| 00:57.39 | Supaplex | oh neat incidental mac trick discovery. command/cloverleaf+Q works within the command/cloverleaf+TAB dialog/interface. |
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| 02:21.56 | levi | Man, motivation to work on this assignment is hard to find. |
| 02:40.42 | levi | Where is everyone tonight? |
| 02:40.50 | Tene | Maryland! |
| 02:40.58 | levi | I like Maryland. |
| 02:41.09 | levi | What's everyone doing there? |
| 02:41.33 | Tene | I don't know about everyone else, but I'm just chatting on IRC and browsing wikipedia. |
| 02:41.53 | levi | Oh, so you're not /really/ in Maryland? Sheesh. |
| 02:42.12 | Tene | What, there's not supposed to be internet connections in MD? |
| 02:42.41 | Tene | I sure hope I'm here... otherwise my students are going to be upset. |
| 02:43.10 | levi | Where in MD are you? |
| 02:43.49 | levi | I spent a bit of time there when my parents lived there. |
| 02:45.37 | Tene | Columbia. |
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| 02:46.12 | levi | I was in Frederick and Thurmont. |
| 02:46.36 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 02:47.54 | levi | Apparently Pres. Clinton golfed in Thurmont frequently. |
| 02:47.58 | levi | Hi, elg. |
| 02:48.20 | elg | hidy |
| 02:52.17 | levi | elg: What adventures have you had lately? |
| 02:52.43 | elg | i have measured the electricity my oven uses to preheat to 450 (with the tiles and dutch oven inside) |
| 02:52.56 | levi | A lot? |
| 02:52.59 | elg | well, I measured the time that the element was on, and multiplied that by the watts according to the oven's sticker |
| 02:53.40 | elg | if I'm doing my calculations right... 2585 watts * 20 minutes * 9.86 cents/kWh = 8.5 cents |
| 02:54.38 | levi | Hmm. Not so much, then. :) |
| 02:55.24 | elg | yeah |
| 02:55.45 | elg | which is semi depressing since it means there's no way to justify a toaster oven on cost alone |
| 02:56.00 | elg | and since the deathly summer is over there's no "so it doesn't get our house hot" justification either |
| 02:56.13 | levi | Well, there's the convenience factor. |
| 02:56.21 | levi | It warms up pretty fast! |
| 02:56.41 | levi | And they're not terribly expensive. |
| 02:56.42 | elg | yeah, but unless you're in a real hurry it's a pretty slight factor |
| 02:56.56 | Tene | elg: there's the "I've developed an allergy to this oven." factor. |
| 02:56.58 | levi | I probably won't get a new toaster oven. No counter space. |
| 02:57.00 | elg | and they take up that much more counter space :) |
| 02:57.24 | elg | but mostly it's good news. not nearly so much guilt in baking a loaf of bread |
| 02:57.41 | elg | not like there was a whole lot, but there was always the nagging "what is this _really_ costing me?" factor |
| 02:58.29 | elg | actually to do the whole loaf, including opening the oven and messing with the dutch oven and all that, the element is on for more like 30 minutes, so more like 13 cents |
| 02:58.31 | levi | That's a good sign that you're altogether TOO frugal. |
| 02:58.56 | elg | and I haven't looked at what our rate really is here, but that's what some website said was the average cost per kWh |
| 02:59.19 | elg | even at the "whopping" 20 cents/kWh that california had in 2001 it's a drop in the bucket |
| 03:10.22 | levi | Yeah, you'd have to be pretty poor to not be able to afford firing up your oven for a loaf of bread. |
| 03:10.51 | levi | So, I think I may actually be able to play songs on my guitar someday. |
| 03:15.07 | Tene | Oh? |
| 03:23.40 | levi | I got it a few days ago, and my attempts to play scales and chords and such were abysmal. Now, after a few days of practice, I am slightly less abysmal. |
| 03:27.06 | levi | Speaking of bread, I went to the local Lehi bakery on main street with high hopes. Alas, I was disappointed. The orange butter flake rolls are yummy, but everything I got there has a somewhat artificial flavor to it. |
| 03:27.40 | elg | ya, i wasn't much impressed with them |
| 03:28.19 | levi | I hope the people I got the sourdough boule from last week get their bakery built soon. |
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| 03:32.06 | elg | ok, so my actual rate is $0.11482/kWh |
| 03:34.37 | levi | So, slightly more expensive than your calculations. |
| 03:35.35 | elg | ya, a dime to get the oven up to 450°, probably 15 cents to bake a loaf (including losing heat while playing with the dutch oven) |
| 03:38.33 | elg | anyone know off-hand what a bag of all-purpose flour costs? |
| 03:38.43 | levi | Hmm. Not much. |
| 03:38.52 | Supaplex | is it more than on-hand? |
| 03:39.27 | Supaplex | smiths had a caselot sale just a few days ago. it might still be on |
| 03:39.58 | levi | $4.09 for 5lbs of King Arthur flour from Amazon.com |
| 03:40.49 | levi | Only $2.80 for Hodgson Mill flour from Amazon, though. |
| 03:42.02 | levi | I'm guessing generic supermarket flour might be cheaper. |
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| 04:11.10 | elg | total cost including ingredients, about 75 cents, and that's a conservative estimate |
| 04:17.29 | Supaplex | and labor? ;) |
| 04:18.49 | levi | The no-knead bread doesn't look very labor-intensive. |
| 04:25.00 | Sargun | Hi |
| 04:30.19 | Tene | Looks like git for windows is coming along pretty well. |
| 04:30.27 | Tene | http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/ |
| 04:30.28 | brac | [msysgit - Google Code] |
| 04:44.47 | Supaplex | -seen jsmith |
| 04:44.47 | brac | jsmith was last seen 2 days, 7 hours, 32 minutes and 18 seconds ago, quitting IRC ("Leaving") |
| 05:03.27 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166-70-238-250.ip.xmission.com) |
| 05:23.33 | rsimpkins | They jacked up my phone with thier latest update. |
| 05:23.45 | rsimpkins | It was just a normal iPhone, no hacks or anything. |
| 05:25.33 | fozzmoo | And now? |
| 05:26.14 | rsimpkins | It's dead. |
| 05:26.20 | rsimpkins | So don't apply the update if you have one. |
| 05:26.20 | fozzmoo | Oh joy. |
| 05:26.20 | Sargun | Its an iPhone... |
| 05:26.25 | Sargun | What do you expect? |
| 05:26.37 | rsimpkins | says 'connect to itunes' but itunes won't see it. |
| 05:26.39 | fozzmoo | rsimpkins: That sucks. |
| 05:26.40 | Sargun | Well, rather, its an apple product. |
| 05:26.47 | Sargun | I'm sorry for your loss |
| 05:26.49 | fozzmoo | Sargun: You must not know much about Apple. |
| 05:26.57 | fozzmoo | Usually, their stuff is pretty high quality. |
| 05:27.02 | Sargun | fozzmoo, I've never had an apple product work as advertised. |
| 05:27.03 | rsimpkins | Yeah, major lame. I was hoping to take it with me on a week long trip too. |
| 05:27.29 | rsimpkins | That's what I get for thinkin Apple engineers know what they are doing. |
| 05:27.32 | Sargun | iBook: Bad HDD, bad battery, bad power adapter, bad "Logic Board" (all within 2 years) |
| 05:27.45 | fozzmoo | Sargun: wow. |
| 05:27.54 | Sargun | my iPod shuffle |
| 05:27.55 | Sargun | bad. |
| 05:28.07 | fozzmoo | I support an all-Mac shop. They love their hardware. |
| 05:28.20 | fozzmoo | Maybe Apple just sucks with portable stuff. |
| 05:28.51 | rsimpkins | This is the last time I purchase an Apple product. |
| 05:28.53 | Sargun | they wouldn't even let me return it |
| 05:28.54 | levi | All my Apple stuff works fine. |
| 05:28.58 | rsimpkins | If they can't get a simple software update right - forget it. |
| 05:29.03 | Sargun | my iPod standard. |
| 05:29.12 | Sargun | It bricked itself |
| 05:29.13 | Sargun | magically. |
| 05:29.47 | Sargun | Later on I got another iPod |
| 05:29.59 | Sargun | and it filled up itself within a few hours |
| 05:30.00 | levi | rsimpkins: Updates on embedded devices are rarely 'simple'. |
| 05:30.06 | Sargun | randomly |
| 05:30.10 | Sargun | apparently some indexing crap |
| 05:30.18 | Sargun | (4 GB iPod) |
| 05:30.21 | fozzmoo | levi: Still... I've never had these kinds of problems with my Treos. |
| 05:30.24 | rsimpkins | levi: yeah, but they don't have that many device types to support. |
| 05:30.31 | Sargun | I've had all sorts of issues |
| 05:30.35 | Sargun | with my Treos |
| 05:30.41 | Sargun | but they are fixable |
| 05:30.43 | fozzmoo | Sargun: w/ software updates? |
| 05:30.46 | Sargun | either by a reset |
| 05:30.50 | fozzmoo | Yeah. There's that. |
| 05:30.52 | Sargun | fozzmoo, Never with a software update. |
| 05:30.55 | fozzmoo | Right. |
| 05:31.09 | Sargun | Or fixable by a depot (if its a hardware issue) |
| 05:31.27 | fozzmoo | I had the keyboard on my 700 replaced on Friday. |
| 05:31.34 | fozzmoo | I abuse it. :) |
| 05:31.38 | levi | I've been lucky enough to never have any serious problems with any of my Apple stuff. |
| 05:31.45 | fozzmoo | The 'Y' key stopped working reliably. |
| 05:32.22 | levi | Their quality has perhaps gone down a bit in recent years, but then so have their prices. If it's not one thing to complain about, it's another. |
| 05:33.53 | rsimpkins | I got it to see it by restarting iTunes. |
| 05:33.57 | rsimpkins | I'm attempting a restore now. |
| 05:34.27 | rsimpkins | 'preparing iphone for restore' |
| 05:35.54 | rsimpkins | 'The iPhone could not be restored. An unknown error occured.' |
| 05:36.00 | rsimpkins | THANKS A LOT APPLE! YOU SUCK! |
| 05:36.30 | levi | That is pretty lame. |
| 05:37.06 | rsimpkins | So, no phone for me this week. |
| 05:37.16 | rsimpkins | Well, no iPhone. I have a back up cell thank goodness. |
| 05:37.32 | rsimpkins | Going to be in San Jose for a week. |
| 05:37.41 | rsimpkins | Not a good time to have a bricked cell. |
| 05:40.37 | Sargun | rsimpkins, Oh, when? |
| 05:40.42 | Sargun | When are you flying in? |
| 05:40.53 | rsimpkins | Tomorrow morning. |
| 05:41.00 | Sargun | Ah, Why are you coming here? |
| 05:41.10 | rsimpkins | Work. |
| 05:41.17 | Sargun | Consulting? |
| 05:41.59 | Sargun | Hm, where in San Jose? |
| 05:42.03 | Sargun | Downtown? |
| 05:42.35 | rsimpkins | no, at our datacenter. |
| 05:42.50 | rsimpkins | Going to be trapped in a windoless noisy room for a week. Tons o fun. |
| 05:42.55 | levi | rsimpkins: You could take the iPhone and see if the guys at the Apple store could exchange it for you. |
| 05:43.05 | rsimpkins | levi: I might try to do that. |
| 05:43.18 | Sargun | Oh, where is your DC? |
| 05:44.26 | rsimpkins | I have no clue. San Jose. |
| 05:47.22 | Sargun | street name of your DC? |
| 05:49.52 | fozzmoo | rsimpkins: And if you know the numeric code to key in for access, maybe you could provide that to Sargun as well. |
| 05:50.30 | rsimpkins | no luck. looks like I'm headed to an apple store to beg for a replacment. |
| 05:55.16 | Sargun | hehe |
| 05:55.30 | Sargun | fozzmoo, Most DCs are actually HID card based here |
| 05:55.52 | Sargun | Our high security one is: |
| 05:55.56 | Sargun | -HID card |
| 05:55.57 | fozzmoo | Yeah, most are... everywhere, actually... I was TRYing to make a joke. |
| 05:55.58 | Sargun | -License |
| 05:56.05 | Sargun | -Make sure your not a minor (bastards) |
| 05:56.12 | Sargun | -Biometric |
| 05:56.14 | Sargun | -Pincode |
| 05:56.29 | Sargun | -Prior auth from account manager |
| 05:56.30 | fozzmoo | My preferred data center uses a pin and a fingerprint (XM) for two doors. |
| 05:56.34 | Sargun | -Signature. |
| 05:56.56 | Sargun | The one I like uses Handscan, Pin, and phone auth |
| 05:57.13 | fozzmoo | The other one I'm working in uses HID & handscan. Three doors into the DC. |
| 05:57.19 | fozzmoo | And then our servers are in a locked cage. |
| 05:57.51 | fozzmoo | The cage is kind of funny, though. |
