| 00:01.14 | brasto | eightyeight: got your ping |
| 00:01.46 | eightyeight | brasto: still-gurus is back up, but it's hosted at stuart's server, not mine |
| 00:02.03 | eightyeight | brasto: still-gurus@conference.buscaluz.org |
| 00:02.18 | brasto | ah, I was looking for a server myself to get it up. Glad someone got it. |
| 00:02.25 | eightyeight | goozbach: ^^ because you're a former guru, you're invited as well. :) |
| 00:02.35 | eightyeight | (the purpose of my ping) |
| 00:02.46 | eightyeight | herlo and Zelut: same for both of you, if you want |
| 00:02.46 | JoshH | can i go? |
| 00:03.22 | eightyeight | are you a guru? |
| 00:03.43 | eightyeight | this is a pretty elite social club. only the best of the best. :) |
| 00:03.51 | jsmith-training | wrote some guru curriculum many a year ago... do I count? |
| 00:04.21 | JoshH | i hang out in the same irc channel as gurus |
| 00:04.24 | JoshH | that counts for something |
| 00:08.37 | maquis | is friends with gurus... |
| 00:12.22 | eightyeight | no admittance without a guru form of id |
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| 02:00.20 | maquis | pokes goozbach to try to acquire some guru id |
| 02:02.11 | maquis | callie just got her first bath!!! |
| 02:03.05 | maquis | tried to dry out her hair as well as possible, then put a warm hat on |
| 02:24.44 | maquis | ok... someone please explain this to me... |
| 02:25.12 | thesuperbigfrog | promotes himself to Bath Technician, first class |
| 02:25.29 | maquis | i just tried to use mplayer... it couldn't use /dev/snd/pcmC0D0p (my sound card) because the device was busy... |
| 02:25.40 | maquis | i used lsof, and the application using the sound card was... |
| 02:25.42 | maquis | <drumroll> |
| 02:25.45 | maquis | xpdf |
| 02:26.37 | mp_ | http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=657587 |
| 02:27.35 | maquis | mp_: so, evince does the same thing? |
| 02:27.39 | maquis | that's not encouraging :) |
| 02:28.18 | mp_ | it's not meant to be :] |
| 02:28.49 | mp_ | but that's an interesting issue. i guess PDF has support for embedding sounds in documents, but i've never encountered that. |
| 02:29.08 | maquis | seems really odd to me... |
| 02:29.12 | sjansen | chooses to blame maquis |
| 02:29.22 | maquis | ~whalenuke sjansen |
| 02:29.23 | ibot | ACTION dons her radiation cloak and tinted glasses while a highly intelligent whale named Ray precipitates critical mass for uncontrolled nuclear fission around sjansen with his mind powers. |
| 02:29.43 | sjansen | ~dodge |
| 02:29.44 | ibot | ACTION dodges! |
| 02:29.54 | sjansen | cowers behind ibot |
| 02:30.00 | sjansen | Missed me! |
| 02:30.07 | maquis | ~miss sjansen |
| 02:30.08 | ibot | ACTION whips a six shooter from her hip and fires just to the right of sjansen. |
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| 04:29.44 | goozbach | eightyeight: pong |
| 04:55.13 | tensai | yay for mysql quietly throwing away my data! |
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| 05:29.34 | Nafai | tensai: And that surprises you? |
| 05:30.32 | tensai | Nafai: well that depends. I've been aware of the "feature" for quite some time. but it always seems to catch me off guard. |
| 05:30.49 | Nafai | heh |
| 05:36.13 | fozzmoo | Nafai: What was it rbm used to say? |
| 05:36.26 | fozzmoo | Something like "MySQL is fine for storing your grocery list." :) |
| 05:39.29 | Nafai | Yeah, something like that :) |
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| 08:29.38 | thesuperbigfrog | ~pie sjansen |
| 08:29.38 | ibot | ACTION hits sjansen in the face with a cream pie |
| 08:30.15 | thesuperbigfrog | dodge that |
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| 17:13.30 | Migs | http://kidcrave.com/uncategorized/unconventional-childrens-books/ |
| 17:31.53 | unum | I'm all for "it's not the stork" |
| 17:32.02 | unum | teaching a donkey to fish will probably not be in my library |
| 17:32.48 | tristanbob_ | anyone here use Mint.com? I just tested it and it looks very useful. |
| 17:34.52 | tristanbob_ | also, how do you configure the hostname in opensuse 11? |
| 17:34.59 | tristanbob_ | as in, what file to edit |
| 17:35.55 | tristanbob_ | do I put in in /etc/hosts |
| 17:36.02 | Migs | trying it now, tristanbob |
| 17:36.17 | tristanbob_ | I know the "hostname name" command, but that looks temporary? |
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| 17:38.07 | mp_ | i use mint. it doesn't integrate particularly well with america first, unfortunetely. |
| 17:38.29 | mp_ | if it did though, i'd be more inclined to use it. |
| 17:39.41 | tristanbob_ | mp_, I thought america first bragged about their online presence |
| 17:39.57 | mp_ | their in-house web presence is very good |
| 17:40.09 | mp_ | i don't know why mint is broken with AF |
| 17:40.32 | tristanbob_ | I was surprised that "weber state credit union" was in there, and it attempted to connect (failed) |
| 17:41.39 | Nafai | mint works okay, but I want more precise categorization of transactions |
| 17:41.58 | Nafai | For example, if I go to walmart, some of it is groceries, some of it is prescriptions, etc |
