| 00:05.07 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@mailhub.sosstaffing.com) |
| 00:10.24 | *** join/#utah hatul30 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-44da9d9e35dced6e) |
| 00:15.29 | *** join/#utah Lakshmi_ (n=chatzill@adsl-69-109-126-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 00:17.11 | *** join/#utah Lakshmi__ (n=chatzill@adsl-69-109-125-159.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 00:28.32 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 01:11.42 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 01:16.43 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 01:16.44 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 01:17.32 | elg | hoooooey, my oven is ugly |
| 01:17.45 | elg | well, not too bad. but it ain't a work of art |
| 01:36.41 | *** join/#utah hatul30 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-bf1c670e61f7d55d) |
| 01:45.31 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@66.195.187.177) |
| 01:55.18 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@208.53.47.251) |
| 02:14.23 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 02:14.24 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 03:00.25 | *** join/#utah Lakshmi___ (n=chatzill@adsl-69-109-125-159.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 03:02.36 | *** join/#utah bonez44 (n=aint@c-24-10-147-163.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 03:03.10 | *** join/#utah sargun_s1reen (i=nobody@xbmodder.us) |
| 03:05.59 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 03:06.00 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 03:23.10 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:34.30 | *** join/#utah nick125_lappy (n=nick@atarack/staff/nick125) |
| 03:39.29 | *** join/#utah nick125_1appy (n=nick@69.49.172.213.swcp.com) |
| 03:39.55 | *** join/#utah zerdith (n=zerdith@66-188-62-36.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) |
| 03:59.34 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 04:06.10 | *** join/#utah bonez41 (n=bonez@c-71-195-250-0.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 04:09.55 | ti`ocpi | blargh! |
| 04:10.00 | ti`ocpi | I fail at job-finding-ness |
| 04:10.09 | mheath | I need to find a job too. |
| 04:10.36 | ti`ocpi | how long have you been looking? |
| 04:11.15 | mheath | Only a few weeks, really. Since I got kicked out of the Navy. |
| 04:11.43 | ti`ocpi | ah |
| 04:11.48 | bonez41 | mheath, kicked out? |
| 04:12.01 | mheath | Administratively Seperated. Yes. |
| 04:13.53 | bonez41 | ah.... |
| 04:14.05 | bonez41 | just didn't see eye to eye with the Navy, eh? |
| 04:14.44 | mheath | What? |
| 04:14.58 | mheath | It was for medical reasons. |
| 04:15.45 | mheath | the administrative seperation part just means "We're going to screw you over and avoid classifying this in any way that gives you a chance of getting any medical benefits" |
| 04:16.56 | ti`ocpi | >< |
| 04:19.41 | *** join/#utah cridrferi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 04:28.31 | *** join/#utah WashiChan (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 04:46.44 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 04:53.38 | tensai | -lart elg |
| 04:59.21 | *** join/#utah cridrferi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 05:07.21 | Lakshmi | HI~ |
| 05:07.38 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@208.64.90.18.utahbroadband.com) |
| 05:11.14 | Tene | Hi, Lakshmi! |
| 05:11.59 | Lakshmi | HI tene! |
| 05:12.06 | Lakshmi | Tene: sup? |
| 05:15.36 | findlay | hi Tene Lakshmi !! |
| 05:16.04 | Tene | Hi Findlay! |
| 05:16.50 | Lakshmi | hi findlay ! |
| 05:24.33 | *** join/#utah WashiChan (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 05:40.45 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 05:43.21 | *** join/#utah cridrferi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 08:16.42 | Supaplex | oh my. yesterday went bye bye. |
| 12:00.41 | *** join/#utah redbeard2 (n=Administ@rrcs-71-41-150-146.sw.biz.rr.com) |
| 13:55.17 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 13:55.18 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 14:05.01 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@128.187.180.88) |
| 14:06.39 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230) |
| 14:14.26 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@208.64.90.18.utahbroadband.com) |
| 14:30.07 | herlo | graphyx: ping |
| 14:51.54 | *** join/#utah phinux (n=jamie@151.155.188.155) |
| 15:07.05 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@65.195.229.142) |
| 15:07.09 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@mailhub.sosstaffing.com) |
