irclog2html for #wowi-lounge on 20070216

`00:00.06`	`Tain`	`Math is overpowered.`
`00:00.07`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`because iirc weapon skill still translates to 0.1% irregardles of level]`
`00:00.10`	`Legorol`	`Cide: let's`
`00:00.15`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`it doesnt' convert it to crit rating`
`00:00.16`	`Shadowed`	`Gnarfoz: It was to overpowered`
`00:00.18`	`Legorol`	`the sentence i would like to understand is the "The player will gain 0.1% to their critical strike rating per weapon skill against monsters above their level."`
`00:00.20`	`Kaso`	`I wish they'd give caster stats a looking over, they should boost spirit and stop butting damge useless penitration on everything`
`00:00.34`	`Cide`	`Legorol: what about it?`
`00:00.47`	`Shadowed`	`I can't remember the exact math, but basically you needed far less stats to improve your damage if you got weapon skills over agi/crit/hit/str/ap`
`00:00.48`	`Legorol`	`which points of weapon skill does this apply to?`
`00:00.54`	`Legorol`	`the amount by which i exceed mylevel*5?`
`00:00.59`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`whatever weapon you are using`
`00:01.02`	`Legorol`	`the amount by which i exceed the mob's defense?`
`00:01.10`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`and monsters defense is level * 5`
`00:01.12`	`Cide`	`Legorol: that's what's vague`
`00:01.14`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem_ (n=tardmrr@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Dongle/Tem)`
`00:01.14`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+v Tem_] by ChanServ`
`00:01.17`	`Legorol`	`Cide: exactly`
`00:01.21`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`how is it vague?!`
`00:01.27`	`Legorol`	`it's a statement about a differential in the skill`
`00:01.27`	`Gnarfoz`	`Shadowed: huh? I can remember everything about it, being a pve combat rogue... get +10 weapon skill for whatever weapon you are using, after that, stack as much +hit as you can, win`
`00:01.31`	`Legorol`	`but they don't state what's the 0 level`
`00:01.48`	`Legorol`	`Tierrie\|Work: does that answer your question, or shall i try to explain?`
`00:01.50`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`its the difference, stated in the "per weapon skill against monsters above their level"`
`00:01.56`	`Shadowed`	`Gnarfoz: It was good enough that wearing Edgemaster's Gauntlets were better DPS gear over Gauntlets of Annih`
`00:01.59`	`Legorol`	`that's not a difference, Tierrie\|Work`
`00:02.07`	`Legorol`	`give me two numbers i should subtract from each other`
`00:02.13`	`Gnarfoz`	`not easy to do though, +weapon skill items were some 10 items in all of wow :\`
`00:02.15`	`Legorol`	`tell me which two i subtract, then multiply by 0.1`
`00:02.22`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Your weapon skill - monsters defense`
`00:02.27`	`Cide`	`does the behavior of weapon skill completely change? does it occur only when your skill is >max, and only for those points? would it behave the same if you were at max-5/max?`
`00:03.01`	`Legorol`	`Tierrie\|Work: so that means, that for monsters above my level, this effect doesn't kick in until my weapon skill reaches monster's defense, i.e. i already have some +skill gear`
`00:03.04`	`Legorol`	`example:`
`00:03.17`	`Legorol`	`at level 60, i have maxed out weapon skill with no extra +skill gear, so i have 300 skill`
`00:03.23`	`Legorol`	`the level 63 mob has 63 defense`
`00:03.26`	`Legorol`	`bah`
`00:03.29`	`Legorol`	`has 315 defense`
`00:03.43`	`Legorol`	`do i get -1.5% crit? +0% crit? which one?`
`00:03.52`	`Legorol`	`now let's say that i get +15 skill, so i also have 315`
`00:03.54`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`you don't get - crit, you get glancing blows`
`00:03.59`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`and you get +0% crit`
`00:04.01`	`Legorol`	`do i now get +1.5% crit? or am i still +0%?`
`00:04.11`	`Legorol`	`glancing blows are separate and irrelevant`
`00:04.18`	`Legorol`	`it's another entry in the combat table`
`00:04.28`	`Legorol`	`ok, so that's what i was asking`
`00:04.44`	`Legorol`	`in the example above, would i have to go above 315 skill in order to start seeing the benefits of +0.1%?`
`00:04.49`	`Gnarfoz`	`yes`
`00:04.55`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`yes`
`00:05.02`	`Cide`	`that doesn't make sense`
`00:05.04`	`Legorol`	`are you sure? has this been tested?`
`00:05.06`	`Legorol`	`i agree with Cide`
`00:05.13`	`Cide`	`that's impossible to do at 60`
`00:05.17`	`Gnarfoz`	`it's what makes people say 'weapon skill sucks now'`
`00:05.29`	`Cide`	`no, that would make it 100% useless`
`00:05.36`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`no i am not sure, no it hasn't been tested`
`00:05.38`	`Legorol`	`Cide: not entirely`
`00:05.42`	`Gnarfoz`	`my point exactly :>`
`00:05.51`	`Legorol`	`by matching your weapon skill to the mobs defense, wouldn't that reduce your miss chance?`
`00:06.00`	`Cide`	`Legorol: apparently not anymore..`
`00:06.07`	`Cide`	`but I can't say I've tested`
`00:06.09`	`Shadowed`	`It's not that weapon skills suck, it's that it's not useful to stack them over over DPS stats`
`00:06.19`	`Legorol`	`so you think that this change is instead of the existing effect,`
`00:06.24`	`Legorol`	`rather than in addition to?`
`00:06.27`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`keep in mind that weapon skills don't degrade/downscale as you level`
`00:06.36`	`Cide`	`right`
`00:06.39`	`Cide`	`which is why they made it a rating`
`00:06.41`	`Legorol`	`my interpretation was that they are keeping all existing effects, but replacing the effect on glancing blow with something else`
`00:06.42`	`Gnarfoz`	`the change note was quite clear on that, the new function is a replacement`
`00:06.45`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`because it converts directly to crit and bypasses the rating system`
`00:06.47`	`Cide`	`so in effect, they do degrade`
`00:06.48`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`huh?`
`00:06.54`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`they changed weapon skill to ratings?`
`00:06.55`	`Shadowed`	`Tierrie\|Work: Weapon skills on items are Weapon ratings`
`00:06.56`	`Shadowed`	`yes`
`00:07.01`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`nuts`
`00:07.01`	`Gnarfoz`	`they changed everything to ratings`
`00:07.07`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`<- mage`
`00:07.11`	`Shadowed`	`On Eye of Nerub, it's "Increases Bow skill rating by 9"`
`00:07.12`	`Cide`	`everything that scales with level got changed to ratings`
`00:07.18`	`Legorol`	`guys, don't get worked up over the +% -> +rating change`
`00:07.21`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`oh snappy`
`00:07.23`	`Shadowed`	`the only thing thats kept static in weapon skill are talents like combat potency`
`00:07.27`	`Cide`	`yep`
`00:07.29`	`Legorol`	`it's just a different way of representing the same thing, it doesn't alter game mechanics in and of itself`
`00:07.35`	`Gnarfoz`	`combat potency? oO`
`00:07.39`	`Cide`	`I disagree, Legorol`
`00:07.43`	`Shadowed`	`whatever the rogue talent is for +weapon skills`
`00:07.44`	`Shadowed`	`Legorol: Yes it does`
`00:07.45`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`its a rogue talent that increases weapon skill`
`00:07.52`	`Gnarfoz`	`ah, weapon expertise`
`00:07.56`	`Shadowed`	`yeah that`
`00:08.00`	`Legorol`	`as long as they converted all item stats properly, it doesn't change anything`
`00:08.06`	`Shadowed`	`sure it does`
`00:08.07`	`Cide`	`what it does is it gives us the psychological effect of character development while there in reality is none`
`00:08.08`	`Legorol`	`what does change is if they change game mechanics`
`00:08.09`	`Gnarfoz`	`there's a warrior pendant for that one, too`
`00:08.24`	`Shadowed`	`10 weapon skill at 70 is less then at 60, so it does change`
`00:08.31`	`Legorol`	`Cide: i disregard any psychological effects when discussing the mathematics of game mechanics`
`00:08.40`	`Legorol`	`it's irrelevant, confusing and unneccessary :o)`
`00:08.45`	`Cide`	`perhaps`
`00:08.55`	`Legorol`	`Shadowed: that's a game mechanics change`
`00:08.56`	`Gnarfoz`	`anyway, straight from patch.txt:`
`00:08.57`	`Gnarfoz`	`- Weapon Skill now does the following:`
`00:08.58`	`Gnarfoz`	`<PROTECTED>`
`00:08.58`	`Gnarfoz`	`glancing.`
`00:08.58`	`Gnarfoz`	`<PROTECTED>`
`00:08.58`	`Gnarfoz`	`against monsters above their level.`
`00:09.02`	`Legorol`	`that's not a direct result of the change from +skill to +skill rating`
`00:09.11`	`Cide`	`Legorol: it doesn't represent the same thing though`
`00:09.18`	`Cide`	`it only does so if your level remains static`
`00:09.28`	`Gnarfoz`	`that's the entire amount of changelog there was about this change :\`
`00:09.29`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge sergio (n=sp@unaffiliated/sergio)`
`00:09.36`	`Legorol`	`Cide: again, i will repeat, because you guys are missing this point, that's a game mechanics change they deliberately introduced`
`00:09.48`	`Cide`	`Legorol: oh, I know`
`00:09.54`	`Cide`	`I don't think I'm missing the point`
`00:09.56`	`Legorol`	`they could have achieved the same effect by saying that "if your level is above the item's level, you don't get the full bonus from any +x% stat on it"`
`00:10.03`	`Cide`	`right`
`00:10.10`	`Cide`	`it had to be done`
`00:10.13`	`Legorol`	`yes`
`00:10.24`	`Legorol`	`changing to a combat rating system made it easier to explain to players`
`00:10.31`	`Cide`	`I'm just saying it's a way of giving us the same items over and over without having people crying over it`
`00:10.33`	`Legorol`	`i know you know, because i know you do understand the math of it all`
`00:10.36`	`Gnarfoz`	`and made it more viable if we ever get to be level 80`
`00:10.38`	`Gnarfoz`	`or whatever level`
`00:10.45`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`you're missing the point guys!`
`00:10.51`	`Legorol`	`Gnarfoz: thanks for the quote, that's good`
`00:10.56`	`Legorol`	`i want to discuss that quote`
`00:11.16`	`Legorol`	`my impression (and this is only opinion) is that they didn't intend to fundamentally alter weapon skill`
`00:11.20`	`Shadowed`	`Cide: It's a way of making it so we aren't still using a level 55 blue trinket at 70 because it's one of the best available :p`
`00:11.21`	`Gnarfoz`	`"now does the following" sounds like "everything else it ever did is now gone, and instead: ..."`
`00:11.28`	`Legorol`	`i.e. they are not changing its effect on +hit and -miss chances`
`00:11.40`	`Cide`	`Shadowed: that's a side effect`
`00:11.40`	`Legorol`	`it seems to me that they just wanted to remove its effect on glancing blows,`
`00:11.44`	`Gnarfoz`	`but then, the only explictly say that the glancing stuff was removed`
`00:11.45`	`Legorol`	`and give something else instead`
`00:11.53`	`Gnarfoz`	`s/the/they`
`00:11.54`	`Shadowed`	`How is that a Cide effect?`
`00:11.56`	`Shadowed`	`er Side`
`00:11.58`	`Gnarfoz`	`lol`
`00:11.59`	`Cide`	`lol`
`00:12.09`	`Legorol`	`lol`
`00:12.23`	`Shadowed`	`obviously theres something wrong if at 70 we're using a BHB from a quest we did at 55, it would make running dungeons pointless`
`00:12.33`	`Legorol`	`Shadowed: as i said, that's a deliberate change in game mechanics, that they introduced at the same time, but independently from the new combat rating system`
`00:12.41`	`Shadowed`	`ah`
`00:12.51`	`Legorol`	`as i said already, they could've introduced it with the existing system too`
`00:13.00`	`Cide`	`they did`
`00:13.02`	`Legorol`	`example: keep existing system, but say "if your level is above the item's level, you don't get the full bonus from any +x% stat on it"`
`00:13.17`	`Cide`	`look at thistle tea`
`00:13.28`	`WobWork`	`I'll have a dash of milk with mine, thanks`
`00:13.31`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Amian (n=amian@CPE001346ca1979-CM00e06f16c85a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`00:13.33`	`Cide`	`or at Bangle of Endless Blessings`
