| 00:00.05 | nick125 | hahahaha |
| 00:02.13 | findlay | ~tubes |
| 00:02.48 | findlay | ibot: the tubes are actually filled with aerodynamic, efficient squirrls, each with carrying packet on their back and they run back and forth ferrying packets from switch to switch and router to router |
| 00:02.50 | ibot | okay, findlay |
| 00:05.15 | *** join/#utah calvarez (i=calvarez@lawn-128-61-120-35.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 00:05.31 | calvarez | thoughts about the Microsoft-Novell affair? |
| 00:05.36 | findlay | ~the tubes |
| 00:05.42 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@129.81.70.216) |
| 00:05.59 | findlay | hm |
| 00:06.02 | findlay | ~the |
| 00:06.10 | findlay | ~tubes |
| 00:06.11 | ibot | tubes are actually filled with aerodynamic, efficient squirrls, each with carrying packet on their back and they run back and forth ferrying packets from switch to switch and router to router |
| 00:06.33 | Keighvin | ~weaselstomp findlay |
| 00:06.34 | ibot | ACTION dons a viking helm, spreads some mayonnaise, and gives findlay a good hard STOMP. Repeatedly. |
| 00:07.44 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@129.81.70.216) |
| 00:08.05 | findlay | ibot: -onjoin -#utah -elg |
| 00:09.28 | Keighvin | ibot: onjoin #utah -elg |
| 00:09.29 | ibot | ok, Keighvin |
| 00:09.48 | elg | ~onjoin -elg |
| 00:09.48 | ibot | ok, elg |
| 00:09.55 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@129.81.70.216) |
| 00:10.31 | tubbybubba | okay, folks, here's an poem referencing a current event: |
| 00:10.42 | tubbybubba | <bubba> /The smart folks of Utah, collectively,/can correct our problems effectively:/For Hatch and his kid/hope for the stupid/in voters and juries, respectively./ |
| 00:19.26 | findlay | ibot: onjoin #utah elg It's never going to go away |
| 00:19.26 | ibot | findlay: ok |
| 00:20.54 | calvarez | ibot, onjoin #utah findlay I'm not your onjoin ho! |
| 00:20.54 | ibot | calvarez: ok |
| 00:20.57 | calvarez | ;) |
| 00:21.55 | nick125 | haha |
| 00:23.53 | findlay | ~lart voting machines and the malevolent people who pedal them |
| 00:24.38 | elg | ~spell anthropomorphize |
| 00:26.37 | calvarez | ~blamebush calvarez still needs to finish his animation project |
| 00:26.39 | ibot | Obviously, it is the current administration's fault that calvarez still needs to finish his animation project. |
| 00:28.40 | macnewbold | ~lart brac |
| 00:28.44 | macnewbold | -lart ibot |
| 00:30.34 | mheath[laptop] | Wow. I'm actually mildly impressed by VB .NET 2005. |
| 00:30.39 | mheath[laptop] | Never thought I'd say that |
| 00:33.32 | findlay | way to go mheath[laptop] you made TimRiker quit by saying that |
| 00:36.49 | atoponce | ibot: bash > VB.NET 2005 |
| 00:36.51 | ibot | ACTION beats > VB.NET 2005 with ksh |
| 00:36.59 | atoponce | lol |
| 00:37.38 | findlay | heh |
| 00:42.16 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=herlo@71-219-19-242.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 00:55.17 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 01:03.07 | *** join/#utah [Utah]tristanbob (i=tristanb@137.190.3.107) |
| 01:08.27 | *** join/#utah Tene (n=tene@poipu/supporter/slacker/tene) |
| 01:29.01 | *** join/#utah billyjean (n=bob@c-24-10-218-42.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 01:36.18 | findlay | is there an easy way to save and reload alsa settings for every control on a card? |
| 01:38.57 | findlay | guess it's in /etc/asound.state |
| 02:09.17 | Sargun | how'd you guess? |
| 02:09.47 | *** part/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 02:09.47 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 02:10.16 | Sargun | ~onjoin Sargun $date is another day without a date, right Sargun? |
| 02:10.16 | ibot | ok, Sargun |
| 02:10.19 | *** part/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 02:10.19 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 02:10.30 | Sargun | mhmm. |
| 02:26.13 | levi_home | Are you trying to make yourself more depressed, or what? |
| 02:29.32 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun: your comments on dating sound like my comments on the Marine Corps. |
| 02:30.16 | Tene | except lame |
| 02:31.24 | levi_home | Tene: You didn't think mheath's were lame? |
| 02:31.49 | levi_home | Pity parties are lame no matter who's throwing them. |
| 02:32.07 | Tene | mheath actually had some sort of content behind his comments. |
| 02:32.15 | *** join/#utah vex (i=nwood@stutter.prohosting.com) |
| 02:32.17 | levi_home | If I throw a pity party here, someone please call me on it. |
| 02:32.50 | Tene | And mheath has been working to do something about his situation, in general |
| 02:32.57 | Tene | Sargun just sits around and complains. |
| 02:33.37 | Tene | "omg girls don't throw themselves at me without me doing any work to make myself appealing to them. my situation is hopeless." |
| 02:34.26 | levi_home | Hey, I can remember several instances of Sargun attempting to do things to get girls to pay attention to him. |
| 02:34.59 | levi_home | They usually weren't great ideas, but that's beside the point. ;) |
| 02:35.03 | Tene | levi: I'm intentionally exaggerating and leaving out inconvenient facts in order to provide support for my particular point of view. |
| 02:35.16 | levi_home | Tene: Oh, well, carry on then. :) |
| 02:35.20 | Tene | You're not supposed to bring up those facts. It's rude. |
| 02:35.32 | Tene | Now, as I was saying, the earth is flat, and there's no proof to the contrary. |
| 02:38.48 | *** join/#utah calvarez (n=calvarez@r82h185.res.gatech.edu) |
| 02:38.49 | levi_home | Right, and it's sitting atop 4 elephants, who are standing on the back of a giant turtle. |
| 02:39.04 | calvarez | ta-da! |
| 02:41.42 | Tene | Turtles all the way down! |
| 02:48.35 | calvarez | BOOM! |
| 02:50.08 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=herlo@71-219-19-242.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 02:51.10 | Sargun | ok |
| 02:51.30 | Sargun | levi_home, sure. |
| 02:51.51 | Sargun | Various things have happened in the past few weeks to make my chances 0 |
| 02:53.47 | Tene | Sargun: just so you're properly warned, I'm going to intentionally misrepresent everything you say here later in order to present your attitude in a very negative way. |
| 02:54.02 | Tene | I'm trying to develop my trolling skills. |
| 02:54.06 | Sargun | Heh. |
| 02:54.17 | Sargun | Rather than being a good troll, your making me laugh |
| 02:54.25 | Sargun | So: Your being a horrible troll. |
| 02:54.26 | Tene | Well I haven't done the trolling yet! |
| 02:54.29 | Tene | Jerk. |
| 02:54.34 | Tene | ~lart Sargun |
| 02:54.43 | Tene | now I'm going to go watch Heroes! |
| 02:54.51 | Sargun | Cya, have fun. |
| 02:54.56 | Tene | Whine and complain while I'm gone so tha tI can mock you with lies when i return. |
| 02:56.49 | Sargun | Sure |
| 02:57.08 | Sargun | the ibot thing was supposed to be a joke |
| 02:57.44 | Sargun | ~onjoin mheath It is $date, and your still are not in the Marine Corps.! |
| 02:57.44 | ibot | ok, Sargun |
| 03:01.09 | Tene | Sargun: apostrophe |
| 03:01.37 | Sargun | no, full words = better. |
| 03:01.55 | Sargun | ~onjoin mheath It's $date, and your still not in the Marine Corps.! |
| 03:01.55 | ibot | ok, Sargun |
| 03:03.46 | Tene | also he's not going back, he's thinking about navy |
| 03:04.20 | Sargun | ~onjoin mheath It's $date, and your still not in any government organization whose job it is to kill people! |
| 03:04.20 | ibot | ok, Sargun |
| 03:04.54 | Sargun | Is that better? |
| 03:06.24 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@wsip-68-14-194-45.no.no.cox.net) |
| 03:07.02 | elg | I really should just take the /. feed out now |
| 03:07.26 | elg | the stupidity in just the feed itself is making me dumb |
| 03:08.08 | elg | "Global Warming Debunked?" One guy finds a well-written argument against global warming and claims shaken faith and it becomes that headline on /. |
| 03:14.35 | levi_home | At least Slashdot articles are not quite as dumb as Digg comments. |
| 03:14.58 | levi_home | When I read those, I found they were pretty much the dregs of the internet. |
| 03:20.29 | mheath[laptop] | Meh, weird place to ask, but I'm looking for any suggestions: Can anyone recommend a military-related (preferably Navy) movie that is PG rated? |
| 03:21.37 | *** join/#utah elg_ (n=fugalh@ip68-11-49-182.no.no.cox.net) |
| 03:23.00 | elg_ | top gun? |
| 03:23.00 | elg_ | is that pg? |
| 03:30.44 | Sargun | sword fish |
| 03:33.10 | levi_home | Swordfish is neither PG nor really military-related. |
| 03:40.51 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@ip68-11-49-182.no.no.cox.net) |
| 03:41.28 | Tene | what's the rating on Patton? |
| 03:46.15 | *** join/#utah calvarez (n=calvarez@r82h185.res.gatech.edu) |
| 03:47.52 | *** join/#utah mrpull-lt (n=jpollman@66.28.50.5) |
| 03:49.18 | elg | Tene: you mean platoon? R I think |
| 03:49.25 | elg | did you get my top gun suggestion? |
| 03:52.16 | levi_home | I'm pretty sure Patton is not the same as Platoon. |
| 03:52.36 | elg | oh is it something about some general named patton? |
| 03:52.44 | levi_home | Yeah. |
| 03:53.25 | levi_home | Apparently it was originally rated 'M' in the USA, and re-rated to PG. |
| 03:54.23 | levi_home | Also apparently a very highly-rated movie, and it won a bunch of awards. |
| 03:58.13 | findlay | ibot: you're sure a talker |
| 03:58.24 | findlay | ibot: onjoin #utah -elg |
| 03:58.24 | ibot | ok, findlay |
| 04:10.10 | maquis | anyone here have experience with tomcat? |
| 04:10.41 | findlay | the navy is retiring them |
| 04:10.52 | maquis | findlay: not that tomcat |
| 04:10.54 | findlay | it was a great, dramatic bird |
| 04:10.59 | elg | poisoned milk should work |
| 04:11.26 | Tene | I really enjoyed Patton. |
| 04:11.42 | maquis | anyone? |
| 04:11.44 | maquis | please? |
| 04:11.55 | elg | maquis: I've fought with it just enough to hate it |
| 04:11.57 | elg | what's up? |
| 04:12.07 | Tene | mheath[laptop]: I really enjoyed Patton, but I don't know what you want the movie for. Levi claims that it's rated PG. |
| 04:12.25 | maquis | elg: i've always used eclipse to compile / deploy... but i don't feel like dealing with VNC |
| 04:12.56 | elg | if you can get nx working that's really quite nice |
| 04:12.57 | maquis | so, i'm just trying to find some good search terms for figuring out how to make and deploy |
| 04:13.03 | elg | and it's not as hard these days |
| 04:13.14 | maquis | nx? |
| 04:13.23 | elg | nomachine.com |
| 04:13.25 | maquis | does that work on windoze? |
| 04:13.25 | elg | see also freenx |
| 04:13.31 | elg | that's the point |
| 04:13.36 | maquis | ah |
| 04:13.38 | maquis | ok |
| 04:13.38 | maquis | thanks |
| 04:13.42 | elg | well, actually |
| 04:13.52 | elg | are you VNCing into windows? |
| 04:13.55 | maquis | no |
| 04:14.00 | elg | iow is tomcat on windows |
| 04:14.02 | maquis | vnc-ing from windows into linux |
| 04:14.10 | elg | ok, yeah. nx will work great |
| 04:14.14 | maquis | cool |
| 04:14.23 | maquis | hopefully i don't need admin to install the windows half |
| 04:14.24 | elg | nx runs on unix bxes but the client works on all platforms |
| 04:14.38 | elg | hopefully |
| 04:14.38 | maquis | i've got root on the linux box, but not on the windoze box |
| 04:14.59 | elg | hack it |
| 04:15.05 | mrpull-lt | maquis: RDP is a better option than VNC IMHO |
| 04:15.23 | elg | neither is very nice for linux |
| 04:15.29 | elg | accessing linux that is |
| 04:15.57 | findlay | there used to be a time when I tried to be helpful when maquis asked a question, but since then I've turned #utah into a den of quippers |
| 04:16.06 | mrpull-lt | elg: true. I don't need anything beyond an SSH client to connect from windows to a linux machine |
| 04:16.32 | elg | maquis: that's a good insight - if you're on a LAN good ol' ssh -X would be fine |
| 04:16.34 | findlay | there's always X |
| 04:16.40 | elg | assuming you have cygwin or something. :) |
| 04:17.08 | elg | you don't need root for that, btw |
| 04:17.14 | elg | for X in windows |
| 04:17.14 | elg | http://xlivecd.indiana.edu/ |
| 04:17.18 | elg | just burn ya one of those |
| 04:17.27 | maquis | elg: yeah... except i'm remote |
| 04:17.29 | elg | stick it in and instant X with an xterm |
| 04:17.38 | elg | yeah, that's less fun. nx is what you want |
| 04:17.38 | mrpull-lt | oh wait... I thought maquis was going from linux to windows. am I backward? |
| 04:17.40 | findlay | no vpn? |
| 04:17.47 | maquis | and eclipse is painfully slow |
| 04:17.50 | maquis | findlay: yes... vpn |
| 04:17.56 | Tene | nx is good for remote. |
| 04:17.58 | maquis | but the connection is not exceptionally fast |
| 04:18.00 | elg | vpn or no, bandwidth is the issue |
| 04:18.07 | maquis | and it's even slower with eclipse |
| 04:18.07 | elg | and latency |
| 04:18.09 | findlay | doesn't vpn mean that it's like a lan? |
| 04:18.13 | elg | nope |
| 04:18.21 | elg | it means you have a virtual private network |
| 04:18.32 | Tene | like a virtual lan run over the internet. |
| 04:18.40 | maquis | findlay: a vpn doesn't suddenly give you LAN-like bandwidth |
