| 00:24.44 | *** join/#utah graphyx (n=graphyx@205.208.245.105) |
| 00:27.47 | Sargun | harleypig, poke |
| 00:46.03 | graphyx | http://www.nwanews.com/adg/Editorial/187608/ |
| 00:46.05 | brac | [NWAnews.com :: Northwest Arkansas' News Source] |
| 00:47.05 | graphyx | brought to you by the people of Arjansas |
| 00:47.14 | graphyx | Arkansas |
| 01:16.22 | *** join/#utah tuxd00d (n=tuxinato@128.187.169.195) |
| 01:36.33 | graphyx | anyone good with vb? |
| 01:37.51 | *** join/#utah zerdith (n=zerdith@66-188-62-36.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) |
| 01:47.47 | harleypig | Sargun: I'm baaaaack |
| 01:48.17 | harleypig | graphyx: *Can* anyone be good with vb? |
| 01:48.59 | graphyx | Well I was defining good as knows more than me and some of the basics. |
| 01:49.02 | graphyx | which isn't hard. |
| 01:49.07 | harleypig | heh |
| 01:49.17 | elg | i read through the melissa virus |
| 01:49.38 | Tene | graphyx: I know a couple of people that have experience with it. Why? |
| 01:50.07 | graphyx | Well I am working on a pen test and it seemed that they had don't a site indexer on the raw files of the system. |
| 01:50.28 | graphyx | including globals.vx |
| 01:50.29 | graphyx | .vb I mean |
| 01:50.52 | graphyx | I though it I could get the connect string by guessing it one character at a time that would be a pretty serious offense. |
| 01:50.55 | Sargun | harleypig, me too! |
| 01:51.10 | graphyx | But it doesn't seem that they had it indexed. |
| 01:51.21 | Sargun | harleypig, Poke. |
| 02:06.52 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=chelle@143-106.dynamicpool.suu.edu) |
| 02:13.03 | elg | -lart sjan |
| 02:14.54 | harleypig | Sargun: Hi! |
| 02:15.08 | harleypig | The joys of family life at night again. |
| 02:15.22 | harleypig | I've been readjusting to the hectic time at night my family has. |
| 02:15.42 | Sargun | ? |
| 02:15.45 | Sargun | oh |
| 02:15.46 | Sargun | ok |
| 02:16.00 | Sargun | So, we finally meet |
| 02:16.04 | harleypig | again. |
| 02:16.06 | harleypig | :> |
| 02:16.16 | Sargun | What are you trying to do? |
| 02:16.17 | harleypig | Do you know anything about tv tuners in linux? |
| 02:20.28 | Sargun | Yeah, sure. |
| 02:21.09 | harleypig | I've got a built-in tv tuner that works fine in winblows but I can't get to work under linux. So, I know the cable is working just fine and the hardware is good. |
| 02:21.41 | harleypig | lspci says Philips Semiconductors SAA7133/SAA7135 Video Broadcast Decoder (rev d1) |
| 02:21.57 | harleypig | But in winblows it's an AverTV 303 something. |
| 02:22.05 | harleypig | Got it written down here somewhere. |
| 02:22.39 | harleypig | The closest I can find in the CARDLIST is 57 -> Avermedia AVerTV GO 007 FM [1461:f31f] |
| 02:23.01 | harleypig | I've tried insmod with tuner=0-73 and haven't gotten it to work. |
| 02:23.04 | harleypig | Any pointers? |
| 02:24.48 | graphyx | &2a940231 |
| 02:24.51 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 02:24.51 | graphyx | that's a good one. |
| 02:25.06 | harleypig | another one is FFFF0FFF |
| 02:25.13 | harleypig | or is it FFFFFFF0 ? |
| 02:25.18 | harleypig | I don't remember. |
| 02:25.50 | harleypig | Probably the first one. |
| 02:26.26 | *** join/#utah nick125_lappy (n=nick@atarack/staff/nick125) |
| 02:31.18 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 02:51.54 | tensai | what's the name of that online electronics store that I can't remember the name of? |
| 02:52.02 | Tene | newegg? |
| 02:52.57 | tensai | no, that's the one I did think of. there's another one. |
| 02:53.01 | tensai | it's on the tip of my tongue |
| 02:53.14 | ScytheBlade1 | tigerdirect? |
| 02:53.19 | Sargun | harleypig, Address me by my name, otherwise, I don't see it. |
| 02:53.25 | tensai | ~ScytheBlade1++ |
| 02:53.43 | tensai | I was thinking "dragon something". I was close. |
| 02:53.46 | Sargun | uh, go to lspPost the full lspci |
| 02:53.46 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 02:53.48 | Sargun | lspci -vv |
| 02:54.04 | Sargun | Uh, forgot about backspace |
| 02:54.57 | ScytheBlade1 | ~karma ScytheBlade1 |
| 02:54.57 | ibot | scytheblade1 has karma of 2 |
| 02:56.36 | tensai | people forget that for ibot to assign karma you have to speak directly to her |
| 02:58.08 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 02:58.48 | harleypig | Sargun: ah. sorry. Did you see what I wrote before? |
| 02:59.04 | elg | ~harleypig∑∑ |
| 02:59.25 | harleypig | What the heck is harleypig sigma sigma ? |
| 03:02.07 | Sargun | yeah! |
| 03:02.08 | Sargun | ok |
| 03:02.32 | elg | it's more than a ++ |
| 03:02.33 | Sargun | harleypig, Can you post lspci -vv of the device |
| 03:03.33 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:10.01 | harleypig | How do I list just that one device? |
| 03:10.38 | Sargun | you copy & paste |
| 03:10.42 | ScytheBlade1 | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:10.49 | Sargun | or ScytheBlade1 is right |
| 03:10.56 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:10.56 | ScytheBlade1 | ^^ |
| 03:11.00 | Sargun | :-) |
| 03:11.25 | harleypig | is the vendor and the device the first numbers in the basic lspci listing? |
| 03:11.37 | harleypig | Like 00:09.0 Mulimedia ... |
| 03:11.41 | ScytheBlade1 | Hm, no |
| 03:12.00 | ScytheBlade1 | Where did that other option go |
| 03:12.10 | ScytheBlade1 | lspci -n |
| 03:12.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Then match it up |
| 03:13.05 | harleypig | 00:09.0 Multimedia controller: Philips Semiconductors SAA7133/SAA7135 Video Broadcast Decoder (rev d1) |
| 03:13.05 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.06 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.06 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.06 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.06 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.08 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.10 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.12 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.14 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:13.17 | harleypig | sargun ... there you go. |
| 03:13.23 | harleypig | thanks ScytheBlade1 |
| 03:15.12 | Sargun | What's wrong with the driver |
| 03:16.07 | harleypig | I found a patch on the linuxtv mailing list for my card (I think) but I don't quite have the confidence to try and patch the kernel yet. |
| 03:16.14 | harleypig | Nothing that I can tell. |
| 03:16.20 | harleypig | modprobe seems to load it fine |
| 03:16.38 | harleypig | The closest card I can find is one digit off |
| 03:16.48 | harleypig | ummm ... |
| 03:17.37 | harleypig | It's not in that text, but in the CARDLIST.saa7134 file, card 57 is listed with 505 instead of 503. |
| 03:18.27 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:18.56 | Sargun | you have a copy of that patch? |
| 03:19.04 | harleypig | http://marc.info/?l=linux-video&m=116604948326596&w=2 |
| 03:19.06 | brac | ['[PATCH] Avermedia AVerTV Studio 503 support' - MARC] |
| 03:19.54 | harleypig | But even with the tuner information from that patch and the card from the 505 entry *or* card 0 I get no signal when running tvtime. |
| 03:20.33 | harleypig | I'm *fairly* certain udev is creating the correct devices ( /dev/v4l/video#) |
| 03:21.01 | harleypig | Usually 0, but when I'm rmmod and modprobing a lot the number changes sometimes. |
| 03:22.49 | Sargun | patch it |
| 03:23.47 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:24.53 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=Jake@166.195.200.105) |
| 03:28.42 | mrpull | elg & co: what sort of processor is required? |
| 03:30.25 | harleypig | Sargun: I was afraid of that ... that patch isn't against the kernel I have installed ... I've been needing to update my kernel, but I have to fix things before I can do that. |
| 03:30.31 | harleypig | bleah |
| 03:31.49 | harleypig | Uh ... my son just asked me a forehead smacking question. |
| 03:31.53 | ScytheBlade1 | harleypig, try it anyways. Unless that driver in specific changed a fair bit, or that patch is incredibly extensive.. |
| 03:32.14 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:32.14 | ScytheBlade1 | The worst that happens is you reboot and it doesn't work :) |
| 03:32.24 | harleypig | I've been looking at the utilities output and gathering data that way. I never looked at the front of the cd. |
| 03:32.34 | harleypig | ScytheBlade1: Yeah ... this is my only machine. :> |
| 03:32.44 | ScytheBlade1 | So add *another* kernel option to it. :) |
| 03:32.55 | ScytheBlade1 | I have three different versions on my laptop, lol |
| 03:33.12 | harleypig | Yeah ... I'm learning how to do that safely. I'm just gun shy about it. |
| 03:33.20 | ScytheBlade1 | grub or lilo? |
| 03:33.28 | harleypig | grub |
| 03:33.35 | ScytheBlade1 | And is this a hand-rolled kernel or distro provided? |
| 03:33.37 | harleypig | It's a lot easier than lilo |
| 03:33.44 | levi_home | Anyone here used tortoisesvn in Windows? |
| 03:33.48 | harleypig | err ... a little of both ... I'm using genkernel |
| 03:33.52 | ScytheBlade1 | levi_home, I do |
| 03:34.13 | ScytheBlade1 | harleypig, haha. Sorry, I can't really help you there. I use gentoo also, but roll it by hand. |
| 03:34.26 | ScytheBlade1 | No idea how it installs the kernel and other requirements. |
| 03:34.31 | Sargun | harleypig, compile it as a module |
| 03:34.45 | harleypig | Yeah, I've been trying to do that with the latest kernel and I can't get it to boot. |
