IRC log for #utos on 20080501

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02:06.01Zelutherlo: ping
02:17.37penoundertakingyou: you need one of these http://coffincouches.com/index.php
02:23.01undertakingyoupeno: you're right, I do.
02:23.20undertakingyouMy only complaint is that they aren't actually coffins, but are in fact caskets.
02:24.24penolol
02:24.26penopicky
02:29.34undertakingyoupeno: I don't think of it as picky, but as right. :)
02:30.45penolol
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03:03.39herloZelut: pong
03:04.29fozzmoohttp://s216.photobucket.com/albums/cc174/rowdyron_album/?action=view&current=negrosfrowndi2.jpg
03:05.15herlohmmm
03:05.33*** part/#utos fozzmoo (n=fozz@166-70-238-250.ip.xmission.com)
03:06.20Zelutherlo: remind me how to 'find' for specific perms? ie; i want to check for any o+w perms.
03:06.23herlois patiently waiting for his son's mother to finish packing his clothes so we can go to the hotel
03:06.42herlofind -perm o+w
03:07.17herloor try find -perm /2
03:07.47penoherlo: that's another good example of where a shell script would be useful!
03:07.53herlowill brb
03:08.05herlopeno: how so?
03:08.26penohave a script to pack clothes!
03:09.19herlooh, that!
03:11.04herlokinda like sanding the floor?
03:11.10penoyup
03:12.35herlo:)
03:15.05sontekherlo: how much have you used revisor?
03:15.19sontekherlo: do you like it?
03:15.30sontekherlo: have you used any other imaging apps?  how do they compare?
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03:52.10herlosontek: used revisor some, it was pretty busted last time I used it.  I've not used much else except mkisofs
04:00.16herloundertakingyou: ping
04:01.28penodamn all computers to hell!
04:02.57decriptorsontek: ping
04:03.22sontekdecriptor: pong :>
04:03.51undertakingyoupeno: ????
04:03.53undertakingyouherlo: pong
04:03.58decriptorsontek: http://www.decriptor.com/ISOS/
04:04.10decriptormy first one was disconnected :(
04:04.25herloundertakingyou: hola
04:04.28penoundertakingyou: had a sata cable fail in my server. :(
04:04.38sontekhugs decriptor
04:06.53fozzmoopeno: Don't you hate SATA cables?
04:07.19fozzmooThey figured out how to make them right... but not until the market was flooded with gazillions of lame ones.
04:07.54penofozzmoo: I do, I just replaced this one once already.
04:08.01decriptorsontek: 32 is coming down and then I'm going to do kde
04:08.09herlofozzmoo: is the blog post done yet?
04:08.17fozzmooherlo: nope.
04:08.17decriptorbug report as much as possible  coolo really needs the help
04:08.22herlofozzmoo: :(
04:08.28fozzmooBut I promised I woudl do it!
04:08.34herlooh, you did?
04:08.42sontekdecriptor: we can test all day saturday :)
04:08.43herloI didn't see the promise ...
04:08.47herloyay!
04:09.06decriptorfor anyone else that wants to chip in, its the new opensuse 11 live install isos
04:09.34fozzmooherlo: You didn't get my direct response to you via Twitter?
04:09.37fozzmooweird.
04:14.05herlonope
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04:35.51fozzmoohttp://www.utos.org/2008/04/30/reminder-linux-distro-release-party-this-saturday-woo/
04:40.13fozzmooherlo: there.
04:40.22herlothanks
04:40.37fozzmoobows
04:41.18herlolooks good
04:41.21fozzmooI'm particularly proud of my "party like it's v0.99" bit. :)
04:42.13fozzmoogoes to bed.
04:42.13herlohaha
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14:04.37herlomorning
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14:57.47undertakingyouohaiyo gozaimasu
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15:57.28trixtur?infobot
15:57.45trixturmeh...worth a try
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16:29.43linuxalienhttp://gizmodo.com/385262/lenovo-parodies-macbook-air-ad-for-x300
16:29.53linuxalienI have a Mac and I have to admit I'd get the X300 over an Air
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16:44.58herloundertakingyou: would that be spanish
16:46.55penoherlo: I think it's either Japanese, or he's been sniffing the embalming fluid a little too much.
