is ridiculous |
| 00:21.49 | kullervo | I can't macro a mouseover disenchant |
| 00:37.54 | Amarande | eh, just use Molinari |
| 00:39.52 | *** join/#wowuidev End (~end@2601:1:9300:d20:21d:7dff:fe06:a45) |
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| 01:00.00 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: did you see somebody on reddit accidentally sent a drone in the mail |
| 01:00.22 | kd3 | http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/24sdzp/i_think_i_just_got_a_drone_in_the_mail/ |
| 01:04.23 | airtonix | "weather drone" |
| 01:04.35 | airtonix | who would have thought? |
| 01:10.03 | Shirik | Arrowmaster: that's pretty awesome |
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| 01:10.32 | Arrowmaster | he said in one comment that it does appear to be missing the engine and camera array |
| 01:11.35 | Shirik | haha "My guess is that they deliver a drone with the package in case you want to return what you got. Talk about customer service." |
| 01:14.33 | Mr_Rabies | http://i.imgur.com/1E9gKMQ.gif |
| 01:16.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Motig (~Motig@unaffiliated/motig) |
| 01:31.00 | Neffi | Mr_Rabies: An animated self portrait? |
| 01:43.28 | Mr_Rabies | new human sprint animation, clearly |
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| 02:05.38 | Primer | So this problem I'm having with my UI is _really_ bothering me now. Ever since I went to a PVE server, all the red texts are now that PVE color. |
| 02:13.06 | Primer | and I can't find the proper search terms to find anything about that on google |
| 02:15.25 | Shirik | http://www.iflscience.com/brain/young-blood-recharges-brains-old-mice |
| 02:15.37 | Shirik | because we didn't have enough of a blood shortage |
| 02:15.56 | Shirik | this reminds me of that episode on voyager where medicines are rationed out based on the worth of an individual |
| 02:18.18 | TC-Work | Primer: Have you tested with no addons/new wtf folder? |
| 02:21.03 | Primer | uhhh why would I do that? |
| 02:21.07 | Primer | I like my addon settings |
| 02:23.17 | Torhal | Primer: Move the folder, don't delete it. |
| 02:24.07 | TC-Work | rename in windows world |
| 02:24.09 | Amarande | Primer: did you use some special shade of red that's recognised as "the pvp red"? |
| 02:24.34 | Iriel | Shirik: there was a story in the previous issue of Asimov or Analog (dont remember which one) with that basic premise - young people with shunts in their arm to help their elders stave off aging diseases. |
| 02:26.00 | Iriel | Primer: Is there some code that’s using the realm name’s font/color as a basis and assumed it’d always be red? I /THINK/ that varies by realm type (but I dont 100% remember) |
| 02:26.24 | Iriel | Or zone name, or whatever would be context sensitive to realm type |
| 02:31.42 | Primer | Yes, I'm talking about how if you go to a PVE realm, shit like raid warnings are this copperish color |
| 02:31.55 | Primer | whereas on PVP realms it's red |
| 02:32.24 | Primer | Amarande: I don't know what you're talking about |
| 02:33.50 | Primer | Torhal: yes, I understand the concept...but I'm just not sure what it'd get me other that determining it's one of my 90 some addons |
| 02:34.02 | Torhal | Ah |
| 02:34.18 | Primer | I was mostly hoping someone else here had already experienced such a thing and would have an answer handy |
| 02:34.28 | Primer | I don't want to disable half the addons, repeat |
| 02:34.46 | Primer | it only happens on this one character that I took to the PVE realm too |
| 02:35.31 | Primer | but perhaps I should |
| 02:37.32 | Primer | because I'm still experiencing a problem where PB doesn't load all raid frames when I join an in-progress bg |
| 02:39.56 | Primer | breser says it's another addon interfering |
| 02:40.26 | Primer | but testing such a thing would be incredibly tedious, since joining an in-progress bgs isn't something I can just trigger at will |
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| 03:06.28 | Primer | ok, wtf, it's showing realm time as 3 hours later than it's supposed to be |
| 03:06.42 | Primer | everything thinks I'm on another realm |
| 03:07.38 | Amarande | CRZ? |
| 03:07.51 | Primer | no, supposedly from merging |
| 03:08.15 | Amarande | merging on top of CRZ |
| 03:08.23 | Amarande | I get the feeling WoW is going to be a very different place when I subscribe next |
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| 03:09.28 | Amarande | Primer, have you noticed any noticeable differences in the social fabric of the game since mergers? |
| 03:09.34 | Amarande | or is it just the same, but bigger? |
| 03:09.43 | Primer | Amarande: I only recently started playing on this realm again |
| 03:09.54 | Primer | so far the place seems as dead as before |
| 03:10.20 | Amarande | though it sounds like the merging idea is to let people actually be social across the realms |
| 03:10.31 | Amarande | hm. can you guild across merged realms or does everyone have to have the same "native" one? |
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| 03:11.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Razernok (~Iiris@71-91-125-249.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com) |
| 03:18.37 | Primer | you can |