| 05:58.09 | fozzmoo | There's fencing around the servers, but not above... and the fence doesn't go to the ceiling. |
| 05:58.41 | fozzmoo | Of course, they'd get you on video trying to go over the cage fence. |
| 05:59.11 | fozzmoo | And then, if you had a floor panel lifter, you could go under the cage fence too. :) |
| 05:59.27 | Sargun | Heh |
| 05:59.31 | Sargun | Same with ours. |
| 05:59.39 | Sargun | and to get in via the loading dock |
| 05:59.48 | Sargun | All you need is a nice shirt. |
| 05:59.53 | fozzmoo | hee hee. |
| 05:59.57 | Sargun | and say the name of the delivery guy |
| 06:00.13 | fozzmoo | There was a colo in Orem that I went to once... |
| 06:00.16 | sontek | My datacenter is in my closet, takes a key to my house, and you have to go through my 2 pitbulls |
| 06:00.23 | fozzmoo | they're located in a warehouse area. |
| 06:00.23 | Sargun | sontek, hehe |
| 06:00.33 | sontek | :D |
| 06:00.41 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=nobody@oalug/member/linuxalien) |
| 06:00.41 | fozzmoo | They had the big garage door open when we went there... |
| 06:00.53 | fozzmoo | And there was an electrician working on something and nobody was in the office. |
| 06:01.02 | Sargun | Ah. |
| 06:01.09 | fozzmoo | So, Tene and I proceeded to take the two servers out that we needed to reinstall... |
| 06:01.18 | Sargun | Yeah. |
| 06:01.24 | fozzmoo | It wasn't until we were leaving with the servers that someone asked us who we were. |
| 06:01.30 | Sargun | haha |
| 06:01.34 | Sargun | I've seen datacenters where the access to the power termination was open |
| 06:01.36 | Sargun | That was bad. |
| 06:01.39 | sontek | did Tene used to work at Iodynamics? |
| 06:01.46 | fozzmoo | sontek: Yep. |
| 06:01.52 | fozzmoo | And then he learned how to get up before noon. |
| 06:01.55 | fozzmoo | Now he works at Guru labs. :) |
| 06:02.04 | sontek | nice =) I had never met him until he started at GL |
| 06:02.09 | Sargun | And the power control/Natural Gas/Water control |
| 06:02.11 | Sargun | was out front |
| 06:02.18 | Sargun | controlled by fire key |
| 06:02.23 | Sargun | I mean you could take out the DC |
| 06:02.24 | Sargun | with like |
| 06:02.33 | sontek | hes a pretty smart guy, did you teach him everything he knows? :P |
| 06:02.37 | Sargun | a little oxygen cutter |
| 06:02.44 | Sargun | er |
| 06:02.44 | fozzmoo | sontek: He says he learned a lot at Io. |
| 06:02.54 | fozzmoo | But he was pretty savvy before too. |
| 06:02.54 | Sargun | Acyletene torch (not sure if that's how you spell it) |
| 06:03.07 | Sargun | fozzmoo, where are you right now? |
| 06:03.14 | fozzmoo | Sargun: In the bathtub. |
| 06:03.25 | Sargun | fozzmoo, Is there water in the bathtub? |
| 06:03.34 | Sargun | fozzmoo, What company are you at? |
| 06:03.35 | levi | I taught him everything he knows. Remotely, through tele-hypnosis. Any flaws in his knowledge are due to my inexperience with the technique. |
| 06:03.41 | fozzmoo | There was... but it got cold. |
| 06:03.46 | fozzmoo | So I let it out... |
| 06:03.50 | fozzmoo | Now I'm going to filli t up again. |
| 06:03.51 | Sargun | rsimpkins, You have any plans for lunch later this week? |
| 06:03.55 | Sargun | fozzmoo, ah. |
| 06:04.00 | fozzmoo | I'm with KnowledgeBlue now. |
| 06:04.00 | levi | fozzmoo: TMI |
| 06:04.07 | Sargun | fozzmoo, Do you have a water proof I/O system? |
| 06:04.18 | fozzmoo | KnowledgeBlue bought Iodynamics. |
| 06:04.29 | fozzmoo | Sargun: No, I just don't drop my laptop into the water. |
| 06:04.34 | fozzmoo | and I don't splash around. |
| 06:04.41 | nick125 | I'm eventually planning on writing my own media databasing application around PostgreSQL. |
| 06:04.42 | Sargun | hehe |
| 06:04.50 | fozzmoo | I've got a little ledge thingie that my laptop sits on. |
| 06:05.04 | levi | Don't you get all pruney? |
| 06:05.13 | fozzmoo | levi: Of course, but it's not permanent. :) |
| 06:06.41 | fozzmoo | Does emcnabb ever say anything anymore? |
| 06:06.46 | Sargun | No. |
| 06:06.51 | Sargun | ~seen emcnabb |
| 06:06.52 | ibot | emcnabb is currently on #utah (3d 10h 58m 41s), last said: 'there you go sjansen, I said something'. |
| 06:06.57 | fozzmoo | hee hee |
| 06:06.59 | Sargun | heh |
| 06:07.31 | levi | Maybe he was hoping that if he stopped coming here, so would Sargun. ;) |
| 06:07.49 | fozzmoo | goozbach told me today he's getting ready to send out wedding invites. |
| 06:07.58 | Sargun | Oh |
| 06:08.03 | Sargun | Who is he getting married to? |
| 06:08.03 | fozzmoo | I'm gonna miss that guy. ;-) |
| 06:08.10 | levi | Heh. |
| 06:08.11 | Sargun | levi, Very funny? |
| 06:08.11 | Sargun | er |
| 06:08.12 | Sargun | .... |
| 06:08.15 | fozzmoo | Sargun: A chick from Georgia. |
| 06:08.19 | Sargun | Neat. |
| 06:08.31 | levi | Sargun: No, not really. |
| 06:08.41 | Sargun | exStudent? |
| 06:08.44 | levi | (in response to your 'question') |
| 06:09.01 | Sargun | I wonder if any Guru has ever dated an exStudent/Student |
| 06:09.13 | fozzmoo | Sargun: No, not an ex-student. |
| 06:09.22 | fozzmoo | I think he met through a church function. |
| 06:09.42 | levi | I don't imagine there are a whole lot of eligible women in GL classes. |
| 06:09.53 | fozzmoo | Oh... they happen. |
| 06:10.06 | fozzmoo | There have been a couple in the classes I've taught. |
| 06:10.20 | levi | Well, sure, but you generally have to go through quite a few potentials before you get married to one. ;) |
| 06:10.28 | fozzmoo | But, you're right. Mostly... not. |
| 06:10.42 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=nobody@oalug/member/linuxalien) |
| 06:11.11 | Sargun | Hm. |
| 06:11.12 | levi | And by eligible, I mean that they're both attractive and not already involved. |
| 06:11.13 | Sargun | Really? |
| 06:11.45 | Sargun | Or at least not hideous. |
| 06:11.47 | Sargun | or old |
| 06:11.55 | Sargun | Like levi's age :-P |
| 06:12.08 | levi | Heh. Well, fozzmoo's older than me, even! |
| 06:12.14 | Sargun | whoa. |
| 06:12.26 | fozzmoo | Yeah. I'm ANCIENT! |
| 06:12.51 | fozzmoo | I'm so old, I actually know old Unix hackers. :) |
| 06:13.00 | fozzmoo | I'm not as old as them... but I know them. :) |
| 06:13.38 | levi | We're not old, you're just a baby. :P |
| 06:14.00 | fozzmoo | I'm just glad I met my geek wife in college before she was snatched up by someone else. |
| 06:14.10 | fozzmoo | Married her when she was 19. |
| 06:14.24 | *** join/#utah Lakshmi (n=chatzill@66-240-25-49.isp.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 06:15.05 | levi | So we're not talking about how you're taking a bath anymore? |
| 06:15.33 | levi | Or about how old/young we are? |
| 06:19.23 | rsimpkins | Update on the iPhone issue. Installed iTunes on the laptop (different machine). The restore worked on the different machine. Luckily I was smart enough to make a back up a few weeks back. |
| 06:19.53 | levi | Weird. |
| 06:21.14 | rsimpkins | There is an 'itunes' button on the main menu now. Need to figure out how to get rid of it. |
| 06:22.28 | levi | In the Start Menu? |
| 06:22.35 | rsimpkins | no, on the iphone |
| 06:22.41 | rsimpkins | it's a purple 'itunes' button. |
| 06:22.50 | levi | That's the wireless itunes music store. |
| 06:23.02 | levi | I don't think you can get rid of it. |
| 06:23.12 | rsimpkins | Bummer. It looks really dumb. |
| 06:26.24 | levi | rsimpkins: If you go to a Starbucks that supports it and use their wireless, you'll get another button while you're there. |
| 06:26.45 | levi | It'll show you the past few songs that were playing in the store and give you the option to buy them. |
| 06:27.25 | levi | Anyway, I think being able to browse and buy music directly from the music player is a pretty compelling feature. |
| 06:27.38 | rsimpkins | Interesting. |
| 06:27.52 | rsimpkins | It is, but I'd like to hide it. |
| 06:28.03 | rsimpkins | Apple loves to take away control in the name of 'ease of use' |
| 06:29.12 | levi | And geeks love to whine about not being able to control every facet of a device. But they are not really a significant portion of the market. |
| 06:30.55 | levi | There's not much of a recourse for geeks who want something like an iPhone, though, since nothing else really has the same interface style. |
| 06:30.58 | rsimpkins | yeah, but I would argue removing a really dumb looking button off your home screen isn't a geeky control thing. :) |
| 06:31.59 | levi | I haven't heard any complaints about the icon's dumbness before. Mostly I hear complaints about the $200 price drop and 3rd party apps getting locked out again. |
| 06:33.57 | Sargun | I haven't heard anything about the iPhone |
| 06:33.57 | levi | I have heard discussion about precisely where the button is placed on the screen, but none about the button itself. |
| 06:34.04 | Sargun | that any other device can't do |
| 06:34.30 | Sargun | except being apple owned |
| 06:34.36 | Sargun | integrate into iTunes |
| 06:34.41 | Sargun | all the Apple-only things |
| 06:34.50 | rsimpkins | It was a gift, so I gotta be careful not to complain too much. |
| 06:34.56 | Sargun | Oh. |
| 06:35.01 | Sargun | From your wife? |
| 06:35.59 | levi | Sargun: The feature list for the iPhone doesn't look very impressive, but Apple products are never about the feature lists. |
| 06:36.30 | levi | Sargun: They're about product design, which Apple is generally very good at. |
| 06:37.00 | Sargun | Heh. |
| 06:37.09 | levi | And by product design, I mean more than just how it looks; I mean both the physical design and the interface. |
| 06:39.08 | levi | Nothing has an interface remotely like the iPhone's interface. |
| 06:39.23 | levi | The same thing could be said for the iPod when it first came out. |
| 06:40.05 | levi | Plus, they're made intentionally less flexible and featureful so that they're easy to use. |
| 06:43.02 | Sargun | heh, I don't want them to decide what I'm capable of handling for me though |
| 06:44.17 | levi | Sargun: They're not making it for you. They're making it for the market. |
| 06:44.43 | Sargun | True. |
| 06:44.52 | levi | Sargun: If you don't like it, you don't have to buy it, but since making it attractive to you would make it less attractive to far more people... |
| 06:45.25 | Sargun | Like the last gen of the PowerBook was neat. |
| 06:48.49 | levi | Apple is successful because they have a strong opinion about how a device should work. It leads to strong design cohesion. People, in general, like that. |
| 06:49.55 | levi | If you come up with some loose bunch of 'cool features' and make things super-configurable, but you don't have a cohesive design, people will be turned off. |
| 06:49.59 | sontek | Apple made it clear that they weren't making an open hackable phone, so when people complain about not being able to do it I just laugh at them |
| 06:50.04 | sontek | THere was a great post on it yesterday |
| 06:50.18 | levi | Except for geeks, who will love it, if they ever hear about it. |
| 06:50.36 | sontek | http://diveintomark.org/archives/2007/10/04/if-wishes-were-iphones?retitled |
| 06:50.45 | levi | Witness the Sharp Zaurus. |
| 06:50.53 | sontek | ^ thats a good read, explains my thoughts exactly |
| 06:50.57 | sontek | mmm zaurus |
| 06:51.13 | levi | Geeks loved the Zaurus. But it was a total mess as an actual product. |
| 06:51.30 | sontek | I won a ipod nano at the suse launch party and I put http://www.rockbox.org/ on it |
| 06:51.53 | levi | I run the standard firmware on my nano. I like it. |
| 06:52.10 | levi | It's way less scratch-prone than my previous iPod. |