16:48.04herlopeno: haha, yeah.  Sounds like undertakingyou
16:48.17herloLittle japanese embalmer at 6'4"
17:06.57undertakingyouherlo: it is japanese and I am  6' 3"
17:07.01undertakingyouSilly herlo
17:10.10herlooh, I was close!
17:10.54herlospanish and japanese are almost the same, they both don't speak american!
17:14.25undertakingyouamerican???
17:14.32undertakingyouWhat is American??
17:14.56throckIt's what most people in the USA speak - because I sure wouldn't call it English.
17:15.04undertakingyouthe ThinkPad x300 by Lenovo is a beautiful thing.
17:15.09throckAnd American is also different from "Utahn"
17:15.41undertakingyouthrock: but that is why it is called 'American English'
17:16.23throckundertakingyou: so do we call it "Utahn English"?
17:19.24undertakingyouI think that we should
17:19.58undertakingyouLet is start the group entitled 'It's Utahn English not Ubonics.'
17:25.22mheathYes! And we can hold rallies calling for those gosh darn linguists to stop.
17:26.14undertakingyouagreed, our new channel is #utahn-english-not-ubonics
17:27.11herlolol
17:27.26undertakingyouI just called Lenovo to see if they will sell any of their laptops without an operating system.  They said no but that they would knock $100 off the price to compensate for the OEM lisence.
17:27.41undertakingyouI'm not sure I think that is cool or a copout
17:28.12undertakingyous/sure\ I/sure\ if\ I/
17:28.48herlostarts his 2nd to last lecture for the week
17:31.17undertakingyous/sure/sure if/
17:31.23undertakingyouthere we go.
17:32.42herloits cool!
17:32.47herloI'm happy
17:33.03herloundertakingyou: I've got to send my lappy in for repair of the bluetooth again
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18:00.50sontekundertakingyou: you aren't willing to get it with suse preloaded?
18:01.59undertakingyousontek: I would . . . except that SuSE sucks.
18:02.05undertakingyouSo who owns SCO?
18:02.15sontek~diaf undertakingyou
18:02.16infobotACTION covers undertakingyou in gas and drops a match.
18:02.38undertakingyou~lart sontek
18:02.38infobotslaps sontek around with a large trout
18:02.52undertakingyou~whalepoop sontek
18:02.53infobotACTION catapults a truckload of whale poop from a freakishly large killer whale named Hugh at sontek
18:02.59sontekundertakingyou: its better than the outdated, copy cat operating system you run
18:03.06sontekundertakingyou: oh, and also broken
18:03.31sontekundertakingyou: hardy destroyed half the populations laptops with their compiz crap
18:03.35undertakingyousontek: this is coming from the guy who is doing all he can to make windows into linux.
18:04.12undertakingyousontek: my laptop works fine. My only Hardy complaint is that the updater is broken and the only way to have a usable machine is to do a fresh install.
18:04.37sontekundertakingyou: we've had an influx of ubuntu converts to suse since hardy
18:04.48sontekundertakingyou: lots of peoplle aren't happy with it
18:05.27undertakingyouyeah, and I am on the fence there.
18:05.28mheathWow, thats cool. I managed to just completely break my system by...installing a font.
18:05.28undertakingyouBut, all in all, I would still do fedora over SuSE
18:05.30undertakingyouor debian
18:05.47undertakingyouOr . . . here is a shocking thought  . . . just turn off compiz
18:06.02sontekundertakingyou: Yeah, but for an LTS, that shit is way to broken
18:06.12undertakingyouok, I agree with that.
18:06.48sontekundertakingyou: and I think both Fedora and Debian are better than Ubuntu, but I forget what your complaints of suse are
18:07.38undertakingyouI wonder if ubuntu ought to do like fedora and have the newest: ubuntu the rocksolid: utnubu and the we are nearly antiquated: bntuuu
18:08.00undertakingyoususe complaint:  YaST
18:08.31trixturis anyone expert-ish at Apache that might be able to answer I question for me?
