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| 00:44.49 | sontek | ~tackle goozbach |
| 00:44.49 | ibot | ACTION tackles goozbach to the ground. |
| 00:44.55 | sontek | no one likes a quitter! |
| 00:46.24 | klys | anyone here live in provo? |
| 00:46.45 | klys | because I might have a question about mail |
| 00:47.53 | Supaplex | klys: I use to |
| 00:48.12 | klys | did you ever recieve mail from "provo police & fire credit union?" |
| 00:48.30 | Supaplex | nope |
| 00:48.33 | klys | ok |
| 00:49.02 | klys | do you know of any advertisement sent to a bogus name? |
| 00:49.31 | Supaplex | what's the postmark on it? |
| 00:49.40 | klys | stamp |
| 00:49.46 | klys | as of saturday |
| 00:50.59 | Supaplex | study the postmark cancelation. is there a zipcode in it? |
| 00:51.08 | Supaplex | what's inside the letter? |
| 00:51.17 | klys | well, I don't want to open it |
| 00:51.32 | klys | but there was a zipcode, 84601 I think |
| 00:52.57 | klys | just looks like old bank mail |
| 00:53.19 | Supaplex | yea, kinda weird. |
| 00:54.01 | klys | when you get advertisements are they sometimes to an individual with a name nobody recognizes who perhaps is not listed? |
| 00:54.42 | klys | ah well |
| 00:55.22 | klys | I'm not sure how direct mail scams work, but I think the best recommendation I've heard is to send everything back |
| 00:55.58 | klys | so how was your day? |
| 00:59.54 | klys | it's 7:00 and I know I won't be thinking anymore tonight |
| 01:08.57 | Supaplex | i'm good. |
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| 02:14.33 | atoponce | fozzmoo: you're a fedora guy, why would i want to enable 'fedora extras'? |
| 02:14.40 | atoponce | is it non-free stuff? |
| 02:14.43 | fozzmoo | Nope. |
| 02:14.51 | fozzmoo | It's all free stuff. |
| 02:15.03 | fozzmoo | It's lots of stuff that didn't make the distro. |
| 02:15.10 | fozzmoo | It's, by definition, extras. |
| 02:15.31 | atoponce | it didn't make the distro? what does that mean? |
| 02:15.40 | fozzmoo | Didn't make the DVD or CD distribution. |
| 02:15.45 | fozzmoo | Not included with the official distribution. |
| 02:15.52 | fozzmoo | extras is dynamic. People are adding to it all the time. |
| 02:16.01 | atoponce | oh. so it's an online repo |
| 02:16.03 | fozzmoo | Now, keep in mind, extras is a thing of the past as of Fedora 7. |
| 02:16.06 | Tene | Except there is no more extras. |
| 02:16.37 | atoponce | when does 7 releas? |
| 02:16.41 | fozzmoo | It's out. |
| 02:16.45 | fozzmoo | Been out since... May? |
| 02:16.55 | fozzmoo | Fedora 8 will be out in November of October. |
| 02:17.10 | atoponce | oh. so why am i installing 6? |
| 02:17.12 | atoponce | herlo: ??? |
| 02:17.15 | fozzmoo | :) |
| 02:17.18 | fozzmoo | heh heh. |
| 02:17.21 | atoponce | ~blame herlo |
| 02:17.36 | ibot | ACTION blames herlo (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 02:17.53 | atoponce | where's the bot? |
| 02:18.12 | atoponce | ibot: you're slow |
| 02:18.12 | ibot | i'll take that as a complement |
| 02:18.17 | fozzmoo | When you install Fedora 7, you'll get a core set of packages - a subset of everything - and then, when you boot up the system after installation, all the packages available in the online repo will be available via package management tools. |
| 02:18.28 | atoponce | ok |
| 02:18.39 | fozzmoo | Good plan. |
| 02:18.58 | atoponce | then hacks herlo's car for a 'surprise' |
| 02:19.22 | atoponce | fozzmoo: don't get too comfy. i'm only installing to pass the cert tests |
| 02:19.45 | atoponce | is 6 the most similar to rhel5? |
| 02:19.52 | atoponce | that's probably why he gave it to me |
| 02:19.56 | fozzmoo | atoponce: yep. RHEL5 is based on FC6 |
| 02:20.03 | atoponce | ah. then that's it |
| 02:20.11 | fozzmoo | Probably. |
| 02:20.21 | fozzmoo | Of course, CentOS5 is even CLOSER to RHEL5. :) |
| 02:20.46 | fozzmoo | But Herlo, being a Fedora Ambassador, probably wouldn't mention that right away. |
| 02:22.32 | atoponce | would you recommend centos over fedora? |
| 02:22.46 | atoponce | when does rhel 6 release? |
| 02:26.31 | fozzmoo | It'll probably be... at least a year or so from now. |
| 02:26.45 | fozzmoo | atoponce: If you're looking to learn RHEL5, yeah, I'd recommend CentOS5 |
| 02:27.09 | atoponce | isn't centos just redhat renamed, as redhat is oss? |
| 02:27.24 | fozzmoo | It's built from the source RPMS of RHEL5 |
| 02:27.40 | atoponce | so is it forked then? |
| 02:27.40 | fozzmoo | So, yeah, it's the same packages with some relabelling. |
| 02:27.44 | sontek | do you guys know if theres a way in svn to propset svn:ignore any folder anywhere in the repo named 'bin' |
| 02:27.51 | sontek | or should I just use some find magic to do it? |
| 02:27.59 | fozzmoo | It's a fork that stays with the trunk. :) |
| 02:28.19 | atoponce | heh |
| 02:28.22 | fozzmoo | It's the same source RPMs only re-branded. |
| 02:28.29 | fozzmoo | Otherwise, the same. |
| 02:28.46 | fozzmoo | It's what paying customers get... without the support contract and the Red Hat Network subscription. |
| 02:29.06 | atoponce | i see |
| 02:29.35 | atoponce | laterz |
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| 03:04.37 | levi | Good evening. |
| 03:10.42 | Supaplex | yes it is |
| 03:14.18 | herlo | atoponce: you're installing 6 because that's what GL teaches on and its fairly close to RHEL5. CentOS 5 is not sanctioned by RH. |
| 03:21.57 | levi | Grrrrr, another program that works in OS X and not in Windows. |
| 03:22.18 | sontek | apple is the devil |
| 03:25.24 | elg | what's the useful program that tells you how much paging is going on in recent seconds? |
| 03:25.24 | elg | i.e. a good indicator of thrashing |
| 03:25.24 | Tene | vmstat |
| 03:29.55 | elg | beautiful |
| 03:30.03 | levi | sontek: No, mingw just sucks. |
| 03:30.33 | herlo | levi: apple is the best company at looking open but staying closed |
| 03:31.17 | levi | herlo: Whatever. That has nothing to do with my problem. |
| 03:32.02 | levi | I don't particularly have a problem with Apple's closedness. |
| 03:32.47 | elg | I'd just like to say something completely off-topic. There's finally a good torrent client for osx, which also happens to run on windows and linux and even beos |
| 03:33.00 | elg | http://transmission.m0k.org/ |
| 03:33.09 | elg | down with azureus |
| 03:33.50 | levi | elg: Lately, I just run rtorrent via screen on my home server that has torrent ports redirected to it. |
| 03:34.05 | elg | yeah, that's what I do too, well not the port stuff |
| 03:34.15 | elg | my headless server is my media center too |
| 03:34.24 | Supaplex | rtorrent++ |
| 03:34.32 | elg | rtorrent sucks, but it works and it runs in screen |
| 03:34.46 | levi | Linux, of course, agrees with OS X on the execution of this program. |
| 03:34.46 | elg | but sometimes I need to download stuff to my laptop, like ISOs and the like |
| 03:34.46 | Supaplex | sucks would be its user interface |
| 03:35.12 | elg | well, that's why I said "it works" |
| 03:35.21 | elg | correctness is fairly objective |
| 03:35.49 | Supaplex | if I ever have the initive, I'd rehash the interface to be more like elinks |
| 03:35.59 | Supaplex | menu bar, stuff that makes sense. etc. |
| 03:36.00 | levi | Of course, I neglected to install gdb with mingw. |
| 03:36.04 | sontek | levi: minigw runs on windows |
| 03:36.15 | levi | sontek: Yeah, and it SUCKS. |
| 03:36.20 | elg | Supaplex: make it so you can get an ETA without resizing the terminal to 8000x80 |
| 03:36.27 | herlo | ~rtorrent++ |
| 03:36.35 | herlo | ~karma rtorrent |
| 03:36.35 | ibot | rtorrent has karma of 2 |
| 03:36.38 | sontek | levi: :( |
| 03:36.46 | elg | ~lart terminal-based programs with flippant disregard for 80 character width |
| 03:36.46 | ibot | offers terminal-based programs with flippant disregard some herring for 80 character width |
| 03:36.53 | levi | sontek: It runs two of my programs incorrectly for inexplicable reasons. |