`00:13.36`	`Cide`	`Equip: Your spell casts have a chance to allow [15 - max(PL - 70,0) / 2]% of your mana regeneration to continue while casting for 15 sec.`
`00:13.56`	`WobWork`	`That's pretty endless`
`00:14.00`	`Cide`	`effect decreases for levels over 70`
`00:14.25`	`Legorol`	`yay, and how do i get to be over 70? :P`
`00:14.32`	`Cide`	`which gives them the opportunity to create a new item at level 80, with the same stats but max(PL - 80)`
`00:14.36`	`Cide`	`and call it an upgrade! :)`
`00:14.57`	`Legorol`	`Cide: since noone is above 70 in the game, how do you know that such a formula is being used?`
`00:15.22`	`Cide`	`Legorol: that's the text directly copied from the spell file (almost)`
`00:15.30`	`Legorol`	`ah, client side data mining`
`00:15.51`	`Legorol`	`ok, back to weapon skill, i haven't heard you guys' opinion on it`
`00:16.00`	`Legorol`	`before the glancing blow change, +skill did a lot of things`
`00:16.15`	`Cide`	`(I actually got that from http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28370 - so I'm just the messenger ;)`
`00:16.17`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`just one I think`
`00:16.43`	`Cide`	`+skill increased hit, crit & reduced glancing blows`
`00:16.45`	`Legorol`	`reduce miss/block/parry/dodge chance, increase crit chance, reduce damage loss in glancing blow`
`00:17.01`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`I have no opinion, its a change yipee kaye.. When you start to have opinions about bug fixes or talents change you take one more step towards becoming a bitching drone`
`00:17.09`	`Legorol`	`Cide: in that case, i will have to shoot you!`
`00:17.10`	`Shadowed`	`None of the other increases/reduces mattered much Legorol, it was the last part that really did it`
`00:17.16`	`Cide`	`Legorol: ack.`
`00:17.28`	`Cide`	`do you have the quest for me?`
`00:17.31`	`Legorol`	`Shadowed: i will be blunt: i don't care`
`00:17.37`	`Legorol`	`i am not asking about "what was useful in the game"`
`00:17.41`	`Legorol`	`but about "what changed and what didn't"`
`00:17.47`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Legorol: if you don't care then why are you asking for our opinions?`
`00:17.54`	`Legorol`	`Cide: you are hte messenger, so you must be shot.`
`00:17.57`	`Legorol`	`like all messengers`
`00:18.13`	`Cide`	`but in reality I'm a bunny in disguise`
`00:18.21`	`Legorol`	`Tierrie\|Work: i asked your opinion on how you interpret that ambiguous set of changes`
`00:18.24`	`Cide`	`in a messenger disguise!`
`00:18.31`	`Legorol`	`not on your opinion about whether you think it's useful or not, or if it ruins the game or not`
`00:18.34`	`Legorol`	`two separate issues`
`00:18.40`	`Legorol`	`Cide: ah ok then`
`00:18.45`	`Cide`	`do I get to live?`
`00:18.50`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`what are you? sean hannity?`
`00:18.54`	`Legorol`	`Cide: for now`
`00:19.04`	`Tain`	`You know how George Bush is the Decider? Well Legorol is the Questioner.`
`00:19.35`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`He's alberto gonzales?`
`00:20.00`	`Karrion`	`.`
`00:20.05`	`Karrion`	`... mt`
`00:21.18`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`look no doubt weapon rating is useful, the question is whether if it is more useful than crit rating and hit rating or attack power. and none of us knows because none of u has has done the maths`
`00:21.32`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`our best bet is to have Cide google it`
`00:21.39`	`Corrodias`	`weapon skill got a huge nerf, didn't it?`
`00:22.12`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`yes it went from ridiculously overpowered to useful`
`00:22.57`	`sysrage`	`http://www.steakandbjday.com/`
`00:23.04`	`Corrodias`	`well, it was hardly ever used on items because of that. it was pretty special.`
`00:23.39`	`Shadowed`	`Tierrie\|Work: it is not`
`00:23.58`	`Corrodias`	`i don't like steak`
`00:24.19`	`Tain`	`What?`
`00:24.33`	`Tain`	`What are you a Communist?`
`00:24.42`	`Karrion`	`As far as I can tell (from web searching, not experimentation ingame), weapon skill skill has the +hit etc (actually, -dodge/block/etc) effect, but - and here's the kicker - only up to a maximum of level * 5.`
`00:24.47`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Shadowed: of course it is, would you rather have weapon ratings or no weapon ratings?`
`00:25.03`	`Karrion`	`so it's pobably useful while levelling a new weapon skill >.<`
`00:25.04`	`Corrodias`	`i can't say i'd be too thrilled with the idea of bj, but at least it's better than some gristly, undercooked slab of fat`
`00:25.05`	`Shadowed`	`Tierrie\|Work: You said "over crit/hit rating or attack power"`
`00:25.27`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Shadowed: oh you're talking about the latter part`
`00:25.31`	`Shadowed`	`yeah`
`00:25.34`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Shadowed: how do you know for sure sure?`
`00:26.03`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Shadowed: you need to consider the item point weight against the benefits`
`00:26.06`	`Shadowed`	`Because most itemization that i've seen so far the amount of weapon skill they put on it isn't enough to make it better then something else that just has the other dps stat`
`00:26.34`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower (i=MPower@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower)`
`00:26.34`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+v MentalPower] by ChanServ`
`00:26.41`	`Corrodias`	`zero point zero four per cent...`
`00:26.53`	`AnduinLothar`	`weapon skill caps!`
`00:26.53`	`Shadowed`	`It's 0.1 now`
`00:26.54`	`AnduinLothar`	`wtf`
`00:27.01`	`Corrodias`	`so if you had +50... wait, what?`
`00:27.08`	`Corrodias`	`wowwiki needs some updates, bad`
`00:27.12`	`AnduinLothar`	`mace +16 and +5 for human... only goes up 15`
`00:27.28`	`AnduinLothar`	`er.. 10`
`00:27.53`	`Corrodias`	`For each point that your weapon skill exceeds your opponent's defense, you gain the following: * Your chance to miss decreases by 0.04%. ... etc`
`00:27.59`	`Corrodias`	`The player will gain 0.1% to their critical strike rating per weapon skill against monsters above their level.`
`00:28.36`	`AnduinLothar`	`wrong`
`00:28.43`	`Karrion`	`and the (skill - defense) effect caps at your max natural skill (level * 5)`
`00:29.25`	`Corrodias`	`well, AnduinLothar, if you know it to be wrong, you can possibly fix it`
`00:29.30`	`Tain`	`That reminds me, I'm going out this weekend to pick up a nice new cast iron skillet. Mine got lost somewhere. Nothing like cooking a steak in cast iron, let me tell you.`
`00:30.02`	`Tain`	`It adds 0.4% tasteosity to each level of steak.`
`00:30.15`	`Shadowed`	`~lart Tain`
`00:30.33`	`AnduinLothar`	`i would but i always feel bad that the cast iron never comes clean..`
`00:30.45`	`Tain`	`That is the wonderful thing about it!`
`00:30.52`	`AnduinLothar`	`'wait, didn't i wash yoiu?"`
`00:30.59`	`TC_Working`	`you like dirty cooking...err...items?`
`00:31.14`	`Tain`	`Well cast iron isn't supposed to look clean like your other stuff, it gets a nice black sheen over time.`
`00:31.20`	`Corrodias`	`Ranged weapon attacks (Bows, guns and crossbows) do not have glancing blows at all, thus weapon skill does not affect this for them. It works the same for all classes that can use ranged weapons (hunters, rogues and warriors).`
`00:31.45`	`TC_Working`	`mmm...nothing like that caked on 2in think layer of grease`
`00:31.45`	`Tain`	`Never wash with soap, just hot water and scrub. But the best way is just to heat the sucker up hot as it'll get, scrub stuff off, and let it cool.`
`00:31.46`	`Corrodias`	`+5 bow skill for trolls is... not even worth having on the character sheet`
`00:31.58`	`Corrodias`	`it would seem`
`00:32.06`	`Tain`	`So are the +5 Human skills not really relevant at all then?`
`00:32.36`	`AnduinLothar`	`+5 does liek nothign any more`
`00:32.37`	`Corrodias`	`well, you'll get an extra 0.2% crit chance on your attacks`
`00:32.42`	`Corrodias`	`i mean`
`00:33.08`	`Corrodias`	`0.5% against mobs above your level, and 0.2% of all that stuff like miss chance, opponent's chance to block, parry, etc`
`00:33.15`	`AnduinLothar`	`should be buffed to +10 or 15 imo`
`00:33.53`	`Legorol`	`Ok I think we all agree that the big question that remains unanswered is this:`
`00:34.09`	`Shadowed`	`pie or cake?`
`00:34.13`	`Corrodias`	`+25 weapon skill would increase your chance to hit a mob by 4% (decrease four of your ways of missing him by 1% each) and your crit chance by 1% if i'm reading this right`
`00:34.18`	`Legorol`	`the +0.1% crit chance per weapon skill starts off from which weapon skill level? yourlevel*5, or opponent's defense`
`00:34.46`	`Corrodias`	`it says "For each point that your weapon skill exceeds your opponent's defense"`
`00:34.53`	`Legorol`	`Corrodias: almost`
`00:35.08`	`Legorol`	`it increases your chance to hit by 3%, and chance to crit by 1%`
`00:35.18`	`Legorol`	`because when you gain crit%, it is taken away from hit%`
`00:35.31`	`Corrodias`	`Your chance to miss decreases by 0.04%. Your opponent's chance to block your attack decreases by 0.04%. Your opponent's chance to parry your attack decreases by 0.04%. Your opponent's chance to dodge your attack decreases by 0.04%.`
`00:35.45`	`Corrodias`	`all of those are higher on the table than crit, which is above normal hits`
`00:36.00`	`Shadowed`	`Legorol: Are you sure? Last I checked hit takes away from miss, crit goes before a regular hit and pushes off a non-crit`
`00:36.24`	`Legorol`	`Shadowed: crit is higher on the table, but say you get crit gear that gives you +1%`
`00:36.38`	`Legorol`	`that +1% comes from the normal hit entry`
`00:36.48`	`Corrodias`	`your chance to land a -regular- hit is increased bt 3% (if indeed you have any chance to land a regular hit) and your chance to crit is increased by 1%`
`00:37.00`	`Legorol`	`Corrodias: yup`
`00:37.14`	`Corrodias`	`but your earlier statement is misleading`
`00:37.19`	`Legorol`	`sorry`
`00:37.24`	`Legorol`	`it's just wording`
`00:37.29`	`Legorol`	`mathematically i think we are all saying the same thing`
`00:37.46`	`Corrodias`	`i only mean that it doesn't increase the chance to just "hit" by 3%, but to specifically land a normal non-crit hit`
`00:38.01`	`Legorol`	`the bottom line: in the combat table, if you have +25 skill above the opponent's defense, the "crit" entry groes by 1%, and the "hit" entry by 3%`
`00:38.04`	`Corrodias`	`again, assuming that noncrits were already at the bottom of the table, not pushed off by everything else`
`00:38.07`	`Shadowed`	`Legorol: oh I see, I though you were talking hit as in reduce your miss hit, not hit as in your normal hit`
`00:38.27`	`Legorol`	`s/groes/grows/`
`00:39.08`	`Legorol`	`and the space they take away from is miss/dodge/parry/block`
`00:39.30`	`Corrodias`	`so weapon skill -is- useful, if you can get a lot of it`
`00:39.40`	`Legorol`	`against PCs, certainly`
`00:39.49`	`Corrodias`	`now how does weapon skill rating compare to weapon skill at 70?`
`00:39.51`	`Legorol`	`we don't know what happens against mobs`
`00:40.13`	`Legorol`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Combat_Rating_System`
`00:40.20`	`Legorol`	`that has the rating -> % conversions`
`00:40.24`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Wing87 (n=Wing@c83-254-245-83.bredband.comhem.se)`
`00:40.25`	`Legorol`	`and rating -> skill`
`00:40.37`	`Legorol`	`oops, no it doesn't, my bad`
`00:40.47`	`Legorol`	`oh yes it does, i'm blind`
`00:40.51`	`Legorol`	`Weapon Skill 1 weapon skill 2.5 3.9`
`00:40.53`	`Corrodias`	`"At level 60, every 2.5 points of Weapon Skill Rating translates into 1 point of actual Weapon Skill."`
`00:41.01`	`Legorol`	`at 70 it's 3.9`
`00:41.02`	`Corrodias`	`3.9 at 70? okay, so that's...`
`00:41.21`	`Legorol`	`25*3.9=97.5 weapon skill rating ;-)`
`00:41.40`	`Corrodias`	`it takes 97.5 + weapon skill rating to get a +1% chance to crit and 4% less overall chance to not hit`
`00:41.52`	`Legorol`	`yup`
`00:41.59`	`AnduinLothar`	`20=5`
`00:42.06`	`Corrodias`	`"The Sceptre of Smiting, for example, now only gives a Mace Skill Rating bonus of +4"`
