| 00:17.39 | *** join/#utah eggyknap_ (n=eggyknap@ip67-88-113-150.z113-88-67.customer.algx.net) |
| 01:03.29 | levi | Good evening. |
| 01:04.12 | *** join/#utah Midorikawa (n=insanemo@64.244.84.126) |
| 01:22.30 | findlay | -chat good |
| 01:22.30 | brac | good had |
| 01:22.35 | findlay | -chat Good |
| 01:22.35 | brac | Good is asterisk at high resolutions that gets me |
| 01:23.55 | findlay | listens to some Berlioz |
| 01:24.16 | Sargun_screen | C |
| 01:24.23 | findlay | -chat Sargun_screen |
| 01:24.23 | brac | Sargun_screen was sad. |
| 01:24.29 | findlay | aw |
| 01:24.34 | nick125 | yes yes, he was. |
| 01:25.03 | lakshmi | hm |
| 01:25.08 | findlay | -chat lakshmi |
| 01:25.08 | brac | lakshmi is sorry for the TV? |
| 01:25.15 | lakshmi | no im not |
| 01:25.22 | lakshmi | im not sorry! ever |
| 01:25.25 | findlay | yuh huh |
| 01:25.29 | findlay | brac never lies |
| 01:25.32 | findlay | -chat brac |
| 01:25.32 | brac | brac was built. |
| 01:25.36 | findlay | -chat findlay |
| 01:25.36 | brac | findlay went after everything gets locked. |
| 01:27.03 | *** join/#utah sontek (n=sontek@opensuse/member/Sontek) |
| 01:29.27 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@208.53.47.251) |
| 01:30.54 | goozbach | ~blootbot |
| 01:30.55 | ibot | it has been said that blootbot is an IRC bot written in perl descended from infobot. Hosted on SF. This project is now merged back into the main infobot project. See [infobot] |
| 01:31.18 | goozbach | ~infobot |
| 01:31.19 | ibot | goozbach, I love abuse, feed me!, or an interactive bot that can learn all sorts of information (http://www.infobot.org/) |
| 01:45.05 | levi | -chat findlay |
| 01:45.06 | brac | findlay is doing! |
| 01:45.12 | levi | findlay: What are you doing? |
| 01:46.32 | goozbach | ~logs |
| 01:46.32 | ibot | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. |
| 01:48.34 | levi | Ooh, The Sarah Connor Chronicles is coming back in September. |
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| 02:23.02 | tensai | great demo of how the recent dns exploit works in real life. http://www.infobyte.com.ar/demo/evilgrade.htm |
| 02:23.44 | tensai | ~onjoin vontrapp <action> steals vontrapp's parking sticker |
| 02:23.44 | ibot | ok, tensai |
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| 03:00.42 | findlay | ~random |
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| 03:01.04 | tensai | findlay: whatcha moving to SLC for? |
| 03:03.11 | sontek | becaus slc is where all the hotties live |
| 03:03.16 | findlay | tensai: skule |
| 03:03.36 | findlay | tensai: you want my job? :) |
| 03:04.25 | tensai | findlay: heh. not for $10/hr. doesn't sound like a bad job though. |
| 03:06.58 | Tene | Yeah, $10/hr for that list of tasks seems pretty low. |
| 03:07.29 | findlay | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:07.52 | findlay | I guess I just think too conservatively |
| 03:08.18 | findlay | I hate money |
| 03:09.02 | findlay | there's always too much or too little and everybody's always making a big deal out of it |
| 03:09.12 | Tene | yarly |
| 03:09.23 | findlay | and you have to trade your dollars for gas and people hate this for some reason |
| 03:09.35 | findlay | so I endeavor to not think of it at all |
| 03:11.47 | Sargun | hehe |
| 03:17.13 | levi | You have to trade your dollars for all sorts of stuff. |
| 03:17.36 | findlay | yeah, it's a really elegant system |
| 03:18.02 | levi | Well, depends on who you ask. |
| 03:18.25 | levi | I mean, our current dollars are FIAT dollars instead of GOLD-BACKED dollars. |
| 03:18.31 | findlay | haha |
| 03:18.38 | findlay | dude |
| 03:18.57 | findlay | all the cool kids are moving *away* from artifact-defined standards |
| 03:19.34 | levi | Well, I don't think Ron Paul really aspires to being a cool kid. |
| 03:19.41 | findlay | like le grand K is the only SI unit still defined by an artifact, and people are actively working on replacing it |
| 03:20.29 | levi | Well, at least the SI standards are still based on unchanging measurements. |