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| 03:22.27 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Esamynn|work] by ChanServ |
| 03:22.54 | Primer | this realm, Gorgonnash US, has been merged with Warsong, Balthazar (sp?), and The Forgotten Coast, and I think one more, and it's still as dead as ever |
| 03:24.31 | Esamynn|work | that's unfortunate |
| 03:24.49 | Esamynn|work | it only took merging with one other server to make mine quite lively at all hours |
| 03:25.53 | Primer | I don't think any guild is more than 12/14 on this realm |
| 03:26.28 | Esamynn|work | mine is only 13/14 |
| 03:28.33 | Esamynn|work | is it perhaps just your faction on your combined realm? |
| 03:29.12 | Razernok | :( |
| 03:45.39 | airtonix | oh ok |
| 03:54.03 | jleclanche | anyone here good with graphics? |
| 03:54.34 | jleclanche | I'm wondering how the process of making a "3d feel" image (like a logo) look "flat" and monochrome is called |
| 03:57.47 | Thunder_Child | Not sure there is a term for 'flattening' an image |
| 03:58.06 | Thunder_Child | which has its own term in PS. |
| 03:58.14 | Thunder_Child | s/term/meaning/ |
| 03:59.46 | Amarande | I'm still surprised at some of the mergers |
| 03:59.55 | Amarande | like Quel'dorei was actually pretty happening when I used to play on it during late BC |
| 04:00.08 | Amarande | I guess some servers die, though :S |
| 04:00.31 | Amarande | Then there are the rare ones that resurrect ... Ysera got a huge renaissance last year, apparently |
| 04:02.41 | Amarande | it was made the "new players" server for a while and then actually became high pop at least for a time |
| 04:03.09 | Amarande | which is actually unusual ... in the past I usually notice the new players servers being unusually *dead* ones, not ones that are even reasonably happening |
| 04:03.46 | Razernok | :( |
| 04:04.41 | Amarande | some people even had a conspiracy theory about it, apparently LOL |
| 04:13.47 | Amarande | (yes, the obvious one, that Blizzard wanted to get people to roll on crap servers so they'll want to transfer when they hit cap and find there's no scene) |
| 04:27.42 | airtonix | jleclanche: rotoscoping? |
| 04:27.50 | airtonix | jleclanche: cellshading? |
| 04:32.17 | Semlar | rotoscopes neffi |
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| 04:35.40 | jleclanche | airtonix: nope |
| 04:36.31 | jleclanche | airtonix: basically going from the first to second one here: http://www.designboom.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/new-google-logo-designboom05.jpg |
| 04:36.43 | jleclanche | or in my case, with all the letters in one color on the right |
| 04:36.54 | airtonix | oh that |
| 04:36.56 | airtonix | posterize |
| 04:37.54 | airtonix | in gimp : colours > posterise |
| 04:38.51 | airtonix | you can also acheive this effect in inkscape with trace |
| 04:41.03 | Razernok | :( |
| 04:41.19 | Amarande | yay steam died again :( |
| 04:41.43 | Amarande | they should make being caught DDoSing be exempt from the Eighth Amendment. seriously. :P |
| 04:41.51 | airtonix | interesting hypothesis Razernok, but what does that say about corruption in the outer rim ? |
| 04:42.08 | Amarande | there are some crimes where cruel and unusual punishment ought to be prohibited ... and then there are crimes that just make you a total douche who ought to be punished in the most painful way possible |
| 04:42.12 | Amarande | DDoS falls in the latter category :| |
| 04:42.31 | airtonix | Amarande: if you beat me in a game, you are a terrorist |
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| 04:50.21 | jleclanche | airtonix: i actually just achieved the effect with colorize |
| 04:50.22 | jleclanche | but thanks |
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| 05:07.35 | Razernok | is sad |
| 05:09.20 | Torhal | Razernok: Considering you typed ":(" three times in the past two hours without typing anything else, I'd say so. |
| 05:16.32 | Semlar | :( |
| 05:23.44 | Razernok | wishes he could get his addon completed |
| 05:24.17 | Neffi | rewrites Semlar in MoonScript |
| 05:24.29 | Semlar | no neffi |
| 05:24.48 | Semlar | if wishes were addons.. |
| 05:25.15 | Neffi | I'm porting code I'm probably never gonna use again, because it seems like a nice language |
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| 05:31.13 | Semlar | ports neffi to starboard |
| 05:31.57 | Neffi | heh |
| 05:36.14 | Primer | There's no way to detect a buff in a macro without using /script right? |
| 05:36.54 | Primer | I want to make an all-in-one buffing macro that I can just spam every time I rez in a bg |
| 05:37.33 | Primer | I have the pet/nopet/felhunter thing working for putting grimoire of sacrifice up, but I'd like to chain that to Dark Intent too |
| 05:37.58 | Razernok | I wish I could complete my addon. :( |
| 05:38.14 | Primer | work harder |
| 05:38.25 | Razernok | I'm stuck on code |
| 05:38.39 | Primer | It took me a long time before my addon was complete |
| 05:38.52 | Primer | and after all that work, no one uses it |
| 05:39.45 | Razernok | I can't figure out the frame names I need to perform Show() on |
| 05:41.35 | airtonix | brotip: 1. find unsolved problems, 2. write code to solve problems 3. ??? 4. profit |