| 06:52.51 | levi | It plays music, which is precisely what I want a music player to do, so I don't feel any need to change the firmware. |
| 06:52.58 | sontek | the one I won was a 1st gen, so it'll get all scratched up, but its hackable now ;) |
| 06:53.20 | fozzmoo | I think I would like an iPod + Rockbox. |
| 06:53.22 | sontek | and banshee actually has good ipod support |
| 06:53.33 | fozzmoo | I've run Rockbox on my iAudio X5. It's nice. |
| 06:54.08 | levi | I bought a Tuxscreen and a Zaurus for hacking, and I never did a lot of hacking on them. It was a cool idea, but I just never did much with it. |
| 06:54.28 | sontek | I've never heard of an iAudio |
| 06:54.49 | fozzmoo | sontek: They're the audiophile's iPod. :) |
| 06:55.07 | sontek | I thought about getting the Zaurus but I can run open embedded on my treo and thats enough for me |
| 06:55.08 | fozzmoo | Flac, Ogg, Mp3, etc. |
| 06:55.11 | sontek | I'll have to check it out |
| 06:55.16 | sontek | I really want a player that supports ogg |
| 06:55.17 | fozzmoo | and the sound quality rivals almost everything else. |
| 06:55.39 | sontek | I was shopping around for mp3 players and then I wont the ipod so I just settled |
| 06:55.39 | fozzmoo | For a while there, a lot of players did support Ogg... but it seems to be dwindling. |
| 06:55.47 | levi | I don't think my ears are good enough to hear the difference. |
| 06:55.58 | fozzmoo | levi: Well, mine certainly aren't either. :) |
| 06:56.23 | sontek | ooh, its made by cowon? |
| 06:56.28 | fozzmoo | Yeah. |
| 06:56.34 | fozzmoo | COW... ON... AMERICA |
| 06:56.44 | levi | The iPod shuffle is supposed to have much better sound output than the other models, but I can never hear a difference. |
| 06:56.51 | sontek | my coworker has the A2 |
| 06:56.56 | fozzmoo | Yeah. |
| 06:57.12 | fozzmoo | The X5 is the 20G 30G and 40G 2.5-inch hard drive players. |
| 06:57.31 | fozzmoo | I'm thinking about getting the iAudio 7. 16GB of flash. |
| 06:57.46 | fozzmoo | 60 hours of playback time before recharging. |
| 06:57.57 | levi | These days, I prefer flash players. 8Gb is plenty for me. |
| 06:58.18 | sontek | The a2 is nice, it has a decent interface and its 60gb |
| 06:58.29 | sontek | and it plays video |
| 06:58.54 | fozzmoo | Yeah. The X5 does too... but it's a teeny screen. |
| 06:59.01 | fozzmoo | I watched the Heroes S1 pilot on it. |
| 06:59.05 | fozzmoo | It was alright. |
| 06:59.11 | fozzmoo | But I didn't recognize anyone. :) |
| 06:59.14 | fozzmoo | 160x120. |
| 06:59.16 | levi | If I buy another iPod, it'll probably be an iPod Touch. |
| 06:59.40 | levi | I played with one at Best Buy. |
| 06:59.59 | levi | Unfortunately, they had it tied down so you couldn't rotate it. |
| 07:00.16 | sontek | The only reason I wont buy an ipod is because of those firmware updates they just did to block other software vendors from interfacing with them |
| 07:00.32 | levi | sontek: Which ones were those? |
| 07:00.33 | sontek | I don't want to have to search around to find a windows machine everytime I need to change my songs :P |
| 07:01.05 | levi | I don't believe that recent one had anything to do with blocking out other software vendors. |
| 07:01.21 | sontek | Well, they setup a hashcode so that only itunes could interface with it |
| 07:01.24 | Sargun | levi, that you can't put songs on there without a salted sha sum? |
| 07:01.27 | sontek | I think the plan was to lock out illegal sharing |
| 07:01.33 | sontek | but it also locked banshee out |
| 07:03.52 | levi | There are a number of theories as to why they put the hash in, and the sane ones don't include purposefully locking out other people. |
| 07:04.27 | levi | Since the new format was figured out within a day or two, it clearly wasn't effective at locking people out. |
| 07:05.22 | levi | My friend at Apple said it was done to improve iTunes syncing. Apparently there were corruption problems occasionally or something. |
| 07:05.38 | sontek | Apple isn't hacker friendly, so I try to stay away from their products, nothing against them, I just know what I want to do with my devices :P |
| 07:06.13 | sontek | yeah, but what does a hash have to do with fixing corruption problems? :P |
| 07:06.31 | levi | Hashes are often used for data verification. |
| 07:06.50 | levi | If the hash is bad, you know the data got corrupted. |
| 07:08.15 | sontek | yeah, that makes sense |
| 07:08.21 | levi | Anyway, Apple largely ignores hacking. Which means they don't bother trying to avoid breaking hacks, which is a totally reasonable stance to take. |
| 07:09.41 | levi | They even do this at a system software level. They'll let you do whatever you want with your software, but if you used unpublished APIs, they WILL break your code when they do a system update. |
| 07:10.22 | levi | Microsoft, on the other hand, tries very hard to maintain backward compatibility with all sorts of old crufty stuff. |
| 07:10.29 | sontek | well on the mac, you have objective c which allows you to extend the api's yourself, so you can add whatever you want |
| 07:10.59 | levi | sontek: To some degree. But if you want to hack the dock, or whatever, you have to get into unpublished apis. |
| 07:12.33 | levi | Apple has been that way since the beginning. They published insanely detailed 'Inside Macintosh' manuals, with caveats about which stuff was off-limits if you wanted interfaces that would stick around. |
| 07:12.34 | sontek | my gf has been asking for a mac, but I've been avoiding it, but I might get her one just so I can play with it :P |
| 07:13.09 | sontek | yeah, thats great of them, I didn't know they even did that |
| 07:14.00 | sontek | Since I don't own a mac I only hear about when they break a hack |
| 07:14.04 | levi | The apple developer site has a bunch of information like that now. Of course, the Microsoft developer site has a ton of information, too, it's just horribly organized and nearly worthless as far as I can tell. |
| 07:14.44 | sontek | I tried hacking on some cocoa a few years ago and that was a terrible API |
| 07:15.25 | levi | That's a minority opinion. Most people rave about it. |
| 07:15.53 | sontek | http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/10/08/wisconsin.shooting/index.html |
| 07:15.55 | brac | [Police track down deputy who stormed party, killed six people - CNN.com] |
| 07:17.10 | levi | Yow. |
| 07:19.07 | sontek | yeah, I agree, I really fell in love with obj c when I was doing the cocoa stuff though |
| 07:21.05 | levi | Gah, my brain is refusing to do this homework. I'm going to bed. |
| 07:21.39 | sontek | haha |
| 07:21.46 | sontek | gnight! |
| 09:33.36 | Supaplex | morning :) |
| 09:33.45 | Supaplex | (early) |
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| 13:03.11 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 13:18.26 | Sargun | Good morning |
| 13:23.54 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@66.7.122.158) |
| 13:46.05 | *** join/#utah PelaoFeliz (n=PelaoFel@67.108.236.230) |
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| 14:22.26 | goozbach | and it's all fozzmoo's fault |
| 14:22.37 | fozzmoo | udderly sad? |
| 14:22.52 | fozzmoo | You're sad about your udders? |
| 14:23.15 | fozzmoo | I haven't had a conversation like this since I lived in Hyrum. |
| 14:24.03 | goozbach | lenovo canceled my laptop order, and now I can't get a WUXGL screen |
| 14:24.07 | goozbach | :( |
| 14:24.12 | fozzmoo | And this is my fault? |
| 14:24.15 | goozbach | yes |
| 14:24.22 | fozzmoo | Dammit. |
| 14:24.24 | goozbach | I haven't figured out why yet... |
| 14:24.28 | goozbach | but I'm working on it |
| 14:24.36 | fozzmoo | What res is WUXGL? |
| 14:24.44 | goozbach | 1900x1600 |
| 14:24.49 | goozbach | :D |
| 14:25.15 | goozbach | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WUXGA |
| 14:25.21 | goozbach | my bad WUXGA |
| 14:25.26 | goozbach | and it's 1900x1200 |
| 14:25.27 | fozzmoo | ahhh. |
| 14:26.08 | goozbach | 16:10 |
| 14:26.13 | goozbach | beautiful! |
| 14:26.25 | goozbach | but sadly, now because of the wedding I can't order it again. |
| 14:26.34 | goozbach | until after January |
| 14:26.49 | fozzmoo | Hmmm. That's not that sad. :) |
| 14:27.33 | fozzmoo | Is it a T61? |
| 14:29.15 | goozbach | yup |
| 14:29.20 | goozbach | t61p |
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| 14:37.54 | klys | ever heard of an 1152x864 lcd ? |
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| 14:55.17 | shadowwire | Nope |
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| 15:19.32 | maquis | ~quote amzn |
| 15:19.49 | maquis | sweet |
| 15:26.27 | fozzmoo | maquis: Got stock? |
| 15:29.28 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@bromine.sosstaffing.com) |
| 15:29.36 | maquis | :) |
| 15:29.38 | maquis | fozzmoo: :) |
| 15:35.35 | maquis | ~quote scox |
| 15:35.41 | maquis | ick |
| 15:35.44 | maquis | they're going up again? |
| 15:35.52 | maquis | who's buying? |
| 15:38.23 | Tene | Huh, they're going up? If they're going up, maybe I should buy some... |
| 15:39.49 | maquis | *scoff* |
| 15:44.04 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp02.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 15:48.43 | elg | -chat if only |
| 15:48.44 | brac | if only it would stand up to 2000MT/s" |
| 15:58.27 | levi | -chat elg is |
| 15:58.27 | brac | elg is trying to determine who may be some small local airline "doing business as" america west |
| 15:58.45 | levi | -chat maquis is |
| 15:58.45 | brac | maquis is currently on #utah |
| 15:58.53 | levi | Very observant, brac. |
| 15:59.09 | maquis | -chat about levi is |
| 15:59.10 | brac | levi is that the latest ISC ntp by hand and said I support an app called Amorphium, and then finding out what neighbor hoods have it configured |
| 15:59.33 | maquis | apparently levi is more interesting than me |
| 16:02.36 | levi | But I make less sense. |
| 16:03.09 | elg | haha neighbor hoods |
| 16:03.13 | elg | -chat neighbor hoods |
| 16:03.13 | brac | neighbor hoods have it anymore. |
| 16:03.31 | levi | -chat neighbor hoods |
| 16:03.31 | brac | neighbor hoods have it delete sensitive info |
| 16:03.32 | elg | and I apparently work for the FBI |
| 16:03.50 | levi | -chat about brac is |
| 16:03.50 | brac | brac is boring |
| 16:03.56 | levi | Heh. |
| 16:04.54 | levi | Ooh, grading? |
| 16:04.58 | elg | ya |
| 16:05.12 | levi | Dashing the hopes of the poor underclassmen? |
| 16:05.29 | levi | "Ha ha! You FAIL!" |
| 16:05.30 | elg | dashing their hopes of partying during the week before finals, absolutely |
| 16:06.12 | shadowwire | Comes to show, Power Corrupts. |
| 16:06.30 | elg | what the... |
| 16:06.43 | elg | one of the brightest students submitted his thing in a rar file |
| 16:06.48 | levi | -chat what the |
| 16:06.48 | brac | what the data center uses a CMS upon which hamachi is installed. |
| 16:06.55 | elg | -chat the heck |
| 16:06.56 | brac | the heck is a bit more sensitive, ok? |
| 16:06.59 | shadowwire | Absolute Power corrupts absolutely, But it rocks absolutely also! |
| 16:07.12 | levi | -chat it rocks |
| 16:07.13 | brac | it rocks absolutely also! |
| 16:07.26 | levi | C'mon, brac, that was a little obvious. |
| 16:07.45 | elg | -chat it sucks |
| 16:07.45 | brac | it sucks less than $1,000 -- but I like it |
| 16:08.10 | ^Migs^ | -chat you suck |
| 16:08.10 | brac | you suck for her... |
| 16:08.14 | levi | Boy, how would it be to have $1,000 suck? |
| 16:08.15 | ^Migs^ | er |
| 16:08.23 | ^Migs^ | -chat i suck |
| 16:08.24 | brac | i suck at math |
