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| 00:30.41 | Lone_Wanderer | Are there any programming contractors here I can ask a question to? |
| 00:30.44 | Lone_Wanderer | of, whatever |
| 00:46.52 | tensai | ~ask |
| 00:46.54 | ibot | from memory, ask is Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily. See also http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html |
| 00:50.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Just wondering if it's typical to charge for meeting time. |
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| 02:21.35 | elg | lart vontrapp |
| 02:25.29 | findlay | looks like I'm going to have to customize my own firefox theme to make it useful |
| 02:33.07 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 02:34.55 | vontrapp | hi |
| 02:35.38 | herlo | ~lart Jayce^ for not shoing up to utos meetings on irc |
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| 02:40.17 | Sargun | avacado ice cream o.O |
| 02:40.20 | vontrapp | this time it did freeze, but i think the mix sat in the fridge for too long |
| 02:40.30 | vontrapp | might not be the best flavor |
| 02:40.47 | vontrapp | er, it might not be at the best flavor it could be |
| 02:41.28 | vontrapp | as per sitting in the fridge for almost a week because apparently the freezer bowl takes a few days to get cold enough |
| 02:42.00 | vontrapp | and someone (*cough* jacob) used up all it's frozenness |
| 02:42.18 | mheath | OK. I have to (temporarily) use an old kernel version |
| 02:42.32 | vontrapp | you'll shoot your eye out! |
| 02:42.38 | mheath | 2.4.24, 2.6.6, or 2.6.7? |
| 02:43.29 | Sargun | GNU/Linux |
| 02:43.31 | Sargun | 2.6.16-suspend2-r7 |
| 02:43.32 | Sargun | Linux god 2.6.16-suspend2-r7 #6 SMP PREEMPT Mon Aug 7 15:29:06 PDT 2006 i686 Genuine Intel(R) CPU T2500 @ 2.00GHz GNU/Linux |
| 02:43.48 | Sargun | Like that? |
| 02:44.13 | mheath | .... |
| 02:44.16 | mheath | Your a moron. |
| 02:44.24 | mheath | OK. Hmmm.. |
| 02:44.25 | Sargun | laugh |
| 02:44.36 | Sargun | herlo, Good you didn't go to castro |
| 02:44.36 | mheath | It will probably have to be 2.4.24 for the time being |
| 02:44.38 | Sargun | 10 people got shot. |
| 02:44.44 | Sargun | mheath, Why? |
| 02:44.51 | nick125_lappy | use 2.6.x |
| 02:44.57 | Sargun | use 2.5 |
| 02:45.00 | nick125_lappy | 2.4.x is too old |
| 02:45.01 | Sargun | use 2.5.x |
| 02:45.07 | nick125_lappy | probably won't even work with udev |
| 02:45.11 | mheath | Sargun: because I need internet, and the driver for the wireless isn't compatible with the latest anything. |
| 02:45.18 | Sargun | mhm. |
| 02:45.24 | Sargun | Run an older kernel in Xen |
| 02:45.24 | mheath | And I don't have time to port it at the moment. |
| 02:45.29 | mheath | ..... |
| 02:45.29 | Sargun | and route it through there |
| 02:45.30 | nick125_lappy | use least 2.6.x kernel |
| 02:45.36 | Sargun | Be a man! |
| 02:45.47 | nick125_lappy | or use a 2.7.x kernel |
| 02:45.54 | mheath | nick125_lappy: it's going to be 2.4. I just realized that I don't have udev or a lot of stuff really setup for 2.6. |
| 02:46.14 | herlo | Sargun: I saw |
| 02:46.17 | mheath | And since I lack the internet on that computer, installing additional software is not a trivial affair. |
| 02:46.20 | herlo | 7 shot |
| 02:46.28 | Sargun | ah |
| 02:46.32 | Sargun | I heard this morning |
| 02:46.57 | Lone_Wanderer | Eve Online is down and I'm bored :( |
| 02:47.09 | Lone_Wanderer | Maybe I'll go see a movie or something. |
| 02:47.22 | mheath | Lone_Wanderer: read a book, perhaps? |
| 02:47.22 | levi_home | Lone_Wanderer: How do you like Eve Online? |
| 02:47.23 | mheath | Heh. |
| 02:47.24 | Lone_Wanderer | Ohhh, a book! |
| 02:47.32 | levi_home | I need something interesting to do with chicken drumsticks. |
| 02:47.34 | Lone_Wanderer | I've been reading one at the book store. |
| 02:47.38 | Lone_Wanderer | Eat them? |
| 02:47.56 | mheath | Lone_Wanderer: you know book stores sell them too, right? |
| 02:48.01 | levi_home | I mean ideas to prepare them. |
| 02:48.03 | mheath | Theres also this thing called a library... |
| 02:48.08 | Lone_Wanderer | I rather like the game, Levi. Any game that's got that level of economy and epic-warfighting ability built into it is bound to get me hooked. |
| 02:48.13 | Lone_Wanderer | ohh |
| 02:48.21 | Lone_Wanderer | talk to my ex girlfriend about that |
| 02:48.24 | mheath | levi_home: Lemon Pepper seasonings....hmm....cajun? |
| 02:48.36 | mheath | ~summon redbeard1 |
| 02:48.37 | ibot | apt takes out 20 clean, identical-looking phones, some extra hands, and pretends to be a telemarketer for a large corporation, so he gets delivered a phonelist containing redbeard1's coordinates |
| 02:49.04 | mheath | levi_home: Barebecue sauce? |
| 02:49.12 | Lone_Wanderer | I do know that bookstores sell them but I'm not buying anything that's not strictly required. |
| 02:50.12 | Lone_Wanderer | Which includes books that have entire chapters devoted to maniacal screeching about the evils of anything other than libertarian capitalism. |
| 02:50.17 | Lone_Wanderer | (but which are otherwise pretty decent) |
| 02:50.17 | herlo | Sargun: no one died though |
| 02:50.26 | Sargun | mhmm |
| 02:50.29 | mheath | Lone_Wanderer: again...a library. |
| 02:50.30 | Sargun | Getting shot = bad |
| 02:50.35 | Sargun | Lone_Wanderer, Did you ask her out? |
| 02:50.37 | herlo | Sargun: yeah |
| 02:50.40 | Lone_Wanderer | I've read all the books I care to at the library. |
| 02:50.43 | Lone_Wanderer | NO I DID NOT ASK HER OUT YET |
| 02:50.47 | Lone_Wanderer | >:O |
| 02:50.53 | mheath | ..... |
| 02:50.55 | herlo | Lone_Wanderer: why not? |
| 02:50.56 | Sargun | heh |
| 02:51.00 | Lone_Wanderer | :'( |
| 02:51.03 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm going to. |
| 02:51.05 | herlo | Lone_Wanderer: you should ask her out |
| 02:51.08 | Lone_Wanderer | I know I should. |
| 02:51.11 | herlo | herlo: soon |
| 02:51.22 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm going to ask her to lunch. |
| 02:51.23 | mheath | herlo: talking to yourself is a bad habit ;-) |
| 02:51.25 | herlo | Lone_Wanderer: if you don't someone else might, then you won't get your chance |
| 02:51.32 | levi_home | mheath: Both of those qualify as 'out', though. |
| 02:51.40 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm not a part-time assassin for nothing herlo. |
| 02:51.47 | herlo | :-P |
| 02:51.52 | Lone_Wanderer | He could ask her out, but it'd be the last thing he did! |
| 02:52.18 | Lone_Wanderer | I need an mp3 player of some sort. A small, portable one. |
| 02:52.22 | Lone_Wanderer | One that is not an ipod. |
| 02:53.44 | Lone_Reader | Later all, to the bookstore I go. |
| 03:01.12 | mheath | ~lart atoponce |
| 03:01.22 | mheath | Theres your cookout :) |
| 03:02.21 | atoponce | hmmm. i could probably have a fairly larye dutch oven cookout with the crater left behind... |
| 03:03.57 | mheath | atoponce: we need to do an OALUG cookout, I think :P |
| 03:04.05 | mheath | Pity it's winter |
| 03:04.10 | mheath | nothing fun happens in winter |
| 03:05.21 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-cc10422fcf5bb158) |
| 03:16.13 | maquis | how did levi_home get op? |
| 03:16.18 | maquis | i didn't give it to him |
| 03:16.25 | elg | of course you did |
| 03:16.45 | elg | you don't remember? |
| 03:16.45 | maquis | no i didn't |
| 03:18.56 | maquis | i don't know |
| 03:19.20 | levi_home | Ha ha ha! |
| 03:19.40 | levi_home | I used my super op powers to erase your memory of the circumstances. |
| 03:25.19 | *** join/#utah spig (n=spig@spig.net) |
| 03:27.31 | elg | maquis: would it console you to know he's been op for a few days? |
| 03:27.40 | maquis | wha? |
| 03:27.49 | maquis | i've been out of it |
| 03:28.00 | maquis | i forgot to take the bus i was supposed to take today |
| 03:28.08 | maquis | and ended up at work half an hour later than i meant to |
| 03:28.30 | levi_home | Whoops. :) |
| 03:28.49 | maquis | yeah |
| 03:29.03 | maquis | note to self: when getting in to work at 7:30, don't forget to leave by 5 |
| 03:29.06 | findlay | op, heh, it's so overrated |
| 03:29.15 | *** kick/#utah [findlay!n=maquis@joanna.zmonkey.org] by maquis (maquis) |
| 03:29.20 | maquis | yup |
| 03:29.25 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@67.137.24.115) |
| 03:29.52 | findlay | and it corrupts your sense of decency |
| 03:29.53 | nick125_lappy | maquis: hey, now its my turn |
| 03:30.02 | maquis | nick125_lappy: for what? |
| 03:30.08 | nick125_lappy | to kick findlay |
| 03:30.08 | maquis | you want to get kicked too? |
| 03:30.17 | findlay | maquis is just being a jerk |
| 03:30.22 | nick125_lappy | no, I want to kick findlay! |
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| 04:23.03 | elg | lol http://hans.fugal.net/images/kerry.jpg |
| 04:26.36 | levi_home | elg: What's that from? |
| 04:26.46 | maquis | lol |
| 04:26.47 | elg | my father in law sent it. (he's in iraq) |
| 04:26.56 | maquis | that rocks! |
| 04:28.04 | elg | he occasionally forwards on interesting stuff |
| 04:29.10 | Sargun | Hahaha |
| 04:29.11 | elg | he's in logistics. works with the iraqi logistics people in training them to take over their own logistics |
| 04:29.20 | Sargun | Thats great. |
| 04:29.32 | elg | his office is in Saddam's palace in baghdad |
| 04:30.01 | elg | the joke is referring to something John Kerry said the other day |
| 04:30.11 | maquis | yeah |
| 04:30.14 | maquis | that was quite the quote |
| 04:30.28 | elg | http://www.wboc.com/Global/story.asp?S=5619791&nav=QEMt |
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| 04:30.34 | levi_home | Ahh, I read something about him apologizing for a 'botched joke'. |
| 04:30.45 | maquis | levi_home: ummm... it's a pretty badly botched joke |
| 04:31.03 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-35122eba633c3ea0) |
| 04:32.22 | elg | he was taking a jab at bush but botched it and it could be interpreted as "if you don't do well in school you might end up stuck in iraq" |
| 04:33.04 | maquis | more like, that's exactly what he said |
| 04:33.50 | elg | yup. "If you make the most of it and you study hard and you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don't you get stuck in Iraq," |
| 04:34.14 | elg | according to this article, what he was supposed to say was: "Do you know where you end up if you don't study, if you aren't smart, if you're intellectually lazy? You end up getting us stuck in a war in Iraq. Just ask President Bush." |
| 04:34.54 | elg | lesson: be really really careful if you're gonna make fun of people publicly |
| 04:35.05 | levi_home | Heh, yeah. |
| 04:35.07 | Tene | "Do your homework or else you'll end up president of the united states." |
| 04:35.29 | mheath | wow |
| 04:35.35 | mheath | Linux harware support has sure come a long way |
| 04:35.57 | mheath | I would have never guessed that the cheapest, very generic USB wireless network adapter from PC Club would be very well supported. |
| 04:37.13 | Tene | Wow, impressive. |
| 04:37.25 | levi_home | elg: There's the mess with the guy running against Hillary Clinton, too. |
| 04:38.24 | maquis | what's happening with pete these days? |
| 04:39.12 | levi_home | He made it to the Slashdot front page. |
| 04:39.55 | levi_home | But against Hatch, it will take more than Slashdot to get him a win. |
| 04:40.18 | elg | levi_home: what's that? I haven't heard that one |
| 04:41.58 | levi_home | elg: This reporter was sitting with Spencer and his wife and they were having a conversation. |
| 04:42.20 | vontrapp | ooh, the scandal |
| 04:42.24 | levi_home | The reporter claims he said Hillary used to be ugly, and he doesn't know why Bill married her. |
| 04:42.48 | levi_home | But she looks different now because of millions of dollars worth of plastic surgery. |
| 04:43.19 | levi_home | He is, of course, denying he said those things. |
