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| 00:40.27 | Kaso | On my trip home from uni one of my screens has developed the a ruddy great patch of dead pixels :< |
| 00:43.20 | zenzelezz | SS or it didn't happen |
| 00:43.53 | Kaso | ha ha! |
| 00:44.56 | Kirkburn|afk | Kaso! |
| 00:45.07 | Kirkburn|afk | I was right :D |
| 00:45.09 | Kaso | Hey kirkburn |
| 00:45.25 | Kirkburn|afk | (Guessed you must have been going home) |
| 00:45.26 | kergoth | http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=uZxVcbEbsVuqoxbIz .. that look sane for leveling? |
| 00:45.31 | kergoth | meh, headache |
| 00:46.48 | Kirkburn|afk | Ooh, so the new Xbox 360 packs do appear to be in production - http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/03/26/xbox-360-elite-production-shots/ |
| 01:13.22 | Thunder_Child | Kirkburn|afk: yea, far better than the origionals |
| 01:13.31 | Thunder_Child | 120 HD, black (always better) |
| 01:13.43 | Thunder_Child | updated firmawer (i think) |
| 01:13.48 | Thunder_Child | firmware* |
| 01:15.26 | Kirkburn|afk | I might even have to consider getting one |
| 01:42.17 | Kirkburn|afk | Awesome - Mediaeval tech support - http://www.devilducky.com/media/57946 |
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| 01:48.05 | cladhaire | Fin: What do you mean about the tooltip |
| 01:48.10 | cladhaire | no screenshot makes for a bad error report. |
| 01:50.07 | Nom- | *sigh* |
| 01:50.22 | Nom- | Anyone used an nForce4 board? I've got noise on my PCI Bus :( |
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| 02:17.47 | *** topic/#wowi-lounge is Paste Code Here: http://wowi.pastey.net/ Did you hear about the guy whose whole left side was cut off? He's all right now. |
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| 02:26.05 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Nom-_ (n=nom@standen.id.au) |
| 02:26.39 | Kaso | I'd like to propose the following quote for the title |
| 02:26.43 | Kaso | <Kirkburn|afk> Argh, half my bin is full of tissues now. |
| 02:26.56 | Kirkburn|afk | God I hate you |
| 02:27.01 | Kaso | mwhaha |
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| 02:39.54 | Corrodias | which BG gets you honor fastest? |
| 02:40.33 | Nom- | Whichever one is on BG weekend |
| 02:40.51 | Corrodias | you know, i actually already considered that |
| 02:40.52 | Nom- | and it depends also on the competition |
| 02:40.54 | Corrodias | how about on a wednesday? |
| 02:41.10 | Corrodias | and i'm not so sure WSG gets me jack for honor anyway :/ |
| 02:41.20 | Corrodias | 62 honor for half an hour is pretty pitiful |
| 02:41.25 | Nom- | I've not tried farming Eye of the Storm yet |
| 02:41.37 | Fin | clad|sleep: I know it was a bad error report; but I figured you'd prefer something rather than nothing. I'll send more details later tomorrow. |
| 02:41.38 | Nom- | It's a tossup between AV and WB |
| 02:41.41 | Nom- | AB even |
| 02:41.52 | Corrodias | arr |
| 02:41.57 | Corrodias | at least i can tolerate those two |
| 02:42.09 | Nom- | It depends on which one you can farm |
| 02:42.21 | Corrodias | i don't understand. i'm very new at pvp. |
| 02:42.27 | Nom- | If you can get a good premade group and 4-cap or 5-cap, then AB kicks the crap out of everything |
| 02:42.43 | Nom- | On the other hand, if the AV games are quick, then it's much faster than slow AB games |
| 02:43.15 | Corrodias | i've played an exalted's worth of AV and i still don't know the "right" way to do things :( |
| 02:43.59 | Nom- | Horde or Alliance, Corrodias ? |
| 02:44.04 | Corrodias | horde |
| 02:44.14 | Nom- | Chances are AB is going to be better then |
| 02:44.20 | Nom- | We tend to dominate AB and lose AV |
| 02:44.30 | Nom- | But I haven't tried @ 70 yet...been too busy raiding and farming |
| 02:44.31 | Corrodias | we only win about 1/3 of the AV in our battlegroup |
| 02:45.08 | Corrodias | well, we're not up to raiding yet, so i'm working on honor farming for a few pvp items for my tank set |
| 02:45.34 | Nom- | AV can be a bit random, depending on whether you're in range of the boss kills |
| 02:45.34 | Nom- | AB is pretty consistent...the only variable is the time it takes to win |
| 02:45.59 | FlAWD | alliance sucks at pvp |
| 02:46.03 | FlAWD | everyone knows this :P |
| 02:46.20 | Nom- | Yes, they do...but they have a terrain and base layout in AV which makes it easy to win |
| 02:46.31 | Nom- | 10 defenders at the alliance base can hold off 30 horde |
| 02:46.39 | FlAWD | yep |
| 02:46.43 | Nom- | whereas 20 horde at the horde base would have trouble holding off 15 alliance |
| 02:46.45 | FlAWD | but horde can do the same |
| 02:46.48 | FlAWD | in that little house |
| 02:46.51 | FlAWD | but they don't |
| 02:46.55 | Corrodias | what little house? |
| 02:46.58 | Nom- | nah you can get around it FlAWD |
| 02:47.01 | Nom- | There's back entrances |
| 02:47.02 | FlAWD | oh? |
| 02:47.03 | Corrodias | they can just ride right through that |
| 02:47.13 | Corrodias | unless hunters get frost traps down, which they don't |
| 02:47.20 | FlAWD | there's a back entrance into the alliance place as well |
| 02:47.26 | Corrodias | besides, that's a very small little house. terrible LoS issues. |
| 02:47.29 | Corrodias | not like the fucking bridge |
| 02:47.32 | Nom- | Yeah, but the back entrance isn't as bad as ours |
| 02:47.46 | Nom- | Ours is right next to the resupply point flag |
| 02:47.50 | Nom- | theirs is near the GY flag |
| 02:48.23 | Nom- | Alliance have the bridge choke point |
| 02:48.27 | Nom- | There's no other way into the base |
| 02:48.33 | Corrodias | AV can be fun, but i think i'll get my items with AB sooner. |
| 02:48.39 | FlAWD | if and when i do AV, and when I charge into the horde base area, i very rarely see horde defending in there |
| 02:48.47 | FlAWD | unless they're turning in rep items |
| 02:48.59 | Corrodias | we're too busy getting pwnd at the frostwolf graveyard |
| 02:49.03 | FlAWD | heh |
| 02:49.08 | Corrodias | from all directions |
| 02:50.08 | Corrodias | and until recently, the horde hasn't had any paladins, which are specifically designed for flag-cap games like that |
| 02:50.14 | Corrodias | we still don't have very many |
| 02:50.47 | FlAWD | true |
| 02:50.54 | FlAWD | but horde always wins ab and wsg |
| 02:51.05 | FlAWD | if it's pug vs pug or premade vs premade |
| 02:51.18 | FlAWD | premade alliance vs pug horde usually has alliance winning |
| 02:51.21 | Corrodias | strange, yet apparently true |
| 02:55.33 | Corrodias | does the horde organize in small number better? does the alliance spend too much time tossing its dwarves? |
| 02:55.42 | Nom- | To illustrate |
| 02:56.26 | Nom- | http://standen.id.au/pics/horde-base.jpg |
| 02:56.32 | Nom- | All the red lines are points of entry into the base |
| 02:56.54 | Nom- | the green dot towards the bottom is the resupply point flag |
| 02:56.55 | FlAWD | yes horde organizes much better |
| 02:57.01 | Nom- | as you can see the back door is right next to the flag |
| 02:57.02 | FlAWD | in smaller groups |
| 02:57.11 | FlAWD | i've never went in that way |
| 02:57.21 | Nom- | In contrast with http://standen.id.au/pics/alliance-base.jpg |
| 02:57.26 | FlAWD | but there is a way to get in the alliance base next to the flag |
| 02:57.47 | Nom- | Not that i've ever seen |
| 02:57.51 | Corrodias | that map is missing a nearly-but-not-quite-exploit-of-terrain jump |
| 02:57.52 | FlAWD | you can come up the hill just to the right of wing commander sildore |
| 02:57.54 | FlAWD | i've seen it |
| 02:57.56 | Corrodias | that takes you in next to the GY flag |
| 02:58.03 | FlAWD | left rather |
| 02:58.09 | Corrodias | very challenging jump |
| 02:58.19 | Nom- | You don't come up the hill |
| 02:58.27 | Nom- | You come across the bridge and behind the building |
| 02:58.38 | FlAWD | i've never done it but i've seen people get in |
| 02:58.45 | Corrodias | nah, it's not across the bridge at all |
| 02:58.49 | Nom- | all the alliance needs to do to defend their base is defend that orange line |
| 02:58.51 | Corrodias | you go up the mountain to the west of the base |
| 02:59.01 | Corrodias | then jump eastward across small landable areas |
| 02:59.13 | Nom- | Corrodias: It's no more effective than charging accross the bridge though |
| 02:59.15 | Corrodias | but it's not something you can move an army through |
| 02:59.18 | Nom- | Even if the entire offensive came that way |
| 02:59.49 | FlAWD | oh and as for AB, alliance acts like idiots in pugs, nobody ever defends, and we LOVE to chase that one hunter from the farm to the stables just to get that HK |
| 03:00.13 | FlAWD | i see 4 people chasing one hunter or druid across the map all the time |
| 03:00.18 | Corrodias | haha |
| 03:00.44 | Nom- | Yeah, Horde are generally more disciplined and better organised in PvP |
| 03:01.10 | FlAWD | and for example at the LM, all the alliance goes halfway down the hill to cut horde off coming from the farm, and a rogue comes up from stables side and ninja's the flag |
| 03:01.10 | Nom- | The problem is, it doesn't matter on AV when the map is so stacked against you |
| 03:01.51 | Nom- | It soudns like the back entrance into the alliance base is probably a bug or unintended scalable terrain more than anything |
| 03:01.53 | FlAWD | i've always just gone into the horde base in AV the same way, right in the front door |
| 03:02.02 | Corrodias | it seems unintended, Nom-, certainly |
| 03:02.02 | FlAWD | even if i'm the first one there i barely see many people defending |
| 03:02.05 | Nom- | Whereas the back door into the horde base is an actual access ramp |
| 03:02.11 | Corrodias | but of course, blizzard never fixes battlegrounds, so it's never going away :) |
| 03:02.47 | Nom- | FlAWD: Most PUGs unfortunately will defend at the middle of the map |
| 03:02.55 | Nom- | But they're ready to hearth back if anything is taken |
| 03:03.26 | FlAWD | i believe that, but by the time the relief hut is taken there's already 20+ alliance there |
| 03:03.36 | Nom- | But the fact remains, that if the alliance know what they're doing, they need not go through that little room at all |
| 03:03.42 | FlAWD | and a lot of people on offence don't want to miss the HK's to hearth back |
| 03:03.45 | Nom- | Which means we actually have no choke point whatsoever |
| 03:03.55 | FlAWD | agreed |
| 03:04.03 | FlAWD | but alliance sucks at pvp nonetheless :) |
| 03:04.31 | Nom- | Most of the time there is a defender at Frostwolf too, FlAWD |
| 03:04.35 | Nom- | But they're guarding the wrong entrance |
| 03:04.43 | Nom- | Because as you see on the map, there's so many ways in |
| 03:04.54 | FlAWD | yea |
| 03:05.14 | Nom- | Not only can you come in the front and back, but there's multiple walls you can jump on your mount off terrain |
| 03:05.19 | Nom- | So the wall may as not even be there |
| 03:09.05 | FlAWD | grr |
| 03:09.17 | FlAWD | stupid computer |
| 03:10.17 | Corrodias | was AV balanced at all before they changed it? |
| 03:10.34 | Tem | maybe not |
| 03:10.37 | Tem | but it was way more fun |
| 03:12.01 | Nom- | from what i understand it was just lots of harder NPCs |
| 03:12.11 | Nom- | Instead of it being a 3 minute boss fight it was 15 minute or something like that |
| 03:12.15 | Nom- | I never played the old version |
| 03:12.32 | Tem | in the old version, the rush to the generals didn't work |
| 03:12.42 | Tem | you had to take and hold the whole map to win |
| 03:12.48 | Tem | (well, not exactly) |
| 03:13.29 | Nom- | The map used to be a several hour event rather than 1-2 hours |
| 03:13.42 | Tem | 1-2 hours? |
| 03:13.57 | Tem | I haven't seen an AV last longer than 20 minutes in a long time |
| 03:14.01 | Tem | since they changed it, in fact |
| 03:14.25 | Tem | Before, a 4 hour AV wasn't uncommon, though :) |
| 03:14.26 | Nom- | err how long ago changed ? |
| 03:14.40 | Nom- | Post 2.0 most games on our battlegroup last upwards of 45 minutes |
| 03:14.51 | Nom- | And that's when we purposefully let the alliance win |
| 03:14.57 | Nom- | (ie. No defense, all offense) |
| 03:15.20 | Tem | The patch just before xrealm they removed a bunch of npcs |
| 03:15.27 | Tem | and it just became a rush to kill the other general |
| 03:15.48 | Nom- | Either you're not a good judge of time |
| 03:15.57 | Tem | or you battlegroup sucks |
| 03:16.01 | Tem | s/you/your/ |
| 03:16.04 | Nom- | Or your battlegroup has really good/crap players on your side (depending on whether you win/lose) |
| 03:16.14 | Nom- | lol |
| 03:16.25 | Nom- | Actually a long fight tends to mean that we're all skilled and well geared :P |
| 03:16.38 | Nom- | If one side is overgeared then it's a very quick fight |
| 03:16.52 | Tem | whatever |
| 03:16.57 | Tem | it still sucks compares to the old AV |
| 03:17.03 | Tem | s/compares/compared/ |
| 03:18.07 | Nom- | Well, given that the old, old AV used to last for 12 hours sometimes |
| 03:18.10 | Nom- | I'd say it's much better |
| 03:18.44 | Nom- | But I wasn't level 60 until after the cross-realm battlegrounds |
| 03:18.49 | Nom- | So I never played it |
| 03:19.12 | Tem | I LOVED the old AV |
| 03:19.17 | Tem | short games are the suck |
| 03:20.13 | Nom- | Depends |
| 03:20.26 | Nom- | If you're after the tokens, long games suck the big one |
| 03:22.28 | Tem | yeah |
| 03:22.32 | Tem | but I was never after tokens |
| 03:22.35 | Tem | I just enjoyed the game |
| 03:23.31 | Corrodias | of course, the alliance still has paladins |
| 03:23.46 | Corrodias | giving them a weapon to fight back against those cheating, organizing horde in AB |
| 03:23.59 | Cairenn | zomg! there are less than 100 people in channel! where is everyone? |
| 03:24.16 | Nom- | bahahaha |
| 03:24.20 | Nom- | Panda Porn! |
| 03:24.31 | Nom- | http://video.news.com.au/videoplayer?channel=Fox+Other&clipid=1198_53323&bitrate=300&format=wmp |
| 03:24.53 | JoshBorke | purl, hug Cairenn |
| 03:24.56 | purl | ACTION hugs Cairenn tightly until Cairenn turns slightly blue |
| 03:25.00 | Cairenn | purl, hug JoshBorke |
| 03:25.01 | purl | ACTION hugs JoshBorke tightly until JoshBorke turns slightly blue |
| 03:26.15 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Tem (n=tardmrr@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Dongle/Tem) |
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| 03:26.49 | Nom- | Power failure...my alts logged off :P |
| 03:26.59 | Tem | Captain's log, stardate uhhhh |
| 03:27.08 | Tem | *groan* April 12th |
| 03:28.14 | Nom- | What about it? |
| 03:28.17 | Nom- | It's a Thursday... |
| 03:28.43 | Nom- | oh wait |
| 03:28.45 | Nom- | never mind |
| 03:28.46 | Nom- | I get it |
| 03:29.50 | Shirik | >>> string.byte("\n"); |
| 03:29.51 | Cide | Shirik: 10 |
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| 03:31.57 | JoshBorke | nn |
| 03:31.57 | *** mode/#wowi-lounge [+v tardmrr] by ChanServ |
| 03:32.12 | Cairenn | night JoshBorke |
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| 03:35.05 | zenzelezz | ... |
