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| 02:18.39 | jackman | Are there any Utes here? |
| 02:19.08 | markl__ | do you mean U students or utahns in general? |
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| 02:36.45 | levi | Good evening, folks. |
| 02:51.30 | eightyeight | so, i've been auditing my packets recently, locking some areas down a bit, and came to a sad realization: |
| 02:52.03 | eightyeight | freenode is one of the larger irc networks, yet it doesn't support ssl. at least not yet. all the others i connect to, which are much smaller in comparison, do |
| 02:52.31 | eightyeight | rather disappointing |
| 02:53.33 | levi | http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/multimedia/video/obp/IntroducingPython.mpg |
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| 03:03.51 | levi | eightyeight: A larger networks means it would be more expensive to support SSL. |
| 03:04.27 | eightyeight | sure. but they also have more hardware |
| 03:04.43 | eightyeight | main hub servers and lots of leafs |
| 03:04.55 | levi | Yes, but supporting SSL could require *more* hardware. |
| 03:05.48 | eightyeight | i understand it's computationally expensive. no argument there, and i'm not that familiar with the hardware they currently have |
| 03:07.03 | eightyeight | i do know they have an average of 50,000 users connected at any time, and roughly 30 main rotation hub servers |
| 03:07.06 | levi | I'm not sure why you'd want your IRC traffic to be SSL-encryped, anyway. |
| 03:07.24 | eightyeight | authenticating to nickserv and pms |
| 03:09.02 | levi | Still not sure why you'd care about that, but whatever. |
| 03:09.49 | eightyeight | really? you blindly trust those on this network? |
| 03:10.02 | levi | Who said anything about blind trust? |
| 03:10.18 | eightyeight | i'm just trying to understand why i wouldn't care about it |
| 03:10.51 | eightyeight | i've seen chanserv and nickserv passwords get sniffed |
| 03:11.13 | eightyeight | comcast doesn't really need to see my packets either |
| 03:11.28 | levi | Ahh, paranoia. |
| 03:11.45 | eightyeight | nods |
| 03:12.01 | eightyeight | a healthy dose, i think |
| 03:12.25 | ramuloso | comcast saves everypacket |
| 03:12.39 | ramuloso | as does qwest |
| 03:12.52 | levi | Even more paranoia! |
| 03:13.08 | ramuloso | don't know about xmission |
| 03:13.11 | eightyeight | well, i don't know about that, and i don't know if they're sniffing my packets, but why take the risk? |
| 03:13.34 | levi | Life is full of risks. Most of them don't really matter. |
| 03:13.47 | levi | If you worried about every risk you took... |
| 03:14.01 | ramuloso | they have to sniff every packet - how else do they 'perform' their new network shaping |
| 03:14.47 | ramuloso | if you are a comcast subscriber - did you _read_ the latest thing they sent to your email accounts |
| 03:14.51 | eightyeight | levi: fair enough. but does the benefit out weigh the risk? the work it takes to configure is minimal |
| 03:15.35 | eightyeight | trivial in fact |
| 03:16.38 | levi | Trivial for *you* to configure, or trivial for freenode to support? |
| 03:17.14 | levi | There are all sorts of trivial things people could do to alleviate trivial risks. |
| 03:17.29 | levi | But that requires thinking about those trivial risks first. |
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| 03:18.03 | eightyeight | all-in-all, my irc packets aren't that important. i'm not passing around ssns, private info, or other things |
| 03:18.32 | eightyeight | if my nickserv pass gets sniffed, i register a new one, contact support, and get it taken care of, changing my pass |
| 03:18.37 | eightyeight | big deal |
| 03:19.38 | eightyeight | however, i doubt ssl would put that big a strain on freenode, as not everyone will connect to it, and it takes no time for a user to access it, if they want |
| 03:19.50 | eightyeight | so, my question is: why not? |
| 03:20.18 | levi | I don't know. Why don't you ask them? |
| 03:20.24 | eightyeight | heh |
| 03:20.29 | levi | Perhaps the answer is, "we don't care" |
| 03:20.39 | levi | That would probably be my answer. |
| 03:20.45 | levi | But I'm not in charge. |
| 03:20.46 | eightyeight | that's probably close to the truth |
| 03:20.59 | levi | I don't see why they *should* care. |
| 03:21.10 | levi | It kind of falls outside the scope of freenode's mission. |
| 03:21.15 | peno | http://freenode.net/faq.shtml |
| 03:21.17 | brac | [freenode: frequently-asked questions] |
| 03:21.19 | peno | search for ssl |
| 03:21.35 | eightyeight | yeah. i've read it. i've asked in #freenode too |
| 03:22.07 | ramuloso | what do you want to achieve using ssl? |
| 03:22.12 | peno | http://blog.freenode.net/category/development/ |
| 03:22.43 | eightyeight | ramuloso: encrypting my packets. why ssl with http? or xmpp? or smtp? or any other protocol? |
| 03:23.37 | ramuloso | just the nick password? is the only thing that would make real sense - as anyone can log anything |
| 03:23.47 | eightyeight | and the chanserv password |
| 03:23.59 | eightyeight | if you've regged a channel, that is |
| 03:24.49 | levi | This is IRC, for goodness sake. It's supposed to be insecure and full of holes. It's like a piece of internet history! |
| 03:24.57 | eightyeight | heh |
| 03:25.05 | levi | You whippersnappers just don't get it. ;) |
| 03:25.25 | ramuloso | it isn't completely old and moldy - |
| 03:25.33 | peno | sure it is |
| 03:26.19 | eightyeight | levi: i guess you have the same feeling about kerberos? |
