| 00:06.23 | Amarande | hmm. if you just stay mounted above him, nothing much happens. you never even get spears or such till you actually do something, at which point you're actually In Combat and can't mount and have to play the game the way the sadist at Blizzard intended it. :| |
| 00:07.57 | Amarande | the NPC also seems to completely stop damaging him once he hits 13.65M |
| 00:08.15 | Amarande | Junk, did you do this during 5.0 or 5.1? |
| 00:08.51 | Amarande | crap, don't tell me 5.1 nerfed it and I'll never get to buy any items from their quartermaster again till I'm willing to throw away hundreds of gold learning this one-off fight. :| |
| 00:10.44 | kullervo | Amarande: what are you killing? |
| 00:11.15 | Amarande | kullervo: Zhao-Jin, final fight of the Golden Lotus exalted end chain |
| 00:11.24 | kullervo | Oh. |
| 00:11.31 | kullervo | I should do that on my paladin I guess. |
| 00:11.33 | Amarande | pretty much you seem to need to be the kind of person who plays Ninja Gaiden or Devil May Cry with skill to get this bastard down. |
| 00:11.49 | kullervo | what's the fight like? |
| 00:11.56 | Amarande | oodles of hit points and a SINGLE mistake and you're killed in one shot & he resets, of course |
| 00:12.32 | kullervo | does he melee that hard, with a special ability, or is it environment? |
| 00:12.36 | Amarande | seriously. why do so many people think that's what makes a better game, instead of having things be strategy and thought based, have it be based on twitch and being able to dexterously lay down a smack over several minutes without error :| |
| 00:12.56 | Amarande | pretty much every now and then he casts a lightning wall thing, if you land in it, it hits you for 30k about 20 times |
| 00:13.13 | kullervo | that doesn't sound hard |
| 00:13.17 | Amarande | and it's one of those "rolls over the area" moving walls of doom, so only precisely timed jumps every time do the trick |
| 00:13.20 | kullervo | what's your brawler's rank? |
| 00:13.51 | Amarande | He also has 13.7M HP, and the only thing that deals more than normal amounts of damage to him is a spear that gets dropped on the ground every now and then, you still need to do about 20 of those |
| 00:13.57 | Amarande | Still don't have one, haven't been able to win the BMAH auctions |
| 00:14.16 | Amarande | and most definitely NOT willing to drop 5000-10000g on a pass just to make sure I don't get sniped |
| 00:14.28 | kullervo | they get sold for 2k or so on my realm's AH |
| 00:14.36 | Amarande | seems to still be about 5k on ours |
| 00:14.50 | kullervo | I looted mine while farming black prince rep |
| 00:15.15 | Amarande | and I'm presuming I can never again buy any gear from the GL quartermaster until I get this guy down |
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| 00:15.27 | kullervo | hahaha |
| 00:15.31 | Amarande | seriously, this seems like a bullshit fight they put in to appeal to crazy action game kids |
| 00:15.43 | Amarande | even the people who've been known to criticise me for "conspiracy theories" or "ranting" hate this boss's guts LOL |
| 00:15.48 | kullervo | fuck you almost made me log in to do that |
| 00:16.23 | kullervo | just wasted too much time killing lk25n |
| 00:16.25 | Amarande | but yeah, what is with MoP's general focus on greatly increased twitch over Wrath and even BC or Cata? |
| 00:16.34 | kullervo | just so I can do lk25h tomorrow |
| 00:16.37 | Amarande | are they trying to balance the economy with increased frequency of repair bills? |
| 00:16.56 | kullervo | because solo things where the only difficulty is in the mob hitting hard aren't very fun |
| 00:17.00 | Amarande | or trying to appeal to action game adrenaline kiddies who won't sub unless it reminds them of a Tecmo or Capcom game? |
| 00:17.08 | kullervo | whereas instantly seeing you succeeded at something is rewarding and fun |
