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| 16:46.37 | frostyfrog | Morning |
| 16:46.53 | aeryndunham | Hiya! |
| 16:49.17 | aeryndunham | wow, I haven't used an IRC client that is not weechat in a long time, this is weird |
| 16:50.30 | frostyfrog | What's your weechat setup? Did you just use the default? |
| 16:50.49 | aeryndunham | I've customised a few things |
| 16:51.18 | aeryndunham | I like it a lot |
| 16:51.38 | aeryndunham | but I'm using my boyfriend's computer and installing weechat on windows is just ugh |
| 16:51.41 | aeryndunham | too much work |
| 16:51.55 | frostyfrog | uses KvIRC, generally |
| 16:52.29 | aeryndunham | when on windows I typically go to hexchat |
| 16:53.05 | unum | http://thedailywtf.com/articles/the-billable-hour |
| 16:53.13 | unum | I'm glad I'm at a small enough company to not have to deal with that |
| 16:53.36 | unum | I always thought it was so bizzare how the university did that |
| 16:55.57 | unum | of course the whole research grant thing probably forces that sort of accounting |
| 16:56.46 | aeryndunham | I don't even understand that article |
| 17:00.13 | manithree | unum: tax codes have the same effect in many places |
| 17:02.52 | unum | manithree: how so? |
| 17:03.28 | manithree | Different types of development (research vs. itops) are differently tax advantaged. So you have to track your hours |
| 17:04.05 | unum | manithree: aaaw that's right, I forgot about that stuff. That's state level stuff right |
| 17:04.13 | unum | are there any federal tax codes like that? |
| 17:04.31 | unum | I know states try to lure companies in that way |
| 17:04.34 | manithree | Both, I think, because I've seen it in and outside Utah. |
| 17:05.01 | unum | that's obnoxious |
| 17:05.05 | manithree | hasn't owned a business for 20+ years, but has to track his hours in PeopleSoft |
| 17:05.44 | manithree | obnoxious is a very polite way to describe it |
| 17:06.11 | unum | aeryndunham: have you ever seen internal billing in a company where one department sends bills to other departments? |
| 17:06.17 | unum | or is that not the confusing part |
| 17:07.38 | aeryndunham | oh, ah, ok |
| 17:07.49 | aeryndunham | well, no, I've only really worked for one company so I haven't seen it in person |
| 17:11.15 | unum | I saw it the univeristy |
| 17:12.01 | unum | at my company we have two units that actually "make" money, everything else is over head |
| 17:12.16 | unum | we get paid to collect survey data |
| 17:12.59 | unum | so in that sort of situation companies will budget money to the units that collect surveys based off the income they bring in |
| 17:13.11 | unum | and then those unit will pay it to run the servers and computers they need |
| 17:14.06 | unum | some how the executives never seem required to submit bids for their services..... |
| 17:48.34 | unum | 30 minute phone call on a friday afternoon to go over "the next steps" for something that could have been a one paragraph email |
| 17:48.39 | unum | I'm really glad I don't work at that company |
| 17:48.59 | unum | this is for a client we deal with once a year |
| 17:50.05 | romanovic | I hate billable hours. I worked at one company where, in addition to time sheets (even for salaried employees), we had to track every hour of every day which project we were working on |
| 17:51.06 | romanovic | and of course nobody was updating project hours several times per day, so everyone spent a significant amount of time on Fridays updating their totals for the week |
| 17:51.42 | romanovic | had 1 hr blocked out every Friday just for managing project hour records |
| 17:52.07 | unum | I wrote a time card program for our other departments |
| 17:52.25 | unum | for most of our employees everything is tracked automatically and they don't have to anything extra |
| 17:52.32 | unum | but this all external billing not internal |
| 17:52.42 | unum | fortunately we don't do any internal billing |
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| 19:23.26 | aeryndunham | re-subscribing to world of warcraft was proooooobably a bad idea |
| 19:31.56 | spangborn | *definitely |
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| 19:43.07 | TodPunk | *absolutely |
| 20:23.19 | jlp_znc | romanovic: you worked for Raytheon? :-) |
| 20:23.56 | romanovic | hah, no. but almost as bad as a defense contractor, it felt like. |