`00:42.10`	`Gnarfoz`	`I'd rather get plain +hit then :> way easier to get`
`00:42.48`	`Legorol`	`not necessarily`
`00:42.53`	`Corrodias`	`so it would take approximately 25 sceptres of smiting to get that kind of result from weapon skill`
`00:42.58`	`Legorol`	`let's work out how much +hit and +crit you'd need for the same result`
`00:43.12`	`Legorol`	`we need enough +hit gear for 4%, and +crit for 1%`
`00:43.36`	`Legorol`	`that's 63.2 hit rating, 22.1 crit rating`
`00:43.49`	`Legorol`	`it's lower, but not that much lower than the weapon skill rating you need`
`00:43.53`	`Corrodias`	`i agree with those numbers`
`00:44.34`	`Corrodias`	`then again, hit rating takes away specifically from chance to miss, while weapon skill takes equally from miss, block, parry, and dodge`
`00:45.12`	`Corrodias`	`i suppose if you've got enough -miss gear already, +skill might be more useful to decrease non-hits more`
`00:45.34`	`Corrodias`	`did i just say more less not hits?`
`00:45.51`	`Legorol`	`ah, interesting quote on http://www.wowwiki.com/Formulas:Weapon_Skill`
`00:46.02`	`Legorol`	`Effectively, you can consider weapon skill to be the inverse of the defense skill.`
`00:46.02`	`Legorol`	`Additionally the 2.0.1 patch notes say`
`00:46.02`	`Legorol`	`The player will gain 0.1% to their critical strike rating per weapon skill against monsters above their level.`
`00:46.02`	`Legorol`	`Presumably this is only for Weapon Skill over your level's natural cap (Level * 5). It is not known if you also get the additional 0.04% crit chance per additional +skill.`
`00:46.16`	`Gnarfoz`	`Legorol: my point was more of the 'there's more items with +hit and +crit than items with +skill' (Even in BC, wow classic had virtually no such items)`
`00:46.31`	`Legorol`	`i think that quote sums up the situation quite nicely: not enough info`
`00:46.43`	`Legorol`	`Gnarfoz: ok, thanks for clarifying it`
`00:47.05`	`Legorol`	`sorry i tend to be a very hardcore theorycrafter, so i disregard factors such as "accessbility" "availability"`
`00:47.09`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge sergio (n=sp@unaffiliated/sergio)`
`00:47.13`	`Gnarfoz`	`heh`
`00:47.50`	`Corrodias`	`what we've come up with is that weapon skill appears to be almost as useful as hit rating and crit rating, in equivalent amounts`
`00:48.03`	`Legorol`	`provided it still works that way`
`00:48.06`	`Shadowed`	`the key being "equivalent amounts"`
`00:48.07`	`Gnarfoz`	`I like to know why I'm planning on getting item X over item Y, too, but I'll still go for the one I can easily get, first and keep the harder to get ones on some list for later =]`
`00:48.10`	`Legorol`	`but we are not sure anymore since the change`
`00:48.21`	`Tain`	`So if she weighs the same as a duck... she's made of wood`
`00:48.24`	`Corrodias`	`however, it may be quite difficult to get any significant amount of +skill rating, and you may get -less- overall than if you had gone for -miss and +crit`
`00:48.30`	`Legorol`	`Tain: lol`
`00:48.49`	`Legorol`	`additionally, +hit/+crit gems are abundant`
`00:48.53`	`Legorol`	`i am yet to see +skill gems`
`00:49.16`	`Corrodias`	`if blizzard's item level calculations value +skill more than -miss and +crit, then you would be gimping yourself (presuming the info is correct) by getting +skill`
`00:49.16`	`Legorol`	`ok i think we have laid weapon skill to rest`
`00:49.48`	`Legorol`	`another interesting topic is socketed items vs. non-socketed`
`00:50.15`	`Legorol`	`so far i got the impression that the mere fact of being a socketed item, and therefore having extra flexibility, adds to the item level`
`00:50.37`	`Corrodias`	`well, yes. it lets you drop in gems/jewels to increase its stats`
`00:50.46`	`Kaso`	`I worked out a general item cost for sockets a while back`
`00:50.49`	`Kaso`	`i forget what it was`
`00:50.49`	`Legorol`	`what i mean is that compared to a non-socketed item, achieving the same sort of stats with socketed items with gems is hard`
`00:51.09`	`Legorol`	`simple example i encountered just now`
`00:51.19`	`Corrodias`	`is it? is that only with commonly available gems, or with expensive jewels?`
`00:51.28`	`Legorol`	`Sethek Halls, you complete one of the quests, you can get a 2H polearm with 90.3 dps, some +agi and +sta`
`00:51.41`	`Legorol`	`at the same time, a 2H axe with same dps drops`
`00:51.45`	`Legorol`	`and has three red sockets`
`00:51.51`	`Legorol`	`i think it also has same or similar +sta`
`00:51.57`	`Gnarfoz`	`with blue quality gems, sometimes you barely get to the same amount of stats as some other non-socketed item`
`00:52.03`	`Legorol`	`it's actually quite hard to get the stats to match the polearm even with rare gems`
`00:52.11`	`Legorol`	`as Gnarfoz says`
`00:52.16`	`Corrodias`	`i see`
`00:52.20`	`Gnarfoz`	`(e.g. Assassination vs. Wastewalker... I think it was shoulders)`
`00:52.29`	`Legorol`	`so in practice i'm finding that at the same level, non-socketed items are better`
`00:52.48`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge snurre (n=snurre@AVelizy-153-1-58-111.w86-217.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`00:52.55`	`Gnarfoz`	`but, I prefer the socketed ones, cause I can stack more +hit that way :D`
`00:52.58`	`Legorol`	`and since you tend to socket the gems for a particular use and don't intend to change it,`
`00:53.11`	`Legorol`	`Gnarfoz: sure you can customize them, and that added value is worth something`
`00:53.27`	`Legorol`	`i am just saying that if you'd collected enough gear for a specific purpose, non-socketed wins`
`00:53.36`	`Gnarfoz`	`yeah`
`00:53.43`	`Legorol`	`socketed is good when you lack gear of a specific purpose, and you can put good gems in to get to that purpose`
`00:54.15`	`subbawt`	`i hate how you get the illusion that you can choose a specific stat that you want to increase above all else`
`00:54.18`	`Legorol`	`but i cry when as a warrior i see itmes with red sockets and +def rating`
`00:54.20`	`Legorol`	`it's useless`
`00:54.21`	`Gnarfoz`	`or you can't get to a specific peace of non-socketed gear for whatever reason and need a substitute`
`00:54.24`	`subbawt`	`and then the meta gems often screw that up`
`00:54.30`	`Gnarfoz`	`(like heroic mode item drops or whatever)`
`00:54.57`	`subbawt`	`like the +healing meta gem requires that you have more yellow and blue gems than red gems`
`00:55.14`	`subbawt`	`with red gems being the big straight +healing gem`
`00:55.16`	`Legorol`	`subbawt, you know that bi-colored gems can work quite well there?`
`00:55.37`	`subbawt`	`well the one im talking about in particular requires more yellow than red`
`00:55.38`	`Corrodias`	`so you'd get... orange and purple gems?`
`00:55.41`	`subbawt`	`and more blue than red`
`00:55.51`	`subbawt`	`i will never have more yellow than red, i promise`
`00:56.08`	`Legorol`	`if you are having problem with that, replace some red with orange`
`00:56.18`	`Legorol`	`it boosts the yellow stat`
`00:56.25`	`Legorol`	`yellow count i mean`
`00:56.32`	`subbawt`	`there are only so many gems that i like`
`00:56.41`	`Corrodias`	`of course, having all orange and purple will still mean your "red" count is half of your total count`
`00:56.53`	`subbawt`	`i basically use +9 healing 2mp5 +4 intellect 2mp5 and +18 healing`
`00:57.38`	`Legorol`	`purple, orange and red, respectively?`
`00:57.46`	`subbawt`	`purple, green, red`
`00:58.00`	`Legorol`	`sorry my bad, yeah +int +mp5 should be green`
`00:58.16`	`Legorol`	`i am finally starting to learn what stats are associated with what colors`
`00:58.23`	`subbawt`	`right now im stuck using a +18 spell damage minor run speed meta gem`
`00:58.28`	`subbawt`	`in my tier 4 helm`
`00:59.24`	`Legorol`	`so replace some of the +18 healing with the orange ones that give +heal/+int or something`
`00:59.31`	`subbawt`	`it's not worth it`
`00:59.35`	`Legorol`	`ok`
`00:59.41`	`subbawt`	`plus i only have like one +18 healing one`
`01:01.42`	`Legorol`	`it's annoying you can only get +hit/+agi and +crit/+str, but not +hit/+str`
`01:01.50`	`Legorol`	`i want to boost my hit rating, but i don't need agi`
`01:02.40`	`Corrodias`	`agility will to some extent increase your +crit, but how much i can't say for a warrior`
`01:02.47`	`Guillotine`	`I'm not sure whether I should be flattered or offended. Someone linked me to an exploit site where they were talking about TTN ><`
`01:03.12`	`Corrodias`	`ttn?`
`01:03.19`	`Legorol`	`<PROTECTED>`
`01:03.41`	`Guillotine`	`Corrodias: TasteTheNaimbow:`
`01:04.01`	`Legorol`	`O.o what could TTN have to do with exploits`
`01:04.03`	`Legorol`	`this is interesting`
`01:05.15`	`Legorol`	`you know, an interesting idea just hit me..`
`01:05.28`	`Legorol`	`i'm sure you all remember the patch where they stopped you being able to swap armor in combat`
`01:05.57`	`Corrodias`	`i don't`
`01:06.00`	`Legorol`	`i'm starting to wonder if it was really because it's problematic from game mechanics point of view, or if it's because it's very costly to reevaluate the combat table from the resulting change in stats?`
`01:06.00`	`Corrodias`	`you're WRONG!`
`01:06.07`	`Legorol`	`ah ok`
`01:06.15`	`Legorol`	`btw that's not a serious thought`
`01:07.02`	`Corrodias`	`since you can change weapons, the table still needs to be recheckable`
`01:07.18`	`Corrodias`	`not to mention any number of table-affecting buffs and debuffs`
`01:08.52`	`Legorol`	`yah i thought of that after i typed the idea :D`
`01:09.00`	`Legorol`	`darn, patch not downloading :(`
`01:09.08`	`Legorol`	`i foolishly logged off, and now 2.0.8 is here`
`01:10.14`	`Corrodias`	`208 already?`
`01:13.31`	`Legorol`	`doesn't the US have it already?`
`01:14.25`	`Gnarfoz`	`everyone relogging around this time should get it, don't they`
`01:14.48`	`Corrodias`	`i hadn't logged in yet`
`01:14.53`	`Corrodias`	`today`
`01:15.45`	`Gnarfoz`	`then leave the logging out part of relogging out of it :>`
`01:16.45`	`Guillotine`	`Legorol: not about TTN having to do with exploits. They just go off on a tangent about it`
`01:18.11`	`Corrodias`	`that's the one that colors people differently by their names?`
`01:18.15`	`Legorol`	`this is nuts, for a small patch that's not supposed to include downtime, i'd been waiting an hour and a half..`
`01:18.19`	`Corrodias`	`well, their text`
`01:18.22`	`Legorol`	`first client couldn't get past Handshaking`
`01:18.31`	`Legorol`	`now the tracker is misbehaving for the download`
`01:18.51`	`Legorol`	`why do you think i'm sitting here ranting about combat ratings instead of zooming towards my flying mount?`
`01:18.56`	`Legorol`	`(currently 68.5 level)`
`01:19.11`	`Legorol`	`and yes, for once, i am leveling quite fast`
`01:19.29`	`Legorol`	`i am even skipping quests, shock horror! that's rather unusual for me`
`01:19.29`	`Legorol`	`that's how much i like the idea of having a flying mount :o)`
`01:19.34`	`Legorol`	`then i'll go back and do the quests i missed out`
`01:20.58`	`Gnarfoz`	`I did not do one quest in Blade's Edge, Netherstorm or Shadowmoon Valley... hit 70 in nagrand`
`01:21.25`	`Legorol`	`that was a distinct possibility for me too`
`01:21.38`	`Gnarfoz`	`did every single quest in all the other areas`
`01:21.38`	`Gnarfoz`	`:>`
`01:21.40`	`Legorol`	`and i was actually curious about the other zones, so i'm just about ready to ditch the remainign quests in Nagrand`
`01:21.53`	`Legorol`	`and move on to Bladge's Edge`
`01:22.02`	`Legorol`	`i am certainly not going to complete the nesingwary quests`
`01:22.11`	`Legorol`	`kill 10000 mobs for.... ehm.... for fun!`
`01:22.14`	`Legorol`	`unlikely`
`01:22.35`	`Gnarfoz`	`relatively nice rewards at the end`
`01:22.37`	`Gnarfoz`	`=]`
`01:22.56`	`Gnarfoz`	`anyway, as soon as I have time, I'll simply start questing again`
`01:22.57`	`Legorol`	`not for a tank, afaik`
`01:22.59`	`Legorol`	`or so i have been told`
`01:23.21`	`Gnarfoz`	`just to get back on my feet in regards to gold`
`01:23.42`	`Gnarfoz`	`skilling up enchanting from 60 (through disenchanting) to 300 was quite expensive`
`01:25.22`	`Guillotine`	`Blade's Edge is really fun`
`01:25.33`	`Guillotine`	`especially the quest at the gnome station`
`01:25.37`	`Guillotine`	`quests*`
