| 00:23.32 | tensai | Sargun_screen: http://www.shelfreliance.com/blog/?p=62 |
| 00:24.15 | tensai | sidesteps the obvious jokes |
| 00:50.44 | Sargun_screen | stabs stupid APIs |
| 01:37.26 | Supaplex | ~lart the stupid APIs |
| 01:37.26 | ibot | gives the stupid APIs an extra strength ACME sleeping pill, sending the stupid APIs to sleep for 150 years, and awakening to seven strange dwarfs and a large apple |
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| 03:08.25 | tensai | tristanbob: http://sundaydriveshirts.com/product.php?productid=16152 |
| 03:12.20 | Sargun_screen | tristanbob: I bought two more licenses |
| 03:12.33 | Sargun_screen | for a total of 6! |
| 04:01.03 | tristanbob | Sargun_screen, that is funny |
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| 04:21.13 | keldwud | hey, there any interest here for a solar oven workshop? The project involves learning how to cook food using only sustainable sources of energy, i.e. carboard box, insulation (newspaper), aluminum foil, and the sun. |
| 04:21.38 | keldwud | five bucks will get you one meal for the day, will be on a Saturday or a Sunday |
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| 04:25.21 | Supaplex | oh look, it's a ramsey |
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| 04:28.25 | Supaplex | ~blame Sargun |
| 04:28.25 | ibot | ACTION blames Sargun (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 04:31.47 | Supaplex | scarfs down some flaming hot ranch pringles mmmmmm nom |
| 04:45.12 | keldwud | oh god, I heard of that ramsey character |
| 04:48.36 | Supaplex | solar oven? is that some new bright idea? |
| 04:49.19 | Tene | Custom ops are fun in Perl 6. I just added support to rakudo for user-defined circumfix ops. |
| 04:49.54 | keldwud | haha, nice one :) |
| 04:50.03 | keldwud | you on twitter yet, supa? |
| 04:50.27 | Supaplex | is there a Jetsons home of the future operator? I could use one of those. |
| 05:30.19 | Tene | http://blogs.gurulabs.com/stephen/2009/05/new-toys-in-perl-6-custom-ops.html |
| 05:37.43 | Sargun_screen | tristanbob: what's funny? |
| 05:37.53 | Sargun_screen | how's that funny |
| 05:39.34 | Sargun | http://www.shelfreliance.com/blog/?p=62 = So slow; vote for cathryn |
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| 06:59.24 | tensai | Supaplex: the solar ovens are actually a great idea in poor rural areas where collecting firewood is difficult and/or dangerous |
| 07:01.04 | Supaplex | it was a pun, nothing more :) |
| 07:01.58 | tensai | ah. wasn't sure if you were aware of their typical uses. around here sounds like a hippie sort of idea. |
| 07:02.11 | tensai | nice for backpacking maybe |
| 07:04.30 | Supaplex | I just assumed it was for hobby, fun, survival adventure etc. but yeah. |
| 07:05.07 | keldwud | tensai - interested in participating? |
| 07:05.47 | tensai | specifically I know there are efforts to get them to people in africa where the women have to leave the village (refuge camp?) to collect firewood and thus risk of attack |
| 07:05.49 | keldwud | I know it sounds all hippie-ish, but the smaller our footprints and lower impact we are, the better off we can be |
| 07:06.01 | tensai | I think it's a pretty cool project that's suprisingly inexpensive |
| 07:06.07 | keldwud | and it wouldn't hurt to spread survival skills |
| 07:06.23 | keldwud | yeah, it would only take 5 bucks or less per person and we would all get a fully cooked meal |
| 07:06.28 | Supaplex | it could be fun :) |
| 07:06.33 | keldwud | 10 bucks if you want beverages with your meal |
| 07:06.44 | keldwud | it would require 3 or 4 hours out of the day, though. |
| 07:06.48 | tensai | keldwud: for one I'm not in utah so it would cost me a bit more than $5 to attend :) |
| 07:06.51 | keldwud | so I've planned a few discussions |
| 07:06.59 | keldwud | tensai - that's okay, I plan on podcasting it |
| 07:07.05 | Tarrant | keldwud: The issue is that the media/'enviormentalists' don't target the low hanging fruit. The target the hard stuff to fix. |