| 03:34.46 | levi_home | ScytheBlade1: How does one use it? I'm trying to walk someone through it. |
| 03:35.04 | ScytheBlade1 | levi_home, it's a shell extension. Right-click the background, SVN --> Checkout. |
| 03:35.18 | ScytheBlade1 | levi_home, right-click a modified folder/file -- SVN --> Update |
| 03:35.26 | ScytheBlade1 | All very self explanatory |
| 03:35.41 | harleypig | This may all be moot anyway ... the utilities are all pointing to AVerTV 503 ... but the cd label says AVerTV 303P |
| 03:35.54 | harleypig | wierd. |
| 03:36.07 | harleypig | And that cd has the software that's working in winblows. |
| 03:40.26 | harleypig | and there's even less info on the web on that version |
| 03:41.55 | *** join/#utah jNb3k (n=jNb3k@c-24-10-178-17.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 03:42.28 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 03:53.52 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 04:00.17 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 04:06.12 | *** join/#utah tuxd00d (n=tuxinato@128.187.206.181) |
| 04:06.35 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 04:09.38 | tensai | encryptz: ping |
| 04:09.45 | encryptz | tensai: pong |
| 04:10.04 | tensai | encryptz: so I see this blog entry about a centon device. what exactly is it? |
| 04:10.40 | encryptz | centon electronics... my most recent nightmare |
| 04:11.01 | encryptz | basically, i purchased ram from them for my wife's ibook, and submitted the rebate form |
| 04:11.14 | encryptz | then, i got a notice, saying that the rebate was no good |
| 04:11.39 | encryptz | so, looking over my records, i thought that i was, so i wrote a nasty blog entry, which is now down, about them |
| 04:11.58 | encryptz | well, they contacted my directly, we worked out the issue, and i ended up getting the rebate in the mail |
| 04:12.25 | encryptz | come to find out, i was in the wrong posting initially about them, as it was compusa who screwed up giving me the rebate a day early |
| 04:13.03 | encryptz | so, that's about it |
| 04:13.04 | encryptz | :) |
| 04:13.26 | encryptz | so, the post on my blog is an apology i made in good faith |
| 04:13.29 | tensai | encryptz: ah, ok. just wondered what it was you bought and how well it actually worked. |
| 04:13.53 | encryptz | the ram is fine. no issues with that... at least not yet... :) |
| 04:14.11 | tensai | I'm looking at an mp3 player from them |
| 04:14.19 | tensai | since my creative went belly up |
| 04:15.03 | encryptz | i don't know anything about their product quality, good or bad |
| 04:28.01 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 04:39.35 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 04:45.48 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 04:52.09 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:08.37 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:13.57 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:14.31 | *** join/#utah ti`ocpi (n=chelle@143-106.dynamicpool.suu.edu) |
| 05:20.20 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:29.32 | Tene | So, I have tickets for the first concert at the old tabernacle after it opens again. |
| 05:29.42 | Tene | Four tickets for Thursday and four tickets for Friday. |
| 05:30.08 | Tene | They're performing a new requiem composed by Mac Wilburg and a requiem by Mozart. |
| 05:30.18 | Tene | Anyone interested? |
| 05:32.43 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:34.30 | Sargun | Tene, Bring me along! |
| 05:36.25 | ScytheBlade1 | I think you're a little far away. |
| 05:37.00 | Tene | Also, I consider Sargun to be more of an irrational troll than a person. |
| 05:37.42 | Sargun | :-( |
| 05:38.00 | Sargun | Tene, Why would you believe such? |
| 05:39.18 | ScytheBlade1 | ~karma Sargun |
| 05:39.19 | ibot | sargun has karma of 1 |
| 05:39.27 | ScytheBlade1 | Huh. I was hoping for negative. |
| 05:39.27 | ScytheBlade1 | ;) |
| 05:41.06 | Sargun | ScytheBlade1, findlay gave me a ++ |
| 05:41.06 | Sargun | No one took the time to downgrade it |
| 05:41.06 | tensai | Tene: a year ago I would have agreed. he seems to have grown up quite a bit. |
| 05:41.06 | tensai | migs is making a fine replacement |
| 05:41.06 | Tene | ~sargun-- |
| 05:41.09 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:41.53 | Sargun | :-( |
| 05:42.14 | Sargun | tensai, Isn't migs a grown man? |
| 05:42.23 | Sargun | Who seems to have some utahnian values |
| 05:42.32 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 05:42.47 | ScytheBlade1 | He's a grown, married man with kids, a house, and a job. |
| 05:42.54 | tensai | Sargun: it's hard to tell sometimes |
| 05:42.58 | ScytheBlade1 | Doesn't make him any less... well... ;) |
| 05:43.21 | ScytheBlade1 | It could be worse |
| 05:43.23 | ScytheBlade1 | He could link 4chan |
| 05:44.23 | Sargun | Haha |
| 05:44.45 | ScytheBlade1 | It's only funny because you know I'm right |
| 05:46.22 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 05:46.35 | ScytheBlade1 | afk sleep |
| 05:56.45 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:03.07 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:08.24 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:15.50 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:23.35 | *** join/#utah Robdor (n=rob@75-162-174-244.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 06:27.17 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:33.41 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:36.58 | *** join/#utah tuxd00d (n=tuxinato@128.187.169.195) |
| 06:40.02 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:45.25 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:53.48 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 07:10.55 | *** join/#utah hatul30 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-c79fe684ca063d03) |
| 07:14.21 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 07:20.47 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 07:37.15 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 07:43.39 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 07:58.07 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 08:03.29 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 08:18.01 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 08:33.34 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 08:49.13 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 08:55.34 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 09:01.58 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 09:09.20 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 09:21.49 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 09:27.36 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166-70-238-250.ip.xmission.com) |
| 09:33.36 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 09:39.35 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 09:50.10 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@160.7.237.70) |
| 09:51.00 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 10:05.34 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 10:15.59 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 10:26.17 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 10:35.14 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@160.7.237.70) |
| 10:45.54 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 10:52.15 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:03.42 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:08.57 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:15.18 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:22.45 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:31.42 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@160.7.237.70) |
| 11:40.17 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:45.36 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 11:58.05 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 12:02.49 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@160.7.237.70) |
| 12:03.26 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 12:19.57 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 12:27.02 | *** join/#utah graphyx (n=graphyx@205.208.245.105) |
| 12:36.30 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 12:41.48 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 12:57.19 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 13:03.04 | atoponce | brailsmt_: connection problems? |
| 13:03.24 | atoponce | ~onjoin -harleypig |
| 13:03.25 | ibot | atoponce: ok |
| 13:11.50 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 13:20.12 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 13:20.51 | *** join/#utah ^Migs^ (n=migs@205.122.50.69) |
| 13:26.36 | *** join/#utah brailsmt1 (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 13:34.54 | ^Migs^ | http://www.physorg.com/news96567089.html |
| 13:35.03 | ^Migs^ | I don't know why governments keep pouring all this money into dumb voting machines |
| 13:37.01 | ^Migs^ | it's a very dumb approach. What they need to do rather than build more and more electronic voting machines, which STILL requires citizens go and stand in line for possibly hours at a time, which is effectively no better to them than just paper voting, is give them options. Integrate phone voting, mail-in voting, Internet voting, manual voting in a building, etc. into one system. |
