| 00:02.38 | *** join/#utah decriptor_ (n=sshaw@161.28.255.52) |
| 00:20.21 | elg | ~pity sjansen |
| 00:20.21 | ibot | I pity da fool sjansen! |
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| 02:07.53 | herlo | elg: the problem with that, is when you get locked in and need something more than the free vmware-server |
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| 02:37.27 | Supaplex | y0 |
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| 02:37.31 | *** join/#utah Supaplex (n=e@166-70-62-194.ip.xmission.com) |
| 02:37.32 | brac | ~lart is |
| 02:37.32 | ibot | whips out a sword and chops is in half |
| 02:38.17 | Tene | -chat about findlay |
| 02:38.17 | brac | findlay went |
| 02:38.35 | Tene | findlay went to the show |
| 02:38.37 | Tene | -chat about findlay |
| 02:38.38 | brac | findlay was slowly born over the net? I am paying for a Dream last night |
| 02:44.12 | Supaplex | -chat about dinner |
| 02:44.12 | brac | dinner went |
| 02:44.19 | Supaplex | into my stomach! |
| 02:44.26 | Supaplex | -chat about ibot |
| 02:44.27 | brac | ibot is a good deal on. Helped me train for boot (non-LVM) |
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| 03:36.56 | elg | herlo: a valid concern for an enterprise that doesn't want to pay |
| 03:37.32 | Supaplex | -chat ~streak |
| 03:37.32 | brac | ~streak is |
| 03:37.32 | ibot | ACTION watches is run through the channel stark naked screeming "lennard jones!!!!" |
| 03:37.53 | elg | herlo: but irrelevant for an individual or soho who will never need more than vmware-server. all the standard freedom arguments apply, in their varying levels of (ir)relevance |
| 03:40.02 | elg | beside, what's lockin when your virtualizing windows anyway? you have to reinstall every couple of months no matter what... ;-) |
| 03:41.38 | herlo | elg: haha, nice. |
| 03:42.28 | herlo | I guess I would say that xen does have some things you can't get with vmware yet. Full virtualization being the big one. |
| 03:42.46 | herlo | but VMWare does have a leg up, being around so long... |
| 03:43.30 | herlo | my point is, try the ones that are open source first, if they won't/don't fit your needs, vmware is a great choice... |
| 03:43.38 | elg | xen is definitely worth a look. when i was setting up my vm, xen was a week-long hair-pulling experience |
| 03:43.42 | elg | I have no idea if it's easier now |
| 03:43.53 | Supaplex | it's as easy as apt-get |
| 03:43.54 | herlo | but its all up to interpretation anyway |
| 03:43.55 | elg | i didn't have a week or any hair to lose |
| 03:45.09 | herlo | elg: some times its a bit challenging to get started, both Fedora/RH and SUSE provide a good set of tools to manage xen these days. |
| 03:45.17 | herlo | elg: sure, leave now! :) |
| 03:45.20 | levi | Heh. |
| 03:45.31 | levi | herlo: Free-software hippy. :P ;) |
| 03:46.08 | herlo | levi: to a point! |
| 03:46.15 | herlo | LOL |
| 03:46.36 | levi | Just don't grow a beard and stop bathing, okay? |
| 03:47.00 | Supaplex | uhm... isn't that keep bathing? |
| 03:47.46 | Supaplex | he can grow a beard. g whiz. :p |
| 03:48.06 | Supaplex | anyway, neuron super cluser is going down for maintenence |
| 03:48.24 | Tene | ~lart Supaplex for not remembering Tene. |
| 03:48.24 | ibot | frags Supaplex with his BFG9000 for not remembering Tene. |
| 03:49.03 | Supaplex | yeah. i'll respawn tomorrow anyway. *chuckle* |
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| 03:49.38 | Supaplex | Tene: you had your distractions anyways :) |
| 03:49.54 | *** part/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166-70-238-250.ip.xmission.com) |
| 03:53.43 | levi | Supaplex: Just don't (grow a beard and stop bathing) |
| 03:54.41 | findlay | ~beard Supaplex |
| 04:05.07 | mrpull-lt | so what is the secret topic for this month's plug? |
| 04:06.53 | sontek | mrpull-lt: do we need to define SECRET for you?! :P |
| 04:07.05 | sontek | just put it on your calendar and be happy! :P |
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| 04:09.56 | mrpull-lt | ahhh so sontek is in on the secret too |
| 04:10.52 | findlay | -chat the secret |
| 04:10.53 | brac | the secret lies with you, always |
| 04:10.56 | findlay | indeed |
| 04:12.27 | *** part/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166-70-238-250.ip.xmission.com) |
| 04:13.13 | mrpull-lt | ~wikipedia the secret |
| 04:14.25 | findlay | ~wiki the obvious |
| 04:14.44 | findlay | heh |
| 04:24.31 | mrpull-lt | levi: you are no longer with linux networx? |
| 04:28.47 | mrpull-lt | findlay: there was a salt lake band several years back called the obvious... i wonder what ever happened to them |
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| 04:33.26 | bonez39 | evening! |
| 04:34.19 | bonez39 | all to bed already? |
| 04:43.34 | Tene | not quite. |
| 04:43.38 | Tene | Coming up soon, though. |
| 04:44.17 | bonez39 | ah.... |
| 04:44.21 | Tene | what's up? |
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| 04:44.34 | bonez39 | Tene: you haven't used synergy...software kvm have you? |
| 04:44.56 | Tene | I know a few people who use it. |
| 04:46.51 | bonez39 | I would really love to use it, on my LAN here..I have three machines..one running sarge, another runs etch and a third...win xp... |
| 04:47.12 | mrpull-lt | bonez39: all with their own displays? |
| 04:47.13 | bonez39 | would be so sweet if I could just run all three machines.....on one monitor...with one keyboard and mouse.... |
| 04:47.33 | Tene | bonez39: synergy does the opposite... |
| 04:47.44 | bonez39 | well, I have two displays....one for sarge, and one between etch and xp....that's the buggger...if I switch I have to disconnect the video from one and plug into the other.... |
| 04:47.45 | Tene | it lets you use one keyboard and mouse for multiple monitors/systems. |
| 04:47.48 | mrpull-lt | synergy is (at least in my experience) good for multi displays on multi machines with a single mouse/keyboard |
| 04:47.56 | Tene | yeah |
| 04:48.15 | bonez39 | well, if could allow me to use one mouse and keyboard for 3 systems on two monitors that would work too...will it do that? |
| 04:48.29 | Tene | Nope. |
| 04:48.33 | Tene | Two systems on two monitors. |
| 04:48.50 | mrpull-lt | if you pull RDP or VNC in the mix you could put one of the systems in a window |
| 04:48.53 | bonez39 | so, I MUST have a monitor for each machine? ...can share one monitor with two machines.. |
| 04:49.09 | bonez39 | I wouldn't midn if one of them was windowed.... |
| 04:50.12 | mrpull-lt | do you run X on your debian boxes? |
| 04:50.24 | Tene | bonez39: you could use VNC or a remote X session... |
| 04:50.36 | mrpull-lt | or x forward you apps |
| 04:50.49 | mrpull-lt | s/you/your/ |
| 04:50.52 | bonez39 | ok, so for my winxp machine.....it's slower, and the etch machine is faster.... |
| 04:51.12 | bonez39 | would I , or could I run something that way, two machines sharing one monitor? |
| 04:51.18 | bonez39 | with remote x? |