`01:26.33`	`Corrodias`	`after reaching level 70 and trudging through netherstorm, i just couldn't take it any more. that old ALT FEVER was too strong.`
`01:28.14`	`Amian`	`legorol: u refering to the hunter killing spree mastery quests in nagrand ?`
`01:28.55`	`Legorol`	`yup`
`01:28.58`	`Legorol`	`and hi :D`
`01:29.30`	`Amian`	`heyas :)`
`01:29.45`	`Amian`	`well from hunter point of view this questlines are a must`
`01:29.56`	`Legorol`	`O.o`
`01:30.04`	`Amian`	`ding lvl64 and hold a gun till lvl70 once u finish those`
`01:30.27`	`Legorol`	`that's assuming you are 64 when you get there`
`01:30.32`	`Legorol`	`i was 67 when i got to nesingwary's`
`01:31.43`	`Amian`	`nother story`
`01:32.18`	`Amian`	`but since i spoiled my quest / information for me it was the very first trip i took on 64 to get my dirty fingers on this gun`
`01:34.44`	`Amian`	`oh lego i made a weird discovery about the gathertype addons and tooltip addon combination problem`
`01:35.47`	`Legorol`	`ok`
`01:35.50`	`Amian`	`gathere,cartographer,metamap + tinytip,af_tte, ct_core`
`01:35.54`	`Amian`	`in any free combination`
`01:36.00`	`Amian`	`either of each`
`01:36.17`	`Amian`	`works as long as you do not let the tooltip anchor to ur mouse`
`01:36.45`	`Legorol`	`that's curious`
`01:36.53`	`Amian`	`so its an Ace2 independent problem`
`01:36.58`	`Legorol`	`by the way, does anyone know what "hit avoidance rating" is?`
`01:37.10`	`Legorol`	`i have a neck item that actually uses those words, i never seen it before`
`01:37.15`	`Amian`	`hmm`
`01:37.38`	`Amian`	`mebe decreases targets hit rating ?`
`01:37.41`	`Legorol`	`Amian, i think you have narrowed the problem well, to somehow being linked to anchoring to the mouse`
`01:38.12`	`Legorol`	`now ask Esamynn\|Away why could that cause a problem ;-)`
`01:38.26`	`Amian`	`legorol: so i injected some debug code into Talismonger to since it intercepts CUSER_UPDATE event`
`01:39.18`	`Amian`	`for some weird reason when it triggers the event the tooltip is empty when it hovers over the node but is filled when it leaves`
`01:39.41`	`Legorol`	`morning Cairenn`
`01:39.46`	`Amian`	`then i leave the mouse a bit above the node move mouse awy and tooltip is filled and stays filled when i move it back to the node`
`01:40.09`	`Cairenn`	`grrrrrrrrrrr`
`01:40.13`	`Cairenn`	`been here all day`
`01:40.18`	`Legorol`	`:D`
`01:40.40`	`Cairenn`	`forgot to change my nick, Gaim doesn't show it to me, on my screen it's always just "Cairenn"`
`01:40.57`	`Corrodias`	`huh. LL refuses to load LootLink_PremadeDatabase because it claims it needs 7.5mb of memory and i have negative 75 megabytes available`
`01:41.11`	`Corrodias`	`or WoW does`
`01:42.40`	`Legorol`	`Amian: sounds like the tooltip only gets filled with info after the CURSOR_UPDATE event`
`01:43.07`	`Legorol`	`but i don't see why that behaviour would be different depending on anchoring..`
`01:43.10`	`Amian`	`which kinda means that the event handle order gets messed up`
`01:43.14`	`Amian`	`i have no idea`
`01:44.31`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@r35h14.res.gatech.edu)`
`01:45.36`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Cairenn: Let your anger turn into hate`
`01:45.37`	`JoshBorke`	`purl, hug Cairenn`
`01:45.38`	`purl`	`ACTION jumps into Cairenn's lap and huggles and hugs Cairenn`
`01:45.49`	`Cairenn`	`I try not to hate`
`01:45.49`	`Cairenn`	`purl, hug JoshBorke`
`01:45.52`	`purl`	`ACTION jumps into JoshBorke's lap and huggles and hugs JoshBorke`
`01:45.53`	`JoshBorke`	`brrrrr, it's cold outside`
`01:46.02`	`JoshBorke`	`purl, warm me up`
`01:46.14`	`Corrodias`	`what's the last set of numbers in an item link?`
`01:46.50`	`Corrodias`	`i shall look it up!`
`01:47.08`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@64.193.93.197)`
`01:48.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@64.193.93.197)`
`01:48.46`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Shadowed: Any luck?`
`01:50.39`	`Guillotine`	`Corrodias: last set of numbers is an identifier`
`01:50.47`	`Guillotine`	`its mainly used for items with TBC suffixes`
`01:50.53`	`Guillotine`	`(so any item after level 60 with "of the something")`
`01:51.02`	`Guillotine`	`the number there signified how many points are put into the item`
`01:51.14`	`Corrodias`	`i meant the item string, i guess. http://www.wowwiki.com/ItemString`
`01:51.17`	`Guillotine`	`so "of the monkey" with 3 will have something like 1 stamina and 1 agility`
`01:51.35`	`Guillotine`	`thats what I meant too ;)`
`01:51.43`	`Corrodias`	`the answer to my question is that it's the uniqueid, and lootlink shouldn't be storing multiple copies of items just because of different uniqueids`
`01:51.48`	`Corrodias`	`well, you do not agree with that article`
`01:52.06`	`Guillotine`	`test it`
`01:52.10`	`Guillotine`	`change the number to something huge`
`01:52.20`	`Guillotine`	`and you'll get an "of the monkey" with 29382 stamina and 29843 agility`
`01:52.32`	`Corrodias`	`something huge?`
`01:52.39`	`Guillotine`	`try 193829`
`01:52.44`	`Guillotine`	`(just typed random numbers)`
`01:52.54`	`Guillotine`	`put that as the last part of an item with a negative suffix`
`01:53.00`	`Guillotine`	`which means its using the new TBC format`
`01:53.07`	`Corrodias`	`this item has 1917255720 as the uniqueid, and it's a natural item`
`01:53.20`	`Guillotine`	`yes, natural items have id's as well`
`01:53.25`	`Guillotine`	`and its not completely known what they mean`
`01:53.32`	`Corrodias`	`this other one has -2060386264`
`01:53.38`	`Corrodias`	`i don't think being "huge" is enough`
`01:53.50`	`Guillotine`	`but the uniqueid on items with TBC suffixes does mean something`
`01:53.59`	`Corrodias`	`well, maybe`
`01:54.08`	`Corrodias`	`but in those two examples i gave, it's the same item`
`01:54.41`	`Corrodias`	`Starfire Trousers of Intellect (although i checked it because lootlink had an error in an older version when it saw one)`
`01:55.17`	`Guillotine`	`try doing DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(" \124cff1eff00\124Hitem:20667:0:0:0:0:0:-55:11919784\124h[Abyssal Leather Belt of the Nightmare]\124h\124r")`
`01:55.22`	`Guillotine`	`with /script of course`
`01:55.27`	`Guillotine`	`and change the eight modifier`
`01:55.32`	`Guillotine`	`you'll see that the values on the item change`
`01:56.01`	`Guillotine`	`it only works when the 7th modifier (the suffix) is negative (meaning its using hte new TBC suffix format)`
`01:56.09`	`Guillotine`	`-55 is of the Nightmare`
`01:57.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=masked@c-71-227-151-230.hsd1.or.comcast.net)`
`01:58.10`	`Guillotine`	`heres a macro you can use to test it: /script for mysomevar=1,50 do DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(mysomevar..": \124cff1eff00\124Hitem:20667:0:0:0:0:0:-55:"..mysomevar.."\124h[Abyssal Leather Belt of the Nightmare]\124h\124r") end`
`01:58.35`	`Guillotine`	`it appears to be linearally scaling until about 500 (forgot the exact number. could be 5k) after which it seems to be random`
`02:00.13`	`Corrodias`	`interesting`
`02:00.31`	`Guillotine`	`I suppose maybe I should update the wowwiki article eventually. But that may make spoofing widespread.`
`02:00.40`	`Guillotine`	`(really I'm just lazy, but the spoofing excuse works)`
`02:00.42`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I need some help with CODing programatically, http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=76890133&postId=768935246&sid=1#0 is my problem, if anyone can help, thanks in advance :D`
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`02:34.13`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`I think WoWWiki has a "No Evil" policy`
`02:34.19`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`It might cover item spoofing`
`02:36.16`	`Corrodias`	`it doesn't need to tell people how to spoof`
`02:36.33`	`Corrodias`	`but having information on what parts of an item string are is not the same`
`02:37.56`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Well I think information should be free for all so I'd say put it on`
`02:38.36`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`But I'm just saying that its a bit of a gray area and Blizzard might get prissy`
`02:44.11`	`Guillotine`	`right. it doesn't say how to spoof`
`02:44.21`	`Guillotine`	`but it gives enough information that anyone who reads it could easily figure it out`
`02:44.35`	`Guillotine`	`I only say it in this channel b/c I know you're not using it to spoof :P`
`02:45.02`	`Guillotine`	`plus, its been said in here before`
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`03:04.15`	`WobWork`	`put it up but rot13 it =)`
`03:04.21`	`WobWork`	`That'll fool them`
`03:05.22`	`WobWork`	`Pie`
`03:05.26`	`WobWork`	`Pie is always a solution`
`03:05.59`	`Nom-`	`I like pie.`
`03:06.04`	`Nom-`	`mmm pie.`
`03:06.11`	`Nom-`	`</bob>`
`03:06.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Sixen_ (n=Sixen@12.206.135.49)`
`03:06.46`	`Nom-`	`OOOOO`
`03:06.54`	`Nom-`	`Pub Lunch is a plausible option`
`03:06.59`	`Nom-`	`checks what time that is`
`03:08.17`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`its dinner time`
`03:08.42`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`you could have roast beef wellington with yorkshire puding`
`03:08.48`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`fuck, you could just have yorkshire pudding`
`03:08.52`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`i love yorkshire pudding`
`03:09.17`	`Nom-`	`It's 12:11pm here`
`03:09.22`	`Nom-`	`Actually, it's really 11:11pm`
`03:09.24`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`you could have malaysian chicken rice`
`03:09.25`	`Nom-`	`11:11am i mean`
`03:09.28`	`Nom-`	`stupid daylight savings`
`03:09.44`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`but go with the beef`
`03:09.47`	`WobWork`	`2:11pm here`
`03:09.54`	`WobWork`	`mmm`
`03:09.57`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`are you in NZ Wob?`
`03:10.01`	`WobWork`	`Sydney =)`
`03:10.09`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`so Nom must be in Melbourne?`
`03:10.13`	`Nom-`	`Perth`
`03:10.26`	`Nom-`	`Melbourne is in the same timezone as Sydney`
`03:10.36`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`oh ok`
`03:10.41`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`that'll teach me!`
`03:10.45`	`WobWork`	`hainan chicken rice?`
`03:10.53`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`hell yeah hainan chicken rice`
`03:10.57`	`Nom-`	`hmm`
`03:10.57`	`WobWork`	`^^`
`03:11.27`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`go with the smelly garlic afternoon breath`
`03:11.27`	`Nom-`	`Thai Green Curry?`
`03:11.28`	`WobWork`	`totally`
`03:11.28`	`Nom-`	`There's a place across the road that makes a mean Green Chicken Curry`
`03:11.58`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`<- was malaysian chinese`
`03:11.58`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`frankly sir, i wouldn't eat green curry`
`03:11.59`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`curry should be one tone, orange to red`
`03:11.59`	`Nom-`	`lol`
`03:12.06`	`Kirkburn\|afk`	`Chicken Korma all the way`
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`03:12.10`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`chicken tikka marsala is neat`
`03:12.12`	`WobWork`	`aloo matar tamarta`
`03:12.15`	`Nom-`	`I was going to have Subway`
`03:12.19`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`subway!?`
`03:12.24`	`WobWork`	`yuck`
`03:12.26`	`Nom-`	`But unfortunately the new Subway just accross the road is not open yet :(`
`03:12.30`	`WobWork`	`phew`
`03:12.47`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`we have a chain here called Quiznos`
`03:12.48`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`do you have it?`
`03:12.48`	`WobWork`	`I dunno about Subway, the smell of the bread puts me off`
`03:12.57`	`Nom-`	`heh`
`03:13.02`	`Nom-`	`Subway is freakin awesome`
`03:13.07`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`its like subway but the bread doesn't look like limp dick and they toast the bread`
`03:13.08`	`kindergip`	`funny had quizno's this afternoon`
