| 00:00.19 | RyanE | btw, the 1.7.2 docs have a few more functions in them than the 1.7.1 I sent you the link to, but they're not quite ready for primetime yet. |
| 00:06.39 | bbeattie | ryane: I didn't see the 1.7.2 link |
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| 00:19.45 | *** mode/#utah [+o Jayce^] by ChanServ |
| 00:22.47 | maquis | ~rlart |
| 00:22.48 | ibot | nabs the moon and broadsides lnchdsl with the sea of tranquility |
| 00:26.16 | *** join/#utah Rolcol (n=Rolcol@unaffiliated/rolcol) |
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| 00:50.59 | tarrant | So I went by Circuit City to check out their '80% off'. Most items there cost more with the '80% off' then to buy them on Newegg in the first place. |
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| 01:24.25 | Rolcol | Does anyone know of basic software that all that needs to do is be able to play back clips of video full screen in a row in different orders decided by the user? |
| 01:26.39 | *** part/#utah sinuhe (n=user@hq-nat2.gurulabs.com) |
| 01:27.10 | goozbach | Rolcol: mplayer? |
| 01:27.15 | Rolcol | This is a request from my dad. I'm looking for something user-simpler than VLC. He's in radio + TV and the commercials are still being put on manually. |
| 01:27.40 | Rolcol | mplayer in the same boat as vlc. Technology challenged |
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| 02:37.50 | brac | puts Icy-Hot in Tene's lip balm |
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| 02:53.36 | *** mode/#utah [+v elg] by ChanServ |
| 02:54.01 | vontrapp_ | -lart elg |
| 02:54.01 | brac | uses the "Customer Appreciation Bat" on elg |
| 02:54.06 | vontrapp_ | ~lart elg |
| 02:54.07 | ibot | whips out his power stapler and staples elg's foot to the floor |
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| 02:56.15 | elg | -lart vontrapp_ |
| 02:56.15 | brac | puts lye in vontrapp_'s coffee |
| 02:56.41 | vontrapp | missed me :p |
| 03:04.30 | tarrant | So any recommendations on cheap, php + mysql hosting I can recommend to my sister? |
| 03:07.22 | Sargun_Screen | hoow did the interview go? |
| 03:07.51 | tarrant | Good I think. |
| 03:08.33 | Sargun_Screen | dreamhost |
| 03:08.51 | tarrant | It was short, she wanted me to meet me and for me to meet her before she gives me the go for the full interview. The only problem might be that I applied for the job last week when I saw it on monster. Hopefully that won't be an issue. |
| 03:09.24 | tarrant | Basically I was stressing way too much over nothing. :) But hey better to be overprepared than under. |
| 03:12.33 | tarrant | Sargun: Thanks dreamhost is pretty much what I was looking for. |
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| 03:25.13 | *** mode/#utah [+v elg] by ChanServ |
| 03:37.19 | levi | Good evening, #utah. |
| 04:06.27 | levi | Arg, I got a jury summons in the mail today. :( |
| 04:06.48 | Tene | argh |
| 04:07.38 | Tene | that's too bad |
| 04:07.50 | Tene | so, I guess I'm presenting on Parrot at PLUG next week. |
| 04:08.15 | levi | Really going to do it this time? |
| 04:08.20 | Tene | Heh. |
| 04:08.50 | Tene | I certainly plan to. |
| 04:11.34 | Tene | I'm vaguely wondering if I should do my "generic imperative language" instead of scheme |
| 04:12.28 | Tene | I don't know how prevalent the "scheme/lisp are weird; I don't like them" thing is, and if I should worry about it being a distraction. |
| 04:14.44 | Tene | Unlikely to actually be an issue. Just vaguely wondering. |
| 04:15.32 | levi | Beats me. People who thinks scheme/lisp are weird aren't really worthy of consideration anyway. ;) |
| 04:15.40 | Tene | Heh. |
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| 04:57.57 | levi | So, I've got a bunch of stuff to freshen up my old 70s road bike. |
| 04:58.20 | levi | New bar tape, brake hoods, brake pads, and rim tape. |
| 04:59.32 | tarrant | Tene: do they record Plug meetings? |
| 05:19.02 | Tene | tarrant: not that I've ever seen |
| 05:19.26 | tarrant | Cool thanks. |
| 05:20.00 | RyanE | I think they might broadcast them, though. |
| 05:20.04 | RyanE | ask Clint. |
| 05:20.37 | RyanE | herlo: do you record the PLUG meetings, or just broadcast them? |
| 05:22.40 | fozzmoo | RyanE: both. |
| 05:23.12 | fozzmoo | http://podcast.utos.org/ |
| 05:23.26 | tarrant | foozmoo: Thanks |
| 05:23.36 | fozzmoo | That is, when someone is there to do the recording. |
| 05:23.57 | fozzmoo | I often show up and videotape it and then sit on it for months before editing it. :) |
| 05:24.14 | fozzmoo | it's my talent. |
| 05:24.15 | fozzmoo | Sitting. |
| 05:26.14 | Tene | Fozz is good at sitting. |
| 05:26.20 | Tene | I've seen him do it for hours at a time. |
| 05:26.37 | Tene | I've never been able to sit still like he does. |
| 05:27.23 | tarrant | fozzmoo: Well if you get a chance to record Tene's presentation I would love to see it. |
| 05:27.55 | Tene | If you could pre-record it, that would be even better. Then you could just play it for everyone and I wouldn't have to do anything. |
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| 05:41.54 | RyanE | and while you're at it, pre-record mine, too. |
