| 00:01.27 | levi_home | Hmm, a Marie Antoinette movie with a New Order soundtrack?! |
| 00:24.39 | findlay | this dude's computer game is so loud I can hear every last detail |
| 00:24.44 | findlay | and it's vibrating the wall |
| 00:25.42 | findlay | any prank ideas? |
| 00:26.55 | Tene | turn the power off and on repeatedly in an attempt to damage their electronics! |
| 00:27.05 | findlay | someday I won't have to live in an apartment building with freshmen |
| 00:27.27 | levi_home | Get a super big speaker system, place it next to the shared wall, and play something like the 1812 overture as loud as you can. |
| 00:27.43 | findlay | levi_home: I've already tried that |
| 00:27.45 | findlay | didn't work |
| 00:28.08 | levi_home | findlay: Obviously you need a louder stereo. |
| 00:28.15 | levi_home | Escalation is the answer! |
| 00:28.21 | levi_home | Fight fire with MORE fire! |
| 00:28.40 | findlay | I know what I need ... |
| 00:28.54 | findlay | *NUCLEAR* SPEAKERS!!@1 |
| 00:29.41 | levi_home | No... Nucular speakers. |
| 00:30.15 | findlay | heh, I can hear his Imperial march music now |
| 00:30.25 | findlay | must be some kind of starwars game |
| 00:31.25 | findlay | levi_home: you're just going to be dissapointed again |
| 00:34.00 | levi_home | Well, I currently pay $84 for phone and internet, after tax. I could possibly get a comparable price with Comcast and some VoIP provider. |
| 00:34.20 | goozbach | so I got a nano |
| 00:34.21 | levi_home | And I have 256k DSL. Do you know how much that sucks? |
| 00:34.56 | mheath[laptop] | ~seen TimRiker |
| 00:35.14 | ibot | timriker <n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 3h 42m 50s ago, saying: 'findlay: me? probably now. though a BZFlag game in SecondLife might be fun.'. |
| 00:35.50 | findlay | ~pity levi_home |
| 00:35.52 | ibot | I pity da fool levi_home! |
| 00:37.17 | levi_home | Actually, no, I couldn't get a comparable price. |
| 00:40.29 | findlay | holy loud batman |
| 00:45.02 | mheath[laptop] | Anyone around who's big on geneology? |
| 00:48.52 | findlay | I'm little on it |
| 00:50.38 | Sargun | levi_home, ack! |
| 00:50.43 | Sargun | move to civilization! |
| 00:50.48 | mheath[laptop] | Well, I have a family member I'm interested in.....He was in the Navy for a long time.... |
| 00:50.59 | mheath[laptop] | I'm thinking I could get a lot of info through a military record, but I'm wondering if I can even get one |
| 00:51.05 | mheath[laptop] | I know they're only generally available for next-of-kin |
| 00:52.39 | Sargun | mheath, any luck contacting your X-co-host |
| 00:53.57 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-8-157.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 00:56.07 | mheath[laptop] | The guy is my great uncle....But the guy has some living children |
| 00:56.25 | mheath[laptop] | I'm worried that the fact that he still has NOK will prevent me from getting a copy of his records. |
| 00:56.52 | mheath[laptop] | They'll want written consent from them, but I don't know who they are - just people listed as "Living" in the LDS familysearch stuff. |
| 00:56.53 | Sargun | ~define NOK |
| 00:56.54 | ibot | Use ~dict for definitions. |
| 00:57.04 | Sargun | ~dict NOK |
| 00:57.10 | Sargun | mheath[laptop], ? |
| 00:57.24 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, next of kin. |
| 00:57.33 | Sargun | oh |
| 01:00.27 | findlay | I suppose this guy doesn't realize how stupid his music sounds |
| 01:03.12 | levi_home | Sargun: Yeah, I'd be so much better off paying California prices. |
| 01:04.08 | Sargun | $14.95 for DSL (1.5/384) + 19.99 for vonage FTW |
| 01:04.27 | levi_home | Sargun: And how much for the house to live in? |
| 01:04.58 | Sargun | What specifications? |
| 01:06.33 | mheath | Sargun: we have a very nice, fairly large house, thats about 20 years old in one of the best suburbs in Ogden, Utah. It's well under $200,000 in value. |
| 01:06.47 | goozbach | crap |
| 01:06.53 | Sargun | goozbach, ? |
| 01:06.59 | mheath | An equivelent house in an equilvent neighborhood near San Francisco would likely be over a million. |
| 01:07.00 | goozbach | not supported by rockbox |
| 01:07.02 | Sargun | like how many square feet |
| 01:07.25 | Sargun | well, almost no big families can afford nice houses in SFO |
| 01:07.46 | mheath | bah, I don't even know enough information for them to likely be able to find this guys military record :( |
| 01:08.26 | mheath | SF-180 wants stuff like service number, date entered, date released... |
| 01:09.03 | mheath | I just have a Name, a birth date, a death date, and I know that he served sometime in 1910-1931, on the USS Denver |
| 01:09.50 | Sargun | My 'rents house is 3.4k (decently sized) and for only 1.2 |
| 01:09.53 | Sargun | in a pretty nice area |
| 01:09.56 | Sargun | well |
| 01:09.59 | Sargun | nice for old people |
| 01:10.04 | Sargun | and kids under 10 years old |
| 01:10.09 | Sargun | old people > 40 |
| 01:10.21 | mheath | Heh, you should see housing values in Telluride, Colorado |
| 01:10.36 | mheath | Horrible little 2 bedroom houses, 100 years old, that used to be temporary mining company housing |
| 01:10.49 | mheath | Now selling for around $10 million |
| 01:10.59 | Sargun | lol |
| 01:13.34 | levi_home | Sargun: So, yeah, we bought my home for under $90k. |
| 01:13.43 | Sargun | whoa |
| 01:13.47 | Sargun | thats |
| 01:13.48 | Sargun | like |
| 01:13.50 | Sargun | wait |
| 01:13.55 | Sargun | a car. |
| 01:13.56 | levi_home | It's a condo, but still. |
| 01:13.59 | Sargun | :-P |
| 01:14.08 | Sargun | thats like |
| 01:14.12 | Sargun | 200k MINIMUM |
| 01:14.15 | Sargun | for a crappy |
| 01:14.18 | Sargun | 2 bedroom condo |
| 01:14.38 | mheath | Sargun: yeah, California is horribly overpriced in every way. |
| 01:14.49 | Sargun | yeah |
| 01:14.55 | Sargun | but income |
| 01:15.02 | Sargun | higgher |
| 01:15.03 | Sargun | higher |
| 01:15.21 | levi_home | So, yeah, I think I'm better off living here and paying an extra $20 a month for Cable. |
| 01:15.34 | mheath | Sargun: no, not really. |
| 01:15.42 | mheath | not preportionally, at least. |
| 01:16.19 | Sargun | how much is minimum wage? |
| 01:16.35 | coolblade | i think income is higher for programmers |
| 01:16.38 | coolblade | not sure though |
| 01:16.48 | Sargun | coolblade, 80k starting at most corporations |
| 01:16.58 | Sargun | Masters in computer science will land you 80k |
| 01:16.58 | mheath | ..... |
| 01:17.00 | coolblade | which is about 30k higher then utah |
| 01:17.06 | mheath | hahahaha |
| 01:17.20 | mheath | Oh, this is grand. So blissfully naive. It's cute. :) |
| 01:17.26 | coolblade | ? |
| 01:17.55 | Sargun | ? |
| 01:18.05 | mheath | coolblade: No, a programming job in california won't pay 80K starting |
| 01:18.54 | Sargun | mheath, I was looking at Oracle a while |
| 01:19.08 | Sargun | back, and they were listing |
| 01:19.11 | Sargun | programmer |
| 01:19.13 | Sargun | as 80k |
| 01:19.18 | coolblade | well ive seen starting jobs posted in slc craigs list for california relocation starting between 65-100g |
| 01:20.24 | levi_home | Were those entry-level jobs, or did they require x years of experience? |
| 01:20.39 | coolblade | 5 years of school or work |
| 01:21.36 | coolblade | but that was for game development |
| 01:21.41 | coolblade | which i bet is hot right now |
| 01:22.00 | mheath | Heh. Sounds to me like an advertisement. |
| 01:22.02 | Sargun | 5 years |
| 01:22.09 | Sargun | I don't reccomend game development |
| 01:22.18 | Sargun | I know a couple people who started that |
| 01:22.18 | mheath | Relocate to California NOW and work in the exciting field of game development, making 65-100K per year! |
| 01:22.23 | Sargun | and are still stuck |
| 01:22.29 | Sargun | in intern positions |
| 01:23.10 | coolblade | it was for xbox game development, and no i wouldnt go game development |
| 01:23.22 | Sargun | good! |
| 01:24.28 | mheath | I'm worried they won't be able to give me anything for this form |
| 01:24.51 | mheath | I've seen the way modern military records are organized, and it's usually by service number. I don't know the guys service number. |
| 01:26.39 | Sargun | Anyone here took the GED? |
| 01:27.35 | mheath | Sargun: ..No, no one here dropped out of highschool. |
| 01:27.36 | coolblade | no |
| 01:27.44 | Sargun | heh |
| 01:33.45 | mheath | Sargun: Your not even in highschool yet, you're from a rich family, and you're already thinking of dropping out of school? |
| 01:34.13 | Sargun | I'm in high school |
| 01:34.14 | Sargun | and no |
| 01:34.17 | Sargun | I was just wondering |
| 01:34.22 | Sargun | because I can take the GED |
| 01:34.30 | Sargun | and then concurrently enroll in a college |
| 01:34.37 | mheath | Sargun: what grade are you in? |
| 01:34.42 | Sargun | 10 |
| 01:35.12 | mheath[laptop] | How old are you again? |
| 01:36.03 | Sargun | 15.75+(40/365.0) |
| 01:36.04 | Sargun | ~ |
| 01:36.38 | Sargun | ~15.75+(40/365.0) |
| 01:36.40 | ibot | 15.859589041096 |
| 01:36.49 | Sargun | ~cal |
| 01:36.51 | ibot | methinks cal is a calendar. try $(cal 1752) |
| 01:37.06 | Sargun | ~cal 2006 |
| 01:40.06 | Sargun | mheath[laptop], poke |
| 01:52.31 | *** join/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/bucky) |
| 01:54.47 | *** part/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/bucky) |
| 02:01.31 | mheath[laptop] | ahh |
| 02:01.33 | mheath[laptop] | I wanted to.. |
| 02:01.36 | mheath[laptop] | ~bucky bucky |
| 02:01.55 | mheath[laptop] | eh, I thought there was a ~bucky |
| 02:02.03 | mheath[laptop] | ~bucky |
| 02:02.04 | ibot | bucky is, like, some kid from southern UT |
| 02:10.24 | *** join/#utah jlp_work (n=jlp@67.106.37.5) |
| 02:22.29 | levi_home | ~buckybot mheath[laptop] |
| 02:22.30 | ibot | mheath[laptop]: you're a stupid idiot, and I can tell you that all I want, but if you say anything mean to me, I'll start crying and insulting everything I can, because you're discriminating against me! |
| 02:22.52 | mheath[laptop] | ah. bucky came and went. I wanted to buckybot him |
| 02:44.04 | *** join/#utah Chadbryant (n=chadbrya@67-41-166-186.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 02:48.20 | coolblade | i hate this, i put a post to sell my laptop on craigslist and ksl and people keep calling and making appointments to meet me, i wait around and they dont show |
| 02:49.45 | Chadbryant | craigslist slc seems to be populated with a lot of flakes |
| 02:50.36 | coolblade | utah seams to be populated with alot of flakes :\ |
| 02:51.39 | Chadbryant | heh, point taken |
| 02:52.15 | coolblade | im pretty sure in sf bay area my laptop would have sold in like 10 min |
| 02:53.15 | Chadbryant | what are you asking for it? |
| 02:53.37 | Chadbryant | some people here are just cheap |
| 02:55.31 | coolblade | just 350 |
| 02:55.31 | coolblade | http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=556060&cat=215&lpid= |
| 02:55.42 | coolblade | 300 for college students |
| 02:57.09 | Chadbryant | good price for it, I think |
| 02:57.56 | Chadbryant | people might be wary of the sound & USB, though |
| 02:59.51 | coolblade | yeah the way i look at it, is if you need a pc and dont need usb and sound then you can get this for a great price |
| 03:00.02 | coolblade | honestly to do school work you dont really need sound |
| 03:00.18 | coolblade | and you can buy pmcia usb card later if needed |
| 03:00.35 | coolblade | and even usb sound |
| 03:03.44 | Chadbryant | true |
| 03:04.01 | Chadbryant | it'd make a good backup machine too |
| 03:05.21 | *** join/#utah levi_home (n=levi@levi.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 03:05.38 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 03:05.39 | *** join/#utah bzob_l (n=bzob_l@nat.myfamilyinc.com) |
| 03:06.20 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 03:06.35 | elg | -lart emcnabb |
| 03:07.35 | mheath[laptop] | I agree. |
| 03:07.37 | mheath[laptop] | ~lart emcnabb |
| 03:09.20 | findlay | ~emcnabb mheath[laptop] |
| 03:09.43 | mheath[laptop] | ~findlay findlay |
| 03:09.45 | ibot | ACTION recreationally nmaps findlay. |
| 03:15.59 | elg | http://enterprise.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/10/09/1434251&tid=41 |
| 03:16.06 | elg | there's more info on debian vs mozilla |
| 03:16.11 | elg | it's even wackier than I thought |
| 03:16.25 | *** join/#utah brandon (n=media@beatties.us) |
| 03:16.32 | elg | basically, debian sees the trademark on the image (or is it copyright) and says, we can't distribute the image |
| 03:16.45 | elg | mozilla says "well, if you're not going to use the official image you can't call it firefox" |
| 03:16.46 | brandon | anyone ever seen a nas box only let root access it? I go to mount it and only root can cd or ls the nas mount point |
| 03:26.33 | tensai | brandon: nfs? |
| 03:31.25 | levi_home | elg: That's what I thought it was about. |
| 03:31.50 | elg | the patches thing is secondary, but part of it too |
| 03:32.13 | brandon | either nfs or cifs |
| 03:32.16 | elg | mozilla wants utter control over the patches. as in, debian has to submit them to mozilla and wait for them to come through |
| 03:32.20 | levi_home | Grr, the changes I made to my chess program just made it slower. |
| 03:34.29 | maquis | howdy |
| 03:36.27 | levi_home | Heya. |
| 03:38.02 | tensai | brandon: I've seen that sort of weird behavior with samba. never with nfs though. |
| 03:38.09 | brandon | nevermind, just cifs has this odd permission issue |
| 03:39.07 | tensai | ok, not surprised then. I've never been all that impressed with using samba as a client. |