| 04:51.45 | Tene | bonez39: you could run two X servers, one with a local session connected and one with a remote session connected. |
| 04:51.47 | bonez39 | is this lots of voodoo, or would it be pretty sane and safe and stable? |
| 04:51.52 | Tene | Not if one of the boxes is Windows, though. |
| 04:52.11 | bonez39 | yeah, that's the rub..I guess I need to just go and guy a kvm switch |
| 04:52.16 | Tene | The best option for windows, I guess, is VNC |
| 04:52.26 | Tene | In either direction. |
| 04:52.42 | Tene | Have a desktop on one system shared over VNC and connect to it on the other. |
| 04:52.50 | bonez39 | VNC for the windows xp / etch combination? |
| 04:52.54 | Tene | yeah |
| 04:53.18 | bonez39 | will this create lots of drag, or lag? or would it be pretty snappy? |
| 04:53.19 | mrpull-lt | it'd be my preference to hook both monitors to the XP machine (if you have a dualhead card or two video card) |
| 04:53.26 | mrpull-lt | and ssh to the linux boxes |
| 04:53.35 | Tene | bonez39: pretty snappy. |
| 04:53.44 | Tene | You won't be playing full-screen video or anything, though. |
| 04:53.48 | bonez39 | no...... |
| 04:53.55 | bonez39 | nor am I wanting to..... |
| 04:54.04 | Tene | yeah |
| 04:54.08 | Tene | so it would be just fine. |
| 04:54.25 | bonez39 | Tene: so how to proceed? know any good tutorials on setting this up...this would be for my one monitor, two machines...xp and etch combo |
| 04:54.30 | Tene | What do you use the win box for, btw? /me curious. |
| 04:54.38 | Tene | bonez39: which would you prefer be the "main" box? |
| 04:54.43 | Tene | win or etch? |
| 04:54.53 | Tene | and which is only accessed through VNC? |
| 04:55.04 | bonez39 | the win box is critical..it processes and sends out claims..on patients I treat..... |
| 04:55.28 | bonez39 | uses two fairly intensive applications..that dominate the system....hog the cpu and such |
| 04:55.46 | bonez39 | the etch box is faster...woud prefer it being main.. |
| 04:55.49 | Tene | 'kay |
| 04:55.58 | bonez39 | it's the one with sound and that I woudl want to run any multimedia through |
| 04:56.10 | Tene | choose a VNC server for windows... tightvnc, ultravnc, realvnc, are options, probably a few others. |
| 04:56.35 | mrpull-lt | (or if it is XP pro, consider using remote desktop... it is built in) |
| 04:56.49 | Tene | Sure, that's an option. I've never worked with it, though. |
| 04:56.50 | bonez39 | yeah, XP pro...remote desktop...it's on that machine.... |
| 04:57.07 | bonez39 | oh, mrpull-it I am listening |
| 04:57.23 | mrpull-lt | bonez39: you likely have tsclient |
| 04:57.43 | bonez39 | do I check with a cmd window? |
| 04:57.47 | mrpull-lt | it is an RDP client for connecting to Windows Terminal Servers / Remote Desktop |
| 04:57.55 | mrpull-lt | are you running Gnome? |
| 04:58.12 | bonez39 | yeah, I think etch runs gnome..... |
| 04:58.15 | mrpull-lt | it is under Internet Applications in many cases |
| 04:58.28 | bonez39 | tsclient? i use ssh all the time.... |
| 04:58.41 | bonez39 | you are talking about on etch or xp? |
| 04:58.44 | Tene | on etch |
| 04:59.00 | Tene | tsclient is the linux application that will connect to remote desktop on windows |
| 04:59.13 | bonez39 | ok.. |
| 04:59.41 | bonez39 | yes, etch has tsclient on it |
| 05:00.05 | bonez39 | I just sshe'd to that box and it has 0.148 |
| 05:00.12 | bonez39 | for tsclient |
| 05:02.57 | bonez39 | anything else? |
| 05:03.09 | bonez39 | not quite sure how to proceed.... |
| 05:03.17 | mrpull-lt | have you ever logged into the windows box with remote desktop? |
| 05:03.25 | mrpull-lt | it'll need to be enabled if you haven't |
| 05:03.29 | levi | mrpull-lt: Nope, not working for Linux Networx anymore. |
| 05:03.43 | bonez39 | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:04.08 | mrpull-lt | bonez39: right click on my computer, then properties |
| 05:04.22 | mrpull-lt | there should be a remote desktop tab IIRC |
| 05:04.42 | bonez39 | ok.. |
| 05:04.50 | levi | mrpull-lt: I got a job with Harman Pro Group a few months ago. |
| 05:05.04 | bonez39 | ok..... |
| 05:05.14 | bonez39 | Harman Pro Group? is this part of Harman Music Group? |
| 05:05.24 | mrpull-lt | choose the remote desktop tab and check the option that says allow remote desktop |
| 05:05.38 | mrpull-lt | and add any users you want to log in as to the group of trusted users |
| 05:05.52 | mrpull-lt | harman seems like a cool company to work with |
| 05:06.07 | mrpull-lt | i met a couple of their sysadmins a few months back |
| 05:06.30 | levi | bonez39: Harman Music Group is a subdivision of Harman Pro Group. I work at the HMG building, though. |
| 05:06.33 | mrpull-lt | linux networx seems cool to... was harman just a better deal? |
| 05:07.05 | mrpull-lt | bonez39: remember, tsclient is a GUI app to see your windows desktop |
| 05:07.12 | mrpull-lt | so you'll need X up and running |
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| 05:08.03 | levi | mrpull-lt: I was happy with Linux Networx, for the most part, but the Harman job was too good to pass up. |
| 05:08.17 | bonez39 | mrpull-lt: ok, I am at the point where I add in names to allow..but the login name on etch is not available.... |
| 05:08.40 | mrpull-lt | you'll put your windows credentials into tsclient |
| 05:08.57 | mrpull-lt | so make sure the windows user you want to log into XP with is in the list |
| 05:09.18 | bonez39 | oh, on tsclient...first...and I need to run that in gui mode on etch to set those up, right? |
| 05:09.26 | mrpull-lt | if you only use one user (that is a member of administrators) it will likely already be allowed |
| 05:09.31 | bonez39 | first, before adding in to xp's remote desktop? |
| 05:11.05 | mrpull-lt | nah... the XP and linux users are completely separate |
| 05:11.24 | mrpull-lt | like i said, you may not even need to add to the XP remote desktop users |
| 05:13.45 | bonez39 | mrpull-lt I get this error...with tsclient...Autoseleted keyboard map en-us |
| 05:14.07 | bonez39 | it errors out, tsclient |
| 05:15.03 | bonez39 | ?? |
| 05:15.26 | mrpull-lt | what kind of error? |
| 05:16.39 | mrpull-lt | doh. i missed teh keyboard map en-us error |
| 05:18.10 | mrpull-lt | so you don't get to a point where you see a window like this screenshot? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/29/Tsclient_screenshot.png |
| 05:18.25 | bonez39 | the error just as I typed it above... |
| 05:18.48 | mrpull-lt | and the error comes before or after the tsclient window appears |
| 05:18.59 | bonez39 | mrpull-lt: here's the question..do I set up tsclient on etch first, or first set up xp and then tsclient on etch? which comes first? |
| 05:19.15 | mrpull-lt | you must set up xp first |
| 05:19.25 | bonez39 | ok......xp first...... |
| 05:19.49 | mrpull-lt | but the setup shouldn't be much more than ticking the box and (optionally) adding users to the remote desktop users |
| 05:19.50 | bonez39 | yeah, that comes up...that link, that opens on etch..... |