| 16:08.24 | shadowwire | Indeed. |
| 16:08.29 | levi | -chat ^Migs^ is |
| 16:08.29 | brac | ^Migs^ is rated 10/10 for excellence in programming, the differences between linux and Tru64. |
| 16:08.37 | ^Migs^ | PFAHAHAHAHAHA |
| 16:08.42 | ^Migs^ | -chat levi is |
| 16:08.43 | brac | levi is going to write a letter to my other friend dropped out in named.conf: include "/etc/bind/zones.rfc1918"; |
| 16:08.53 | ^Migs^ | -chat elg is |
| 16:08.53 | brac | elg is right, and you than passing a password, or setting up polyphony, etc. |
| 16:09.02 | ^Migs^ | -chat wtf is |
| 16:09.02 | brac | wtf is the guest didn't have much point in time |
| 16:09.21 | shadowwire | -chat whats going on |
| 16:09.22 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
| 16:09.30 | shadowwire | crap. |
| 16:09.31 | elg | -chat and then |
| 16:09.32 | brac | and then you have to be cleaning up memory, but when I only sometimes liked to run or step on it |
| 16:09.35 | mrpull | elg: have you seen maddox's grading of other people's kids art? |
| 16:09.36 | mrpull | http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=irule |
| 16:09.37 | brac | [I am better than your kids.] |
| 16:09.43 | mrpull | there are a few cuss words in there |
| 16:09.50 | shadowwire | nice |
| 16:10.10 | shadowwire | -chat crap |
| 16:10.10 | brac | crap went |
| 16:10.22 | levi | -chat liked to |
| 16:10.22 | brac | liked to work this time, you're pretty sick of uppity language snobs, that think "cans" is a business preference, not even that... |
| 16:10.52 | levi | -chat of uppity |
| 16:10.52 | brac | of uppity language snobs, that think I figured out what a riot. |
| 16:11.02 | levi | -chat language snobs |
| 16:11.03 | brac | language snobs |
| 16:11.16 | shadowwire | -chat bye |
| 16:11.16 | brac | bye went |
| 16:11.18 | levi | -chat sick of |
| 16:11.19 | brac | sick of that, as people who enter here. |
| 16:11.22 | levi | -chat sick of |
| 16:11.22 | brac | sick of that, my tongue |
| 16:11.28 | levi | -chat my tongue |
| 16:11.29 | brac | my tongue was hurting.. sjansen thanks, I've tried it last night |
| 16:11.52 | levi | Endless entertainment! |
| 16:11.53 | shadowwire | -chat his tounge |
| 16:11.54 | brac | his tounge |
| 16:12.10 | shadowwire | I dont get it. |
| 16:12.32 | shadowwire | -chat dont get it |
| 16:12.32 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
| 16:12.42 | shadowwire | help chat |
| 16:12.49 | shadowwire | brac: help chat |
| 16:12.49 | brac | markov plugin: listens to chat to build a markov chain, with which it can (perhaps) attempt to (inanely) contribute to 'discussion'. Sort of.. Will get a *lot* better after listening to a lot of chat. usage: 'markov' to attempt to say something relevant to the last line of chat, if it can. other options to markov: 'ignore' => ignore a hostmask (accept no input), 'status' => show |
| 16:12.50 | brac | current status, 'probability' => set the % chance of rbot responding to input, 'chat' => try and say something intelligent, 'chat about <foo> <bar>' => riff on a word pair (if possible) |
| 16:13.48 | shadowwire | still dont get it. |
| 16:13.50 | elg | shadowwire: one word: arity |
| 16:14.00 | levi | -chat arity is |
| 16:14.01 | brac | arity is |
| 16:14.04 | levi | -chat arity |
| 16:14.04 | brac | arity did |
| 16:14.20 | shadowwire | -chat arity |
| 16:14.20 | brac | arity went |
| 16:14.23 | levi | Apparently we need to talk more about arity in here. |
| 16:18.02 | elg | this is boring |
| 16:18.15 | elg | because we aren't requiring big number support, I have to stick with 10-bit keys |
| 16:18.18 | tensai | shadowwire: brac can chat about two word pairs. if you give him a single word, he auto appends is, went, was, etc. to make a pair. |
| 16:18.31 | elg | and even the stupidest factorization crack can crack 10-bit keys in the blink of an eye |
| 16:19.39 | levi | elg: Is this a class you're taking or grading for? |
| 16:21.47 | elg | grading for |
| 16:22.04 | elg | the one I was toying with the lab last week, breaking 32-bit keys and stuff |
| 16:22.31 | levi | It's sad that so few mainstream languages have transparent bignum support. |
| 16:23.29 | elg | heh |
| 16:23.35 | elg | What would you like to do? |
| 16:23.35 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:23.35 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:23.35 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:23.35 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:23.48 | levi | Sweet!! |
| 16:27.23 | findlay-w | -chat you like |
| 16:27.23 | brac | you like tattoos |
| 16:28.59 | levi | This is a pretty good catalog of Common Lisp features: http://abhishek.geek.nz/lisp-features |
| 16:29.04 | brac | [Features of Common Lisp (by Abhishek Reddy)] |
| 16:31.11 | shadowwire | -chat encrypt crack |
| 16:31.11 | brac | encrypt crack |
| 16:31.37 | shadowwire | -chat crack ok |
| 16:31.37 | brac | crack ok |
| 16:31.44 | shadowwire | I still dont get it. |
| 16:32.13 | shadowwire | -chat would you |
| 16:32.13 | brac | would you help with mythTV as one of the vegan world. |
| 16:32.56 | shadowwire | So... The -chat thing needs to be a question? |
| 16:33.10 | levi | You have to use two words that are juxtaposed in brac's memory. |
| 16:33.18 | shadowwire | How do I know? |
| 16:33.29 | levi | You don't, but you can guess. |
| 16:33.39 | shadowwire | oh. |
| 16:33.50 | levi | They'll only be juxtaposed in brac's memory if someone has said them together while brac was listening. |
| 16:34.13 | shadowwire | -chat is this |
| 16:34.13 | brac | but chat is it |
| 16:34.13 | brac | is this supposed to be a pain to update the firmware loader installed, I just brought up the page |
| 16:34.18 | levi | I want a crack ok is that so wrong? |
| 16:34.22 | levi | -brac crack ok |
| 16:34.46 | shadowwire | -chat crack ok |
| 16:34.47 | brac | crack ok is that it's cheap, and the host |
| 16:35.03 | levi | See how it works? |
| 16:35.05 | shadowwire | I see. |
| 16:35.15 | shadowwire | -chat i see |
| 16:35.15 | brac | i see where you're coming from 71.230.161.46, but it's working for her, she was a King, I doubt we'll ever need. |
| 16:35.34 | shadowwire | how odd. |
| 16:35.54 | shadowwire | -chat how odd |
| 16:35.54 | brac | how odd is that one is SD, even better |
| 16:36.17 | shadowwire | -chat a king |
| 16:36.17 | brac | a king size sheet and spray painted the question I have a recommendation for a few months and really enjoy working here, and not a printer.. you are pedantic about the rainstorms |
| 16:36.40 | shadowwire | -chat the rainstorms |
| 16:36.40 | brac | the rainstorms |
| 16:37.02 | shadowwire | -chat a printer |
| 16:37.03 | brac | a printer over the head with a .txt extension? |
| 16:37.26 | shadowwire | -chat and not |
| 16:37.26 | brac | and not trying to have their heads down. |
| 16:37.50 | shadowwire | -chat where is |
| 16:37.50 | brac | where is the asterisk box with javascript and XML? |
| 16:38.08 | shadowwire | I think I get it now. |
| 16:41.16 | findlay-w | -chat why is |
| 16:41.17 | brac | why is that? |
| 16:41.24 | findlay-w | -chat because |
| 16:41.25 | brac | because is screwed -- I got to be "leaving" because I'm sure they get hit. That's the name is Michael, and I usually don't get why people steal cable TV, DSL for specifying protocols: http://www.opendylan.org/%7ehannes/secure-networking.pdf |
| 16:41.45 | Tene | -chat findlay |
| 16:41.45 | brac | findlay is constantly absorbing paradoxes. |
| 16:41.54 | findlay-w | I am |
| 16:42.03 | findlay-w | -weather kpvu |
| 16:42.18 | findlay-w | for the good of humanity |
| 16:43.16 | Tene | ~weather kpvu |
| 16:43.35 | Tene | -chat -chat |
| 16:43.35 | brac | -chat went |
| 16:44.04 | findlay-w | ~say -chat "say ~say -chat Tene" |
| 16:44.05 | ibot | -chat "say ~say -chat Tene" |
| 16:44.07 | brac | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'brac: help chat' |
| 16:44.39 | findlay-w | ~say -chat about stuff |
| 16:44.39 | ibot | -chat about stuff |
| 16:44.41 | brac | stuff is really the only Findlay's of close relation on the computer? |
| 16:55.09 | levi | Hmm. Is anyone interested in Jesse's idea of getting a venture capital person to talk at PLUG about getting a startup funded? |
| 16:55.40 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@psnet.cc) |
| 16:55.40 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 16:57.25 | ^Migs^ | my wife rescued an abandoned kitten from the park a couple weeks ago. well, the cat only lived a week. We came home and it was lying sick on our bed. Feces were everywhere, and it looked like its bowels fell out. So we had to take it to the vet to get it put to sleep. |
| 16:57.41 | ^Migs^ | poor little kitty. Sweetest thing, too. Always wanted to snuggle and be held... |
| 16:59.36 | findlay-w | sure |
| 16:59.53 | findlay-w | ^Migs^ is just trying to come to terms with cat viscera on his bed |
| 17:00.47 | ^Migs^ | well, it's all cleaned up now |
| 17:06.07 | levi | Yuck. |
| 17:06.41 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=sshaw@137.65.56.136) |
| 17:09.11 | ^Migs^ | the kitty let my kids carry him around in a basket and push him in the stroller |
| 17:09.22 | findlay-w | heh |
| 17:09.45 | ^Migs^ | he would actually PURR while they were doing all this crap to him. Such a good kitty. |
| 17:10.03 | Tene | Or perhaps just mentally dead and near death. |
| 17:10.27 | jlp_work | at least the kitten wasn't alone at the end of it's life. it could have been cold and wet and even more miserable |
| 17:10.36 | ^Migs^ | how does that mean he wasn't a good kitty? Many homo sapiens become well-mannered when they're near death |
| 17:10.50 | ^Migs^ | Yeah, when we found him, he was malnourished |
| 17:13.53 | levi | My dad's dog died a few weeks ago. That was really sad, too. |
| 17:28.46 | ^Migs^ | I think your situation is sadder |
| 17:32.35 | levi | There was less disgustingness involved, though. He died happy, at least. |
| 17:32.43 | levi | And was never neglected. |
| 17:33.01 | levi | Had some sort of heart problem. |
| 17:33.04 | ^Migs^ | so my situation is sadder |
| 17:33.18 | ^Migs^ | sadly, they are no winners in a situation like this |
| 17:34.09 | levi | Depends on how you want to quantify sadness. Is it more sad when an animal has been neglected and dies painfully, or when a long-loved pet dies peacefully? |
| 17:34.20 | levi | Both of them really suck. |
| 17:34.46 | ^Migs^ | well, this kitten was only a few months old, so he wasn't suffering for long |
| 17:40.41 | Supaplex | are we taking bets yet to how long ^Migs^ can hold out for another kitty? |
| 17:43.06 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@216.243.239.137) |
| 17:43.54 | ^Migs^ | probably not too long |
| 17:43.59 | ^Migs^ | we had another cat years ago, but he got hit by a car |
| 17:44.15 | ^Migs^ | oh you mean how long before we get another one, or how long the next one we get will survive? |
| 17:44.24 | ^Migs^ | I don't want a kitty, but my wife does |
| 17:44.31 | ^Migs^ | she's wanted one for a long time |
| 17:44.45 | sjansen | cats++ |
| 17:44.53 | sjansen | kittens++ |
| 17:45.40 | *** topic/#utah by sjansen -> The channel for content free discussion in Utah | http://plug.org/irc | PLIG RFC: http://plig.jottit.com/ | http://icanhascheezburger.com/ |
| 17:46.14 | mrpull | does any body know of any tools/calculators to model growth of backups? |
| 17:46.22 | mrpull | a little googling isn't helping |
| 17:53.14 | dataw0lf | http://www.fudgie.org/?q=1 |
| 17:53.15 | brac | [glTail.rb - realtime logfile visualization] |