| 03:47.52 | *** join/#utah jbellis (n=Jonathan@c-67-177-21-76.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:06.58 | levi_home | Wow, they arrested Hans Reiser. |
| 04:07.09 | mheath | What for? |
| 04:07.35 | maquis | y? |
| 04:09.40 | tensai | ~convert 750 mph to feet per second |
| 04:10.13 | tensai | ~convert 3000 feet per second to mph |
| 04:10.56 | mheath | random question: Does anyone know if social security numbers were assigned to already living people after Social Security was started? |
| 04:11.01 | mheath | Did they have to go get one? |
| 04:11.16 | tensai | yes, they were assigned to already living people |
| 04:11.41 | tensai | the first guy to get one died before receiving any benefits |
| 04:12.44 | levi_home | mheath: Suspicion of the murder of his estranged wife. |
| 04:13.13 | mheath | levi_home: you serious? :P |
| 04:13.35 | levi_home | mheath: Yup. |
| 04:13.46 | levi_home | She's been missing since early Sept. |
| 04:14.12 | mheath | Hmm. I need to go look at the news. anything new happening with North Korea? |
| 04:14.25 | tensai | when is somebody going to finally arrest Hans Fugal for that sourdough massacre in June? |
| 04:14.42 | Sargun | yay! |
| 04:15.02 | fozzmoo | Sounds like they blew off some firecrackers in a tunnel and told everyone it was a nuclear bomb test. |
| 04:15.04 | mheath | though, if theres a military draft resulting from that, maybe I could convince the government to draft me.... |
| 04:15.49 | mheath | fozzmoo: no. The current thought is that it was a nuclear device, it just didn't work properly |
| 04:15.50 | Sargun | yeah |
| 04:16.02 | levi_home | mheath: So far, the US draft resolution is only calling for sanctions. |
| 04:16.04 | mheath | I ready somewhere that the explosion was roughly the size of 400 metric tons of TNT |
| 04:16.13 | mheath | levi_home: I hate the UN |
| 04:16.49 | levi_home | mheath: That's fine, but the UN is where the action is right now. |
| 04:16.50 | fozzmoo | UN == Useless N... Nincompoops |
| 04:17.06 | mheath | You better watch out, because if you don't stop that we might write a resolution calling for a meeting where it will be recommended that we right a resolution that recommends that, two months from then, we have another meeting where we might resolve to pass some trade restrictions. |
| 04:17.30 | levi_home | What do you want to do, provoke a nuclear conflict? |
| 04:18.06 | fozzmoo | The UN is all about political posturing, pontificating, and gesticulating. |
| 04:18.31 | fozzmoo | yeah. I dare No. Korea to deploy a nuke. |
| 04:18.43 | fozzmoo | the only reliable delivery device they have now is by strapping it on someone's back. |
| 04:18.58 | mheath | fozzmoo: nah, their missiles can easily reach south korea |
| 04:19.03 | mheath | which would be their likely target |
| 04:19.27 | maquis | if no korea does decide to deploy the nuke, i feel sorry for the no korean citizens |
| 04:19.36 | fozzmoo | Their missiles could probably reach South Korean... if a bunch of Soldiers carried them across the no mans land... :) |
| 04:20.33 | fozzmoo | Not really sure what the N Korea govt is thinking. |
| 04:21.19 | fozzmoo | China's not happy and they're usually N. Korea's best friend. |
| 04:21.31 | maquis | fozzmoo: the n korean government doesn't really care |
| 04:21.42 | fozzmoo | So why build a nuke? |
| 04:21.52 | fozzmoo | What's their goal? Go out with a bang? |
| 04:21.59 | fozzmoo | Why not just use it on themselves? :) |
| 04:22.28 | maquis | if they really tick off china, that's a good thing for the n korean people -- if they escape from n korea while china's mad at n korea, the chinese government won't hand them back to their government to be tortured and moved to concentration camps |
| 04:22.45 | fozzmoo | Yeah. |
| 04:22.49 | maquis | fozzmoo: they want to prove that they are the greatest nation on earth... |
| 04:23.35 | maquis | information is very slowly starting to infiltrate into n korea, and they realize that some people in the country may not continue blindly believing that they're the greatest nation on earth ruled by a benevolent god-figure |
| 04:23.58 | atoponce | ok. pdf isn't free, so what's a free alternative? is odf it? |
| 04:24.32 | maquis | ok... why in the world won't <alt>-number work for me today? |
| 04:24.57 | levi_home | odf is not quite equivalent to pdf. |
| 04:25.04 | atoponce | right |
| 04:25.09 | maquis | atoponce: are you still trying to figure that stuf all out? |
| 04:25.14 | maquis | atoponce: text |
| 04:25.19 | maquis | last i checked, that was free |
| 04:25.22 | atoponce | not really, i'm just bugged with pdf |
| 04:25.30 | atoponce | i've always hated it |
| 04:25.36 | *** part/#utah Chadbryant (n=chadbrya@67-41-166-186.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 04:25.44 | maquis | i prefer pdf over ppt, doc, etc |
| 04:25.55 | maquis | and in my experience, you usually have to choose between those |
| 04:25.56 | atoponce | text doesn't handle gravics and vectors, though... :-)ยป |
| 04:26.13 | maquis | sure it does... it's just a bit more difficult |
| 04:26.40 | mheath | atoponce: said formats are easily embedded in text-format documents. Like ODF. |
| 04:27.03 | atoponce | ? |
| 04:27.30 | maquis | wow... scott morris' post really didn't get along nicely with bloglines for me |
| 04:28.02 | levi_home | PDF is a nice format. I like it. |
| 04:28.55 | atoponce | hmmm |
| 04:28.56 | Sargun | What doesn't fit in this list: |
| 04:28.57 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:28.57 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:28.57 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:28.58 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:28.58 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:29.37 | maquis | ummm.... lounge area |
| 04:29.56 | atoponce | the problem is, i can't find anything in google. i get "how to open pdf docs" "create pdfs" "pdf freeware" etc |
| 04:30.28 | Sargun | Do you shoot when it is raining? |
| 04:30.28 | Sargun | We shoot all the time...bring rain gear. |
| 04:30.52 | tensai | openoffice can create pdfs. also ghostscript. there are a ton of apps that read them as well. |
| 04:30.53 | atoponce | nothing on the pdf license(s), alternatives to pdf, the pdf standards.... |
| 04:30.59 | mheath | Sargun: reminds me of blackwater |
| 04:31.18 | levi_home | Only free software zealots want an alternative to pdf, but there generally aren't enough talented free software zealots to create a viable alternative. ;P |
| 04:31.20 | tensai | the pdf spec is published, but it might be that adobe charges $$$ for it |
| 04:31.50 | atoponce | which is fine, but where is their licensing info on their site? |
| 04:31.53 | tensai | http://partners.adobe.com/public/developer/pdf/index_reference.html |
| 04:31.58 | Sargun | mheath, that is off the blackwater site |
| 04:32.31 | levi_home | http://partners.adobe.com/public/developer/pdf/index_reference.html |
| 04:32.35 | Sargun | Are civilians allowed at Blackwater? |
| 04:32.35 | Sargun | All people of goodwill are welcome at the Blackwater Training Center. We are strong proponents of the Second Amendment. |
| 04:32.37 | Sargun | heh |
| 04:32.38 | levi_home | Oops, late. |
| 04:33.02 | mheath | Sargun: why are you looking at that site? Did you join the NRA and forget to tell us? |
| 04:33.11 | Sargun | hehehe |
| 04:33.16 | atoponce | heh. i need a pdf viewer to read about the pdy spec... |
| 04:33.28 | atoponce | s/pdy/pdf/ |
| 04:33.31 | Sargun | Looking at investing in a rifle producer |
| 04:33.32 | Sargun | :-P |
| 04:33.43 | mheath | .... |
| 04:34.19 | levi_home | atoponce: I'm sure you can find one. |
| 04:34.28 | atoponce | i have one, i just find it funny |
| 04:34.46 | Sargun | no, my AP History teacher was talking about blackwater earlier today |
| 04:34.48 | atoponce | but it's not the reader i'm concerned with, it's the format. |
| 04:35.08 | levi_home | PDF/X and PDF/A are even ISO standards now. |
| 04:35.15 | levi_home | Or, rather, PDF/A will be soon. |
| 04:35.33 | Sargun | mheath, Can you start work at a defense contractor? |
| 04:35.47 | Sargun | or is that also endangering your team mates? |
| 04:35.58 | tensai | section 1.5 of the version 1.6 spec covers the PDF licensing terms |
| 04:36.46 | tensai | it's remarkably open |
| 04:37.22 | levi_home | It's also based on Postscript, which has been around and ubiquitous for years. |
| 04:37.29 | levi_home | And is also really cool. |
| 04:37.31 | tensai | 1. must honor document access permission controls in a document |
| 04:37.37 | tensai | 2. must include a copyright notice |
| 04:38.05 | mheath | Sargun: what do you mean? Defense contractor just means a company the DoD has a contract with. |
| 04:38.09 | *** join/#utah tuxd00d (n=tuxinato@128.187.128.38) |
| 04:38.16 | Sargun | yeah |
| 04:38.28 | Sargun | rather "Private security firm" |
| 04:38.30 | mheath | It can be everything from the company that makes the footlockers to a company that makes missiles or guns. |
| 04:38.33 | atoponce | i like poststript, but pdf's have always seemed bloated to me, and extrating a decent quality image from one is a pain |
| 04:38.45 | mheath | Sargun: I don't know. |
| 04:39.02 | levi_home | PDFs are like postscript with embedded fonts. |
| 04:39.15 | tensai | pdfs are compressed, no? |
| 04:39.31 | levi_home | They can be, IIRC. |
| 04:39.41 | atoponce | i think it's on option. not sure about default |
| 04:40.21 | Sargun | any new podcasts out today? |
| 04:40.27 | levi_home | The only measure I can think of in which postscript is superior to PDF is simplicity. |
| 04:40.39 | levi_home | PDFs can be text-indexed and searched. |
| 04:40.47 | levi_home | (if they are created with support for that) |
| 04:41.00 | levi_home | PDFs can be given tables of contents. |
| 04:41.12 | findlay | don't pdfs use zip internally? |
| 04:41.35 | tensai | findlay: why don't you read the spec and tell us. it's only 1200 pages. |
| 04:41.45 | findlay | ~zip tensai |
| 04:41.53 | tensai | ~pdf findlay |
| 04:41.57 | mheath | http://www.colt.com/mil/M16.asp |
| 04:42.06 | findlay | tensai: ist's probably a 1200 page pdf |
| 04:42.09 | mheath | This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine.... |
| 04:42.14 | atoponce | 1213 actually... |
| 04:42.20 | tensai | findlay: yes, it is a pdf |
| 04:42.24 | findlay | haha |
| 04:42.39 | mheath | Rifle Serial Number 6570990 |
| 04:42.56 | mrpull- | mheath: what is that saying? this is my rifle, this is my gun? |
| 04:42.57 | findlay | pdf is so inflexible |
| 04:43.10 | atoponce | ~agree with findlay |
| 04:43.38 | atoponce | among other things |
| 04:43.38 | mheath | mrpull-: "This is my rifle, this is my gun" is a rather crude chant from "Full Metal Jacket" talking about their rifles and their erm.....<censored> |
| 04:43.39 | findlay | especially when they do the double column thing. What a joke |
| 04:43.44 | mheath | _I_ was quoting the Marine Corps Rifle Creed |
| 04:44.00 | atoponce | i like the bookmarks. cool. but that's about it. |
| 04:44.07 | tensai | try flash paper and you'll run screaming back to pdf |
| 04:44.17 | atoponce | even then, they don't work 100% of the time |
| 04:44.24 | findlay | atoponce: kpdf makes pdfs almost tolerable for me |
| 04:44.36 | findlay | ~kpdf++ |
| 04:44.41 | tensai | findlay: I've settled on kpdf too |
| 04:44.56 | findlay | half the pain of pdf is acroread.exe which takes forever to load |
| 04:45.40 | findlay | you get to admire this wonderful splash screen for a minute or two while each and every dll on the planet is loaded |
| 04:45.41 | mheath | Is there a way to remove unnecessary carriage returns from a document in Open Office? |
| 04:45.42 | tuxd00d | I don't care so much about the load time of acroread as much as it's lack of stability in a web browser |
| 04:45.53 | maquis | findlay: just use xpdf |
| 04:45.56 | maquis | it's fast |
| 04:46.03 | Tene | mheath: clarify "unnecessary"? |
| 04:46.08 | mheath | Say you copy a document off a website that had linefeeds added to make it forced to a certain width |
| 04:46.11 | findlay | then you get to read the plain text document that should have been html anyway |
| 04:46.25 | Sargun | I wish my sister would SHUT UP! |
| 04:46.32 | Tene | mheath: if you're copying text, check out 'fmt' |
| 04:46.48 | tuxd00d | Sargun: use ear plugs |
| 04:46.54 | Sargun | uhh |
| 04:46.57 | Sargun | fremont? |
| 04:47.20 | Tene | 'fmt'. It's an executable on many unix systems. |
| 04:47.25 | findlay | maquis: xpdf lacks some coolness features that kpdf has |
| 04:47.34 | Tene | Evince! |
| 04:47.34 | mheath | Tene: I'm in Windows, however :( |
| 04:47.40 | findlay | even acroread doesn't have some kpdf features |
| 04:47.52 | tensai | findlay: such as? |
| 04:47.52 | Tene | mheath: Then no, you have no interesting or useful options for text processing. |
| 04:47.57 | findlay | evince is good too, but not as featured as kpdf |
| 04:48.00 | atoponce | Tene: evince is in dyer need of help :-)ยป |
| 04:48.10 | tensai | mheath: gvim |
| 04:48.11 | Tene | I'd suggest ssh-ing into a linux box and runnin 'man fmt' |
| 04:48.29 | mheath | I wonder if I could make a decent macro/script for OpenOffice |
| 04:49.08 | findlay | tensai: mainly I just like the UI better than evince |
| 04:49.16 | tuxd00d | fmt is a neat program |
| 04:49.23 | findlay | and it's *way* better than the acroread UI |
| 04:49.35 | findlay | I'd rather use xpdf |
| 04:49.42 | mheath | Just something along the lines of: if current character is <carriage return> and (previous character is not <carriage return> and next character is not <carriage return) delete current character |
| 04:49.50 | tensai | findlay: I'm sold on kpdf. I just wondered if there was more coolness to find. |