| 04:18.45 | findlay | yes |
| 04:18.46 | elg | which is as much like a LAN as a violin is like an orchestra |
| 04:18.53 | mrpull-lt | with overhead of encryption that normally isn't there when it is a local lan |
| 04:18.57 | findlay | oh, I get it now |
| 04:19.08 | findlay | (: |
| 04:19.32 | findlay | but maquis said remote |
| 04:19.47 | maquis | findlay: yes... i'm remote |
| 04:19.58 | maquis | curses... why can't it be in yum? |
| 04:20.06 | Tene | Because it hates you! |
| 04:20.09 | findlay | but simultaneously in the same room. How can this be? |
| 04:20.14 | Tene | maquis: check freenx |
| 04:20.24 | maquis | yum search nx only gives lynx |
| 04:20.31 | Tene | findlay: the power of abstraction! |
| 04:20.37 | maquis | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:20.44 | findlay | its a quantum entanglement |
| 04:21.01 | maquis | so, does nobody know how to compile anad deploy war files manually? |
| 04:21.22 | findlay | maquis: why are you so predisposed to kick me? |
| 04:22.00 | elg | maquis: no freenx? |
| 04:22.21 | maquis | elg: not in yum |
| 04:22.27 | maquis | and i don't feel like tracking down dependencies |
| 04:22.43 | findlay | maquis: what repos do you have? |
| 04:22.58 | elg | there is nomachine's free as in beer version |
| 04:23.05 | elg | they might have an RPM. probably do. they had a deb |
| 04:23.58 | elg | freenx can be a pain, although they might have an rpm on their site. http://freenx.berlios.de/ |
| 04:24.10 | elg | freenx is more libre |
| 04:24.44 | elg | but nx is more polished, and mostly libre software under its candy coating |
| 04:27.15 | maquis | stupid connection |
| 04:28.21 | findlay | ~lart connection |
| 04:28.23 | maquis | elg: nomachine's version requires dependencies |
| 04:28.55 | elg | vnc it is! |
| 04:29.01 | maquis | yup |
| 04:29.05 | maquis | i guess so |
| 04:29.13 | elg | ok. no complaining |
| 04:29.15 | maquis | it should be possible to do this all via the command-line, though |
| 04:29.43 | elg | with java, the question you should be asking is not whether it's possible, but how little effort can you get away with |
| 04:29.52 | maquis | yeah |
| 04:29.53 | maquis | well... |
| 04:30.16 | maquis | i'm putting in extra hours on this project because i just want to get it done so i can move on to something that's not java + tomcat |
| 04:31.20 | elg | right and you want to do it with as few extra hours as possible |
| 04:31.37 | maquis | yes |
| 04:31.40 | elg | so the question is will hunting dependencies be more fun that fighting vnc |
| 04:31.51 | elg | or more/less time |
| 04:32.15 | levi_home | Grr. |
| 04:32.44 | levi_home | I'm trying to use \url in my .bib file, but LaTeX isn't liking it. |
| 04:32.44 | maquis | levi_home: agreed |
| 04:32.52 | Sargun | maquis, I know its a pain in the arse (tomcat) |
| 04:33.11 | maquis | Sargun: it's a major pain |
| 04:33.19 | maquis | just a little bit longer, though |
| 04:41.14 | findlay | maquis: why do you hate me so much? |
| 04:43.03 | mrpull-lt | the Raiders are terrible |
| 04:43.20 | levi_home | Ahh, I've finally got my rfc citation correct, I think. |
| 04:44.32 | mrpull-lt | levi_home: you are citing an RFC in a paper? |
| 04:45.28 | Tene | http://www.projectwonderful.com/ |
| 04:46.01 | Tene | Hmm. Mischan. |
| 04:46.27 | findlay | I guess she's ignoring me |
| 04:46.29 | mrpull-lt | I saw a slick web page that would create bibliographies and endnotes automatically |
| 04:54.01 | maquis | findlay: i don't |
| 04:54.21 | maquis | gah! stupid thing just started working for no reason whatsoever |
| 04:55.39 | maquis | or maybe not |
| 04:56.13 | maquis | uh oh |
| 04:56.52 | maquis | anyone know who the seahawks are playing tonight? |
| 04:57.47 | maquis | ah... according to espn, we were playing the raiders... and supposedly, we won |
| 04:58.00 | maquis | mrpull-lt: is that the game you were referring to? |
| 05:06.47 | *** join/#utah el_gaucho (n=bigdog@zeus.thebigdog.biz) |
| 05:06.48 | levi_home | mrpull-lt: Yes, I'm citing an RFC in a paper. |
| 05:07.05 | *** part/#utah el_gaucho (n=bigdog@zeus.thebigdog.biz) |
| 05:07.12 | maquis | perhaps ibot does... |
| 05:07.34 | *** join/#utah vontrapp (n=von@71.35.254.49) |
| 05:07.56 | Sargun | good morning |
| 05:11.39 | mrpull-lt | maquis: yeah seahawks spanked the raiders |
| 05:11.45 | mrpull-lt | the raiders are a big letdown |
| 05:12.11 | mrpull-lt | levi_home: nevermind about the auto citation machine... it didn't have RFC as an option |
| 05:12.19 | Sargun | aren't those different leagues? |
| 05:12.47 | mrpull-lt | Sargun: Seattle vs Oakland? |
| 05:13.12 | Sargun | I thought seahawks were hockey. |
| 05:14.11 | mrpull-lt | maybe, but not the Seattle Seahawks of the NFL |
| 05:15.01 | mrpull-lt | that game was of interest to me... I used to have Randy Moss and now have Alexander in my Fantasy Football linueup |
| 05:15.10 | mrpull-lt | both are a bust this year |
| 05:25.30 | findlay | heh footbal |
| 05:25.40 | findlay | who wants football when you could be listening to Dvorak |
| 05:26.02 | findlay | ibot: hug maquis |
| 05:26.04 | ibot | ACTION gets a running start and tackle-hugs maquis |
| 05:26.24 | Tene | Is it even worth going out to vote tomorrow? Would I even make any difference at all? |
| 05:26.29 | findlay | heh, take that |
| 05:27.03 | findlay | ~differentiate Tene |
| 05:27.12 | Tene | Even if I would theoretically make a difference, could I trust the voting machines? |
| 05:27.22 | findlay | Tene: not if you work the knobs of one of those vote eating machines |
| 05:27.31 | findlay | request a paper ballot |
| 05:27.39 | findlay | they are required to let you do that |
| 05:27.45 | findlay | I did |
| 05:28.30 | Tene | If the voting machines were compromised, my single valid ballot would be easily outweighed by manipulated electronic ballots, so it wouldn't really matter |
| 05:29.42 | elg | we had a fill-in-the-oval thing |
| 05:29.46 | elg | when I voted early |
| 05:30.01 | elg | and then you stick it in a scantron-like machine |
| 05:30.21 | elg | so they have the paper version and the electronic counting |
| 05:30.36 | Tene | I have trouble believing that my vote would matter anyway, especially here in Utah. |
| 05:30.38 | levi_home | Now to figure out how to cite an IEEE spec document... |
| 05:30.49 | elg | seems smart to me. although the ovals were too big and therefore a pain to fill properly. They should have just used regular ol' scantron technology instead of getting fancy |
| 05:31.00 | levi_home | Tene: There are plenty of races where your vote would make a difference, I'm sure. |
| 05:31.18 | findlay | indeed |
| 05:31.52 | elg | Tene: you don't vote because your vote would change the outcome. you vote because it's there |
| 05:31.56 | levi_home | Tene: There are probably also some ballot propositions or something. |
| 05:32.07 | elg | if everyone votes, it works. if everyone doesn't vote out of frustration, it doesn't |
| 05:32.27 | elg | in other words, you're a statistic. better than not being a statistic, when it comes to voting. :) |
| 05:32.27 | findlay | yes, elg is right |
| 05:32.42 | Tene | And what if everyone votes, but, for example, blindly votes on party lines? |
| 05:33.00 | findlay | then you stood up for what you belive in |
| 05:33.24 | findlay | it's not about everyone else. It's about excercizing your right to democracy |
| 05:33.35 | elg | it doesn't take a majority vote to make a difference. if so and so only won the election by a hair instead of a landslide, it changes what he does (if he's up for reelection) |
| 05:34.01 | elg | it's not about excercising a right, to me |
| 05:34.15 | findlay | what is it then? |
| 05:35.08 | elg | it's simple numbers. ok, so one vote may not be the deciding factor but the sand on the beach is one grain at a time nonetheless |
| 05:35.38 | elg | if you vote, you're counted. if you don't vote, you're not |
| 05:35.49 | findlay | true |
| 05:40.33 | elg | it's as simple as that. if you can't bother to be counted, you don't care enough to complain |
| 05:42.26 | elg | if you're feeling despair about not mattering, vote for someone outside the two main parties. libertarian for example |
| 05:42.34 | elg | it's fun. you should try it |
| 05:43.04 | elg | makes you feel independent. like a member of the rebellion in star wars |
| 05:55.11 | synic | is there a way to tell python-pgsql to automatically truncate data that's too long for the target field? |
| 05:55.21 | synic | er.. wrong channel, heh |
| 05:56.10 | mheath[laptop] | I need to learn more Japanese |
| 05:56.39 | mheath[laptop] | Japanese movies with English subtitles really annoy me. I can't understand with just Japanese, but I know enough Japanese to understand that the subtitles are crap. |
| 05:56.44 | mheath[laptop] | Translated in weird ways. |
| 06:03.47 | Tene | try French subtitles instead. |
| 06:04.37 | findlay | don't you mean Freedom subtitles? |
| 06:06.58 | mheath[laptop] | bah, I shouldn't have watched this video. |
| 06:07.06 | mheath[laptop] | Depressing......Very...Very...depressing. |
| 06:07.16 | mheath[laptop] | (not refering to the one with the messed up subtitles) |
| 06:08.21 | mheath[laptop] | http://www.devildogs.info/1108%20D%201034.wmv |
| 06:08.28 | mheath[laptop] | I really shouldn't have watched that....bah. |
| 06:16.51 | Tene | you shouldn't watch it but we should? |
| 06:17.24 | mheath[laptop] | Tene: Meh, not sure why I posted it. |
| 06:17.33 | mheath[laptop] | I doubt you'd mind it, but I doubt you'd care much about it |
| 06:17.39 | Tene | what is it? |
| 06:18.45 | mheath[laptop] | Tene: Just a video camera panning over all the recruits in Platoon 1034, Delta Company, Recruit Training Regiment, MCRD San Diego. |
| 06:18.52 | Tene | 'kay |
| 06:19.21 | mheath[laptop] | With and audio track of Drill Instructor Staff Sargeant Anderon calling cadence. |
| 06:19.27 | maquis | mrpull-lt: good to hear that atleast the seahawks did well |
| 06:19.37 | maquis | thanks to the game, it took me an extra hour to get home tonight |
| 06:19.46 | Tene | Gah. SHUT UP, Nagios! |
| 06:20.08 | Tene | No, that doesn't mean send me more messages. |
| 06:20.11 | mheath[laptop] | Gah! That scares me! |
| 06:20.27 | mheath[laptop] | ~protect me from Drill Instructor Staff Sargeant Leek |
| 06:20.33 | ibot | ACTION sees a grenade rolling toward me from Drill Instructor Staff Sargeant Leek, and leaps onto it. |
| 06:20.33 | Tene | What scares you? |
| 06:20.43 | mheath[laptop] | Tene: A picture of Drill Instructor Staff Sargeant Leek. |
| 06:21.25 | mheath[laptop] | DI SSGT Leek seemed to want to make me his personal project. |
| 06:21.34 | Sargun | Anyone in here into zodiac? |
| 06:21.40 | mheath[laptop] | About half of my current muscle mass is directly attribute to DI SSG Leek |
| 06:21.47 | mheath[laptop] | *attributable |
| 06:21.57 | Tene | unless that's the name of an open-source project, Sargun, no |
| 06:22.05 | mheath[laptop] | But, I'll shut up now |
| 06:22.10 | mheath[laptop] | Like I said, I shouldn't have watched that video |
| 06:22.26 | mheath[laptop] | But its interesting. Apparently my platoon is graduating on Wednesday, rather than this Friday. They were supposed to graduate on the Marine Corps birthday... |
| 06:22.29 | Sargun | heh |
| 06:23.07 | mheath[laptop] | Or rather, "the platoon I was once in". It would probably disgust them to hear me say "my platoon". |
| 06:26.34 | Sargun | mheath[laptop], then do they have contact with the outside world? |
| 06:27.19 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun: tomorrow they will. |
| 06:27.31 | mheath[laptop] | My old platoon |
| 06:27.45 | mheath[laptop] | Tomorrow they get their Eagle, Globe, and Achor, and become united states marines |
| 06:27.46 | Sargun | How do you know? |
| 06:27.49 | mheath[laptop] | then they spend the day with their family |
| 06:28.02 | mheath[laptop] | and, on wednesday, they graduate. |
| 06:28.26 | Sargun | Fun. |
| 06:28.28 | mheath[laptop] | Lucky me. Rather than getting my EGA tomorrow, I get to take To Go orders at Applebees! My life is oh-so-fufilling. |
| 06:28.33 | Sargun | Ah, where do they get shipped out to from here on? |
| 06:28.47 | Sargun | I would think that Apple bees wouldn't be too bad. |
| 06:28.53 | mheath[laptop] | .... |
| 06:28.55 | Tene | ... |
| 06:29.07 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=herlo@71-219-19-242.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 06:30.53 | mheath[laptop] | OK, time for sleep. |
| 06:31.20 | Tene | g'night |
| 06:31.59 | findlay | .... |
| 06:32.13 | findlay | ~bee |
| 06:32.17 | ibot | it has been said that bee is soon going to be converted to a Linux chick by Jenson whether she likes it or not |
| 06:32.49 | findlay | ibot: how do you feel that I'm always trying to include you in our conversations? |
| 06:33.51 | Tene | ~apple |
| 06:33.53 | ibot | apple is a "different" computer company :). They are currently known for the iMac, eMac, PowerMac, XServe, iPod, iBook, and Titanium Powerbook. Their computers use (motorola) PowerPC processors, of the G3 (750) and G4 (74XX) nature. the G4 processor has vector processing known as "altivec". Apple can be found at http://www.apple.com, or apple recently adopted the ... |