| 05:42.08 | tarrant | What are you presenting RyanE? |
| 05:42.41 | RyanE | Home Automation with Control4 and how we use Linux... I don't have the details quite yet. |
| 05:42.55 | tarrant | Nice |
| 05:43.01 | RyanE | we shall see... :) |
| 06:04.01 | levi | WTF, my wife just went into a lengthy digression about how awful I was at maintaining our lawn last year. |
| 06:04.34 | RyanE | nice. |
| 06:04.48 | RyanE | I need to get to IFA and get some spring fertilizer... Should've done it last week. |
| 06:05.33 | levi | I never give her any crap about not doing laundry every week, etc. Sheesh. |
| 06:05.34 | RyanE | Fortunately for me, my 14-yo now mows. |
| 06:05.37 | RyanE | heh |
| 06:06.39 | levi | If you're going to interrupt what I'm doing to chat with me for half an hour, at least don't spend a good chunk of it criticizing me! |
| 06:09.39 | levi | Anyway, I've got the day off from work tomorrow, and I plan on enjoying it. :) |
| 06:10.36 | RyanE | you should get right on that lawn... :) |
| 06:11.16 | levi | Gonna spend a little time fixing up the bike, a little bit of time cleaning the garage, do some reading, and yeah, maybe a little bit of yard work. |
| 06:11.29 | levi | Maybe work on my old Miata, too. |
| 06:16.20 | RyanE | Enjoy the time off. |
| 06:28.52 | levi | I earned it working 13-15 hours through the weekend. :) |
| 06:55.51 | Tene | So, Template::Declare is a pretty nice web templating library for perl. I'm thinking of porting it to Perl 6. |
| 06:56.04 | Tene | It turns out to not be threadsafe, though. |
| 06:57.07 | Tene | If i can't think of a better implementation, I might just use the same implementation anyway. |
| 06:57.15 | Tene | It would be ideal if I could avoid it, though. |
| 07:07.26 | levi | Bah, who needs more than one thread anyway? ;) |
| 07:07.59 | RyanE | Back in my day, you only had one thread for the WHOLE OS... and you only had 48K and YOU LIKED IT!... :) |
| 07:09.46 | Tene | Well, with some of the autothreading stuff in Perl 6, it starts to become more likely you'll run into problems |
| 07:11.08 | levi | RyanE: I'm using uC/OS for a project at work. The original version, which was published in a magazine years ago. :) |
| 07:11.49 | levi | It does, at least, have multiple threads/tasks. |
| 07:12.14 | RyanE | Yeah, I was thinking Apple ][... |
| 07:13.41 | levi | You can make a multitasking OS for any system with a timer interrupt. It just might not be very fancy. :) |
| 07:17.26 | RyanE | and you'd be out of your mind to do it for something that old. |
| 07:18.30 | levi | These days, yes. You can get a far more powerful processor for a couple of bucks. |
| 07:28.11 | Sargun | Astroturf it |
| 07:28.28 | Sargun | RyanE, REALLY? |
| 07:28.54 | Sargun | RyanE, are you that old, you had to program around 48k of RAM, and not even cooperative multitasking? |
| 07:30.04 | RyanE | Yes and no... We had an Apple ][ when I was growing up (we got it in Dec. '78), and that was the first machine I programmed on. |
| 07:30.31 | RyanE | but no, I didn't have to code around 48k... |
| 07:30.51 | Sargun | didn't the apple 2 have cooperative multitasking |
| 07:30.56 | levi | The first Apple ][ apparently had 4Kb of RAM and ran at 1 Mhz. |
| 07:30.59 | RyanE | and cooperative multitasking didn't really happen on Apples until the Apple ][gs... |
| 07:31.15 | RyanE | levi: but you could put up to 48k on the mainboard, and another 16k on the language card. |
| 07:31.25 | Sargun | what differentiated the GS? |
| 07:31.32 | levi | ... |
| 07:31.33 | RyanE | different architecture. |
| 07:31.44 | RyanE | different OS, but backwards-compatible for apps. |
| 07:31.45 | levi | Man, Sargun is truly from another era. |
| 07:31.53 | Sargun | levi, hehe |
| 07:31.54 | RyanE | no doubt. |
| 07:32.11 | Sargun | RyanE, well, you don't really need hardware support, do you |
| 07:32.33 | levi | I learned to program on the Apple ][. |
| 07:32.42 | RyanE | heh. not now... :) |
| 07:32.54 | RyanE | gots me device drivers and a fancy multitasking OS. |
| 07:33.46 | levi | Back then, computers came with a technical manual and schematics. |
| 07:34.12 | Sargun | o.O |
| 07:34.13 | RyanE | the entire Monitor ROM was printed in the RED book which came with the ][. |
| 07:34.17 | Sargun | you got schematics |
| 07:34.25 | RyanE | I think it was 8-10 pages of assembly |
| 07:34.28 | Sargun | RyanE, the code? |
| 07:34.32 | RyanE | yep. printed out. |
| 07:34.46 | Sargun | long hand? |
| 07:34.47 | Sargun | holy crap |
| 07:34.50 | RyanE | you also got it on the ROM chip... :) |
| 07:35.06 | Sargun | so... weird... |
| 07:35.24 | RyanE | at least it was assembly, not just machine language... :) |
| 07:36.03 | levi | RyanE: I imagine Sargun feels something like how I felt listening to Alan Kay and his contemporaries chatting about the computers of their youth at the reception following his Organick lecture. |
| 07:36.14 | Sargun | apparently some of my friends who are from your era, nearly double my age, could edit machine code with a hex editor... |
| 07:36.43 | levi | Sure, why not? |
| 07:36.58 | RyanE | I could for a while. |