`03:13.10`	`Nom-`	`In fact, i'm considering going to the one in East Perth`
`03:13.11`	`WobWork`	`not in syd`
`03:13.18`	`Nom-`	`It's a 10 minute walk there tho`
`03:13.35`	`kindergip`	`italian classic with extra pepperoni`
`03:13.54`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`i like honey mustard chicken`
`03:13.57`	`Nom-`	`Subway here is good actually`
`03:14.00`	`WobWork`	`If I were to get a sandwich, I'd prefer one that hasn't had everything in it processed`
`03:14.04`	`Nom-`	`They toast the bread too (on request`
`03:14.12`	`Legorol`	`does anyone have any idea what "hit avoidance rating" is?`
`03:14.17`	`WobWork`	`hehe here, 'toast' means 'stick in the microwave'`
`03:14.21`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`dodge?`
`03:14.25`	`WobWork`	`dodge?`
`03:14.25`	`Legorol`	`i have an item with that, and it's not resilience, defense, dodge, or parry`
`03:14.38`	`Nom-`	`nah they use a proper grill to toast them in the Subway here`
`03:14.39`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`what is the item`
`03:14.51`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Industrial (n=tom@a80-100-243-86.adsl.xs4all.nl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`03:15.03`	`Nom-`	`and with the exception of the cheese and things like ham and salami, the ingredients are not processed`
`03:15.10`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`philly steak and cheese is a nifty sandwich`
`03:15.14`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`its like beef aujour with cheese`
`03:15.16`	`Nom-`	`I mean it's pretty hard to process Lettuce and Capsicum`
`03:15.31`	`WobWork`	`true`
`03:15.35`	`Nom-`	`I always get chicken anyway, and that's well...chicken`
`03:15.37`	`WobWork`	`but they end up limp`
`03:15.39`	`WobWork`	`and soggy`
`03:15.47`	`Nom-`	`Well, I either get Chicken or Vegetarian`
`03:15.50`	`Legorol`	`Tierrie\|Work: Necklace of Trophies, blue, level 67 BoE neck,`
`03:15.52`	`WobWork`	`and iceberg lettuce is an abomination`
`03:15.58`	`Nom-`	`The veggie subs are freakin awesome value`
`03:16.07`	`Legorol`	`+22 str, +15 agi, Equip: improves hit avoidance rating by 14`
`03:16.18`	`WobWork`	`If I were to go vegetarian, I'd get a vegetable stirfry from the thai place`
`03:16.33`	`WobWork`	`or gadogado`
`03:16.57`	`kindergip`	`wowdailynews.com - now open`
`03:17.06`	`WobWork`	`cause peanut sauce makes everything good`
`03:17.12`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`I have GM confirmation that the +hit avoidance stat relates to the chance of being hit by ranged attacks such as spells, arrows, bullets etc. He also said it has NO effect on melee damage. <-- pulled from Thott comments`
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`03:18.02`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`I'd eat gado gado anyday, except from the place near my work -- they add tomatoes, boiled string beans and sliced cabbage to gado gado`
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`03:18.50`	`WobWork`	`...sliced... cabbage?`
`03:19.00`	`WobWork`	`tomatoes?`
`03:19.06`	`WobWork`	`what is this business =P`
`03:19.20`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`they are in the business of food heresy`
`03:19.41`	`WobWork`	`It is true.`
`03:20.18`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`they will take your favorite food like bacon cheeseburger and put in stuff like eggplant and tofu`
`03:20.30`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`just kidding about that last one`
`03:21.46`	`WobWork`	`The thought of a tofu cheeseburger is disturbing`
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`03:23.11`	`Tain`	`You want to see a burger? http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/34709834/m/199002643831`
`03:23.51`	`WobWork`	`heh`
`03:23.59`	`WobWork`	`I recall one with extra patty extra cheese extra patty extra cheese extra patty extra cheese extra patty extra cheese extra patty extra cheese`
`03:24.07`	`WobWork`	`It was ... scary`
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`03:24.14`	`Nom-`	`That's not a burger`
`03:24.18`	`Tain`	`haha that was In and Out Burger. That was crazy.`
`03:24.22`	`WobWork`	`And I left out most of the extra patty xtra cheese`
`03:24.25`	`Nom-`	`http://www.heartattackgrill.com/ <-- that's a burger`
`03:24.40`	`Tain`	`Nah that's just stupid.`
`03:24.41`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/graphics/2006/08/16/hfat.jpg`
`03:25.08`	`WobWork`	`http://photos1.blogger.com/img/113/2202/1024/Halloween2004%20086b.jpg`
`03:25.10`	`WobWork`	`bing`
`03:25.13`	`Tain`	`Yeah Tierrie I've been to a place that makes a five pound burger like that.`
`03:25.21`	`WobWork`	`Now that's a scary buger`
`03:25.29`	`WobWork`	`s/buger/burger/`
`03:25.49`	`Tain`	`That's just piling patties on though, not impressive looking. Just sloppy.`
`03:25.54`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`my heart stopped when i saw that 40x40`
`03:26.37`	`Tain`	`Besides its different when you're doing it at home with your own two hands.`
`03:27.13`	`kindergip`	`monster burger wins`
`03:27.13`	`Nom-`	`Anyone seen Ghost Rider yet ?`
`03:27.26`	`Tain`	`Come on, this looks like a happy group of people. http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j4/jidai_ars/6whathavewedone.jpg`
`03:27.27`	`Nom-`	`I'm trying to work out if it's worth going to see tonight :)`
`03:27.29`	`kindergip`	`1lb is a good size`
`03:27.30`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`no dude it comes out tonight`
`03:27.33`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`well tomorrow night`
`03:27.43`	`Nom-`	`lol`
`03:27.47`	`Nom-`	`It started last night here`
`03:28.12`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`http://www.thestencil.com/archives/images/giantburger.jpg`
`03:28.14`	`Tain`	`Maybe I'll go this weekend. I dunno.`
`03:28.20`	`cogwheel`	`grrr.... programs that put icons on my desktop without asking should be tarred, feathered, burned at the stake, used as fertilizer, eaten and shit by cows, put into a bag, and set on fire`
`03:28.24`	`Tain`	`hahah that's great, Tierrie`
`03:28.28`	`WobWork`	`hehe`
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`03:28.34`	`WobWork`	`you so need a helmet for that burger`
`03:28.49`	`mjgoossen`	`That was a fun netskip!`
`03:29.08`	`WobWork`	`cogwheel: on someone else's doorstep?`
`03:29.08`	`mjgoossen`	`I had to unplug my 'net cord to reset..`
`03:29.25`	`cogwheel`	`on the doorstep of the programmer who made it do that... >:D`
`03:30.08`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`dude`
`03:30.15`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`those decisions are usually made by the programmer's manager`
`03:30.16`	`Mike-N-Go`	`What is happning?`
`03:30.40`	`cogwheel`	`well, whoever's in charge :P`
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`03:39.05`	`Tain`	`I'm catching up on this season of Rome. It's a great show.`
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`04:11.51`	`scotepi`	`doesnt anyone here know much about how gathere works?`
`04:13.43`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Well, you 'gather' stuff, and then it shows up on your map(s)`
`04:13.58`	`scotepi`	`im wondering how it puts igons on the mini map`
`04:14.00`	`Guillotine`	`#norganna would probably be the place to go ;)`
`04:14.11`	`scotepi`	`s/igons/icons`
`04:14.20`	`Guillotine`	`anyone know if your currently equipped weapon skill affects damage in feral forms?`
`04:14.33`	`scotepi`	`yes it does`
`04:14.57`	`Guillotine`	`well thats stupid. I don't feel like meleeing people with my staff to gain another 50 levels >:(`
`04:15.44`	`scotepi`	`find something evade buged or the mobs in blasted`
`04:15.50`	`scotepi`	`that need to die near the crystal`
`04:15.57`	`Guillotine`	`you no longer gain weapon skills from evade :(`
`04:16.09`	`Nom-`	`only the stats affect in feral form`
`04:16.21`	`Nom-`	`ie. +str, +agi etc`
`04:16.23`	`Guillotine`	`alright, so what exacltly does 'feral weapon skill' do?`
`04:16.36`	`Nom-`	`Feral weapon skill is always Level * 5`
`04:16.46`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Well..`
`04:16.47`	`Nom-`	`So you can add more to that`
`04:16.48`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge tardmrr (n=tardmrr@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Dongle/Tem)`
`04:16.48`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+v tardmrr] by ChanServ`
`04:16.49`	`Guillotine`	`alright. so the char panel is slightly messedd up`
`04:17.04`	`Nom-`	`So at level 60 you have 300 Feral Weapon Skill`
`04:17.08`	`Guillotine`	`it shows the staff skill affected by my +fera weapon skill while in feral forms`
`04:17.08`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I have done everything I can think of to get items to COD in the mail.`
`04:17.10`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (n=ckknight@198.199.136.119)`
`04:17.20`	`Nom-`	`if you get +10 Feral Weapon Skill, then it's the equivilent (in weapon skill) of having level 62`
`04:17.24`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Unsuccessfully..`
`04:17.42`	`Mike-N-Go`	`The user will have to press the "send" button themselves then.`
`04:20.55`	`Nom-`	`That's probably intentional Mike-N-Go, as part of the anti-scam stuff`
`04:21.23`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I am not scamming :(`
`04:21.36`	`Mike-N-Go`	`But I guess autofill is better then nothing :)`
`04:28.22`	`Mike-N-Go`	`So`
`04:28.30`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I eddied the WoW Wiki`
`04:28.49`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I attach "PROTECTED" to the front?`
`04:39.44`	`Nom-`	`What's shakin', people ?`
`04:41.11`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I am editing the WoWWiki :)`
`04:41.39`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Documenting functions inside of MailFrame.lua....`
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`05:09.20`	`Osagasu`	`What in god's name is "Hit avoidance rating"`
`05:09.44`	`Mike-N-Go`	`A rating to avoid hits?`
`05:09.56`	`LiquidEnforcer`	`Dodge/Parry/Block?`
`05:10.00`	`Osagasu`	`Well, Dodge does the same thing...`
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`05:11.49`	`Karrion`	`Osagasu: I would assume it gets directly subtracted from an attacker's hit rating... but I have nothing to back that up`
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`05:21.15`	`WobWork`	`Hit Avoidance Rating is apparantly chance to dodge ranged/spells`
`05:21.21`	`WobWork`	`but excludes melee`
`05:21.41`	`WobWork`	`according to research done by someone else on this channel =P`
`05:22.04`	`Karrion`	`WobWork: interesting`
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`05:43.35`	`Kaelten`	`whats better performance wise? an extra function call or an extra table creation?`
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`06:02.14`	`WobWork`	`Kael, I would say a function call`
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`06:09.56`	`Cairenn`	`hahahha http://www.questionablecontent.net/`
`06:10.04`	`Cairenn`	`and with that - night guys`
`06:22.09`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Night Cairenn`
`06:22.27`	`Kaelten`	`night cair`
`06:23.56`	`Shadowed`	`Mike-N-Go: Forgot to tell you, but the COD call still works just the UI doesn't update with the amount`
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`06:24.29`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Oh, so what does that mean?`
`06:24.54`	`Mike-N-Go`	`It does not fiffill the function I require done?`
`06:24.57`	`Mike-N-Go`	`http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=6139`
`06:25.14`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I made it so it would just autofill, by editing the COD boxes directly..`
`06:26.32`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Shadowed: ?`
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`06:32.38`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Bye..`
