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| 01:01.37 | maquis | Anyone here know anything about turnips? |
| 01:01.53 | maquis | Google isn't being very helpful |
| 01:02.18 | mheath | thats an odd request. |
| 01:02.54 | maquis | I know, but Im trying to make dinner and this was the first place I figured I might find an answer... |
| 01:03.34 | jsmith | loves mashed turnips with a bit of salt and butter |
| 01:03.55 | maquis | I just need to know whether is normal for turnips to have holes inside, or if that means it's gone bad |
| 01:04.30 | maquis | jsmith: do you know? |
| 01:04.52 | jsmith | maquis: I've never seen them with holes inside, but usually I haven't been the one to cook them |
| 01:06.24 | maquis | Hmmm... maybe I should just use the one turnip, then? Recipe calls for two, and one didn't have holes... and I've never had a turnip before, aio really know nothing... |
| 01:06.41 | jsmith | I'd just use the one |
| 01:07.34 | maquis | Ok... thanks! |
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| 01:09.33 | maquis- | Bah... stupid phone |
| 01:12.51 | cedwards | does anyone here use DNS Made Easy? |
| 01:13.28 | cedwards | I'm looking for a better anycast DNS solution. |
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| 04:02.20 | eightyeight | zachwily: broken client? |
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| 05:51.35 | Sargun_Screen | Hey. |
| 05:51.42 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: DNS MAde easy is fucking terrible. |
| 05:51.45 | Sargun_Screen | Stay away from them. |
| 05:51.55 | Sargun_Screen | Their web interface is straight out of 1993. |
| 05:52.02 | Sargun_Screen | It makes you want to herp-derp. |
| 05:52.28 | Sargun_Screen | Dynect is what I would reccomend. |
| 06:00.21 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: good to know |
| 06:01.10 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: what kinda biz are you in |
| 06:01.20 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: what kinda transaction amounts to you have? |
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| 15:07.25 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: we do online marketing and have considerable amounts of traffic where speed is critical. |
| 15:07.58 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: I know we need an IP Anycast DNS provider. We're looking at UltraDNS or DNS Made Easy or.. whatever else someone might suggest. |
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| 15:11.19 | macnewbold | cedwards: if Dyn offers the service you need, they'll probably be less than half the cost of UltraDNS for a similar thing. |
| 15:11.36 | cedwards | macnewbold: yeah. ultra is expensive. |
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| 15:51.10 | cedwards | can't see if dyn does bgp anycast or not. that's probably the best solution in the end. |
| 15:55.55 | JoshH | it's probably not something they would say on their main site, you might need to ask their sales. |
| 15:56.17 | cedwards | ultradns lists it |
| 15:57.06 | JoshH | ya, i see that now |
| 16:00.40 | JoshH | is that a requirement some manager came up with? |
| 16:00.56 | JoshH | most probably use that, as it's a pretty common way to spread things around datacenters |
| 16:01.22 | JoshH | or even for redundancy in the same one |
| 16:02.15 | JoshH | i'm pretty sure dyndns does, fwiw |
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| 16:19.24 | RyanE | Question for #utah: What's the best Android phone out there on Verizon or AT&T? |
| 16:21.13 | TimRiker | "best" for me is one that cyanogen supports. see their list of supported phones. |
| 16:21.33 | TimRiker | http://www.cyanogenmod.com/devices |
| 16:21.50 | goozbach | RyanE: that is my answer as well |
| 16:22.11 | JoshH | i think the newest version of the galaxy is supposed to be nice |
| 16:22.17 | goozbach | Im seriously thinking about going with a samsung phone from here on out because they actually sent some to the CM developers |
| 16:22.28 | goozbach | and *THAT* is how you should treat the mod community |
| 16:22.41 | TimRiker | agrees |
| 16:25.24 | goozbach | TimRiker: what's the story with your phone? |
| 16:29.03 | TimRiker | Once upon a time I built a phone and got it approved by Verizon. They didn't produce it. We all lived sadly ever after. The end. |
| 16:29.33 | goozbach | what a sad story |
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| 16:38.25 | jalbretsen | http://comicalconcept.com/illustrations/make-it-tso |
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| 18:10.11 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: UltraDNS is a bit expensive. |
