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| 19:57.53 | sjansen | http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/30/magazine/30Wikileaks-t.html?_r=4 |
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| 20:20.23 | Gate | sjansen: no, I won't pay for a nytimes account. |
| 20:23.17 | sjansen | slashdot has a free link |
| 20:25.50 | Tene | nytimes links that need registration always annoy me. |
| 20:26.08 | Tene | I know I could use bugmenot or whatever, but I don't need it for any other news source. |
| 20:26.27 | goozbach | the NYT needs to die a quick death |
| 20:26.31 | Gate | sjansen is right, if you click the slashdot link it lets you through |
| 20:26.35 | Gate | but it won't |
| 20:27.02 | Gate | http://news.slashdot.org/story/11/01/27/1513225/NYTimes-On-Dealings-With-Assange |
| 20:29.16 | fungus | http://www.bugmenot.com/view/nytimes.com |
| 20:31.19 | sjansen | The NYT needs to live a long and healthy life. |
| 20:31.58 | sjansen | Considering the depth and breadth of their coverage, you can hardly fault them for not wanting to live on advertising alone. |
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| 21:10.07 | sjansen | *sigh* I hate when my code starts looking like a stairway to nowhere. |
| 21:17.48 | eightyeight | NYT is already dying a quick and painful death |
| 21:18.14 | Gate | eightyeight: I would have described it as slow, begging, painful death. |
| 21:18.30 | eightyeight | i find it entertaining that they're putting up a paywall, as if to numb the pain, or something |
| 21:18.55 | JoshH | why would someone want them to die? |
| 21:19.16 | eightyeight | who wants them to die? |
| 21:19.23 | JoshH | goozbach |
| 21:19.36 | eightyeight | ah, yes |
| 21:20.05 | Gate | They need to evolve or die, they are trying to evolve, but I think the internet is going to teach them a harsh lesson about natural selection. |
| 21:20.24 | Gate | But all is not lost for them. yet. |
| 21:21.03 | JoshH | i fear a future where the only news online is random blogs and TMZ |
| 21:21.10 | eightyeight | we'll see. i don't take the paper, and never found the need to subscribe to one |
| 21:21.16 | goozbach | I was just trying to stir up some contriversy |
| 21:21.29 | JoshH | heh |
| 21:22.03 | Gate | I get decent in-depth news from CNN, Fox and BBC three or four times a day, all free. And since each has a different bias I generally get the whole picture. |
| 21:22.09 | Gate | or enough of it |
| 21:22.26 | mheath | I'm with JoshH. Though realistically I see that a medium like the NYT is obsolete and rediculous, romantically I fear the decline of one of the last members of the "old guard" of reporting, as it were. |
| 21:22.35 | goozbach | I get my news from slashdot |
| 21:22.44 | eightyeight | i get mine from twitter |
| 21:22.48 | goozbach | which I read at -1 |
| 21:22.55 | Gate | goozbach: I didn't bother adding them, but Reason.com, Slashdot and Ars Technica are on that list too |
| 21:23.02 | mheath | Gate, None of them really covered Cairo until yesterday. |
| 21:23.12 | JoshH | arstechnica has been a bookmark of mine for years |
| 21:23.23 | Gate | I started hearing about it two days ago, I think, but I haven't been following it closely |
| 21:23.24 | eightyeight | i like ars |
| 21:23.34 | eightyeight | looks up reason.com |
| 21:23.35 | Gate | mheath: when did the protests start? |
| 21:23.46 | Gate | eightyeight: libertarian magazine |
| 21:23.59 | eightyeight | ah |
| 21:24.01 | sjansen | In depth? CNN and Fox? Really? |
| 21:24.07 | Gate | not a lot of news, mostly opinion and analysis peices |
| 21:24.14 | mheath | Gate, Like 4 days ago, really. |
| 21:24.16 | JoshH | eightyeight: it's actually pretty good quality, for the most part |
| 21:24.24 | sjansen | Few news outlets can compare to the consistent depth and quality of a good newspaper. |
| 21:24.25 | Gate | sjansen: enough to understand the news and a helluva lot better than their TV spots |
