irclog2html for #wowi-lounge on 20060905

`00:00.57`	`Cairenn`	`prostitute? that's not a bad word :p`
`00:01.57`	`Cairenn`	`nor is whore`
`00:02.17`	`zespri_work`	`so whore is a good word, then?`
`00:04.41`	`Cairenn`	`it's a job description :p`
`00:05.08`	`Kirkburn`	`I was going to say slut :)`
`00:05.51`	`Cairenn`	`well, I'm not sure that is a particularly "naughty" word, although it definitely isn't "nice"`
`00:06.16`	`Cairenn`	`yay for perceptions and social context and ...`
`00:06.18`	`Kirkburn`	`You made me say it! :P hehe`
`00:07.31`	`Cairenn`	`yes, I definitely did, I came to your house, held a gun to your head and forced you to say it`
`00:07.39`	`Cairenn`	`:p`
`00:08.22`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge [ven] (n=ven@dynadsl-080-228-76-024.ewetel.net)`
`00:09.01`	`Kirkburn`	`I tawt a taw a Cairenn ... I did! I did!`
`00:09.07`	`Cairenn`	`lol`
`00:12.28`	`zespri_work`	`Kirkburn, did you like the crocodile hunter?`
`00:12.53`	`Kirkburn`	`I did :(`
`00:14.13`	`zespri_work`	`I don't know, people aroung me (collegues) was making fun of his death yesterday. I find this repulsive`
`00:14.39`	`Kirkburn`	`As would I`
`00:15.09`	`Kirkburn`	`I don't like it when people say "oh well, he died doing what he loved" ... yes, because I'm sure that makes it okay :/`
`00:16.22`	`zespri_work`	`and "you would expect this sooner or later anyway"`
`00:17.03`	`zespri_work`	`meaning that he had it coming`
`00:18.18`	`Kirkburn`	`mmm`
`00:19.17`	`Kirkburn`	`Stupid, isn;t it`
`00:19.39`	`zespri_work`	`yeah =(`
`00:19.45`	`Kirkburn`	`On a lighter note ... the wowwiki upgrade has broken various image links :/`
`00:20.25`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ven (n=ven@dynadsl-080-228-76-024.ewetel.net)`
`00:31.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GremWarsong (n=Grem@dyn-8-82.myactv.net)`
`00:32.27`	`GremWarsong`	`Hey everyone`
`00:32.52`	`GremWarsong`	`On the WoW wiki, there is a quote: "I was able to hack a way to record out info to file on demand to the config.wtf file through SetCVar() but that requires overloading an existing variable to do that" -- Pyrophreak`
`00:32.59`	`GremWarsong`	`Does anyone know anything about that quote, or how to accomplish it?`
`00:32.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower_ (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`00:33.27`	`Iriel\|Working`	`You used to be able to create your own cvars, and they used to save on demand.`
`00:33.33`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I'm not sure if they're that flexible now.`
`00:33.46`	`Iriel\|Working`	`You shouldn't be able to create your own cvars`
`00:33.54`	`Iriel\|Working`	`and saving is likely deferred until logout, just like key bindings`
`00:34.05`	`GremWarsong`	`ah`
`00:34.11`	`Iriel\|Working`	`When was the quote made?`
`00:34.13`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Recently?`
`00:34.15`	`GremWarsong`	`So there's virtually no way to output any form of data to external file on demand?`
`00:34.19`	`GremWarsong`	`no, January of 2005`
`00:34.20`	`GremWarsong`	`lol`
`00:34.43`	`Kirkburn`	`GremWarsong, can I have a link to that please>`
`00:34.44`	`GremWarsong`	`I need some tangible way to output or create any form of data`
`00:34.50`	`Kirkburn`	`:)`
`00:35.17`	`GremWarsong`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/User:AlexanderYoshi/Completed_Notes#File_UI_From_Pyrophreak`
`00:35.41`	`GremWarsong`	`Does anyone know a way to output even the tiniest form of data that can be read outside of WoW? Even if it's a boolean or integer`
`00:36.24`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Making a screenshot or reloading the UI are the last remaining ones`
`00:36.26`	`Iriel\|Working`	`That's it`
`00:36.28`	`zespri_work`	`Does hunter sees the number of ammo left in and ammo pouch right on the poach icon?`
`00:36.42`	`Iriel\|Working`	`yes, or a * if it's more than will fit`
`00:36.46`	`Kirkburn`	`Thanks Grem. If it was on a main page, I would have got rid of it :P`
`00:36.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=GeoMance@dialup-4.240.210.153.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net)`
`00:37.15`	`zespri_work`	`I'm trying to find the blizz code that outputs this, can't seem to find it`
`00:37.41`	`GremWarsong`	`lol kirk`
`00:37.42`	`zespri_work`	`not in MainMenuBarBagButtons.lua not in PaperDollFrame.lua`
`00:38.02`	`zespri_work`	`Any idea what should I look for to find it?`
`00:38.13`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Outputs what?`
`00:38.23`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Kaelten] by ChanServ`
`00:38.35`	`zespri_work`	`outputs the number of ammo left in the ammo poach`
`00:38.58`	`zespri_work`	`onto the ammo poach icon`
`00:39.22`	`Tain`	`You can script taking a screenshot can't you?`
`00:40.01`	`MentalPower_`	`yes you can`
`00:40.05`	`zespri_work`	`the icon themselves I beleive are described in MainMenuBarBagButtons.xml, the template based off the one that is in PaperDollFrame.xml but I can't find the code anywhere that actually displays the numbers`
`00:40.47`	`zespri_work`	`unless it's SetItemButtonCount(this, GetInventoryItemCount("player", this:GetID()));`
`00:40.52`	`zespri_work`	`which is unlikely`
`00:41.29`	`zespri_work`	`I'd run WoW and played around, but I can't right now. So I can figure it out somehow only by looking at the Blizz sources`
`00:41.30`	`GremWarsong`	`Hey guys, do any actions ever output to logs`
`00:41.34`	`GremWarsong`	`what is the /Logs folder for?`
`00:41.39`	`GremWarsong`	`Can we output data somehow to them?`
`00:41.40`	`Iriel\|Working`	`of course, doing something improper with the ability to take a screenshot will get it removed quickly.`
`00:41.53`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Flyoc (n=flyin_do@APlessis-Bouchard-153-1-88-4.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`00:41.58`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GremWarsong : Accept this - There IS no real time output from wow, nor will there be.`
`00:42.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`The /chatlog and /combat logs`
`00:42.48`	`GremWarsong`	`chat logs and combat logs exist?`
`00:43.03`	`Iriel\|Working`	`You can do some one-shot things, like on-demand load an addon with bugs in its XML, I dont think FrameXML.log is buffered as much as the others.`
`00:43.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Yes, they exist, they're heavily buffered`
`00:43.47`	`GremWarsong`	`Ah, how heavily?`
`00:44.01`	`GeoDaMancer`	`zespri: as per wowwiki -- count = GetInventoryItemCount("unit", slotId)`
`00:44.40`	`GeoDaMancer`	`>.> Hrm.`
`00:44.50`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Wait, that's not much help, is it?`
`00:44.50`	`zespri_work`	`the question is, if it has anything to do with displaying ammo count on the ammo pouch icon. What do you think the slotId would be?`
`00:44.57`	`GremWarsong`	`on-demand loading of bugs in its XML is an interesting idea Iriel`
`00:45.24`	`GeoDaMancer`	`20, would be my guess.`
`00:45.44`	`zespri_work`	`for which of the four poaches?`
`00:45.55`	`jaxdahl`	`cladhaire?`
`00:45.58`	`zespri_work`	`oh cool`
`00:46.03`	`cladhaire`	`jaxdahl: hrm?`
`00:46.13`	`zespri_work`	`seems that you are rigt, GeoDaMancer`
`00:46.16`	`MentalPower`	`frameXML.log is realtime`
`00:46.47`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Exploit it, and it'll cease to be realtime soon enough, however`
`00:46.49`	`Iriel\|Working`	`bear that in mind`
`00:46.53`	`MentalPower`	`yup`
`00:47.02`	`GeoDaMancer`	`No, I don't think that I am.`
`00:47.06`	`Iriel\|Working`	`You'll have the wrath of the community trying to debug with a buffered log to contend with 8-)`
`00:48.42`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`00:49.07`	`zespri_work`	`GeoDaMancer, I think wow has inner workings to realize that this is an ammo bag and return a sane number when you call GetInventoryItemCount for an ammo bag`
`00:49.31`	`zespri_work`	`just have to test it =)`
`00:50.16`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I'm testing it, actually. ^^;`
`00:51.02`	`GeoDaMancer`	`It's slot 0, actually.`
`00:51.07`	`zespri_work`	`huh?`
`00:51.11`	`zespri_work`	`slot 0?`
`00:51.16`	`zespri_work`	`what do you mean slot 0?`
`00:51.16`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yes.`
`00:51.29`	`GeoDaMancer`	`slotId for the ammo = 09.`
`00:51.32`	`GeoDaMancer`	`^0^`
`00:51.38`	`zespri_work`	`I mean the number that is displayed on the bag`
`00:51.45`	`zespri_work`	`what if you have two bags?`
`00:51.53`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Oooh. Oh! Oh. >.>`
`00:52.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`xD I read what you said wrong. xD`
`00:52.08`	`Iriel\|Working`	`its based on the amount of ammo of the one you have EQUIPPED`
`00:52.16`	`Iriel\|Working`	`if you have 2 types of arrow, only the equipped one is counted`
`00:52.38`	`zespri_work`	`Iriel, so if you have two bags, you will always have the same number then?`
`00:52.38`	`Cairenn`	`aye`
`00:52.50`	`zespri_work`	`on both of them`
`00:52.52`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I believe so, if you have 2 quivers/ammo ouches`
`00:52.54`	`Iriel\|Working`	`pouches, even`
`00:53.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Could probably write something that goes through the pouches, and computes the total.`
`00:53.10`	`Cairenn`	`well, hopefully ammo are ouches, for the enemy at least ;)`
`00:53.52`	`zespri_work`	`so do you bleleive that in case of ammo poaches GetInventoryItemCount will return the same value for slot 0 and slot 20-23 (whereever you have you pouch in)?`
`00:54.43`	`GremWarsong`	`Since XML files are loaded at startup, I dont see how a realtime XML error could even exist`
`00:54.46`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hrm, well...`
`00:55.02`	`zespri_work`	`GeoDaMancer, can you try and tell me do you get the same value for slot 0 and 20?`
`00:55.06`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I have no idea, I'd test it, but I don't use pouches.`
`00:55.15`	`zespri_work`	`oh`
`00:55.22`	`zespri_work`	`ok then`
`00:55.29`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Let me go pick up a cheap one, and I'll check.`
`00:56.00`	`zespri_work`	`thanks a lot`
`00:56.02`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GremWarsong ; LoadOnDemand addons.`
`00:56.12`	`Iriel\|Working`	`The files are indexed at startup, they're only loaded when they're first needed`
`00:56.38`	`GremWarsong`	`I see`
`00:56.48`	`GeoDaMancer`	`LOD.`
`00:57.06`	`GremWarsong`	`Are there any 'load' errors?`
`00:57.08`	`GremWarsong`	`Err`
`00:57.13`	`GremWarsong`	`Are there -only- 'load' errors?`
`00:57.21`	`GremWarsong`	`What could produce an XML error?`
`00:57.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge [ven] (n=ven@dynadsl-080-228-76-024.ewetel.net)`
`00:57.39`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Syntax errors in XML`
`00:57.46`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yep.`
`00:57.52`	`GremWarsong`	`Hmm`
`00:58.17`	`GremWarsong`	`So loading an on-demand addon that contains a syntax error will create an error log entry in realtime?`
`00:59.12`	`Kirkburn1`	`Quick note, if anyone notices any problems with wiki pages ... tell us! :)`
`00:59.13`	`MentalPower`	`yes`
`00:59.17`	`Iriel\|Working`	`yes, the first time you try loading it during that session`
`00:59.48`	`GremWarsong`	`Is there any way to get data inside that error?`
`00:59.54`	`GremWarsong`	`So that we can customize errors a bit`
`01:00.17`	`Iriel\|Working`	`No`
`01:00.32`	`Iriel\|Working`	`THERE IS NO REAL TIME IO AVAILABLE TO THE UI CODE.`
`01:01.13`	`GremWarsong`	`There are oftentimes clever workarounds to things =)`
`01:01.26`	`GeoDaMancer`	`zespri: It returns the total number of arrows in the pouch.`
`01:01.45`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Regardless of type, or equipping.`
`01:02.09`	`zespri_work`	`Thank a lot!`
`01:02.57`	`GeoDaMancer`	`zespri: That is if you check the pouch. If you check the ammoslot it returns the total number of that type of arrow.`
`01:05.06`	`zespri_work`	`well, the main question that I had is how the UI displays this numbers on the poaches. No I have my answer - through GetInventoryItemCount!`
`01:05.23`	`zespri_work`	`Thank you for confirming that for me`
`01:05.49`	`GeoDaMancer`	`You're welcome.`
`01:06.06`	`GeoDaMancer`	`If you need me to test other things, just ask. I'm working on my own script right now, so it's no trouble. xD`
`01:07.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Flyoc (n=flyin_do@APlessis-Bouchard-153-1-88-4.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`01:08.47`	`zespri_work`	`thank you for your nice offer =) I'm just investigating a bug report in one of our addons, and I guess, currently I'm done with this. There is no apparent reason for this bug to happen, and all looks good. The next step would be for me to fire up the addon in question when I get home and see if I can reproduce the bug. Currently I'm inclined to think that this is a user error, like forgetting to enable and addon =)`
`01:09.30`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Which addon is it?`
`01:10.12`	`zespri_work`	`BetterItemCount. Don't worry about it. It's jsut a few lines of code that displays 10k instead of * when the number is more then 999`
`01:10.15`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GremWarsong : We've been doing this for a long time now, and collectively a great many of us have verified that all of the obvious and many of the non-obvious attempts at real time output do not work. There WERE some mechanisms for this, key bindings, cvars, to name but 2, but all the holes have been closed, or are so weak (L.O.D. errors, screenshots) as to be a non-issue.`
`01:10.46`	`warla`	`http://www.wowledgebase.com/?id=1 <-- is that link a little faster?`
`01:11.21`	`GremWarsong`	`Im considering using screenshots as a form of IO, so im pretty desperate for anything`
`01:11.24`	`GremWarsong`	`Can you tell me about LOD errors?`
`01:11.44`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Screenshots have a lot of advantages, they can carry a lot of information, and they're relatively fast.`
`01:12.00`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Having said that, they do stall the client (albeit briefly) just like a UI reload`
`01:12.14`	`GremWarsong`	`Yes, you can use a frame to overlay data in the form of pixel colors`
`01:12.30`	`Iriel\|Working`	`All the "LOD errors' thing gets you is knowledge a particular addon was loaded`
`01:12.31`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah, seems about 600 millisecond average for screenshot, is there a way to speed that up?`
`01:12.46`	`Iriel\|Working`	`No, and if you do what you're trying to do, I suspect they'll slow it down deliberately.`
`01:13.19`	`Iriel\|Working`	`and you only get to load a LOD addon once per session, so it's inherently limited unless you pre-create a zillion addons`
`01:13.29`	`GremWarsong`	`Haha`
`01:13.32`	`GremWarsong`	`Definitely not an option =/`
`01:13.40`	`Iriel\|Working`	`but even then you've got problems.`
`01:13.53`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Lower your resolution to improve your SS time`
`01:14.00`	`Cairenn`	`please note, this channel is full of people that follow blizzard's rules and tend to get rather antsy about folks that are trying to deliberately hack around them`
`01:14.03`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah, ive got 800x600`
`01:14.27`	`GremWarsong`	`I understand that Cairenn, but while Blizzard allows us to utilize their functions, I believe that we should be able to use them in any way we can`
`01:14.30`	`zespri_work`	`Well, getting info out of WoW is not agains TOS. it's just an uphill battle`
`01:14.32`	`Cairenn`	`since those that hack around them make things miserable for everyone else`
`01:14.34`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Actually, i'm quite happy to discuss ways of hacking around them, because it helps get holes fixed.. The problem is the implication that we might not have thought of something that's really obvious.`
`01:14.41`	`Kirkburn`	`GremWarsong, I would repectfully disagree`
`01:14.58`	`GremWarsong`	`If they dont intend for them to be there, they will 'fix' them`
`01:15.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`We can say, fairly categorically, that all of the things you're suggesting dont work and have been tried.`
`01:15.12`	`GremWarsong`	`So we might as well discuss every opportunity for the tools we are provided`
`01:15.38`	`Kirkburn`	`That is like suggesting testing the law "because they don't have a law on it yet"`
`01:15.59`	`Kirkburn`	`It can result in the UI becoming more restictive for everyone else`
`01:16.02`	`zespri_work`	`GremWarsong, so why are you willing to spend your time on implementing a work arond, which is almost certainly will be "fixed" should you succeed?`
`01:16.25`	`GremWarsong`	`Removing the ability to take screenshots seems like a rash fix`
`01:16.32`	`Iriel\|Working`	`They wouldn't do that`
`01:16.38`	`Iriel\|Working`	`they'd just make it so you have to press a key`
`01:16.44`	`GremWarsong`	`I dont mind pressing a key`
`01:16.48`	`zespri_work`	`What Iriel said, they'd just add a delay`
`01:16.52`	`GremWarsong`	`I press a key for a screenshot anyway`
`01:16.54`	`Kirkburn`	`_Many_ others will`
`01:16.54`	`GremWarsong`	`Right`
`01:17.17`	`Kirkburn`	`Don't be so self-absorbed to think that others won't be different to you`
`01:17.36`	`Iriel\|Working`	`The root question we generally ask at one point is -- why do you need real time output?`
`01:17.47`	`Tain`	`Making with the bots`
`01:17.48`	`GremWarsong`	`Generally for data collection`
`01:17.56`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Why does it have to be real time then?`
`01:18.01`	`Iriel\|Working`	`You can't USE the data in real time`
`01:18.14`	`GremWarsong`	`Because I dont want to have to log out everytime I want to submit said data`
`01:18.23`	`Iriel\|Working`	`so reload your UI for each submission`
`01:18.37`	`GremWarsong`	`I want the data submission to be relatively automated`
`01:18.37`	`Iriel\|Working`	`doesn't take that long, and you dont have to do anything silly to access that`
`01:18.58`	`Iriel\|Working`	`You're straying awfully close to the 'things blizzard dont want you to do' line there though are you not?`
`01:19.06`	`Arrowmaster`	`you just said you dont mind pressing a key, so bind a damn key to reload the ui`
`01:19.07`	`Kirkburn`	`Real-time data could be used in 'bad' ways, and more than we could think of`
`01:19.08`	`GremWarsong`	`Not really`
`01:19.19`	`GremWarsong`	`I want to create an in-game message board that outputs the data to my webpage`
`01:19.27`	`Kirkburn`	`Real-time data collection is a no-no`
`01:19.34`	`GremWarsong`	`It could be used in bad ways im sure`
`01:20.11`	`Iriel\|Working`	`About the best uses for screenshots I've seen discussed was as an emergency fallback for a DKP system.. it was to use Saved variables and chat logs for its normal update, but would screenprint after significant evetns in case of crashes or other disasters.`
`01:20.31`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah`
`01:20.38`	`Kirkburn`	`Blizzard don't want real-time data collection, we should respect that`
`01:20.41`	`GremWarsong`	`You can store outrageous amounts of data in screenshots`
`01:20.58`	`Iriel\|Working`	`True, but you'll find creating it on the WoW side trickier than you think`
`01:21.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Fonts and OCR tend to end up the simplest implementations`
`01:21.08`	`zespri_work`	`Actually as a teoretical excersice it's getting me realy interested =)`
`01:21.14`	`GremWarsong`	`Like I said, by creating a frame that covers the screen, you can plot pixels on it that represent data`
`01:21.29`	`GremWarsong`	`And then create the screenshot, and have a program read the pixel row to create data`
`01:21.32`	`Iriel\|Working`	`We've discussed OCR, barcodes, and data glyphs before.`
`01:21.55`	`GremWarsong`	`Im very new to the modding community, so unfortunately I didnt get to hear about those methods`
`01:22.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`They're all possible, but all kind of a pain`
`01:22.11`	`zespri_work`	`what is data glyphs?`
`01:22.32`	`GremWarsong`	`I dont see why they're a pain`
`01:22.33`	`Iriel\|Working`	`zespri: They're a 2D information encoding technique from Xerox, kinda like 2d barcodes`
`01:22.48`	`GremWarsong`	`The biggest pain is the lag when taking a screenshot`
`01:22.55`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Well, 'a' you have to render them, you likely dont want to create thousands of Texture objects because it'll slow down your UI quite a bit`
`01:22.56`	`zespri_work`	`Iriel, do you have a link?`
`01:23.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`then 'b' you have to write code to parse them out of the screenshot`
`01:23.29`	`Iriel\|Working`	`then 'c' you start wondering why SavedVariables and a 5 second reloadui is so bad`
`01:23.37`	`GremWarsong`	`Iriel, can you plot pixels to a texture?`
`01:23.55`	`Iriel\|Working`	`http://www.parc.com/research/projects/dataglyphs`
`01:23.58`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GremWarsong : No`
`01:24.13`	`GremWarsong`	`Ah, so you have to create a new texture for each pixel`
`01:24.15`	`GremWarsong`	`I see`
`01:24.22`	`zespri_work`	`Iriel, cheers, I just need to google it as a single word`
`01:25.06`	`GremWarsong`	`Iriel, you could plot text to the screen with different colors, although you wouldnt be able to store nearly as much data`
`01:25.32`	`Iriel\|Working`	`There are tradeoffs to be had between one Texture per pixel, and a smaller numvber of Textures displaying subsets of a larger 'dictionary' image.`
`01:25.43`	`Iriel\|Working`	`But if you're going to go to that effort, just create your bit patterns as a TTF font`
`01:25.46`	`Iriel\|Working`	`and use it in game`