| 05:20.07 | bonez39 | so I am switching my vid cable back to xp....hold on... |
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| 05:20.56 | mrpull-lt | so you just punch in the IP address of you XP host in the tsclient window and hit connect |
| 05:21.10 | mrpull-lt | it should ask for credentials and you are off to the races |
| 05:21.19 | bonez39 | wait...I just hooked up xp..... |
| 05:21.25 | bonez39 | you said I need to set up xp FIRST..... |
| 05:21.31 | bonez39 | I have xp connected.... |
| 05:21.40 | mrpull-lt | gotcha... |
| 05:21.41 | bonez39 | and I have the remote desktop dialogue up too..... |
| 05:21.47 | bonez39 | ok....what first on xp/? |
| 05:22.05 | mrpull-lt | so you have the system properties | remote desktop window up? |
| 05:22.55 | mrpull-lt | and "allow users to connect remotely to this computer" checked? |
| 05:23.18 | bonez39 | yeah |
| 05:23.28 | bonez39 | I have the Select Users box open now |
| 05:23.36 | mrpull-lt | cool. does you type a password when you log into windows? |
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| 05:23.53 | bonez39 | yeah, I type a password in...to get into xp |
| 05:23.59 | mrpull-lt | good |
| 05:24.15 | bonez39 | ok... |
| 05:24.17 | mrpull-lt | and is the user you use to log in included in the remote users list |
| 05:24.17 | mrpull-lt | ? |
| 05:24.40 | bonez39 | no...how do I get it, in? add it as a user in xp? |
| 05:24.43 | mrpull-lt | the only other thing to consider is if windows firewall is permitting remote desktop thru |
| 05:24.53 | mrpull-lt | add what as a user in XP? |
| 05:25.34 | mrpull-lt | additional users shouldn't be required on either box |
| 05:26.06 | bonez39 | ok, I set myself as a user on xp..... |
| 05:26.54 | bonez39 | ok.... |
| 05:27.05 | mrpull-lt | it sounds like a good time to test tsclient |
| 05:27.05 | bonez39 | now I bring up etch? and tsclient on it? |
| 05:27.09 | mrpull-lt | yup |
| 05:27.16 | bonez39 | ok, connecting to etch with video |
| 05:28.19 | mrpull-lt | if that doesn't work, i'd start over and follow this howto on the windows side |
| 05:28.21 | mrpull-lt | http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/mobility/getstarted/remoteintro.mspx |
| 05:28.46 | bonez39 | ok, I open tsclient... |
| 05:29.13 | bonez39 | maybe I am not entering the right stuff into tsclient on etch |
| 05:30.36 | mrpull-lt | just try the IP address in the host field and leave everything else blank |
| 05:31.07 | mrpull-lt | the "host" field may actually be labeled "computer" |
| 05:31.12 | bonez39 | in tsclient, on etch, right? |
| 05:31.27 | bonez39 | I put in the IP of the host machine, in this case, the ip of the xp machine? |
| 05:32.00 | mrpull-lt | correct |
| 05:32.21 | mrpull-lt | it is asking what machine you want to connect to.... or the XP RDP server in this case |
| 05:32.41 | bonez39 | well, I verify theip ....of the xp box..and enter it ... yes, I put that in the Computer box...what about all the rest? |
| 05:32.58 | mrpull-lt | leave it blank for now and hit connect |
| 05:33.09 | mrpull-lt | windows will ask for the user and password later |
| 05:34.52 | bonez39 | ok, I enter en-US for the keyboard, now it errors when I try, in tsclient, to connect, just says ERROR: Connect: connection refused...that's it? |
| 05:35.23 | mrpull-lt | are you familiar with the XP firewall? |
| 05:36.16 | bonez39 | not well enough, but I want to learn..if I can get this going? |
| 05:36.18 | bonez39 | ... |
| 05:36.31 | bonez39 | you are saying it's my firewall preventing connection, right? |
| 05:36.36 | mrpull-lt | most likely |
| 05:36.39 | mrpull-lt | http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/mobility/getstarted/remoteintro.mspx |
| 05:37.02 | mrpull-lt | that link has detailed instructions including screenshots to work thru the firewall portion |
| 05:41.58 | mrpull-lt | whoa... what happened to the overstock.com lady? |
| 05:42.19 | bonez39 | who is the overstock.com lady? |
| 05:42.27 | mrpull-lt | bonez39: sorry for the distraction |
| 05:44.53 | bonez39 | mrpull-lt that's ok...just logging on..working through that link, about win firewall |
| 05:45.59 | findlay | ~dict reckless |
| 05:46.04 | bonez39 | mrpull-lt where the tutorial talks about having to run win 95 or later...and doesn't include linux anything...I disregard that, right? ...tsclient....spoofs all that? |
| 05:46.57 | mrpull-lt | yes. that part is talking about the client side |
| 05:47.15 | mrpull-lt | in this case, you'll be running tsclient on linux instead of the MS client on their OS's |
| 05:51.33 | bonez39 | ok... |
| 05:53.21 | bonez39 | mrpull-lt: rebooting, brb... |
| 05:53.26 | *** part/#utah bonez39 (n=scott@c-71-195-243-49.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 05:54.29 | mrpull-lt | ~dict wreckless |
| 05:55.06 | bucky | ~dict negligent |
| 05:56.49 | mrpull-lt | i'd say synergy is harder than tsclient... that probably would have been a failure |
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| 07:20.24 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@72.8.99.158) |
| 07:20.24 | brac | dunno |
| 07:20.25 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
| 07:30.45 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@72.8.99.158) |
| 07:30.45 | brac | you best check yo'self! |
| 07:30.46 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
| 08:23.31 | Supaplex | -chat yesterday |
| 08:23.31 | brac | yesterday is that it plays well, but I don't have a type of line, i believe |
| 08:26.47 | Supaplex | fo sure |
| 08:27.23 | findlay | yays |
| 08:27.25 | Supaplex | kewlzies |
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| 13:10.23 | brac | Jayce^ is male, ibot is getting wet Oh, this rain it will likely get pushed back for now :( |
| 13:11.26 | elg | sing them blues |
| 13:15.49 | jsmith | -chat about the rain |
| 13:15.49 | brac | the rain forest |
| 13:15.58 | jsmith | -chat the blues |
| 13:15.58 | brac | the blues Travelers ... |
| 13:16.13 | jsmith | -chat blue rain |
| 13:16.13 | brac | blue rain |
| 13:16.14 | elg | the rain forest is in danger of flying out the window |
| 13:16.20 | elg | -chat the rain |
| 13:16.20 | brac | the rain go away! |
| 13:16.23 | elg | -chat the rain |
| 13:16.23 | brac | the rain forest is three trees :) |
| 13:16.26 | jsmith | No, don't go away! |
| 13:16.36 | jsmith | Did I mention how much I like the rain? |
| 13:16.45 | elg | i wonder if you like it more than me |
| 13:20.00 | jsmith | elg: Let's see... I woke up this morning around 5:30 to notice that the power was out, and didn't even mind, because it was raining. So I got dressed and walked around outside in the rain, just because I could. |
| 13:20.20 | elg | slightly more than me then. |
| 13:20.29 | elg | my son and I have been known to walk around in the rain |
| 13:20.32 | elg | but not at 5:30am |
| 13:21.14 | elg | i used to don my overcoat and felt hat and walk for hours in the rain on my mission, and love it |
