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| 17:21.36 | sjansen | http://developers.slashdot.org/story/10/12/20/0459240/RubyGems-Module-Count-Soon-To-Surpass-CPANs |
| 17:21.36 | sjansen | Oh noes! Perl is dying! |
| 17:24.37 | goozbach | gets busy to upload three more modules |
| 17:29.16 | eightyeight | anyone know how to bulk-forward mail in mutt? |
| 17:38.23 | elg | ugh. I misread the website and now I have a hard decision: watch tron in imax 3d (I prefer 2d) or go another day |
| 17:39.35 | sjansen | Go another day. As a responsible consumer, it is critical that you provide zero support to the 3D madness. |
| 17:40.20 | unum | I'm trying to call a function in a c library that requries an unsigned char pointer to be passed to it |
| 17:40.33 | unum | I'm trying to do this from python |
| 17:40.44 | elg | with ctypes? |
| 17:40.49 | unum | is there a python group on freenode or have they shunned it ? |
| 17:40.51 | unum | elg: ya |
| 17:41.05 | unum | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:41.13 | unum | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:41.20 | unum | function(byref(cbuf)) is what I've been trying do to do |
| 17:41.32 | unum | but I think that only works for signed chars |
| 17:42.29 | elg | isn't there away to do a cast in ctypes? |
| 17:42.43 | sjansen | Unless you plan on adding bytes, you can generally get away with ignoring the difference between signed and unsigned char. |
| 17:43.06 | unum | it errors out |
| 17:43.13 | sjansen | These unsigned char are probably UTF8. Am I right? |
| 17:43.29 | unum | probably |
| 17:49.19 | eightyeight | figured it out |
| 17:49.37 | eightyeight | tag the messages i want to forward with 't', then press ';b' to bounce |
| 17:49.40 | eightyeight | slick |
| 17:49.43 | eightyeight | mtt ftw |
| 17:49.46 | eightyeight | s/mtt/mutt/ |
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| 18:48.55 | eightyeight | thoughts on using cron to run ntpdate |
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| 19:28.08 | sjansen | ntpdate is deprecated |
| 19:28.15 | sjansen | Why not just use ntpd? |
| 19:28.49 | sjansen | Those are my thoughts. |
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| 19:29.49 | JoshH | i normally use ntpdate to sync up at boot, then ntpd afterward |
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| 19:37.59 | eightyeight | sjansen: where is the documentation showing it's deprecated? |
| 19:38.20 | eightyeight | i guess there's the disclaimer |
| 19:40.05 | eightyeight | basically, my coworker doesn't like the amount of traffic ntp puts on the wire |
| 19:41.31 | eightyeight | he thinks a cronjob running at 1am each day calling ntpdate prevents that |
| 19:46.39 | elg | and how much traffic is that? |
| 19:48.52 | eightyeight | from what i can see, next to nothing |
| 19:49.03 | eightyeight | he's going off the frequency of logs in /var/log/messages |
| 19:49.52 | sjansen | Tell you coworker to quit being silly and get back to work. |
| 19:50.02 | sjansen | ntpdate doesn't handle clock drift |
| 19:50.11 | sjansen | ntpdate doesn't retry if there's a network blip |
| 19:50.20 | sjansen | ntpdate isn't long for the world anyway |
| 19:54.00 | JoshH | i'd say that coworker is definitely pretty silly... |
| 19:54.42 | eightyeight | i understand his concerns. we have 100+ machines using encrypted ntp against our local ntpd |
| 19:55.05 | eightyeight | if the drift is large, then the polling is frequent |
| 19:55.20 | eightyeight | and we're planning on growing to 300+ |
| 19:55.52 | eightyeight | i need to get actual mentrics, but from what i can tell, even then the network load should be light |
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| 21:08.35 | elg | eightyeight: facebook runs ntp on thousands of servers. tell him to get back to work. ;-) |
| 21:11.27 | goozbach | :) |
| 21:11.29 | shalkie | eightyeight: Wouldn't the use of Multicast or broadcast be better suited anyways? |
| 21:11.43 | goozbach | elg: but but but tHERE ARE MANY NTP LINES IN THE LOGS!!!! |
| 21:11.48 | goozbach | think of the LOGS!!!! |
| 21:13.15 | elg | grep -v ntp |