`01:26.03`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah`
`01:26.27`	`MentalPower`	`or use a barcode fint`
`01:26.32`	`MentalPower`	`font*`
`01:26.38`	`GremWarsong`	`Has anyone benchmarked thousand of texture objects that are 1x dimensions?`
`01:26.39`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Barcodes aren't very space efficient`
`01:26.48`	`MentalPower`	`true`
`01:26.56`	`MentalPower`	`what about 2D barcodes?`
`01:27.13`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Those are better, but still oriented at a somewhat lossy medium`
`01:27.17`	`MentalPower`	`or is that the same as dataglyphs`
`01:27.24`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Bit pattern fonts would be much easier`
`01:27.37`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Dataglyphs are cool because you can embed them in other stuff`
`01:28.39`	`GremWarsong`	`Hey`
`01:28.50`	`GremWarsong`	`Does WoW load any resources dynamically`
`01:28.54`	`GremWarsong`	`Like graphical resources`
`01:29.08`	`MentalPower`	`yes, textures`
`01:29.34`	`MentalPower`	`textures, models, sounds they're all loaded dinamically`
`01:29.39`	`Iriel\|Working`	`well, 'dynamically' is a bit of a misnomer`
`01:29.46`	`MentalPower`	`yeah`
`01:29.52`	`MentalPower`	`on demand?`
`01:29.53`	`Iriel\|Working`	`they're indexed upon client startup, and loaded on-demand the first time they're needed`
`01:30.09`	`MentalPower`	`yeah, what iriel said`
`01:30.12`	`GremWarsong`	`ah`
`01:30.25`	`GremWarsong`	`it was just a random question, has nothing to do with current conversation`
`01:30.32`	`GremWarsong`	`Have there been any other discussed techniques, Iriel?`
`01:31.56`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem_ (n=tardmrr@ip70-177-40-169.br.br.cox.net)`
`01:31.56`	`Iriel\|Working`	`That's really it, anything else obviously violates the TOS in some way (some in spirit) (Screen scraping from the video driver to extract information, extracting the network data stream, trying to look at the executable's memory, etc).`
`01:32.07`	`Iriel\|Working`	`All of those should get your account cancelled pretty effectivey`
`01:32.07`	`Cairenn`	`night MentalPower\|ZZzz`
`01:32.23`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah, im not messing with any of that`
`01:32.40`	`cladhaire`	`Haha this is fun`
`01:32.47`	`cladhaire`	`anyone want to work with me on a raid simulation environment =)`
`01:32.50`	`GremWarsong`	`What do you mean by screen scraping?`
`01:33.09`	`GremWarsong`	`Reading RGB values on the screen?`
`01:34.12`	`GremWarsong`	`Basically the same as reading from a screenshot`
`01:34.19`	`GremWarsong`	`except without the software screenshot`
`01:35.28`	`Tain`	`My guild already simulates raiding. Except they think it's real.`
`01:35.36`	`GremWarsong`	`haha`
`01:36.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Raid Simulation Enviroment?`
`01:36.34`	`cladhaire`	`GeoDaMancer: Yeah, you can now setup PerfectRaid, even if you'r enot in a raid.`
`01:36.49`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ahhh. >.>`
`01:39.23`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tem_ (n=tardmrr@ip70-177-40-169.br.br.cox.net)`
`01:39.57`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GremWarsong : yes.`
`01:40.12`	`Kirkburn`	`Can everyone get to http://www.wowwiki.com/ ? Cos I can't, but Mikk can ....`
`01:40.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`In xml, is there a Get for anything you want to set?`
`01:40.26`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I can`
`01:40.42`	`Kirkburn`	`I don't understand it!`
`01:40.45`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GeoDaMancer ; Usually, if there are gaps that you need filled, ask about them and we may know where to get it`
`01:40.49`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Kirkburn : Flush your DNS cache`
`01:40.54`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Kirkburn : Use a real browser (8-))`
`01:40.59`	`Kirkburn`	`Just did!`
`01:41.02`	`Kirkburn`	`And I tried FF`
`01:41.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I need to set a custom value.`
`01:41.11`	`Cairenn`	`I can get to it fine`
`01:41.16`	`Kirkburn`	`(ipconfig /flushdns, Mikk told me =)`
`01:41.30`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Could be your ISP caching upstream`
`01:41.41`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Er, one that won't interfer with any other value in the normal xml, like an ID, but not an id.`
`01:41.49`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I dont know what the TTL was set to on the old DNS entry (assuming they did indeed change IP)`
`01:41.57`	`Iriel\|Working`	`GeoDaMancer : Just do this.geoDaMancerThing = 12`
`01:42.08`	`Kirkburn`	`It's possible ... but it worked for the first couple of hours after the upgrade`
`01:42.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`And I can pull it up again how?`
`01:42.23`	`Iriel\|Working`	`X = this.geoDaMancerThing;`
`01:42.24`	`GeoDaMancer`	`like this.geoDaMancerThing?`
`01:42.25`	`Kirkburn`	`Only about 30 mins ago have I stopped being able to reach it :`
`01:42.29`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ahhhh, thankee.`
`01:42.29`	`Iriel\|Working`	`XML frames are just tables, really`
`01:43.59`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Alright then.`
`01:44.00`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=GeoMance@dialup-4.240.210.153.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net)`
`01:44.09`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GeoDaMancer (i=GeoMance@dialup-4.240.210.153.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net)`
`01:44.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I hate key-commands.`
`01:48.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hrm..`
`01:50.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is there a way to tell what sort of action is currently in the cursor?`
`01:56.10`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Neko-Zelgadis (n=Zelgadis@d463c941.datahighways.de)`
`01:56.42`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge MickZzz (i=bofh@81-233-236-26-no19.tbcn.telia.com)`
`01:56.46`	`Tem`	`no`
`01:56.58`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hrm.`
`01:57.13`	`GeoDaMancer`	`After it's placed, is there a way?`
`01:57.21`	`Tem`	`not always`
`01:57.32`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Which actions can't be checked?`
`01:58.16`	`Tem`	`well, it depends entirely on where you placed it`
`01:58.29`	`Tem`	`if you put it down on an action bar, the it's very difficult to tell`
`01:58.40`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Where else could I put it?`
`01:58.43`	`Tem`	`if you put it down in a bag, it's 1 api away`
`01:59.06`	`GeoDaMancer`	`But you can't put an action in a bag, item yes, but action no.`
`02:01.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Asni (n=insa@135.80-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`02:03.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dorbak (n=dorbak@S0106000f6645fe8c.ed.shawcable.net)`
`02:05.04`	`ScytheBlade1`	`Who codes PerfectTargets again?`
`02:05.59`	`Tem`	`tekkub`
`02:06.15`	`ScytheBlade1`	`:(`
`02:06.17`	`ScytheBlade1`	`He isn't here now..`
`02:06.23`	`ScytheBlade1`	`I had a feature request`
`02:06.32`	`Tem`	`he's in #wowace`
`02:06.42`	`ScytheBlade1`	`Hmm`
`02:06.50`	`cladhaire`	`he probably wont' add features`
`02:06.58`	`cladhaire`	`he hates perfecttargets`
`02:07.04`	`ScytheBlade1`	`lol`
`02:07.09`	`cladhaire`	`i'm not kidding =)`
`02:07.11`	`ScytheBlade1`	`I just want it to switch modes`
`02:07.21`	`ScytheBlade1`	`How many mobs are targeting a player`
`02:08.29`	`dorbak`	`evening folks --- is there a way to determine if a name (passed into a function) is either in your guild, or on your friends list? IsUnitFriend doesn't seem to do what I want it to do...thanks`
`02:09.36`	`Arrowmaster`	`scan your guildroster and friendslist and check`
`02:10.57`	`ScytheBlade1`	`yeah he wasn't happy that I mentioned it, haha`
`02:11.00`	`dorbak`	`That's what I was looking for, but it isn't popping out in the API list in the wowwiki :) Know the function by hand?`
`02:11.10`	`dorbak`	`popping out at me*`
`02:11.25`	`dorbak`	`(to scan the various lists)`
`02:14.30`	`dorbak`	`actually, I guess I could get the number of friends, then individually construct my "friend list" by stepping through each one...`
`02:14.34`	`dorbak`	`hmmm...`
`02:16.18`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`yes, that's right`
`02:16.46`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`02:16.49`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`it's like that with most WoW functions, they don't return all the results as a table`
`02:17.07`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`Kirkburn :o?`
`02:17.50`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (i=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`02:18.24`	`Cairenn`	`evening ckknight`
`02:18.27`	`ckknight`	`hey`
`02:18.32`	`ckknight`	`how's everyone doing?`
`02:18.33`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tuller (n=chatzill@c-68-57-185-39.hsd1.va.comcast.net)`
`02:20.11`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Hrm. >.>`
`02:20.59`	`cladhaire`	`I'm well, thanks.`
`02:21.08`	`cladhaire`	`ckknight: Your brother all married up yet?`
`02:23.46`	`cladhaire`	`Wall: How are you?`
`02:24.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`dorbak: for friendAt = 1, GetNumFriends do if string.find(GetFriendInfo(friendAt), name) return true else return false end end ?`
`02:24.27`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Er, attached a () to GetNumFriends`
`02:24.39`	`warla`	`yay.. got webspace thats better than my slow snailtop`
`02:24.41`	`warla`	`http://www.wowledgebase.com/?id=1`
`02:25.06`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`+ then`
`02:25.23`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mery (i=metelman@p54AED76F.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`02:26.14`	`cladhaire`	`warla: if i had known, i could have set you up`
`02:26.15`	`cladhaire`	`and still can`
`02:27.43`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`mhm, does anyone know if kirkburn already knows that wowwiki is kinda screwed up since that update today?`
`02:28.02`	`GeoDaMancer`	`warla, is this what's in your character's bag?`
`02:28.23`	`Cairenn`	`Kirkburn1: do you know if you know that the wowwiki is kinda screwed up since that update today?`
`02:28.30`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`xD.`
`02:28.34`	`Cairenn`	`Kirkburn1: oh, right, you can't even get to it, nm`
`02:28.42`	`Cairenn`	`;)`
`02:28.45`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`i assumed he is sleeping.`
`02:28.50`	`Cairenn`	`hehehe`
`02:29.05`	`Cairenn`	`sorry, was just too obvious to not take ;)`
`02:29.51`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I haven't had a problem with it, what's the screw up? xD`
`02:30.04`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`html-tags don't work properly anymore`
`02:30.13`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`just an example: http://www.wowwiki.com/API_GetGuildRosterSelection`
`02:30.18`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`it's everywhere like this`
`02:30.36`	`GeoDaMancer`	`That isn't html, is it?`
`02:30.58`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`well, wiki-style html ^^;`
`02:31.08`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I mean, that looks more like a problem with parsing whatever the files are saved as.`
`02:31.10`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`it's with all <x></x> wikitags`
`02:31.18`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`yea`
`02:31.41`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ahhh, never dealt with the back part of a wiki.`
`02:34.51`	`Kirkburn1`	`I'm not asleep :P`
`02:34.59`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`^^`
`02:35.08`	`Kirkburn`	`I _should_ be :P`
`02:35.25`	`Kirkburn`	`Actually, I was just playing Need For Speed Underground 2, which is awespme, as ever :P`
`02:35.38`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`gahh`
`02:35.47`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i need to figure out what's making me hardlock occasionally in wow`
`02:36.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Neko-Zelgadis, not sure what the problem is?`
`02:36.30`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`uhm, it displays the ending-tags even not supposed to do so?`
`02:36.38`	`Kirkburn`	`The only big change I know of is that linked images will display as links now instead of the image`
`02:37.07`	`Kirkburn`	`(external images, you have to put them in <imagelink> tages now)`
`02:37.17`	`Kirkburn`	`Neko-Zelgadis, I still can't get to the wiki to check :(`
`02:37.41`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`mhm, how do you mean that :)?`
`02:37.58`	`Kirkburn`	`The wiki just won't load at all for me!`
`02:38.23`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`oh, i see. i'll make a copy of an example then`
`02:38.30`	`Kirkburn`	`k :)`
`02:38.43`	`dorbak`	`GeoDaMancer: thanks for that! A bit cleaner than what I've got, but fairly similar :)`
`02:39.11`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`http://www.miyaki.de/dev/GetGuildRosterSelection.html`
`02:39.33`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`as said, it's like this on the whole wiki`
`02:39.49`	`Kirkburn`	`You're talking about the </dt> and </dd>?`
`02:39.54`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`yep`
`02:40.06`	`Kirkburn`	`Phew, cause the page looks crazy for me :P`
`02:40.53`	`Kirkburn`	`I'm not sure what those tags do tbh :P Good idea would be to drop a note on User talk:Rustak`
`02:41.01`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`then it's probably only normaly-looking to me because i have everything still in chache ^^;`
`02:41.05`	`Kirkburn`	`He's the guy who upgraded the wiki`
`02:41.13`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`ok`
`02:41.46`	`Kirkburn`	`Make sure you explain is clearly - he's not an active member :)`
`02:41.59`	`Kirkburn`	`(even if he does own it)`
`02:42.00`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Welcome, dorbak, it's similiarly easy to get the one for the guild.`
`02:42.15`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`hmm, the events-listing is rendered where oddly too`
`02:42.58`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I think it's that the upgrade didn't remove older directions.`
`02:43.40`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Flyoc_ (n=flyin_do@APlessis-Bouchard-153-1-88-4.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`02:43.52`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`http://www.miyaki.de/dev/event_list.PNG`
`02:44.30`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`somehow it randomly puts these icons for unordered lists in there :)`
`02:44.48`	`Kirkburn`	`If only Mikk weren't asleep :/`
`02:45.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Checked in something other than Opera?`
`02:45.36`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`well, IE is the same, but haven't tested that in firefox`
`02:45.44`	`Kirkburn`	`k`
`02:46.19`	`Kirkburn`	`Well, since I can't get to the wiki to see what it's like for me, I can't do much atm ... =(`
`02:46.36`	`GeoDaMancer`	`FF gets the same results when looking at things.`
`02:46.45`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`that's no problem, I just wanted to make sure that someone knowns about this ^^`
`02:46.48`	`Kirkburn`	`I need to go to bed, but if it's not sorted tomorrow, I'll look again`
`02:46.57`	`Kirkburn`	`Thanks :)`
`02:47.22`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Leep swell, mang.`
`02:47.46`	`Neko-Zelgadis`	`good night then :)`
`02:47.47`	`Kirkburn`	`Noodgight overene!`
`02:47.53`	`Cairenn`	`night Kirkburn`
`02:48.08`	`Kirkburn`	`*overyene :P`
`02:48.37`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zespri_work (n=andrews@124.197.5.115)`
`02:53.26`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`ooh`
`02:53.40`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`a quest just did that "yellow arrow pointing in the direction of the objective" thing again`
`02:53.51`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`really with i knew what caused that`
`02:54.13`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I know! So do I!`
`02:57.27`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`oh it's doing it again`
`02:57.29`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`zomg`
`03:00.18`	`GeoDaMancer`	`What quest?`
`03:02.35`	`GeoDaMancer`	`What's the difference between this.id and this:GetID()?`
`03:05.36`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Shouldn't they both return the same value?`
`03:06.00`	`Iriel\|Working`	`One is a method that returns the C++ stored frame ID (an integer)`
`03:06.14`	`warla`	`ZOMG finally hell yes`
`03:06.14`	`Iriel\|Working`	`The other is referencing the 'id' value of the frame's lua table (which could be anything)`
`03:06.21`	`warla`	`HUHURAN down`
`03:06.24`	`warla`	`heh`
`03:06.27`	`warla`	`firsttime kill`
`03:06.44`	`warla`	`was a draw.... raid died... and she died off my corruption tick lol...`
`03:06.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I'm trying to access information from an xml document. Is there a way to pull the id of the item without using the GetID()?`
`03:07.47`	`jaxdahl`	`got maexxna tonight, warla`
`03:07.49`	`jaxdahl`	`about 10 min ago`
`03:08.15`	`GeoDaMancer`	`~_~ And to think, I'm happy when I can get through with VC.`
`03:09.06`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Ah. I think I get it now.`
`03:09.51`	`GeoDaMancer`	`The slot ID of the action bar is dictated by the C++ stored frame ID, and not the actual id. >.>`
`03:13.07`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`<GeoDaMancer> What quest?`
`03:13.16`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`http://www.thottbot.com/index.cgi?qu=328`
`03:14.40`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`i passed by the chest and left the cave`
`03:14.43`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Grrr.`
`03:14.48`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`then noticed the arrow pointing back into the cave`
`03:15.12`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Heh.`
`03:15.44`	`GeoDaMancer`	`This is getting rather frustrating. xD`
`03:15.53`	`Mr_Rabies2`	`the xml thing?`
`03:15.59`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yes.`
`03:18.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Okay, I'm firing something that displays this.id from a onclick event in a check box. It's returning 'nil'.`
`03:19.12`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is that right, or am I doing this wrong?`
`03:19.18`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge [Ammo] (n=wouter@connected.dnd.utwente.nl)`
`03:19.21`	`Tuller`	`try this:GetID()?`
`03:20.31`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Alright, that works. But I have another value I'm trying to call in the from the xml check box, and it's not one of the prewritten Gets.`
`03:21.21`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Hang on a sec, are you trying do to <Frame ... wibble="hello" ...> and then access wibble from code?`
`03:21.28`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yes.`
`03:21.39`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Ah, you can't do that, you'd need to assign this.wibble in the OnLoad for the frame`
`03:22.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Doink. That would explain the problem. xD`
`03:22.25`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Thank you very muchly.`
`03:23.22`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I see, I see. It doesn't actually assign the values in the xml to the table when it loads, it only accesses them using Get functions.`
`03:23.34`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Thank you, thank you very much.`
`03:23.47`	`Iriel\|Working`	`There are C++ objects behind the scenes which the XML is allocating`
`03:24.03`	`Iriel\|Working`	`they have pre-defined properties, for which there are get and set methods exposed to lua`
`03:24.16`	`Iriel\|Working`	`so we can reach them, however they're not IN the lua table, they're in the C++ object that's behind it`
`03:24.45`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Like protected or private variables/methods in a class.`
`03:24.49`	`Iriel\|Working`	`THEN, the object we use in the API is a lua table with a reference to this C++ object, and we can put whatever we want in there, with the exception of the key 0 (number 0), which is used for the C++ reference`
`03:25.03`	`GeoDaMancer`	`There're there, but you can only use them with the right public method.`
`03:25.12`	`Iriel\|Working`	`pretty much, yes`
`03:25.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Alright. ^_^ Thank you.`
`03:25.57`	`GeoDaMancer`	`That explains one of my big problems. xD`
`03:27.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I'm trying to write my Gui so that it conserves the space taken up in the action bar.`
`03:30.22`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Zelgadis (n=Zelgadis@d463c941.datahighways.de)`
`03:33.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`How can you tell if the cursor has something through the API?`
`03:34.04`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Never mind.`
`03:37.08`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge chuckg (n=chuckg@66-237-5-116.starstream.net)`
`03:39.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`YES!`
`03:44.50`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Flyoc_ (n=flyin_do@APlessis-Bouchard-153-1-88-4.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
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`04:13.25`	`zespri_work`	`what laptop can run wow? and what are good laptops nowadays anyway?`