| 17:59.07 | tensai | grr. kids! |
| 17:59.41 | tensai | my server was too loud so my son decided to turn it off |
| 18:17.39 | elg | tensai: smart kid ;-) |
| 18:18.14 | elg | -chat i can |
| 18:18.14 | brac | i can figure out how to tell exim that fyrenice.dynalias.com is a 4 letter word]ty developers, look at http://twistedmatrix.com/projects/core/documentation/examples/chatserver.py |
| 18:46.57 | sjansen | ~dict mollytoggle |
| 18:47.23 | sjansen | tensai: Sounds like you need to invest in a molly toggle. |
| 18:48.10 | sjansen | Oops, molly guard. |
| 18:48.28 | sjansen | http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/molly-guard |
| 18:57.33 | shadowwire | -chat sounds like |
| 18:57.34 | brac | sounds like the power lines / over the clear winner in quality, dropped calls, lag, thing kept freezing |
| 19:07.49 | atoponce | why doesn't brac speak in clear clean sentances? |
| 19:08.03 | ^Migs^ | brac was programmed by a team of retarded monkeys |
| 19:08.41 | atoponce | ahh |
| 19:09.20 | ^Migs^ | -chat retarded monkeys |
| 19:09.20 | brac | retarded monkeys |
| 19:09.50 | atoponce | uh huh... |
| 19:10.02 | *** join/#utah brasto (n=brasto@out.lnxi.com) |
| 19:10.24 | sjansen | -chat atoponce |
| 19:10.24 | brac | atoponce did an rm -Rf / |
| 19:10.40 | mrpull | does it matter if the million monkeys on a million typewriters are retarded? |
| 19:10.45 | sjansen | How embarrasing. What a mistake to make on your first day of work. |
| 19:10.59 | mrpull | sjansen: do tell |
| 19:11.00 | atoponce | heh |
| 19:11.03 | sjansen | atoponce: Don't worry. I'll help you reinstall your system. ;-) |
| 19:11.31 | atoponce | what can i say. RH didn't prompt me :) |
| 19:12.07 | Supaplex | -chat ruby |
| 19:12.07 | brac | ruby is because SGI was one of these this morning |
| 19:12.36 | thaddeusq | atoponce: So where are you at? |
| 19:12.59 | atoponce | go-lucky des moines |
| 19:13.17 | Supaplex | wasn't sjansen just there? |
| 19:13.29 | atoponce | we're both there |
| 19:13.34 | atoponce | he's teaching, i'm learning |
| 19:13.37 | atoponce | rh133 |
| 19:13.41 | Supaplex | ahh neato |
| 19:14.18 | atoponce | he's *ok* as a teacher... :) |
| 19:14.37 | thaddeusq | sjansen teaching, there's an oxymoron |
| 19:15.28 | fozzmoo | I spent a night in Des Moines once. |
| 19:15.57 | shadowwire | Hard work always pays off after time, but Laziness pays off ow. |
| 19:16.12 | shadowwire | now, dang it. |
| 19:16.30 | fozzmoo | Laziness pays off.... ow! |
| 19:16.56 | shadowwire | -chat dang it |
| 19:16.57 | brac | dang it is the way hip netBSD shirt |
| 19:16.57 | atoponce | yeah. laziness pays off alright... |
| 19:17.11 | goozbach | that's because fozz's mom slapped him in the back of the head and told him to take out the trash *NOW* |
| 19:17.27 | fozzmoo | heh. |
| 19:17.45 | Supaplex | sjansen: atoponce says he can teach better? How soon does that start? :) (ok, so maybe he implied that by saying you teach "ok") |
| 19:18.29 | atoponce | oh, i never said i could teach better... i'm just grading on the likes of brac. |
| 19:18.43 | atoponce | comparing to brac, i should say |
| 19:19.07 | shadowwire | -chat teach better |
| 19:19.07 | brac | teach better |
| 19:19.14 | shadowwire | craopla |
| 19:19.19 | Supaplex | -chat atoponce |
| 19:19.19 | brac | atoponce is still under googles control. |
| 19:19.26 | Supaplex | HAHA cool |
| 19:19.38 | thaddeusq | atoponce: You'll never teach as well as sjansen unless you memorize rfc3092 |
| 19:19.43 | shadowwire | ~lart all this nonsense |
| 19:19.43 | ibot | puts all this nonsense into a headlock and administers a mighty noogie, rubbing half of all this nonsense's hair of |
| 19:19.56 | atoponce | heh |
| 19:20.02 | atoponce | we just went over that rfc |
| 19:20.06 | Supaplex | so what's 1/2 nonsense and bald? |
| 19:20.15 | atoponce | and ip over avian courier |
| 19:20.42 | thaddeusq | atoponce: really, it took until half way through Monday? sjansen's slipping. |
| 19:21.01 | shadowwire | avian courier. is that someone who ships the avian flu? |
| 19:21.25 | Supaplex | depends on the health of the bird |
| 19:21.35 | shadowwire | -chat i see |
| 19:21.35 | brac | i see differences all right. |
| 19:21.39 | atoponce | print the ip packet, attatch it to a pidgen, send off the bird, etc... |
| 19:21.50 | shadowwire | nice. |
| 19:22.06 | atoponce | rinse. repeat. |
| 19:22.54 | shadowwire | pigeon. |
| 19:23.55 | shadowwire | Anyone ever seen bermingham roller pigeons? |
| 19:24.39 | thaddeusq | hawks like roller pigeons |
| 19:24.41 | shadowwire | ~lart herlo's hawks |
| 19:24.41 | ibot | calls herlo's hawks on the phone ... the lights are on but nobody's home |
| 19:24.48 | levi | I recommend clay pigeons. |
| 19:25.01 | shadowwire | those are nice. |
| 19:25.25 | Supaplex | clay pigeons are tougher to cook |
| 19:25.33 | shadowwire | true. |
| 19:25.36 | thaddeusq | shadowwire: I've seen bermingham roller pigeons. Had a neighbor that raised them when I was a kid. |
| 19:25.53 | shadowwire | pretty cool eh? |
| 19:26.07 | thaddeusq | I used to love watching them. |
| 19:26.32 | shadowwire | my father raises them as his hobbie. |
| 19:26.51 | levi | Supaplex: They shatter nicely, though. |
| 19:26.58 | Supaplex | oh yes they do |
| 19:27.09 | shadowwire | and yes herlo, He has lost quite a few to hawks. |
| 19:27.25 | herlo | hawks are my favorite bird |
| 19:27.39 | herlo | especially the chicken hawk |
| 19:27.41 | shadowwire | any particular type? |
| 19:27.50 | Kemotaha | herlo, it fits you well |
| 19:28.07 | shadowwire | ~chat chicken hawk |
| 19:28.11 | shadowwire | ops |
| 19:28.13 | herlo | Kemotaha: thanks |
| 19:28.21 | herlo | Kemotaha: small bird, big power! |
| 19:28.23 | shadowwire | -chat chicken hawk |
| 19:28.23 | brac | chicken hawk excuse |
| 19:28.34 | levi | herlo: I'm glad to hear that your efforts to get the local user group meetings recorded are bearing fruit. |
| 19:28.44 | herlo | levi: quite a bit actually |
| 19:28.58 | levi | I can't make it to PLUG this semester. :( |
| 19:28.59 | herlo | levi: we want this to grow. I plan to record all meetings by end of 2008 |
| 19:29.07 | shadowwire | so now they have something to eat at the meeting. |
| 19:29.10 | herlo | levi: Jayce^ and I are working on a solution for PLUG |
| 19:29.27 | levi | Nice. I'd really like to hear this javascript presentation. |
| 19:29.35 | thaddeusq | http://www.nbrconline.com/ |
| 19:30.21 | thaddeusq | that's the National Birmingham Roller Pigeon Club - |
| 19:31.26 | Kemotaha | Look it's herlo on the front page |
| 19:31.44 | Kemotaha | he's being hel by a boy with a virginia tech shirt |
| 19:32.32 | herlo | Kemotaha: that's not a chicken hawk! |
| 19:32.44 | Kemotaha | I know |
| 19:33.45 | Kemotaha | herlo, just don't look it up on wikipedia |
| 19:33.54 | herlo | Kemotaha: why? |
| 19:34.07 | shadowwire | yea why? |
| 19:34.08 | Kemotaha | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chickenhawk |
| 19:34.34 | Kemotaha | something I didn't want to learn |
| 19:35.32 | herlo | http://tinyurl.com/39z72q |
| 19:35.43 | herlo | Kemotaha: I didn't know that, but I guess that makes sense |
| 19:35.53 | herlo | Kemotaha: most cartoons are propaganda anyway |
| 19:35.58 | Kemotaha | yeah, it puts a while different spin on it |
| 19:36.00 | herlo | s/propa/propo/g |
| 19:36.03 | ^Migs^ | lol, my wife just got a new kitty |
| 19:36.11 | herlo | nope, right the first time |
| 19:36.34 | herlo | Kemotaha: I still won't think of it that way... |
| 19:37.18 | Kemotaha | that is the one to stick with |
| 19:48.42 | herlo | :) |
| 19:59.15 | elg | ^Migs^: there goes the neighbor hood |
| 20:00.28 | elg | average homework score: 90% |
| 20:00.29 | elg | sickening |
| 20:00.57 | elg | but mostly expected when it's a pure programming assignment. it's easy to verify you've got the thing at least 99% right |
| 20:01.13 | levi | elg: What, you like the average score to be lower? |
| 20:01.29 | elg | When *I* am a torturer%Wteacher I'll make them write up what they learned |
| 20:01.35 | elg | a la the old (dreaded) 312 |
| 20:02.10 | levi | Heh. |
| 20:02.29 | elg | levi: I like things to be discriminant. I have nothing against the whole class earning an A, but if everyone gets 100% on something it's too easy |
| 20:02.43 | levi | Probably true. |
| 20:03.18 | elg | and that's what happened. a few people lost a few points for not following directions, and some didn't complete the full assignment (citing lack of time or whatever - actually they would have been better off turning it in a day or two late but oh well) |
| 20:03.29 | elg | that's the only reason it was as low as 90% |
| 20:04.24 | elg | still, it wasn't a mickey mouse assignment. it's more a case of being simply verifiable |
| 20:04.53 | elg | no doubt some did it in an hour and some struggled for days. I'd like to know that, if I were the teacher |
| 20:05.16 | elg | and I could, with writeups. the one-hour and 3-day students might both still get As, but I'd know whether things are too easy or too hard |
| 20:05.33 | elg | and if someone managed to squeak out some code but didn't really understand, that might show up too |
| 20:06.11 | elg | but hey, I'm not the teech. :) |
| 20:06.58 | elg | i'm all for an average of 65 or 70 and lifting the grade |
| 20:07.38 | *** part/#utah PelaoFeliz (n=PelaoFel@67.108.236.230) |
| 20:07.42 | *** join/#utah PelaoFeliz (n=PelaoFel@67.108.236.230) |
| 20:08.56 | levi | Students tend to not like that, though. They don't get the warm fuzzy 'I know I'm getting an A' feeling. |
| 20:10.06 | elg | true. Or instead of lifting, just lower the bars to compensate. I had a few classes like that at BYU - where the cutoff for A was like 80 or 85 |
| 20:10.30 | elg | you could still get the warm fuzzy 'guaranteed on track for A' feeling (which I loved) |
| 20:10.45 | tensai | physics was that way and it drove me crazy. I had like a 60% but that was a B-. |
| 20:10.45 | elg | but it still instilled total fear into everyone that this must be a "really hard class" |
| 20:10.46 | levi | Yeah. |
| 20:11.26 | tensai | as a student, very frustrating. as a teacher, yeah I might do that. |
| 20:12.17 | levi | ~quote goog |
| 20:12.59 | elg | i read in the paper about the chicago marathon |
| 20:13.13 | elg | something like 50 people hospitalized, at least one dead |
| 20:13.34 | elg | because they were running when the temp was like 88°F and humid |
| 20:13.45 | levi | Yow. |
| 20:14.12 | levi | I watched something on PBS a while ago about a run through Death Valley in the middle of the summer. Now that's insane. |
| 20:14.22 | elg | this just goes to show two things: marathon runners are totally nuts. How do you manage to train for a marathon without learning you shouldn't push yourself into dehydration and heat exhaustion or heat stroke? |
| 20:14.34 | elg | second, people who run here in Las Cruces are as nuts as I thought they were |
| 20:15.03 | levi | Running is just crazy. At least get yourself on a bicycle, people! |
| 20:15.44 | elg | in other news, I "learned" some interesting "facts" over the weekend. |
| 20:15.53 | levi | I wonder what length of bicycle ride would roughly correspond to the effort and training required for a marathon run. |
| 20:16.19 | elg | apparently aerobic exercise, more than anaerobic, makes the body break down more muscle along with other stuff |
| 20:17.10 | levi | I'm not convinced too many exercise specialists really know what they're talking about. |