| 03:27.48 | levi | eightyeight: No, kerberos isn't supposed to be insecure and full of holes. It's from a far more recent age, when security-minded people took over the internet. |
| 03:27.51 | eightyeight | after all, i can encrypt a kerberized telnet of ftp. those are crusty, moldy, old and full of holes too. :) |
| 03:28.53 | eightyeight | s/of/or/ |
| 03:29.38 | levi | You can do that *now*, since everyone is obsessed with encrypting everything. |
| 03:29.55 | eightyeight | but, i digress. i would like to see it. i suffer from bits of paranoia. i admit. i think it's good too |
| 03:30.30 | levi | Understanding risks is good. Paranoia is not. |
| 03:31.27 | levi | Paranoia exaggerates some threats, which distorts rational behavior. |
| 03:32.01 | levi | We're irrational enough without adding to it. :) |
| 03:32.22 | eightyeight | true |
| 03:33.55 | eightyeight | paranoia typically means delusion. and delusional i am not. concerned about my security, i am |
| 03:34.21 | Zelut | makes some off-hand remark about Yoda, and gets back to watching "Fringe".. |
| 03:34.39 | eightyeight | Zelut: python > perl |
| 03:34.57 | eightyeight | dons flame resistant clothes |
| 03:35.07 | Zelut | eightyeight: I'm not deep enough down that rabbit hole for that to bother me.. yet. |
| 03:35.32 | eightyeight | :) |
| 03:44.50 | jackman | markl__: I mean U students |
| 03:52.39 | levi | Anyone watch the Python movie link I pasted earlier? |
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| 04:02.02 | markl__ | levi: can you paste it again? |
| 04:02.21 | markl__ | i saw my first episode of The IT Crowd today, good stuff |
| 04:02.32 | markl__ | how did i miss that for so long? |
| 04:02.44 | levi | http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/multimedia/video/obp/IntroducingPython.mpg |
| 04:03.25 | tensai | so ramuloso stated that qwest and comcast save every packet and I strongly doubt that's true |
| 04:03.40 | tensai | that's a *lot* of data |
| 04:04.20 | markl__ | inspect maybe, save, that would be impressive |
| 04:04.31 | levi | tensai: An infeasible amount of data to store, indeed. |
| 04:04.32 | tensai | inspect is a requirement. hard to route otherwise. |
| 04:04.45 | levi | tensai: But why burst his silly paranoiac bubble? |
| 04:04.46 | markl__ | you don't have to inspect the whole packet though |
| 04:05.16 | jackman | markl__: do you go to the u? |
| 04:05.29 | tensai | markl__: that's true. and routers can work in asics without even peeking at the data. |
| 04:05.48 | markl__ | jackman: a couple of times a year for sporting events, that's about it |
| 04:05.53 | tensai | levi: he's gone now so his paranoia is safe and secure |
| 04:06.59 | jackman | markl__: I just got accepted but I don't know anybody. |
| 04:07.41 | levi | BTW, I got to play with one of these today: https://www.xmos.com/products/xc1 |
| 04:10.38 | tensai | levi: for what? |
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| 04:15.11 | levi | tensai: Well, they're implementing Ethernet AVB for their chip, so they were showing us how to develop for it so we could evaluate it for use in Harman products. |
| 04:15.18 | levi | But it's a way cool gadget. |
| 04:15.30 | levi | You can do stuff in software that would normally require hardware. |
| 04:33.51 | levi | For example, here's a project implementing a Fast Ethernet MAC in software. |
| 04:33.55 | levi | http://www.xlinkers.org/projects/ethernet_mac |
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| 15:11.25 | tensai | ~dip elg in glue |
| 15:11.39 | elg | -chat now tensai |
| 15:11.40 | brac | now tensai |
| 15:11.46 | elg | -chat now sjansen |
| 15:11.46 | brac | now sjansen |
| 15:11.51 | elg | -chat now emcnabb |
| 15:11.51 | brac | now emcnabb |
| 15:12.05 | elg | now brac is dumb |
| 15:12.08 | elg | -chat now brac |
| 15:12.08 | brac | now brac has forgotten all his chat wisdom |
| 15:13.30 | jsmith | brac: Where is your brain? |
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| 15:17.20 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
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| 17:37.07 | albino | Anyone have advice on the best phone service providers in utah? |
| 17:40.38 | high_roller | albino: for cell, or landline service? |
| 17:41.07 | albino | for landline |
| 17:41.20 | albino | t1 DID...whatever local terminology it takes :) |
| 17:41.52 | albino | diesel: wtf :) |
| 17:50.46 | fungus | I've been a big fan of XO lately for T1 PRIs |
| 17:50.55 | fungus | good service, prices, etc |
| 17:55.42 | albino | fungus: they have a local shop somewhere? |
| 17:56.21 | fungus | http://www.xo.com/contact/Pages/locations.aspx |
| 17:58.51 | albino | I have a local avaya phone company, it seems like there ought to be a local cisco phone company |
| 18:00.02 | mrpull | albino: Mountain States Networking (mstates.com) is a Cisco shop that sales Cisco VoIP |
| 18:00.38 | fozzmoo | Yeah- Mountain States. |
| 18:00.51 | mrpull | s/sales/sells/ |
| 18:00.54 | mrpull | I'm an idiot |
| 18:01.05 | fozzmoo | mrpull: But you're OUR idiot. |
| 18:01.13 | mrpull | ahhh... I feel better now. |
| 18:01.23 | mrpull | anyone going up to SLLUG tonight? |
| 18:01.31 | fozzmoo | I am leaning toward it. |
| 18:01.37 | fozzmoo | I'll be bringing my kids if I come. |
| 18:01.38 | mrpull | the topic appeals to me |
| 18:01.40 | fozzmoo | (and my video camera) |
| 18:01.44 | mrpull | and stuart does a good job |
| 18:02.33 | fozzmoo | He makes me feel guilty for wanting to make money, tho. ;-) |
