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| 01:19.28 | countzer | Hello |
| 01:19.33 | countzer | everybody in utah :D |
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| 01:39.12 | shalkie | Hell... O... They seem to do that. :-( |
| 01:39.21 | shalkie | Greetings and Salutations mister jalbretsen |
| 01:40.07 | jalbretsen | howdy shalkie |
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| 05:20.52 | bonez2046 | I bought a new video card and just am trying to install it...on another machine. When I plug in the new card, and attach video cable.and boot up, I get nothing, no post from bios.. if I remove said card, plug cable into mobo video, then it boots up...Why does this happen? |
| 05:27.52 | mindjujuH | card not fully seated in the slot? |
| 05:27.59 | mindjujuH | bad card? |
| 05:29.15 | bonez2046 | I just bought it.... |
| 05:29.25 | bonez2046 | and I did make sure it's fully seated.. |
| 05:30.05 | bonez2046 | I went into the BIOS and swtched off the onboard vga |
| 05:30.17 | bonez2046 | thinking that was interferring |
| 05:30.22 | bonez2046 | to no avail |
| 05:32.15 | bonez2046 | any other ideas, mindjujuH ? |
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| 06:32.38 | bonez2046 | mindjujuH: still on? here's another question. I notice the fan, on the video card is not blowing, i.e., no power is getting to the card |
| 06:33.02 | bonez2046 | but why would having the card plugged into its slot, prevent the mobo video from working too? |
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| 10:16.00 | programmerq | was really hoping to have been able to leave work by now. |
| 11:49.45 | programmerq | woo hoo! |
| 11:49.47 | programmerq | can go home! |
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| 14:53.50 | pashdown | http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/shuzq/iama_isp_owner_who_is_running_for_the_us_senate/ |
| 14:54.11 | pashdown | upboats pleze |
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| 15:00.29 | goozbach | upboated |
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| 15:45.16 | fadein | Good luck, Pete! |
| 15:45.39 | tedp | too bad i can't vote anywhere that counts, but i [up]voted on reddit. |
| 15:45.49 | tedp | very intersting AMA thread! |
| 15:50.24 | Migs | upvoted |
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| 16:16.15 | Sargun_Screen | You guys still like him, even after this: http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/shuzq/iama_isp_owner_who_is_running_for_the_us_senate/c4e5gw3 |
| 16:17.13 | tedp | Sargun_Screen: after paragraph 2 here, yes. http://peteashdown.org/issues/guns/ |
| 16:17.49 | Migs | lol, who's this Master2u clown? |
| 16:18.28 | Sargun_Screen | I agree with him |
| 16:18.35 | fozzmoo | I'm not a one-issue guy. pashdown is completely wrong on that. Govt shouldn't criminalize and regulate objects, but behavior. The second amendment guarantees we can arm ourselves. It doesn't say "arm yourself with most safe weapons." |
| 16:19.22 | fozzmoo | s/most/mostly/ |
| 16:19.30 | tedp | sweet. i'm off to buy a cruise missile on credit then! |
| 16:19.31 | Migs | fozzmoo++ |
| 16:20.05 | tedp | "i'm not a one-issue guy"++ |
| 16:20.47 | Sargun_Screen | fozzmoo: yes, but most people are fuckking stupid. |
| 16:21.07 | fozzmoo | If you read books like Unintended Consequences by John Ross, you find out that Gun Control in the 20th century has been largely a power grab by the federal govt. There was no gun control whatsoever until prohibition was repealed and the Treasury Dept had all these agents that had been employed prosecuting speakeasies and moonshiners and now they had nothing to do... |
| 16:21.08 | Sargun_Screen | err, pretty. |
| 16:21.39 | Sargun_Screen | fozzmoo: You wouldn't open, and legalize the production and trade of cannabis, MDMA, etc... Would you? |
| 16:22.03 | Sargun_Screen | What about highly refined Uranium 235? |
| 16:22.04 | fozzmoo | So, the first National Firearms Act of 1934 was passed as a ridiculous revenue bill (that never had a chance in hell of generating revenue for the govt) |
| 16:22.44 | fozzmoo | It was intended for one purpose: to keep those Treasury agents employed. |
| 16:23.31 | fozzmoo | Sargun_Screen: If you know me, you know I'm not a fan of war on drugs. |
| 16:23.54 | fozzmoo | I think you can make a case for radioactive elements. :) |
| 16:24.06 | fozzmoo | They're a danger regardless of behavior. :) |
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| 16:26.23 | Sargun_Screen | How are radioactive isotopes any more dangerous than a firearm |
| 16:27.17 | Sargun_Screen | (Most, not highly enriched uranium, or similar) |