| 20:17.12 | elg | of course (if you allow enough recovery) you still build up muscle in the long run |
| 20:17.23 | elg | but the people touting that were, naturally, the bodybuilders |
| 20:17.51 | levi | The bodybuilders were touting aerobic exercise? |
| 20:17.51 | elg | they even go so far as to say that you can't lose fat with strictly aerobic exercise. they're as convinced as the people who think that the only way to lose fat is cardio |
| 20:18.06 | elg | most bodybuilders do some (say 15 minutes a day) cardio |
| 20:18.24 | elg | no, touting that aerobic makes you lose muscle |
| 20:18.33 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp02.cs.nmsu.edu) |
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| 20:18.45 | levi | Yeah, but their schtick is usually that your heart gets a better workout with weightlifting, and that it's also the best way to lose weight. |
| 20:18.59 | tensai | for the average Joe Sixpack, I don't think the distinction is important because *any* exercise is more than he is getting now |
| 20:19.23 | elg | levi: yeah, that's the schtick I'm seeing |
| 20:19.55 | levi | Of course, they're right to some degree. |
| 20:19.58 | elg | some bodybuilders are apparently afraid to walk down to the 7/11 in fear of losing some of their muscle |
| 20:20.16 | elg | but yeah I think they're partially right, just like everyone else |
| 20:20.31 | levi | Everyone just takes the few facts they get to extremes. |
| 20:20.39 | elg | it sure seems like balance is in order. interval training with some strength training to supplement seems like a good middle road |
| 20:20.58 | levi | Especially if you don't actually want to be a bodybuilder. |
| 20:21.03 | tensai | levi: I would guess that the bike to running ratio is about 5:1, so about 125 miles on a bike |
| 20:21.21 | elg | if you're trying to maintain a 3% body fat 12" arms sculpted bod, then the fear may even be justified |
| 20:21.34 | elg | if you're trying to be healthy and look like a healthy but normal person, otoh |
| 20:22.20 | levi | Definitely increasing your muscle mass a bit will help you be healthier and lose some of your fat. |
| 20:22.55 | levi | But, for most people, that'll happen naturally just by DOING STUFF besides sitting in a chair all day. |
| 20:23.40 | elg | my "learning" wasn't entirely in vain though. I didn't even know the word catabolic, let alone that the first stage of recovery is very catabolic. I didn't realize skinny marathon runners were not only very lean but have less muscle too, and that if you just want to lose weight getting some reasonable muscle in addition to raising that heart rate might be a good approach |
| 20:24.08 | elg | interesting stuff. though, I planned on doing interval training anyway, so in the end it didn't profit me much. but I do like knowing what's going on behind the scenes. :) |
| 20:25.00 | elg | levi: precisely. do something is much more important than anything else |
| 20:25.53 | levi | Weightlifting is kind of fun, too, especially if you do it with some friends. |
| 20:26.01 | levi | I never made much progress with it, though. |
| 20:26.15 | ^Migs^ | especially telekinetic weightlifting |
| 20:26.18 | elg | i never liked it much. had to do some on my jr high basketball team |
| 20:26.39 | elg | sweaty, noisy, clanky, ugly |
| 20:26.44 | elg | felt alright though |
| 20:27.01 | elg | I'm going to incorporate some isometrics. that looks intriguing |
| 20:27.14 | elg | and no clanking equipment |
| 20:27.43 | elg | i'm fairly anti-equipment. side effect of being a cheapskate I guess. :) |
| 20:27.48 | levi | From what I've heard, some of the best gains you can get are from core strength lifts, like lunges and dead lifting. |
| 20:27.50 | elg | (says the guy who goes to a freakin' pool 3 times a week) |
| 20:28.01 | levi | Yeah, a pool is pretty serious equipment. :) |
| 20:28.41 | ^Migs^ | I'm fairly anti-exercise |
| 20:29.09 | ^Migs^ | I would lose the nice healthy chunks of flab around my midline |
| 20:29.10 | elg | good. kittens can't tolerate it |
| 20:29.29 | ^Migs^ | we tried to take our first cat on walks. It was hilarious. |
| 20:32.00 | levi | http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=1520249&page=0 |
| 20:32.02 | brac | [Marathon vs 100 mile bike ride] |
| 20:32.45 | levi | What I get from that thread is this: Running thrashes your body. Don't do it. ;) |
| 20:32.56 | elg | my sentiments exactly |
| 20:33.08 | dataw0lf | my body is fine and I run six miles a day. |
| 20:33.15 | dataw0lf | wussies. |
| 20:33.28 | elg | i don't have to be a wus. I have bad knees |
| 20:33.50 | elg | so nobody in their right mind will try to talk a 6'4" guy with bad knees into taking up running |
| 20:33.51 | dataw0lf | I have three pins in my right knee. You could say it's 'bad'. |
| 20:34.18 | dataw0lf | I just don't get the same rush from bike riding as I do running *shrug* |
| 20:34.18 | elg | i might, but then I'd have to draw conclusions that you might not like |
| 20:34.49 | dataw0lf | You can draw all the conclusions you want, I'm in fine shape, and the day my doctor says I should stop running, I shall. |
| 20:34.51 | levi | I just don't get the same rush from running that I do from bike riding. Diffrent strokes, I guess. |
| 20:35.44 | elg | i'm sure you're in great shape, and it sounds like your enhanced knees are doing fine |
| 20:37.04 | dataw0lf | I'm just saying that I haven't had any complications from running 6+ miles a day since I was 15. |
| 20:37.41 | dataw0lf | it probably has more to do with running technique than with running in and of itself. |
| 20:37.44 | levi | dataw0lf: I didn't mean 'thrash your body' as in 'cause permanent harm'. |
| 20:38.06 | dataw0lf | levi: Ah. I mistook what you said, then. |
| 20:39.09 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@66.7.122.158) |
| 20:39.20 | levi | The thread was talking about how running a marathon was harder than cycling a 100 miles. |
| 20:40.16 | dataw0lf | levi: I assumed you meant that running is too hard on the body as some people claim. |
| 20:40.38 | levi | And some people brought up how they're pretty similar by some conversion factor, but the running just makes you more exhausted, or something. |
| 20:41.03 | elg | what is the conversion factor based on if not how much exertion is put forth? |
| 20:41.41 | dataw0lf | I think you learn a lot more about body rhythm and and breathing methods from running. |
| 20:41.47 | dataw0lf | -and |
| 20:42.11 | levi | I'm not sure, really. It could be that you put out the same amount of exertion, calorie-wise, but running is just harder on your muscles, joints, etc. |
| 20:42.24 | elg | i think it's hard to beat swimming for a sport with endless room for technical betterment |
| 20:42.35 | ^Migs^ | what about golf? |
| 20:42.46 | elg | golf is definitely the sport for kittens |
| 20:42.53 | levi | I think golf is in a different category of 'sport'. |
| 20:42.53 | ^Migs^ | pffssh |
| 20:42.57 | dataw0lf | elg: Yea, I'd agree. |
| 20:43.00 | ^Migs^ | golf is the ULTIMATE sport |
| 20:43.05 | dataw0lf | Swimming++ |
| 20:43.07 | elg | golf sounds like tons of fun |
| 20:43.08 | dataw0lf | Golf isn't a sport. |
| 20:43.09 | ^Migs^ | it's perfect for all ages |
| 20:43.12 | dataw0lf | Golf is a skill. |
| 20:43.12 | ^Migs^ | anyone can play it |
| 20:43.20 | ^Migs^ | Wrong |
| 20:43.24 | elg | but it's not the same sort of thing as running or swimming or cycling |
| 20:43.25 | dataw0lf | No, I'm not wrong. |
| 20:43.31 | ^Migs^ | Wrong. |
| 20:43.31 | tensai | golf is a game. like chess. |
| 20:43.34 | dataw0lf | A 'sport' is an athletic competition. |
| 20:43.40 | *** join/#utah macnewbol1 (n=mac@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 20:43.40 | dataw0lf | You do not have to be an athlete to play golf. |
| 20:43.42 | elg | tensai++ |
| 20:43.43 | dataw0lf | End of argument. |
| 20:43.53 | ^Migs^ | But it helps |
| 20:44.03 | dataw0lf | No, it doesn't really. |
| 20:44.04 | elg | i doubt it helps as much as perfecting your swing |
| 20:44.05 | ^Migs^ | Just like being an "athlete" helps you run better, swim better, or cycle better |
| 20:44.16 | ^Migs^ | you can do all those without being an athlete |
| 20:44.19 | elg | more like how being a good chess player helps you cycle better |
| 20:44.23 | elg | maybe it does, to a small extent |
| 20:44.28 | dataw0lf | Any game that a overweight 60 year old can win national tournaments at is not a sport. |
| 20:44.33 | ^Migs^ | I don't appreciate this redefining of the word "sport" |
| 20:44.39 | elg | ~dict sport |
| 20:44.40 | dataw0lf | It is not a redefinition. |
| 20:44.46 | ^Migs^ | then wrestling isn't a sport either |
| 20:45.00 | dataw0lf | Wrong again. Wrestlers are athletes. |
| 20:45.10 | ^Migs^ | Agreed. If wrestling is a sport, so is golf. |
| 20:45.24 | ^Migs^ | the two are very similar |
| 20:45.27 | tensai | wrestlers have got to me the baddest athletes around, imho |
| 20:45.47 | dataw0lf | definitely the 'baddest' in an actual fight. |
| 20:45.58 | dataw0lf | But I'd say boxers are generally more athletic. |
| 20:46.07 | ^Migs^ | what about ping pong? Is that a sport too? |
| 20:46.09 | elg | sport: an activity involving /physical exertion/ and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment |
| 20:46.12 | brasto | ~golf |
| 20:46.18 | ^Migs^ | overweight people can play that quite well |
| 20:46.31 | dataw0lf | I've never actually sweat after a ping pong game |
| 20:46.42 | ^Migs^ | golf consists of plenty of physical exertion, especially for an overweight person |
| 20:46.46 | tensai | dataw0lf: that could be. we didn't have boxing in school. |
| 20:47.07 | dataw0lf | tensai: neither did we, it was a club sport. |
| 20:47.20 | ^Migs^ | and I ALWAYS am sweaty after a ripping game of ping pong |
| 20:47.30 | elg | golf is as much like wrestling as it is like baking |
| 20:47.33 | dataw0lf | That's because you need to get in shape. |
| 20:47.33 | PelaoFeliz | I bet your average golfer expends more energy than your average baseball player, though, if the golfer doesn't use a cart |
| 20:47.40 | tensai | ^Migs^: but do you get sweaty opening a bag of cheetos too? |
| 20:47.50 | ^Migs^ | well |
| 20:47.52 | ^Migs^ | not AS sweaty |
| 20:47.55 | elg | PelaoFeliz: good point. baseball only barely qualifies as a sport because people run around the bases |
| 20:48.11 | levi | elg: And take lots of steroids. |
| 20:48.11 | ^Migs^ | yeah, so is baseball a sport? |
| 20:48.24 | elg | baseball is a game |
| 20:48.25 | tensai | baseball is an excuse to chew tobacco |
| 20:48.29 | ^Migs^ | the problem with your definition is the burden of proof is on YOU to define where "physical exertion" actually starts |
| 20:48.40 | elg | says who? |
| 20:48.48 | elg | I say it's on you to show that there is actually any exertion at all |
| 20:48.52 | ^Migs^ | what is the threshold of physical exertion a sport has to include to be considered a sport? |
| 20:48.56 | elg | is mall walking a sport? |
| 20:49.08 | ^Migs^ | if it's competitive mall walking, yes |
| 20:49.14 | elg | I don't know, maybe the aerobic threshold? |
| 20:49.26 | dataw0lf | This conversation is boring. It's just out of shape people arguing with in shape people so they don't feel as bad about themselves. |
| 20:49.34 | dataw0lf | I'm gonna go play some tennis. |
| 20:49.43 | elg | don't forget to wear those tight white shorts |
| 20:49.43 | ^Migs^ | yeah right. We're probably all giant fatties anyway. |
| 20:49.53 | tensai | "Golf, a kind of sport where moving has a much lesser part than dexterity." -wikipedia |