| 15:10.27 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 15:21.40 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 15:21.41 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 15:31.47 | *** join/#utah thaddeusq (n=thaddeus@66.238.29.117.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 15:32.05 | *** join/#utah bmidgley_ (n=bmidgley@c-24-2-92-215.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 15:36.21 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 15:36.21 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 15:37.44 | elg | i really dismay when I see the attitude that bugs should be reported to a -devel list and that signing up for said list is "a small price to pay for getting your bug fixed" |
| 15:38.06 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@h4607eea0.area7.spcsdns.net) |
| 15:38.08 | fozzmoo | mugshot |
| 15:38.12 | fozzmoo | rocks |
| 15:38.14 | elg | 2 problems: first, you're making the user subservient, which is never ever a good idea even for OSS |
| 15:39.11 | elg | second, if all those people really _did_ what you suggest, you'd have a bunch of people on your -devel mailing list that you don't want there, pitching in with their uninformed opinions and wreaking havoc and being (in your perspective) total morons |
| 15:39.46 | *** join/#utah nick125_1appy (n=nick@69.49.172.213.swcp.com) |
| 15:39.53 | elg | not to mention missing out on bug reports by people who know what they're doing, who invariably belong to so many mailing lists they are strongly averse to signing up for more |
| 15:41.36 | elg | bug trackers can be a real pain, but it's not hard to have a bug moderator that forwards bugs to the list (even if it's just a web page with a captcha) |
| 15:41.51 | elg | or I like the LKML approach, but an open list isn't for everyone |
| 15:52.22 | mheath | are |
| 15:52.36 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp03.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 15:52.37 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 15:52.38 | mheath | oops, miscopied some stray word. Sorry. |
| 15:53.02 | mheath | elg: bug trackers are how Ubuntu did it. |
| 15:53.08 | mheath | Their approach seemed to work |
| 15:53.27 | mheath | But I know I've tried to report legitimate major issues on there and had it take literally months before I got any kind of reply or got the bug level elevated |
| 16:08.30 | elg | a decent bug tracker (hard to find) that people actually pay attention to, is the best approach |
| 16:08.34 | elg | for a large project |
| 16:08.42 | elg | for a small one, just give them your email address :) |
| 16:09.02 | mheath | yeah. |
| 16:09.20 | mheath | Like I was saying though....Ubuntu has a decent bug tracker, and its poorly maintained. |
| 16:09.42 | mheath | I get teh impression that 90% of the 'people that matter' on there just filter by severity |
| 16:09.57 | mheath | And they have VERY few people looking at low severiy stuff and elevating it |
| 16:18.43 | elg | bad bug trackering is worse than none at all |
| 16:19.30 | mheath | yep |
| 16:20.21 | mheath | Wow. My dad came down and started a conversation about the windows release of Safari with me |
| 16:20.39 | mheath | Kept saying how he liked the look and feel alot |
| 16:21.02 | findlay | does /etc/hosts.deny work for forwarded traffic? |
| 16:25.13 | mheath | Depends on how its forwarded. Only works for traffic your own computer can resolve as coming from that address. |
| 16:26.55 | findlay | mheath: so it should work then. Is there some reason it won't work for traffic that's already connected? |
| 16:27.21 | findlay | I'm denying it at the box that does the natting |
| 16:32.01 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@h460736d6.area7.spcsdns.net) |
| 16:36.22 | sjansen | findlay: hosts.deny only works for programs that link libwrap.so |
| 16:37.08 | sjansen | hosts.deny is very limited in capability compared to netfilter/iptables and almost certainly not what you're looking for |
| 16:37.40 | sjansen | for details, read about tcp_wrappers |
| 16:38.26 | findlay | well, I added the hosts in question to the firewall |
| 16:39.10 | findlay | oh, man |
| 16:39.52 | findlay | in order to force a reset of the offending traffic, since all traffic goes through a proxy, I shut down the proxy for a couple of minutes |
| 16:40.50 | findlay | and then I waited for somebody to come and tell me that 'the internet doesn't work'. 'Let's see', say I, and we go to their comupter and with as straight a face as possible I restart the proxy from a putty session |
| 16:41.12 | findlay | I hate being deceptive |
| 16:41.30 | findlay | but it cut out the booty traffic |
| 16:53.05 | sjansen | ~smut findlay |