| 18:10.25 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: I would look at Dynect or dns.com |
| 18:10.29 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: it is. we ended up going with dns made easy, and i agree with you about the interface. |
| 18:10.32 | Sargun_Screen | DNS.com is reengineering their infrastructure. |
| 18:10.48 | Sargun_Screen | dynect does BGP anycast, and they're expanding their infrastructure hugely. |
| 18:11.01 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: management made a financial comparison and decided dns made easy was the best next-step. |
| 18:11.17 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: It's like $100/mo for DME, right? |
| 18:12.03 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: $60/m for 10M queries, but we're doing quite a bit more than that. |
| 18:12.04 | cedwards | https://www.dnsmadeeasy.com/enterprisedns/pricing.html |
| 18:13.35 | cedwards | but we need to monitor it to see how many queries we're already doing. we're not quite sure. |
| 18:14.09 | jsmith | Amazon Route 53, perhaps? |
| 18:14.16 | jsmith | throws out random ideas |
| 18:14.43 | cedwards | we looked at that as well. we don't want to put too many eggs in amazons basket (our entire infrastructure is already there) |
| 18:14.57 | Sargun_Screen | jsmith: For most enterprises Route53 doesn't make sense |
| 18:15.11 | Sargun_Screen | It's A) Too expensive |
| 18:15.15 | jsmith | Sargun_Screen: I realize that -- just throwing out ideas in case cedwards hadn't considered it |
| 18:15.22 | Sargun_Screen | B) Not very powerful |
| 18:15.38 | cedwards | the one thing Route 53 does give us is the ability to assign A records to load balancers. |
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| 18:15.40 | Sargun_Screen | C) Not a very good interface for people. |
| 18:15.50 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: Uh? Isn't that fairly normal? |
| 18:15.52 | cedwards | currently it's limited to CNAMEs, which kind of sucks for that one additional lookup. |
| 18:16.08 | Sargun_Screen | Oh, Amazon ELB? |
| 18:16.12 | cedwards | right. |
| 18:16.19 | cedwards | amazon load balancers require CNAMEs. |
| 18:16.20 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: DNS is fast enough if you have good edge servers |
| 18:16.27 | Sargun_Screen | So, having a CNAME doesn't suck |
| 18:16.47 | cedwards | so, teh next step is to move off of ELB and use our own HAProxy (or similar) |
| 18:17.10 | jsmith | cedwards: And setup your own DNS infra, obviously :-p |
| 18:18.02 | cedwards | jsmith: i have been running in-house DNS but without the edge-servers / ip anycast it hasn't been responsive enough. |
| 18:19.25 | jsmith | cedwards: Makes sense |
| 18:20.45 | cedwards | jsmith: we went from Godaddy (gross!) to east/west coast DNS servers.. and now to ip anycast |
| 18:20.51 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: That's so ghetto. |
| 18:20.58 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: I feel for you |
| 18:21.13 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: stick with ELB |
| 18:21.21 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: i've been at this company about two months. it's been a mess. |
| 18:21.46 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: Are you a infrastructure "fixer" |
| 18:21.54 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: why the ELB vs running our own load balancer? we're hoping for improved management, stats and the A record ability. |
| 18:22.07 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: I'm the first admin they've ever had since.. ever. |
| 18:22.24 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: the devs have historically set things up. i'm sure you can guess how that could go. |
| 18:22.33 | cedwards | grumbles something about a big house of cards. |
| 18:23.26 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: because internally, if you run one LB instance, and it becomes degraded, failover becomes an issue |
| 18:25.52 | Sargun_Screen | s/LB/haproxy/ |
| 18:26.00 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: Honestly, outsource your load balancing |
| 18:27.44 | Sargun_Screen | Akamai comes to mind |
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| 18:30.57 | cedwards | we outsource most so far.. not everything |
| 18:34.22 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: I've done quite a bit of investigation on this, and for low-latency, 99.9% environments (not 5-nines), that operate accross a known georegion - There are quite a few options |