| 18:02.48 | mrpull | friggin socialists ;-) |
| 18:03.37 | albino | oh do we rang aginst socialists here? |
| 18:03.47 | fozzmoo | rangs and rangs |
| 18:03.56 | poole | there is nothing on the sllug.org web site |
| 18:04.06 | mrpull | albino: nah. only liberals, conservatives, and moderates |
| 18:04.14 | fozzmoo | Marc's been spamming the SLLUG mailing list. |
| 18:04.16 | mrpull | oh and extremists |
| 18:04.23 | albino | oh those guys |
| 18:04.28 | albino | I know who you speak of |
| 18:04.30 | fozzmoo | And homosexuals wanting to partake of the holy institution of marriage. |
| 18:06.39 | unum | and the people who are freaking out about the redefinition of a word |
| 18:07.36 | albino | unum: I'm guessing they're freaking out about the discrimation implied by the redefinition of a word :) |
| 18:08.10 | unum | don't you mean the anti-discrimation implied by the redefinition of a word? |
| 18:08.29 | goozbach | and on that note I start ignoring #utah for a couple of hours |
| 18:08.45 | unum | goozbach: probably a good idea :) |
| 18:08.57 | unum | man pirates, i should go be one of those |
| 18:09.03 | albino | unum: either way :) |
| 18:09.06 | unum | they managed to get a tanker |
| 18:09.13 | albino | unum: where you working these days? Still in Utah? |
| 18:09.23 | unum | I don't what they could really plan to do with it |
| 18:09.28 | unum | albino: ya still in murray |
| 18:09.37 | mrpull | pirates amuse me. |
| 18:09.45 | fozzmoo | snickers |
| 18:09.46 | mrpull | but annoy me that they don't dress the role |
| 18:09.48 | albino | unum: cool, I didn't see you at utos this year, were you there? |
| 18:09.54 | unum | no |
| 18:10.20 | unum | they did it during our busy season |
| 18:11.07 | mrpull | my kids thought it was funny that they interspersed clips pirate movie characters throughout that news story on NBC this morning |
| 18:11.14 | mrpull | hey! that's captain jack! |
| 18:11.53 | mrpull | why don't we mix in other movie clips with wallstreet news or sports or war updates? |
| 18:12.11 | fozzmoo | Reminds me that Thomas Jefferson engaged the US navy against Islamic militants (pirates) around the turn of the 19th century. |
| 18:12.19 | fozzmoo | in the Carribean. |
| 18:12.25 | unum | what would you mix in with wallstreet? |
| 18:12.52 | unum | I guess there are plenty of wall street movies, but not starring jonny dept |
| 18:13.00 | mrpull | ~imdb Wallstreet |
| 18:13.20 | mrpull | http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094291/ |
| 18:13.21 | unum | in the carribean? |
| 18:13.24 | fungus | Greed is good. |
| 18:13.24 | brac | [Wall Street (1987)] |
| 18:14.00 | tensai | speaking of pirates, what's the deal with somalia? there have been 90 pirate attacks this year. |
| 18:14.19 | harleypig | WWIII will be against freeboots |
| 18:14.19 | mrpull | I guess I meant |
| 18:14.25 | mrpull | -imdb Wallstreet |
| 18:14.31 | brac | Wall Street (USA, 1987) : http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094291/ | Ratings: no votes. Genre: Crime/Drama |
| 18:14.31 | brac | Kevin Hefner : http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1883419/ | Birth: 7 October 1973, Baltimore, Maryland, USA | Writer: "Animal Precinct"; "Animal Cops: Detroit"; "Speeders". Producer: "Flip This House: The College Special (#1.9)"; "Flip This House: Too Good to Be True (#1.6)"; "Flip This House: Ginger's Revenge (#1.4)" |
| 18:14.44 | unum | fozzmoo: wikipedia says you're wrong |
| 18:15.03 | mrpull | freeboots? |
| 18:15.12 | tensai | opposite of payboots? |
| 18:15.21 | mrpull | payboots? |
| 18:15.33 | tensai | opposite of freeboots |
| 18:15.51 | harleypig | http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/freebooter |
| 18:15.53 | brac | [freebooter - Definition from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary] |
| 18:15.57 | harleypig | -dict freeboot |
| 18:16.01 | harleypig | or is it |
| 18:16.03 | mrpull | that is a new one :) |
| 18:16.04 | harleypig | ~dict freeboot |
| 18:16.18 | mrpull | (to me since apparently it came from 1570) |
| 18:16.25 | harleypig | :] |
| 18:16.30 | harleypig | I read too much. |
| 18:16.41 | mrpull | words are hard |
| 18:16.57 | mrpull | (where is Jayce^ to pick up on a Brian Regan quote?) |
| 18:18.33 | mrpull | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUJWzA1M_Dw |
| 18:20.22 | unum | Jefferson sent marines to fight north african pirates in the mediterian |
| 18:20.34 | fozzmoo | Oh! MARINES! Gosh |
| 18:20.37 | fozzmoo | my mistake! |
| 18:20.50 | unum | you got the sea wrong |
| 18:20.54 | unum | that's what I was arguing with |
| 18:21.08 | unum | he sent the navy and marines |
| 18:21.24 | fozzmoo | Oh. |
| 18:21.52 | fozzmoo | I thought it was the Bahamas and what-not where they were having problems |
| 18:21.59 | fozzmoo | All those islands were no-mans land. |
| 18:22.10 | unum | not in the 19th century |
| 18:22.20 | JoshH | something needs to be done about these pirates for sure |
| 18:22.23 | unum | at the turn of the 18 century is when those places were problems |
| 18:22.29 | unum | but I don't think they were muslims |
| 18:22.48 | unum | except maybe the ones we brought over as slaves |
| 18:23.10 | JoshH | seal team 6 is probably too tied up in iraq right now to handle a rescue </uneducated civilian guess> |
| 18:23.37 | JoshH | i would hope the political issues with something like that wouldn't be a huge obstacle |
| 18:24.50 | unum | it's a british crew and a saudi ship |
| 18:25.25 | unum | looks like your caribean pirates were mostly protestants |