| 17:42.07 | Nafai | So I just do it by hand with a tool called ledger |
| 17:42.16 | tristanbob_ | Nafai, I agree. I created some new catagories, but I wonder if it learns when I change the category it used. |
| 17:42.46 | tristanbob_ | btw - I just discovered the "yes" command. Not really as exciting as it sounds. |
| 17:43.03 | Nafai | heh |
| 17:43.07 | tristanbob_ | yes "This is so cool! Just like basic" |
| 17:43.10 | Nafai | Is that equivalent to "true" ? |
| 17:43.19 | tristanbob_ | nope - man yes |
| 17:44.40 | Nafai | heh |
| 17:44.52 | Nafai | Wow, it's the equivalent of: |
| 17:44.58 | Nafai | 10 PRINT "y" |
| 17:45.01 | Nafai | 20 GOTO 10 |
| 17:45.04 | Nafai | in a single command! |
| 17:45.43 | thesuperbigfrog | tristanbob_: for opensuse you do practically any and all configuration in YAST; try running yast2 from the command line |
| 17:46.55 | thesuperbigfrog | all of the config is very GUI in opensuse |
| 17:47.25 | tristanbob_ | thesuperbigfrog, problems is this is a virtual appliance running JeOS |
| 17:47.29 | tristanbob_ | so no yast |
| 17:47.48 | Nafai | No /etc/hostname in OpenSuSe? |
| 17:48.02 | tristanbob_ | Nafai, sadly no |
| 17:48.17 | tristanbob_ | is there any suse gurus here? |
| 17:48.35 | Nafai | Not I, thank goodness |
| 17:48.54 | Nafai | I guess I'd do this to find out: |
| 17:49.20 | Nafai | sudo find /etc -exec grep $(hostname) {} \; -print |
| 17:49.23 | Nafai | Or somesuch |
| 17:52.06 | thesuperbigfrog | ah |
| 17:53.09 | TehLaser | Is there any reason to do that instead of "grep -r $(hostname) /etc" ? |
| 17:53.26 | TehLaser | has weak find skillz, so he's not entirely sure what's going on there. |
| 17:53.56 | Nafai | Oh, you know, probably not. I'm just so used to doing it the find way because I often add a search for just specific file types |
| 17:54.22 | Nafai | TehLaser: It's doing exactly what your command will do. |
| 17:55.18 | TehLaser | I tend to use for instead of find for that, just becuase the find syntax is so inscrutible. |
| 17:55.52 | Nafai | It can be cryptic once you start adding various conditionals and such |
| 17:56.06 | TehLaser | "for file in *.txt; do echo $file; grep $whatever $file; done;" sort of things. I abuse the hell out of that pattern. |
| 17:59.24 | thesuperbigfrog | tristanbob_: is there a file /etc/HOSTNAME ? |
| 17:59.29 | JoshH | i think suse has /etc/HOSTNAME |
| 17:59.53 | JoshH | yet another reason to avoid that crappy dist |
| 18:00.02 | tristanbob_ | ls: cannot access /etc/hostname: No such file or directory |
| 18:00.26 | tristanbob_ | JoshH, I use Ubuntu, but SuseStudio is so powerful I want to use it to create a custom Linux appliance |
| 18:00.28 | thesuperbigfrog | can you create it? (guessing) |
| 18:00.57 | JoshH | seriously though, it should be there, in all caps |
| 18:01.04 | JoshH | unless something is weird |
| 18:01.47 | tristanbob_ | I"m going to ask in #suse |
| 18:02.24 | Nafai | JoshH: Why in the world do they make it all caps? I've never seen it that way on any other distro. |
| 18:03.23 | thesuperbigfrog | suse without yast is just asking for a goose chase when config needs changing |
| 18:04.10 | Nafai | The way you talk, it must be like editing the Windows registry with DEBUG.COM. :) |
| 18:04.58 | JoshH | i have no clue Nafai |
| 18:07.48 | tristanbob_ | echo mynewhostname > /etc/HOSTNAME |
| 18:09.16 | Nafai | So if HOSTNAME doesn't it exist it just defaults to localhost or something? |
| 18:10.31 | JoshH | i didn't know that susestudio existed, but what's better about it than ubuntu studio? |
| 18:11.04 | tristanbob_ | Nafai, my hostname is "linux" |
| 18:11.27 | Nafai | JoshH: Different thing. Susestudio is a tool to make custom distributions, basically. |
| 18:11.30 | Nafai | AIUI |
| 18:11.33 | JoshH | ah, ok |
| 18:11.48 | JoshH | i can't imagine why anyone would want to use a distro derived from suse, but whatever |
| 18:12.06 | Nafai | The demo I saw a year or so ago at UTOS was pretty slick |
| 18:12.09 | Nafai | But, I agree :) |
| 18:13.43 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@97-117-67-167.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 18:13.54 | tristanbob_ | JoshH, it is so cool - I am creating an appliance for an obsure linux app that doesn't have any packages |
| 18:14.06 | tristanbob_ | I tried creating a package, but suse studio is so much easier |
| 18:14.10 | sjansen | Oh noes! elg is trying to invade my privacy! |
| 18:14.12 | sjansen | http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/12/10/1341220/Facebook-Masks-Worse-Privacy-With-New-Interface |
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| 18:20.27 | elg | wow, plug has totally jumped the shark. |
| 18:20.35 | elg | not a single post on how evil FB is trying to steal everyone's privacy |
| 18:20.51 | elg | glad to see irc hasn't ;) |
| 18:21.31 | elg | IMHO (which is not the opinion of my employer or sjansen's reindeer, blah blah), the wizard is a bit unfortunately worded but it's definitely a net win |
