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| 04:20.28 | *** topic/#utah is Utah related discussion including user groups | logs @ http://ibot.rikers.org/%23utah/ | See also ##lds | OpenWest Conference May 7-9, 2015! http://www.openwest.org/ |
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| 15:08.02 | bregalad | one of those pyramid schemes that poses as a startup across the street is hosting a ruckus at their building across the street |
| 15:10.05 | bregalad | that's one of the things that fascinates me about pyramid schemes, that they'll get people to do just about anything, like show up at the front of some ugly building in smelly Lehi at 8:30 AM and scream like they're at a rock concert |
| 15:14.39 | eightyeight | is it a pryamid scheme, or MLM |
| 15:15.42 | bregalad | which is the euphemism of the other? |
| 15:16.26 | eightyeight | they're not necessarily the same thing |
| 15:16.52 | eightyeight | EG: Avon is MLM, not a pyramid scheme |
| 15:18.36 | bregalad | doesn't make it less repugnant |
| 15:19.56 | eightyeight | i have less distaste for avon or tupperware than i do amway or mona vie |
| 15:20.41 | Jayce^ | having written the software that both avon and tupperware used for their sitebuilder for years, along with those other companies, I can't agree with that |
| 15:21.00 | Jayce^ | the crap they pull on those people... |
| 15:21.25 | bregalad | Jayce^: that makes you the facillitator :-) |
| 15:21.47 | Jayce^ | :) it was the job that brought me to Utah.. years ago |
| 15:22.06 | Jayce^ | writing the accounting software |
| 15:23.31 | eightyeight | i prefer avon an tupperware salespeople to the rest. while it's still sales, they are less pushy than say cutco or saladmaster |
| 15:23.55 | eightyeight | and they focus on selling the product, and having home demos more than signing up salespeople |
| 15:24.46 | eightyeight | regardless, pyramid schemes are illegal. MLM is not |
| 15:26.09 | bregalad | and the Bill of Rights is the highest law in the land |
| 15:26.15 | bregalad | that seems to work out ok |
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| 15:28.14 | jsmith | bregalad: I thought it was a set of amendments to the highest law in the land :-p |
| 15:28.26 | jsmith | bregalad: Just sayin'.... |
| 15:28.27 | bregalad | jsmith: yeah, whatever |
| 15:28.30 | jsmith | ducks and hides |
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| 15:57.11 | peno | Must Love Money |
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| 16:40.29 | bregalad | ~napoleon |
| 16:40.30 | infobot | Just listen to your heart. That's what I do. |
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| 17:23.20 | jlp_znc | I used to work for a seminar company. You may have heard of it, it was called "iMALL". |
| 17:23.45 | jlp_znc | We didn't sell web sites. We sold "education", teaching people how to sell web sites. |
| 17:23.53 | jlp_znc | And, oh, man, did we sell them. |
| 17:24.24 | jlp_znc | $3k a pop for the two day training (and two free web sites to sell, which you could easily sell for $1500 each and recoup your costs... sure you could). |
| 17:25.21 | bregalad | sounds like a steal |
| 17:25.33 | jlp_znc | Our guys would run an advertising blitz in an area. Radio ads, mostly, telling people to "call this number for a free seminar on how to make money with "the Internet" |
| 17:25.46 | jlp_znc | the free seminar was basically a hard sell for the training program. |
| 17:26.26 | jlp_znc | Oh, sure, we had some successful people who actually sold one or more web sites. We had over 400 customers at one point (this was the mid 90s). |
| 17:26.48 | jlp_znc | customers being actual web sites that we hosted that sold products or at least were brochure-ware |
| 17:27.07 | jlp_znc | we had thousands of "consultants" who had taken the training and never sold a thing though. |
| 17:27.25 | jlp_znc | in fact, that was our business plan... train more consultants and expect 99% of them to never sell anything. |
| 17:29.20 | jlp_znc | we made millions. |
| 17:29.29 | jlp_znc | it was crazy. |
| 17:29.52 | jlp_znc | our CEO and President were banned permanently from ever selling anything related to the Internet by the SEC. |
| 17:30.34 | jlp_znc | http://articles.latimes.com/keyword/imall-inc |
| 17:31.41 | jlp_znc | guess it was the FTC: "Former IMall President Mark Comer and former Chairman Craig R. Pickering will be barred for life from selling any Internet-related business opportunities as part of the agreement, the Federal Trade Commission said." |
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| 17:32.16 | jlp_znc | April 16, 1999. I was out of there by then (left in 98). |
| 17:32.41 | jlp_znc | I think one of the guys I worked with there now works at bluehost... Mark Horstmeier... anyone know him? |
| 17:33.14 | bregalad | is any commerce not internet related now? |
| 17:34.27 | jlp_znc | I'm sure there is a hotdog or taco vendor with a cart somewhere that doesn't use the internet. |
| 17:34.47 | Jayce^ | jlp_znc: the place I was at was the same model, and then morphed it all into the tool that the MLM's all bought |