| 13:37.08 | ^Migs^ | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:45.10 | ^Migs^ | Any issues of improper counts could be resolved by just letting users log in to a system and see who they voted for, get a real-time count of all votes, etc. Simple verification like that. |
| 13:47.23 | ^Migs^ | Of course, this'll never happen, because it's too obvious and sensible. |
| 13:48.14 | ^Migs^ | instead, we'll just pump the taxpayers' money into corporations to produce pointless machines for us. Of course, voters will STILL have to go to a separate building, and STILL having to wait hours in line, and may or may not be able to vote for who they want (which was never a problem with paper ballots), but LOOK! WE HAVE TOUCHSCREENS NOW! |
| 13:48.46 | elg | it'll never happen |
| 13:49.10 | elg | people are way too paranoid, and the gold standard of windows will never instill any hope of a secure online voting system in a single person on the planet |
| 13:50.18 | ^Migs^ | I suppose even if people could check their own votes online, they'd still be paranoid, you're right. |
| 13:50.32 | ^Migs^ | although, why would they trust that any less than paper ballots? |
| 13:50.57 | ^Migs^ | you actually have people manually counting the votes then. |
| 13:51.50 | elg | in their eyes, you can't hack into people |
| 13:51.52 | ^Migs^ | voters shouldn't be trusted to know what's secure |
| 13:52.02 | elg | although social engineering is easier than cracking |
| 13:52.49 | elg | just about anything would be more secure than the diebold junk, but some electronic voting works well. what we have in NM does - you fill out your ballot with a special pen, kind of like a scantron but with less noise |
| 13:52.56 | elg | then you feed it to a machine |
| 13:53.02 | elg | the original ballots are kept for auditing |
| 13:53.42 | elg | i think that's the very best approach. you need a verified paper trail, and nothing online or by phone will give you that |
| 13:53.48 | ^Migs^ | other countries have a better chance of implementing a secure online votign system, since the don't have the problem of 50 states doing whatever the heck they want |
| 13:53.55 | ^Migs^ | s/votign/voting/ |
| 13:54.30 | ^Migs^ | how is a paper trail any better than being able to verify a digitized vote? |
| 13:54.36 | ^Migs^ | not everyone has access to the paper trail |
| 13:54.44 | ^Migs^ | how can i trust those in charge of the paper trail? |
| 13:55.05 | elg | because it needs to be auditable |
| 13:55.32 | ^Migs^ | how is that not auditable? |
| 13:55.40 | elg | you may have an unshaking faith in digital data, but the fact is digital data is quite fragile, and if someone does crack in and change it there's no trace of what the data used to be |
| 13:55.46 | ^Migs^ | if my vote is wrong, there's a phone number there or an email address, and I can call and complain |
| 13:56.28 | ^Migs^ | I don't have unshaking faith. Which is WHY I would require that I can access my vote at ANY time. |
| 13:56.38 | elg | audits happen by external people. a group goes through the paper and their count had better match up with what the computer says |
| 13:56.52 | elg | ^Migs^: it doesn't matter what the system tells you you voted |
| 13:57.05 | elg | a cracker could easily have it tell people exactly what they want to hear |
| 13:57.15 | elg | and still give different results to the people who announce the results |
| 13:58.05 | ^Migs^ | I fail to see how that's any worse than not having a clue what's going on with my vote |
| 13:58.15 | elg | you might as well call up $evil_politician and say "Hi, I'd like to place a vote for your opponent, will you make sure that gets registered?" |
| 13:58.27 | ^Migs^ | trusting some people I don't know and have never met and don't know if I can trust to properly count my vote |
| 13:58.32 | elg | ^Migs^: it's no worse. but it's worse than paper |
| 13:59.02 | elg | ^Migs^: your mistrust in humanity and your infallible trust in computers are misplaced |
| 13:59.02 | ^Migs^ | I don't agree |
| 13:59.28 | ^Migs^ | I don't have infallible trust in computers, but I trust their computational power MORE than I trust the computational power of humans |
| 13:59.46 | elg | computational power is not the issue |
| 14:00.06 | elg | if the humans are off by a few dozen, it doesn't matter. if it's that close someone will call for a recount |
| 14:00.06 | ^Migs^ | computational efficiency then |
| 14:00.16 | elg | sure, computers will count more accurately and faster |
| 14:00.19 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=olsonl@mailhub.sosstaffing.com) |
| 14:00.20 | elg | that's not the issue |
| 14:00.44 | elg | it's got to be transparent, have a paper trail that can be independently audited by humans |
| 14:01.04 | elg | and secure |
| 14:01.07 | ^Migs^ | then why not just print out the results? |
| 14:01.32 | elg | if they're printed at the voting site and a copy is given to the person and given to the precinct, then that's fine |
| 14:01.35 | ^Migs^ | well, I suppose the issue there could be that the vote is intercepted before the printing |
| 14:01.44 | elg | right |
| 14:01.51 | elg | you want the paper trail verified by the voter |
| 14:02.19 | ^Migs^ | but I still believe a truly effective voting system is in providing people with OPTIONS, which means they may not always be on-site |
| 14:02.30 | elg | effective perhaps |
| 14:02.33 | elg | but not secure enough |
| 14:02.40 | ^Migs^ | Oregon, e.g., has a vote-by-mail-only system |
| 14:02.49 | elg | where secure encompasses auditability, etc. for simplicity |
| 14:02.51 | ^Migs^ | how do they know their votes are properly received and counted? |
| 14:03.09 | elg | they don't. but they do know that if they're received they can be recounted by an independent auditing body |
| 14:03.22 | elg | with most computer voting you know neither |
| 14:03.48 | elg | i believe voting should be computer-assisted. it just has to be auditable and secure |
| 14:04.13 | ^Migs^ | why shouldn't ALL citizens be able to audit the votes? |
| 14:04.15 | elg | maybe "you're voting online which means you don't get to verify the paper trail - if that's ok by you continue" |
| 14:04.31 | elg | ^Migs^: it's this funny thing called anonynimity |
| 14:04.39 | ^Migs^ | I think that's overrated |
| 14:04.48 | ^Migs^ | some countries make all votes public |
| 14:05.03 | elg | so you don't trust random people to count your vote, but you'll happily give them how you voted |
| 14:05.30 | ^Migs^ | how about a unique ID instead of a name? |
| 14:05.36 | ^Migs^ | that would give some semblance of anonymity |
| 14:05.56 | elg | just a façade |
| 14:06.34 | elg | it's a moot point anyway. the public can't audit the votes even if they could see online exactly who voted what |
| 14:06.36 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@70.5.231.20) |
| 14:07.10 | elg | unless A) they can verify each individual vote with the individual that voted, or B) you have some magic way where everyone in the US has access to the paper ballots |
| 14:07.26 | ^Migs^ | what if there were completely independent methods of auditing your OWN vote, before they are actually fed into the universal system? |
| 14:07.38 | elg | by A) I don't mean the individual that voted can check his vote - we have already said that can be spoofed |
| 14:08.03 | elg | so all you know then is that it was good before it got into the big system |
| 14:08.12 | elg | who's to say your vote was counted the way you wanted? |
| 14:08.44 | ^Migs^ | have a massive breakdown, so I could hand-count each and every vote if I wanted to |
| 14:09.07 | ^Migs^ | but it would only identify MY vote by name, but not anyone else's |
| 14:09.21 | elg | so what good would that do you, unless you happen to get a kick out of OCD behavior? |
| 14:09.30 | ^Migs^ | the point is that it's THERE |
| 14:09.36 | elg | SO? |
| 14:09.40 | elg | what GOOD does it do? |
| 14:09.47 | elg | none whatsoever. you know absolutely nothing |
| 14:10.17 | elg | take the old paper system |
| 14:10.46 | elg | if you call up 1800checkmyvote and say "hi, I'd like to verify that I voted for James Doohan", "Yup, you did.", "Thanks |
| 14:11.13 | elg | what do you know? you know nothing. you know that either you did or you didn't vote for scotty. you know that the guy on the phone did or didn't look up your vote. you know that the guy on the phone did or didn't lie to you |
| 14:11.40 | elg | even if you don't tell him who you voted for, all you know is that he knows who you voted for. you don't know that your vote was really counted that way |
| 14:12.43 | ^Migs^ | I still fail to see why this wouldn't be resolved by just logging into some web site, and seeing a giant list of ALL the votes in my state/county/whatever. Then I can hand-count them myself. If the announced results are different than what I counted, even significantly different, I have reason to be worried |
| 14:13.26 | ^Migs^ | okay, now I see what you mean |
| 14:13.33 | elg | yes, that will help detect the problem |
| 14:13.52 | ^Migs^ | there's still no paper trail, but i'm not sure with this method it would be necessary |
| 14:13.52 | elg | and if that was done, it should be that you can run or write a program to a web service that will independently count |
| 14:13.59 | elg | but what if you detect a problem? where do you go for the true answer? |
| 14:14.02 | elg | it has to be the paper trail |
| 14:14.20 | ^Migs^ | ok |
| 14:14.23 | elg | we should be able to see the results in detail like you say |
| 14:14.28 | elg | then we can detect fraud |
| 14:14.32 | elg | and call for recounts, etc. |