| 07:37.27 | levi | They probably wrote code in assembly, and it's only a short translation from assembly to machine language in hex. |
| 07:37.28 | RyanE | 6502 assembly was pretty simple. You could keep most of it in your head. And the stuff you couldn't was like fancy jumps with offsets, etc. that you didn't use as often. |
| 07:38.06 | RyanE | and the Monitor ROM had a built-in disassembler. So you would just say 'List memory locations XXXX-XXXX', and it would list it, disassembling it as it listed. |
| 07:38.20 | RyanE | so the Monitor ROM was the hex editor as well... |
| 07:38.27 | levi | I had a bunch of guys in my cube the other day debugging a network expansion card for an amplifier, and we were reading hex values out of an I2S line on a scope. |
| 07:39.18 | levi | Part of my first computer arch class at BYU had us writing code on a Mac SE into the debugger in hex. |
| 07:39.30 | Sargun | I write x86 assembly... I can't read machine code... |
| 07:39.46 | levi | x86 assembly is an abomination. |
| 07:40.14 | levi | And you don't read machine code because you don't live and breathe assembly programming. |
| 07:40.38 | RyanE | levi: was that 143? On the Apple MACs? |
| 07:40.48 | levi | RyanE: Yup. |
| 07:41.04 | RyanE | When I took 143, before my mission, it was on the Apple ]['s. When I returned, they'd switched to the MACs |
| 07:41.18 | Sargun | Did you guys listen to music on laser disc? |
| 07:41.40 | levi | laser discs were for movies. |
| 07:41.46 | Sargun | er, yeah, movies |
| 07:41.57 | levi | Geez, get your ancient technology straight. :) |
| 07:42.00 | Sargun | levi, yeah, why would I live and breath assembly today. I only dive into ASM for optimization, and hunting down stupid compiler bugs. |
| 07:42.09 | RyanE | My brother-in-law had a LD player. We watched The 10 Commandments on it. Awesome. |
| 07:42.44 | levi | Sargun: You probably wouldn't, unless you were doing really tiny embedded systems. |
| 07:43.19 | levi | We had a Beta VCR, and then a SVHS VCR. |
| 07:44.38 | Sargun | o.O |
| 07:44.58 | Sargun | VHSs were being phased out as I hit 10 years old. |
| 07:45.09 | RyanE | ouch. |
| 07:45.14 | levi | Yes, we know you're a baby. |
| 07:45.23 | Sargun | old men. |
| 07:45.38 | RyanE | hey, somebody had to create the world you live in... :) |
| 07:46.03 | levi | Hey, we're *still* creating the world you live in. |
| 07:47.25 | Sargun | and we're destroying it. |
| 07:47.36 | RyanE | heh |
| 07:48.54 | levi | Nah, you're not old enough to destroy it yet. That's all our generation, too. |
| 07:49.03 | levi | And the previous one. |
| 07:49.38 | Sargun | you don't think our music & social networking are destroying the world |
| 07:50.39 | levi | No, do you? |
| 07:52.24 | Sargun | I think Rap music is... |
| 07:52.50 | RyanE | if Rap is destroying the world, it's 'slow-acting'... |
| 07:52.58 | levi | Nah, it's the Country music that will be the downfall of the world! |
| 07:53.07 | Sargun | that thing too. |
| 07:54.04 | levi | Some Rap is awesome. Same for some Country. |
| 07:56.14 | levi | Rapper's Delight FTW! ;) |
| 07:59.45 | tarrant | Sargun: how old are you, if you don't mind me asking? |
| 08:00.35 | tarrant | Levi: I think for both rap and country its largely a matter of what its about. At least for me. |
| 08:00.59 | Sargun | tarrant, 18 years, 3 months, 3 days. |
| 08:01.06 | Sargun | 3**2+3**2=18 |
| 08:01.30 | RyanE | My guess was 19. |
| 08:01.33 | Sargun | tarrant, you? |
| 08:01.48 | tarrant | I feel way behind now. 18, 7 months |
| 08:01.59 | Sargun | how many days? |
| 08:02.20 | tarrant | I started linux when I was 14, it was on and off and only 2 years or so ago that I got semi-serious. |
| 08:02.36 | Sargun | I started at 12 |
| 08:02.42 | Sargun | Installed gentoo at 14. |
| 08:02.48 | tarrant | *tips hat* |
| 08:03.06 | Sargun | hehehe, @ xkcd |
| 08:03.26 | tarrant | <- Debian at 14, Ubuntu at 15, then slackware at 16. |
| 08:03.46 | Sargun | when did you go all linux? |
| 08:04.22 | levi | I care more about the sound of a song than what it's about. |
| 08:04.34 | tarrant | Debian really confused me, My father introduced me to the ideas of a free os, but I had no one there to actually introduce me to the concepts of unix, and programming. Its largely been self discovery at a much slower pace than if I had someone to push me. Something I'm attempting to rectify for my younger siblings. |
| 08:04.38 | Sargun | levi, what bands do you like? |
| 08:05.11 | Sargun | don't they'll only compete with you in the future job market |
| 08:05.24 | tarrant | levi: For me its both, almost equally. With both rap and country my dislike has little to do with the sound, and almost all to do with the content. |
| 08:05.27 | levi | My dad introduced me to programming... on the Apple ][. He wrote programs to help quiz me on my multiplication tables. |
| 08:05.48 | Sargun | my father was an insurance agent. |
| 08:06.03 | RyanE | mine was in the printing business. |
| 08:06.11 | levi | tarrant: I hate the sound of today's pop country music, but Johnny Cash and some of today's alt-country stuff is awesome. |