| 07:07.13 | keldwud | and encouraging audience participation and questions |
| 07:07.28 | keldwud | tarrant - yeah, that's part of the problem |
| 07:08.04 | keldwud | during the summer, if just 10 people cooked and cured the majority of their food using sunlight, that would make a huge impact |
| 07:08.21 | keldwud | I have a pretty awesome condo complex where everyone here is interested in things like that |
| 07:08.27 | tensai | I cure my garlic in the sunlight every fall. does that count? |
| 07:08.32 | keldwud | the ultimate goal is to make our condo as self-sustainable as possible |
| 07:09.02 | keldwud | harvest rainwater, plant mushroom logs on the fire escapes, plant food around the building, etc |
| 07:09.33 | keldwud | anyway, you want me to keep you in mind Supa? if so, go ahead and email me your contact info |
| 07:09.58 | keldwud | tensai, I'll post a link in here with the details once I get it organized so you can watch if you'd like. |
| 08:12.46 | Sargun | keldwud, where? |
| 08:14.56 | keldwud | somewhere near downtown |
| 08:15.06 | keldwud | still collaborating |
| 08:15.35 | Sargun | downtown what |
| 08:15.52 | keldwud | the only downtown that matters in a channel called #utah |
| 08:15.55 | keldwud | ;) |
| 08:16.21 | keldwud | county has a population of 1.4 million + |
| 08:16.35 | keldwud | but downtown only has a population of 120-150k |
| 08:16.48 | keldwud | 84111, 84102, 84103 |
| 08:27.19 | Sargun | I'm guessing not the "right" downtown |
| 08:31.49 | keldwud | haha. what county are you in? Utah County? |
| 08:32.09 | keldwud | lol @ "some traditions are long standing because they are *right*" |
| 08:32.11 | keldwud | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9d38EoQ9pg |
| 08:33.04 | keldwud | I like how in that commercial they used visual imagery to imply that treating other human beings with respect will allow them to take your bible away |
| 08:33.12 | keldwud | "They took our bibles!" |
| 09:06.28 | Sargun_screen | keldwud: Alameda. |
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| 14:49.07 | ^Migs^ | http://my.opera.com/chooseopera/blog/show.dml/3251503 |
| 14:49.11 | ^Migs^ | "Good news, everyone! Opera has hit a milestone today with an amazing result of 17.39% market share in... ANTARCTICA! Today's statistics are a proof that maybe 1 out of 5 scientists has Opera as their preferred browser. :cool:" |
| 14:52.56 | mecworks | Anyone have DSL ISP service through csolutiouns? |
| 14:53.06 | mecworks | I'm wondering if there's an outtage right now. |
| 14:53.27 | mecworks | can't access any of my servers and Qwest says their lines are fine. |
| 14:59.36 | mecworks | Can anyone hit www.sllug.org ? Maybe it's my connection here. |
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| 15:48.59 | tristanbob__ | mecworks, I can't get to that site |
| 15:49.30 | mecworks | Yeah, I just called csolutions and they are having an outtage right now. Not much I can do about it. Thanks for checking though. |
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| 16:12.52 | redbeard2 | need a recommendation on a good load balancer. barracuda networks isn't cutting it for us. |
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| 16:16.01 | goozbach | good almost always means $$$ |
| 16:16.14 | goozbach | and what are you load balancing? |
| 16:16.16 | goozbach | http? |
| 16:16.52 | goozbach | we just bought a new F5 LTM 1500 load balancer cluster |
| 16:17.11 | goozbach | it's pricy, but it's fast, reliable, and infinatly configurable |
| 16:17.28 | redbeard2 | web and database |
| 16:18.12 | redbeard2 | our current LB just does it by port, which is fine |
| 16:18.47 | goozbach | I'm just getting into the database side of load balancing here |
| 16:24.54 | redbeard2 | trying to get a quote on co-lo from xmission, but apparently the girl that does that is out today |