| 04:50.22 | atoponce | mheath: then you would have any line breaks |
| 04:50.25 | maquis | findlay: xpdf may lack coolness, but it's lightweight and fast |
| 04:50.28 | findlay | tensai: well my favorite feature is the select/copy method |
| 04:50.29 | atoponce | *wouldn't |
| 04:50.39 | findlay | maquis: yes, I like it for that |
| 04:50.40 | mheath | atoponce: yes you would |
| 04:50.48 | atoponce | unless it's in dos format |
| 04:50.48 | mheath | The line breaks I want are all doubled up |
| 04:50.58 | mheath | atoponce: bah, thats simple pseudo code |
| 04:51.08 | mheath | ignore the line feed / CR implications |
| 04:51.09 | atoponce | so, \l\r ? |
| 04:51.11 | findlay | I also like the slide show view |
| 04:51.13 | mheath | I know they're there, I didn't address it |
| 04:51.23 | mrpull- | whoa! I didn't see hans reiser was arrested! |
| 04:51.31 | mrpull- | until now |
| 04:51.40 | mheath | mrpull-: he's a baaaad man. :P |
| 04:51.53 | findlay | and the UI commonality with the other kviewers like kdvi and kghostview |
| 04:52.07 | mheath | Windows Vista is too slow. Starting to really get to me. |
| 04:52.18 | findlay | makes it like you can't tell the difference between dvi/ps/pdf |
| 04:52.19 | mheath | Not the aggonizingly slow with weird lockups that most windows versions have |
| 04:52.40 | mheath | just smoothly much slower, so that you know things _should_ be going a lot faster than they are. |
| 04:52.53 | findlay | mheath: it's time to reinstall |
| 04:53.10 | findlay | didn't you know windows was meant to be reinstalled regularly? |
| 04:53.14 | atoponce | i enjoyed hans fugal's recent post on iceweasel |
| 04:53.30 | atoponce | i'll be switching. that's for certain |
| 04:54.09 | mheath | atoponce: it will be neat if our LUG is given a chance to work on that cluster |
| 04:54.11 | atoponce | goodbye firefox/mozilla. |
| 04:54.14 | mheath | and use those lab facilities |
| 04:54.40 | atoponce | mheath: yeah. i hope we can, but with the short notice, i doubt we'll pull it off for the install fest |
| 04:54.56 | findlay | ugh, that logo needs work |
| 04:55.02 | atoponce | but hopefully for future meets. it's just too cool to pass pu |
| 04:55.06 | atoponce | *up |
| 04:55.18 | atoponce | findlay: #10 |
| 04:55.31 | atoponce | that's a good-looking logo |
| 04:55.41 | mheath | atoponce: yeah, I know, but in the future... :) |
| 04:55.48 | atoponce | definitely |
| 05:07.10 | tensai | ~rlart |
| 05:09.26 | mheath[laptop] | Oh, if anyone is curious, my question about excessive line returns (to restrict to a certain width)... |
| 05:10.05 | mheath[laptop] | Format -> AutoFormat -> Apply gets rid of that in Open Office |
| 05:33.00 | Sargun | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8376947077775909834&q=happy+feet&hl=en |
| 05:36.19 | *** join/#utah mrpull-_ (n=misterpu@mail.pollmann.us) |
| 05:39.33 | atoponce | Sargun: that's nothng, although funny |
| 05:39.35 | atoponce | http://dailydancer.com/ |
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| 13:37.53 | *** join/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
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| 13:49.44 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 13:51.18 | redbeard1 | ~lart elg |
| 13:51.46 | elg | ~cook redbeard1 |
| 13:51.52 | ibot | ACTION throws redbeard1 in a big pan with veggies inside and cooks redbeard1 on 350 for an hour |
| 13:51.56 | redbeard1 | ~brulee elg |
| 13:51.57 | ibot | ACTION whisks elg with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 13:52.10 | graphyx | wow... |
| 13:52.22 | graphyx | I would almost think that redbeard1 programmed that one himself. |
| 13:52.36 | elg | if you didn't know better? |
| 13:52.40 | redbeard1 | heh... you could almost think that, couldn't you? |
| 13:53.06 | graphyx | ~factinfo brulee |
| 13:53.06 | ibot | there's no such factoid as brulee, graphyx |
| 13:53.13 | graphyx | ~info brulee |
| 13:53.40 | redbeard1 | ibot: what is brulee? |
| 13:53.43 | ibot | redbeard1: what are you talking about? |
| 13:54.33 | redbeard1 | apparently ibot doesn't want to share where he learned how to make creme brulee |
| 13:55.25 | redbeard1 | ~brulee |
| 14:00.05 | goozbach | ~factinfo brulee (.)* |
| 14:00.05 | ibot | there's no such factoid as brulee (.)*, goozbach |
| 14:00.10 | goozbach | blast |
| 14:00.17 | goozbach | ~blast |
| 14:00.18 | ibot | hmm... blast is a program which allows one to Vent his/her frustration with programs by blowing holes in them |
| 14:00.42 | goozbach | ooh need to go to a clean&shoot |
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| 14:13.04 | *** join/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 14:22.06 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-00dc97916da15504) |
| 14:25.12 | levi | Good morning. |
| 14:26.01 | goozbach | morn |
| 14:30.56 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166.70.238.250) |
| 14:31.54 | redbeard1 | i like the name Iceweasel |
| 14:32.04 | graphyx | It's pretty cool. |
| 14:32.08 | graphyx | ~groaner |
| 14:32.21 | ibot | ACTION puts on a Comedysportz ref shifts, blows a load whistle, places a paper bag over graphyx and says, "Groaner foul. Now remember kids, the first one is paper the second is plastic." |
| 14:32.36 | graphyx | rock on. That is just what I was hoping it would be.. |
| 14:32.38 | jsmith | The name "weasel" certainly comes with a certain connotation, doesn't it :-) |
| 14:33.01 | redbeard1 | that's why i like it |
| 14:33.42 | elg | I think it's hilarious. I don't necessarily think it's a good real name |
| 14:33.50 | elg | but I think half the point is to tick off mozilla |
| 14:33.54 | goozbach | I like the icon that's copulating with the world |
| 14:34.10 | elg | who I'm betting is not amused by "iceweasel" |
| 14:34.12 | redbeard1 | goozbach: i just barely saw that, made me laught |
| 14:34.19 | redbeard1 | s/t$// |
| 14:34.33 | elg | some of those icons with the white weasels could be cool, if the head weren't decapitated by transparency |
| 14:35.01 | elg | isn't syn/ack done automatically by the tcp stack? |
| 14:35.12 | goozbach | elg: supposedly |
| 14:35.21 | elg | k, that's what I thought |
| 14:35.27 | goozbach | if you use the right code |
| 14:35.38 | goozbach | open a tcp socket, and yes |
| 14:35.42 | elg | vontrapp is trying to decode some undocumented mythtv protocol |
| 14:36.05 | goozbach | try to code lower than tcp and you may have to do that yourself? |
| 14:36.14 | goozbach | wireshark |
| 14:36.23 | elg | he's at the netcat stage right now |
| 14:36.34 | goozbach | ahh |
| 14:43.13 | *** join/#utah dilvie (n=chatzill@c-67-166-126-133.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 14:44.48 | ^Migs^ | this guy my boss hired to be our other Java developer doesn't know a thing about Java, and I'm not sure what to do. I'm trying not to spend too much time babysitting him, but for someone who has never coded anything before, Java isn't exactly an easy first language. |
| 14:45.57 | levi | Why did he hire a guy who has never programmed before to be a Java developer? |
| 14:46.39 | elg | probably related to someone |
| 14:46.57 | ^Migs^ | no |
| 14:47.04 | ^Migs^ | I think he embellished a little in his interview |
| 14:47.09 | dilvie | hmm |
| 14:47.32 | ^Migs^ | My boss was a little anxious to hire someone, for one thing, and he put the job opening on Monster but only two people applied. I suggested he try other things like craigslist et al, but he didn't |
| 14:47.44 | dilvie | Buy him a Java book |
| 14:47.50 | ^Migs^ | I gave him a bunch of Java resources |
| 14:48.01 | dilvie | craigslist is the shit for recruitment |
| 14:48.02 | ^Migs^ | keep in mind, he doesn't even really understand the basics of OOP |
| 14:48.05 | dilvie | works great! |
| 14:48.10 | ^Migs^ | yeah, no kidding |
| 14:48.20 | elg | goozbach: http://thedailywtf.com/forums/thread/87504.aspx |
| 14:48.39 | dilvie | every time I post a job openning on craigslist, I get a bunch of qualified applicants. |
| 14:48.41 | ^Migs^ | also, once he finally does start coding, I'm going to have to quality-check all his code. Not looking forward to that either. |
| 14:48.44 | dilvie | wonderful thing. |
| 14:48.54 | ^Migs^ | I mean, he's a great guy, and I like him, and in terms of graphical design, he's been a pretty good asset... |
| 14:49.06 | ^Migs^ | I just hope he's able to cut it in development |
| 14:49.25 | ^Migs^ | He's already been around for about 2 or 3 months |
| 14:49.52 | ^Migs^ | I was ACTUALLY hoping my boss would hire someone better at Java development than I am, so *I* could learn from him. |
| 14:50.18 | levi | One always hopes for something like that, but it rarely happens. |
| 14:50.57 | levi | Sometimes, I think I'll have to go work for a big company to work closely with better programmers. |
| 14:51.26 | levi | Actually, I do work with a couple of guys who are better C coders than me, but I don't work closely with them and I haven't written any C code in a while. |
| 14:52.46 | Jayce^ | Yeah, I know what you mean, I get stuck working with redbeard1 ...... |
| 14:54.19 | elg | i "work" with people better at math and CS theory than me |
| 14:54.35 | elg | not sure how they code though |
| 14:55.53 | Jayce^ | wonder if iceweasel had anything to do with al's new weasel stomping day song |
| 14:56.53 | levi | The name Iceweasel just works on so many levels. |
| 15:01.51 | ^Migs^ | he also has a habit of telling irrelevant stories, and he tends to talk a long time, repeating points at least 3 times during his stories |
| 15:01.57 | ^Migs^ | kind of a waste of my time |
| 15:02.35 | levi | Jayce^: I think it had more to do with Matt Groening's little poem about love. |
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| 15:09.55 | *** join/#utah vex (n=vex@c-67-161-240-108.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 15:16.01 | redbeard1 | ~brulee Jayce^ |
| 15:16.03 | ibot | ACTION whisks Jayce^ with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 15:31.41 | maquis | gah! |
| 15:31.48 | maquis | it's all top-posted! |
| 15:31.52 | Sargun | ~sleep |
| 15:31.53 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, sleep is overrated, and a poor substitute for caffeine. |
| 15:36.12 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 15:37.43 | tristanbob | what else needs to be done when creating an IRC channel? all I have done is join an empty channel. |
| 15:38.02 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 15:39.10 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 15:39.11 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 15:39.14 | fozzmoo | That's it. Now tell people about your channel. :) |
| 15:39.20 | *** join/#utah SB1-Work (n=kylesb@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 15:39.46 | tristanbob | fozzmoo: how do I get chanserv in there? how do I become an op |
| 15:40.02 | fozzmoo | Oh. Can't answer those. :) |
| 15:40.17 | tristanbob | and what is the purpose of chanserv? |
| 15:40.24 | SB1-Work | tristanbob, in where? |
| 15:41.36 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-00dc97916da15504) |
| 15:41.47 | SB1-Work | generally, the syntax to give yourself a +o is /msg chanserv #channel op |
| 15:42.35 | mheath | mmm, I'm going to make myself some of my coffee cake for breakfast. |
| 15:42.36 | bonez39 | any samba gurus? |
| 15:42.41 | tristanbob | SB1-Work: I will try that.. thanks |
| 15:42.46 | maquis | SB1-Work: you also have to add on the name of the channel after that, last i checked |
| 15:42.58 | maquis | er... i guess that was for tristanbob |
| 15:43.10 | SB1-Work | maquis is probably right, it's either "#channel op" or "op #channel" |
| 15:43.13 | SB1-Work | I forget which |
| 15:43.23 | SB1-Work | Yeah, maquis is right actually |
| 15:43.25 | maquis | it's /msg chanserv op #channel |
| 15:43.35 | tristanbob | good to know... :) |
| 15:43.41 | maquis | SB1-Work: i had better be.... otherwise i wouldn't have the @ on :) |
| 15:44.07 | SB1-Work | hehe |
| 15:44.23 | SB1-Work | it can vary from network to network to |
| 15:44.29 | SB1-Work | Hence why I'm never 100% sure |
| 15:44.33 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@firebat.aros.net) |
| 15:44.33 | maquis | ah |
| 15:44.39 | maquis | so, we're not talking about freenode? |
| 15:44.39 | tristanbob | hmmm... I get an instant reply from chanserv that repeats my "op #channel" |
| 15:44.49 | tristanbob | yes, freenode |
| 15:44.52 | SB1-Work | no, we are, I just sometimes confuse channels |
| 15:44.55 | tristanbob | shall I mention the channel? |
| 15:44.58 | SB1-Work | s/channels/networks/ |
| 15:45.49 | tristanbob | I feel vulnerable without OP status, someone who knows what they are doing can kick or ban me |
| 15:45.56 | SB1-Work | ol |
| 15:45.58 | SB1-Work | *lol |
| 15:46.49 | Jayce^ | why is it, when I see people say things like that I get a *nigh* unbearable itch to kick them :) |
| 15:47.09 | maquis | tristanbob: why would you ever think that someone with op would kick you? |
| 15:47.10 | tristanbob | :) human nature |
| 15:47.18 | tristanbob | not this channel, and not you guys |
| 15:47.31 | tristanbob | I'd like to setup a permanent channel for an opensource project |
| 15:47.42 | SB1-Work | Jayce^, that's why you befriend the server ops ;) |
| 15:47.47 | ^Migs^ | I suggest you do |
| 15:47.49 | SB1-Work | Jayce^, it works wonders on small networks :) |
| 15:48.09 | Jayce^ | *ouch* :) |
| 15:49.08 | maquis | i don't think i've ever seen any abuse of op privileges in #utah... |
| 15:49.15 | SB1-Work | Nope |
| 15:49.34 | SB1-Work | Though from what I've randomly heard here, PLUG could use a little ;) |