| 08:06.28 | Sargun | tarrant, what bands do you like3 |
| 08:06.51 | tarrant | levi: agree with the Johnny Cash, when I was living in Nebraska there were a few pop-country songs that I did pick up. |
| 08:07.35 | tarrant | Sargun: Bright Eyes, Shins, and Postal Service are some of my favorites. Styles: Techno, Indie, and Classic Rock (Doors, Styx, Queen) |
| 08:08.04 | levi | I love the Shins. |
| 08:08.06 | Sargun | that's acceptable |
| 08:08.24 | tarrant | Techno is a blast because I can put it on, loud, and then zone out everything else in the world. |
| 08:08.25 | levi | Heh, "that's acceptable"? Like you're some arbiter of musical taste? |
| 08:08.33 | Sargun | I'm a fan of Cake, Nine inch Nails, Skinny Puppy... |
| 08:08.54 | levi | Sargun: They aren't even your generation. |
| 08:08.59 | Sargun | Linkin Park. |
| 08:09.10 | Sargun | Some Steriogram is cool. |
| 08:09.42 | tarrant | Well my brother wants to go take a crack at Gurps, so have fun all. Talk to you later. |
| 08:09.54 | Sargun | Gurps? |
| 08:10.07 | Sargun | what are these gurps? |
| 08:10.11 | levi | Role playing game. |
| 08:10.14 | tarrant | Generic Universal Roleplaying system. Its like D&D on crack. |
| 08:10.15 | Sargun | Ah. |
| 08:10.23 | Sargun | Crack is good. |
| 08:10.29 | levi | That's from my generation, too. |
| 08:10.42 | Sargun | levi, damn you old people. |
| 08:10.51 | RyanE | which, Crack, or D&D? :) |
| 08:10.59 | tarrant | Hey both Gurps 4 and D&D 4 is my generation. (Except I grew up on 3rd D&D, how does that work) |
| 08:11.00 | levi | Heh. Both. :) |
| 08:11.18 | RyanE | I used to play D&D in my friend's basement in Jr. High. Like '80 or '82... |
| 08:11.26 | levi | I've got a set of Rolemaster books, and some Palladium games. |
| 08:11.28 | RyanE | good times. |
| 08:11.40 | RyanE | I was never DM. |
| 08:12.30 | levi | tarrant: Just 'cause they keep making new editions doesn't mean you get to claim them. :) |
| 08:13.14 | tarrant | :-p No but the fact that I have a 3rd level dwarf wizard in 4e D&D does. |
| 08:13.49 | levi | My brother works for Wizards of the Coast/TSR. |
| 08:14.10 | RyanE | My brother works for Sybase. |
| 08:14.26 | RyanE | not that great for bragging... :) |
| 08:14.28 | Sargun | I lack a brother. |
| 08:14.34 | tarrant | My brother was a video game tester. (So was I) |
| 08:14.40 | RyanE | Sargun: you want mine? :) |
| 08:15.26 | Sargun | only if you take my sister. |
| 08:15.41 | tarrant | all right the sheets are done printing. I'm gone for now, for real. |
| 08:15.43 | RyanE | got plenty of those, no thanks. |
| 08:15.45 | RyanE | later |
| 08:15.52 | levi | I'm going to bed. We old people need our sleep. |
| 08:15.59 | Sargun | Good night Utahns. |
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| 14:08.48 | Supaplex | ~lart morning |
| 14:08.48 | ibot | farts in morning's general direction |
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| 14:26.12 | Sargun | hi |
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| 14:33.35 | eightyeight | you know, i'm sure we could clear the /ban list on chanserv |
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| 15:20.57 | Sargun_Screen | ~seen tensai |
| 15:21.23 | ibot | tensai is currently on #utos #utah. Has said a total of 30 messages. Is idling for 17h 39m 51s, last said: 'maquis: without a tv, how do you keep up on all the pop culture?'. |
| 15:21.24 | tensai | he's over there ---> |
| 15:21.29 | Sargun_Screen | tensai: two questions |
| 15:21.51 | Sargun_Screen | A) How much does it cost you per DID you get from NANPA? |
| 15:22.38 | Sargun_Screen | B) Do you have to pay bandwidth fees to qwest, or do you just pay per circuit fees (on the DSL circuit side) |
| 15:24.05 | tensai | B) just for the circuit |
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| 15:24.33 | tensai | A) recurring or non-recurring? |
| 15:24.43 | Sargun_Screen | Both... |
| 15:25.09 | Sargun_Screen | Well I know the allocations are flat rate per block |
| 15:25.42 | Sargun_Screen | but, are there recurring fees rather than the yearly block renewal fees? |
| 15:25.44 | tensai | well to be honest, I don't know so it's kind of a moot question |
| 15:26.23 | Sargun_Screen | hmmm |
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| 15:31.47 | Sargun_Screen | Really the only way of getting national coverage of DIDs is by taking advantage of VoIP |
| 15:31.55 | Sargun_Screen | or someone with national peering links. |
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| 16:07.08 | Sargun | Anyone here used Dell tower servers? |
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| 16:08.51 | sjansen | Attention please! |
| 16:08.52 | sjansen | http://thefinancebuff.com/2009/03/redefining-played-by-the-rules.html |
| 16:08.56 | sjansen | Thank you, that is all. |
| 16:14.51 | utahcon1 | Pay 20% down... it would take me 30 years to save up 20% down :( |
| 16:15.24 | Sargun | utahcon1, then maybe you don't deserve to own a house. |
| 16:15.47 | utahcon1 | guess not. |
| 16:16.05 | Sargun | You're not quite in the socioeconomic tier which enables you to purchase a home. |