| 16:29.09 | Sargun | redbeard2, We assembled our own stuff on ipvs. |
| 16:29.12 | Sargun | We love it. |
| 16:29.20 | Sargun | Yes, I know, it's hackish |
| 16:32.09 | thesuperbigfrog | great quote: Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if both are frozen |
| 16:32.12 | thesuperbigfrog | - Edward V Berard |
| 16:47.09 | harleypig | http://www.xkcdb.com/?5779 |
| 16:47.10 | brac | [XKCDB: The #xkcd Quote Database] |
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| 17:07.07 | Sargun | lol |
| 17:07.23 | Sargun | Those lovable Brits department: |
| 17:07.23 | Sargun | They also have trouble pronouncing `vitamin'. |
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| 17:15.16 | sjansen | http://thefinancebuff.com/2009/05/bad-experience-with-apple-ipod-shuffle.html |
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| 17:27.28 | synic | TimRiker: where is the bzflag store located? |
| 17:29.29 | synic | It says store pickup is free, and free is my preferred cost |
| 17:31.46 | sjansen | synic: Pickup is at my apartment. Please wait 2 weeks for item availability. (Full disclosure: access to my bzflag branch store requires paying a $35 parking fee.) |
| 17:32.06 | synic | :P |
| 17:52.15 | Supaplex | I can only imagine the outcome of not paying.... |
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| 18:05.42 | *** topic/#utah by sjansen -> http://utos.org/irc | Log @ http://ibot.rikers.org/#utah | UTOSC - http://tinyurl.com/utosc2009-venue | This space for rent. |
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| 18:07.26 | pmcnabb | I have a friend looking for a linux admin to help with a "web app development environment." Right now they're looking for either full- or part-time (remotely, for now) help with web_apps/DB/SCM/maintenance/security/etc. on CentOS platform. If interested, contact Brad at wbhumphrey@gmail.com. I'd like to help out myself, but my plate is too full. :) |
| 18:22.07 | ^Migs^ | I was interested, right up until you said "CentOS" |
| 18:22.19 | ^Migs^ | or possibly "friend" |
| 18:22.33 | toelovell | i was discouraged by the centos part |
| 18:26.40 | unum | that does look kind of interenting... |
| 18:26.56 | unum | but I don't think I could handle an 80 hour work week |
| 18:26.57 | unum | is wimp |
| 18:28.17 | jsmith | doubts they'd pay him enough |
| 18:28.40 | unum | remember jsmiths contracting rate and agrees |
| 18:29.56 | unum | although how long of a committent do they need. and are they ok if I'm only availiable in the evenings |
| 18:30.12 | unum | I guess I could contact the person I'm supposed to.... |
| 18:39.04 | mulicheng | We have a couple CentOS machines on our network. I also shuddered at the OS mention. |
| 18:41.04 | unum | we only have a few centos servers |
| 18:41.23 | unum | and I curse and swear everytime I need a new package, because it means I need a new repository |
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| 18:48.16 | mulicheng | I have to build rpms for them now and then.. |
| 18:50.05 | ^Migs^ | if I wasn't doing another side web project, I would actually contact them |
| 18:50.09 | ^Migs^ | sounds interesting, to say the least |
| 18:52.11 | mulicheng | I'm more interested in application programming. I have a hard time committing to any web or administration work. |
| 18:56.32 | unum | I think I'd rather do admin work than development |
| 18:56.38 | unum | especially web development |
| 18:57.50 | unum | anyone hiked Bechler River? -> http://www.localhikes.com/HikeData.ASP?DispType=3&ActiveHike=0&GetHikesStateID=&ID=4768 |
| 18:57.52 | brac | [LocalHikes - Detailed Hike Information] |
| 18:58.46 | pmcnabb | ^Migs^: mulicheng: They are looking for help with building a solution, which could involve using another distro. If CentOS is the only holdup, I'd still contact him and ask about that. |
| 18:59.38 | mulicheng | Perhaps someone can talk them into custom building some Gentoo machines. Then that person can have contract work forever :) |