| 03:20.55 | levi | They're not declared by the FIAT of a CENTRAL BANK controlled by PRIVATE INTERESTS. |
| 03:21.00 | findlay | money's not an SI unit :) |
| 03:28.10 | Newsome | don't know about you, but my account balance is NaN |
| 03:31.21 | sontek | mine is int.MAX_VALUE :D |
| 03:31.22 | sontek | ;) |
| 03:36.48 | levi | sontek: How many bits in your int, though? |
| 03:37.10 | Sargun | Enough. |
| 03:55.48 | levi | Huh, the Hale Center Theater is putting on The Scarlet Pimpernel again. |
| 03:56.06 | sontek | whos going to see Ralph Nader on Thursday!? |
| 03:56.08 | sontek | lololol |
| 04:15.34 | levi | Whee, Ralph Nader! |
| 04:27.32 | nick125 | sontek: the five independents, which are over *there*. Oh look, the 3 republicans are over *there*! |
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| 05:04.15 | levi | http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2008/jul/28/church-shooting-police-find-manifesto-suspects-car/ |
| 05:05.17 | levi | Clearly we need to ban Hannity, Savage, and O'Reilly. Violent video games only make impressionable kids kill people. Conservative pundits make adults kill people! |
| 05:10.59 | fozzmoo | This sounds too much like a set up. |
| 05:11.38 | fozzmoo | Like... the guy knew the press would publish what they found, so he got some old conservative titles from a local thrift store and tossed them in the back seat. |
| 05:12.01 | fozzmoo | reads more. |
| 05:12.07 | fozzmoo | Oh, but the gay thing... |
| 05:12.22 | fozzmoo | I can see Michael Savage telling his listeners to go do drive-bys there. :) |
| 05:12.25 | levi | No, it just sounds like a crazy guy who was taking the gasbags a little too literally. |
| 05:13.02 | fozzmoo | Savage is... whew. |
| 05:15.08 | fozzmoo | Listening to Savage could drive someone to suicide... |
| 05:15.15 | fozzmoo | Maybe that's what this guy ws doing. |
| 05:15.21 | levi | Savage is a Weiner. |
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| 05:15.47 | fozzmoo | Yep. |
| 05:15.50 | Tene | fozzmoo: you ever look at Template::Declare? |
| 05:16.14 | fozzmoo | Sounds familiar... |
| 05:16.26 | levi | (Weiner is his real last name) |
| 05:16.36 | Tene | Comes from the Jifty folks. Pretty nice templating system. |
| 05:16.47 | fozzmoo | Looks... scary. |
| 05:16.59 | fozzmoo | In that it's not designer friendly. |
| 05:17.09 | Tene | Yeah. |
| 05:17.43 | Tene | It's for projects you're doing yourself, not passing stuff off to a designer. |
| 05:17.50 | fozzmoo | Obviously. Looks cool tho. |
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| 05:18.14 | fozzmoo | levi: Hmm.m I can understand why he changed it. Publishing a book titled "Weiner Nation" doesn't have quite the same edge. |
| 05:18.15 | Tene | I saw your posts on TT and thought I'd mention it. |
| 05:18.22 | fozzmoo | Tene: Thanks! |
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| 05:38.45 | *** part/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@209.41.95.5) |
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| 05:40.21 | levi | Wow, nice budget deficit we're running. $482 billion. |
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| 06:15.51 | C4N | Whoa, a smiley. |
| 06:17.39 | Tene | Mmm... PadWalker... |
| 06:18.06 | findlay | ibot: ⺠is means fozzmoo |
| 06:18.07 | ibot | findlay: i'm not going to learn illegal characters |
| 06:18.15 | findlay | ibot: you are illegal |
| 06:18.16 | ibot | findlay: I think you lost me on that one |
| 06:18.38 | findlay | ibot: get unicode support, man |
| 06:18.38 | ibot | ACTION fetches unicode support, man |
| 06:18.48 | findlay | -chat ibot |
| 06:18.48 | brac | ibot did that. I'm sure it would have thought humanly possible. |
| 07:07.29 | fozzmoo | Harry Potterã®ããªãã®æ¬ã¯ã¨ã ãã¼ã»ã¹ãªã¼ãã©ã¼ãããã§ä»å©ç¨ã§ããã |
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| 14:42.27 | Sargun_screen | I must ask: What's the point of making your variable private? |
| 14:43.25 | Sargun_screen | Or protected? |
| 14:43.59 | Sargun_screen | memcpy($MYDATA, (void*)$YOURPROTECTED, $SOMEZIE) |
| 14:44.02 | Sargun_screen | SOMESIZE |