| 18:26.20 | JoshH | personally i think putting considerable resources into taking out pirates would be a worthy cause for the US military, regardless of the nationality of particular ships that are attacked. but other countries should definitely play a part as well. |
| 18:28.43 | unum | JoshH: are you saying the us should get involved in taking out the warlords in samolia? |
| 18:30.56 | JoshH | probably not a good idea right now, but eventually, i could get behind that. right now, i think we, and other allied navies, should devote some ships to hunting and taking out pirate vessels |
| 18:31.56 | unum | I'm not sure that's really a doable task |
| 18:32.03 | JoshH | i wouldn't mind seeing missiles lobbed at warlord's compounds either, but i'd rather not see anyone on the ground in somalia until we aren't stretched too thin from other wars |
| 18:32.33 | fungus | And all of that should be coordinated with other countries via the UN |
| 18:32.45 | JoshH | ideally, yes |
| 18:32.49 | unum | I mean speed boats only cost about $10,000 don't they |
| 18:34.54 | unum | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Shepherd <- US based pirates |
| 18:36.32 | tensai | JoshH: there is an ongoing effort to fight somali pirates. it just hasn't been completely effective. |
| 18:37.37 | tensai | that oil tanker they've got was destined for the US, so there's plenty of good reason for us to get involved |
| 18:40.07 | tensai | http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7737797.stm |
| 18:40.09 | brac | [BBC NEWS | Africa | Saudi owners 'talking to pirates'] |
| 18:45.45 | tensai | on the status of fighting the pirates. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7735144.stm |
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| 18:50.33 | high_roller | maybe they should try and sue the pirates, since that seems to work well for the RIAA |
| 18:51.46 | Supaplex | only if it'll bankrupt the RIAA in the process. |
| 18:52.37 | jshipley | Hmm... maybe we could make some money off of it... Fine the pirates for piracy, and use the money to fund our health care system. |
| 18:52.58 | Supaplex | we have a system for that? |
| 18:53.00 | jshipley | (Naval pirates, not file-sharers) |
| 18:53.51 | jshipley | Fine... we contract them out so that they become privateers instead of pirates. |
| 18:54.01 | jshipley | We take a 50% cut and look the other way |
| 18:54.18 | Supaplex | and they can keep their belly button |
| 18:54.37 | unum | while the lawsuits hasn't stopped piracy it raised awarness of the legality issues and probably decreased it from what it would have been |
| 18:54.38 | jshipley | health care was just an example... maybe we could put it into education instead... |
| 18:54.39 | high_roller | while looking the other way, claim that its an anti-terrorist operation |
| 18:55.18 | jshipley | A great deal of money could be made by robbing other nations :) |
| 18:55.25 | unum | jshipley: seeing as how we had probably paid for the oil already(through the commodity market) I think it's zero sum |
| 18:55.42 | unum | someone said the oil was heading for the us |
| 18:56.36 | jshipley | I'm not really being serious here, my first thought was that it would probably be best to just destroy their port. |
| 18:57.37 | unum | in the wikipedia article it said they usually just held the crew hostage and stole their personal items |
| 18:57.45 | unum | so they don't actually need to bring the ship to port |
| 18:58.54 | jshipley | no, but destroying the main pirate base would do a good deal to slow their operations |
| 18:59.12 | unum | the use speed boats, so they don't have to use a port |
| 18:59.58 | unum | they probably just launched from the beach |
| 19:00.28 | unum | they may have launched from a larger boat, so if you figure out which boat that was and where it's based out of..... |
| 19:03.24 | *** join/#utah brac (i=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 19:03.53 | jshipley | ~lart brac |
| 19:03.53 | ibot | beats the living hamstercrap out of brac |
| 19:05.03 | *** part/#utah poole (n=poole@c-67-172-251-10.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 19:08.13 | unum | anyone else beening reading about the new hash contest |
| 19:08.22 | WoodsDog | herlo, you around? |
| 19:08.43 | WoodsDog | anyone know what a practical use of atime is? |
| 19:12.21 | jshipley | atime is used by mutt when you're using the mbox format |
| 19:13.31 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@97-117-59-103.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 19:13.48 | jshipley | there are possibly other programs that use atime |
| 19:13.53 | sjansen | So is everyone coming to my SELinux presentation at SLLUG tonight? |
| 19:14.11 | jshipley | then again, atime can slow things down a lot |
| 19:14.13 | sjansen | I hear the Smiths near the downtown library is having a sale on rotten fruit. |
| 19:14.27 | jsmith | sjansen: If I were there, I'd certainly come to the meeting |
| 19:14.46 | sjansen | Has anyone mentioned relatime yet? |
| 19:16.44 | jshipley | I suppose atime could be useful for some sort of backup program |
| 19:17.01 | jshipley | I generally just use noatime though |
| 19:18.12 | fungus | backups use mtime, not atime |
| 19:18.49 | fozzmoo | sjansen: Do you mind if I bring my kiddos? |
| 19:19.04 | fozzmoo | sjansen: Think you can throw in some song & dance? |
| 19:19.51 | fozzmoo | gives sjansen a cane and a top hat |