| 03:37.42 | levi | Man, I will never write programs I wish to cross-compile to Windows in C again. |
| 03:38.12 | sontek | levi: gcc runs on windows |
| 03:38.13 | elg | can you statically link cygwin dll? |
| 03:38.33 | levi | sontek: What do you think mingw uses as a compiler? |
| 03:39.07 | sontek | levi: well that sucks =) try the intel compiler? |
| 03:39.18 | sontek | levi: or rewrite your app in C# =) |
| 03:39.25 | elg | visual basic |
| 03:39.33 | levi | elg: Hmm, I could try linking against mingw. |
| 03:39.37 | levi | Er, cygwin. |
| 03:39.41 | sontek | ~flog elg |
| 03:39.42 | ibot | ACTION pokes elg with a stick |
| 03:40.07 | levi | I don't think I have mono installed on my laptop anymore. |
| 03:40.22 | levi | Otherwise, C# would have been a reasonable solution. |
| 03:40.40 | elg | port to java? |
| 03:40.46 | sontek | C# > Java |
| 03:40.48 | sontek | :D |
| 03:40.53 | sontek | in my opinion* |
| 03:41.22 | levi | elg: Could be possible, but I don't want to spend the time. |
| 03:41.50 | levi | elg: I'll just demonstrate that it works in person instead of wasting more time with this garbage. |
| 03:42.04 | levi | I already got the okay to do that with one of the other programs. |
| 03:47.52 | elg | speaking of Java, it has the same broken modulo operator that C does |
| 03:47.57 | Supaplex | if you want the socket 7 boards that bad, they're all yours |
| 03:48.01 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:48.08 | elg | -10 = -10 mod 60 |
| 03:48.38 | elg | > puts "-10 = #{-10 % 60} mod 60" |
| 03:48.38 | elg | -10 = 50 mod 60 |
| 03:48.45 | elg | that's what sanity dictates |
| 03:54.23 | Supaplex | klys: bring it all by my place, and test/pickup a replacement. |
| 03:54.46 | klys | hmm, transportation is not easy. where? |
| 03:54.58 | Supaplex | Sunset (near Hill AFB) |
| 03:55.19 | klys | well I'll keep you in mind, appreciate it |
| 03:55.58 | klys | the bad part is the motherboard, everthing else is here. |
| 03:56.49 | Supaplex | I don't know how many work, but you're free to try until you find one you like. I think I have 22 or so |
| 03:59.07 | klys | this one has 4 simm slots, weighing in at 128 MB total, 1 empty dimm slot, 3 pci slots, 4 isa, and the processor was running at 233. there is also an empty cache slot and it uses jumpers and a p-n-p ami bios |
| 03:59.40 | klys | yes I was using it for linux |
| 04:01.41 | klys | also has a nice monitor switchbox |
| 04:02.25 | Supaplex | would you like a pc100 128mb dimm for the simms to? |
| 04:03.08 | Supaplex | my printer can use simms for job spooling. the 1mb'ers are weak. |
| 04:10.04 | klys | probably the only wayy that works for me is if you send it (and I take care of postage) |
| 04:11.38 | Supaplex | ok. I need to double check my printer to see what kinds it'll accept. |
| 04:12.57 | klys | ok, I think these kind of boards (that you might have lying around) take PC66 |
| 04:13.08 | klys | I'm not sure though |
| 04:13.53 | Supaplex | humm oh yeah. I have pc66 dimms to, iirc |
| 04:17.11 | Supaplex | I have some boards that have 8 simms, 0 dimms. |
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| 04:20.00 | klys | anything like that would work as long as it's fast enough (up to 200) and it's AT |
| 04:20.02 | levi | Aha, my problem was actually a bug. |
| 04:20.16 | levi | One of my two programs works on Windows now. |
| 04:21.00 | klys | what program? |
| 04:21.40 | levi | The one I was complaining about earlier. |
| 04:22.09 | levi | I compiled and debugged it with VC++ Express, which made the problem clear. |
| 04:22.57 | Supaplex | ~lart levi's vagueness |
| 04:22.57 | ibot | DoSes levi's vagueness |
| 04:23.25 | levi | If you weren't here for my rant, then the resolution isn't important. |
| 04:23.51 | klys | first mention, 21:20. no program described. |
| 04:24.17 | klys | hey, did you ever try compiling sched.c ? |
| 04:24.23 | levi | No. |
| 04:24.26 | klys | k |
| 04:25.54 | klys | how good did AT ever get... |
| 04:27.18 | klys | woo 450 MHZ $20 at ebay |
| 04:27.55 | levi | I'll give you a busted PIII-450 board if you want to reattach a cap on it. |
| 04:31.15 | levi | Unless I tossed that one. |
| 04:31.45 | levi | I've got an Athlon Tbird of some sort on a motherboard that doesn't POST for some reason. You can have that, too, if you want to try to fix it. |
| 04:32.16 | klys | I can't fix motherboards, too many layers of circuitry. |
| 04:32.50 | nick125 | Fixing caps isn't too hard from what I've heard. |
| 04:33.23 | klys | cap, socket? |
| 04:33.50 | klys | capacitor |
| 04:33.51 | nick125 | A lot of motherboards have the problem where the capacitors leak. |
| 04:33.55 | klys | easy |
| 04:35.16 | klys | just would have to make sure it's AT |
| 04:35.23 | klys | levi: is it AT? |
| 04:35.38 | klys | because if it's ATX I already have one |
| 04:37.26 | levi | It's probably ATX. |
| 04:37.31 | klys | hmm |
| 04:38.09 | klys | my next thing on the ATX system would have to be a 700 MHz P3 |
| 04:38.35 | klys | and trying to find a quiet fan for it |
| 04:38.50 | klys | what's your next upgrade? |
| 04:40.05 | klys | supaplex: what's your next upgrade |
| 04:40.06 | levi | My next upgrade is to find a decent power supply for my dual-Xeon server. |
| 04:40.27 | klys | how many watt |
| 04:40.34 | levi | So I can turn it on without barricading it in a soundproof room. |
| 04:40.59 | levi | A 500W would probably do it, but it's got to have an 8-pin CPU power connector. |
| 04:41.21 | klys | the P4-enabled ATX kind? |
| 04:41.40 | klys | or is this something newer? |
| 04:42.40 | klys | OIC, dual stuff |
| 04:43.35 | levi | Yes, the dual-proc thing. |
| 04:46.31 | levi | It's got a ton of RAM, but I don't remember how many gigs. |
| 04:47.06 | levi | Last time I tried to boot it, I couldn't get the factory bios ROM to work, and it only booted via LinuxBIOS. |
| 04:47.32 | levi | Getting a working ebi for it to boot that way will take a bit of work, which I don't have time for right now. |
| 04:52.45 | klys | best quote I have for you is 67 before shipping. rsvp and I'll drop you a link/part number (I remember spending $90 on mine) |
| 04:54.10 | Supaplex | klys: I just bought an amd x2 socket am2 3800+ system |
| 04:54.17 | klys | I would quote you the total, though they want me to parse their php for them? |
| 04:54.48 | klys | AMD, good choice...is it 32-bit capable? |
| 04:55.02 | Supaplex | yes. 32+64 |
| 04:55.11 | klys | and the DDR speed? |
| 04:55.23 | levi | What AMD CPUs are not 32-bit capable? |
| 04:55.33 | Supaplex | ddr2 5xxx something. I forget. |
| 04:55.40 | klys | swee* |
| 04:56.11 | klys | congrats on making a wise purchase decision (even though I don' know how much you spent) |
| 04:56.12 | Supaplex | Linux li 2.6.18-5-xen-vserver-amd64 #1 SMP Wed Sep 26 06:30:20 UTC 2007 x86_64 |
| 04:57.00 | Supaplex | klys: it'll only cost me labor to fill and mail off 45 rebates (from which I ear profit off of after it's all done) |
| 04:57.08 | Supaplex | s/ear/earn/ |
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| 04:57.37 | Supaplex | I specifically wanted socket am2 for better xen support |
| 04:58.31 | klys | Xen, the virtual machine monitor |
| 04:58.34 | klys | ~xen |
| 04:58.35 | ibot | i heard xen is not my friend |
| 04:58.56 | Supaplex | yes |
| 04:59.26 | nick125 | Xen is....fun |
| 04:59.37 | nick125 | Very fun. |
| 04:59.38 | Supaplex | the one downside (besides no vista refund) is this motherboard can only support up to 2 1gb sticks. :-/ |
| 04:59.53 | Supaplex | but for the price, I need to stop complaining. |
| 05:00.00 | klys | are you really going to run vista as the main OS? |
| 05:00.16 | levi | Unless you're Amazon, apparently: http://www.virtualization.info/2007/10/xen-based-amazon-ec2-suffers-major.html |
| 05:00.19 | brac | [virtualization.info: Xen-based Amazon EC2 suffers major faults] |
| 05:00.19 | Supaplex | it's never booted in my hands on this box. |
| 05:00.37 | klys | okay, maybe you'll run it in vmware? |