| 16:16.10 | utahcon1 | Sucks that I have to continue to just throw money out the window while renting. |
| 16:16.41 | Sargun | does it? |
| 16:16.48 | utahcon1 | It does for me. |
| 16:16.50 | Sargun | you could always go homeless.... |
| 16:16.53 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=Jake@67.208.136.68) |
| 16:16.56 | utahcon1 | That would suck more. |
| 16:16.58 | jshipley | utahcon1: It would also depend on how much you're spending on a house. $15,000 is easier to save up than $50,000, and the mortgage payments on 150k would be a lot smaller than mortgage payments on 500k |
| 16:17.00 | Sargun | Since when do you matter? |
| 16:17.01 | *** join/#utah fcodiaz (n=francisc@70.102.172.126) |
| 16:17.04 | utahcon1 | But I wouldn't be tossing money. |
| 16:17.23 | ^Migs^ | jshipley, thanks Captain Obvious. |
| 16:17.27 | ^Migs^ | ;) |
| 16:17.44 | Sargun | jshipley, you can buy a house for $150,000? Wtf? |
| 16:17.54 | ^Migs^ | my house was only $140,000 |
| 16:18.07 | Sargun | o.O |
| 16:18.12 | ^Migs^ | where the heck do you live? |
| 16:18.16 | Sargun | is it like a one room, one bath house. |
| 16:18.19 | ^Migs^ | most homes in Utah are pretty affordable |
| 16:18.23 | utahcon1 | my first house was under $150. |
| 16:18.23 | jshipley | Now, if only they made nice houses in the area I want to live for $150,000 |
| 16:18.26 | utahcon1 | Didn't pay a dime down. |
| 16:18.30 | ^Migs^ | no, 4 bedroom, 3 bathroom. 2800 sq. feet. |
| 16:18.31 | utahcon1 | Worked out just fine. |
| 16:18.36 | ^Migs^ | 0.2 acre lot. |
| 16:18.44 | utahcon1 | Then I got divorced... and damnit she got the house. |
| 16:18.49 | ^Migs^ | I live in a nice quiet Roy cul-de-sac |
| 16:19.08 | ^Migs^ | the home is worth about $200,000 now according to zillow |
| 16:19.16 | utahcon1 | I found a great house in Riverton for $139K... .25 acres. 4 bed 2 bath. |
| 16:19.22 | ^Migs^ | yeah there you go |
| 16:19.24 | jshipley | http://www.utahrealestate.com/853669 |
| 16:19.25 | brac | [Utah Real Estate - Your One Stop Source for Searching Real Estate in Utah] |
| 16:19.26 | Sargun | ^Migs^, O.o |
| 16:19.32 | sjansen | utahcon1: It is a myth that owning a home is always a better investment and that paying rent is "throwing away money". |
| 16:19.37 | ^Migs^ | yeah it is, sjansen |
| 16:19.38 | Sargun | ^Migs^, Where do you live? |
| 16:19.47 | ^Migs^ | with rent, you have someone who fixes all your utilities and stuff |
| 16:19.54 | ^Migs^ | Roy, Utah |
| 16:19.58 | utahcon1 | sjansen: oh I agree. |
| 16:20.01 | jshipley | you can get a house for less than $100,000 |
| 16:20.04 | ^Migs^ | Most of Utah is cheap |
| 16:20.15 | utahcon1 | sjansen: but your chances of actually owning something increase greatly with a purchase over a lease. |
| 16:20.17 | ^Migs^ | yeah, going less than $100,000 isn't going to get you that great a house. Maybe a condo, actually. |
| 16:20.31 | ^Migs^ | there are some condos around $100k that are in nice areas |
| 16:20.35 | sjansen | Mows the lawns. Pays the taxes. Etc. |
| 16:20.41 | ^Migs^ | yeah, sjansen |
| 16:20.50 | utahcon1 | I have never seen a condo I liked. |
| 16:20.54 | ^Migs^ | seriously, having that load off is kind of worth it |
| 16:21.04 | Sargun | Odd place. Roy, Utah. Must be zombies there or something.... |
| 16:21.10 | ^Migs^ | where do you live, Sargun? |
| 16:21.21 | Sargun | Pleasanton, CA |
| 16:21.24 | ^Migs^ | oh hahahahaha |
| 16:21.38 | Sargun | And it ain't too pleasant. |
| 16:21.43 | ^Migs^ | no, California is a craphole |
| 16:21.52 | ^Migs^ | you can't get anything decent unless you have $1 million to spend |
| 16:22.06 | ^Migs^ | Utah is a very, very inexpensive place to live |
| 16:22.16 | ^Migs^ | compared to the rest of the country, that is. And the areas here are generally nice. |
| 16:22.20 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp37.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 16:22.20 | *** mode/#utah [+v elg] by ChanServ |
| 16:22.48 | ^Migs^ | My sister lived around the South for a few years while her husband was in the military, and they had pretty inexpensive homes in the low $100,000s too, but nothing near as nice as what you can get around here. |
| 16:22.59 | utahcon1 | ^Migs^: Utah is more expensive than anything in the southeast. |
| 16:23.02 | sjansen | Utah is expensive compared to North Dakota. I'm still having trouble adjusting to home prices here. |
| 16:23.28 | ^Migs^ | yeah, but in the Southeast homes are uglier |
| 16:23.28 | utahcon1 | It sickens me how much new homes are going for in UT. |
| 16:23.32 | utahcon1 | just silly. |
| 16:23.40 | Sargun | ^Migs^, you can get something ok for about $600k |
| 16:23.40 | ^Migs^ | yeah, Utah IS going up. I'm glad I bought my home early. |
| 16:24.19 | ^Migs^ | $600k seems ridiculous to me, Sargun. That's why I never want to live in Cali. |
| 16:24.29 | utahcon1 | is with ^Migs^ |
| 16:24.35 | ^Migs^ | nice climate, but that's it. The job market in Utah is still pretty good, cost of living is low. |
| 16:24.38 | utahcon1 | I think paying more than $300K is insane. |
| 16:24.42 | ^Migs^ | why would I want to move to Cali |
| 16:24.45 | ^Migs^ | I agree with you, utahcon1 |