| 19:00.38 | sjansen | shakes his head sadly at the rising generation's inability to appreciate CentOS's advantages |
| 19:02.01 | pmcnabb | We run our family server on CentOS, and I've been happy with it (though our family is biased towards RedHat-based software ;) ) |
| 19:02.49 | mulicheng | "The rising generation" heh |
| 19:02.52 | sinuhe | Being Red Hat biased is not difficult, but I don't want to start a flame war. |
| 19:03.47 | mulicheng | I'm not a distro bigot.. I've used quite a few actually. I just don't like having to work hard to install current software. |
| 19:04.33 | mulicheng | hm, think I'll use libXYZ in my project. Crap... latest rpm is libXYZ-<current version - 5> |
| 19:05.24 | ^Migs^ | I was just kidding about CentOS |
| 19:06.10 | ^Migs^ | but contact him anyway and tell him everyone you talked to hates CentOS |
| 19:06.42 | pmcnabb | ^Migs^: I already have. That why I mentioned they're open to using another distro. |
| 19:07.31 | sjansen | mulicheng: Let me guess. You're a programmer, not a sysadmin? |
| 19:07.45 | mulicheng | absolutely. |
| 19:07.57 | mulicheng | I do sysadmin work out of necessity sometimes. |
| 19:08.27 | sjansen | CentOS isn't designed for programmers. It's designed for professions who want to keep a service running for a long time with the least maintenance. |
| 19:08.27 | ^Migs^ | I do both, but I'm better as a programmer |
| 19:08.34 | mulicheng | I'm quite adept at most Linux needs and a lot of network stuff, but frankly, I'm must more interested in C, Python, C++ etc. |
| 19:08.35 | ^Migs^ | pffft |
| 19:08.43 | ^Migs^ | less maintenance = less $$$ for me |
| 19:08.54 | ^Migs^ | I want job security! |
| 19:09.12 | mulicheng | Install Gentoo! |
| 19:09.16 | ^Migs^ | word |
| 19:10.21 | sjansen | As far as I'm concerned, you can't be a really good programmer until you understand how sysadmins think and why they're right, not programmers. |
| 19:10.48 | ^Migs^ | Or just think about how Migs is always right. Problem solved. |
| 19:11.57 | sjansen | Call me an old fogey, but's just plain depressing watching Linux being taken over my single-boxers who have no problem with requiring weekly reboots. |
| 19:12.22 | goozbach | ohh boy, if I could only have my dream... |
| 19:12.34 | goozbach | rebuild my entire system here on postgres, without mysql |
| 19:12.41 | goozbach | and everything running centos 5.3 |
| 19:12.46 | mulicheng | So you can't be a good programmer if you say to the sysadmin "our customers want feature xyz, the boss says that is a great idea, we can make more money if we do that, and the sysadmin says.. I can't support that, it's too hard to upgrade our server." |
| 19:12.46 | goozbach | *sigh* |
| 19:13.14 | goozbach | mulicheng: that's the reason you use centos, |
| 19:13.23 | mulicheng | hm, recalls the uptime on my servers... 656, 572 etc. |
| 19:13.35 | sjansen | mulicheng: You can't be a good programmer if you can't understand the needs of a sysadmin and work together to come to a compromise. |
| 19:13.35 | goozbach | mulicheng: you are a single boxer |
| 19:13.47 | goozbach | it's obivous |
| 19:13.57 | mulicheng | I have 9 physical servers with about 14 virtual servers. |
| 19:14.03 | unum | I thought I was applying for a sysadmin job but spend most of my time programming |
| 19:14.13 | sjansen | Most programmers want to use the latest tech because it's sexy. They have no problem convincing themselves that using bleeding edge libraries is the only option. |
| 19:14.40 | sjansen | Sometimes it is necessary to use bleeding edge tech, but it's much more rare than most programmers think. |
| 19:15.28 | sjansen | Believe me, I'm a programmer at heart. But I had it beaten out of me by real world experience. |
| 19:15.41 | mulicheng | Hey, I'm still using Python 2.5 |
| 19:15.49 | pmcnabb | mulicheng: Lucky |
| 19:16.09 | mulicheng | yeah, lucky that most distros upgraded from 2.4 |
| 19:16.19 | mulicheng | CentOS poke again. |