| 15:49.34 | Jayce^ | lulling you into a sense of false security |
| 15:49.44 | SB1-Work | The mailing list anyways |
| 15:49.51 | Jayce^ | actually, we've had issues when we let sjansen have them for a little while |
| 15:50.23 | maquis | i know that Jayce^ and i would *never* think to kick anyone without a good reason... |
| 15:50.27 | maquis | :) |
| 15:50.30 | bonez39 | how do I tell where a print job goes...if I print, for example, a pdf document to 'lpr' but nothing comes out of the printer? where does that print job go? how can I troubleshoot this? |
| 15:50.54 | tristanbob | can you guys create a random channel and see what steps it takes to get ops and chanserv? the commands you gave are not working for me |
| 15:50.59 | maquis | lpq could tell you something? |
| 15:51.04 | maquis | (that was to bonez39 |
| 15:51.05 | maquis | ) |
| 15:51.11 | SB1-Work | tristanbob, you probably want to register your channel. |
| 15:51.25 | tristanbob | do you have a link I can read about that? |
| 15:51.39 | SB1-Work | I'd recommend /msg chanserv help register |
| 15:51.55 | bonez39 | E [11/Oct/2006:09:36:38 -0600] [Job 1119] Unable to connect to SAMBA host, will retry in 60 seconds...ERROR: Connection failed with error NT_STATUS_ACCESS_DENIED |
| 15:52.05 | bonez39 | that's the error I find in /var/log/cups/error_log |
| 15:52.09 | maquis | emcnabb: you've been an op at least once |
| 15:52.26 | Jayce^ | yeah, he was one of the abusers... |
| 15:52.30 | *** mode/#utah [+o emcnabb] by maquis |
| 15:52.34 | tristanbob | SB1-Work: I did that.... I get an instant reply of "help register" .... what does that mean? |
| 15:52.36 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/var/log/cups# lpq |
| 15:52.37 | bonez39 | sethlaser is ready |
| 15:52.37 | bonez39 | Rank Owner Job File(s) Total Size |
| 15:52.37 | bonez39 | active root 1119 (stdin) 28672 bytes |
| 15:52.42 | *** mode/#utah [-o emcnabb] by Jayce^ |
| 15:52.45 | Jayce^ | :) |
| 15:52.47 | bonez39 | maquis, that's the output from lpq |
| 15:52.55 | maquis | hmmm |
| 15:53.01 | maquis | it didn't tell you where it was going? |
| 15:53.05 | SB1-Work | tristanbob, that's very odd |
| 15:53.08 | bonez39 | no..... |
| 15:53.08 | maquis | what did you set lpr up to print to? |
| 15:53.13 | bonez39 | maquis, no telling where it was going.. |
| 15:53.43 | maquis | emcnabb: wait a bit until Jayce^ isn't around... |
| 15:53.48 | SB1-Work | Does your reply look like ">chanserv< help register" by chance? |
| 15:53.50 | emcnabb | woohoo |
| 15:53.53 | maquis | unless you want to kick him as soon as you get it |
| 15:53.55 | bonez39 | maquis, I set lpr to print to sethlaser, a laserjet iiip attached to 'seth', my win xp machine.....using this > lpadmin -p sethlaser -v smb://seth/sethlaser |
| 15:53.55 | tristanbob | ok - I did that command in this channel and I got the info |
| 15:54.01 | SB1-Work | There you go |
| 15:54.06 | SB1-Work | That's an xchat stupidity |
| 15:54.09 | Jayce^ | maquis, I can take yours away too :-p |
| 15:54.16 | tristanbob | SB1-Work: so you have to type that in a working channel with chanserv present |
| 15:54.20 | maquis | bonez39: i dunno |
| 15:54.25 | tristanbob | SB1-Work: thanks, I will read up on that |
| 15:54.30 | SB1-Work | np |
| 15:56.40 | SB1-Work | Geez, 48 new windows updates to approve |
| 15:59.38 | maquis | is it patch tuesday (or was it yesterday?) |
| 15:59.47 | SB1-Work | Yesterday, yeah |
| 15:59.57 | tristanbob | SB1-Work: ok, now I have a chicken and egg problem. I try to register the channel, and it says I need OPs. I try to get OPs, but I need to register the channel first |
| 16:00.06 | SB1-Work | tristanbob, what channel is it? |
| 16:01.05 | *** part/#utah SB1-Work (n=kylesb@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 16:02.51 | *** join/#utah SB1-Work (n=kylesb@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 16:02.55 | SB1-Work | oops. Left the wrong channel. |
| 16:05.13 | mheath | mmm |
| 16:05.41 | *** join/#utah Robdor (n=rob@208.187.198.179) |
| 16:10.55 | *** join/#utah scothoser (n=scothose@wifi-177145.aoce.utah.edu) |
| 16:12.27 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-24-10-162-63.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 16:15.38 | mheath | scothoser: I'm going up there for an orientation in November, it looks like |
| 16:19.21 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 16:20.36 | scothoser | mheath: Sweet! Which day in November? |
| 16:22.20 | mheath | scothoser: Tuesday the 28th |
| 16:22.30 | mheath | 1:30-7:00 PM |
| 16:22.34 | mheath | brb |
| 16:23.50 | fozzmoo | http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article1834360.ece |
| 16:23.50 | fozzmoo | Article slams America for being such a big consumer. Kinda of funny that it mentions water use more than anything else... like the water we consume just disappears. |
| 16:24.44 | fozzmoo | goozbach: SoN CO Run 11/15-11/18 |
| 16:25.39 | findlay | oh no |
| 16:29.40 | *** join/#utah vex_ (n=vex@216.194.126.99) |
| 16:31.19 | mheath | today is wednesday, right? |
| 16:31.23 | mheath | ~boggle maquis |
| 16:33.25 | scothoser | mheath: Yes, it is. |
| 16:33.49 | mheath | I love how short my shifts are at my new job at work |
| 16:34.09 | mheath | I'll go home with just as much if not more money, but the shifts are half as long |
| 16:35.47 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=herlo@class1-nat.gurulabs.com) |
| 16:36.04 | maquis | doh |
| 16:36.37 | maquis | mheath: where's the new job? |
| 16:38.46 | mheath | maquis: applebees. temporary, for a couple months, until I start at UoU |
| 16:38.50 | mheath | (same place I worked before I enlisted) |
| 16:39.24 | rsimpkins | Don't you have to report and then pay taxes on tips? |
| 16:40.15 | redbeard1 | rsimpkins: yeah, you do |
| 16:40.22 | mheath | rsimpkins: Yeah. |
| 16:40.23 | findlay | ~report rsimpkins |
| 16:40.43 | rsimpkins | How does the IRS know how much money you've made on tips? |
| 16:40.50 | rsimpkins | If your tips are in cash - that is. |
| 16:40.55 | mheath | rsimpkins: you report it on a daily basis. |
| 16:41.09 | mheath | In our case, our restraunt is all computer based |
| 16:41.13 | rsimpkins | mheath: What stops you from slipping the cash in your pocket and only reporting half or soemthing? |
| 16:41.21 | mheath | use a touchscreen computer to clockin, enter food, clock out |
| 16:41.25 | mheath | rsimpkins: nothing. |
| 16:41.28 | redbeard1 | rsimpkins: isn't the honor system great? |
| 16:41.50 | rsimpkins | I was just wondering if there is an IRS nazi in each resturant checking for that kinda thing. |
| 16:41.54 | mheath | Except not being a complete jerk to your coworkers, because the tips usually get shared (at least partially) with them |
| 16:41.59 | rsimpkins | Or if you report low tips if your managers will get after you, etc. |
| 16:42.09 | elg | i never got that. I tip less because of it |
| 16:42.18 | mheath | rsimpkins: they do trend analysis, I think, incase you start doing something big |
| 16:42.23 | redbeard1 | rsimpkins: low tips just means you're in utah |
| 16:42.27 | mheath | a couple dollars here and there, I'm sure would go unnoticed |
| 16:42.31 | elg | if I'm going to give a generous tip, it's because I like how I was served, not because I want to benefit all the other waiters who may be total jerks |
| 16:42.35 | mheath | but if you suddenly start reporting hundreds of dollars less in tips.... |
| 16:42.38 | *** join/#utah calvarez (i=calvarez@lawn-128-61-124-152.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 16:42.39 | mheath | you're not going to get away with it :) |
| 16:42.49 | SB1-Work | redbeard1, I'd debate that. I usually tip 20%ish, and the other night my dad tipped 200% |
| 16:42.57 | mheath | elg: no, its not the waiters who get a portion of the tip |
| 16:43.05 | mheath | Its our bartenders who mixed/poured your drinks |
| 16:43.15 | elg | mheath: and if I don't drink? |
| 16:43.17 | mheath | And the host/hostess who greeted you and took you to your table |
| 16:43.25 | redbeard1 | SB1-Work: i try to never tip less than 20%... but i'm not most utahns. |
| 16:43.34 | rsimpkins | Waiters tip the bus boys too, right - so they are more motivated to clear of tables in a particular section. |
| 16:43.39 | SB1-Work | redbeard1, heh. Power to you. |
| 16:43.41 | mheath | elg: Everything drink wise is prepared by our bartender. |
| 16:43.56 | mheath | rsimpkins: nah. |
| 16:43.58 | elg | I'm sure it takes a lot of work to pour that water with no ice |
| 16:44.03 | mheath | We have to clear tables in a certain amount of time |
| 16:44.09 | mheath | supposed to be 2 minutes max after the table gets up |
| 16:44.11 | elg | which is refilled a thousand times by overeager waiters trying to bloat me |
| 16:44.23 | elg | who always get ice in it |
| 16:44.49 | mheath | elg: ...Your complaining because your drink is refilled too much? |
| 16:44.53 | mheath | They're not forcing you to drink it |
| 16:45.22 | elg | of course not |
| 16:45.37 | elg | that doesn't mean I want my drink refilled every 30 seconds |
| 16:45.43 | elg | it's a nuisance |
| 16:45.52 | rsimpkins | elg: What resturant is this? |
| 16:46.02 | elg | every restaurant, to varying degrees |
| 16:46.22 | rsimpkins | I guess we don't go to the same places. |
| 16:46.26 | elg | I leave a bigger tip if they come once about halfway through and ask if I want a refill. to me that's about right |
| 16:47.12 | elg | if they notice things and offer relevant assistance, that's good. popping by every time they make a circuit and asking if we need anything is a demerit |
| 16:47.44 | mheath | elg: you'd like our servers then |
| 16:47.52 | mheath | You really would |
| 16:47.52 | rsimpkins | A good waiter doesn't need to say anything. |
| 16:47.55 | elg | great |
| 16:47.57 | mheath | not at all overbearing |
| 16:48.06 | elg | next time I'm in ogden maybe I'll come by. :) |
| 16:48.15 | redbeard1 | elg: most waiters i've seen wait for the halfway point on everything but water. funny thing is, if water ever drops below half, that's when they usually stop giving me refills. like i've abused my privilege or something |
| 16:48.46 | elg | redbeard1: heh. I'll have to remember that |
| 16:48.54 | elg | go thirsty and drink over half right away |
| 16:49.25 | rsimpkins | findlay: I think Burger King lets you do that. ;) |
| 16:49.44 | mheath | Whenever I visit a table (to bring them their food; food is ran by anyone available here, not just the tables specific server), I'll just say "Is there anything else I can get you before your server comes around again? Perhaps some steak sauce, sir?" |
| 16:49.58 | mheath | if no, "Enjoy your meal." <walk away> |
| 16:50.35 | mheath | If anyone calls Applebees in riverdale to order food to go tonight, you're likely to get me on the phone. |
| 16:50.59 | maquis | mheath: do you deliver to seattle? :) |
| 16:51.03 | rsimpkins | I've left 150% tips before, but never a 200% one. that is a big tip. |
| 16:51.19 | SB1-Work | My dad knows the owner. Good friends with him. |
| 16:51.32 | SB1-Work | HORRIBLY busy night, and the owner got up and did our table himself |
| 16:51.42 | rsimpkins | I'll usually do a 100% tip on very outstanding service and professionalism. |
| 16:52.09 | SB1-Work | iirc, it was a $80 meal, too |
| 16:52.11 | mheath | maquis: There are applebees up there too :) |
| 16:52.21 | mheath | No, we don't deliver. Only pickup :) "Carside to go" |
| 16:52.41 | mheath | THanks you for calling applebees on riverdale road featuring carside service; this is Mike, how can I help you? |
| 16:53.24 | redbeard1 | i have a friend that never leaves less than a $5 tip, even if the service was horrible, and/or even if he only ordered a cup of coffee |
| 16:53.44 | mheath | redbeard1: thats awesome |
| 16:53.47 | mheath | Thats the way I am |
| 16:53.57 | mheath | I work with too many servers....I feel guitly not leaving something decent |
| 16:57.33 | findlay | that's one of the main reasons I don't like to be served |
| 16:57.53 | mheath | The worst serivce I ever received in a nice restraunt was in a hotel in salt lake city |
| 16:58.09 | mheath | Thats when I was going through MEPS, so the stay in the hotel and the meal was contracted by the government |
| 16:58.30 | mheath | The waitress must have been unused to anyone leaving any kind of tip, so they gave you horrible service |
| 16:58.37 | findlay | I *will* however leave a good tip, but being served violates my sense on independence |
| 16:59.18 | mheath | findlay: you're too uptight |
| 16:59.31 | mheath | the point is just to sit back, enjoy the food, enjoy the conversation, and not have to worry about it :) |
| 16:59.36 | elg | i'll be happy to be served and compensate accordingly when I'm rich |
| 16:59.45 | findlay | mheath: I don't like to eat in public |
| 16:59.52 | findlay | and it's expensive |
| 16:59.53 | elg | til then I mostly go to places without servers |
| 17:00.21 | findlay | that's why I buy nearly all of my food at the store |
| 17:00.34 | mheath | bah |
| 17:00.43 | mheath | I eat out a lot, probably because I get half off at Applebees |
| 17:00.44 | mheath | :P |
| 17:00.50 | findlay | heh |
| 17:01.03 | elg | if I got half off I might be able to afford to tip |
| 17:01.08 | elg | see if you can't arrange it |
| 17:01.30 | mheath | hah |
| 17:01.38 | mheath | Our prices are actually really good, imho. |
| 17:01.46 | mheath | A lot surprised me about applebees when I started working there |
| 17:01.53 | mheath | How much is fresh made, how good the prices actually are |
| 17:02.18 | mheath | I, as an employee, am allowed to buy some of the raw ingredients at the price we bought them for. |