| 04:45.22 | maquis | so, you know those little flash things where they tell you "look really closely, there are 3 things different between these 2 pictures, and you're really special if you can find all 3" and then suddenly something jumps out at you" |
| 04:45.31 | findlay | Pete made slashdot last year sometime too |
| 04:45.39 | maquis | so, my manager sent one of those out to our whole team yesterday |
| 04:45.45 | maquis | one of the guys was doing it during our team meeting |
| 04:45.47 | maquis | :) |
| 04:45.58 | maquis | with the volume on his computer turned up |
| 04:46.06 | findlay | heh |
| 04:46.35 | elg | maquis: i saw a video along those lines. like a car commercial, but then the car goes behind a tree and disappears, and while you lean in closer for a look, |
| 04:46.50 | elg | wham! some ugly somethingorother jumps up at you |
| 04:47.20 | maquis | yeah |
| 04:47.24 | maquis | i've seen that one too |
| 04:47.30 | maquis | but this was just too funny in the middle of a meeting |
| 04:47.41 | maquis | and our manager was laughing so hard afterwards |
| 04:51.11 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=clints@208.34.118.101) |
| 04:53.50 | Tene | how do I convince mysql to show me what permissions are defined for a table? |
| 04:54.00 | *** join/#utah epp (n=evan@c-67-182-211-240.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:54.05 | elg | Tene: with a mallet |
| 04:54.11 | Tene | :( |
| 04:54.24 | elg | or you could try scooby snacks |
| 04:54.36 | nick125_lappy | scooby snacks!! give me some!! |
| 04:55.19 | maquis | ~whaleslap mysql |
| 04:55.22 | ibot | ACTION beats mysql upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 04:55.39 | elg | Tene: don't listen to me, I'm just bitter against databases |
| 04:56.12 | elg | i can never convince them to do reasonable things like show me what permissions are defined for a table, and even when I can figure out how to do something I promptly forget it long before the next time I need to remember |
| 04:57.06 | levi_home | Grr, why does Lost have to be so mysterious? |
| 04:57.29 | Tene | docs show me everything I need in postgres. mysql is evil. I have to go online and search around. |
| 04:58.49 | nick125_lappy | Tene: and search. and search. and search. and ask in their IRC channels. and beg in their IRC channels. and you might get an answer! |
| 05:01.55 | mheath | Is there an easy to use thing like curses for something like perl or python? |
| 05:02.37 | elg | i'm sure they have curses libs |
| 05:02.45 | elg | see also slang |
| 05:02.57 | mheath | Actually, I want something more friendly than curses |
| 05:03.01 | mheath | just premade dialogs and like |
| 05:03.13 | mheath | not lots of customizations and terminal control |
| 05:03.16 | elg | oic. I thought you were just odd for thinking curses was easy |
| 05:03.36 | elg | if you find one, I know a professor here who would like to know about it |
| 05:04.09 | elg | he recently sent out a call for thesis-seeking masters students to implement something along those lines |
| 05:04.18 | mheath | ... |
| 05:04.24 | mheath | That sounds like something relatively trivial. |
| 05:04.36 | mheath | Not something you'd do a masters thesis on. |
| 05:04.48 | mheath | Unless I misunderstood you / you misunderstood me |
| 05:04.53 | elg | I wouldn't know, I don't focus on what people do masters theses on |
| 05:05.08 | mheath | I'm talking about something like 'dialog' for shell scripts, with programming language bindings |
| 05:05.34 | elg | but you might also be underestimating the undertaking that developing a GUI toolkit is, especially one aimed at consoles |
| 05:06.04 | mheath | elg: like you said, I'm sure theres ncurses or some curses bindings for something like perl or python |
| 05:06.05 | elg | how about `xmessage foo`? |
| 05:06.27 | mheath | And, ncurses or curses takes care of the grunt work |
| 05:06.40 | elg | for some definition of grunt work, yes |
| 05:06.52 | elg | but it doesn't really do any sort of auto layout |
| 05:07.00 | elg | like modern gui toolkits do |
| 05:07.14 | elg | and dialog doesn't count, it just does dialogs |
| 05:08.40 | elg | a proper, modern gui toolkit for consoles would not be a trivial undertaking |
| 05:08.48 | elg | a thin veneer over curses that is only marginally better would be |
| 05:09.03 | elg | as would some minor subset a la dialog |
| 05:09.22 | elg | well even those wouldn't be trivial. not masters-level, but not trivial |
| 05:09.23 | mheath | elg: Not necessarily trivial, but I don't there consisting of a masters thesis. |
| 05:09.33 | mheath | It is just redoing someone elses work in another programming language. |
| 05:09.42 | elg | no |
| 05:09.45 | mheath | Replicating things that exist already |
| 05:09.47 | elg | reimplementing curses would be doing someone elses work |
| 05:09.56 | elg | there doesn't exist such a toolkit. at. all. |
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| 05:10.09 | elg | after all these years. if it were trivial, it would be done |
| 05:10.10 | Sargun | mheath, is there any way a recruit could be on IRC? |
| 05:11.12 | mheath | O.o probably not, no. |
| 05:11.30 | Sargun | After you go through boot camp |
| 05:11.32 | Sargun | what happens? |
| 05:12.11 | elg | actually, it's possible some company did something along those lines (in a dos-mindset sort of way) back in the dos heyday |
| 05:12.17 | mheath | (though platoons have scribes appointed to help with admin work in Excel spreadsheets on the computer in the duty hut...I knew a couple guys who got away with checking their e-mail at home while 'working') |
| 05:12.20 | elg | but I'm not aware of anything, and neither is he |
| 05:12.26 | levi_home | elg: It may be that there are such text-based gui libraries that have been lost in the mists of time. |
| 05:12.35 | elg | right |
| 05:12.45 | mheath | Sargun: SOI, or basic infantry, depending no MOS. Thats just in the USMC; other branches vary. |
| 05:12.53 | elg | but a lot of the gui design concepts of modern toolkits didn't even exist back then |
| 05:12.54 | Sargun | ah |
| 05:12.54 | levi_home | elg: I recall a Borland editor clone... it may have some sort of library. |
| 05:12.55 | Sargun | cool. |
| 05:12.58 | elg | just look at tk |
| 05:13.00 | elg | like autolayout |
| 05:13.14 | mheath | Sargun: talking to a guy who's spewing out crap? |
| 05:13.15 | elg | tk is contemporary or newer than the ol' dos days |
| 05:13.18 | mheath | Saying their in boot camp or something? |
| 05:13.34 | Sargun | mheath, yeah. |
| 05:13.57 | mheath | Sargun: lmao. USMC boot camp? |
| 05:14.02 | elg | my cousin had net access. he was a sysadmin/software guy of some sort. this was not in boot camp or anything |
| 05:14.06 | Sargun | mheath, yeah :-) |
| 05:14.13 | mheath | Where you talking to this person at? |
| 05:14.24 | Sargun | AIM |
| 05:14.56 | mheath | Sargun: This person is really instant messaging you, saying that they are currently a Marine Corps recruit? |
| 05:15.13 | Sargun | yes |
| 05:15.15 | Sargun | -_- |
| 05:15.30 | mheath | Haha. Ask them if they're at San Diego or on the Island. |
| 05:15.46 | Sargun | -waiting- |
| 05:15.55 | Sargun | san diego |
| 05:16.00 | Sargun | they say they gotta sign off |
| 05:16.01 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:16.17 | mheath | Sargun: ask for platoon # and company quickly |
| 05:16.28 | Sargun | -asks- |
| 05:17.23 | elg | ~lart vontrapp |
| 05:19.17 | *** join/#utah mheath[laptop] (n=mheath@c-67-182-231-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 05:19.30 | Tene | I added a column to this table as type "boolean" |
| 05:19.31 | Tene | looking at the table now, it claims that it's of type "tinyint(1)" |
| 05:19.32 | Tene | I guess... mysql doesn't really work with booleans? |
| 05:19.53 | mheath[laptop] | Yah. Online with my new mini-usb network adapter.. :) |
| 05:20.12 | mheath[laptop] | Tene: tinyint(1) would be the literal type of a boolean. |
| 05:20.12 | Tene | yay! |
| 05:20.34 | mheath[laptop] | THis is open source at its best |
| 05:20.34 | Tene | Yes, but it requires you to use "0" and "1" instead of "true" and "false" which I didn't expect. |
| 05:20.39 | Sargun | he said "crap" |
| 05:20.41 | Sargun | and signed off |
| 05:20.54 | mheath[laptop] | Tene: yeah, it doesn't support "true" or "false" |
| 05:21.02 | nick125_lappy | Sargun: lol |
| 05:21.22 | levi_home | Sargun: What sort of connection was he supposedly using? |
| 05:21.33 | Sargun | I don't know |
| 05:21.36 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun: it's really unlikely he was telling the truth, but possible, I guess. Like I said, I knew a few scribes who had snuck a look at some e-mail. |
| 05:21.48 | Sargun | I was trying to get him to click on a link to get his IP |
| 05:21.57 | mheath[laptop] | Though I could think of many, many, MANY things I'd do with limited computer time down there than talk to Sargun |
| 05:22.12 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:22.14 | Sargun | hahaha |
| 05:22.42 | mheath[laptop] | and those scribes were the rarity. They were in MRP, too, which is really off track from actual training. |
| 05:22.58 | mheath[laptop] | Honestly, for 99.9% of the people down there, using a computer is the last thing on your mind. |
| 05:26.35 | levi_home | I think I will start with the Davis-Putnam algorithm for logical resolution in my program. |
| 05:26.46 | Sargun | surviving is highest? |
| 05:27.02 | mheath | No. Doing what your told is highest. |
| 05:27.38 | mheath | You don't have time to think about the concept of surviving. You just do what your told, because you are, at a very, very primative level, very afraid of what will happen if you don't. |
| 05:27.54 | Sargun | What is first level punishment? |
| 05:28.21 | mheath | What do you mean, 'first level punishment'? There is no defined levels of punishment |
| 05:28.31 | mheath | Drill instructors just get pissed off at your behavior and react |
| 05:28.33 | Sargun | oh |
| 05:28.42 | Sargun | He just yells? |
| 05:28.49 | Sargun | and pits you marine friends against you? |
| 05:28.55 | mheath | which can vary from having them yelling at you in a way you can't even imagine, to having him come up and slug you in the chest. |
| 05:29.09 | Sargun | ack. |
| 05:30.23 | mheath | One favorite of the drill instructors was what they called in the bootcamp venacular "waterbowl IT", which consisted of having to drink excessive amounts of water until you threw up. |
| 05:32.48 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun: alot of that is off the record, though...they're not technically supposed to make you drink water until you throw up, or touch you |
| 05:32.52 | Sargun | thats freaking crazy. |
| 05:33.14 | mheath[laptop] | the worse thing they do officially is IT you, which consists of heavy, HEAVY physical activity... |
| 05:33.34 | mheath[laptop] | Rapidly switching between activities like pushups, situps, jumping jacks, running in place, for a good 30 minutes or so |
| 05:33.50 | mheath[laptop] | ~it Sargun |
| 05:33.51 | ibot | So we want to be stupid, right, Sargun ? Fine, pushups, right now. OK, side straddle hops, right now. OK, run in place, right now. I didn't say stop! |
| 05:34.16 | Sargun | ouch |
| 05:34.22 | Sargun | so like your muscles explode? |
| 05:34.32 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun: Its an atmosphere that makes the best of the best. |
| 05:34.39 | mheath[laptop] | IT is far less than situations you'd experience in combat |
| 05:34.45 | Sargun | Whats the drop out rate? |
| 05:34.54 | mheath[laptop] | Very low, actually |
| 05:35.09 | mheath[laptop] | Just because its really hard to get sent home, unless you have a bad medical problem like they thought I did |
| 05:35.31 | mheath[laptop] | To just 'drop out' you're probably looking at legal action and possibly jail time |