| 19:20.03 | sjansen | fozzmoo: Consider carefully what you asking. Having me dance and sing is like having harleypig speedos. |
| 19:20.21 | sjansen | fozzmoo: Consider carefully what you're asking. Having me dance and sing is like having harleypig model speedos. |
| 19:25.13 | mrpull | sjansen: I'm the wuss that always disables selinux |
| 19:25.18 | mrpull | so I should benefit |
| 19:25.23 | mrpull | I'll be there |
| 19:25.32 | jshipley | fungus: right... I guess didn't stop to think about that too much |
| 19:27.19 | sjansen | jshipley: Your scenario wasn't totally unreasonable. Someone could conceivably combine the backup process with tmpwatch like pruning. |
| 19:31.48 | jshipley | it might be useful to have /tmp on a seperate partition with atime enabled |
| 19:32.00 | jshipley | especially if you never reboot |
| 19:33.02 | fungus | depending on your usage of /tmp, it is sometimes useful to put it on a tmpfs |
| 19:33.34 | Tene | sjansen: when and where is your presentation? |
| 19:34.53 | sjansen | 7:10pm ; Warnock Engineering Building (WEB) room 101, University of Utah |
| 19:35.06 | sjansen | http://www.map.utah.edu/index.jsp?find=62 |
| 19:35.07 | brac | [UMAP :: Interactive Campus Map for the University of Utah] |
| 19:35.39 | Tene | sjansen: will it be awesome? |
| 19:36.00 | sjansen | Are you kidding? Of course not! |
| 19:36.07 | Tene | Ah. Nevermind, then. |
| 19:36.42 | sjansen | I'm going to be presenting SELinux in form of song and dance. It will traumatic. |
| 19:38.38 | jshipley | sjansen: song and dance? that almost sounds more traumatic than powerpoint |
| 19:39.07 | sjansen | Blame fozzmoo. |
| 19:39.56 | jsmith | Iambic pentameter? |
| 19:40.06 | jsmith | 3/4 time or 4/4 time? |
| 19:40.17 | jsmith | SELinux Riverdance? |
| 19:45.50 | albino | WoodsDog: All the linux performance stuff I've read says the first thing you should do is remount everything noatime |
| 19:46.44 | albino | The Xmission guy at the last utos made fun of people who were still using atime |
| 19:48.22 | Tene | http://www.kctv5.com/news/18007514/detail.html#- |
| 19:48.27 | brac | [Teen In Trouble For Hugging Teacher - Kansas City News Story - KCTV Kansas City] |
| 19:49.55 | sjansen | jsmith: I'm planning on setting the entire presentation to the tune of Row Row Row Your Boat. It's the only song I now well enough. |
| 19:50.41 | jsmith | sjansen: I can understand how you'd fit "audit2allow" in that tune, but how do you handle "setroubleshootd"? |
| 19:50.57 | fozzmoo | Tene: That's... sheeesh. |
| 19:51.02 | sjansen | Painfully. |
| 19:51.49 | sjansen | I plan on ending around 8:30 or when I dislocate my jaw. Whichever comes first. |
| 19:51.55 | mrpull | but a dream ~= setroubleshootd |
| 19:52.17 | mrpull | life is but a dream... |
| 19:52.21 | jsmith | Turning "troubleshoot" into a triplet? |
| 19:52.22 | mrpull | too much of a stretch |
| 19:52.24 | jsmith | Wow... |
| 19:52.51 | jsmith | ... I knew sjansen was talented, but that's really out there. Might get him on American Idol! |
| 19:53.23 | mrpull | s - e - tou - ble - shoot -deee! |
| 19:53.33 | fozzmoo | :-D |
| 19:53.41 | mrpull | dang. that might be worse than goozbach singing blues clues |
| 19:53.59 | jsmith | hums the theme song to the Smurfs, just for mrpull |
| 19:54.33 | mrpull | jsmith: evil. pure evil. I will get my revenge. |
| 19:54.58 | jsmith | mrpull: Never. You're talking to a guy that used to change the ring tone on his cell phone just to get his boss humming a different tune every day of the week. |
| 19:56.52 | mrpull | jsmith: here is some inspiration for your next ring tone: http://view.break.com/566368 |
| 19:58.16 | mrpull | damn you jsmith. now you got my worst song ever playing in my browser. |
| 20:01.46 | fozzmoo | /What's gonna work? Team work!/ |
| 20:02.19 | unum | the indians think they go the "mother ship" |
| 20:02.32 | mrpull | fozzmoo: wonder pets grates on me. I don't want my kids imitating animals with speech impediments |
| 20:03.37 | fozzmoo | My favorite annoying kids show music is Backyardigans. |
| 20:03.53 | mrpull | I'm cool with Backyardigans |
| 20:04.17 | mrpull | my favorite song has got to be: Hot Dog Hot Dog Hot Diggity Dog! |
| 20:04.28 | fozzmoo | Your backyard friends, the Backyardigans! Together in the backyard again, In the place where we belong, Where we'll prob'ly sing a song, And we'll maybe dance along. |
| 20:05.39 | unum | is immune to this attack |
| 20:05.44 | fozzmoo | mrpull: You don't have a problem with your kids imitating animals who walk around naked? |
| 20:05.53 | fozzmoo | ;-) |
| 20:06.00 | unum | they're all wearing fur coats |
| 20:06.00 | mrpull | fozzmoo: the other day Donald Duck was in a dunking booth. |
| 20:06.09 | mrpull | wtf would a duck care if he got dunked in water? |
| 20:06.16 | fozzmoo | mrpull: Good point. |
| 20:06.27 | fozzmoo | I force my kids to watch Tom & Jerry. |
| 20:08.14 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@lib-uconnect-7.wireless.utah.edu) |
| 20:08.15 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
| 20:08.23 | findlay | -chat ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:08.24 | brac | ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:08.24 | ibot | onjoin for findlay set by brac on Mon Nov 10 13:29:02 2008: -chat about ~say -chat ~shoot convolution |
| 20:08.33 | findlay | ~say -chat ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:08.33 | ibot | -chat ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:08.34 | brac | ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:08.34 | ibot | onjoin for findlay set by brac on Mon Nov 10 13:29:02 2008: -chat about ~say -chat ~shoot convolution |