`04:13.36`	`clad\|sleep`	`zespri_work: I have a $400 laptop, and it runs wow great`
`04:13.50`	`Cairenn`	`night clad\|sleep, sweet dreams`
`04:14.13`	`clad\|sleep`	`zespri_work: Celeron 1.5, 704MB RAM.`
`04:14.16`	`clad\|sleep`	`Cairenn: Night cair`
`04:14.45`	`zespri_work`	`my budget is 2000USD, but I'm not sure what direction to look at`
`04:15.27`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I'm a thinkpad whore, if there's an affordable option there with a reasonable video card it'll be solid, but they're probably overly pricy if you're on a budget.`
`04:15.43`	`Iriel\|Working`	`my fiancee's dell runs wow just fine, they seem to make decent enough machines for reasonable prices.`
`04:17.10`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight__ (i=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`04:18.25`	`zespri_work`	`cheers. toshibas was popular some years ago, but now thy are either to expensive or too cheap =)`
`04:19.15`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I've had no direct experience with toshibas in the last few years, so can't rate them either way.`
`04:19.57`	`Tem`	`I miss the good old days`
`04:19.58`	`Tem`	`http://imagelink.org/temp/333`
`04:20.31`	`zespri_work`	`Iriel, what do you like about thinkpads? Style and design?`
`04:22.05`	`Iriel\|Working`	`They're well constructed, well designed, appropriately linux friendly, light (I like the T series) and I like the trackpoint (I dislike the trackpads)`
`04:22.35`	`GeoDaMancer`	`2000USD. I wish I had that to buy a laptop. -_-`
`04:23.15`	`Iriel\|Working`	`They're made by Lenovo now, but I have the first Lenovo thinkpad too (X41 - A tablet one) and they dont appear to have skimped on any of the features (though obviously you wouldn't buy a tablet if you didn't need one, not worth the extra expense)`
`04:23.31`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Acer computers are pretty good. At least mine works alright.`
`04:23.47`	`Tem`	`my roomate had an Acer laptop`
`04:23.54`	`Tem`	`it gave him constant problems`
`04:24.05`	`GeoDaMancer`	`His did?`
`04:24.21`	`Tem`	`aye`
`04:24.21`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Mine's only problem is that I used it like a desktop too much. xD`
`04:24.21`	`Tem`	`heh`
`04:24.30`	`Tem`	`my laptop suffers from desktop-wanna-be syndrome`
`04:24.50`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Same here. Well, and the fans've broken on it after a year's hard use.`
`04:24.54`	`Iriel\|Working`	`One of my co-workers did that to himself, got some horrendous alienware monstrosity`
`04:26.26`	`Tem`	`I'm living with a dell xps laptop`
`04:26.40`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I want an alienware monstrosity.`
`04:27.23`	`Tem`	`it's 20 pounds of computing desktop-wanna-be-ness`
`04:27.29`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I wants.`
`04:27.42`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Just get a desktop once it's that heavy!`
`04:28.05`	`Iriel\|Working`	`is 2k enough to afford a mac?`
`04:28.10`	`Iriel\|Working`	`(laptop, that is)?`
`04:28.11`	`Tem`	`well, at the time I had to have a laptop`
`04:28.14`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yes.`
`04:28.15`	`Tem`	`it was required of me`
`04:28.28`	`Tem`	`I couldn't afford a decent laptop AND a desktop that I could game with`
`04:28.38`	`Tem`	`so I created a monster`
`04:28.58`	`GeoDaMancer`	`http://macconnection.com`
`04:32.33`	`Corrodias`	`is there a currently working version of Decursive?`
`04:32.47`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Decursive?`
`04:33.18`	`Tem`	`Corrodias, iirc there's one at wowi`
`04:33.29`	`Tem`	`"decursive continued" or somesuch`
`04:38.09`	`Corrodias`	`thanks`
`04:42.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge AnduinLothar (n=KarlKFI@ip68-106-219-78.oc.oc.cox.net)`
`04:53.08`	`warla`	`anyone around?`
`04:53.21`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Me, sort of.`
`04:53.26`	`warla`	`does anyone else have issues with the WOW forums`
`04:53.36`	`warla`	`those shitforums seem to bring me old listings`
`04:53.40`	`GeoDaMancer`	`It's a forum. >.>`
`04:53.46`	`warla`	`i always see the same gay threads`
`04:53.56`	`Cairenn`	`warla: excuse me?`
`04:54.25`	`warla`	`yea..`
`04:54.30`	`warla`	`i mean i can reload`
`04:54.33`	`warla`	`i can make a new thread`
`04:54.37`	`warla`	`when i look at the forum list`
`04:54.39`	`warla`	`it doesnt change`
`04:54.44`	`warla`	`its ALWAYS the same`
`04:54.46`	`zespri_work`	`I just was looking at dell XPS. May be I get one of these`
`04:54.53`	`warla`	`sometimes after 5000 reloads i see something different`
`04:55.07`	`Cairenn`	`that's nice ... but your comments could use refinement`
`04:55.14`	`warla`	`heh k`
`04:57.45`	`warla`	`so does anyone have same prob?`
`04:57.51`	`warla`	`or does the blizzard forum loads fine?`
`04:58.09`	`GeoDaMancer`	`No clue, I don't look at them. -At all-.`
`04:58.14`	`warla`	`hehe`
`04:58.23`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Forums == teh anti-christ. xD`
`04:58.25`	`warla`	`any suggestion for forums that are better? ;-)`
`04:58.29`	`Cairenn`	`they can be less than stellar, yes, but usually a refresh clears it up ... mind you, the only forum I ever look at is the UI forum`
`04:58.47`	`Cairenn`	`if you want official Blizz forums, that's it`
`04:58.52`	`warla`	`the UI forum is the one i have the most problems with`
`04:59.02`	`warla`	`Lootlink for 1.12? Kharthus 1 546 by Kirov`
`04:59.10`	`warla`	`thats the thread i see on top for the past 5 days`
`04:59.15`	`warla`	`1 reply`
`04:59.19`	`Cairenn`	`try clearing your cache`
`04:59.34`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Warla; You are on the RIGHT forum, right?`
`04:59.39`	`Iriel\|Working`	`warla : The new ones, not the old ones?`
`04:59.46`	`warla`	`ya`
`04:59.46`	`warla`	`new`
`04:59.54`	`warla`	`http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/board.html?forumId=11114 <-- ui forum`
`05:00.00`	`Iriel\|Working`	`warla : There's a 2.0.0 Changes - Concise list sticky thread?`
`05:00.17`	`warla`	`ya there us`
`05:00.18`	`warla`	`is`
`05:00.32`	`Cairenn`	`weird, it's not that messed up for me`
`05:00.34`	`warla`	`and right below is Lootlink for 1.12? Kharthus 1 546 by Kirov`
`05:00.38`	`Iriel\|Working`	`I dont see a Lootlink for 1.12 thread ANYWHERE`
`05:00.38`	`warla`	`for the past 5 days`
`05:00.40`	`warla`	`no change`
`05:00.49`	`Cairenn`	`clear your cache`
`05:00.51`	`warla`	`the threads seem to not refresh drives me nuts`
`05:01.02`	`Cairenn`	`do a hard refresh`
`05:01.10`	`Cairenn`	`alt F5`
`05:01.11`	`Iriel\|Working`	`Clear your COOKIES for the site, also`
`05:01.16`	`Cairenn`	`that too`
`05:01.26`	`Iriel\|Working`	`And if you're using any kind of proxy or cache, disable it for now`
`05:18.57`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Yay, time to write an insertion. >.>`
`05:51.41`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Dhraga (n=chatzill@static-213.88.132.126.addr.tdcsong.se)`
`05:53.37`	`Dhraga`	`Morning all`
`05:54.27`	`Cairenn`	`hi Dhraga`
`05:54.47`	`Cairenn`	`night guys, sleepy time for me`
`05:54.52`	`Dhraga`	`Hehe nn`
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`06:02.08`	`Mikma`	`PerfectRaid:Simulate() ooh, pretty :D`
`06:05.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tain (n=tain@ip68-109-29-175.ri.ri.cox.net)`
`06:07.20`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Do you actually have to exit WoW when you make changes to a .toc or can you just disconnect?`
`06:25.24`	`norgs_away`	`actually have to quit and restart to reload toc changes`
`06:26.22`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Thanks, norgs.`
`06:26.24`	`norgs_away`	`same thing for xml changes too ( i think ) although it seems to reload xml changes if the xml file didn't parse properly... never been able to really work that out tho`
`06:26.52`	`Mikma`	`.toc and texture -changes require wow-reboot`
`06:26.55`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Nah, changes an xml file reload if you use /reloadUI or whatever it is.`
`06:26.59`	`Mikma`	`but .xml and .lua don't`
`06:27.36`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I was just checking, 'cause I didn't want to quit if I didn't have to.`
`06:27.45`	`norgs_away`	`yeah - i thought that too, but i've often made changes to xml and it doesn't reload`
`06:27.48`	`krka`	`additional files require a wow-reboot`
`06:28.03`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Sweet. It's working.`
`06:28.52`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Well, mostly working. xD`
`06:28.53`	`norgs_away`	`ahhh - when you say texture changes, you mean texture changes in the xml file?`
`06:29.21`	`norgs_away`	`that's prolly what i've been noticing...`
`06:30.05`	`GeoDaMancer`	`It's hard to make it so that action bar slots force right alignment. >.>`
`06:30.25`	`Mikma`	`hmmh?`
`06:30.34`	`Mikma`	`what do you mean by that?`
`06:31.30`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Tain_ (n=tain@ip68-109-29-175.ri.ri.cox.net)`
`06:31.31`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I'm writing a script that brings a action-bar sort of thing up, and allows you to organize it for a one click action thing. Like, it'll manage your buffs, and debuffs, and which attacks get fired in what priority. Like you'll riposte when able before you'll do a sinister strike, and things of that sort.`
`06:32.46`	`GeoDaMancer`	`And, I'm make a Gui for it, so it's just drag and drop for arranging the actions. But, I want it so that the actions align to the right.. Like if you drop something in the left most box, but there're empty boxes between it and the right, it'll slide it to the right most empty box.`
`06:33.00`	`GeoDaMancer`	`If that makes sense at all. xD`
`06:34.15`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I'm also making it so that it conserves action bar space. So it only takes up the amount of actions that are in the gui listing, with no spaces between them.`
`06:36.11`	`GeoDaMancer`	`Is that confusing enough?`
`06:38.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight_ (i=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`06:40.32`	`GeoDaMancer`	`But, I need to write it more correctly. -_-`
`06:42.29`	`GeoDaMancer`	`I need to write a reordered. -_-`
`06:44.04`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Priam (n=vnabet@pc.yacast.fr)`
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`07:55.59`	`Shadowed`	`Anyone know offhand how much AP increases/decreases damage range by 1 for warriors?`
`07:56.15`	`Shadowed`	`been checking wiki, but it keeps timing out :/`
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`08:20.24`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`i never got to understand the dps increases / decreases :(`
`08:22.54`	`MoonWolf`	`14 is one dps`
`08:23.09`	`MoonWolf`	`if you would have a 2 speed weapon with 5 - 10 damage`
`08:23.25`	`MoonWolf`	`gaining 14 ap would turn it into this`
`08:23.46`	`MoonWolf`	`1(dps) * 2(weapons speed in seconds) = 2`
`08:24.04`	`MoonWolf`	`2 speed 7(5+2) - 12(10 + 2)`
`08:24.27`	`MoonWolf`	`is this clear ?`
`08:24.31`	`Mikma`	`no`
`08:24.50`	`Dhraga`	`hehe`
`08:24.54`	`Shadowed`	`yes`
`08:24.55`	`Shadowed`	`thanks`
`08:24.59`	`Mikma`	`you're being pro. stop it!`
`08:25.26`	`MoonWolf`	`this is easy, it gets fun when damage bonusses from talents weapons and stuff figure into it.`
`08:25.26`	`Shadowed`	`now if i owned something with 14 AP`
`08:25.33`	`Shadowed`	`yeah`
`08:25.43`	`Shadowed`	`working on a sim for combat, so have to go through all thefun math`
`08:26.50`	`MoonWolf`	`I will take no more of this Mikma, takes the trout away and puts it back in the wild`
`08:26.57`	`Shadowed`	`lol`
`08:38.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge snurre (n=snurre@AVelizy-153-1-64-137.w86-217.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
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`09:00.49`	`vhaarr`	`Anyone know of any problems with GetPlayerBuffTexture?`
`09:17.33`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mery (i=metelman@p54AED76F.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`09:22.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge GremWarsong (n=Grem@dyn-8-82.myactv.net)`
`09:22.44`	`GremWarsong`	`Hey everyone`
`09:22.50`	`GremWarsong`	`Im having some horrible times drawing...a texture`
`09:22.57`	`GremWarsong`	`I draw a texture that is 10x10, but it draws it 8x8`
`09:23.09`	`GremWarsong`	`I position it at 1,1, but it positions it wrong on the screen by a pixel or two, randomly`
`09:23.10`	`Cairenn`	`because it has to be power of 2`
`09:23.33`	`GremWarsong`	`on positioning and size?`
`09:24.02`	`Cairenn`	`on size, note I said it after you said dimensions but before you said positioning?`
`09:24.12`	`Mery`	`are you using a UI scale?`
`09:24.17`	`GremWarsong`	`no Mery`
`09:24.40`	`Cairenn`	`with it not being power of 2, you're lucky it's showing at all`
`09:24.43`	`GremWarsong`	`hmm`
`09:24.44`	`Mery`	`(10x10 texture is fine, but the file you load into it has to be a power of 2)`
`09:25.00`	`GremWarsong`	`Im not loading a file`
`09:25.03`	`GremWarsong`	`Im just drawing pixels`
`09:25.34`	`Mery`	`can you post you code in http://wowi.pastey.net/ ?`
`09:26.02`	`Cairenn`	`how are you "just drawing pixels"?`
`09:26.17`	`GremWarsong`	`I position textures in a row`
`09:26.27`	`Mery`	`he probably means a texture object filled with a color`
`09:26.32`	`GremWarsong`	`right Mery`
`09:26.32`	`Cairenn`	`yes, but how are you getting them into game?`
`09:26.41`	`Cairenn`	`I understand that`
`09:26.54`	`Cairenn`	`but he says he isn't loading a file ... it has to be a file confused`
`09:27.00`	`GremWarsong`	`It doesnt have to be a file`
`09:27.05`	`GremWarsong`	`You can take a texture and draw a background to it`
`09:27.10`	`Mery`	`he is not loading a .tgy or .blp`
`09:27.13`	`GremWarsong`	`So they are just colored squares`
`09:27.15`	`Mery`	`tga*`
`09:27.34`	`Cairenn`	`oookay ....`
`09:27.42`	`GremWarsong`	`wowi.pastey.net/618`
`09:27.46`	`Cairenn`	`nm then, I'm just going to bed`
`09:28.26`	`Mery`	`Error, that code is not available`
`09:28.28`	`GremWarsong`	`sec`
`09:28.51`	`GremWarsong`	`http://www.wowi.pastey.net/618`
`09:29.20`	`GremWarsong`	`They are drawing to the screen with random dimensions (offset by 1), and random positions (offset by 1)`
`09:29.54`	`Mery`	`well SetWidth(8) and SetHeight(8) make it 8x8 ...`
`09:30.01`	`GremWarsong`	`Right...`
`09:30.03`	`GremWarsong`	`Is that okay?`
`09:30.29`	`Mery`	`night Cairenn\|sleep`
`09:30.56`	`Mery`	`ya but you said you wanted the texture to be 10x10, didn't you?`
`09:31.05`	`GremWarsong`	`I dont care what size they are`
`09:31.06`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`then set it to 16 x 16`
`09:31.12`	`GremWarsong`	`No matter what size I make them, their size changes`
`09:31.15`	`GremWarsong`	`by a pixel or two`
`09:31.56`	`Mery`	`what resolution are you running in?`
`09:32.05`	`GremWarsong`	`800x600`
`09:32.54`	`Mery`	`you should try to anchor them relative to each other instead of all relative to UIParent`
`09:33.09`	`GremWarsong`	`That shouldnt matter`
`09:33.18`	`GremWarsong`	`I cant even get 1 to appear correctly`
`09:33.26`	`GremWarsong`	`Even 1 is never the right size or in the right spot`
`09:34.30`	`GremWarsong`	`In other words, I cant get one exact texture to draw to the screen in the shape or location I told it too`
`09:34.35`	`GremWarsong`	`it's always a pixel or two off in some way`
`09:35.50`	`Mery`	`well the problem may be that the UI system is 1024x768 pixel, so with 800x600 resultion a 8 pixel width texture should be 6,25 pixel width`
`09:36.15`	`Corrodias`	`what?`
`09:36.20`	`GremWarsong`	`Why? Wouldnt an 8 pixel width texture be 8 pixels?`
`09:36.22`	`GremWarsong`	`lol`
`09:36.51`	`Mery`	`no wait..`
`09:37.05`	`Mery`	`i guess i need some sleep too..`
`09:37.15`	`Corrodias`	`so do i. class starts early tomorrow. 'ni!`
`09:37.18`	`GremWarsong`	`Nobody knows the answer to this?`
`09:37.19`	`GremWarsong`	`=/`
`09:37.30`	`GremWarsong`	`Nobody has ever tried to plot a texture accurately?`
`09:37.48`	`Mery`	`but in any case try setting the resolution to 1024x768`
`09:37.51`	`Mery`	`and make a ss`
`09:38.34`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah`
`09:39.01`	`GremWarsong`	`I need it to work in any resolution`
`09:39.02`	`GremWarsong`	`heh`
`09:39.12`	`GremWarsong`	`Resolution-specific addons seems like a nasty idea`
`09:41.02`	`Mery`	`well was it correct in 1024x768?`
`09:42.11`	`GremWarsong`	`let me look`
`09:43.26`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah, they seem perfect in 1024x768`
`09:44.12`	`GremWarsong`	`So lets consider that I dont care about their width and height, I just need them to all be the same size in 800x600`
`09:44.31`	`GremWarsong`	`16x16 is perfect in 1024x768`
`09:44.38`	`GremWarsong`	`So I need to find perfect dimensions that work for 800x600`
`09:45.17`	`Mery`	`well if you then use UIScale in the video options, they will get scaled down again`
`09:45.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Andalia (n=xx@p54ADC09E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`09:45.34`	`Mery`	`(unless you counter that)`
`09:46.04`	`GremWarsong`	`Lets assume im not using UIScale`
`09:46.23`	`Mery`	`if 16x16 is fine in 1024 then why isn't it in 800x600? (I mean they should be the same "size" on your screen just with less pixels as you show less pixels)`
`09:46.51`	`GremWarsong`	`thats what I thought`
`09:48.20`	`GremWarsong`	`but it doesnt`
`09:48.22`	`GremWarsong`	`it gets mis-shaped`
`09:49.00`	`Mery`	`what do you mean by mis-shaped?`
`09:49.11`	`GremWarsong`	`Their width is random off by a pixel`
`09:49.21`	`GremWarsong`	`either a pixel short or pixel long`
`09:49.48`	`Mery`	`because 16 pixel is 12.5 pixel in 800x600`
`09:50.11`	`GremWarsong`	`Is there a solution?`
`09:50.32`	`Mery`	`(for that im the wrong person to ask i bothered too less with such problems)`
`09:50.48`	`GremWarsong`	`lol`
`09:51.02`	`GremWarsong`	`The advice kinda makes sense though =)`
`09:53.17`	`Mery`	`if you anchor them to each other there shouldn't be pixel width gaps i think`
`09:53.57`	`Mery`	`(if you get those)`
`09:54.19`	`GremWarsong`	`The gaps are caused because of their size being messed up`
`09:55.01`	`Mery`	`well "no"`
`09:55.18`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Legorolo (n=Legorol@tcmpc43.phy.cam.ac.uk)`
`09:55.28`	`Mery`	`the gaps are cause couse you don't anchor them in the logical way as you want it`
`09:55.44`	`Mery`	`"one texture next to the other with a 0 pixel spacing"`
`09:56.02`	`Mery`	`you anchor them all individually on the screen`
`09:56.08`	`Mery`	`which is not the same`
`09:56.12`	`GremWarsong`	`hmm`
`09:56.16`	`GremWarsong`	`Really`
`10:00.27`	`GremWarsong`	`Okay, that didnt work`
`10:00.34`	`GremWarsong`	`anchoring them together, they are still different sizes`
`10:01.25`	`Mery`	`but do you have gaps?`
`10:01.37`	`GremWarsong`	`No`
`10:01.56`	`GremWarsong`	`I didnt have gaps before`
`10:02.01`	`GremWarsong`	`because I assume they were overlapping`
`10:02.55`	`Mery`	`well i don't think you can do anthing against the slightly different size`
`10:03.25`	`Mery`	`because of how wow adjusts the interface to look the same on all resolutions`
`10:03.39`	`GremWarsong`	`I just want it to work in 800x600 mostly`
`10:04.30`	`Mery`	`hmm try settign the height and width to 12.8 pixels`
`10:04.54`	`Mery`	`(for a hopefully 10 pixel texture in 800x600)`
`10:05.56`	`GremWarsong`	`didnt work at all`
`10:06.04`	`Mery`	`an error?`
`10:06.09`	`GremWarsong`	`no`
`10:06.14`	`GremWarsong`	`oddly spaced and randomly sized`
`10:06.15`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (n=Jonathan@host81-159-131-7.range81-159.btcentralplus.com)`
`10:06.16`	`GremWarsong`	`again, by a pixel or two`
`10:08.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Insa (n=insa@62.175-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`10:09.50`	`Mery`	`then i dunno...`
`10:09.57`	`GremWarsong`	`=/`
`10:10.17`	`Mery`	`why in 800x600 anyway? wanna fraps something?`
`10:10.27`	`GremWarsong`	`Yeah`
`10:18.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Dhraga (n=chatzill@static-213.88.132.126.addr.tdcsong.se)`
`10:19.22`	`Dhraga`	`Hi all`
`10:19.55`	`GremWarsong`	`What would be the perfect UI scale for pixel-perfect frames in an 800x600 environment?`
`10:20.44`	`Dhraga`	`Any lua coder here atm by any chance ?`
`10:21.28`	`GremWarsong`	`Sure`
`10:22.04`	`Dhraga`	`I have a question... will type it together... gimmie a sec`
`10:29.16`	`Dhraga`	`I'm looking fior either an existing addon that enhances the chat strings that can be use in macros (like %t etc), there is one by Satrina called ChatFrameExtender at : http://ui.worldofwar.net/ui.php?id=1506 wich does this but it doeas a lot of other features also...`
`10:30.16`	`Dhraga`	`Any lua coder here that could just rip out everything except the chat string enhancements from the ChatFrameExtender ?`
`10:30.58`	`Dhraga`	`Strings in ChatFrameExtender is (I hope pasting multiple lines wont get me kicked:P) ....`
`10:31.12`	`Dhraga`	`Added string expansions (can be used in macros)`
`10:31.14`	`Dhraga`	`* %s - expands to target's sex`
`10:31.15`	`Dhraga`	`* %l - expands to target's level`
`10:31.17`	`Dhraga`	`* %r - expands to target's race`
`10:31.18`	`Dhraga`	`* %c - expands to target's class`
`10:31.20`	`Dhraga`	`* %p - expands to target's PVP rank + name ('Private Satrina')`
`10:31.21`	`Dhraga`	`* %rn - expands to your target's PVP rank as a number (0-14)`
`10:31.23`	`Dhraga`	`* %rs - expands to your target's PVP rank as a string ('Private', 'Field Marshal', etc.)`
`10:31.24`	`Dhraga`	`* %tt - expands to the target of your current target`
`10:31.26`	`Dhraga`	`* %zon - expands to your current zone (ie. Stormwind City)`
`10:31.27`	`Dhraga`	`* %loc - expands to your current location (as shown above the minimap)`
`10:31.29`	`Dhraga`	`* %pos - expands to your current location cooordinates '(20,30)'`