| 03:35.21 | Tem | damnit! |
| 03:35.44 | Tem | this silly client won't order my servers like I want it to |
| 03:35.50 | Corrodias | why are people still flagged after exiting a battleground? i don't get that. |
| 03:36.04 | Tem | oh well screw it |
| 03:36.15 | Nom- | Coz they were participating in PvP ? |
| 03:37.08 | Corrodias | yes, but now they're not. |
| 03:37.30 | Corrodias | i see no benefit of the lingering flag to anyone other than griefers |
| 03:38.11 | zenzelezz | isn't it just the same 5-minute flag as for any other PvP? |
| 03:39.15 | Corrodias | yep |
| 03:39.29 | Corrodias | other pvp flagging you for 5 minutes afterward makes sense to me |
| 03:39.49 | zenzelezz | I don't see why you should get away any easier after a BG |
| 03:40.20 | zenzelezz | just my opinion of course |
| 03:45.20 | Nom- | well |
| 03:45.28 | Nom- | Let's put it this way |
| 03:45.50 | Nom- | If you've regularly got the opposite faction camping your major cities, then you have more to worry about than a PvP flag ^_^ |
| 03:55.13 | Fin | well yes, you have to worry about the opposite faction regularly camping your major cities |
| 03:55.35 | Fin | :P |
| 03:55.35 | Fin | I always thought the flag was to stop bots |
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| 04:02.36 | Corrodias | several games in AB and i get about 200 honor |
| 04:02.41 | Corrodias | jesus christ i hate honor grinds |
| 04:02.51 | Nom- | lol |
| 04:06.18 | trik | you know what sucks even more? |
| 04:06.27 | trik | you play alot of games for wsg holiday |
| 04:06.36 | trik | you get about 8k honors |
| 04:06.40 | trik | log out |
| 04:06.44 | trik | and you log back in |
| 04:07.00 | trik | and it says you only received about 6k last night |
| 04:07.44 | trik | you make a report to a GM if it's a mistake that you lost about 2k honor |
| 04:08.01 | Corrodias | estimates |
| 04:08.06 | trik | and they tell you it's not a mistake, it's just displaying the wrong honor points last night |
| 04:08.11 | Corrodias | apparently the game doesn't know how to tell how much honor you're getting |
| 04:08.29 | Corrodias | i don't know why it's so hard |
| 04:08.33 | Nom- | we pwn the competition |
| 04:08.33 | Nom- | Never a problem... |
| 04:08.34 | zenzelezz | without knowing how the server calculates it we can't tell |
| 04:08.46 | trik | freakin bullshiet i tell ya |
| 04:08.48 | zenzelezz | for all we know they might need the total outcome of a BG to do the proper code |
| 04:08.48 | Corrodias | apparently blizzard doesn't know, either |
| 04:08.56 | Corrodias | yeah, okay, could be |
| 04:09.17 | trik | it seems to me |
| 04:09.28 | trik | that blizzard just wants us to spend alot more time |
| 04:10.25 | zenzelezz | if the calculations were easy and straight forward then they could just update it real-time, not overnight |
| 04:10.35 | Corrodias | hey, if getting honor were easy, i might not go insane trying to get a god damn BELT |
| 04:11.08 | Mr_Rabies2 | i've got no goals for myself in pvp, i just screw around |
| 04:11.30 | Mr_Rabies2 | since the druid items are supposedly getting changed, in the feral field especially, since they're meh |
| 04:12.49 | zenzelezz | I think I could be of great aid to alliance BGs, since the horde would be too busy laughing about the prot spec nub running around cluelessly to mount an effective defense |
| 04:12.50 | zenzelezz | but then I don't like PvP |
| 04:15.49 | trik | is it just me or do the hordes win all the time in bgs? |
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| 04:29.42 | Corrodias | we don't |
| 04:30.15 | Corrodias | we're almost losing this wsg, for example |
| 04:31.40 | Corrodias | any second now... |
| 04:31.44 | Corrodias | god i hate wsg |
| 04:34.13 | Kirkburn|afk | Short US maintenance! http://blue.cardplace.com/newcache/forums.worldofwarcraft.com/86853840.htm |
| 04:38.25 | Mr_Rabies2 | depends on the bracket |
| 04:38.30 | Mr_Rabies2 | and battlegroup |
| 04:38.41 | Mr_Rabies2 | and time of day, and a huge number of things |
| 04:48.24 | Corrodias | we just won the game. the very, very long game. |
| 04:49.31 | Corrodias | i dunno, i kinda like bear form in these battlegrounds. i get the 5 second stun, the immobilizing charge, and the survivability. with as much as i gear Feared and crap, i don't usually get to do much damage in cat form anyway. |
| 04:51.47 | Mr_Rabies2 | yeah you're pretty much a prot warrior with less survivability and damage in bear :x |
| 04:52.17 | Mr_Rabies2 | and no hamstring :x |
| 04:52.36 | Shirik | I hate hamstring |
| 04:53.13 | Mr_Rabies2 | me too, yet i never see anyone complaining about it |
| 04:54.06 | Mr_Rabies2 | people whine that we can break slowing effects for a huge mana cost but people never seem to care about a spammable snare on no DRs for a low rage cost that's instant cast :x |
| 04:54.18 | Shirik | yup |
| 04:54.28 | Shirik | and I only have one way of getting out of it |
| 04:54.32 | Shirik | a trinket on a 5min cooldown |
| 04:54.45 | Shirik | and as soon as I use it, I get hit with hamstring again |
| 04:54.57 | Mr_Rabies2 | i can get out of it about 3 times, but it's pointless since it can just be reapplied instantly |
| 04:56.29 | *** join/#wowi-lounge krka (n=krka@c83-250-203-119.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 05:05.05 | Kirkburn|afk | Still looking for feedback on http://www.wowwiki.com/User:Kirkburn/Dev2 |
| 05:05.09 | Kirkburn|afk | Anyone? :) |
| 05:06.21 | Fin | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:06.30 | *** join/#wowi-lounge xlvii (n=Tim@144.136.157.109) |
| 05:06.31 | xlvii | would 170 hit rating be enough to start raiding? i am a rogue. |
| 05:07.22 | Fin | I prefer it to the current front page, but that's say a 105 score vs a 100 or something |
| 05:07.32 | Fin | Kirkburn|afk: sorry for the utterly useless feedback |
| 05:08.14 | Kirkburn|afk | heh |
| 05:08.25 | Kirkburn|afk | "It's better", good enough for me |
| 05:08.50 | Kirkburn|afk | I probably won't put it up until the weekend |
| 05:08.51 | Fin | it's slightly neater, slightly cleaner, a little more refined |
| 05:09.18 | Fin | like a 21 year old vs an 18 year old, perhaps |
| 05:10.06 | Kirkburn|afk | lol |
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| 05:14.14 | Shirik | 21 or 18 |
| 05:14.16 | Shirik | both good imo |
| 05:14.43 | Shirik | but I do like the new one |
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| 05:22.03 | Kirkburn|afk | I wonder when I last played WoW |
| 05:22.28 | Kirkburn|afk | Is there any way of finding out? |
| 05:23.00 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Nom__ (n=nom@standen.id.au) |
| 05:23.37 | Fin | check the timestamps on savedvariables? |
| 05:23.48 | Kirkburn|afk | sneaky |
| 05:25.02 | Kirkburn|afk | 2 1/2 weeks ago |
| 05:25.34 | Fin | how many / what level characters do you have? |
| 05:25.40 | Fin | to be nosey |
| 05:27.08 | Fin | (in the interests of full disclosure) |
| 05:27.26 | Kirkburn|afk | 1 level 70, 1 level 42, several around 20 |
| 05:27.43 | Kirkburn|afk | Methinks you meant 3 level 70s? |
| 05:28.27 | Fin | no, 60s :) |
| 05:28.44 | Kirkburn|afk | weirdo |
| 05:29.01 | Fin | I stopped playing around christmas, just stopped having fun |
| 05:29.21 | Kirkburn|afk | Not even BC tempted you? |
| 05:29.42 | Fin | I logged on my rogue and checked out Outlands for about half an hour |
| 05:30.07 | Kirkburn|afk | Were you on beta? |
| 05:30.34 | Fin | I had to walk to the next flight point, and picked up a bunch of grinding quests... didn't exactly make me enthusiastic about starting to play again considering the reasons I think I got bored of it... |
| 05:30.38 | Fin | no |
| 05:30.45 | Fin | I didn't want to try out the new content before it got here |
| 05:30.59 | Fin | I was on the original beta though |
| 05:31.00 | Kirkburn|afk | And yet, even when it is here, you're not trying it out ;P |
| 05:31.25 | Fin | well, I did try it out, it just felt like more of the same grinding stuff... |
| 05:31.45 | Fin | I *started* playing again because I got to see some new stuff :) |
| 05:31.53 | Kirkburn|afk | Well, I'm surely not the only one to tlel you this, but you're missing out :) |
| 05:32.01 | Kirkburn|afk | Or *tell |
| 05:32.07 | Fin | my 60s are alliance, the 31 is a blood elf - new faction, new starting zone, new race, new quests... |
| 05:32.13 | Fin | oh, I know |
| 05:32.27 | Fin | most of the time I'm playing I'm on TS with a bunch of people who are all raiding |
| 05:32.35 | Fin | it makes me want to start raiding again |
| 05:32.38 | Kirkburn|afk | Yeah, only char I've been playing recently is my BE and draenei. Both aren't past 10 yet :/ |
| 05:32.56 | Kirkburn|afk | Never raided myself |
| 05:33.00 | Fin | but, I did get bored of raiding before, I haven't raided for about 5 months I think now |
| 05:33.05 | Fin | well |
| 05:33.08 | Fin | they're not always raiding |
| 05:33.14 | Fin | grouping as well |
| 05:33.20 | Fin | 5-mans, 10-mans, mostly atm |
| 05:33.44 | Kirkburn|afk | hehe |
| 05:34.02 | Fin | I figured I probably would want to start playing again at some point, s'why I bought BC |
| 05:34.24 | Fin | also, and some people might find this silly, but I made some real friends in the last two years playing |
| 05:34.44 | Kirkburn|afk | awesome |
| 05:35.09 | Fin | so I didn't really want to dump them :) |
| 05:35.50 | Fin | (btw, I have also met a bunch of them, some a bunch of times - best trip in recent memory was to Scotland getting raging drunk with some people from WoW :) |
| 05:36.08 | Kirkburn|afk | lol |
| 05:37.06 | Fin | I know what yo umean |
| 05:37.08 | Fin | <u |
| 05:37.19 | Fin | it was like that for me around Christmas |
| 05:37.35 | Fin | logged on a few times |
| 05:37.39 | Fin | no spark |
| 05:38.14 | Fin | what I want to know is, when's WoW 2 coming out? |
| 05:38.46 | Fin | incidentally, I am honestly amazed and cannot understand how it's possible that I've been playing the same game for such a long time |
| 05:38.57 | Fin | I mean, I used to think I played a lot of quake, but... 2 years? fuck |
| 05:39.16 | Kirkburn|afk | I wants the next expansion pack :P |
| 05:39.46 | Fin | so, same question back to you - BC not tempting? |
| 05:39.58 | Kirkburn|afk | Not instancing and raiding, no |
| 05:40.11 | Kirkburn|afk | Ouch, there's only two people online on TM:Sunrise atm |
| 05:40.11 | Fin | what about the rest of it? |
| 05:40.21 | Kirkburn|afk | Done all the solo quests on my 70 char |
| 05:40.29 | Fin | it's mostly just playing with other people that I really like |
| 05:40.30 | Kirkburn|afk | Keep meaning to level my 42, but haven't got around to it |
| 05:40.41 | Fin | (said the vicar to the nun) |
| 05:40.56 | Kirkburn|afk | heh |
| 05:42.28 | Fin | also, learning Lua was cool |
| 05:43.10 | Kirkburn|afk | I should do that someday |
| 05:43.10 | Fin | not that I'm an expert by any means, of course |
| 06:03.57 | Kirkburn|afk | Rambo IV shots - http://www.flynetonline.com/2007/03/rambos-last-mission-in-thailand.html |
| 06:07.05 | Corrodias | i want a way to get good tanking items for the waist and feet slots without pvp :P |
| 06:20.29 | Kirkburn|afk | Shirik|zZz, quick buzz |
| 06:20.34 | Shirik|zZz | sup |
| 06:20.44 | Kirkburn|afk | Just saw your question on the Dev page |
| 06:21.08 | Kirkburn|afk | Can't create a box in the middle of the page, but I can ask about it |
| 06:21.13 | Shirik|zZz | ah ok |
| 06:21.20 | Kirkburn|afk | (I tried it earlier using the standard code, no worky :( ) |
| 06:21.22 | Shirik|zZz | see I don't really know anything about wiki editing, to be honest |
| 06:21.30 | Shirik|zZz | like what the limitations are, etc. |
| 06:21.50 | Kirkburn|afk | I'll see what I can do |
| 06:21.56 | Kirkburn|afk | Anyhoo, sleep well :) |
| 06:21.59 | Shirik|zZz | night |
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| 07:26.07 | Nom- | 1-20 is a blast |
| 07:26.14 | Nom- | You should all try it again some time ^_^ |
| 07:26.35 | Nom- | In fact, levelling 1-30 is the funnest part of the game :P |
| 07:26.59 | Nom- | Aside from raiding...I love raiding :P |
| 07:27.05 | Mr_Rabies2 | the barrens can burn in a fiery inferno for all i care |
| 07:27.26 | Nom- | Stuff the barrens |
| 07:27.31 | Nom- | Blood Elf starting zone > all |
| 07:27.56 | Mr_Rabies2 | the 40-45 area is my favorite i think |
| 07:28.02 | Mr_Rabies2 | i love sm and zf |
| 07:28.27 | Nom- | I prefer soloing Stratholme |
| 07:28.50 | Nom- | Still haven't worked out how to take the key guy down solo on my pally tho |
| 07:28.56 | Nom- | His enrages hurt too much |
| 07:29.57 | Nom- | And i've not tried on my mage yet, but he's only level 62... |
| 07:30.13 | Nom- | I'll try and get 63 on my mage tonight, if I get enough time |
| 07:30.23 | Nom- | Gotta use the rested xp up at least as quick as it comes in :P |
| 07:33.36 | Mr_Rabies2 | i cant solo it :[ |
| 07:33.49 | Mr_Rabies2 | apparently its impossible for druids to |
| 07:34.02 | Nom- | hmmm probably not impossible |
| 07:34.09 | Nom- | just very difficult because you don't have much AoE DPS |
| 07:34.20 | Mr_Rabies2 | since the bear nerf i haven't seen anyone saying they've been able to even handle the trash mobs |
| 07:34.29 | Mr_Rabies2 | i know i can't |
| 07:34.32 | Nom- | With my pally, i've done 1000 damage to all mobs before they even start hitting on me |
| 07:34.42 | Nom- | Then you've got ret aura, consecration |
| 07:34.45 | Mr_Rabies2 | and i could handle them easy as hell pre bear nerf |
| 07:34.50 | Nom- | Plus Exorcism for single target burst |
| 07:37.28 | Nom- | wow...i just noticed |
| 07:37.42 | Nom- | molten armor is the same crit reduction as 490 defense |
| 07:38.14 | Nom- | Talk about uber for AoE |
| 07:38.19 | Nom- | No more crits! :D |
| 07:38.36 | Nom- | That makes it a viable PvP choice too lol |
| 07:38.59 | Nom- | Not as good in PvP of course, due to the fact everyone has +crit |
| 07:39.32 | snurre- | but most also have procs from crits |
| 07:39.36 | snurre- | which it prevents |
| 07:41.04 | Nom- | hmm where's the pally Dungeon Set 4 ? |
| 07:43.30 | Nom- | hmm they haven't even got them labelled on wowhead :( |
| 07:44.40 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Thorarin (i=marcel@s55918431.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 07:45.44 | Nom- | How crap....Warrior gets Bold => Doomplate, Mage gets Incanter's => Mana-Etched, but Paladin gets Righteous => (nothing) |
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| 07:46.45 | Nom- | WTB a decent heroic upgrade set for Paladin :( |
| 07:48.26 | snurre | first of all, there is no such thing as dungeon set 4 |
| 07:48.33 | snurre | 3 is the highest |
| 07:48.49 | Nom- | Yeah, but you could consider Doomplate as Dungeon Set 4 |
| 07:48.49 | snurre | and pewpewadin can wear doomplate if he wants |
| 07:48.56 | Nom- | Given that most of it drops in Heroics |
| 07:48.57 | snurre | you could, but you wont |
| 07:49.56 | snurre | tankadin can wear bold, healadin can wear hallowed |