| 05:42.11 | airtonix | i suspect the wow community doesn't need yet another mod pack/actionbar/lulziwinbutton |
| 05:42.57 | Razernok | I'm mainly wanting the addon for myself not for others |
| 05:43.37 | airtonix | i once took three years to make my bed. |
| 05:44.15 | airtonix | but then dressing anti-matter into the shaepe of a pillow is an artform best not rushed |
| 05:46.27 | Semlar | seriously though the frames you're trying to show don't exist |
| 05:47.41 | airtonix | don't listen to that rubbish. |
| 05:47.48 | airtonix | everything exists for the right price |
| 05:47.55 | Semlar | i'm not sure that's true |
| 05:48.12 | airtonix | care to find out? |
| 05:48.19 | Neffi | Primer: You can't conditionally apply a buff in combat. You can either find an addon that will do that for you (out of combat only), or just prefix all spell names with ! so they dont cancel |
| 05:48.26 | Neffi | eg /cast !Arcane Brilliance |
| 05:49.45 | Semlar | couldn't you just make a castsequence for your buffs |
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| 05:50.25 | Primer | there's a bunch of logic though |
| 05:50.51 | Primer | dismiss pet if I have any pet other than a fel hunter, then summon fel hunter, then sac it |
| 05:51.09 | Primer | Like I said, I have that part worked out, but it's a 4 line macro |
| 05:51.20 | Semlar | so just add more lines |
| 05:51.44 | Semlar | the more the merrier |
| 05:52.23 | Primer | we'll see if what I added works next time I die |
| 05:53.06 | Semlar | an addon can do the logic as long as you're out of combat but that seems unnecessary |
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| 05:57.58 | Primer | yeah, too much logic |
| 05:58.29 | Primer | none to account for the lack of buff |
| 05:59.20 | Primer | Here's the macro, one one line: #showtooltip /cast [nopet] Summon Felhunter /cast [pet:Felhunter] Grimoire of Sacrifice /stopmacro [nopet] [pet:Felhunter] /script PetDismiss() |
| 06:00.07 | Primer | I suppose turn one into a /castsequence |
| 06:00.30 | Semlar | what else do you need it to cast |
| 06:00.38 | Primer | /castsequence [pet:Felhunter] Dark Intent, Grimoire of Sacrifice |
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| 06:01.50 | Semlar | what if you just did /cast !Dark Intent as the first line |
| 06:02.06 | Primer | it has a gcd |
| 06:02.17 | Semlar | doesn't matter |
| 06:02.29 | Primer | anyhow, that worked |
| 06:02.30 | Semlar | it would only cast it if you didn't have the buff |
| 06:02.52 | Primer | negative |
| 06:03.04 | Primer | I just ran it manually, and it recast despite the buff already being up |
| 06:03.36 | Semlar | well that's how the druid shift macros work without canceling your form |
| 06:03.36 | Primer | oh wtf |
| 06:03.42 | Primer | now it's doing taint |
| 06:04.41 | Semlar | actually i guess it might cast it anyway just not cancel it |
| 06:04.42 | Primer | I just typed /cast !Dark Intent |
| 06:04.48 | Primer | yeah, it does cast it |
| 06:21.31 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: are you watching the hearthstone ogn tournament? |
| 06:21.36 | jleclanche | the commentary is ... painful |
| 06:22.01 | jleclanche | the girl sounds like she played hearthstone for a total of 3 hours |
| 06:26.54 | jleclanche | oh thank god they swapped them out |
| 06:27.51 | zenzio | seeing spurious "SQLSTATE[HY000]: General error: 2006 MySQL server has gone away" in the error log isn't exactly how I had hoped to start the day :-| |
| 06:31.02 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: its worse now. fuck, this is the cringiest tournament I've ever seen, of anything :/ |
| 06:31.16 | zenzio | is it an official tournament? |
| 06:31.18 | jleclanche | ya |
| 06:33.00 | jleclanche | and apparently the stream shut off |
| 06:38.54 | Razernok | wishing he could complete his addon. |
| 06:40.50 | jleclanche | zenzio: this is so pathetic :/ purely playing the crapass meta decks and of course winning with them |
| 06:41.46 | zenzio | I don't actually know much about the game, but I can imagine that sucks |
| 06:46.06 | jleclanche | sigh |
| 06:46.26 | jleclanche | handlock wins because double molten giant taunt is a thing and isnt broken at all |
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| 07:06.09 | Razernok | :( |
| 07:06.54 | Semlar | :( |
| 07:08.15 | jleclanche | handlock vs handlock |
| 07:08.20 | jleclanche | wasnt that entertaining |
| 07:08.20 | jleclanche | .. |
| 07:08.55 | Razernok | I want to finish my addon....... :( |
| 07:12.56 | zenzio | Razernok: that's all understandable, but if it's still just the actionbar thing then you've already exhausted all the answers in here |
| 07:14.09 | jleclanche | Razernok: you need to stop bugging people here like this - no one will finish it for you. if you have actual API questions, go ahead, but this is ridiculous |
| 07:17.01 | Razernok | I'm stuck on code atm. |
| 07:19.10 | jleclanche | Razernok: I don't think you understand how to actually ask for help. you don't build a house by saying "I wish I could build a house". |
| 07:19.31 | jleclanche | Razernok: and you don't progress by saying "I'm stuck on the foundations" |
| 07:20.41 | Semlar | :( |
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| 07:25.40 | Semlar | build me a house neffi |