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`06:37.11`	`Shadowed`	`Mike-N-Go: For setting the amount of a COD mail`
`06:37.13`	`Shadowed`	`remember?`
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`07:02.24`	`Nom-`	`wootay`
`07:02.29`	`Nom-`	`My first bug week on Wednesday`
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`08:30.29`	`Corrodias`	`okay, those arena servers are -laggy-`
`08:31.12`	`Corrodias`	`and/or my connection is getting hiccups. i see the flat-out disconnection before may have been my router's fault`
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`09:40.35`	`zenzelezz`	`"There were multiple problems saving data."... well there's something I've not seen the downloader say before`
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`09:47.36`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`Enraged Fire Spirit becomes enraged!`
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`09:56.07`	`zenzelezz`	`sounds like a pretty angry fire elemental Rabies`
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`10:48.14`	`Corrodias`	`gotta get me some arena team going on here`
`10:48.43`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i think zul'aman is about ready for release now, it looks a lot better :O`
`10:50.14`	`Corrodias`	`so does your mom`
`10:58.15`	`Corrodias`	`honorfu is not accomplishing its goals`
`11:02.31`	`Corrodias`	`do arena teams get some kind of chat channel? would it be best to keep them in-guild for the sake of communication?`
`11:03.27`	`Corrodias`	`oh. ew. but i'm not excited about the prospect of fighting an all-warlock team.`
`11:04.06`	`Corrodias`	`or... pretty much any team with a warlock, rogue, or feral druid.`
`11:04.32`	`[Ammo]`	`just before TBC we fought an all warlock AB team`
`11:04.42`	`[Ammo]`	`10 of them approximately were felguard spec'd too`
`11:04.48`	`[Ammo]`	`stunfest`
`11:04.58`	`[Ammo]`	`lost 2000-1800 though`
`11:05.32`	`Corrodias`	`i don't know what you mean by "lost 2000-1800"`
`11:06.11`	`[Ammo]`	`they had 2000 points aka win`
`11:06.15`	`[Ammo]`	`we had 1800 points when they won`
`11:06.20`	`Corrodias`	`ah`
`11:06.21`	`[Ammo]`	`pretty close fight`
`11:06.26`	`Corrodias`	`i'm surprised`
`11:06.35`	`[Ammo]`	`they lack one thing healing`
`11:06.36`	`Corrodias`	`unless you mobbed individuals`
`11:06.48`	`Corrodias`	`they can keep multiple opponents feared until they're all dead :/`
`11:07.38`	`Corrodias`	`i find my best hope of success against a warlock is to hope they're too busy killing other people to notice me hitting them`
`11:09.21`	`Corrodias`	`but yes, as you take away their health, they don't really regenerate it`
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`11:17.01`	`Corrodias`	`rogues and warriors are in the same boat as far as that's concerned`
`11:17.29`	`Corrodias`	`although a rogue has an unpleasant tendency to disappear, removing my dots, and i swear even right through faerie fire`
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`11:29.52`	`Kaelten-Laptop`	`anyone know of a way to iterate over a multiple result without resorting to create a table?`
`11:30.49`	`Elkano`	`concatinate them to a string? put them into a function and use ...?`
`11:31.11`	`Kaelten-Laptop`	`well how would I iterate over ... without using a table?`
`11:31.54`	`Elkano`	`for i = 1, select(#, ...) do x = select(i, ...) end ?`
`11:32.36`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dieck (n=dieck@saengerschafter.de)`
`11:34.48`	`dieck`	`Hi there. I'm looking for a documentation, howto or other "fm" for nesting UIDropDownMenus to a submenu structure. Google isn't a real help here, or maybe I'm just setting the wrong keywords :)`
`11:38.51`	`krka`	`you could take advantage of recursion too`
`11:41.01`	`dieck`	`maybe I have to understand recursion first, to understand recursion :)`
`11:41.04`	`dieck`	`is there any manual?`
`11:41.53`	`Elkano`	`:evil: you could use DewDrop instead of the Blizzard stuff`
`11:41.54`	`dieck`	`what I'm trying: a nested submenu showing the 3 continents, then the zones of the continent, then the subzones (not all, but chosen)`
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`12:01.25`	`Corrodias`	`this is perhaps the best thing anyone has ever said, <dieck> maybe I have to understand recursion first, to understand recursion :)`
`12:02.03`	`Corrodias`	`Dewdrop is a dropdown library, possibly Ace-related`
`12:02.19`	`Corrodias`	`i really have no idea how it works, but maybe it can be found at www.wowace.com`
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`13:25.14`	`subbawt`	`baron rivendare is too hard to solo :(`
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`13:35.37`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`what class?`
`13:35.55`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i bet paladins tear him up`
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`13:56.29`	`AdfliCto`	`gotta save a text from an EditBox into an array, how do i do ?`
`13:56.55`	`Kaso`	`array[key] = TextBox:GetText()`
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`13:58.11`	`AdfliCto`	`k, as i thought, but how do i make the array, read something about that arrays in lua are very flexible`
`13:58.36`	`Kaso`	`well, to be correct lua has tables, which can be nested to form arrays`
`13:58.43`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Gnarfoz (i=smallbra@unaffiliated/gnarfoz)`
`13:59.10`	`Kaso`	`http://www.lua.org/pil/2.5.html`
`13:59.21`	`krka`	`lua has tables, which you may think of as a magical mapping of objects`
`13:59.25`	`krka`	`arrays is just a special case`
`14:00.03`	`Kaso`	`http://lua-users.org/wiki/TablesTutorial`
`14:00.22`	`AdfliCto`	`thx`
`14:14.50`	`AdfliCto`	`how do i save this table between game sessions?`
`14:15.09`	`AdfliCto`	`## SavedVariables: QuestNoteFrameArray ?`
`14:15.13`	`AdfliCto`	`in toc file?`
`14:15.53`	`Kaso`	`mmhm as long as the table is global`
`14:16.16`	`AdfliCto`	`arent they by default?`
`14:16.21`	`Kaso`	`yes`
`14:16.28`	`AdfliCto`	`k, haven't changed that`
`14:16.34`	`AdfliCto`	`but doesnt seem to work`
`14:16.44`	`Kaso`	`have you relogged since you changed TOC?`
`14:16.55`	`AdfliCto`	`only reloaded ui`
`14:17.03`	`Kaso`	`close wow, start again`
`14:17.08`	`AdfliCto`	`k`
`14:17.13`	`Kaso`	`TOC changes require a full restart`
`14:17.21`	`AdfliCto`	`k, nice to know :)`
`14:19.04`	`AdfliCto`	`YES!.. it works ! :)`
`14:19.10`	`AdfliCto`	`fantastic`
`14:22.21`	`krka`	`holy raid content, batman!`
`14:22.28`	`AdfliCto`	`my first real addon :)`
`14:30.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Xuerian (n=core@12-196-151-165.psknet.net)`
`14:36.14`	`AdfliCto`	`How do i make my EditBox to loose focus (having to click it to be able to write in it) when it is shown?`
`14:36.39`	`AdfliCto`	`ive played around with SetFocus(false); and ClearFocus(); but it doesn't seem to work`
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`14:44.52`	`Kaso`	`ClearFocus() should do they job`
`14:45.03`	`Kaso`	`not sure why it wouldnt`
`14:47.24`	`AdfliCto`	`it does, but as soon as i type a char on my keyboard it gains focus`
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`14:48.44`	`Kaso`	`im no expert on editboxes, but could it be connected to SetAutoFocus/IsAutoFocus`
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`16:00.14`	`JoshBorke`	`magical mappings of objects, lol`
`16:12.41`	`kergoth`	`morning`
`16:13.35`	`Cairenn\|afk`	`hi kergoth :)`
`16:14.06`	`kergoth`	`hey cair, how goes it?`
`16:14.19`	`Cairenn\|afk`	`not bad, yourself?`
`16:14.34`	`kergoth`	`bored out of my mind, in crappy training classes all week`
`16:14.53`	`Cairenn\|afk`	`heh`
`16:15.10`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`it's better than working isn't it?`
`16:15.24`	`kergoth`	`not particularly. i'd rather be working than stuck in this`
`16:15.37`	`kergoth`	`at least working i get to use the tools i'm used to, not some weak editor in this IDE from this vendor`
`16:15.39`	`JoshBorke`	`purl, hug Cairenn\|afk`
`16:15.49`	`purl`	`ACTION gets a running start and tackle-hugs Cairenn\|afk`
`16:15.54`	`kergoth`	`hehe`
`16:16.00`	`kergoth`	`purl: entertain me`
`16:16.05`	`Cairenn\|afk`	`purl, hug JoshBorke`
`16:16.07`	`purl`	`ACTION hugs JoshBorke`
`16:16.07`	`JoshBorke`	`someone take my test for me`
`16:16.13`	`kergoth`	`purl: emulate peter`
`16:16.14`	`purl`	`NOOOOOO. Silly rabbit, Trix are for kids. Damn longears, trying to take Easter away from Jesus. Anyway, what was that you were saying?`
`16:17.32`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge sergio- (n=sp@unaffiliated/sergio)`
`16:22.48`	`zenzelezz`	`I can sense the SHADOW on your hearts. There can be no rest for the wicked!`
`16:23.00`	`kergoth`	`hehe, From the article: 'So now, thinking about playing an RPG just makes me tired. I'm tired of starting a new game and being a loser. I'm tired of running the same errands to prove myself. The next time I enter my fantasy world, I want it to not assume that I'm a jackass.'`
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`16:24.08`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`What article, and what rpg?`
`16:24.20`	`JoshBorke`	`any RPG in general`
`16:24.23`	`zenzelezz`	`article on RPGs in general today`
`16:24.28`	`kergoth`	`its linked on slashdot`
`16:24.29`	`JoshBorke`	`i read teh blurb on slashdot yiesterday`
`16:24.45`	`JoshBorke`	`my first thought: QQ more n00b`
`16:25.05`	`Xuerian`	`Nah, I agreed with it.`
`16:25.22`	`zenzelezz`	`I agreed with it in part`
`16:25.34`	`JoshBorke`	`in all serious though, i do partially agree with it`
`16:25.43`	`zenzelezz`	`but more than what he mentions I am annoyed that by the time you finally get some pwnage gear in RPGs, you're 5% from the end`
`16:26.50`	`kergoth`	`wow's the only mmorpg i've played, but it bothers me that its all about the gear, itd be nice if there were possessions like land or buildings in addition to what you carry.. /shrug`
`16:27.57`	`JoshBorke`	`he's talking about RPG's in general though, isn't he?`
`16:29.06`	`kergoth`	`yea, the comment i just made wasnt about the article, just general annoyance`
`16:29.17`	`kergoth`	`hrm, i dislieke the irssi alt-left alt-right default keybindings, i should remap those`
`16:49.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge sergio (n=sp@unaffiliated/sergio)`
`16:51.26`	`dieck`	`ok, I finally figured out how to created nested UIDropDownMenus. Now I'm lacking the value of the "parent" menu entry, to get the values for the submenu. http://wowi.pastey.net/6790?hi=44 -- how do I get KEY_LEVEL1?`
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`17:04.43`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i dunno lol`
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`17:49.55`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`~seen iriel`
`17:50.19`	`purl`	`iriel <n=daniel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #wowi-lounge, 6d 14h 25m 52s ago, saying: 'Kraze: whatever the last frame that was dispatched for, at the time QUEST_GREETING_Check gets called'.`
`17:50.19`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`:[`
`17:50.19`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`purrrrrl`
`17:51.23`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge tyroney\|work (n=tyroney@66.239.241.162.ptr.us.xo.net)`
`17:52.01`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@74.92.248.14)`
`17:52.26`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@107.49-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`17:53.12`	`tyroney\|work`	`Hmm. If wanted to re-hash the auction inerface to make it more info/results, and even less ui/candy, would I run into big hurdles if I were to basically reproduce the auction ui and call its functions?`
`17:53.35`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge LimitedEdition[W (n=paiva11u@160.202.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com)`
`17:53.45`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge cogwheel (n=chatzill@c-67-164-121-134.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`17:53.54`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`Need help on how to link an image onto a page in wow wiki? can some one help me?`