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| 15:02.25 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
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| 15:19.17 | levi | Sargun_screen: You can subvert pretty much anything you want to in C++ if you want to do ugly crap like that. What's the point of the type system and different datatypes and all that, then? |
| 15:21.00 | levi | Sargun_screen: Answer: It lets you use the compiler to enforce certain rules, as long as you don't intentionally subvert it. |
| 15:21.21 | levi | The fact that you *can* subvert it doesn't eliminate the value. |
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| 15:44.07 | sjansen | ~host 99.bottles-of-beer.friocorte.com |
| 15:44.08 | ibot | see nslookup 99.bottles-of-beer.friocorte.com |
| 15:44.18 | sjansen | ~nslookup 99.bottles-of-beer.friocorte.com |
| 15:44.47 | sjansen | stupid bot |
| 15:45.03 | Sargun_screen | Hehe |
| 15:45.03 | sjansen | nslookup is deprecated, and the record is there |
| 15:45.40 | Sargun_screen | The server automagically stuffs all of those records in one packet. |
| 15:45.46 | Sargun_screen | ~dig 99.bottles-of-beer.friocorte.com |
| 15:46.12 | Sargun_screen | Go time! |
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| 16:01.52 | levi | Man, why aren't there any interesting conversations here anymore? |
| 16:02.47 | unum | because I joined |
| 16:03.02 | unum | does any know what channel the utah perl mongers hang out in? |
| 16:03.30 | levi | I got the feeling that the group was going defunct. |
| 16:03.45 | levi | They used to all hang out and chat here, afaik. |
| 16:04.22 | levi | I think they still do, at least as much as they hang out on IRC. |
| 16:04.34 | levi | Why; do you want to chat about perl? |
| 16:08.47 | unum | ya I'm having trouble getting the system function to work the way I want with a certain program |
| 16:08.59 | fungus | ~nslookup 16.bottles-of-beer.friocorte.com |
| 16:09.05 | unum | I was looking for suggestions |
| 16:11.16 | unum | doing console base programming in perl reminds me of the good old days of learning pascal in high school |
| 16:11.59 | unum | got it working |
| 16:12.13 | unum | oh wait... |
| 16:13.57 | unum | hmmm I think my main problem is that I'm using term::screen |
| 16:14.24 | levi | Well, if harleypig or Jayce^ show up, I'm sure they'll have an answer for you. |
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| 16:30.41 | fozzmoo | Yeah. |
| 16:30.50 | fozzmoo | waits for harleypig or Jayce^ |
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| 16:34.29 | unum | fozzmoo: what do you recommend for an ncurses like package for perl |
| 16:34.53 | fozzmoo | That's a good question. I haven't really done much of that in years. |
| 16:36.29 | fozzmoo | Have you hit the CPAN for curses? |
| 16:36.33 | fozzmoo | Have you cursed the CPAN? :) |
| 16:36.59 | unum | I'm looking at that now. we were using something called screen::term |
| 16:37.09 | fozzmoo | Looks like there are a gazillion Curses::* modules. |
| 16:37.15 | unum | ya |
| 16:38.05 | fozzmoo | Check out Curses::Application |
| 16:38.06 | sjansen | levi: Burn out. One too many afternoons wasted "discussing" non-work-related topics. |
| 16:39.06 | Tene | unum: I've been doing a lot of curses programming in perl lately. |
| 16:39.20 | Tene | unum: what's your question? |
| 16:40.53 | unum | Tene: which module do you recommend? |
| 16:41.04 | Tene | unum: what are you wanting to do with curses? |
| 16:41.33 | unum | just a simple menu, with an externel system call as one of the options |
| 16:42.34 | unum | I need to be able to redraw the screen, and replace characters |
| 16:42.48 | unum | I also like have a getch function |
| 16:42.48 | Tene | unum: Curses::Application does a lot for you. |
| 16:43.08 | Tene | I'm just using plain 'Curses' with a little bit of Curses::Forms. |
| 16:44.36 | goozbach | my bottles of beer domain still works?! |
| 16:44.39 | goozbach | coolio |
| 16:44.49 | unum | ya the application stuff has a ton of stuff |
| 16:44.59 | bugQ | goozbach: how many bottles? |
| 16:45.05 | goozbach | 99 |