| 05:00.39 | vontrapp | how do i test if a file descriptor is still open? |
| 05:00.52 | Supaplex | never will (atleast not natively). I only plan to do some occasional testing for www.goodbye-windows.com |
| 05:01.01 | klys | because if you can afford vmware, you should run win32. |
| 05:01.04 | Supaplex | vontrapp: lsof? |
| 05:01.19 | Supaplex | vmware-server is $0, but xen is GPL |
| 05:01.35 | Supaplex | I have pv drivers for windows to. |
| 05:01.57 | levi | vontrapp: Write to it and see if you get EBADF? |
| 05:02.07 | klys | get a copy of 98SE and the free DDK. Borland compiler and mingw developer studio. run windows a little. |
| 05:02.13 | vontrapp | hmm |
| 05:02.17 | vontrapp | Supaplex: in c-code |
| 05:02.29 | vontrapp | maybe stat? |
| 05:02.30 | Supaplex | I'm so not into windows. sorry :P |
| 05:03.16 | klys | you're plenty enough hijacked by available code packaging you can afford to run C in a cross-platform development context. |
| 05:03.26 | levi | vontrapp: That's like asking, 'how can I tell if this pointer has had free() called on it?' |
| 05:04.16 | klys | also check out masm32 while you're at it. |
| 05:04.19 | vontrapp | well, it's just an int, the os already keeps track of open files |
| 05:04.24 | vontrapp | it really shouldn't be hard |
| 05:04.51 | levi | vontrapp: It's an int, but so is a pointer. Its association with kernel memory structures ends when you close it. |
| 05:04.55 | vontrapp | well, i guess that fd could be reused again |
| 05:05.00 | levi | Indeed. |
| 05:05.22 | vontrapp | but i don't really care about that, i just want to know if it's used at all right now |
| 05:05.24 | levi | (A cause of some hard-to-track bugs in a program of mine) |
| 05:05.42 | levi | You have to keep track of that yourself. |
| 05:07.21 | klys | supaplex: www.allegro.cc |
| 05:07.57 | levi | Just like you have to keep track of whether you've free'd a pointer or not. |
| 05:08.48 | levi | The situation really is very analogous, though it's the allocator that keeps track of pointers rather than the OS. |
| 05:10.20 | levi | If you want to ensure you don't write to it if it is open, you could use fcntl instead of write. |
| 05:10.42 | levi | You'd still get EBADF if it was not open. But there'd be no guarantee that it hadn't been closed and reused. |
| 05:16.46 | decriptor | hey c++ question |
| 05:17.03 | decriptor | if I declare 2 vectors, vector<int> i, j; |
| 05:17.07 | decriptor | and fill i |
| 05:17.13 | decriptor | can I do i= j; |
| 05:18.20 | vontrapp | i assume the stl would have done the proper copying for the create by copy constructor |
| 05:18.46 | vontrapp | question is, is the 'proper thing' really what you want ;) |
| 05:18.46 | decriptor | I'd hope so, but not sure |
| 05:19.06 | decriptor | I want a deep copy, so when I change out fields in the second it doesn't change the first one |
| 05:19.30 | vontrapp | you'll have to look at the implementation details of vector |
| 05:19.46 | vontrapp | or maybe someone else knows off hand (not me) |
| 05:21.32 | decriptor | yeah, I asked in #c++ but nothing |
| 05:22.31 | klys | supaplex: you asleep? |
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| 05:22.56 | vontrapp | maybe try asking "does i = j do a deep copy or shallow?" |
| 05:23.23 | decriptor | vector operator=(const vector& c2); |
| 05:23.30 | decriptor | I wonder if it does a deep copy |
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| 05:43.00 | levi | It should copy all the elements. |
| 05:43.54 | levi | At least according to the SGI STL docs. |
| 05:44.59 | Supaplex | klys: foodies shopping. all done. |
| 05:45.06 | decriptor | looking at the header I think that's what it does |
| 05:51.08 | levi | decriptor: You could run a little experiment. |
| 05:51.31 | Supaplex | all the cool kids experiment. |
| 05:51.58 | decriptor | levi: yup if my code works, cool, if not then its not that way :P |
| 05:53.32 | Supaplex | learn your programming language one test case at a time |
| 06:29.12 | Supaplex | klys: http://armada.daxal.com/~supaplex/ebay/ |
| 06:29.25 | klys | oh, I'm here |
| 06:31.07 | klys | oh, do you have them in a box? |
| 06:31.19 | klys | hey do you have an AT case? |
| 06:31.23 | Supaplex | huh? |
| 06:31.30 | klys | I mean one that's not powered on |
| 06:31.32 | Supaplex | yes, I have a few |
| 06:31.40 | klys | any are empty? |
| 06:31.43 | Supaplex | yup |
| 06:31.47 | klys | I don't need one myself, but |
| 06:32.02 | klys | and you have a pci video card and a monitor right? |
| 06:32.12 | Supaplex | actually, yes |
| 06:32.30 | klys | oh I see you might not have a cpu/heatsink handy |
| 06:32.45 | klys | mine won't power on |
| 06:32.56 | klys | it's definately the motherboard giving me an issue |
| 06:33.19 | klys | it was shorted out near the keyboard bios chip |
| 06:33.22 | Supaplex | well, there's a 486 on of them, but heh. |
| 06:33.34 | Supaplex | on one of* |
| 06:33.35 | klys | cool, all I need is a part number |
| 06:33.46 | klys | it's not socket 5 it's socket 7 right |
| 06:34.00 | Supaplex | i'll look |
| 06:35.16 | klys | mine was a 586F63 |
| 06:39.48 | klys | su-pa-plex sup-a-plex |
| 06:39.54 | Supaplex | 1m |
| 06:39.59 | Supaplex | found it |
| 06:41.59 | Supaplex | a80486dx-33 l3099010 sx419 intel (C) 1989 |
| 06:42.28 | klys | really? is it socket 5 I'm looking for the mobo part |
| 06:44.19 | Supaplex | ami bios aa5566107 486dx isa bios 1992 |
| 06:44.50 | klys | do you have a real socket 7 board, linke |
| 06:44.53 | klys | like |
| 06:45.09 | klys | man that 486 was socket 3 (fits in socket 5 tho) |
| 06:45.46 | Supaplex | I have a lot of socket 7 boards |
| 06:45.57 | klys | ok |
| 06:45.58 | Supaplex | you want part numbers on them to??? |
| 06:46.02 | klys | no just one |
| 06:46.09 | klys | it would be 200 MHz or better |
| 06:46.17 | klys | and have at least 3 pci |
| 06:46.38 | klys | and take either 4 simms up to 128 MB or a DIMM (66 or 100) |
| 06:47.09 | Supaplex | p5mvp-b4 rev (something) |
| 06:47.20 | Supaplex | takes three dimms |
| 06:47.32 | Supaplex | at or atx psu |
| 06:47.56 | klys | my isa cards are: soundblaster, hercules video, ne2000 or smc8000, and ... |
| 06:48.15 | Supaplex | award bios (can't read the sn/pn) has three pci/2 isa |
| 06:48.23 | Supaplex | 1 agp |
| 06:48.44 | Supaplex | oh, 4 pci, but one is shared with an isa |
| 06:49.43 | klys | that would leave me without herc, hmm |
| 06:50.01 | klys | I like the board, I just don't like PCI sound cards for some reason |
| 06:50.21 | klys | ok, 2 ISA is enough then |
| 06:50.44 | klys | becase I could have herc and SB and Gbit nic |
| 06:50.59 | klys | ok, past the initial shock |
| 06:51.08 | klys | we could trade ram |
| 06:51.32 | klys | do you want 4x32 for 128 MB 72-pin ? |
| 06:52.03 | klys | my other system has PC133 so this would be an upgrade |
| 06:52.23 | Supaplex | yeah that's ok |
| 06:52.33 | klys | I mean, PC100 form 72-pin |
| 06:53.15 | klys | ok, do you know sometimes in the store like michael's you can find large rolls of crate paper? |
| 06:53.29 | klys | and then maybe you have a shoebox lid |
| 06:54.07 | klys | maybe you have a box; I don't know |
| 06:54.12 | Supaplex | I already have rolls of the shipping paper (recycled paper stuff) |
| 06:54.26 | klys | do you do a lot of eBay selling? |
| 06:54.30 | Supaplex | and lots of shipping flats |
| 06:54.45 | Supaplex | not a lot, but I scored on shipping supplies |
| 06:55.21 | Supaplex | I cleaned out one of the office max stores I stopped in months ago. they changed their logo/packging on their name brand bubble mailers. everything was too cheap to pass up. |
| 06:55.29 | klys | sorry about being such a beggar, I only have one job now. I applied for another one today |
| 06:55.36 | Supaplex | I filled up on two carts of the stuff :P |
| 06:56.05 | Supaplex | bbiam |
| 06:56.08 | klys | where do you keep it all? |
| 06:59.09 | klys | if I had expensive packing supplies I'd probably cram them in the coat closet |