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| 18:45.14 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: IF you want to have a formal conversation, feel free to directly phone, or IM me |
| 18:46.09 | cedwards | Sargun_Screen: are you referring to CDN options? |
| 18:46.16 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: Kind of. |
| 18:47.04 | goozbach | cedwards: DNS speed is your bottleneck? |
| 18:47.37 | goozbach | what is the application which makes that the case? |
| 18:47.37 | cedwards | goozbach: one of many right now. |
| 18:49.01 | cedwards | we need faster DNS. we need fewer calls from clients to our resources and we need to distribute content across CDN(s). |
| 18:49.38 | cedwards | if we're lucky this company won't crumble under its own weight as it's growing too fast. |
| 18:50.00 | cedwards | the problem is everyone is too afraid to make any big decisions in fear that the whole thing'll come crumbling down. |
| 18:50.13 | cedwards | but there comes a point where, if those decisions aren't made, the whole thing will collapse. |
| 18:50.32 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: If you don't mind saying, what are the revenue numbers like? |
| 18:51.25 | goozbach | and if you're growing that fast you really should call F5 and get their GSM? |
| 18:51.38 | goozbach | it's a DNS/LB/Cross-Site solution |
| 18:51.40 | goozbach | GT< |
| 18:51.42 | goozbach | GTM |
| 18:51.47 | goozbach | global traffic manager IIRC |
| 18:51.57 | JoshH | so it's a management issue? |
| 18:52.10 | cedwards | it's a freakin' everything issue around here. |
| 18:52.40 | peno | +1 for F5 |
| 18:52.56 | goozbach | cedwards: f5, then spend one month learning the tool |
| 18:52.58 | JoshH | just do the changes and say you made the decision |
| 18:53.06 | goozbach | never have a headache about it again |
| 18:53.17 | goozbach | http://www.f5.com/solutions/availability/global-load-balancing/ |
| 18:53.18 | brac | [Global Load Balancing Solutions | Solutions | F5 Networks] |
| 18:53.57 | cedwards | hah! if i make any changes without near company-wide communication they lose their shit over it. |
| 18:54.22 | JoshH | "what, didn't you guys get that email i sent last night about it?" |
| 18:54.41 | goozbach | micromanagement |
| 18:54.43 | goozbach | ? |
| 18:54.46 | goozbach | what's your role? |
| 18:54.48 | goozbach | CTO |
| 18:54.52 | goozbach | CIO? |
| 18:54.58 | goozbach | "tech guy" |
| 18:55.00 | goozbach | ? |
| 18:55.08 | goozbach | BOFH? |
| 18:55.23 | cedwards | I migrated DNS from godaddy to internal, which they wanted and i communicated to the team (except for the VP of finance?!) and he constantly uses it against me. |
| 18:55.53 | Sargun_Screen | goozbach: Yea, I just IMed patrick gilmore about it, and he said GTM with TCP Proxying is what cedwards is looking for. |
| 18:56.18 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards, I can put you in touch with Patrick and his team if you'd like |
| 18:56.26 | JoshH | the akamai guy? |
| 18:56.26 | cedwards | "you did a poor job of communicating previous changes to the company, and it affects everyone. i'm reluctant about future changes.." |
| 18:56.52 | cedwards | tbh, i may jump ship before long.. we'll see. |
| 18:56.58 | JoshH | i would asap |
| 18:57.00 | Sargun_Screen | JoshH: Yes, he's just like the Chief Network Architect there...nothing big |
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| 19:08.47 | goozbach | Sargun_Screen: you work at F5? |
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| 20:02.00 | solomojo | yes |
| 20:02.19 | solomojo | some people still play minecraft |
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| 20:03.23 | rsimpkins | cedwards: Where are you at now? |
| 20:03.44 | cedwards | rsimpkins: company called mediaforge |
| 20:05.18 | rsimpkins | cedwards: Omniture/Adobe had some similar challenges due to rapid growth. I think we've got most of them licked though, or on the way to resolution. |
| 20:07.45 | rsimpkins | I think mediaforge might be a competitor? A little unclear on that. |
| 20:10.37 | cedwards | online marketing, mostly focusing on retargeted ads. |
| 20:10.53 | cedwards | visit site A, get cookiet. visit site B within ad network, site A ads display. |
| 20:11.51 | cedwards | there's more to it of course, but that is the basic premise. |
| 20:21.27 | rsimpkins | cedwards: So the main challenge you're having is the 'architect by committee' issue? |
| 20:25.02 | cedwards | rsimpkins: well it was 'architect by developers who don't know what they're doing' and now 'architect by committee with developers and managers who don't know what they're doing' |