| 07:49.59 | Nom- | No paladin with half a brain would wear Doomplate :( |
| 07:49.59 | Nom- | If you're a tankadin, you need spell damage, but you can't sacrifice the gem slots for that |
| 07:50.00 | Nom- | You need the gem slots for +defense |
| 07:50.49 | Nom- | A tankadin in Bold won't have enough aggro generating capability |
| 07:50.56 | Nom- | Unless the mob is undead or demon |
| 07:51.08 | snurre | doomplate, mana-etched stuff aren't class-specific like bold and incanters |
| 07:51.18 | Nom- | I realise this |
| 07:51.22 | snurre | theyre more cross-class with other stats |
| 07:51.23 | Nom- | But they're actually a progression |
| 07:51.33 | Nom- | But they're not an upgrade to a tankadin |
| 07:51.36 | Nom- | Not really |
| 07:51.59 | snurre | i dont get why anyone would bother wearing dungeon sets at all anyway though.. getting epic tradeskill items or better single pieces is not exactly hard |
| 07:52.14 | Nom- | For a warrior, most of the Doomplate is a significant upgrade to Bold |
| 07:52.21 | Nom- | Due to the extra gem slots mainly |
| 07:52.34 | Corrodias | wtb a reasonable knowledge of what bear form tanking chest piece to get |
| 07:52.34 | Nom- | For a paladin, you'd be gimping your dps, threat, mana...everything |
| 07:52.54 | Nom- | Corrodias: Lots of stamina, agility and some gem slots for +def gems |
| 07:52.58 | Nom- | Until you have 415 defense :P |
| 07:53.20 | snurre | just go healing and wait for blizz to fix paladin tanking itemization |
| 07:53.33 | snurre | theyve said theyre gonna do it, so |
| 07:53.48 | Nom- | lol snurre, can't do that :P |
| 07:53.55 | Nom- | I'm tanking Kara |
| 07:53.57 | Corrodias | i wonder if a 1% chance of being crit is acceptable, compared to, say, a 3% greater chance of dodging |
| 07:54.07 | snurre | then what do you need dungeon sets for? |
| 07:54.07 | Corrodias | and i think the answer is yes |
| 07:54.32 | Nom- | I'm just searching for gear upgrades |
| 07:54.42 | Nom- | The tanking plate is going to the warrior in our group |
| 07:54.50 | snurre | depends on the situation.. dodge makes total damage taken less, but more spiky.. and it's the latter that kills |
| 07:54.52 | Corrodias | i have "enough" stamina. i need more mitigation/avoidance than i have, now. |
| 07:54.53 | Nom- | I'm ending up with the healing plate, which is useless for my role |
| 07:55.12 | Nom- | Corrodias: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28264 |
| 07:55.23 | Nom- | Heroic BF |
| 07:55.38 | Corrodias | yeah, that's not bad |
| 07:56.11 | Corrodias | in fact... i think that has the perfect balance of armor, agility, and stamina that i seek, with sockets anyway |
| 07:56.48 | Elkano | wouldn't http://www.wowhead.com/?item=25689 be better? |
| 07:56.54 | Nom- | http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28204 (Black Morass) |
| 07:56.56 | Corrodias | my biggest problem is low armor: just over 18k unbuffed right now |
| 07:57.00 | Corrodias | http://www.gurgleblaster.net/emmerald/Bear_Mitigation/Chest.html |
| 07:57.04 | Corrodias | just give me the item names, please |
| 07:57.33 | Elkano | Corrodias, Heavy Clefthoof Vest |
| 07:58.01 | Nom- | Chestguard of No Remorse |
| 07:58.05 | Corrodias | i'm currently holding onto a Chestguard of the Talon and a Heavy Clefthoof Vest. i'm not sure which i prefer. |
| 07:58.14 | Nom- | Yeah, the crafted gear isn't bad |
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| 07:58.39 | Corrodias | ideal would be the arena pvp thing but i need a team that actually plays... |
| 07:58.40 | Nom- | Of course, paladin gets shafted on crafted gear too :P |
| 07:58.52 | Corrodias | 404 Armor, +18 Agility, +39 Stamina, +22 Resilience, 3 sockets |
| 07:59.12 | Nom- | Ecept for the epic healing bracers, most of the crafted stuff is warrior oriented that i've seen |
| 08:00.10 | Elkano | I still use http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28051 (Jerkin of the Untamed Spirit), but I'm only 67 ^^ |
| 08:00.20 | Corrodias | i think it's easier for me to get 2% in dodge than it is to get 200 more armor, which becomes 1000 armor, which is about 2% damage reduction |
| 08:00.29 | Corrodias | according to the old armor forumlas page |
| 08:00.45 | Corrodias | forumlas! formulas. |
| 08:01.06 | Nom- | It's not that effective at 70 any more Corrodias |
| 08:01.13 | Nom- | It's not much reduced, but it's a lesser effect |
| 08:01.51 | Nom- | 12086 armor = 53.38% |
| 08:02.02 | Corrodias | the other druids tend to advise over 20k armor, but i think it's going to be easier for me to get good stats with a higher dodge than it would be to get my armor that high, especially since i skipped three high-armor but low-other-stats items |
| 08:02.07 | Corrodias | quest rewards |
| 08:02.20 | Nom- | 25K armor, 12k hitpoints and 415 defense is ideal |
| 08:02.21 | Corrodias | and what's 13086? |
| 08:02.41 | Corrodias | 25k? that is impossible for me to attain at this point |
| 08:02.56 | Corrodias | without manimal's cinch and the similar pants and boots, there's no way. |
| 08:03.01 | Nom- | Just as well you quantified that :) |
| 08:03.05 | Nom- | It's definately possible |
| 08:03.19 | Corrodias | you speak words i do not believe |
| 08:03.26 | Nom- | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:03.54 | Nom- | That's for level 70 vs level 70 |
| 08:05.47 | Nom- | Around the 32000 armor mark you reach the mitigation cap |
| 08:05.57 | Nom- | 1200053.19738446 |
| 08:05.58 | Nom- | 1300055.18412395 |
| 08:05.58 | Nom- | 1400057.00906037 |
| 08:06.09 | Corrodias | according to my calculation |
| 08:06.37 | Corrodias | the reduction given from 18000 armor is 98% of the reduction given from 19000 armor. |
| 08:06.45 | Corrodias | thus the 2% per 1000 armor seems to hold |
| 08:07.08 | Nom- | Well, it's a diminishing returns formula |
| 08:07.20 | Corrodias | believe me, i've read the wowwiki page |
| 08:07.33 | Nom- | I mean, put it this way |
| 08:08.06 | Nom- | The difference between 25K and 30K is only 4% |
| 08:08.24 | Corrodias | 4% of 100% of damage, right? |
| 08:08.41 | Nom- | whereas 20K to 25K is 6% |
| 08:08.46 | Nom- | yeah of 100 |
| 08:08.49 | Corrodias | according to this calculation, 25000 armor would get me taking 10% less damage than i do now at 18000 armor |
| 08:09.04 | Nom- | 1800063.0% |
| 08:09.05 | Corrodias | maybe i did it wrong... |
| 08:09.09 | Nom- | 2500070.3% |
| 08:09.11 | Corrodias | i don't know what number you're trying to output |
| 08:09.16 | Corrodias | those are meaningless to me |
| 08:09.26 | Nom- | 25000 = 70.3% |
| 08:09.30 | Nom- | 18000 = 63.0% |
| 08:10.48 | Corrodias | actually, what it says is that the mitigation of 18k is 89.6% as high as the mitigation from 25k, which means... 11.5% less damage if i got my armor that high |
| 08:11.59 | Nom- | *blink* |
| 08:12.01 | Nom- | huh? |
| 08:12.14 | Corrodias | f(18000)/f(25000) = 89.6% |
| 08:12.35 | Corrodias | f(25000)/f(18000) = 111.5% |
| 08:12.48 | Nom- | I don't follow you |
| 08:13.01 | Corrodias | f(armor) is the mitigation percentage for the value of armor given |
| 08:13.01 | Nom- | It's a 6.7% damage reduction increase |
| 08:13.07 | Nom- | I don't know where you're getting 11.5% from |
| 08:13.09 | Corrodias | yes, but 6.7% of full damage |
| 08:13.16 | Corrodias | not compared to what you were already taking at 18k armor |
| 08:13.26 | snurre | (100 - (100 * DmgReduction1)) / (100 - (100 * DmgReduction2)) |
| 08:13.59 | Corrodias | my numbers might still be wrong |
| 08:14.37 | Corrodias | let me try this again |
| 08:15.16 | Nom- | It's 370 damage vs 296 damage for a 1000 damage swing |
| 08:15.41 | snurre | the closer you get to 100%, the more value each % has |
| 08:16.13 | snurre | so it really doesnt matter if you go from 1000 to 2000 or 18000 to 19000, it reduces the damage you receive per hit by the same amount |
| 08:16.14 | Corrodias | okay, so i'd only take 80% as much damage as i do with 18k armor. that makes more sense. |
| 08:16.38 | Nom- | snurre: I think you'll find that's false :) |
| 08:17.05 | Nom- | in fact, I've just proved it with the excel sheet i've got |
| 08:17.23 | Nom- | the difference between 0 armor and 1000 armor is 86 damage |
| 08:17.37 | Nom- | the difference betwen 10k armor and 11k armor is 23 damage |
| 08:18.24 | Nom- | You people are thinking backwards imho :P |
| 08:18.29 | Corrodias | the difference between 5k armor and 4k armor is about 6.5% |
| 08:18.39 | Corrodias | for 25k and 24k it goes to 2.9% |
| 08:18.47 | Corrodias | 2.9? that seems awfully high... |
| 08:19.12 | Elkano | Nom, 86/23 based on what damage? 100? |
| 08:19.30 | Nom- | more like 0.9% Corrodias |
| 08:19.37 | Corrodias | the point is that i'd take 80% as much damage as i do with 18k armor if i got my armor that high |
| 08:19.45 | Nom- | Elkano: 1000 swing |
| 08:20.18 | Nom- | It's a difference in amount of damage mitigated...these guys are thinking in wierd ways |
| 08:21.12 | Elkano | so with 1k armor, 8.6% is mitigated? how much raw damage you take at 10k and 11k? |
| 08:21.26 | Corrodias | this doesn't help me decide what chest piece to get |
| 08:21.36 | Corrodias | although i think the wastewalker one is a fine choice, good balance of stats |
| 08:21.50 | Corrodias | pop three +8 agility jewels in there and i'm good to go |
| 08:22.08 | Nom- | raw damage at 10k = 513.56 |
| 08:22.12 | Nom- | 11k = 489.74 |
| 08:22.51 | Corrodias | divide the latter by the former and you get 0.953618 |
| 08:23.07 | Corrodias | 95.4% as much damage at 11k as at 10k |
| 08:23.13 | Elkano | so that makes 4.64% mitigated |
| 08:23.51 | Nom- | oooooh i see where you're going |
| 08:23.52 | Elkano | it's not as much as for 1k but still noticable I think |
| 08:24.09 | Nom- | It is a diminishing return still tho |
| 08:24.19 | Nom- | 8% from 1000 to 2000 |
| 08:24.41 | Nom- | 4.6% |
| 08:24.44 | Nom- | for 10k to 11k |
| 08:24.46 | snurre | http://www.wowwiki.com/Formulas:Damage_reduction |
| 08:24.53 | Nom- | 3.2% from 20k to 21k |
| 08:25.20 | Nom- | That's where I got the formula from snurre |
| 08:28.34 | Elkano | 50% against level 73: 11962; 75% against level 73: 35886 -> +200% armor for +25% raw but it's another 50% effective ^^ |
| 08:28.47 | Elkano | it's not as bad as it looks ^^ |
| 08:29.26 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Adys (n=Miranda@APoitiers-256-1-55-125.w90-16.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 08:30.08 | Nom- | http://www.standen.id.au/wow/armour.txt |
| 08:30.13 | Corrodias | heroic blood furnace. that has to be hell. :( |
| 08:30.14 | Nom- | there check that out...that's the differendce |
| 08:30.19 | Corrodias | i can't imagine completing a heroic instance from what i've heard. |
| 08:30.31 | Nom- | lol they're not that bad |
| 08:30.35 | Nom- | No harder than doing Karazhan |
| 08:30.46 | Nom- | Just need people to be attentive and know what they're doing |
| 08:30.54 | Corrodias | yeah, we couldn't handle that last time |
| 08:31.00 | Nom- | It'd be a nightmare to PUG, but with guild it should be ok |
| 08:31.07 | Corrodias | so armor is a good thing, i see |
| 08:31.27 | Corrodias | making arena rewards very important for my tanking set :/ |
| 08:31.56 | Nom- | Heroic rewards aren't bad tho |
| 08:32.06 | Nom- | And there's some nice gear from the end of heroic instances |
| 08:32.14 | Nom- | The last boss in every heroic drops an epic |
| 08:32.26 | Corrodias | well, take a look at this: http://www.gurgleblaster.net/emmerald/Bear_Mitigation/Chest.html |
| 08:32.37 | Corrodias | even ignoring the order they're in, you can see the highest armor stuff is pvp rewards |
| 08:32.44 | Corrodias | except the tier 5 piece |
| 08:33.08 | Nom- | well at the end of the day anyway, all tanks need 3 things |
| 08:33.11 | Nom- | 1. Stats to hold aggro. |
| 08:33.19 | Nom- | 2. Stamina |
| 08:33.21 | Nom- | 3. Damage mitigation |
| 08:33.55 | Nom- | In the case of a bear, it's nice if you can get to 415 defense so you don't get crit, but not essential |
| 08:34.11 | Nom- | It's more important to get more armor than the average warrior to make up for the fact you get crit |
| 08:34.41 | Corrodias | sadly, my armor is in limbo at 18.8k and horrible pvp grinds and heroic instances are my only ways of improving it |
| 08:35.18 | Nom- | http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Stormscale&n=Kakeka |
| 08:35.22 | Corrodias | i'm currently using a Chestguard of the Talon, a decently high armor chest piece, but the wastewalker tunic has similar stats, about 80 less armor, and three sockets |
| 08:35.22 | Nom- | That's our Feral Druid |
| 08:36.09 | Corrodias | that's cat gear |
| 08:36.11 | Nom- | he probably logged in his dps gear lol, but he's been happily helping tank Kara |
| 08:36.16 | Elkano | clefhoof set will give you 739 armor (4064.5 effective as bear), 131 Stamina, 86 defense rating and 4 blue, 4 yellow sockets |
| 08:36.35 | Nom- | Hmm i'll see if the other druid logged in tank gear |
| 08:36.35 | Corrodias | much better than my cat gear, which i have been neglecting because i'm too casual to build two good sets :P |
| 08:37.10 | Nom- | yeah they both logged in kitty gear lol |
| 08:37.11 | Nom- | oh well |
| 08:37.19 | Corrodias | heavy clefthoof vest: 290 Armor, +52 Stamina, +28 Defense rating, 3 sockets |
| 08:37.35 | Corrodias | Chestguard of the Talon: 378 Armor, +34 Agility, +21 Stamina, +36 Strength, 0 sockets |
| 08:37.56 | Corrodias | former looks better, right? but the armor loss would drag my armor down to low 18k's |
| 08:38.05 | Nom- | well the pair of them have in the order of 10.5k hitpoints in caster form in their tank set |
| 08:38.14 | Nom- | That's before the bear bonus |
| 08:38.21 | Corrodias | mine's mid 9000's |
| 08:38.34 | Nom- | And they've got 16-18k armor |
| 08:38.36 | Corrodias | i'm sure they're all magnificently geared and i'm jealous :P |
| 08:38.50 | Nom- | and i know Kakeka has 410ish defense too |
| 08:38.58 | Elkano | Corrodias, I think its about 500 less armor |
| 08:39.03 | Corrodias | yes |
| 08:39.34 | Corrodias | with the chestguard of the talon, i have 18.9k armor, 407 defense, and 23.7% dodge, unbuffed |
| 08:39.41 | Nom- | I suppose it all depends on your stat balance Corrodias |
| 08:39.47 | Corrodias | with the clefthoof thing, i have the wrong jewels in it. so it's crappy right now. :) |
| 08:39.57 | Nom- | Defense and Dodge make up for not having much armor |
| 08:40.08 | Corrodias | 18.3k armor, 423 defense, 21.77% dodge |
| 08:40.19 | Nom- | and armor and stamina makes up for not having much defense or dodge |
| 08:40.20 | Nom- | :) |
| 08:40.36 | Corrodias | the dodge will go up and the defense will go down if i put +8 agility jewels in it |
| 08:41.27 | Corrodias | very hard to decide between those two |
| 08:41.31 | Nom- | Well, our MT has 16.9% dodge, 15.7% parry, 12404 armor |
| 08:41.56 | Corrodias | armless worms can parry, but a bear can't >:/ |
| 08:42.17 | Nom- | I've got 11.53% dodge, 10.19% parry, 12076 armor |