`10:31.30`	`Dhraga`	`* %hc, %hm, %hp - expand to your current, maximum, percentage health`
`10:31.32`	`Dhraga`	`* %mc, %mm, %mp - expand to your current, maximum, percentage mana`
`10:31.49`	`ckknight`	`spam.`
`10:32.03`	`Dhraga`	`Ya, I know, sorry ck ;)`
`10:32.09`	`ckknight`	`use pastey next time.`
`10:32.17`	`ckknight`	`http://wowi.pastey.net/`
`10:32.44`	`Dhraga`	`Thanks =)`
`10:34.54`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`10:35.18`	`Kirkburn`	`I still can't reach wowwiki.com :/`
`10:36.19`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`10:39.04`	`Kirkburn`	`Can anyone find out the IP address for me?`
`10:39.46`	`Kirkburn`	`nvm`
`10:40.29`	`Dhraga`	`Kirk, doe4s it work for you now ?`
`10:40.42`	`Kirkburn`	`nope, not even using the IP`
`10:41.21`	`Dhraga`	`It works fine for me, must be you ISP try rerouting yourself through a web proxy... try the Freebar at : http://www.secure-tunnel.com/`
`10:41.33`	`Dhraga`	`And see if it gets you there`
`10:41.36`	`Kirkburn`	`Pinging it completely fails`
`10:42.00`	`Dhraga`	`Mmm your isp must have some problems atm reaching their net`
`10:42.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@r35h14.res.gatech.edu)`
`10:43.37`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge DarkImakuni (n=DarkImak@host81-152-199-85.range81-152.btcentralplus.com)`
`10:44.16`	`Dhraga`	`Kirk, can you reach the http://www.secure-tunnel.com/ from your pc ?`
`10:45.25`	`Kirkburn`	`yup`
`10:45.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge [Wobin] (n=Wobin@218-214-59-86.people.net.au)`
`10:46.04`	`Dhraga`	`Then in the Freebar field down to the left just paste in http://www.wowwiki.com`
`10:46.19`	`Dhraga`	`It should allow you to reach wowwiki.com`
`10:46.53`	`Kirkburn`	`ooh, I see`
`10:46.58`	`Kirkburn`	`Yeah that worked`
`10:47.05`	`Dhraga`	`great =)`
`10:47.14`	`Kirkburn`	`Totally messes up the code though :P`
`10:47.31`	`Dhraga`	`Web proxies are good to use when your isp is having problems...`
`10:47.46`	`Dhraga`	`Hmmm.... Lemme think if I can remeber any other web proxie`
`10:48.20`	`Kirkburn`	`Hope it sorts itself soon :/`
`10:51.53`	`Dhraga`	`Kirk, try http://www.the-cloak.com/login.html and paste in wowiki's adress in the starting url box`
`10:52.36`	`Kirkburn`	`That worked a lot better :P`
`10:53.18`	`Dhraga`	`Most welcome`
`10:53.55`	`Dhraga`	`If this things happens again bookmark this page : http://ipinfo.info/html/anonymous-surfing_2.php it lists the most on the web proxies out there`
`10:54.10`	`Kirkburn`	`thanks :)`
`10:54.44`	`Dhraga`	`yw`
`10:56.13`	`Dhraga`	`Btw, was there any coder out there that had time to just rip out the chat strings enhancements from the ChatFrameExtender ? biig puppy smile : http://ui.worldofwar.net/ui.php?id=1506`
`11:08.36`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`11:12.52`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kemayo (n=kemayo@pool-71-103-168-20.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net)`
`11:38.30`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge warla (i=Darky28@39.220.76.83.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`11:38.43`	`warla`	`damn`
`11:38.56`	`warla`	`Firefox somehow displays pages more clever than IE`
`11:39.11`	`warla`	`hidden stuff firefox wont load right away so its faster`
`11:39.21`	`warla`	`while crappy IE loads everything even the hidden stuff`
`11:41.46`	`warla`	`http://www.wowledgebase.com/?id=1 <-- compare loading speed in snailplorer 7 and firefox`
`11:47.24`	`DarkImakuni`	`Firefox ftw`
`11:49.31`	`ckknight`	`Opera ftw :-P`
`11:51.06`	`Kirkburn1`	`Snailsplorer ftw \o/`
`11:52.41`	`ckknight`	`um`
`11:52.48`	`ckknight`	`taxes ftl`
`11:55.22`	`DarkImakuni`	`ckknight ftw :P`
`11:55.32`	`ckknight`	`hehe`
`11:55.46`	`DarkImakuni`	`<3 FuBar`
`11:57.35`	`ckknight`	`good stuff`
`12:00.05`	`Kirkburn1`	`indeed it is :)`
`12:01.51`	`DarkImakuni`	`I've used it from day one, back when it was called BossPanel`
`12:02.38`	`Kirkburn1`	`Yeah, I kinda wish I'd changed from Titan earlier`
`12:08.42`	`ckknight`	`I doubt from day one...`
`12:08.48`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge JoshBorke (n=Josh@ohm.stl.gtri.gatech.edu)`
`12:08.53`	`ckknight`	`though maybe`
`12:08.53`	`Kirkburn1`	`I got my Zen Vision:M back today :D`
`12:08.58`	`ckknight`	`it would've been back in February.`
`12:09.08`	`Kirkburn1`	`ckknight, he's obviously stalking you :P`
`12:09.13`	`ckknight`	`it's undergone like 2 rewrites now`
`12:09.13`	`DarkImakuni`	`lol`
`12:09.14`	`JoshBorke`	`morning`
`12:09.17`	`Kirkburn1`	`And stealing code from your computers :)`
`12:09.25`	`ckknight`	`DarkImakuni, I've done other, grander things than FuBar.`
`12:09.42`	`Kirkburn1`	`Giant ice palaces?`
`12:09.56`	`Kirkburn1`	`Created an articificial lake?`
`12:10.17`	`DarkImakuni`	`survived the horrors of high school?`
`12:10.17`	`Kirkburn1`	`Blew up the planet between Mars and Jupiter?`
`12:10.32`	`DarkImakuni`	`rofl @ Kirkburn`
`12:10.39`	`Kirkburn1`	`DarkImakuni, now, let's not be too over the top here :)`
`12:11.02`	`Kirkburn1`	`_No-one_ survives high school`
`12:11.05`	`ckknight`	`High School wasn't bad for me.`
`12:11.12`	`ckknight`	`I went to a special school, though`
`12:11.16`	`ckknight`	`with short buses and all.`
`12:11.22`	`ckknight`	`for some ungodly reason.`
`12:11.43`	`Kaelten`	`anyone know how to force mediawiki to make all the users see one skin`
`12:11.43`	`Kaelten`	`?`
`12:11.45`	`Kirkburn1`	`ckknight, so you're a spawn of the devil?`
`12:11.52`	`Kirkburn1`	`Cos that would be quite ungodly`
`12:11.53`	`DarkImakuni`	`my high school was hell... 12 years of total crap`
`12:12.16`	`Kirkburn1`	`Kaelten, delete all the other options?`
`12:12.18`	`ckknight`	`sorry, Kirkburn, I don't follow the Judeo-Christian belief system.`
`12:12.40`	`Kaelten`	`Kirkburn1: tried that, now its just causing errors for everyone else`
`12:12.41`	`Kirkburn1`	`God isn't exclusively owned by the, y'know :P`
`12:12.44`	`Kirkburn1`	`*them`
`12:12.58`	`Kirkburn1`	`Kaelten, ack. No idea then :/`
`12:13.08`	`ckknight`	`I think the devil is, though.`
`12:13.21`	`Kirkburn1`	`I think you are, too`
`12:13.35`	`Kirkburn1`	`I'm off swimming`
`12:13.37`	`Kirkburn1`	`Taraa`
`12:29.54`	`ckknight`	`hey guy.`
`12:30.10`	zinor`	`i think we're nearing beta test of the django site :)`
`12:30.45`	`Thrae`	`What is a "Django" anyway? All I know of it is the Capcom video game "Django the Solar Boy".`
`12:30.50`	zinor`	`www.djangoproject.com`
`12:31.15`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge bindi (i=indigo@d51A479A6.access.telenet.be)`
`12:31.39`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight_ (i=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`12:32.17`	`ckknight_`	`similar, Thrae, except it's actually a web development framework`
`12:32.48`	`Thrae`	`No no, I mean where does the word "Django" come from? Is it a common name in Djangoese or something?`
`12:32.56`	`ckknight_`	`Django Reinhart`
`12:33.27`	zinor`	`"Python on a plane" for what it provides Python developers, one observer said.`
`12:33.30`	zinor`	`haha, snakes on a plane :P`
`12:35.54`	`wereHamster`	`Thrae, Django was a italian westen movie`
`12:36.31`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kaelten (n=Kaelten@68.63.37.188)`
`12:36.33`	`*** mode/#wowi-lounge [+o Kaelten] by ChanServ`
`12:38.39`	`ckknight_`	`the framework is named after Django Reinhart`
`12:41.43`	zinor`	`brb installing net card`
`12:42.01`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight (i=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`12:46.06`	`wereHamster`	`oh.. didn't know that.. is he one of the developers?`
`12:47.18`	`ckknight`	`no, he's a musician`
`12:48.50`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor (n=yo@dslb-088-064-189-144.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`12:50.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Thrae (n=generalm@c-68-48-83-98.hsd1.md.comcast.net)`
`12:56.46`	`warla`	`does anyone have opera installed?`
`12:56.57`	`Mikma`	`me`
`12:57.28`	`warla`	`http://www.wowledgebase.com/?id=1 <-- could you check if that works somehow? but i dont make much hope.. opera always hates the stuff i make.. especially javascript lol`
`12:59.22`	`Mikma`	`warla: afaik, works perfectly!`
`12:59.55`	`Mikma`	`warla: recipes are shown 2x else perfect =)`
`13:00.56`	`warla`	`heh`
`13:01.14`	`warla`	`no javascript errors?`
`13:01.18`	`warla`	`that would surprise me`
`13:01.20`	`Mikma`	`nope`
`13:01.27`	`warla`	`opera ALWAYS hates whatever i code`
`13:01.35`	`Mikma`	`i'll try anothertime soon`
`13:01.42`	`Mikma`	`eating at the same tiome`
`13:02.04`	`warla`	`heh k :-)`
`13:04.58`	`Mikma`	`ok now`
`13:21.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge xordoquy (n=xordoquy@87.98.199.194)`
`13:21.17`	`xordoquy`	`hi`
`13:23.09`	`xordoquy`	`can someone help me understand how PartyMemberBuffTooltip is linked to a PartyMemberFrame ?`
`13:23.55`	`xordoquy`	`I can't get how the buff icons are positioned relating to the group members frame`
`13:26.36`	`xordoquy`	`oh, forget, I finally just found`
`13:37.40`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`13:38.49`	`Kirkburn`	`_Still_ no response from wowwiki.com for me :/`
`13:39.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Laric (i=Laric@217-13-2-126.dd.nextgentel.com)`
`13:41.41`	`Kirkburn`	`Spanish players! You have a website! http://wow-europe.com/es/`
`13:41.55`	`Kirkburn`	`Ole! (yes, I have no accent key)`
`13:43.28`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Dhraga (n=chatzill@static-213.88.132.126.addr.tdcsong.se)`
`13:43.49`	`DarkImakuni`	`Olé :P`
`13:44.00`	`Kirkburn`	`Thank you =)`
`13:44.14`	`DarkImakuni`	`Alt 130 = é`
`13:46.49`	`Flyoc`	`��`
`13:47.13`	`Flyoc`	`or you can have a french keyboard`
`13:47.44`	`xordoquy`	`Kirkburn: works here`
`13:47.58`	`Kirkburn`	`xordoquy, it's something up with my ISP, it seems`
`13:48.02`	`Laric`	`wonder if someone will shoot me for filing all these flyspray reports based on framexml.log :P`
`13:48.06`	`Kirkburn`	`I can't even ping it`
`13:48.25`	`Laric`	`oops wrong channel :P`
`13:48.27`	`Kirkburn`	`I've yet to find another website I can't reach though`
`13:51.01`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ckknight_ (i=ckknight@rrcs-74-62-251-191.west.biz.rr.com)`
`13:52.15`	`JoshBorke`	`except wowwiki?`
`13:52.21`	`Kirkburn`	`Indeed`
`13:52.41`	`Kirkburn`	`I can reach it using a proxy website thingy though`
`13:53.03`	`Kirkburn`	`Rather annoying, given I'd quite like to admin it :P`
`13:56.28`	`DarkImakuni`	`Kirkie: http://www.wowwiki.com/Main_Page works for me`
`13:57.07`	`Kirkburn`	`I can't ping the server, neither can the PC downstairs :/`
`13:57.12`	`xordoquy`	`it works but it seems he can not reach it ^^`
`13:57.19`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirkburn: you do a traceroute yet?`
`13:57.31`	`Kirkburn`	`What would I type for that?`
`13:57.41`	`ckknight_`	`getting a SQL error with wowwiki`
`13:57.54`	`ckknight_`	`MySQL returned error "1205: Lock wait timeout exceeded; try restarting transaction (localhost)".`
`13:57.56`	`ckknight_`	`:-(`
`13:58.16`	`Kirkburn`	`Notify Rustak on his talk page if you find bugs :)`
`13:58.26`	`Kirkburn`	`He's planning on looking at stuff again anyway`
`13:58.40`	`ckknight_`	`getting it on the Draenei page`
`13:58.46`	`ckknight_`	`weird thing is, it doesn't happen on other pages`
`13:58.53`	`Kirkburn`	`Strange`
`14:00.06`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirkburn: in windows, i believe it's tracert www.wowwiki.com`
`14:00.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`14:01.08`	`Kirkburn1`	`Running a tracert`
`14:01.19`	`Kirkburn1`	`I can't get past falcon.eicat.ca`
`14:02.17`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge \|FF\|Im2good4u (n=Silvana@82.173.40.73)`
`14:02.59`	`Kirkburn1`	`Everything just times out`
`14:03.57`	`xordoquy`	`can you connect internet ? :p`
`14:04.32`	`Kirkburn1`	`I've browsed lots of sites since the wowwiki stopped responding, had no failures :/ Ho hum, time for lunch`
`14:15.12`	`Maldivia`	`grrrr`
`14:15.34`	`Maldivia`	`I hate the new forums, for it inability to "save" the form text, like the old forums, when pressing back`
`14:16.00`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge [RTE] (n=1@pat.syndesis.com)`
`14:16.05`	`[RTE]`	`morning folks`
`14:17.17`	`DarkImakuni`	`afternoon RTE`
`14:20.10`	`xordoquy`	`does someone use wowbench ?`
`14:25.35`	`ckknight_`	`Maldivia, works for me with Opera`
`14:27.49`	`Maldivia`	`hmm`
`14:28.28`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge cogwheel (n=chatzill@67.188.231.45)`
`14:41.53`	`Legorolo`	`xordoquy: sort of, i used it before`
`14:43.33`	`Thrae`	`Anyone know any UI issues for 1.12? I'm planning on making an addon called "FixMe" which incorporates fixes for the Blizzard UI.`
`14:44.55`	`Thrae`	`For 1.12 all I have so far is one -- the Battlefield Minimap will auto-hide itself on some occasions even if you've shown it last BG session. There are some other "Fix" addons which still apply to 1.12 that I'll absorb.`
`14:48.07`	`xordoquy`	`Legorolo: is it worthy ?`
`14:48.18`	`Legorolo`	`depends on what you use it for, but i'd say very much so`
`14:48.29`	`xordoquy`	`ok`
`14:48.35`	`Legorolo`	`for what it was designed for, it works very well`
`14:48.48`	`xordoquy`	`since I'm running linux on my work computer, I don't have much choice ;)`
`14:48.54`	`Legorolo`	`hehe`
`14:49.06`	`Legorolo`	`just remember it's not supposed to be a complete implementation of the client ;-)`
`14:49.08`	`xordoquy`	`anyway, it's not worthy for UI placement`
`14:49.24`	`Legorolo`	`since it's not graphical, that's pretty much a given..`
`14:49.37`	`Thrae`	`wowbench?`
`14:49.45`	`Legorolo`	`a client emulator`
`14:49.59`	`Legorolo`	`which will load and run your addons, and has some of the API emulated`
`14:50.00`	`xordoquy`	`Legorolo: I can still give the conditional UI activation anyway`
`14:50.10`	`xordoquy`	`http://www.wowwiki.com/WoWBench/`
`14:50.20`	`Legorolo`	`btw, is it just me or is wowi not loading for anyone else either?`
`14:50.28`	`Thrae`	`I know what wowbench is, just making sure that's what you were talking about ;)`
`14:50.33`	`Thrae`	`Yeah, wowi is down it seems =/`
`14:50.52`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Hexarobi (i=Hexarobe@71.15.119.130)`
`14:52.24`	`Legorolo`	`true Thrae, we could've been talking about the other wowbench..`
`14:52.37`	`Legorolo`	`;-)`
`14:52.56`	`Kaelten`	`back`
`14:53.15`	`Thrae`	`Legorolo: I didn't scroll up far enough ;)`
`15:04.36`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Cide (i=Cide@81-226-233-5-no60.tbcn.telia.com)`
`15:05.53`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge ven (n=ven@dynadsl-080-228-66-140.ewetel.net)`
`15:15.23`	`Kirkburn\|lunch`	`xordoquy, Mikk is the guy behind wowbench - he's strangely absent today though ...`
`15:17.40`	`xordoquy`	`;)`
`15:18.57`	`Corrodias`	`decursive can display "magic" type effects... is there a class that can cure those?`
`15:19.21`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge cogwheel (n=chatzill@intra.kistlerwine.com)`
`15:19.23`	`Kirkburn`	`mages?`
`15:19.41`	`Corrodias`	`your question mark indicates uncertainty`
`15:19.49`	`Corrodias`	`*suggests`
`15:19.54`	`Kirkburn`	`Your assumption would be correct :P`
`15:20.12`	`Kirkburn`	`I think they have that ability anyway`
`15:21.20`	`[RTE]`	`I know warlock's felhunter can dispell em`
`15:22.24`	`Kirkburn`	`Abolish Magic: http://www.thottbot.com/?sp=776`
`15:22.41`	`Kirkburn`	`Is that a priest spell?`
`15:23.02`	`Kirkburn`	`Also, Cleanse does the same for Paladins`
`15:23.33`	`Corrodias`	`that appears to be a boss spell`
`15:24.19`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Osagasu (n=Kronus@208.104.133.240)`
`15:25.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`15:25.13`	`Kirkburn1`	`Corrodias, got disconnected`
`15:25.22`	`Kirkburn1`	`I meant Dispel Magic is the priest spell: http://www.thottbot.com/?sp=527`
`15:25.30`	`Corrodias`	`ah`
`15:25.59`	`Kirkburn1`	`Also shamans can do it with purge`
`15:26.23`	`Kirkburn1`	`So basically, paladins priests and shamans`
`15:29.12`	`Osagasu`	`Did you all see the D&T Kel'Thuzad teaser?`
`15:33.05`	`Corrodias`	`how interesting, people talk about "TitanBar". i thought it was Titan Panel.`
`15:33.21`	`Kirkburn1`	`s/people/stupid people/ :)`
`15:33.40`	`Osagasu`	`Does it really matter?`
`15:34.13`	`Corrodias`	`well, i guess if getting the name of an addon completely wrong doesn't matter, then no. or maybe there's another addon that actually is named titanbar.`
`15:34.18`	`Kirkburn1`	`It's the principle of the thing! :)`
`15:34.19`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge TS\|Skrom (n=Skrom@66.148.226.210.nw.nuvox.net)`
`15:34.26`	`Osagasu`	`It isn't completely wrong.`
`15:34.29`	`Corrodias`	`in any case, i ought to leave for class now, because it's a bit of a walk and i don't know where the room is, yet.`
`15:34.33`	`Osagasu`	`and you knew what they were talking about.`
`15:34.48`	`Corrodias`	`i only knew what they were talking about because i asked someone in the game what they were talking about`
`15:35.07`	`xordoquy`	`maybe somewhat offtopic, but what class your guys are playing ?`
`15:35.14`	`Osagasu`	`Someone needs a thesarus.`
`15:35.18`	`xordoquy`	`(UI developer put appart ;)`
`15:35.35`	`Osagasu`	`I'm playing a mage.`
`15:35.41`	`Corrodias`	`druid + hunter. time to go, see ya!`
`15:36.01`	`Osagasu`	`So, I joined a raiding guild.`
`15:36.40`	`Osagasu`	`I under-estimated why they complained so much about repair costs. Vael blows. :<`
`15:37.52`	`Osagasu`	`Anyways.`
`15:38.12`	`xordoquy`	`I'm playing a paladin, but I have hard time finding out an UI that matches my requirements`
`15:38.37`	`Osagasu`	`D&T wiped against Kel'thuzad... in five seconds. That's surprising.`
`15:39.22`	`Kirkburn1`	`Five?`
`15:39.44`	`Kirkburn1`	`This was with it working - I know KT despawned before`
`15:39.52`	`Kirkburn1`	`^ that was a question :P`
`15:43.31`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Osagasu (n=Kronus@208.104.133.240)`
`15:43.37`	`Osagasu`	`Maybe a little bit longer. He did some sort of AoE shadow Spell, I can only assume Death & Decay, and it killed everyone but one person (who proceeded to run around the area for 30 seconds or so).`
`15:44.10`	`Kirkburn1`	`lol`
`15:44.25`	`Kirkburn1`	`(yay for NFSU2, my Toyota Corolla is awesome :P)`
`15:52.37`	`Osagasu`	`It was 15 seconds, give or take a few, between when they started the enounter and wiped.`
`15:52.54`	`xordoquy`	`any video around ^_^ ?`
`15:53.07`	`Osagasu`	`dtguilds.com`
`15:53.34`	`Osagasu`	`They're the most advanced raiding guild in the game. you think they don't have a website? :P`
`15:54.23`	`xordoquy`	`I'm pretty new to WoW`
`15:54.34`	`xordoquy`	`4 weeks of game yet`
`15:54.58`	`xordoquy`	`I still have a lot to discover`
`15:57.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge hghjk (n=sdjhfjs1@21.80-202-153.nextgentel.com)`
`16:00.57`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge \|FF\|Im2good4u (n=Silvana@82.173.40.73)`
`16:02.24`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Gryphen (n=gryphon@mail.alexdevco.com)`
`16:03.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`that was an awesome video haha`
`16:03.13`	`TS\|Skrom`	`AOE.... dead dead dead dead dead`
`16:07.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Cide- (i=Cide@81-226-233-5-no60.tbcn.telia.com)`
`16:09.18`	`JoshBorke`	`lol, yea, that part was great`
`16:10.33`	`JoshBorke`	`xordoquy: what requirements do you have to play your paladin?`
`16:11.12`	`xordoquy`	`well, not to play, but to ease ;)`
`16:11.42`	`xordoquy`	`like having the healing buttons near the teammates figures`
`16:11.58`	`JoshBorke`	`xordoquy: check out Clique`
`16:12.10`	`JoshBorke`	`you can just click on their frames and it'll cast spells on them`
`16:12.12`	`xordoquy`	`often in PvP it's a bit too fast for me with the raw interface`
`16:12.35`	`xordoquy`	`plus the pain to focus someone else to heal and try to refocus an enemi after`
`16:12.47`	`JoshBorke`	`xordoquy: check out clique, you should like it`
`16:12.47`	`xordoquy`	`nice`
`16:12.51`	`xordoquy`	`lemme see`
`16:12.52`	`JoshBorke`	`anyway, lunch time`
`16:13.01`	`wereHamster`	`why are the EU forums down all day?`
`16:13.07`	`xordoquy`	`I played with GroupButtons but it lost 2 times the configuration :(`
`16:13.16`	`xordoquy`	`wereHamster: are they ?`
`16:13.29`	`Legorolo`	`wereHamster: up all they, i'd been posting`
`16:13.33`	`Legorolo`	`s/they/day/`
`16:14.42`	`wereHamster`	`strange.. now it works..`
`16:14.54`	`wereHamster`	`but I wasn't able to get to the forums the whole day..`
`16:16.14`	*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor` (n=yo@dslb-088-064-182-077.pools.arcor-ip.net)
`16:18.42`	`xordoquy`	`well`
`16:19.09`	`xordoquy`	`curse gaming and ui.mod does not know about clique`
`16:21.07`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Andalia_ (n=xx@p54ADC25F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`16:24.24`	*** join/#wowi-lounge zinor` (n=yo@dslb-088-064-182-077.pools.arcor-ip.net)
`16:34.37`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Oh noes! call the batfone, wowinterface seems to be down!`
`16:35.34`	`Industrial`	`Wooooo first day of school. Stoned.`
`16:39.39`	`cogwheel`	`TS\|Skrom, it's intermittent... If you hit refresh a few times it'll eventually come up...`
`16:39.51`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge snurre (n=snurre@AVelizy-153-1-64-137.w86-217.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`16:39.58`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Abenadi (n=mtgother@wsip-70-166-187-15.ph.ph.cox.net)`
`16:40.03`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Well that's good to know`
`16:40.11`	`TS\|Skrom`	`because if wowinterface is down then the terrorists win`
`16:40.14`	`cogwheel`	`But yes, the batphone definitely needs calling.`
`16:44.43`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge tyroney (n=tyroney@66.239.241.162.ptr.us.xo.net)`