| 17:35.02 | jlp_znc | it wasn't Plexum, was it? |
| 17:35.07 | Jayce^ | no, IDI |
| 17:35.20 | jlp_znc | I guess Plexum is the new hotness for MLMs these days. |
| 17:35.30 | jlp_znc | it's PHP based, but requires PHP 5.2 or 5.3. :-) |
| 17:35.34 | Jayce^ | jlp_znc: mark is up here, good guy |
| 17:35.53 | jlp_znc | mention my name to him and see if you get a reaction |
| 17:36.03 | jlp_znc | might want to say "jlp" |
| 17:36.37 | Jayce^ | jlp_znc: he's in internal chat, and working on the openstack stuff |
| 17:37.17 | romanovic | jlp_znc: haha. i pulled up that article, look who's selling 1gig internet in SLC? http://oi58.tinypic.com/jakirn.jpg |
| 17:37.47 | Jayce^ | romanovic: there's a couple houses they're doing that for.. |
| 17:38.12 | Jayce^ | after all, the local VIP's wanted a better connection.. so *they* got it |
| 17:38.46 | Jayce^ | was just arguing last night with people in his town that keep shouting against our local fiber provider, saying wireless is so much better |
| 17:39.07 | Jayce^ | now granted, the fiber guys have their issues, but dang digis is not a valid alternative |
| 17:39.08 | romanovic | Jayce^: utopia? |
| 17:39.13 | Jayce^ | DirectoCom |
| 17:39.22 | Jayce^ | DirectCom |
| 17:39.24 | jlp_znc | how can you think wireless is an alternative to fiber? that's crazy talk. |
| 17:39.31 | bregalad | ignorance-based aggressiveness is an unlimited resource |
| 17:39.33 | Jayce^ | jlp_znc: idiots.. |
| 17:39.40 | jlp_znc | dont' get me started on utopia |
| 17:39.55 | Jayce^ | basically, seems most people don't like them because they are also the DSL provider, and most of the old copper sucks |
| 17:40.04 | jlp_znc | still doesn't have utopia in Murray, a "tier one" city that was "built out" more than five years ago |
| 17:40.20 | Jayce^ | "Why can't I get the same bandwidth on DSL" "Why don't I pay less since I cant' get as fast of a speed" |
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| 17:45.04 | asoc | jlp_znc: What part of Murray are you in? I just went to a meeting yesterday about what they are doing to help that. Their plan is pretty good I think. They want to try to get the UTOPIA board to realize that Murray people want UTOPIA. They are starting with the people that have the connection to their house and have gotten rid of their fiber based interned subscription. |
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| 17:46.12 | fozzmoo | sees that jlp_znc got started on Utopia |
| 17:47.11 | asoc | They are hoping to show that Murray is a place that will bring profit if it is more built out. |
| 17:47.14 | fozzmoo | I had the same frustration when I had my company's office in West Valley City. We had Utopia fiber running past our office, but their coverage map showed coverage ending two units to our east and picking back up a couple units to our west. |
| 17:47.46 | asoc | fozzmoo: about 20% of Murray residents are basically in that same situation |
| 17:48.18 | romanovic | I got really excited when Herriman City announced on their FB page that they were looking to bring fiber to the city |
| 17:48.45 | fozzmoo | romanovic: Yes, one of the city councilpeople I've talked to said they've been approached by several companies about it. |
| 17:48.48 | romanovic | then I read more closely, they were "in talks" with providers to bring fiber internet service to herriman. |
| 17:49.04 | jlp_znc | asoc: I live just west of I-15 off of 5900 S. When Murray was built out, they built in all of the areas surrounding my neighborhood, but left my neighborhood out (this was in 2005). I've been pestering them every once in a while, since. |
| 17:49.19 | fozzmoo | jlp_znc: :( |
| 17:49.37 | jlp_znc | their fiber runs along the edge of my property (aerially) |
| 17:49.40 | asoc | Hey we are almost neighbors! |
| 17:50.16 | fozzmoo | It's too bad you can't fashion an induction coil to siphon access off the aerial line. :) |
| 17:50.23 | fozzmoo | I guess fiber doesn't work that way. ;-) |
| 17:50.29 | jlp_znc | yeah, fiber |
| 17:50.34 | asoc | So we are sitting in the same boat. |
| 17:50.37 | jlp_znc | I could cut the cable! |
| 17:50.42 | jlp_znc | that might get some attention |
| 17:50.58 | jlp_znc | "I'll just put a man in the middle right ... here." |
| 17:51.22 | asoc | I really think that the plan that they have put in place is really going to help. |
| 17:52.35 | jlp_znc | do you have any additional info on this plan? |
| 17:52.36 | asoc | And they seem to understand it a lot better than they did at the Macquiere meeting |
| 17:53.20 | Wegg | I had fiber in Orem a long long time ago. |
| 17:53.23 | Wegg | It wa glorious. |
| 17:56.20 | asoc | The jist of the plan is to activate the inactives who have fiber up to their house so that when UTOPIA comes back like they always do asking for people to help pay their bonds we can say look we just added X amount of revenue for you. That more than covers what would be our portion of that bond. So like we always say no we will not pay it but if you build out here we can get you even more revenue because our citizens are excited about this and we are |