| 05:35.57 | mheath[laptop] | Well...they told us it included jail time; I don't know if thats true, or just to scare us from wanting to drop out |
| 05:36.17 | mheath[laptop] | I can tell you it leaves a bad mark on your record and its a really long uphill battle for those who chose to 'drop out' |
| 05:36.27 | nick125_lappy | so much for it being voluntary |
| 05:37.04 | mheath[laptop] | nick125_lappy: It stopped being voluntary when you went deeply in debt to the government after they've housed you, fed you, trained you, and payed you. |
| 05:37.39 | mheath[laptop] | Its just not fulfilling a contract. |
| 05:37.47 | mheath[laptop] | Which is against the law. |
| 05:38.35 | Sargun | can't you be executed by shooting squad for abandonment? |
| 05:39.48 | mheath[laptop] | Yes. |
| 05:40.07 | mheath[laptop] | But saying "I want to go home" or even refusing to cooperate is not abandonment |
| 05:40.26 | mheath[laptop] | and while they can still legally execute someone for abandonement, it hasn't been done since WWII |
| 05:40.51 | mheath[laptop] | I knew a guy in MRP who had gone AWOL for a while. |
| 05:40.55 | mheath[laptop] | Two guys, actually. |
| 05:41.22 | Sargun | Don't they usually bread and water the guy for 7 days? |
| 05:41.46 | mheath[laptop] | No, not usually. |
| 05:41.46 | Sargun | oh |
| 05:41.55 | Sargun | how often does that happen? |
| 05:42.03 | mheath[laptop] | Bread and Water (and, now, a vitamins supplement) is just a generic NJP |
| 05:42.16 | mheath[laptop] | Doesn't happen too often, from what I understand |
| 05:42.42 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun: Those guys that went AWOL just got a brief forfiture of pay and allowances |
| 05:42.47 | Tene | Don't they {something weird and random i heard from TV or someone not in the military}? |
| 05:43.06 | mheath[laptop] | Tene: thats the way this conversation seems |
| 05:43.11 | mheath[laptop] | Don't they {insert naive comment}? |
| 05:44.25 | Sargun | heh |
| 05:44.45 | Sargun | This is what I heard from a Sailor a few years ago. |
| 05:45.10 | mheath[laptop] | Yes, they can restrict you to quarters and limit you to bread and water rations |
| 05:45.13 | mheath[laptop] | Its really not that common |
| 05:45.17 | mheath[laptop] | and its really not that bad when it happens |
| 05:45.24 | mheath[laptop] | because it happens for a maximum of a week |
| 05:45.34 | mheath[laptop] | Its not a bad punishment either |
| 05:45.54 | mheath[laptop] | its just a Non-Judicial Punishment, which means it can be given at the discrection of your Commanding Officer |
| 05:46.04 | mheath[laptop] | you don't have to be convicted of anything in a court or anything |
| 05:52.07 | maquis | mheath[laptop]: so, if they were to find out that you exaggerated your injuries just to get out, would you get in trouble? |
| 05:52.36 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: you missed that whole conversation. I did not exagerate in the sense you imply. |
| 05:52.54 | mheath[laptop] | Nor was the concern to send me home really based on the presented condition |
| 05:53.10 | maquis | mheath[laptop]: i read the entire conversation, as a matter of fact |
| 05:53.14 | mheath[laptop] | It was based on the pretense that I was likely to have more knee problems |
| 05:53.31 | maquis | congratulations for stating the entire thing on a publicly logged channel, btw |
| 05:54.03 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: I did not exagerate in the sense you imply. |
| 05:54.29 | maquis | mheath[laptop]: well... you lied at one of 2 points... either you lied to them, or you lied in here |
| 05:54.38 | Tene | Anyone know the maximum integer that can fit in a postgres INTEGER? |
| 05:55.03 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: No. When I had that conversation, I was rather depressed and wondering 'what if' I had kept my mouth shut. |
| 05:55.16 | mheath[laptop] | Raising any medical complaints short of death is regarded down there as exageration. |
| 05:55.27 | maquis | whatever |
| 05:55.31 | mheath[laptop] | If I can move around, I'm exagerating by complaining about my knee. |
| 05:56.03 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: what part of that conversation is inconsistent with what I'm telling you? |
| 05:56.42 | maquis | mheath[laptop]: the part where you specifically claim that you exaggerated your medical condition so they would send you home |
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| 05:57.48 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: I could barely walk. Want to know what I was told when I asked to go to medical? Stop exagerating. Your fine. Your just weak. |
| 05:57.57 | mheath[laptop] | Turns out they were right. |
| 05:58.13 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:58.16 | mheath[laptop] | I was in bad pain at the time, but it turns out that if I had just toughed it out for a while longer, I would have been great. |
| 05:58.48 | maquis | anyway, i'm going to bed |
| 05:58.53 | maquis | i'm tired of this topic |
| 05:58.56 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: If I have any concerns about lieing about my medical condition, its realted to reentering. |
| 05:58.57 | Sargun | night macnewbold |
| 05:59.01 | Sargun | and maquis |
| 05:59.09 | maquis | gnight Sargun |
| 05:59.26 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: because one doctor here thinks I have a bad genetic condition that can cause spontaneous death |
| 06:00.15 | mheath[laptop] | Luckily, he never mentions the issue by name or specifically in his written diagnosis |
| 06:00.42 | mheath[laptop] | The things he does mention I'm easily having a second opinion orthopedic doctor clear |
| 06:01.01 | SpecialK | A heart condition? |
| 06:01.05 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: and next time you say "I'm tired of this topic" and stalk off, remember that you're the one that started it. |
| 06:01.29 | mheath[laptop] | SpecialK: yes. |
| 06:01.29 | maquis | mheath[laptop]: actually, you were the one going off about the marines and the fact that the only way to get out is to have a medical condition |
| 06:02.09 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: I was answering a question Sargun asked about people who go AWOL. |
| 06:02.13 | mheath[laptop] | That isn't related. |
| 06:02.18 | mheath[laptop] | SpecialK: yes. |
| 06:03.01 | mheath[laptop] | SpecialK: A condition that can cause a sudden aneurism of the aeortic wall, causing nearly spontaneous death. |
| 06:04.35 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: you think I faked massive swelling of the knee? Perhaps I faked my flatfootedness, patella alta, and ligiment laxativity, too? |
| 06:05.04 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: and walking around wiht a bad limp for 3 weeks, never bending me knee..yeah, that was just for fun! you're right! |
| 06:05.04 | Tene | For some reason the phrase "spontaneous death" is extremely entertaining to me. It probably isn't wise for me to mention that here, though. |
| 06:07.27 | mheath[laptop] | maquis: what does it matter, anyway, how you chose to interpret what I said? |
| 06:07.43 | mheath[laptop] | I'm telling you now, quite clearly, what I meant by what I said. |
| 06:11.57 | Tene | mheath[laptop]: she's gone... |
| 06:16.33 | mheath[laptop] | As am I. Goodnight. |
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| 06:45.28 | SpecialK | The heart failure thing happens from time to time. There was a football player at Rice who collapsed and died, as well as a missionary playing basketball in the MTC who went up for a layup and came down dead. |
| 06:46.05 | Lone_Reader | crazy |
| 06:46.23 | Lone_Reader | I feel this crazy urge to make a snide remark about the missionary but I won't :p |
| 06:47.57 | SpecialK | That was a couple of years ago |
| 06:49.56 | Lone_Reader | Too bad for the kid and his family. |
| 06:50.20 | Sargun | :-/ |
| 06:50.21 | Lone_Reader | but, it's bedtime for me |
| 06:50.24 | Lone_Reader | see you all later |
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| 15:17.59 | *** topic/#utah is The source for OSS focused discussion in Utah | Read http://plug.org/node/28 | goozbach went to Texas de Brasil and all I got was this lousy topic |
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| 15:18.31 | goozbach | ibot: never leave again! |
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| 15:42.11 | goozbach | REDBEARD1! |
| 15:42.14 | goozbach | morning |
| 15:46.17 | levi | Good morning. :) |
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| 15:58.41 | elg | ~lart vont |
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| 16:01.58 | ^Migs^ | http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_305235233.html |
| 16:02.14 | goozbach | yay! I posted a new blog entry! |
| 16:02.27 | Keighvin | ~lart goozbach's blog entry. |
| 16:02.32 | Keighvin | Gooz, where's your @? |
| 16:03.32 | goozbach | Keighvin: it'll be showing up at the planet shortly, however it's at http://blog.friocorte.com/ |
| 16:04.06 | Keighvin | Actually, I meant "@" in a more literal sense of "why art thou not op'd" |
| 16:04.15 | Keighvin | But I'm checking out the post anyway. :) |
| 16:04.55 | goozbach | ahh I netsplit |
| 16:04.59 | goozbach | aparently |
| 16:05.08 | goozbach | I like being without my @ |
| 16:05.17 | goozbach | it's nice to use it in a threatining way |
| 16:05.26 | goozbach | like "don't make me get my @" |
| 16:05.45 | goozbach | aparently I need more pepsi |
| 16:05.51 | elg | ^Migs^: ha. nonintimidating environment my foot |
| 16:06.15 | elg | if a "corrections officer" is escorted out for vocal breathing, I'd be a little intimidated |
| 16:06.18 | elg | no matter who I was |
| 16:07.11 | ^Migs^ | heh |
| 16:07.17 | ^Migs^ | hilarious that they actually called the cops on him |
| 16:07.49 | elg | ~grunt goozbach |
| 16:07.58 | goozbach | leaving it up to all of you to decide what I'm grunting about. |
| 16:08.09 | elg | too much caffeine, probably |
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| 16:09.34 | Keighvin | I'm guessing he's getting ready to squat 500 lbs. |
| 16:09.59 | elg | of unix manuals |
| 16:11.25 | goozbach | elg: I haven't had enough |
| 16:11.32 | goozbach | that's what the grunt was about. |
| 16:11.36 | Crax | so like 5 manuals then? |
| 16:12.03 | levi | Nobody actually has printed Unix manuals anymore. |
| 16:13.04 | goozbach | levi: you haven't worked for the government lately, have you? |
| 16:13.44 | levi | Ahh, well, they don't count. |
| 16:14.07 | levi | Government IT depts. are practically computer museums. |
| 16:14.45 | graphyx | If you can delay a project by 5 hours just because the printing of the manual isn't done yet, wouldn't you? |
| 16:15.13 | goozbach | graphyx: yup |
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| 16:24.21 | ^Migs^ | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/11/01/level3_robbery/ |
| 16:24.55 | levi | More proof that C sucks: http://scienceblogs.com/goodmath/2006/11/the_c_is_efficient_language_fa.php |
| 16:25.08 | levi | I should say, more evidence that C sucks. |
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| 16:39.01 | elg | i agree with the premise that c/c++ are not The Fastest by some mandate from heaven |
| 16:39.25 | elg | but frankly his rant is just a rant from a guy that doesn't like C/C++. Some of the comments really discredit his arguments |
| 16:40.15 | Keighvin | A good coder matters as much if not more than the language. |
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| 16:40.36 | Keighvin | (in terms of performance) |
| 16:40.42 | levi | elg: There was one comment that may or may not discredit his arguments. |
| 16:41.04 | elg | we're talking about a guy who doesn't know the difference between int x[1000] and int *x |