| 20:08.36 | findlay | lamer |
| 20:08.37 | mrpull | hey wait... someone is claiming TMBG wrote and sang the Hot Dog song form Mickey Mouse Club House |
| 20:08.40 | jshipley | how about using this song? |
| 20:08.41 | jshipley | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuUViOlqbII |
| 20:09.05 | findlay | ~onjoin findlay -chat ~say -chat |
| 20:09.05 | ibot | findlay: ok |
| 20:09.06 | mrpull | jshipley: OOOOH no... I've seen them on tv. |
| 20:10.38 | mrpull | well I'll be. it was They Might Be Giants that did the Hot Dog song. |
| 20:10.45 | mrpull | I love that song. |
| 20:15.16 | jshipley | mrpull: they're kind of interesting... unfortunately, she's not a very good country singer. worse, for me at least, I'm not much of a country fan. |
| 20:15.54 | mrpull | jshipley: yeah. there isn't even a "it is so bad it is good" angle on that one |
| 20:16.03 | jshipley | mrpull: I think the weirdest part is how hard they try to live seperate lives. |
| 20:16.27 | fozzmoo | Amazing how --exclude='*psd' speeds up an rsync transfer |
| 20:16.29 | mrpull | they are an interesting couple for sure |
| 20:16.47 | jshipley | mrpull: right... it's more like somebody took pity on them and let her cut an album because she wanted to |
| 20:17.23 | mrpull | quite possibly. maybe a Make a Wish type grant. |
| 20:17.37 | jshipley | what a time consuming life though... they shower at different times, have separate careers, attend separate college courses... |
| 20:18.12 | mrpull | you'd have to be pretty special to put up with a sibling 24/7 |
| 20:18.28 | jshipley | oh yeah, and completely separate relationships. If one is on a date, the other does her best to ignore it all |
| 20:20.22 | jshipley | I don't know if I could take it, but that explains their efforts to have some semblance of separate lives |
| 20:30.05 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@lib-uconnect-7.wireless.utah.edu) |
| 20:30.05 | brac | ~say -chat ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:30.06 | ibot | -chat ~onjoin findlay |
| 20:30.06 | brac | ~onjoin findlay -chat ~say -chat ~shoot convolution |
| 20:30.06 | ibot | ok, brac |
| 20:31.37 | tensai | unum: the pirates apparently operate from larger ships out at sea but do come in to port. the main pirate port is Eyl. |
| 20:32.00 | tensai | it seems there is some agreement that bombing the living tar out of it would slow down pirating |
| 20:32.19 | tensai | but apparently international laws make destroying a town difficult |
| 20:32.41 | findlay | are they amassing too many dvds and mp3s? |
| 20:32.51 | jshipley | could we just park a navy outside the port and demolish any ships that try to leave? |
| 20:32.57 | tensai | findlay: these would be actual pirates with guns and ships |
| 20:32.58 | findlay | just notify the FBI, I'm sure they and the riaa can handle anything |
| 20:33.31 | findlay | tensai: just wait until the mpaa gets them in the courtroom. Then they'll think twice about guns and ships |
| 20:33.33 | tensai | jshipley: un resolutions preclude sinking pirate ships until an onboard search has been performed to confirm they are really pirates |
| 20:34.07 | jshipley | hmm... maybe we can just secretly hire some privateers to do the job? |
| 20:34.20 | tensai | india did sink a pirate ship yesterday |
| 20:34.21 | findlay | because if they get too many mp3s society will collapse |
| 20:34.39 | unum | elg: thanks, that's good to know |
| 20:34.49 | tensai | they've talked about hiring private security or arming the ships, but there are UN rules about that too |
| 20:35.47 | *** join/#utah wakigame (n=wakigame@smivpn.sorensonmedia.com) |
| 20:36.22 | jshipley | well then, it sounds like a pretty good career opportunity |
| 20:36.49 | jshipley | even better than it was in the 1800s when it was likely to get you hanged without much of a trial |
| 20:37.51 | jshipley | although I doubt that there are any modern pirates that will be romanticized... Where are the Blackbeards and the Dread Pirate Roberts? |
| 20:39.15 | findlay | I'm a pirate. I pirated all these tracks off from my CDs onto my computer |
| 20:40.07 | unum | findlay: we don't use that term like that in here. you mean copied with out authorization </rms> |
| 20:40.26 | findlay | unum: maybe I can pirate some over to you in an email |
| 20:40.28 | tensai | I think the reason the RIAAs tactics won't work against these actual pirates is because the pirates aren't customers of the ship owners |
| 20:40.35 | tensai | it only works if you sue your own customers |
| 20:40.37 | findlay | or you could grab it off from my pirate server |
| 20:41.02 | jshipley | findlay: s/pirate/share/ |
| 20:41.04 | findlay | tensai: hm, that's a critical observation |
| 20:41.21 | tensai | jshipley: when their other option is to live a poor and destitute life in a war-torn country, yeah I'd say being a pirate makes a lot of sense for them |
| 20:41.24 | jshipley | 'piracy' isn't about stealing, it's about sharing with your neighbor |
| 20:41.36 | findlay | haha |
| 20:41.57 | tensai | you guys saw cory doctorow's essay this week on copyright? |
| 20:42.06 | jshipley | no, is it good? |
| 20:42.15 | tensai | http://www.locusmag.com/Features/2008/11/cory-doctorow-why-i-copyfight.html |
| 20:42.17 | brac | [Locus Online Features: Cory Doctorow: Why I Copyfight] |
| 20:43.17 | tensai | jshipley: I thought so. but then I like most of what he says. I really like his voice too. |