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| 20:45.44 | rsimpkins | cedwards: PRDs. |
| 20:46.12 | rsimpkins | Make a project book, and make sure each entity has a signature page for the PRD. |
| 20:46.33 | rsimpkins | It is a terrible tool to have to use, but it will add dicipline and smoke out people who are in the chain that don't need to be. |
| 20:47.01 | rsimpkins | discipline |
| 20:54.15 | fugue88 | rsimpkins: What's a PRD? |
| 20:55.18 | fugue88 | Project Risk Database? |
| 20:55.31 | nage | Pile of Redundant Documents? |
| 20:55.37 | fugue88 | :D |
| 20:56.09 | fugue88 | Planned Relinquishment of Duties |
| 20:58.27 | rsimpkins | fugue88: The last one is more accurate. |
| 20:58.36 | rsimpkins | It is a CYA tool. |
| 20:59.08 | fugue88 | rsimpkins: Gotta link or something? |
| 21:00.03 | rsimpkins | fugue88: Any software/administration requirements approach will work. The point is the signatures, and the fact it is printed out. |
| 21:00.11 | rsimpkins | It is really a phsycological tool. |
| 21:00.44 | rsimpkins | "Hey, Mr. X. I need that PRD signed I placed on your desk or the WHOLE COMPANY will come to a screaching halt until you do." |
| 21:01.11 | rsimpkins | screeching even. Man I am on my game today. |
| 21:01.52 | jsmith | rsimpkins: We all have those days... |
| 21:01.57 | rsimpkins | It is a very effective tool to reverse manage micromanagement. |
| 21:02.17 | jsmith | What, you mean up-front planning instead of Monday-morning quarterbacking? |
| 21:02.21 | jsmith | blinks |
| 21:02.36 | rsimpkins | Yeah, PRDs are great to kill that kinda playbook. |
| 21:03.11 | rsimpkins | "I'm sorry, if it isn't in the PRD you will have to issue a project change request, in writting, and get all the prodev and prod-reps to sign it. |
| 21:03.17 | rsimpkins | thankuverymuch." |
| 21:03.28 | fugue88 | Project Requirements Document? |
| 21:03.57 | rsimpkins | They are so wonderful. Really. If you work for a company that isn't "grown up" and stuff, it can make things tollerable. |
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| 21:04.42 | rsimpkins | If you want to go a step further, add a style guide. |
| 21:04.54 | rsimpkins | Then refuse ANY change or PRD that does not conform to the style guide. |
| 21:05.59 | rsimpkins | The style guide is a counter-attack to the micromanager who feeds you pages of signed change requests. |
| 21:07.19 | rsimpkins | In such a situation I used a style guide and the PRD process to authorize the deltion of a simple deprecated directory. It was 3 pages long and took 2 weeks to get done. But it got done. Under the old method, it would simply never have happened. |
| 21:08.16 | JoshH | sweet jebus |
| 21:08.41 | JoshH | i couldn't handle anything like that |
| 21:09.00 | rsimpkins | Yeah, I didn't last long. But the reality is that they _still_ use the approach I developed at that firm. |
| 21:09.05 | rsimpkins | PRDs with a style guide. |
| 21:09.30 | rsimpkins | It works for them. Without it, nothing happens. Nothing. |
| 21:10.36 | rsimpkins | Fortunatly Adobe has got a good middle ground I think. We have a CMR process with approval committees, but it is automated. We also have the CMR nazi who beats people up for not following the process. |
| 21:11.09 | rsimpkins | Plus the tool has the right mix of humor, and the ability to override the committee if you need to. |
| 21:12.04 | rsimpkins | The PRD with style guide approach is probably what cedwards needs though. |
| 21:12.31 | jsmith | A bigger clue-by-four :-) |
| 21:13.16 | rsimpkins | Bad managers are simply bad managers. You can leave, or you can be the grown up and manage the managers. |
| 21:13.53 | jsmith | Amen, brother! |
| 21:34.28 | cedwards | erg. I'm trying to explain to a dev why a CNAME that points to an outside domain will have a different SOA than the original CNAME address. |
| 21:40.56 | Sargun_Screen | goozbach: No, I am in between jobs right now. |
| 21:41.00 | Sargun_Screen | goozbach: Well, that's a lie. |
| 21:41.05 | Sargun_Screen | goozbach: I put in my two weeks yesterday |
| 21:42.28 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: haha. |
| 21:42.49 | Sargun_Screen | cedwards: Interested in the GTM stuff? |
| 21:42.55 | cedwards | he's concerned that it's broken because he's trying to query our address through the SOA address. |
| 21:42.58 | cedwards | wtf |
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| 22:23.44 | Sargun_Screen | Anyone here in the SF Bay Area and want a systems job? |
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