| 16:27.20 | neybar | ultimately don't we have rules, laws etc in place for dealing with murders, thieves and so on. Owning a gun or even a cruise missle isn't the problem. Using it to kill some one is (assuming it isn't for self-defense) |
| 16:27.23 | Sargun_Screen | like, think cesium 237? |
| 16:27.31 | Sargun_Screen | neybar: Not true. |
| 16:27.56 | neybar | which part? I'm fairly certian it is against the law to murder someone. |
| 16:28.00 | Sargun_Screen | 137 |
| 16:29.24 | Sargun_Screen | neybar: The fact that certain things are not allowed to be owned. |
| 16:30.28 | neybar | I didn't say it was legal (in our current system) to have a cruise missle. I'm just saying if it was the act of ownership isn't the problem. It's the usage. |
| 16:31.00 | JoshH | heh, this channel has the weirdest debates |
| 16:31.08 | errstr | heh |
| 16:31.16 | Sargun_Screen | I want a cruise missile. |
| 16:31.22 | neybar | err I'm saying *that* the act of ownership. I got distracted mid sentence there... |
| 16:31.32 | Sargun_Screen | You know, they have some of the most advanced guidance systems on the face of the planet? |
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| 16:32.42 | errstr | it's not the act of owning slaves, it's just if you make them do hard labor. |
| 16:32.48 | errstr | right? |
| 16:32.50 | Sargun_Screen | 3.6 |
| 16:33.07 | Sargun_Screen | Er, clarify |
| 16:33.21 | neybar | ok, but humans and machines are just a little different wouldn't you say? I have a computer, and I force it to do hard labor all the time. |
| 16:33.31 | neybar | I'm totally all for putting machines into slavery |
| 16:33.35 | errstr | heh |
| 16:33.58 | errstr | i'm saying that even ownership of something can cross a line. |
| 16:34.18 | Sargun_Screen | uhh |
| 16:41.02 | fozzmoo | ~language Sargun_Screen |
| 16:41.02 | ibot | ACTION grabs Sargun_Screen by the ear and washes Sargun_Screen's mouth out with soap |
| 16:47.42 | fozzmoo | errstr: Okay, let's say you're right - that the government is in the right to criminalize ownership of certain objects. Should that apply to a class of objects specifically protected by the Bill Of Rights? |
| 16:50.27 | errstr | i think that's a false assumption. WMDs didn't exist when the Bill of Rights was written. I'm not arguing against gun ownership, but I am arguing for some common sense. |
| 16:53.13 | fozzmoo | Case in point, when the NFA(1934) was first prosecuted, it went to a Federal court. The judge quickly dismissed the case (US vs Miller, 1938) saying the statute was unconstitutional, plain and clear. The govt appealed and it went to the Supreme Court. What happened there is interesting. Consider this from Wikipedia: The District Court ruling was overturned on a direct appeal to the United States Supreme Court (see United States v. Miller). No brief was filed on b |
| 16:53.13 | mrpull | http://memegenerator.net/instance/18973830 |
| 16:53.27 | mrpull | Stephen beat me to it |
| 16:53.43 | fozzmoo | mrpull: Heh. |
| 16:57.30 | errstr | I think that it's silly that it has to be such a black-and-white thing. Why can't we have some guns that aren't regulated and others that are? What is so wrong with drawing a line? |
| 16:57.59 | errstr | Slipper Slope arguments need not apply |
| 16:58.04 | errstr | Slippery, too |
| 16:58.21 | fozzmoo | If I'm a gun enthusiast and I like shooting fully-automatic guns and can do so safely, why shouldn't I be able to? |
| 16:58.37 | errstr | Why can't that fully-automatic gun be regulated? |
| 16:59.00 | errstr | Does it stop you from shooting it if you pass certain requirements? |
| 16:59.30 | fozzmoo | If you really want to study the ridiculousness of gun laws, find out the facts behind "Ruby Ridge" incident in Idaho, 1992. |
| 17:00.14 | fozzmoo | Most people think it was about some white separatists not paying their taxes or something, if they know anything about it at all. Hardly anyone knows it was about a shotgun that was allegedly too short according to the NFA. |
| 17:00.35 | fozzmoo | A bunch of people died over that 3/8 of a inch or something like that. |
| 17:01.05 | errstr | I don't see anything wrong with making sure that certain people, like convicted criminals and the mentally unstable don't own automatic guns. Seriously, what is wrong with that? Why does it have to be all or nothing? |
| 17:01.10 | fozzmoo | Our form of government was established so that the citizens could self-regulate. |
| 17:01.26 | fozzmoo | I think a strong case could be made for situations like that, errstr. |
| 17:02.05 | fozzmoo | But me, I've got no criminal record, no (documented) mental issues. Why can't I own an M4? |