| 08:42.34 | Nom- | And at the end of the day, both of us can tank well enough... |
| 08:42.52 | Nom- | I think a good target would be 20-25% dodge with bear-like armor |
| 08:43.28 | Corrodias | i think i'm going to keep the heavy clefthoof vest and just deal with low armor, trying to boost my dodge instead :P |
| 08:43.41 | Corrodias | my boots and pants have the wrong jewels, too, but i'm replacing those eventually, i hope |
| 08:44.29 | Nom- | bleh, it's so hard to say really...it's all about juggling stats lol |
| 08:44.46 | Corrodias | maybe my dodge can get high enough that the low armor isn't a problem :P |
| 08:44.56 | Corrodias | i'll be a nimble little bear |
| 08:45.13 | Nom- | well as long as you realise that 18k armor isn't low :) |
| 08:45.20 | Corrodias | well, for a bear, it's getting down there |
| 08:45.23 | Nom- | If you can get 415 defense, then it's actually pretty damn good |
| 08:45.30 | Elkano | wow, by searching for a tank equiped druid in our guild in the armory I noticed none of our lvl 70 druids is heal specced :/ |
| 08:45.50 | Nom- | Elkano: It's scary to find one of those these days, isn't it? |
| 08:46.14 | Corrodias | i was balance/restoration. i love healing. but our guild needed another tank more than me as a main healer, so i respecced at 70. |
| 08:46.36 | Nom- | Yeah, there's more than enough heal classes about now |
| 08:46.40 | Elkano | but its fun to see holy priests outheald by balance druids ^^ |
| 08:46.54 | Elkano | but that could have been a gear issue |
| 08:47.07 | Nom- | Well, i could be the most powerful healer in our raid |
| 08:47.12 | Nom- | But i've been relegated to tanking too :P |
| 08:47.15 | Nom- | Paladin > All for heals |
| 08:47.22 | Corrodias | well now |
| 08:47.26 | Nom- | (it's sad because it's true) |
| 08:47.30 | Corrodias | when using smaller heals, i hear the mana efficiency is amazing |
| 08:47.39 | Nom- | sure is Corrodias |
| 08:47.41 | Corrodias | what happens if you need to pump out larger amounts of healing? |
| 08:47.56 | Nom- | The holy talents let you do that effectively |
| 08:48.08 | Nom- | A non-holy paladin runs oom on big heals too fast |
| 08:48.12 | Nom- | but a holy paladin can go all day |
| 08:48.30 | Corrodias | i totally want a healer... but i have no alts above level 25 |
| 08:48.51 | Corrodias | i screw around a lot while playing, so i don't really have time to have one character at "the top" and another trailing close behind |
| 08:48.54 | Nom- | lol no class is guaranteed to be healer any more |
| 08:49.04 | Nom- | Every spec of every class brings something useful to the raids now |
| 08:49.33 | Corrodias | indeed :o |
| 08:49.37 | Nom- | For instances, it's immensely useful to put a shadow priest in the group with your healers or mana using dps |
| 08:49.39 | Corrodias | except maybe dps warrior. lolz. ;) |
| 08:50.00 | Corrodias | just kidding. i don't know enough about the warrior class to say what it can do. |
| 08:50.04 | Nom- | No, DPS warrior brings the improved buffs |
| 08:50.22 | Nom- | DPS warrior can add a massive amount of DPS to all your melee DPS just by using their buffs |
| 08:50.42 | Nom- | That sentence had too many DPSes in it |
| 08:51.00 | Corrodias | dpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdps |
| 08:51.13 | Nom- | About the only classes that don't make a huge difference are your pure DPS classes |
| 08:51.30 | Nom- | Mage for instance, you don't gain anything massive by bringing a frost mage over a fire mage |
| 08:51.37 | Nom- | arcane does bring slow though, which is useful |
| 08:52.12 | krka | zomg dps |
| 08:52.33 | Nom- | Even the different hunter builds bring some useful buffs |
| 08:53.00 | Nom- | I think about the only class that wouldn't make any difference is a rogue |
| 08:54.01 | Corrodias | you mean, the only class for which spec wouldn't really make a difference in their contribution to the raid |
| 08:54.08 | Corrodias | right? |
| 08:54.27 | Corrodias | just checking here |
| 08:54.58 | Corrodias | WoW has trained me. in old hillsbrad today, we were all transformed into humans, as usual. unfortunately, one of us was a rogue. |
| 08:55.19 | Corrodias | my instinctual hatred of human rogues kicked in and i couldn't stand to look at him :P |
| 08:55.36 | Corrodias | instinctual? ingrained. |
| 08:55.50 | krka | you're a classist! |
| 08:56.08 | Corrodias | i've had enough trouble with human and night elf rogues for life |
| 08:56.19 | Corrodias | unfortunately, i'm still doomed to PvP for a decent tanking belt |
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| 09:01.41 | Codayus | Arms spec warrior brings a nifty +4% melee damage buff against mobs that aren't immune to bleed effects. |
| 09:02.14 | Codayus | And a - healing effectiveness debuff, for the (very rare) fights that's important. |
| 09:02.25 | Codayus | Rogues can bring...uh...imp sap? :-( |
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| 09:02.41 | Corrodias | ys |
| 09:02.47 | Corrodias | yes, sapping is pretty nifty |
| 09:03.30 | Corrodias | anyway, they possibly can do more damage without pulling aggro due to feint. but then, a warrior can take some hits while a rogue really can't take more than a couple. |
| 09:04.20 | Codayus | Warrior DPS scales better...or did pre-TBC, not sure if that's changed... |
| 09:05.56 | Codayus | Also, I find DPS warriors tend to be pretty squishy if they pull aggro - their overall avoidance % tends to be pretty damn low. At least rogues get evasion. :-p |
| 09:06.26 | Corrodias | well, i was thinking of the plate armor |
| 09:06.30 | Codayus | *nod* |
| 09:07.46 | Codayus | I'm not really familiar with TBC DPS warriors; my guild has one, but he never raids... |
| 09:08.08 | Corrodias | i think we have one |
| 09:08.16 | Corrodias | calls himself Karunch. cute name. |
| 09:08.59 | Codayus | Back when I sometimes brought a warrior alt to MC though, I actually had a couple bits of leather and mail in my pure DPS set, and my HP pool was pathetic. <shrug> |
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| 09:09.04 | Dhraga | Lo all |
| 09:10.30 | Codayus | OTOH, I was perfectly able to OT if I swapped gear, which a rogue isn't really able to do... |
| 09:10.52 | Codayus | (Due to our class balance, we end up with 2 prot warriors in Karazhan mostly, which is DEFINTELY not ideal for most fights.) |
| 09:11.04 | Corrodias | wait, that's not ideal? |
| 09:11.29 | Codayus | Naa |
| 09:12.15 | Codayus | For the Maiden fight, we tell the 2nd prot warrior to run around and bandage people. |
| 09:14.06 | Codayus | Random question - doesn't some class have a spell..or talent...that does extra damage to dazed targets? |
| 09:15.10 | Corrodias | hunter |
| 09:15.17 | Corrodias | check the talents, it's in there somewhere |
| 09:15.35 | Elkano | spell iirc |
| 09:15.59 | Codayus | Ah... |
| 09:16.02 | Codayus | Steady Shot |
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| 09:16.15 | Codayus | Causes an additional 175 against dazed targets. |
| 09:16.48 | Codayus | I was vageuly thinking that maybe Blade Twisting could help out raid DPS, but actually, that's kind of pathetic. :-) |
| 09:16.58 | Corrodias | i find i last longer in battlegrounds if i go "prot bear" rather than "dps cat" |
| 09:17.08 | Corrodias | obviously! |
| 09:17.18 | Corrodias | my comparative contribution is questionable |
| 09:17.48 | Elkano | you could try to go healer and help your team ;) |
| 09:17.52 | SunTiger | tanking bears in bg's are usefull if other people make use of them. |
| 09:17.57 | Shadowed | not really |
| 09:18.19 | Corrodias | my healing is not particularly impressive, but yes |
| 09:18.28 | Corrodias | you know, that's a good point |
| 09:18.30 | Shadowed | the use is limited to AV and WSG, and even then the contribution isn't so amazing that they should always do it |
| 09:18.40 | SunTiger | true |
| 09:18.52 | Shadowed | really, i'd rather a warrior in WSG because of spell reflect |
| 09:19.01 | Corrodias | rather than banging my head against the horrible, horrible wall of pvp as a damage role, perhaps i should be healing |
| 09:19.01 | SunTiger | but i have cursed many a time at a damn bear that would not go damn well DIE. |
| 09:19.04 | Shadowed | since it's usually the large magic crits that kill me, not the melee one |
| 09:19.10 | Elkano | well, Corrodias, I always have my healer set with me... it's only abou 400 +heal but better than nothing |
| 09:19.40 | Corrodias | i have taken to putting the restoration set in the bank when i am not thinking i will need it, because i only use 16-slot bags |
| 09:19.43 | SunTiger | while the bear slowly but surely walk to the opponent base with out flag. |
| 09:20.06 | Corrodias | although i think i spent 600g on gems, items, and enchantment materials yesterday, so i don't know if it's worth being stingy vs getting larger bags :/ |
| 09:20.26 | Shadowed | 600g sounds about right |
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| 09:20.40 | Shadowed | SunTiger, let me guess Warrior? |
| 09:20.46 | SunTiger | rogue |
| 09:20.58 | Corrodias | i have lots of living rubies now, but no guildmates who can cut the +8 agility jewel yet |
| 09:21.15 | SunTiger | and i have been every damn spec out there. |
| 09:21.25 | SunTiger | exepct for 20/20/21 |
| 09:21.30 | SunTiger | except* |
| 09:21.34 | Shadowed | if it's only you attacking then you'll have issues anyway, but the same thing would happen with a warrior...theres just very little well geared warriors at 70 right now |
| 09:21.41 | Shadowed | anyway, sleep! |
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| 09:22.11 | SunTiger | no its not just me attacking, its my team + their team attacking us + healing the bear |
| 09:22.14 | Corrodias | every time i think about playing a hunter, it just gives me way too much stress |
| 09:22.22 | Elkano | Corrodias, I also only have 16 slot bags :/ and I usualy have my DPS, tank and healer set with me... I hardly had more than 20 slots free the past months ^^' |
| 09:22.27 | Corrodias | i don't think i'll ever get a hunter too far without going mad again |
| 09:22.35 | SunTiger | Corrodias, i stopped playing a hunter because its to damn easy. |
| 09:22.48 | Corrodias | for me, it's very complex |
| 09:23.05 | Corrodias | i suspect people who see it as easy do not push it to its performance limits |
| 09:23.12 | Shadowed | Sounds like someone needs to be SA/EAing him |
| 09:23.22 | SunTiger | thats not what i mean, playing a hunter makes the game itself , esepcially pvp, to easy. |
| 09:23.40 | SunTiger | really, i can kite almost anything around |
| 09:24.01 | SunTiger | and as a marks/beast i hurt a damn lot. |
| 09:24.15 | Corrodias | i fought a pretty good hunter today. he had me ice trapped twice, scattershotted twice, and scared beast twice while i was trying to kill him as a bear. i only just got him below half health, but that was a fun fight. |
| 09:24.49 | Corrodias | when i play a hunter, i tend to spend way too much time agonizing over names, pets, specs, pet specs, and action bar layout |
| 09:24.58 | SunTiger | lol |
| 09:25.23 | SunTiger | pet - go for whatever you like |
| 09:25.24 | SunTiger | pet spec- you are leveling armor and hp |
| 09:25.46 | SunTiger | layout well, you do have a lot of buttons to position |
| 09:25.52 | Corrodias | yes :( |
| 09:25.56 | SunTiger | on my rogues its easy, my hunter still struggles. |
| 09:25.58 | Corrodias | i think i have it all worked out |
| 09:26.23 | SunTiger | and names.. names are silly. |
| 09:26.26 | Corrodias | but then whenever i play near a hunter, i keep bitching silently to myself about how blizzard needs to give pets an overhaul |
| 09:26.53 | SunTiger | tell that to the infernals, high risk vs reward my ass |
| 09:26.56 | Corrodias | skill-learning, levelling, model choice, and the "caster stats" disease being issues that irritate me |
| 09:27.02 | SunTiger | hunter pets solo infernals and doomgaurds. |
| 09:27.22 | SunTiger | and that is with demo lock vs beast warrior. |
| 09:27.32 | Corrodias | oh, and pet abilities |
| 09:27.40 | Corrodias | spore bats have no damage-related abilities! |
| 09:27.54 | SunTiger | so ? |
| 09:31.21 | wereHamster | does anyone have experience with Fraps and TeamSpeak? Especially how well they work if both are capturing sound at the same time? |
| 09:32.01 | Mr_Rabies2 | i'd suppose that probably depends on your sound card among other things |
| 09:32.11 | Mr_Rabies2 | your best bet is likely to just try it out |
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| 09:32.33 | Corrodias | i mean, spore bats can't do anything but white damage attack and growl |
| 09:32.40 | Corrodias | they're in every way inferior to any other pet choice in terms of performance |
| 09:33.42 | Mr_Rabies2 | comparing lock and hunter pets is apples and oranges |
| 09:33.55 | Mr_Rabies2 | to get a new pet out, all a lock has to do is cast another spell |
| 09:35.01 | Mr_Rabies2 | plus he doesn't have to feed it, level it, train it, (other than buying grimoires) tame it, tame other pets to get spells for the one you like, keep its happiness up, etc |
| 09:35.20 | Mr_Rabies2 | it's like comparing vanish and feign death |
| 09:36.13 | Corrodias | actually |
| 09:36.22 | Corrodias | this is specifically about the doomguard |
| 09:36.48 | Corrodias | summoning a doomguard takes 5 people, including the warlock, and kills a random member of the party. then the doomguard has to be enslaved. |
| 09:36.56 | Corrodias | if the only warlock dies, you're toast |
| 09:37.09 | Corrodias | or would be if a doomguard were threatening in any way, which, by the sound of it, it really isn't. |
| 09:37.41 | Corrodias | that's another thing. what purpose does pet feeding have? i see no actual purpose for it. |
| 09:37.53 | Corrodias | maybe if your pet got temporary buffs based on what sort of food you feed it... |
| 09:38.28 | Corrodias | having to carry stacks of meat to click on every 20 minutes doesn't enhance the fun of the game in any way |
| 09:38.51 | Elkano | Corrodias, there is secific pet food in game now |
| 09:39.12 | Elkano | at least one item I know of |
| 09:40.13 | Corrodias | yeah, but it's not used like normal pet food |
| 09:41.46 | Elkano | well, didn't try on my hunter ^^ |
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| 09:44.40 | Mr_Rabies2 | it only gives the buff, no happiness effect afaik |
| 09:46.44 | Mr_Rabies2 | also, the doomguard may not be too much in the damage department (it's not bad at all honestly, but its spells are pretty awesome |
| 09:52.00 | Corrodias | i'm having a hard time finding a list of those spells on wowhead. what can it do? |
| 09:55.56 | Corrodias | "Although great whilst leveling, at 70 this sucks. Even with some decent healing gear on it's only about a 1.5k heal." -- referencing the draenei racial ability heal. this guy doesn't know what decent healing gear is, apparently. |