| 21:24.31 | JoshH | one of my friends tried to get me into a reason a while back and sent me a few issues |
| 21:24.37 | eightyeight | Gate: so, what you're saying is, if i share this in google reader, it's bound to get a comment or two out of Jayce^ or fozzmoo? |
| 21:24.39 | eightyeight | ducks |
| 21:24.44 | mheath | sjansen, I think part of that is sensationalism. |
| 21:25.08 | mheath | News Programs have a rolling audience. People watch them for ~30 minutes at a time, and switch channels or go elsewhere |
| 21:25.26 | mheath | For news papers, people buy the whole newspaper. They may not read all of it, but they have the entire newspaper to present anything and everything they want. |
| 21:25.40 | Gate | sjansen: those in depth peices are going to be around, but the problem is that by the time they get one of those articles out the faster news services have already moved on to what slutty actress X is wearing |
| 21:25.41 | mheath | You can fit a lot more in a newspaper than you can in a 30 minute news progra |
| 21:25.55 | JoshH | TV news is the absolute worst |
| 21:26.17 | sjansen | Dunno. Radio news can be pretty bad too. |
| 21:26.25 | eightyeight | again, twitter |
| 21:26.41 | JoshH | websites can be the best, since there's no silly things like limits on how long an article can be, but most of it is crap, and since nobody likes to pay for information online, there's not much at newspaper quality levels |
| 21:27.00 | mheath | I get newspapers on my Nook :) |
| 21:27.00 | Gate | To be honest I haven't listened to a radio news or talk show in years, and even then it was because I was captive in someone else's car |
| 21:27.04 | mheath | Best of both worlds, IMHO. |
| 21:27.12 | eightyeight | you know about world events before the AP, NYT or WSP, and before NPR, CNN, etc |
| 21:27.21 | JoshH | i only listen to sports news on the radio |
| 21:27.34 | JoshH | and only when driving |
| 21:28.01 | Gate | eightyeight: but you get vastly innacurate news, badly reported, laced with emo and whining. |
| 21:28.18 | Gate | I'll wait an hour for a service to report it. |
| 21:28.32 | sjansen | eightyeight: There's a place for timeliness, but it hardly replaces the need for quality. More and faster is not better. |
| 21:28.51 | eightyeight | meh |
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| 21:29.09 | Gate | sjansen: agreed. the "Fast" news services were all on fire blaming before the bodies had finished hitting the ground at the Tuscon shooting |
| 21:29.11 | eightyeight | you don't get biased, slanted, and bought-and-paid-for news either |
| 21:29.20 | eightyeight | it comes hard and hitting |
| 21:29.45 | sjansen | Are you serious? Twitter isn't slanted?! |
| 21:29.51 | Gate | lol |
| 21:30.43 | eightyeight | when you get the flood of data from 100,000 sources, you get all angles |
| 21:30.55 | eightyeight | of course everyone puts out their slant, but you get 100 other slants too |
| 21:31.06 | Gate | sjansen: of course not, half are on team edward and half on team... whatever the hell his name was. |
| 21:31.11 | Gate | jacob. |
| 21:31.30 | goozbach | I'm team blade |
| 21:31.33 | eightyeight | i guess it depends on the event, though |
| 21:31.52 | sjansen | Assuming your twitter sampling is representative. A pretty big assumption if you ask me. |
| 21:31.57 | Gate | goozbach: I'm on the team that never saw the movies, never read the books and never plans to do so. |
| 21:32.14 | sjansen | I'd rather balance 3 professional articles than 3000 tweets. |
| 21:32.16 | eightyeight | with the egypt riots/protests going on right now, you get a lot of "free egypt", and little, if any support for mubarak |
| 21:32.37 | JoshH | Gate: word brother |
| 21:32.52 | JoshH | true blood on the other hand... i won't miss |
| 21:33.03 | eightyeight | twitter does have millions of active twits... |
| 21:33.03 | Gate | I would argue that twitter is naturally biased because of user demographic. |
| 21:33.19 | eightyeight | Gate: yeah. again, depends largely on the issue |