| 17:02.13 | errstr | That's not what "gun enthusiasts" say, though. That's all I'm saying. There *is* a line to be drawn and no one but the government (who we elect) can draw that line. |
| 17:02.36 | fozzmoo | Then I guess I'm just a shade grayer than your black/white gun nut. |
| 17:03.31 | JoshH | fozzmoo: ruby ridge is an example of a lot of things gone wrong |
| 17:03.45 | fozzmoo | Yeah, almost all of them by the government. |
| 17:04.05 | JoshH | well, if you just by the numbers |
| 17:04.59 | JoshH | a big part of the problem is how we have a "war" on everything, and how police are so militarized |
| 17:05.06 | errstr | There are certain responsibilities that a citizen has to other citizens, that includes not killing others. If the person who is applying for an M4 can meet requirements and pass safety tests and only use the gun in regulated areas (all things we do for driving a car), then I don't see a problem. |
| 17:05.09 | JoshH | same kind of thing with the guy in ogden with the weed |
| 17:05.18 | fozzmoo | JoshH: Yep. Agreed! |
| 17:05.34 | fozzmoo | "But, the police are heroes. They protect us!" |
| 17:06.07 | errstr | But, if we don't fight against drugs what is stopping me from becoming an addict? |
| 17:06.11 | fozzmoo | I'm sorry that guy died, but he died as a result of incompetence and stupid management. |
| 17:06.15 | JoshH | we just need less things to be illegal |
| 17:06.20 | JoshH | and cops to be more old fashioned |
| 17:06.23 | errstr | JoshH: agreed |
| 17:06.43 | shalkie | errstr: Are you an alcoholic? |
| 17:06.45 | neybar | while I have my personal views on actual drug usage, I think that the war on drugs is completely out of line. |
| 17:06.45 | JoshH | personally i don't care if fozzmoo has a full auto, as long as he only shoots it in safe areas |
| 17:06.52 | errstr | shalkie: it was a joke |
| 17:07.09 | JoshH | i don't think he should be able to pack it around loaded on campus |
| 17:07.20 | shalkie | Oh. Hmm... Guess I missed the sarcasm tag... |
| 17:07.26 | fozzmoo | On a somewhat-related note, the city of Herriman is exploring development options for a shooting range on the south of the city. |
| 17:07.31 | JoshH | not because he's then able to use it if he gets pissed off, but because it would make people panic |
| 17:08.09 | neybar | but aren't there public nuisance laws in place to take care of that? |
| 17:08.13 | errstr | Honestly, we should have shoulder mounted rocket launcher firing ranges. I would totally do that. <-- not sarcastic |
| 17:08.14 | fozzmoo | JoshH: I think he shouldn't be prevented from doing so. |
| 17:08.37 | JoshH | errstr: indeed. also, you can of course shoot full autos at certain gun ranges |
| 17:08.43 | JoshH | vegas and salt lake both have billboards for them |
| 17:08.53 | fozzmoo | But, like neybar said, if you're walking around with a "scary looking gun," you could be a "nuisance." |
| 17:09.02 | JoshH | and there are other cases where having an older full auto is legal |
| 17:09.29 | fozzmoo | People can own fully automatic weapons, but it's a paperwork nightmare, and it's expensive. |
| 17:09.30 | JoshH | fozzmoo: i can picture a concealed holder seeing someone walk into teh library with a rifle and trying to take him out |
| 17:09.42 | JoshH | we can't just pretend we live in tombstone |
| 17:09.58 | fozzmoo | Oh, like a preemptive strike? :) |
| 17:10.28 | JoshH | sure |
| 17:10.39 | JoshH | then if he misses, the other guy shoots back to defend himself, etc |
| 17:10.47 | fozzmoo | Concealed permit carriers usually learn quite a bit about when it's legal to open fire on someone. You have to be in a situation where there's a legal threat to your life. |
| 17:10.57 | fozzmoo | You can't just open fire on someone because they look dangerous. |
| 17:10.57 | neybar | assuming the CC guy did shot the rifle carrying person, and no actual threat was there, then he goes to jail for 1st degree murder right? |
| 17:10.59 | JoshH | usually is the key word |
| 17:11.10 | JoshH | there have been several incidents of concealed holders screwing up in utah in the past few yeras |
| 17:11.35 | fozzmoo | What about the 85 million gun owners that didn't make the news? :) |
| 17:11.40 | Jayce^ | funny how 'well-regulated' today means something so different from what it was 200 yrs ago.. |
| 17:12.04 | JoshH | fozzmoo: that's how they should all be |
| 17:12.06 | Jayce^ | by the old terms, it means they should still be helping us with ammo and training... like Switzerland |
| 17:12.47 | Jayce^ | now we see it as a means to handcuff |