| 13:21.25 | elg | my companions were usually a bit spoilish though |
| 13:28.28 | nick125 | Anyone have any comments about AD vs. LDAP? |
| 13:28.46 | nick125 | (Or AD vs. OpenLDAP rather) |
| 13:29.17 | jsmith | elg: Yours too, eh? |
| 13:29.55 | ^Migs^ | one costs money, the other doesn't |
| 13:30.30 | nick125 | ^Migs^: I'm debating on whether I should try to get AD replaced with OpenLDAP. |
| 13:30.38 | ^Migs^ | I'm working on setting up OpenLDAP right now. It's pretty nice, though you're going to want to get a browser for it like Directory Administrator or Gosa |
| 13:30.54 | ^Migs^ | Novell also provides its eDirectory licenses for free, up to 250,000 or something |
| 13:31.10 | ^Migs^ | why do you want to change, nick? |
| 13:31.34 | ^Migs^ | AD is pretty nice, though admittedly I probably haven't used it as much as you |
| 13:31.35 | nick125 | ^Migs^: Mainly due to trying to adopt a platform agnostic environment. |
| 13:31.44 | ^Migs^ | ah, good idea |
| 13:32.06 | ^Migs^ | everybody says OpenLDAP is miserably hard to set up, but I haven't found that to be the case at all |
| 13:32.21 | nick125 | I feel that trying to get Samba/AD working would be a really big pain, not to mention I'd like to get rid of having to pay huge amounts of licensing fees. |
| 13:32.27 | ^Migs^ | I mean, you still have to tweak quite a bit, but then you just set up an account creator so you have an interface more like AD, which makes it easier |
| 13:32.42 | ^Migs^ | do you have to pay them each year? |
| 13:33.11 | nick125 | Well, I mean when we have to pay for upgrades. |
| 13:33.14 | ^Migs^ | bleh |
| 13:33.22 | ^Migs^ | OpenLDAP is great. Runs on less hardware than AD, too |
| 13:33.47 | nick125 | Gosa looks pretty nice...the entire fact that it's web-based will make it nice so other people can manipulate the LDAP setup (such as adding users, changing users' passwords, etc) |
| 13:34.00 | ^Migs^ | yeah, I'm going to be installing that, too. You can also set up Samba accounts, mail, etc. through it |
| 13:34.06 | ^Migs^ | there's also Luma |
| 13:34.15 | nick125 | How does the mail thing work? |
| 13:34.27 | ^Migs^ | no idea yet :) Haven't gotten that far. I just looked through the list of features. |
| 13:34.28 | nick125 | Eventually, I'm planning on making mail hosted in-house with backup MX. |
| 13:34.54 | nick125 | So if I could use LDAP for authentication.....single login everywhere! |
| 13:34.59 | ^Migs^ | yup :) |
| 13:35.09 | ^Migs^ | what mail server are you looking to use? |
| 13:35.40 | ^Migs^ | I've thought of using Zimbra, ,mainly because of the user-friendly Groupwise-like web client |
| 13:35.44 | nick125 | Postfix/Dovecot probably. |
| 13:35.56 | ^Migs^ | plus we can buy a support contract if we need it |
| 13:36.19 | nick125 | I don't like how Zimbra doesn't work on non-RPM/non-DEB based systems too well. |
| 13:36.39 | ^Migs^ | since I'm using Debian/Ubuntu, works great :) |
| 13:36.49 | ^Migs^ | still need to set up the DNS server and all that, though |
| 13:37.16 | ^Migs^ | could use Qmail too |
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| 13:40.56 | nick125 | I'm probably going to run this on Gentoo with Debian clients. |
| 13:43.11 | nick125 | I'm gonna see if I can pull some boxes today to do a trial run of OpenLDAP and this other cool stuff with a Debian Client and a Win32 client. |
| 13:48.43 | nick125 | The main thing I'm worried about is how do I get network drives mounted in Windows and NFS mounts mounted in Linux with information from LDAP. |
| 13:50.04 | ^Migs^ | not sure how that would work. All my network drives are going to be Samba. |
| 13:53.58 | nick125 | I guess I could use Samba for the entire thing...it'd probably be a pain though. |
| 13:55.03 | nick125 | The main thing I need is to make sure there is no way possible for another user to see another user's files. |
| 13:55.34 | nick125 | er, for a user to see another user's files |
| 13:56.01 | ^Migs^ | hmm, what would be the best way to do that? |
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| 14:28.52 | Kemotaha | mini moo? |
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| 14:30.22 | Kemotaha | are you staying this time fozz? |
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| 14:34.45 | fozzmoo | I'm here for good this time, Kemotaha |
| 14:34.56 | fozzmoo | I think I've fixed my pidgin problem... for now. |
| 14:35.01 | Kemotaha | hehe |
| 14:36.20 | herlo | fozzmoo: you should try finch |
| 14:36.34 | herlo | fozzmoo: then you can run it on a centralized server :) |
| 14:38.27 | fozzmoo | I have used finch before. |
| 14:38.45 | fozzmoo | I've used a variety of IRC clients. |
| 14:39.10 | fozzmoo | If I saw more value in idling, I would use a console-based IRC client. |
| 14:39.45 | fozzmoo | That's not to say I don't appreciate the content of #utah or any other IRC channel. I simply don't have time to always get caught up. |
| 14:40.23 | fozzmoo | maquis: Nice tonsils. |
| 14:40.53 | maquis | fozzmoo: you must be seeing things... i haven't had tonsils since i was little |
| 14:41.24 | fozzmoo | Ahh. Adenoids then. |
| 14:41.38 | maquis | nope... |
| 14:41.47 | maquis | those came out at the same time as the tonsils :) |
| 14:44.33 | fozzmoo | Nice uvula! |
| 14:44.52 | fozzmoo | (You still have one of those, don't you?) |
| 14:57.46 | goozbach | drfozz! |
| 14:57.48 | goozbach | nice |
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| 15:22.33 | brac | I didn't see the advantages of using a uid instead of just a PDA. |
| 15:22.52 | elg | well, uids are cheaper |
| 15:23.00 | elg | and don't need batteries |
| 15:28.49 | levi | elg: push-down automata need batteries? |
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| 15:39.12 | fozzmoo | So, I installed a CentOS 4.5 Xen guest on a CentOS 5 dom0... |
| 15:39.28 | fozzmoo | Everything works well, except I can't ssh from the domU to the dom0 or vice versa. |
| 15:39.44 | fozzmoo | The dom0 is also the LDAP server and the domU can't seem to get to that either. |
| 15:39.54 | fozzmoo | Otherwise the domU can get out to the network fine. |
| 15:42.59 | *** join/#utah shadowwire (n=shadowwi@mail.swplumb.com) |
| 15:43.15 | shadowwire | good morning. |
| 15:44.12 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@bromine.sosstaffing.com) |
| 15:46.07 | fozzmoo | Wow. I just did a 'ethtool -K eth0 tx off' on the dom0 and now I can ssh fine. |
| 15:46.14 | fozzmoo | and LDAP works now. |
| 15:53.04 | shadowwire | Anyone know where I can find a good python tutorial? |
| 15:53.20 | fungus | http://diveintopython.org |
| 15:53.21 | brac | [Dive Into Python] |
| 15:53.46 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@hq-nat2.gurulabs.com) |
| 15:53.52 | fozzmoo | Dive... into... python? |
| 15:54.25 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=steve@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 15:55.00 | shadowwire | Yeah, Why not? |
| 15:56.46 | fozzmoo | Sounds scary. |