| 21:34.01 | Gate | true, but you are getting a sample of people who *whose* to use twitter, which, I believe qualifies as a convience sample which tend not to accurately represent the population |
| 21:34.11 | Gate | s/whose/choose/ |
| 21:34.42 | JoshH | the bottom line is, we can all agree that twitter does need to die a very quick death |
| 21:35.20 | eightyeight | i don't |
| 21:36.12 | Gate | JoshH: agreed |
| 21:36.26 | JoshH | eightyeight: well you're wrong |
| 21:36.32 | eightyeight | ok |
| 21:36.41 | Gate | can I add facebook to that consensus? and myspace, buzz, <insert social network X here> |
| 21:36.53 | JoshH | yes |
| 21:37.22 | eightyeight | i've come to the conclusion that facebook is evil, and turns people either evil, or stupid |
| 21:37.33 | eightyeight | buzz has had some good discussion on it though |
| 21:37.54 | JoshH | never heard of buzz |
| 21:37.55 | Gate | facebook doesn't plan to change people into idiots, it simply exploits the fact that they already are. |
| 21:38.04 | Gate | buzz is Google's |
| 21:38.48 | JoshH | oh ya |
| 21:38.53 | JoshH | rings a bell now |
| 21:39.10 | eightyeight | i like the reader and gmail integration in buzz. i share a feed, people comment, and i can reply using gmail, reader or buzz |
| 21:39.50 | eightyeight | it doesn't feel like a "here's the latest picture of my cat" social network |
| 21:40.08 | eightyeight | it has a level of maturity about it |
| 21:40.52 | Gate | eightyeight: good to hear. I suppose I can keep buzz off that list. It can join linkedin as the only other social network of which I don't hate the fundamental concept. |
| 21:41.29 | mheath | Woah. There are "gzip" command line options that are equivelent to "zcat"? |
| 21:41.48 | mheath | Came up in a Linux apptitude test I took for a job interview |
| 21:42.18 | mheath | er |
| 21:42.57 | mheath | zcat | less |
| 21:43.13 | mheath | paged output. Apparently theres a way to do that directly with gzip |
| 21:43.24 | goozbach | interesting |
| 21:43.39 | goozbach | hope they don't hold it against you for not knowing that |
| 21:44.00 | goozbach | because you should be doing taco bell debugging |
| 21:45.12 | fugue88 | goozbach: Only respond to health-code citations? |
| 21:45.20 | goozbach | http://teddziuba.com/2010/10/taco-bell-programming.html |
| 21:45.26 | goozbach | taco bell programming |
| 21:45.52 | mheath | goozbach, they didn't. According to the interviewer (who really knew nothing about tech), I did "really really well" |
| 21:46.07 | mheath | The test was really short and really straightforward, except for a few really obscure questions like that. |
| 21:46.11 | JoshH | is that for that company you were asking about the other day? |
| 21:46.43 | mheath | JoshH, Kind of. I'm not interviewing with them directly, I'm going through an IT recruiter company. |
| 21:47.24 | Gate | a question like that could only really be answered by geniuses and cheaters. |
| 21:47.38 | mheath | The recruiter really knew nothing about tech. |
| 21:47.45 | Gate | or a few people who just happened to know it |
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| 21:48.38 | mheath | I said something to the effect of "At my current job, one of my responsibilities is basic circuit troubleshooting for DS3s, E1s, MPLS lines. If something goes wrong, we troubleshoot, escalate to the vendor, and assist with any necessary troubleshoooting like installing hardloops at our end." |
| 21:48.54 | mheath | She asked me to "explain what you mean by a circuit. What does that mean?" |
| 21:49.04 | JoshH | heh |
| 21:49.11 | JoshH | was she hot though? |
| 21:49.32 | mheath | Not really |
| 21:49.56 | mheath | You could tell she was obsessed with commission too. She was rather put off that I didn't immediately have a list of other qualified people who would be interested in this position. |
| 21:50.52 | mheath | Actually, some of you Utah county types, maybe you can answer this for me. |