| 19:16.38 | pmcnabb | mulicheng: That's not the point. Existing systems that have been running forever are not going to be updated |
| 19:16.42 | sjansen | mulicheng: Python 2.5 is what, a year old? That's still "bleeding edge" by the definition of most sysadmins. |
| 19:17.08 | sjansen | Just because a server was built 2 years ago, that doesn't mean it should be scrapped. |
| 19:17.15 | mulicheng | Python 2.6.x and 3.x are quite a bit more bleeding edge from the programmer point of view than 2.5 is. |
| 19:17.35 | sjansen | So? |
| 19:17.48 | mulicheng | So my point is that my distros use 2.5 so I use 2.5 |
| 19:17.53 | mulicheng | I'm agreeing with you |
| 19:17.59 | sjansen | Who cares about programmers? They don't get paged at 2am because when production goes down. |
| 19:18.09 | unum | I do |
| 19:19.10 | unum | of course when I'm introduced to clients I "work with the computers" |
| 19:19.13 | sjansen | Pretty much the only enterprise Linux release with Python 2.5 is SLES11, but I doubt you're using SLES. |
| 19:19.37 | sjansen | Let me bet that you're using Ubuntu, specifically 9.04 because you don't see the advantage of 8.04 LTS. |
| 19:20.07 | goozbach | sjansen: that sounds like a good idea |
| 19:20.18 | goozbach | make a paging hook into each line of source code |
| 19:20.39 | goozbach | when something breaks on a line you're in the "blame file" for, *YOU* get paged with the sysadmin |
| 19:22.14 | mulicheng | I'm not working on web software right now. |
| 19:22.29 | JoshH | debian lenny has 2.5 |
| 19:22.35 | JoshH | it's enterprise enough |
| 19:22.41 | mulicheng | so the python apps I'm running are deployed to desktops, and most of them are Fedora 8, a few Fedora 10, and some CentOS. |
| 19:22.42 | sjansen | Hardly. |
| 19:22.45 | goozbach | lenny == 5.0? |
| 19:22.49 | JoshH | yes |
| 19:22.52 | goozbach | I can never keep them straight |
| 19:23.00 | sjansen | Now that Debian has finally gotten its act together, each release is only supported for about 2 years. |
| 19:23.02 | goozbach | debian shouldn't be refered to by name, just by number |
| 19:23.09 | JoshH | i never even pay attention to the numbers |
| 19:23.17 | JoshH | about 3, sjansen |
| 19:23.37 | goozbach | 3 years I can handle |
| 19:23.41 | JoshH | however long it takes for the next release, then one year after release date |
| 19:23.52 | sjansen | Back when Debian required an entire ice age between releases, calling it an enterprise distro could be done while keeping a straight face. Not today. |
| 19:24.01 | redbeard2 | if only we had some magical sequencial numbering system in place, so that people could refer to releases by a value that makes sense (especially in relationship to other releases) instead of using meaningless names |
| 19:24.32 | JoshH | it's only non-enterprise in that it isn't officially supported by a lot of commercial software, and it doesn't have corporate support |
| 19:24.42 | JoshH | but most people agree that it makes for a fine server |
| 19:25.29 | sjansen | Only people who aren't scared witless by repeated demonstrations that Debian is held hostage by politics the likes of which no distro has ever had to content with. |
| 19:25.31 | JoshH | personally i wouldn't work somewhere that made me mess around with SUSE |
| 19:25.40 | JoshH | but my standards are higher than average |
| 19:26.34 | sjansen | Nah, I think most people recognize that SLES is the most frustrating of all available choices. |
| 19:27.25 | JoshH | if i was running commercial enterprise software, that i needed support for, that was only supported on an enterprise distro, i'd use redhat |
| 19:27.28 | JoshH | for all other cases, i'd use debian |
| 19:28.09 | sjansen | Debian politics scare me too much. A single DD throwing a hissy fit can cause an incredible amount of damage. |
| 19:28.34 | JoshH | cases of actual damage are rare |
| 19:28.52 | JoshH | if you just run the stable distro, you can generally ignore the behind the scenes drama |