| 06:34.02 | Tene | ~apple_(fruit) |
| 06:35.00 | mheath[laptop] | ~bed maquis |
| 06:35.01 | ibot | ACTION tucks maquis into a warm bed. |
| 06:35.16 | Tene | ~chlorophorm maquis |
| 06:35.17 | maquis | i want to get this stupid thing working first |
| 06:35.40 | mheath[laptop] | why is the bed warm? |
| 06:35.50 | mheath[laptop] | if your beds already warm, someones been sleeping in it already |
| 06:36.14 | Tene | you, in the future |
| 06:36.59 | mheath[laptop] | You know what.... |
| 06:37.09 | findlay | me in the future? |
| 06:37.22 | findlay | ibot: do you know what? |
| 06:37.24 | ibot | yes, I know what. |
| 06:37.26 | Tene | Yes, it's future-heat, leaking into the past |
| 06:37.29 | Sargun | mheath[laptop], then you probably don't wanna get into that bed if it is warm |
| 06:37.31 | findlay | well, ibot does |
| 06:38.06 | findlay | Tene: the angle of the light cones don't even break even on the world lines |
| 06:38.27 | findlay | certainly not point backwards |
| 06:38.28 | mheath[laptop] | Times for sleep. |
| 06:38.34 | findlay | wow, that would be a wierd reality |
| 06:38.53 | maquis | which is warm because of the fuzziness, not because of other people being in it, nor because of future-heat |
| 06:38.54 | mheath[laptop] | ~uncurl maquis |
| 06:38.55 | findlay | would you like some java with that? |
| 06:38.59 | Sargun | Why is it warm? |
| 06:39.15 | Sargun | heh |
| 06:39.16 | findlay | Sargun: because Tene maladjusted the light cones |
| 06:39.16 | Sargun | nevermind |
| 06:39.23 | Sargun | Stupid Tene |
| 06:39.59 | maquis | why won't the stupid thing work? |
| 06:40.06 | Sargun | wha? |
| 06:40.33 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: Future Heat is overheating it. |
| 06:41.50 | findlay | ibot: Future Heat is what makes beds warm, as in 'nice warm bed', because you in the future heated it |
| 06:41.52 | ibot | okay, findlay |
| 06:42.46 | maquis | doh... 6 hours til morning |
| 06:43.14 | mheath[laptop] | Yes, which is why I need to stop slacking off and GET IN BED |
| 06:43.15 | mheath[laptop] | ~lart me |
| 06:44.35 | maquis | ouch |
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| 06:57.08 | Sargun | Whats the difference between an extremely close friend, and a girlfriend? |
| 06:57.28 | vontrapp | the girlfriend you make out with |
| 07:01.22 | vontrapp | or the one that's a girl |
| 07:02.05 | Sargun | I'm leaning to extremely close friend, so when something goes wrong, everything doesn't go to hell |
| 07:13.08 | findlay | a girlfriend is a waste of time and emotional energy, and often a robber of virtue |
| 07:13.20 | findlay | a close friend is much less stressful |
| 07:13.49 | findlay | a girlfriend is an excuse to make out |
| 07:14.51 | findlay | which is not a very wholesome pastime anyway |
| 07:51.22 | Sargun | heh |
| 07:51.54 | levi_home | It is pretty fun, though. ;) |
| 07:52.13 | Sargun | In my experience it isn't... |
| 07:52.23 | Sargun | having to always think before you say stuff != fun. |
| 07:52.37 | Sargun | crapp girlfriends = easy to get. good ones != easy to find. |
| 07:54.36 | levi_home | Learning to think before speaking is a good thing. |
| 07:54.51 | levi_home | It will get you far in life, and not just with girls. |
| 07:55.01 | Sargun | heh |
| 07:55.05 | Sargun | well you can |
| 07:55.12 | Sargun | 't even speak anything close to the truth |
| 07:55.23 | levi_home | Sure you can. |
| 07:55.26 | Sargun | with a bad girlfriend, I've learned. |
| 07:55.55 | Sargun | "Sargun, do you think I'm dumb?" |
| 07:55.58 | Sargun | "Yes." |
| 07:56.01 | Sargun | -slap- |
| 07:56.34 | levi_home | Well, you have to be tactful. Another excellent skill to learn. |
| 07:57.02 | Sargun | so, how do you respond to that? |
| 07:58.36 | levi_home | Well, first of all, I wouldn't be dating someone I thought was dumb. But if by some bizarre turn of events I was, I would find some way in which she wasn't dumb to mention. |
| 07:59.02 | levi_home | Dumbness is rarely a binary state; someone can be smart in some areas and dumb in others. |
| 07:59.51 | Sargun | if you don't realize they are dumb until you begin dating them? |
| 08:00.36 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@cobra.mcnabbs.org) |
| 08:00.49 | levi_home | Then you say something to the effect that you're just not compatible, or somesuch. |
| 08:01.10 | levi_home | Surely you could think of things like this. |
| 08:01.45 | levi_home | Anyway, I must sleep. |
| 08:04.54 | Sargun | night |
| 08:04.56 | Sargun | have fun |
| 08:05.00 | Sargun | counting sheep |
| 08:05.08 | Sargun | emcnabb, Where is cobra located? |
| 08:44.52 | findlay | wherever the snakes are |
| 08:51.26 | Sargun | Isn't cobra the enemy of the GI Joes? :-P |
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| 13:54.31 | calvarez | remember, vote today! |
| 13:55.00 | calvarez | Americans that don't vote are n00bs |
| 13:55.35 | jsmith | calvarez: We finally agree on something! |
| 13:56.51 | calvarez | ROFL, Grand Theft Mario http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICoDFooBXpU |
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| 14:41.28 | atoponce | i voted |
| 14:42.39 | goozbach | so, what does it take to cause 5 different flamewars on PLUG? |
| 14:42.50 | goozbach | answer: $10,000 |
| 14:42.52 | goozbach | :) |
| 14:45.52 | graphyx | Must be one of those you had to be there things. |
| 14:47.57 | goozbach | it's late but, my name is goozbach, and I approve this topic |
| 14:48.13 | goozbach | thanks for the support #utah |
| 14:48.39 | goozbach | jsmith: my campaign promise is to never go to Texas de Brazil again. |
| 14:48.50 | goozbach | can I count on your vote? |
| 14:49.01 | jsmith | Definitely! |
| 14:49.12 | graphyx | Vote for what? |
| 14:49.20 | jsmith | Especially when you helped subsidize my salary ;-) |
| 14:49.22 | graphyx | President of the windows haters club? |
| 14:50.29 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 14:50.37 | levi | Heh, Grand Theft Mario. |
| 15:01.00 | spr | So for the first time in 3 months I had some fast food, Wendys, yesterday. |
| 15:01.09 | spr | Now I'm not so sure it was a good idea. |
| 15:01.26 | calvarez | if you need fast food, try Subways |
| 15:01.45 | calvarez | I don't know if it qualifies as "fast food" entirely, but it is good |
| 15:01.53 | calvarez | or at least not as bad |
| 15:01.56 | spr | I don't qualify that as "fast food" :) Too healthy. |
| 15:02.35 | calvarez | hehe yea |
| 15:02.43 | calvarez | hmm, smoothies should be considered fast food themn |
| 15:02.44 | spr | I'm just surprised at how badly my system is handling it, given I used to have it pretty often. |
| 15:02.54 | calvarez | the amounts of sugar in those things are poisonous |
| 15:03.14 | calvarez | Jamba Juice is the biggest lie ever |
| 15:03.21 | spr | :) I lived off Jamba Juice one year. Very Tasty. |
| 15:03.27 | calvarez | more calories than a Big Mac |
| 15:03.32 | calvarez | not kidding |
| 15:03.36 | spr | I know. |
| 15:04.23 | calvarez | and there are new studies that suggest that what matters is total amount of calorie intake, and how much of those calories come from fat |
| 15:04.40 | calvarez | in other words, with respect to obesity, calorie excess is what matters, regardless of source |
| 15:04.52 | calvarez | fat calories are a concern only with regards to cholesterol levels |
| 15:05.12 | calvarez | but Jamba Juice makes you fat just as much as a Big Mac |
| 15:05.44 | calvarez | when I went to BYU, I loved to walk by Jamba Juice at the Wilkinson Center to laugh at people who thought their choice was "healthy" |
| 15:07.50 | spr | I think it's still better than McDonalds, but I wouldn't say "healthy" |
| 15:08.05 | calvarez | better as in tastier, yes |
| 15:08.11 | levi | calvarez: I didn't think that was particularly new information, but getting it more widely known is certainly a good thing. |
| 15:08.12 | *** join/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 15:08.38 | calvarez | levi, the idea that non-fat calories are just as basd as fat calories is pretty new |
| 15:08.39 | spr | Of course Jamba Juice now as "all fruit" smoothies where they don't put in the sherbet or anything else |
| 15:08.46 | spr | Those actually might be good. |
| 15:08.48 | calvarez | research from about 3 yrs ago |
| 15:08.59 | vontrapp | blast |
| 15:09.02 | vontrapp | didn't get through |
| 15:09.06 | calvarez | spr, they'll be terrific when they stop adding sugar |
| 15:09.14 | vontrapp | who knows what time the polls close? |
| 15:09.17 | calvarez | THEN they'll be somewhat healthy |
| 15:09.25 | calvarez | vontrapp, they closed at 4PM |
| 15:09.26 | levi | calvarez: I've assumed all calories were just as bad for more than 3 years. Maybe I was doing so without research to back me up. :P |
| 15:09.35 | calvarez | levi, hehe, probably |
| 15:09.39 | calvarez | but you and I agree |
| 15:09.50 | vontrapp | are they going to postpone that because nobody could vote in the morning? |
| 15:09.53 | calvarez | vontrapp, nvm what I said |
| 15:10.01 | levi | Fats are just calorie-rich, so you tend to get a lot of calories when you use a lot of fat. |
| 15:10.10 | calvarez | I meant to say, they were open this morning from 2 to 4:30 AM |
| 15:10.33 | vontrapp | um, that's when they broke? |
| 15:10.33 | levi | Replacements for fats in 'fat-free' food tend to add just about as many calories, though. |
| 15:10.45 | calvarez | vontrapp, hehe, probably |
| 15:10.56 | vontrapp | i'm all for the all natural calories |
| 15:10.58 | spr | calvarez: looking at the Jamba site, the new all fruit ones might actually not have added sugar. Or at least a lot less. They're only about 300 calories each (compared to the 500) |
| 15:11.02 | calvarez | levi, in many cases they do |
| 15:11.28 | *** join/#utah mheath[laptop] (n=Mike@c-67-182-231-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 15:11.30 | calvarez | spr, good, now they managed to go from "unhealthy" to "non-critical" |
| 15:11.39 | calvarez | leave sugar out, and they become healthy |
| 15:11.55 | calvarez | or use Splenda |
| 15:12.02 | spr | I bet they don't taste as good though :) |
| 15:12.06 | vontrapp | blech, splenda |
| 15:12.09 | calvarez | no, Splenda doesn't cause cancer |
| 15:12.17 | calvarez | splenda is ok |
| 15:12.23 | calvarez | I like it, as a matter of fact |
| 15:12.26 | vontrapp | what does splenda have in it? |
| 15:12.41 | calvarez | it's sugar that has been modified so that your body doesn't absorve it |
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| 15:12.58 | mheath[laptop] | How do you know its good for you/ |
| 15:13.06 | mheath[laptop] | Or rather, not bad |
| 15:13.06 | calvarez | so, it's sugar. It doesn't taste LIKE sugar, it's sugar |
| 15:13.18 | mheath[laptop] | Humans have been surviving on the same foods of years |
| 15:13.24 | calvarez | well, it doesn't absorve and it doesn't cause cancer |
| 15:13.37 | mheath[laptop] | Then, a new product gets used for a few decads and suddenly you're sure its fine for you |
| 15:13.37 | calvarez | so, I know that it isn't bad as far as known health concerns go |
| 15:14.25 | calvarez | mheath[laptop], if a health concern arises with regards to it, then I'll stop using it. Right now I don't have a reason to believe it is bad |
| 15:14.49 | calvarez | but it is so with respect to the common usage of regular sugar |
| 15:18.50 | *** join/#utah vex (n=vex@216.194.126.99) |
| 15:19.50 | levi | And here I am, eating a packet of sugary instant oatmeal and drinking a Mountain Dew for breakfast. :P |
| 15:20.29 | graphyx | The worst thing about the elections is this. When a demorcrat or repub says to the people, I believe this and then the party says something different. What are they going to do. vote with the party or lose the campaign dollars that come from the party? |
| 15:20.47 | phinux | I wouldn't worry too much levi. I'll bet in a few years they discover that splenda doesn't absorb in your stomach so it clogs up your colon and causes cancer. |
| 15:20.54 | graphyx | So it seems that it doesn't really matter what the person things personally unless they can keep in the office without the party dollars. |
| 15:22.01 | goozbach | interesting, eat more == get fatter? who knew?! |
| 15:22.14 | goozbach | wow! |
| 15:22.24 | graphyx | We should sue all the grocery stores |
| 15:22.38 | graphyx | And get money from them cause they didn't put that on their doors when we went in to buy food. |
| 15:22.47 | graphyx | Otherwise I wouldn't have bought and eaten so much. |
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| 15:37.55 | vanderbault | Good morning. I just noticed that this place exists. Has anyone asked about sllug.org? I noticed that it's down. Anyone know what's up?? |
| 15:38.38 | levi | Sorry, no idea. |
| 15:38.53 | spr | works for me |
| 15:39.56 | vanderbault | ya, it's there. Just says it's Sovereign.Org and that there are no mailing lists available at ... woa |
| 15:40.08 | vanderbault | that was strange. now it's there. |
| 15:40.22 | vanderbault | Ok. * blush* :) |
| 15:48.33 | calvarez | graphyx, lol |