`16:46.07`	`tyroney`	`Woo, all sorts of cool new changes coming. I think the exp will be the first time I actually need to change any of my mods. So exciting!`
`17:01.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Let's say I have an assosiative array PlayerList={["Player1"] = 40, ["Player2"] = 85, ["Player3"] = 60} and I sort it based on the key. Would PlayerList[2] be 60?`
`17:01.18`	`Legorolo`	`nope`
`17:01.23`	`cogwheel`	`doesn't work that way`
`17:01.31`	`cogwheel`	`you can only sort integer-indexed tables`
`17:01.36`	`Legorolo`	`if you sort it based on the key,`
`17:01.39`	`TS\|Skrom`	`okay, so I need an index`
`17:01.45`	`Legorolo`	`you are sorting it by Player1, Player2 etc. part`
`17:01.51`	`Legorolo`	`did you mean to say sort it by value?`
`17:01.55`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I meant value, yes`
`17:02.40`	`cogwheel`	`you'd still need an integer-indexed table. There is no sorting for other indices because it's implemented as a hash`
`17:03.21`	`Legorolo`	`if you mean to sort by value, then yes, you need an indexing table`
`17:03.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`a table.insert uses the next integer index, correct?`
`17:03.38`	`Legorolo`	`yes`
`17:03.41`	`Legorolo`	`so you can do:`
`17:04.03`	`Legorolo`	`indexTable = {}; for i,v in PlayerList do table.insert(indexTable,v) end`
`17:04.12`	`Legorolo`	`table.sort(indexTable)`
`17:04.24`	`cogwheel`	`bad legorolo`
`17:04.25`	`Legorolo`	`and then to access elements:`
`17:04.47`	`cogwheel`	`for k,v in pairs(PlayerList) do table.insert(indexTable, v) end`
`17:04.51`	`cogwheel`	`:P`
`17:04.54`	`TS\|Skrom`	`understand now I keep forgetting the rules for the different table types so it helps to be refreshed every now and then lol`
`17:05.04`	`Legorolo`	`there are no different table types`
`17:05.07`	`Legorolo`	`only one type of table`
`17:05.28`	`cogwheel`	`only one type of table, but lua treats integer indexes differently than other types`
`17:05.29`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er... different types of arrays? then?`
`17:05.34`	`Legorolo`	`nope`
`17:05.39`	`TS\|Skrom`	`simple vs associative?`
`17:05.42`	`Legorolo`	`nope`
`17:05.52`	`Legorolo`	`from the user's point of view, there is only one type of table`
`17:06.02`	`Legorolo`	`it's only how internally Lua handles them that there are differences`
`17:06.08`	`cogwheel`	`table.sort on a table with non-integer types does not work`
`17:06.18`	`Legorolo`	`cogwheel: that doesn't make it a different type of table`
`17:06.26`	`TS\|Skrom`	`cog, hehe thanks I should write that on my monitor`
`17:06.31`	`Legorolo`	`table.sort, as a function, is defined to work on the part of the table that has integer keys`
`17:07.05`	`cogwheel`	`but that's what i meant by "lua treats integer indexes differently than other types" since table.sort is a part of the language.`
`17:07.12`	`Legorolo`	`nope`
`17:07.16`	`Legorolo`	`table.sort is a function`
`17:07.22`	`Legorolo`	`which happens to be supplied standard`
`17:07.33`	`Legorolo`	`it is not part of the definition of the language, if it wasn't there, we could write it`
`17:07.38`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I could still explicity define a key,value pair though, right? so for example, I'm indexing a raid group.. 40 members, if I wanted to add the "player" unit as a seperate index I could do [41]="player"?`
`17:08.22`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I could do a [2001] = "player" as long as I keep it an integer?`
`17:08.23`	`Legorolo`	`Lua, from the language definition point of view, does not treat integer indexes differently than other types`
`17:08.38`	`Legorolo`	`it is most implementations of Lua that do, internally`
`17:08.47`	`Legorolo`	`and some of the standard functions`
`17:09.12`	`cogwheel`	`Right, but that's what we were talking about... a particular implementation of lua and one of the standard functions...`
`17:09.34`	`Legorolo`	`your statement that i contradicted was that the Lua language treats integer indices differently`
`17:09.40`	`Legorolo`	`all i did was say that statement is false`
`17:09.51`	`krka`	`Legorolo is right, stop arguing`
`17:09.57`	`Legorolo`	`lol`
`17:10.00`	`Legorolo`	`hi krka, ltns`
`17:10.09`	`Legorolo`	`anyway, on to you, TS\|Skrom`
`17:10.13`	`krka`	`flar`
`17:10.16`	`Legorolo`	`i am not sure exactly what you are trying to do`
`17:10.18`	`Legorolo`	`flar?`
`17:10.22`	`cogwheel`	`I appreciate your pedantry... lord knows i do that too. I just wanted to put it in terms that TS\|Skrom would get without confusing him further`
`17:10.23`	`krka`	`four letter acronyms rock`
`17:10.52`	`Legorolo`	`what's flar`
`17:11.05`	`Legorolo`	`cogwheel: ok, i understand you tried not to confuse TS\|Skrom`
`17:11.22`	`Legorolo`	`simplifying things is good, but you could still try to do it in such a way that you don't make false statements`
`17:11.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`heh thanks for looking out for me guys :P`
`17:11.52`	`Legorolo`	`oh btw my example on sorting by value is wrong :)`
`17:12.06`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm not a total newb programmer just newb to lua, and I often say the wrong words myself (key,value mixup earlier as an example)`
`17:12.21`	`tyroney`	`So... are arg1 etc disappearing?`
`17:12.22`	`Legorolo`	`ok so you have a table, with one element for each player, i take it`
`17:12.27`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'll pastey it in a few minutes so you can check it for me :D`
`17:12.31`	`Legorolo`	`tyroney: nope`
`17:12.41`	`Legorolo`	`why do you think they would?`
`17:12.56`	`Cide-`	`arg# are global`
`17:13.06`	`Cide-`	`I think you're mistaking arg# for "arg"`
`17:13.09`	`tyroney`	`I kept reading about vararg stuff, and wondering if the arg#s were a wow thing, or an api thing.`
`17:13.10`	`Legorolo`	`argX have nothign to do with the Lua language, it's a Blizzard only thing`
`17:13.17`	`tyroney`	`Great.`
`17:13.21`	`tyroney`	`Thank you.`
`17:13.32`	`Legorolo`	`as Cide said, the vararg stuff will change if Lua 5.1 appears`
`17:13.34`	`krka`	`as is "this"`
`17:13.39`	`Legorolo`	`yeah`
`17:13.39`	`krka`	`and "event"`
`17:13.52`	`Legorolo`	`especially "this" and "argX" can be confusing for new modders`
`17:13.57`	`krka`	`it was for me`
`17:13.58`	`Legorolo`	`seems very much like it's part of the language`
`17:14.08`	`krka`	`especially this, coming from java atleast`
`17:14.12`	`Legorolo`	`yah`
`17:14.18`	`Legorolo`	`also, similar one is "self"`
`17:14.32`	`tyroney`	`uh oh. this? I think I used this once or twice somewhere. Bah, I'll just wait for something to break on the test realm when I have a chance to visit it.`
`17:14.56`	`Legorolo`	`the variable "this" is, contrary to what you'd think at first sight, is nothing special`
`17:15.03`	`Legorolo`	`unlike other languages you might be used to`
`17:15.03`	`tyroney`	`Hmm. My latest (meta table hooked) thing uses quite a bit of this and self, if I recall.`
`17:15.10`	`cogwheel`	`tyroney, don't worry... they were just using "this" as another example of possible confusion for Lua newbs`
`17:15.11`	`Legorolo`	`however, WoW uses the variable "this" for special purposes`
`17:15.22`	`Legorolo`	`ah right`
`17:15.26`	`Legorolo`	`i see no need to explain :)`
`17:15.28`	`tyroney`	`Ah. Man, all sorts of great news today.`
`17:15.51`	`TS\|Skrom`	`http://wowi.pastey.net/619 -- no fair laughing at my amateur code. There may be better ways to do something I just don't know them yet :p`
`17:15.54`	`Legorolo`	`TS\|Skrom: so you have a table with all the players and some associated values,`
`17:15.57`	`Legorolo`	`and you want to sort it?`
`17:15.57`	`tyroney`	`I guess being able to read so many programming languages, and almost write them, has paid off to some degree.`
`17:16.00`	`Legorolo`	`ah, pastebin, goodie`
`17:16.16`	`Legorolo`	`TS\|Skrom: don't worry, no laughing at other people tends to happen here`
`17:16.20`	`Legorolo`	`we were all newbs once`
`17:16.26`	`krka`	`except iriel`
`17:16.26`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower_ (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`17:16.38`	`JoshBorke`	`hola`
`17:16.41`	`TS\|Skrom`	`that's the table I'm making, and I pretty much know how to sort it (have a similar table/function setup elsewhere i had forgotton about haha)`
`17:18.10`	`Legorolo`	`krka: i tell you a secret, i think Iriel might have been a newb too once`
`17:18.15`	`Legorolo`	`but that's only rumour`
`17:18.18`	`tyroney`	`Heresy!`
`17:18.28`	`krka`	`i dont believe it`
`17:18.33`	`Legorolo`	`TS\|Skrom: ok i see you got finalTargetList`
`17:18.45`	`Legorolo`	`i take it you want to sort it then`
`17:18.58`	`Legorolo`	`looks like the code is correct, in terms of how you are setting up finalTargetList`
`17:19.14`	`Legorolo`	`to sort it, you will need to use table.sort(finalTargetList, yourComparisonFunction)`
`17:19.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`yeah... was gonna use something like: local function listSort(a,b) return a[2] < b[2] end`
`17:19.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:19.42`	`Legorolo`	`right`
`17:19.45`	`Legorolo`	`looks good to me`
`17:19.45`	`krka`	`looks good`
`17:19.52`	`Legorolo`	`and to krka too!`
`17:19.55`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lol`
`17:19.57`	`Legorolo`	`that's two people telling you it's good`
`17:20.01`	`krka`	`the code overall looks good, except for lack of locals and too many table constructions`
`17:20.07`	`Legorolo`	`so there is high confidence (in statistical sense) that it'll work`
`17:20.22`	`TS\|Skrom`	`krka I have a problem with that :(`
`17:20.25`	`krka`	`not just any two people either! practically two lua demigods`
`17:20.40`	`Legorolo`	`yay! i got called a Lua demigod!`
`17:20.54`	`JoshBorke`	`Legorol is a lua demigod`
`17:20.55`	`Legorolo`	`wait, did you just call yourself a demigod too?`
`17:20.59`	`krka`	`of course`
`17:21.01`	`Legorolo`	`~lart krka`
`17:21.07`	`krka`	`:P`
`17:21.13`	`Legorolo`	`you are right of course`
`17:21.22`	`JoshBorke`	`oh dear`
`17:21.26`	`TS\|Skrom`	`one of these days I'll go through and 'local' variables that need to be... I always forget when I'm coding though`
`17:21.26`	`Legorolo`	`but labelling oneself shamelessly like that is naughty!`
`17:21.37`	`krka`	`i never claimed that i wasn't shameless`
`17:21.39`	`Legorolo`	`that's liable to introduce bugs TS\|Skrom`
`17:21.48`	`krka`	`in fact i've proven the opposite many times`
`17:21.52`	`Legorolo`	`it's a good idea to get into the practice of using locals in the first place`
`17:22.03`	`krka`	`imo, local should be the default state in lua`
`17:22.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hehe it took me about 3 weeks of coding before I thought... you know I really should rename my functions to include my addon name...`
`17:22.16`	`krka`	`should be a global keyword instead`
`17:22.30`	`Legorolo`	`krka: i used to be a person who boasts a lot, but now i'm flawless`
`17:22.32`	`Legorolo`	`:)`
`17:22.56`	`TS\|Skrom`	`having a lot of tables isn't bad if you nil them out at the end of the function though right?`
`17:23.06`	`Legorolo`	`it is bad`
`17:23.13`	`Legorolo`	`niling them out doesn't make a difference`
`17:23.18`	`krka`	`well, every time you create a garbage you create potential garbage`
`17:23.25`	`TS\|Skrom`	`i thought that made them subject to garbage collection`
`17:23.30`	`krka`	`which fills up memory and thus cause garbage collection more often`
`17:23.34`	`Legorolo`	`TS\|Skrom: nope`
`17:23.42`	`krka`	`in lua 5.0 garbage collection is kinda slow`
`17:23.45`	`krka`	`5.1 is better though`
`17:23.45`	`Abenadi`	`they are subject to garbage collection when there is no reference available to them, i believe`
`17:23.52`	`Legorolo`	`what makes something subject to garbage collections is if they are not referenced at all any more`
`17:24.03`	`Legorolo`	`ok so in your case`
`17:24.05`	`krka`	`(or by a weak table)`
`17:24.08`	`krka`	`but that's overcourse`
`17:24.09`	`Legorolo`	`if you have a global variable that is a table,`
`17:24.16`	`krka`	`is overcourse a word in english btw? we use it in swedish`
`17:24.24`	`Legorolo`	`niling it out will subject everyting that was inside the table to garbage collection`
`17:24.30`	`Legorolo`	`krka: i don't think so`
`17:24.30`	`krka`	`the same goes for function closures btw :)`
`17:24.38`	`krka`	`meh, i figured :/`
`17:24.42`	`Legorolo`	`ok example:`
`17:24.52`	`Cide-`	`I understood, krka ;)`
`17:25.03`	`krka`	`figured you would`
`17:25.04`	`Legorolo`	`myTable = { {1, "a"}, {2, "b"} }; myTable = nil`
`17:25.09`	`krka`	`know of a good translation?`
`17:25.16`	`Cide-`	`nope :/`
`17:25.24`	`Legorolo`	`this will make the two small tables inside myTable garbage collected eventually`
`17:25.33`	`Legorolo`	`myTable itself (since it's a global variable) will stay around`
`17:25.50`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirov (n=Kirov@204.155.78.126)`
`17:26.02`	`krka`	`uhm`
`17:26.05`	`Legorolo`	`and before krka jumps in, yes, i'm aware of the fact that technically you also cause the table that myTable was reffering to be garbage collected too`
`17:26.06`	`JoshBorke`	`hola kirov`
`17:26.11`	`krka`	`what are you talking about Legorolo?`
`17:26.20`	`krka`	`myTable = nil will remove that global variable`
`17:26.20`	`Kirov`	`hola bork bork bork`
`17:26.29`	`Cide`	`hi hi Kirov bonk`
`17:26.33`	`Legorolo`	`hmm`
`17:26.37`	`Legorolo`	`ok yeah bonk me`
`17:26.40`	`JoshBorke`	`the whole Legorolo is kinda weird, could you go back to Legorol^? :-D`
`17:26.45`	`Legorolo`	`lol`
`17:26.52`	`krka`	`and yes, i can do that`
`17:26.53`	`Legorolo`	`wait wait, i agree with you`
`17:26.56`	`Legorolo`	`so can i have it back?`
`17:26.58`	`TS\|Skrom`	`i've been doing InRangeList = nil for awhile now... but you say I need to do more?`
`17:27.07`	`krka`	`ok, but on probation status over 6 weeks`
`17:27.12`	`Legorolo`	`TS\|Skrom: the problem usually is not with whether you nil stuff or not`
`17:27.22`	`Legorolo`	`in the vast majority of cases you don't need to explicitly nil stuff`
`17:27.27`	`Cide`	`you want to make sure you don't "create" garbage`
`17:27.27`	`krka`	`TS\|Skrom: there are some strategies you can do instead`
`17:27.32`	`krka`	`i like to reuse tables`
`17:27.34`	`Legorolo`	`the thing that causes problems for the garbage collection is creating new tables`
`17:27.48`	`krka`	`then again, with lua 5.1 i am not sure garbage will be such a big issue`
`17:27.49`	`Cide`	`store unused tables in a weak table!`
`17:28.09`	`JoshBorke`	`wtf is this weak table stuff :-P`
`17:28.21`	`krka`	`i have even went so far as to implement a proper memory manager :/`
`17:28.24`	`krka`	`<-- crazy`
`17:28.28`	`Cide`	`basically you can reference it without having lua regard it as a reference when it's deciding whether to collect it as garbage or not`
`17:28.33`	`Legorolo`	`TS\|Skrom: the whole point about having a garbage collector is so that you don't need to worry too much about "destroying" objects, so you don't need to do explicit niling and stuff`
`17:28.48`	`TS\|Skrom`	`making them local is often good enough?`
`17:28.49`	`Cide`	`krka: that is crazy`
`17:28.58`	`Cide`	`TS\|Skrom: making tables local doesn't do anything`
`17:28.59`	`krka`	`table objects can never be local`
`17:28.59`	`cogwheel`	`coughs http://www.lua.org/pil/17.html`
`17:29.02`	`Legorolo`	`making them local makes no difference to garbage creation`
`17:29.03`	`krka`	`only variables can be local`
`17:29.20`	`Legorolo`	`damn, Cide beat me`
`17:29.23`	`krka`	`having local variables is good for two reasons`
`17:29.28`	`krka`	`1) they're faster to access than global`
`17:29.39`	`krka`	`2) they don't interfere with global namespace`
`17:29.41`	`Legorolo`	`ok, time to explain to TS\|Skrom the difference between variable and the table that the variable references ;-)`
`17:29.54`	`krka`	`TS\|Skrom: have you programmed in any other language?`
`17:30.03`	`Cide`	`(and that same thing goes for functions)`
`17:30.03`	`TS\|Skrom`	`php mainly`
`17:30.08`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and basic haha`
`17:30.14`	`Legorolo`	`basic rules!!`
`17:30.15`	`krka`	`hm, that won't help much :)`
`17:30.23`	`krka`	`yup Cide`
`17:30.25`	`TS\|Skrom`	`no... I keep forgetting to put "then" on my if's`
`17:30.28`	`krka`	`php has references, right?`
`17:30.38`	`krka`	`basically, lua has reference types and primitive types`
`17:30.43`	`Cide`	`you can reference with &`
`17:30.45`	`krka`	`primites are numbers, booleans and nil`
`17:30.52`	`krka`	`reference types are functions, strings, tables, et.c.`
`17:31.07`	`Legorolo`	`krka, before you go further,`
`17:31.09`	`Legorolo`	`i have an idea`
`17:31.14`	`krka`	`i wasn't going any further`
`17:31.16`	`Legorolo`	`i think this might be the best way to explain it:`
`17:31.20`	`krka`	`that's as far as i can explain :P`
`17:31.23`	`Legorolo`	`consider that I write this piece of code`
`17:31.30`	`Legorolo`	`tableA = { 1, 2, 3}`
`17:31.35`	`Legorolo`	`tableB = tableA`
`17:31.46`	`krka`	`and you _would_ write that piece of code!`
`17:31.54`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lol`
`17:32.11`	`Legorolo`	`the point here is that tableA's contents doesn't get copied to tableB at this point`
`17:32.22`	`Legorolo`	`instead, both tableA and tableB will refer to the same object`
`17:32.30`	`Cide`	`(that gave me a headache when I first learned about it)`
`17:32.30`	`Legorolo`	`if you modify one, the other gets modified too`
`17:32.41`	`Legorolo`	`so what can we conclude from this:`
`17:32.58`	`Legorolo`	`that a variable such as tableA and the actual table that it's referring to are not exactly the same thing`
`17:33.07`	`Legorolo`	`several variables can all refer to physically the same table`
`17:33.18`	`Legorolo`	`if that makes sense..`
`17:33.23`	`krka`	`i like to keep atleast 3 variables point to the same table`
`17:33.27`	`krka`	`just to be safe`
`17:33.32`	`krka`	`kind of like a RAID setup`
`17:33.33`	`Legorolo`	`lol, thanks for the random interruption ;-)`
`17:33.34`	`Cide`	`in case you nil two of them out by mistake`
`17:33.42`	`Legorolo`	`it was funny though`
`17:33.57`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er.. okay I understand that part.. and I remember reading it in the lua manual`
`17:33.58`	`krka`	`i am bored :/`
`17:34.14`	`TS\|Skrom`	`a,b = b,a will switch the variables`
`17:34.42`	`krka`	`yes`
`17:34.42`	`Legorolo`	`ok but the important point about it is this:`
`17:35.01`	`Legorolo`	`tableA in the example above is therefore called a reference variable`
`17:35.15`	`Legorolo`	`it is only referring to the table, it is NOT the table itself`
`17:35.23`	`Legorolo`	`let's take the example further:`
`17:35.35`	`Legorolo`	`i now do: tableA = { 3, 2, 1 }`
`17:35.45`	`Legorolo`	`at this point, tableA will now start referring to the new table i just created`
`17:35.52`	`Legorolo`	`and tableB will still refer to the old one`
`17:36.14`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower_ (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`17:36.46`	`Legorolo`	`so a variable is just something that let's you get access to the table, the table itself is a separate thing from the variable`
`17:36.59`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I see`
`17:37.00`	`Legorolo`	`several variables can therefore refer to the same table, or even no variables`
`17:37.09`	`Legorolo`	`if i do:`
`17:37.11`	`Legorolo`	`tableA = nil`
`17:37.14`	`Legorolo`	`tableB = nil`
`17:37.20`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I think that's part of my problem, in php it doesn't quite work like that with tables...`
`17:37.23`	`Legorolo`	`all that happens is that these variables no longer refer to the table`
`17:37.26`	`krka`	`php sucks :/`
`17:37.35`	`krka`	`very non-intuitive, imo`
`17:37.36`	`Legorolo`	`the two tables that were created still live somewhere in memory`
`17:37.38`	`krka`	`lua is consistent`
`17:37.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`krka - yes`
`17:37.45`	`Legorolo`	`you just have no way of getting to them any more`
`17:37.46`	`JoshBorke`	`until garbage collection`
`17:37.52`	`JoshBorke`	`then they go poof?`
`17:37.52`	`Legorolo`	`and this is where garbage collection comes in, exactly`
`17:37.56`	`Legorolo`	`yes`
`17:38.05`	`JoshBorke`	`gc just removes all objects that are no longer reference`
`17:38.12`	`krka`	`we have no way to test if it actually goes poof since we can't access it`
`17:38.15`	`Legorolo`	`garbage collector's function is exactly this: find those tables (and other stuff) that you can no longer access by any means`
`17:38.19`	`Legorolo`	`and destroy them`
`17:38.20`	`TS\|Skrom`	`so how do you avoid using tables when you have to have arrayed data to work with?`
`17:38.28`	`JoshBorke`	`reuse the same table`
`17:38.37`	`Legorolo`	`yes`
`17:38.41`	`JoshBorke`	`if you never need to have more than 1 function accessing the table`
`17:38.47`	`krka`	`here's a method of clearing a table`
`17:38.47`	`Cide`	`it also checks islands, I believe`
`17:38.51`	`krka`	`not that it's not recursive`
`17:38.54`	`TS\|Skrom`	`okay that I understand, but what if I'm populating data from one table into another, leaving out certain key,value pairs?`
`17:39.02`	`krka`	`for k, v in in pairs(table) do table[k] = nil end`
`17:39.06`	`JoshBorke`	`ooo, that's impressive`
`17:39.08`	`krka`	`gah`
`17:39.10`	`krka`	`error`
`17:39.15`	`krka`	`i write ONE line and still get it wrong`
`17:39.16`	`krka`	`i suck`
`17:39.21`	`Cide`	`good.`
`17:39.23`	`Cide`	`err.`
`17:39.23`	`Legorolo`	`what's wrong with that one krka?`
`17:39.24`	`Cide`	`god.`
`17:39.30`	`JoshBorke`	`krka: good thing you're not working on GRAB anymore :-P`
`17:39.35`	`JoshBorke`	`double in`
`17:39.50`	`krka`	`also, the ", v" is unnecessary`
`17:40.03`	`Cide`	`pretty sure it will error because the iterator is nil`
`17:40.04`	`Legorolo`	`it is unnecessary, but doesn't create garbage`
`17:40.13`	`krka`	`yeah`
`17:40.53`	`Legorolo`	`ah, double in`
`17:40.53`	`Cide`	`I did a pretty ugly way`