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| 10:10.41 | Calliee|Work | ... |
| 10:11.01 | Calliee|Work | I love the draenei racial heal |
| 10:11.09 | Corrodias | his statement puts "decent healing gear" at +420 healing |
| 10:11.20 | Calliee|Work | better than any HoT I've seen on a priest |
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| 10:25.45 | Corrodias | comments on the Jaina Proudmoore boss on wowhead and, i think, allakhazam indicate that people have had disciplinary action taken on their accounts for killing her |
| 10:26.51 | Corrodias | can't say if it's true or not |
| 10:32.20 | Corrodias | [away] @ sleep |
| 10:44.46 | Mr_Rabies2 | for farming her yeah |
| 10:44.56 | Mr_Rabies2 | she had a bug that she may still have |
| 10:45.01 | Mr_Rabies2 | that she respawns instantly |
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| 15:06.07 | JoshBorke | gah, i hate the limitations of lua regex :-/ |
| 15:06.31 | krka | it's lua patterns, not lua regex |
| 15:07.24 | JoshBorke | s/regex/patters/ |
| 15:07.31 | JoshBorke | s/regex/patterns/ |
| 15:07.35 | JoshBorke | :-P |
| 15:07.43 | JoshBorke | all i want is a simple OR |
| 15:07.48 | JoshBorke | is that too much to ask |
| 15:11.29 | krka | yes |
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| 15:11.51 | JoshBorke | :-( you crush all my dreams krka |
| 15:12.05 | krka | that's what i'm here for |
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| 15:13.57 | Shirik | JoshBorke: You could... |
| 15:14.21 | Shirik | match (%w) and then test that capture |
| 15:14.37 | Shirik | maybe |
| 15:14.41 | Shirik | depends on what you're trying to do |
| 15:15.06 | Shirik | I do wish lua implemented regexes though :/ |
| 15:17.30 | krka | implement them yourself :) |
| 15:17.45 | Shirik | Well they've already been implemented somewhere |
| 15:17.48 | Shirik | someone was talking about it |
| 15:17.55 | Shirik | but implementing it in lua would be ungodly slow |
| 15:17.58 | Shirik | at least I think so |
| 15:18.13 | Shirik | And we can't implement C in WoW for obvious reasons |
| 15:20.06 | Shirik | maybe I'll try it and see the speed on it |
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| 15:23.34 | krka | regex is overrated anyway |
| 15:23.41 | Shirik | I <333333 them |
| 15:23.46 | krka | if you need to do complex stuff, regex is the wrong way to do it |
| 15:23.56 | krka | write a proper tokenizer / grammar instead |
| 15:24.12 | Shirik | I know there are better ways to do it |
| 15:24.24 | Shirik | hell I've used regexes to parse XML before, even with a readibly accessible parser class |
| 15:24.31 | Shirik | but... it's just something that I find easy to use |
| 15:24.51 | Shirik | you can't deny they're powerful |
| 15:25.00 | krka | xml with regex? that's just nasty |
| 15:25.06 | Shirik | I know :P |
| 15:25.12 | Shirik | but I only needed it for a very specific purpose |
| 15:25.28 | Shirik | and using the SAX parser was just a lot more than I really needed |
| 15:25.37 | krka | i'm guilty of similar hacks actually |
| 15:25.43 | Shirik | I wanted to scrape a very specific (one single) line from a webpage |
| 15:25.59 | Shirik | so.... I wrote a regex to grab it, rather than trying to use the XML parser |
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| 15:51.52 | Nom- | *sigh* |
| 15:51.58 | Shirik | rawr! |
| 15:52.02 | Nom- | Why are so many PHP coders producing devilspawn? |
| 15:52.14 | Shirik | it's because php became popular in version 4 |
| 15:52.23 | Shirik | and at the time, that was the proper way to code |
| 15:52.52 | Nom- | pffft sif |
| 15:52.58 | Shirik | sif? |
| 15:53.04 | Nom- | Maybe in PHP, but every other language didn't do evils such as this |
| 15:53.10 | Nom- | hell |
| 15:53.18 | Nom- | when I learnt PHP I didn't write code this bad |
| 15:53.23 | Nom- | At least I used OO Classes |
| 15:53.30 | Shirik | then you didn't code in php 4 |
| 15:53.36 | Shirik | OOP didn't exist in php 4 |
| 15:53.36 | Nom- | and HTML templates instead of embedding everything and hard coding it |
| 15:53.44 | Nom- | Yes it did |
| 15:53.48 | Shirik | It was added in php 5 |
| 15:53.51 | Nom- | You could make a class and extend it |
| 15:54.02 | Nom- | That's all you need for OO |
| 15:54.39 | Nom- | http://au3.php.net/oop <-- right there |
| 15:54.41 | Shirik | hrm, I take that back, it was in 4 |
| 15:54.41 | Nom- | documented as in php4 |
| 15:54.45 | Shirik | yeah I'm looking at that right now :P |
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| 15:54.52 | Shirik | well rather http://us3.php.net/manual/en/language.oop.php |
| 15:55.00 | Shirik | same difference though |
| 15:55.41 | Shirik | you could probably argue that it's the same reason a lot of addons are written as "devilspawn" |
| 15:55.52 | Shirik | it's an easily accessible language to newer programmers |
| 15:55.56 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Legorol (i=Legorol@zr205.trin.cam.ac.uk) |
| 15:56.06 | Nom- | perl is even more easily accessible |
| 15:56.10 | pastamancer | Nom-: for exactly the same reason there's oodles of horrible VB code out there |
| 15:56.14 | Nom- | It's standard on every linux distro out there |
| 15:56.25 | Shirik | most newer programmers don't even use linux |
| 15:56.28 | Nom- | pastamancer: Depending on which kind of VB, that's not as true |
| 15:56.46 | pastamancer | last time I touched it was VB6 |
| 15:56.59 | Nom- | pastamancer: VBA, yes...True VB6 or VB.NET, that's just due to programmer stupidity...it's not exactly easy to start writing the VB app |
| 15:57.02 | Shirik | I pride myself on the fact that I've never touched VB :P |
| 15:57.05 | Nom- | Unless you pirate the software that is |
| 15:57.22 | pastamancer | Nom-: I think you answered your question then |
| 15:57.39 | Nom- | Yeah, well |
| 15:57.53 | Nom- | TBH, if it's been written by someone who pirated a copy of VB, then you'd expect it to be bad |
| 15:57.57 | pastamancer | not everyone who writes code is a "programmer" |
| 15:58.08 | Shirik | true statement. |
| 15:58.32 | pastamancer | there's a reason books like "learn java in 7 days" or whatever exist |
| 15:58.38 | pastamancer | because there's people buying t hem |
| 15:58.45 | pastamancer | and those people are writing code |
| 15:59.03 | Shirik | Yup |
| 15:59.17 | Nom- | Yeah, but some of those books aren't that bad |
| 15:59.21 | Shirik | I shelled out something like $150 like 8 years ago for VC++6 when I hadn't a clue what I was doing |
| 15:59.27 | Nom- | They teach *reasonable* OO prinicipals |
| 15:59.30 | Shirik | granted, I learned over time, and didn't release that code until I knew what I was doing |
| 15:59.36 | Shirik | but I'm sure the same principle applies |
| 15:59.56 | Nom- | My first steps into C++ were with a C++ in 10 days book |
| 16:00.08 | Shirik | I had bought VC++ and C++ for dummies at the same time :P |
| 16:00.34 | Nom- | If anything, i'd blame Microsoft for poor programming practices in Windows code |
| 16:00.40 | Nom- | They make it too easy to code |
| 16:00.43 | Shirik | hehe |
| 16:00.49 | Shirik | that's a bad thing? |
| 16:00.52 | Nom- | Which leads to people making stuff that barely just works |
| 16:00.57 | Nom- | ie. Poorly written |
| 16:01.12 | Shirik | I think some of the problems that exist are |
| 16:01.19 | Shirik | people program without actually knowing how a computer works |
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| 16:01.41 | Shirik | thus we get problems like buffer overflows which overwrite code thus executing arbitrary code |
| 16:01.44 | Legorol | My 2 pennies worth: did you know that you can write full fledged VB scripts with nothing but a standard out-of-the box Windows installation and Notepad? |
| 16:01.51 | Nom- | Anyway, my point remains... I've yet to see one PHP programmer who produces anything but complete and utter crap |
| 16:02.06 | Nom- | The only good ones are usually good because they work on other stuff, like Perl or C++ |
| 16:02.24 | Shirik | Well the thing is |
| 16:02.26 | Legorol | My other 2 pennies worth: programming language has nothing to do with programming skill. |
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| 16:02.35 | Shirik | you can't really write C (well) without knowing how a computer works |
| 16:02.46 | Shirik | you take that knowledge to PHP and you're better off |
| 16:02.49 | Shirik | it's an experience thing |
| 16:02.56 | Nom- | Yeah, you don't dive into C++ or even Perl without knowing what you're doing to some degree |
| 16:03.05 | Nom- | Compared to PHP, Perl is a much steeper learning curve |
| 16:03.16 | pastamancer | bwahaha, one of my hunter friends made the mistake of joking about nneeding to farm snakes for her snake traps. The result: http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g235/huntressgrendyl/snakes.jpg |
| 16:03.36 | Legorol | Why are you guys even comparing languages to one another? It's all about the environment you are presented with to program in, and the context you do it in. |
| 16:03.37 | Shirik | HAHA |
| 16:03.55 | Nom- | HAHA |
| 16:04.06 | Shirik | nice. |
| 16:04.17 | Nom- | We're not comparing, Legorol. Well, i'm not... |
| 16:04.43 | Legorol | There is no easier and harder language, or one that makes you program better, imo. There are contexts in which people want to jump in and create something, and the languages that tend to appear in that context. |
| 16:04.44 | Nom- | I'm just generalizing that most PHP programmers write awful code, and most C/C++ coders write good code :) |
| 16:05.06 | Shirik | Nom |
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| 16:05.16 | Nom- | note, i've quantified it as "most", meaning there are exceptions |
| 16:05.19 | Legorol | Let me rephrase your statement: most programmers that work in situation that use php write awful code, and most taht work in contexts that use c/c++ write better code. |
| 16:05.27 | Shirik | I'm a C coder... and you said you didn't like my PHP either :P |
| 16:05.32 | Legorol | Do notice i am blaming the context, not the language. |
| 16:05.33 | Shirik | granted you've only seen about 2 lines of my code but hey |
| 16:05.50 | Legorol | Perfect example: World of Warcraft. |
| 16:05.56 | Shirik | here let me show you what I consider to be a "good" example of my php |
| 16:06.07 | Legorol | Before WoW, Lua was an obscure scripting language used by a small group of programmers for specialist purposes. |
| 16:06.09 | Nom- | Shirik: Yes, but that was only an education problem...you didn't know about the much better way :) |
| 16:06.23 | Nom- | Shirik: You probably use the same godawful methods in C when you use MySQL, i bet? |
| 16:06.25 | Legorol | With WoW, we have a 10-million userbase environment, a lot of which wants to "script" or program WoW. |
| 16:06.36 | Shirik | Actually I don't combine C with MySQL |
| 16:06.38 | Legorol | and suddenly you get a bunch of people who don't know much about programming, starting to use Lua |
| 16:06.40 | Shirik | at least not yet |
| 16:06.52 | Shirik | I use C mostly with microcontrollers so |
| 16:06.54 | Legorol | Does this in any way reflect on the Lua language? No. |
| 16:06.57 | Shirik | can't really fit mysql in there |
| 16:07.05 | Nom- | Legorol: The scripting community for WoW is quite small compared to the userbase |
| 16:07.32 | Nom- | Legorol: I would take a stab in the dark that 30% of the entire userbase uses addons |
| 16:07.44 | Legorol | I know that full well, I am saying there are a lot of novices that don't know much about programming or anything at all, that were first drawn to it because of WoW |
| 16:07.45 | Nom- | But there's probably only 1 or 2% who have had a hand in actually writing any LUA |
| 16:07.58 | Legorol | I am not talking about hard numbers here |
| 16:08.11 | Legorol | I am trying to describe the way people end up in an environment which uses a particular language |
| 16:08.28 | Shirik | here Nom- what do you think: http://pastey.net/9420 |
| 16:08.31 | Legorol | Lua has seen an influx of inexperienced programmers, because of WoW. That's what I'm saying. |
| 16:08.32 | Shirik | aside from the obvious mysql flaw |
| 16:08.56 | Shirik | which we discussed yesterday |
| 16:08.59 | Legorol | It doesn't reflect on the language in any way. You wouldn't be able to say "Lua programmers are useless" |
| 16:09.18 | Legorol | Lua has been popularised, which attracted the lesser programmatically educated |
| 16:10.18 | Shirik | But Legorol I do have to stand beside my point |
| 16:10.26 | Shirik | people who don't know how a computer works tend to write poor code |
| 16:10.27 | Legorol | Hope this example explains why I cringe when I see statements like "php programmers this" and "C programmers that" |
| 16:10.41 | Legorol | Shirik, i completely agree with you |
| 16:10.45 | Nom- | Shirik: That looks pretty sane to me |
| 16:11.04 | Shirik | and the reason people say statements like "php programmers this" and "C programmers that" is because C natively requires an intimate knowledge of memory mapping, etc. |
| 16:11.09 | Nom- | Even with the MySQL flaw, it's much more sane than the code I was looking at :) |
| 16:11.16 | Legorol | Shirik: and that's where i start to disagree |
| 16:11.17 | Shirik | heh, well that's good |
| 16:11.28 | Legorol | It depends on the context in which C appears in. |
| 16:11.53 | Shirik | Nom-: I wrote that a while back when one of my pages was killing the site |
| 16:12.08 | Shirik | I was pretty happy with it ^^ |
| 16:12.54 | Shirik | Legorol: The reason I say this is because of things like, with garbage collectors and all that out there, many programmers without prior expreience start ignoring the fact that they have to worry about memory usage |
| 16:13.12 | Shirik | They don't bother to clean up memory or conserve it, they imagine if it disappears it'll get cleaned up |
| 16:13.17 | Legorol | which is what the point about a garbage collector is ;-) |
| 16:13.27 | Shirik | No, a garbage collector is not so you can forget about memory |
| 16:13.39 | Shirik | If anything, I think it means you have to worry about memory more |
| 16:13.49 | Legorol | if you had to worry about memory management when there is a GC, then it's either a bad garbage collector, or there is no point to it |
| 16:14.06 | Legorol | good example is Lua 5.0's GC |
| 16:14.09 | Shirik | that's the kind of attitude that makes /me/ cringe :/ |
| 16:14.29 | Legorol | it was a bad GC unsuitable for real time applications |
| 16:14.29 | Legorol | so we had to worry about memory use |
| 16:14.29 | Legorol | and we all had to learn |
| 16:14.33 | Legorol | with 5.1's GC, we have to worry less |
| 16:14.39 | Nom- | Quite honestly, as long as a PHP coder is made to understand the value of abstracting stuff into classes, and also of using templates instead of embedded HTML, their code improves immensly |
| 16:14.49 | Shirik | have to worry less doesn't mean not at all |
| 16:15.18 | Legorol | ok |