| 17:02.36 | elg | that would be apples and bees? |
| 17:02.38 | mheath | and the prices we charge our customers really aren't bad at all based on those prices |
| 17:03.02 | Jayce^ | hehe, now we have a fun thing to do between NUPM and plug... |
| 17:03.14 | Jayce^ | crank voip calls to applebees tonight anyone? |
| 17:03.39 | mheath | We receive enough as they are. |
| 17:03.45 | elg | Jayce^: I thought you were going to say "sing raffi songs" |
| 17:03.51 | mheath | I had a kid try to call up and order rediculous amounts of food |
| 17:04.00 | mheath | then give me a phone number with 9 digits in it |
| 17:04.14 | maquis | 9 digits? |
| 17:04.19 | mheath | Yeah |
| 17:04.25 | elg | lucky you had a regex |
| 17:04.25 | scothoser | He must have been from France. ^_^ |
| 17:04.31 | mheath | The kid was like "655..4.9...9..9...9....9" |
| 17:04.50 | mheath | We do get some insane orders there, though |
| 17:04.56 | mheath | especially on Monday mornings for some reason |
| 17:05.03 | mheath | people that call in and order $600 worth of salads |
| 17:05.14 | mheath | (real people) |
| 17:05.44 | scothoser | Sounds like an office party.. They always order salads so that vegans are not offended. |
| 17:05.58 | mheath | scothoser: no, all of our salads have meat :P |
| 17:06.33 | mheath | except for our $1.99 "house salad" |
| 17:09.12 | elg | maybe they're tricking the vegans |
| 17:09.35 | maquis | what's the most graceful way of killing a defunct process? |
| 17:09.48 | findlay | kill |
| 17:09.58 | goozbach | kill -15 |
| 17:09.58 | findlay | die |
| 17:10.00 | findlay | death |
| 17:10.01 | mheath | Half those people never even look into our "Applebees Anywhere", which is platter, party-sized portions |
| 17:10.05 | redbeard1 | shutdown -r now |
| 17:10.06 | calvarez | kill -graceful |
| 17:10.12 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-68-22-220-206.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 17:10.16 | goozbach | pull the powercord |
| 17:10.18 | mheath | instead they order dozens of identical individual salads |
| 17:10.23 | findlay | ~kill process |
| 17:10.26 | ibot | ACTION shoots a fluxmeson gun at process |
| 17:10.26 | calvarez | format c:/ |
| 17:10.28 | calvarez | ehhh |
| 17:10.31 | calvarez | nvm :p |
| 17:10.49 | mheath | ~lart calvarez for using windows |
| 17:10.50 | redbeard1 | rm -rf / |
| 17:10.53 | mheath | ;-) |
| 17:10.57 | calvarez | meh |
| 17:11.11 | mheath | hahas |
| 17:11.11 | calvarez | I am freer, I use any OS I want :p |
| 17:11.20 | mheath | calvarez: I was joking |
| 17:11.29 | calvarez | I know ;) |
| 17:12.01 | calvarez | MAN I love Blender :) |
| 17:12.08 | calvarez | sooo easy |
| 17:12.13 | findlay | make distclean |
| 17:12.23 | calvarez | all the comments I heard about "messy UI" are stupid and misinformed |
| 17:12.36 | findlay | ~blend calvarez |
| 17:12.50 | calvarez | it's 10x cleaner and easier than Maya's UI |
| 17:13.04 | calvarez | ~tilde findlay |
| 17:13.12 | calvarez | ~lart findlay |
| 17:14.49 | mheath | ~~ |
| 17:14.50 | ibot | Every moment in which im called upon is torture |
| 17:14.59 | calvarez | ~~ |
| 17:15.00 | ibot | Every moment in which im called upon is torture |
| 17:15.06 | redbeard1 | -torture ibot |
| 17:15.09 | calvarez | ~kill ibot |
| 17:15.10 | ibot | ACTION shoots a charged quark gun at ibot |
| 17:15.15 | redbeard1 | ~torture ibot |
| 17:15.16 | ibot | ACTION forces ibot to support Debian GNU/Hurd in production. |
| 17:15.22 | calvarez | haha |
| 17:15.24 | calvarez | haaa |
| 17:16.19 | calvarez | ~torture mheath |
| 17:16.21 | ibot | ACTION forces mheath to support Debian GNU/Hurd in production. |
| 17:16.21 | redbeard1 | so ibot, what do you think of iceweasel, then? |
| 17:16.21 | mheath | ibot is just perl, right? |
| 17:16.24 | Jayce^ | yes |
| 17:16.24 | mheath | Perl works on Debian GNU/Hurd. |
| 17:16.24 | mheath | ibot would work. |
| 17:16.26 | mheath | :) |
| 17:16.27 | calvarez | loool |
| 17:16.29 | calvarez | lag |
| 17:16.49 | Jayce^ | no mheath that's Perl/Debian/GNU/Hurd get it right |
| 17:17.22 | mheath | Jayce^: Actually, I don't understand why it's not "Debian GNU" and instead "Debian GNU/Hurd" |
| 17:17.27 | calvarez | hmm, how would you compare linux kernel and GNU/Hurd? |
| 17:17.52 | findlay | a penguin versus a bunch of gnus? |
| 17:17.54 | mheath | calvarez: Linux is more production ready, and has a lot more drivers. |
| 17:17.56 | mheath | Far stabler |
| 17:18.05 | mheath | But the structure is completely different |
| 17:18.07 | calvarez | that's what I thought |
| 17:18.08 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-69b81e5f04f4317d) |
| 17:18.15 | mheath | Hurd, infact, is not comparable to Linux. |
| 17:18.21 | mheath | Hurd is not any kind of a kernel at all. |
| 17:18.26 | mheath | Mach is the GNU equivelent to Linux |
| 17:18.33 | goozbach | heaven forbid if you dare make any comparison around mheath |
| 17:18.42 | findlay | the gnus might gang up on the penguin, but the penguin probably has superior processing sk1llz |
| 17:18.50 | calvarez | mmm, what's the relationship between mach and hurd? |
| 17:19.02 | mheath | goozbach: just not "Hurd vs. Linux" or "vi vs emacs" :-) |
| 17:19.16 | calvarez | someone told me vi was better |
| 17:19.20 | calvarez | than emacs |
| 17:19.22 | emcnabb | it's too bad mheath is ignoring me, otherwise we could talk about the Hurd some more |
| 17:19.23 | calvarez | ;) |
| 17:19.34 | calvarez | j/k |
| 17:19.41 | mheath | Mach is a microkernel. It provides basic memory paging, interprocess communication, and the core device driver framework |
| 17:19.45 | scothoser | It's easy to compare the two, as long as you use extreme biases to make your points. ^_^ You can compare anything.. Haven't you learned that from your friendly neighborhood politician? ^_^ |
| 17:20.00 | redbeard1 | i don't suppose tristan rhodes hangs out in here, does he? |
| 17:20.16 | calvarez | ~find tristan rhodes |
| 17:20.20 | elg | scothoser: you mean the internet isn't really a series of tubes? |
| 17:20.27 | mheath | Hurd, by hooking onto the Mach, provides the core process control and security features necessary for multiuser support, provides the actual drivers/translaters |
| 17:20.32 | calvarez | argh |
| 17:21.09 | scothoser | elg: Of course it is! It's just that the tubes are smaller than first thought.. And now bought by Google. ^_^ |
| 17:21.23 | calvarez | elg, I always thought the internet had one huge building-sized ethernet HUB somewhere |
| 17:21.53 | mheath | haha |
| 17:21.55 | elg | calvarez: nope, definitely a series of tubes in a dumptruck |
| 17:21.59 | mheath | My billion port HUB. |
| 17:22.08 | calvarez | ;) |
| 17:22.22 | mheath | My web server ran GNU for a while |
| 17:22.43 | calvarez | my computer runs linux |
| 17:23.00 | calvarez | not GNU/Linux, but Linux |
| 17:23.19 | levi | elg: Wait, wait... I thought that dump trunks were explicitly not involved! |
| 17:23.19 | mheath | calvarez: which is GNU minus mach and Hurd :) |
| 17:23.19 | elg | my computer runs circles |
| 17:23.21 | elg | around yours |
| 17:23.32 | mheath | calvarez: OK, I'll just take everything thats GNU way then |
| 17:23.33 | elg | levi: honestly I can't remember if it was not a truck and was tubes, or not tubes and was a truck |
| 17:24.37 | elg | shows you how much I have to learn about the internet |
| 17:24.40 | calvarez | elg, yea, trying to unstick the wedgie than mine gave it :p :) |
| 17:25.33 | levi | elg: C'mon, you gotta know the latest internet metaphors. |
| 17:25.34 | scothoser | elg: Where did you get the legs for your computer? That would be awesome, if it could also run straight instead of just in circles. ^_^ |
| 17:25.34 | mheath | to name a few :) |
| 17:25.34 | calvarez | mheath, I just decided to purposedly leave the "GNU/" out of "GNU/Linux" as a protest against the FSF |
| 17:25.46 | elg | my computer runs Debian Iceweasel/Linux |
| 17:25.46 | levi | Yay for the ice weasels! |
| 17:26.18 | elg | GNU/Xorg/Iceweasel/Apache/OpenLDAP/Postfix/Dovecot/Ruby on Rails/ejabberd/Linux |
| 17:26.31 | elg | hope I didn't leave any out |
| 17:26.41 | mheath | elg: GNU and Linux are the core. |
| 17:26.54 | elg | Linux is the core. |
| 17:26.56 | mheath | None of those others will run without Linux, or without GNU Libc |
| 17:27.02 | elg | GNU is around the core |
| 17:27.03 | herlo | ~seen fozzmoo |
| 17:27.18 | ibot | fozzmoo <n=fozz@166.70.238.250> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 1h 2m 34s ago, saying: 'goozbach: SoN CO Run 11/15-11/18'. |
| 17:27.18 | elg | The others are around that |
| 17:27.18 | elg | it's like concentric circles |
| 17:27.32 | mheath | elg: Yes, but GNU and Linux are the requirements. :) |
| 17:27.37 | mheath | Everything else is optional |
| 17:27.41 | elg | nonsense |
| 17:27.50 | elg | I can't run a webserver without a webserver. the webserver isn't optional |
| 17:28.12 | mheath | elg: no, you can't, but my point was that you can run your computer, period, without GNU |
| 17:28.13 | redbeard1 | ~seen tristanbob |
| 17:28.16 | ibot | tristanbob is currently on #ubuntu-utah (3d 4h 19m 43s) #utah (3d 4h 19m 43s). Has said a total of 22 messages. Is idling for 1h 28m 19s, last said: 'SB1-Work: ok, now I have a chicken and egg problem. I try to register the channel, and it says I need OPs. I try to get OPs, but I need to register the channel first'. |
| 17:28.17 | mheath | You can not startup your computer without GNU |
| 17:28.24 | mheath | you can't even init=/bin/bash |
| 17:28.30 | elg | sure, I can run it on a regular UNIX or Windows |
| 17:28.38 | mheath2 | elg: I run a webserver without a webserver |
| 17:28.43 | mheath | elg: bah, thats beside the point :P |
| 17:29.01 | elg | you can run GNU on other than linux |
| 17:29.04 | elg | no? |
| 17:29.23 | elg | like a traditional UNIX or BSD or Hurd |
| 17:29.29 | elg | but you don't call it GNU/Solaris |
| 17:29.34 | elg | or GNU/FreeBSD |
| 17:29.35 | mheath | The GNU utilities. You can not use GNU Libc. |
| 17:29.40 | mheath | There is a GNU/FreeBSD. |
| 17:29.44 | mheath | And a GNU/Solaris |
| 17:30.02 | elg | ah, so it's the libs |
| 17:30.48 | elg | what happens when you use dietlibc? is it dietlibc/Linux? |
| 17:30.53 | mheath | elg: so, hold on... |
| 17:30.56 | mheath | On this system |
| 17:30.57 | *** join/#utah mrpull-w (n=mrpull@166.192.74.88) |
| 17:30.59 | mheath | FreeBSD heath.boldlygoingnowhere.org 6.1-RELEASE FreeBSD 6.1-RELEASE #0: Sun May 7 04:32:43 UTC 2006 root@opus.cse.buffalo.edu:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/GENERIC i386 |
| 17:31.05 | mheath | I'm not running FreeBSD, right? |
| 17:31.10 | mheath | I'm running "The FreeBSD kernel" |
| 17:31.18 | Newsome | WTF cares? |
| 17:31.27 | mheath | There is no such thing as "The FreeBSD operatings system", because the kernel is the only thing that matters at all? |
| 17:31.46 | mrpull-w | freebsd is a distro |
| 17:32.08 | mheath2 | Newsome: never doubt mheath |
| 17:32.15 | elg | operating system: that which operates the hardware |
| 17:32.31 | Newsome | how come your uname doesn't display that you're running GNU/FreeGNUBGNUSGNUDGNU ? |
| 17:32.31 | elg | everything else: along for the ride |
| 17:33.00 | mheath | elg: So, your saying then, that this is not properly called FreeBSD, this entire system is just "The FreeBSD kernel"? |
| 17:33.13 | elg | no, I'm saying call it FreeBSD |
| 17:33.15 | mheath | That is the proper title for the operating system I am running? |
| 17:33.25 | mheath | elg: OK, how about this then |
| 17:33.25 | elg | I think you've got the argument topsy turvy |
| 17:33.33 | mheath2 | elg: you're wrong |
| 17:33.38 | mheath2 | you're always wrong |
| 17:33.57 | elg | true, but that's irrelevant |
| 17:34.02 | mheath | What about "GNU"? I'm not talking about GNU/Linux or anything like that, I'm just talking about GNU. What the FSF designates as, and has made releases of, "The GNU Operating System"? |
| 17:34.18 | mheath | Do you agree that GNU is the correct term? |
| 17:34.37 | elg | no |
| 17:34.48 | mheath | elg: what makes it different than FreeBSD then? |
| 17:34.58 | elg | does this GNU thing operate the hardware? If not it's just a very good and useful library |
| 17:35.08 | mheath | elg: what would you call it then? |
| 17:35.27 | mheathjr | Linux |
| 17:35.29 | elg | Linux operating system, with GNU libc, apache, ruby on rails, bash, etc. etc. |
| 17:35.38 | mheath | elg: NO! I am not talking about GNU/Linux! |
| 17:35.41 | mheath | NOT with LInux |
| 17:35.44 | mheathjr | Linux |
| 17:35.45 | mheath | The GNU Operating system. www.gnu.org |
| 17:35.52 | elg | oh you mean hurd |
| 17:35.59 | elg | go ahead and call it gnu, that's fine with me |
| 17:36.02 | goozbach | hehe |
| 17:36.05 | mheath | elg: why call it hurd? Hurd has nothing to do with the hardware, anymore than Libc does. |
| 17:36.13 | elg | so call it mach |
| 17:36.22 | Newsome | and, it can't run without a hard drive, so you might as well call it GNU/Hurd/Seagate |
| 17:36.31 | mheathjr | elg: gnu you need to me explaining again! |
| 17:36.57 | Newsome | oh, and it probably needs a monitor: GNU/Hurd/Seagate/Panasonic |
| 17:36.59 | mheathjr | Newsome: don't forget the case |
| 17:37.03 | mrpull-w | what is the windows kernel called? |
| 17:37.03 | elg | or, go to the other extreme and call it by the distro name |
| 17:37.24 | levi | mrpull-w: NT |
| 17:37.27 | elg | that analogizes with windows xp, windows 2000, windows 2003 server, etc. all of which are based on an NT kernel |
| 17:37.30 | mheath | elg: So, its OK that the GNU operating system is called GNU, and it's OK that the FreeBSD operating system is called FreeBSD? |