| 00:17.53 | Amarande | (oddly enough, if this was a raid mechanic, I probably wouldn't be nearly so grumbly about it heh) |
| 00:19.07 | Amarande | and I might need to retalent thanks to the craptastic 5.1 fix for druid mushroom exploits in arenas |
| 00:19.40 | Amarande | which has had a *much* more far-ranging effect (it affects certain quests, and also seems to affect practically everything with a reticle, like mages' rune of power) |
| 00:20.02 | Amarande | otherwise, I'd have been able to use the stand on the pillar strategy, but you still get hit every now and then there and you can't put a rune because of that stupid fix |
| 00:20.29 | Amarande | Blizz. Stop ruining the PvE game for the sake of arenas. Seriously. :| |
| 00:22.03 | Sephiroth | amazing |
| 00:22.13 | Sephiroth | another week of lfr, and no wisdoms. |
| 00:22.15 | Amarande | (basically, there are oodles of places now where you are no longer allowed to put down a reticle-based ability or item for any reason, all to prevent druids from cheaping out in arenas by putting mushrooms where melee fighters can't destroy them) |
| 00:22.59 | Amarande | it kills one of the Redridge quests, and it also means there's loads of places where us mages can't put down Rune of Power without there being any good reason for us not to be able to |
| 00:23.15 | Amarande | since all we get is "no path available" |
| 00:23.40 | Amarande | path-etic, really. :P |
| 00:25.21 | Amarande | But yeah, you know what that lightning wall reminds me of, come to think of it? |
| 00:25.31 | Amarande | Crash fucking Bandicoot. I didn't sign up for World of Bandicraft. LOL |
| 00:25.45 | Amarande | I seem to remember one of the Crash bosses worked exactly like this. :| |
| 00:27.16 | Amarande | hm. flames do damage but aren't impassible. at least if I die in Mogu'shan Palace instance with this quest active I don't have to worry heh |
| 00:27.22 | Amarande | (have to pass through quest area to reach instance portal) |
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| 00:30.57 | Amarande | I've also, FWIW, never quite understood the people who *like* super unforgiving twitch action games like Ninja Gaiden, heh |
| 00:31.14 | Amarande | It's fun to watch Let's Play videos of such games, but I can't really get into them in any way resembling "gah, I just got my ass kicked again" LOL |
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| 00:32.19 | Amarande | Now on the other hand, super unforgiving turn-based thought-based games like Shin Megami Tensei series stuff or Pools of Darkness, those I <3. :) |
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| 00:38.26 | Amarande | yay, standing on the pillar and using invocation to heal doesn't work either |
| 00:38.41 | Amarande | seriously, blizz. is this all about getting hundreds of our dailies gold back to try to pull it out of the game economy? :P |
| 00:40.55 | Amarande | WTF. |
| 00:40.57 | Amarande | Seriously? |
| 00:41.10 | Amarande | I can no longer do my weekly turn ins of lesser charms until I suck it up and spend all the gold it takes on repairs to beat this guy? |
| 00:41.13 | Amarande | WTF BLIZZARD. |
| 00:42.56 | Amarande | and I'm guessing it's 99.99% impossible to get any help at all with the quest unless by absolute stroke of luck, due to the phasing |
| 00:56.32 | Jammer | Amarande: what you talking about? :p |
| 01:00.28 | Jammer | did you try abandoning the quest? maybe it'll reset the phasing |
| 01:02.32 | Amarande | Jammer: abandoning it does no good |
| 01:02.43 | Jammer | zhao-jin wasn't that hard tho? :p |
| 01:02.45 | Amarande | once you get to the point where you can accept the quest to kill Zhao-Jin, you're basically fucked as a raider |
| 01:02.51 | Amarande | until you can manage to complete it |
| 01:03.10 | Amarande | no more coins till you do, as even the NPCs at the faction homes phase out, including the guy you turn in lesser charms to |