| 16:01.21 | fozzmoo | I'm no artist, but imagine a drawing depicting a guy diving headfirst into the gaping open mouth of a python snake. |
| 16:02.39 | shadowwire | Hmm... When you put it that way... |
| 16:04.03 | levi | shadowwire: http://www.ibiblio.org/obp/thinkCSpy/ |
| 16:04.34 | levi | A revised version in draft form is here: http://www.greenteapress.com/thinkpython/ |
| 16:04.36 | brac | [How to Think Like a (Python) Programmer] |
| 16:05.08 | *** join/#utah Lakshmi (n=chatzill@unaffiliated/lakshmi) |
| 16:05.15 | fozzmoo | Lakshmi! |
| 16:05.26 | Lakshmi | fozzmoo!!! |
| 16:06.05 | shadowwire | IBOT! |
| 16:06.06 | fozzmoo | ¡¡¡ |
| 16:06.17 | shadowwire | !@#$%^&! |
| 16:06.18 | UtahBot | shadowwire: Error: "@#$%^&!" is not a valid command. |
| 16:06.26 | shadowwire | Sorry. |
| 16:08.40 | Lakshmi | fozzmoo: whatcha upto? |
| 16:08.58 | fozzmoo | Being amazingly productive. |
| 16:09.07 | fozzmoo | (for a change) |
| 16:18.52 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=sshaw@137.65.56.124) |
| 16:22.47 | Tene | fozzmoo: nice |
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| 16:24.21 | elg | levi: definitely. all those transitions |
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| 16:26.43 | Lakshmi | fozzmoo: gjob, i have to be stuck in the worlds horrid econ class |
| 16:29.01 | fozzmoo | I enjoyed econ when I took it. |
| 16:29.11 | Tene | I like econ. |
| 16:35.41 | Lakshmi | i like it too |
| 16:35.48 | Lakshmi | i just dont like the lady teaching it |
| 16:35.56 | Lakshmi | cause she doesnt know what she is talking about |
| 16:36.09 | Lakshmi | and gives us the wrong answers for our hw |
| 16:37.05 | fozzmoo | <rightwingwacko>Sounds like your typical college professor.</rightwingwacko> |
| 16:38.09 | Lakshmi | heh |
| 16:38.33 | Lakshmi | true, my bio professor is the only one i think that knows half her stuff and can actually teach it |
| 16:45.06 | elg | fozzmoo: what about it? did they finally add imap? |
| 16:45.57 | fozzmoo | elg: I dunno. I haven't read everyone else's blogs about it. |
| 16:46.09 | levi | elg: They're rolling it out now. |
| 16:46.17 | levi | elg: Some people have IMAP, but I don't yet. |
| 16:47.38 | elg | the leopard tour video mentioned easy setup with gmail, yahoo mail, and a few others |
| 16:47.43 | elg | for the mail program |
| 16:47.49 | fozzmoo | what is leopard? |
| 16:47.51 | elg | they could have at least called it iMail |
| 16:48.00 | elg | the next osx release, on friday |
| 16:48.08 | levi | elg: There have been speculations about that. |
| 16:48.11 | fozzmoo | oh. |
| 16:48.22 | levi | Yay, Leopard! |
| 16:48.35 | fozzmoo | Go Leopard, go! |
| 16:48.51 | elg | ~bonk fozzmoo |
| 16:48.52 | ibot | ACTION bonks fozzmoo over the head |
| 16:49.00 | levi | See Leopard run! Run, Leopard, run! |
| 17:19.23 | elg | me too |
| 17:21.10 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@66.236.68.4.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 17:24.05 | elg | *¡KИIO* |
| 17:24.54 | ^Migs^ | Is there a program that opens a copy of a window within that window. E.g., open a window 1/6 the size of my screen in the bottom-right corner, so I can just work in that smaller window and it'll duplicate the effects on the big window? |
| 17:25.26 | ^Migs^ | s/window/BONZAI!!!/ |
| 17:25.35 | ^Migs^ | oops |
| 17:25.41 | elg | foo foo foo |
| 17:25.43 | elg | s/foo/bar/g |
| 17:25.52 | elg | good ibot |
| 17:25.54 | ^Migs^ | forgot that g at the end |
| 17:26.00 | ^Migs^ | Is there a program that opens a copy of a window within that window. E.g., open a window 1/6 the size of my screen in the bottom-right corner, so I can just work in that smaller window and it'll duplicate the effects on the big window? |
| 17:26.08 | ^Migs^ | s/window/PARTY!!!/g |
| 17:27.16 | Tene | migs: no. |
| 17:29.54 | ^Migs^ | I'm sure there's gotta be SOMETHING |
| 17:31.23 | Tene | migs: what is it you're wanting to do? what's the purpose of this thing you want? |
| 17:31.30 | Tene | What's the goal you're trying to accomplish? |
| 17:31.38 | elg | he just thinks it would be cool to work pip |
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| 18:02.31 | shadowwire | Pressurized Irrigation Pipe? |
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| 18:19.59 | sjansen | ^Migs^: Theoretically, it's possible. I think I remember enlightenment doing something kinda like that years ago. |
| 18:20.24 | sjansen | Although I think it was limited to just dragging windows around. |
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| 18:27.14 | elg | ~drag sjansen |
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| 18:33.37 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 19:14.21 | unum | I need to write a script to find out how many state lobbyists each organization has |
| 19:14.32 | unum | the lds church may win for having the most |
| 19:15.57 | unum | probably to deal with real estate issues |
| 19:25.09 | fozzmoo | unum: Why do you need to write such a script? |
| 19:25.51 | unum | fozzmoo: because the state website is pain for stuff like that |
| 19:29.09 | fozzmoo | I mean: Why do you have a *need* for that information. |
| 19:32.08 | elg | he wants to blackmail sjansen |
| 19:32.46 | bucky | maybe he wants to sell the information to a mass mailer |
| 19:33.51 | bucky | for Cracker Barrel or someone |
| 19:35.29 | unum | well I do have a list of all the lobbyists so that it can me used for mass mailing... |
| 19:35.40 | unum | I don't need the other information, I just want it |
| 19:36.45 | fozzmoo | unum: What do you mass mail lobbyists about? |
| 19:36.59 | elg | ~giggle |
| 19:37.00 | ibot | teeheehee! |
| 19:37.03 | fozzmoo | I mean, I can understand mass mailing legislators... |
| 19:37.13 | fozzmoo | but what do you say to lobbyists? |
| 19:37.22 | elg | death threats mostly |
| 19:37.31 | fozzmoo | aahhh. |
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| 19:39.29 | elg | how does one muster up the gumption to read 2.5 dissertations in under 24 hours? |
| 19:39.40 | shadowwire | bleh. |
| 19:40.48 | sontek | elg: a case of redbull? |
| 19:40.50 | fozzmoo | http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9584_22-6214996.html?tag=nl.e550 |
| 19:41.02 | fozzmoo | " The group is experimenting with a device that uses cows to generate power to charge its battery." |
| 19:41.11 | fozzmoo | I'm guessing it's because in some parts of the world, there may not be a power outlet nearby but there's almost guaranteed to be a cow nearby. |
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| 19:45.36 | elg | what part of the cow do they use? |
| 19:45.57 | elg | do you strap it to the cow and use grazing inertia? do you make the cow run on a treadmill? do you capture methane? |
| 19:46.07 | elg | does the cow chew on a ball that converts to energy? |
| 19:46.48 | Tene | Do you grind up the cow and feed it as fuel into a generator? |
| 19:47.29 | elg | mr fusion |
| 19:50.32 | shadowwire | but ya gotta have beer for Mr. Fusion. |