| 17:37.52 | elg | sure, they can pick whatever name they like |
| 17:38.07 | mheath | And you believe that "FreeBSD" reflects all of FreeBSD, not just "The FreeBSD Kernel"? |
| 17:38.09 | Newsome | GNU/Hurd/Seagate/Panasonic/Logitech/Intel/`rpm -qa` |
| 17:38.28 | elg | the freebsd distro, sure |
| 17:38.47 | mrpull-w | yes. freebsd is the whole distro. |
| 17:38.58 | elg | I run Debian. Debian titles itself Debian GNU/Linux, so if I'm in a pedantic mood I might type that out |
| 17:39.16 | mheath | OK. And you already said earlier that, if I replaced FreeBSD's ls with gnuls, that doesn't make it worthy to suddenly be called GNU/FreeBSD |
| 17:39.39 | levi | One of the nice things about free software is that, if you don't like the name, you can call your version of it whatever you'd like! |
| 17:39.52 | mheath | What makes replacing Mach in GNU so much more worthy to completely drop the name of the distro? |
| 17:39.54 | levi | mheath: Are you trying to restrict my freedom to call my OS Linux? |
| 17:40.09 | mrpull-w | i propose we call it freeweasel |
| 17:40.11 | elg | mmm, I'm looking forward to Waterbuffalo/Linux |
| 17:40.34 | levi | mheath: Or, more specifically, my freedom to not use the name 'GNU' in my OSs name? |
| 17:40.41 | elg | ibot: lol |
| 17:40.45 | ibot | i heard lol is stands for Laughs Out Loud. It is grammatically incorrect to use LOL in the first person; use 'heh' or 'haha' instead. If you want to use LOL, do '/me lol' instead. |
| 17:40.45 | mheath | ibot: that query was like...20 minutes ago. |
| 17:41.00 | elg | no ibot, that was a command |
| 17:41.06 | elg | so my grammatical usage was correct |
| 17:42.42 | mheath | So it's correct to take a software distribution, change one package, and not acknolwedge at all that what is left is based a lot on the original distro? Thats ethical |
| 17:42.46 | mheath | ? |
| 17:43.07 | calvarez | mheath, it's ethical if it is GNU |
| 17:43.12 | elg | ibot: no, lol stands for Laughing Out Loud. It is grammatically incorrect to use LOL in the third person; use 'is laughing out loud' instead. If you want to use LOL, first see a shrink. |
| 17:43.13 | ibot | elg: what are you talking about? |
| 17:43.47 | calvarez | ibot: screw you |
| 17:43.48 | ibot | ACTION asks you to bend over |
| 17:43.51 | elg | mheath: not only ethical, but the only solution in the mozilla case |
| 17:43.53 | calvarez | haaaahahaha |
| 17:44.08 | levi | mheath: Sometimes it is. You and RMS are just going to have to deal with it. |
| 17:44.10 | calvarez | meh, the iceweasel thing is silly |
| 17:44.13 | mheath | Completely ignoring the functions of the packages, the vast majority of the packages you have left are all GNU packages. It is still a distribution entirely of GNU packages, except for one. |
| 17:44.41 | levi | mheath: Do you not realize how full of crap that last statement was? |
| 17:44.56 | mheath | levi: I'm not talking about a completed distro. |
| 17:44.57 | calvarez | ibot: screw you |
| 17:44.58 | ibot | ACTION asks you to bend over |
| 17:45.17 | elg | Look, if you want to name your distro The distro with a bunch of GNU tools, GNU libc, a Linux kernel, Apache, Xorg, GNOME, KDE, etc. |
| 17:45.19 | levi | mheath: You're talking about some specially constructed entity that only exists in your mind, apparently. |
| 17:45.20 | elg | you're welcome too |
| 17:45.48 | elg | sure the GNU tools and libs are important. Lots of things are important in a distribution |
| 17:46.06 | mheathjr | mheath: are you a member of the FSF? |
| 17:46.22 | levi | mheath: The fact is, I can name a distribution whatever I'd like to unless there's a specific license clause that forbids it, which I believe would be against the free software guidelines. |
| 17:46.25 | mheath | levi: no, I'm talking about a very slightly modified version of the GNU software distribution which everyone seems to think is OK to not even acknowledge that it's even BASED on the GNU software distribution |
| 17:46.27 | elg | most newbies can care less about libc or bash, to them the "operating system" is GNOME or KDE |
| 17:46.35 | elg | that doesn't mean that's what the OS really is |
| 17:46.48 | levi | mheath: People acknowledge that it is, they just didn't include GNU in the name. |
| 17:46.51 | mheath | elg: In which case, GNOME is part of the GNU operating system, too ;-) |
| 17:47.01 | elg | KDE isn't |
| 17:47.13 | elg | so is kubuntu not GNU/Linux then? |
| 17:47.17 | goozbach | let's see, from keyboard to processor: |
| 17:47.50 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@65.89.234.66) |
| 17:48.11 | levi | mheath: Arguing simultaneously that people should have freedom to do as they wish with software and that they should be forced to follow some naming convention is logically inconsistent. You should stop, because it makes you look foolish. |
| 17:48.23 | mrpull-w | wahoo... we are having or baby in 45 minutes |
| 17:48.34 | elg | mrpull-w: congrats! |
| 17:48.36 | goozbach | dell/dell/XFCE/xterm/bash/pts/gnulibc/linux/intel |
| 17:48.40 | levi | mrpull-w: What are you doing here then?! Congrats. :) |
| 17:48.44 | mheath | mrpull-w: and your in IRC? |
| 17:48.46 | mheath | :P |
| 17:48.48 | elg | the hospital have wireless? |
| 17:48.52 | mheath | Congrats though :) |
| 17:48.56 | elg | c section? |
| 17:48.58 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 17:49.01 | elg | transporter? |
| 17:49.13 | mheath | hah |
| 17:50.05 | mheath | levi: See, I always took "GNU/Linux" as an abbreviation for "The GNU Operating System with the Linux Kernel" |
| 17:50.15 | elg | there you go again |
| 17:50.15 | mheath | I believe thats fair. Thats just my opinion, though. |
| 17:50.27 | elg | GNU software distribution |
| 17:51.48 | elg | Like levi said, nobody disacknowledges the existence or importance of GNU in a distro |
| 17:52.16 | elg | nor do they deny the importance of Xorg, Apache, etc. many of which are not affiliated with GNU |
| 17:52.30 | scothoser | mheath: Wouldn't that depend entirely on your definition of an operating system? Is the operating system independent of the kernel, or the user interface? |
| 17:52.32 | elg | to start naming them in the name is madness |
| 17:52.38 | graphyx | anyone know how to revise comments left for an auction on ebay? |
| 17:52.49 | elg | scothoser: see, the OS is that part which runs GNU software |
| 17:52.56 | mheath | scothoser: Indeed. And I think it is differing definitions of operating system that cause this argument |
| 17:53.09 | graphyx | I bought a cell phone, it arrived fine, but when we went to activate it, it was for another carrier instead of the one advertized.. |
| 17:53.21 | scothoser | graphyx: what comments are you looking to change? Is it the feedback? |
| 17:53.26 | graphyx | I left good feedback, but I might need to change it. |
| 17:53.29 | elg | graphyx: don't leave feedback until it's done |
| 17:53.30 | graphyx | yeah feedback |
| 17:53.37 | graphyx | elg: Too late for that one now.. |
| 17:53.51 | scothoser | graphyx: you can't, once you have left feedback it's static. You can leave a follow up comment, though. |
| 17:53.58 | graphyx | Ok. |
| 17:54.09 | scothoser | Through the Site Map, there should be a link. If not, check in the Feedback Forum. |
| 17:54.14 | graphyx | They have a good rating and other cell phones, so I think that they may make good on it. |
| 17:55.02 | mheath | hmm, I'm going to finally clean off this keyboard today, I think |
| 17:55.26 | scothoser | Most sellers I know generally will. It's those that have a lot of feedback comments that are unscored that I would worry about... |
| 17:55.46 | graphyx | true. |
| 17:55.53 | graphyx | This person has a lot of good comments. |
| 17:56.09 | graphyx | And another phone up on auction that is supposedly the correct one. |
| 17:56.12 | graphyx | without any bids on it. |
| 17:56.23 | graphyx | So they could just do a cross shipping thing. |
| 17:57.15 | scothoser | True.. |
| 17:57.53 | graphyx | Thought I would want them to confirm it was for the right company. |
| 17:57.58 | graphyx | prior to shipping it. |
| 17:57.59 | graphyx | ;) |
| 17:58.16 | scothoser | Understandable. ^_^ |
| 17:58.20 | scothoser | Are they a powerseller? |
| 17:58.36 | graphyx | fxulla on ebay. |
| 17:58.47 | *** join/#utah mrpull-w (n=mrpull@166.192.101.223) |
| 17:59.27 | graphyx | not a powerseller from what I can see. |
| 17:59.36 | scothoser | Hmm. I don't know the name, so that's a good sign. I generally remember the really bad sellers. ^_^ Let me see if I can recognize them.... |
| 17:59.48 | graphyx | Ok. |
| 18:00.04 | graphyx | scothoser: how come you so familiar with the ebay sellers? |
| 18:00.43 | elg | -lart emcnabb |
| 18:00.50 | scothoser | I used to be a supervisor over the Powerseller Support team at eBay. ^_^ I worked there at eBay for 3 years. |
| 18:01.10 | scothoser | Before I started here at the U. eBay paid for my Masters degree. ^_^ |
| 18:01.20 | graphyx | scothoser: Ok. |
| 18:01.25 | graphyx | cool. |
| 18:01.29 | graphyx | makes sense I guess. |
| 18:02.13 | emcnabb | ibot: thanks! |
| 18:02.13 | ibot | sure thing, emcnabb |
| 18:02.39 | graphyx | What did ibot do? |
| 18:02.52 | graphyx | That was brac that removed debian from your system. |
| 18:03.14 | emcnabb | oh, yeah |
| 18:03.16 | emcnabb | brac: thanks |
| 18:03.29 | emcnabb | so ungrateful |
| 18:14.54 | *** join/#utah dilvie (n=chatzill@c-67-166-126-133.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 18:22.55 | *** join/#utah bzob_l (n=bzob_l@nat.myfamilyinc.com) |
| 18:26.47 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-69b81e5f04f4317d) |
| 18:27.36 | SB1-Work | levi mheath: Are you trying to restrict my freedom to call my OS Linux? <--- best line ever |
| 18:33.30 | findlay | I hereby call levi's OS levix |
| 18:33.56 | dilvie | http://www.myspace.com/freeutah |
| 18:35.33 | SB1-Work | So yeah, that link being a link I would actually click, despite it being at myspace.com |
| 18:35.47 | SB1-Work | I opened it, then realized that I had blocked myspace.com |
| 18:37.38 | *** join/#utah calvarez (i=calvarez@lawn-128-61-124-152.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 18:37.38 | levi | dilvie: Is he affiliated with a party? Doesn't look like it's mentioned on the page. |
| 18:38.41 | dilvie | he is me |
| 18:39.23 | dilvie | libertarian party |
| 18:39.48 | dilvie | officially, but I'm literally right on the border between libertarian and democrat, philosophically. |
| 18:40.11 | dilvie | There's already a strong democrat running, though. |
| 18:40.22 | levi | Oh, heh. |
| 18:40.40 | dilvie | I've considered running as a republican |
| 18:41.08 | dilvie | because republicans once stood for smaller government, state powers, and fiscal responsibility |
| 18:41.23 | dilvie | but that's not the way the GOP is leaning these days |
| 18:41.38 | levi | No indeed. |
| 18:46.16 | SB1-Work | So yeah, postfix has a lot of documentation included. |
| 18:46.30 | dilvie | it better |
| 18:46.32 | dilvie | it's ancient |
| 18:46.42 | dilvie | plenty of time for docs to get written |
| 18:47.00 | SB1-Work | Indeed |
| 18:47.09 | SB1-Work | Now it's just a matter of finding what I need to read. |
| 18:49.08 | dilvie | last chance to register |
| 18:49.09 | dilvie | http://www.clerk.slco.org/elections/html/satellite_gen.htm |
| 18:49.17 | dilvie | mail-in deadline is passed |
| 18:52.47 | SB1-Work | Hmm, I should take a lunch and head down to the clerk's office (I'm four blocks away from the city gov't building) |
| 18:52.53 | SB1-Work | I mailed in my registration, but never got my card. |
| 18:54.02 | SB1-Work | I think I will. bbl. |
| 19:05.07 | findlay | dilvie: what office? |
| 19:07.51 | dilvie | state house |
| 19:08.02 | dilvie | district 24 |
| 19:08.20 | dilvie | oh, you mean location? |
| 19:08.21 | dilvie | eheh |
| 19:08.29 | findlay | like people in this state care about politics anyway |
| 19:08.42 | dilvie | the locations are listed on that page |
| 19:08.58 | dilvie | people do care, they just don't believe that they have a voice |
| 19:09.06 | findlay | (: |
| 19:09.57 | findlay | but now everybody's really disenfranchised because of those stupid voting machines |
| 19:09.59 | dilvie | people who support republicans figure that the republican will win anyway, so why bother, and people who support democrats or independents figure they're going to lose anyway, so why bother |
| 19:10.28 | fozzmoo | dilvie: The conservative "arm" of the GOP is still where you want to be. |
| 19:10.43 | fozzmoo | The GOP needs more active conservatives to bring the party back to where it was, say, 20 years ago. |
| 19:10.52 | dilvie | fozzmoo: politically, you're probably right |
| 19:11.06 | fozzmoo | You could run as a constitutional candidate... but that's just an exercise in futility. :) |
| 19:11.11 | dilvie | fozzmoo: but I would piss off the republican party. ;) |
| 19:12.14 | dilvie | utah republicans tend to be a lot less liberal on social issues than I am |
| 19:13.04 | findlay | the Utah republican party disgusts me in general |
| 19:13.12 | beandog | http://www.cnn.com/ |
| 19:13.28 | dilvie | I might have stood a chance at winning though if I ran republican this year and got past the primaries |
| 19:14.09 | findlay | that would be awesome |
| 19:14.21 | findlay | then you could represent #utah in the house as well |
| 19:14.30 | findlay | geek rights! |
| 19:14.59 | fozzmoo | dilvie: Yeah, social issues are a weird thing in the GOP. |
| 19:15.40 | fozzmoo | I think you'll find quite a diversity of perspectives when it comes to social issues in the GOP. |