| 16:25.03 | ^Migs^ | I have no intention of moving anytime soon, either. I'd be perfectly okay living in the house we have now the rest of our lives. |
| 16:25.21 | Sargun | ^Migs^, but the kind of jobs available here would never come to UT. |
| 16:25.24 | utahcon1 | I would like to buy a house in Daybreak, but they are retardedly expensive. |
| 16:25.30 | ^Migs^ | neighbors are perfect, house is pretty roomy... |
| 16:25.40 | utahcon1 | I am kinda hoping the housing market craps out a little more in UT so I can afford Daybreak... mmmm fiber. |
| 16:25.46 | ^Migs^ | Like what, Sargun? |
| 16:25.54 | ^Migs^ | Sargun: Salt Lake City was rated the #1 place for jobs last year by Forbes |
| 16:26.16 | jshipley | utahcon1: If you're wealthy enough, $300k isn't horrible. You have to spend the money somewhere, right? Unfortunately, I am not wealthy, so I want a much cheaper home. |
| 16:26.29 | ^Migs^ | and still, the recession hasn't hit Utah as hard as it has hit other places. Granted, that's no comfort to the Utahns have been laid off... |
| 16:26.30 | sjansen | I think paying more than $100k is insane... If only the rest of the market agreed with me... |
| 16:26.32 | ^Migs^ | *who have |
| 16:26.43 | ^Migs^ | If you live in Cali, expect to keep rentnig |
| 16:27.04 | ^Migs^ | it'll keep crapping out I bet, utahcon. Just save your money for awhile. |
| 16:27.06 | utahcon1 | jshipley: I would rather spend the money on other things than my wood studs and asphalt shingles. |
| 16:27.07 | utahcon1 | :) |
| 16:27.14 | ^Migs^ | seriously, there's nothing wrong with renting. |
| 16:27.27 | Sargun | ^Migs^, the data center/bandwidth density here is pretty high. |
| 16:27.29 | ^Migs^ | I kind of wish we'd saved up a little more for a down payment, honestly |
| 16:27.47 | ^Migs^ | do you at least have a good landlord who fixes crap for you? |
| 16:27.52 | jshipley | utahcon1: I agree |
| 16:27.54 | Jayce^ | sjansen: our first place was $100k, of course it was a condo though :( |
| 16:28.11 | Sargun | ^Migs^, the rent control laws here are awesome though. |
| 16:28.17 | ^Migs^ | how so, Sargun? |
| 16:28.23 | Sargun | how so to which one |
| 16:28.33 | ^Migs^ | the rent control laws |
| 16:28.34 | utahcon1 | utah has no rent control. You pay whatever you landlord wants. |
| 16:28.37 | jshipley | I'm still in an apartment, and probably will be for a while. |
| 16:28.39 | utahcon1 | and rent is getting stupid here. |
| 16:28.46 | ^Migs^ | oh man |
| 16:28.47 | utahcon1 | you are paying more to rent than most mortgages cost. |
| 16:28.51 | Sargun | For example, rent prices are being depressed by the government. :-). |
| 16:28.51 | ^Migs^ | no kidding |
| 16:28.55 | ^Migs^ | oh NICE |
| 16:29.01 | ^Migs^ | wow, why don't they do that here? |
| 16:29.11 | tensai | rent prices should get some help then. depression is real. |
| 16:29.25 | Sargun | Also, stuff like the landlord can't evict you unless they have a good reason |
| 16:29.25 | sjansen | Rent control is a lie, a populist misdirection that unfairly punishes the unlucky and those with lower income. |
| 16:29.38 | Sargun | ~lart sjansen |
| 16:29.38 | ibot | takes out a seltzer bottle and sprays sjansen in the face. You know, one of those old-school seltzer bottles clowns have? Yeah those. Anyway, consider yourself spritzed |
| 16:30.15 | sjansen | Sargun: Read the economics of rent control. It is fundamentally unjust, resulting in a net negative for lower income classes. |
| 16:30.34 | Sargun | sjansen, how so? |
| 16:33.03 | sjansen | Rent control unfairly allows one person to pay a lower than market value while forcing others to subsidize that person. Artificially depressing the price of one unit accelerates the inflation of other units. |
| 16:36.05 | sjansen | Or did you think the money for maintenance, taxes, etc. magically appears from somewhere else? Perhaps the owner of the property doesn't care about making a profit? I know I'd love to spend hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars on a property without seeing any return. It would make me feel... virtuous. And that's all I'd ever need since we can all live on virtue. |
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| 16:39.55 | unum | some one from salt lake sent something to the dailywtf but the envelope got tore open |
| 16:40.04 | unum | someone should send him a ctr ring |
| 16:40.56 | sjansen | Choose The Ridiculous? |
| 16:41.59 | *** join/#utah redbeard2 (n=jphall@208.110.152.42) |
| 16:42.42 | fungus | http://ctlring.com/ |
| 16:43.50 | elg | haha, that's awesome |
| 16:45.24 | jshipley | ooh, I want one :) |
| 16:46.00 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@cpe-071-070-229-150.nc.res.rr.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 16:46.00 | *** join/#utah gshipley (n=gshipley@nat/redhat/x-5997f8ca15c9f049) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 16:46.00 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=decripto@opensuse/member/decriptor) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 16:46.00 | *** mode/#utah [+v emcnabb] by irc.freenode.net |