| 19:51.08 | shadowwire | And you could send me a few while your at it. :) |
| 19:53.41 | shadowwire | ~destroy smorrey |
| 19:53.42 | ibot | no |
| 19:53.54 | shadowwire | Ok then... |
| 19:54.43 | levi | This is almost as bad as xbmodder's 'PTP over DNS' crazy scheme. |
| 19:55.24 | elg | levi: maybe someone should propose that. see if he springs for it |
| 19:55.27 | Tene | levi: what is? |
| 19:55.34 | Tene | oh, plug, I guess. |
| 19:55.38 | levi | Yeah. |
| 19:55.39 | elg | "Possible Torrent Alternative" thread |
| 19:56.02 | levi | He wants to make some secure signed UDP packet based torrent-like system. |
| 19:57.29 | rsimpkins | Does anyone know of a decent web front end to NNTP? |
| 19:58.15 | rsimpkins | I was looking at ninan, but it only supports binary and is really, really buggy. |
| 19:59.25 | elg | front end to what exactly? google groups? or your own nntp server? |
| 19:59.33 | rsimpkins | My own server. |
| 20:00.58 | elg | web if to the config or to the news? |
| 20:01.18 | rsimpkins | To the news. |
| 20:01.28 | elg | so you want a web-based nntp client |
| 20:01.30 | elg | no clue |
| 20:07.01 | sjansen | I thought Usenet was illegal these days. |
| 20:07.46 | rsimpkins | sjansen: Your existance is illegal. Expect an sjansen DMCA take down notice soon. You'll need to uninstall yourself. |
| 20:07.56 | Supaplex | haha |
| 20:08.11 | fozzmoo | I wish Usenet was... popular again. |
| 20:08.15 | fozzmoo | I miss those daze. |
| 20:08.32 | Supaplex | ~hype Usenet |
| 20:09.12 | rsimpkins | I don't think usenet will last much longer now that the lawyers are involved. |
| 20:09.38 | fozzmoo | lawyers? |
| 20:09.57 | fozzmoo | What's going on? |
| 20:10.05 | rsimpkins | The **AA is suing usenet providers. |
| 20:10.10 | JoshH | usenet.com only, so far |
| 20:10.17 | JoshH | but they practically asked for it |
| 20:10.24 | rsimpkins | Well, I'm sure that's just the start though. |
| 20:10.45 | JoshH | probably |
| 20:10.47 | fozzmoo | Because of binaries distribution? |
| 20:10.59 | fozzmoo | Cuz I guess Google Groups is still fairly alive and well. |
| 20:11.05 | fozzmoo | but they don't do binaries. |
| 20:11.14 | JoshH | their site basically said "this is the place to safely get all the illegal files you want" |
| 20:11.28 | fozzmoo | heh heh. |
| 20:11.49 | fozzmoo | Usenet is a horrible way to distribute binaries. |
| 20:11.52 | levi | Some usenet groups are still active. |
| 20:12.15 | levi | fozzmoo: Most ways to distribute binaries are horrible in one way or another. |
| 20:12.43 | fozzmoo | levi: BitTorrent, for example, is genious compared to Usenet. :) |
| 20:12.45 | rsimpkins | Most of what goes down on usenet these days is totally illegal. |
| 20:13.12 | levi | rsimpkins: There are plenty of discussion newsgroups that aren't remotely illegal. |
| 20:13.20 | rsimpkins | levi: That is true. |
| 20:14.05 | levi | rsimpkins: I'm sure, thanks to Google Groups, that a lot of the people in the discussion newsgroups have no idea they're using nntp. |
| 20:14.28 | Supaplex | indeed |
| 20:14.53 | levi | But, as far as total bandwidth goes, I wouldn't be surprised if most of the raw data of a full newsfeed is illegal. |
| 20:15.13 | levi | That's only one way to measure 'what goes down' on usenet, though. |
| 20:15.31 | rsimpkins | I think companies that offer binary feeds are the ones who will be sued. |
| 20:15.42 | fozzmoo | Eeek. |
| 20:16.15 | fozzmoo | I'm actually surprised it's taken this long. |
| 20:16.21 | rsimpkins | Same here. |
| 20:17.28 | rsimpkins | Once it dies I will feel like the last place where speech was totally and absolutly free (like it or not) died with it. |
| 20:18.57 | Supaplex | welcome to rsimpkins melowdrama |
| 20:19.22 | rsimpkins | Supaplex: Well, maybe I'm wrong. Where is the new happening place? |
| 20:19.35 | fozzmoo | You can say whatever you want in my backyard. :) |
| 20:19.40 | Supaplex | we'll just have to wait in see :) |
| 20:19.44 | JoshH | you don't have to register your blogs just yet |
| 20:20.43 | rsimpkins | Don't you guys get the sense that the academics and geeks built the Internet for us - then money got involved and we tollerated it becaues money is good - but then that brought the lawyers to ruin it all. |
| 20:22.19 | fozzmoo | rsimpkins: The Net Neutrality debate does make me concerned about that. |
| 20:22.37 | fozzmoo | It's interesting because when I first started using the Internet, it really was pretty self-policing. |
| 20:23.21 | fozzmoo | I mean, if you posted a for-sale advertisement to a non-forsale Usenet newsgroup, your access was suspended the next day. |
| 20:24.02 | fozzmoo | Then you'd have to drag your sorry butt up to the campus Internet administrator and get a lecture about how you're a representative of the school when you're online and if you don't follow the rules, you lose the privilege. |
| 20:24.28 | rsimpkins | It was an easier problem I think, but the Internet is turning less in to a collection of organizations agreeing to communicate, and more in to a 'thing' that can be controlled. |
| 20:24.46 | elg | that's a joke |
| 20:25.01 | fozzmoo | Now, when you tell someone they're breaking the rules of netiquette, they say, "So what!? Screw you! This is the INTERNET, man! NOBODY can tell me ANYTHING I don't want them too!" |
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| 20:25.33 | rsimpkins | fozzmoo: Some kid did that to me. I found his real name, where he lived, and I called his parents. |
| 20:25.39 | fozzmoo | heh heh. |
| 20:25.41 | elg | nobody controls the internet, for better or worse. and if anyone managed to, another internet would pop up in its place |
| 20:26.00 | elg | it would be small, lack critical mass, be only populated by geeks... |
| 20:26.04 | Supaplex | let's start it now before it's too late ;) |
| 20:26.05 | elg | in short it would be the good ol' days again |
| 20:26.06 | rsimpkins | fozzmoo: He posted the message from school, so lost his school access privlages and recieving mandetory councling. |
| 20:26.11 | fozzmoo | elg: I love it when you get romantic. |
| 20:26.43 | rsimpkins | elg: I think that would work if I could point my cable modem at some other network - but I can't. |
| 20:26.52 | rsimpkins | elg: The joy of the old days was you were dealing with modems. |
| 20:27.00 | rsimpkins | You could just call another number if you wanted to. |
| 20:27.20 | rsimpkins | BBS days. |
| 20:27.32 | fozzmoo | ahhh. nostalgia. |
| 20:27.37 | elg | an encrypted interface tunnel would be faster than modems were |
| 20:27.38 | Supaplex | yea, we'll fire up the bbs again. |
| 20:27.45 | fozzmoo | elg: Yeah- we need VPNs. |
| 20:28.04 | fozzmoo | I think JPEGs are killing the Internet. |
| 20:28.12 | elg | lol |
| 20:28.17 | rsimpkins | More ascii - amen! |
| 20:28.28 | rsimpkins | I wanna see some of that old school ascii art. |
| 20:28.30 | unum | back in my day when we just had gopher it was so much better |