| 16:45.20 | goozbach | run this: host 99.bottles-of-beer.friocorte.com |
| 16:45.41 | Tene | unum: I suggest looking at the examples in the Curses package to see if you need anything more than that. |
| 16:45.47 | bugQ | oh, it's a subdomain. I thought you had something _really_ cool. :P |
| 16:45.55 | Tene | unum: what will be in your menu? |
| 16:46.10 | unum | the user will have to type in there employee number |
| 16:46.19 | unum | and then "clock in"(sql insert) |
| 16:46.27 | Tene | Ah, then you want Curses::Forms, probably. |
| 16:46.44 | unum | and then they can choose "local job" (system function call) |
| 16:46.50 | Tene | Or even maybe Curses::Forms::Dialog::Input |
| 16:47.11 | unum | or remote(job)which has other options and updates counters on the screen |
| 16:47.35 | unum | thanks I'll look at all of that |
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| 17:01.42 | encryptz | unum: i thought vd was going the python route? decide against that? |
| 17:02.03 | encryptz | not that there's anything wrong with perl, just curious |
| 17:06.29 | unum | encryptz: we decided against that several months before you left |
| 17:06.38 | unum | went php/perl |
| 17:07.04 | unum | actually I think the whole python thing died pretty much after mike left |
| 17:07.21 | encryptz | ahh |
| 17:07.37 | encryptz | i thought it was still an option, with ruby as another alternative |
| 17:08.13 | unum | I don't think ruby has ever even been considered |
| 17:10.30 | encryptz | how is that hole in the wall doing anyway? busy? |
| 17:10.44 | encryptz | picks on unum |
| 17:21.08 | unum | things are starting to pick up |
| 17:21.14 | unum | it's been slow until this week |
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| 17:41.58 | harleypig | arghh ... what's wrong with this html snippet?! <input type="textarea" name="why" id="why" rows="3" cols="40"></textarea> |
| 17:42.14 | harleypig | I'm getting just a single row of about 20 characters width. |
| 17:42.38 | Tene | harleypig: you want the <textarea> tag |
| 17:42.50 | Tene | <textarea> is a separate tag from <input> |
| 17:42.54 | Tene | I don't know know why. |
| 17:43.21 | bugQ | there is no reason. |
| 17:43.38 | Tene | bugQ: DONT QUESTION THE W3C! |
| 17:43.43 | harleypig | *blush* |
| 17:43.48 | bugQ | you could say "legacy reasons", if you like |
| 17:43.50 | harleypig | someone just pointed it out to me |
| 17:45.08 | harleypig | I knew that ... that's what I get for starting to type one thing and not deleting it before rewriting it with the new concept. |
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| 18:44.34 | elg | heh, gmail's smtp tls cert is expired |
| 18:44.49 | Tene | heh |
| 18:50.14 | elg | at 10:48 this morning |
| 18:50.37 | elg | somewhere a sysadmin was reading slashdot... |
| 18:58.57 | levi | That, or he was engaged in a vigorous debate on a local mailing list. |
| 18:59.13 | levi | Off topic, of course. |
| 19:16.41 | elg | that's an interesting thing to think about |
| 19:17.00 | elg | when plug goes off-topic we have utah-driven topics |
| 19:17.09 | elg | i wonder what off-topic looks like in silicon valley |
| 19:18.04 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:18.05 | elg | first guess |
| 19:22.07 | levi | I dunno, I imagine they have a bunch of Ron Paul fans there, too, and that they're similarly vocal. |
| 19:24.04 | elg | some, no doubt |
| 19:24.21 | elg | but they would also have some vocal $DEMOCRAT supporters |
| 19:24.44 | levi | They do have a republican governor. |
| 19:25.26 | elg | yes, and of course there are enough people and diversity to make sweeping generalizations completely useless |
| 19:25.55 | elg | but the bay area, technology crowd |
| 19:26.12 | elg | might be much more stereotypical. i don't know, just a guess. that's why it's an interesting thing to wonder |
| 19:27.00 | levi | There would be a lot more asians, that's for sure. |
| 19:32.56 | unum | levi: but their republican govenor is 10x more liberal than our democrat congressman |