`17:40.53`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (n=Jonathan@host81-159-131-7.range81-159.btcentralplus.com)`
`17:40.53`	`krka`	`Cide: islands?`
`17:40.53`	`Cide`	`local oldKey; for k in pairs(tbl) do if ( oldKey ) then tbl[oldKey] = nil; end oldKey = k; end if ( oldKey ) then tbl[oldKey] = nil; end`
`17:40.54`	`krka`	`is that another word for cycles?`
`17:40.54`	`Cide`	`not sure if there's a better one`
`17:41.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`looking back at my pastey again - http://wowi.pastey.net/619 - I pull key,value pairs from InRangeList and filter using UnitIsDeadOrGhost only those I want to consider as targets and place them into FinalTargetList which I will sort later`
`17:41.16`	`Cide`	`krka: local a = { }; local b = { tbl = a }; a.tbl = b`
`17:41.22`	`krka`	`pretty sure mine works too Cide`
`17:41.28`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I can't think of any way (and it's my newbness I'm sure) to get that down to one table`
`17:41.34`	`Cide`	`krka: I seem to remember that it errors that way`
`17:41.36`	`TS\|Skrom`	`or to reuse the same one`
`17:41.42`	`Cide`	`maybe I just suck(ed)`
`17:41.54`	`Cide`	`if so, demote me to noob`
`17:41.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Guest6972835 (i=Darky28@39.220.76.83.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`17:42.07`	`krka`	`tested mine, it works`
`17:42.27`	`Cide`	`hm..`
`17:42.38`	`krka`	`another generic good thing is to try to reduce the number of tables you use`
`17:42.54`	`krka`	`avoid nested structures. in many cases you can get away with a constant number of tables`
`17:44.18`	`JoshBorke`	`TS\|Skrom: instead of nesting the tables, why not have a separate table that is value indexed. sec, i'll see if i can write something up`
`17:44.27`	`Cide`	`good: local num_apples = { num_apples1, num_apples2 }; local num_oranges = { num_oranges1, num_oranges2 };`
`17:44.28`	`Cide`	`bad: local num = { { num_apples1, num_oranges1 }, { num_apples2, num_oranges2 }, ... }`
`17:44.44`	`Legorolo`	`ok i'm off, i'll leave TS\|Skrom in the hands of the not-so-demi-anymore-gods`
`17:44.56`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm screwed :p`
`17:45.10`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Legorolo (n=Legorol@tcmpc43.phy.cam.ac.uk)`
`17:45.14`	`krka`	`Cide: makes a good example`
`17:45.42`	`Kirov`	`I have a great one STranq, table1={table2={table3={onevariable}}};`
`17:45.42`	`krka`	`rici in #lua made this`
`17:45.42`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Laric (i=Laric@217-13-2-126.dd.nextgentel.com)`
`17:45.42`	`Kirov`	`and that's all that's ever in it`
`17:45.42`	`krka`	`bad: points = { {x1, y1}, {x2, y2}, ... }`
`17:45.48`	`krka`	`good: xpoints = { x1, x2, ... }`
`17:45.49`	`krka`	`et.c.`
`17:45.54`	`krka`	`same thing really`
`17:46.05`	`TS\|Skrom`	`isn't that using two tables instead of one?`
`17:46.08`	`Cide`	`ya, though I guess yours is more applicable in reality :)`
`17:46.17`	`Kirov`	`TS\|Skrom - it's using 3 tables instead of 2`
`17:46.24`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er...`
`17:46.26`	`tyroney`	`kriov: I think something in my brain just exploded. Or died.`
`17:46.30`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I thought the idea was less is more?`
`17:46.44`	`Cide`	`TS\|Skrom: the bad example uses 3 tables, the good one uses two`
`17:47.33`	`Cide`	`and the bad example will use 101 tables if you have 50 entries, whereas the good one still will only use 2`
`17:47.34`	`Kirov`	`tyroney - In my defence it used to hold a lot of info, but I moved them all out in to their own tables, just that last one variable I keep forgetting to move out.`
`17:47.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`ohhh... see that's me being stupid and thinking of the variable itself as the table...`
`17:48.33`	`TS\|Skrom`	`okay so in my example I have InRangeList = values`
`17:48.42`	`tyroney`	`kirov: not questioning validdity. I just don't want to think about what something that nested means. (at least not at this time. maybe later)`
`17:48.53`	`TS\|Skrom`	`only one table, but I also have FinalTargetList = {{name,pct},{name,pct}}`
`17:49.04`	`JoshBorke`	`question: do integer indexed tables have to be continuous to be sorted?`
`17:49.14`	`TS\|Skrom`	`but.. but... cide that'`
`17:49.24`	`TS\|Skrom`	`that's how you taught me to sort like that lol`
`17:49.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`remember my myspells table awhile back?`
`17:49.39`	`Cide`	`yes`
`17:50.00`	`TS\|Skrom`	`so the "bad" example above is okay sometimes?`
`17:50.07`	`Cide`	`it's not so much "good" as it is "easy"`
`17:50.43`	`JoshBorke`	`maybe...http://wowi.pastecode.com/4229`
`17:50.44`	`Cide`	`Kirov: what you want is: function nest() return { nest() }; end table1=nest()`
`17:51.11`	`Kirov`	`lol`
`17:53.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn (n=jbcc@d207-216-176-153.bchsia.telus.net)`
`17:58.49`	`TS\|Skrom`	`.okay now the servers need to come up so I can test lol`
`17:59.00`	`Cairenn\|sleep`	`mine's up`
`17:59.30`	`TS\|Skrom`	`yeah I just checked, mine is too haha`
`18:26.32`	`Shadowed`	`damn you php`
`18:31.53`	`JoshBorke`	`???wow.web.forums.error500.message???`
`18:31.53`	`JoshBorke`	`ew`
`18:32.46`	`cogwheel`	`And i was about to tell someone how to do something...`
`18:33.27`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mery (i=metelman@p54AED09B.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`18:35.17`	`Abenadi`	`will myarray["mykey"] = nil remove the mykey pair from myarray or just set its value to nil?`
`18:36.00`	`JoshBorke`	`removes it`
`18:36.06`	`Abenadi`	`k thanks`
`18:37.00`	`cogwheel`	`Abenadi, don't think of nil so much as a value... think of it as the absence of a value. a = nil is equivalent to never mentioning a at all.`
`18:37.19`	`cogwheel`	`or resetting it to the state where it had never been mentioned`
`18:37.30`	`Abenadi`	`i was just wondering whether or not it would come up in a for loop of myarray's key pairs`
`18:38.00`	`JoshBorke`	`nope`
`18:38.01`	`Mikma`	`Warla: yohoo? :)`
`18:41.05`	`cogwheel`	`heh... it actually says "Server is busy, please try again" instead of "???wow.web.forums.error500.message???"`
`18:41.19`	`cogwheel`	`i guess the error message server isn't as busy now... lol`
`18:43.39`	`Kemayo`	`Or maybe I'm just too obsessed with popularity. :)`
`18:45.13`	`cogwheel`	`Kemayo, equally annoying are low ratings because they find no use for your addon as opposed to actual flaws in its design. I'd much rather have a few people who really like (and highly rate) my addon than a bunch of people give it one star for the simple fact that they don't need its functionality...`
`18:49.50`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zylex (i=zylex@dsl96032.kund.kramnet.se)`
`18:50.48`	`Kemayo`	`Exactly! Rate me down because I'm crap, not because you don't use addons like mine.`
`18:51.28`	`[RTE]`	`what addon are you talking about?`
`18:52.00`	`zylex`	`Hello, could anyone assist me with an addon problem?`
`18:52.12`	`JoshBorke`	`we can try`
`18:52.13`	`[RTE]`	`probably ...`
`18:52.24`	`zylex`	`Anyone used abestimadedfinalscore ad?`
`18:52.38`	`zylex`	`Stopped working after 1.12`
`18:52.49`	`zylex`	`no clue why ;/`
`18:53.04`	`[RTE]`	`"load out of date addons" checkmark on?`
`18:53.05`	`zylex`	`i launches and commands works but the "frame" or what to say dosent show`
`18:53.50`	`[RTE]`	`any error messages?`
`18:53.58`	`zylex`	`nope :S`
`18:54.28`	`zylex`	`it evens says "blabla addon loaded etc"`
`18:55.14`	`[RTE]`	`can you link it?`
`18:55.26`	`zylex`	`theres no download spots`
`18:55.32`	`zylex`	`i could zip it and dcc it or something`
`18:55.37`	`Cairenn`	`...`
`18:55.41`	`Shadowed`	`hrm, anyone know what the formula for increasing melee weapon range is? Using ( AP / 14 ) / Weapon speed but that doesn't seem to do anything :/`
`18:55.52`	`Cairenn`	`you're using an addon that has no where to download it from? then how did you get it?`
`18:56.04`	`zylex`	`well its a private addon`
`18:56.15`	`zylex`	`a guy made it on a realm i used to play on`
`18:56.25`	`zylex`	`think it exist in some addonspack aswell`
`18:56.30`	`Kemayo`	`[RTE]: I was whining about AuldLangSyne on WoWI.`
`18:56.43`	`Shadowed`	`What's the command line zylex`
`18:56.47`	`Shadowed`	`/abhefs?`
`18:56.55`	`Kemayo`	`I just got an error while updating an addon on WoWI:`
`18:56.56`	`zylex`	`,/abesti`
`18:57.00`	`Kemayo`	`Warning: Missing argument 1 for savefile() in /classes/file/Work_File.php on line 302`
`18:57.16`	`Kemayo`	`Didn't seem to cause any problems, though.`
`18:57.40`	`Shadowed`	`http://ui.worldofwar.net/ui.php?id=1421 private eh?`
`18:57.42`	`TS\|Skrom`	`warning =! error`
`18:58.03`	`zylex`	`well thats a modded version�`
`18:58.14`	`zylex`	`ii think`
`18:58.24`	`zylex`	`used to be private atleast`
`18:58.35`	`Shadowed`	`There are a lot of addons that use it a couple of them that are 1.12 compatible. I suggest you search around`
`18:58.42`	`Kemayo`	`Well, yes, but not a good sign nonetheless.`
`18:59.06`	`TS\|Skrom`	`no.. kemayo, warnings are okay most of the time`
`18:59.23`	`Shadowed`	`In this case, if he's passing a filename to savefile() it means it'll error`
`18:59.31`	`zylex`	`Shadowed: none got a working verion of abest`
`19:00.03`	`TS\|Skrom`	`warnings don't mean something's broken, just means something is unexpected`
`19:00.23`	`Kemayo`	`They're generally a sign that you're doing something in a non-optimal manner. Thus, they should be brought to the attention of people who're running the app.`
`19:00.35`	`[RTE]`	`<Kemayo>: well, it doesn't seem to do much more then CT_PlayerNotes, at least not from description, so why would people like it?`
`19:00.38`	`Shadowed`	`If he's passing a filename to savefile() and savefile expects a file, you're not giving it a file.`
`19:00.41`	`TS\|Skrom`	`agreed, but as you say.. it worked`
`19:00.57`	`zylex`	`can anyone take a look at http://ui.worldofwar.net/ui.php?id=1421 and maybe solve the problem for me?`
`19:01.13`	`zylex`	`ive tried alot of things, but im not so good at lua`
`19:01.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`wait, is this something YOU are working on giving the error?`
`19:01.53`	`TS\|Skrom`	`s/error/warning/`
`19:01.57`	`Kemayo`	`[RTE]: Hey, it does a lot more than CT_PlayerNotes. If you'd complained that it doesn't do much more than FriendsFacts, that would be fair. But that's still a bad reason to rate something down.`
`19:02.11`	`Kemayo`	`TS\|Skrom: Nope.`
`19:02.25`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh my mistake :d`
`19:02.39`	`TS\|Skrom`	`in that case, burn the witches who leave warnings in their code`
`19:03.21`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: try repositioning ABEstimatedFinalScore_Frame frame and see if that works`
`19:04.16`	`zylex`	`in the xml file or what?`
`19:04.50`	`[RTE]`	`Kemayo: I did not say that :), it's not a good reson at all, but still people want to see "good mods" not rewrites of something they already use and love :(`
`19:04.57`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: at macro first`
`19:05.09`	`zylex`	`could you pm me an example?`
`19:05.20`	`zylex`	`i actually tried that but never got it to work`
`19:06.50`	`Shadowed`	`blargh @ melee formula's`
`19:08.06`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: /script ABEstimatedFinalScore_Frame:ClearAllPoints(); ABEstimatedFinalScore_Frame:SetPoint("TOP", UIParent, "TOP", -60, -150);`
`19:08.41`	`zylex`	`thanks, ill try it`
`19:09.37`	`zylex`	`dosent work`
`19:09.54`	`zylex`	`but when i do reloadui i see the addon for 1 sec then wow gets minimized and the addon vanishes`
`19:10.25`	`[RTE]`	`try /script ABEstimatedFinalScore_Frame:Show()`
`19:10.41`	`tyroney`	`The other day I was polishing off a mod, and I discovered a typo'd variable. (I think it was "item") I was expecting to have a reference to a texture of mine, but with the typo, I wound up with a reference to a fontstring (? ) ...`
`19:11.54`	`tyroney`	`The fontstring in question belonged to itemrack, and I looked into its code, and I trust gello, so I assume there's something somewhere in the base ui that left that thing referenced. (for me to grab it)`
`19:12.17`	`tyroney`	`Is it worth trying to hunt it down to report to whoever actaully left it out in the wild? Is it even possible?`
`19:12.35`	`zylex`	`ok i can se the frame now`
`19:12.42`	`zylex`	`not sure it works yet tho`
`19:13.01`	`TS\|Skrom`	`do variables you are saving need to be global?`
`19:13.18`	`Shadowed`	`hrm, this makes no sense`
`19:14.49`	`tyroney`	`shadowed: melee formulas? Are you talking about reverse engineered min-maxing information?`
`19:14.50`	`zylex`	`ok the frame disappears when someone captures a flag`
`19:14.51`	`cogwheel`	`TS\|Skrom, local variables only exist in the block where they're declared... I'll let you figure out the answer from that :P`
`19:14.55`	`Shadowed`	`( ( 1124 / 14 ) * 2.6 ) + 119 = 327.9 and ( ( 1124 / 14 ) * 2.6 ) + 221 = 429.7`
`19:15.00`	`zylex`	`also it dosent show the score nor the timeleft`
`19:15.03`	`Shadowed`	`character sheet shows 327 - 430`
`19:15.43`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hehe just making sure cog, I was trying to make my addon more environmentally friendly and didn't wanna screw something up inadvertantly`
`19:15.48`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: I bet it has something to do with disapearing minimap bug lots of people experience`
`19:15.50`	`Shadowed`	`tyroney yeah, i should have the correct formula, but it's wrong from the character sheet from what i said above`
`19:15.57`	`Kemayo`	`[RTE]: You make a good point. I clarified the description to give people a better idea of the differences between the mods.`
`19:16.18`	`cogwheel`	`"environmentally friendly" hehe :)`
`19:16.29`	`tyroney`	`Isn't the sheet just rounded? Or am I completely missing something?`
`19:16.51`	`Shadowed`	`If it's rounded then 327.9 becomes 379 and 429.7 becomes 430 in which case it's still wrong`
`19:16.52`	`zylex`	`Is it possible to fix that bug?`
`19:16.57`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh man... I've developed an itch on my chest and arms prolly a mild allergic reaction to these antibiotics I'm on...`
`19:17.08`	`tyroney`	`Maybe it's biased to nice round numbers. Ok, maybe not.`
`19:17.16`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and I've been rubbing my chest so much to relieve the itch that I've literally given myself bruises`
`19:17.22`	`Shadowed`	`Cide: you here by any chance?`
`19:17.38`	`tyroney`	`ts\|skrom: cut that out. If it's that bad, give your doc or pharm a call.`
`19:17.41`	`TS\|Skrom`	`notice I didn't say "scratching" learned that lesson before`
`19:18.06`	`TS\|Skrom`	`tyroney I did.. and for some reason they said they couldn't give me anything else..`
`19:18.24`	`TS\|Skrom`	`since it wasn't " that bad" I would just have to deal and sleep in a cooler room to relieve the itching`
`19:18.32`	`Shadowed`	`tyroney: CTProfile does rounding it looks like, when i do the math it matches up with that data. But not my in-game character sheet :/`
`19:18.38`	`TS\|Skrom`	`doesn't help when I'm at work and can't take my shirt off and sit in front of a fan ><`
`19:19.12`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm allergic to pennicillan so what they gave me is about all I can take`
`19:19.24`	`TS\|Skrom`	`like highly allergic to penn... more then just a slight itch hehe`
`19:19.35`	`tyroney`	`Ew.`
`19:19.45`	`[RTE]`	`Kemayo: better, but you need some "catch" to your addon, ad something like ability to display player note in the tooltip on mouseover or something`
`19:20.23`	`[RTE]`	`then people will be using your addon, not originals, give them something they think they can use, not neceserelly useful, but "cool"`
`19:20.57`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: sucks to be you`
`19:21.20`	`Shadowed`	`hmmm`
`19:21.21`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: go natural, herbs and all :)`
`19:21.27`	`Shadowed`	`CTProfile matches the character seet`
`19:21.28`	`Shadowed`	`sheet*`
`19:21.39`	`Shadowed`	`I almost wonder if they floor the minimum range, and ceil the maximum range`
`19:21.47`	`zylex`	`[RTE]: i think the problem is when something in Arathi Basin happens it does something that closes addon`
`19:22.08`	`zylex`	`if score updates it gets hidden, also if flag statuses change`
`19:22.28`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: check the events, they may have been changed, more importantly the arguments of the events`
`19:22.41`	`Shadowed`	`tyroney: I think blizzard (for some reason) doesn't round it, but for the minimum range they floor() it, and for the maximum they ceil() it. Not sure why, but thats what its looking like`
`19:23.07`	`zylex`	`im not really sure what to look for`
`19:23.07`	`[RTE]`	`Shadowed: it actually makes sens`
`19:23.08`	`zylex`	`:S`
`19:23.11`	`tyroney`	`shadowed: sounds sane enough.`
`19:24.04`	`Shadowed`	`( 24 / 14 ) * 1.3 = 2.3, which means 35 + 2.3 = 37 which matches the character sheet, and 73 + 2.3 which would mean 76, but the char sheat says 75`
`19:24.08`	`Shadowed`	`after switching to priest`
`19:24.57`	`zylex`	`what exactly does this means? -->`
`19:24.58`	`zylex`	`if (event == "UPDATE_WORLD_STATES") then`
`19:24.58`	`zylex`	`-- void atm`
`19:24.58`	`zylex`	`end`
`19:24.58`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: well, take a look at the events addon has registered and go on wowwiki and see if there were any changes done to them in 1.12, I'm pritty sure there were, then see if those changes will impact OnEvent function of addon in any way`
`19:25.14`	`zylex`	`kk`
`19:26.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`why if 35+2.3 is 37 would 73+2.3 = 76?`
`19:26.24`	`[RTE]`	`anyone here wants to help me with localizations for GTS?`
`19:26.46`	`TS\|Skrom`	`5 + 2 = 7... 3 + 2 = 5`
`19:27.00`	`Shadowed`	`TS\|Skrom: Because I think they may floor the minimum damage and 35 is the minimum, and ceil the maximum, 73 being max`
`19:27.01`	`Shadowed`	`so`
`19:27.06`	`tyroney`	`[RET]: Just how do you define help? I might volunteer if I can learn something without losing too much of my mind.`
`19:27.10`	`Shadowed`	`floor( 35 + 2.3 ) and ceil( 73 + 2.3 )`
`19:27.17`	`Hexarobi`	`rounding down to the nearest integer for one, rounding up for the other`
`19:27.31`	`TS\|Skrom`	`wait... did you say it backwards? is it coming out 76 when you expect 75?`
`19:27.37`	`[RTE]`	`By help I mean writting localization in German, French, Chinese or Corean`
`19:27.43`	`Shadowed`	`it's a lot of conflicting data`
`19:28.05`	`[RTE]`	`There's not much to translate though, just 2-3 pages worth of text.`
`19:28.05`	`Shadowed`	`I know the formula is right, AP / 14 * weapon speed + max range = new max range`
`19:28.26`	`Shadowed`	`The problem is that i'm +/- 1 off due to rounding, can't make it match up with the in-game sheet :/`
`19:28.54`	`TS\|Skrom`	`wouldn't it be floor(newMax + .5)`
`19:29.03`	`[RTE]`	`aperantly not`
`19:29.17`	`TS\|Skrom`	`cog taught me that one ^.^`
`19:29.23`	`Shadowed`	`if you did ceil( newMax + 0.5 ) then i'd be off`
`19:29.30`	`[RTE]`	`look, it makes sns to floor the min value and cil the max value`
`19:29.35`	`Shadowed`	`actually, hrm sec`
`19:29.38`	`[RTE]`	`sens*`
`19:30.05`	`[RTE]`	`because if you do that you get the minimum containing interval`
`19:30.29`	`[RTE]`	`given that the limits must be integers, not real`
`19:30.44`	`Shadowed`	`If you do floor( newMax + 0.5 ) then the maximum is correct. If you do floor( newMin + 0.5 ) then it's off by one`
`19:30.48`	`TS\|Skrom`	`unless the game engine doesn't round using ceil`
`19:31.10`	`Shadowed`	`I'm pretty sure it stores and gets the info server side, so i'd imagine that the server has round() support`
`19:32.20`	`Shadowed`	`blargh`
`19:32.22`	`Shadowed`	`this is so very annoying`
`19:32.35`	`TS\|Skrom`	`floor the min and +.5 floor the max?`
`19:32.50`	`Shadowed`	`i'm already doing that`
`19:33.22`	`Shadowed`	`i'm in PHP though, so i can just call round();`
`19:34.06`	`cogwheel`	`floor(num + 0.5) is exactly the same as round(num)`
`19:34.09`	`cogwheel`	`I promise`
`19:34.44`	`Shadowed`	`yeah`
`19:35.16`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er... you are doing addon work in php?`
`19:35.26`	`TS\|Skrom`	`foom cleanup on aisle five again`
`19:36.00`	`Shadowed`	`yep`
`19:36.20`	`Shadowed`	`It's not an in-game addon, but i'm working with the in-game formula's`
`19:36.28`	`TS\|Skrom`	`ahh`
`19:37.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`today I get to learn about checkboxes :D`
`19:37.55`	`Cide`	`Shadowed: back`
`19:38.16`	`Shadowed`	`Cide: Did you do the formula's for CTProfile?`
`19:38.24`	`Shadowed`	`for calculating melee damage range`
`19:38.30`	`Cide`	`Shadowed: yes`
`19:38.48`	`Cide`	`and yes, floor() minimum, ceil() maximum`
`19:39.10`	`Shadowed`	`Do priests have a different calculation by any chance then?`
`19:39.52`	`Cide`	`let me load up the code`
`19:41.16`	`Shadowed`	`( 24 / 14 ) * 1.3 + 73 = 75.2 if i ceil that, it's 76 but char sheet says 75 for max. I'm guessing priests use a different calculation, but want to make sure`
`19:41.35`	`TS\|Skrom`	`is there a version of "radio" buttons in wow?`
`19:41.40`	`Cide`	`floor($ammoDps$speed+$damageModifier($damage + $power/14*$speed + $damageAddition))`
`19:41.49`	`TS\|Skrom`	`as in, default behavior of only one per group selected at any given time?`
`19:42.05`	`TS\|Skrom`	`or is that done with checkboxes, "onclick -> clear other boxes"`
`19:42.18`	`Shadowed`	`Do you have the calc's for offhand damage when DWing?`
`19:42.40`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: with checkboxes`
`19:42.44`	`TS\|Skrom`	`ahh thanks`
`19:42.45`	`Cide`	`um, not sure - we're two developers`
`19:42.53`	`Shadowed`	`it's fine, will go work it out`
`19:42.58`	`Cide`	`though I don't think that affects the damage ranges`
`19:43.00`	`Shadowed`	`answers the question that was bugging me though, thanks`
`19:43.19`	`Shadowed`	`Well, you take a 50% reduction, wasn't sure if they applied it before or after calculating the range`