| 17:57.14 | Wegg | how would they get the inactives to pay? |
| 17:57.26 | jlp_znc | get them to become active again, I guess |
| 17:57.37 | asoc | with some approximate numbers with this Murray alone could almost make up for a large chunk of the current operating defecit if they can get them reactivate. |
| 17:57.40 | asoc | Yea |
| 17:57.43 | Jayce^ | Wegg: Home Teachers |
| 17:57.54 | jlp_znc | Jayce^: LOL |
| 17:58.05 | asoc | Jayce^: that is actually what I was thinking the whole time they were explaining it. |
| 17:58.09 | Wegg | A lot of them, in my area at least. . . gave up on Utopia when it would glitch or their ISP would go bust without telling them. |
| 17:58.18 | Jayce^ | and with that, lunchtime.. |
| 17:58.19 | jlp_znc | they should have used xmission |
| 17:58.30 | Jayce^ | xmissionaries... |
| 17:58.30 | asoc | A lot of them had issues with certain ISPs |
| 17:58.40 | asoc | But most of those guys don't exist anymore |
| 17:58.41 | Wegg | which was a lot more expensive and didn't offer TV |
| 17:58.53 | jlp_znc | tv schmee vee |
| 17:58.58 | asoc | and you can now switch ISP for $35 |
| 17:59.00 | jlp_znc | you've got bandwidth! |
| 17:59.24 | Wegg | If you are going to replace Comcast. . . you have to have a way for people to watch their crappy reality TV shows. |
| 17:59.53 | Wegg | Hence. . . Comcast is all mighty. |
| 18:01.13 | asoc | Since they are already connected they can get service without having to have a contract. So they are hoping people would give it another chance. |
| 18:01.26 | asoc | That is what I understood of the plan from the meeting |
| 18:03.05 | asoc | The Mayor and city council have actually been calling and knocking on peoples doors. |
| 18:03.28 | asoc | It is almost as if the plan were straight out of Preach My Gospel/Missionary Handbook. |
| 18:04.44 | Wegg | Faith based government. |
| 18:05.04 | Wegg | Xmission just need better missionaries. |
| 18:09.49 | jlp_znc | Well, I do know that the new mayor used to be a bishop (of my sister-in-law's old ward). |
| 18:10.12 | jlp_znc | maybe he got in and discovered that, while he could get Utopia, many of his constituites could not. |
| 18:14.38 | Migs | https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10155185181900112 |
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| 18:29.05 | jlp_znc | some kids had way too much time on their hands. |
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| 18:36.24 | bregalad | eightyeight: do you know how to reorder windows, or even better, specify the ordering in the config for weechat? |
| 18:36.48 | bregalad | every time I restart it, the windows are created in a random order |
| 18:37.01 | eightyeight | do you mean physically moving the buffers? or reordering the activity nubers in the status bar? |
| 18:37.20 | bregalad | actually, it seems to be the servers are in random order |
| 18:37.34 | bregalad | I think I mean reordering the activity numbers in the status bar |
| 18:37.43 | eightyeight | well, you can use '/buffer move' to reorder the buffers |
| 18:37.44 | bregalad | I don't know if those are windows or buffers or whatever |
| 18:37.51 | bregalad | oh, missed that one |
| 18:38.22 | eightyeight | then '/layout store' and '/save' |
| 18:38.23 | bregalad | I think the problem is that weechat will append buffers as server connections are completed, which is non-deterministic |
| 18:38.32 | bregalad | nice, thanks |
| 18:38.43 | eightyeight | new buffers will always be appended |
| 18:39.11 | eightyeight | but if you have a saved layout, then it will be restored next time weechat is started |
| 18:40.09 | eightyeight | i also '/set weechat.look.hotlist_sort number_asc' |
| 18:40.40 | eightyeight | the default value of 'group_time_asc' is just... weird |
| 18:41.22 | bregalad | yes, I've found many of weechat's defaults to be vexing |
| 18:41.35 | bregalad | but at least they are things that are configurable |
| 18:41.45 | eightyeight | i <3 its modularity |
| 18:41.55 | eightyeight | it's extremely flexible in that regard |
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| 19:54.55 | bregalad | https://github.com/blog/1981-large-scale-ddos-attack-on-github-com |
| 19:55.13 | bregalad | 'specific class of content' == 'junky javascript frameworks'? |
| 19:55.17 | bregalad | :-) |
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| 20:53.58 | manithree | specific class of content is probably https://github.com/letsgetrandy/DICSS |
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| 22:01.21 | levi | I'm using weechat now too. |
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| 22:02.08 | bregalad | the main thing I like about weechat is that I can autohide and show joins and quits |
| 22:02.20 | bregalad | and the nick sidebar is builtin, not some buggy plugin |
| 22:11.04 | levi | Indeed, those are very nice. |
| 22:11.37 | levi | I have the join/quit thing on the automatic filtering mode, which shows relevant joins/quits but not the bulk of them. |
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