| 19:34.14 | unum | of course sometimes I think our republican govenor is more liberal than our democrat congressman |
| 19:34.29 | unum | ;) |
| 19:34.52 | elg | so i just finished Elantris |
| 19:34.52 | Tene | levi: how do you see race on a mailing list? |
| 19:34.54 | fozzmoo | raises hand in agreement |
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| 19:34.56 | elg | excellent book |
| 19:35.03 | elg | i'm going to have to read more of his stuff |
| 19:35.07 | unum | what's it about? |
| 19:35.10 | elg | Tene: unicode |
| 19:35.18 | Tene | *blink* |
| 19:35.20 | Tene | ~lart elg |
| 19:35.20 | ibot | whacks elg with a giant beaver's tail |
| 19:35.35 | unum | you know there's really not enough beaver around here |
| 19:35.40 | elg | http://www.brandonsanderson.com/portal/Elantris |
| 19:35.42 | brac | [Brandon Sanderson: Elantris Portal] |
| 19:44.09 | unum | so the wheel of time guy croaked before finishing didn't he? |
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| 19:53.39 | unum | encryptz: I was wrong the other day djbdns does not need to be patched |
| 19:53.46 | unum | but all other dns systems probably do |
| 19:54.07 | opapo | I have a problem with my vpn connection |
| 19:54.19 | opapo | I can connect, but I can't get anywhere after that |
| 19:54.24 | bugQ | what about maradns? |
| 19:54.37 | opapo | route -n is as follows: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/31842/ |
| 19:54.40 | sjansen | *sigh* I hate saying "if you can't see it, you haven't been paying attention" but it's true. The only way to see the change in MS's behavior is to remember what it was like a several years ago. |
| 19:56.06 | unum | OpenDNS, PowerDNS and MaraDNS |
| 19:56.17 | unum | didn't need to be patched |
| 19:56.56 | bugQ | tat |
| 19:57.02 | bugQ | um, yay |
| 19:58.45 | Tene | sjansen: how has their behavior changed? |
| 19:59.29 | findlay | sjansen: well there's one important difference from IBM |
| 19:59.52 | findlay | IBM didn't have ballmer as CEO when they changed their attitude |
| 20:00.49 | findlay | 'linux is a [cancer|communist|antiamerican]' doesn't really make for a very open position |
| 20:01.35 | encryptz | 'linux is a antiamerican' isn't proper grammar |
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| 20:02.13 | findlay | yeah, see? |
| 20:03.38 | sjansen | Yeah, but IBM only had to deal with the US court system. Microsoft has to deal with an economic model that gives amazing value to customers. |
| 20:03.45 | sjansen | And the EU courts. |
| 20:04.20 | findlay | you're saying the floss environment is so different than it was 10 years ago? |
| 20:04.31 | mrpull | rats. i was hoping djbdns did need to be patched |
| 20:04.52 | mrpull | my only experience with that software (admittedly 6-7 years ago) was a PITA. |
| 20:05.21 | mrpull | but it seemed like just getting it installed took a whole lot more effort than needed. |
| 20:07.21 | sjansen | findlay: If you're referring to IBM, you're not looking far enough back in history. |
| 20:07.21 | Tene | mrpull: so why were you hoping that it did need to be patched? |
| 20:07.53 | mrpull | the $500 offer to report a hole in his software |
| 20:07.58 | findlay | Tene: the same reason you secretly want MS to still be conniving swindlers :-) |
| 20:08.10 | mrpull | it's a dumb unfounded bias |
| 20:08.47 | findlay | mrpull: what isn't? |
| 20:08.57 | fozzmoo | findlay: Why are you moving to SL? |
| 20:09.10 | findlay | sjansen: I still fail to understand your statement |
| 20:09.11 | sjansen | IBM was prepared to change and accept F/OSS precisely because of the difficulties it went through in the 70's and 80's. |
| 20:09.33 | findlay | fozzmoo: UU |
| 20:09.45 | findlay | teh skool |
| 20:09.49 | fozzmoo | findlay: transfer? |
| 20:09.52 | elg | anyone else hear UVU and think uvula? |
| 20:09.53 | findlay | yup |
| 20:10.00 | sjansen | Microsft hasn't been slapped around as hard until this century. |
| 20:10.25 | elg | ~slap sjansen |
| 20:10.26 | ibot | ACTION slaps sjansen, keep your grubby fingers to yourself! |