| 20:28.36 | fozzmoo | I remember arguing with a professor about that. |
| 20:28.39 | rsimpkins | unum: Gopher rocked. |
| 20:28.55 | fozzmoo | when Netscape v1 came out, it supported GIFs *and* JPEGs |
| 20:29.03 | fozzmoo | and he predicted it would ruin everything. |
| 20:29.11 | rsimpkins | he was right! :) |
| 20:29.16 | fozzmoo | I believe unum knows who I'm talking about. |
| 20:30.02 | elg | it was sjansen, wasn't it? |
| 20:30.31 | unum | dineirstein? |
| 20:30.36 | fozzmoo | unum: heh. No. |
| 20:30.55 | fozzmoo | A EE professor we both worked for (at different times) at USU. |
| 20:32.49 | unum | aaah him |
| 20:32.54 | unum | I never worked for him et did |
| 20:33.03 | unum | he's at oxford now |
| 20:33.53 | fozzmoo | Oxford?! |
| 20:33.57 | fozzmoo | Good. |
| 20:34.20 | unum | you wouldn't believe how much usu it has improved since :) |
| 20:35.04 | herlo | I'm near Harvard :) |
| 20:35.26 | fozzmoo | herlo: Don't get chased off campus. |
| 20:37.30 | herlo | fozzmoo: nah, I'm not going there, but I'm close by |
| 20:37.44 | herlo | fozzmoo: I'm going to the World Series tonight... |
| 20:38.09 | elg | ~baseball |
| 20:38.09 | ibot | Confuscious say, "Baseball not true. Man with four balls CANNOT walk." |
| 20:38.59 | fozzmoo | herlo: And you say you want to settle down and run a non-profit org. |
| 20:39.21 | herlo | fozzmoo: lol |
| 20:46.27 | unum | the reason I'm massing mailling lobbyists really is kind of odd... |
| 20:46.45 | unum | a certain politician wants to hold a town hall meeting and needs some money to do so |
| 20:47.08 | unum | I didn't know elected officials would actually solicit funds from lobbyists |
| 20:47.46 | unum | that reminds me I need to call him and see if he has a copy of the utopia killer bill yet |
| 20:49.01 | fozzmoo | Another one?! |
| 20:49.03 | fozzmoo | Sheeesh. |
| 20:53.28 | unum | sounds like they're not going to try and do it now |
| 20:53.30 | unum | whew |
| 20:53.44 | unum | atleast not through the privatization committe |
| 20:53.46 | unum | e |
| 20:55.16 | unum | http://www.le.utah.gov/asp/interim/Commit.asp?Year=2007&Com=SUBPRI |
| 20:55.16 | brac | [Government Competition and Privatization Subcommittee 2007] |
| 20:55.28 | unum | click on the agenda for tommorrows meeting |
| 20:59.12 | fozzmoo | The Subcommittee will discuss measures the Legislature could take to address the growth in an interlocal cooperative agency providing telecommunication services. |
| 21:00.48 | fozzmoo | Oooh. That wording just pisses me off. |
| 21:02.22 | *** part/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@66.7.122.158) |
| 21:02.38 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=sshaw@137.65.56.124) |
| 21:02.41 | unum | my favorite is one of those bills will make it so libraries have to charge hotel rates for renting class rooms |
| 21:02.53 | unum | atleast that's the goal |
| 21:03.46 | unum | that lincoln guy has his work cut out for him |
| 21:20.43 | elg | anyone have experience with teranews? |
| 21:21.09 | elg | specifically, I'm wanting a free nntp service for low bandwidth (just a couple text groups) |
| 21:21.21 | elg | my isp hasn't got all the groups I want, plus I can only get to them from my home network |
| 21:47.09 | *** join/#utah mrpull- (n=misterpu@mail.pollmann.us) |
| 22:01.46 | Supaplex | how bumpy was 2.6.23? I'm still on goodole 2.6.18 with deb security patches |
| 22:02.11 | Supaplex | well, my openwrt has 2.6.22 |
| 22:02.49 | atoponce | 2.6.22-2-amd64 |
| 22:03.27 | atoponce | i would like to see the .23 kernel. i hear it is tickless, which would be nice on my battery |
| 22:03.56 | mrpull- | i miss the old odd/even dev stable scheme |
| 22:04.01 | sjansen | 2.6.23 is barely out, too soon to say |
| 22:04.32 | atoponce | mrpull-: it's still followed, is it not? 2.8 will be the next stable, with 2.7 the unstable |
| 22:04.35 | sjansen | 2.6.24 merges 32bit and 64bit x86 into one arch |
| 22:05.14 | mrpull- | atoponce: not the way I used to understand it... but i stopped following so i could be wrong |
| 22:05.15 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-75-0-136-70.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:05.27 | atoponce | i thought it was just the first minor number |
| 22:06.06 | mrpull- | aren't they adding major features to 2.6 whereas in the old days they'd add them to 2.7 and back port them into 2.6 if deemed stable? |
| 22:06.28 | mrpull- | like i said, i don't follow it anymore... so i don't know what I'm talking about |
| 22:06.50 | sjansen | 2.7 is unlikely for a long time, it would indicate a major redesign (instead of major redesign, from here on out gradual refactoring with large subsystem changes is more likely) |
| 22:07.30 | atoponce | "a major redesign (instead of major redesign" ? |
| 22:07.35 | sjansen | Development is in git until considered ready for test, in which case you have -rc1, rc2, rc3 until judge sufficiently ready. |
| 22:08.37 | sjansen | After a release, 2.6.X with only minor updates handled in 2.6.X.Y (for example, 2.6.22.3) |
| 22:09.21 | sjansen | atoponce: I don't see what you're asking. Perhaps you don't understand because you didn't include the part after the comma. |
| 22:10.11 | atoponce | you say it would take a major redesign, then retract it. so i'm having a hard time figuring out your sentance |
| 22:10.51 | tensai | atoponce: he's saying the alternative to a major redesign is "from here on out gradual refactoring..." |
| 22:10.55 | Tene | atoponce: read the entire parenthetical comment as a separate statement. |
| 22:11.47 | atoponce | *shrug* |
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| 22:15.55 | sjansen | If major redesign -> increase version to 2.7 |
| 22:16.13 | sjansen | If not major redesign -> keep number |
| 22:16.27 | sjansen | If not major redesign -> gradually refactor to achieve major change |
| 22:16.49 | mrpull- | and scheduler changes fall into which category? |
| 22:17.30 | *** join/#utah hatul3048 (i=hatul30@gateway/tor/x-7ef9c8c3c1e4bc32) |
| 22:18.59 | atoponce | ahh. i see. |
| 22:23.48 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp02.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 22:23.49 | brac | beandog is calling asurion |
| 22:24.48 | Supaplex | beandog: so, what did you call asurion? |
| 22:25.55 | elg | late for dinner |
| 22:26.25 | Supaplex | >:) |
| 22:33.28 | beandog | man |
| 22:33.30 | beandog | who knows |
| 22:39.25 | sjansen | mrpull: _obviously_ scheduler changes are too minor to count |
| 22:39.52 | mrpull- | and the scheduler controversy a couple years back? |
| 22:42.10 | sjansen | mrpull: scheduler controversy? I think you're thinking of the VM controversy. |
| 22:42.36 | sjansen | I mean, _obviously_ changing the VM is a big enough deal it'd never be attempted in a stable kernel. |
| 22:42.40 | sjansen | Oh... wait... |
| 22:42.51 | mrpull- | :) |
| 22:44.06 | mrpull- | i thought the O(1) scheduler got patched into 2.4 from 2.5 despite a bunch of resistance from some vocal people |