| 07:00.48 | Supaplex | I have lots of office storage boxes. most of the shipping stuff is hiding in boxes under one of my other desk |
| 07:00.52 | klys | this box I just found was for the first PCI card I bought thinking it would work with asterisk |
| 07:01.13 | klys | one main thing I'll use this new system for is asterisk probably |
| 07:01.54 | klys | it was in the closet next to a motorola cable modem box, full of styrofoam |
| 07:02.35 | Supaplex | ok apple's pulling a stupid here. humm |
| 07:02.50 | klys | before using the styrofoam I'll need an anti-static bag for the memory |
| 07:02.58 | Supaplex | eek. 1am. |
| 07:03.04 | klys | yeah |
| 07:03.25 | klys | I'm sure I could scrounge up something anti-static |
| 07:04.01 | klys | the sticker on the memory says www.gigabuys.com |
| 07:04.03 | Supaplex | I've misplaced my antistatic bags. they're in a box to, but I don't recall where. |
| 07:04.23 | Supaplex | I'm sure I could dig one up for the ram eaisly. I know where my ram is. |
| 07:04.55 | klys | when you put your house together what use did you intend for your other desk? |
| 07:06.05 | Supaplex | I have two laser printers on it. |
| 07:06.16 | Supaplex | a spare server, and other junk |
| 07:06.42 | klys | I mean, what sort of room is it in |
| 07:06.52 | Supaplex | oh, and a 700w psu I haven't even opened yet. It was suppose to be my new psu for a new system until I got the amd instead. |
| 07:07.11 | Supaplex | oh, previous owners turned it into a beauty parlor thing. |
| 07:07.14 | klys | really? maybe levi wants it |
| 07:07.29 | klys | so it's your...office? |
| 07:07.32 | Supaplex | if he wants to pay the right price, sure. |
| 07:07.37 | Supaplex | yup, that's what I've made of it. |
| 07:08.21 | klys | you have an office with two desks no window and one door, one desk with printers facing the other wall. maybe you have a file folder cabinet too |
| 07:08.43 | Supaplex | no :p |
| 07:08.51 | Supaplex | there's two windows |
| 07:08.57 | klys | maybe I'm just thinking of the old mission office |
| 07:08.58 | Supaplex | no file cabinet |
| 07:09.14 | klys | :) |
| 07:09.15 | Supaplex | just a regular home |
| 07:09.36 | Supaplex | there are four desks and one counter in this room |
| 07:09.40 | klys | wow |
| 07:09.52 | klys | which one are you supposed to leave incoming stuff on? |
| 07:10.33 | klys | I think if I had a home office, it would have a desk opening in the wall |
| 07:10.36 | Supaplex | I guess that's the spare office box. |
| 07:11.02 | klys | do you consult there? |
| 07:11.03 | Supaplex | ask JoshH, it's a g33k lair down here. |
| 07:11.10 | klys | hee |
| 07:11.12 | Supaplex | no |
| 07:11.43 | Supaplex | when the power goes out, you have a high chance of going deaf from all the uspes going "BEEEEEP!" at once. |
| 07:11.53 | klys | ok, then you have a fax |
| 07:12.04 | klys | I mean, fax machine |
| 07:12.09 | klys | on one of your printers |
| 07:12.14 | Supaplex | my 12" video iPod does faxes |
| 07:12.19 | klys | and that's where you'd consult |
| 07:12.53 | klys | sounds like a lot of wiring |
| 07:13.34 | Supaplex | don't get lost in my wire jungle. |
| 07:13.39 | klys | oo |
| 07:13.43 | Supaplex | (behind the desk) |
| 07:13.57 | klys | is your flashlight on top of it? |
| 07:14.05 | Supaplex | I weed it out often enough :P |
| 07:14.13 | klys | ;) |
| 07:15.09 | klys | my desktop has a label on top of it: mic spk line, should read `mic line spk' |
| 07:17.36 | Supaplex | drives me bonkers |
| 07:22.53 | Supaplex | ~lart slow sd card adapter |
| 07:22.53 | ibot | slaps slow sd card adapter around with a large trout |
| 07:28.54 | klys | fetchmail configration is a wise way, to say I get email for you |
| 07:30.14 | Supaplex | and Outlook is another way to say "Look OUT!" |
| 07:35.23 | Supaplex | klys: http://armada.daxal.com/~supaplex/ebay/at%20socket7%20motherboards/webpage/ |
| 07:38.00 | klys | 0559 |
| 07:38.21 | klys | is there a part number |
| 07:38.59 | Supaplex | http://armada.daxal.com/~supaplex/ebay/at%20socket7%20motherboards/IMG_0559.JPG (it's 3.9mb) |
| 07:39.43 | klys | I'm sure you can identify it if you'd like |
| 07:39.58 | klys | although it is late |
| 07:40.09 | Sargun | Supaplex, is that ISA? |
| 07:40.22 | klys | yes, those 4 are isa |
| 07:40.33 | Supaplex | amibios 586 1985-95 f847192 |
| 07:40.48 | Supaplex | yes, 4 isa, 4 pci, one is shared |
| 07:40.56 | Supaplex | two dimms to |
| 07:40.56 | klys | f847192 is this the bios or motherboard part |
| 07:41.02 | Supaplex | bios |
| 07:41.10 | klys | the mobo? |
| 07:41.18 | Supaplex | can't find it |
| 07:41.21 | klys | hmm |
| 07:41.34 | Sargun | The RAM slots are weird. |
| 07:41.41 | Sargun | What are those white things? |
| 07:42.07 | klys | best thing to do then is boot it with a pci video card, keep on the reset button, and write the bios string |
| 07:43.10 | Supaplex | I think I'll do that tomorrow |
| 07:43.38 | klys | ok, tomorrow I'm around probably before 10 or after noon |
| 07:43.40 | Supaplex | yay for macro mode. <3 |
| 07:43.58 | Supaplex | good luck with 'before 10' hahaha |
| 07:44.13 | klys | well I have some errands, so |
| 07:44.42 | Supaplex | I have an errand with my pillow. |
| 07:44.46 | Supaplex | nite. :P |
| 07:44.57 | klys | ciao |
| 08:09.07 | Sargun | Should I split up my IPv6 net into /64s? (15 of them |
| 08:11.05 | Sargun | or /80s? |
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| 14:44.36 | elg | -chat ipv6 net |
| 14:44.36 | brac | ipv6 net into /64s? (15 of them are major |
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| 15:08.12 | Supaplex | moin |
| 15:08.42 | elg | niom |
| 15:16.58 | sontek | morn' |
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| 15:17.39 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@bromine.sosstaffing.com) |
| 15:18.41 | sjansen | evenaftermorn |
| 15:24.33 | sjansen | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:26.22 | sjansen | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:26.57 | sjansen | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:27.50 | RyanE | sjansen: unless you're doing it to weed out a difficult / stupid employee... |
| 15:28.06 | RyanE | sjansen: when they don't pass the class, you have 'probable cause'. |
| 15:28.16 | Det3_ | Heh. Much better to buy the employee some reference material and tell him/her to go at it. |
| 15:28.33 | RyanE | Det3_: don't tell that to our GL overlords. |
| 15:28.58 | fozzmoo | Yeah- Don't offend the GL overlords. |
| 15:29.08 | fozzmoo | They've got their conceal and carry permits, after all. |
| 15:29.11 | sjansen | Det3_: Depends. Time is money. |
| 15:29.25 | RyanE | yes, but probable cause is expensive to fabricate. |
| 15:29.37 | sjansen | Most of what I know I taught my self. It was cheap as long as you don't cost time as an expense. |
| 15:29.42 | RyanE | sjansen: nevermind. I didn't realize you were responding to Det3_ |
| 15:30.21 | sjansen | Companies send employees to get training because most people aren't self motivated enough, and even those that are will take longer when self educating. |
| 15:30.40 | fozzmoo | sjansen: Good point. |
| 15:31.06 | RyanE | I've also been at companies where the training was almost time off for good behavior. |
| 15:33.33 | Det3_ | Very true, but that is a double-edged sword. Earlier this year I went to Boston for some training on a certain PowerPC processor - I ended up being an assistant instructor in the class because I knew about as much as the Freescale engineers. |
| 15:33.53 | Det3_ | So it goes both ways. |
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| 16:00.51 | levi | Det3: I signed up to buy a Johnson JT50. Now I just need a guitar... |
| 16:04.47 | Det3 | levi: Ouch. I'd sell you mine if I still owned it. |
| 16:05.32 | Det3 | levi: Too bad Music go Round isn't still here - you could get a decent Ibanez or Jackson for cheap there. All the shredders sold theirs to pick up Gibsons or Parkers for their nu-metal projects. :-) |