18:08.31sontekundertakingyou: But how can you hate suse for yast? Its just a tool, you aren't required to use it for anything
18:08.40sontekundertakingyou: its just there if youo want it
18:08.49undertakingyouyouo?
18:08.54sontekundertakingyou: it at least provides you a gui configuration tool for most server stuff
18:09.11sontekundertakingyou: which is more than any other distro
18:09.18undertakingyouBut I don't want a gui for server configuration.  SSH and a terminal are all that is really needed.
18:09.35sontekundertakingyou: then thats all youo use
18:09.46sontekundertakingyou: yuo can't hate a distro for giving you options :P
18:09.46undertakingyouyouo?
18:10.28trixturhates Ubuntu just for not being SuSE
18:10.31sontekundertakingyou: thats like saying youo hate mcdonalds because they have to many menu items :P
18:10.51undertakingyouI don't use SuSE as a server, I used it as a desktop.  I can hate it, zypper sucked to install stuff, search for stuff, and enable repo's so I use YaST.  Then I see that YaST sucks also.
18:10.58sontekundertakingyou: do you hate ubuntu because they provide apt-get and aptitude?
18:11.16sontekundertakingyou: I think by sucked you meant you didn't know how to use it
18:11.17undertakingyouAre you kidding sontek?  McDonalds has only 3 menu options in my mind.
18:11.35sontekundertakingyou: zypper mr --enable 1   is enable first repo
18:11.40undertakingyousontek: if it isn't intuative it must suck.
18:11.41sontekzypper se name is search for app
18:11.47sontekzypper in app is install app
18:11.53sontekwhats not intuitive about that?
18:12.04undertakingyousontek: if it isn't intuative it must suck.
18:12.14sontekyou can also spell install and search all the way out if you want to be like ubuntu and type more than you need to
18:12.34sontekundertakingyou: but wasn't intuitive?
18:12.35undertakingyousontek: I happen to like typing thank you
18:12.41sontekthose commands are straight forward to me
18:12.56herlosontek: YaST sucks and I do know how to use it
18:13.21sontekherlo: we are talkking zypper not yast
18:13.32sontekherlo: yast doesn't matter, its not required.
18:13.33herlozypper is mostly a reincarnation of rug, and its not horrible, but they need to stick to it
18:13.42sontekherlo: ROFLLLLLLLL
18:13.43herlo12:11 < sontek> undertakingyou: I think by sucked you meant you didn't know how to use it
18:13.47herlooops
18:13.58sontekherlo: reincarnation of rug?
18:14.03herlo12:10 <@undertakingyou> I don't use SuSE as a server, I used it as a desktop.  I can hate it,    pashdown   zypper sucked to install stuff, search for stuff, and enable repo's so   pelaofel~  I use YaST.  Then I see that YaST sucks also.
18:14.07sontekherlo: hpefully you aren't doing the GL SUSE classes
18:14.20sontekherlo: you are breeding uneducated fools if you are :P
18:14.21undertakingyouI did not find it helpful or intuative . . . whether they are straight forward to you or not. I tried to install gcc and kernel stuff needed to compile something, took 4 hours when using search and man pages to figure out the commands
18:14.21herloso last I checked, you were discussing YaSt
18:14.38herlosontek: I don't like teaching the GL SUSE classes
18:15.03trixturI think some people just hate user friendly interfaces sontek.
18:15.04undertakingyousontek: this isn't a blind, I hate it because it isn't ubuntu.  I don't like it because after using it I still couldn't use my system!