| 22:44.09 | mrpull- | but no matter |
| 22:44.34 | sjansen | Actually, I think you're right. |
| 22:47.33 | maquis | -chat |
| 22:47.35 | brac | benchmarks are both macs? |
| 22:47.44 | maquis | -chat about sjansen is |
| 22:47.44 | brac | sjansen is just second to last 40 years. |
| 22:50.48 | mrpull- | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:52.56 | tensai | what's the difference between a court order and a subpeona? |
| 22:53.35 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=sshaw@sshaw.fttp.xmission.com) |
| 22:53.38 | tensai | s/subpeona/subpoena/ |
| 22:54.26 | Tene | -chat about benchmarks are |
| 22:54.26 | brac | benchmarks are both getting into it, it's fine now, and I had something to do this? |
| 22:55.58 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 22:56.51 | levi | I think you guys discussing Linux kernel versioning are assuming that there's actually reasoning behind it. |
| 22:57.22 | mrpull- | it seemed more reasonable the old way |
| 22:57.49 | decriptor | \ |
| 22:58.09 | mrpull- | i've only used the kernels provided by the distros for long enough that it doesn't matter to me anymore |
| 22:58.41 | mrpull- | quitting time... later |
| 22:58.44 | JoshH | tensai: a subpeona is sent to you, a search warrant is what the cops show up with |
| 22:58.44 | *** part/#utah mrpull- (n=misterpu@mail.pollmann.us) |
| 22:58.54 | JoshH | that's about the only practical difference |
| 22:59.06 | tensai | too many legal terms... |
| 22:59.48 | JoshH | they can subpoena customer information, and have you get back with it, or show up with a warrant and get it on the spot |
| 23:00.44 | herlo | JoshH: a subpoena can request u come in, if u don't, a warrant will be made for ur arrest : |
| 23:00.54 | herlo | or can be |
| 23:02.07 | maquis | and a court-order is? |
| 23:02.30 | herlo | a subpoena |
| 23:02.40 | herlo | unless its lunch |
| 23:02.45 | herlo | :) |
| 23:02.53 | JoshH | ah, thought tensai meant warrant, too close to 5 for my brain to function |
| 23:03.01 | herlo | hehe |
| 23:03.01 | maquis | so, the answer to tensai's question is "nothing" |
| 23:03.52 | herlo | and then thinks better of it and moves on |
| 23:04.01 | tensai | I believe a subpoena is a type of court order |
| 23:04.20 | tensai | but this document I'm reading indicates they're separate items |
| 23:04.21 | herlo | tensai: right |
| 23:04.48 | herlo | tensai: interesting |
| 23:05.13 | tensai | "disclose personally identifiable information to a governmental entity solely in response to a court order (and not, for example, a subpoena)" |
| 23:05.14 | JoshH | technically a subpoena requires a "response", and a court order requires a "disclosure" |
| 23:05.45 | herlo | whoa! |
| 23:05.50 | JoshH | you can respond to a subpoena with a "wait, what do you need exactly?", but with a court order, you provide the information |
| 23:06.15 | herlo | Supaplex: that's a bunch of poor sid. be careful |
| 23:06.33 | JoshH | at least that's my limited understand from dealing with them occasionally |
| 23:06.48 | Supaplex | it's a vserver guest. if it goes boom, it won't adversely affect me |
| 23:08.15 | Supaplex | actually, I'll take the lowtech route today. too many issues with printing envelopes. I'll just do the 8 or so by hand. |
| 23:14.46 | levi | Heh heh, Lonnie beats down smorrey with real facts! |
| 23:15.29 | maquis | herlo: it's being braindead |
| 23:15.50 | fungus | Did I sound like I was "beating him down" |
| 23:15.58 | fungus | I meant to be nice. |
| 23:15.59 | herlo | maquis: what is? |
| 23:16.24 | maquis | herlo: my computer |
| 23:17.04 | herlo | ~lart maquis' computer |
| 23:17.04 | ibot | teaches maquis' computer that M$ Access is a database. No, really, a database. A real live multi-user... well, ok, not multi-user, but a database. Yeah, that sounds right. |
| 23:17.43 | herlo | :) |
| 23:19.07 | levi | fungus: Well, it was a nice beat-down. |
| 23:19.32 | fungus | heh, ok. I can deal with that. |
| 23:21.37 | levi | Somehow I doubt it will make much difference, but it was nice. |
| 23:23.36 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@bromine.sosstaffing.com) |
| 23:23.42 | levi | He seems to be one of those people that doesn't recognize his own incompetence. And by this, I don't mean that he's universally incompetent, just that he seems to believe he is competent in areas that he is not. |
| 23:24.19 | maquis | who doesn't recognize his own incompetence? |
| 23:24.23 | maquis | and where was the beat-down? |
| 23:24.25 | maquis | i wanna see! |
| 23:24.41 | fungus | PLUG mailing list |
| 23:24.44 | maquis | oh |
| 23:24.49 | fungus | Thread about bittorrent protocols |
| 23:24.52 | maquis | i don't think i'm on that anymore |
| 23:25.00 | maquis | who's incompetent? |
| 23:25.24 | levi | smorrey, about peer-to-peer network protocols. |
| 23:26.03 | levi | I am also incompetent to write a new peer-to-peer filesharing protocol, but at least I'm aware of the fact. |
| 23:26.11 | maquis | :) |
| 23:26.42 | levi | One must first realize incompetence before that state can be remedied, though. |
| 23:28.28 | levi | He also seems to be incompetent to write a book about programming MMORPGs, yet he is doing so anyway. |
| 23:28.55 | levi | People like that drive me crazy. |
| 23:32.37 | *** join/#utah professor_x (n=jon@out.lnxi.com) |
| 23:33.37 | professor_x | whow |
| 23:35.15 | dataw0lf | someone needs to tell him his efforts should be focused on changing corporations that inflict ridiculous policies rather than writing a new protocol. |
| 23:36.48 | professor_x | I agree |
| 23:38.59 | levi | Hi, professor_x |
| 23:39.49 | professor_x | hey levi |
| 23:40.02 | professor_x | This is the Provo Linux Users Group? |
| 23:40.07 | Tene | Yep. |
| 23:40.26 | Tene | Well, people from all over Utah, and who used to live in Utah... |
| 23:40.26 | maquis | professor_x: plus a few additions |
| 23:40.43 | Tene | but that's a superset of plug. yes, there are many pluggers here. |
| 23:40.47 | maquis | professor_x: it's pretty much open-source users who have some connection to utah |
| 23:40.59 | maquis | and former pluggers |
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| 23:42.38 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@bromine.sosstaffing.com) |
| 23:42.50 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@2001:5c0:8fff:fffe:0:0:0:1647) |
| 23:42.59 | professor_x | hm... |
| 23:43.04 | professor_x | do you server hamburgers? |
| 23:44.59 | professor_x | Hey i've been wandering, what determines what modules are loaded at bootup? |
| 23:45.37 | professor_x | Does the kernel just probe the hardware and then say, "Oh i need this one, and this one, and this one" |
| 23:45.49 | Supaplex | is one not loading? or you want one to not load? |
| 23:46.10 | professor_x | no... I'm just wandering |
| 23:46.48 | Supaplex | modinfo has some hints |
| 23:53.29 | *** part/#utah professor_x (n=jon@out.lnxi.com) |