| 17:01.59 | *** join/#utah fozzmo1 (n=fozz@032-321-716.area1.spcsdns.net) |
| 17:17.35 | *** join/#utah nick125_lappy (n=nick@atarack/staff/nick125) |
| 17:23.51 | *** join/#utah Migs (n=Migs@75-162-151-90.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 17:26.02 | Migs | http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/software/soa/US-ruling-makes-server-RAM-a-document-/0,130061733,339278641,00.htm |
| 17:26.21 | brac | [US ruling makes server RAM a 'document'?: News - Software - ZDNet Australia] |
| 17:26.21 | Migs | A federal judge in Los Angeles last week ruled (PDF) that a computer server's RAM, or random-access memory, is a tangible document that can be stored and must be turned over in a lawsuit. |
| 17:26.22 | Migs | If allowed to stand, the groundbreaking ruling may mean that anyone defending themselves in a civil suit could be required to turn over information in their computer's RAM hardware, which could force companies and individuals to store vast amounts of data, say technology experts. Roaming the Web anonymously was already nearly impossible. This ruling, which brings up serious privacy issues, could make it a lot harder. |
| 17:26.27 | Migs | wtf are they thinking? |
| 17:28.05 | Migs | "Here's, I'll fed ex you my RAM sticks. You'll find what you need." |
| 17:28.07 | Migs | hahaha |
| 17:28.50 | findlay | ha |
| 17:30.33 | Migs | the whole article reeks of technical ignorance |
| 17:33.15 | nick125_lappy | haha |
| 17:35.08 | findlay | hahaha |
| 17:35.16 | findlay | ~hahaha |
| 17:35.17 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, hahaha is http://www.shacknews.com//screens.x/iotd//5/thumbs/bsodirony.jpg Win 98 Increased Dependability...NOT |
| 17:35.21 | brac | [Shacknews - Screenshots] |
| 17:35.23 | findlay | ~hahahaha |
| 17:35.24 | ibot | methinks hahahaha is ahahahah |
| 17:41.35 | nick125_lappy | I hope nobody here is using utopia....if so, you are supporting harming yourselves! |
| 17:41.57 | nick125_lappy | According to qwest, least. |
| 17:42.12 | nick125_lappy | http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/84866 |
| 17:42.13 | brac | [broadband help » News » Qwest: Community-Run Fiber 'Harms Consumers' - Steer clear of those dangerous, faster options, kids...] |
| 17:42.17 | nick125_lappy | brb |
| 17:43.54 | findlay | I'm being HARMED!!1 |
| 17:53.21 | *** join/#utah tristanbob (n=tristan@oalug/member/tristanbob) |
| 18:00.28 | elg | gads. OSS is now GPLed. If it were just "too little too late" it woudln't even be worth mentioning |
| 18:00.43 | elg | but it's not. it's "just die already, stupid steaming pile" |
| 18:01.03 | elg | and there are _still_ irrationals out there that believe against all reason that OSS is better than ALSA |
| 18:02.10 | findlay | elg: but devfs is way better than udev :) |
| 18:15.46 | sjansen | http://www.chowhound.com/topics/360376 |
| 18:16.59 | sjansen | I'm trying not to laugh loudly and disturb my students. The thought of mixing vodka and gelatin in a hotel coffee maker amuses me deeply. |
| 18:17.19 | sjansen | Some of the comments are priceless. |
| 18:21.30 | maquis | ok... stupid question: if there is not an "order by" in a sql query, there is no "first result" or "last result" that can be expected to be constant across queries (even if the data in the table does not change), correct? |
| 18:22.16 | maquis | ie, it's possible for the result to be the same multiple times due to caching, etc., but there is no guarantee that it will continue... |
| 18:24.00 | sjansen | correct |
| 18:24.12 | maquis | sjansen: thx |
| 18:24.36 | findlay | ~sql maquis |
| 18:24.38 | maquis | just wanted to make sure before using that in a fight with another team |
| 18:24.45 | findlay | heh |
| 18:25.08 | sjansen | Sounds likes someone's dealing with paging data in a Web app. |
| 18:25.19 | maquis | sjansen: nah... we're way too far back-end for that |
| 18:31.00 | findlay | I seriously need to learn some style |
| 18:31.10 | findlay | of the cascading variety |
| 18:32.14 | findlay | anybody have recommendations as to where I might start? |
| 18:33.15 | phinux | http://www.w3schools.com/css/ |
| 18:33.16 | brac | [CSS Tutorial] |
| 18:33.22 | phinux | That will cover the basics. |
| 18:33.44 | phinux | After that I found Eric Meyer's CSS books to be useful. |
| 18:34.35 | sjansen | http://alistapart.com/topics/code/css/ |
| 18:37.34 | sjansen | You'll know you've made is past the newbie stage when you find a deep respect and budding love for Zeldman. |
| 18:39.34 | findlay | and then I'll have some style! |
| 18:40.20 | sjansen | Don't count on it. Understanding the mechanics and producing beautiful work are different but related skills. |
| 18:43.14 | findlay | are you saying I'm artless? |