| 18:22.04 | elg | if you changed the defaults, then the recommendation is to keep your settings. if you didn't, you get this thing in your face that says guess what your stuff has been and will be less private than you wanted. |
| 18:22.20 | elg | and now you have per-item privacy |
| 18:22.50 | elg | and the whole privacy settings are less complex but still flexible |
| 18:23.33 | elg | all of which i think will end up with more net privacy for everyone, although of course there's the desire to encourage people to share where they feel comfortable doing so |
| 18:25.11 | elg | the eff blog post yesterday is a fair assessment I think, though we've changed some things already in response to that. |
| 18:26.37 | sjansen | elg: Are you implying you'd appreciate me bringing the topic up on PLUG? |
| 18:27.09 | elg | I'd give basically the same speel, perhaps moderately edited, in response |
| 18:27.21 | sjansen | Perhaps I could imply that FB is killing mentors by selling private data to proprietary top-posting software vendors. |
| 18:27.29 | elg | i wouldn't be hurt or excited one way or the other, but it surprises me that something so obviously flamewar-worthy hasn't been brought up yet. |
| 18:27.34 | elg | :-D |
| 18:27.55 | elg | or if not flamewar-worthy, at least conspiratorial fodder |
| 18:28.07 | tristanbob_ | elg, I like the improvments, so I can decide who gets my posts (by using friend groups) |
| 18:28.16 | sjansen | elg: Why does Facebook hate America's freedom? |
| 18:28.19 | elg | yes, it's totally awesome |
| 18:28.30 | tensai | the per-post privacy settings is a total win |
| 18:28.37 | elg | i've been using it for probably 2 months now and it is as awesome as you think it is |
| 18:28.43 | tensai | letting friends list be public data is not |
| 18:28.44 | elg | friend lists need to be easier to manage though |
| 18:29.02 | elg | and they need a LRU friendl ists list in the drop-down |
| 18:29.16 | elg | your set of friends has never been private |
| 18:29.32 | elg | and, that's one of the things we responded to from the eff post |
| 18:29.39 | elg | we now give you an option to hide friend list from search |
| 18:29.52 | elg | though it's still not private, it's secure by obscure |
| 18:29.53 | elg | the way it was before |
| 18:30.10 | elg | note that "your set of friends" != your set of friend lists |
| 18:30.38 | elg | that would be a totally evil thing to make public. then fozzmoo and von would know they're on my "libertarians - do not open on bad days" list. |
| 18:31.10 | sjansen | I thought fozz was a mootarian. |
| 18:31.21 | fozzmoo | I love one person's response: "I just want attention,so I'm fine with it." |
| 18:32.36 | fozzmoo | Eric Schmidt would say, "If you don't want anyone to see your friends list, don't have any friends." |
| 18:33.43 | elg | lol |
| 18:34.04 | sjansen | Good idea. |
| 18:34.06 | sjansen | ~lart world |
| 18:34.06 | ibot | accelerates a free AOL cd to 50,000 rpm and lets world feel it |
| 18:34.16 | sjansen | ~lart everyone |
| 18:34.16 | ibot | executes killall -TERM everyone |
| 18:34.42 | tensai | elg: I skipped the wizard when prompted yesterday. how do I get it back? |
| 18:34.50 | sjansen | I hate all y'all! You're stinky and you make me want to vomit! |
| 18:35.30 | elg | tensai: hm, try logging out and back in? maybe go to settings -> privacy? |
| 18:35.39 | tensai | elg: tried both of those, no luck |
| 18:36.22 | fozzmoo | Settings->Privacy worked for me. |
| 18:37.01 | fozzmoo | But I think FB needs a couple new levels of privacy like "Friends of friends of friends" and "Friends of Friends of Friends of Friends" |
| 18:37.04 | sjansen | Quit talking to me. Go away. We're not friends. |
| 18:37.16 | elg | and Kevin bacon |
| 18:37.21 | fozzmoo | elg: Right. |
| 18:37.59 | elg | ~friend sjansen |
| 18:38.18 | sjansen | updates his FB status to "homicidal" |
| 18:38.49 | elg | silly sjansen, you don't have a fb status |
| 18:41.41 | Jayce^ | I just want to be able to set friend levels from the GPG trust scores |
| 18:41.59 | elg | heh |
| 18:42.19 | *** part/#utah pelaofeliz (n=PelaoFel@67.108.236.230) |
| 18:43.14 | elg | tensai: did that work? |
| 18:43.24 | tensai | elg: no. still no love. |
| 18:44.36 | elg | try http://www.facebook.com/privacy/transition.php?privacy_wizard_version=500 |
| 18:45.11 | tensai | considers trying privacy_wizard_version=499 |
| 18:45.30 | elg | yeah, that does make you wonder. |
| 18:45.42 | elg | silly php programmers |
| 18:47.36 | tensai | elg: that worked |
| 18:47.51 | tensai | I sure do want to try version 499 though. it's killing me. |
| 18:49.23 | Migs | wow: http://www.boingboing.net/2009/12/09/woman-whod-been-secr.html |
| 18:56.04 | elg | santa's helper. |
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| 19:01.42 | Migs | http://www.sketchysantas.com/ |
| 19:11.52 | mrpull | Migs: the creepy apartment lady made me feel better about the mouse i found in my pantry |
| 19:11.59 | mrpull | but i think it is a fake |
| 19:12.06 | mrpull | (the video, not my mouse) |
| 19:12.13 | Jayce^ | oooh, limited edition EFF + xkcd shirt |
| 19:15.52 | jsmith-training | played with a Nook last night, fwiw... it's not as bad as some reviews made it out to be |