| 16:41.47 | graphyx | I haven't coded C/C++ in a LONG time, but I think understand the difference between those two things. |
| 16:42.00 | graphyx | s/ think / think I / |
| 16:42.04 | maquis | elg: who? |
| 16:42.17 | elg | the guy writing that blog article |
| 16:42.36 | maquis | what blog article? (i got disconnected somehow last night) |
| 16:42.40 | elg | more accurately, he believe them to be the same thing |
| 16:42.49 | elg | http://scienceblogs.com/goodmath/2006/11/the_c_is_efficient_language_fa.php |
| 16:43.41 | tensai | maquis: what did you do? |
| 16:43.49 | elg | ~lart tensqui |
| 16:43.50 | maquis | tensai: that's what i'm asking you :P |
| 16:44.26 | tensai | box hasn't rebooted. I don't know what you broke. |
| 16:44.34 | maquis | i didn't touch nothin! |
| 16:44.38 | elg | freenode had issues |
| 16:44.42 | elg | that might be why |
| 16:44.52 | levi | Yes, he was wrong about that. But the general point is correct; unrestricted pointers make it very difficult to optimize code. |
| 16:44.53 | tensai | I'm not at home so I wasn't downloading anything |
| 16:45.03 | levi | And once you pass your C array to another function... |
| 16:45.09 | elg | yes, it's true |
| 16:45.30 | elg | and otoh most features of "real" languages are hard to optimize too |
| 16:45.43 | elg | not impossible, naturally, but hard and therefore often suboptimal |
| 16:45.52 | elg | ocaml looks pretty good though |
| 16:46.19 | levi | OCaml has the perfect set of features to write a good compiler for. |
| 16:47.12 | levi | SML, too. MLton generally ends up with faster object code than ocaml does, but not by a huge factor or anything. |
| 16:48.15 | elg | the real question is why are the languages that compete with C in speed all obscure |
| 16:48.40 | levi | The thing is, C generally gets translated into some variety of functional code by the compiler anyway so that complex analysis can be done by the compiler. Stuff like the aliasing problem gets in the way of performing optimizations that would normally be available. |
| 16:49.16 | elg | no doubt |
| 16:49.50 | levi | So you're not /really/ much closer to the hardware with C than you are with something like OCaml; you just get to perform a few unsafe operations that happen to be critical for writing device drivers and memory managers and such. |
| 16:51.23 | levi | And since the compiler is going to be rewriting your code anyway, there's not much point in trying to tell it exactly what sort of primitive operations to execute when you could be giving it information that's useful to its optimization routines. |
| 16:52.03 | elg | yes and yes |
| 16:52.13 | elg | so why are the C killers obscure? |
| 16:52.25 | levi | Because UNIX and WIndows were not written with them. |
| 16:52.37 | elg | that's why C is popular |
| 16:52.40 | maquis | because C is fun |
| 16:52.43 | elg | that's not why the others are obscure |
| 16:53.06 | levi | Well, it's certainly related. |
| 16:53.21 | maquis | elg: the fact that C is popular would cause other languages with the same features to be less popular |
| 16:53.32 | elg | i don't know. there's many languages that people like to program in that aren't C |
| 16:53.51 | Keighvin | They even had the GUI HTML, CSS, and JavaScript embedded directly in the @#$! thing. |
| 16:53.54 | elg | maquis: but the point is we need languages that DON'T have the same 'features', but are fast |
| 16:53.54 | maquis | think back to high school: the more popular person A became, the less popular other people were |
| 16:54.15 | elg | fame is fickle |
| 16:54.47 | maquis | elg: i'll agree... it's a good thing that the amount you make in life isn't directly proportional to how popular you were in high school.. |
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| 16:55.13 | elg | more like inversely proportional |
| 16:55.34 | maquis | yeah |
| 16:55.41 | maquis | which is good for most of us |
| 16:55.44 | levi | ocaml is certainly very suitable for a lot of programming tasks in general. It was created by university programmers in France, though. |
| 16:56.11 | elg | so anyway, I contend that it's not mutually exclusive to be cool (in the good sense) and to be fast. so why do we have fast but uncool and cool but unfast, but nothing that's cool and fast |
| 16:56.30 | elg | cool+fast would have a chance to eventually (over many years) unseat C |
| 16:57.03 | elg | or at least give an alternative to forward thinking free minded individuals. :) ocaml may be that, I don't know. I'm not that familiar with it |
| 16:57.42 | maquis | what's uncool about c? |
| 16:57.55 | levi | It's a steaming pile of garbage, that's what. ;) |
| 16:58.24 | ^Migs^ | REAL programmers use Java |
| 16:58.30 | levi | Actually, it is pretty uncool these days, if the CS students at UVSC are any measure. |
| 16:58.39 | levi | Everyone at least uses C++. |
| 16:58.44 | goozbach | time for food |
| 16:59.20 | elg | ~feed goozbach |
| 16:59.21 | ibot | ACTION offers goozbach some horseraddish |
| 16:59.41 | levi | And it's uncool for pretty darn good reasons. |
| 17:00.02 | levi | maquis: And I wrote a whole paper about them, if you recall. |
| 17:00.52 | maquis | levi: i vaguely recall that |
| 17:01.37 | maquis | i still hold that, regardless, java sucks worse |
| 17:01.45 | maquis | particularly when tomcat is involved |
| 17:04.52 | Keighvin | ~lart tomcat |
| 17:06.54 | Keighvin | ~java tomcat |
| 17:06.55 | ibot | Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: tomcat |
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| 17:07.28 | levi | maquis: Java the language is, in many ways, far superior to C for a lot of programming tasks, but not all. Java the set of bloated 'Enterprise' libraries and tools is a monstrosity that may or may not have a very useful subset. ;) |
| 17:08.06 | ^Migs^ | Java is awesome for anything. Everyone should use Java. |
| 17:08.34 | ^Migs^ | I think some people are just afraid of admitting that |
| 17:08.52 | maquis | ~whaleslap ^Migs^ |
| 17:08.53 | ibot | ACTION beats ^Migs^ upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 17:09.17 | ^Migs^ | haha |
| 17:09.25 | ^Migs^ | seriously though, I personally am never going back to C/C++ |
| 17:09.29 | ^Migs^ | maybe C#, though |
| 17:09.43 | levi | C# is actually looking to turn into a fairly cool language. |
| 17:10.37 | levi | Microsoft has this huge cadre of functional programming researchers that have been turned loose on their language design projects. |
| 17:11.05 | levi | Sun has some pretty darn smart people, too, but they have to be a lot more conservative thanks to their current marketshare. |
| 17:11.14 | levi | findlay: That is foolish. |
| 17:11.19 | findlay | I know |
| 17:12.10 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@64-52-97-250.client.cypresscom.net) |
| 17:12.48 | ^Migs^ | findlay is just being part of the crowd. It's cool to be anti-Microsoft. |
| 17:13.15 | levi | I'm annoyed at Java for stealing the market from Smalltalk, which was actually growing in the business programming realm when it showed up. |
| 17:13.30 | Keighvin | I hate MS, but I know better than to bet against them. |
| 17:13.45 | *** join/#utah bmidgley_ (n=bmidgley@IP-155-101-217-227.media.utah.edu) |
| 17:14.06 | levi | But that did force down the price of Smalltalk systems to the point where they were cheap enough to be picked up by hobbyists. |
| 17:14.12 | levi | And eventually freed. |
| 17:14.51 | findlay | I don't care if it's cool, I just don't like them as a company. Their corporate culture and philosophy disgusts me |
| 17:14.53 | levi | And thus, the recent growth of interest in Smalltalk and Ruby. |
| 17:15.07 | findlay | except for a few things like what levi was talking about |
| 17:15.57 | levi | The guy who's the product manager for Visual C++ .net came to UVSC for a colloquium talk. He made it sound like a really fun environment. |
| 17:17.05 | levi | And Microsoft is so huge that there are likely several distinct corporate cultures and philosophies within it. |
| 17:17.57 | findlay | perhaps, but I'm never going to work there if they remain the same |
| 17:18.05 | *** join/#utah vontrapp (n=von@71.35.254.49) |
| 17:18.20 | *** join/#utah Robdor (n=Robdor@208.187.198.179) |
| 17:18.28 | levi | They have not remained the same. They are far less evil today than they were, though they still do some pretty darned annoying things with their OS stuff. |
| 17:18.51 | *** join/#utah levi_home (n=levi@levi.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 17:19.05 | findlay | yeah |
| 17:19.47 | findlay | but mainly I'll always dislike proprietary software |
| 17:22.14 | findlay | can anybody bring up www.byu.edu? |
| 17:22.28 | findlay | I'm getting: HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 404 Not Found |
| 17:22.34 | elg | yarp |
| 17:22.58 | findlay | did BYU disappear from off the map? |
| 17:23.06 | elg | works here |
| 17:23.09 | maquis | findlay: maybe the networking prof tried to demonstrate the fact that the HTTP command DELETE doesn't work again |
| 17:23.27 | findlay | heh |
| 17:23.48 | findlay | ~lart veracity |
| 17:23.52 | maquis | (when i was in there, he did 'DELETE /' and panicked when it replied "200 OK" |
| 17:23.53 | findlay | ~flame veracity |
| 17:23.55 | ibot | veracity sux0rz d00d!!!!!!!!!!!!!!@@!!!!!!!11 |
| 17:23.59 | *** join/#utah vontrapp_ (n=von@71.35.254.49) |
| 17:24.06 | findlay | ~nuke veracity |
| 17:24.07 | ibot | ACTION prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at veracity ... B☢☢M! |
| 17:24.24 | [Utah]tristanbob | ☢☢ |
| 17:24.34 | elg | maquis: ha. did it work? |
| 17:24.38 | elg | who was it? |
| 17:24.48 | findlay | veracity's network sux0rz |
| 17:24.50 | maquis | elg: it didn't... but he was panicked for a minute or two |
| 17:24.53 | maquis | elg: dr zappala |
| 17:25.27 | vontrapp | when i start gnome-theme-manager, it turns on my gnome theme (human) |
| 17:25.42 | findlay | it can't even connect to www.byu.edu, a mere mile from iprovo |
| 17:25.45 | vontrapp | i want the themage on, but i don't want to start a manager and close it just to get it |
| 17:25.55 | vontrapp | is there another command that will just turn the theme on? |
| 17:26.04 | findlay | vontrapp: /usr/lib-exec/gnome-settings-daemon |
| 17:26.08 | findlay | or simmilar |
| 17:26.34 | findlay | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:26.42 | findlay | that's it |
| 17:26.51 | vontrapp | ok, great |
| 17:27.17 | findlay | but test if $GSDPID is set first |
| 17:27.46 | vontrapp | why, what's that for? |
| 17:27.59 | elg | it executes rm -rf / |
| 17:28.02 | findlay | that's the PID of the running daemon |
| 17:28.03 | elg | on thursdays |
| 17:28.13 | vontrapp | oh, i know it's not already running |
| 17:28.16 | vontrapp | i'm not using gnome |
| 17:28.29 | *** join/#utah xbmodder (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 17:28.35 | findlay | well, you test it to make sure another copy isn't running |
| 17:28.48 | maquis | vontrapp: just a warning that i've discovered: some gnome-commands don't play nicely if gnome's not running |
| 17:28.58 | findlay | maquis: like? |
| 17:28.58 | vontrapp | well, apparently when i run it manually it doesn't set GSDPID anyway |
| 17:29.05 | elg | maquis: that's racism |
| 17:29.12 | maquis | findlay: i'm not sure... the one i tried a couple days ago |
| 17:29.14 | vontrapp | ~race maquis |
| 17:29.47 | elg | ok, I'm officially sick of this denoational semantics mess |
| 17:30.04 | findlay | grep --criteria "the one she tried a couple of days ago" maquis@maquis-box.com:./bash_history |
| 17:30.06 | vontrapp | ~dict denoational |
| 17:30.28 | elg | denotational |
| 17:30.38 | maquis | ~dict denotational |
| 17:31.01 | vontrapp | hmm, ubuntu multiverse just isn't enough for me |
| 17:31.08 | vontrapp | i want java packages, and acroread |
| 17:31.31 | elg | multiverse |