| 20:10.53 | sjansen | My point is that customers alone have incentive to force MS to change. But thanks to the EU, MS is seeing pressure from two sides at once. |
| 20:11.54 | findlay | ~transfer |
| 20:11.58 | findlay | ~transfer findlay |
| 20:12.00 | sjansen | ~punish elg |
| 20:12.00 | ibot | ACTION forces elg to install and use Windows |
| 20:13.47 | sjansen | http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/funny-pictures-your-cat-is-going-to-anger-management-classes.jpg |
| 20:15.14 | sjansen | Hey, where's ^Migs^? How I'm supposed to share a URL just for him? http://www.poopsign.com/ |
| 20:15.18 | brac | [OH MY GOD IT'S THE POOP SIGN] |
| 20:16.54 | findlay | ~sjansen ^Migs^ |
| 20:16.55 | ibot | ACTION tells ^Migs^ good things about sjansen |
| 20:17.49 | unum | I have a hard time trusting ms |
| 20:18.16 | unum | but if they place their stuff under gplv3, ad it's any good I'd probably use it |
| 20:18.21 | findlay | ~seen ^Migs^ |
| 20:18.26 | ibot | ^migs^ <n=Migs@wsddevdude.weber.k12.ut.us> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 22h 58m 51s ago, saying: 'http://www.blabberize.com'. |
| 20:21.40 | mrpull | it is kinda fun that sjansen is apologizing for MS these days... flashback 5-6 years and ask him about MS |
| 20:21.56 | findlay | heh |
| 20:22.37 | mrpull | on a completely unrelated note... |
| 20:22.50 | mrpull | a Tim Burton Alice in Wonderland will be AWESOME |
| 20:23.04 | sjansen | really for trues? |
| 20:23.12 | findlay | there are some jazz modes that have no unrelated notes. All twelve tones can be incorporated |
| 20:23.20 | mrpull | sjansen: you apologizing for MS or the Burton Alice? |
| 20:23.46 | findlay | it's like a point of instability that leads to tonic adroitness |
| 20:25.13 | mrpull | findlay: i guess that's why i only like bluesy jazz... the really esoteric scales unsettle me |
| 20:25.29 | findlay | mrpull: you mean like bebop? :) |
| 20:25.40 | findlay | it's surprisingly easy |
| 20:25.43 | mrpull | bebop or doowop? |
| 20:26.45 | findlay | traditionally I guess you just need to be able to move through keys fast |
| 20:26.57 | findlay | and it's not too unsettling I don't think |
| 20:27.02 | sjansen | mrpull: Burton Alice. Amazing potential. |
| 20:27.34 | findlay | I vote with sjansen |
| 20:29.37 | findlay | haha, I love it when xfce decides to delete all my workspaces and collapse all the windows into the remaining one |
| 20:29.53 | Tene | nice |
| 20:30.05 | findlay | maybe I'm unwittingly hitting an unfortunate key combination |
| 20:30.23 | mrpull | sjansen: agreed. I generally like Burton's films. I love the Alice stories. |
| 20:30.33 | mrpull | remember the American McGee's Alice game? |
| 20:30.39 | findlay | ~fortune |
| 20:30.39 | ibot | i guess fortune is a kickass app available for Linux. Packages are in OZ and http://frob.us/modules.php?name=Fortune lets you use fortune over the web. |
| 20:30.43 | mrpull | i never finished it, but it was a fun dark game |
| 20:30.54 | bugQ | heck ya |
| 20:31.00 | findlay | mrpull: remember labrinth? |
| 20:31.03 | findlay | the movie |
| 20:31.24 | mrpull | yes. but i saw it at a drive in when i was very young. Bowie freaked me out. |
| 20:31.31 | mrpull | i truly thought he was evil. |
| 20:31.32 | findlay | that was a wierd movie, partially excusable because it was made in the 80s |
| 20:31.49 | findlay | yeah, but now it's just funny :) |
| 20:32.05 | mrpull | what does labrinth have to do with Alice in Wonderland? |
| 20:32.13 | findlay | it's a wierd movie, that is all |
| 20:53.04 | mrpull | http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/pc/americanmcgeesalice?q=Alice |
| 20:53.23 | mrpull | its hard to believe Alice was nearly 8 years ago. |
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| 21:08.40 | elg | so I'm helping a guy in my ward with his second-year information systems python class |
| 21:09.09 | elg | if you can call it exposure to python, it's my first real exposure to python |
| 21:09.33 | elg | though I haven't seen much, I am not being impressed, relatively speaking |
| 21:09.52 | elg | I've tried to reserve judgement on python, since python bashing by ruby people is so cliché |