| 19:30.03 | sjansen | At least Ubuntu has drawn away most of the crazies who used to run Debian Unstable on their servers. |
| 19:30.17 | mulicheng | lol true |
| 19:30.43 | JoshH | also people who think they need 5 years of support, even though only 20 or 30 packages are supported for that long |
| 19:31.06 | goozbach | JoshH: I just turned off some hardware we had for 7 years |
| 19:31.17 | sjansen | Yeah, Ubuntu LTS is a scam when you study the details. |
| 19:31.24 | goozbach | ohh |
| 19:31.28 | goozbach | commnenting on LTS |
| 19:31.51 | JoshH | ubuntu lts is a fine server distro, you just can't believe the claims without understanding the details |
| 19:32.00 | eggyknap | At a previous job, the phones died. We yelled at the guy in charge of 'em for quite a while, until someone pointed out that the system had been bought, used, before said phone system admin was even born :) |
| 19:32.22 | JoshH | but basically, most choices really come down whether you prefer the debian or redhat style of administration |
| 19:32.27 | JoshH | personally i've always liked debian better |
| 19:35.35 | harleypig | GENTOO! |
| 19:36.13 | sjansen | My experience is that most people who claim preference for Debian have never learned RHEL in depth. Which leads them to ridiculous complaints like comparing RPM to APT (apples and oranges) instead of RPM to DPKG and YUM to APT. |
| 19:36.18 | mulicheng | I've played with Gentoo. I'm sure LTS sysadmins hate it and programmers love it. |
| 19:36.52 | JoshH | nothign is worse than accepting a small consulting gig, fixing something setup by a long gone admin ages ago, getting to the server, and finding gentoo, reiserfs, tons of tweaks, and important services that don't come up after a reboot |
| 19:37.20 | sjansen | Most people who use RHEL, on the other hand, don't even have Debian on their radar since Debian doesn't feel RHEL users with a sense of inadequacy the way RHEL makes Debian users feel unloved and ignored in the professional market. |
| 19:37.26 | mulicheng | charges extra for upgrading a gentoo box! |
| 19:38.06 | JoshH | most RHEL users i know are business type admins who use the full gui on their servers |
| 19:38.15 | JoshH | and who hire consultants for the dirty work |
| 19:38.20 | JoshH | which is fine if you're into consulting |
| 19:39.06 | sjansen | Since I'm one of the few who has taken the time to learn RHEL, SLES and Debian/Ubuntu, I get pissed when Debian/Ubuntu users start spouting off without knowing what they're talking about. |
| 19:39.12 | JoshH | seems like it's userbase consists of a mix of those, and real enterprises |
| 19:40.31 | JoshH | centos is popular with the techies who prefer the red hat style but don't need to care about enterprise worthiness |
| 19:41.07 | sjansen | I'd quibble a little. CentOS is for those that can't get budget approval for RHEL. |
| 19:41.18 | JoshH | suse is for people who need the enterprise stuff, but who also had very traumatic childhoods and harbor suppressed memories of all kinds of horrific abuse |
| 19:42.37 | goozbach | if you've got sysadmin resources, sometimes it makes sense to go with Centos |
| 19:42.53 | sjansen | Cent requires being more plugged into ongoing development, but not as much as Debian. Cent also requires a willingness to live dangerously during the delay between RHEL updates and CentOS updates. |
| 19:43.09 | goozbach | sjansen: true |
| 19:43.24 | goozbach | but how many RHEL admins get the updates installed inside that window anyhow |
| 19:43.25 | goozbach | ? |
| 19:46.32 | sjansen | All good sysadmins who are allowed to treat administration as their primary responsibility, instead of being required to pull double duty as developers and admins at the same time. |
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| 19:58.58 | mulicheng | Pulling double duty is the pits. |
| 19:59.05 | mulicheng | Neither job gets done as good as it could be. |