| 16:09.18 | levi | Det3: I got it pretty cheap. |
| 16:09.59 | levi | If it turns out I don't like it, I'll sell it in a year and probably turn a profit. |
| 16:10.22 | levi | I played with one a coworker bought, though. |
| 16:13.46 | Det3 | A JT50, or a bigger one? |
| 16:18.45 | *** join/#utah decriptor (i=sshaw@nat/novell/x-78919c93cefd5acd) |
| 16:23.39 | findlay-w | ~onjoin findlay |
| 16:23.47 | elg | -lart findlay-w |
| 16:23.53 | findlay-w | ~onjoin findlay Feduntsetoo! |
| 16:23.53 | ibot | findlay-w: ok |
| 16:24.21 | findlay-w | decriptor: what do you know about providers on iProvo? |
| 16:24.34 | decriptor | not much of them :P |
| 16:24.47 | decriptor | xmission is in the works to get onto iprovo |
| 16:24.50 | findlay-w | the real question is when xmission |
| 16:24.59 | decriptor | jump on their irc channel |
| 16:25.04 | findlay-w | I did |
| 16:25.21 | findlay-w | they say it's up to the Provo bureacucracy |
| 16:25.24 | decriptor | ah |
| 16:25.29 | decriptor | then who knows when |
| 16:25.31 | decriptor | you know what |
| 16:25.39 | findlay-w | could be tomorrow, could be 5 years from now |
| 16:25.39 | decriptor | call and request xmission |
| 16:25.52 | decriptor | I'm sure if enough people call that it might help push it along |
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| 16:27.22 | mrpull | with all the bread talk in here i assume somebody will be amused by this link i saw on boing boing this monring: |
| 16:27.23 | mrpull | http://www.whatonearthcatalog.com/cgi-bin/hazel.cgi?randomizer=1787072585&action=detail&item=AY3282 |
| 16:27.25 | brac | [What on Earth - A Collection Of Fun Wear & Delightful Diversions] |
| 16:27.54 | elg | amused, yes, but it looks disgusting |
| 16:28.02 | elg | i'd never eat a baguette that looks like that. :) |
| 16:28.26 | mrpull | it could double as a captain caveman club too |
| 16:44.22 | sjansen | Det3: True. Sadly, not everyone seems to consider expertise an important skill for an instructor. |
| 16:44.52 | sjansen | At GL, we feel differently. Experience has taught that it's easier to teach a technical person to teach than it is to teach a teacher technical material. |
| 16:45.36 | sjansen | So we look for expertise or an ability to learn very quickly on the job as an important part of our screening process. |
| 16:45.55 | findlay-w | OpenGL |
| 16:46.38 | sjansen | We also pride ourselves on trying to make our training materials useful as reference material too. |
| 16:47.07 | sjansen | Sadly, many other companies feel differently. I've even seen a few that think a print out of the slides with zero content to be acceptable. |
| 16:47.36 | sjansen | Of course, neither our material nor our instructor are perfect, but as we like to put it internally "we suck less". |
| 16:48.02 | mrpull | sjansen: still hiring? seems like you guys are blowing up (in a good way) |
| 16:48.03 | sjansen | Too bad we can't use that as an official motto. :-( |
| 16:49.12 | sjansen | mrpull: Maybe. I think there's still one or two opening. Although I know we already have some strong candidates for at least one position. |
| 16:49.26 | mrpull | how many employees do you have now? |
| 16:51.01 | fungus | Anyone run a Jabber server? What is your opinion? |
| 16:51.39 | findlay-w | mrpull: \pi^2/6 |
| 16:52.25 | elg | fungus: I run a jabber server. My opinion is that oatmeal is gross |
| 16:53.14 | fungus | lol, What is your opinion on jabber servers? |
| 16:53.14 | findlay-w | I don't run jabber servers and I prefer steel cut oats |
| 16:53.14 | sjansen | fungus: Wildfire^wOpenfire is annoying, fat, but easy to setup. |
| 16:53.14 | elg | I think they're great |
| 16:53.20 | fungus | jabberd2, ejabberd, Openfire, etc. |
| 16:53.22 | sjansen | Never could get ejabberd to work on my server. |
| 16:53.30 | elg | I use ejabberd |
| 16:53.31 | sjansen | jabberd2 seems to be mostly abandoned. |
| 16:53.43 | elg | it was quirky to set up but straightforward |
| 16:53.45 | fungus | That is what I kind of thought about jabberd2 |
| 16:53.57 | elg | i even managed to migrate my jabberd users, etc. to it |
| 16:54.08 | fungus | sjansen: what do you use? |
| 16:54.10 | sjansen | mrpull: Give me a moment, I'm still trying to find more toes. |
| 16:54.20 | fozzmoo | we've got Openfire set up at KB. |
| 16:55.15 | fungus | The only complicated thing I plan on doing, is integrating LDAP auth backend. |
| 16:55.24 | sjansen | mrpull: 13, I think. We just hired 1 or 2. I'm not actually sure, haven't met the new guys yet. |
| 16:55.52 | sjansen | fungus: Wildfire cause I don't want to upgrade it. I want to switch to ejabberd, but haven't found the time to fight it again. |
| 16:56.14 | fungus | ahh, ok. I'll check them out then. |
| 16:58.49 | *** join/#utah ScytheBlade1 (n=Death@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 16:59.40 | redbeard2 | sjansen: pirates or ninjas? |
| 16:59.57 | sjansen | ninjas |
| 17:04.46 | findlay-w | piratezen |
| 17:07.49 | Det3 | Forgive me, since I'm new here - WTF is GL? :-) |
| 17:08.07 | Det3 | And what do you guys do? |
| 17:08.13 | findlay-w | www.gurulabs.com/ |
| 17:08.22 | Det3 | Aha. Now all is clear. |
| 17:08.28 | findlay-w | they indoctrinate you in sjansen-mantra |
| 17:09.00 | Det3 | Only one sjansen-mantra, or sjansen-mantras? :-) |
| 17:09.22 | findlay-w | there are many sjansen-mantras in the cannon |
| 17:09.26 | findlay-w | s/n// |
| 17:09.31 | findlay-w | s/n//g |
| 17:09.53 | sjansen | Repeat after me: "su -" "I will allways use the minus sign" "If I ever su without the minus sign crows will eat the flesh of my eyes" "I will always su -" |
| 17:09.56 | sjansen | Good. |
| 17:10.04 | findlay-w | I prefer `su -l` |
| 17:10.26 | sjansen | Now repeat after me: "Stuart first rule of shell variables: Always put shell variable in double quotes unless you have a very good reason not to." |
| 17:10.31 | sjansen | Good. |
| 17:11.07 | Det3 | Awww, now I just login as root and leave the console logged in all the time. That's the easiest for me. ;-) |
| 17:11.34 | sjansen | Repeat after me: "Laziness is good. The tab key is my friend. I will always copy and past file paths when debugging. Laziness is good." |
| 17:12.13 | Det3 | Wow. People need to be taught this? |
| 17:12.15 | Det3 | Wait, nevermind. |
| 17:12.28 | Det3 | Make a system idiot proof, and nature will breed a better idiot. |
| 17:12.36 | Det3 | No wonder I was a good sysadmin back in the day. |
| 17:13.08 | findlay-w | Det3: were you autocratic? |
| 17:13.32 | *** part/#utah brasto (n=brasto@out.lnxi.com) |
| 17:13.33 | Det3 | findlay-w: No. My first ops manuals were from O'Reilly and Simon Travaglia. |
| 17:13.43 | Det3 | I was totalitarian. |
| 17:14.03 | Det3 | ;-) |
| 17:14.06 | Jayce^ | sjansen, how do you past a file path? |
| 17:14.06 | findlay-w | becoming a sysadmin myself has provoked some previously unawakened autocratic tendencies in my nature |
| 17:14.18 | sjansen | ~whack Jayce^ |
| 17:14.19 | ibot | ACTION whacks Jayce^ upside the head. |
| 17:14.24 | findlay-w | heh |
| 17:14.25 | sjansen | ~spellcheck Jayce^ |
| 17:14.36 | sjansen | ~grammarnazi Jayce^ |
| 17:14.44 | sjansen | ~dosomethingreallynastyto Jayce^ |
| 17:15.19 | Det3 | That's what got me into big iron, methinks... having an iron fist and a diamond brain. |
| 17:15.28 | fozzmoo | There's nothing like coming into a pre-deployed network as an administrator... |
| 17:15.33 | Det3 | oh ew. |
| 17:15.39 | Det3 | Especially if it's coax or thicknet. |
| 17:15.49 | fozzmoo | and finding several dozen Linux machines everyone is logged into as root. |
| 17:15.51 | Det3 | However, token ring is doable. |
| 17:15.57 | Det3 | Heheheh. |
| 17:16.13 | Det3 | That's when you grab the hammer drill and open up the floor tiles that expose the quicklime pits. |
| 17:16.33 | sjansen | fozzmoo: Sure there is. The military calls it a cluster f***. |
| 17:16.40 | fozzmoo | sjansen: Yep. |
| 17:16.55 | Jayce^ | fozzmoo, so, describing the new place? |