| 20:24.00 | spangborn | I enjoyed billing my hours at AST in 6 minute increments |
| 20:24.06 | jlp_znc | we had to track our time in Jira for project management purposes (i.e., how much time did you spend on this story/bug/task/whatever), and then we had to track our time in Raytheon's JAMIS system so we would get paid. |
| 20:24.07 | spangborn | It was a blast /s |
| 20:24.09 | romanovic | coincidentally, our engineering director had come from Raytheon. |
| 20:24.36 | jlp_znc | our managers spent about a half day on Friday making sure all the number added up right. |
| 20:25.15 | jlp_znc | and JAMIS time codes (about 20 characters long) always seemed to expire and have to be recreated by accounting right around the time that timecards were due. |
| 20:25.26 | jlp_znc | it was a nightmare. |
| 20:25.48 | jlp_znc | at PartNET (another defense contractor) we had paper time sheets that we had to fill out every week. |
| 20:26.28 | jlp_znc | I don't miss that, I'll tell you. |
| 20:26.56 | jlp_znc | it is fairly common, though, unum, to have different sub-organizations in a large company cross bill to other deprtments. |
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| 20:32.08 | spangborn | https://i.redditmedia.com/t_uHwyzyUaJ_uRZ8eZ5EMnRcJaOhUmEKwkelmSljnfQ.jpg?w=438&s=a721f97812a48decf8c0976f84201343 |
| 20:37.33 | romanovic | loves second winter, but sees the snow rapidly melting :( |
| 20:39.13 | aeryndunham | second winter? |
| 20:39.53 | TodPunk | and Februlevensies |
| 20:41.29 | spangborn | Winter went away and came back |
| 20:41.54 | levi | aeryndunham: We get an early peek at spring around this time of year, and then plunge back into winter for a while. |
| 20:42.00 | aeryndunham | Ahh |
| 20:43.22 | aeryndunham | is binging bad TV and agonizing over a Python problem she should really be able to figure out |
| 20:43.44 | levi | Sometimes taking your mind off it is the best way to make progress. |
| 20:44.44 | aeryndunham | I got stuck on it a few days ago and have been avoiding it since |
| 20:45.20 | levi | I find that frustration and anxiety kind of narrow my thinking and make it hard to do the sort of out-of-the-box thinking necessary for solving hard problems. Makes for a nasty negative reinforcement loop. |
| 20:48.19 | aeryndunham | yeah, me too |
| 20:48.40 | aeryndunham | I get discouraged and then decide I'm too stupid to learn to program and it's just no good |
| 20:54.27 | aeryndunham | http://i.imgur.com/O8U1hZN.png - I don't think this should be confusing me |
| 20:54.32 | levi | It's just a different way of thinking that takes time to get used to. |
| 20:55.47 | levi | Ahh; that's "higher order functions" |
| 20:56.09 | jlp_znc | what's confusing? |
| 20:56.17 | levi | It's even a further different way of thinking about how programming works. |
| 20:56.32 | aeryndunham | well as far as my brain says the answer is 4 but it's not |
| 20:56.57 | jlp_znc | 2^2 == 4, 4^4 == 16 |
| 20:56.59 | levi | Why don't you explain how you think it should get to 4? We can help you find where you go wrong. |
| 20:57.22 | jlp_znc | *, not ^ |
| 20:57.22 | jlp_znc | sorry |
| 20:57.27 | jlp_znc | 2*2 == 4, 4*4 == 16 |
| 20:58.53 | levi | Clearly jlp_znc is already comfortable with the idea. |
| 20:58.56 | aeryndunham | where do you get 4 |
| 21:00.17 | jlp_znc | okay, so the mult function essentially square's it's argument, right? |
| 21:00.26 | jlp_znc | so mult(2) == 4, right? |
| 21:00.33 | aeryndunham | yeah |
| 21:00.38 | aeryndunham | that part I understand |
| 21:00.45 | jlp_znc | so what test is doing is essentially calling mult(mult(2)) |
| 21:00.50 | aeryndunham | using functions as arguments for other arguments confuses me |
| 21:01.16 | jlp_znc | think of the word "mult" as just a pointer to the function |
| 21:01.35 | jlp_znc | so you pass the word (function pointer) mult into test |
| 21:01.45 | jlp_znc | so in test, "func" == "mult" |
| 21:02.43 | aeryndunham | oh ok |
| 21:02.51 | aeryndunham | I think I might understand |
| 21:04.52 | levi | Test is kind of a meta-operation; it doesn't know what to do itself, but it expects you'll give it both an operation and data that works with that operation, and it's responsible for combining them. |
| 21:29.19 | aeryndunham | hmmm I ate some cheese and now I feel all funny |
| 21:36.44 | spangborn | Ha ha funny, or? |
| 21:37.24 | aeryndunham | like the cheese was bad. it didn't look bad. |