| 19:16.26 | Nafai | I heard it was really slow, did it seem that way to you? |
| 19:16.37 | levi | So, while I was in San Jose a while ago, I went to Fry's. They had a little display with 7 or 8 e-book readers out for you to examine. |
| 19:16.38 | Nafai | Did you try it at a local B & N? I want to see one. |
| 19:16.55 | levi | They were *all* broken in some way. You couldn't page through a book on any of them. |
| 19:17.02 | Jayce^ | http://www.coreplanets.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6392 zombie wars |
| 19:17.13 | thesuperbigfrog | As a Kindle owner, I would be interested to see how the Nook compares |
| 19:17.50 | Nafai | I want an ebook reader |
| 19:18.00 | Nafai | But I'm not too keen on the Kindle |
| 19:18.02 | Nafai | DRM and all |
| 19:18.19 | levi | I want one, but I don't want to pay for one. So, if anyone wants to give me a present... ;) |
| 19:20.09 | Nafai | heh |
| 19:20.53 | elg | couldn't page through? |
| 19:21.03 | elg | isn't that like the primary use case? |
| 19:21.09 | tristanbob_ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XLshEBvYdw |
| 19:21.43 | thesuperbigfrog | Nafai: you'd be hard-pressed to find an ebook reader that does not suppot DRM features |
| 19:21.47 | tensai | jsmith-training: what did you play? checkers? soccer? I hear they can be sore losers. |
| 19:22.18 | Nafai | thesuperbigfrog: sure, "support", but the Kindle is particularly heinous |
| 19:22.34 | thesuperbigfrog | The Kindle supports DRM, but only for ebooks bought through Amazon |
| 19:22.34 | Nafai | Besides, Amazon is selling all of their music DRM free |
| 19:22.46 | Nafai | I don't see why they have to make their books with DRM |
| 19:22.47 | jsmith-training | tensai: Read parts of Dracula, downloaded the "Count of Monte Cristo" from Google Books, and played with the media player |
| 19:23.13 | jsmith-training | Nafai: It was a *bit* slow, but nothing like I had read about on the web |
| 19:23.50 | thesuperbigfrog | If the content owner wants DRM, and most do, Amazon has to comply with the content owner's demands if they want to sell the ebook |
| 19:24.22 | thesuperbigfrog | The Kindle will also support non-DRMed formats |
| 19:25.02 | thesuperbigfrog | I personally think that Amazon would do DRM-free ebooks if they could, just as they have with MP# |
| 19:25.06 | thesuperbigfrog | MP3 |
| 19:25.23 | elg | kindle does pdf now, right? |
| 19:25.41 | Nafai | finally |
| 19:25.42 | thesuperbigfrog | for all kindle except 1st gen |
| 19:26.10 | levi | Except you can't zoom, apparently. |
| 19:26.20 | elg | that's good, but it's a bit ominous that it didn't to begin with |
| 19:27.05 | thesuperbigfrog | PDF isn't the ideal format because it isn't reflowable |
| 19:27.58 | thesuperbigfrog | most ebook formats are based on HTML, so there really isn't a hard concept of pages / page size like PDF has |
| 19:27.58 | levi | I don't think there is an ideal format for e-books. |
| 19:28.07 | elg | it's not ideal, but it's the de facto standard for non-drm ebooks that exist in the wild |
| 19:28.14 | elg | or one of the top players anyway |
| 19:28.21 | levi | Sometimes, the page layout and formatting is important. Sometimes reflow is important. |
| 19:28.36 | jsmith-training | tends to agree w/ levi |
| 19:28.47 | elg | not supporting it means you don't care about free material |
| 19:28.56 | jsmith-training | I wish epub had better support for formatted text |
| 19:29.22 | tensai | I wish epub would give me a cookie. I like cookies. |
| 19:31.54 | jsmith-training | ~buy tensai cookie |
| 19:31.55 | ibot | ACTION goes to S-Mart and gets a dozen cookies for tensai |
| 19:32.42 | thesuperbigfrog | ~buy maquis shotgun |
| 19:32.43 | ibot | ACTION goes to S-Mart and gets a dozen shotguns for maquis |
| 19:33.01 | thesuperbigfrog | gotta be ready in case zombies attack |
| 19:36.37 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@c-174-52-44-58.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 19:48.40 | maquis | smiles |
| 19:49.21 | maquis | levi: which ebook readers? |
| 19:49.29 | maquis | sony? cooler? others? |
| 19:49.40 | Nafai | fozzmoo: I knew my mother-in-law would comment on your comment :) |
| 19:49.47 | maquis | loves her kindle |
| 19:50.07 | Nafai | The kindle indeed looks awesome |
| 19:50.33 | Nafai | But I'm not sure if I can compromise given the control Amazon has over it (not a monopoly, but things like the 1984 incident) |
| 19:50.45 | maquis | meh... |
| 19:50.50 | maquis | most of my books aren't from amazon |
| 19:51.06 | maquis | got a few of the google books, but most of the stuff i've got on there is from manybooks.net |
| 19:51.22 | Nafai | Oh nice |
| 19:51.33 | Nafai | I've done a little reading on my G1, but the screen is just a little too small |
| 19:51.53 | Nafai | For example, I re-read most of Real World Haskell on it (when I was too lazy to dig out the book after moving) |
| 19:52.00 | Nafai | It made reading code a bit difficult, but it wasn't too bad |