18:15.05sontekundertakingyou: you need to learn how to use man pages better :P   type 'man zypper' then hit /install
18:15.08herlobut maybe you can enlighten me on hte benefits of zypper over rug
18:15.14herloseeing as we only teach rug
18:15.21sontekundertakingyou: then you just do zypper install gcc
18:15.24sontekundertakingyou: and done! :)
18:15.50sontekherlo: speed, perfromance, doesn't require a daemon, better commandline usage
18:16.09herlosontek: last I heard, it still uses ZMD, they just sped it up
18:16.19herlothe commandline seems *very* similar to rug
18:16.23herloother than its longer
18:16.37herlorug == 3 chars, zypper = 6 chars
18:16.39sontekherlo: ZMD doesn't exist
18:16.42herloand yes, I know how to alias
18:16.50herlosontek: okay.  When did they get rid of it?
18:16.51undertakingyousontek: did gcc is ok because it is in the first repo, kernel headers are a different story, and zypper search kernel and zypper search linux return nothing.
18:17.13sontekherlo: rug and zypper have completely different commandline args, but zypper as all of rugs commandline args too for compatibility
18:17.18sontekherlo: 10.3
18:17.37sontekundertakingyou: if you want kernel headers you enable the source repo, just like in ubuntu
18:17.56herloalias rug='zypper' and it works then?
18:18.21sontekundertakingyou: ubuntu might have them on by default, but thats ubuntu's faut, they aren't a src distro :p
18:18.43undertakingyousrc distro?
18:18.58herlonobody wants the F8 burn I made in class.  Although about 6ppl took F9Preview and a few others took F8
18:19.06herloI just have oneleft
18:19.14undertakingyousontek: I can enable repo's my complaint there was with search, with the repo enabled search returned nothing.
18:19.31sontekherlo: alias with -r
18:19.35sontekherlo: for rug compatibility
18:21.09sontekundertakingyou: the kernel is called 'kernel-source'
18:21.18sontekundertakingyou: zypper se kernel
18:21.45undertakingyousontek: you seem to be having a hard time reading
18:21.48undertakingyoulet me repeat
18:21.51undertakingyousontek: I can enable repo's my complaint there was with search, with the repo enabled search returned nothing.
18:22.00herlosontek: oh
18:22.02undertakingyousontek: did gcc is ok because it is in the first repo, kernel headers are a different story, and zypper search kernel and zypper search linux return nothing.
18:22.03herlorly?
18:22.52sontekundertakingyou: and what i'm saying is thats impossible ;)
18:23.31undertakingyousontek: then why did it happen?
18:23.48sontekundertakingyou: and I just looked, kernel-source is actually in the main repo
18:23.55undertakingyousontek: then why did it happen?
18:23.56sontekundertakingyou: so you don't have to enable repos either
18:24.01undertakingyousontek: then why did it happen?
18:24.10sontekundertakingyou: you probably typed knerl ;)
18:24.18herlolol, probably not
18:24.25sontekundertakingyou: gotta spell properly for it to find it
18:24.28undertakingyouthis is not a 'I'm afraid of the command line' thing.  It is a 'it didn't work'.
18:24.38sontekundertakingyou: suse also provides a website to find packages in *all* repos
18:24.49sontekand a command line app called pin that will do the same
18:25.02sontekundertakingyou: it was a pebkac
18:25.28undertakingyounot a pebkac problem, not a dfu or anything else
18:25.35undertakingyouit is a SuSE sucks problem
18:26.25herlodfu?
18:26.42undertakingyoudumb <expletive of your choice> user
18:26.43herlojust wants to see undertakingyou swear :)
18:26.51herlofracking!
18:26.54sontekundertakingyou: well, I can't protect suse against incompetent users, so I'l let you think it sucks :P
18:27.11herlo~lart sontek for calling undertakingyou incompetent
18:27.11infobotblames sontek for all the evil in the world for calling undertakingyou incompetent
18:27.17undertakingyousontek: you don't have to, just try and help in not suck
18:27.34sontekundertakingyou: well, if you can come up with a complaint that wasn't pebkac, i'll help you fix it
18:27.49sontekundertakingyou: or reasons why you couldn't figure them out, i'll help document them
18:27.59undertakingyousontek: if you can come up with a better explenation I will
18:28.12sontekundertakingyou: why was zypper hard for you?