`17:54.21`	`tyroney\|work`	`Link to the image and page?`
`17:55.04`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge kindergip (n=one@h24-207-52-155.dlt.dccnet.com)`
`17:55.07`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`private messages blocked? hun`
`17:55.24`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Patronus_Veritas#General_Information`
`17:55.28`	`Cairenn`	`you have to be registerd`
`17:55.33`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Rags.JPG`
`17:55.40`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`all good`
`17:55.44`	`dieck`	`http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Images_and_other_uploaded_files`
`17:55.48`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`wanted to know how to do it, but I guess having it done works`
`17:56.14`	`Cairenn`	`may I suggest #wowwiki channel? :)`
`17:56.29`	`LimitedEdition[W`	`that might work too:)`
`17:57.37`	`tyroney\|work`	`I just like giving helpful examples.`
`17:58.09`	`dieck`	`IRC should be like an aid program: don't give water, teach how to dig wells`
`17:58.09`	`tyroney\|work`	`oh, hey. Go view the soruce of the main page for a working inline image.`
`17:58.45`	`cogwheel`	`dieck: that's essentially my motto... my sig on the forums is "I'd rather teach a man to fish"`
`17:59.21`	`tyroney\|work`	`Well, that's a link, but images would be similar.`
`17:59.51`	`dieck`	`cogwheel: I like "the gene pool has no nonswimmer basin" :)`
`18:00.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=gryphon@mail.alexdevco.com)`
`18:00.54`	`dieck`	`as now are more people "active" here :) I finally figured out how to created nested UIDropDownMenus. Now I'm lacking the value of the "parent" menu entry, to get the values for the submenu. http://wowi.pastey.net/6790?hi=44 -- how do I get KEY_LEVEL1?`
`18:01.03`	`tyroney\|work`	`Here: http://www.wowwiki.com/index.php?title=Interface_Customization&action=edit has an image at the top. ( "[[Image:Image name.jpg]]" )`
`18:02.48`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge _aLF (n=Alexandr@aix73-2-88-160-210-8.fbx.proxad.net)`
`18:03.22`	`tyroney\|work`	`dieck: this:GetParent():GetParent() ? Most things like that you can just pile on the parent operations, though looking at your code I have no idea what you're asking.`
`18:04.27`	`dieck`	`tyroney\|work: I want to nest submenus, but to choos which data to display as sub, I have to get the parent id. I'll have a look what GetParent() returns`
`18:11.15`	`dieck`	`hm, this:GetParent():GetParent() is nil, this:GetParent() is a table { Show (function), showTimer (number), isCounting (number), 0 (userdata), numButtons (number), maxWidth (number) } -- can I access "userdata" in a useable way?`
`18:17.42`	`JoshBorke`	`dieck: this:GetParent() is the frame object which happens to be a table`
`18:20.30`	`dieck`	`hm, I'm a routined programmer, but quite new to wow programming. So, the frame object won't tell me it's parent (GetParent:GetParent is nil)`
`18:20.37`	`dieck`	`so I'm stuck as before :)`
`18:21.02`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge LimitedEdition[W (n=paiva11u@160.202.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com)`
`18:22.05`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`did u try local lol = this:GetParent; omg = lol:GetParent`
`18:22.29`	`dieck`	`hm, I'll have a try`
`18:23.03`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`ofc whit the () at the function cals`
`18:24.20`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (n=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-185.west.biz.rr.com)`
`18:24.23`	`JoshBorke`	`if GetParent() returns nil then it doesn't have a parent`
`18:26.12`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`oke i got to go bye bye`
`18:26.23`	`Cairenn`	`later \|FF\|Im2good4u`
`18:26.37`	`JoshBorke`	`bb`
`18:26.42`	`JoshBorke`	`~emulate JoshBorke`
`18:26.44`	`purl`	`ACTION hugs Cairenn`
`18:26.48`	`Cairenn`	`heh`
`18:26.55`	`Cairenn`	`~emulate Cairenn`
`18:26.56`	`purl`	`ACTION stealth bumps a couple threads`
`18:27.07`	`Cairenn`	`argh! who changed my emulate?`
`18:27.18`	`Bouvi`	`~emulate Bouvi`
`18:27.25`	`Bouvi`	`I don't have one :(`
`18:27.27`	`Cairenn`	`no purl, emulate cairenn is <action> purrs`
`18:27.52`	`tyroney\|work`	`dieck: Do you need to nest your tables so that it reflects your dropdown structure? (just throwing things out here, I haven't seen enough code to offer solid help)`
`18:27.59`	`Cairenn`	`no purl, emulate cairenn is [action] purrs`
`18:28.24`	`zenzelezz`	`~emulate Cairenn`
`18:28.26`	`purl`	`ACTION stealth bumps a couple threads`
`18:28.27`	`Bouvi`	`I broke it trying to emulate me`
`18:28.34`	`tyroney\|work`	`~emulate tyroney`
`18:28.35`	`purl`	`ACTION prays for the forums`
`18:28.41`	`JoshBorke`	`no purl, emulate Cairenn is [action] purrs`
`18:28.57`	`Cairenn`	`purl, no, emulate Cairenn is [action] purrs`
`18:28.58`	`purl`	`Cairenn: okay`
`18:29.03`	`Cairenn`	`there we go`
`18:29.08`	`zenzelezz`	`think it's <action> though`
`18:29.09`	`zenzelezz`	`~emulate Cairenn`
`18:29.10`	`purl`	`rumour has it, emulate cairenn is [action] purrs`
`18:29.15`	`Cairenn`	`grrrrrr`
`18:29.25`	`Cairenn`	`purl, no, emulate Cairenn is <action> purrs`
`18:29.26`	`purl`	`okay, Cairenn`
`18:29.33`	`Cairenn`	`~emulate Cairenn`
`18:29.34`	`purl`	`ACTION purrs`
`18:29.41`	`zenzelezz`	`:)`
`18:29.45`	`tyroney\|work`	`~botsnack`
`18:29.45`	`purl`	`:), tyroney\|work`
`18:32.30`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge nuOHEP (n=nuOHEP@h54.ciscom.ru)`
`18:36.56`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Wing87 (n=Wing@c83-254-245-83.bredband.comhem.se)`
`18:38.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Wing87 (n=Wing@c83-254-245-83.bredband.comhem.se)`
`18:47.51`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`Haha Scott Adams of Dilbert made a funny post about how 95% of men will have sex with a robot and 5% have stated a strong preference for lying`
`18:48.03`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`And one of the comments on his blog was "I'm under NDA with Apple right now, but I can say this- hang onto your virginities for another six months."`
`18:48.14`	`kergoth`	`hahah`
`18:48.29`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`http://dilbertblog.typepad.com/the_dilbert_blog/2007/02/tap_the_robot.html`
`18:57.32`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`http://www.fantent.com/2007/02/15/shot-for-shot-remake-of-geris-game/`
`19:02.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Cide (n=Cide@81-226-233-5-no60.tbcn.telia.com)`
`19:02.47`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+v Cide] by ChanServ`
`19:08.42`	`Bouvi`	`~emulate Bouvi`
`19:08.43`	`purl`	`ACTION wonders about the cosmic balance.`
`19:10.56`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Elessdy (n=no@d23-62.rb.lax.centurytel.net)`
`19:17.08`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Iriel\|Working (n=chatzill@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)`
`19:17.28`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Iriel\|Working] by ChanServ`
`19:19.56`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`~emulate purl`
`19:19.57`	`purl`	`ACTION tries to look like herself.`
`19:20.33`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`purl has boobs?!`
`19:21.47`	`JoshBorke`	`who says we need real ones?`
`19:22.15`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`yah lady`
`19:22.21`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`who said we need real ones`
`19:22.29`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`i'd settle for two muffins right now in my hands`
`19:22.31`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`freshly baked`
`19:22.45`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`thus warm`
`19:23.00`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`then i will eat previouslymentioned muffin`
`19:23.12`	`Bouvi`	`I will stick to my wife.... weird people here`
`19:23.27`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`you don't like pastries?`
`19:23.49`	`Bouvi`	`Not to substitute boobs no.`
`19:24.03`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`man cannot live on breast, but we can live on bread`
`19:24.21`	`Bouvi`	`No but man can make one hell of a go at it.`
`19:28.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@74.92.248.14)`
`19:29.20`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`so I am reading the news today`
`19:29.45`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`and apparantly the US is going to catch another Al Qaeda #1/#2`
`19:30.01`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`which makes that job officially the shortest job life expectency ever`
`19:30.51`	`Tierrie\|Work`	`can you imagine how the promotions would go? "Congrats Ahmed you're promoted" "Me no want job!" "Well too bad we put out a press release" "Oh gno I will be captured by tomorrow"`
`19:30.59`	`zenzelezz`	`I think they just label anyone they catch #1-5`
`19:31.02`	`zenzelezz`	`for publicity`
`19:34.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge KarlThePagan (n=andross@lanip-170-65.go180.net)`
`19:40.14`	`Bouvi`	`Well I would not want to catch #2 that would be a crappy job`
`19:44.32`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i see what you did there`
`19:45.07`	`Thorgard`	`Ow.. OW.. My funny bone.. I think it's broken..`
`19:45.10`	`Thorgard`	`Thanks a lot, Bouvi.`
`19:48.48`	`Bouvi`	`Anytime`
`20:04.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge cncfanatic1 (n=cncfanat@74.226-240-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`20:18.27`	`Elessdy`	`am i correct in this? mages cannot spellsteal a paladin bubble, but priests can purge it`
`20:19.24`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`priests can mass dispel it`
`20:19.38`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`that's about it`
`20:22.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@82-32-40-219.cable.ubr06.azte.blueyonder.co.uk)`
`20:25.35`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`you can spellsteal bop`
`20:25.44`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`and priests/shamans can purge bop`
`20:26.21`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`but Divine Shield is unpurgable/unstealable/undispellable except mass dispel`
`20:28.08`	`Elessdy`	`bop?`
`20:28.37`	`zenzelezz`	`Blessing of Protection I guess`
`20:29.13`	`Corrodias`	`i know paladins have several kinds of shields...`
`20:29.44`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`they have 3, but two are on the same cooldown and one is inferior in every way`
`20:30.32`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`Divine Shield and Divine Protection are on the same cooldown, but DProt won't let you attack`
`20:30.45`	`Corrodias`	`i see`
`20:31.17`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`DS doubles your swing timer`
`20:31.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (n=ckknight@198.199.136.119)`
`20:32.01`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`and well they have Divine Intervention too but that's not a shield as much as it is a "make someone else feign death by killing myself"`
`20:32.02`	`Corrodias`	`i don't know what kind of damage output a paladin can push, but they have not seemed too dangerous to me so far`
`20:32.36`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`depends on his spec`
`20:32.43`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`Paladins are all about attrition`
`20:32.52`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`ret pallies less so`
`20:33.07`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`they can fight with attrition but they can really get in your face`
`20:33.12`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`as long as they can do even a little damage, and you can't kill them, they'll eventually win`