| 17:17.06 | fozzmoo | Jayce^: uh... a little bit, yeah. |
| 17:17.31 | fozzmoo | Just deployed an LDAP server in the data center for SSO and we've been turning off root logins via SSH |
| 17:17.35 | sjansen | Of course not. KB is the greatest. KB is filled with experts. Send KB all your money and they will solve all your problems. |
| 17:17.37 | sjansen | Probably. |
| 17:18.17 | fozzmoo | Robb wasn't lying when he said KB's focus was at the top of the stack (business apps) and they needed people with expertise closer to the system. |
| 17:18.20 | findlay-w | does KB stand for Fozzmoo's Solutions? |
| 17:18.24 | sjansen | fozzmoo is certainly describing a customer KB is helping to right it's past wrongs. |
| 17:18.40 | fozzmoo | findlay-w: KnowledgeBlue. |
| 17:18.54 | findlay-w | I like Fozzmoo's Solutions better |
| 17:19.39 | fozzmoo | That was Iodynamics: Fozzmoo's poorly^H^H^H^H^Hhardly marketed solutions. |
| 17:20.09 | Jayce^ | programmers aren't marketers (thankfully) |
| 17:20.17 | Jayce^ | had to explain that a lot at astricon.. |
| 17:20.25 | findlay-w | heh |
| 17:20.35 | Jayce^ | "Freeside sounds exactly like what we need, why haven't we heard of it before.." |
| 17:22.18 | findlay-w | because it's made by a bunch of freedom-loving hippy programmers |
| 17:24.15 | Jayce^ | actually, if you ever met ivan... hippy is right |
| 17:27.43 | sontek | or any perl developer for that matter... |
| 17:27.45 | sontek | ;) |
| 17:27.52 | sontek | ~hug Jayce^ |
| 17:27.52 | ibot | ACTION sneaks up on Jayce^ and suddenly hugs Jayce^ tightly |
| 17:28.33 | sjansen | sontek: Don't do that. You don't know where he put that before you touched it. |
| 17:29.27 | elg | tensai: why the weird downloader if it's drm-free? |
| 17:29.42 | sjansen | s/where he put/what he did with/ |
| 17:29.47 | tensai | elg: it's just a download manager |
| 17:30.36 | elg | download managers are programs that escaped from hell |
| 17:30.40 | sontek | fozzmoo: in some cultures, flicking a booger is a sign of respect! (ever seen ace ventura? :P) |
| 17:31.06 | fozzmoo | Can't say I have. Don't know if I respect you anymore, tho. :) |
| 17:31.26 | tensai | elg: I'm sure they some reason for it. it's fairly non-intrusive, as far as download managers go. |
| 17:31.44 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=steve@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 17:31.53 | tensai | they send you a .amz file which has a token in it. your browser just handles .amz files, so it doesn't muck with everything else. |
| 17:32.22 | tensai | and it's just a a download manager, not a music player or store interface or anything silly |
| 17:32.37 | sjansen | Probably: Some creaps keep maxing our bandwidth bulk downloading. Other whiners have crappy browsers and think it's our fault. So we'll just make them use our downloader. |
| 17:32.48 | sjansen | s/creaps/creeps |
| 17:34.04 | elg | probably: management: "Can't we control <random unimportant aspect of downloading>? I want to control it! Control! WAA! |
| 17:34.16 | elg | developer: sheesh, ok, we'll make them use this dumb downloader thing |
| 17:40.09 | tensai | the downloader is only required for album downloads, not for single tracks. so it's gotta be something about multiple files. |
| 17:41.30 | mrpull | if I see "usb 1-1: new high speed USB device using address 5" in dmesg |
| 17:41.44 | mrpull | the disk is detected at USB2.0 right? |
| 17:41.55 | mrpull | the 400 Mbps version... |
| 17:42.00 | tensai | not necessarily |
| 17:42.46 | tensai | there are two classes of devices, high speed like disks and low speed like mice |
| 17:42.51 | mrpull | tensai: i see other usb devices noted as usb full speed |
| 17:43.29 | mrpull | tensai: my recollection is low speed ~ 1mb, full speen 12mb, high speed 400mb |
| 17:43.32 | mrpull | or something like that |
| 17:44.07 | beandog | http://www.linux.org/news/LO2007/teneffects.html |
| 17:44.09 | beandog | hee hee hee |
| 17:44.10 | beandog | that is great |
| 17:45.01 | mrpull | And the number 1 side effect of switching to Linux is: |
| 17:45.01 | mrpull | your problems meeting members of the opposite sex disappear |
| 17:45.05 | mrpull | not likely... |
| 17:45.16 | mrpull | i've been to those LUG meetings |
| 17:45.37 | RyanE | they do disappear, because you're too busy playing in Linux to worry about meeting members of the opposite sex. |
| 17:45.52 | goozbach | fozzmoo: you aware of any CentOS5 munin-node packages? |
| 17:46.02 | mrpull | RyanE: nicely done! |
| 17:48.49 | mrpull | poop. i assumed (incorrectly) that the stock CentOS 4.5 kernel supported NTFS |
| 17:49.01 | tensai | mrpull: hmm, that could be right. I'm not sure the exact terminology. |
| 17:49.42 | mrpull | tensai: i hoped that dmesg used the same terminology, but it is so confusing i figured there was room for error |
| 17:49.55 | elg | tensai: ah, so it's "we don't trust our users to be able to figure out zip files" |
| 17:49.59 | mrpull | this NTFS issue is a bigger hang up right now anyway. |
| 17:50.03 | tensai | elg: would you? |
| 17:50.14 | elg | I'm thinking |
| 17:50.25 | *** join/#utah decriptor (i=sshaw@nat/novell/x-95b8bf013d71efc7) |
| 17:51.14 | elg | no, but I would trust them to figure out zip files as much as figuring out how to download and use a strange downloader thing |
| 17:51.37 | elg | and they could ask their kids or buddies how to handle this crazy zip thing |
| 17:51.46 | tensai | elg: that's a good point |
| 17:51.51 | elg | and maybe some wouldn't call tech support |
| 17:51.55 | elg | though most still would of course |
| 17:52.15 | tensai | mrpull: my mouse says "low speed" and my printer says "high speed". I know it's usb 2.0. |
| 17:52.36 | tensai | I don't think I have any usb 1 devices around |
| 17:54.43 | tensai | mrpull: wikipedia says you were right about low, full and high |
| 17:55.31 | tensai | usb 3.0 will be "super speed" at 4.8gbit |
| 17:56.49 | beandog | supah speed. |
| 18:01.41 | tensai | supah dupah speed |
| 18:03.51 | atoponce | whatever happened to firewire? |
| 18:04.01 | beandog | usb2 is faster I think |
| 18:04.11 | atoponce | will there be a ieee1394c? |
| 18:04.11 | beandog | though I think theres a second revision of firewire in the works |
| 18:04.32 | beandog | Ive never even seen a device that uses firewire |
| 18:04.38 | beandog | but then again, Im sheltered. |
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| 18:06.54 | atoponce | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_device_bandwidths#Computer_buses_.28external.29 says so |
| 18:08.17 | mrpull | i've got a firewire 800 card sitting here |
| 18:08.41 | mrpull | but i'd rather go USB2 and the data slowly than try to install this card in a production server |
| 18:08.44 | klys | just found a 100 Mbps hub on sale $5 |
| 18:09.22 | klys | still in the store |
| 18:09.49 | beandog | whats really annoying is why mobos even have usb1 onboard anymore. |
| 18:10.34 | atoponce | easy |
| 18:10.36 | atoponce | upgrades |
| 18:10.45 | beandog | heh |
| 18:10.50 | beandog | okay, mr money pants. |
| 18:10.51 | beandog | :) |
| 18:11.30 | atoponce | it is annoying though |
| 18:18.14 | goozbach | fozzmoo: nevermind it's in DAG |
| 18:18.27 | elg | beandog: lots of camcorders do |
| 18:18.39 | elg | that's the only thing I've ever physically seen that uses it |
| 18:19.13 | beandog | yah |
| 18:19.28 | beandog | I havent made home movies since I was 12. |
| 18:19.41 | beandog | I've still got a tape of a great one I made with my TMNT action figures. |
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| 18:32.21 | fozzmoo | Lots of hard drive enclosures can be connected via firewire. |
| 18:32.41 | fozzmoo | I've seen several external enclosures that have both firewire and USB |
| 18:32.58 | fozzmoo | Firewire S400 actually delivers data faster than USB 2.0 |
| 18:33.07 | sjansen | Firewire is more common for media. DV Cameras, etc. |
| 18:33.34 | fozzmoo | One of the early Linux projects involving Firewire was an ethernet implementation. |