| 20:43.36 | unum | coulton wrote a nice letter for the creative commons |
| 20:43.36 | tensai | not to mention we share a name, which of course makes me biased |
| 20:43.49 | jshipley | it's kind of hard to take it seriously when the riaa likes to compare robbing ships, kidnapping/ransoming people, and general mayhem at sea with sharing files |
| 20:43.51 | *** join/#utah cgibreak (n=cgibreak@cgibreak.us.to) |
| 20:44.12 | unum | tensai: have you seen his ring |
| 20:44.26 | tensai | unum: yeah |
| 20:44.49 | jshipley | I've read the first paragraph... I agree so far, and I'm liking it |
| 20:50.00 | *** part/#utah wakigame (n=wakigame@smivpn.sorensonmedia.com) |
| 20:50.26 | harleypig | badger badger |
| 20:50.51 | harleypig | badger badger badger badger badger badger badger badger badger badger badger |
| 20:51.17 | jshipley | tensai: that's a pretty good article. I hope that somebody will see reason and change the laws about all this |
| 20:52.11 | jshipley | unfortunately, http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/10/bush-signs-law.html |
| 20:56.12 | goozbach | equating breaking copyright with masturbation, love it! |
| 20:57.43 | jshipley | I've never, ever broken any copyright laws. |
| 20:58.01 | goozbach | jshipley: either have I |
| 20:58.04 | goozbach | ever |
| 20:58.09 | goozbach | not once |
| 20:58.18 | goozbach | except that one time |
| 20:58.26 | unum | I'm going to hold out hope until I see the name of the CTO |
| 20:58.46 | unum | me either never |
| 20:59.07 | unum | I love it when members of my church get up and start taking about pirating church music |
| 20:59.14 | goozbach | heh |
| 20:59.19 | unum | I guess I've only seen it twice so far.... |
| 20:59.29 | jshipley | Maybe we'll see a "War on Piracy (Copyright Infringement)" similar to the "War on Drugs" and "War on Terror" |
| 20:59.35 | unum | but when you consider how rarerly I make it through all of church. |
| 21:00.14 | unum | don't forget the war on poverty |
| 21:00.38 | unum | I'm starting to think the US has lost most of their "wars" |
| 21:00.39 | harleypig | Let's have a war on porn ... I'll be a double agent ... |
| 21:01.16 | unum | harleypig: how did you not get the job to look up porn for the state |
| 21:01.26 | harleypig | Didn't even know about it. |
| 21:01.27 | unum | I thought John Dougal wrote that law just to give you a job |
| 21:01.32 | harleypig | :D |
| 21:01.44 | harleypig | What's the pay? |
| 21:01.52 | harleypig | All the kleenex and lotion you want? |
| 21:02.23 | tensai | there's a mental image I did *not* need |
| 21:02.36 | goozbach | harleypig: looks like $150,000 |
| 21:02.42 | harleypig | holy crap |
| 21:02.44 | jshipley | Let's start a new war -- we can call it the "War on Reason" |
| 21:02.47 | goozbach | http://www.usatoday.com/life/2001-03-04-porn-czar.htm |
| 21:02.48 | brac | [USATODAY.com - Utah lawyer turns 'porn czar'] |
| 21:03.49 | harleypig | goozbach: no, that's for both a 'czar' and an assistant ... probably 100K and 50k |
| 21:03.53 | harleypig | But ... even so. |
| 21:04.00 | jshipley | Unfortunately, I think that we've already been fighting that war for a few years |
| 21:04.36 | unum | jshipley: yes, yes we have. |
| 21:05.22 | jshipley | oops |
| 21:05.26 | jshipley | s/years/decades/ |
| 21:06.11 | goozbach | this article is interesting: |
| 21:06.15 | goozbach | "Two-thirds of them are Mormons, followers of the strict Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which bans alcohol and sex outside marriage." |
| 21:06.19 | harleypig | Hey ... we ban alchohol and sex out site ... |
| 21:06.22 | harleypig | you beat me to it. |
| 21:06.30 | goozbach | you can have booze after you're married! |
| 21:06.41 | harleypig | I'll just stop typing. |
| 21:06.48 | harleypig | I wish I'd known that ... |
| 21:06.48 | Jayce^ | cheers |
| 21:06.58 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 21:06.58 | goozbach | goes by the package store on his way home |
| 21:07.18 | tensai | ban(alcohol | (sex outside marriage)) |
| 21:07.19 | harleypig | goozbach is gonna buy a new package? |
| 21:08.19 | goozbach | tensai: yeah, I know, but it's a poorly worded sentance |
| 21:09.01 | tensai | goozbach: it's a poorly organized language easily leading to ambiguity |
| 21:09.33 | goozbach | that too |
| 21:09.41 | harleypig | tensai: That's no excuse for poorly worded sentences. |
| 21:09.43 | goozbach | but it's funny, see? |
| 21:09.54 | harleypig | especially from someone who uses words as part of their job. |
| 21:10.05 | goozbach | yeah, see? |
| 21:10.19 | goozbach | </gangster voice> |
| 21:10.19 | harleypig | holy see? |
| 21:10.27 | harleypig | holy crap? |
| 21:30.46 | jshipley | Does anybody know if Lenny is still targeted to release in 08 |
| 21:34.50 | harleypig | Lenny won't get any release until Karl accepts his own orientation. |
| 21:35.54 | jshipley | harleypig: I don't get that reference |
| 21:36.03 | harleypig | Lenny and Karl? |
| 21:36.12 | harleypig | from the Simpsons |
| 21:38.12 | jshipley | Sorry, I like the show, but I really don't watch it much |
| 21:38.43 | harleypig | s'all right .. 'twas a bad joke anyway :] |
| 22:08.14 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@72.62.161.77) |
| 22:08.14 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 22:13.03 | goozbach | harley that was a great joke |
| 22:21.46 | jshipley | anti-piracy the way it should be: |
| 22:21.47 | jshipley | http://www.youtube.com/v/OGqX-tkDXEk&hl=en&fs=1 |