| 14:14.42 | elg | and see what happened and get all kinds of warm and fuzzy |
| 14:15.03 | elg | but in the end there has to be a paper trail, because a paper trail is the only thing humans can audit independently of computers |
| 14:15.05 | ^Migs^ | okay, so let's say we not do off-site voting for now. Require people to go on-site so that we can create a paper trail. |
| 14:15.25 | elg | you could even have them print something out and mail it |
| 14:15.34 | elg | might delay a recount by a few days |
| 14:15.35 | ^Migs^ | yeah, that would work |
| 14:15.47 | ^Migs^ | mail-in voting is fine |
| 14:16.27 | elg | if you trust the post office :) |
| 14:16.27 | ^Migs^ | they could log into a site, vote, and it makes a printable ballot they are required to mail in |
| 14:16.55 | ^Migs^ | although that seems redundant |
| 14:17.04 | elg | that's the point :) |
| 14:17.06 | ^Migs^ | well, it would save the government postage |
| 14:17.19 | ^Migs^ | because in the states that have voting by mail, they actually mail the ballots TO them. |
| 14:17.24 | ^Migs^ | I think |
| 14:17.28 | ^Migs^ | maybe they're downloadable, I don't know |
| 14:17.47 | ^Migs^ | okay, so what we've come up with here seems like a working solution. |
| 14:20.38 | ^Migs^ | and it implies that it's not such a waste to have e-voting machines. The next logical step is to make the results available to everyone. |
| 14:24.30 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 14:31.06 | *** join/#utah redbeard2 (n=redbeard@c-67-161-242-51.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 14:33.42 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 14:38.48 | raventh1 | ibot: give me paper voting again |
| 14:38.49 | ibot | ACTION gives paper voting again to raventh1 |
| 14:46.20 | elg | -lart vontrapp |
| 14:53.30 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 15:03.55 | elg | get fuzzy is funny today |
| 15:03.56 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (n=brailsmt@c-69-242-149-79.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) |
| 15:03.57 | ^Migs^ | link? |
| 15:03.57 | elg | http://www.comics.com/comics/getfuzzy/ |
| 15:03.57 | brac | [Get Fuzzy] |
| 15:03.57 | ^Migs^ | haha |
| 15:03.59 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@208.64.90.18.utahbroadband.com) |
| 15:08.11 | *** join/#utah lukfugl (n=lukfugl@dsl092-197-124.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 15:13.17 | *** join/#utah Supaplex (i=supaplex@166-70-62-199.ip.xmission.com) |
| 15:13.52 | elg | -lart lukfugl |
| 15:14.11 | lukfugl | -lart elg |
| 15:26.06 | lukfugl | lutefisk? |
| 15:29.53 | jsmith | What, you don't know about lutefisk? |
| 15:30.44 | jsmith | The best in Swedish cuisine |
| 15:32.44 | herlo | Jayce^: congrats man... |
| 15:33.13 | graphyx | herlo: what did he do? |
| 15:33.59 | herlo | graphyx: His wife had a baby girl |
| 15:34.13 | herlo | http://halls.lug-nut.com/jayce/ |
| 15:34.14 | graphyx | ok |
| 15:34.17 | graphyx | cool |
| 15:34.23 | graphyx | good job Jayce^!! |
| 15:34.27 | herlo | I figure he's not here right now, but hey |
| 15:34.33 | graphyx | hope you get some sleep at night soon |
| 15:40.29 | lukfugl | Jayce^: gratz! |
| 15:48.34 | ^Migs^ | omg just reached revision 666 in SVN |
| 15:49.56 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@64.122.197.182) |
| 15:50.22 | sjansen | o/~ Ding dong the witch is dead. Which witch? The wicked witch. Ding dong the wicked witch is dead! ~/o |
| 15:53.28 | Keighvin | It's "which OLD witch" |
| 15:53.55 | Keighvin | Though I don't believe the D receives any particular consideration, more like "ol'" than "old" IIRC. |
| 15:55.24 | sjansen | ~melt Keighvin |
| 15:55.36 | lukfugl | ~boil Keighbin |
| 15:55.38 | ibot | ACTION boils Keighbin in a hot steaming kettle of beezlenut oil |
| 15:55.47 | lukfugl | -lart lukfugl |
| 15:55.55 | lukfugl | that's what I get for not using tab completion |
| 15:56.12 | Keighvin | Ooh, what a world, what a world! |
| 15:57.25 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@70.5.231.20) |
| 15:59.18 | harleypig | http://bash.org/?755535 |
| 15:59.20 | brac | [QDB: Quote #755535] |
| 16:00.34 | levi | There's another important aspect of voting systems that has to be preserved. It should be impossible to prove to someone else who you voted for. |
| 16:07.01 | levi | Which throws a big wrench into the verification thing, but there are indeed solutions to the problem. |
| 16:07.20 | ^Migs^ | such as? |
| 16:07.20 | ^Migs^ | and I thought we resolved that issue in our discussion |
| 16:07.21 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 16:07.21 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 16:07.44 | lukfugl | ~dorothy sjansen |
| 16:07.51 | ibot | ACTION sends a tornado to Kansas, scooping up a house containing a young girls with a yappy dog, then drops the house unceremoniously on sjansen |
| 16:07.55 | levi | Well, anonymity was mentioned, but not the reasons for it. |
| 16:08.09 | lukfugl | d'oh, typo |
| 16:08.37 | levi | It's necessary so that you can't be forced or bribed by people or organizations into voting a certain way. |
| 16:08.55 | levi | Or, so that organizations or people can't seek retribution on people who didn't vote the way they wanted. |
| 16:09.07 | lukfugl | ibot: no, dorothy $target is sends a tornado to Kansas, scooping up a house containing a young girl and her yappy dog, then drops it unceremoniously on $target |
| 16:09.10 | ibot | okay, lukfugl |
| 16:09.27 | lukfugl | ibot: no, dorothy $target is <action> sends a tornado to Kansas, scooping up a house containing a young girl and her yappy dog, then drops it unceremoniously on $target |
| 16:09.29 | ibot | okay, lukfugl |
| 16:09.36 | lukfugl | there we go |
| 16:09.39 | lukfugl | ~dorothy elg |
| 16:09.41 | ibot | ACTION sends a tornado to Kansas, scooping up a house containing a young girl and her yappy dog, then drops it unceremoniously on elg |
| 16:09.46 | levi | Anyway, I read a clever research paper on the problem of being able to verify who you voted for via a paper record without having it give away who you voted for. |
| 16:10.15 | jsmith | David Chaum has done all kinds of work on that particular piece |
| 16:10.54 | levi | It's been a while so I don't recall the exact details, but it had something to do with marking a pattern instead of a single vote. Neither side of the ballot would tell who you voted for, but when added together the ballots would produce the correct result. |
| 16:11.16 | levi | You'd keep one side for verification purposes, and the other would go into the box to be counted. |
| 16:12.17 | *** join/#utah bonez39 (n=bonez@c-71-195-250-0.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 16:13.21 | jsmith | http://courses.csail.mit.edu/6.897/spring04/Chaum-SecretBallotReceiptsTrueVoterVerifiableElections.pdf |
| 16:13.24 | levi | Anyway, there's no lack of interesting solutions to various voting problems. There's just a lot of inertia to overcome with our current system. People are pretty conservative about it. |
| 16:13.54 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 16:14.06 | jsmith | punchscan.org is an implementation of Chaum's idea |
| 16:15.01 | levi | jsmith: That looks like a much more polished version of what I read. |
| 16:15.37 | jsmith | Yeah... |
| 16:16.15 | levi | I mean, based on the same kind of concepts, not the exact same implementation. It looks like the idea is much further refined there. |
| 16:16.44 | jsmith | http://images.punchscan.org/punchscanonasheet.png <-- interesting graphic that tries to describe it |
| 16:18.15 | ^Migs^ | nice find |
| 16:18.48 | levi | One problem is that you can verify who you voted for, so votes could be bought or coerced. |
| 16:21.53 | bonez39 | I set up my son as a user on my system...so I can keep documents he writes or has me help him with (he's 11 years old) ... using adduser david then I su david to access his directories...to store a document...and I get the following error: david@fyrenice:~/dox$ vim pink_floyd |
| 16:21.53 | bonez39 | Xlib: connection to ":0.0" refused by server |
| 16:21.54 | bonez39 | Xlib: No protocol specified |
| 16:22.04 | bonez39 | what might cause such Xlib errors? |
| 16:22.37 | Keighvin | vim sounds like it might be an alias for gvim - it's trying to connect to a running X server on the local machine. |
| 16:23.07 | Keighvin | It also may be that you are trying to launch a process under X as a user other than that which has permission to interact with that session. |
| 16:23.25 | Supaplex | how do you spell the animal that sounds like "nack"? gnack? or is that some made up word or something? |
| 16:24.25 | bonez39 | gnaack.....or knaack....? |
| 16:24.56 | bonez39 | Keighvin, ok.... |
| 16:38.11 | QBFreak | I don't suppose anyone in here is familiar enough with windows XP to know how to safely remove a restore point without actually booting the OS (ie: from BartPE or by placing the HDD in another machine) |
| 16:40.22 | QBFreak | I can delete the _restore{whatever} in System Volume Information, but I don't know if thats a good idea |
| 16:45.11 | *** join/#utah pmcnabb (n=peter@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 16:51.33 | ^Migs^ | yeah, I wouldn't do that either |
| 16:51.42 | ^Migs^ | why do you need to remove it? |
| 16:52.46 | QBFreak | one of the files is infected |
| 16:53.01 | QBFreak | I just booted it into safe mode and disabled system restore (which deletes the restore points) |