| 01:03.30 | Amarande | wonder if a GM would help me or just LOL at me |
| 01:04.40 | Amarande | One mistake and you die, and the few viable ways to do it take 20-30 minutes |
| 01:08.02 | Freyja | [The Wowhead Blog] 5.2 PTR - Build 16577 - Spell Changes and More - http://www.wowhead.com/news=210686/5-2-ptr-build-16577-spell-changes-and-more |
| 01:09.06 | neutronimity | erm what was the other channel again? |
| 01:09.11 | neutronimity | I accidentally left |
| 01:09.35 | Amarande | #wowuidev |
| 01:33.01 | Freyja | [The Wowhead Blog] 5.2 PTR - Build 16577 - New Reputation Rewards, Spell Changes, and More - http://www.wowhead.com/news=210686/5-2-ptr-build-16577-new-reputation-rewards-spell-changes-and-more |
| 01:33.09 | Amarande | yay, finally. |
| 01:33.17 | Amarande | still have to agree with most of the wowhead comments here |
| 01:33.22 | Amarande | which is to say, the fight was overlong and underfun |
| 01:34.05 | Amarande | particularly for an action-based RPG |
| 01:34.11 | hylje | fun is a buzzword |
| 01:38.15 | Amarande | hylje: heh. don't we play games to have fun? |
| 01:47.32 | Amarande | bah. |
| 01:47.35 | Amarande | still i469 |
| 01:47.49 | Amarande | c'mon, can't I queue with just one item level less? pretty pretty please? :D |
| 01:48.52 | hylje | gather your friends, you can go underleveled if you have your own party |
| 01:49.06 | hylje | like in the old times |
| 01:49.16 | Amarande | I guess it's better than the old times, too |
| 01:49.45 | Amarande | If it was still like the old Wrath days, to get into a PUG raid they'd be basically asking you to have i509 and link cheeve LOL |
| 01:49.57 | hylje | the lfd gear limits are meant for the generic buffoon |
| 01:50.24 | Amarande | man, I was glad when Ten Ton Hammer got hit with a ten ton hammer for being asshats (apparently, got caught stealing addons against their licence terms to post on their site) |
| 01:50.39 | Amarande | they're the company that created GearScore, which was responsible for so much wailing and gnashing of teeth in LK |
| 01:52.40 | Amarande | btw. something that also occurred to me just now. you get an achievement when you finally beat that boss |
| 01:52.54 | Amarande | does Blizzard use the percentage of people who get a given achievement as a yardstick to balance difficulty for the next expansion? |
| 01:53.15 | Amarande | like if too many people get particularly hard achievements, it means we're in for a rough one next xpac as they feel that they'll need to make it challenging for that market? |
| 01:55.07 | hylje | achievements were probably born out of statistics gathering like that |
| 01:55.26 | hylje | you can't really design stuff without response |
| 01:58.14 | Jammer | Amarande: they also have data like amount of pulls it took to get the kill |
| 01:59.00 | Amarande | hylje: I'm thinking more things like, if you stretch to manage an achievement for the points' sake |
| 01:59.09 | Amarande | and too many people do so, when it was otherwise something hard enough that they might not have tried it otherwise |
| 01:59.20 | Amarande | if then it means a higher likelihood that that level of difficulty becomes baseline next time |
| 01:59.33 | Amarande | and then you wish you hadn't all stretched for 10 achievement points :) |
| 02:03.36 | Jammer | statistical data probably isn't the only consideration for game balance and you would require thousands of players to do something in order for them to even notice |
| 02:04.42 | hylje | i hope blizzard indeed has some qualitative playtesting going on |
| 02:05.10 | Jammer | their playtesting seems really horrible at times :P |
| 02:05.39 | Jammer | or maybe they're just using the diablo3 initial balance thing... "we tested this and then tripled all values to make it harder" |
| 02:05.45 | hylje | have you played through portal developer commentary? valve's playtesters are worse |