| 21:51.37 | mheath | How much (ballpark) would you expect a Linux Support Engineer, with ~4 years of experience, Associates degree, etc. to make? Doing professional level support for high performance Linux systems. |
| 21:52.07 | mheath | I ask because the company in question has the job posted for significantly more on Dice.com if you apply directly than the recruiting company is offering me, but their figure is almost so high I think it might be a typo or erroneous. |
| 21:52.42 | JoshH | all i can say is, probably not enough |
| 21:53.17 | Gate | I could see $40k down here |
| 21:53.32 | JoshH | i was thinking around 40 |
| 21:53.51 | mheath | $40k is akin to what the recruiting company is offering (It's an hourly rate but roughly translates to that, full time) |
| 21:53.57 | mheath | They have it posted directly for $50k. |
| 21:55.24 | fugue88 | mheath: If you ask for more, ask for something like 51K or 49K, not for 50K. 51K and 49K being less well-rounded numbers has a psychological effect of keeping the negotiations closer to your ask. |
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| 21:56.35 | JoshH | 49999.99 |
| 21:56.39 | fugue88 | :D |
| 21:57.32 | Gate | mheath: it doesn't have a DOE copout on it? |
| 21:59.28 | eightyeight | mheath: who's the recruiter? |
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| 22:02.08 | mheath | eightyeight, Robert Half Technology. |
| 22:02.36 | mheath | Technically its a contractor/recruiter. I'd be working for them, contracted out to the company in quiestion, for the first 3-4 months |
| 22:02.42 | mheath | and then permanently highered as a direct employee |
| 22:03.13 | eightyeight | mheath: yes, i'm familiar with rht. who is the female though? |
| 22:03.23 | eightyeight | i bet i know who it is |
| 22:04.13 | Gate | hm, I talked to them in '09 |
| 22:05.45 | eightyeight | mheath: is it kerstin moore? the female you interviewed with? |
| 22:05.49 | Gate | they were hiring for Goldman-sachs at the time |
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| 22:16.09 | mheath | eightyeight, yep |
| 22:16.21 | eightyeight | heh |
| 22:16.28 | eightyeight | she's aggressive, to say the least |
| 22:54.19 | Gate | am I nuts for considering writing a kernel module to enhance iptables? |
| 22:56.47 | goozbach | not now, but you soon will be :) |
| 22:56.50 | Gate | lol |
| 22:57.03 | goozbach | what do you need to do that iptables doesn't know how to handle? |
| 22:57.04 | Gate | there is a module that is 90% of what I need |
| 22:57.25 | Gate | well, I have an odd situation, so I am open to suggestions |
| 22:57.32 | Gate | I have two internet connections |
| 22:58.13 | Gate | IP tables is taking outgoing packets, marking odd-numbered packets and marked packets get sent to the secondary connection |
| 22:58.33 | Gate | This is working fabulously until today, when someone tried to log in to linode. |
| 22:58.50 | goozbach | you are trying to aggregate the connections? |
| 22:59.02 | Gate | Since every other packet is coming from a different remote ip, linode is requiring reauthentication on nearly every action. |
| 22:59.02 | Gate | yes |
| 22:59.18 | Gate | We are also using it as a completely transparent fallover |
| 22:59.25 | Gate | (baja broadband sucks balls) |
| 22:59.26 | goozbach | methinks there's a better solution |
| 22:59.42 | goozbach | something like aggregated connections? |
| 22:59.48 | Gate | I didn't pioneer this one, but I am open to alternatives :) |
| 22:59.57 | goozbach | aggegrated links I mean |
| 23:00.04 | goozbach | er interfaces |
| 23:02.28 | Gate | goozbach, that is what we are shooting for. or are you referring to some program in particular |
| 23:02.44 | goozbach | well linux can do it... I just don't remember how |
| 23:02.46 | goozbach | give me a sec |
| 23:03.00 | goozbach | are you using a router distribution? or roll your own? |
| 23:03.47 | Gate | its a ubuntu server install |