| 15:48.51 | calvarez | "Surgeon's warning: eating may cause you obesity" |
| 15:51.18 | vanderbault | Well. I will ask you the same question then. Is the best way to force all internet traffic through a proxy to use a transparent iptables setup? I didn't want to mess with having to configure the proxy on all my computers. If that is the best, how do you keep the logs showing the client ip instead of the router ip? |
| 15:51.43 | vanderbault | I used http://tldp.org/HOWTO/TransparentProxy-6.html as my guide. |
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| 15:54.49 | OrrinHatch2006 | ;) |
| 15:55.04 | vontrapp | ~voteout OrrinHatch2006 |
| 15:57.30 | OrrinHatch2006 | ~cerebellum vontrapp |
| 15:57.31 | ibot | ACTION takes orrinhatch2006's cerebellum and feeds it to ravenous wolvez |
| 15:57.40 | OrrinHatch2006 | ~whatiscerebellum |
| 15:57.42 | ibot | i guess whatiscerebellum is shutup calverez |
| 15:57.46 | OrrinHatch2006 | hahaaaaaha |
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| 16:01.51 | *** join/#utah redbeard1 (n=redbeard@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 16:02.30 | mheath[laptop] | ~lart Pete Ashdown |
| 16:02.57 | mheath[laptop] | I had some respect for him. Then I heard about his action figure advertisement |
| 16:03.29 | mheath[laptop] | And realized that, hes totally out of touch with the majority of voters, and he's also rather silly and dissillusioned |
| 16:05.54 | OrrinHatch2006 | he is out of touch. nevertheless, he seems like a cool guy |
| 16:06.06 | mheath[laptop] | yeah. I'm sure I'd like the guy |
| 16:06.07 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 16:06.31 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_ppc (n=pocketir@h460615fc.area1.spcsdns.net) |
| 16:06.34 | mheath[laptop] | Don't think I'd vote for him, compared to a decent guy (unfortunately, we have NO decent people) |
| 16:06.53 | xbmodder_ppc | hey all |
| 16:06.53 | OrrinHatch2006 | he's just a little too much into Hatch-bashing, and bashing opponents is a turn-off for me |
| 16:06.53 | mheath[laptop] | Heres xbmodder_ppc to show off his Mac. |
| 16:06.54 | xbmodder_ppc | its a pocketpc |
| 16:06.57 | xbmodder_ppc | not a mac |
| 16:07.06 | OrrinHatch2006 | xbmodder_ppc, do you like your BigMac? It's full of fat, you kn ow |
| 16:07.14 | xbmodder_ppc | that would be xbmodder_sh@! |
| 16:07.26 | OrrinHatch2006 | pocketpc |
| 16:07.35 | goozbach | food is bad for you |
| 16:07.39 | xbmodder_ppc | i hate mcdonalds/burger king |
| 16:07.41 | OrrinHatch2006 | my Zaurus will kill your pocketPC!! |
| 16:07.55 | goozbach | 100% of the people who get cancer have eaten food at least once in their lives |
| 16:07.58 | bonez41 | anyone here using hplip ? |
| 16:08.01 | xbmodder_ppc | but can it make calls at evdo speeds? |
| 16:08.03 | mheath[laptop] | OrrinHatch2006: If I ever ran for political office, I would focus entirely on my views. There would be no insults, no scandal provocation......I wouldn't call the opponent names, or say they slept with some woman......I wouldn't compare them to an action figure villains (like Ashdown does) |
| 16:08.11 | xbmodder_ppc | can you do sip calls? |
| 16:08.20 | mheath[laptop] | And I'd be logical, admit defeat, and not try to lie, cheat, steal, or bribe my way into officee |
| 16:08.22 | bonez41 | OrrinHatch2006, how old/new is your zaurus? |
| 16:08.22 | OrrinHatch2006 | ~vote-for mheath[laptop] |
| 16:08.38 | mheath[laptop] | hah |
| 16:08.41 | xbmodder_ppc | lol |
| 16:08.52 | mheath[laptop] | can't vote for me yet :P |
| 16:09.08 | MHeath2006 | is there an "Other (please specify)" option in the voting system? |
| 16:09.17 | mheath[laptop] | I think I really might get into some small time politics, eventually. City council, that kind of thing. |
| 16:09.35 | xbmodder_ppc | poltics suck |
| 16:09.39 | mheath[laptop] | Of course, with a military career I'll be moving around too much, and in most situations you can't be in a political office and in the military at the same time/ |
| 16:09.40 | MHeath2006 | bonez41, it's old |
| 16:09.49 | *** part/#utah vanderbault (n=Mike@cbqco.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 16:09.51 | mheath[laptop] | xbmodder_ppc: Politics suck because politicians make it suck. |
| 16:09.54 | *** part/#utah redbeard1 (n=redbeard@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 16:10.00 | xbmodder_ppc | that xmission guy is running for governor of utah, right? |
| 16:10.05 | MHeath2006 | rofl |
| 16:10.07 | MHeath2006 | haaaaa |
| 16:10.09 | MHeath2006 | no |
| 16:10.13 | MHeath2006 | US Senate |
| 16:10.21 | MHeath2006 | he was here yesterday |
| 16:10.40 | xbmodder_ppc | whoa |
| 16:11.00 | goozbach | xbmodder_ppc: where have you been? |
| 16:11.09 | calvarez | I had a little conversation about abortion with him |
| 16:11.16 | goozbach | pay attention man! |
| 16:11.17 | calvarez | I can't aree with him |
| 16:11.20 | goozbach | vote goozbach |
| 16:11.37 | calvarez | vote goozbach for US Senate Janitor 2006! |
| 16:11.47 | calvarez | ;) |
| 16:11.49 | calvarez | j/k |
| 16:11.59 | goozbach | I don't care WHAT you vote me for |
| 16:12.05 | goozbach | just vote for me |
| 16:12.19 | goozbach | I'm running for Channel Emperor, US senate |
| 16:12.20 | calvarez | my vote is guilty |
| 16:12.27 | goozbach | Guilty |
| 16:12.28 | mheath[laptop] | What is wrong with ads that say "I'm a hardworking, honest guy, and I will do my best to represent your views, whether they change or not. I believe in fair representation, honesty, and in addressing the issues that matter to the voters" rather than saying "my opponent is an evil person who molests young boys, and therefore god will strike them down with lightning during their first term, so it's a waste of time to vote for them any |
| 16:12.34 | goozbach | not-guilty |
| 16:12.41 | goozbach | out of big brother |
| 16:12.45 | goozbach | off the island |
| 16:12.54 | goozbach | for american Idol |
| 16:13.00 | calvarez | goozbach, go pack up your things, you're going to the Island!! |
| 16:13.05 | goozbach | YAY! |
| 16:13.10 | goozbach | start the bone saw |
| 16:13.13 | calvarez | lol |
| 16:13.31 | mheath[laptop] | For the life of me, I can NOT comprehend how politicians are so corrupt |
| 16:13.36 | mheath[laptop] | Every single one of them |
| 16:13.43 | mheath[laptop] | Even the 'good' newage ones are just....messed up. |
| 16:15.06 | calvarez | man, I found a mirror that rocks...I am almost done downloading the 4GB DVD image of Kubuntu in under 1 hr, yay! |
| 16:15.37 | mheath[laptop] | Why is Kubuntu 4GB? |
| 16:15.44 | calvarez | Kubuntu Edgy |
| 16:15.45 | mheath[laptop] | My poor laptop is starting to get obsolete |
| 16:15.48 | harleypig | So how many people couldn't vote this morning because of glitches? |
| 16:15.56 | *** join/#utah SB1-Work (n=kylesb@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 16:16.10 | calvarez | Kubuntu 6.10 "Edgy Eft" |
| 16:16.21 | mheath[laptop] | harleypig: eh? |
| 16:16.25 | mheath[laptop] | You joking or is there something up? |
| 16:16.30 | harleypig | mheath[laptop]: There is both a live cd and a dvd install |
| 16:16.52 | harleypig | No, I couldn't vote this morning because my entire district is unable to load the ballots on the machines. |
| 16:17.12 | calvarez | rofl |
| 16:17.25 | mheath[laptop] | ..... |
| 16:17.28 | harleypig | at least they don't have to worry about the machines being hacked. |
| 16:17.44 | SB1-Work | Haha |
| 16:17.45 | Crax | couldn't you just use a paper ballot then? |
| 16:17.52 | harleypig | They didn't have any. |
| 16:17.54 | mheath[laptop] | And they don't have the capability to use any paper ballets as a backup? |
| 16:17.55 | goozbach | heh |
| 16:18.01 | harleypig | I asked and they looked at me like I was crazy. |
| 16:18.22 | mheath[laptop] | well, they're going to fix it and allow you to vote tomorrow, right? |
| 16:18.40 | harleypig | As far as I know, a paper ballot backup was rejected because the machines would just work. |
| 16:19.14 | SB1-Work | I was able to get a paper backup. |
| 16:19.20 | Crax | If you have a change of address, you have to cast a paper ballot after filling out a form in davis county anyways...so some people are still filling out paper ballots |
| 16:19.23 | SB1-Work | I wasn't able to *keep* it, but hey, it printed, they stored it |
| 16:20.01 | harleypig | My favorite quote from this morning is a comment from one of the young ladies taking polls after I refused to give her my email addresses: "These people just don't get computers." |
| 16:20.26 | SB1-Work | haha |
| 16:20.30 | SB1-Work | That's pretty good |
| 16:20.52 | mheath[laptop] | SB1-Work: thats a paper backup of your electronic vote, not a paper ballot you can cast |
| 16:20.54 | harleypig | I was tempted to ask her what her email address was and hack whatever account she had but decided it wasn't worth it. |
| 16:21.24 | SB1-Work | mheath[laptop], I realize that |
| 16:21.27 | maquis | harleypig: lol |
| 16:21.38 | SB1-Work | Why did they want your e-mail? |
| 16:22.36 | harleypig | *shrug* Probably spam. I told her that's why I wasn't going to give it to her. She said they wouldn't do that but couldn't tell me what they were gonna use it for, other than ask for more survey information and keep me updated on various bits of local information. |
| 16:22.53 | SB1-Work | Uh, yeah, no thanks |
| 16:23.01 | harleypig | I said "Yep, spam" and walked away. That's when she made the comment to her co-pollster. |
| 16:23.11 | *** join/#utah vex (n=vex@216.194.126.99) |
| 16:23.45 | maquis | there are funny moments in life.. |
| 16:23.58 | maquis | people assuming that i have no understanding of computers prompts a lot of them |
| 16:24.30 | SB1-Work | 166M ./mail.brantleyonline.com <-- no more spam, thanks |
| 16:24.44 | levi | From what I heard on the radio this morning, all of Utah county's polling stations were down due to not being able to read the poll cards or something. |
| 16:24.55 | maquis | levi: really? |
| 16:25.03 | levi | Salt Lake county polling stations were apparently working, though. |
| 16:25.19 | SB1-Work | Yup... I voted just fine |
| 16:25.26 | maquis | is utah using the diebold machines this year/ |
| 16:25.27 | maquis | ? |
| 16:25.38 | SB1-Work | They are |
| 16:25.55 | SB1-Work | I felt dirty using it. -.- |
| 16:26.23 | SB1-Work | Which is also pretty much the reason I had that paper backup printed |
| 16:26.54 | maquis | i know there's a good joke hidden in their name... i just haven't gotten it right yet |
| 16:27.24 | SB1-Work | "Die Boldly! Go out with a bang!" ? |
| 16:27.25 | *** join/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 16:27.39 | maquis | i was thinking that they want freedom to die boldly |
| 16:27.48 | SB1-Work | Mmm, better, no doubt |
| 16:27.52 | maquis | but i can't seem to make that work yet |
| 16:30.56 | *** join/#utah wps_ (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 16:32.10 | maquis | <beep>!!!!! |
| 16:32.53 | *** join/#utah wps_ (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 16:33.54 | maquis | <-- IDIOT!!!! |
| 16:34.08 | SB1-Work | ? |
| 16:34.36 | maquis | it took me like 5 hours to find that bug! |
| 16:34.39 | ^Migs^ | vvv IDIOT |
| 16:35.00 | ^Migs^ | haha, no one wants to say anything |
| 16:35.01 | levi | I'm in the middle of tracking down someone else's regression bug. Blah. |
| 16:35.03 | ^Migs^ | oops |
| 16:35.07 | SB1-Work | Haha, sucker |
| 16:35.12 | maquis | ^Migs^: we wer just waiting for you to say something |
| 16:35.13 | maquis | :) |
| 16:35.24 | SB1-Work | It's funny because it's true |
| 16:37.14 | levi | Of course, my code repository doesn't have tags or anything corresponding to the release RPMs I've been testing... :/ |
| 16:38.24 | maquis | my project won't build because a .swp file doesn't exist? |
| 16:38.27 | maquis | what the? |
| 16:39.25 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 16:44.23 | mheath | Give me that OOORAH marine corps spirit! |
| 16:44.31 | mheath | (Give me that OORAH marine corps spirit!) |
| 16:44.41 | mheath | Because it's good enough for Chestty Puller |
| 16:44.46 | mheath | And it's good enough for me! |
| 16:50.14 | harleypig | maquis: :D |
| 16:50.30 | harleypig | someone wasn't thinking when tghey decided on an extension? |
| 16:51.03 | maquis | harleypig: it's a swap file for a file inside my project |
| 16:52.27 | findlay | ~swap maquis |
| 16:57.01 | harleypig | maquis: someone *really* wasn't thinking ... how can a swap file make ... wait, when you say build do you mean compile? |
| 16:57.14 | maquis | harleypig: yup |
| 16:57.33 | harleypig | ?! How can a swap file prevent a project from compiling? |
| 16:57.51 | maquis | harleypig: don't ask... it's eclipse |
| 16:59.03 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp-123-54.tulane.edu) |
| 16:59.18 | harleypig | I was about to ask if it was that silly Java thing. |
| 16:59.28 | vontrapp | lol |
| 16:59.31 | maquis | yeah... it's a silly java thing |
| 16:59.35 | vontrapp | calvarez: why not use torrent? |
| 16:59.43 | maquis | which i'm excited to no longer use when i'm done with this project |
| 17:00.34 | elg | don't count your coffee beans before they percolate |