| 17:12.57 | fozzmoo | Not a whole lot of crime in Switzerland, is there, Jayce^? |
| 17:13.56 | JoshH | i'll make a deal |
| 17:14.24 | Jayce^ | of course, according to the state constitution, we should have training and resources provided as well |
| 17:14.54 | unum | Jayce^: it's called the national guard |
| 17:15.06 | fozzmoo | Jayce^: Speaking of resources, I met some guys at the gun show this last Saturday from the Price range. |
| 17:15.10 | unum | they really changed how it used to work, but technically it's the militia |
| 17:15.18 | Jayce^ | unum: no, actually they are different, only since old FDR have we tried switching that |
| 17:15.45 | Jayce^ | fozzmoo: nice guys, talked with them several times |
| 17:15.58 | Jayce^ | it's a great range, just so far away |
| 17:16.06 | fozzmoo | Yeah. Told them what Herriman is doing. They, of course, said to come check out their facilities for research. |
| 17:16.26 | Jayce^ | only place you can do measure 1k yd in the state |
| 17:16.30 | errstr | opinion poll: What is the best shooting range in SLC? |
| 17:16.41 | fozzmoo | I'm heading that way in the next couple of weeks. Might stop by. |
| 17:16.52 | neybar | errstr: for what kind of shooting? |
| 17:16.53 | fozzmoo | errstr: I've heard lots about Lee Kay, but I haven't personally been there. |
| 17:17.09 | fozzmoo | Yeah- Lee Kay is mostly for rifles and shotguns, if I understand correctly. |
| 17:17.09 | errstr | handgun type stuff, nothing big |
| 17:17.31 | errstr | googles Lee Kay |
| 17:17.32 | neybar | If you want to do shotgun it is hard to beat Lee Kay, they have a trap range, skeet range, plus several rifle/pistol ranges at varying distances. |
| 17:17.37 | JoshH | holladay was nice but i haven't been in a while, not evne sure if it's still there |
| 17:17.54 | fozzmoo | http://utahshootingsports.com/leekay.htm <-- Site looks like it was made in 1997 |
| 17:18.08 | errstr | yeah, wow |
| 17:18.14 | errstr | nice that its outside, though. |
| 17:18.36 | errstr | someone told me Get Sum Guns (sp?) was a good indoor one |
| 17:18.52 | Jayce^ | I have a friend that does a bunch in NSLC, not sure which place though |
| 17:19.05 | neybar | for handgun I went mainly to Get Some Guns and Ammo. But mainly because it was close to where I was living at the time |
| 17:19.23 | errstr | oh, they spell it correctly. I was thinking it was "Git' Sum" but it is "Get Some" |
| 17:19.28 | fozzmoo | Impact has an indoor range up in Ogden. Not sure if they have one at their other store in Kearns. |
| 17:19.39 | Jayce^ | I've always been kinda annoyed by that store.. |
| 17:19.51 | neybar | Impact or Get Some? |
| 17:19.57 | Jayce^ | get some |
| 17:20.11 | neybar | yeah, they have a nice range, I just really don't like their sales people. |
| 17:20.22 | errstr | it's much less expensive than I thought it would be. |
| 17:20.48 | errstr | really would like a rocket launcher range, though |
| 17:21.05 | neybar | I'd like to try that at least once. |
| 17:21.12 | errstr | like sky diving |
| 17:21.21 | JoshH | just play fps's |
| 17:21.25 | neybar | too bad explosive targes are illegal in utah now (at least on public lands) |
| 17:21.26 | JoshH | they're realistic |
| 17:21.42 | errstr | imagines a real-life rocket jumping range |
| 17:22.09 | neybar | heh, I'd just blow my feet off. I never could get the hang of rocket jumping in Quake. |
| 17:22.41 | fozzmoo | hee. |
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| 19:46.45 | supernovia | mindjuju: we're needing a little more access to do some stuff for the schedule display |
| 19:46.58 | supernovia | to be able to create files for example |
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| 22:35.34 | fozzmoo | http://is.gd/PCdP5b |
| 22:46.49 | manithree | I've eaten horse. I can never run for office. |
| 22:48.41 | eightyeight | what's so bad about eating dog meat? |
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| 22:52.21 | fozzmoo | Nothing. What's wrong with your wife being a stay-at-home-mom? Nothing. |
| 22:53.29 | JoshH | she should be out making money! |
| 23:06.05 | fozzmoo | Well, instead, she was out spending money. |
| 23:09.23 | JoshH | heh |
| 23:16.32 | shalkie | I am glad that someone finally read his book and found that gem! |
| 23:17.53 | shalkie | I understand that South Korea has an entire industry that raises canines for food. |
| 23:23.00 | shalkie | The gem comment was sarcastic. |
| 23:26.42 | *** join/#utah tr-808 (brambles@unaffiliated/contempt) |
| 23:26.46 | *** part/#utah manithree (~blr@li4-76.members.linode.com) |
| 23:58.26 | *** join/#utah jessie (~jessie@97-117-97-252.slkc.qwest.net) |