| 16:53.47 | QBFreak | Trend Micro was telling me the name of what the file was when it was placed into the restore point, not what it was actually named on the disk |
| 16:53.59 | ^Migs^ | can't your virus scanner remove it? |
| 16:54.09 | QBFreak | for whatever reason, it could not |
| 16:54.18 | ^Migs^ | "If the System Volume Information (SVI) folder is on a FAT partition and a virus infected file has been detected or copied to the data store before it was cleaned, the data store needs to be purged to remove the Restore Point with the infected file. To do this, the user should disable and then re-enable System Restore monitoring on that particular drive as specified in How can I disable System Restore from monitoring a particular drive? If the System Volume In |
| 16:54.18 | ^Migs^ | formation Folder is on an NTFS partition, the SVI directory can be accessed by a virus utility to clean an infected file as any other part of the file system." http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/plan/faqsrwxp.mspx |
| 16:54.23 | QBFreak | I suspect if I had taken ownership of the folder it could have, but that would have required another scan |
| 16:55.27 | QBFreak | I was scanning the drive in another machine, so the AV was running under a completly different set of rights |
| 16:55.46 | QBFreak | scanning it locally did not get everything the first time |
| 16:56.19 | ^Migs^ | can you just delete the infected file? |
| 16:56.56 | elg | levi: the scantron-like approach is simple, cost-effective, and handles all of the aspects well |
| 16:57.11 | QBFreak | I didn't know the file name, the AV was reporting the name of the file as it was before it was stored, they are named Annnnnnn.ext (where n is a sequential number) |
| 16:57.14 | elg | no name, and as long as you can keep people from looking over your shoulder until you've stuck it in the machine you're anonymous |
| 16:57.27 | elg | computer counting, so you can have all the niceties that computers bring |
| 16:57.35 | elg | paper trail, locked away inside the scanning machines |
| 16:57.46 | elg | etc. etc. |
| 16:57.54 | ^Migs^ | oh here we go |
| 16:57.56 | elg | it's so dead simple that alternative solutions are mostly brain dead |
| 16:57.57 | ^Migs^ | QBFreak, use Disk Cleanup |
| 16:58.01 | findlay | elg: but the scantron scanner has to be open source for it to be trustworthy |
| 16:58.19 | elg | sure, ideally |
| 16:58.21 | ^Migs^ | Start->All Programs->Accessories->System Tools->Disk Cleanup |
| 16:58.28 | elg | but if anyone has doubts, the paper trail is counted by humans |
| 16:58.33 | findlay | yup |
| 16:58.39 | elg | and that'd done randomly in every election anyway |
| 16:58.46 | *** join/#utah kreg (n=kreg@208.98.188.95) |
| 16:58.49 | elg | random precincts are audited to make sure the machines are matching the human counts |
| 16:58.59 | kreg | ah, i remember this place |
| 16:59.08 | elg | in that case, |
| 16:59.09 | ^Migs^ | this place don't remember you |
| 16:59.11 | elg | ~lart kreg |
| 16:59.11 | ibot | lowers kreg's priority |
| 16:59.14 | findlay | ~welcome kreg |
| 16:59.19 | ibot | Howdy, kreg! |
| 16:59.19 | kreg | >: ) |
| 16:59.26 | QBFreak | ^Migs^: I already disabled and reenabled system restore, that took care of it |
| 16:59.48 | kreg | oh ya, TimRiker , that sounds familar |
| 16:59.48 | ^Migs^ | next logical step: put all votes online, but not online voting |
| 16:59.52 | ^Migs^ | oh, okay |
| 16:59.53 | ^Migs^ | cool |
| 17:00.23 | QBFreak | initially I wanted to try and just wipe the points without booting, but that seems like A Bad Idea |
| 17:09.26 | Zelut | anyone have much experience with fetchmail? |
| 17:11.18 | elg | some |
| 17:13.47 | Zelut | elg: I'm trying to have fetchmail get my gmail and give it to my user but I can't seem to find where it's putting it. |
| 17:14.23 | Zelut | it says 'receiving for myusername@localhost' but if I open mutt, which looks to /var/mail/myusername it's empty. |
| 17:16.30 | jsmith | Zelut: Is it putting them in /var/spool/mail/myusername? |
| 17:16.52 | Zelut | ..and the mail.log says /var/mail/myusername: can't stat, not a file. is a directory. |
| 17:17.43 | elg | sounds like fetchmail is doing its thing, and your MTA isn't doing it's share |
| 17:17.47 | Zelut | there is nothing but the tmp,cur,new folders in /var/spool/mail/myusername--no new mail. |
| 17:18.01 | elg | is your MTA capable of delivering to maildir? |
| 17:18.04 | elg | and/or configured |
| 17:18.19 | elg | is procmail involved? |
| 17:18.27 | Zelut | would that be on postfix end or dovecot? |
| 17:18.36 | elg | postfix |
| 17:19.06 | elg | it's postfix complaining in mail.log, right? |
| 17:19.44 | elg | most likely, postfix wants to deliver to an mbox /var/mail/user |
| 17:19.53 | elg | but finds a maildir /var/mail/user/ and gives up |
| 17:20.15 | elg | rm -r /var/mail/user (or move it somewhere) |
| 17:20.28 | elg | and try to get postfix to deliver something |
| 17:20.40 | *** join/#utah pmcnabb (n=peter@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 17:24.34 | Zelut | elg: that looks like it worked.. |
| 17:32.06 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 17:32.07 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 17:40.03 | Zelut | elg: thanks.. any quick suggestions on how to automate fetchmail? |
| 17:40.44 | sjansen | cron? |
| 17:42.50 | Zelut | it says it is able to run as a daemon but I haven't quite figured that part out yet. |
| 17:42.58 | sjansen | Zelut: Using maildir is a Good Thing(TM). You want to do it. |
| 17:43.22 | sjansen | Friends don't let friends use fetchmail. |
| 17:44.13 | Zelut | sjansen: do you have a better suggestion (why do I know you will...) for accessing gmail via IMAP then? |
| 17:44.32 | Zelut | the solution I came up with was use fetchmail to pull it locally and use a local imap |
| 17:47.34 | *** join/#utah pmcnabb_ (n=peter@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 17:48.35 | *** join/#utah calvarez (n=Hhhhh@lawn-143-215-204-146.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 17:48.57 | calvarez | hello |
| 17:49.03 | levi | Hello. |
| 17:49.05 | elg | automate fetchmail? the only thing to automate is startup |
| 17:49.09 | levi | How's gatech? |
| 17:49.12 | elg | @reboot fetchmail |
| 17:49.29 | calvarez | gatech is doing fine, thank you. |
| 17:49.37 | calvarez | It says hi to you |
| 17:49.42 | levi | Good, good. |
| 17:51.54 | ^Migs^ | http://wjz.com/topstories/topstories_story_114122046.html |
| 17:51.56 | brac | [wjz.com - Utah County Jail Inmates May Be Charged Rent] |
| 17:54.53 | lukfugl | seems reasonable to me |
| 17:55.13 | lukfugl | this is jail (highly transitory) not prison (long stays) we're talking about |
| 17:56.25 | elg | ~jail lukfugl |
| 17:56.39 | elg | ~rent lukfugl |
| 17:56.51 | elg | ~evict lukfugl |
| 17:57.06 | graphyx | $10?? |
| 17:57.11 | graphyx | Wow, Imagine this. |
| 17:57.25 | graphyx | Hey gaurd, the motel 6 down the way is full up. |
| 17:57.43 | graphyx | What offense should I commit to get you to put me up for only $10? |
| 17:57.50 | graphyx | for 1 night. |
| 17:58.12 | graphyx | And on top of that they don't even need a credit card to hold the room. |
| 17:58.13 | lukfugl | graphyx: the thing is, that exact situation happens for free instead of $10 -- hance I see no problem with charging the $10 |
| 17:58.22 | graphyx | Yeah |
| 17:58.25 | graphyx | I agree. |
| 17:58.27 | lukfugl | *hence |
| 17:58.43 | lukfugl | well, not the *exact* situation :) |
| 17:58.46 | elg | well I ogree |
| 17:58.54 | graphyx | I know what you mean. |
| 17:59.02 | graphyx | elg: Are you a dvorakist? |
| 17:59.17 | graphyx | the ao typo is harder is qwerty. |
| 18:00.03 | graphyx | To be honest, now that I don't look at the keyboard when I type I find myself mistyping because I am not on home row. |
| 18:00.13 | graphyx | more often. |
| 18:00.49 | graphyx | quick, we need to buy up all the typo domains for the dvorak key set. |
| 18:01.05 | graphyx | google would be gaaglo. |
| 18:04.35 | *** join/#utah pmcnabb (n=peter@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 18:08.44 | Keighvin | Ah, Dvorak. |
| 18:09.06 | Keighvin | I like how Jayce^ put that - he calls'em dvorks (rather than dvorakists). |
| 18:11.24 | bonez39 | are we talking about John Dvorak...the tech columnist? |
| 18:11.34 | ^Migs^ | http://tinyurl.com/3duu5r |
| 18:11.36 | brac | [RedEnvelope] |
| 18:19.14 | Keighvin | No, the alternate keyboard layout. |
| 18:33.21 | *** join/#utah pmcnabb (n=peter@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 18:33.41 | elg | um, http://tinyurl.com/3duu5r |
| 18:33.42 | graphyx | well dvorkian would be a little too close of kvorkian |
| 18:33.44 | brac | [RedEnvelope] |
| 18:33.46 | elg | er, kit includes johnny-jump-ups, pansies, nasturtiums and calendula—all beautiful, all delicious |
| 18:34.01 | elg | yeah, that's the first thing I want to eat when I think of edible plants |
| 18:34.06 | graphyx | and we all know that dvorak in the opposite of assisted suicide. |
| 18:34.45 | graphyx | Well you can give both flowers and chocolate |
| 18:34.48 | graphyx | all in one package! |
| 18:41.23 | sjansen | My only question is: what if they don't have the money to pay rent? |
| 18:41.38 | sjansen | "I'm sorry, we're going to have to let you go free since you don't have $10." |
| 18:42.09 | lukfugl | sjansen: community service? |
| 18:42.27 | sjansen | "For $10 you get a standard room. For $25 you get a room with a private toilet. For $0 you can sleep behind the refrigerator in the guards lounge." |