| 19:16.08 | fozzmoo | When it comes to fiscal issues, national security, and governmental policy, though, I'd say the party is fairly monolithic. |
| 19:16.28 | dilvie | fozzmoo: in the party in general, I might agree, but looking at utah legislator's voting records, I don't see a lot of diversity there. |
| 19:16.43 | SB1-Work | Not really |
| 19:17.48 | dilvie | seems to me the GOP is willing to stomp all over the constitution in order to appear tough on crime, tough on drugs, and generally god-fearing |
| 19:18.20 | SB1-Work | I actually saw Ashdown the other day. He was quite literally standing on the side of the road with his family, surrounded in signs, and waving as people drove by |
| 19:18.39 | dilvie | what they end up doing is create a lot of very unfortunate unintended consequences, where individual rights get trampled for no good reason |
| 19:18.41 | SB1-Work | Just standing there for an hour or two, on 33rd south and maybe 1200 E |
| 19:18.53 | dilvie | SB1: haha, cool. |
| 19:19.05 | SB1-Work | It was, actually |
| 19:19.37 | SB1-Work | Talk about your low budget campaign, heh. |
| 19:21.14 | mheath | wow, voice recognition in vista is kind cool |
| 19:21.19 | mheath | though still a bit innacurate |
| 19:21.23 | mheath | complete desktop control now |
| 19:22.23 | dilvie | 655,000 Iraqi deaths |
| 19:22.35 | dilvie | how cool is war? |
| 19:22.54 | findlay | it's probably pretty hot in Iraq |
| 19:24.13 | fozzmoo | SB1-Work: Honk n waves are a common campaign tactic- especially in the last days. |
| 19:24.25 | fozzmoo | Or shoudl that be Latter Days? :) |
| 19:24.41 | SB1-Work | haha |
| 19:24.51 | SB1-Work | Well either way, you don't see Hatch doing that. |
| 19:24.52 | fozzmoo | I think Pete would be a republican if this weren't Utah. :) |
| 19:26.17 | mheath | "Start Solitaire" |
| 19:26.26 | mheath | "Select 9. 2." |
| 19:27.18 | levi | I really don't see the appeal of talking to a computer. |
| 19:27.46 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@hfugal.nmsu.edu) |
| 19:27.48 | SB1-Work | yeah, I'm pretty sure the novelty will wear off quickly |
| 19:28.24 | mheath | haha, it understands "Capital M as in Mary" |
| 19:28.28 | mheath | thats cool |
| 19:29.27 | levi | I played with voice control on a Mac for all of a minute or so before I got bored with it. |
| 19:30.01 | fozzmoo | "Format See Colon, Enter." |
| 19:30.24 | SB1-Work | Haha |
| 19:30.37 | SB1-Work | We used OSX's Automator to read webpages off verbally |
| 19:30.48 | SB1-Work | One kid got the idea to have it read chuck norris facts |
| 19:31.13 | *** join/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-09dc48be2cd0bd8a) |
| 19:32.37 | mheath | "Press y three times" |
| 19:32.48 | mheath | "Press y as in yoke three times" |
| 19:34.02 | *** join/#utah neybar (n=jalance@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 19:34.16 | SB1-Work | Or, you could, you know |
| 19:34.21 | SB1-Work | Press y three times |
| 19:35.56 | levi | When the computer can read my subvocalized thoughts with 100% accuracy, then I might be interested in using that kind of interface. |
| 19:36.22 | levi | The people who work on this stuff must have private offices or something. |
| 19:36.27 | mheath | This is actualy fairly accurate |
| 19:36.43 | mheath | makes me wonder if that video of this detecting "Dear Mom" as "dear aunt" was fake |
| 19:36.44 | levi | Fairly accurate isn't good enough. |
| 19:36.51 | mheath | I sometimes have to repeat myself, but it never makes mistakes that bad |
| 19:36.59 | mheath | and it has a really good, easy to use way of correcting errors |
| 19:39.53 | findlay | levi: what about Star Trek style interfaces? |
| 19:40.02 | dilvie | http://www.utrave.org/showthread.php?t=32631 <-- why I don't support drug prohibition |
| 19:40.23 | mheath | I'm going to IRC with voice recognition |
| 19:41.40 | amcnabb | mheath, I can only see voice interfaces being useful for dictating letters, etc. |
| 19:42.05 | amcnabb | When I'm talking to roommates (who are more or less human), I prefer to write code on a whiteboard than to try to say it out loud. |
| 19:42.15 | amcnabb | Spoken English just doesn't get the idea across. |
| 19:42.53 | *** join/#utah mheath[laptop] (n=mheath@c-67-182-231-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 19:42.54 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 19:43.08 | harleypig | Anyone know how to get my kicker back? |
| 19:43.15 | harleypig | It's disappeared and I can't find it. |
| 19:43.23 | findlay | ~find kick |
| 19:43.42 | findlay | heh, that might even be useful somehow |
| 19:43.47 | harleypig | heh |
| 19:45.33 | mheath[laptop] | test |
| 19:47.11 | harleypig | fail |
| 19:50.11 | findlay | if you wanted to contracted we are not would you do: we'ren't |
| 19:50.36 | findlay | I'm'n't |
| 19:50.46 | findlay | you're'n't |
| 19:50.50 | findlay | whatever |
| 19:52.16 | mheath[laptop] | x-chat does not support voice recognicion so I have to spell out everything |
| 19:52.49 | mheath | which is, rather, a waste of time |
| 19:52.55 | mheath | I can't get it to input anything on the start menu either |
| 19:53.01 | mheath | IT types it into the search box there |
| 19:57.00 | ^Migs^ | haha: http://www.qdb.us/69719 |
| 19:58.07 | mheath[laptop] | ~lart ^Migs^ |
| 20:01.15 | redbeard1 | what the... did i just walk into a food fight? |
| 20:01.36 | mheath[laptop] | you were lartd through MS voice recognition, ^Migs^ |
| 20:02.15 | ^Migs^ | should I be honored? |
| 20:02.36 | findlay | I wouldn't mind eating a whole pumpkin pie right now |
| 20:03.03 | mheath[laptop] | I need a IRC client that supports this. |
| 20:03.33 | mheath[laptop] | This is tedious. |
| 20:03.46 | mheath[laptop] | ^Migs^, yes. |
| 20:05.20 | ^Migs^ | I get Thursday and Friday, omgomgzomg |
| 20:05.21 | mheath[laptop] | I went through the trouble of spelling that lart out. |
| 20:05.26 | findlay | tilde ell aa arr tee space emm ach ee aa tee ach |
| 20:05.34 | mheath[laptop] | no |
| 20:05.57 | mheath[laptop] | it doesn't recognize the text entry box as a text entry box, because its GTK |
| 20:05.57 | *** part/#utah herlo (n=herlo@class1-nat.gurulabs.com) |
| 20:06.14 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=herlo@class1-nat.gurulabs.com) |
| 20:06.19 | findlay | I should write a perl module that translates a string into a "spelled out" string |
| 20:06.23 | findlay | then I'd be cool |
| 20:06.42 | ^Migs^ | and lots of hot women would appear on your doorstep |
| 20:06.51 | mheath[laptop] | So I can't even just say the letters, I have to say "Press Tilde. Press l. Press A. Press R. Press T. Press space. Press Shift 6. Press Tab. Press Enter" |
| 20:07.33 | ^Migs^ | maybe blind people just shouldn't use computers |
| 20:07.45 | ^Migs^ | no, that's dumb |
| 20:07.56 | ^Migs^ | I guess it would be for paraplegics actually |
| 20:11.09 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-09dc48be2cd0bd8a) |
| 20:15.20 | SB1-Work | here, check this out |
| 20:15.26 | SB1-Work | ~lart ^Migs^ |
| 20:15.45 | mheath | HOLY CRAP |
| 20:15.49 | mheath | THIS MADE MY DAY |
| 20:15.52 | scothoser | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:16.09 | mheath | An envelope from the MCRD San Diego Finance Office addressed to PFC Michael Heath |
| 20:16.11 | mheath | w000000t |
| 20:16.14 | mheath | I've been waiting for this for ages |
| 20:18.03 | mheath | United States Treasury check :) |
| 20:18.54 | SB1-Work | Awesome |
| 20:19.16 | SB1-Work | This computer I'm fixing has three rootkits, two backdoor'd trojans (yes, really), and a good six viruses |
| 20:19.39 | mheath | I still got screwed, money wise, but I'm happier now |
| 20:19.42 | mheath | I HAVE MONEY! |
| 20:25.06 | mheath | scothoser: am I elligible for that yet? :P |
| 20:26.24 | scothoser | It's just for faculty and staff.. You can get the educational discounts, but would still be charged sales tax. |
| 20:28.13 | findlay | ~tax mheath |
| 20:32.26 | Jayce^ | scothoser, you suck :) |
| 20:32.32 | Jayce^ | just thought I'd mention that |
| 20:34.23 | SB1-Work | Does anyone know of a livecd that has support for the recent NTFS writing abilities? |
| 20:34.31 | SB1-Work | Got a few rootkits here that need to die... |
| 20:36.28 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp08.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 20:36.31 | mheath | scothoser: I can go onto Hill AFB (or even Fort Douglas PX, which has Ipods) and get both discounts and no sales tax :) |
| 20:36.37 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@000-242-432.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 20:36.51 | Jayce^ | mheath, but then you get surcharge |
| 20:37.07 | Jayce^ | still, usually better than most other places |
| 20:37.07 | mheath | Jayce^: surcharge? How so? |
| 20:37.31 | Jayce^ | mheath, military px system don't do taxes, true, but they have a surcharge system that does add some cost... |
| 20:37.41 | mheath | No, they don't. |
| 20:38.04 | mheath | they increase the prices to make a profit and pay their employees, just like any business does. |
| 20:38.06 | Jayce^ | if they have an item, it's normally a better deal on base, but in the case of a tax free sale, where you also get a discount on the main price, it'll be better at the school |
| 20:38.19 | Jayce^ | mheath, no, the military controls the surcharge levels |
| 20:38.21 | mheath | Jayce^: apple has military discounts, too |
| 20:38.23 | Jayce^ | they have for years |
| 20:38.36 | mheath | Jayce^: just asked my dad, and he says no |
| 20:38.37 | Jayce^ | mheath, I'm aware of that... I grew up on bases. |
| 20:38.46 | mheath | He's been shopping exclusively on military bases for 40 years. |
| 20:39.00 | mheath | Jayce^: what kind of base were you on, though? |
| 20:39.11 | scothoser | Jayce^: I'll not tell you what I was planning on getting, then... redbeard1 is already rather upset with me for the system I have planned for personal use.. My work Mac Pro is also rather impressive, when it finally get's ordered. |
| 20:39.20 | mheath | PX system on Air Force and Army bases (Hill AFB and Ft Douglas) is run completley seperate from Navy/Marine Corps/Coast Guard |
| 20:40.21 | redbeard1 | ~brulee scothoser |
| 20:40.24 | ibot | ACTION whisks scothoser with eggs and cream, and bakes at 350F before sprinkling with sugar and torching |
| 20:40.25 | Jayce^ | mheath, navy, AF, army... |
| 20:40.29 | Jayce^ | they are all right by each other wher eI grew up |
| 20:41.00 | Jayce^ | scothoser, yeah, I'll have my pb for another year before I get a new one probably |
| 20:42.50 | scothoser | I haven't been to a Military PX in ages.. since my Military ID expired... Unfortunately that was before my mission to Germany. |
| 20:43.50 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 20:43.53 | scothoser | talk about "water, water everywhere, and not a drop to drink". |
| 20:43.54 | harleypig | http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/10/11/plane.crash/index.html |
| 20:44.00 | mheath | bah, I wanted to buy some stuff, and I have money now...but I really should put this in savings for college... |
| 20:44.14 | mheath | harleypig: I lack a web browser ATM, care to give a synapsis? |
| 20:44.16 | harleypig | mheath: You cna give it to me |
| 20:44.27 | harleypig | A small airplane crashed into a 50-story residential building on Manhattan's East Side on Wednesday, killing at least two people, the New York City Fire Department and New York City Police Department said. |
| 20:44.50 | mheath | bah, I gurantee you it was an accident |
| 20:45.03 | mheath | killing 2 people isn't as bad as that could have been, too... |
| 20:45.53 | emcnabb | Sweet... I'm getting a quad core processor in the next few days |
| 20:46.15 | scothoser | Man, of all the places for that to happen.. It had to be New York. I'm getting flashbacks from 5 years ago, going to Ancient Greek and hearing about the two towers.. |
| 20:46.16 | Jayce^ | emcnabb, niiice |
| 20:46.52 | emcnabb | now if it was only for my home system :-) |
| 20:47.00 | harleypig | People on the tv looked very scared. |
| 20:47.22 | graphyx | BTW, it's october. 11 !!!!! |
| 20:47.26 | graphyx | IT can't be a coincidence.. |
| 20:47.32 | graphyx | 9/11 10/11 |
| 20:47.43 | graphyx | 5 years from now we need to be on the watch for 11/11 !!!! |
| 20:47.46 | graphyx | IT's a conspiricy! |
| 20:47.55 | emcnabb | ~lart graphyx |
| 20:47.59 | SB1-Work | It's people going "TERRORISM NOOOOOOOOO" |
| 20:48.00 | graphyx | That would be on the day 11/11/11!!!!! |
| 20:48.02 | SB1-Work | And little else |
| 20:48.18 | graphyx | It's a Bush conspiricy. |
| 20:48.30 | graphyx | They are trying to remind people of the attack to drum up political numbers. |
| 20:48.35 | emcnabb | Bush sucks |
| 20:48.38 | emcnabb | moving on... |
| 20:49.02 | graphyx | so the tampered with an airplane to cause it to crash into a major city to remind people of terrorism to get them to support the war. |
| 20:49.09 | graphyx | because the elections are coming. |
| 20:49.23 | harleypig | wait ... 9/11/01 ... 10/11/06 ... we're safe until 11/11/11 |
| 20:49.36 | graphyx | harleypig: Yeah. That's right. |
| 20:49.53 | harleypig | erp ... didn't notice yours ... 5 years between attacks. |
| 20:50.02 | SB1-Work | If you call it an "attack". |
| 20:50.10 | graphyx | 9/11/01 thousands died 10/11/06 2 people died 11/11/11 a couple people will sprain their ankles simultaneously as a plane lands. |
| 20:50.11 | nick125_lappy | some people say it was an accident |
| 20:50.16 | harleypig | IT'S AN ATTACK I TELLS YA! |
| 20:51.02 | graphyx | "He's got my fathers eyes" ,.. "Gomez, take those out of his mouth." |