18:28.17sontekundertakingyou: what was hard about it?
18:28.30sontekundertakingyou: what was difficult about the man page? I find the man page for detailed and helpful
18:28.31undertakingyousontek: scroll up and read.
18:29.02undertakingyouI didn't say the man page was bad, I read the man page
18:29.05sontekundertakingyou: I read but there were no details
18:29.15sontekundertakingyou: you said you read the man page and still couldn't figure it out
18:29.35sontekundertakingyou: i'm wondering what about the commands 'search', 'install', and 'remove' wewre hard to understand
18:30.32sontekI'd love to know why people don't like suse so we could make it better
18:30.45sontekbut even my gf learned how to do those on her own :P
18:30.52undertakingyoulet me quote again :
18:30.54sontekand she had never used linux before
18:31.04undertakingyousontek: I can enable repo's my complaint there was with search, with the repo enabled search returned nothing.
18:31.13undertakingyousontek: did gcc is ok because it is in the first repo, kernel headers are a different story, and zypper search kernel and zypper search linux return nothing.
18:31.21undertakingyousontek: then why did it happen?
18:31.27undertakingyousontek: if you can come up with a better explenation I will
18:31.31undertakingyoutry suse
18:31.33sontekundertakingyou: and i'm saying that couldn't have happened, if you can reproduce it I'd love to see how
18:31.47sontekundertakingyou: i'm guessing you misspelled your search
18:32.08sontekand went into suse wanting to hate it, so you were were like "well, that doesns't work!'
18:32.40sontekbecause with your example of kernel, I had to do the samething because I was usisng vmware
18:32.54sontekand I installed vmware + kernel-surce the same day openSUSE 10.3 got released
18:33.01sontekso I know finding that package worked ;)
18:33.35sontekBut I can assure you, that not finding the package was pebkac and had nothing to do with suse
18:33.48sontekor zypper
18:34.41undertakingyousontek: I tried suse with high hopes at the recomendation of you and decriptor.  I did this stuff the day oter the release.  when you come up with a better explination that 'pebkac' I will try SuSE again.
18:34.55undertakingyous/oter/after/
18:39.00sontekundertakingyou: i'm sorry, I would love to come up with a better explanation for you
18:39.16sontekundertakingyou: but what you are complaining about is truly an impossibility
18:39.40sontekundertakingyou: but if you'd like to install and reproduce the bug, I'll fix it myself :)
18:39.58sontekundertakingyou: but I think if you did that, you'd have a hard time reproducing it :)
18:41.05sontekundertakingyou: You should've asked about it when you still had suse
18:41.18undertakingyou<PROTECTED>
18:41.28sontekundertakingyou: and his response?
18:41.36sontekundertakingyou: should've asked me! I'm super genius
18:41.44sontek~genius sontek
18:41.45infobotdon't worry, sontek!  You can do it!  You are a genius!
18:41.51sonteksee
18:42.11undertakingyouhe couldn't explain the search problem, but gave me the direct name of the package.  Whick I found much more helpful than being called a pebkac.
18:43.11sontekundertakingyou: I gave you the name of the package
18:44.12sontek12:22 < sontek> undertakingyou: the kernel is called 'kernel-source'
18:44.25undertakingyouwhich is very helpful now.
18:44.50sontekbut your search problem is unexplainable, if install found it, search would have
18:44.54sontekthey go off of the same db
18:45.10sontekwhich is why I call pebkac
18:45.13sontekprove me wrong!
18:45.14sontek;)
18:45.31undertakingyouand I say it did happen regardless of what is supposed to happen.
18:45.35undertakingyouprove me wrong
18:45.49sontekundertakingyou: I did prove you wrong, 'zypper se kernel' found it
18:46.12sontekundertakingyou: so did zypper se kern
18:46.15sontekand pin kern
18:46.21undertakingyouNo, you just proved that it did what was supposed to happen in that instance.  You haven't proven mine wrong.