| 20:00.11 | sjansen | Because while both jobs require technical aptitude and good trouble shooting skills, in just about every other way they are polar opposites. |
| 20:02.40 | sjansen | People have no problem distinguishing between an architect and a general contractor, but throw in a computer and suddenly programmers and sysadmins look like the same creature. |
| 20:04.15 | JoshH | people find out you know stuff about computers, and expect you to be able to answer their questions about microsoft word |
| 20:05.04 | JoshH | then when you can't answer it, they huff and puff and figure you don't actually know anything and consider you a fraud |
| 20:06.24 | sjansen | I haven't had that problem, but then my response is always "I don't use Windows". |
| 20:06.49 | goozbach | sjansen: in your analgy which is which? |
| 20:07.04 | goozbach | architech is the programmer, general contractor == sysadmin? |
| 20:07.05 | JoshH | mine is too, but it doesn't help |
| 20:07.12 | JoshH | at least not always |
| 20:07.26 | maquis | i still get a lot of questions about how to do this, that and the other thing |
| 20:07.35 | maquis | most of it is simple enough that i do know how to do it |
| 20:07.38 | sjansen | goozbach: correct |
| 20:07.57 | maquis | but when i can't figure something out on my mom's mac, she always asks why i went to school for 4 years if i don't know how to do it... |
| 20:07.59 | JoshH | i had a voice mail from my aunt the other day saying something about how they uninstalled some weather program and then the screensaver stopped working |
| 20:08.06 | JoshH | naturally, i never called her back |
| 20:08.33 | ^Migs^ | new auto-tune the news! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fngEnIkz44 |
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| 20:16.01 | elg | writing is painful |
| 20:16.04 | elg | not in a "my finger is smashed in the door" kind of way |
| 20:16.13 | elg | more like "my back hurts and hasn't stopped hurting for 2 weeks" kind of way |
| 20:16.33 | elg | except that with writing, you can just not write. not so with back pain |
| 20:16.46 | unum | it sounds like you need some new ergonomics |
| 20:16.59 | elg | so writing beats back pain, because you can take breaks |
| 20:17.09 | elg | unum: for my back pain? |
| 20:17.17 | elg | or do you mean mental ergonomics? |
| 20:17.26 | unum | ya for your back pain |
| 20:18.01 | sjansen | The only reliable tip I've ever heard for making writing less painful is making yourself write daily. Preferably for a newspaper while living hand to mouth. |
| 20:18.04 | elg | my back pain, which isn't as bad as my example back pain, but does exist (are you psychic?) is mostly because of my backpack and walking, and my stubborn refusal to do situps. |
| 20:18.37 | elg | sjansen: that does help. at least, it helps you actually do the writing |
| 20:18.47 | elg | but it doesn't completely dull the pain of actually writing |
| 20:20.03 | Supaplex | it's also easy to want someone else to do it. |
| 20:20.23 | elg | someone else to do my situps? |
| 20:21.04 | Supaplex | the writing... |
| 20:27.51 | maquis | elg: you think writing is painful? |
| 20:28.10 | elg | not all writing, but yes |
| 20:28.20 | unum | I mean you need better ergonomics for your example back pain |
| 20:28.21 | maquis | what are you writing that's painful? |
| 20:28.33 | unum | but I thought you meant the pain was in your hands |
| 20:28.35 | elg | my dissertation |
| 20:28.55 | maquis | doesn't like writing stuff that's assigned, but loves to do short stories, journal-writing, etc... |
| 20:28.58 | unum | I feel like I have a heavy wait on my chest when I try to write stuff like that |
| 20:29.09 | elg | i like to write in irc, email, blogs |
| 20:29.19 | maquis | seriously, if i don't get a chance to at least write a post every day on the creative-writing RPG i play, I get really crabby |
| 20:29.23 | elg | even papers if i'm interested in the subject |