| 19:52.37 | maquis | the majority of the amazon books i have on my kindle are either free books (offered for a limited time to get you interested in a particular author/series) or indie books (most of which are not drm'd, and which are usually pretty good and priced < 3$) |
| 19:52.47 | Nafai | good to know |
| 19:52.53 | maquis | i'm cheap |
| 19:53.07 | maquis | i consider 9$ to be very expensive for a book... |
| 19:53.24 | maquis | paid it for pirate latitudes... and going to pay 8$ for under the dome... |
| 19:53.31 | maquis | but other than that, i usually avoid anything over 5$ |
| 19:53.51 | JoshH | do you get an amazon discount? |
| 19:54.13 | maquis | JoshH: not a particularly good one... we get 10% off, up to 100$ off per year |
| 19:54.24 | JoshH | well, that's better than some |
| 19:54.33 | JoshH | overstock.com has no employee discount at all |
| 19:54.34 | maquis | don't think it actually applies to kindle books, though |
| 19:54.41 | maquis | at least, i've never seen it applied to my kindle books |
| 19:54.48 | JoshH | i did a stint there back in 2003 and it sucked |
| 19:55.01 | maquis | i have an amazon credit card, though, so i get 25$ gift certificates pretty regularly |
| 19:55.04 | maquis | :) |
| 19:55.17 | maquis | and i use swagbucks.com for searches, so i get 5$ gift certificates regularly from there |
| 19:55.23 | maquis | and i buy most of my books using those |
| 19:56.46 | fozzmoo | Nafai: :-D |
| 19:58.08 | fozzmoo | Nafai: I felt a slight twinge of regret after I posted the comment. Hoped it didn't offend anyone. |
| 19:58.20 | JoshH | link? |
| 19:58.34 | JoshH | i love reading offensive stuff |
| 19:59.55 | fozzmoo | heh. |
| 20:00.08 | fozzmoo | Nafai posted on FB that he was missing his wife while he was in SF. |
| 20:00.17 | fozzmoo | I said, "/me sends Nafai a blow-up doll." |
| 20:00.23 | Nafai | Heh |
| 20:00.31 | Nafai | "slight twinge" |
| 20:00.59 | Migs | ~lart fozzmo |
| 20:00.59 | ibot | throws a AN/M-8 smoke grenade at fozzmo |
| 20:01.01 | Migs | ~lart fozzmoo |
| 20:01.01 | ibot | send killer squirrels to attack fozzmoo |
| 20:01.11 | fozzmoo | NO! NOT KILLER SQUIRRELS! |
| 20:01.15 | JoshH | maybe if you were sending him a realdoll, there would be cause for concern |
| 20:01.19 | Migs | I just feel bad for fozzmo |
| 20:02.48 | fozzmoo | Like "/me calls Bay Area Escorts and orders them to Nafai's hotel room" |
| 20:02.58 | fozzmoo | Yeah- I wouldn't go that far. |
| 20:03.47 | JoshH | ya, they're too expensive there |
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| 20:28.53 | *** join/#utah ArdAmAx (n=arpa@mail2.ijf.hr) |
| 20:29.04 | *** part/#utah ArdAmAx (n=arpa@mail2.ijf.hr) |
| 20:36.49 | levi | maquis: I think one of them was a Sony. A bunch were brands I'd never heard of. |
| 20:46.59 | sjansen | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:48.25 | levi | I think so. |
| 20:48.29 | elg | http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2009/12/ukrainian-student-dies-from-exploding-chewing-gum/1?csp=34 |
| 20:48.42 | levi | Serves them right for not giving her a better employee discount. ;) |
| 20:51.58 | *** join/#utah badon (n=q@166-70-80-198.ip.xmission.com) |
| 20:52.00 | levi | elg: Moral of the story - don't leave open jars of explosive substances on your desk while surfing the web. :P |
| 20:52.20 | elg | uh, yeah |
| 20:54.02 | levi | Oh the other hand, it is a clever way to get a posthumous 15 minutes of fame. |
| 21:03.51 | Jayce^ | fozzmoo: another problem eh? |
| 21:04.00 | fozzmoo | sighs |
| 21:04.09 | goozbach | fozzmoo: NO!!! |
| 21:04.33 | goozbach | sends fozzmoo some SL Valley escorts |
| 21:04.47 | fozzmoo | Not sure that's going to help. Send them to the appraiser. :) |
| 21:05.05 | goozbach | you can sent them where you need |
| 21:05.47 | fozzmoo | Hmmm. tweaking a Perl script that's running on a Winbloze box I have FTP access to. There's probably no easy way to install CPAN modules. |
| 21:06.06 | goozbach | eek |
| 21:06.13 | goozbach | include lib ../ |
| 21:07.01 | harleypig | We need to make a zombie porno ... |
| 21:08.17 | fozzmoo | There's probably plenty of porn out there by "actors" who seem like they're lifeless already. |
| 21:08.37 | harleypig | But that's just a comparison ... that's not *really* zombie porn. |
| 21:08.48 | goozbach | harleypig: you're not searching hard enough |
| 21:08.58 | harleypig | ooo ... harder ... |
| 21:09.08 | harleypig | I'm not searching at work at all |
| 21:10.12 | Migs | hahaha http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzWAJduvcCw |
| 21:26.02 | sjansen | http://www.redhat.com/about/news/prarchive/2009/spice-os.html |
| 21:26.15 | sjansen | RH is _so_ awesome. |
| 21:28.00 | sinuhe | Nice |
| 21:39.31 | fozzmoo | Interesting! |
| 21:41.36 | levi | Hmm. Do I want to pay an extra $4/mo to get BluRay from Netflix? |
| 21:42.57 | Migs | I wouldn't do it |
| 21:43.05 | Migs | then again, I don't have an HD TV |
| 21:43.25 | levi | I have both an HD TV and a BluRay player now. |
| 21:43.50 | levi | And two whole BluRay discs. |
| 21:44.50 | levi | sjansen: Why would I be excited about this SPICE thing? |
| 21:45.47 | fozzmoo | RH is paving the way to making SPICE an open standard. |