`19:43.33`	`Cide`	`it's not added at all, I believe`
`19:43.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn_ (n=chatzill@bby-wired-gen2-873.authent.sfu.ca)`
`19:44.13`	`Cide`	`to the char sheet`
`19:44.13`	`Shadowed`	`alright, thanks`
`19:45.43`	`Mikma`	`clad\|work: you here?`
`19:51.42`	`Esamynn_`	`sorry for the spam, setting up nicknames for my laptop`
`19:54.07`	`zylex`	`[RTE]: i got big troubles finding that error :)`
`19:54.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Warla\|school (i=Darky28@39.220.76.83.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`19:54.57`	`[RTE]`	`zylex: well, can't help you more, I'm at work, so no testing for me`
`19:55.01`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I hate writing crystal reports`
`19:55.16`	`TS\|Skrom`	`especially when no one tells you what any of the database fields mean and you just have to guess`
`19:55.32`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Oh gee this looks like fun, I'll pull this one over and hope for the best ><`
`19:56.38`	`[RTE]`	`sounds fun`
`19:56.51`	`[RTE]`	`delete * from database;`
`19:56.53`	`[RTE]`	`done`
`19:56.55`	`[RTE]`	`:)`
`19:56.56`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lol`
`19:57.05`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'd get murdered by a large angry mob`
`19:57.20`	`[RTE]`	`but the report will be done :) lol`
`19:57.24`	`TS\|Skrom`	`haha`
`19:57.39`	`[RTE]`	`better yet:`
`19:57.54`	`zylex`	`anyone else that got some spare time to help me get this addon to work?`
`19:58.12`	`TS\|Skrom`	`and the stupid thing is... this report I'm doing is so we can send all our customer data to ... a supplier... who doesn't have any noncompete clause who will give us a 2% discount when we buy from them if we give all this data up including, who they are, what they buy and how often`
`19:58.16`	`[RTE]`	`rename all the fields you do not know :)`
`19:58.25`	`zylex`	`worked flawless until patch 1.12... http://ui.worldofwar.net/ui.php?id=1421`
`19:59.05`	`TS\|Skrom`	`how many customers do we have to lose due to the supplier selling directly before that 2% gets eaten up?`
`19:59.08`	`TS\|Skrom`	`answer: not many`
`19:59.38`	`[RTE]`	`hehe`
`19:59.41`	`TS\|Skrom`	`but I'm just the computer jockey not the accountant or the salesman, so they don't ask me`
`20:00.08`	`[RTE]`	`yeah, so back to work, typing monkey :)`
`20:00.33`	`[RTE]`	`it is their decision to make and their money to risk`
`20:01.15`	`[RTE]`	`if only I had money to start my own company ...`
`20:01.26`	`[RTE]`	`.. I would'ev already retired :) lol`
`20:01.33`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hehe`
`20:01.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`one of these days... one of these days`
`20:01.48`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm getting ready to start back to college`
`20:02.02`	`TS\|Skrom`	`gonna get me a programming degree and get out of this hardware/software support rut I'm in`
`20:02.25`	`[RTE]`	`yeah, one more year of uiversity for me and I'm done :)`
`20:02.58`	`[RTE]`	`I don't see much of an improvement in the future for me though :(`
`20:03.13`	`[RTE]`	`unless I find some rich bastard I can leach off :) hehe`
`20:03.21`	`TS\|Skrom`	`you sound like my ex wife`
`20:03.25`	`[RTE]`	`by rich bastard I mean client`
`20:03.28`	`[RTE]`	`lol`
`20:03.56`	`[RTE]`	`I knew I should have been a wonan :)`
`20:04.39`	`TS\|Skrom`	`so now I've got the base report written, I'm just waiting on the vendor to email me with the requirements that we have to send to them so I can make his job of stealing our customers even easier`
`20:05.00`	`TS\|Skrom`	`because not only do I have to send him my data I have to put it in a special order so it's easier to steal, I mean read`
`20:05.07`	`[RTE]`	`brb, tea time`
`20:05.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`20:05.28`	`TS\|Skrom`	`yo kirk`
`20:06.03`	`Kirkburn`	`Ciao`
`20:08.50`	`Shadowed`	`finally, got the calcs working`
`20:12.50`	`TS\|Skrom`	`what was the difference shadowed?`
`20:17.49`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Guillotine (n=chatzill@ns.motek-services.com)`
`20:21.25`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`Q: when i have items that increase magical damge from spells/effect does that also effect my hunter shots ?`
`20:24.25`	`Industrial`	`How do I delete a MediaWiki page?`
`20:24.58`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`Industrial: u dont u need admin rightts for it`
`20:25.02`	`Industrial`	`fs`
`20:25.03`	`Industrial`	`:p`
`20:25.17`	`Industrial`	`even if im the one that made it?`
`20:25.22`	`Industrial`	`its my own page :<`
`20:25.47`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`well its like that on an other wiki i know`
`20:26.01`	`\|FF\|Im2good4u`	`since oages are edited by anyone they dont realy got a rela ownder`
`20:26.02`	`Industrial`	`k cause im not seeing a del button`
`20:26.10`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Industrial (n=tom@hellsblade.xs4all.nl)`
`20:27.12`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Industrial (n=tom@hellsblade.xs4all.nl)`
`20:27.13`	`Industrial`	`woops`
`20:29.13`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Parak (i=PROFI@user-0cev737.cable.mindspring.com)`
`20:33.51`	`JoshBorke`	`no, you can't delete a page`
`20:36.21`	`Kirkburn`	`Only sysops (admins) can delte any pages`
`20:36.37`	`Kirkburn`	`And I still can't reach the wiki ...`
`20:36.51`	`Industrial`	`this is for the wowace wiki in case you are wondering :P`
`20:37.02`	`Kirkburn`	`Still, same rules :P`
`20:37.11`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirkburn: see if your traceroute goes through the same router that you get stuck on for the wiki`
`20:37.51`	`Kirkburn`	`I can get to the Ace wiki fine`
`20:37.59`	`Shadowed`	`TS\|Skrom: What do you mean difference?`
`20:38.02`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: people are lazy and they want someone todo their job for them, so I'm not surprised :)`
`20:38.05`	`Kirkburn`	`The traceroute stops in Canada for me`
`20:38.28`	`JoshBorke`	`where does it stop again?`
`20:38.46`	`Kirkburn`	`falcon.eicat.ca`
`20:38.52`	`Kirkburn`	`(66.96.16.5)`
`20:38.58`	`[RTE]`	`traceroute never stops in canada`
`20:39.00`	`[RTE]`	`::)`
`20:39.04`	`Shadowed`	`calc was just`
`20:39.08`	`TS\|Skrom`	`Shadowed: what made it work now? did you find something?`
`20:39.12`	`Shadowed`	`ceil( ( $weapon['max'] + ( $this->attackpower / 14 * $weapon['speed'] ) ) * $dw_penalty )`
`20:39.15`	`JoshBorke`	`interesting. looks like you're being dropped there. i go through there also and it works`
`20:39.17`	`Shadowed`	`floor( ( $weapon['min'] + ( $this->attackpower / 14 * $weapon['speed'] ) ) * $dw_penalty )`
`20:39.19`	`TS\|Skrom`	`RTE: I must have missed something... what are you talking about lol`
`20:39.25`	`Shadowed`	`first one is maximum/min for OH when DWing`
`20:39.28`	`Shadowed`	`actually`
`20:39.32`	`Kirkburn`	`JoshBorke, after that point, I get request timed out.`
`20:39.47`	`JoshBorke`	`hm`
`20:39.53`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: seems like connection is being blocked or doews not go through some gate or whatever`
`20:39.57`	`Shadowed`	`TS\|Skrom: http://pastebin.ca/161801`
`20:40.06`	`Kirkburn`	`What if my IP were banned somehow? Might that have that effect?`
`20:40.12`	`Shadowed`	`first calc is for offhand, bottom one is the calc for MH`
`20:40.19`	`JoshBorke`	`yea, i was going to see if there is a way to see banned IPs on the wiki`
`20:40.25`	`Kirkburn`	`not afaik`
`20:40.27`	`TS\|Skrom`	`what connection?`
`20:40.40`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I don't remember talking bout any connection lol`
`20:40.56`	`Kirkburn`	`He meant me :P`
`20:41.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh hehe`
`20:41.16`	`JoshBorke`	`Kirkburn: i'd check with other sysops on the wiki`
`20:41.26`	`TS\|Skrom`	`my addon won't load. I'm guessing it's an xml error somewhere but I'm not getting any error codes. is there a log file somewhere I could look at?`
`20:41.33`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: I was talking about the last fraze you told me before I went for tea`
`20:41.39`	`Kirkburn`	`I'm going to try restarting the router and d/c-ing, see if I can change IP`
`20:41.54`	`TS\|Skrom`	`ohhhh RTE gotcha :D`
`20:41.54`	`JoshBorke`	`finally! i can see my writing!`
`20:42.00`	`[RTE]`	`TS\|Skrom: try openning xml file with IE/FF first`
`20:42.05`	`TS\|Skrom`	`yeah my mind blanked on that one`
`20:42.13`	`[RTE]`	`hehe`
`20:43.44`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge MentalPower_ (i=chatzill@host-70-45-82-92.onelinkpr.net)`
`20:44.33`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I hate xml`
`20:44.59`	`TS\|Skrom`	`it hates me too so it's okay`
`20:45.32`	`tyroney`	`And besides opening in a browser, remember to check the logs.`
`20:46.23`	`TS\|Skrom`	`er... I think I need some help...`
`20:46.30`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I've got five checkboxes lined up horizontally`
`20:46.42`	`TS\|Skrom`	`when I hover my mouse over #4 it highlights and clicks #2... what gives?`
`20:47.00`	`TS\|Skrom`	`too close maybe?`
`20:47.09`	`tyroney`	`I should make myself a checklist of: [things a ui widget needs to be displayed] and [things to do/check when getting something working]. It would save me a few hours a month.`
`20:47.30`	`tyroney`	`Do checkboxes have some built-in text that's overlapping in weird ways?`
`20:47.58`	`TS\|Skrom`	`they do have a text component off to the left...`
`20:48.00`	`JoshBorke`	`in WoW? yes, if you use the default WoW checkbox, it has a FontString attached to it`
`20:48.03`	`TS\|Skrom`	`how can I check that?`
`20:48.04`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`20:48.16`	`JoshBorke`	`wb Kirkburn`
`20:48.16`	`TS\|Skrom`	`or limit it?`
`20:48.19`	`Kirkburn1`	`Guess what happened :P`
`20:48.23`	`JoshBorke`	`sorry Kirkburn, same IP :-P`
`20:49.18`	`Kirkburn1`	`Hmm, either way, I'm back in the wiki!`
`20:49.19`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge zespri_work (n=andrews@124.197.5.115)`
`20:49.23`	`zespri_work`	`morning`
`20:49.27`	`JoshBorke`	`awesome!`
`20:50.10`	`Kirkburn1`	`morning zespri :)`
`20:50.39`	`Kirkburn1`	`And yes indeed, JoshBorke - I must have been very very unlucky with my previous connection :P`
`20:51.00`	`TS\|Skrom`	`bah, I :SetWidth(1) on my text boxes as a test and it still does it hehe, must not be because of the fontstrong`
`20:52.40`	`Cide`	`time for the biggest part of ctprofiles to be rewritten`
`20:53.03`	`JoshBorke`	`in game profiles!`
`20:53.08`	`JoshBorke`	`Cide: so CTRA2 is done? :-D`
`20:53.16`	`Cide`	`nope`
`20:53.29`	`Shadowed`	`what are you guys rewriting`
`20:53.43`	`Cide`	`we're optimizing it, and as such I'm rewriting the stats calculator`
`20:53.49`	`Shadowed`	`ahh`
`20:54.04`	`Shadowed`	`bah`
`20:54.13`	`Shadowed`	`going from LUA -> PHP after not doing PHP for a few months is hard`
`20:54.35`	`Cide`	`well, I do both on a daily basis so it's not that bad`
`20:54.51`	`cogwheel`	`I just do my web programming in Lua... problem solved`
`20:54.53`	`cogwheel`	`:P`
`20:54.57`	`krka`	`kepler`
`20:54.57`	`krka`	`?`
`20:55.01`	`Shadowed`	`Been doing LUA mostly, havn't had much time to do PVP.`
`20:55.02`	`Shadowed`	`er PHP`
`20:55.03`	`cogwheel`	`yeah`
`20:55.09`	`krka`	`php is crap`
`20:55.13`	`krka`	`of course it sucks to go back to it`
`20:55.33`	`Shadowed`	`By sucks to go back to it, I mean not used to the syntax ;)`
`20:56.21`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm the reverse shadowed, I keep forgetting my thens :D`
`20:56.56`	`wereHamster`	`Cide, what for does CTRA2 need a stats calculator?`
`20:57.00`	`zespri_work`	`why don't the do 1.12.1? they have nothing to patch?`
`20:57.05`	`Cide`	`ctprofiles does`
`20:57.10`	`kergoth`	`kepler looks nice, i need to try that`
`20:57.15`	`tyroney`	`TS_Skrom: you set your fontstring width to 0, or the built-in fontstring child of the checkbox?`
`20:57.21`	`wereHamster`	`a, so you'll integrate ctprofiles into CTRA2?`
`20:57.27`	`TS\|Skrom`	`the fontstring that I was currently working with`
`20:57.32`	*** join/#wowi-lounge frus` (i=frus@082-146-096-162.dyn.adsl.xs4all.be)
`20:57.34`	`Shadowed`	`[53:13] <Cide> we're optimizing it, and as such I'm rewriting the stats calculator`
`20:57.49`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I assumed it was tree based... defined at the this: level overrides anything set from the template?`
`20:58.06`	`Cide`	`wereHamster: no... I haven't even mentioned ctra2 until JoshBorke asked :)`
`20:58.28`	`wereHamster`	`I didn't read the whole backlog.. :-X`
`20:59.13`	`tyroney`	`Honestly, I don't know exactly. Woiuld it be a pain to temporarily re-arrange them vertically, or something, to see if the same mis-click still happens?`
`21:00.58`	`tyroney`	`TS\|Skrom: by the way, feel free to paste something somewhere. I sort of enjoy the xml side, even if it gets a little longwinded and tedious.`
`21:02.34`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I just rearranged vertically and there's no problem`
`21:02.45`	`TS\|Skrom`	`it seems the click box extends beyond the visible range`
`21:03.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`at least unless you tell it not to be, which is what i don't know how to do`
`21:03.12`	`TS\|Skrom`	`maybe you have to set the widge of the box?`
`21:04.11`	`TS\|Skrom`	`http://wowi.pastecode.com/4245`
`21:04.18`	`TS\|Skrom`	`widge = width O.o`
`21:04.28`	`TS\|Skrom`	`that's them vertically`
`21:07.41`	`tyroney`	`Wait, in the UI options xml, I noticed something...`
`21:08.09`	`[RTE]`	`well, later folks, I'm headed hoome`
`21:08.16`	`tyroney`	`nevermind.`
`21:08.31`	`clad\|work`	`Well this is fucking inconvenient.`
`21:08.42`	`cladhaire`	`sorry, effing inconvenient`
`21:09.25`	`cogwheel`	`O.o`
`21:09.32`	`Cairenn`	`cladhaire: watch your fucking mouth!`
`21:09.45`	`cladhaire`	`Cairenn: i dont like NSFW'ing.. since I've irc'd from work`
`21:09.53`	`Cairenn`	`nod`
`21:10.00`	`tyroney`	`TS\|Skrom: the <HitRectInsets> in the OptionsCheckButtonTemplate might have something to do with it.`
`21:10.02`	`Tain_`	`I'm fucking home.`
`21:10.14`	`tyroney`	`<AbsInset left="0" right="-100" top="0" bottom="0"/>`
`21:10.14`	`cladhaire`	`i hate you all`
`21:10.26`	`Cairenn`	`awww, we hate you too :)`
`21:10.27`	`Tain`	`And I found a fucking apartment 5 miles from work.`
`21:10.33`	`Tain`	`But I fucking hate moving.`
`21:10.36`	`Cairenn`	`grats Tain`
`21:10.42`	`Cairenn`	`but you can stop now, lol`
`21:11.01`	`Tain`	`That last one wasn't added extraneously.`
`21:11.18`	`cladhaire`	`I'm pissed because some fucktard got my debit card number, and used it to charge a grand of shit at western union. So now my account is closed, and I don't have a god damned debit card to take with me to the UK.`
`21:11.28`	`Cairenn`	`ACK`
`21:11.31`	`Tain`	`I'm going to be paying movers a bunch of money to move all my stuff.`
`21:11.42`	`Tain`	`That's horrible clad. :(`
`21:11.47`	`Cairenn`	`cladhaire: not good! :(((`
`21:11.51`	`cladhaire`	`Yeah.`
`21:11.54`	`cladhaire`	`fucking tell me about it.`
`21:11.57`	`Tain`	`I'll pay you cash to come move my stuff though.`
`21:12.22`	`cladhaire`	`I was planning on taking about 100 pounds to the UK with me, and using ATM's there to replenish any of that cash, so I don't get screwed on exchange rates.`
`21:13.43`	`Tain`	`That's what I did going to Canada the last time I flew in. They gave me a hard time saying I was suspicious because I didn't have enough cash on me to spend a week in canada.`
`21:14.11`	`cladhaire`	`Not to mention that the UK doesn't trust credit cards, they prefer debit cards with all of their PIN goodness`
`21:14.27`	`Tain`	`Yeah.`
`21:15.01`	`zespri_work`	`I haven't used cash in years...`
`21:15.37`	`Tain`	`They get pissed when you try to swipe your card down a stripper's ass.`
`21:15.51`	`[Ammo]`	`cladhaire: I think you forgot to commit the actual plugin for clique, but only adjusted the .xml`
`21:15.57`	`cladhaire`	`[Ammo]: meh`
`21:16.08`	`cladhaire`	`zespri_work: Yeah, but you get shit for exhange rates when going cash for cash, so the goal is to have SOME cash, but turn the same amount in, so you don't lose any money.`
`21:16.40`	`zespri_work`	`but, yeah, I'm travaling oversees soon to, so haven't decided should I get a wad of cash with me or get chareged 5 bucks per transaction + unfair exchnge rates`
`21:17.16`	`cladhaire`	`zespri_work: Thats why credit cards are beautiful =)`
`21:17.22`	`cladhaire`	`I'll make due, I'm just.. annoyed.`
`21:17.25`	`[Ammo]`	`cladhaire :)`
`21:17.35`	`cladhaire`	`I know for a fact that taxi I need to take both ways, I'll need at least 100 pounds for that.`
`21:18.25`	`zespri_work`	`They charge a lot for cash advances on credit cards`
`21:18.43`	`TS\|Skrom`	`ARRRHGLBLRBLR BLRLBR`
`21:18.49`	`TS\|Skrom`	`murloc noises ftw ><`
`21:18.52`	`zespri_work`	`And the country I'm going to is not civilized enough so you could pay with a credit card everywhere =)(`
`21:18.58`	`cladhaire`	`zespri_work: Aaah, see that's the problem`
`21:19.03`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: PING`
`21:19.18`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: Is there any chance I could bother you for a moment when you have a chance?`
`21:20.01`	`TS\|Skrom`	`http://wowi.pastecode.com/4246 -- someone please tell me why my font strong won't show :(`
`21:20.54`	`cogwheel`	`this:SetText`
`21:21.27`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I had that at first and it wouldn't show then :(`
`21:21.43`	`TS\|Skrom`	`trying again now to triple check`
`21:21.51`	`TS\|Skrom`	`<OnLoad>`
`21:21.51`	`TS\|Skrom`	`<PROTECTED>`
`21:21.51`	`TS\|Skrom`	`<PROTECTED>`
`21:21.52`	`cogwheel`	`Well, this:GetName().."CheckButtonDesc" is completely wrong since this script is for the FontString itself...`
`21:23.01`	`TS\|Skrom`	`true, I meant to have $parent there I think`
`21:23.05`	`cogwheel`	`wait a minute... fontstrings don't even have scripts`
`21:23.19`	`TS\|Skrom`	`oh for crying out loud ><`
`21:23.23`	`tyroney`	`ding ding ding!`
`21:23.37`	`TS\|Skrom`	`thanks... <-- dumbass`
`21:23.51`	`tyroney`	`I love making mistakes like that. Well, evey now and then. Not too often.`
`21:25.27`	`cogwheel`	`XSD-recognizing XML editor 4tw!`
`21:26.40`	`tyroney`	`ps: cogwheel - what do you use along those lines? I might as well upgrade from notepad sooner or later.`
`21:26.44`	`TS\|Skrom`	`SetNonSpaceWrap : how is this used?`
`21:26.50`	`Hexarobi`	`textpad`
`21:27.01`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I use programmer's notepad`
`21:27.13`	`Hexarobi`	`BBedit`
`21:27.19`	`Cide`	`textpad is awesome`
`21:27.42`	`Kirkburn1`	`Ping cladhaire`
`21:27.42`	`cogwheel`	`I haven't tried using textpad 'cause I had a very bad first impression when it completely choked on UTF-8 that it didn't recognize`
`21:27.53`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn: Any chance I could get you to figure out how much a taxi is goign to cost me?`
`21:27.59`	`Kirkburn`	`Where to where?`
`21:28.04`	`cogwheel`	`I personally use VS 2005 but that's because i happen to have it and it works...`
`21:28.05`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn: I need to get fro Heathrow to the University of Kent`
`21:28.16`	`Kirkburn`	`Two secs, see what I can do :)`
`21:28.20`	`cladhaire`	`=)`
`21:28.20`	`cladhaire`	`<3`
`21:28.24`	`Hexarobi`	`heh, university of kent`
`21:28.29`	`cladhaire`	`Hexarobi: Why heh?`
`21:28.37`	`Hexarobi`	`i find england funny`
`21:28.40`	`cladhaire`	`why?`
`21:28.42`	`cladhaire`	`lol`
`21:28.45`	`Hexarobi`	`monty python`
`21:28.52`	`cogwheel`	`hex, you're not alone :P`
`21:29.00`	`cogwheel`	`Spotted Dick`
`21:29.28`	`Hexarobi`	`bollocks is bad, dogs bollocks is very good`
`21:29.52`	`cogwheel`	`kirkburn, what do you think of us over here? ;)`
`21:30.05`	`Hexarobi`	`i dont trust a society that would burn Guy Fawkes in effigy`
`21:30.17`	`cogwheel`	`with all our missing letters (like color, program, etc..)`
`21:30.28`	`Hexarobi`	`through`
`21:30.49`	`Hexarobi`	`herb`
`21:30.55`	`Hexarobi`	`aloo-mini-umm`
`21:32.06`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`21:32.12`	`Kirkburn1`	`How unfortunate that I got disconnected just then :P Last msg received: "i dont trust a society that would burn Guy Fawkes in effigy"`
`21:32.34`	`Kirkburn1`	`cogwheel, no-one eats Spotted Dick :)`
`21:32.52`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: haha`
`21:32.59`	`Tain`	`I'm a fan of entertainment that's come from England.`
`21:33.04`	`Tain`	`Definitely not the food however.`
`21:33.11`	`Kirkburn1`	`I <3 Brit comedy :)`
`21:33.32`	`Kirkburn1`	`The 'national dishes' aren't actually. We eat normal food, I promise`
`21:33.42`	`cogwheel`	`I had steak and kidney pie while i was there... I probably would've liked it if it weren't for the urine taste ... O.o`
`21:33.56`	`TS\|Skrom`	`well just learned something new about xml`
`21:34.04`	`TS\|Skrom`	`well, not new, but something I didn't kow`
`21:34.06`	`TS\|Skrom`	`know*`
`21:34.08`	`Kirkburn1`	`cogwheel, I just have steak pie, no kidney for me :/`
`21:34.14`	`Kirkburn1`	`So, cladhaire I have advice!`
`21:34.22`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: zomg k =)`
`21:34.35`	`Kirkburn1`	`For a taxi from heathrow to the Uni of Kent, it would cost about £125`
`21:34.41`	`Kirkburn1`	`However, there is a much cheaper option`
`21:34.43`	`cladhaire`	`i'll take the tube and the train =)`
`21:34.44`	`cogwheel`	`I also had a veggie burger at McDonalds before they offered them here ;)`
`21:35.07`	`Kirkburn1`	`Yeah, that. Or get a bus to Gatwick, and a taxi from there`
`21:35.20`	`cladhaire`	`any idea how much that would run me?`
`21:35.21`	`Tain`	`McDonalds got into trouble with those veggie burgers since they were cooking them on the same grill as the meat and pissing people off.`
`21:35.42`	`Kirkburn1`	`Train is a much better choice though.`
`21:35.57`	`Tain`	`clad you should hitchhike.`