| 17:32.03 | elg | oh, I thought you said universe |
| 17:32.09 | elg | doesn't multiverse have java and acroread? |
| 17:33.00 | levi | elg: What about denotational semantics are you sick of? |
| 17:33.07 | elg | the mess |
| 17:33.20 | levi | I'm not sure which mess you're referring to. |
| 17:33.29 | vontrapp | well, i have multiverse on and no such packages show themselves |
| 17:33.40 | elg | I'm not sure how I'd do it better, but this business of "now take this one version we discussed in class and change it this way" |
| 17:33.54 | elg | so we have literally dozens of versions of toy languages |
| 17:33.58 | levi | Most of the papers I've read that discuss semantics use operational semantics. |
| 17:34.17 | elg | none of which are really documented anywhere |
| 17:34.28 | elg | i'm sure the same problem would apply to operational |
| 17:34.28 | maquis | vontrapp: you probably need to get some more repositories |
| 17:34.35 | levi | elg: That's how CS330 and the language-building projects worked, IIRC. Except you defined them operationally via scheme code. |
| 17:34.45 | vontrapp | yeah, hence multiverse is not enough |
| 17:34.53 | findlay | vim syntax files are fun |
| 17:34.57 | vontrapp | but that means i have to go digging for repos |
| 17:35.01 | findlay | if you know what's going on, that is |
| 17:35.37 | levi | elg: Is the way you're supposed to change it not clear, or is it just cumbersome to have some many different versions? |
| 17:37.17 | *** join/#utah Crax (n=nobody@42dbd951.dsl.aros.net) |
| 17:38.38 | elg | cumbersome |
| 17:38.49 | elg | how you're supposed to change it is perfectly clear |
| 17:38.53 | elg | what you're supposed to change is not |
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| 17:39.05 | elg | since I don't write down everything they put on the blackboard |
| 17:39.17 | levi | Ahh. |
| 17:39.22 | levi | Yeah, that would be annoying. |
| 17:39.37 | levi | At least with CS330 the thing you're supposed to modify is available on a web page. |
| 17:39.41 | elg | it's also cumbersome in that any nontrivial features get really messy really quickly (in the denotational semantics) |
| 17:39.57 | elg | right. |
| 17:40.16 | levi | Yeah, I got that impression from my extremely cursory look at den. sem. |
| 17:41.22 | elg | and I'm still waiting for that insight into why it's better than any other kind of semantics. :) it is more abstract, yes, but it's still essentially operational IMO |
| 17:41.32 | elg | the way you figure out what the mess means is to evaluate it |
| 17:41.40 | elg | eg simplify it |
| 17:42.05 | elg | in the end you're doing the computation. so how is that different from operational semantics? |
| 17:43.00 | levi | Beats me. |
| 17:43.18 | levi | I'm still not entirely clear on the difference. |
| 17:43.38 | elg | oh well. we're done with den. sem. now (except homework and tests) |
| 17:45.30 | *** join/#utah manithree (n=blr@c-71-199-35-71.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 17:49.04 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 17:53.33 | *** join/#utah TacoJockey (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-d626ec0b98fa0904) |
| 18:11.17 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-79a810ea006de1bf) |
| 18:12.11 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@000-052-082.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 18:12.13 | findlay | aww, the taco man left (: |
| 18:13.53 | harleypig | I want: http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/generic/8a5b/?cpg=39H |
| 18:14.36 | levi | Heh, there seems to be a war going on at the Denotational Semantics page on Wikipedia between Carl Hewitt and a bunch of others. |
| 18:16.18 | *** join/#utah Jayce^ (n=jayce@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 18:16.18 | *** mode/#utah [+o Jayce^] by ChanServ |
| 18:17.11 | levi | harleypig: That's pretty cool, in an extremely geeky way. :) |
| 18:17.22 | manithree | what other way is there? |
| 18:18.02 | levi | The way that my wife would approve of. ;) |
| 18:22.24 | findlay | harleypig: for Christmas? |
| 18:22.38 | findlay | only if you get me a thinkpad |
| 18:25.11 | ^Migs^ | once again, the new guy has disappeared for a couple hours, and I have no idea where he went |
| 18:28.55 | findlay | ^Migs^: that was classic |
| 18:29.36 | elg | wow, that's fancy |
| 18:30.11 | ^Migs^ | what, you're getting tired of me complaining about him? |
| 18:34.32 | findlay | no, it was just funny, and said funnily |
| 18:35.04 | ^Migs^ | :) |
| 18:37.04 | goozbach | http://i12.tinypic.com/48lx0zn.jpg |
| 18:37.06 | goozbach | SFW |
| 18:37.58 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@000-178-815.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 18:38.46 | ^Migs^ | man, that is tacky |
| 18:39.11 | elg | tacky? |
| 18:39.16 | elg | as in composed of tacks? |
| 18:39.27 | elg | or do you have something against mr. man? |
| 18:39.50 | ^Migs^ | absolutely not. It made me snicker. |
| 18:40.00 | ^Migs^ | it was more of a snort, really |
| 18:41.45 | graphyx | I thought it was rather amuzing. |
| 18:41.51 | ^Migs^ | oh it was |
| 18:48.13 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@c-24-10-229-14.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 18:51.11 | goozbach | tacky |
| 18:51.16 | goozbach | ~tack ^Migs^ |
| 18:51.28 | goozbach | ~attack ^Migs^ |
| 18:51.29 | ibot | ACTION grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing ^Migs^ |
| 18:59.38 | Keighvin | ~weaselstomp redbeard1 |
| 18:59.40 | ibot | ACTION dons a viking helm, spreads some mayonnaise, and gives redbeard1 a good hard STOMP. Repeatedly. |
| 18:59.58 | redbeard1 | ~whaleparry Keighvin |
| 18:59.59 | ibot | ACTION uses a slightly less-huge but eminently more agile killer whale named Edwardo to parry Keighvin's attacks. |
| 19:00.54 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-5c1756d6d7588bc5) |
| 19:12.38 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleslap redbeard1 |
| 19:12.39 | ibot | ACTION beats redbeard1 upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 19:15.56 | redbeard1 | ^Migs^: you've got red on you |
| 19:17.19 | findlay | ~whaleglob |
| 19:18.25 | Keighvin | ~whalepunt findlay |
| 19:18.27 | ibot | ACTION looks onward as an everest-sized whale called Victor punts findlay across the Solar System |
| 19:19.35 | Keighvin | ~halehug redbeard1 |
| 19:19.40 | ^Migs^ | ~whalefu Keighvin |
| 19:19.51 | ^Migs^ | ~whalebodyslam Keighvin |
| 19:20.46 | ^Migs^ | ~whalestab Keighvin |
| 19:20.48 | ibot | ACTION stabs Keighvin with a rather narrow and pointy whale named Montgomery |
| 19:20.59 | Keighvin | ~whaleparry ^Migs^ |
| 19:21.01 | ibot | ACTION uses a slightly less-huge but eminently more agile killer whale named Edwardo to parry ^Migs^'s attacks. |
| 19:21.08 | Keighvin | ~whalelemmings ^Migs^ |
| 19:21.09 | ibot | ACTION 's jaw drops as an army of lemmings escape the mouth of a rather sizeable whale named Remus. The army tramples ^Migs^ |
| 19:21.24 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleshoot Keighvin |
| 19:21.42 | Keighvin | ~whaleflurry ^Migs^ |
| 19:21.43 | ibot | ACTION unleashes a flurry of slaps at ^Migs^ using Gilbert - the ideal whale for the job |
| 19:21.53 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleglob Keighvin |
| 19:22.01 | ^Migs^ | ~whalestomp Keighvin |
| 19:22.05 | ^Migs^ | ~whalepunch Keighvin |
| 19:22.24 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleconsume Keighvin |
| 19:22.27 | Keighvin | ~whalenametheft ^Migs^ |
| 19:22.28 | ibot | ACTION watches in awe as a rather menacing whale named Reginald (who also happens to be well versed in the art of marketing) kicks ^Migs^'s ass and steals his/her name. The now anonymous target weeps. |
| 19:22.51 | ^Migs^ | how do you know all these commands? |
| 19:22.56 | Keighvin | ~whalebomb ^Migs^ |
| 19:22.57 | ibot | ACTION throws an explosive whale named Gunter at ^Migs^ and hides. |
| 19:22.58 | Keighvin | Not telling. |
| 19:23.26 | redbeard1 | ~whalelart Keighvin |
| 19:23.35 | redbeard1 | it was worth a shot |
| 19:23.43 | ^Migs^ | yay, new guy came back....after 4 hours being gone for whatever reason |
| 19:25.05 | harleypig | ^Migs^: Use the source Luke! |
| 19:25.21 | ^Migs^ | ~source ^Migs^ |
| 19:25.26 | Keighvin | harleypig: 'tain't in the source, it's in the DB. |
| 19:25.46 | harleypig | The DB is tainted? |
| 19:25.56 | Keighvin | No, it's 'tain't'd. |
| 19:26.32 | Keighvin | That's almost as bad as the "I-can't-thing-of-alien-names-without-apostrophes" syndrome for beginning sci-fi authors. |
| 19:26.51 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
| 19:26.51 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 19:28.33 | ^Migs^ | hahaha |
| 19:29.00 | ^Migs^ | if I were making alien names, I'd use non-standard ASCII characters, like § and º |
| 19:29.51 | findlay | does a sci fi magazine really need a copy editor? |
| 19:30.16 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 19:30.16 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 19:30.21 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-bb797037c3eb947d) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 19:30.33 | elg | ^Migs^: I think your new guy is in the cia |
| 19:30.39 | macnewbold | findlay: of course. even sci fi readers need it to make sense when they read it. |
| 19:30.48 | macnewbold | unlike my last sentence |
| 19:31.05 | findlay | its from 'The Foreigner' |
| 19:31.14 | *** join/#utah redbeard1 (n=redbeard@pollux.northsky.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 19:32.38 | ^Migs^ | or maybe he's a SUPERHERO |
| 19:33.05 | elg | yeah. cut the hero some slack you meanie |
| 19:33.36 | ^Migs^ | I feel like a real schmoe. |
| 19:34.41 | *** join/#utah vontrapp (n=von@71.35.254.49) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 19:35.06 | *** join/#utah levi_home (n=levi@levi.dsl.xmission.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 19:36.48 | findlay | could have been saving small children from the throes of the evil Dr. Phone Call that has been terrorizing the SLC area |
| 19:41.52 | *** join/#utah vex (n=vex@216.194.126.99) |
| 19:43.05 | emcnabb | usually I'm not |
| 19:43.13 | emcnabb | ugh |
| 19:46.13 | findlay | ~grump emcnabb |
| 19:46.27 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-20-54.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 19:48.56 | emcnabb | interesting, Novell and Microsoft are cuddling up? |
| 19:48.58 | emcnabb | http://www.marketwatch.com/News/Story/Story.aspx?guid=%7b6993FD14-ECEC-4896-B29F-0E00E301AAD8%7d&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo |
| 19:50.50 | findlay | elg: is there a way to get vim to do a tab-like UI? |
| 19:51.23 | elg | minibufexplorer? |
| 19:51.31 | elg | vim7 has tabs, but they're pretty lame |
| 19:52.45 | ^Migs^ | I prefer the term "bedfellows" |
| 19:53.46 | emcnabb | haha |
| 19:54.27 | Keighvin | Peace out, you all. |
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| 20:07.19 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-bb797037c3eb947d) |
| 20:08.26 | *** join/#utah calvarez (i=calvarez@lawn-128-61-120-35.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 20:12.52 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@64-52-97-250.client.cypresscom.net) |
| 20:13.52 | calvarez | ok, question: what would be your main selling point when trying to get non-so-computer-savvy people to switch to Linux for personal/office tasks? |
| 20:15.20 | calvarez | variety of software for a single task? customization? free alternatives to Windows products? price? |
| 20:15.39 | calvarez | I'm trying to make this as concise and non-all-encompassing as possible |
| 20:15.50 | goozbach | put it in front of them and offer no other alternative. |
| 20:16.06 | ^Migs^ | OpenOffice |
| 20:16.17 | ^Migs^ | if money isn't an issue, then don't even bother trying |