| 20:49.55 | dataw0lf | elg: hey, tennis rocks. |
| 20:49.59 | ^Migs^ | potato chip crumbs tumbling down our shirts |
| 20:50.02 | elg | tennis is fun |
| 20:50.06 | dataw0lf | one of the best workouts ever. |
| 20:50.11 | ^Migs^ | tennis isn't really a sport either |
| 20:50.23 | elg | kittens can't play tennis, so it is a sport |
| 20:50.31 | elg | kittens can mall walk and play golf |
| 20:50.33 | thaddeusq | elg: I'll bet Tiger woods believes he participates in a sport |
| 20:50.34 | elg | so they're not sports |
| 20:50.39 | levi | ^Migs^ isn't really a person, he's an advanced AI programmed to start pointless arguments in #utah |
| 20:50.53 | ^Migs^ | until a kitten competes in the PGA, I don't really think they can play golf competitively |
| 20:51.00 | dataw0lf | levi: I'd argue about that "advanced" part. But yea. |
| 20:51.05 | elg | thaddeusq: if I were tiger woods I'd much prefer to think of myself as participating in a game of skill |
| 20:51.05 | tensai | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamster_racing |
| 20:51.07 | ^Migs^ | it doesn't take an advanced AI to start pointless arguments in here |
| 20:51.11 | elg | than mere athletic prowess |
| 20:51.14 | levi | dataw0lf: Well, he sucked you into the argument, didn't he? ;) |
| 20:51.25 | Jayce^ | still, he's got nothing on old bucky.. |
| 20:51.27 | elg | he probably works out so that he can be fit, which brings some benefit to the game after all |
| 20:51.47 | elg | but his real quality is in skill. he'd like people to recognize that no doubt |
| 20:51.51 | tensai | ~buckybot |
| 20:51.54 | thaddeusq | elg: If you were Tiger Woods, you wouldn't hang out in here and nobody would argue with what you thought golf was. :) |
| 20:51.57 | tensai | ~buckybot elg |
| 20:51.58 | ibot | elg: you're a stupid idiot, and I can tell you that all I want, but if you say anything mean to me, I'll start crying and insulting everything I can, because you're discriminating against me! |
| 20:51.58 | ^Migs^ | http://www.eglobe1.com/index.php/2006/09/30/fried-rats/ |
| 20:51.58 | dataw0lf | levi: That isn't too hard ;-) |
| 20:52.00 | levi | Jayce^: Well, that's the upside of ^Migs^; he's not nearly as annoying and offensive. |
| 20:52.08 | elg | thaddeusq: right on one point anyway |
| 20:52.18 | elg | but I bet tiger gets into more discussions about golf than I ever will :) |
| 20:52.40 | brasto | ibot golf is not a sport, it's a recreational activity that requires no physical exertion. |
| 20:52.41 | ibot | okay, brasto |
| 20:52.43 | dataw0lf | I'd be willing to bet that Tiger Woods makes enough money that he doesn't much care whether you call it a "sport" or a "skill" |
| 20:52.53 | brasto | ~golf |
| 20:52.53 | ibot | somebody said golf was not a sport, it's a recreational activity that requires no physical exertion. |
| 20:52.58 | ^Migs^ | brasto: Except for fat people |
| 20:53.08 | ^Migs^ | then it requires a lot of physical exertion, so your definition fails |
| 20:53.37 | levi | This feels to me a lot like a 'Star Destroyer vs. Enterprise' argument. |
| 20:53.49 | dataw0lf | heh |
| 20:53.53 | thaddeusq | levi: Ford vs. Chevy |
| 20:54.01 | Jayce^ | Ninja vs pirate |
| 20:54.03 | ^Migs^ | the Enterprise really isn't made to defend against a Star Destroyed |
| 20:54.05 | ^Migs^ | *Destroyer |
| 20:54.09 | Tene | levi: The Enterprise can be piloted by a kitten, therefore it's not a sport. |
| 20:54.10 | Jayce^ | ninja, everytime |
| 20:54.19 | brasto | 'tis ibot's definition, so it settles all |
| 20:54.22 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: now you're just being ridiculous. |
| 20:54.25 | ^Migs^ | the ship's computer can pilot the ship |
| 20:54.30 | ^Migs^ | the crew is just supplemental |
| 20:54.30 | sontek | Paintball vs Airsoft |
| 20:54.37 | elg | Jayce^: pirate, every time he can get off a shot first |
| 20:54.45 | *** join/#utah Max253 (n=Max@72-254-27-250.client.stsn.net) |
| 20:54.48 | dataw0lf | elg: Like Han? |
| 20:54.50 | ^Migs^ | no, but ninjas disappear in a puff of smoke before the shot hits |
| 20:55.01 | Jayce^ | sontek, not even close :) actual marks vs fat kids playing with bb's |
| 20:55.02 | elg | dataw0lf: precisely |
| 20:55.08 | dataw0lf | Pirates get all the women, so who really cares who'd win? |
| 20:55.15 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: hehe. |
| 20:55.17 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, which version of the movie? :) |
| 20:55.25 | dataw0lf | The right one. |
| 20:55.28 | Jayce^ | :) |
| 20:55.31 | dataw0lf | ;-) |
| 20:55.32 | ^Migs^ | pirates get WENCHES |
| 20:55.35 | ^Migs^ | there's a difference |
| 20:55.37 | brasto | whether skinny or fat, golf requires little physical exertion compared to anything that is truly a sport |
| 20:55.45 | Max253 | any ladies to chat today? |
| 20:56.00 | ^Migs^ | okay, so at what precise amount of physical exertion does an activity become a sport? |
| 20:56.03 | ^Migs^ | lol |
| 20:56.04 | ^Migs^ | "ladies" |
| 20:56.07 | Tene | A ninja friend of mine just got married. |
| 20:56.13 | ^Migs^ | it's funny when people say that in chat rooms, as if they're being suave |
| 20:56.40 | Jayce^ | and of course, #utah is the home of "ladies" chatting as such |
| 20:56.50 | dataw0lf | well, ^Migs^ IS speaking.... |
| 20:56.57 | thaddeusq | ^Migs^: brasto isn't going to answer that because that's the magic secret. |
| 20:57.01 | Jayce^ | PJIRC? |
| 20:57.06 | ^Migs^ | I thought we were all blonde supermodels |
| 20:57.15 | ^Migs^ | pajama IRC? |
| 20:57.17 | Max253 | well, any chicks today? |
| 20:57.28 | ^Migs^ | Max253: pics or ban |
| 20:57.30 | Jayce^ | ~gender |
| 20:57.30 | ibot | I'm not sure |
| 20:57.42 | dataw0lf | Max253: You'd be better off to /join #debian, that's where the girls are. |
| 20:57.56 | Jayce^ | no, #gnu |
| 20:58.39 | dataw0lf | aw shucks. |
| 20:58.39 | Jayce^ | bah, meeting time |
| 20:58.41 | tensai | Jayce^: it's GNU/#gnu. you're mocking the efforts of hundreds of dedicated GNU/developers |
| 20:59.16 | *** join/#utah Max358 (n=Max@72-254-27-250.client.stsn.net) |
| 20:59.16 | Jayce^ | no mheath chats for max253 |
| 20:59.16 | ^Migs^ | Max just upgraded |
| 20:59.16 | Jayce^ | max appears, harleypig goes away.. |
| 20:59.23 | dataw0lf | suspicious... |
| 20:59.49 | thaddeusq | I think harleypig went looking for chicks |
| 21:00.20 | levi | Man, Facebook is highly annoying. |
| 21:00.32 | dataw0lf | indeed it is. |
| 21:00.36 | elg | i could have guessed that |
| 21:00.42 | dataw0lf | with all the apps they added. |
| 21:00.57 | dataw0lf | "You have been invited to join ducks versus geese!" |
| 21:00.59 | dataw0lf | I mean, sheesh. |
| 21:01.04 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@66.236.68.4.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 21:01.11 | elg | pigs vs rats |
| 21:01.56 | *** join/#utah beandog_ (n=steve@69.27.17.186) |
| 21:02.41 | levi | Yeah, I have exactly one Facebook 'friend', who is some girl I knew back at BYU years ago. She keeps pinging me with these bizarre apps that I have no desire to add to my page, so I have no idea what they're saying. |
| 21:03.04 | ^Migs^ | http://bash.org/?809302 |
| 21:03.05 | brac | [QDB: Quote #809302] |
| 21:04.11 | levi | Apparently at the U, there's a programming class where the big project is programming mods to the Half Life engine. |
| 21:05.07 | dataw0lf | that's... frightening. |
| 21:05.18 | levi | A coworker of mine, who must be in his 50s or so, is in the class as part of his Masters program. He absolutely hates computer games, so he is rather unhappy. |
| 21:05.38 | ^Migs^ | that would be a rather instructive project, I would think |
| 21:05.49 | ^Migs^ | although it depends on what kind of mods, really |
| 21:05.58 | levi | Yeah, introducing you to the real-world hell of software development. |
| 21:06.19 | dataw0lf | and the hell that is the Windows C API, Half-Life SDK, and DirectX |
| 21:07.05 | levi | Plus, dealing with Valve/Steam or whatever it's called. |
| 21:07.13 | elg | i don't find the urge to spend much time with computer games. i find other diversions more fulfilling. But to actively hate playing video games seems difficult |
| 21:07.52 | levi | elg: He's an opinionated guy. Very cool, though. His preferred hobby is flying his glider. |
| 21:07.54 | elg | I mean, running aside, how many people do you know that actively hate something that's fun? |
| 21:08.02 | sontek | I want to make a mod of halflife called 'food fight' |
| 21:08.08 | levi | Well, he doesn't think computer games are fun. |
| 21:08.08 | sontek | guess what you would do in it... |
| 21:08.13 | elg | levi: RC or real thing? |
| 21:08.17 | levi | elg: Real thing. |
| 21:08.26 | elg | that's cool. |
| 21:08.34 | elg | computer games do pale to flying |
| 21:08.54 | elg | but you have to have some kind of mental block for them to not be fun |
| 21:08.55 | dataw0lf | I don't know how people get into video games so much. |
| 21:09.18 | levi | We get lunchtime flying stories and weather commentary when he's got enough free time to go to lunch with him. |
| 21:09.40 | elg | did he build his own? |
| 21:09.48 | ^Migs^ | video game developers don't have as much earning potential as app developers |
| 21:10.09 | sjansen | Bummer. There were a bunch of comments with my name in them, but they scrolled out of my xchat history before I had a chance to read them. |
| 21:10.14 | levi | Nope. He's got enough money to own a pretty nice glider. |
| 21:10.24 | sjansen | I guess everyone that said nice things about me will just have to repeat what they said. |
| 21:10.25 | ^Migs^ | and I'm not sure why being a game dev is such a dream job for so many would-be devs. You're still doing the same things, working in a team environment, have deadlines, grunt work, etc. as you would with an app |
| 21:10.35 | elg | how does he launch it? does he depend on a tow or by cable or... |
| 21:10.44 | elg | -lart sjansen |
| 21:10.52 | levi | elg: Yeah, he's launched by a tow plane. |
| 21:11.03 | elg | that's the one downside to a glider |
| 21:11.08 | levi | elg: He's got some interesting rough weather tow plane stories. |
| 21:11.19 | elg | something like this, in a place where you could roll-start with a hill, would be fun |
| 21:11.19 | elg | http://home.att.net/~m--sandlin/bug.htm |
| 21:11.21 | brac | [Basic Ultralight Glider] |
| 21:11.32 | PelaoFeliz | Migs: yeah, but your testing is a lot more fun |
| 21:11.43 | sontek | ^Migs^: but if you love games, it'd probably be your dream to design and develop one |
| 21:11.46 | levi | Apparently, there are glider clubs and such, so finding a tow plane isn't hard. |
| 21:11.47 | PelaoFeliz | plus, your work research includes playing video games |
| 21:12.01 | levi | The tow plane pilots just hang around the airports all day. |
| 21:12.03 | sontek | ^Migs^: just like I love doing nothing, So I love coding projects that are going to amount to nothing! |
| 21:12.20 | elg | 2007/10/08 13:13:17] <Supaplex> wasn't sjansen just there? |
| 21:12.21 | elg | [2007/10/08 13:14:37] <thaddeusq> sjansen teaching, there's an oxymoron |
| 21:12.21 | elg | [2007/10/08 13:17:45] <Supaplex> sjansen: atoponce says he can teach better? How |
| 21:12.21 | elg | soon does that start? :) (ok, so maybe he implied that by saying you teach "ok") |
| 21:12.21 | elg | [2007/10/08 13:19:38] <thaddeusq> atoponce: You'll never teach as well as sjansen |
| 21:12.21 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:12.23 | elg | [2007/10/08 13:20:42] <thaddeusq> atoponce: really, it took until half way throug |