| 21:46.08 | levi | I would only care about that if I cared about SPICE. |
| 21:46.12 | fozzmoo | Anyone who wants to be involved in the development of the standard can, like any open source project. |
| 21:46.38 | fozzmoo | levi: Then you would not be excited about this SPICE thing. |
| 21:47.05 | levi | I'm asking what's interesting about SPICE, not what's interesting about open source. |
| 21:47.31 | sjansen | I haven't seen it in person, but supposedly SPICE can efficiently stream HD video from a VM to a client without skipping. |
| 21:47.47 | tensai | levi: SPICE is exciting because when combined with SALT and HEAT it makes FOOD better. |
| 21:48.00 | Jayce^ | and it makes your eyes *really* blue |
| 21:48.09 | Jayce^ | but it's really just worm poop |
| 21:48.20 | levi | The spice must flow! |
| 21:49.41 | sjansen | Unlike VNC, supposedly SPICE doesn't suck. Unlike Citrix, SPICE is no longer proprietary. |
| 21:50.23 | goozbach | and *THAT*'s what makes it awesome |
| 21:50.26 | levi | So SPICE is supposed to be a way for a thin client to connect to a remote VM on a server? |
| 21:50.36 | fozzmoo | http://www.spice-space.org/features.html |
| 21:52.38 | elg | levi: would you pay $4/month to rent a single blu-ray from a local store whenever you jones for hd? |
| 21:52.46 | levi | OK, now SPICE is interesting. |
| 21:53.28 | fozzmoo | http://www.spice-space.org/docs/spice_for_newbies.pdf |
| 21:53.45 | fozzmoo | Lots of diagrams in that PDF that don't seem to scream "newbie." |
| 21:53.50 | levi | elg: Maybe. The whole Netflix value proposition has gone out the window for me, though, as I never watch movies anymore. |
| 21:54.18 | elg | in that case, cancel netflix altogether and spend $4-$12/mo at a local store. problem solved :) |
| 21:54.40 | fozzmoo | I plan to do the Netflix streaming thing. |
| 21:54.55 | levi | elg: My wife still uses it, but she still watches stuff on VHS, so I don't think she'd care about BluRay. |
| 21:55.20 | Migs | at least VHS doesn't have all the problems DVDs have with scratches, skipping, etc. |
| 21:55.32 | fozzmoo | I recently stopped in a store to watch a blueray of Monsters Inc. on an HD TV. |
| 21:55.48 | Jayce^ | we use the netflix streaming a bit... |
| 21:55.48 | fozzmoo | The experience was indeed reminiscent of 10 years ago when I first say DVD video. |
| 21:55.59 | fozzmoo | s/say/saw/ |
| 21:56.09 | levi | It just has the problems of crappy picture, crappy audio, waiting forever for rewinds, degradation of video quality over time, etc. |
| 21:56.12 | Jayce^ | has a bunch of the kids-shows we can toss on in those times you just need them to sit down for a bit |
| 21:56.12 | elg | yeah, I've totally never screamed at a VHS tape and threw it to the floor because it just puts out snow or a continually v-hold screwed up picture or distorted audio |
| 21:57.07 | levi | Jayce^: I have my DVR regularly recording and keeping the last 4 or 5 episodes of various PBS kids shows just for that purpose. :) |
| 21:57.21 | elg | ditto, but i only keep 1 or 2 |
| 21:57.22 | Migs | sounds more like a temper thing than a VHS thing |
| 21:57.26 | Jayce^ | yeah, I have a pretty big archive, but they have shows that I don't get... |
| 21:57.28 | elg | but they come on more than daily |
| 21:57.44 | Jayce^ | my daughters seem to love *wubzy* ..... gag |
| 21:57.47 | elg | caillou, arthur, curious george are the perennial favorits |
| 21:58.10 | elg | and then there's star wars and thomas DVDs |
| 21:58.29 | levi | My kids like Curious George, Word World, Super Why, Dinosaur Train, etc. |
| 21:58.47 | Jayce^ | yo gabba gabba |
| 21:58.55 | Jayce^ | that show really freaked me out at first |
| 21:59.02 | goozbach | I started fraggle rock on netflix streaming last night |
| 21:59.09 | mulicheng | levi: Netflix value went away for us too. We watched all the movies we were interested in.. now our queue is empty so I put the account on hold. |
| 21:59.13 | elg | i outlawed super why and my wife doesn't like word world |
| 21:59.15 | Jayce^ | goozbach: classic |
| 21:59.19 | elg | haven't seen dino train |
| 21:59.30 | levi | mulicheng: I've got a zillion in my queue, I just don't watch them when they arrive. :) |
| 21:59.41 | Jayce^ | I keep finding series that I want to see, I just don't have time to go through them all |
| 21:59.47 | mulicheng | Our problem is that we're generally disinterested in movies. |
| 21:59.53 | levi | elg: It's a new PBS one. It's got a UofU Paleontologist on it, apparently. |
| 22:00.13 | Jayce^ | like I just went through Hogans Heroes.... that's a lot of discs to get over time |
| 22:00.14 | tensai | elg: super reads to the rescue! |
| 22:00.16 | mulicheng | especially everything produced presently. |
| 22:00.19 | tensai | s/reads/readers/ |
| 22:00.40 | elg | they butcher every single story they touch |
| 22:01.26 | levi | Yeah, the stories are butchered, and then they butcher them further. But that's no crime that Disney hasn't committed over and over. |
| 22:01.48 | elg | cinderlla's unhappy! we'll write in a check for 1 million dollars and her mom and dad never die. problem solved! super readers to the rescue! |