| 07:26.17 | Razernok | Too many assholes in this world, No one will tell me what I need to know. |
| 07:26.30 | zenzio | everyone has told you what you need to know |
| 07:26.34 | zenzio | you just refuse to accept it |
| 07:26.49 | Neffi | Semlar: ok. gimme like upper 6 figures for supplies |
| 07:26.59 | Neffi | I'm coming to rather like Moonscript https://gist.github.com/2656727f6e679f6503d6 |
| 07:27.08 | Neffi | So concise |
| 07:27.10 | Razernok | Wrong, no one has told me what I need to know. |
| 07:27.26 | Torhal | Cairenn: ^ |
| 07:27.41 | Semlar | we haven't told you want you want to know maybe, but we have told you what you need to know |
| 07:27.45 | Torhal | Razernok: You've been repeatedly told that what you want is not possible. |
| 07:27.59 | Torhal | That's not being assholes, it's Telling The Truth (TM) |
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| 07:29.01 | Cairenn | Oy, again? |
| 07:29.05 | Torhal | :/ |
| 07:29.06 | zenzio | again... |
| 07:29.33 | zenzio | though admittedly this time he's fishing by repeating ":(" and "I wish I could finish my addon" from time to time |
| 07:29.55 | *** join/#wowuidev ajmitch (ajmitch@ubuntu/member/ajmitch) |
| 07:29.56 | Semlar | neffi what is moonscript |
| 07:30.03 | Cairenn | Razernok: You didn't get the message the first time? |
| 07:30.15 | Neffi | Semlar: language that compiles into pure Lua |
| 07:30.49 | Semlar | hmm kind of like LESS for CSS? |
| 07:31.06 | Neffi | I don't know |
| 07:31.15 | Neffi | http://moonscript.org/ <- maybe? |
| 07:31.16 | Semlar | it's like a scripting language that generates CSS |
| 07:31.50 | Neffi | Well it's semantically Lua, but not syntactically, and provides a lot more features in both than Lua does |
| 07:33.03 | Semlar | but then you has to learn a new thing |
| 07:33.20 | Neffi | Like I said, it's semantically Lua |
| 07:33.54 | zenzio | so now you can metatable your CSS? =D |
| 07:34.03 | Neffi | Most idioms transfer easily. I literally read through the official docs for a half hour, then started porting some code I had lying around. An hour later I was comfortable with it, like I've been using it a while |
| 07:34.31 | Neffi | Havent touched the advanced features like built-in OOP though |
| 07:35.19 | Semlar | i'm scared neffi, it's different |
| 07:35.41 | Neffi | lol |
| 07:36.07 | Neffi | I wanted to learn it because it seems to go well with Lapis by the same author, and Lapis looks amazing |
| 07:36.27 | Torhal | Anyone who uses SocialState and is tired of it being broken, I'm in the process of writing a replacement - has decent functionality already, just no config as of yet: Frenemy (yes, I know, horrible word) |
| 07:37.06 | jleclanche | Semlar: i think you mean "kind of like coffeescript for js" |
| 07:37.13 | Semlar | why not call it SociaList |
| 07:37.14 | jleclanche | more appropriate comparison. and that looks like it yes |
| 07:37.35 | Neffi | clever name, Semlar |
| 07:37.53 | Semlar | i can never tell because it's like 3 in the morning |
| 07:38.13 | Semlar | i don't think my brain is functioning |
| 07:41.25 | Semlar | i'm supposed to have a project finished by the end of the week and there aren't enough hours in the day |
| 07:42.31 | Torhal | Semlar: Whip some up using ScrollFrames. |
| 07:42.41 | Neffi | gives Semlar liquid caffeine concentrate |
| 07:42.58 | Semlar | that could work.. |
| 07:43.16 | Neffi | Contract project Semlar? |
| 07:43.27 | Semlar | did i ever tell you about the time i put a scrollframe inside of another scrollframe |
| 07:44.47 | Neffi | yeah. something about 3 attractive actors and a spinning top |
| 07:44.55 | Semlar | oh aye |
| 07:45.56 | Semlar | they had a hell of a time cleaning up afterward, i don't mind telling you |
| 07:47.34 | Neffi | well it's time to zombiemode. dont work too hard semlar! nite |
| 07:47.54 | Semlar | i'll try |
| 07:54.24 | Shirik | Amazon why you lying to me |
| 07:54.33 | Shirik | 46 minutes ago they sent me an email saying "hey you left this item in your cart" |
| 07:54.36 | Shirik | log in, no item in cart... |
| 07:56.32 | Semlar | sounds like a new marketing campaign |
| 08:38.58 | karl_w_w | never heard of it jleclanche |
| 08:39.27 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: https://pay.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/24uc11/how_come_no_one_is_talking_about_ogn_hearthstone/chasa4z?context=3 |
| 08:42.40 | karl_w_w | who is that commentating with hafu? |
| 08:43.41 | jleclanche | No idea |
| 08:44.02 | karl_w_w | it's annoying because it sounds familiar |
| 08:44.35 | karl_w_w | I don't recognise his face though |
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| 09:01.26 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: http://ihearthu.com/tag/doa/ ? |
| 09:11.36 | karl_w_w | oh yeah |
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| 10:23.03 | airtonix | karl_w_w: i like displaying actionbars 6-10 with apiShowActionBar(i). umad? |
| 10:25.09 | airtonix | Semlar: moonscript is what coffeescript is to javascript. |
| 10:25.23 | airtonix | *to Lua |
| 10:25.44 | Semlar | i think you were right the first time |
| 10:26.49 | airtonix | i was merely using advanced editorial battlefield tactics to illustrate the shortcommings of my initial statement |