| 22:28.32 | elg | -lart edgar rice burroughs |
| 22:28.32 | brac | drops a truckload of VAXen on edgar rice burroughs |
| 22:31.39 | elg | that has got to be the most disgusting ending to a book |
| 22:31.53 | harleypig | which book? |
| 22:32.30 | harleypig | goozbach: thx :] |
| 22:33.04 | elg | tarzan of the apes |
| 22:33.22 | tensai | elg: have you read the bible? |
| 22:33.28 | tensai | ended is pretty crazy |
| 22:33.42 | elg | hm, true, but not so disgusting |
| 22:33.47 | harleypig | just realizes he hasn't actually ever read Tarzan of the Apes |
| 22:33.54 | elg | it's a very very good read |
| 22:33.59 | elg | right up to the last two sentences |
| 22:34.01 | elg | moron |
| 22:34.05 | harleypig | :D |
| 22:34.13 | elg | the internet seems to indicate it's rectified in later books though |
| 22:34.52 | neybar | I don't think I'm going to be reading that any time soon. Would the last two sentences make any sense out of context? quote? |
| 22:35.37 | elg | it's spoiler, but you're welcome to read it http://www.literature.org/authors/burroughs-edgar-rice/tarzan-of-the-apes/chapter-28.html |
| 22:35.43 | brac | [Literature.org - The Online Literature Library] |
| 22:35.57 | elg | and no it wouldn't make much sense out of context I guess |
| 22:36.15 | elg | but if you read the entire last chapter it would |
| 22:54.25 | harleypig | elg: :D |
| 22:54.36 | harleypig | That's pretty funny actually. |
| 23:15.34 | jshipley | elg: After reading the several lines leading up to the last two, they seem to be pretty decent lines |
| 23:15.52 | *** join/#utah undertakingyou (n=will@undertakingyou.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 23:16.07 | elg | oh they're well enough written |
| 23:16.51 | levi | elg: The worst endings I've read have been from Hemingway. |
| 23:18.24 | tensai | argh! I ripped and transcoded the wrong dvd title. there's 8 hours of cpu time I'll never get back. |
| 23:18.42 | Sargun | heh |
| 23:20.10 | jshipley | elg: I suppose I'd have to read a lot more to see what's wrong with them |
| 23:20.42 | jshipley | elg: I can see why you'd be outraged if those last two lines are betraying what Tarzan has been working for for half the book |
| 23:22.14 | *** join/#utah Reilithion (n=lucas@75-162-244-44.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 23:23.04 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@97-117-59-103.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 23:26.46 | levi | The ending of A Farewell to Arms made me so mad I never read another one of his books. |
| 23:29.52 | jshipley | I hate it when good books are ruined by stupid endings |
| 23:30.14 | jshipley | I'm not even talking about the state of the characters, etc at the end |
| 23:31.13 | jshipley | I read a pretty good book once (by an author that I like), but was mad at how trite the last couple of lines were |
| 23:32.46 | *** join/#utah cgibreak (n=cgibreak@cgibreak.us.to) |
| 23:34.49 | *** join/#utah RyanE_ (i=Piadas@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 23:40.43 | Reilithion | be'e Tene |
| 23:40.51 | Tene | re'i |
| 23:40.54 | Tene | do mo |
| 23:41.08 | Reilithion | You coming to the meeting tonight? |
| 23:41.21 | Sargun | no |
| 23:41.25 | Tene | ma nunpeni |
| 23:41.54 | Reilithion | the SE Linux presentation up at WEB 101 |
| 23:42.47 | Reilithion | It was announced on the SLLUG mailing list. |
| 23:43.08 | Tene | na go'i .i mi djuno lo banzu la'oi selinux |
| 23:43.48 | Reilithion | .ua |
| 23:43.59 | Tene | .i ku'i la'oi sjansen cu slabu mi |
| 23:44.51 | Tene | la'oi sjansen cu ca zi vi trixe mi |
| 23:45.53 | Reilithion | .ua .i'e |
| 23:46.51 | Tene | mi sy mintu lo ka se jibri la'oi gurulabs |
| 23:47.37 | Tene | s/mintu/simsa/ |
| 23:48.04 | Tene | ... Oh, hi ibot. I guess this isn't #lojban. |
| 23:48.12 | Reilithion | lol |
| 23:48.19 | Reilithion | You just noticed that? |
| 23:48.32 | Tene | Yeah. You addressed me in lojban, so I presumed it was. |
| 23:49.02 | Reilithion | Interesting. |
| 23:49.44 | Reilithion | I'll have to find out what other channels you inhabit and come up with funny form-vs.-content pranks to pull on you. |
| 23:50.23 | Tene | You could check with /whois tene |
| 23:50.44 | Reilithion | That I could. |
| 23:51.04 | Reilithion | Aww. It only shows the two. |
| 23:51.09 | Reilithion | .uinai |
| 23:51.24 | Reilithion | Oh well. I'll just have to get creative. |
| 23:53.58 | harleypig | anyone know how to set the timezone on a centos box? |
| 23:54.52 | Reilithion | uhm, not off the top of my head |
| 23:55.10 | harleypig | can I safely relink /etc/localtime |
| 23:55.13 | harleypig | hmm |
| 23:56.48 | Reilithion | I bet there's an actual command to handle it. At the very least, I wouldn't do that unless a manual somewhere told me to. |
| 23:58.09 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@cpe-069-134-233-156.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 23:58.09 | *** mode/#utah [+v emcnabb] by ChanServ |
| 23:58.44 | harleypig | Well, I can do that in ubuntu (and it's kissin' cousins), gentoo, and a couple of others. |
| 23:59.13 | harleypig | I don't think it'll hurt the system ... but usually a tool is provided if other things have been tacked on. |
| 23:59.21 | harleypig | Nope. My admin says thats the way to doit. |
| 23:59.34 | Reilithion | Admin says so works. |
| 23:59.41 | *** part/#utah albino (n=albino@69.12.222.214) |
| 23:59.51 | Reilithion | Then at least you can blame them if something goes horribly wrong. |
| 23:59.57 | harleypig | heh |