| 22:11.04 | unum | so does anyone here have experience setting up an online payment system(non-paypal) |
| 22:11.16 | fozzmoo | unum: Like AuthorizeNet? |
| 22:11.19 | sjansen | You know, I never thought I'd drink a Root Beer I didn't like. Diet Hansen's has proven me wrong. |
| 22:11.55 | fozzmoo | unum: I've worked with LinkPoint, AuthorizeNet, and CyberCash (back in the day) |
| 22:11.57 | levi | Heh. It's easy to go wrong in the diet soda world. |
| 22:12.03 | goozbach | sjansen: I see your problem... it's a *DIET* |
| 22:12.22 | goozbach | I'd imagine Jayce^ has some experience of that |
| 22:12.26 | fozzmoo | Diet A&W isn't bad. |
| 22:13.57 | unum | fozzmoo: what can you tell me about the costs? |
| 22:14.17 | fozzmoo | Oh, gee, I really don't know about costs. I've just worked on the code. :) |
| 22:15.22 | unum | well then I'll ask my other question. it's transparent to the user then(ie not like paypal or google checkout) |
| 22:15.30 | fozzmoo | It can be. |
| 22:15.42 | fozzmoo | Most of the payment processors have at least a couple different modes. |
| 22:15.52 | mp_ | develops theory that wikis encourage terrible software documentation |
| 22:16.13 | fozzmoo | You can do the actual payment on the processor's site... |
| 22:16.24 | fozzmoo | or you can do the payment on your site and submit it to the processor behind the scenes. |
| 22:18.16 | Jayce^ | unum: costs depend entirely on how big you are, what you sell, and how you sell it |
| 22:18.24 | sjansen | counters with the theory that wikis result in at least some software documentation where before there wouldn't have been any |
| 22:18.25 | fozzmoo | unum: http://developer.authorize.net/api/ |
| 22:18.45 | Jayce^ | it's a racket really, and everything is negotiable, but always in their favor |
| 22:18.50 | fozzmoo | :) |
| 22:19.03 | mp_ | i accept that theory but counter with the theory that just because it's present doesn't mean it isn't terrible |
| 22:19.19 | elg | anyone have opinions on roof racks? one from the mazda dealer is like $400 which seems insane. |
| 22:19.32 | fozzmoo | Yeah- Dealer options are always insanely expensive. |
| 22:19.47 | fozzmoo | elg: Talk to a nice bike shop. |
| 22:19.50 | levi | They are expensive no matter where you get them from, but $400 is probably not the cheapest you can get. |
| 22:19.53 | elg | then i see stuff on amazon for as low as $50 or $100, and oem not-from-mazda-but-specific-for-mazda5 that are like $200-$300 |
| 22:19.54 | unum | apparantly I left the hoa board meeting a little to early on tuesday |
| 22:20.04 | levi | Everything at a nice bike shop is also insanely expensive. |
| 22:20.11 | fozzmoo | levi: good point. |
| 22:20.16 | Jayce^ | and then the mounting is always a lot from a dealer... there will be a lot of aftermarket shops that do better deals |
| 22:20.19 | unum | I'm put a website up on my server for them, so then I get an email telling me to add online payments by january 21st |
| 22:20.26 | elg | so i wonder what the important factors to consider are when it comes to roof racks |
| 22:20.40 | Jayce^ | look for places that do window-tinting, custom wheels, or truck mods.. |
| 22:20.42 | elg | especially since i've never had a roof rack that didn't come with the vehicle or a roof that I cared about. |
| 22:20.53 | fozzmoo | reboots to new kenrel |
| 22:21.00 | fozzmoo | s/kenrel/kernel/ |
| 22:21.40 | Jayce^ | unum: there are lots of gateways out there, and if you are big enough, you can do direct-processor or bank (but I don't think you would be, that's really big) |
| 22:21.56 | levi | You probably want to consider the accessories that go along with the actual rack. |
| 22:22.06 | Jayce^ | there are several places that they charge you, you gotta have plenty of people going over the paperwork and such |
| 22:22.15 | levi | Such as mounting hardware for bikes/skis/cargo boxes, locks, etc. |
| 22:22.46 | Jayce^ | elg: for an example, I'm getting rails added to my truck shell so I can put the yakima racks on it.. not a full rack though |
| 22:23.08 | Jayce^ | and I'm getting rails that are for the yakima ends I have, the ones that can go in a cars rain-gutters |
| 22:23.13 | levi | Yakima and Thule are the major systems, IIRC. |
| 22:23.18 | Jayce^ | vs the normal truck-topper specific ones |
| 22:24.20 | elg | i want to stick some luggage up once or twice a year for the utah road trip |
| 22:24.26 | elg | and perhaps in the future carry a surfboard. |
| 22:24.36 | unum | Jayce^: we're only talking about 99 payments/month |
| 22:24.47 | elg | bonus if i could throw my bike up there with minimal dissassembly |
| 22:24.54 | Jayce^ | yeah, something such as the local authorize-net. |
| 22:25.07 | unum | ooh arb that could be what we want |
| 22:25.09 | Jayce^ | fees will be somewhat similar to paypal, and you have to code for it.. |
| 22:25.14 | Jayce^ | but it's a direct |
| 22:25.22 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@174.52.44.58) |
| 22:25.35 | Jayce^ | ARB avoids having to have a "full" billing system, and you don't need nearly as much PCI work |
| 22:25.43 | Jayce^ | though you are really locked in with them |