| 10:27.06 | Semlar | how silly of me |
| 10:27.10 | airtonix | indeed |
| 10:27.20 | airtonix | now, kneel before me |
| 10:27.40 | airtonix | and clean up your mess |
| 10:27.48 | karl_w_w | sure airtonix, why not |
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| 10:29.20 | airtonix | ok |
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| 11:58.57 | jleclanche | So as it turns out, balancing data between two external hard drives only goes so far |
| 11:59.02 | jleclanche | you eventually run out of space. http://dpaste.com/3GSMRXH/ |
| 11:59.41 | jleclanche | time to get a new external hard drive. Recommendations? I'd like to get away from the MyBook line |
| 11:59.52 | airtonix | zfs |
| 11:59.56 | jleclanche | ? |
| 12:00.47 | karl_w_w | what's wrong with mybook? |
| 12:01.06 | airtonix | i just like saying that everytime i see people manually splitting data amongst drivers |
| 12:01.07 | jleclanche | I've had a host of issues with them, each and every one of them slightly different |
| 12:01.08 | airtonix | drives* |
| 12:01.35 | karl_w_w | i've had a couple of wd elements external drives and they've been great |
| 12:01.47 | jleclanche | I've never had issues with hitachis, but i dont know if HGST is actually hitachi or just some lousy outsourced company |
| 12:01.59 | zenzio | I also use WD Elements, served me well |
| 12:02.14 | jleclanche | I'd like to try something different, I'm on my 4th MyBook now. |
| 12:02.41 | jleclanche | in order the issues I've had with them btw: |
| 12:02.44 | zenzio | far as I know Elements isn't MyBook, but I may be mistaken. Either way, there's plenty of drives to choose from |
| 12:03.07 | jleclanche | - broken USB firmware leading to the external hard drive crashing the entire USB subsystem of the motherboard |
| 12:03.33 | jleclanche | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:03.39 | Semlar | HGST was acquired by western digital |
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| 12:03.54 | jleclanche | and more problems I dont actually remember |
| 12:03.59 | jleclanche | Semlar: Im aware but that may not matter |
| 12:04.10 | jleclanche | I dont care about where the money goes, just the product quality |
| 12:04.20 | Semlar | anyway, hitachis have substantially lower failure rates than some of their competitors |
| 12:04.28 | Semlar | namely seagate |
| 12:05.08 | jleclanche | hahahaha. |
| 12:05.09 | jleclanche | yes |
| 12:05.27 | jleclanche | no, I've not had critical failures so far with the MyBooks which I'm happy with |
| 12:05.44 | jleclanche | but I've not had a SINGLE failure in a hitachi drive with a 5 year uptime |
| 12:06.12 | jleclanche | http://www.amazon.co.uk/HGST-Touro-Desk-External-Drive/dp/B006L0XE7O |
| 12:06.13 | jleclanche | http://www.amazon.co.uk/HGST-Touro-Desk-External-Drive/dp/B006T93P94 |
| 12:06.28 | jleclanche | These are the same price for me, anyone know the difference? one is rrp'd at twice the other.. |
| 12:08.29 | zenzio | according to the stats, one is at least significantly larger (physically) |
| 12:08.42 | Semlar | those could just be bogus though |
| 12:08.45 | zenzio | which seems odd given the pictures |
| 12:09.01 | Semlar | those stats are manually filled in |
| 12:09.28 | jleclanche | the dx3 is 1.5kg, the other is 900g |
| 12:09.36 | Semlar | the model numbers are different but that doesn't even mean they're not the same drive |
| 12:09.39 | jleclanche | the fuck do they put in there |
| 12:10.32 | jleclanche | if i had to guess, the Pro may be an older line which had a 4tb high end model, and the dx3 is a newer line |
| 12:12.26 | Semlar | alright i found the product manuals for both of them |
| 12:12.36 | Semlar | http://www.touropro.com/uk/images/site/pdf/TouroDesk_3%200_datasheet_1111_web.pdf and http://www.touropro.com/en/images/site/pdf/TouroDeskPro_datasheet_0812_LR.pdf |
| 12:13.00 | Semlar | they list the model numbers at the bottom |
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| 12:16.13 | Semlar | the only difference i can see is pro is 7200 rpm and the other one is 5400 |
| 12:16.28 | airtonix | weeeeee vs burdrrrrrrr |
| 12:16.48 | airtonix | fight to the death... whooooo will win? |
| 12:16.52 | jleclanche | The difference between the Touro Pro and the Touro DX3 4TB drives is the speed of the drives, the pro is 7200rpm and the the DX3 should be 5400rpm. |
| 12:16.56 | airtonix | tune in next week for a result! |
| 12:16.56 | jleclanche | Semlar: foiled |
| 12:17.27 | Semlar | i only know the rpm of the one drive because someone mentioned it in a comment |
| 12:17.38 | Semlar | and the other one has it listed |
| 12:18.37 | Semlar | the slower drive might be more reliable |
| 12:19.51 | airtonix | hey. so what's up with star wars? |
| 12:20.29 | Semlar | oh the pro also apparently comes with 3gb of cloud storage or something |
| 12:24.07 | jleclanche | i ordered the Pro |
| 12:25.11 | karl_w_w | airtonix, it's predictable and boring |
| 12:25.21 | airtonix | like your mum? |
| 12:25.29 | karl_w_w | indeed! |
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| 12:30.01 | airtonix | indubitably |
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| 13:25.56 | Workfoz | hard drive failure rates? http://blog.backblaze.com/2014/01/21/what-hard-drive-should-i-buy/ :D |