| 20:16.19 | graphyx | Here is somethign amusing. |
| 20:16.28 | graphyx | We have IPS enabled to block p2p software here at work. |
| 20:16.28 | ^Migs^ | why do you want them to switch to Linux anyway? |
| 20:16.33 | graphyx | and we ahve a security event monitor. |
| 20:16.56 | graphyx | one of the rules that triggers is if someone sends anything to dark addresses. (Ie non routable. 1.x.x.x) |
| 20:17.16 | calvarez | ^Migs^, that is exactly the question I am asking: why would non-computer-savvy people want to switch to Linux? |
| 20:17.30 | graphyx | We were getting alerts for stuff headed to 1.3.3.7 Usually stuff that translates to leetspeak is interesting for a securtiy standpoint since leetspeak is from hacker culture. |
| 20:17.33 | calvarez | from a user's perspective, btw |
| 20:17.36 | ^Migs^ | oh, you're talking about MS + Novell |
| 20:17.45 | graphyx | Turns out that limewire client will send tcp and udp packets to 1.3.3.7 |
| 20:17.47 | ^Migs^ | I thought you had some people you were trying to convince |
| 20:17.55 | graphyx | We had 3 cases where limewire was used when that occured. |
| 20:17.59 | graphyx | Seems funny to me. |
| 20:18.09 | ^Migs^ | I would like to see that. I run SuSe Linux here with Windows running in VMWare |
| 20:18.16 | calvarez | ^Migs^, no, I'm actually helping out someone prepare a paper trying to convince some UVSC professors to switch to FOSS for their academic tasks |
| 20:18.21 | ^Migs^ | although I never use the VMWare, but everyone else in the office does |
| 20:18.30 | ^Migs^ | ? |
| 20:18.37 | ^Migs^ | what's wrong with their current system? |
| 20:18.40 | calvarez | the idea is analyze why they would be better off using FOSS and how to convince them of that |
| 20:19.05 | ^Migs^ | oh |
| 20:19.08 | calvarez | Free/Open Source Software |
| 20:19.08 | ^Migs^ | free open source... |
| 20:19.09 | ^Migs^ | gotcha |
| 20:19.28 | ^Migs^ | so what's wrong with their current setup? |
| 20:19.47 | ^Migs^ | are they complaining about it or something? |
| 20:19.57 | calvarez | not that I'm aware of |
| 20:19.59 | ^Migs^ | ? |
| 20:20.10 | ^Migs^ | so you just feel the need to push your OSS philosophy on someone else? |
| 20:20.26 | calvarez | ack, I don't push nothing on nobody |
| 20:20.33 | calvarez | on the contrary sometimes |
| 20:20.36 | ^Migs^ | see, that's the problem with you Linux/OSS fanbois. You feel this unsatiable urge to not only engage in such activities yourself, but push it on the REST of us |
| 20:20.40 | calvarez | we've been in some flame wars about it before |
| 20:20.46 | calvarez | lol |
| 20:20.58 | ^Migs^ | then when you do, you sit back content, and snicker with your other LInux homies about how much MS sucks |
| 20:21.12 | calvarez | no, I'm interested in helping people be more computer-savvy and have more options available. That is as far as my agenda goes. |
| 20:21.47 | ^Migs^ | oh, I wish I could believe that |
| 20:21.47 | calvarez | If they evaluate their needs, and they decide to use non-FOSS software, that's cool |
| 20:21.47 | calvarez | in fact, that's what I've done myself |
| 20:21.47 | calvarez | I don't use Linux anymore |
| 20:21.47 | ^Migs^ | you're all like "OMG I USE TEH L1NUX I M L33T" |
| 20:21.59 | ^Migs^ | right |
| 20:22.03 | calvarez | hmm, are you reading those characters that show up in your screen? |
| 20:22.16 | ^Migs^ | Sure, but why should I believe anything a LINUX user says? |
| 20:22.17 | calvarez | it seems you didn't see what I just said |
| 20:22.25 | calvarez | I don't know, why? |
| 20:22.27 | calvarez | explain |
| 20:22.41 | calvarez | illuminate me |
| 20:22.48 | ^Migs^ | I already did. Linuxers are just trying to force everyone else to use LInux. |
| 20:23.01 | ^Migs^ | and they'll use any conniving tactic to accomplish this end. |
| 20:23.04 | levi | Honestly, unless you get into philisophical reasons to use Free Software, I see two practical reasons to use LInux instead of Windows. One, you don't have to pay for any of your applications. Two, you won't get loaded down with malware from web browsing. |
| 20:23.09 | calvarez | yes. I've found that sharp metal objects are good in the forcing process |
| 20:23.18 | calvarez | thank you levi |
| 20:23.19 | calvarez | it |
| 20:23.33 | ^Migs^ | no, that didn't solve anything |
| 20:23.49 | ^Migs^ | you're not helping someone choose whether to use WIndows or lInux. You're trying to CONVINCE someone who's ALREADY using Windows to SWITCH to Linux. |
| 20:24.16 | calvarez | s just it's funny. I've been considered a troll in the BYU UUG before for criticizing the philisophical standpoint of Stallman et al., and some guy here says I'm trying to push FOSS onto people, lol |
| 20:24.18 | levi | Of course, it's not completely secure, so your computer can still get hacked; it's just far less likely. |
| 20:24.30 | ^Migs^ | who the crap is Stallman? |
| 20:24.52 | levi | ^Migs^: Where the crap have you been living? Under a crappy rock? |
| 20:24.53 | calvarez | ^Migs^, it's an alien monster that will suck your life out of your butt |
| 20:25.03 | calvarez | be careful |
| 20:25.14 | calvarez | tie a pillow on to your rear end |
| 20:25.35 | calvarez | that will make the sucking process less efective and you might survive |
| 20:25.52 | calvarez | anyways |
| 20:25.58 | calvarez | levi, what do you think? |
| 20:26.17 | ^Migs^ | who would go to a UUG anyway? |
| 20:26.20 | calvarez | what are some good selling points when doing FOSS proselitying to non-computer-savvy people? |
| 20:26.20 | ^Migs^ | what do you even do there? |
| 20:26.23 | levi | Not much. But what particular thoughts are you asking about? |
| 20:26.30 | calvarez | ^Migs^, we eat babies |
| 20:26.49 | calvarez | we have baby limb snacks in each UUG meeting |
| 20:26.50 | levi | ^Migs^: We say crap a lot. You'd like it. |
| 20:26.58 | ^Migs^ | crappin' heck! |
| 20:27.20 | ^Migs^ | do you ever have mud wrestling competitions? |
| 20:27.37 | calvarez | no, but we have pizza wrestling competitions |
| 20:27.48 | levi | calvarez: Mostly I don't really try to get non-computer-savvy people to use Linux. |
| 20:27.50 | calvarez | they're almost analogous, but instead of mud we use pizza |
| 20:27.50 | ^Migs^ | WHY does your friend want to do this, anyway, calvarez? Is he going to score huge brownie points with them or something if he succeeds? |
| 20:28.11 | calvarez | ^Migs^, he wants to do it so he can save the rain forest |
| 20:28.23 | elg | calvarez: I've had people come to me, and the reason is always viruses/spyware |
| 20:28.27 | levi | ^Migs^: And it will win him extra crap points. |
| 20:28.31 | manithree | Same here. |
| 20:28.33 | ^Migs^ | crap points, eh? |
| 20:28.47 | levi | ^Migs^: It's all about the crap. |
| 20:28.48 | calvarez | ^Migs^, yes, you can trade them for crap |
| 20:29.02 | elg | Freedom has a little nudge but mostly it's about as effective at inducing change as telling people that fast food is bad for them is at getting them to eat better |
| 20:29.06 | calvarez | crap in sealed bottles for long-term storage |
| 20:29.29 | ^Migs^ | I don't see why you would want to do that, which goes back to my initial point about forcing a FOSS lifestyle on someone else. If their system works for them, don't try to convince them to change it. |
| 20:29.38 | levi | Because you never know when there's going to be an emergency, and you won't be able to obtain your crap through normal means. |
| 20:29.52 | ^Migs^ | I mean, if they were oblivious of imminent doom awaiting them, that would be one thing, but I doubt that's what's happening here. |
| 20:30.07 | elg | ^Migs^: why don't you go rant at a persuasive writing teacher or something? |
| 20:30.10 | calvarez | ^Migs^, explain the relationship between proselitying and forcing that your thesis is based on |
| 20:30.22 | ^Migs^ | don't get me started on persuasive writing teachers. Bunch of crocks. |
| 20:30.23 | *** join/#utah koosh (n=paul@67.138.58.2) |
| 20:30.35 | *** part/#utah koosh (n=paul@67.138.58.2) |
| 20:30.48 | ^Migs^ | are you going to be proselyting to others, too? |
| 20:30.52 | ^Migs^ | or only this tiny group? |
| 20:31.10 | calvarez | I am not doing either. I'm helping someone to present a paper to a group of professors at UVSC |
| 20:31.25 | levi | calvarez: Which professors? CNS ones, or somewhere else? |
| 20:31.26 | calvarez | I've done my share of FOSS proselitying in the past |
| 20:31.29 | calvarez | dunno |
| 20:31.36 | calvarez | philosophy, most likely, but not sure |
| 20:31.40 | levi | Ahh. |
| 20:31.50 | elg | CNS? |
| 20:32.04 | ^Migs^ | is it going to be a symposium or conference paper or something? |
| 20:32.08 | calvarez | this guy is interested in seeing if the professors would be willing to use FOSS software for research- and teaching-related tasks |
| 20:32.12 | levi | elg: Computing and Network Sciences |
| 20:32.40 | calvarez | like colaborative notetaking, grade bookkeeping, blogging, etc |
| 20:32.52 | elg | funny you should assume they'd fall into "non-so-computer-savvy" category. :) |
| 20:33.03 | calvarez | well, this guy suggested so |
| 20:33.10 | elg | the cns I mean |
| 20:33.13 | levi | elg: Well, I forgot about that part. :) |
| 20:33.13 | calvarez | oh |
| 20:33.15 | calvarez | yea |
| 20:33.25 | elg | levi: even so it's probably more true than not |
| 20:33.29 | calvarez | lol |
| 20:33.33 | levi | The CNS professors I know at UVSC are reasonably savvy. |
| 20:33.52 | elg | calvarez: that's a problem, there's not a lot of quality floss out there for grade books |
| 20:33.55 | elg | not that I've seen |
| 20:33.57 | levi | Except for perhaps one, who I'm not sure is savvy about anything. |
| 20:34.10 | calvarez | anyways, some of the suggestions are: FOSS may reduce the problem with malware, spyware, viruses, etc, also it's free |
| 20:34.30 | calvarez | free updates |
| 20:34.46 | elg | what does a prof care about free if the dep. just serves it up on a plate? |
| 20:35.02 | levi | Yeah, cost is not a big one to sell to the profs. |
| 20:35.07 | calvarez | true |
| 20:35.14 | elg | you either tackle the philosophical issues, or you go for the technical merits (and hide the technical demerits) |
| 20:35.34 | calvarez | but probably the technical merits would not be so relevant to them |
| 20:35.38 | ^Migs^ | how do you know they're not REQUIRED to use certain Windows programs? |
| 20:35.39 | levi | If these are really philosophy profs, perhaps the philisophical approach would actually get you somewhere. |
| 20:35.45 | elg | for some people they balance out. for some like us linux has technical superiority. for others there's no good floss for their niche and windows is better |
| 20:35.52 | calvarez | true |
| 20:35.53 | ^Migs^ | how cumbersome would it be for them to make the change from WIndows to Linux? |
| 20:35.58 | calvarez | to be honest, that's my case |
| 20:36.12 | calvarez | most of the equipment I must use is mostly Windows-only |
| 20:36.43 | levi | My fastest computer at home is largely a WIndows machine. |
| 20:36.45 | ^Migs^ | Windows has more quality programs than Linux, yeah |
| 20:37.14 | levi | Because my wife likes to play games. I have both cygwin and vmware-running-Linux on it, though. |
| 20:40.19 | calvarez | hmpf, the only quality programs that I can get in Windows only are Visual Studio and games |
| 20:40.32 | calvarez | other than that, I'd use Linux only |
| 20:41.36 | ^Migs^ | why would you use Linux only? |
| 20:41.40 | levi | Pardon my blasphemy, but I really wish we could move on to a new OS in the free software world instead of continuing with Linux. It feels to me like an anchor that's keeping us from making real leaps in security, reliability, etc. |
| 20:42.02 | levi | This is not a very realistic wish, I know, but I wish it anyway. |
| 20:42.04 | ^Migs^ | that's stupid |