| 21:13.17 | shalkie | Postfix will quite if time jumps on it. |
| 21:13.22 | mheath | thats like...whole kilobytes, just of NTP. |
| 21:13.28 | elg | hehe |
| 21:13.42 | elg | surely ntp can be configured to be stealthy and hard to debug. |
| 21:13.54 | mheath | <shalkie> Postfix will quite if time jumps on it. |
| 21:13.59 | mheath | So you just deliver your logs via Postfix |
| 21:14.03 | mheath | and its a self correcting problem :P |
| 21:17.38 | sjansen | considers the implications of naming servers after impressionist painters |
| 21:17.57 | sjansen | chuckles evilly as he considers naming a pair of email servers monet and manet |
| 21:19.03 | mheath | sjansen, please don't. |
| 21:19.26 | mheath | I can't remember what it was, but one of the companies we recently acquired had naming schemes that led to a few combinations like that |
| 21:19.45 | eightyeight | elg: yeah. i'll be running some metrics showing the amount of traffic. maybe i'll let wireshark run for 24 hours, just picking up ntp, and see what he bandwidth is |
| 21:19.49 | mheath | We had a major outage that got delayed for an hour because they were investigating the wrong server =\ |
| 21:19.57 | shalkie | wonders what the end result of mail handled by the "dali" mailserver might be... |
| 21:21.09 | mheath | I like our current naming scheme. Utilitarian, but rather clear. |
| 21:21.55 | mheath | Servers use the scheme LOC-TYPE-##. LOC is a 3 letter location code for the data center, TYPE is the type of server, and ## is a unique number. A database server in India might be IND-DATA-01. |
| 21:26.37 | goozbach | BORE-ING!!! :) |
| 21:26.56 | goozbach | you should use subdomains per datacenter |
| 21:27.07 | goozbach | and the hostname should say more |
| 21:27.28 | goozbach | oracle-03.slc.noc.example.com |
| 21:28.03 | goozbach | webaccel-* should be nginx-* |
| 21:28.19 | goozbach | app-* should be myinternalappname-* |
| 21:28.38 | goozbach | but having a naming structure like that does make sense |
| 21:33.04 | sjansen | When I was at BYU they gave multiple names to machines. |
| 21:33.37 | sjansen | The official name was informative as just discussed. |
| 21:34.24 | sjansen | But CNAMEs were created so that commonly used machines like nimitz.byu.edu could be access faster than typing ora-foo-bar-baz-qux.byu.edu. |
| 21:35.07 | goozbach | ~sjansen++ |
| 21:35.50 | sjansen | They also had a location based naming scheme in the data center ala Utah streets. (100N-537W.byu.edu or some such) But I forget the details of how that was integrated. |
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| 21:37.00 | goozbach | and using a CNAME is useful because the mapping is preserved |
| 21:37.23 | goozbach | none of "what does garglesplat do again?" |
| 21:37.49 | goozbach | when a dig returns "gargleslat is an alias to oracle-02.slc.noc.example.com" |
| 21:44.36 | *** topic/#utah by sjansen -> logs @ http://ibot.rikers.org/%23utah/ | minecraft multiplayer: plug.org | Joy to the world! |
| 22:02.56 | maquis | sick toddler = no fun |
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| 22:09.13 | TehLaser | every place I've worked seems to think that descriptive DNS is a security hole. |
| 22:09.42 | TehLaser | That is, naming a server oracle-01.loc.org.com or something cannot be tolerated, because then the attack can tell you're using oracle. |
| 22:10.28 | goozbach | TehLaser: if you don't have split dns then yes, that's a valid statement |
| 22:10.40 | TehLaser | So we usually eneded up with <country><state><"APP"|"FP"|"DEV"><number> |
| 22:10.50 | goozbach | but your internal hosts shoulnd't be avaliabile outside the network |
| 22:11.06 | goozbach | and if an attacker is inside your network |
| 22:11.11 | goozbach | game over man |
| 22:12.02 | TehLaser | I just found it rather silly, since determining that, say, oracle is in use is usally pretty darn easy. |
| 22:12.20 | TehLaser | s/usally/usually/ |
| 22:13.30 | goozbach | yeah |
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| 23:19.56 | eightyeight | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Setuid#History |