| 13:26.36 | airtonix | answer: none, let backblaze buy them instead. |
| 13:27.09 | Workfoz | that's not the worst summary ever |
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| 13:34.43 | nevcairiel | Workfoz: their results should be taken with a shovle of salt though |
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| 14:11.47 | karl_w_w | yeah seriously, why does everyone link that backblaze post |
| 14:12.52 | karl_w_w | they don't even compare like for like they just run dekstop HDDs in servers |
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| 14:27.39 | airtonix | everyone still of the mind that best primaryKey is an auto incrementing integer? |
| 14:29.00 | Maldivia | if all you need is for is to ensure that the table has a primary key, then sure |
| 14:29.09 | Maldivia | otherwise, go for something that makes sense to the data |
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| 14:53.18 | nevcairiel | natural primary keys are often problematic |
| 14:53.57 | nevcairiel | if you have a single unique value to identify it, great, but if you need to build a compound to achieve that ... go with your integer |
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| 15:03.27 | Unkle | Station! |
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| 15:29.08 | Workfoz | karl_w_w, nevcairiel: how is comparing desktop hdds (running in servers) to desktop hdds (running in servers) not comparing "like for like" (assuming that means "apples to apples") |
| 15:29.43 | Workfoz | or rather, that to karl_w_w, and to nevcairiel: what needs the salt? the fact that they're reporting on their (rather unique) use-case? that should be obvious, tbh ^^ |
| 15:30.06 | nevcairiel | thats what he said, my point is more like that their environment and external factors are rather special, and you can't really take much information from it for your own hdd use |
| 15:30.52 | Workfoz | well, they describe their use case quite thoroughly, I don't see how the information can't be useful ^^ |
| 15:31.32 | nevcairiel | its an interesting article no question, but the take-away for my own hdd decisions was basically zero |
| 15:31.50 | Workfoz | btw jleclanche - it's not just HGST -> WD, Hitachi drives can also be had under Toshiba's name now |
| 15:32.33 | Workfoz | (because WD was forced to divest the HGST stuff they acquired further) |
| 15:32.50 | karl_w_w | because they are also comparing NAS HDDs, and they are not using the drives for the same amount of time |
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| 15:34.11 | nevcairiel | my main point is that their setup is *extremely* sensitive to vibrations, while in a home setup you'll be much more resistant to that, and vibrations is what can really cause issues for hdds |
| 15:34.21 | Workfoz | they do cover a wide spread of different models, but I got the feeling they quite clearly separated what information relates to what drives |
| 15:34.39 | karl_w_w | but they dont buy the drives at the same time |
| 15:34.41 | nevcairiel | they even revised their enclosure design once to fix a vibration problem, who is to say some of the older hdds arent still running in the non-revised enclosures |
| 15:35.07 | Workfoz | they probably have a post somewhere saying if they do :D |
| 15:35.15 | Workfoz | but that's guesswork right there |
| 15:35.31 | karl_w_w | "I don't see how the information can't be useful" useful for what? home users? it's practically useless unless we are planning to run large public file servers at home |
| 15:35.52 | karl_w_w | and as I said, that link keeps cropping up when people ask about home use |
| 15:35.56 | Workfoz | why do they have to be public |
| 15:36.15 | Workfoz | it certainly applies to people homebrewing a big NAS? |
| 15:36.28 | nevcairiel | not really all that much |
| 15:36.34 | karl_w_w | because a home user wont be able to generate much disk activity |
| 15:36.48 | Workfoz | nevcairiel: ok, so in a high-density storage environment with possibly extreme amouts of vibration, X happens. That's still valuable information? reading a bit further up, adys was actually looking for a single (!) external drive... resistance to external influence should be interesting there? |
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| 15:37.26 | nevcairiel | high frequency vibrations is rarely something that an external drive is exposed to :p |
| 15:37.29 | Workfoz | karl_w_w: raid -> all disks in use when accessing anything, also they're probably all spinning all the time? I'm running out of ideas |
| 15:38.30 | Workfoz | so, basically, all it boils down to is "it's not a post that was created with the desire to make a drive comparison that's as neutral as possible, but data gathered from a live environment of a specific company's product"? |
| 15:38.31 | nevcairiel | in any case, its well known that the older seagate drives had a few issues, and those are the ones mainly causing the statistics to look bad |
| 15:38.50 | karl_w_w | pretty much Workfoz |
| 15:39.30 | karl_w_w | those aren't "what it should be and what it shouldn't be" that you said, they were "reason A it's not very useful and reason B" |