| 20:29.23 | unum | I like to write in the snow |
| 20:29.41 | unum | has never actually written in the snow |
| 20:29.46 | maquis | if i get to write in a notebook with a nice fountain pen for an hour or so each day, it puts me in a good mood |
| 20:29.48 | elg | likely story |
| 20:30.03 | elg | maquis: wanna write my dissertation? |
| 20:30.09 | maquis | the quality of the pen has a significant impact on my enjoyment of writing, though... |
| 20:30.12 | elg | you can use a fountain pen. |
| 20:30.19 | maquis | elg: you gonna buy me a new fountain pen for it? |
| 20:30.39 | elg | sure. i'll reimburse you |
| 20:30.57 | elg | i'll even make the graphs. that part's kinda fun |
| 20:31.09 | maquis | can i write it as a work of fiction? |
| 20:31.20 | elg | it can only be as fictional as my research |
| 20:31.38 | maquis | hmmm... i don't have to be the one defending it, so i guess i can probably write whatever i want |
| 20:31.49 | maquis | i doubt anyone actually reads the middle section anyways |
| 20:32.40 | elg | you know how you get sick and you know you'll feel better once you just throw up? |
| 20:32.58 | elg | I feel like it'll be much better after my head explodes |
| 20:33.20 | elg | i know how to gag myself, but I'm not sure how to trigger a head explosion |
| 20:33.22 | maquis | elg: no... i'm pregnant... i don't feel better afterwards... |
| 20:33.33 | elg | see, you're pregnant, not sick |
| 20:33.39 | maquis | ... |
| 20:33.53 | maquis | hmmm... |
| 20:34.03 | elg | nauseaous, yes |
| 20:34.24 | elg | but not all nausea is caused by the kind of stomach bug that goes away after you hurl |
| 20:34.38 | maquis | to trigger a head explosion, you want to cross your eyes, then concentrate really hard on something while holding your breath and simultaneously trying to blow the air out your ears |
| 20:38.09 | goozbach | don't forget to hold your nose |
| 20:38.15 | maquis | yeah |
| 20:38.22 | maquis | hmmm... maybe it worked? |
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| 21:08.34 | jshipley | right, the worst kind is the nausea that, after vomiting, turns into long minutes of dry heaving, followed by feeling horrible for hours. |
| 21:08.59 | jshipley | well, the worst kind is the kind that you die from, but the dry heaving kind is still bad |
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| 22:02.21 | TimRiker | synic: (lagged reply) no idea. there is a cafepress store at least, I don't know where they are either. |
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| 23:14.23 | maquis | ~whaleslap emcnabb_ |
| 23:14.24 | ibot | ACTION beats emcnabb_ upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 23:17.17 | pmcnabb | emcnabb_: Hi |
| 23:19.23 | macnewbold | this morning I heard a great tale of outsourcing and how it can go terribly wrong... http://dojo.codegreene.com/?p=295 |
| 23:27.20 | *** join/#utah bonez46 (n=scott@75-145-58-209-Utah.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 23:30.40 | bonez46 | I have a windows system I need to back up.. it's on my network and I have access to it.. suggestions? I'd like to back up all the data files, registry, and all that stuff, so that I can have the backup, tarred.. on my linux box, but also I will be running the few win programs on a virtual box installation on my linux box.. |
| 23:30.44 | bonez46 | Suggestions? |
| 23:35.30 | bonez46 | is this thing on? can you read me? |
| 23:42.29 | Sargun_screen | no |
| 23:42.44 | bonez46 | that explains it.. |
| 23:42.48 | Sargun_screen | uhm, I recommend an image based backup |
| 23:43.59 | Sargun_screen | http://www.partimage.org/Main_Page |
| 23:44.04 | Sargun_screen | http://freshmeat.net/projects/g4l/ |
| 23:44.09 | Sargun_screen | http://www.clonezilla.org/ |
| 23:44.15 | brac | [Clonezilla] |
| 23:49.07 | bonez46 | so I can clone that drive.. a 10 gb drive and write the image to my 250 gb drive . |
| 23:50.08 | Sargun_screen | sure, why not |
| 23:52.04 | bonez46 | ok. |