| 18:33.47 | fozzmoo | Kinda of a cool idea- 400Mbps between two hosts. |
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| 18:51.28 | sjansen | http://hypertree.woot.com.ar/ <-- That pretty circle thing is interactive! |
| 18:51.30 | brac | [The JavaScript Canvas Hyperbolic Tree] |
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| 19:07.42 | mrpull | did #yum update used to mean something different than it does now? |
| 19:11.20 | fozzmoo | mrpull: What do you mean? |
| 19:15.35 | mrpull | fozzmoo: reaching back 3-4 years, it seems like it used to be more like --check-update |
| 19:15.48 | fozzmoo | Hmmm. I don't remember that. |
| 19:15.49 | mrpull | so it followed a more apt style process |
| 19:16.02 | mrpull | yum update && yum upgrade |
| 19:16.03 | fozzmoo | yum has never really worked like yum. |
| 19:16.12 | fozzmoo | I mean, like apt-get |
| 19:16.27 | *** join/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/bucky) |
| 19:16.28 | fozzmoo | But my original statement could be a nice quotable. |
| 19:16.29 | mrpull | i'm talkin' way back... before redhat/fedora adopted it |
| 19:16.53 | fozzmoo | I never used yellow-dog, so I dunno |
| 19:17.05 | fozzmoo | It's always worked the way it works now for as long as I've used it. |
| 19:17.16 | fozzmoo | I was reluctant to use it for a long time because apt-get seemed faster. |
| 19:17.48 | sjansen | apt-get was faster |
| 19:17.55 | fozzmoo | yeah, it was. |
| 19:18.01 | sjansen | And not just because it skipped downloads. |
| 19:18.05 | mrpull | yum was horribly slow back then |
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| 19:18.08 | fozzmoo | yeah. |
| 19:18.17 | sjansen | Unfortunately, apt4rpm was faster because it was uncomplete. |
| 19:18.17 | fozzmoo | yum's come a long way. |
| 19:18.34 | mrpull | now i'm gonna have to check out the old duke lists to see if they made the change or if i'm just dreaming |
| 19:21.13 | mrpull | looks like back as far as 2004 it behaved the same as it does now |
| 19:21.21 | mrpull | maybe i was smoking something |
| 19:21.34 | sontek | everyone should use zypper |
| 19:21.36 | sontek | :D |
| 19:21.51 | mrpull | sontek: tell me about zypper... the other day was the first I'd heard of it |
| 19:21.56 | mrpull | does it come out of Novell? |
| 19:23.48 | sjansen | Everyone should use nsis. |
| 19:24.01 | sontek | mrpull: yeah, its sponsored by novell |
| 19:24.15 | sjansen | nsis.sf.net |
| 19:25.17 | sontek | mrpull: it supports accesing XML RPM metadata repos and the suse Yast2 repos |
| 19:25.37 | sontek | and as of 10.3 GM its actually pretty fast |
| 19:26.05 | mrpull | is there any advantage over yum for redhat users? |
| 19:27.56 | sjansen | You mean there are still people who don't use RHEL/Fedora? |
| 19:28.05 | sjansen | How silly. |
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| 20:16.24 | Det3 | mmmm... MPC8572.... |
| 20:23.48 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@64.0.193.157) |
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| 20:40.29 | ibot | tickles tuple with a rose bush |
| 20:46.52 | levi | Det3: I listened to a JT50, and today my boss got some mega-huge one with 100 presets that weighs a ton. Not sure what model it was. |
| 20:49.23 | Det3 | levi: Might be a the 200, if I'm remembering correctly. |
| 20:55.47 | levi | We fiddled with it a bit before a meeting, but there were too many knobs and displays to figure out WTF was going on with it in 15 minutes, aside from scrolling through a few of the presets. |
| 20:56.41 | Det3 | Heh. First-gen Digitech custom displays. |
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| 21:04.59 | *** join/#utah decriptor (n=sshaw@161.28.252.233) |
| 21:17.04 | levi | Now I need to get me a guitar... ;) |
| 21:17.09 | *** join/#utah mindjuju (n=mindjuju@65-121-75-195.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 21:25.50 | Det3 | Heheheh. That's easy. |
| 21:25.52 | Det3 | Pawn shop? |
| 21:26.02 | Det3 | Hell, if you can score me a JD-800, I'd buy you a guitar levi. |
| 21:26.09 | Det3 | Of equal or greater value. |
| 21:26.10 | *** part/#utah mindjuju (n=mindjuju@65-121-75-195.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 21:26.37 | levi | I'm pretty sure there weren't any JD-800s in the auction. |
| 21:27.39 | mrpull | http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20071002-sony-bmgs-chief-anti-piracy-lawyer-copying-music-you-own-is-stealing.html |
| 21:27.52 | mrpull | Making "a copy" of a purchased song is just "a nice way of saying 'steals just one copy'," she said. |
| 21:27.57 | mrpull | what a goofus |
| 21:29.11 | beandog | Im willing to bet that 95% of record executives either don't own or use a computer. |
| 21:29.33 | beandog | and that they're ugly. |
| 21:29.49 | mrpull | and I bet they all have ipods |
| 21:29.53 | sjansen | and inbred |
| 21:30.01 | mrpull | that have music they didn't buy from apple |
| 21:30.16 | sjansen | It's not stealing when they do it because they work for a music company. |
| 21:30.30 | sjansen | Kinda like having a job means an infinite supply of office supplies. |
| 21:30.49 | mrpull | sjansen: free office supplies is a nice perk |
| 21:31.05 | beandog | In that case, I work in the pirate industry. |
| 21:31.50 | sjansen | mrpull: It doesn't have to end at office supplies. Go ahead and take home any computer that aren't being used. I'm sure your employer won't mind. |
| 21:32.33 | mrpull | i've been taking one of the buildings home one brick at a time |
| 21:32.40 | mrpull | it's working out pretty well |
| 21:32.53 | nick125 | Any opinions between OGG Q8 and FLAC? |
| 21:32.53 | mrpull | i'm going to start on the wiring and plumbing in the winter |
| 21:33.06 | nick125 | I'm thinking of reripping my CDs as either OGG or FLAC |
| 21:33.12 | nick125 | They are currently in 128kbit MP3 |
| 21:33.28 | mrpull | nick125: you'd better check with sony BMG before you start re-stealing all of that music |
| 21:33.52 | sjansen | mrpull: Brilliant! |
| 21:33.55 | nick125 | Sure, I definitely will. What's his phone number? |
| 21:34.16 | mrpull | now there you go nick125. what makes you think "it" is a HE? |
| 21:34.34 | nick125 | mrpull: I'm pretty sure the Sony BMG CEO is a male |
| 21:34.51 | nick125 | Anyways, bbl |
| 21:34.59 | mrpull | nick125: the sony lead council is a woman... but whatever |
| 21:35.16 | mrpull | nick125: don't take my smartassery to seriously |
| 21:35.27 | mrpull | s/to/too/ |
| 21:35.59 | mrpull | woo hoo. my headphones should be here. |
| 21:36.35 | mrpull | booo... nevermind |
| 21:42.26 | Det3 | levi: It's a Roland product. |
| 21:46.55 | levi | mrpull: What kind of headphones? |
| 21:48.15 | Tene | sjansen: *obviously* you need ot be medicated. |
| 22:09.50 | vontrapp | for all the crap i hear about comcast i am certainly impressed so far |
| 22:11.41 | vontrapp | the whole process of getting set up has been really quick and painless as yet |
| 22:11.41 | vontrapp | still have to actually activate, waiting for wifely approval on that, but from 2:30 on the freeway today to 3:30 arriving at home i have everything i need |
| 22:11.41 | vontrapp | very impressive |
| 22:15.09 | *** join/#utah atoponce (n=aaron@ubuntu/member/pdpc.supporter.bronze.atoponce) |
| 22:16.08 | dataw0lf | oh, they're quick to get you on the line |
| 22:16.11 | dataw0lf | Once you're there though... |
| 22:18.02 | vontrapp | dataw0lf: yeah... /me continues with trepidation |
| 22:19.09 | vontrapp | i just have to do it, though |
| 22:19.09 | vontrapp | i just can't handle the crap that is hotsite another week |
| 22:19.10 | vontrapp | i like their attitude on contracts and cancelation fees, though |
| 22:19.32 | vontrapp | "we don't believe in those, we won't ask for your firstborn or lock you in" is what i was told :) |
| 22:20.45 | beandog | that reminds me |
| 22:20.51 | beandog | does anyone have any of the HDTV packages w/Comcast? |