| 15:40.08 | Workfoz | well, it's certainly not the be all end all of "what disk should I buy", but it's one of the few large-scale data points... if it doesn't really apply to what you're interested in finding out, there's not much I can do about that :D |
| 15:40.12 | nevcairiel | all i'm saying is that while its an interesting article, its not as useful information as people make it out to be |
| 15:40.34 | nevcairiel | basically the core info is, old seagate drives failed a lot |
| 15:41.14 | nevcairiel | everything else is pretty much balanced |
| 15:41.27 | Workfoz | I'm not sure anyone made it out to be as anything it's not... I just linked it (accompanied by what I thought was the topic at hand that made me link it) :D |
| 15:41.44 | Workfoz | (and then I asked what your objections are, because: the more you know(tm)) |
| 15:42.49 | Workfoz | I buy my desktop drives (which I use for large file storage, in my computer, not a separate NAS) by €/GiB, if I don't have a compelling reason not to *shrug* ^^ |
| 15:42.55 | Unkle | Since I dropped in late, I'm assuming we're talking about the cloud storage company that open-sourced their designs? |
| 15:44.10 | Workfoz | specifically, about why linking their "what hard disk should I buy" blog post (which could use a better title) in response to just that question is... not very helpful |
| 15:44.36 | Workfoz | (The blog post in question: http://blog.backblaze.com/2014/01/21/what-hard-drive-should-i-buy/ - make of it what you will ^^) |
| 15:45.03 | Unkle | Yeah, I read it last year when they published it and while it was interesting, it didn't really have much impact on my current buying decisions. |
| 15:45.07 | nevcairiel | yeah their title really caused a lot of the complaints on the web, since they make it out to be a bit more than it is |
| 15:45.20 | Workfoz | by last year, you mean this year? :D |
| 15:45.30 | Workfoz | or are you alluding to the fact that time passes faster in IT ^^ |
| 15:45.45 | Unkle | Wow. It was January? I thought it was longer ago than that. |
| 15:45.59 | Workfoz | apparently |
| 15:46.43 | Workfoz | jleclanche: to be more precise, taken from a little "update" notice on backblaze's post: HGST 2.5" stuff went to WD, 3.5" to Toshiba (not sure if there's offical info on that, Wikipedia is not that specific) |
| 15:47.40 | Workfoz | nevcairiel: also, interestingly enough, the "bad rap" you said Seagate gets in their post should be considered countered by their closing statement, in which they say their current favourite for new storage is a Seagate 4TB desktop drive |
| 15:48.13 | nevcairiel | well the bad reputation is mostly from the graphs showing seagate failures |
| 15:48.23 | Workfoz | which just goes to show that people don't read |
| 15:48.23 | Workfoz | :D |
| 15:48.38 | nevcairiel | if you look at the data table near the bottom, its one special drive that failed a lot, the old 1.5tb seagate, which already had a rather bad reputation |
| 15:48.40 | Workfoz | but... graphs! |
| 15:49.06 | nevcairiel | although the new performance drive from seagate still has a 10% failure rate |
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| 15:50.47 | nevcairiel | but the desktop/NAS drives spin slower, so they are in theory also less prone to mechanical failures |
| 15:51.17 | Fisker | asdfgsfds nevcairiel |
| 15:56.29 | nevcairiel | also, i finally solved this damn issue thats been plagueing me for half a week now |
| 15:56.35 | nevcairiel | calls it a day |
| 15:57.13 | Workfoz | calls nevcairiel a day |
| 15:57.24 | nevcairiel | go home |
| 15:57.42 | Workfoz | in 5 minutes |
| 15:58.01 | nevcairiel | no gleitzeit? |
| 15:58.09 | Workfoz | if you have some time, I'd like to know a bit more about your flexraid setup, over in #wowace |
| 15:58.39 | Workfoz | "someone" has to stay until 6 pm (at least one person per team), and since I come in quite late most days, that's usually me |
| 15:58.47 | nevcairiel | hehe |
| 15:58.50 | Workfoz | (although there's 2 other people left, too, but... well) |
| 15:59.21 | nevcairiel | we usually only had admins until 5, unless you scheduled some work to be done |
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| 16:47.07 | TC-Work | http://varianto25.com/ |
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| 16:51.20 | Unkle | http://grahamcluley.com/2014/05/dropbox-box-leak/ |
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| 16:57.17 | Arrow|phone | Kaelten: finally supporting KSP I see. Go crack the whip and get a new Mac and Linux clients out now! |
| 17:00.53 | Arrow|phone | Also you should give me back mod rights on curseforge |
| 17:01.26 | pompy | Don't do it!! |
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| 17:05.28 | A-KO | hm |
| 17:16.26 | Fisker | slaps Lopeppeppy around a bit with a large trout |
| 17:20.31 | Lopeppeppy | Bonjour. |
| 17:20.56 | Fisker | How very Apple of you |
| 17:21.32 | Fisker | LOPEPPEPPYDISCOVER |
| 17:21.42 | Fisker | please ack |
| 17:21.49 | Lopeppeppy | HACK. |
| 17:23.13 | Fisker | At least it wasn't a nack |
| 17:35.33 | Lopeppeppy | Or a neck. |
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| 17:44.19 | Fisker | :o Lopeppeppy |
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| 18:24.14 | mikma | http://youtu.be/vwjED7EsfVI |