`20:33.30`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i dueled one for an hour and a half about a year ago or so`
`20:33.45`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`resto druid(at the time, i believe) versus a holy paladin`
`20:33.54`	`Corrodias`	`in an arena match, it seems to me that it would be best to leave enemy paladins as the last thing to kill`
`20:34.23`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`One of our old pallies won that way all the time... his mana regen and AC were such that he could keep from dying for a long long long time`
`20:34.23`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i can't tell you how many "this is like watching old people have sex" comments i had during that time`
`20:34.36`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`and "god someone kill someone this is boring"`
`20:35.21`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`from the outside it looks like we're barely doing anything but if you looked at the two of us sitting at our computer you'd see us spamming keys and clicking frantically with beads of sweat dripping down our brows`
`20:35.21`	`Corrodias`	`"look at that ugly night elf"`
`20:35.42`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`taurens don't look right in most of the druid gear out there`
`20:35.45`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`especially caster gear`
`20:35.49`	`Corrodias`	`heheh`
`20:40.30`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge nuoHep (n=nuOHEP@h54.ciscom.ru)`
`20:42.25`	`Neuro_Medivh`	`wow... I've never seen a mod author so controling. Threatening to take his ball and go home even.`
`20:42.47`	`Corrodias`	`wow, sounds like a graphic artist`
`20:43.03`	`Bouvi`	`Hey!!! I am a graphic artist!!`
`20:44.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge andross_ (n=andross@lanip-170-65.go180.net)`
`20:50.20`	`dieck`	`re, and I haven't still solved my problem :)`
`20:51.08`	`dieck`	`as now are more people "active" here :) I finally figured out how to created nested UIDropDownMenus. Now I'm lacking the value of the "parent" menu entry, to get the values for the submenu. http://wowi.pastey.net/6810?hi=43 -- how do I get the KEY_LEVEL1 value?`
`20:52.53`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge andross__ (n=andross@lanip-170-65.go180.net)`
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`21:00.22`	`Corrodias`	`i've had my own fight as a restoration druid against another restoration druid`
`21:00.34`	`Corrodias`	`it was in a battleground, though, and someone came and finished it for us`
`21:01.17`	`Iriel\|Working`	`dieck: Can you not find any examples in blizzard's code? That's usually my source for working how they intended drop-downs to woek`
`21:01.19`	`Iriel\|Working`	`work, even`
`21:02.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge KarlThePagan (n=andross@lanip-170-65.go180.net)`
`21:02.34`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Parak (i=PROFI@user-10874ap.cable.mindspring.com)`
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`21:04.11`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Iriel\|Working] by ChanServ`
`21:04.23`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Argh, dircproxy sometimes I hate thee so`
`21:04.32`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Nargiddley (n=narg@203-97-236-74.cable.telstraclear.net)`
`21:05.35`	`dieck`	`Iriel\|Working: i tried to find blizzard examples, but maybe I'm looking in the wrong places :)`
`21:21.48`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Thursdae (n=Thursdae@CPE-65-26-218-40.wi.res.rr.com)`
`21:21.54`	`Thursdae`	`Hello`
`21:22.23`	`Thursdae`	`Anyone know of a mod that can copy and paste stuff appearing in ur chat log, like entire lines, such as a whisper or guild chat somone says?`
`21:23.35`	`AnduinLothar`	`ChatEdit`
`21:24.25`	`dieck`	`aaaaaaahh`
`21:24.27`	`dieck`	`found it :)`
`21:25.50`	`Thursdae`	`nice thanksQ`
`21:26.02`	`dieck`	`working example of nested UIDropDown menus: http://wowi.pastey.net/6814`
`21:45.49`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Nightdew (n=nightdew@24.30.120.48)`
`21:47.27`	`zenzelezz`	`bleh... I don't like Kharazan`
`21:47.40`	`zenzelezz`	`becomes like a competition between the two guild groups, rather than a unity`
`22:01.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Amian (n=amian@CPE001346ca1979-CM00e06f16c85a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`22:07.32`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge moonsorrow (n=eagle@HSI-KBW-085-216-057-070.hsi.kabelbw.de)`
`22:07.53`	`Shadowed`	`Tain: Are you planning on updating TrackAlert at some point?`
`22:07.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge weab (n=asdf@cpe-70-112-139-87.austin.res.rr.com)`
`22:12.56`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Adys8924 (n=Miranda@APoitiers-256-1-48-229.w90-16.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`22:13.04`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@74.92.248.14)`
`22:17.59`	`Tain`	`No, Shadowed`
`22:18.36`	`Shadowed`	`mind if i mess around with it a little? wanted to see if it's possible to scan using a newly created minimap`
`22:20.40`	`Tain`	`Yeah go ahead. It's one of the few things that I'd like to see actually go somewhere. I just don't have the ambition for it anymore.`
`22:21.59`	`Tain`	`You'd have to throw out the existing code entirely, but the idea is simple. Make a new minimap, scale it tiny, position it to the mouse cursor, and scan the tooltip.`
`22:23.17`	`Shadowed`	`need to play with it a little to see how possible it is right now`
`22:27.57`	`Shadowed`	`annnd figure out how you even create a minimap`
`22:32.46`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge wobin (n=wobin@218-214-59-86.people.net.au)`
`22:33.16`	`Tain`	`Well you couldn't then, at least not without blowing things up. I was hoping you could do some semblance of it with CreateFrame now.`
`22:33.52`	`Shadowed`	`yeah i'm trying to figure out if you can, but theres not much documention so I can't figure out if my code is wrong or if it's not possible`
`22:34.02`	`Shadowed`	`all the minimap addons do is just hijack the current one`
`22:36.28`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge weab (n=asdf@cpe-70-112-143-167.austin.res.rr.com)`
`22:47.42`	`Shadowed`	`Yeah looks like theres no way to use a new minimap without messing up the existing one, if we scale down the created one the game becomes confused as to where to place them`
`22:48.42`	`Shadowed`	`I suppose in theory you could set the alpha to 0 and move it under the mouse, but since the dot's don't follow that alpha it would look weird`
`23:08.15`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Legorol (i=Legorol@zr205.trin.cam.ac.uk)`
`23:11.34`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@64.193.93.197)`
`23:24.51`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Last time I tried that the game only renders one tracking layer`
`23:25.01`	`Iriel\|Working`	`(sorry, joining the conversational party late)`
`23:25.40`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Legorol (i=Legorol@zr205.trin.cam.ac.uk)`
`23:25.57`	`Tain`	`It was like that when I tried, but it was a long time ago.`
`23:28.54`	`Tain`	`I was hoping for some more leeway these days.`
`23:35.58`	`Shadowed`	`Iriel\|Working: I just did a quick hack of copying the minimap XML and renaming it, I can get it to show the tracking dots on both the new minimap and the old one. But if I try to change the scale of the new one, the dot moves around on both the main and the new minimap`
`23:36.57`	`Shadowed`	`Mike-N-Go: Can you explain how SetSendMailCOD is broken by the 2.0 changes? I was able to do SetSendMailCOD( 10 ) and then send mail and got one with 10 copper COD.`
`23:37.20`	`Shadowed`	`and i'm pretty sure you're not allowed to call protected functions through the chat`
`23:37.34`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Well, it was broken for me..`
`23:37.41`	`Shadowed`	`broken how`
`23:37.50`	`Mike-N-Go`	`It did not work.`
`23:38.15`	`Shadowed`	`Arenas, sec!`
`23:38.20`	`Mike-N-Go`	`http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/download.php?id=6139&aid=10181`
`23:38.27`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Download and test that version`
`23:38.44`	`Mike-N-Go`	`I think that is the one with SetSendMailCOD() in it.`
`23:40.55`	`Iriel\|Working`	`If you type in /script commands they're protected`
`23:41.01`	`Iriel\|Working`	`If you programatically edit the edit box, they'r enot`
`23:42.30`	`Shadowed`	`Oh? I though if something was protected you couldn't call it period even typing a /script into the chat box`
`23:43.29`	`Shadowed`	`I can also call it through luaslinger, is there another way to specifically test if it's protected?`
`23:48.32`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Well, it does not work.. so what do you call that?`
`23:49.54`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Shadowed, That got changed in 2.0`
`23:50.02`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Shadowed, when slouken got crafty with tainting`
`23:51.33`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Iriel, are you the same one who replayed to my post on the WoW forums :)`
`23:52.12`	`Cide`	`there's only one Iriel!`
`23:52.42`	`Shadowed`	`Iriel\|Working: If I could call it through a mod like luaslinger, does that mean it's unprotected. Or is there a specific way to test it?`
`23:53.13`	`Mike-N-Go`	`proctedfunc() I think there is something like that.`
`23:53.31`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I think the call is issecure() , it's in the 2.0 changes thread`
`23:53.34`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Forget what it is tho, but there is a way to find what causes taint.`
`23:53.59`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Oh, ignore that, i'm confusing 2 issues on you`
`23:54.31`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I dont think the function is PROTECTED since it doesn't throw an error message at you about calling blizzard code`
`23:54.50`	`Mike-N-Go`	`BRB`
`23:54.51`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I think it may just require a hardware event, in which case luaslinger or a Button or a Key binding can do it`
`23:54.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Cairenn (n=Cairenn@MMOI/Administratrix/Cairenn)`
`23:54.55`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Cairenn] by ChanServ`
`23:54.57`	`Iriel\|Working`	`But an event or OnUpdate cannot`
`23:57.38`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mike-N-Go (n=mjgoosse@64.193.93.197)`
`23:57.47`	`moonsorrow`	`what's the easiest way to get a debuff description?`
`23:58.25`	`Cide`	`GameTooltip:SetUnitDebuff("unit", index); message(GameTooltipTextLeft2:GetText())`
`23:58.28`	`Mike-N-Go`	`Iriel\|Working: What were you saying?`
`23:58.47`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I dont think the function is PROTECTED since it doesn't throw an error message at you about calling blizzard code`
`23:58.50`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I think it may just require a hardware event, in which case luaslinger or a Button or a Key binding can do it`
`23:58.52`	`Iriel\|Working`	`But an event or OnUpdate cannot`
`23:58.59`	`moonsorrow`	`thanks Cide`
`23:59.11`	`Mike-N-Go`	`If you know a way I can get it to work, http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=76890133&postId=769438056&sid=1#2 , is where the problem is told.`
`23:59.37`	`Cide`	`moonsorrow: you probably don't want to use GameTooltip though, since it might override the content of the tooltip if it's being displayed to the user when you call that`
`23:59.37`	`Mike-N-Go`	`What I can't find out how to do, is COD items programiclly.`
`23:59.49`	`moonsorrow`	`yeah, I'll create my own`
`23:59.54`	`Shadowed`	`I'm guessing Iriel\|Working is right, that it requires a key press but it's not protected, since they don't want you to be able to send 30-40 COD scam mails.`

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