| 16:15.18 | Shirik | want to see a bad example Nom-? |
| 16:15.18 | Nom- | One of these days, I plan to port the perl DBIx::Class module into PHP |
| 16:15.33 | Shirik | One of the other coders on my team (that doesn't work on this anymore) |
| 16:15.41 | Legorol | By the way, I think this is an interesting analogy, which I always stood by: |
| 16:15.42 | Shirik | I'll probably be rewriting this page from scratch because it's really causing problems |
| 16:15.46 | Nom- | That'll be the day that PHP finally gets a decent DB Abstraction layer |
| 16:16.05 | Legorol | Just like with human speach, learning to speak is different from learning a language, same goes for programming. |
| 16:16.11 | Nom- | Shirik: I doubt you can show me anything that surprises me |
| 16:16.26 | Shirik | http://pastey.net/9421 |
| 16:16.34 | Shirik | this is actually a lot better than it was |
| 16:16.41 | Shirik | we didn't used to have template_top and template_bottom |
| 16:16.48 | Shirik | I made those because he duplicated the same code in every single page |
| 16:16.58 | Shirik | and it pissed me off when we wanted to change one thing we go change every page |
| 16:17.35 | Nom- | Quite frankly, i've seen a lot worse |
| 16:17.36 | Shirik | I hate lines like this too: <?php } ?> |
| 16:18.06 | Nom- | I doubt i'd be able to find an example now |
| 16:18.49 | Nom- | But i've worked on one script which had 8 nested loops, self-referencing functions (foo() calls bar(), bar() calls foo(), foo() calls foo()) |
| 16:18.57 | Nom- | It was a real dog's breakfast |
| 16:19.12 | Industrial | ack |
| 16:19.14 | Shirik | correct me if I'm wrong |
| 16:19.19 | Shirik | there was a time when php didn't allow recursive calls? |
| 16:19.24 | Shirik | or maybe that was another language |
| 16:19.32 | Shirik | hm I forget |
| 16:19.37 | Nom- | Nah, you're thinking of Javascript :) |
| 16:19.49 | Shirik | maybe |
| 16:20.11 | Nom- | It was nasty |
| 16:20.34 | Industrial | when do you need recursive calls on the web, tbh. |
| 16:20.34 | Nom- | There was like these massive nexted if-else statements to work out what to do on a particular invocation |
| 16:20.58 | Cide | um |
| 16:21.04 | Nom- | Yeah, it was nasty...ended up rewriting it in about 45 lines of PHP code and a Smarty template |
| 16:21.12 | Shirik | Hi Cide! |
| 16:21.15 | Cide | recursive calls are like standard in almost all programming languages |
| 16:21.17 | Cide | hi Shirik |
| 16:21.29 | Shirik | There was one language I know I came across that didn't allow it |
| 16:21.32 | Cide | it's a common programming practice and not specific to the application |
| 16:21.32 | Shirik | and I was like "what the hell?" |
| 16:21.38 | Nom- | Yeah, Javascript doesn't Shirik |
| 16:21.47 | Nom- | There is a way around it, but it's tricky |
| 16:21.55 | Shirik | I was just making a point, I forgot what it was; might have been Javascript |
| 16:21.57 | Industrial | I was going to use djangoproject.org for my next project at school but the client (the school itself actually) would only accept php :( |
| 16:22.06 | Shirik | though I never really used javascript much |
| 16:22.31 | Cide | django is made of win |
| 16:22.39 | Industrial | it certainly is :P |
| 16:22.43 | Nom- | lol the docs for this app are even worse |
| 16:22.51 | Nom- | It says to change the .htaccess file |
| 16:22.53 | Nom- | But there isn't one |
| 16:22.58 | Cide | make one :) |
| 16:23.10 | Nom- | Yeah, but it's a preconfigured one |
| 16:23.15 | Nom- | And it doesn't say what's mean to be in it |
| 16:24.13 | Shirik | Cide: By the way, it's true that Recursion is pretty standard practice, but it's also true that there are times you don't want to use it |
| 16:24.26 | Shirik | I mean, you could implement a factorial function like this: |
| 16:24.34 | Cide | well, yeah |
| 16:24.57 | Shirik | >>> function fact(n) if (n == 0) then return 1; else return n*fact(n-1); end end return fact(5); |
| 16:25.01 | Shirik | er.... |
| 16:25.09 | Shirik | well ok like that :P |
| 16:25.12 | Shirik | or like this |
| 16:25.13 | Cide | try again |
| 16:25.15 | Shirik | >>> function fact(n) if (n == 0) then return 1; else return n*fact(n-1); end end return fact(5); |
| 16:25.16 | Cide | Shirik: 120 |
| 16:25.41 | Cide | that's what memoization is for though :) |
| 16:25.51 | Shirik | >>> function fact(n) local a = 1; for x = 1,n do a = a * x; end return a; end return fact(5); |
| 16:25.51 | Cide | Shirik: 120 |
| 16:26.00 | Shirik | they're both the same, but one's obviously better |
| 16:26.56 | Shirik | Someone actually once said to me |
| 16:27.05 | Shirik | "If recursion is the answer, you're asking the wrong question" |
| 16:27.11 | Shirik | I can't say I completely agree with it as sometimes it's necessary |
| 16:27.16 | Shirik | but it does make some sense |
| 16:27.44 | Cide | >>> local c = { } local function _fact(n) local a = 1; for x = 1,n do a = a * x; end c[n] = a; return a; end return function fact(n) return c[n] or _fact(n); end fact(5); |
| 16:27.44 | Cide | Cide: [string "local c = { } local function _fact(n) local a = 1; for x = 1,n ..."]:1: '(' expected near 'fact' |
| 16:27.47 | Cide | meh |
| 16:28.02 | Cide | >>> local c = { } local function _fact(n) local a = 1; for x = 1,n do a = a * x; end c[n] = a; return a; end function fact(n) return c[n] or _fact(n); end return fact(5); |
| 16:28.02 | Cide | Cide: 120 |
| 16:28.06 | Shirik | At least now you get an error message instead of "attempt to call a nil value" |
| 16:28.36 | Cide | yeah :) |
| 16:28.42 | Shirik | >>> pcall(nil); return 1; |
| 16:28.42 | Cide | Shirik: 1 |
| 16:28.44 | Shirik | interesting |
| 16:28.51 | Shirik | I thought pcall threw an error if you passed in nil |
| 16:28.54 | Cide | >>> return pcall(nil) |
| 16:28.54 | Cide | Cide: false, "attempt to call a nil value" |
| 16:33.15 | Shirik | Hi Cairenn |
| 16:33.19 | Cairenn | hi Shirik |
| 16:40.30 | Nom- | ZZZ time |
| 16:40.36 | Shirik | it's |
| 16:40.42 | Shirik | 1 in the afternoon |
| 16:40.47 | Shirik | where I am |
| 16:41.04 | Shirik | that's like, 6PM UK, 10AM PDT... |
| 16:41.11 | Shirik | where do you live >< |
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| 18:39.57 | Kaso | My group of dead pixels on my monitor look like a little dog with a hat standing on its hind legs |
| 18:40.00 | Kaso | http://kasoo.net/img/imgs/DSCF0699.jpg |
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| 18:42.26 | TC_Working | lol |
| 18:42.39 | Shadowed | your monitor's talking to you kaso |
| 18:42.44 | TC_Working | droopy |
| 18:42.59 | Kaso | i was pissed when i saw them first, now its my little pal |
| 18:43.04 | Shadowed | haha |
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| 18:45.56 | kneeki|atwork | Morning Everyone |
| 18:53.11 | *** join/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@r35h14.res.gatech.edu) |
| 18:55.26 | JoshBorke | I HATE ALLERGIES! |
| 18:59.25 | JoshBorke | >>> return 'test' |
| 18:59.25 | Cide | JoshBorke: "test" |
| 18:59.49 | JoshBorke | >>> if (test = string.match('hello','h')) then return 'k' else return 'bah' end |
| 18:59.49 | Cide | JoshBorke: [string "if (test = string.match('hello','h')) then return 'k' else retu..."]:1: ')' expected near '=' |
| 19:00.10 | JoshBorke | darn |
| 19:01.59 | Shadowed | >>> if ( string.match( "hello", "h" ) ) then return "k"; else return "bah" end |
| 19:01.59 | Cide | Shadowed: "k" |
| 19:02.04 | Shadowed | >>> if ( string.match( "hello", "ht" ) ) then return "k"; else return "bah" end |
| 19:02.04 | Cide | Shadowed: "bah" |
| 19:02.59 | JoshBorke | Shadowed: i need to results of string.match _D |
| 19:03.23 | Shadowed | guess you can't short cut then! |
| 19:07.09 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Funkeh`` (n=funkydud@host81-129-145-5.range81-129.btcentralplus.com) |
| 19:10.35 | *** join/#wowi-lounge clad (i=jnwhiteh@fairfax.dreamhost.com) |
| 19:11.09 | JoshBorke | i'm sorry, i can't support horde druids |
| 19:11.19 | JoshBorke | s/i'm sorry,// |
| 19:11.49 | Legorol|away | Cide, how did the comma-at-end solution work out for your string matching needs? |
| 19:11.54 | clad | look what i can do now, heh =) |
| 19:11.56 | clad | http://wow.pastey.net/9442 |
| 19:12.25 | JoshBorke | clader? |
| 19:12.48 | Cide | Legorol: haven't tried it in practice yet, but I think it'll work out great :) |
| 19:12.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge cladwork (i=jnwhiteh@fairfax.dreamhost.com) |
| 19:12.58 | cladwork | uhh got d/c |
| 19:12.59 | JoshBorke | clad: er? |
| 19:12.59 | cladwork | apparently |
| 19:13.04 | JoshBorke | now there are 3 of you |
| 19:13.05 | Legorol | good, that's about the most useful thing i did in Lua in weeks :o) |
| 19:13.11 | cladwork | JoshBorke: huh? |
| 19:13.19 | JoshBorke | clad: what's that? |
| 19:13.28 | cladwork | JoshBorke: quest data, in full |
| 19:13.31 | JoshBorke | Legorol: i have something for you!! :-D write a distributed database in lua :-D |
| 19:13.53 | Legorol | yuck |
| 19:13.58 | JoshBorke | lol |
| 19:14.01 | Legorol | JoshBorke, that's, like, hard work! |
| 19:14.08 | JoshBorke | but really REALLY useful |
| 19:14.28 | JoshBorke | i'll love you forever, or at least until i forget |
| 19:14.35 | cladwork | JoshBorke: I can give you all quest data from wowhead, including comments as a lua table, for any quest |
| 19:14.47 | cladwork | well, i have the data to.. I probably won't go that insane for the addon. |
| 19:15.14 | JoshBorke | cladwork: you get the coroutines working? |
| 19:15.46 | cladwork | JoshBorke: yeah, but they're not necessary, cause I'm not going to allow searchin like that, on LightHeaded |
| 19:16.12 | JoshBorke | cladwork: do they work like you said they would? in parallel with the wow client? |
| 19:16.30 | cladwork | what do you mean? |
| 19:16.34 | cladwork | yes, that's HOW coroutines work |
| 19:17.16 | JoshBorke | but i was confused because wow is single threaded, so how could you have multi-threadedness within a single thread? |
| 19:17.20 | cladwork | anyone have a quest series that has more than one quest per "step".. like one that's both horde and alliance |
| 19:17.25 | cladwork | JoshBorke:its NOT multithreading. |
| 19:17.27 | cladwork | that' swhat i told you |
| 19:17.31 | cladwork | you should read the chapter on coroutines. |
| 19:17.46 | cladwork | it allows you to yield your lua work, and then resume it later, allowing the game to run |
| 19:17.55 | cladwork | its the single-threadedness that makes coroutines really useful |
| 19:18.04 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ecole (n=nospam@155.31.167.201) |
| 19:18.05 | JoshBorke | cladwork: http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=10680 |
| 19:18.06 | cladwork | cause you can do signifigant computation periodically, instead of all at once. |
| 19:18.21 | Shirik|Ecole | >>> return bit.band(255,155); |
| 19:18.21 | Cide | Shirik|Ecole: 155 |
| 19:18.40 | JoshBorke | how is that different than doing the computation in a stepwise process in an OnUpdate? |
| 19:18.45 | cladwork | woot, the parser handles that correctly |
| 19:19.18 | cladwork | JoshBorke: With coroutines, you don't have to specially code anything.. you take existing function A.), put coroutine.yield() at the yield point, and magic! |
| 19:19.33 | JoshBorke | lol, you forgot the positioning! |
| 19:19.39 | JoshBorke | 1 2 3 4 5 |
| 19:19.39 | JoshBorke | rogue rogue rogue |
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| 19:21.43 | cladwork | hrm.. my scrape is missing almost 1.5k quests |
| 19:21.49 | cladwork | i guess i have to run it again tonight, heh |
| 19:22.00 | cladwork | 3200 quests ends up being a 9 meg file at this point |
| 19:22.10 | cladwork | but thats just blegh raw data, in indexed tables. |
| 19:22.42 | JoshBorke | how does decompression work? do you decompress the entire table? |
| 19:22.58 | JoshBorke | or do you compress by quest? |
| 19:23.02 | cladwork | by quest |
| 19:23.11 | cladwork | as they're requested |
| 19:23.22 | cladwork | anything that needs to be searchable is in the table key |
| 19:23.25 | cladwork | and left out of the data |
| 19:23.34 | cladwork | if i were to go insanely nuts on what you can do with this mod |
| 19:23.40 | cladwork | i'm frankly, happy if it stays right where it is. |
| 19:23.45 | cladwork | giving you comments on quests in your log =) |
| 19:24.20 | JoshBorke | question for the peanut crowd: any way i could use metatables to tell me what value was set for what key when they are first set? without doing the business of a 'shadow' table? |
| 19:24.52 | Cide | __newindex? |
| 19:25.32 | JoshBorke | ok, so __newindex takes in the value |
| 19:25.35 | JoshBorke | k, thanks |
| 19:25.54 | Cide | >>> t = setmetatable({}, { __newindex = function(self, k, v) rawset(self, k, v) print("set " .. k .. " to " .. v) end }) t[1] = "hi", t["moo"] = "foobar" |
| 19:25.54 | Cide | Cide: [string "t = setmetatable({}, { __newindex = function(self, k, v) rawset..."]:1: unexpected symbol near '=' |
| 19:26.14 | Cide | >>> t = setmetatable({}, { __newindex = function(self, k, v) rawset(self, k, v) print("set " .. k .. " to " .. v) end }) t[1] = "hi" t["moo"] = "foobar" |
| 19:26.14 | Cide | Cide: "set 1 to hi", "set moo to foobar" |
| 19:26.50 | JoshBorke | kk, thanks |
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| 19:34.09 | Shadowed | Anyone delt with making a SavedVariable parser before? |
| 19:35.27 | Kaso | Just impliment the lua interpreter into your app, seeing as SV's are valid lua code |
| 19:35.43 | Shadowed | it's a Java app |
| 19:35.57 | Kaso | ah |
| 19:35.59 | Kaso | then maybe not |
| 19:36.32 | Shirik | why not |
| 19:36.50 | Shirik | meh, I guess it's more work than it's worth |
| 19:37.05 | Shirik | Shadowed: It can't be hard, especially in java |
| 19:37.17 | Shirik | all you have is variable = <some array> |
| 19:37.17 | kergoth | pretty sure there's already java<->lua bindings somewhere. |
| 19:37.20 | kergoth | check luauforge |
| 19:37.23 | Shirik | where the array is [key] = [pair] |
| 19:37.24 | Shirik | over and over |
| 19:37.24 | kergoth | luaforge, even |
| 19:40.07 | Shadowed | Seems like a lot of extra stuff added to parse them |
| 19:49.22 | Industrial | somebody tell me the name of a good (iyo) artist :P |
| 19:49.31 | JoshBorke | what kind of artist? |
| 19:49.37 | Industrial | i dont care |
| 19:49.41 | Industrial | im bored need something new |
| 19:49.43 | Industrial | :D |
| 19:51.27 | Industrial | :D? |
| 19:51.44 | Industrial | as long as its not 'urban' |
| 19:51.49 | Industrial | *twitch* |
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| 20:03.58 | Simeon | yo |
| 20:05.40 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Andalia (i=xx@p54ACA7E6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:19.24 | TC_Working | wow...they have a countdown for GTA IV. http://www.rockstargames.com/IV/ |
| 20:21.23 | Kirkburn|afk | zomg two days, zomg, zomg |