| 18:46.08 | sjansen | http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9024559&pageNumber=10 |
| 18:46.42 | sjansen | findlay: If I wanted to insult you, I'd say you had a tin ear. |
| 18:46.48 | findlay | heh |
| 18:52.16 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@216.31.27.110) |
| 18:52.17 | brac | x-plane linux: http://www.x-plane.com/ |
| 18:54.44 | elg | where would you go to find firewood on a 100° day? |
| 19:01.07 | sjansen | Well... there's the grocery store where they have packaged logs. |
| 19:01.38 | sjansen | Then there's a national park so long as it's already dead, dry and on the ground. |
| 19:01.56 | sjansen | Or there's your neighbor's wood pile at 3am as long as you don't get caught. |
| 19:02.01 | sjansen | Take your pick. |
| 19:02.46 | dataw0lf | national parks are the best |
| 19:02.56 | dataw0lf | you're helping the forest service by grabbing dead logs |
| 19:05.25 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=jamie@151.155.188.155) |
| 19:05.58 | sjansen | Just don't make a habit of weekly trips or they'll probably want you to get some sort of permit or something. |
| 19:08.15 | sjansen | http://consumerist.com/consumer/backend/dell-demands-takedown-of-our-22-confessions-of-a-former-dell-sales-manager-269127.php |
| 19:08.27 | maquis | ok... in screen i want to reorder the windows -- ie, the one that is currently 3, i want to set as 2 |
| 19:08.32 | maquis | is that even possible? |
| 19:08.41 | maquis | i'm not seeing it in the manpage |
| 19:10.25 | findlay | ask goozbach |
| 19:11.14 | maquis | goozbach: ping! |
| 19:12.22 | elg | no prepackaged logs right now |
| 19:14.11 | maquis | ooh! |
| 19:14.17 | maquis | :number xx |
| 19:14.29 | findlay | get some old logs from /var/log. Ha ha |
| 19:17.20 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 19:48.38 | *** join/#utah phinux (n=jamie@151.155.188.155) |
| 20:24.05 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 20:50.09 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@66.195.187.177) |
| 20:56.08 | findlay | thanks maquis |
| 20:56.21 | findlay | (must learn stuff everyday) |
| 20:58.51 | Tene | WTF don't send passwords to me over smtp! |
| 20:59.00 | Tene | ~lart people who send passwords over email |
| 20:59.00 | ibot | DoSes people who send passwords over email |
| 20:59.04 | findlay | haha |
| 20:59.07 | Tene | ~botsnack |
| 20:59.07 | ibot | Tene: aw, gee |
| 20:59.21 | findlay | can't email use ssl? |
| 20:59.42 | beandog | thats just for authentication |
| 20:59.58 | beandog | I send all my passwords over AIM |
| 21:00.00 | tensai | Tene: we've had a few customer email us their CC# before |
| 21:00.06 | beandog | It's AOL ... I'm sure it's secure. |
| 21:00.35 | Tene | Who stores plaintext passwords instead of hashes anyway? |
| 21:00.39 | Tene | That's... really lame. |
| 21:00.49 | beandog | most everyone |
| 21:00.55 | tensai | smtp can deliver over ssl |
| 21:01.00 | Tene | eww. I didn't want to know that, beandog. |
| 21:01.09 | Tene | ibot: erase my memory |
| 21:01.11 | tensai | my server will deliver via ssl if it's available |
| 21:01.15 | findlay | Tene: what do you think about it (SSL+SMTP)? |
| 21:01.35 | findlay | s/Tene/tensai/ |
| 21:01.58 | Tene | findlay: not enough experience with it to give an informed opinion, but I do know that it's not.... oh, you're not talking to me. jerk. leading me on like that. Who do you think you are?! |
| 21:02.05 | tensai | findlay: it works well, but you're not guaranteed that your message will use ssl for the whole trip |
| 21:02.29 | findlay | Tene: I'm ... Amazing Man(R)!! |
| 21:02.38 | beandog | email needs to be reinvented anyway |
| 21:02.38 | Tene | Oh, okay then. |
| 21:02.40 | Tene | That's fine. |
| 21:02.47 | findlay | tensai: that's not fun |
| 21:03.15 | tensai | fyi the plug mail server will deliver mail to you via ssl if your server advertises it |
| 21:03.37 | beandog | my crap, network solutions sure waters stuff down. |
| 21:03.41 | tensai | no wait, that's the wrong log message |
| 21:04.22 | tensai | the asterisk list is delivered via ssl though |
| 22:13.28 | Supaplex | ahh a secret superpower |
| 22:36.44 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=jamie@151.155.188.155) |
| 22:51.37 | *** part/#utah raventh1 (n=raven@68.142.142.101) |
| 23:05.34 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 23:13.21 | *** join/#utah cridrferi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 23:24.01 | *** join/#utah WashiChan (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 23:47.25 | *** join/#utah cridrferi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
| 23:50.48 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=Chelle@67.182.192.235) |