| 22:26.08 | Jayce^ | elg: if you google, you'll find all the big catalogs carry aftermarket ones, you can do yourself.. |
| 22:26.21 | Jayce^ | if you aren't afraid of possibly drilling holes in your new car |
| 22:28.31 | tensai | elg: it's a scam. all you really need is some towel racks from home depot and a spool of duct tape. |
| 22:29.38 | Jayce^ | that worked for the clampett-mobile tensai, but now he's in calIforny, and has to look the part |
| 22:30.16 | levi | elg: http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123734815 |
| 22:31.12 | unum | that's a lot cheaper than I thought |
| 22:31.58 | levi | elg: Also note that you can often get genuine Mazda parts from online Mazda dealers way cheaper than your particular local dealer. |
| 22:34.05 | levi | I sometimes buy Miata parts from this place, which is selling the 5's roof rack for $300: http://www.finishlineperformance.com/store/product.php?productid=16828&cat=279&page=2 |
| 22:37.22 | tensai | say I've got a roof rack, what do I need to be able to put skis up there? |
| 22:37.30 | levi | elg: This one is slightly cheaper, and has free shipping for orders over $150: http://www.trademotion.com/partlocator/index.cfm?action=MorePartInfo&PartID=538817&siteid=214264&catalogid=5733 |
| 22:37.34 | eggyknap | tensai: duct tape? |
| 22:37.34 | tensai | do I need a special ski rack? or can I just tie them town? |
| 22:37.40 | tensai | s/town/down/ |
| 22:38.16 | tensai | eggyknap: well obviously duct tape can solve any problem :) |
| 22:38.48 | levi | They make special ski attachments for racks, but you could just tie them on if you wanted to. |
| 22:40.42 | levi | elg: Looks like the Mazda rack is made by Thule, so you could put any Thule attachment on it. |
| 22:53.05 | elg | i wonder about one of these |
| 22:53.05 | elg | https://roofbag.com/OrderProducts.asp |
| 22:53.30 | fozzmoo | I have something like that. |
| 22:54.04 | levi | I can't imagine it would be good for the finish on your roof to put it up there without a rack. |
| 22:54.22 | Jayce^ | I've got one (and have one that busted) |
| 22:54.25 | Jayce^ | worked well |
| 22:54.33 | tensai | eggyknap: did I ever mention I got an instance of bucardo running? wasn't too difficult. |
| 22:54.46 | Jayce^ | levi: ours had a soft bottom, didnt' cause any issues |
| 22:55.20 | levi | Definitely cheaper than a rack, but it won't help for bikes/surfboards/etc. |
| 22:55.30 | eggyknap | tensai: w00t ;) |
| 22:55.35 | Jayce^ | right, but just extra space when going on a trip, it's good |
| 22:56.10 | Jayce^ | used our on the legacy quite a few times, but was hard because sub's don't have normal window edges to grab on to |
| 22:56.23 | elg | yeah, i can get a rack later when i get into surfing. if i can find a rack solution with confidence for $150 i'll probably do that, otherwise i'll go with the bag |
| 22:56.54 | Jayce^ | elg: we've used the bag even with a roof rack. keep things dry |
| 22:57.30 | elg | true that. |
| 22:57.55 | levi | I doubt you're going to find a *good* rack system for $150. |
| 22:58.05 | Jayce^ | yeah |
| 22:59.12 | levi | Racks are just expensive. You're going to pay at least $200 for the bars/mounts, and then probably at least another $100 for equipment-specific mounting gadgets, and maybe another $50 for locks, etc. |
| 22:59.26 | Jayce^ | yup |
| 22:59.48 | levi | Thus, I have never had a nice rack on a car. ;) |
| 23:00.08 | Jayce^ | that's why I'm just getting gutter rails instead of buying truck specific racks, even though my yakimas are coming on 20 years old |
| 23:00.38 | levi | I was shocked at how much I had to pay to put a trailer hitch on my van and get a hitch-mount bike rack. |
| 23:00.53 | Jayce^ | levi: where'd you get the hitch? |
| 23:01.08 | elg | metal stuff is expensive |
| 23:01.10 | Jayce^ | I've found before that u-haul actually had some of the best after-market hitch install deals for cars |
| 23:01.23 | Jayce^ | at least at the time it was |
| 23:01.31 | fozzmoo | I bought the hitch for my Subaru through checker and installed it myself. |
| 23:01.50 | fozzmoo | Correction- the HITCH RECEIVER. :) |
| 23:01.56 | levi | Jayce^: The first one I got from e-hitch, and they sent me crap that didn't work together. The mounts were from one hitch, and the crossbar was from another one. |
| 23:02.33 | levi | The second one I bought from an online Eurovan parts place on sale. |
| 23:02.51 | levi | Exactly the same brand of equipment, though. |
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| 23:46.11 | harleypig | http://www.coverbrowser.com/covers/worst-album-covers/2#i75 |
| 23:54.06 | harleypig | http://strider01.wordpress.com/2009/08/15/crappy-album-covers-143-guys-who-only-want-to-be-your-friend/ |
| 23:55.59 | harleypig | wonders how many people have him ignored |
| 23:58.50 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@c-67-164-125-152.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 23:58.50 | *** mode/#utah [+v elg] by ChanServ |
| 23:59.17 | mulicheng | wonders why the ignore button for harleypig won't stick when his client disconnects and reconnects. |