| 20:21.57 | Kirkburn|afk | Apparently they recently had a half-hour advert on TV which consisted of that countdown |
| 20:23.48 | TC_Working | sad |
| 20:28.35 | zenzelezz | I swear there's a new version of NoScript every time I restart Firefox |
| 20:29.59 | TC_Working | then dont restart firefox |
| 20:30.33 | zenzelezz | I do it once a week usually |
| 20:31.51 | zenzelezz | more because Kaspersky keeps insisting I reboot that because I feel a need to restart Firefox |
| 20:33.59 | Shirik | noscript is pointless anyway |
| 20:34.23 | zenzelezz | I like it |
| 20:34.29 | zenzelezz | obviously |
| 20:34.32 | Shirik | why though? |
| 20:35.06 | zenzelezz | because it prevents lots of websites from doing stupid stuff with javascript |
| 20:35.23 | Shirik | don't go to stupid sites :P |
| 20:35.42 | zenzelezz | you're dull to talk to |
| 20:36.26 | Shirik | I just point out the obvious :P |
| 20:37.22 | zenzelezz | no, you point out the stupid |
| 20:37.47 | zenzelezz | noscript is like anti-virus. If you're confident you will never under any circumstances contract it, feel free not to use it, but you're only putting yourself at risk |
| 20:37.59 | zenzelezz | and the Internet is one big mess of links to stupid sites |
| 20:38.06 | Shirik | Javascript can't install crap on your computer |
| 20:38.13 | Shirik | worst it's going to do is spam you with popups |
| 20:38.16 | Shirik | or something like that |
| 20:38.23 | Gryphen | i visit the crappiest of sites in IE and have no trouble with javascript |
| 20:38.29 | Shirik | I find the benefits of javascript outweigh the problems |
| 20:38.50 | zenzelezz | if I want a site to use it I simply allow it |
| 20:39.20 | zenzelezz | disallowing it by default just saves me from crappy sites taking up resources and slowing the browser |
| 20:39.45 | Gryphen | i upgraded from my pentium 90 |
| 20:40.11 | zenzelezz | talking to you is like talking to a brick wall, only less interesting |
| 20:41.29 | Gryphen | that was pretty good |
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| 21:15.49 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Mortius (i=Mortius@ppp-71-128-207-76.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net) |
| 21:17.08 | Mortius | I've been trying off and on to get a custom dropdown menu to work in my addon, and I've never been successful. I've followed the wowwiki's help, heck I cut and paste the code even, and that didn't work, although its very vague. |
| 21:19.08 | Mortius | I've tried putting the code from wowwiki into the existing frame that I want to have a dropdown menu, I've tried putting it in it's own XML, I've put the function calls it lists in my .lua and also tried them in the various events in the xml, and every combination of those, all with no popup showing up. |
| 21:19.52 | Mortius | wondering if anyone can make sense of this : http://www.wowwiki.com/HOWTO:_Use_UIDropDownMenu |
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| 21:31.38 | Corrodias | man, you guys have been busy with the talking today |
| 21:32.06 | TC_Working | hmm..it's kinda interesting to see yourself singed of then on again |
| 21:32.13 | TC_Working | signed* |
| 21:34.41 | *** join/#wowi-lounge ag`_ (n=ag`@0x503e79d4.bynxx18.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk) |
| 21:37.07 | Mortius | anyone know if there is a better tutorial for using UIDropDownMenu than WoWWiki? |
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| 22:07.48 | Mortius | Can you use CreateFrame to make a messageframe? |
| 22:08.07 | Tem | yes |
| 22:08.15 | Tem | which type of message frame do you want? |
| 22:08.29 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=MikeNGoS@64.193.93.197) |
| 22:08.30 | Tem | CreateFrame("ScrollingMessageFrame",frameName,parent,template) |
| 22:08.32 | Mortius | I just want a message that will fade |
| 22:08.44 | Mortius | okay , I was putting "MessageFrame" |
| 22:08.50 | Mortius | and getting an error |
| 22:09.09 | Tem | what error? |
| 22:09.13 | Tem | because that should be fine |
| 22:09.31 | Mortius | it's a "USAGE:" error |
| 22:09.36 | Mortius | telling me I'm using createframe wrong |
| 22:09.41 | Tem | show me your full call |
| 22:10.05 | Mortius | do I have to put something for template? |
| 22:10.17 | Mortius | I probably have quotes around the wrong thing |
| 22:10.26 | Mortius | local newFrame = CreateFrame("MessageFrame", "TooFarToFollow", "ParentUI"); |
| 22:10.41 | *** part/#wowi-lounge kneeki|atwork (n=kneeki|a@66-193-135-142.static.twtelecom.net) |
| 22:10.42 | AnduinLothar | UIParent? |
| 22:10.51 | MentalPower | and UIParent can't be a string |
| 22:10.52 | Tem | the third value needs to be a direct frame reference not a string |
| 22:10.54 | Mortius | oh thats what I did wrong |
| 22:10.58 | MentalPower | it has to be a frame reference |
| 22:11.05 | Tem | also, I supect you want UIParent instead of ParentUI |
| 22:11.08 | Mortius | So UIParent, no quotes |
| 22:11.10 | Mortius | yes,. lol |
| 22:11.11 | MentalPower | aye |
| 22:11.14 | Tem | s/sup/suspect/ |
| 22:11.20 | Tem | s/sup/susp/ |
| 22:11.40 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=MikeNGoS@64.193.93.197) |
| 22:12.54 | Mortius | well the error went away at least hehe |
| 22:13.38 | Mortius | okay, mind to tell me what else I'm doing wrong here: http://wowi.pastey.net/9452 |
| 22:13.41 | Mortius | :D |
| 22:14.34 | Mortius | not sure what else I need to set to make that appear |
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| 22:18.45 | Mr_Rabies2 | http://music-news.com/ShowNews.asp?nItemID=13535 |
| 22:18.52 | Mr_Rabies2 | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:19.04 | Mr_Rabies2 | like a fel reaver, only more frightening :O |
| 22:20.31 | Mortius | Am I missing a lot of stuff in there to make the message show? http://wowi.pastey.net/9452 |
| 22:20.58 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Karrion (n=kieron@corp-gw01.imrworldwide.com) |
| 22:22.43 | ZealotOnAStick | Mr_Rabies: That's one of the worst things I've seen in a while. |
| 22:23.02 | Mr_Rabies2 | i can't say i'm opposed to the idea no matter how impossible it would be |
| 22:23.14 | Shirik | Mortius: |
| 22:23.28 | Mortius | yes? |
| 22:23.46 | Shirik | Use frame:SetPoint("CENTER", UIParent, "CENTER", 0, 0); |
| 22:23.46 | Mortius | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:24.25 | Shirik | also |
| 22:24.42 | Mortius | hmm, still no workie :( |
| 22:24.51 | Shirik|Fooding | I'll look at it from the cafeteria |
| 22:24.54 | Shirik|Fooding | look for Shirik|Ecole |
| 22:25.05 | Mortius | lol okay thanks |
| 22:25.07 | Shirik|Fooding | they close in 30 min I have to get there :P |
| 22:25.26 | Mortius | np man :) |
| 22:28.33 | Mortius | I also don't want a million of those frames everytime they try to follow someone too far away.. will it keep making more than one even though they have the same name? or will it destroy the old one in the process? |
| 22:30.27 | Cide | you can't destroy frames |
| 22:30.44 | Corrodias | hey, how can a priest resurrect during an arena match, with a paladin and a warlock with as teammates? |
| 22:31.00 | Corrodias | i thought resurrection spells were banned, and soulstones have too long a cooldown afaik |
| 22:31.05 | Cide | they are |
| 22:31.06 | clad|dinner | resurrection spells are not banned |
| 22:31.14 | Cide | I'm pretty sure they are clad|dinner |
| 22:31.14 | clad|dinner | if you get ooc, you can res someone |
| 22:31.17 | clad|dinner | *shake* |
| 22:31.18 | clad|dinner | rebirth is |
| 22:31.25 | clad|dinner | there was a thread about it a week or two ago |
| 22:31.38 | Shadowed | rebirth is banned because of the cooldown |
| 22:31.39 | clad|dinner | its only spells with cooldowns longer than 15 minutes, and res has no cooldown |
| 22:31.41 | Mortius | so is that a problem then? I mean, my code is creating a frame everytime someone trys to follow someone too far away |
| 22:31.41 | clad|dinner | Shadowed: aye |
| 22:31.47 | Mike-N-Go | Hi! |
| 22:31.54 | clad|dinner | Mortius: re-use your frame |
| 22:32.09 | Cide | ya, you're right clad |
| 22:32.12 | Mortius | so just create it once in an onload, then use it? |
| 22:32.15 | Shadowed | we've ressed team mates in arena matches for the hell of it, rarely can you actually use it to win the match |
| 22:32.27 | clad|dinner | Mortius: Is that works for your needs, then absolutely |
| 22:32.47 | Mortius | okay, now I just have to find out how come its not showing and I'll be set :D |
| 22:32.51 | Shadowed | Actually, technically can't you get rebirth down to 12m clad|dinner? I though the AQ40 set bonus reduced it along with talents |
| 22:33.14 | clad|dinner | possibley =) |
| 22:33.16 | clad|dinner | -e |
| 22:33.19 | Shadowed | hmm... |
| 22:33.28 | Shadowed | what do your talents reduce rebirth by? |
| 22:34.05 | clad|dinner | dont remember |
| 22:34.36 | Shadowed | hmm do they even have a talent to reduce it? i don't see one |
| 22:35.26 | Antiarc|Work | Spells are banned based on their base time, not talented/bonused times, IIRC |
| 22:35.45 | Shadowed | Soemones already tested I assume then? |
| 22:35.48 | Shadowed | someone too |
| 22:37.08 | Mortius | which one of these ways is it suppose to be done? http://wowi.pastey.net/9453 or http://wowi.pastey.net/9452 ? Not that either of these work.. but still. |
| 22:43.10 | Karrion | Mortius: those should function the same |
| 22:44.01 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ecole (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 22:44.16 | Shirik|Ecole | ok Mortius |
| 22:44.21 | Shirik|Ecole | got the pastey link again? |
| 22:44.35 | Corrodias | does the arena just -seem- incredibly unbalanced in favor of rogues, mages, and warlocks, or is it just me? |
| 22:44.52 | Corrodias | paladins too if not interrupted |
| 22:44.56 | Shirik|Ecole | It's somewhat true |
| 22:45.33 | Mortius | thanks karrion; Shirik: http://wowi.pastey.net/9452 |
| 22:45.54 | Mortius | do I need a setfont? |
| 22:46.03 | Shirik|Ecole | and it won't appear? |
| 22:46.17 | Mortius | nope |
| 22:47.29 | Corrodias | as a healer, i'm dead before i can cast a single spell if they have a rogue |
| 22:47.34 | Corrodias | every time |
| 22:47.44 | Shirik|Ecole | I don't know if this is required |
| 22:47.52 | Corrodias | but i think every class is pretty much an open book for rogues |
| 22:47.57 | Mortius | I added :SetInsertMode("BOTTOM") |
| 22:47.58 | Shirik|Ecole | but try SetTimeVisile() too |
| 22:48.01 | Mortius | okay |
| 22:48.06 | Corrodias | and when i say "open book" i mean "easy kill" |
| 22:48.11 | Shirik|Ecole | s/Visi/Visib/ |
| 22:48.27 | Shirik|Ecole | SetFont may also be required |
| 22:48.42 | Shirik|Ecole | but SetFontObject > SetFont |
| 22:49.08 | Shirik|Ecole | at least, it would be easier to use to start off with, allowing us to see if that's the problem |
| 22:50.00 | Mortius | ok, is it SetFontObject("Fonts/Fritz__.TTF"); ? I forget .. |
| 22:50.29 | *** join/#wowi-lounge wobin (n=wobin@218-214-59-86.people.net.au) |
| 22:52.12 | Shirik|Ecole | nah |
| 22:52.16 | Shirik|Ecole | just something like |
| 22:52.17 | Mortius | I tried SetFont("Interface/AddOns/dem0n/dem0n.ttf", 10); |
| 22:52.23 | Mortius | which is my font I use for everything |
| 22:52.57 | Shirik|Ecole | for example, WoWWiki uses the example SetFontObject(GameTooltipTextSmall) |
| 22:53.07 | Mortius | ah I see |
| 22:54.13 | Mortius | I looked at witchhunt which adds message frames and does all this, and I set everything that addon does and still not getting anything to show up |
| 22:54.50 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ghost (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 22:54.59 | Shirik|Ghost | grr |
| 22:55.05 | Shirik|Ghost | I didn't register my Shirik|Ecole nick >.> |
| 22:55.10 | Shirik|Ghost | oh well |
| 22:55.25 | Shirik|Ghost | anyway... |
| 22:55.27 | Mortius | this is what I currently have : http://wowi.pastey.net/9454 |
| 22:55.28 | Shirik|Ghost | Are you sure you're adding a message? |
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| 22:56.32 | Shirik|Ghost | impressive |
| 22:56.35 | Shirik|Ghost | that's the worst ping ever. |
| 22:56.36 | Mortius | yeah, I have just above that a ChatFrame1:AddMessage("working.."); |
| 22:56.42 | Shirik|Ghost | (18:56:05) [CTCP: Shirik|Ghost] PING |
| 22:56.43 | Shirik|Ghost | (18:56:28) [CTCP PING reply from Shirik|Ghost]: 22.687s |
| 22:56.47 | Shirik|Ghost | My school's network sucks. |
| 22:57.03 | Shirik|Ghost | yes that's 22 seconds, not ms |
| 22:57.10 | Mortius | wow |
| 22:57.59 | Shirik|Ghost | you know |
| 22:58.01 | Shirik|Ghost | now that I look at this |
| 22:58.08 | Shirik|Ghost | nm I counted wrong |
| 22:59.48 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ghost12 (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 22:59.52 | Shirik|Ghost12 | I'm going to kill my school |
| 23:00.23 | Shirik|Ghost12 | and you're sure that font exists, right? |
| 23:00.34 | Mortius | yes, I use that everywhere |
| 23:00.58 | Shirik|Ghost12 | what's with your irratic use of semicolons :P |
| 23:01.02 | Shirik|Ghost12 | You use them on like half the lines |
| 23:01.18 | Shirik|Ghost12 | most people either always or never use them |
| 23:01.46 | Mortius | I thought you had to haha |
| 23:02.10 | Mortius | oh yeah I'm missing two |
| 23:02.14 | Mortius | I added them in :P |
| 23:02.20 | Shirik|Ghost12 | try frame strata dialog |
| 23:02.35 | Shirik|Ghost12 | shouldn't matter, but what the hell |
| 23:03.04 | Shirik|Ghost12 | and stupid questions coming now |
| 23:03.10 | Shirik|Ghost12 | You aren't getting any lua errors, right? |
| 23:03.13 | Mortius | right |
| 23:03.23 | Mortius | I would mention those hehe |
| 23:04.33 | Shirik|Ecole | oh |
| 23:04.38 | Shirik|Ecole | you don't have to ClearAllPoints() btw |
| 23:04.57 | Mortius | okay, I added that in there because that is what witchhunter does |
| 23:04.59 | Shirik|Ecole | do you have devtools installed? |
| 23:05.06 | Shirik|Ecole | it doesn't hurt, but it's not necessary either |
| 23:05.06 | Mortius | yes |
| 23:05.14 | Shirik|Ecole | do /dump TooFarToFollow |
| 23:05.19 | Shirik|Ecole | it exists right? |
| 23:05.34 | Mortius | let me check, I need to enable devtools on this character im testing with |
| 23:05.51 | Mortius | I had turned off all addons but mine to test |
| 23:05.58 | Shirik|Ecole | not a bad idea |
| 23:07.25 | *** join/#wowi-lounge bleetah (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter) |
| 23:07.27 | Mortius | it said nil at first, and then I tried to follow someone too far away, now it says = [0] <userdata TooFarToFollow[0]> |
| 23:08.01 | Shirik|Ecole | I |
| 23:08.08 | Shirik|Ecole | hrm |
| 23:08.21 | Shirik|Ecole | change that CreateFrame line to |
| 23:08.43 | Shirik|Ecole | TooFarToFollow = CreateFrame("MessageFrame", nil, UIParent); |
| 23:08.55 | Mortius | ok one sec |
| 23:08.59 | Shirik|Ecole | then try again |
| 23:09.08 | *** part/#wowi-lounge bleetah (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter) |