| 17:01.38 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 17:02.08 | elg | maquis: my SoC mentor was at amazon back in the day. I get the feeling he was a bigshot. Have you heard of him? Paul Davis |
| 17:02.44 | maquis | elg: nope... but the only people i know outside my team are the other byu guys |
| 17:02.59 | *** join/#utah Keighvin (n=ptomlins@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 17:03.13 | elg | too bad. we could have bugged ^Migs^ |
| 17:14.48 | calvarez | vontrapp, I use torrent only when I have time to wait |
| 17:14.58 | calvarez | it would have taken almost a day |
| 17:15.18 | elg | torrents can be well-seeded |
| 17:15.28 | findlay | yes |
| 17:15.38 | vontrapp | esp ubuntu ones |
| 17:15.41 | elg | and then faster than any single download point unless you can saturate your bandwidth from their server |
| 17:15.43 | calvarez | of course. But, this time, it wasn't |
| 17:15.46 | findlay | I've downloaded ubuntu faster on torrent than from a dedicated server |
| 17:15.58 | calvarez | elg, it took me less than 1 hr to download a whole DVD image |
| 17:16.00 | elg | emcnabb: move on to pprofile |
| 17:16.12 | calvarez | so, in this case, no |
| 17:16.13 | findlay | oprofile+! |
| 17:16.13 | elg | calvarez: that's wonderful |
| 17:16.17 | calvarez | I know ;) |
| 17:16.18 | elg | but you don't understand |
| 17:16.25 | calvarez | yes I do |
| 17:16.29 | elg | if you saturate your bandwidth then great |
| 17:16.37 | calvarez | I just use the fastest method for the current thing |
| 17:16.38 | vontrapp | well with such gracious bandwidth you should help out the needy that are having a hard time torrenting it |
| 17:16.44 | elg | you have good access to a good mirror |
| 17:16.52 | calvarez | vontrapp, I usually do |
| 17:16.53 | emcnabb | elg: pprofile? |
| 17:17.00 | elg | and then qprofile |
| 17:17.04 | findlay | emcnabb: oprofile++ |
| 17:17.05 | calvarez | but I don't feel a moral responsibility to do so |
| 17:17.07 | findlay | emcnabb: oprofile# |
| 17:17.09 | emcnabb | nooo! |
| 17:17.13 | findlay | lol |
| 17:17.13 | vontrapp | of course not |
| 17:17.52 | calvarez | but seriously, I've heard that during summer time, bandwidth can be 13GB/hr sometimes |
| 17:18.05 | calvarez | right now it's at 2-4 |
| 17:18.07 | elg | on campus? |
| 17:18.11 | calvarez | yup |
| 17:18.22 | elg | where was the mirror? |
| 17:18.52 | elg | when I had a fast on-campus connection it was very easy to notice that it was usually the other end that was the bottleneck |
| 17:19.06 | elg | almost never utilized full bandwidth from one download of any kind |
| 17:19.30 | elg | torrents can be amazing in that situation, because the other end is no longer a bottleneck |
| 17:19.38 | calvarez | http://mirror.mcs.anl.gov/ |
| 17:19.42 | elg | but you have supermirror, so what do you care |
| 17:19.45 | *** join/#utah SpecialZ (n=Speck@128.187.166.129) |
| 17:19.46 | calvarez | they have a few distros in there |
| 17:19.58 | vontrapp | what campus |
| 17:19.58 | vontrapp | ? |
| 17:20.11 | elg | gatech |
| 17:20.11 | calvarez | 1.3-1.4 kb.sec |
| 17:20.14 | calvarez | kb/sec |
| 17:20.18 | elg | that's not fast |
| 17:20.34 | calvarez | less than 1 hr for a 4GB DVD image |
| 17:20.36 | elg | not even if you meant kB/sec |
| 17:20.39 | maquis | ~lart SpecialZ |
| 17:20.45 | elg | a little dvd |
| 17:20.48 | SpecialZ | ~lart maquis |
| 17:21.04 | elg | a voip call is like 20 kbps |
| 17:21.27 | elg | or between 2 and 3 kB/sec |
| 17:21.39 | elg | my dsl line is nominally 1.5mbps |
| 17:22.39 | calvarez | sorry |
| 17:22.39 | calvarez | lol |
| 17:22.46 | calvarez | 1.3 MB/sec |
| 17:23.03 | ^Migs^ | megabyte or megabit? |
| 17:23.04 | calvarez | more like 1.5 though |
| 17:23.08 | calvarez | byte |
| 17:23.27 | ^Migs^ | mine if 1.5 mbit, although I sometimes get 3 or 4 mbit burst speed |
| 17:23.33 | ^Migs^ | s/if/is/ |
| 17:23.34 | calvarez | so, more like 10.4 mbps |
| 17:24.41 | ^Migs^ | but still, pfff. That's just my home connection, from here, I can download a 4.7 GB DVD image in about 5 minutes. |
| 17:24.56 | calvarez | lol |
| 17:25.13 | calvarez | do I smell crap? |
| 17:25.50 | calvarez | somehow I doubt you have a 120 mbps connection |
| 17:25.52 | ^Migs^ | Let me try |
| 17:26.12 | ^Migs^ | no, I have a gigabit connection |
| 17:26.32 | calvarez | sure |
| 17:26.43 | *** join/#utah xbmodder (n=xbmodder@dsl092-012-130.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 17:26.48 | calvarez | and I'm Tony Danza |
| 17:26.55 | xbmodder | Who here has completed the voting process? |
| 17:26.58 | ^Migs^ | are you? |
| 17:27.02 | calvarez | and the Tap Extravaganza |
| 17:27.31 | calvarez | xbmodder, I would, but I'm not a US citizen yet |
| 17:27.43 | calvarez | it's discrimination, I tell ya |
| 17:27.46 | calvarez | ;) |
| 17:28.15 | ^Migs^ | I think we're on a OC-48 connection, but I'm not sure |
| 17:28.25 | ^Migs^ | I'd really have to ask. I just know I have screaming fast speeds. |
| 17:28.26 | calvarez | I'm not sure either ;) |
| 17:28.37 | calvarez | so I agree with you |
| 17:29.03 | calvarez | k, I'm gonna go play Pro Evolution Soccer 5 |
| 17:29.11 | ^Migs^ | hey calvarez |
| 17:29.16 | calvarez | yea |
| 17:29.18 | ^Migs^ | why don't you go play Pro Evolution Soccer 5 now? |
| 17:29.25 | calvarez | ok |
| 17:29.39 | maquis | hmmm... shaolin soccer would be an interesting video game |
| 17:29.44 | ^Migs^ | haha |
| 17:29.46 | ^Migs^ | omg, that would rock |
| 17:31.36 | *** join/#utah lukfugl (n=lukfugl@lukfugl.fttp.xmission.com) |
| 17:31.58 | ^Migs^ | who are you? |
| 17:32.07 | lukfugl | I am Spartacus |
| 17:32.08 | emcnabb | ^Migs^: newb |
| 17:32.10 | maquis | emcnabb: i want a pic |
| 17:32.10 | ^Migs^ | oh |
| 17:32.18 | lukfugl | or wait, no. I mean "Jacob Fugal" |
| 17:32.21 | lukfugl | yeah, that's right |
| 17:32.30 | maquis | a hairless emcnabb would be interesting to see |
| 17:32.32 | ^Migs^ | people who shave their heads who don't normally shave their heads look really goofy |
| 17:33.11 | xbmodder | o.O |
| 17:33.21 | emcnabb | ahhh |
| 17:33.25 | xbmodder | hehe |
| 17:33.51 | graphyx | Ok I just got done voting around here. |
| 17:33.56 | graphyx | They had electronic voting. |
| 17:33.59 | graphyx | IT was interesting. |
| 17:34.05 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 17:34.05 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 17:34.07 | xbmodder | Diebold? |
| 17:34.21 | graphyx | You signed into your district and they gave you an identification slip of paper for what your ballot was suppose to be. |
| 17:34.32 | graphyx | And that was what allowed you to vote. |
| 17:34.33 | emcnabb | I got a sticker that said "I Voted" with a flag on it. I feel very special, and patriotic |
| 17:34.56 | graphyx | If I wanted to, I could have gone and printed out my own copy of those tags and voted 2-3 times if the workers weren't paying attention. |
| 17:35.14 | graphyx | since it didn't check if you were who you said you were after getting the slip of paper. |
| 17:35.31 | graphyx | They only way they could check would be to count the number of voters for the district and match that against those who did vote. |
| 17:36.30 | graphyx | nope. |
| 17:36.40 | lukfugl | aww |
| 17:36.42 | xbmodder | #politics |
| 17:36.43 | ^Migs^ | why don't they put voting on the web, and allow you to view your vote after you vote? Plus allow some sort of anonymous peer review so you can see what others voted for and get up-to-date poll statistics? |
| 17:36.49 | graphyx | I just wanted to point out the voting process. |
| 17:36.59 | graphyx | Not discuss the issues or other such notions. |
| 17:37.00 | emcnabb | graphyx for president! |
| 17:37.09 | ^Migs^ | that would do wonders for the problem people have with a paper trail, if you can verify the existence of the vote |
| 17:37.46 | graphyx | ^Migs^: They had a paper trail. It printed each selection on a paper roll and showed that to the left of the screen. |
| 17:38.00 | graphyx | But there was no way to connect a person to which paper trail was theirs |
| 17:38.27 | ^Migs^ | see, that's dumb |
| 17:38.38 | graphyx | yeah. |
| 17:38.54 | graphyx | The paper they gave me was one that was Ward 2c |
| 17:38.57 | graphyx | And taht was it. |
| 17:39.03 | emcnabb | All hail President Graphyx... Commander In Chief! |
| 17:39.11 | ^Migs^ | what's the point of electronic voting machines anyway? You still have to go to a designated location to vote. |
| 17:39.16 | graphyx | Just a small blue cardstock print out. |
| 17:39.31 | ^Migs^ | it just costs extra $$$ to build them, and there's no real advantage |
| 17:39.40 | ^Migs^ | maybe for the ballot counters, but that's it |
| 17:39.47 | graphyx | ^Migs^: Cause those darn push pin voting things are too complicated for floridans |
| 17:39.52 | graphyx | So they have to get touch screen votoing. |
| 17:39.57 | graphyx | I liked the design. |
| 17:40.11 | ^Migs^ | voting should be a matter of ACCESSIBILITY. Give people options. Have a touch-tone phone system, or a web site, or if you want to do it the old-fashioned way, go to that designated location and wait in line. |
| 17:40.22 | graphyx | It showed a screen to verify your votes and would go back to that section to confirm the choices. |
| 17:40.22 | ^Migs^ | I'm sure it's nice. |
| 17:40.41 | graphyx | SO it was a little bit better than the push pin voting since you knew what choice you had made before you submitted. |
| 17:41.30 | ^Migs^ | yeah |
| 17:42.43 | elg | it's all about the counting |
| 17:43.06 | elg | i doubt we'll see the day anytime soon when you can vote online or over the phone. much too difficult to solve the authentication problem |
| 17:43.53 | elg | i like the scantron approach |
| 17:43.58 | emcnabb | elg: they just asked for my name; no ID or anything |
| 17:44.03 | ^Migs^ | how is the authentication problem difficult? |
| 17:44.06 | emcnabb | I could have gone in as all my neighbors |
| 17:44.12 | ^Migs^ | and how would it be any less secure than the current situation? |
| 17:44.16 | ^Migs^ | exactly, emcnabb |
| 17:44.21 | elg | emcnabb: that's not to say there's no authentication problem with onsite voting either. :) |
| 17:44.25 | ^Migs^ | any web-based solution would be a step up |
| 17:44.27 | emcnabb | :-) |
| 17:44.28 | elg | they asked for my id and checked me in on the computer |
| 17:44.35 | elg | they _can_ do that in person |
| 17:44.47 | emcnabb | they looked my name up in a book and asked me what my address was |
| 17:44.50 | ^Migs^ | no, when you register you're given a pin number |
| 17:44.50 | elg | it's much more difficult to avoid repeats/cheating |
| 17:44.53 | ^Migs^ | problem solved |
| 17:45.00 | emcnabb | elg: true |
| 17:45.02 | elg | hardly |
| 17:45.18 | ^Migs^ | PROBLEM SOLVED. kthxbye |
| 17:45.24 | elg | not at all |
| 17:45.30 | graphyx | I handed them my voter registration card. I could have snapped a shot of the other names in the book and gone home and generated similar cards for the others on the page. |
| 17:45.42 | elg | unless you are giving an 8-digit alphanumeric pin |
| 17:45.51 | graphyx | And had people go in and vote as them. If they asked for ID, they could simply say, oh I left it at home. I"ll go get it. |
| 17:46.00 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-20-54.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 17:46.04 | elg | graphyx: exactly |
| 17:46.07 | ^Migs^ | I just SAID they should be given a pin number |
| 17:46.09 | ^Migs^ | pay attention |
| 17:46.12 | graphyx | but they didn't ask for anything more than what I handed them initially which was the voter reg card. |
| 17:46.34 | elg | ^Migs^: I did. pin number without qualification means an insecure 4-digit number |
| 17:46.35 | ^Migs^ | no it doesn't |
| 17:46.36 | elg | which would be fine for an atm-like setup |
| 17:46.42 | emcnabb | graphyx: they didn't even ask for my card |
| 17:46.44 | ^Migs^ | I Don't even think it's fine for ATMs |
| 17:47.11 | elg | well at least at an atm you can't sit there for hours doing a brute force attack without being noticed |
| 17:47.12 | ^Migs^ | I thought the secure nature of the pin was assumed when I made that statement. Sorry for making that assumption. |
| 17:47.20 | ^Migs^ | sure you can |
| 17:47.27 | ^Migs^ | wear a ski mask, and go at 3 in the morning |
| 17:47.39 | emcnabb | of course I live in Holly Springs NC, where all us fo'ks is good people |
| 17:47.40 | elg | not on election day when there's a line of 80 people behind you |
| 17:48.00 | ^Migs^ | see, so the problem IS solved with a pin number. |
| 17:48.02 | goozbach | I can't wait to see that |
| 17:48.15 | goozbach | "sir your name?" |
| 17:48.20 | goozbach | -- "bob" |
| 17:48.26 | goozbach | -- "sorry" |
| 17:48.26 | elg | ^Migs^: with a random cryptographically strong password |
| 17:48.32 | elg | i'll concede |
| 17:48.38 | ^Migs^ | of course you concede |
| 17:48.39 | goozbach | --"would you belive steve?" |
| 17:48.41 | ^Migs^ | because I'm right |
| 17:48.44 | elg | but if floridans can't handle hanging chads, good luck with the password thing |
| 17:48.56 | elg | ~lart goozbach |
| 17:48.56 | maquis | yeah |