| 18:42.35 | graphyx | Well we find a way to pay the medical costs of illegal immegrants I am sure that they could use the funds from other areas to accomodate truly indigent individuals. |
| 18:44.38 | sjansen | "I've got $10 that says you won't swallow this battery. Prove me wrong and you get to sleep in a bed tonight." |
| 18:46.13 | levi | elg: A grow-it-yourself kit, eh? |
| 18:46.18 | levi | elg: At least it comes with recipes. |
| 18:47.04 | sjansen | "I love you so much honey, happy valentines. Here's some flower seeds. Now grow them and cook me something." |
| 18:48.57 | levi | sjansen: I don't know about you, but I don't talk to my mother like that. |
| 18:50.23 | elg | giving my mom seeds and a planter would be like her giving me a "linux for dummies" book |
| 18:51.07 | *** join/#utah pmcnabb (n=peter@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 18:53.56 | sjansen | The new t61 uses nVidia instead of ATI! |
| 18:54.07 | elg | the who? |
| 18:54.28 | Keighvin | He uses it to bullseye wamp rats back home. |
| 18:55.36 | jsmith | sjansen: Yeah, I saw that... |
| 18:55.50 | sjansen | No mention of WUXGA though. :-( |
| 18:56.02 | ^Migs^ | I managed to set up Icecast and ICES. Now I'm trying to figure out a decent way to allow multiple users to use the same Linux box remotely for live audio streams, as it seems that ICES may require any audio input be from the server's hardware itself. |
| 18:56.21 | ^Migs^ | I get the feeling I'm going to end up running multiple instances of ICES |
| 18:56.42 | sjansen | http://digg.com/hardware/Summary_of_new_Thinkpad_T61_series |
| 18:57.05 | jsmith | sjansen: From the announcement letter: WXGA (1280 x 800) or WXGA+ (1440 x 900) |
| 18:57.16 | elg | ^Migs^: you gotta have something capture the audio from the local audio card |
| 18:57.27 | jsmith | sjansen: I'm assuming you've seen http://www-306.ibm.com/common/ssi/OIX.wss?DocURL=http://d03xhttpcl001g.boulder.ibm.com/common/ssi/rep_ca/5/872/ENUSAG07-0205/index.html&InfoType=AN&InfoSubType=CA&InfoDesc=Announcement+Letters&panelurl=OIX.wss%3Fbuttonpressed%3DNAV002PT090&paneltext=Announcement+letter+search |
| 18:57.31 | elg | if you figure out how to get a remote box to capture local audio, let me know |
| 18:57.32 | ^Migs^ | and I imagine that would require an app to be installed. Either that or a Flash object or java applet, perhaps |
| 18:57.39 | sjansen | jsmith: Many people expected the T61 to include WUXGA. |
| 18:58.00 | jsmith | sjansen: Yeah, I know... |
| 18:58.05 | ^Migs^ | I did find a recording app at flashcoms.com, but it requires the Flash Media Server to be installed. The demo is pretty cool. It saves the files in FLV, but that's easy to convert to mp3 with ffmpeg |
| 18:58.18 | jsmith | ^Migs^: What about using Asterisk and VoIP to stream the audio through ICES to your Icecast server |
| 18:58.22 | ^Migs^ | I don't want to buy the Flash Media Server if all I'm going to be using it for is live recording, though |
| 18:58.29 | elg | levi: once a snake always a snake |
| 18:58.32 | sjansen | I was so looking forward to upgrading to a Thinkpad. :-( |
| 18:58.37 | ^Migs^ | hmmm |
| 18:58.53 | ^Migs^ | hmmmmmmmmmmmm |
| 18:59.14 | ^Migs^ | that would probably work, but I'd prefer something simpler |
| 18:59.20 | ^Migs^ | because then I'd have to set up a whole VoIP system |
| 18:59.58 | elg | ^Migs^: are the clients windows? |
| 18:59.58 | *** join/#utah Zelut_ (n=christer@kuyaedz.fttp.xmission.com) |
| 19:00.04 | ^Migs^ | yes |
| 19:00.21 | ^Migs^ | I suppose if it's absolutely necessary, I could force an app pushout to every computer |
| 19:00.51 | ^Migs^ | in fact, I bet when all is said and done, that would be preferrable to the 'powers that be' |
| 19:01.09 | elg | search for 'shoutcast source client |
| 19:01.25 | elg | find something that serves as a shoutcast source client on windows, and it might work with icecast |
| 19:01.34 | ^Migs^ | shoutcast does work with icecast |
| 19:02.05 | ^Migs^ | well, that would certainly be the easiest way. I was approaching this as something that would have to be entirely web-based, but I suppose it doesn't. It DOES have to be as easy as possible so our moronic teachers can use it |
| 19:02.12 | ^Migs^ | sorry, shouldn't say that about teachers |
| 19:02.31 | ^Migs^ | but you don't have to listen to their whining |
| 19:02.41 | ^Migs^ | actually you probably do, elg |
| 19:03.47 | levi | I'm somewhat envious of the teachers in my condo complex. Most of them got their condos with the 'teacher next door' deal, which means they were 50% subsidized. Plus the prices went way up, so they're all sitting on huge chunks of equity. |
| 19:05.30 | elg | i don't, no |
| 19:05.34 | ^Migs^ | yeah, teachers get good tax and housing breaks |
| 19:05.45 | ^Migs^ | you don't have idiot teachers in your department? |
| 19:05.47 | elg | but i have no reason to believe that teachers are any better at abusing computers than any other luser |
| 19:06.00 | elg | a client push out is probably best |
| 19:06.12 | elg | there will likely be fewer problems with that than a 100% web solution |
| 19:06.18 | elg | which means fewer support calls |
| 19:10.55 | ^Migs^ | you're probably right |
| 19:18.59 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 19:24.46 | levi | A free compiler design textbook: http://www.diku.dk/hjemmesider/ansatte/torbenm/Basics/ |
| 19:25.20 | levi | (there are a number of other ones out there, too, including a succinct one by Niklaus Wirth) |
| 19:27.19 | *** join/#utah Zelut (n=christer@ubuntu/member/zelut) |
| 19:32.28 | ^Migs^ | http://deadspin.com/sports/college-football/ok-get-up-walk-it-off-254799.php |
| 19:35.13 | elg | "I got bonked by the football" |
| 19:35.51 | elg | sjansen: hey, I just upgraded my yepp firmware to 3.180 and there's now no annoying startup beep |
| 19:35.58 | elg | and it has +/- 30% speed option |
| 19:36.06 | sjansen | Yay! |
| 19:36.08 | elg | and a higher file/folder limit |
| 19:36.08 | sjansen | url? |
| 19:36.14 | elg | though I never came across that limit |
| 19:36.45 | elg | http://www.cczclan.com/yp-55download.asp |
| 19:36.46 | brac | [CCz_Cataphract's YP-55 Support Site] |
| 19:36.48 | sjansen | ~praise elg |
| 19:36.49 | ibot | All hail elg! |
| 19:36.59 | elg | you'll need windows to upgrade the firmware |
| 19:37.06 | elg | you could probably do it in vmware, but I was too chicken |
| 19:37.22 | elg | some people had trouble with usb hubs, so I just found a friend with windows |
| 19:37.51 | sjansen | bah humbug |
| 19:38.25 | sjansen | Guess that means I have to wait until I get home. :-( |
| 19:40.36 | sjansen | http://weblog.raganwald.com/2006/10/are-we-blub-programmers.html <-- Not only is Blub a new word, looks like Greenspun is a new verb. |
| 19:40.39 | brac | [Raganwald: Are we Blub programmers?] |
| 19:41.01 | elg | is it the past tense of greenspin? |
| 19:44.38 | findlay | why is ubuntu stuck in an endless loop dist-upgrading? |
| 19:45.33 | elg | because you're lucky |
| 19:45.44 | sjansen | findlay: Did you scratch your stomach after hitting enter? Ubuntu is punishing you. |
| 19:45.50 | elg | congrats, you're the millionth upgrder |
| 19:46.33 | findlay | do I win a prize/ |
| 19:46.39 | elg | the real question is why ubuntu's upgrade manager felt obliged to uninstall software that I had intentionally installed |
| 19:46.47 | elg | findlay: yes, infinite loop |
| 19:46.58 | findlay | yay |
| 19:47.28 | sjansen | findlay: Fate has chosen you to solve the halting problem. |
| 19:48.16 | findlay | I accept this charge with fortitude and resolve |
| 19:48.19 | findlay | ~compute sjansen |
| 19:48.32 | elg | Jayce^++ |
| 19:48.37 | elg | Jayce^.sleep-- |
| 19:48.59 | sjansen | Jayce^: Congrats! |
| 19:49.22 | *** topic/#utah by sjansen -> The channel for OSS discussion in Utah | http://plug.org/irc | Utah Open Source Conference - September 6-8, 2007 | http://halls.lug-nut.com/jayce/2007/04/24/Brynn_is_Born |
| 19:51.05 | levi | sjansen: You haven't been paying attention if you think Greenspunning is a new word. |
| 19:51.26 | sjansen | levi: Not the the right circles, apparently. |
| 19:52.03 | levi | 'Greenspun's Tenth Rule of Programming: "Any sufficiently complicated C or Fortran program contains an ad-hoc, informally-specified bug-ridden slow implementation of half of Common Lisp."' |
| 19:52.18 | levi | From: http://philip.greenspun.com/research/ |
| 19:52.22 | brac | [Philip Greenspun's Research] |
| 19:54.32 | sjansen | levi: I'm familiar with Greenspun's Universal Personal Recognition Lisp Rule. I just hadn't seen it as a verb before. |
| 19:56.09 | findlay | yay, unichrome driver! |
| 19:56.15 | findlay | ubuntu does love me |
| 19:56.24 | findlay | thanks ubuntu |
| 19:56.38 | findlay | ~hug ubuntu |
| 19:56.41 | ibot | ACTION gets a running start and tackle-hugs ubuntu |
| 19:57.50 | elg | what's a unichrome? |
| 19:58.19 | sjansen | elg: I think he meant unicorn. |
| 19:58.38 | findlay | Xorg via-unichrome driver |
| 19:58.56 | findlay | I've been suffering with the vesa driver for these past several months |
| 19:59.07 | findlay | ~lart closed, proprietary hardware |
| 19:59.07 | ibot | shoots closed, proprietary hardware in his sleep |
| 19:59.31 | sjansen | It's well known that William Gibson's book "Burning Chrome" was originally going be be named "Unichrome" but his niece kept calling it "Unicorn" until finally in frustration he told the publisher to change the name to "Burning Chrome". |
| 20:00.11 | sjansen | And, as I'm sure everyone is aware, the Ubuntu Cabal's secret goal is to building a global intelligence using spare CPU cycles. |