| 21:12.25 | elg | h Monday? sjansen's slipping. |
| 21:12.27 | elg | [2007/10/08 15:10:09] <sjansen> Bummer. There were a bunch of comments with my na |
| 21:12.29 | elg | me in them, but they scrolled out of my xchat history before I had a chance to re |
| 21:12.31 | elg | ad them. |
| 21:12.35 | elg | [2007/10/08 15:10:24] <sjansen> I guess everyone that said nice things about me w |
| 21:12.37 | elg | ill just have to repeat what they said. |
| 21:12.38 | ^Migs^ | I love games |
| 21:13.00 | ^Migs^ | but I don't need to work for a company to develop one, because unless I'm the game designers, I'd have little or no control over how it looks |
| 21:13.06 | ^Migs^ | better to be an indie developer |
| 21:13.32 | ^Migs^ | and I'm not sure the testing would be that much fun either. Doing the same thing over...and over...and over again, until it's just right |
| 21:13.45 | sontek | ^Migs^: but if you love halo, it'd probably be fun to work for bungie |
| 21:13.50 | sontek | especially now that they split from ms |
| 21:14.05 | sontek | not trying to defend the thoughts, I'd hate to develop a game |
| 21:14.07 | ^Migs^ | I've never played Halo |
| 21:14.22 | ^Migs^ | I've developed indie games off and on. Nothing major, though. That's enjoyable, because there's freedom |
| 21:14.38 | tensai | but developing games is not a sport |
| 21:14.50 | ^Migs^ | unless it's EXTREME game development |
| 21:14.54 | sontek | Me and some coworkers are making a multiplayer snakes game so we can slack off at work |
| 21:14.59 | elg | kittens can do it, so it's not a sport |
| 21:15.05 | ^Migs^ | see, now that's fun game development |
| 21:15.08 | sjansen | ~elgsnack |
| 21:15.13 | sontek | we don't want to sell it, market it, or even give it away, we just nee d something we can slack off at work with |
| 21:15.21 | ^Migs^ | I hope my kitten grows up to be an extreme game developer |
| 21:15.32 | sjansen | ~destroy thaddeusq |
| 21:15.32 | ibot | no |
| 21:15.41 | ^Migs^ | yeah, that does sound like a definite need |
| 21:15.53 | sjansen | ibot: When I tell you to destroy someone, I want to to reign down destruction on their head! |
| 21:15.57 | elg | sontek: irc just isn't doin' it for ya huh? |
| 21:16.08 | levi | Pat Eyler made Programming Reddit's front page. |
| 21:16.11 | goozbach | sjansen: you have to be specific |
| 21:16.14 | ^Migs^ | someone needs to make an IRC client that turns it into a game |
| 21:16.20 | sjansen | I'm talking biblical style justice. Blood, fire, that sort of stuff. Now get to work and destroy thaddeusq! |
| 21:16.21 | sontek | elg: nah, because everytime I yelled "I WIN!" when chatting on IRC they just looked at me weird |
| 21:16.22 | elg | done |
| 21:16.23 | elg | -roulette |
| 21:16.25 | brac | elg: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 21:16.32 | goozbach | remember your scorchedfoo |
| 21:16.35 | sontek | and bzflag isn't good for alt-tabbing |
| 21:16.35 | ^Migs^ | -roulette |
| 21:16.36 | brac | ^Migs^: chamber 2 of 6 => +click+ |
| 21:16.44 | goozbach | ~travolta thaddeusq for sjansen |
| 21:16.44 | ibot | ACTION replaces thaddeusq for sjansen with several craters in a multi-colored display of superior fire power |
| 21:16.44 | sontek | -roulette |
| 21:16.49 | brac | sontek: chamber 3 of 6 => +click+ |
| 21:16.53 | sontek | w00t |
| 21:16.56 | sontek | I WIN! |
| 21:16.59 | ^Migs^ | -roulette |
| 21:16.59 | brac | ^Migs^: chamber 4 of 6 => +click+ |
| 21:17.08 | goozbach | -roulette |
| 21:17.08 | brac | goozbach: chamber 5 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 21:17.11 | sontek | ok, now we don't need the snakes game, i'll just play roulette |
| 21:17.12 | ^Migs^ | hahaha |
| 21:17.16 | sjansen | goozbach: Remember them? I wrote most of scorch based ones. |
| 21:17.17 | sontek | -roulette |
| 21:17.19 | brac | sontek: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 21:17.24 | goozbach | then use them |
| 21:17.33 | sjansen | ~funkybomb goozbach |
| 21:17.34 | ibot | ACTION blows away goozbach in a psychedelic flash |
| 21:17.53 | elg | we should arrange a periodic #utah scorched earth game |
| 21:18.00 | sjansen | ~fireant goozbach |
| 21:18.04 | ^Migs^ | oh man, that would be fun |
| 21:18.11 | ^Migs^ | I used to pwn that game |
| 21:19.18 | sjansen | scorched3d |
| 21:19.35 | elg | naturally. it's enough like the real thing and it runs on all platforms |
| 21:20.59 | sontek | isn't scorched3d like works armageddon? |
| 21:21.06 | sontek | I'm in if it is |
| 21:21.14 | sontek | worms* |
| 21:21.24 | ^Migs^ | similar, yeah |
| 21:22.34 | sontek | then lets get this party started |
| 21:22.45 | sontek | or we could do some tetrinet |
| 21:22.45 | sontek | :D |
| 21:31.07 | elg | dhcp02.cs.nmsu.edu |
| 21:32.26 | levi | ~scorch earth |
| 21:32.27 | elg | sorry, server is flaking out |
| 21:32.30 | elg | anyone else? |
| 21:34.37 | sontek | where fozz when you need him |
| 21:34.56 | sjansen | perl perl perl |
| 21:35.04 | sontek | AHHHH IT BURNS |
| 21:35.15 | sontek | don't use that 4 letter word in here |
| 21:35.17 | sontek | ~language sjansen |
| 21:35.18 | ibot | ACTION grabs sjansen by the ear and washes sjansen's mouth out with soap |
| 21:35.19 | sjansen | "perl perl perl" is the chant to invoke fozz |
| 21:35.24 | sjansen | Kinda like the bat signal. |
| 21:35.32 | sontek | ahh, then its ok |
| 21:37.58 | sontek | where should I take katie for our 6 year anniversary |
| 21:38.27 | tensai | ibot: perl perl perl is <action> winds up fozzmoo |
| 21:38.27 | ibot | ACTION forces ^Migs^ to use perl |
| 21:38.27 | levi | sontek: I'm partial to Martine |
| 21:40.08 | sontek | whats martine? |
| 21:40.21 | levi | It's a restaurant in downtown SLC. |
| 21:40.46 | levi | http://www.dininginutah.com/martine.htm |
| 21:40.47 | brac | [Martine Restaurant in Salt Lake City] |
| 21:42.09 | sontek | Thanks, i'll check it out =) |
| 21:42.22 | levi | My wife loved it, and so did I. |
| 21:42.40 | sontek | what time of food? |
| 21:42.48 | elg | 6pm |
| 21:42.53 | sontek | type! |
| 21:43.08 | sontek | I don't have a browser right now, installing SUSE on katies laptop :P |
| 21:43.39 | dataw0lf | Martine is great |
| 21:43.54 | levi | Well, they specialize in tapas, which are Spanish appetizers, but the menu is pretty varied. You can see a sample menu on the site. |
| 21:44.11 | levi | It's all in gourmet-speak, though. |
| 21:44.27 | dataw0lf | they have a pretty good wine selection, too. |
| 21:45.15 | levi | I need to make up an excuse to eat there again. |
| 21:45.37 | sontek | I have to do something romantic since the first thing I did for her today was buy her a laptop and made her run linux on it :P |
| 21:45.59 | sontek | she was definitly happy about the Laptop part :P |
| 21:46.03 | levi | Yes, something romantic would be a good idea. |
| 21:48.30 | sontek | I'll checkout martine, it sounds good :P |
| 21:48.44 | levi | Martine has excellent food, and the menu is varied enough to provide something delicious for anyone. And it's not terribly expensive for what it is. |
| 21:49.23 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=sshaw@137.65.56.136) |
| 21:51.58 | levi | The tapas are ~$8-$9 each, entrees are $23 with soup or salad, or $26 with a tapa, or $29 with soup or salad and tapa. Desserts are $5 or $7. |
| 21:53.43 | brasto | is there a command to see the max number of loopback devices? |
| 21:55.17 | mrpull | brasto: that is an interesting question... how many do you need? |
| 21:55.50 | brasto | not sure, mrpull . I'm troubleshooting this error: |
| 21:57.24 | brasto | Error running: /path/to/ramdiskfile mount -o loop /path/to/mount/dir |
| 21:58.18 | tensai | I think by default there are only 8 loopback block devices |
| 21:58.27 | mrpull | brasto: i'm sorry i don't have any help to lend there... I was thinking network loopback ineterfaces |
| 21:58.50 | brasto | ah... np mrpull |
| 21:59.43 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-75-0-136-70.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:00.31 | tensai | brasto: see modinfo loop |
| 22:00.34 | tensai | parm: max_loop:Maximum number of loop devices (1-256) (int) |
| 22:00.51 | tensai | you'll have to modprobe loop with max_loop set to a higher number |
| 22:01.25 | tensai | mrpull: I was thinking the same thing until I saw the error |
| 22:01.33 | tensai | on cisco devices you can create multiple loopback interfaces, but I don't think you can on linux |
| 22:02.33 | levi | elg: You might find this interesting: http://www2.nea.org/he/heta04/images/w04p51.pdf |
| 22:02.41 | tensai | yes, max_loop is default to 8 |
| 22:04.10 | brasto | tensai: max_loop:Maximum number of loop devices (int) |
| 22:04.17 | brasto | that's all I have? |
| 22:04.52 | tensai | brasto: not sure what you mean |
| 22:05.05 | tensai | modprobe loop max_loop=256 |
| 22:05.20 | brasto | it didn't return a number of devices when I ran modinfo loop |
| 22:06.10 | tensai | brasto: no, it doesn't show you. that just shows what parameters the module supports. |
| 22:06.22 | brasto | ah, ok |
| 22:06.23 | tensai | brasto: try ls /sys/block/loop* |
| 22:07.19 | tensai | er, ls -d /sys/block/loop* |
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| 22:07.30 | brasto | that's cool - it shows the current number of loops |
| 22:07.39 | brasto | trying second command now |
| 22:08.41 | brasto | ah, don't need to run that one, it'll return the same info but without listing all the subs |
| 22:09.10 | tensai | findlay-w: the opera I'll be in is "Amahl and the Night Visitors" by Gian Carlo Menotti |
| 22:09.13 | tensai | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amahl_and_the_Night_Visitors |
| 22:43.21 | tristanbob | any ideas on how to debug evolution to find out why it fails to open? (it used to work) |
| 22:43.40 | tristanbob | now it starts up a window in the task bar then closes |
| 22:44.05 | tensai | tristanbob: strace generally helps |
| 22:44.15 | tensai | strace -f |
| 22:44.18 | tristanbob | tensai: I'll try it now |
| 22:45.10 | tristanbob | tensai: actually - let me reboot first - I never thought of that (this is linux after all) |
| 22:45.34 | tensai | rebooting only solves the symptoms, not the problem |
| 22:45.43 | tristanbob | hmmmm |
| 22:45.55 | tensai | with windows, running windows *is* the problem therefore rebooting is the only recourse |
| 22:45.56 | tristanbob | I just want my headache to go away doctor! |
| 22:46.08 | tristanbob | who cares about the brain tumor |
| 22:46.36 | tensai | strace should be pretty quick to run |
| 22:46.57 | tensai | it's saved my bacon on many occasions |
| 22:50.25 | maquis | ~6091/1454 |
| 22:50.26 | ibot | 4.189133425034 |
| 22:50.29 | maquis | ibot: thx |
| 22:50.30 | ibot | np, or eeeerrruuusssshhhwwwaaaaaAAAAAAAAA!!!!11 |
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| 22:53.04 | tristanbob | tensai: yay I fixed it |
| 22:53.06 | tristanbob | ;) |
| 22:53.14 | tristanbob | reboot cured my cancer |
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| 23:06.44 | tensai | ~reboot tristanbob |
| 23:06.45 | ibot | ACTION pushes tristanbob's reset button |
| 23:07.39 | tristanbob | ibot: thats not my reset button |
| 23:11.47 | tensai | and she didn't even buy you a drink first |
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| 23:19.09 | goozbach | ~seen elg |
| 23:19.12 | ibot | elg <n=fugalh@dhcp02.cs.nmsu.edu> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 1h 36m 24s ago, saying: '6pm'. |
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