| 17:49.03 | maquis | floridians are the cause of all the problems |
| 17:49.12 | ^Migs^ | maquis makes a convincing point |
| 17:49.12 | emcnabb | therefore goozbach sucks |
| 17:49.23 | goozbach | hey, I'm not floridian yet |
| 17:49.23 | maquis | ^Migs^: what was that point? |
| 17:49.34 | ^Migs^ | that floridians are the cause of all the problems |
| 17:49.37 | emcnabb | goozbach: yeah, you're just a wannabe! |
| 17:49.39 | maquis | oh |
| 17:49.40 | emcnabb | that's worse! |
| 17:49.47 | goozbach | true |
| 17:49.55 | goozbach | hmm hunger pains, time to eat |
| 17:50.02 | goozbach | vote goozbach!!! |
| 17:50.13 | ^Migs^ | my food better get here soon. We're ordering in from some catering place in Ogden. |
| 17:50.16 | maquis | ~eat goozbach |
| 17:50.18 | ibot | ACTION eats goozbach and falls over dead |
| 17:50.18 | goozbach | wannabe floridian party |
| 17:50.21 | elg | applebees probably |
| 17:50.32 | ^Migs^ | no, it's called Li'l Reds Sweet Shoppe or something |
| 17:50.38 | ^Migs^ | except we're getting sandwiches. Go fig. |
| 17:51.15 | ^Migs^ | fig as in figure. I'm not actually pro-figs. |
| 17:51.50 | lukfugl | figs are yummy |
| 17:51.59 | maquis | ^Migs^: what's your problem with figs? |
| 17:52.30 | elg | so a strong password over ssl would be fine, but you wouldn't get people to agree to it as the only way to vote |
| 17:52.59 | ^Migs^ | I don't have a problem with figs. My position on figs is neutral. I'm neither pro-figs nor anti-figs. Why must people always assume others can only have dualistic viewpoints? |
| 17:53.11 | ^Migs^ | "I don't love you." "WHY DO YOU HATE ME!?!?!?!?!" |
| 17:53.21 | elg | it's the carets |
| 17:53.35 | ^Migs^ | I only have them because some idiot stole my caretless name. |
| 17:53.44 | ^Migs^ | I look like some UFO floating around |
| 17:54.06 | ^Migs^ | elg: That's why I said we need to give people options |
| 17:54.12 | elg | i'm all for options |
| 17:54.18 | elg | but most states can't grok single-option voting |
| 17:54.25 | ^Migs^ | touchtone phone systems, physical locations, electronic voting machines, etc. |
| 17:54.30 | elg | I'm not optimistic about their ability to generate options |
| 17:54.39 | ^Migs^ | doesn't Oregon have a mailing option? You send your vote through the mail? |
| 17:54.53 | elg | and we've seen what happens when the industry gets their paws on the lucrative technological voting market |
| 17:54.59 | maquis | in washington (at least in my area), it's mail-in only |
| 17:55.06 | elg | everyone has that. it's called absentee |
| 17:55.08 | ^Migs^ | options |
| 17:55.16 | ^Migs^ | yeah, but some are required to do it |
| 17:55.20 | maquis | elg: yeah... but here, it's mail-in only |
| 17:55.39 | elg | does it have to be postmarked today? |
| 17:55.41 | elg | or earlier? |
| 17:55.49 | maquis | elg: i think it needs to be postmarked by today |
| 17:55.57 | elg | bet that gets on the news media's nerves, always having to wait for Washington's votes to count. :) |
| 17:56.05 | maquis | which is probably a problem, since i think it's sitting on my desk |
| 17:56.13 | ^Migs^ | not only that, there SHOULD be a system that integrates all the options together, and provides it in a form that is compatible with all other states' systems, and is readable at the federal level so it could be used during presidential elections |
| 17:56.24 | elg | and it should be open source |
| 17:56.27 | elg | totally agree |
| 17:56.31 | ^Migs^ | yes, it should actually |
| 17:56.32 | graphyx | So if you live in washington DC you don't get to vote on a senator. |
| 17:56.36 | elg | but think about what will really happen |
| 17:56.37 | graphyx | ? |
| 17:57.03 | ^Migs^ | and it should be tested for more unimportant elections first |
| 17:57.04 | elg | diebold or oracle or someone will devise it and it'll be illegal under the dmca or some other silly law to audit it and the vote will be compromised every election for the next 10 years |
| 17:57.13 | ^Migs^ | yes, of course |
| 17:57.24 | ^Migs^ | our systems suck |
| 17:57.46 | ^Migs^ | we need to get someone other than Diebold in the game |
| 17:57.50 | graphyx | so what site is going to have the published election results? |
| 17:58.14 | elg | i want to see some system of accurate electronic counting with paper trail. I don't much care what the specifics are |
| 17:58.27 | elg | graphyx: The Internet |
| 17:58.31 | elg | it'll be in one of the tubes |
| 17:58.37 | graphyx | cnn.com doesn't have it up yet.. |
| 17:58.44 | lukfugl | heh |
| 17:58.49 | graphyx | I suppose it is only 10AM in California. |
| 17:58.56 | graphyx | and 7? in hawaii? |
| 17:59.02 | elg | i think they're not supposed to call any elections until the polls close |
| 17:59.13 | graphyx | right... |
| 17:59.19 | ^Migs^ | it will be accurate when ANYONE can count the votes, with any personal identifying information removed |
| 17:59.33 | ^Migs^ | problem solved again kthxbye |
| 17:59.40 | xbmodder | It is illegal under DMCA to audit them, IIRC (the code, the encryption algorithm) |
| 17:59.57 | maquis | stupid dmca |
| 18:00.33 | xbmodder | heh |
| 18:01.13 | xbmodder | There is another law, or it might also fall under the DMCA to audit the encrypted vote file/backup |
| 18:01.19 | *** join/#utah spig (n=spig@sento1.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 18:02.11 | *** join/#utah Robdor (n=Robdor@208.187.198.179) |
| 18:02.18 | elg | ^Migs^: what the heck are you talking about? once it's in the computer it's counted already. unless you mean people counting the paper trail |
| 18:02.32 | elg | that's brilliant. let just any old joe come in and manhandle the paper trail |
| 18:02.48 | ^Migs^ | ? |
| 18:02.58 | ^Migs^ | I'm talking about people counting the paper trail. And what's the problem if it's read-only? |
| 18:02.59 | elg | but I agree it would be nice for people to be able to see the raw numbers |
| 18:03.12 | elg | ^Migs^: like in a museum? behind a glass panel? |
| 18:03.28 | ^Migs^ | no, through electronic means |
| 18:04.20 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@firebat.aros.net) |
| 18:04.50 | ^Migs^ | and perhaps if you have your own personal information handy, you can see your own vote among the others. If everyone has the capacity to double check their own vote in the system, and see tallies of others, that solves that problem. |
| 18:05.00 | xbmodder | I think we should use a quantum voting system :-P |
| 18:05.16 | findlay | ~entangle xbmodder |
| 18:05.23 | xbmodder | hehe |
| 18:05.29 | ^Migs^ | haha |
| 18:05.38 | findlay | hihi |
| 18:05.43 | xbmodder | ? |
| 18:05.47 | xbmodder | hihi? |
| 18:05.50 | findlay | huhu |
| 18:05.54 | findlay | hoho |
| 18:05.58 | xbmodder | ohoh |
| 18:05.59 | ^Migs^ | migsmigs |
| 18:05.59 | findlay | hyhy |
| 18:06.04 | findlay | hwhw |
| 18:06.06 | ^Migs^ | mahimahi |
| 18:07.17 | xbmodder | Why don't clubs swipe cards (licenses) and analyze the magstripe? |
| 18:07.21 | *** join/#utah btoone (n=brandon@208.187.196.115) |
| 18:07.49 | *** part/#utah btoone (n=brandon@208.187.196.115) |
| 18:07.50 | xbmodder | Can't they query the card's number in some sort of DB? |
| 18:08.18 | xbmodder | or the barcode on a temporary license? |
| 18:09.18 | *** join/#utah tubbybubba (i=10138@sharedserver.org) |
| 18:09.35 | xbmodder | or is underage clubbing not a problem in utah? |
| 18:09.44 | xbmodder | Are utahnian teens good? |
| 18:10.02 | findlay | you mean underage kids going around and hitting each other with clubs? |
| 18:10.13 | xbmodder | ~lart findlay |
| 18:10.20 | graphyx | I think they have a problem with kids hitting each other over the head with skateboards, but not clubs. |
| 18:10.49 | findlay | so that would be skateboarding? |
| 18:10.49 | lukfugl | longboards seem the most popular, though |
| 18:10.49 | findlay | longboarding |
| 18:10.49 | xbmodder | Card for skateboards? |
| 18:10.56 | findlay | carding |
| 18:11.29 | graphyx | I guess that was in Nebraska |
| 18:12.18 | graphyx | Actually I don't have that article handy... |
| 18:14.08 | maquis | some kid apparently got attacked with a skateboard in our church building's parking lot a couple years ago |
| 18:14.51 | xbmodder | hahahaha |
| 18:14.54 | xbmodder | What was he doing? |
| 18:15.46 | Keighvin | clubbing underage children. |
| 18:16.07 | emcnabb | no Nebraska bashing |
| 18:18.44 | lukfugl | how about Nebraska clubbing, or skateboarding? |
| 18:21.29 | ^Migs^ | cool. Virtual Earth 3d is out: http://virtualearth.spaces.live.com/Blog/cns!2BBC66E99FDCDB98!7573.entry |
| 18:23.10 | findlay | microsoft is teh evill |
| 18:23.31 | ^Migs^ | heh, you haven't even tried it yet, have you? |
| 18:24.35 | findlay | I don't touch the evil |
| 18:25.09 | graphyx | what about teh evil? |
| 18:25.39 | findlay | it is teh microsofts |
| 18:25.47 | graphyx | ~teh |
| 18:25.50 | ibot | Broken keyboard or hand |
| 18:25.54 | ^Migs^ | yeah, I guess ur right |
| 18:30.53 | SpecialZ | xbmodder, I don't want people swiping my license and stealing my information. |
| 18:31.00 | ^Migs^ | oh man, this is neat. They have texture-mapped buildings. |
| 18:42.40 | findlay | how do I query all the elements in a table with sql? |
| 18:42.51 | findlay | like SELECT THE ROWS FROM THIS TABLE |
| 18:43.02 | findlay | ? |
| 18:43.34 | elg | select * from foo; |
| 18:44.26 | ^Migs^ | http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061106/od_nm/crime_tshirt_dc |
| 18:49.51 | *** join/#utah jsmith-away (n=jsmith@h4605004d.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 18:51.35 | ^Migs^ | http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/11/07/pot.burgers.ap/index.html |
| 18:57.48 | ^Migs^ | wtf? http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/11/07/oven.puppy.ap/index.html |
| 18:58.50 | ^Migs^ | what's wrong with you Salt Lake City people? |
| 18:58.53 | elg | heh. good old isleta pueblo |
| 18:59.01 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 18:59.04 | elg | what's wrong with you, that's a bad url |
| 18:59.25 | elg | oh, maybe it's just cnn |
| 18:59.32 | elg | the other link that worked doesn't work now either |
| 18:59.58 | emcnabb | ~lart elg |
| 19:00.02 | findlay | people in salt lake are too salty |
| 19:00.18 | ^Migs^ | that's why they have to cook puppies |
| 19:00.21 | findlay | sodium and chlorine are just bad |
| 19:00.40 | findlay | and when you combine them it multiplies their evilenss |
| 19:05.01 | *** join/#utah mheath[laptop] (i=mheath@c-67-182-231-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 19:09.08 | ^Migs^ | PUPPY ROASTERS!!!!!!!!!! |
| 19:09.41 | ^Migs^ | I'm so glad I live in Ogden where everybody is nice and people treat each other right |
| 19:09.58 | SB1-Work | lol, you're such a horrible liar |
| 19:13.06 | *** join/#utah jsmith-away (n=jsmith@h4605004d.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 19:14.20 | calvarez-pwning | people in SLC are horrible |
| 19:14.37 | findlay | ~depress ^Migs^ |
| 19:14.39 | ibot | ACTION kills a kitten and makes ^Migs^ watch |
| 19:14.45 | calvarez | lol |
| 19:15.15 | ^Migs^ | haha |
| 19:15.51 | ^Migs^ | it's one thing to drown puppies, but baking them in an oven is just unacceptable |
| 19:16.08 | ^Migs^ | unless you intend to eat them, obviously. |
| 19:16.37 | elg | this wasn't no puppy. it was a chihuahua |
| 19:16.37 | levi | Hmm, packrat parsers. |
| 19:23.15 | *** join/#utah Phishy (n=none@63.194.187.135) |
| 19:27.10 | ^Migs^ | bleh, meeting |
| 19:52.59 | *** join/#utah Crax (n=nobody@207.173.85.26) |
| 19:55.39 | goozbach | ubuntu cookies?! |
| 19:55.41 | goozbach | awesome |
| 19:57.04 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
| 19:57.04 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 19:59.41 | *** join/#utah spig (n=spig@sento1.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 20:02.11 | Keighvin | Tasty, too. |
| 20:02.31 | Keighvin | I was fortunate enough to get one from the test batch. |
| 20:06.47 | graphyx | as far as I know, I am the only one of 7 on my row at work to vote. |
| 20:06.55 | graphyx | I have 3 confirmed non voters. |
| 20:07.04 | graphyx | And no one else seems interested about it at all. |
| 20:07.52 | Phishy | VOTE!!! |
| 20:07.59 | Phishy | Down with the Bush regime!!! |
| 20:12.15 | Jayce^ | ~whaleslap Phishy |
| 20:12.17 | ibot | ACTION beats Phishy upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 20:12.27 | *** join/#utah spig_ (n=spig@sento1.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 20:15.21 | Phishy | ~pimpslap Jayce^ |
| 20:15.22 | ibot | phishy pimpslaps Jayce^. ouch! |
| 20:17.55 | *** join/#utah redbeard1 (n=redbeard@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 20:20.22 | findlay | holy cow this CD is dripping with shameless hyperbole with an obvious flavor of marketing |
| 20:20.32 | redbeard1 | findlay: what cd? |
| 20:20.32 | levi | findlay: What CD? |
| 20:20.42 | levi | redbeard1: I win! |
| 20:20.54 | redbeard1 | dude, my client says i win |
| 20:21.04 | findlay | as for the sound itself, what is that I hear, distortion on this 96khz 24 bit super DIGITAL transfer? |
| 20:21.13 | levi | What does findlay's client say? |