| 16:48.46 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@thelances.net) |
| 17:06.57 | RyanE | I need an RSS feed for the URLS on #utah. |
| 17:10.37 | *** join/#utah gshipley_ (n=gshipley@nat/redhat/x-9b2a300dbabede4d) |
| 17:13.18 | jshipley | that would be nice, as long as it also says who posted the urls so you could know which ones to avoid at work |
| 17:15.09 | RyanE | Yeah, I'd think it should have the whole nick / URL line, including any comments made in the line. Smarter yet is if it got the few lines in front and behind the URL... |
| 17:15.15 | ^Migs^ | that ctlring might cause the ring business some problems |
| 17:15.17 | RyanE | why doesn't someone go write that for me... :) |
| 17:15.31 | RyanE | ^Migs^: why? |
| 17:15.46 | ^Migs^ | going to run the ring business right out of business |
| 17:16.39 | ^Migs^ | I don't see why that's not possible, RyanE. All the logs are [for better or worse] on the web |
| 17:16.43 | ^Migs^ | Could just write a parsing script |
| 17:17.28 | RyanE | or a bot that writes out a URL RSS as it happens. The logs are all a day behind. |
| 17:17.28 | ^Migs^ | hmmm |
| 17:17.28 | ^Migs^ | which would be easier? |
| 17:17.37 | ^Migs^ | probably the bot |
| 17:18.14 | RyanE | I would think the bot. |
| 17:20.25 | Jayce^ | ~url |
| 17:20.44 | ibot | url is probably (Universal Resource Locator) This is what is used to give Web addresses for HTML, VRML, WAV and other files. It simply contains the Internet name of the machine containing the data and the path to the file. Much like the UNC, except specifically for the Internet. The address also includes what protocol should be used. |
| 17:20.53 | Jayce^ | hrm, ibot used to have something like that, probably just query out the command and you could find it |
| 17:21.09 | RyanE | I thought it was brigham or whatever the other bot's name was that did URL stuff... |
| 17:21.15 | RyanE | ~urls |
| 17:21.23 | elg | brac |
| 17:21.25 | RyanE | hmmm... |
| 17:21.25 | elg | -urls |
| 17:21.25 | brac | no urls seen yet for channel #utah |
| 17:21.32 | elg | but he seems a bit broked. :) |
| 17:21.36 | RyanE | apparently so... :) |
| 17:21.44 | elg | http://google.com |
| 17:21.54 | elg | http://slashdot.org |
| 17:22.06 | elg | http://fugal.net |
| 17:22.07 | brac | [fugal.net] |
| 17:22.09 | elg | -urls |
| 17:22.09 | brac | no urls seen yet for channel #utah |
| 17:22.16 | RyanE | yep, broked. :) |
| 17:22.46 | ^Migs^ | all in favor of renaming brac to brigham? |
| 17:22.54 | JoshH | aye |
| 17:22.57 | elg | he used to be called brigham |
| 17:23.01 | ^Migs^ | ah ok |
| 17:23.04 | ^Migs^ | why the change? |
| 17:23.06 | elg | don't remember why |
| 17:23.07 | RyanE | aye aye, cap'n! |
| 17:23.08 | JoshH | and rename ibot to moroni |
| 17:23.16 | RyanE | probably because brigham is harder to type than brac |
| 17:23.17 | ^Migs^ | I'm in favor of that too, JoshH |
| 17:23.26 | jshipley | lol, we are utah after all, right? |
| 17:23.34 | ^Migs^ | yeah, let's take a little pride in our heritage |
| 17:23.36 | JoshH | or gordon |
| 17:23.39 | ^Migs^ | there you go |
| 17:23.41 | ^Migs^ | gordonbot |
| 17:23.47 | ^Migs^ | or monsonbot |
| 17:23.56 | RyanE | tsmbot |
| 17:24.01 | JoshH | monson doesn't have a legacy yet |
| 17:24.01 | ^Migs^ | perfect |
| 17:24.09 | RyanE | bensonbot |
| 17:24.12 | JoshH | you can't get a bot after a year in offie |
| 17:24.13 | JoshH | c |
| 17:24.18 | ^Migs^ | oh ok |
| 17:24.58 | sjansen | Space Ghost Coast to Coast! |
| 17:25.03 | elg | bri<tab> is no harder than brac :) |
| 17:25.15 | elg | someone had a qualm with brigham iirc |
| 17:25.25 | RyanE | br<tab> works for either... |
| 17:25.38 | elg | or maybe it was just that the brigham db died and he started with a clean slate so i gave him a new name |
| 17:25.43 | elg | brasto |
| 17:26.22 | ^Migs^ | bruckheimer |
| 17:26.36 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:26.40 | elg | nope, no conflict there. |
| 17:26.56 | sjansen | brak |
| 17:26.58 | sjansen | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8322707190506334834 |
| 17:27.46 | ^Migs^ | why is Google Video still around? |
| 17:27.58 | utahcon1 | won't be for long. |
| 17:28.10 | jshipley | why not? |
| 17:28.12 | ^Migs^ | that's what I thought 2 years ago |
| 17:28.16 | utahcon1 | they are closing it down. |
| 17:28.31 | ^Migs^ | when's the closing date? |
| 17:28.40 | *** join/#utah moriancumer (n=jared@c-24-10-254-247.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 17:29.02 | utahcon1 | hmm |
| 17:29.08 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@75.148.99.197) |
| 17:29.15 | utahcon1 | actually look like they are just going to stop uploads to the service. |
| 17:29.20 | utahcon1 | the content will remain |
| 17:29.33 | utahcon1 | I don't know why they don't just move it all to YouTube and redirect the url. |
| 17:30.17 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp37.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 17:30.25 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp37.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 17:30.26 | *** mode/#utah [+v elg] by ChanServ |
| 17:30.30 | elg | ~rlart |