| 02:06.01 | Amarande | heh, I've still yet to give Diablo III a try |
| 02:06.21 | Jammer | well it got nerfed to the ground so probably at suitable level for you now |
| 02:06.25 | Amarande | mind you, I might run into boss fights that make me want to pull hair like that one |
| 02:06.26 | hylje | and yeah i heard d3 inferno was something their playtesters could barely beat.. and then they doubled or tripled the numbers |
| 02:06.32 | Amarande | but ... that would probably be on inferno |
| 02:06.37 | Amarande | and inferno is supposed to be hard :) |
| 02:07.14 | Amarande | the pisser about that golden lotus boss is not only is it overlong and underfun, but once you get to that point, you MUST beat him or you're locked out of a lot of *baseline* content |
| 02:07.27 | Amarande | e.g., the ability to simply trade in your spirits or lesser charms |
| 02:07.54 | Jammer | how hard is it to jump over that wall? :P |
| 02:07.54 | Amarande | and I'd hate to even imagine the feeling of someone if they'd somehow managed to get to that point without a flying mount (not sure if it's even possible, maybe, there's one daily you'd have to skip at least) |
| 02:08.15 | Amarande | since then you wouldn't even be able to buy Pandarian flying at all until you succeeded |
| 02:08.25 | Amarande | Jammer: a single time, not at all |
| 02:08.44 | Jammer | but it's exactly the same the whole fight >< |
| 02:08.56 | Amarande | the number of times it takes to whittle the boss down, knowing that a single mistake means you have to start all over because it's a guaranteed kill (except maybe against dedicated tank types with their 800k buffed HP) |
| 02:09.11 | Amarande | that starts to make you nervous, and that in turn makes it easier to fuck up |
| 02:09.49 | Amarande | while I was doing my successful mounted run, I saw a death knight on the ground attempt it the ballsy way |
| 02:09.52 | Jammer | oh damn it... eu servers down until ~noon >< |
| 02:10.01 | Amarande | he was there for a few spear hits or so, I didn't see him come back after that |
| 02:10.04 | Amarande | I presume he gave up |
| 02:10.36 | Amarande | Jammer: not exactly, there's two different patterns, and I'm not 100% positive there's a way to tell which until they spawn |
| 02:11.19 | Amarande | hmm. at least two. I think I saw "single strafing wall", "single strafing back & forth wall", "double outward sweeping walls" and "double pincer walls" |
| 02:11.45 | Amarande | but like I said, I don't think I saw any pattern to which spawned when that would be of any help, and the jumping itself isn't very easy to control either, as I noticed if e.g. I wanted to land on top of a pillar using that method |
| 02:12.26 | Jammer | what class are you playing? |
| 02:12.29 | Amarande | mage |
| 02:13.41 | Amarande | oh, yeah. the couple of times I tried the "DPS from a pillar" strategy, one of which actually went quite far before I ran out of mana and was screwed |
| 02:13.47 | Jammer | does cauterize work there? |
| 02:13.55 | Amarande | I noticed you can't put a rune of power on top of the pillar either ... it will give you the dreaded "no path available" |
| 02:14.08 | Amarande | have never tried Cauterize, I do know that Greater Invisibility lets you drop out of battle though |
| 02:15.05 | Amarande | and from what I understand, the no path available thing (which I've also seen every now and then when trying to put down a rune during normal questing, if I'm e.g. on a rocky incline) we can blame on that usual thing that we blame random PvE screw-overs on. *sigh* |
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| 03:59.02 | Freyja | [The Wowhead Blog] 5.2 Update: You Can Keep Your Valor! - http://www.wowhead.com/news=210687/5-2-update-you-can-keep-your-valor |
| 04:00.38 | fewyn | ^ hooray |
| 04:03.12 | foomz | wow |
| 04:03.14 | foomz | thats awesome |