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| 18:28.11 | mikma | http://imgur.com/gallery/vi6XS5Y |
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| 18:50.51 | Kodiack | New Wowhead layout makes me sad. :( |
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| 18:51.30 | Stanzilla | it's broken, that's why maybe? |
| 18:51.44 | zenzelezz | neat, they auto-focus the search box so you can't keyboard navigate right away |
| 18:53.55 | Kodiack | It also looks like junk on my rotated 1024x1280 display. It has an obnoxious horizontal scrollbar now. That sidebar is the main culprit, and it looks like they didn't even have the foresight to add an option to hide it. |
| 18:54.02 | Kodiack | I thought sidebars were finally starting to die. D: |
| 18:54.47 | Amarande | wait, people use the front page on wowhead? heh |
| 18:55.13 | Amarande | usually if I see the front page at all it's for a tiny short period of time before I'm off to an item or NPC page |
| 18:55.29 | Amarande | and then I might as well just do a new search in the same window, or spawn off a new tab from that one :S |
| 18:55.58 | Kodiack | I use it for a quick search. It's painful to look at now. Before they had a Google-style layout with a simple, centered search box right in the middle of the page with few distractions. |
| 18:56.21 | Amarande | come to think of it, I'd hate to be a front-page web designer |
| 18:56.37 | Kodiack | Also, even on item/NPC/spell/etc. pages, it still stretches at 1024x1280. Looks like the main reason for that in those pages is because of all the garbage in their footer. |
| 18:56.41 | Amarande | it's like designing book covers ... you *know* that your bit is what people actually care about the least in the end |
| 18:56.49 | Kodiack | The huge-ass "ZAM" logo makes me want to hurt kittens |
| 18:56.53 | Amarande | yet, you're pushed to design it as if the front page/cover what people care about the most, heh |
| 18:57.17 | Kodiack | Haha, yeah, I'd hate to be a web designer because I know I'd be at ends with people like myself :P |
| 18:57.23 | Amarande | it seems odd |
| 18:57.37 | Amarande | I mean, it's like designing a room as an architect and deciding the design of the DOOR is the most important thing heh |
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| 19:20.01 | Amarande | hmmmm |
| 19:20.17 | Amarande | if you finish most battles while soloing in an MMO with near full health, is that a sign that you're being too cautious about picking battles? :) |
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| 21:18.37 | Neffi | all of these look really good https://imgur.com/gallery/O5B4c |
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| 21:52.37 | TC-Work | PLAY THEM ALL |
| 21:59.07 | Neffi | you dont have to tell me twice ;) |
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| 22:04.37 | Jamash | Amarande: yes |
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| 22:13.15 | Amarande | well that was sweet. wish fights in WoW had tactical moments this fun sometimes :) |
| 22:15.56 | Amarande | though I'm not sure of anyone besides shaman who has that major league of a knockback off the top of my head heh |
| 22:16.19 | Amarande | (plus mob density and assist aggro probably would prevent it in WoW even then) |
| 22:23.26 | Amarande | three mobs on a balcony that you really can't take straight up. but hey! you can CC one, and then knock one of the other two off the balcony |
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| 22:24.01 | Amarande | and then you get to take them all one at a time because the one who went off the edge can't get back in time to help and you can take out both him and the third mob before the first comes out of CC |
| 22:25.44 | Razernok | :( |
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| 22:50.14 | Unkle | "We've revamped Wowhead's homepage to better highlight our database and other content." - Stress on the "other content." |
| 22:54.15 | Neffi | Who at Microsoft thought it was a good idea that their installer should extract itself to D:\ ? I kinda hope this person doesnt have a job anymore |
| 22:54.28 | Jamash | Neffi: lolwut |
| 22:54.51 | Neffi | I think it's the VS redistributable. Some bundled versions of it do that |
| 23:02.00 | Jamash | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:02.24 | Neffi | Rather than a temp dir? Rather than to RAM? |
| 23:02.31 | Jamash | listen I don't work at Microsoft |
| 23:02.35 | Neffi | That's probably the logic they used. And it's insane logic |
| 23:02.43 | Jamash | if I did you would hear about more Microsoft buildings burning down |
| 23:02.54 | Neffi | "3 megabyte extraction? enumerate all drives, we need the biggest one!" |
| 23:03.00 | Dagmar | Oh don't let anything stop you doing that |
| 23:03.06 | Dagmar | We'll wait for the headlines |
| 23:03.08 | Jamash | can't afford the airfare |
| 23:03.31 | Dagmar | Put up a Kickstarter |
| 23:03.39 | Jamash | and I doubt any of the crowdfunding sites accept "arson" as a project |
| 23:04.23 | Jamash | also Microsoft probably has pretty good fire suppression systems |
| 23:05.07 | Jamash | they have to deal with all the flaming idiots in management, after all |
| 23:05.21 | Neffi | chuckles |
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