| 20:42.12 | manithree | I used pwb and Visual Studio for 6-7 years. Quality is the last word I would use to described them |
| 20:42.13 | ^Migs^ | just improve the Linux kernel |
| 20:42.33 | ^Migs^ | or hack it up and call it something else |
| 20:42.37 | levi | I don't want to get into the reasons that I think that's a bad idea. |
| 20:42.46 | levi | Well, not so much a bad idea, but not what I want. |
| 20:43.29 | levi | Suffice it to say that I have thought about it, and I don't think it's stupid, but I don't think it's likely to happen any time soon either. |
| 20:43.57 | elg | i just want a plane |
| 20:44.42 | graphyx | This one do? |
| 20:44.42 | graphyx | http://www.airhogs.com/airhogsProduct.jsp?key=178 |
| 20:45.44 | manithree | graphyx: Got my son one of those for his 7th birthday last weekend. It's a hoot. |
| 20:45.51 | levi | BeOS was along the lines of what I'm thinking, but I wasn't specifically interested in it. Its use of C++ was problematic. |
| 20:45.56 | manithree | I finally got to fly it yesterday |
| 20:46.00 | elg | graphyx: nope. but it'd be fun to play with probably |
| 20:46.56 | *** join/#utah Tene (n=tene@poipu/supporter/slacker/tene) |
| 20:47.26 | graphyx | I will probably get one for christmas. |
| 20:47.49 | mrpull | levi: beos was cool |
| 20:48.13 | mrpull | levi: have you seen any of the spin off's from beos (like zeta)? |
| 20:48.16 | Tene | So, do I keep trying to fix this laptop or break down, sell it for parts, and buy a new one? |
| 20:49.37 | levi | mrpull: Nope, not really. But I don't really hear much buzz at all about them, which renders them about as likely to become generally useful as the Hurd. |
| 20:50.27 | mrpull | levi: yeah... they are are at best toys |
| 20:50.41 | mrpull | levi: but linux was too in the not too distant past |
| 20:51.19 | *** join/#utah Keighvin (n=ptomlins@kei.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 20:53.11 | levi | mrpull: This is true, but there was also a very big void to fill at the time. |
| 20:53.23 | mrpull | wow... SkyOS has come a long way since I last looked at it |
| 20:54.32 | levi | GNU needed a kernel, and there was really no feasible alternative since BSD was in a copyright battle at the time. |
| 20:55.10 | levi | SkyOS would be interesting to play with if it was free. |
| 20:57.12 | mrpull | Yeah. It is a bummer that it is closed. |
| 20:57.24 | mrpull | It's Mono and Windows Forms support makes it interesting to me |
| 20:57.41 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@86.43.76.98) |
| 20:57.46 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@64-52-97-250.client.cypresscom.net) |
| 20:58.38 | mrpull | http://syllable.org/ is an interesting "unknown" OS too |
| 21:00.09 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 21:01.58 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
| 21:01.58 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 21:09.20 | harleypig | ooga booga |
| 21:09.41 | ^Migs^ | unga bunga |
| 21:10.14 | sjansen | hang on snoopy hang on |
| 21:11.34 | mrpull | sjansen: http://www.amiright.com/misheard/artist/mccoys.shtml |
| 21:12.16 | sjansen | yeah, yeah, but my version is more fun |
| 21:12.26 | mrpull | excuse me while I kiss this guy |
| 21:14.28 | goozbach | sJANsen!! |
| 21:14.50 | goozbach | how'd irelandia go/is going? |
| 21:15.13 | sjansen | not bad |
| 21:15.14 | mrpull | I worked with a guy who claimed to play bass for the McCoys (the people who made the Hang on Sloopy song famous) |
| 21:15.24 | mrpull | dunno if he was full of crap or not |
| 21:15.31 | sjansen | mostly work, sun's almost down by 5pm |
| 21:16.47 | sjansen | When students talk to me, I can mostly understand them. When they talk to each other, I swear they must be using another language. |
| 21:17.30 | *** part/#utah manithree (n=blr@c-71-199-35-71.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 21:17.45 | elg | gaelic?:) |
| 21:18.16 | *** join/#utah SB1-Work (n=kylesb@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 21:18.32 | sjansen | Most people drive manual transmission. I had to go back to the rental counter to get an automatic. |
| 21:18.32 | Keighvin | ~piglatin probably just slang and miscellaneous devolved vernacular |
| 21:20.00 | sjansen | And even then it's not a normal automatic. No park. If you don't kill the engine, the car'll just roll. |
| 21:20.06 | elg | long live manual transmission |
| 21:20.31 | mrpull | sjansen: cant drive stick? |
| 21:20.55 | sjansen | nor gargle and talk at the same time |
| 21:21.09 | sjansen | although I can almost gargle and sing |
| 21:21.10 | Keighvin | elg: I'm with you. |
| 21:21.20 | Tene | long live manual transmission |
| 21:21.39 | mrpull | learning to drive on a stolen tractor has it benefits |
| 21:21.45 | sjansen | long live cars that drive themselves |
| 21:22.06 | sjansen | long live heated bathroom floors |
| 21:22.09 | *** join/#utah spr_ (n=spr@otherlab.cs.byu.edu) |
| 21:22.57 | sjansen | long live fuddruckers |
| 21:23.40 | redbeard1 | fuddruckers? why? |
| 21:24.05 | redbeard1 | i mean, they make a good burger, but is it really $10 good? |
| 21:24.41 | spr_ | redbeard1, it is if you get the combo with the shake |
| 21:25.04 | redbeard1 | i didn't know they had shakes |
| 21:25.10 | mrpull | redbeard1: it depends on who is paying! |
| 21:25.24 | redbeard1 | mrpull: this is also true |
| 21:25.26 | sjansen | long live expensed dinners! |
| 21:25.48 | ^Migs^ | how many fuddruckers locations are there? |
| 21:25.50 | sjansen | long live the giant cement bison in Jamestown, ND |
| 21:26.14 | redbeard1 | mmm, bison. i love bison. |
| 21:26.22 | redbeard1 | dunno about cement bison tho. |
| 21:27.33 | ^Migs^ | ~whalepunt Keighvin |
| 21:27.38 | ibot | ACTION looks onward as an everest-sized whale called Victor punts Keighvin across the Pacific |
| 21:27.56 | Keighvin | ~whalebomb ^Migs^ |
| 21:27.58 | ibot | ACTION throws an explosive whale named Gunter at ^Migs^ and hides. |
| 21:28.38 | Keighvin | Have I already done that one? |
| 21:28.47 | redbeard1 | yes |
| 21:28.54 | redbeard1 | ~whaleburger Keighvin |
| 21:28.55 | ^Migs^ | UNORIGINAL |
| 21:29.01 | Keighvin | ~whalenutshot ^Migs^ |
| 21:29.03 | ibot | ACTION smashes ^Migs^ in the nuts with a huge, yet swift whale named Ricardo |
| 21:29.03 | Keighvin | Fine. |
| 21:29.07 | redbeard1 | ~whaletaco Keighvin |
| 21:29.19 | ^Migs^ | ~whalepasta Keighvin |
| 21:29.22 | redbeard1 | ~whalemousse Keighvin |
| 21:29.25 | ^Migs^ | ~whalesoup Keighvin |
| 21:29.35 | graphyx | ok . |
| 21:29.39 | graphyx | We have gone from nuts to soup. |
| 21:29.40 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleagriculture Keighvin |
| 21:29.41 | graphyx | IT's over. |
| 21:29.55 | Keighvin | graphyx? |
| 21:29.58 | ^Migs^ | actually, IT is a booming profession |
| 21:29.59 | findlay | ~whale* |
| 21:30.07 | graphyx | yep |
| 21:30.24 | graphyx | ^Migs^: IT is the new in. |
| 21:30.35 | sjansen | Ginger? |
| 21:30.45 | ^Migs^ | ~whaleconsultant Keighvin |
| 21:30.47 | sjansen | The segway? |
| 21:31.52 | Keighvin | ~whalenorris ^Migs^ |
| 21:31.54 | ibot | ACTION gets a whale with a facial hair issue named Charles to roundhouse whack ^Migs^ in the face with his tail |
| 21:31.57 | graphyx | Pac man pie charts? |
| 21:32.17 | graphyx | Ok I've got the next pie chart joke. |
| 21:32.24 | mrpull | graphyx: I saw that. That was awesome. |
| 21:32.24 | redbeard1 | ~chucknorris Keighvin |
| 21:32.33 | graphyx | "Percentage of the pie eaten. Percentage of the pie not eaten." |
| 21:33.09 | sjansen | ~pie graphyx |
| 21:33.11 | ibot | ACTION hits graphyx in the face with a cream pie |
| 21:33.17 | redbeard1 | ~brulee sjansen |
| 21:33.18 | ibot | ACTION whisks sjansen with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 21:33.27 | graphyx | ~pwndsauce sjansen |
| 21:33.28 | ibot | A ginormous opened bottle of Pwnsauce in the sky tips over and engulfs sjansen in a torrent of pwnsauce, leaving them with a shirt stain that reads "Pwned". |
| 21:33.30 | sjansen | Oh, yes! Please! Please! |
| 21:33.53 | sjansen | ~brulee me |
| 21:33.55 | ibot | ACTION whisks sjansen with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 21:34.12 | graphyx | ~brulee cream |
| 21:34.13 | ibot | ACTION whisks cream with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 21:34.19 | findlay | ~say no |
| 21:34.21 | ibot | no |
| 21:34.23 | findlay | too late |
| 21:34.24 | redbeard1 | ~brulee vanilla |
| 21:34.26 | ibot | ACTION whisks vanilla with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 21:34.46 | graphyx | ~say ok. |
| 21:34.47 | ibot | ok. |
| 21:34.48 | sjansen | ~steal redbeard1's brulee |
| 21:34.50 | ibot | ACTION grabs redbeard1's brulee and gives it to sjansen |
| 21:34.52 | findlay | ~burlea something else |
| 21:34.58 | redbeard1 | ~brulee findlay |
| 21:35.00 | ibot | ACTION whisks findlay with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 21:35.30 | findlay | ~say -lart ibot |
| 21:35.32 | ibot | -lart ibot |
| 21:36.29 | Jayce^ | whoa, bradipo posted on plug, he hasn't been around for a while |
| 21:37.17 | findlay | he was in here a few days back |
| 21:38.05 | harleypig | funny looking mushroom |
| 21:38.07 | harleypig | http://blog.harleypig.com/fungarse.jpg |
| 21:38.21 | sjansen | huh, looks like his post killed my email client |
| 21:38.53 | findlay | drat, my new CD hasn't come yet |
| 21:40.47 | sjansen | I should have known not to open an image from harleypig, even if it is only a mushroom. |
| 21:42.01 | harleypig | ? It's safe for work ... |
| 21:42.18 | harleypig | Mildly disturbing maybe |
| 21:42.19 | sjansen | flash backs, man, flash backs |
| 21:42.21 | harleypig | :> |
| 21:42.38 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@000-178-815.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 21:45.08 | ^Migs^ | my imagination is running wild on that mushroom picture |
| 21:46.53 | sjansen | shrooms'll do that to you |
| 21:48.15 | macnewbold | anyone in here do Ruby on Rails? A guy Jeff Burningham <jeff@jsbconsultinggroup.com> who sent an email back in July to a UPHPU list is now looking for a Ruby dev. contact him if you're interested. |
| 21:51.30 | calvarez | hmm, sorry for bringing up a one hour old argument, but what's the beef with Visual Studio? |
| 21:51.42 | calvarez | I think it's a terrific development tool |
| 21:51.50 | ^Migs^ | OMG U LIKE VISUAL STUDIO!?? VISUAL STUDIO SUCKS!!!! |
| 21:52.01 | graphyx | It can be used to develop closed source software there for it is evil. |
| 21:52.06 | ^Migs^ | that's why. Follow the formula "_____?!??!?! _______ SUCKS!!!!!!!!" |
| 21:52.07 | graphyx | ~flame me |
| 21:52.08 | ibot | graphyx sux0rz d00d!!!!!!!!!!!!!!@@!!!!!!!11 |
| 21:52.13 | calvarez | yes I like it, and I would like to hear coherent arguments on why it "sucks" |
| 21:52.30 | ^Migs^ | you're asking the wrong group. We all hate Microsoft here in #utah, and by association hate Visual Studio. |
| 21:52.54 | calvarez | explain the relationship between being in #utah and hating Microsoft |
| 21:53.20 | ^Migs^ | it's uncanny, really, but that's just how it is around here |
| 21:53.41 | ^Migs^ | never dawned on anyone that you can be both pro-Linux AND pro-Microsoft |
| 21:53.47 | calvarez | so, you're saying it is accidental? explain |
| 21:54.39 | findlay | its, well, just too "visual" |
| 21:54.51 | findlay | I prefer my development to be mostly aural |
| 21:55.17 | calvarez | "aural" |
| 21:55.18 | calvarez | ? |
| 21:55.25 | findlay | that's why I have this festival plugin to gvim |
| 21:55.36 | findlay | nevermind |
| 21:55.37 | calvarez | like, you develop software by using incense to build up an "aura"? |
| 21:55.57 | findlay | ~dict aural |
| 21:56.22 | ^Migs^ | findlay makes an excellent point |
| 21:56.35 | findlay | of course |
| 21:56.44 | ^Migs^ | and some of us with advanced brains use telepathy for coding |