| 20:00.55 | sjansen | Less well known is that findaly has recently been recruited by a counter-insurgency of Gibson fanboys and ex-Gentoo users. |
| 20:01.37 | sjansen | findlay is trying to learn the vocabulary of the Ubuntu Intelligencia, but he's having some difficulty. |
| 20:02.08 | elg | -lart sjansen |
| 20:02.16 | elg | ~unicorn sjansen |
| 20:02.25 | sjansen | Of course, now that I've published my little exposee, the black helicopter are probably coming for both of us. |
| 20:02.45 | elg | hey, I want a helicopter ride |
| 20:03.04 | lukfugl | ~dorothy elg |
| 20:03.06 | ibot | ACTION sends a tornado to Kansas, scooping up a house containing a young girl and her yappy dog, then drops it unceremoniously on elg |
| 20:04.18 | findlay | s/rainbow/70's colors or autumn browns and oranges/ |
| 20:04.38 | rsimpkins | elg: helicopter rides are awesome. I've only got to ride in two, but it was cool. |
| 20:05.33 | sjansen | rsimpkins: Liar. Nobody returns from a black helicopter ride. |
| 20:05.57 | graphyx | except the black helicopter pilots. |
| 20:06.11 | rsimpkins | sjansen: oh, didn't read the 'black helicopter' part. These happened to be white ones. |
| 20:06.28 | findlay | ah, yes. Mozart concert arias |
| 20:06.55 | findlay | a largely undiscovered collection of gems in Mozart's copious output |
| 20:06.57 | sjansen | Besides, I'd hardly describe having every major orifice probed as "cool". |
| 20:07.03 | sjansen | I should know. |
| 20:07.25 | elg | ibot, probe sjansen's minor orifices |
| 20:07.30 | sjansen | Look a jackalope! |
| 20:08.08 | rsimpkins | sjansen: Yeah, getting your ports probed is never fun. |
| 20:08.58 | findlay | I've got it! |
| 20:09.01 | findlay | ~halt sjansen |
| 20:09.04 | ibot | ACTION computes sjansen then halts |
| 20:09.10 | findlay | ~halt ubuntu |
| 20:09.12 | ibot | ACTION computes ubuntu then halts |
| 20:09.18 | sjansen | iptables -A INPUT -s hans -j ATTACH-INCENDIARY-DEVICE-AND-RETURN-TO-SENDER |
| 20:10.52 | findlay | ~recurse |
| 20:10.54 | ibot | ~recurse |
| 20:10.57 | findlay | ~halt ~recurse |
| 20:10.58 | ibot | ACTION computes ~recurse then halts |
| 20:12.36 | findlay | all your infinities are converge on findlay |
| 20:13.38 | findlay | ibot + Hilbert Space = NP |
| 20:26.01 | sjansen | ~lart herlo |
| 20:26.01 | ibot | beats herlo into protomatter with the andromeda galaxy |
| 20:26.12 | sjansen | ~steal herlo's hardware |
| 20:26.13 | ibot | ACTION grabs herlo's hardware and gives it to sjansen |
| 20:26.38 | elg | ~steal ibot |
| 20:26.40 | ibot | ACTION grabs ibot and gives it to elg |
| 20:27.55 | findlay | ~halt ibot |
| 20:27.57 | ibot | ACTION computes ibot then halts |
| 20:28.11 | rsimpkins | ~halt pi |
| 20:28.12 | ibot | ACTION computes pi then halts |
| 20:28.25 | rsimpkins | wow, ibot computed pi awefully fast. :) |
| 20:28.57 | elg | ~halt p=?np |
| 20:28.59 | ibot | ACTION computes p=?np then halts |
| 20:29.44 | herlo | ~lart sjansen |
| 20:29.44 | ibot | teaches sjansen that M$ Access is a database. No, really, a database. A real live multi-user... well, ok, not multi-user, but a database. Yeah, that sounds right. |
| 20:29.53 | herlo | ~steal sjansen's soul |
| 20:29.55 | ibot | ACTION grabs sjansen's soul and gives it to herlo |
| 20:30.02 | herlo | muuahhahaaaaahaaaaa! |
| 20:31.22 | elg | sounds like a fair trade |
| 20:32.58 | graphyx | herlo: sounds like you are assuming that his soul isn't already under contract. |
| 20:35.23 | levi | Heh, they always make a better idiot: http://applematters.com/index.php/section/comments/and-they-said-the-mac-was-intuitive/ |
| 20:35.27 | brac | [Apple Matters | And They Said the Mac Was Intuitive] |
| 20:39.42 | *** join/#utah tristanbob (n=tristan@oalug/member/tristanbob) |
| 20:40.14 | lukfugl | awesome |
| 20:41.39 | *** join/#utah dna3e8 (n=dna3e8@72.8.72.226) |
| 20:41.58 | elg | dude that runs around deleting files that he doesn't know what are for: stupid |
| 20:42.02 | herlo | graphyx: oh, but it is, mine... |
| 20:42.27 | elg | fault for said escapade: stupid dude. not that the mac and/or some program he installed "failed to hide /usr" |
| 20:43.30 | Tene | at the very least he should have looked inside the folder first |
| 20:43.53 | findlay | and seen the bits inside |
| 20:44.10 | elg | s/rm/sudo rm/ |
| 20:44.13 | findlay | how many bits do you have in your /usr directory? |
| 20:44.31 | Tene | findlay: at least ninety. |
| 20:44.39 | findlay | wow. That's a lot |
| 20:44.40 | Tene | what about you? |
| 20:44.46 | findlay | not so many |
| 20:44.52 | dna3e8 | i need to initialize my video card... how do i do that in command line.. |
| 20:45.13 | elg | rm -rf ~sjansen |
| 20:45.15 | Tene | dna3e8: I don't understand what you mean. |
| 20:45.19 | elg | that should do the trick |
| 20:45.36 | Tene | dna3e8: what is "initializing your video card"? |
| 20:45.54 | elg | Tene: I already answered the question. stop gloryhogging |
| 20:46.20 | Tene | elg: I lagged your bits. They won't arrive at the channel until tomorrow. |
| 20:46.24 | dna3e8 | Tene: the command that is used when you change resolutions |
| 20:47.40 | bonez39 | I have comcast...providing access at both home and work...when away from work, I can ssh in to connect and look around, and run stuff and run scp to transfer files....remotely....I USED to be able to do the same from work TO home....yet, lately, my IP at home has been changing often... |
| 20:48.00 | levi | I could probably look up the series of machine code instruction you could use to put a VGA card into Mode X. |
| 20:48.25 | bonez39 | other than assuring that port 22 is forwarded to my linux box....which has an static internal LAN ip address....how can I assure that my domain alwyas finds my IP at home? |
| 20:48.33 | Tene | dna3e8: I don't understand. |
| 20:49.02 | Tene | bonez39: the quickest,e asiest solution is to get a free account at http://dyndns.org/ |
| 20:49.50 | bonez39 | tene, but then isn't my domain going to be dyndns.mydomain.com? |
| 20:49.51 | elg | bonez39: find a dynamic dns service |
| 20:50.21 | elg | like dyndns or NO-IP.com (but if you do that don't be fooled into deleting /usr) |
| 20:50.25 | Tene | bonez39: you can set your domain to be a CNAME (pointer) to whatever.dyndns.org |
| 20:50.27 | bonez39 | elg, Tene but why, WHY can I get it done at my office, which basically has the same service...dynamic IP with comcast..and yet I have no trouble connecting to work? |
| 20:50.30 | dna3e8 | tene: i connect to the machine over vnc when i connect the remote computers monitor dosn't come out of power saving |
| 20:50.44 | bonez39 | same basic setup at office and at home... |
| 20:50.47 | elg | bonez39: that's a question for comcast network engineers |
| 20:51.01 | elg | the answer is, because your home IP changes a lot and your work IP doesn't |
| 20:51.01 | *** join/#utah hagna (n=hagna@70.98.162.62) |
| 20:51.33 | elg | dna3e8: why should it? |
| 20:51.35 | ^Migs^ | http://www.zeenews.com/articles.asp?aid=367459&ssid=27&sid=ENV |
| 20:51.38 | brac | [Zee News - First habitable Earth like planet outside Solar System discovered] |
| 20:53.03 | bonez39 | elg, so at work..I am just lucky that it works..and I shouldn't upset it, by asking too much... |
| 20:53.20 | dna3e8 | elg: it does most of the time, but i want to run the command that 'wakes up the display' |
| 20:53.41 | Tene | bonez39: basically, yes. |
| 20:54.05 | elg | dna3e8: why? |
| 20:54.07 | Keighvin | xset dpms force o |
| 20:54.12 | Keighvin | xset dpms force on |
| 20:54.22 | elg | what Keighvin said |
| 20:54.23 | Keighvin | Ignore that first one. |
| 20:54.24 | elg | btu why? |
| 20:58.10 | dna3e8 | elg: it is too slow to forward the display to the host computer, so the guest has it own monitor.. due to desk space i have one key board... |
| 20:58.27 | *** join/#utah Robdor (n=rob@208.187.198.179) |
| 21:00.55 | lukfugl | wow, only 20 light years away |
| 21:00.57 | Tene | dna3e8: have you looked at synergy? |
| 21:01.16 | elg | dna3e8: yes, you want synergy |
| 21:01.29 | lukfugl | so if they exist and have radio communication, it's only a 40 year round trip latency :) |
| 21:03.15 | elg | lukfugl: imagine ssh |
| 21:04.54 | lukfugl | communications, that is |
| 21:05.03 | lukfugl | the clicky aliens that live in subspace are freaky |
| 21:05.16 | lukfugl | always trying to cut you up |
| 21:05.42 | dna3e8 | I am using x2x |
| 21:05.45 | Tene | So, I was trying to come up with a Movie Sequel or RPG Character Level response to the plug post about the "System Administrator 2" job opening, but I can't come up with anything. |
| 21:06.45 | elg | dna3e8: have you tried synergy |
| 21:11.08 | *** join/#utah tuxinator_linux (n=tuxinato@128.187.169.195) |
| 21:16.14 | dna3e8 | yes |
| 21:16.20 | dna3e8 | but it is not mac freindly |
| 21:17.51 | dna3e8 | look an update for mac... let me try it.. |
| 21:21.36 | dna3e8 | grrr no easy gui... |
| 21:22.38 | elg | are both macs? |
| 21:23.40 | elg | sjansen: my mac now remounts the yepp when i unmount it after a few seconds, unless I unplug it |
| 21:23.43 | dna3e8 | no |
| 21:23.55 | elg | i'd be interested in knowing if it does that to you in linux |
| 21:26.07 | dna3e8 | elg: the host is mac the guest is FC 6 |
| 21:26.07 | elg | if synergy doesn't float your boat i'd look into NX |
| 21:26.08 | elg | then you could use the other monitor to have a dual monitor mac setup |
| 21:26.08 | elg | and life would be sweet indeed |