| 20:21.55 | findlay | way to go guys. Way to go DECCA for making the recording sound like it was done a room with the ambience of the worst kind of recording studio |
| 20:22.38 | findlay | the unforgivable ear of the recording microphone it is true picks up flaws even in the Wiener Philharmoniker |
| 20:23.07 | findlay | but I think I'll be favoring my Deutsche Grammophon recordings in the years that come |
| 20:23.24 | findlay | even though there are those blatant trumpet mistakes |
| 20:23.54 | findlay | but they've (Decca) butchered it because everybody loves Karajan |
| 20:24.13 | findlay | levi: I show that redbeard1 got here first |
| 20:24.28 | findlay | (now that I'm done raving) |
| 20:24.36 | levi | Drat. |
| 20:24.43 | levi | redbeard1: You win. :( |
| 20:25.42 | findlay | the Berliner Philharmoniker DG recordings just have a irrepresible charm and grandeur that can't be competed with in this tinny recording-studio-sound version |
| 20:26.12 | findlay | sounds like they shoved a microphone up the bell of every trombone |
| 20:26.48 | goozbach | redbeard1: ubuntu cookies?@ |
| 20:26.54 | findlay | and in the process of remixing destroyed any ambience there might have been given by the hall |
| 20:27.02 | redbeard1 | mmm, ubuntu cookies |
| 20:27.02 | goozbach | s/?@/?!/ |
| 20:27.14 | redbeard1 | so tasty! |
| 20:27.19 | findlay | but the WPO's playing is splendid as always and Karajan is in top form |
| 20:27.22 | redbeard1 | make's already posted them |
| 20:27.28 | goozbach | methinks I confused ibot |
| 20:27.44 | redbeard1 | ibot: are you confused? |
| 20:27.52 | findlay | maybe I'll have to remix this CD with some more greater spatial effects |
| 20:28.18 | mheath[laptop] | Hey, anyone have a recommendations on a place to grab a good dinner in downtown salt lake? |
| 20:28.33 | mheath[laptop] | I'm just traveling up 4th South / 5th South to get up to the University of Utah |
| 20:28.40 | findlay | levi: redbeard1: its Karajan/Wiener Philharmoniker Tschaikowsky 3 famous ballet suites |
| 20:28.40 | mheath[laptop] | Don't want to go too out of my way.... |
| 20:28.42 | redbeard1 | mheath[laptop]: red iguana, if you have time |
| 20:28.46 | levi | redbeard1: If you keep it up, maybe they'll ask you to write an article for the magazine. |
| 20:28.59 | elg | mheath[laptop]: macaroni grill is ok |
| 20:29.02 | redbeard1 | levi: sweet! |
| 20:29.03 | levi | mheath: What sort of food/price range are you looking at? |
| 20:29.34 | mheath[laptop] | levi: Nothing too expensive. It's just me, and I'm not against spending $20 or so. |
| 20:29.43 | elg | then stop at mcdonalds |
| 20:29.55 | elg | you can get lots of ice cream cones for $20 |
| 20:30.04 | levi | There's some decent stuff up right next to campus. The Pie, Market Street Broiler, etc. |
| 20:30.18 | Phishy | mmmmm |
| 20:30.20 | Phishy | The Pie. |
| 20:30.21 | mheath[laptop] | I hate finding my way around salt lake |
| 20:30.24 | mheath[laptop] | so confusing compared to Ogden |
| 20:30.38 | redbeard1 | The Pie! |
| 20:30.39 | levi | It's really not very hard. |
| 20:30.41 | mheath[laptop] | I'm nervous about just finding my way to the Student Services building today |
| 20:30.49 | redbeard1 | mheath[laptop]: definitely the pie. |
| 20:31.05 | Phishy | I love their Beer Jog specials. |
| 20:31.08 | Phishy | Jug |
| 20:31.13 | findlay | ugh, I hate recording studio sound |
| 20:31.19 | mheath[laptop] | Phishy, yeah, I don't think I can buy one of those legally. |
| 20:31.20 | redbeard1 | gah! two people posted me on digg! |
| 20:31.25 | levi | findlay: We get the picture. :) |
| 20:31.34 | Phishy | mheath[laptop], why not? |
| 20:31.36 | findlay | levi: this is awful |
| 20:31.43 | findlay | levi: this is the worst recording ever |
| 20:31.48 | findlay | levi: I'm redundant |
| 20:31.52 | findlay | (-: |
| 20:31.55 | findlay | ~lart me |
| 20:32.45 | findlay | whatever |
| 20:32.45 | levi | Redundantly repetitve. |
| 20:32.45 | levi | repetitive, even. |
| 20:32.45 | mheath[laptop] | Phishy, We live in the USA. I can join the Marine Corps, but not vote. Or drink. Or own a gun (I'm only allowed to be issued a semi-automatic burst fire weapon, you see, not buy one) |
| 20:32.45 | Phishy | Why can't you vote? |
| 20:32.45 | mheath[laptop] | Yeah, I love that. The government will issue me an M16A2, but I can't buy paintball gear at Walmart. |
| 20:32.45 | goozbach | so is there anything fun going on in SLC friday afternoon? |
| 20:32.45 | Phishy | What American are you from? |
| 20:32.45 | mheath[laptop] | Phishy, I'm 17. |
| 20:32.48 | Phishy | ah |
| 20:32.48 | goozbach | ~seen dilve |
| 20:33.00 | ibot | goozbach: i haven't seen 'dilve' |
| 20:33.01 | Phishy | lol |
| 20:33.01 | goozbach | ~ping |
| 20:33.03 | ibot | pong |
| 20:33.03 | goozbach | ibot: respond |
| 20:33.04 | ibot | when spoken to, respond. |
| 20:33.05 | Phishy | ~pimpslap goozbach |
| 20:33.06 | ibot | phishy pimpslaps goozbach. ouch! |
| 20:33.18 | goozbach | ~seen dilvie |
| 20:33.21 | ibot | dilvie <n=chatzill@c-67-166-126-133.hsd1.ut.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 10d 12h 49m 16s ago, saying: 'but I got a kick out of it.'. |
| 20:33.39 | mheath[laptop] | ibot, tell goozbach about abuse |
| 20:33.42 | findlay | whatever it was we may know he got a kick out of it |
| 20:34.13 | mheath[laptop] | I don't understand why we don't use tell * about * more often |
| 20:34.24 | mheath[laptop] | OK, I've got to go rake some leaves then head up to the UoU |
| 20:34.34 | goozbach | rake away |
| 20:34.35 | findlay | levi: although the super fine remastering is awesome. You can hardly tell this recording is 42 years old |
| 20:34.45 | goozbach | I hope you get hand splinters! |
| 20:34.50 | goozbach | how's that for abuse? |
| 20:34.53 | goozbach | :) |
| 20:34.56 | mheath[laptop] | redbeard1, BAH! Red Iguana looks good! |
| 20:35.01 | mheath[laptop] | North temple...easy to find / stands out? |
| 20:35.14 | findlay | although one wonders what kind of unwholesome compressors, etc. they shoved the sound through |
| 20:35.32 | mheath[laptop] | I shouldn't go there, though. I'd never be able to decide what to buy. |
| 20:35.34 | Phishy | findlay, what are you talking about? |
| 20:35.51 | findlay | Phishy: how do you feel about talking about? |
| 20:36.29 | mheath[laptop] | Phishy, a bit more effort and findlay will be able to pass the turing test :) |
| 20:36.54 | findlay | mheath[laptop]: tell me more about turing test :) |
| 20:37.18 | levi | If you drive north/south through SLC, you'll eventually cross North Temple. You'll be able to tell because you'll be just barely north of the temple. |
| 20:37.56 | Phishy | I wonder what would happen if the temple fell over? |
| 20:38.19 | Phishy | A strong gust of wind just knocks the thing over onto temple square. |
| 20:38.20 | findlay | there would be a big pile of granite |
| 20:38.24 | elg | someone tell me there's a better way: http://pastie.caboo.se/21696 |
| 20:38.51 | findlay | I doubt you're going to be able to do that with a gust of wind |
| 20:39.01 | Phishy | Do you think people would blame it on the devil? or odd weather? |
| 20:39.01 | levi | elg: You want to initialize your arrays with a literal array? |
| 20:39.23 | findlay | if you did it people would probably blame you |
| 20:39.47 | elg | levi: I know I could do int [] xpoints = {1, 2, 3} |
| 20:40.04 | Phishy | nah, i'll just blame it on terrorism and everyone will nod and attack another middle-eastern country. |
| 20:40.22 | levi | elg: Aside from that, no, there's not a better way I'm aware of. |
| 20:40.32 | elg | the completely asinine java graphics api wants two arrays and the size of them. fine. But isn't there a shorthand way to create them on the fly? |
| 20:40.51 | levi | No. |
| 20:40.54 | elg | if I do that trick above I have to make different names for each |
| 20:41.24 | levi | Java, like C and C++, pretty much sucks that way. |
| 20:42.56 | levi | You could even do it that way in OCaml. |
| 20:43.07 | xbmodder | Any poll updates? |
| 20:43.13 | xbmodder | Internet here sucks. |
| 20:43.29 | levi | But not in Java, C, or C++, the BEST LANGUAGES THAT WILL EVAR BE!!1 |
| 20:43.32 | findlay | ~poll |
| 20:43.34 | ibot | Script for automating Fidonet polls. URL: http://www.drmach.demon.co.uk/vashti/software/index.html |
| 20:44.52 | findlay | does anybody here notice the slashdot article tags? |
| 20:45.06 | *** join/#utah Crax (n=nobody@207.173.85.26) |
| 20:46.45 | elg | ~insane levi |
| 20:47.37 | levi | Yes, I have lost my mind and need to be committed. |
| 20:47.54 | findlay | levi: you forgot C# |
| 20:47.57 | findlay | and C## |
| 20:48.02 | findlay | and Cx |
| 20:48.08 | findlay | and Cxx |
| 20:48.17 | findlay | (x meaning double sharp) |
| 20:48.21 | findlay | obviously |
| 20:48.45 | Phishy | ~nerd findlay |
| 20:48.47 | levi | I don't know if C# has array literals. |
| 20:49.49 | xbmodder | Isn't # = pound |
| 20:49.52 | findlay | it may not even be a literal language at all |
| 20:49.56 | xbmodder | So it should be C pound pound |
| 20:50.04 | xbmodder | or C pound squared? |
| 20:50.22 | findlay | xbmodder: are you talking about skateboard clubbing again? |
| 20:50.28 | xbmodder | Hahaha |
| 20:50.38 | findlay | guess so |
| 20:51.01 | xbmodder | Where is a good line for exit polls? |
| 20:51.01 | Tene | xbmodder: # is "sharp" in music |
| 20:51.34 | xbmodder | Ah. |
| 20:51.47 | xbmodder | Microsoft is the most anti-musical company ever? |
| 20:54.01 | findlay | I voted against microsoft |
| 20:54.04 | Phishy | Down with the Bush Regime!!! |
| 20:54.08 | findlay | and apple |
| 20:54.21 | findlay | I voted for freebsd and linux |
| 20:54.36 | findlay | s/free/open/ |
| 20:57.29 | goozbach | this weekend rocked |
| 20:57.32 | goozbach | I had 15 women over at my house this weekend due to my cooking skills |
| 20:57.52 | goozbach | and I have redbeard1 to thank for it |
| 20:58.05 | redbeard1 | sweet! |
| 20:58.13 | redbeard1 | how did you pull that off? |
| 20:58.27 | xbmodder | goozbach: You are my idol. |
| 20:58.30 | xbmodder | :-P |
| 20:58.51 | levi | Heh, Dennis Ritchie, when asked about the hardest parts of C to get right: "A closely related aspect is the treatment of arrays and pointers. Given the perenniality of questions about this and the contortions that C++ goes [through] to move away from C on this, it might well be counted as a mistake." |
| 20:58.54 | goozbach | redbeard1: remember WAY back when I made that beef stew? |
| 20:59.00 | redbeard1 | goozbach: yeah |
| 20:59.31 | goozbach | so the then-current GF and her roommates that ate over that night aparently spread the word of my leet cooking skills |
| 20:59.41 | xbmodder | Hehe. |
| 21:00.07 | xbmodder | ~seen LoneWanderer |
| 21:00.39 | ibot | lonewanderer <~dan@208.186.180.204> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 780d 23h 32m 59s ago, saying: 'ahh there we go'. |
| 21:00.40 | goozbach | a couple months ago I invited a slew of folks from my ward over for fajitias |
| 21:00.40 | findlay | levi: good luck selling that to people who grew up indoctrinated in the holiness of C/C++ |
| 21:00.40 | xbmodder | ?Donde esta ibot? |
| 21:00.40 | goozbach | last week, this really hot chick asked when I was going to do fajitas again. |
| 21:00.49 | goozbach | I made them again saturday |
| 21:00.50 | findlay | goozbach: I've seen linewanderer in #django before |
| 21:01.00 | macnewbold | wow, that's a long time |
| 21:01.01 | findlay | or xbmodder, rather |
| 21:01.12 | redbeard1 | goozbach: dude, you are my hero. |
| 21:01.24 | findlay | goozbach: is teh findlay hero |
| 21:01.34 | goozbach | ANYwho the word aparently got spread pretty good |
| 21:01.36 | xbmodder | Lone hasn't been out since wednesday, anyone know if he went through with that girl? |
| 21:01.52 | goozbach | and a bunch of folk ended up at my house saturday for dinner |
| 21:02.07 | elg | goozbach: you didn't invite just her over for some fajitas? |
| 21:02.11 | goozbach | total 9 chicks, 3 dudes. |
| 21:02.20 | elg | 6 for you |
| 21:02.33 | elg | the chef gets the leftovers |
| 21:02.40 | goozbach | elg: she, at the time, had a boyfriend, (who could easily kick my trash) |
| 21:02.49 | xbmodder | Is goozbach commited to one of those girls/women yet? |
| 21:02.56 | goozbach | xbmodder: nope |
| 21:03.11 | elg | goozbach: not if you made him a special fajita |
| 21:03.22 | goozbach | heh |
| 21:03.27 | xbmodder | Put chloroform in their fajita |
| 21:03.36 | xbmodder | That might work... |
| 21:03.48 | goozbach | it worked out in the end. |
| 21:03.53 | goozbach | let me finish |
| 21:04.03 | elg | do pleas3! |
| 21:04.19 | goozbach | so taking inspiration from both Alton Brown and redbeard1, I made cookies |
| 21:04.42 | xbmodder | When do the polls close? |
| 21:04.44 | goozbach | I lucked out and my first batch were the best dang cookies I've ever tasted |
| 21:04.51 | xbmodder | 18:00, right? |
| 21:04.55 | xbmodder | Local time zone? |
| 21:05.03 | mheath[laptop] | You know, I kind of wish that a lot of republicans win the elections today. |
| 21:05.10 | mheath[laptop] | and that very little changes |
| 21:05.11 | redbeard1 | goozbach: chocolate chip? |
| 21:05.21 | mheath[laptop] | Because that way, people will continue to get fed up |