`21:36.04`	`Kirkburn1`	`For gatwick to the Uni, it would probably reduce to taxi to £50 or so`
`21:36.14`	`cogwheel`	`I had to bus from Hearthrow to Oxford... I think i would've much preferred a train...`
`21:36.45`	`Kirkburn1`	`But the trains are reliable`
`21:36.54`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: Which path would you reccomend? http://www.kent.ac.uk/maps/canterbury/find-campus.html`
`21:37.18`	`cladhaire`	`if you don't mind me exploiting our friendship =)`
`21:37.37`	`Kirkburn1`	`hehe`
`21:38.12`	`Kirkburn1`	`(It's fortunate that my mum helps with a taxi company)`
`21:38.21`	`Kirkburn1`	`For the train advice?`
`21:38.52`	`Kirkburn1`	`London (Charing Cross or Waterloo East) to Canterbury West`
`21:39.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kaso (n=Jonathan@host81-159-131-7.range81-159.btcentralplus.com)`
`21:39.18`	`Kirkburn1`	`Mainly because Canterbury West is closer to the campus`
`21:39.34`	`cladhaire`	`Okay, and it should be reasonably obvious how to get to Charing Cross from Heathrow?`
`21:40.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Guillotine_ (n=chatzill@ns.motek-services.com)`
`21:40.40`	`Kirkburn1`	`Looking at a tube map now`
`21:41.20`	`Kirkburn1`	`Map of the tube: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/colourmap.pdf`
`21:41.43`	`Kirkburn1`	`(tfl = transport for london, excellent site for anyone wanting to travel around london)`
`21:41.43`	`cladhaire`	`oooh handy`
`21:41.45`	`cladhaire`	`i'll print that out`
`21:41.53`	`Kirkburn1`	`Good idea :)`
`21:42.11`	`Kirkburn1`	`Charing Cross looks easiest to get to`
`21:42.21`	`cladhaire`	`fair enough =)`
`21:42.39`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: Now if I could just figure out my damn money, I'd be close to set =)`
`21:43.03`	`Kirkburn1`	`Picadilly Line to Piccadill Circus, then one stop on the Bakerloo line :)`
`21:43.12`	`Kirkburn1`	`*Piccadilly`
`21:43.41`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hrmpf. I can't seem to get my text to wrap and I can't google an answer for "New line in XML"`
`21:43.47`	`TS\|Skrom`	`someone hep me prz`
`21:43.53`	`Kirkburn1`	`Our money is eeeasy :P`
`21:43.59`	`cladhaire`	`No, you misunderstand`
`21:44.13`	`cladhaire`	`I had some fraud on my debit card today, so that account is closed and I won't be able to get a new card in time.`
`21:44.17`	`Kirkburn1`	`Thought I might have :P`
`21:44.30`	`Kirkburn1`	`Ouch`
`21:44.44`	`cladhaire`	`I was going to come over, exchange say $150 at the airport so I had some cash, spend only what i need to in cash, and replenish what i do spend at an ATM (using credit for everything else)`
`21:45.01`	`cladhaire`	`that way when I get back to the airport, I get the same exchange rate back on the money I changed.. and I save some money`
`21:45.16`	`Kirkburn1`	`Sounds okay to me`
`21:45.21`	`cladhaire`	`but that's no longer an option`
`21:45.26`	`cladhaire`	`so i'm gonna get screwed on any money i change =0`
`21:45.31`	`Kirkburn1`	`The train journey will probably be around ... hmm ... £30-40`
`21:45.55`	`cladhaire`	`yeah, i was expecting about $100 each way to and from kent, which blows.. but i can deal`
`21:46.34`	`tyroney`	`TS\|Skrom: warpping is presentation, and technically thus wouldn't be a part of xml. (xml is for organization of data) I think you want to search for the newline or carriage return character. (not really any relation to xml)`
`21:46.47`	`Kirkburn1`	`cladhaire, train prices you can find here: http://www.thetrainline.com`
`21:46.57`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn1: Thanks`
`21:47.10`	`Kirkburn1`	`np`
`21:47.24`	`cladhaire`	`I really appreciate it =)`
`21:47.32`	`cladhaire`	`If you can meet me for lunch on Monday, I'll buy you a beer :P`
`21:47.37`	`Kirkburn1`	`Hehe`
`21:47.49`	`Kirkburn1`	`When do you arrive?`
`21:47.57`	`cladhaire`	`10.30am thursday`
`21:48.15`	`Kirkburn1`	`So you didn't leave the organsising tooo late then :P`
`21:48.24`	`cladhaire`	`well i knew what i was going to do`
`21:48.36`	`cladhaire`	`but the trying to avoid cash thing changed things..`
`21:48.43`	`Kirkburn`	`Ah yeah`
`21:48.52`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hrm... so I should avoid setting my label text inside the xml, register for an event of some kind and set my text inside the LUA that way I can use the newline?`
`21:48.55`	`Kirkburn`	`Trains ftw`
`21:48.56`	`cladhaire`	`at least you guys take credit.. even if you prefer debit.`
`21:49.07`	`Kirkburn`	`Not really true tbh`
`21:49.30`	`Kirkburn`	`I'd say it's swinging towards credit cards atm, which isn't a good thing`
`21:49.31`	`cladhaire`	`my bf said everyone looked at him really weird when he gave it to them :P`
`21:49.51`	`Kirkburn`	`Gave a credit to whom?`
`21:49.59`	`Kirkburn`	`^ card`
`21:50.02`	`cladhaire`	`it was at some store, or restaurant.`
`21:50.30`	`Kirkburn`	`Weird! Nah, many people pay with credit cards now`
`21:50.46`	`cladhaire`	`well thats goodto know`
`21:50.59`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mr_Rabies2 (n=yams@adsl-066-156-082-132.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`21:51.09`	`Kirkburn`	`:)`
`21:51.32`	`Kaso`	`maybe if he paid for some tiny amount with a credit card he'd get a funny look though.`
`21:51.36`	`Kirkburn`	`We're not as strange as we may sound! Promise!`
`21:51.41`	`TS\|Skrom`	`lies`
`21:52.01`	`cladhaire`	`=)`
`21:52.06`	`Kirkburn`	`I didn't say I was representative of normal brits :P`
`21:52.14`	`cladhaire`	`very true :P`
`21:52.51`	`TS\|Skrom`	`well I guess I'll leave that text location stuff for later... I can always fix the looks after I get the meat done hehe`
`21:53.16`	`Industrial`	`how do I color text in MediaWiki?`
`21:53.26`	`Industrial`	`(wowwiki is mediawiki right?)`
`21:53.31`	`Kirkburn`	`Same way you would in html?`
`21:53.40`	`cladhaire`	`alright well i'm off to shower and make dinner`
`21:53.53`	`Kirkburn`	`Bon appetit`
`21:54.07`	`cladhaire`	`Kirkburn: Thank you for your help, hopefully I can leave you alone for a bit, but no promises =)`
`21:54.20`	`Kirkburn`	`Heh, any questions, just ask :)`
`21:54.31`	`Industrial`	`<span style="color:#f00;">RED</span> ?`
`21:54.35`	`Industrial`	`=P`
`21:54.39`	`Kirkburn`	`Industrial, coding in mediawiki is just like coding for a normal website`
`21:55.02`	`Industrial`	`oki`
`21:55.05`	`Kirkburn`	`Main differences is the extra codes you can use on top :)`
`21:55.25`	`Kirkburn`	`Yeah, your example was fine :)`
`21:55.46`	`Kirkburn`	`(though I hate when people reduce hex colours to 3 chars =)`
`21:56.40`	`Kirkburn`	`Back to NFSU2 :) (I wrote NSFW at first :/ )`
`21:56.42`	`Cide`	`red is cool in 3 char hex though`
`21:56.53`	`Cide`	`f00bar`
`21:56.56`	`Kirkburn`	`I can cope with f00 :)`
`21:56.57`	`Cide`	`no R though :(`
`21:57.04`	`Kirkburn`	`f00baa`
`21:59.32`	`Industrial`	`Kirkburn, yeah dunno why they put that in css`
`22:00.04`	`Industrial`	`http://wiki.wowace.com/index.php/IdChat#PlayerNames yay colors :P`
`22:00.26`	`Kirkburn`	`Looks good`
`22:00.39`	`Kirkburn`	`Put the actual codes in afterwards at least :)`
`22:01.11`	`Industrial`	`hmm oki`
`22:01.14`	`Kirkburn`	`Actually, scratch that, see no need for it :P`
`22:01.31`	`Kirkburn`	`Didn't realise what the page was actually for :)`
`22:01.53`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge CSE\|Deadly (n=deadly2@bas1-montreal19-1177818720.dsl.bell.ca)`
`22:02.35`	`Kirkburn`	`Even worse is when people define colours using "red" or "grey" in CSS ... it can totally break in some browsers :/`
`22:03.12`	`Industrial`	`oh yeah`
`22:04.07`	`jaxdahl`	`put in a note`
`22:04.12`	`jaxdahl`	`that shaman color willc hange in BC`
`22:04.16`	`jaxdahl`	`and it is unknown what it will be`
`22:04.31`	`jaxdahl`	`Kirkburn\|racing, maybe you found out in the files you had?`
`22:05.28`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`white, atm`
`22:05.42`	`Industrial`	`Kirkburn\|racing, what are you racing`
`22:05.43`	`Industrial`	`:P`
`22:05.51`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`Toyota Corolla, souped up :P`
`22:06.05`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`145mph and rising :)`
`22:07.03`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Guillotine_ (n=chatzill@ns.motek-services.com)`
`22:08.49`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Mikk (i=bofh@81-233-236-26-no19.tbcn.telia.com)`
`22:10.55`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn_ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:11.13`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge Esamynn_ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:11.47`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn_ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:12.24`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn_ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:13.28`	`Esamynn_`	`msg nickserv identify 21383`
`22:13.34`	`Esamynn_`	`oops`
`22:13.36`	`subbawt`	`uhhoh`
`22:13.42`	`Esamynn_`	`good thing i didn' finish that`
`22:13.45`	`Esamynn_`	`good thing i didn' finish that;p`
`22:13.49`	`Esamynn_`	`:P`
`22:14.21`	`Industrial`	`-NickServ- Password Incorrect`
`22:14.22`	`subbawt`	`/ns ghost Esamynn 21383`
`22:14.23`	`Industrial`	`:>`
`22:14.26`	`subbawt`	`;_;`
`22:19.55`	`Esamynn_`	`anyone know what I can do if I accidentally screwed up a nickserv password and don't know what it is anymore?`
`22:20.56`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`Contact a freenode admin`
`22:21.08`	`wereHamster`	`brute-force attack?`
`22:21.20`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`Check the website, there's stuff on there I remember`
`22:21.44`	`Esamynn_`	`Kirkburn\|racing: thanks`
`22:22.39`	`cladhaire`	`HOW ON EARTH was my bash quote rejected.`
`22:22.59`	`cladhaire`	`MentalPower: cananyone suggest any perl tutorials?`
`22:22.59`	`cladhaire`	`Mikk: 1. bust out your modem. 2. dial something with a steady stream of output. 3. change your terminal speed to whatever the modem ISN'T using at the moment. 4. save the resulting terminal session output as " cool.pl" and execute it.`
`22:23.02`	`cladhaire`	`<3`
`22:23.25`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Wobin (i=Wobin@218-214-59-86.people.net.au)`
`22:23.26`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn_ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:24.10`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Marmatt92 (n=Marmatt9@ip70-174-72-217.hr.hr.cox.net)`
`22:24.46`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn__ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:26.18`	`Marmatt92`	`What does everybody this is the best UI for priests? I've been trying to find one but ot alot of them are very good.`
`22:26.24`	`Marmatt92`	`*aren't`
`22:26.47`	`Kirov`	`UIs are a very personal thing.`
`22:26.49`	`jaxdahl`	`why doesn't the game join channels until you land if you login while you're in flight?`
`22:27.05`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn__ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:27.10`	`Kirov`	`The "perfect" setup for one person may be hated by someone else.`
`22:27.12`	`Marmatt92`	`i just want opinions`
`22:27.40`	`cogwheel`	`It's like saying: "Hi, I'm a 23 year old male. What's the best car i should buy?!`
`22:27.48`	`cogwheel`	`that ! was supposed to be a "`
`22:28.14`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - Yes, but everyone knows the answer to that.`
`22:28.21`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - the cheapest pos you can find.`
`22:28.42`	`cogwheel`	`Well, since addons are free, i've got plenty of options :P`
`22:28.48`	`Marmatt92`	`how about a compilation?`
`22:28.52`	`cogwheel`	`s/e a/e most a/`
`22:29.49`	`Kirov`	`Marmatt92 - compilations tend to just be a quick stepping stone to find a lot of addons you don't like.`
`22:29.50`	`cogwheel`	`You might have better luck in the priest forum (at least if the forums were working, that is...)`
`22:30.06`	`cogwheel`	`There would be a lot more focused knowledge there`
`22:30.40`	`Kirov`	`It also depends heavily on how you want to play your priest`
`22:30.44`	`cogwheel`	`hrm... looks like the hamster fell off its wheel again :\`
`22:31.12`	`Kirov`	`cogwheel - feeding time, he's head down in his food dish packing his cheeks`
`22:31.48`	`TS\|Skrom`	`hehe "plan the work, work the plan" as my pappy always says`
`22:32.09`	`TS\|Skrom`	`feels good to have a plan for what you want to change on your addon before you start to code... work through that plan... and actually see it come off well`
`22:36.11`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn__ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:36.52`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`jaxdahl, because channels are set at the end of flights`
`22:37.13`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`If you login whilst in mid-air, you aren't 'in' any area`
`22:37.34`	`Kirkburn\|racing`	`That's my thinking anyway`
`22:38.44`	`Esamynn_`	`there we go, i figured out my typo :)`
`22:47.19`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Esamynn__ (n=jbcc@bby-wired-gen1-834.authent.sfu.ca)`
`22:49.51`	`Hatsuki`	`nihilum has now wiped twice at 1% kel'thuzad ;)`
`22:50.51`	`Corrodias`	`i take it that's him having 1% health left?`
`22:50.52`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge dreyruugr (n=chatzill@66.77.144.6)`
`22:51.02`	`Corrodias`	`must be pretty frustrating. does he do something special when that low?`
`22:51.12`	`Hatsuki`	`ya`
`22:51.32`	`Hatsuki`	`they're offering 5kg for anyone who can get them rend buff=)`
`22:51.52`	`Corrodias`	`kilog's? :o`
`22:51.56`	`Hatsuki`	`ya`
`22:52.08`	`Hatsuki`	`full flasked zanza'd etc raid`
`22:52.14`	`Corrodias`	`5 kilograms of fine crack cocaine`
`22:52.30`	`Mery`	`rend buff?`
`22:52.34`	`Corrodias`	`i have absolutely no idea what that means, Hatsuki.`
`22:52.54`	`cogwheel`	`That's an interesting coincidence... i'm actually reading http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocaine right now... :P`
`22:52.56`	`Hatsuki`	`when you return rend's head, thrall gives "rend-buff"`
`22:53.08`	`wereHamster`	`Corrodias, k = thousand, g = gold`
`22:53.09`	`Corrodias`	`where is rend from, anyway?`
`22:53.11`	`Hatsuki`	`ubrs`
`22:53.12`	`Mery`	`horde only?`
`22:53.14`	`Hatsuki`	`ya`
`22:53.17`	`Hatsuki`	`horde quest`
`22:53.22`	`Corrodias`	`wereHamster: i mean flask, zanza, etc.`
`22:53.24`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`22:53.25`	`Mery`	`(that's why I don't know)`
`22:53.38`	`Mery`	`what does the buff do?`
`22:53.40`	`Hatsuki`	`stacks with dragonslayer buff`
`22:53.46`	`wereHamster`	`flask gives 2k HP or spelldmg or mana and meybe there are other flasks..`
`22:53.50`	`Hatsuki`	`+500hp, 300ap and stuff`
`22:53.57`	`Mery`	`hmm nice`
`22:54.11`	`wereHamster`	`and flasks don't disappear when you die`
`22:54.18`	`Mery`	`but i guess every single hode already did the quest LOL :P`
`22:54.20`	`wereHamster`	`2 hours each`
`22:54.24`	`Corrodias`	`it's a nice little buff, lasts for one hour, and i don't know if the rend buff persists through death`
`22:54.33`	`Hatsuki`	`doesnt persist`
`22:54.57`	`Hatsuki`	`well, they've 2hrs before maintenance`
`22:55.21`	`Corrodias`	`who've done what?`
`22:55.37`	`Corrodias`	`the buff has persisted through death just before a maintenance shutdown?`
`22:55.46`	`Hatsuki`	`...`
`22:55.55`	`Hatsuki`	`maintenance starts in 2hrs`
`22:55.55`	`Corrodias`	`you didn't have a verb in your sentence`
`22:56.08`	`Kirkburn`	`he did`
`22:56.09`	`Hatsuki`	`which means instance reset`
`22:56.12`	`Corrodias`	`oh, "they have 2 hours", i get it`
`22:56.15`	`Kirkburn`	`:P`
`22:56.23`	`Corrodias`	`maintenance starts in 2 hours? is this euro, or am i out of the loop?`
`22:56.27`	`Hatsuki`	`euro`
`22:56.34`	`Hatsuki`	`eu-magtheridon`
`22:56.38`	`wereHamster`	`nihilum is an EU guild`
`22:59.21`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Qzot (n=nickell@sandbox.xerox.com)`
`23:08.37`	`Qzot`	`Anyone in channel?`
`23:08.43`	`TS\|Skrom`	`no`
`23:08.45`	`TS\|Skrom`	`:)`
`23:08.56`	`Qzot`	`Blast. I had a question.`
`23:09.05`	`Qzot`	`Can you let me know if someone logs on?`
`23:09.12`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I was just joking`
`23:09.16`	`TS\|Skrom`	`there were a ton around earlier`
`23:09.17`	`Qzot`	`Oh. :D`
`23:09.33`	`TS\|Skrom`	`I'm outta here though, adios`
`23:09.50`	`Qzot`	`I can't seem to guess the names of the API functions to put icons over the heads of mobs.`
`23:10.31`	`Kirov`	`RaidTarget`
`23:10.35`	`Kirov`	`icon`
`23:11.16`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Warla (i=Darky28@65-165.0-85.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`23:11.22`	`Qzot`	`ty. Exactly what I was looking for.`
`23:19.51`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge The-Real (i=the_real@85.24.43.252)`
`23:20.09`	`Maldivia_`	`any 60 shamans here ?`
`23:20.39`	`zespri_work`	`55 shaman won't count?`
`23:21.30`	`Maldivia_`	`hmm, if you can tell me how much health your stoneclaw totem(rank 5) have at level 55?`
`23:22.16`	`Kaso`	`Doesnt thottbot say that?`
`23:22.44`	`Maldivia_`	`I'm not interested in what thottbot says, I'm interested in what the ingame tooltip says`
`23:23.05`	`Maldivia_`	`thottbot doesn't take level into consideration`
`23:23.13`	`zespri_work`	`Mhm, if I was able to run WoW at work I would tell you =)`
`23:23.16`	`Kaso`	`ah, true`
`23:23.59`	`Maldivia_`	`zespri: if you should take a guess, would it be 390 or 411 ?`
`23:24.25`	`Maldivia_`	`or (585 / 617 if you have talents)`
`23:24.45`	`zespri_work`	`no idea, sorry`
`23:24.50`	`Maldivia_`	`heh, ok`
`23:26.37`	`*** part/#wowi-lounge wereHamster (n=tomc@gw.ptr-62-65-141-13.customer.ch.netstream.com)`
`23:29.17`	`*** join/#wowi-lounge Kirkburn1 (n=Kirkburn@84-45-141-44.no-dns-yet.enta.net)`
`23:39.44`	`Maldivia_`	`hmm, any 60 druids then, who can tell me how much AP they get from cat form (according to tooltip)`
`23:41.32`	`Thrae`	`Cat Form receives 2 AP from Strength and 1 AP from Agility. With the Heart of the Wild, this becomes 2.4 from Strength. With the talent directly preceeding HoTW, this increases to 150%.`
`23:42.10`	`Maldivia_`	`I know... not what I mean`
`23:42.34`	`Maldivia_`	`The cat form "spell" reads something like: Shapeshift into cat form, increasing melee attack power by xxx plus Agility. Also protects the caster from....`
`23:42.49`	`Maldivia_`	`it's the xxx I'm interested in`
`23:43.13`	`Maldivia_`	`... ok, that could be misinterpreted`
`23:43.44`	`Kirkburn1`	`haha`
`23:44.02`	`Thrae`	`purl, Maldivia is 19:55 < Maldivia_> it's the xxx I'm interested in`
`23:44.06`	`purl`	`okay, Thrae`
`23:44.14`	`Kirkburn1`	`:D`
`23:44.34`	`Cairenn`	`LOL`
`23:44.50`	`Kirkburn1`	`And who can blame him ...`
`23:45.11`	`Thrae`	`Yeah, everyone loves Vin Disel!`
`23:45.31`	`Kirkburn1`	`My love for Vin Diesel is strangely absent`
`23:48.38`	`Maldivia_`	`do we really dont have any druids or shammys in this channel, that's currently playing aswell :\|`
`23:48.39`	`Kirov`	`Vin Diesel was the voice of The Iron Giant`
`23:48.53`	`cladhaire`	`I'm a druid`
`23:48.57`	`cladhaire`	`whats the question?`
`23:49.18`	`Maldivia_`	`cat form, what does the tooltip read, how much AP you get from it`
`23:50.13`	`cladhaire`	`120 plus Agility`
`23:50.21`	`Maldivia_`	`ok, thank you :)`
`23:50.25`	`cladhaire`	`np`
`23:51.31`	`Tain`	`PerfectRaid.lua:445: attempt to concatenate field '?' (a nil value)`
`23:52.17`	`Thrae`	`Tain: What's on line 445?`
`23:52.24`	`Thrae`	`Might be a UnitName call`
`23:52.40`	`Tain`	`Yeah that's it`
`23:53.02`	`cladhaire`	`frames[i].Name:SetText(self.CLASSES[class]..UnitName(id).."\|r")`
`23:53.02`	`Thrae`	`Change it to (UnitName)`
`23:53.03`	`cladhaire`	`?`
`23:53.13`	`Tain`	`That's the one clad`
`23:53.17`	`cladhaire`	`Thrae: Thanks for the reminder, i'll go take a look at those.`
`23:53.52`	`Tain`	`Change who to what not?`
`23:55.02`	`Thrae`	`Hmmm that looks more like either self.CLASSES[class] was bad, or UnitName(id) was bad. With Cross BGs, the server syncing problems are getting worse, you can't rely on the text from anything never being nil.`
`23:55.11`	`Maldivia_`	`Thrae: not neccesary, only 1st return value is used in that scenario`
`23:55.26`	`cladhaire`	`it means the class wasn't available.`
`23:55.28`	`cladhaire`	`which keeps sucking.`
`23:55.33`	`Thrae`	`Maldivia_: I was just making a guess there`
`23:55.47`	`cladhaire`	`i'll put something inf or it, thanks tain`
`23:55.55`	`Tain`	`I'm not even in a bg, just normal raid`
`23:56.01`	`Maldivia_`	`hmm, I've never had problem with class not available... but I find it funny when I see rogues and warriors running around with mana in BGs :)`
`23:56.18`	`cladhaire`	`i'll default to warrior`
`23:56.28`	`cladhaire`	`Maldivia_: Its not available all the time when a raid shuffles around.`
`23:56.33`	`cladhaire`	`Maldivia_: Really frustrating.`
`23:56.50`	`Thrae`	`cladhaire: What is self.CLASSES[class]? It looks like it should return the colour, does it also return the localized class text?`
`23:56.51`	`Tain`	`I don't even want to be in this raid.`
`23:56.52`	`Maldivia_`	`cladhaire: hmm, weird - never have problems with it in my raid addon`
`23:57.18`	`cladhaire`	`Thrae: No, it just returns the color`
`23:58.20`	`Thrae`	`I usually do (ClassColors[class] or "FFFFFF") in that situation, but some people say I'm lazy`
`23:58.40`	`cladhaire`	`well it needs to be handled in some way`
`23:58.46`	`Thrae`	`Even if it's only a 1% chance of the server giving bad info, I want to avoid my mod from throwing an error`
`23:59.01`	`cladhaire`	`well yes, but its not that simple.`
`23:59.04`	`Maldivia_`	`Thrae: you'll still get the nil error`
`23:59.05`	`cladhaire`	`i agree however on the principle.`
`23:59.06`	`Tain`	`Nothing ever is.`
`23:59.28`	`Maldivia_`	`Thrae: you'd have to do ClassColors[class or "PRIEST"], or similar`
`23:59.47`	`cladhaire`	`Thrae: ClassCOlors[class] won't work because class is nil, and you can't index a table with a nil key`
`23:59.51`	`cladhaire`	`is what Maldivia_ is saying.`

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