| 21:26.40 | dna3e8 | i am using a second monitor as either a second mac display or as the linux disply |
| 21:26.56 | elg | with a kvm? |
| 21:27.40 | dna3e8 | yes |
| 21:28.44 | elg | i'd set up nx and use the kvm as a backup way to get to the linux box (i.e. for booting, etc.) |
| 21:28.51 | elg | that's what I'd do |
| 21:29.13 | elg | if I used the linux box a lot I might use synergy as long as it's not too buggy with osx |
| 21:29.28 | dna3e8 | but would that cause the display to be forwarded (not enought band width |
| 21:29.51 | elg | what bandwidth do you have? |
| 21:30.12 | dna3e8 | i don't know... it is just real sluggish... |
| 21:30.13 | elg | I don't even dare ask why bandwidth is an issue for computers sitting right next to eachother |
| 21:31.00 | elg | i think you'll find bandwidth isn't an issue with nx, unless you have a really pathological situation. but I can't say for sure unless you can give some hard numbers' |
| 21:31.23 | Tene | elg: I've seen computers right next to each other both connected over wifi to a wireless router right next to them. |
| 21:31.36 | elg | :) |
| 21:31.50 | elg | well nx works great over wifi from my couch to my server and workstation |
| 21:31.59 | dna3e8 | kk |
| 21:32.06 | elg | so there's some anecdotal evidence |
| 21:32.11 | Tene | Yeah, it does work fine over wifi |
| 21:32.40 | dna3e8 | a google seach for nx it too broud |
| 21:32.43 | elg | the best part about nx is that you don't have a big rectangular window |
| 21:32.54 | elg | you can just run one program as its own little window |
| 21:32.57 | elg | i.e. xterm |
| 21:33.02 | elg | and you can run other programs from there |
| 21:33.08 | elg | nomachine.com |
| 21:33.14 | Tene | dna3e8: look for "nomachine" or "freenx" |
| 21:35.20 | dna3e8 | Tene: does teh linux machine need to host an nx server...? |
| 21:35.27 | elg | ya |
| 21:35.32 | elg | nomachine has rpms |
| 21:35.37 | elg | or you can futz about with freenx |
| 21:40.36 | dna3e8 | sry... di i need a sever and client ont he linux machine.. |
| 21:40.51 | Tene | server on linux machine |
| 21:40.54 | Tene | client on mac |
| 21:41.38 | dna3e8 | thanks (i am trying to be careful since it is a semi-critical sever) |
| 22:00.22 | levi | elg: What has R done for you today? |
| 22:06.18 | elg | i've been writing randon variable generators as a way to study for my exam tomorrow |
| 22:06.25 | elg | R graphs them for me |
| 22:06.33 | levi | Cool. |
| 22:06.47 | elg | v = scan("poisson") |
| 22:06.48 | elg | hist(v) |
| 22:06.54 | elg | easiest histogram ever |
| 22:08.00 | dna3e8 | grrrr |
| 22:08.08 | goozbach | ~seen emcnabb |
| 22:08.46 | ibot | emcnabb is currently on #utah. Has said a total of 61 messages. Is idling for 5d 2h 43m 36s, last said: 'elg: for a while ours had problems in IE'. |
| 22:08.49 | Tene | v = scan("poseidon") |
| 22:08.52 | Tene | hist(v) |
| 22:18.11 | levi | Sweet, I got 1001/1000 points in my Interpersonal Communications class. |
| 22:22.48 | Keighvin | Extra point(s) for talking to members of the opposite sex? |
| 22:27.33 | sjansen | elg: I haven't upgraded the firmware, but no it doesn't remount itself. |
| 22:28.17 | sjansen | elg: Actually, I have problem with Fedora trying to use the ehci drivers and failing. The device claims to be USB 2.0 but apparently isn't. I have to modprobe uhci to get it to work. |
| 22:29.17 | elg | well mine didn't before I upgraded the firmware |
| 22:29.39 | sjansen | You and your fancy new firmware. |
| 22:29.48 | elg | Keighvin: you get extra points for longs posts to plug |
| 22:30.04 | elg | sjansen: yeah, and me and my dead battery :9 |
| 22:30.08 | sjansen | "Look at me, my mp3 player doesn't make annoying beeps anymore, I'm so special." |
| 22:30.12 | elg | I tried to play with it and my battery promptly died |
| 22:30.24 | elg | so I have to wait ntil I get home too |
| 22:30.26 | sjansen | heh |
| 22:31.03 | sjansen | Yeah, but you're closer to home. I'm a couple states away. And I've been Windows free for 7 years, so I'm going to have to ask a friend for help. |
| 22:31.19 | sjansen | Which is just plain embarrassing. |
| 22:31.23 | elg | hehe |
| 22:31.34 | elg | ask a student |
| 22:31.46 | sjansen | "You should only use Linux like me, your life will be happier... and you won't be able to upgrade your MP3 player." |
| 22:31.49 | elg | don't some of your students have windows on their laptops, at least as a dual boot? |
| 22:31.56 | elg | give extra credit |
| 22:31.58 | elg | ;-) |
| 22:32.28 | sjansen | Ask a student to install random software downloaded off the Internet onto a Windows box? I'd like to think they're smarter than that. |
| 22:32.48 | elg | ok, give extra points off then |
| 22:32.54 | sjansen | heh |
| 22:34.13 | elg | or should we say extra debit |
| 22:34.50 | elg | that could be funny, but it might be backwards. if you start saying debit you might find that extra debit means extra credit more than extra credit does |
| 22:34.56 | *** join/#utah tristanbob (n=tristan@oalug/member/tristanbob) |
| 22:35.06 | elg | i dn't know, i'd have to turn on the accounting part of my brain to figure that one out |
| 22:35.30 | Tene | http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3A%21*%21jodie-2007%21*%21&diff=125645541&oldid=116536639 |
| 22:39.04 | sjansen | Tene: Wow. That makes me feel old... so old. |
| 22:39.24 | sjansen | Joints stiffening... Mind slowing down... Spelling improving... |
| 22:42.08 | ScytheBlade1 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:%21%2A%21jodie-2007%21%2A%21 |
| 22:42.12 | ScytheBlade1 | That's horrible |
| 22:43.14 | elg | i mean wud u??? |
| 22:43.45 | elg | i find it amusing that underneath it all it's the same conversation teenage girls have been having for eons |
| 22:46.13 | *** join/#utah tristanbob (n=tristan@oalug/member/tristanbob) |
| 22:46.39 | tristanbob | anyone using dual-monitors with twinview? one vga and one dvi? |
| 22:46.56 | tristanbob | what did you modify in xorg.conf? |
| 22:46.59 | ScytheBlade1 | Dual DVI here |
| 22:47.06 | elg | is the dvi a red herring? |
| 22:47.12 | elg | (or th vga) |
| 22:47.22 | tristanbob | vga is working, dvi is not |
| 22:47.40 | ScytheBlade1 | I'll give you my xorg.conf, but I can't be of much more help than that :/ |
| 22:47.47 | tristanbob | I had two vga working fine, but I purchased a dvi monitor |
| 22:47.56 | tristanbob | ScytheBlade1: ok - pastebin? |
| 22:48.03 | ScytheBlade1 | Does the single DVI work fine? |
| 22:48.24 | tristanbob | ScytheBlade1: how can I test that? I see the bios screen on both monitors |
| 22:48.32 | Tene | tristanbob: works fine for me |
| 22:48.41 | tristanbob | but when X starts it only comes up on the vga |
| 22:48.46 | ScytheBlade1 | Ahh, okay |
| 22:49.01 | ScytheBlade1 | Sec |
| 22:49.12 | ScytheBlade1 | Pastebin isn't working.. |
| 22:49.58 | ScytheBlade1 | http://pastebin.ca/456631 <-- I'm not canadian, I swear |
| 22:50.10 | elg | ~blame canada |
| 22:50.12 | ibot | ACTION blames canada (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 22:50.28 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 22:50.39 | lukfugl | ~blame Quebec |
| 22:50.41 | ibot | ACTION blames Quebec (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 22:52.42 | *** part/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 22:52.44 | Keighvin | ~blame |
| 22:53.21 | elg | -excuse |
| 22:53.22 | brac | interrupt configuration error |
| 22:53.55 | Keighvin | ~java brac |
| 22:53.57 | ibot | Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: brac |
| 22:54.18 | elg | ~bash Keighvin |
| 22:54.19 | ibot | ACTION beats Keighvin with ksh |
| 22:54.28 | lukfugl | -ri elg |
| 22:54.39 | elg | -excuse |
| 22:54.41 | brac | Jan 9 16:41:27 huber su: 'su root' succeeded for .... on /dev/pts/1 |
| 22:55.08 | Keighvin | Is brac configurable? |
| 22:55.16 | elg | brac, are you configurable? |
| 22:55.17 | brac | don't ask me |
| 22:55.40 | lukfugl | brac, you are configurable |
| 22:55.41 | brac | but you are funny |
| 22:55.50 | lukfugl | -lart brac |
| 22:55.51 | elg | -chat harleypig wears |
| 22:55.52 | brac | harleypig wears |
| 22:55.55 | lukfugl | ~lart brac |
| 22:55.55 | ibot | squeezes brac till brac turns blue like papa smurf |
| 22:56.02 | elg | -chat harleypig wearing |
| 22:56.02 | brac | harleypig wearing |
| 22:56.07 | lukfugl | -chat about harleypig thong |
| 22:56.08 | brac | harleypig thong |
| 22:56.31 | lukfugl | -chat about elg |
| 22:56.31 | brac | elg went |
| 22:56.51 | elg | -chat and harleypig |
| 22:56.52 | brac | and harleypig were recent participants in a psychology paper in general |
| 22:57.06 | Tene | http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Miscellaneous&diff=prev&oldid=106758400 |
| 22:57.11 | elg | i knew it. harleypig experiments |
| 22:57.12 | lukfugl | now we only need to know *who* and harleypig... |
| 22:58.07 | lukfugl | on the wikipedia reference desk's flight? |
| 23:01.52 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=Jake@65.246.47.187) |
| 23:20.37 | *** join/#utah tristanbob (n=tristan@oalug/member/tristanbob) |
| 23:21.05 | tristanbob | good news - sort of - I got the dvi side to work... but without the VGA side |
| 23:26.51 | *** join/#utah tristanbob (n=tristan@oalug/member/tristanbob) |
| 23:28.28 | elg | -lart lukfugl |
| 23:42.38 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@70.5.231.20) |
| 23:54.24 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=UNKNOWN@sp1.cotse.net) |
| 23:57.09 | *** join/#utah tuxd00d (n=tuxinato@128.187.169.195) |