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| 23:05.00 | Gate | anyway, what I was trying to achieve is if a packet has gone out between a source and destination I want it to remain in the marked/unmarked column for all packets for five minutes after that |
| 23:06.19 | goozbach | http://www.debian-administration.org/article/Routing_for_multiple_uplinks |
| 23:06.35 | goozbach | solve the problem one layer below the firewall |
| 23:07.43 | goozbach | http://linux-ip.net/html/adv-multi-internet.html |
| 23:10.35 | Gate | do you know enough about this to know how it handles one of the links going down? |
| 23:10.54 | Gate | as stated, one of the links has the uptime of a sick cat. |
| 23:12.33 | goozbach | I've done it in a previous job |
| 23:12.50 | goozbach | and prior to setting this up it was a manual switch EVERY time the link went down |
| 23:13.07 | goozbach | once I set this up I didn't touch it again until I tore the system out when we left the building |
| 23:13.25 | goozbach | so it either went unoticed, or worked like a charm |
| 23:13.31 | goozbach | which was better than it had been |
| 23:13.52 | JoshH | Gate: who are the isps? |
| 23:14.01 | Gate | baja is the shitty one |
| 23:14.13 | Gate | xmission is what I convinced them to get as the new link |
| 23:14.28 | JoshH | do you have your own ips? |
| 23:14.49 | Gate | yes, one ip through each |
| 23:15.05 | JoshH | i meant your own assignment but it's not necessarily needed |
| 23:15.11 | JoshH | is baja decent enough to do bgp? |
| 23:15.29 | Gate | notes the sound of bgp going over his head |
| 23:15.48 | Gate | no idea |
| 23:16.08 | goozbach | bgp is an option, but only if the simple ip route weighting doesn't work |
| 23:16.32 | goozbach | bgp is a bit of a heavy tool for what I'm assuming is an office uplink |
| 23:16.42 | goozbach | for a certian type of office anyway |
| 23:16.53 | Gate | yep, single office ~12 machines |
| 23:17.05 | JoshH | ah, ok |
| 23:17.14 | JoshH | you could probably get by with one of those dual lan linksys's then |
| 23:17.17 | JoshH | err dual wan |
| 23:17.23 | macnewbold | yeah, don't mess with bgp unless you're truly going to do multi-homing and get your own AS or something |
| 23:17.54 | macnewbold | yeah, i've seen those, but haven't tried them. They seemed to be about $200 last i checked |
| 23:18.33 | JoshH | ya, if you don't have things that need to be accessible from the outside over either isp, it's probably not the simplest way to go |
| 23:19.10 | Gate | we have a webserver which needs to be accesible |
| 23:19.29 | Gate | I don't see why that would be a problem |
| 23:19.32 | JoshH | so is it only used from one isp now? |
| 23:19.44 | Gate | yes |
| 23:20.43 | JoshH | what's baja called exactly |
| 23:20.50 | Gate | Baja Broadband |
| 23:20.57 | Gate | formerly orange broadband |
| 23:21.03 | Gate | formerly charter internet services |
| 23:21.18 | Gate | they keep changing the name to dodge their bad brand |
| 23:21.54 | Gate | unfortunately they offer some of the best speeds available, if you can keep the damned link up and avoid their broken routes |
| 23:22.17 | goozbach | a simiple stopgap for the inward bound traffic could be a short ttl on the DNS and round-robining the two public addresses |
| 23:22.26 | goozbach | and if a link goes down removing the bad IP |
| 23:22.31 | JoshH | oh god, don't mention that |
| 23:22.57 | Gate | services here are important, but non-critical. they can be kept on one IP or the other |
| 23:23.53 | goozbach | I'd still suggest a short ttl |
| 23:23.58 | goozbach | for just that record |
| 23:24.01 | goozbach | just in case |
| 23:24.13 | Gate | yeah |
| 23:25.45 | goozbach | that was another OOPs I fixed when I re-did our gateway |
| 23:26.00 | goozbach | the ingress for the "vpn" was on the less reliable link |
| 23:26.06 | goozbach | with a TTL of one day |
| 23:26.31 | goozbach | changed that to 60 seconds and solved the "I can't work from home cause the link keeps dropping" issues |
| 23:37.47 | *** join/#utah fcodiaz (~fcodiaz@nat-out.fw01.slc.dechocorp.net) |