| 22:20.53 | dataw0lf | vontrapp: heh. |
| 22:24.46 | vontrapp | finally webif2 works on my router! |
| 22:24.49 | vontrapp | it's very nice |
| 22:25.08 | beandog | ooh |
| 22:25.11 | beandog | webif2 ftw |
| 22:25.12 | vontrapp | maybe it just took a couple weeks to load up... |
| 22:27.37 | vontrapp | could use a little more ajax on things like "save settings" |
| 22:48.41 | kreg | using the software advisor. i've setup my hardware. how do choose the required filed "Feature Set" ? |
| 22:48.46 | kreg | i don't know what any of them mean |
| 22:49.05 | kreg | i have ethernet and a DS3 ATM card |
| 22:51.35 | tensai | kreg: what are the options? |
| 22:51.52 | kreg | bunches |
| 22:51.56 | kreg | adv |
| 22:51.58 | kreg | ios desktop |
| 22:52.01 | kreg | enterprise stuff |
| 22:52.01 | kreg | etc |
| 22:52.08 | tensai | feature set usually corresponds to what features you need in IOS, such as ipv6, ipsec, etc. |
| 22:53.12 | kreg | ipv4, atm |
| 22:53.28 | *** join/#utah vontrapp_ (n=von@70.102.163.132) |
| 22:53.30 | kreg | it's currently running 12.2 |
| 22:53.40 | kreg | sofware advisor just suggested 11.1 |
| 22:53.45 | kreg | ... so i'm doing somethign wrong |
| 22:53.56 | tensai | ew, don't run 11 |
| 22:54.41 | kreg | heh i know |
| 22:54.47 | kreg | i just don't know what feature set to choose |
| 22:55.01 | tensai | with ethernet and a ds3 atm you should be okay with any of them, I think |
| 22:56.15 | atoponce | how can i check the dma setting of my sata drive? |
| 22:56.21 | tensai | kreg: looks like I'm running is-mz on all of mine. I forget exactly which feature set that is. |
| 22:56.28 | atoponce | hdparm -I /dev/sda1 ? |
| 22:57.29 | tensai | hdparm -d, I think |
| 22:57.36 | sontek | atoponce: I always use -tT |
| 22:57.45 | sontek | but that just tests performance |
| 22:57.54 | dataw0lf | -d gets the DMA setting, yar |
| 22:58.08 | sontek | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:58.12 | sontek | thats all -d gets me ;) |
| 22:58.33 | atoponce | -d gives me blanks |
| 22:58.37 | atoponce | /dev/sda1: |
| 22:58.40 | tensai | hdparm -I /dev/sda |grep DMA |
| 22:58.47 | tensai | atoponce: it's /dev/sda, not /dev/sda1 |
| 22:58.54 | atoponce | ok. same result still |
| 22:59.18 | atoponce | so probably not enabled then? |
| 22:59.22 | tensai | yeah, -d doesn't show me anything either. I haven't had to use hdparm for the last few years it seems. |
| 22:59.40 | tensai | what does hdparm -I /dev/sda |grep DMA show? |
| 22:59.48 | sontek | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:00.05 | tensai | DMA: mdma0 mdma1 mdma2 udma0 udma1 udma2 udma3 udma4 *udma5 |
| 23:00.07 | atoponce | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:00.15 | tensai | udma5 is ATA133, iirc |
| 23:00.47 | atoponce | hmmm. i need to check the spec on my sata drive, but i'm sure it will do better than that |
| 23:01.09 | atoponce | isn't that the point of sata, among other things? |
| 23:01.49 | tensai | nope, udma5 is ata100. udma6 is ata133 |
| 23:02.03 | beandog | theres also sdparm for SATA |
| 23:02.15 | tensai | which is aka SATA/150 |
| 23:02.16 | atoponce | yeah. that's not right. i've got this beefy hardware, and i'm taking advantage of it? |
| 23:02.20 | tensai | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AT_Attachment |
| 23:03.33 | atoponce | hdparm -d1 /dev/sda |
| 23:05.49 | klys_ | sjansen: ping |
| 23:05.58 | atoponce | i guess what i'm trying to troubleshoot is my screensaver |
| 23:06.20 | atoponce | the euphoria screensaver, and most GL screensavers are choppy |
| 23:06.45 | atoponce | given the fact that i have pretty solid hardware, regardless if i'm running a 2d or 3d video driver, it should push it fine |
| 23:07.00 | atoponce | so i'm a little miffed that i'm running ata100 on a sata drive to start |
| 23:07.16 | atoponce | then, is the intel X driver a 3d-capable driver? |
| 23:07.29 | tensai | it does seem a little odd. wikipedia seems to indicate that sata starts at udma6 |
| 23:07.40 | tensai | atoponce: mine is |
| 23:07.49 | atoponce | is what? |
| 23:08.00 | tensai | is what you asked, 3d capable |
| 23:08.04 | atoponce | oh |
| 23:08.05 | tensai | glxinfo | grep direct |
| 23:09.06 | atoponce | flxinfo: command not found |
| 23:09.13 | atoponce | s/flx/glx/ |
| 23:10.24 | atoponce | aptitude install mesa-utils |
| 23:11.44 | atoponce | direct rendering: No |
| 23:12.00 | tensai | then you don't have hardware assisted 3d rendering |
| 23:12.05 | tensai | that's why you're so choppy |
| 23:12.22 | atoponce | ahh. come to think of it, the video is onboard sharing ram |
| 23:12.27 | atoponce | that makes sense |
| 23:12.31 | beandog | ack |
| 23:12.31 | beandog | evil. |
| 23:12.33 | tensai | well, that doesn't necessarily mean it can't |
| 23:12.36 | beandog | atoponce, upgrade your hw :) |
| 23:12.42 | atoponce | it's a lappy |
| 23:12.44 | beandog | and yes |
| 23:12.48 | tensai | I'm using a laptop with an intel chip and I have 3d rendering |
| 23:12.51 | beandog | intel is glx compat, depending on the one |
| 23:12.54 | beandog | most of em |
| 23:12.56 | beandog | i810 or something |
| 23:13.01 | beandog | I think. |
| 23:13.04 | tensai | direct rendering: Yes |
| 23:13.04 | tensai | OpenGL renderer string: Mesa DRI Intel(R) 915GM 20061017 x86/MMX/SSE2 |
| 23:13.12 | atoponce | heh |
| 23:13.20 | atoponce | tensai: how to set the rendering if possible? |
| 23:13.28 | tensai | i810 is a bit old, but yes it could do 3D |
| 23:14.06 | tensai | atoponce: first you'll need a sledge hammer and a pick axe... |
| 23:14.29 | tensai | atoponce: can you pastebin your Xorg.0.log? |
| 23:19.56 | atoponce | tensai: yeah. just a sec |
| 23:21.33 | atoponce | tensai: http://pastebin.ca/724915 |
| 23:23.02 | tensai | stinking ipv6. I need to turn that off |
| 23:23.22 | tensai | either that or get my tunnel broker working |
| 23:24.29 | kreg | well fark, i don't want to choose "feature sets" i just wanna download the norm. |
| 23:24.45 | kreg | i can't get software advisor to suggest antyhing other than 11.1 for my 7206 |
| 23:24.58 | kreg | which is already running 12.2 |
| 23:25.20 | kreg | i even told it i have a ethernet and atm DS3 module |
| 23:27.49 | tensai | atoponce: (WW) intel(0): Not enough video memory. Disabling DRI. |
| 23:28.03 | atoponce | so i just need to give it more ram, eh? |
| 23:29.30 | klys | ~lart tene |
| 23:29.30 | ibot | throws tene's poor little doggy off a cliff |
| 23:29.59 | Tene | ~sinuhe klys |
| 23:30.00 | ibot | ACTION describes all the benefits of GNU*PLUS*Linux to klys |
| 23:30.09 | atoponce | heh |
| 23:30.17 | klys | ok, gnu+linux+??? |
| 23:30.30 | atoponce | it's called ubuntu |
| 23:30.35 | klys | for you |
| 23:30.45 | atoponce | it's called gentoo |
| 23:30.49 | atoponce | it's called slackware |
| 23:30.50 | atoponce | etc |
| 23:31.09 | klys | gnu+linux+dpkg ? seems like I skipped somethong |
| 23:31.28 | atoponce | do you know what thong you skipped? |
| 23:31.38 | klys | something important like X |
| 23:32.30 | atoponce | gnu/linux/X would be sufficient |
| 23:32.40 | klys | for slackware lusers |
| 23:35.19 | beandog | actually, gentoo can can be gentoo/linux, gentoo/bsd or gentoo/osx |
| 23:35.27 | beandog | jerks. |
| 23:35.28 | beandog | :) |
| 23:35.39 | beandog | Im not sure about the last one actually, they may have dropped that port. |
| 23:35.45 | klys | GNU+LAMP+dpkg+X |
| 23:35.57 | dataw0lf | 4D/win 2 |
| 23:36.47 | Supaplex | GENTOO/FREEDOS! |
| 23:36.49 | klys | and on this platform, the killer app is...pygtk |
| 23:40.54 | beandog | and dont forget GeNToo |
| 23:40.58 | beandog | Windows NT port |
| 23:41.24 | beandog | http://www.gentooexperimental.org/nt/ |
| 23:42.03 | Supaplex | oh g0rsh |
| 23:42.09 | klys | does it run pygtk also? |
| 23:42.29 | Supaplex | experimental is an understatement, isn't it? |
| 23:43.13 | beandog | lol the screenshots are great |
| 23:47.23 | klys | supaplex: you get the bios string I was asking you about last night? |