18:46.28sontekand I'm sure I couldn't think of more complicated searches to get it too :P
18:47.21sontekundertakingyou: well, sorry you had a bad experience, suse has been on all 5 of my computers since release of 10.3 and they al have kernel-source on there and I've never seen that issue
18:47.28sontekand I have a good mix of 32bit and 64bit
18:47.39sontekI've never seen that happen
18:47.47sontekand never heard anyone say that its happened to them
18:48.12sontekso, you either have really bad luck.. ;)
18:50.10sontekBut either way, even if it was a bug,  youo found a very rare hard to reproduce bug
18:50.20sontekwhich is no reason to hate a distro
18:50.29sontekI hate ubuntu because the basics don't work :P
18:51.58penoi hate *
18:52.03undertakingyoupeno: ROFL
18:54.04throckI hate Ubuntu because the basics don't work too.  I figure out how to get them working, then 6 months later they come out with a new release and I have forgotten how I got it all to work again.  Then it's back to the forums and googling.  How dare them!
18:54.18throck</sarcasm>
19:18.11mheathO.o
19:18.37mheath/part #antiubuntu-us-ut
19:23.42YorokobiOn that note: Happy OpenBSD 4.3 Release Day, everybody!
19:25.54undertakingyouYorokobi: sorry man, you might be the only excited one there.  But come to the distro release party and promote the heck out of it.
19:27.15Yorokobiwish I could
19:27.43undertakingyouYorokobi: come on, there will be free food (on a first come first serve basis)
19:28.21Yorokobihas a scheduling conflict.
19:28.49undertakingyouis curious what could be so important.
19:29.01undertakingyouBut since you didn't disclose freely, I won't pry
19:29.23YorokobiI'm feeding the FT missionaries dutch oven cooked potatoes and ribs.
19:29.41undertakingyoubring them over.  Sontek isn't a member.
19:29.52undertakingyouThey can have chipolte and contact at the same time.
19:29.54YorokobiIn other words, I'll be cooking most of the afternoon and cleaning most of the night. :)
19:29.58Yorokobichipotle
19:30.53undertakingyouchipotle, chipolte.  I mean what you know.
19:33.17fozzmooHow do you say chipotle?
19:33.37Yorokobichee pote lay
19:34.08fozzmooNot chip-poat-ell. Okay. nThanks!
19:50.28penomm. chipotle.
20:25.02tristanbob_mmmmm
21:13.22*** join/#utos Gate (n=gate@unaffiliated/gate)
21:46.30sontekI'll join !
21:46.39sontekbut I have tattoos and i'm not giving up drinking
21:46.47sontek:D
21:46.55sonteki'll stop premarital sex and swearing though
21:47.30penosontek: you have to give up the choice in your own underwear, and no more sundays off
21:48.31sontekI have to start wearing underwear?
21:49.53penoyes
21:57.44herlosontek: but not pants
21:58.25sontekhmm
21:58.32sontekI'll have to think about this
21:58.40sontekI like being freeeeee
21:58.56sonteka nice little breeze on a spring afternoon
22:00.33herlopukes a little in his mouth
22:03.54sontekhaha
22:51.37*** join/#utos linuxalien (n=zaphod@oalug/member/linuxalien)
22:55.44decriptorping ghendricks
22:55.50decriptorghendricks: ping
22:55.58ghendricksdecriptor: hi
22:56.21decriptorI have a testopia question for you,  is there support for mantis?
22:56.56ghendricksnope, fraid not
22:56.59ghendricksBugzilla is it
22:57.03decriptorgotcha
22:57.15decriptorI wonder if there is a mantis to bugzilla migrater
22:57.18ghendrickssimply because it is a plugin to Bugzilla
22:57.26decriptoroh
22:57.30decriptorI didn't realize that
22:57.31ghendricksit is tightly coupled with the Bugzilla code
22:58.02ghendricksone of these days, when I feel ambitious, I may try to seperate it
22:58.13decriptorthat would be cool
22:59.46*** join/#utos macinturd (n=zaphod@macintard.dsl.xmission.com)

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