| 04:10.42 | Jammer | not sure if that's good thing :I |
| 04:10.50 | fewyn | why wouldn't it be? |
| 04:11.08 | Jammer | can't use it for upgrades any longer |
| 04:11.17 | Jammer | so if you don't have rep to buy new items you're just wasting it |
| 04:14.56 | Jammer | what's the optimal amount of valor to save is rather tricky question when you can't really predict your raid progress |
| 04:16.43 | Jammer | looks like you can buy amulets for 1250 valor at neutral |
| 04:17.18 | Jammer | assuming you can access the quartermaster without earning any valor guess that's the first thing you do after patch |
| 04:19.42 | Jammer | so 2nd week of patch you're at 2750 valor at start of the week... but do you have friendly rep to spend it on something else beside amulets? |
| 04:46.15 | nebula169 | its all 496, so meh |
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| 06:49.47 | Jammer | nebula169: new valor gear is 522 |
| 06:59.31 | nebula169 | from raids |
| 06:59.48 | nebula169 | like you need to run the raids to get rep for the 522 stuff |
| 07:00.36 | Jammer | one item seems to be available at neutral already |
| 07:01.20 | Jammer | also would be nice to see some figures how much rep you get per full clear |
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| 17:21.02 | Freyja | [The Wowhead Blog] News Round Up: Updated 5.2 Patch Notes, Preparing for PvP in 5.2, Blizzard Store Sale - http://www.wowhead.com/news=210652/news-round-up-updated-5-2-patch-notes-preparing-for-pvp-in-5-2-blizzard-store-sa |
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| 22:42.02 | Freyja | [The Wowhead Blog] Diablo III Database Site Revamp and Giveaway - http://www.wowhead.com/news=210713/diablo-iii-database-site-revamp-and-giveaway |
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| 22:56.06 | Jammer | good way to wipe your raid on sha of fear as priest... lifegrip your tank 1 second before breath of fear... worked perfectly... totally planned that |
| 22:56.41 | b4k4^^ | :D |
| 22:56.55 | b4k4^^ | you have won an internet :D |
| 23:00.55 | Jammer | decided to move my lifegrip from being same button as pw:s after that :P |
| 23:01.04 | b4k4^^ | :P |
| 23:01.04 | Jammer | mistake potential just too great |
| 23:01.21 | b4k4^^ | good thing I don't have macros |
| 23:01.51 | *** join/#wowhead xythian (~xythian@c-98-222-180-237.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 23:02.26 | Jammer | just too many abilities to not have some trigger from same buttons with shift/ctrl/alt etc |
| 23:03.21 | Jammer | I guess you could manage if you had one of those crazy mouse with keypads in them |
| 23:05.57 | Jammer | warrior is the worst there... got like 4 full bars of buttons |
| 23:06.03 | JunkHead | my warrior got tier helm today from lfr. |
| 23:06.13 | JunkHead | so now i have dps 4 set bonus.:) |
| 23:06.24 | JunkHead | and it replaced a blue! |
| 23:06.26 | JunkHead | :D |
| 23:06.36 | b4k4^^ | I just try to map things so that possibly dangerous (and/or rarely used) things are in non-trivial places :P |
| 23:07.01 | neutronimity | WTB divine intervention. |
| 23:07.14 | b4k4^^ | should run Terrace, finally got my priest to the chimera quest bit |
| 23:07.34 | b4k4^^ | and with luck I'll get the staff too |
| 23:08.19 | JunkHead | http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormrage/Sickman/advanced <-- despite this pic, he's quite a lovable guy |
| 23:08.33 | JunkHead | Although he hates his tanking-turned-dps shoulders.:( |
| 23:10.45 | Jammer | b4k4^^: yeah indeed but things like lifegrip need to be quick often :) |
| 23:12.08 | b4k4^^ | there's that, esp. if you're a healer |
| 23:12.23 | b4k4^^ | my priest is mainly shadow |
| 23:17.19 | Ward | when I play resto, I always put symbiosis on a shadow priest |
| 23:17.22 | Ward | for the life grip |
| 23:23.32 | JunkHead | 4 possible upgrades for me in HoF pt 1 |
| 23:23.45 | JunkHead | hmm.... |