| 21:12.26 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:12.37 | elg | stupid irc client |
| 21:12.47 | elg | ' '.join(ary) is just backwards I meant to say, and things like it |
| 21:13.14 | elg | and this really neat persistent hash thing (I think ruby has an equivalent but i haven't used it much and it doesn't have nearly the cool metaphor) called shelves |
| 21:13.31 | elg | but written by someone who couldn't be bothered to figure out the singular form of the word isn't shelve but shelf |
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| 21:13.49 | elg | i thought python was supposed to be more literary. misspelling hardly suggests literary |
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| 21:23.13 | Tene | elg: explain shelves? |
| 21:23.26 | elg | shelve.open('foo') |
| 21:23.32 | elg | foo[x] = 42 |
| 21:23.39 | elg | uses bdb in the backend I think |
| 21:23.50 | elg | probably you can use one of the many simple dbs |
| 21:23.59 | elg | that creates foo.db |
| 21:24.02 | elg | persistent hashes, basically |
| 21:24.14 | elg | or dictionaries, to use pythonspeak |
| 21:24.27 | Tene | ah |
| 21:24.28 | Tene | nice |
| 21:30.07 | levi | elg: shelve is the verb form, though. |
| 21:30.30 | elg | verbs as object names? |
| 21:30.38 | levi | But you're right, shelve.open('foo') doesn't make much sense. |
| 21:30.50 | elg | nor import shelve |
| 21:31.00 | elg | shelve(s, 'key', 'value') might make sense |
| 21:31.01 | levi | Huh, weird. |
| 21:31.05 | elg | but wouldn't be OO |
| 21:31.52 | levi | Except that's how all Python function signatures look, since the 'self' argument is explicit. |
| 21:32.40 | elg | when defining it? |
| 21:36.43 | levi | Yeah. |
| 21:37.43 | elg | even for static methods/ |
| 21:37.52 | elg | certainly not |
| 21:37.54 | levi | Not for static methods. |
| 21:38.27 | elg | anyway, it woudln't matter if that was the reason. the api should be for the user programmer if there's a tense conflict |
| 21:38.31 | levi | Although my Python knowledge is very rusty. |
| 21:38.47 | elg | that whole explicit self and __foo__ stuff is another ugly splotch |
| 21:39.07 | levi | I think it's ugly too, though Pythonistas seem to like it. |
| 21:39.08 | elg | python confuses me. the whitespace thing is to make it pretty, and yet it's so ugly |
| 21:39.32 | elg | it's like a 14 year old girl with too much makeup |
| 21:40.25 | nick125 | Good programmers use whitespace anyways, so what's the issue? |
| 21:40.27 | elg | anyway i'm sure programming in python is much more productive than say c++ |
| 21:40.33 | elg | it's not the whitespace making it ugly |
| 21:40.35 | elg | that part is fine |
| 21:40.39 | elg | it's the rest of the language that's ugly |
| 21:40.42 | nick125 | It's better than something like the end tags in Ruby. |
| 21:40.45 | elg | (not all of it is ugly, of course) |
| 21:40.53 | nick125 | brb |
| 21:40.55 | elg | i think do/end is fine. it's not ugly |
| 21:41.03 | elg | i'm not talking syntax |
| 21:41.36 | elg | syntax is syntax. it is what it is and in the end rarely makes a large impact on things beyond a superficial level |
| 21:42.17 | levi | I actually enjoy using Python, in those rare occasions that I'm called on to use it. |
| 21:42.44 | levi | There's not a lot of cognitive overhead involved for me, so it's really easy to pick back up. |
| 21:42.46 | elg | i'm sure it's not bad to actually use |
| 21:43.02 | elg | i'm just finding myself amazed at how ugly it is |
| 21:43.21 | elg | call me spoiled |
| 21:43.43 | levi | You spoiled little brat. ;) |
| 21:44.01 | elg | ~tantrum |
| 21:46.25 | Tene | I keep forgetting that Perl 5 isn't Perl 6. |
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| 21:58.31 | opapo | is anyone using qgis? |
| 21:58.40 | opapo | I can't find a good map of utah |
| 22:16.07 | tensai | ~rlart |
| 22:16.08 | ibot | beats tvc123 to within 2.54cm of his life |
| 22:27.14 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp25.cs.nmsu.edu) |
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| 22:28.44 | bugQ | ibot: convert 2.54cm to in |