| 17:30.54 | ibot | takes a large goose feather pillow and swings it wildly in lnchdsl's direction, hitting lnchdsl and sending lnchdsl flying into the closet |
| 17:30.55 | ^Migs^ | yeah |
| 17:30.55 | sjansen | For starters, because the resolution of YouTube videos is lousy. |
| 17:30.55 | ^Migs^ | not high-quality YouTube videos |
| 17:30.55 | ^Migs^ | nobody cares about the resolution |
| 17:31.02 | ^Migs^ | ~rlart |
| 17:31.04 | ibot | strangles WoodsDog with a doohicky mouse cord |
| 17:35.48 | ^Migs^ | ~rlart |
| 17:35.49 | ibot | blasts lnchdsl to oblivion with a kamehameha wave |
| 17:35.52 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleslap brac |
| 17:35.53 | ibot | ACTION beats brac upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 17:51.25 | jshipley | I've often found youtube quality to be better than video.google.com quality |
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| 18:32.59 | *** mode/#utah [+v emcnabb] by ChanServ |
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| 19:33.04 | Jayce^ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h17s0R6pgw8&feature=channel_page |
| 19:33.10 | Jayce^ | stop the pop! |
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| 19:45.04 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@32.156.249.24) |
| 19:48.56 | elg | pops Jayce^s collar |
| 19:49.39 | goozbach | pops open a bottle of pepsi, or as the new ad would have you call it "pop" |
| 19:51.06 | *** part/#utah nan0meter (n=Null@204.128.230.1) |
| 20:17.48 | Tene_ | Jayce^: what is that? |
| 20:18.11 | Jayce^ | plea to stop popped collars |
| 20:22.09 | *** join/#utah ibot (i=ibot@rikers.org) |
| 20:22.09 | *** topic/#utah is http://plug.org/irc | CHannel log @ http://ibot.rikers.org/#utah | I'll gladly pay you lolmorrow for a cheezburger today. |
| 20:22.09 | *** mode/#utah [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
| 20:23.35 | Tene_ | No, he never wears that. |
| 20:25.07 | Jayce^ | just on weekends.. |
| 20:26.17 | *** join/#utah toofer (n=toofer@kjordan.securesites.net) |
| 20:26.35 | Jayce^ | he and emcnabb, back in college, all the time.. |
| 20:26.40 | Jayce^ | isn't that right elg |
| 20:26.58 | emcnabb | ? |
| 20:27.12 | elg | emcnabb wore wife beaters |
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| 20:52.57 | sjansen | Tene_ doesn't remember my Don Johnson years. |
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| 21:09.40 | thrain][ | so... |
| 21:10.08 | thrain][ | UVU is apparently announcing their new pres in a few |
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| 22:16.04 | utahcon1 | anyone running KDE 4.2? |
| 22:16.39 | Jayce^ | oooh, *real* sugar Mtn Dew... |
| 22:26.30 | RyanE | but only for a short time. |
| 22:26.43 | Jayce^ | Food Storage :-p |
| 22:28.03 | RyanE | Can't believe it's Daylight Savings Time adjustment this weekend. Too early. This is the week that 9AM church is going to kill me. |
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| 22:36.04 | *** part/#utah fcodiaz_ (n=francisc@70.102.172.126) |
| 22:39.48 | jshipley | Hey, anybody here seen Dollhouse? |
| 22:39.57 | fozzmoo | jshipley: /me raises hand |
| 22:40.07 | fozzmoo | I've watched the first two episodes. Haven't seen #3 yet. |
| 22:40.10 | jshipley | fozzmoo: what do you think? |
| 22:40.24 | fozzmoo | Well, like any Joss Whedon series, it's off to a slow start. :) |
| 22:40.54 | jshipley | For some reason, it kind of reminds me of Alias. It seems like a pretty decent show though |
| 22:40.54 | fozzmoo | I have my concerns that Eliza Dushku can pull off what is needed for a character that has to be a different personality each week. |
| 22:41.18 | fozzmoo | But we'll see. She was never one of my favorite actors on Buffy. |
| 22:41.33 | jshipley | The only other Whedon show I've seen is Firefly, and I loved that. I've got good hopes for Dollhouse. |
| 22:42.20 | fozzmoo | I have a feeling around 5 or 6 episodes in, Dollhouse will become a much more character-driven show than it has been. That's how Whedon always is, it seems. |
| 22:42.44 | fozzmoo | I really like that Amy Acker is in it (the doctor at The Dollhouse). She was awesome in Angel. |
| 22:43.22 | fozzmoo | And that guy from BSG whose name I can't remember (or pronounce) is in it too. |
| 22:43.33 | fozzmoo | Well... my tires are rotated, so I'm off to home now. |
| 22:43.38 | fozzmoo | is at the tire store presently. |
| 22:43.42 | fozzmoo | leaves |
| 23:08.54 | RyanE | jshipley: I thought it was OK. Not early enough to see if it'll get really good yet. |
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| 23:44.19 | unum | I just got into a big argument with the other programmer about rounding |
| 23:44.57 | sjansen | Rounding is rarely correct. Better to square. |
| 23:45.03 | unum | good idea |
| 23:45.14 | unum | it had to do with time |
| 23:45.30 | unum | currently everything is rounded to the nearest 15 minutes |
| 23:45.38 | unum | we plan to fix that |
| 23:46.18 | unum | left to my own devices I probably would have truncated to the nearest second and divided by 3600 and rounded to 5 digits |