| 21:56.54 | ^Migs^ | Visual Studio is woefully lacking in telepathic support. |
| 21:58.36 | findlay | but you said it was terrific. Does that mean terrible, or terrorist? |
| 21:58.48 | calvarez | but, of course, there is some shortcut (Esc+j+$+KK8mn@DDED21C2#@##$D@, RTFM) in gvim that allows you to do that |
| 21:58.50 | *** join/#utah markl_ (n=mark@mail.knm.org) |
| 21:59.33 | calvarez | I can imagine, using a microphone and dictating the code, lol |
| 21:59.39 | calvarez | so useless |
| 22:01.15 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@195.sub-166-161-154.myvzw.com) |
| 22:02.23 | findlay | its actually more like: "Computer, tell gvim that I want a project that processes telepathic layer network data and prints out a web report" |
| 22:02.54 | findlay | and then you just sign your name in the AUTHORS file |
| 22:03.45 | *** part/#utah graphyx (n=graphyx@205.208.245.105) |
| 22:03.48 | calvarez | ~gvim |
| 22:03.49 | ibot | gvim: see vim-gtk |
| 22:03.55 | sjansen | It's really very simple. Visual Studio requires an enourmous investment of time. I have already wasted too much of my life on proprietary software. I refuse to do so again. |
| 22:04.04 | calvarez | rofl |
| 22:04.07 | sjansen | Visual Studio sucks because all proprietary software sucks. |
| 22:04.19 | calvarez | funny |
| 22:04.24 | calvarez | sjansen is funny |
| 22:04.25 | findlay | but you need over the critical threshold negative psycho curvature in the local subcyberspace |
| 22:04.51 | sjansen | It's a definition. A universal truth. A greater wisdom hiding behind lesser wisdoms. |
| 22:04.59 | calvarez | ok, Ayn Rand |
| 22:05.03 | sjansen | A power that flows through and binds the universe. |
| 22:05.07 | goozbach | perl perl perl |
| 22:05.12 | goozbach | I invoke fozzmoo |
| 22:05.23 | findlay | for the virtual tachyons to conform to a semistable Hawking array |
| 22:05.24 | calvarez | Visual Studio does not require a lot of time to learn. |
| 22:05.35 | goozbach | delay that, I invoke fozzmoo in ~15min |
| 22:05.43 | goozbach | it's 5 and I have to drive home |
| 22:05.44 | sjansen | Like love. And kittens. Short, opinionated, hairy men that don't shower. |
| 22:05.46 | calvarez | in fact, it's fairly easy to pick it up, after doing development with gcc |
| 22:06.15 | ^Migs^ | calvarez is ANTI-FOSS |
| 22:06.22 | ^Migs^ | NOT a good idea here in #utah, calvarez |
| 22:06.34 | ^Migs^ | so take your pro-proprietarism elsewhere |
| 22:06.59 | calvarez | why not? It's funny to see people get all scandalized |
| 22:07.33 | ^Migs^ | if we've learned one thing today, it's that calvarez is self-contradictory. Earlier he was all "OMG LINUX ROCKS FOSS 4 EVERY1" and now he's all "LINUX SUCKS USE VISUAL STUDIO!" |
| 22:07.38 | sjansen | Good ole' Vim, now there's a friend. |
| 22:07.48 | calvarez | for the record, I favor FOSS as a software development and distribution model, but I do not condemn proprietary software by any means. |
| 22:07.55 | ^Migs^ | I might be paraphrasing, but that's the basic gyst |
| 22:08.00 | sjansen | Like a good marriage, as the years pass by slowly Vim and I are merging to become one mind and one body. |
| 22:08.39 | calvarez | in fact, I like the fact that both exist and encourage the other one to innovate |
| 22:08.44 | calvarez | free market baby ;) |
| 22:08.56 | findlay | but in order to have formal convergance of a mitigating stabilizer group the eigen matrix must be of the strong type and satisfy the Thorne conjecture for stability |
| 22:08.59 | calvarez | ^Migs^, explain |
| 22:09.20 | findlay | I know what I'll do |
| 22:09.21 | ^Migs^ | explain what? |
| 22:09.25 | calvarez | findlay, just use an upwind integrating scheme |
| 22:09.34 | calvarez | ^Migs^, exactly |
| 22:09.40 | ^Migs^ | exactly? |
| 22:09.45 | calvarez | you got it man |
| 22:09.48 | sjansen | ^Migs^: duh! |
| 22:09.56 | ^Migs^ | wow, I got pwned |
| 22:09.58 | ^Migs^ | ~pwndsauce ^Migs^ |
| 22:10.16 | ibot | A ginormous opened bottle of Pwnsauce in the sky tips over and engulfs ^Migs^ in a torrent of pwnsauce, leaving them with a shirt stain that reads "Pwned". |
| 22:10.17 | findlay | I'll write a perl module that absorbs math/physics/chemistry/computer jargon and spews forth several flavors of techno/scientific nonsense |
| 22:10.39 | Jayce^ | woohoo, we just announced that we now do DSL... wish we could get it in UT :/ |
| 22:10.53 | calvarez | ^Migs^, no, you didn't get pwned. You got cerebellum'd |
| 22:11.06 | findlay | Jayce^: why?, cheap? |
| 22:11.17 | *** join/#utah lane_ (n=lane@64-52-97-250.client.cypresscom.net) |
| 22:11.19 | calvarez | http://ist-socrates.berkeley.edu/~btvoytek/images/classes/cerebellumd.gif |
| 22:11.26 | Jayce^ | no, QWEST.... |
| 22:11.41 | Jayce^ | $14.95, and $19.95 DSL .. |
| 22:13.09 | ^Migs^ | wow |
| 22:13.16 | ^Migs^ | I don't get it |
| 22:13.24 | calvarez | exactly |
| 22:13.27 | calvarez | ;) |
| 22:13.37 | calvarez | I agree with you |
| 22:13.44 | emcnabb | 32-bit hardware sucks |
| 22:13.51 | calvarez | ~kill emcnabb |
| 22:13.53 | ibot | ACTION shoots a excited pseudotachyon gun at emcnabb |
| 22:13.58 | emcnabb | ~slay calvarez |
| 22:14.00 | ibot | ACTION brandishes Excalibur! "With this sword, I vanquish thee, calvarez!" apt lops off calvarez's head. |
| 22:14.10 | calvarez | ~nuke emcnabb |
| 22:14.11 | ibot | ACTION prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at emcnabb ... B☢☢M! |
| 22:14.42 | findlay | ~whalepunt calvarez |
| 22:14.44 | ibot | ACTION looks onward as an everest-sized whale called Victor punts calvarez across the Solar System |
| 22:14.58 | calvarez | ~whaleparry findlay |
| 22:14.59 | ibot | ACTION uses a slightly less-huge but eminently more agile killer whale named Edwardo to parry findlay's attacks. |
| 22:17.01 | levi | Jayce^: How would that be better than xmission? |
| 22:17.30 | Jayce^ | because it's my company :) |
| 22:17.47 | calvarez | ~WTF-pwn findlay |
| 22:17.54 | levi | Jayce^: For some reason, I don't find that very compelling. ;) |
| 22:18.01 | calvarez | grrr |
| 22:18.17 | Jayce^ | levi, :-p |
| 22:18.28 | ^Migs^ | my $24.95 for a year subscription to Qwest DSL is about to expire :( |
| 22:18.43 | ^Migs^ | what was up with that $27.95 for life deal or whatever it was? |
| 22:19.03 | levi | I like that Microsoft released Express Editions of its various Visual Studio languages, but it's too bad that you can't use the OCaml or Haskell or whatever IDE extensions with it. |
| 22:19.34 | findlay | ~shoot VS |
| 22:19.35 | ibot | ACTION shoots VS in the eye with a glue gun! |
| 22:19.43 | levi | I need Qwest to make a new CO that's closer to my home. I can barely hold a 256k DSL link. |
| 22:19.44 | findlay | aw, that's a boring one |
| 22:21.01 | findlay | ~shoot something else in a more interesting way |
| 22:21.02 | ibot | ACTION shoots something else in a more interesting way in the ear with a quantum singularity weapon! |
| 22:21.13 | findlay | (: |
| 22:21.24 | findlay | ibot: that was redundant |
| 22:23.32 | calvarez | how can you see the code for an ibot learned command? |
| 22:24.26 | *** join/#utah vex_ (n=vex@216.194.126.99) |
| 22:24.45 | findlay | I think it involves ~literal somehow |
| 22:25.00 | findlay | but maybe it's closed source |
| 22:25.08 | calvarez | lol |
| 22:25.09 | findlay | just kidding (-: |
| 22:25.35 | findlay | ~literal shoot |
| 22:25.36 | ibot | "shoot" is "<reply> bang!" |
| 22:25.51 | *** part/#utah findlay (n=justin@67.137.24.115) |
| 22:26.00 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@67.137.24.115) |
| 22:26.03 | findlay | ~literal shoot |
| 22:26.05 | ibot | "shoot" is "<reply> bang!" |
| 22:26.09 | findlay | whatever |
| 22:26.19 | calvarez | ~shoot |
| 22:26.21 | ibot | bang! |
| 22:26.27 | findlay | hm |
| 22:26.40 | calvarez | how can you make a reply be an actions instead of saying the thing? |
| 22:26.47 | calvarez | s/actions/action/ |
| 22:26.54 | findlay | don't know |
| 22:27.23 | findlay | I imagine a tour through ibot's cache of replies mighh be very instructive |
| 22:27.30 | findlay | s/hh/ht |
| 22:28.03 | ^Migs^ | ~literal whaleslap |
| 22:28.05 | ibot | "whaleslap" is "your mom" |
| 22:28.10 | ^Migs^ | ~literal whalepunt |
| 22:29.44 | calvarez | ~cerebellum ^Migs^ |
| 22:29.45 | ibot | ^Migs^, YOU GOT CEREBELLUM'D!! http://ist-socrates.berkeley.edu/~btvoytek/images/classes/cerebellumd.gif |
| 22:31.27 | mheath | ~whaleslap ^Migs^ |
| 22:31.29 | ibot | ACTION beats ^Migs^ upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 22:31.37 | mheath | ~literal whaleslap $foo |
| 22:31.39 | ibot | ACTION beats $foo upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 22:33.09 | findlay | ~dude, tell me what the literal command is |
| 22:33.22 | macnewbold | ~literal findlay |
| 22:33.28 | *** join/#utah hhatfield (n=glennh@outgoing.inetz.com) |
| 22:42.49 | *** join/#utah mrpull_ (n=mrpull@205.158.184.126) |
| 22:43.46 | findlay | ~uname |
| 22:43.48 | ibot | it has been said that uname is a cool way to "print system information" (man uname for more info), for basic use, try: uname -a |
| 22:46.39 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=mrpull@205.158.184.126) |
| 22:47.52 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 23:23.41 | *** join/#utah jnbek (n=jnbek@c-24-10-178-17.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 23:36.00 | Keighvin | ibot: literal cmd: findlay (.*) |
| 23:36.50 | Keighvin | ibot: literal cmd: findlay (.*?) |
| 23:36.51 | ibot | "cmd: findlay (.*?)" is "($target): <action> recreationally nmaps $target." |
| 23:37.02 | Keighvin | Forgot the regex limiter. |
| 23:38.31 | findlay | hm, that's interesting |
| 23:38.54 | findlay | ibot: literal cmd: findl(.*?) |
| 23:39.23 | macnewbold | ~findlay findlay |
| 23:39.24 | ibot | ACTION recreationally nmaps findlay. |
| 23:39.42 | findlay | ibot: literal cmd: (.*?) |
| 23:43.30 | Keighvin | I dl'd the blootbot source and scraped through it to see some of the inner workings. |
| 23:46.07 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 23:46.09 | Sargun | hiya |
| 23:49.55 | *** join/#utah jnbek (n=jnbek@c-24-10-178-17.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 23:50.00 | *** join/#utah graphyx (n=graphyx@205.208.245.105) |
| 23:51.04 | findlay | hi |
| 23:51.15 | nick125_lappy | hi |
| 23:51.22 | findlay | don't know about the 'ya' part though |
| 23:54.26 | Sargun | hi |
| 23:54.37 | Sargun | better |
| 23:54.47 | macnewbold | ~sargun Sargun |
| 23:54.56 | ibot | nothing |
| 23:54.56 | Sargun | Hahaha! |
| 23:54.58 | Sargun | I fixed it |
| 23:55.02 | macnewbold | so what does xbmodder mean, anyway? |
| 23:55.07 | macnewbold | and where'd you get Sargun from? |
| 23:55.21 | Sargun | xbmodder = xbox modde |
| 23:55.22 | Sargun | xbmodder = xbox modder |
| 23:55.26 | Sargun | Sargun = My name |
| 23:55.29 | Sargun | and |
| 23:55.42 | [Utah]tristanbob | I thought blogger.com was supposed to have good reliability? |
| 23:55.47 | [Utah]tristanbob | Blogger Problem |
| 23:55.47 | [Utah]tristanbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:55.48 | [Utah]tristanbob | Status code: 1-500-3 |
| 23:55.58 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:55.58 | Sargun | Sargun: |
| 23:55.59 | Sargun | Temporal (worldly) realm of human existence |
| 23:56.02 | Sargun | Isn't that cool? |
| 23:56.21 | Sargun | [Utah]tristanbob, I think that happens when someone breaks the drive array. |
| 23:57.27 | [Utah]tristanbob | grr - I want my money's worth! oh, wait, I take that back |
| 23:57.36 | Sargun | Haha |
| 23:57.44 | Sargun | How long was the down time? |
| 23:58.03 | [Utah]tristanbob | not sure - at least 5-10 mins? |
| 23:58.10 | [Utah]tristanbob | looks up now |
| 23:58.55 | graphyx | Sargun: Is Sargun your name IRL? |
| 23:59.11 | Sargun | IIRC |
| 23:59.38 | graphyx | You aren't sure what your name is? Wow.. sounds like you have more issues that just social problems. |