| 22:29.05 | bugQ | only "approximately"? |
| 22:33.13 | findlay | ibot's convert-fu is not very picky |
| 22:33.24 | findlay | 2.54 to within the accuracy of a float |
| 22:37.53 | tensai | right. ibot just hedges her answers. |
| 22:37.58 | tensai | ~convert 2.53cm to in |
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| 22:41.36 | *** join/#utah bonez45 (n=scott@mail.FYRENICE.COM) |
| 22:42.18 | bonez45 | I get the following errors when attempting to boot with a new Ubuntu 8.x install disk: [545.339475] invalid compressed format (err=1) [545.343400] kernel panic - not syncing VFS unable to mount root fs on unknown - block (104,1) Suggestions? |
| 22:47.44 | Tene | Hmm. |
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| 23:10.27 | Sargun | http://xbmodder.us |
| 23:10.31 | Sargun | brac, http://xbmodder.us |
| 23:10.37 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us |
| 23:10.41 | Sargun | http://xbmodder.us/ |
| 23:10.43 | Sargun | http://xbmodder.us/index.html |
| 23:10.47 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/index.html |
| 23:10.59 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/index.php |
| 23:11.06 | Sargun | http://google/index.php |
| 23:11.08 | encryptz | ? |
| 23:11.08 | Sargun | http://google.com/index.php |
| 23:11.11 | Sargun | http://google.com/ |
| 23:11.19 | Sargun | trying to get brac to say a URL |
| 23:11.28 | bugQ | you forgot http://www.xbmodder.us/ |
| 23:12.03 | encryptz | http://www.xbmodder.us/../../etc/passwd |
| 23:12.06 | Sargun | http://amazon.com |
| 23:12.07 | Sargun | http://amazon.com/ |
| 23:12.34 | Sargun | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo |
| 23:12.48 | encryptz | Sargun: you _could_ pm him, you know |
| 23:13.18 | Sargun | it might not work |
| 23:13.18 | findlay | brac: pm! |
| 23:13.34 | encryptz | Sargun: well, it's obviously not working here |
| 23:13.41 | Sargun | brac, url |
| 23:13.42 | findlay | brac: hi |
| 23:13.43 | Sargun | -movieplot |
| 23:13.52 | Sargun | I think I broke him |
| 23:13.53 | findlay | -chat Sargun |
| 23:13.58 | Sargun | Hehe |
| 23:13.58 | findlay | -overload |
| 23:14.24 | findlay | ibot: hi |
| 23:14.25 | ibot | hello, findlay |
| 23:20.43 | findlay | ~brac |
| 23:20.44 | ibot | brac is, like, the enemy, or a bnot |
| 23:20.56 | findlay | ibot: no, brac is the enemy |
| 23:20.57 | ibot | findlay: okay |
| 23:26.52 | brac | hey findlay :) |
| 23:26.56 | brac | Summary: He's a Nobel prize-winning Jewish photographer who must take medication to keep him sane. She's a hard-bitten streetsmart hooker descended from a line of powerful witches. They fight crime. |
| 23:26.56 | brac | Sargun had done all the pertinant questions. |
| 23:31.17 | findlay | yay |
| 23:31.40 | findlay | -lag |
| 23:32.40 | encryptz | -yay |
| 23:33.12 | findlay | -chat encryptz |
| 23:33.12 | brac | encryptz went |
| 23:33.30 | findlay | http://Sargun.com |
| 23:36.19 | Sargun | Wow. |
| 23:36.22 | Sargun | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo |
| 23:36.27 | Sargun | -movieplot |
| 23:36.28 | brac | Summary: He's an obese devious dog-catcher on the run. She's a virginal Buddhist nun with a knack for trouble. They fight crime. |
| 23:36.34 | Sargun | http://amazon.com |
| 23:36.42 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/index.php |
| 23:36.44 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/ |
| 23:36.46 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/sla |
| 23:36.48 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/slawdadd |
| 23:36.49 | Sargun | http://www.xbmodder.us/slawdadddwad |
| 23:36.53 | *** join/#utah nick125 (n=nick@pdpc/supporter/student/nick125) |
| 23:47.35 | findlay | -chat Sargun overload |
| 23:49.36 | *** join/#utah sinuhe (n=user@12.50.104.2) |
| 23:52.31 | brac | Sargun overload |
| 23:55.11 | fozzmoo | brac: I know EXACTLY how you feel. |
| 23:56.55 | findlay | -chat fozzmoo |
| 23:56.55 | brac | fozzmoo did |
| 23:57.04 | findlay | -chat EXACTLY |
| 23:57.05 | brac | EXACTLY did you ask him to bring in the evening |