| 21:05.33 | mheath[laptop] | and next time elections roll around, they'll be ready for complete change |
| 21:05.38 | goozbach | so, sunday night, I invited a bunch of people over to watch the CES fireside, making sure to mention that I was going to make cookies again. |
| 21:05.42 | goozbach | redbeard1: yup |
| 21:05.44 | mheath[laptop] | this time around....a few democrats are going to get elected here and there |
| 21:05.51 | mheath[laptop] | but they won't have enough power to do anything |
| 21:06.06 | mheath[laptop] | So people will say "Oh, even though we elected a lot of democrats, they're not doing anything, so..." |
| 21:06.23 | elg | democrats in power wouldn't be any better |
| 21:06.37 | mheath[laptop] | elg, they would CHANGE things |
| 21:06.40 | elg | I hope just enough democrats get elected to balance things out |
| 21:06.40 | goozbach | and so their were a bunch of pretty females at my house till late sunday night. |
| 21:06.42 | mheath[laptop] | which is the important thing, I think |
| 21:06.45 | mheath[laptop] | "better" is relative |
| 21:06.50 | goozbach | respect the power of the cookies |
| 21:06.56 | redbeard1 | yes |
| 21:07.24 | redbeard1 | cooking skills make a man marketable |
| 21:07.42 | emcnabb | I think both sides suck, but at least there needs to be some type of compromise in the middle when both have power |
| 21:07.46 | Keighvin | ~lart more stupid political solicitation calls to a PRIVATE FREAKING CELL PHONE |
| 21:07.59 | emcnabb | unlike now where the Republicans do whatever they'd like |
| 21:08.14 | elg | emcnabb: exactly. I don't ever want to see a completely republican or completely democratic senate/house/presidency |
| 21:08.28 | elg | i've seen both and I didn't like either |
| 21:08.30 | mheath[laptop] | Keighvin, apparently the republicans have been making said annoying phone calls under the pretense that it's the democratic cantidate calling, so you'll get annoying with the democratic cantidate. |
| 21:08.38 | mheath[laptop] | *annoyed with |
| 21:08.39 | emcnabb | it defeats the entire purpose of our government's structure |
| 21:08.40 | Keighvin | Not only is it illegal for them to make a call to a recipient who may be assessed charges for that call (e.g., cell phones) they're blocking the caller ID on the incoming source, which immedialy fails the provisions of maintaining clear identity. |
| 21:09.03 | emcnabb | Keighvin: ugh |
| 21:09.14 | Keighvin | s/immedialy/immediately/ |
| 21:09.35 | levi | Gosling quote, from the same interview as the Ritchie quote: "I think it would be a tragic statement of the universe if Java was the last language that swept through." |
| 21:09.47 | elg | :) |
| 21:11.16 | levi | According to the next sentence or two in his quote, it's about time for another language to take over, too. |
| 21:11.26 | levi | Sadly, it may just be C#. :/ |
| 21:11.42 | emcnabb | Java: 'Compile once, run anywhere*' *where the same version of Java is installed |
| 21:11.55 | emcnabb | fought that today... |
| 21:12.21 | levi | Stroustrup: "Without supporting libraries, most serous applications are unnecessarily hard in C++. With suitable libraries, most are reasonably easy." |
| 21:12.37 | levi | Sounds like what the guys who used C++ for the mozy.com programming contest said. |
| 21:12.43 | Tene | levi: where are these quotes from? |
| 21:12.54 | levi | http://www.gotw.ca/publications/c_family_interview.htm |
| 21:13.11 | findlay | its blaspheme! |
| 21:13.39 | elg | it's true |
| 21:13.48 | goozbach | so a vote for me is a vote for cookies |
| 21:13.56 | eco | Very true. |
| 21:14.03 | *** topic/#utah by elg -> The source for OSS focused discussion in Utah | Read http://plug.org/node/28 | vote for goozbach; sjansen puts chihuauas in ovens |
| 21:15.04 | findlay | I vote for goozbach |
| 21:15.09 | findlay | ~goozbach++ |
| 21:18.12 | levi | Stroustrup: In addition to Simula67, my favorite language at the time was Algol68. I think that "Algol68 with Classes" would have been a better language than "C with Classes." However, it would have been stillborn. |
| 21:19.11 | *** join/#utah mrpull-vx (n=Miranda@lacc-66-78-233-139.smartcity.com) |
| 21:20.56 | levi | Heh, both Ritchie and Stroustrup think the idea of a single ideal programming language for all tasks is absurd. Gosling thinks Java is pretty close, and perl is also nice if you're doing lots of string matching. ;) |
| 21:21.22 | findlay | languages are still immature |
| 21:21.56 | eco | Wow... he actually thinks that Java is nearly ideal for all tasks... |
| 21:22.56 | mrpull-vx | findlay: didn't gentoo adopt a convention like that (a year plus a month)? |
| 21:23.19 | eco | I don't think the minor number means months. |
| 21:23.23 | findlay | mrpull-vx: its <year>.<release> |
| 21:23.31 | mrpull-vx | and commit to 4 releases a year... then didn't do it? |
| 21:23.51 | findlay | there's usually 2 'releases' a year |
| 21:24.10 | levi | Heh, when asked what languages they admire outside of the C family, both Ritchie and Stroustrup mention Lisp. :) |
| 21:24.22 | findlay | of course |
| 21:24.29 | levi | Stroustrup also includes Algol68 and ML. |
| 21:24.48 | eco | hehe, and Gosling didn't answer. |
| 21:26.00 | findlay | ~rot1e128 ML |
| 21:27.39 | Keighvin | ~java lisp |
| 21:27.41 | ibot | Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: lisp |
| 21:31.07 | goozbach | hi I'm goozbach, and I approve this new topic |
| 21:31.37 | goozbach | my opponent is a kitten, and puppy hating, lutefisk eater. |
| 21:33.18 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@129.81.70.216) |
| 21:36.44 | levi | Gosling mentioned Lisp earlier, and I'm pretty sure he admires it. |
| 21:38.02 | levi | Surprise surprise, Stroustrup and Gosling have different opinions on the value of de-facto standards! |
| 21:42.22 | goozbach | FYI when you don't have chocolate chips, diced snickers are a good substitute |
| 21:42.44 | macnewbold | oh yeah |
| 21:43.09 | macnewbold | when you don't have diced snickers, chocolate chips are a poor but acceptable substitute |
| 21:44.07 | ^Migs^ | haha, I just did a search on my portal and got "School 404 not found" lolololollolololololololollololololol |
| 21:44.59 | goozbach | snicker-chip cookies |
| 21:45.00 | goozbach | ohh |
| 21:45.06 | goozbach | I should write up that recipie |
| 21:49.44 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-20-54.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 21:50.06 | redbeard1 | snicker chip? |
| 21:51.37 | levi | Snickerdoodles with chips? |
| 21:51.48 | levi | I dunno about that. |
| 21:58.17 | goozbach | levi: no, it's a chocolate-chip cookie but instead of nestle toll-house chips, it's diced snickers |
| 21:58.21 | goozbach | tasty! |
| 21:58.36 | levi | Ahh, I'd try one of those. :) |
| 22:03.02 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-20-54.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 22:09.10 | ^Migs^ | LOS ANGELES - Britney Spears filed for divorce Tuesday from Kevin Federline, officials said. The Los Angeles County Superior Court filing cites "irreconcilable differences," said court spokeswoman Kathy Roberts. |
| 22:15.38 | goozbach | come to LUGOT tonight and I'll give you one levi |
| 22:22.29 | ^Migs^ | what's LUGOT? |
| 22:24.01 | goozbach | forums.lugot.org |
| 22:24.18 | goozbach | Linux Users Group of Thomasville/Tallahassee |
| 22:24.55 | ^Migs^ | that forum is entirely too popular |
| 22:32.14 | ^Migs^ | wtf, there's some administrator here who keeps requesting small changes. I have, like, 10 emails requesting small changes. Why not just figure out what you want first, THEN tell me everything? |
| 22:40.41 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 23:02.06 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@129.81.70.216) |
| 23:02.52 | elg | ibot: thanks for keeping your trap shut |
| 23:02.52 | ibot | my pleasure, elg |
| 23:22.49 | levi | elg: Have you read anything about Parsing Expression Grammars? |
| 23:22.57 | levi | Or Packrat parsers? |
| 23:23.40 | Tene | I know some people who have done quite a bit. |
| 23:23.45 | Tene | levi: why? |
| 23:23.57 | *** join/#utah suspence (n=spencer@208.187.196.34) |
| 23:24.02 | levi | I'm reading through a paper on PEGs right now. |
| 23:24.36 | Tene | Yeah, I've got some friends who implemented Lojban in PEG. |
| 23:25.20 | levi | I wrote a Markdown translator a while back, and I was disappointed at how ad-hoc it was. I wanted to write a grammar for Markdown, but it didn't really fit any grammar I knew. |
| 23:25.32 | levi | Any kind of grammar, that is. |
| 23:25.58 | levi | I think a PEG might be able to match it, though. |
| 23:26.19 | levi | Even if not, they seem very interesting. |
| 23:26.30 | levi | And I was just looking at Lojban the other night, too. |
| 23:27.32 | Tene | http://teddyb.org/~rlpowell/hobbies/lojban/grammar/index.html |
| 23:27.54 | Tene | I was reading through the PEG and trying to translate it into Perl6 Rules. |
| 23:28.03 | Tene | I got the morphology halfway working. |
| 23:28.15 | levi | What exactly are Perl6 Rules? |
| 23:29.42 | Tene | pattern matching and such. Perl6 is going to ship with a grammar for parsing perl6, allowing intelligent macros and such instead of dumb source filters. |
| 23:30.24 | Tene | I really don't know enough about the area or the terminology to really give a useful explanation. |
| 23:30.39 | Tene | Specify a bunch of rules, match against one and get a parse tree... |
| 23:31.55 | Tene | Built on the replacement for regexes |
| 23:32.28 | levi | I'm curious what their theoretical foundations are. |
| 23:32.52 | levi | E.g., PEGs are essentially defining a recursive-descent parser. |
| 23:33.28 | levi | I'm not really sure what regexes are supposed to be these days, since they're not really pure regular expressions anymore. |
| 23:33.32 | Tene | I absolutely don't have the background to answer that question. |
| 23:33.42 | Tene | Here's the synopsis, though: http://dev.perl.org/perl6/doc/design/syn/S05.html |
| 23:36.55 | levi | Yow, that is a mess. |
| 23:37.08 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@69-12-240-206.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) |
| 23:37.19 | Sargun | ibot, yes. |
| 23:37.22 | ibot | You don't say! |
| 23:37.45 | Tene | yeah |
| 23:37.46 | atoponce | http://www.ksl.com/?nid=320&sid=615393 « that's the page to start watching here in about 1½ hours |
| 23:38.00 | levi | I think I'll stick with PEGs. |
| 23:38.16 | Tene | Here's the apocalypse: http://dev.perl.org/perl6/doc/design/apo/A05.html |
| 23:38.50 | Keighvin | ~lart dynamic bugs |
| 23:39.17 | levi | I wonder if people who like Lojban generally like or dislike perl. |
| 23:39.34 | Tene | It varies. |
| 23:39.51 | Tene | I like it, I know some who hate it, others who like it, others who are indifferent. |
| 23:40.00 | Tene | Several who are fond of lisp |
| 23:40.11 | levi | They certainly seem like opposite ends of the designed language spectrum. |
| 23:40.33 | Tene | not as much as you'd think |
| 23:41.29 | levi | Well, I must say I agree with Larry's take on the problems of 'current regex culture'. |
| 23:41.35 | Tene | I think someone there wrote a PEG parser generator in a lisp of some sort... |
| 23:41.44 | levi | There are a couple of them. |
| 23:41.51 | Tene | Or was working on one at least. |
| 23:42.08 | levi | One in Common Lisp that seems more like a toy, and one in Scheme that looks more like an academic project. |
| 23:42.50 | levi | There is an excellent perl-compatible regex library for Common Lisp that is sometimes faster than perl itself. It'd be nice to have a Packrat parser of that quality for Lisp. |
| 23:43.20 | Tene | Also, there's a ##parsers here on freenode |
| 23:44.03 | Tene | Interestingly, the only lojbanist in there wasn't really involved with the lojban PEG, I believe. |
| 23:44.23 | Tene | Perhaps he was the person working with the lisp-based parser generator. |
| 23:44.38 | levi | So, are you into lojban as well, or do you just know people who are? |
| 23:45.07 | Tene | I'm going to a convention inPhiladelphia in a couple of weeks to meet with the lojban community. |
| 23:45.26 | Tene | Yeah, I've been studying lojban for a while. |
| 23:45.48 | Tene | Feel free to come hang out in #lojban. ;) |
| 23:46.29 | Keighvin | Tene: Sweet! I didn't know we had another lojban geek in here! |
| 23:46.30 | levi | Cool. I don't know it at all, I just gave the website a cursory glance the other day after happening upon a link to it from jcowan's web page. |
| 23:47.17 | Keighvin | I got to the point where I could pronounce it, but that was it. |
| 23:47.29 | Tene | .ue mi ji'a na pu djuno |
| 23:47.40 | Tene | Ahh. |
| 23:49.19 | Keighvin | Apostrophe is just a h-like breath pause, yes? |
| 23:49.55 | Tene | a "voiceless glide", I believe it's called. |
| 23:50.01 | Tene | So yeah, something like that. |
| 23:56.07 | *** part/#utah suspence (n=spencer@208.187.196.34) |
| 23:59.24 | Keighvin | I'm still on the mailing list, but I haven't bothered to keep up on it for the last 2 years or so. |
| 23:59.31 | Keighvin | They're just going to an archived gmail filter. :( |