| 23:09.30 | Mortius | same result |
| 23:09.59 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Wictory (i=Wictory@81-233-60-147-no71.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 23:10.10 | Mortius | im hoping I dont have an invisible frame on top of this hiding it or something |
| 23:10.11 | Shirik|Ecole | what about /dump TooFarToFollow.AddMessage |
| 23:10.22 | Shirik|Ecole | if it were inivisible it wouldn't be hiding it |
| 23:10.24 | Shirik|Ecole | think about that |
| 23:10.27 | Mortius | true |
| 23:10.37 | Wictory | hi all |
| 23:10.42 | Shirik|Ecole | evening |
| 23:10.59 | Mortius | [1]=<function> |
| 23:11.07 | Shirik|Ecole | odd, but ok |
| 23:11.08 | Shirik|Ecole | that's good |
| 23:11.29 | Shirik|Ecole | I thought frames were tables not userdata though :/ |
| 23:11.31 | Shirik|Ecole | w/e |
| 23:11.40 | Wictory | anyon of you guys got nice spelldamage gear? |
| 23:12.58 | Wictory | woud like to find some reaserch of the trinket "six demon bag" |
| 23:13.24 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ghost12 (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 23:13.59 | Mortius | Six Demon Bag info, scroll near the bottom: http://www.thottbot.com/?i=5660 |
| 23:14.00 | Shirik|Ecole | Mortius: You try that command? |
| 23:14.25 | Mortius | I didn't see anything since /dump TooFarToFollow.AddMessage |
| 23:14.39 | Shirik|Ecole | (19:12:06) (Shirik|Ecole) ok so TooFarToFollow exists |
| 23:14.39 | Shirik|Ecole | (19:12:18) (Shirik|Ecole) what happens when you do /script TooFarToFollow:AddMessage("Test"); |
| 23:14.46 | Wictory | yeah i have find some there... but thottbot more feels like there is a bunch of trash peeps just talking shit :P |
| 23:14.47 | Mortius | yeah that never showed |
| 23:15.01 | Shirik|Ecole | my school's netops are morons, sorry |
| 23:15.22 | Mortius | That doesn't do anything, no errors and it doesn't show |
| 23:15.35 | Shirik|Ecole | interesting |
| 23:15.43 | Mortius | Wictory: on that page though, someone in the comments actually did a rundown of everything six demon bag does |
| 23:16.00 | Shirik|Ecole | capture the SetFont returns |
| 23:17.15 | Mortius | im not sure I know how to do that.. heh |
| 23:17.34 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ghost12 (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 23:17.38 | Shirik|Ghost12 | *sigh* |
| 23:17.53 | Shirik|Ecole | ns identify eldarrox |
| 23:17.58 | Shirik|Ecole | oh go me |
| 23:17.59 | clad|dinner | pwnt |
| 23:18.04 | Shirik|Ecole | time to change passwords again :P |
| 23:18.29 | Wictory | what characters you folks play ? |
| 23:19.06 | Shirik|Ecole | dwarf male, BE priest, dwarf priest |
| 23:19.20 | Mortius | i have a BE mage currently |
| 23:19.34 | Wictory | well atleast that dwarf male is a intresting class;) |
| 23:19.43 | Wictory | kk |
| 23:19.49 | snaked | Orc warrior is the only way to go. |
| 23:19.54 | Shirik|Ecole | Mortius: All I mean is |
| 23:19.55 | Shirik|Ecole | do something like |
| 23:20.03 | snaked | The twisting nether favors the blood sponges. |
| 23:20.06 | Wictory | i started a be paladin lvl 65 so far:/ |
| 23:20.12 | Shirik|Ecole | mytempvar = TooFarFrame:AddMessage(... |
| 23:20.13 | Shirik|Ecole | that line |
| 23:20.21 | Shirik|Ecole | and then when you load up, after that line is executed however your addon does it |
| 23:20.25 | Shirik|Ecole | do a /dump mytempvar |
| 23:20.27 | Shirik|Ecole | to see what's in there |
| 23:20.45 | Mortius | kk |
| 23:21.04 | *** join/#wowi-lounge bleetah (n=Bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter) |
| 23:21.17 | Wictory | found a intresting macro a couple of days ago tho:/ were you can trick the forberence on a pally |
| 23:21.36 | Shirik|Ecole | "trick"? |
| 23:21.43 | Shirik|Ecole | Macros do exactly what they are intended to do |
| 23:21.49 | Mortius | mytempvar = nil |
| 23:21.50 | Shirik|Ecole | er... what they are written to do |
| 23:21.50 | Wictory | well |
| 23:21.52 | Shirik|Ecole | ok |
| 23:21.57 | Shirik|Ecole | then your SetFont() isn't working correctly |
| 23:21.59 | Shirik|Ecole | that's the problem |
| 23:22.01 | Wictory | i try explain it to uyou |
| 23:22.19 | Shirik|Ecole | try doing something pre-installed |
| 23:22.27 | Shirik|Ecole | like use SetFontObject(SystemFont); |
| 23:23.06 | *** join/#wowi-lounge chuckg (i=chuckg@66-237-5-116.starstream.net) |
| 23:23.35 | Mortius | ok it finally showed up |
| 23:23.40 | Shirik|Ecole | :D |
| 23:23.43 | Shirik|Ecole | there's something wrong with that font |
| 23:23.46 | Mortius | hehe thanks :) |
| 23:23.47 | Wictory | divine shield the "gay bubble" makes the paladin get forberence so he cant cast for example Avenging Wrath for 1min |
| 23:23.52 | Shirik|Ecole | SetFont() only returns nil when it doesn't work correctly |
| 23:23.53 | Mortius | I use that font for all the labels |
| 23:23.56 | Shirik|Ecole | it returns 1 if the font was applied |
| 23:24.06 | Wictory | but i got a macro so i coud trick it so you can cast both of the spells on the same time |
| 23:24.18 | Shirik|Ecole | what both spells? |
| 23:24.21 | Mortius | okay thanks a lot for all your help Shirik. I can make it work from this. |
| 23:24.22 | Shirik|Ecole | oh |
| 23:24.24 | Shirik|Ecole | avenging wrath |
| 23:24.29 | Wictory | divine shield and avenging wrath |
| 23:24.31 | Wictory | yeah |
| 23:24.33 | Shirik|Ecole | what does that do? |
| 23:24.41 | Shirik|Ecole | Mortius: No problem |
| 23:24.44 | Wictory | increese the paladins damage by 30 procent |
| 23:25.04 | Shirik|Ecole | You can't cast Avenging Wrath while under forebearance? |
| 23:25.05 | Wictory | but it shoud cause forberence it isent supposed to be able to cast both of them |
| 23:25.13 | Shirik|Ecole | I thought you just couldn't cast divine shield with it up |
| 23:25.21 | Wictory | when u use ither of the abillitys |
| 23:25.30 | Wictory | divine shield or avenging wrath |
| 23:25.49 | Wictory | it shoud be a 1 min forberence wich you cant use ither of them again |
| 23:26.14 | Wictory | but i made a macro wich i read on a site so you can use both of them on the same time becuse of a macro |
| 23:26.42 | Wictory | i think i can find a clip whit it |
| 23:26.45 | Wictory | sec |
| 23:26.55 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ghost12 (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 23:27.23 | Shirik|Ecole | The Forbearance debuff reads "Cannot be made invulnerable by Divine Shield, Divine Protection or Blessing of Protection." |
| 23:27.29 | Shirik|Ecole | That doesn't say anything about avenging wrath :/ |
| 23:28.02 | batrick | so you can't overload functions in lua? |
| 23:28.20 | Shirik|Ecole | might be a typo |
| 23:28.24 | Shirik|Ecole | Batrick: Not exactly |
| 23:28.25 | Wictory | hmm... well ingame when i use avenging wrath i get forberence :/ |
| 23:28.28 | Shirik|Ecole | probably not in the way you think |
| 23:28.33 | Shirik|Ecole | What you can do |
| 23:28.43 | Shirik|Ecole | function foo(bar, baz) |
| 23:28.51 | Shirik|Ecole | and it's legal to call both foo(bar) and foo(bar, baz) |
| 23:28.57 | Shirik|Ecole | if you do foo(bar) then baz == nil |
| 23:29.08 | Shirik|Ecole | oh it's also legal to call foo() |
| 23:29.12 | Shirik|Ecole | in which case bar and baz are both nil |
| 23:29.51 | Shirik|Ecole | >>> function foo(bar, baz) return bar or "nil", baz or "nil"; end return foo(); |
| 23:29.52 | Cide | Shirik|Ecole: "nil", "nil" |
| 23:29.54 | Shirik|Ecole | see? |
| 23:30.23 | Shirik|Ecole | but, creating two functions with the same name doesn't work |
| 23:31.03 | Shirik|Ecole | >>> foo = function() return 1; end; foo = function(bar) return 2; end; return foo(); |
| 23:31.03 | Cide | Shirik|Ecole: 2 |
| 23:31.09 | Shirik|Ecole | It will always just overwrite the old function |
| 23:31.14 | batrick | i see |
| 23:31.24 | Mortius | yeah, it wont work with my font, which is just morpheous font. I use that in my XML via : <FontString name="$parentLabel" setAllPoints="true" font="Interface\AddOns\dem0n\dem0n.TTF" justifyV="BOTTOM" justifyH="RIGHT"> |
| 23:31.33 | batrick | thanks shirik :) |
| 23:31.36 | Shirik|Ecole | np |
| 23:32.20 | Mortius | but if I do :SetFont("Interface\AddOns\dem0n\dem0n.TTF", 12); it no workie |
| 23:32.29 | Wictory | damn to bad i cant show you guys:P |
| 23:32.31 | batrick | that's what I suspected, o well. apparently DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage() was handling all my enthusiastic attempts at overloading :) |
| 23:32.34 | Wictory | its hard to explain it |
| 23:33.25 | *** join/#wowi-lounge Shirik|Ghost12 (n=nospam@155.31.161.72) |
| 23:33.29 | Shirik|Ghost12 | As I was saying |
| 23:33.31 | Shirik|Ghost12 | does avenging wrath cause the GCD? |
| 23:34.18 | Wictory | gcd sorry for being nobich |
| 23:34.26 | Wictory | global cooldown? |
| 23:34.28 | Shirik|Ghost12 | GCD = Global Cool Down |
| 23:34.28 | Shirik|Ghost12 | yeah |
| 23:34.44 | Wictory | yes it causes the same global cool down as divine shield |
| 23:34.52 | Wictory | thats the bug thing whit it |
| 23:34.57 | Shirik|Ghost12 | then ... how did you write the macro |
| 23:35.31 | Mortius | hmm, even :SetFont("Fonts\FRIZQT__.TTF", 18); doesn't work, I must be doing something wrong. |
| 23:35.43 | Wictory | cant write the / |
| 23:35.48 | Shirik|Ecole | I don't use SetFont personally |
| 23:35.59 | Shirik|Ecole | I find SetFontObject to work far more easily |
| 23:35.59 | Wictory | but it is by following /cast Avenging Wrath |
| 23:36.08 | Wictory | ..../stopcasting |
| 23:36.20 | Wictory | .../cast divine shield |
| 23:36.22 | Mortius | I would like it to use the font I've been using for everything, so it matches, but oh well. |
| 23:36.30 | Shirik|Ecole | that would only work if Avenging Wrath doesn't cause the GCD |
| 23:37.01 | Shirik|Ecole | you could um |
| 23:37.05 | Shirik|Ecole | copy what's in Fonts.xml |
| 23:37.09 | Mortius | ah, I see :SetFont("FRIZQT__.TTF", 18); works |
| 23:37.10 | Shirik|Ecole | and make a FontObject for it ^^ |
| 23:37.16 | Wictory | i woud so like to show it |
| 23:37.17 | Mortius | so it has to be inside the fonts folder |
| 23:37.59 | Mortius | I wonder if "..Interface\AddOns\dem0n\dem0n.TTF" would work heh |
| 23:38.10 | *** join/#wowi-lounge kaiden (n=kaiden@76.22.26.131) |
| 23:38.20 | Wictory | i can try whit a print screen tho if you want |
| 23:38.24 | *** part/#wowi-lounge kaiden (n=kaiden@76.22.26.131) |
| 23:39.37 | Wictory | tryed now once again |
| 23:39.58 | Wictory | i do get the gcd from just using avenging wrath wich thottbot says it dosent |
| 23:40.40 | Wictory | i cant understand what makes it work |
| 23:40.43 | Wictory | whit the macro |
| 23:46.15 | Shirik | so |
| 23:46.17 | Shirik | Avenging wrath |
| 23:46.26 | Shirik | causes a ~1.5s cooldown if you were to click it manually |
| 23:46.30 | Shirik | on all spells |
| 23:48.47 | Shirik | ~dict defunct |
| 23:48.58 | Shirik | ~dict 2 defunct |
| 23:49.03 | Shirik | =/ |
| 23:49.06 | Shirik | ~dict 3 defunct |
| 23:49.13 | Shirik | Ok none of this is right >< |
| 23:49.20 | Shirik | maybe the guy just used the word wrong |
| 23:53.51 | Mortius | okay I did what you said shirik, and now I can use TooFarToFollow:SetFontObject(dem0nFont); and it works ! :D |
| 23:54.04 | Shirik | awesome |
| 23:54.09 | chuckg | Is it not possible to remove an addon entirely from WoWI? |
| 23:54.22 | Shirik | I wouldn't be surprised |
| 23:54.27 | Shirik | in programming practices this is often looked down upon |
| 23:54.38 | Shirik | you never delete a file, you never permanently remove changes, etc. |
| 23:54.44 | Shirik | you diff them |
| 23:54.54 | Shirik | For example, google code |
| 23:54.55 | chuckg | I don't want my addon on the site anymore. |
| 23:55.00 | chuckg | Frown all you want. |
| 23:55.01 | Shirik | If you had a google project, you cannot delete it |
| 23:55.03 | chuckg | That's a basic function. |
| 23:55.14 | Shirik | Why don't you want it there? |
| 23:55.16 | clad|dinner | chuckg: yes there is. |
| 23:55.39 | Shirik | I still think it shouldn't be removed, even if it is possible :/ |
| 23:55.43 | Shirik | it only hurts the community |
| 23:55.53 | chuckg | Leaving this addon hurts the community. |
| 23:55.54 | cladhaire | Shirik: thats a rather facist point of view. |
| 23:55.56 | chuckg | Trust me. |
| 23:56.03 | chuckg | Could you tell me where/how clad? |
| 23:56.11 | Shirik | cladhaire: Google has the same point of view, to be honest |
| 23:56.19 | cladhaire | actually, they added the delete feature |
| 23:56.23 | Shirik | oh did they? |
| 23:56.25 | cladhaire | yes |
| 23:56.26 | cladhaire | smartass =) |
| 23:56.33 | Shirik | Well they did have the same point of view :P |
| 23:56.36 | cladhaire | after a month, it cannot be deleted anymore. |
| 23:56.42 | cladhaire | btu there are reasons when its necessary and or acceptable |
| 23:56.45 | cladhaire | ESPECIALLy on a mod site |
| 23:56.52 | cladhaire | where the mod will break or just plain not work and can't be updated |
| 23:56.54 | chuckg | Are we talking about wowi? |
| 23:56.56 | cladhaire | having it there jsut asks for trouble. |
| 23:57.02 | chuckg | :) |
| 23:57.04 | Shirik | Having it there means someone else could pick it up and fix it |
| 23:57.04 | cladhaire | chuckg: I can delete the mod for you, just tell me which one. |
| 23:57.12 | chuckg | cgBonusScanner. |
| 23:57.15 | chuckg | cgInvite. |
| 23:57.15 | Cairenn | chuckg: yes it is possible, just tell a staff member |
| 23:57.20 | Cairenn | links |
| 23:57.21 | chuckg | Those two, please. |
| 23:57.26 | chuckg | http://wowinterface.com/downloads/info4968-cgBonusScanner.html |
| 23:57.31 | chuckg | http://wowinterface.com/downloads/info4969-cgInvite.html |
| 23:57.39 | chuckg | Thanks. |
| 23:57.40 | cladhaire | Shirik: Stop. Authors are allowed to remove their mods, they own all the IP. |
| 23:57.41 | cladhaire | period. |
| 23:57.50 | cladhaire | WoWi hosts them at the author's behest |
| 23:57.57 | cladhaire | when they no longer want it there, it can be removed, simple as that |
| 23:58.04 | Shirik | I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to point out that an author should think strongly about making such a decision. But so be it |
| 23:58.19 | chuckg | Shirik click on cgBonusScanner. Read the description. |
| 23:58.22 | cladhaire | you're not telling him to strongly think abou tit. |
| 23:58.23 | chuckg | You'll see why it should be deleted. |
| 23:58.27 | cladhaire | you're telling him deleting is the devil. |
| 23:58.31 | cladhaire | without considering the real world =) |
| 23:58.33 | cladhaire | ideals are cool |
| 23:58.37 | Corrodias | what the hell |
| 23:59.09 | Shirik | ok |
| 23:59.13 | Shirik | that's a valid reason to delete then |
| 23:59.33 | cladhaire | shocking =) |
| 23:59.35 | Cairenn | cladhaire: you pulling them or want me to? |
| 23:59.43 | cladhaire | i can if you don't have em up |
| 23:59.47 | Cairenn | go for it |