| 20:51.12 | *** part/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@65.89.234.66) |
| 20:52.47 | ^Migs^ | an accident? |
| 20:53.42 | scothoser | There are no details as of yet, but there hasn't been any indication that the event is linked to a terrorist group... |
| 20:53.53 | scothoser | As far as we know, at any rate. |
| 20:54.03 | emcnabb | Jayce^: I'm going to my first LUG meeting tomorrow night since I moved out here |
| 20:54.03 | ^Migs^ | Oh, I thought you were talking about 9/11/01 |
| 20:54.03 | graphyx | I wouldn't expect it to be.. |
| 20:54.24 | graphyx | I am pretty sure that they would have loaded it up with explosives before hitting the building. |
| 20:54.27 | SB1-Work | Oops. |
| 20:54.34 | SB1-Work | Note to self: killing winlogon.exe = BSOD |
| 20:54.35 | graphyx | A small plane just doesn't have enough umph... |
| 20:55.24 | ^Migs^ | Because you see, some friendly neighborhood Muslims were enjoying a nice quiet game of "DEATH TO THE INFIDELS" aboard a plane, going to visit relatives, when one of them, whipping out a toy cap gun, accidentally fumbled around with it and discharged a few caps, frightening a few people. Unfortunately, both pilots had a heart attack, so the heroic Muslims took control of the plane, tried to steer it to safety, but accidentally hit a building. |
| 20:55.50 | scothoser | Of course, to play devil's advocate, it could have been the only thing a terrorist group could get to.. |
| 20:55.59 | nick125_lappy | ^Migs^: um.. |
| 20:58.32 | scothoser | The only thing that would really worry me is that Bin Laden has been threatening attacks for years.. and may have gotten desperate to have some sort of visual evidence that he has some power left to be a threat. |
| 20:59.26 | elg | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:00.09 | graphyx | elg: I thought they released a patch to prevent that from happening to eliminate the threat that terrorists were using it as a simulator... |
| 21:00.10 | graphyx | ;) |
| 21:00.10 | levi | elg: TERRORIST! |
| 21:00.36 | elg | lol |
| 21:00.37 | elg | well this was when I was preteen |
| 21:00.37 | ^Migs^ | TERRORIST IN TRAINING |
| 21:00.39 | elg | mostly I crash into the ground now |
| 21:00.48 | ^Migs^ | I haven't played a flight sim in years |
| 21:00.51 | ^Migs^ | now I want to play one |
| 21:00.56 | elg | flying among Really Fake skyscrapers got boring |
| 21:01.10 | graphyx | wireframe skyscrapers? |
| 21:01.13 | elg | speaking of, tensai what was that one you recommended? does it have a free trial? |
| 21:01.22 | graphyx | xplane |
| 21:01.35 | levi | I mostly crashed into bridges or water, because trying to fly underneath a bridge was cool! |
| 21:01.36 | ^Migs^ | you know what was a cool flight sim? Corncob. |
| 21:01.45 | ^Migs^ | cuz there were aliens and stuff, and you could jump out of your plane. |
| 21:01.46 | elg | graphyx: we're talking MS flight simulator mid 90s |
| 21:02.13 | elg | I like flightgear too, but I was getting frustrated trying to get my joystick to work Just Right |
| 21:02.22 | ^Migs^ | what was that flight sim that was absurdly realistic, so realistic no one could possibly play it? |
| 21:02.32 | ^Migs^ | like, real down to the controls in the sim itself |
| 21:02.40 | ^Migs^ | Falcon? |
| 21:02.48 | Tene | ^Migs^: erm... people fly *completely* real aircraft every day... |
| 21:03.10 | ^Migs^ | yes, but not your average flight sim player |
| 21:03.36 | levi | I used to play Falcon 3.0 all the time. |
| 21:03.43 | ^Migs^ | yeah, it was Falcon |
| 21:03.44 | levi | It's probably what I tried to fly under bridges in. |
| 21:03.45 | ^Migs^ | were you any good at it? |
| 21:03.50 | levi | Not very. |
| 21:04.00 | ^Migs^ | I think they made up to Falcon 5.0 |
| 21:04.10 | ^Migs^ | and the instruction manual was, like, 500 pages long |
| 21:04.14 | levi | I occasionally shot down enemy planes and sometimes bombed the right targets. |
| 21:04.15 | harleypig | Well, the Yankees have their excuse for this year ... |
| 21:04.21 | harleypig | Lidle was on the plane that crashed. |
| 21:04.28 | nick125_lappy | It looks like they found out the plane that crashed was registered to Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle, and, at the accident site, they found Lidle's passport |
| 21:04.34 | nick125_lappy | harleypig: I was about to post that ... |
| 21:04.38 | harleypig | heh |
| 21:04.44 | levi | I'm not sure if I ever landed successfully though. ;) |
| 21:04.45 | harleypig | I beat you by 7 seconds |
| 21:04.50 | elg | http://www.x-plane.com/sysreq.html |
| 21:04.54 | nick125_lappy | harleypig: I was typing it up :P |
| 21:04.55 | elg | 60 gig HDD |
| 21:05.01 | harleypig | I just typed less |
| 21:05.02 | ^Migs^ | best flight sim ever was Wing Commander |
| 21:05.06 | elg | surely you can not install all the scenery? |
| 21:05.51 | nick125_lappy | what good is a flight simulator without scenery? |
| 21:06.54 | levi | Mmm, Wing Commander. |
| 21:07.13 | levi | I enjoyed the original X-WIng game, too. |
| 21:07.37 | maquis | rebel assault was a fun star wars game |
| 21:07.50 | goozbach | wing commander, ohh fun |
| 21:08.08 | elg | nick125_lappy: not much, but you don't necessarily need all the scenery |
| 21:08.13 | levi | I need to try that space flight sim MMORPG game. |
| 21:08.37 | Tene | Eve? |
| 21:08.52 | ^Migs^ | probably Eve |
| 21:08.54 | ^Migs^ | my friend likes it |
| 21:08.57 | nick125_lappy | I need to learn how ot use flightgear again/ |
| 21:08.59 | ^Migs^ | it seems pretty awesome, actually |
| 21:09.06 | ^Migs^ | Wing Commander should be a MMORPG, frankly |
| 21:09.19 | ^Migs^ | Wing Commander's AI seemed so far ahead of its time |
| 21:09.27 | levi | Yeah, I think Eve is what I was thinking of. |
| 21:09.31 | ^Migs^ | the whole game was far ahead of its time |
| 21:09.44 | levi | I also loved playing the original Mechwarrior. |
| 21:10.05 | ^Migs^ | you have good taste in games, levi |
| 21:10.26 | maquis | there's some really cool mech game at the orem nickelcade |
| 21:11.13 | ^Migs^ | wtf? HAMILTON, Ohio (AP) -- A city prosecutor was charged with indecency after a security camera caught him walking around naked in a government building after business hours. |
| 21:11.23 | nick125_lappy | LOL |
| 21:11.30 | ^Migs^ | what was he doing? |
| 21:11.31 | levi | ^Migs^: I found you could take on the ultra-heavy mechs in a Locust just by running really fast and getting between their legs. You could then take out the legs, and run on to the next one. |
| 21:11.37 | nick125_lappy | my first question is why was he walking around naked? |
| 21:11.45 | nick125_lappy | my second question was why was he there after business hours |
| 21:12.10 | levi | ^Migs^: And you could get insane amounts of money by doing that, since money was determined by 'difficulty'. |
| 21:12.12 | ^Migs^ | I never played Mechwarrior. I knew plenty about it, but I missed out :( |
| 21:13.29 | levi | I didn't have a PC at the time, but I was always hanging out with friends who had it. |
| 21:13.29 | ^Migs^ | yeah, me too |
| 21:13.29 | ^Migs^ | except I only watched them play |
| 21:13.29 | ^Migs^ | well, I had a PC |
| 21:13.29 | ^Migs^ | I was more an adventure gamer, anyway |
| 21:13.29 | ^Migs^ | still am |
| 21:13.29 | levi | I had a neighbor that was a friend of my parents, and she let me install Wing Commander on her PC. |
| 21:13.29 | ^Migs^ | which one? WC1? |
| 21:13.37 | ^Migs^ | I NEVER played the Special Operations for WC2. How dumb is that? |
| 21:13.40 | levi | I don't recall if it was 1 or 2. |
| 21:14.04 | ^Migs^ | so for me there's this giant part of the WIng Commander saga I'm completely oblivious to |
| 21:14.14 | levi | One of my favorite games of all time was Star Control 2. |
| 21:14.20 | ^Migs^ | oh, that's a cool game too |
| 21:14.23 | levi | So cool! |
| 21:14.32 | ^Migs^ | had cool music, too |
| 21:14.42 | levi | Cool music, cool story, fun gameplay. |
| 21:14.42 | ^Migs^ | I remember that |
| 21:15.29 | levi | The music was all in MOD files, so you could play it in any MOD player. |
| 21:15.58 | levi | I played the 2-player combat mode against my friend all the time. |
| 21:16.43 | scothoser | Has anyone checked out VegaStrike? They have several fully functional Wing Commander modules that are quite fun. I like the Privateer version myself. |
| 21:17.17 | ^Migs^ | http://www.wcnews.com/ |
| 21:17.58 | ^Migs^ | Privateer 2 was pretty interesting. I really liked that one. |
| 21:18.05 | levi | Hmm, Homeworld. I should reinstall that sometime. |
| 21:18.06 | ^Migs^ | weird story, as I recall |
| 21:19.24 | levi | Time for me to get to school. |
| 21:19.59 | Jayce^ | homeworld was a good set of games |
| 21:25.13 | Tene | Agreed. |
| 21:25.27 | Tene | The Freespace games are fun. |
| 21:30.18 | harleypig | http://www.funtoosh.com/dj.php?details=A11~362 |
| 21:30.22 | harleypig | maquis: don't look |
| 21:30.27 | Tene | So, anything specific anyone's interested in for the Catalyst presentation at NUPM tonight? |
| 21:34.33 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-8-157.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 21:37.14 | bonez39 | tensai, around? |
| 21:40.36 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 21:41.19 | *** join/#utah bigdog_ut (n=bigdog@208.177.146.102.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 21:41.39 | Jayce^ | http://www.plat-forms.org/faq.htm |
| 21:41.42 | Jayce^ | ok, that's just *stupid* |
| 21:42.09 | Jayce^ | "We have been considering Perl as one of the platforms to be admitted to the contest. So far, we have decided against it because we believe that too few professionals use it professionally for us to hope to get enough requests for admittance for the Perl platform." |
| 21:42.27 | Jayce^ | too few professional *web platform* people use perl?? |
| 21:42.28 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 21:42.35 | Tene | Wow. |
| 21:46.00 | beandog | you can use perl on the web? |
| 21:46.16 | beandog | ;) |
| 21:47.40 | Tene | The main focus of his presentation is "How to get catalyst running on an rpm-based distro." |
| 21:48.00 | Jayce^ | Tene, yeah, but I'm going to force him to talk a bit about how to use it :) |
| 21:48.06 | Tene | Heh. |
| 21:48.14 | Jayce^ | 'cause people gotta know |
| 21:48.19 | Tene | He asked me to write up a presentation on a bunch of associated modules. |
| 21:48.21 | Jayce^ | you coming Tene? |
| 21:48.38 | Tene | Working on my presentation right now. |
| 21:48.40 | Tene | Yeah. |
| 21:48.47 | Jayce^ | just found out one somebody wrote that I've been requesting for a while |
| 21:48.55 | Jayce^ | http://search.cpan.org/~ash/Catalyst-Model-File-0.02/lib/Catalyst/Model/File.pm |
| 21:48.59 | Jayce^ | Tene++ |
| 21:56.00 | SB1-Work | Man, windows rootkits suck |
| 21:56.06 | SB1-Work | I can't imagine a properly done linux one |
| 21:57.58 | Tene | There are several, actually. |
| 21:58.37 | SB1-Work | I know, I've just never had to deal with one |
| 21:59.04 | SB1-Work | Unlike this windows box that I just had to clean, which had two, four trojans, two e-mail spam bots, and four IM worms |
| 21:59.06 | bonez39 | how do I check how much ram my video card has? |
| 21:59.31 | Tene | lspci -vvv might show it |
| 21:59.59 | bonez39 | ok... |
| 22:02.05 | bonez39 | Tene, could you take a look at the output from lspci in #flood....to see what you think? |
| 22:05.37 | bonez39 | tene: Region 0: Memory at e4000000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=64M] |
| 22:05.45 | bonez39 | does that appear like the memory output? |
| 22:15.02 | Tene | Yeah, 64M |
| 22:23.11 | *** join/#utah bzob (n=bzobrist@nat.myfamilyinc.com) |
| 22:40.19 | bonez39 | Tene, I have 64m ... on my video card...I get these moments....when i have to back the resolution off....to 1024x768...I usually run at 1280x1024....the colors get washed out.....and something I get streaks vertically.... |
| 22:41.53 | *** part/#utah scothoser (n=scothose@wifi-177145.aoce.utah.edu) |
| 22:43.17 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-75-0-136-70.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:50.53 | *** join/#utah graphyx (n=graphyx@205.208.245.105) |
| 22:51.09 | graphyx | What is a command to send an email from the command line? |
| 22:51.17 | graphyx | I want to receive confirmation that a cronjob occured. |
| 22:58.19 | Jayce^ | mail |
| 22:59.56 | *** part/#utah herlo (n=herlo@class1-nat.gurulabs.com) |
| 23:02.41 | bonez39 | let's say I can ssh to a machine at home....but I really want to connect to another networked machine....is there a way to ssh to that other machine, through the one with port 22 forwarded to it? |
| 23:03.22 | graphyx | Jayce^: I found mail, but I can't find the syntax to send a mail form a single line, any help there? |
| 23:03.39 | graphyx | bonez39: ssh to the first and then ssh from the first to the second? |
| 23:03.44 | graphyx | You could also do a tunnel. |
| 23:04.03 | graphyx | It accepts inputs from one and redirects them to another system/port |
| 23:04.08 | Jayce^ | cat data | mail me@example.com |
| 23:04.16 | bonez39 | graphyx, yeah, something like? I hear about people connecting to one machine and then appending ':idforother machine' at the end of the connecting string |
| 23:04.32 | graphyx | bonez39: Not familiar with that |
| 23:04.40 | graphyx | tunnel has to be set up before the connection. |
| 23:04.58 | graphyx | Suppose you could make it happen dynamically, but I don't think I would want to allow that. |
| 23:05.04 | bonez39 | no..... |
| 23:05.41 | graphyx | Jayce^: Trying it out. Thanks. |
| 23:06.08 | graphyx | Jayce^: Anyway to get a subject? |
| 23:06.41 | Jayce^ | yes.... |
| 23:06.49 | graphyx | ahh. -s |
| 23:06.55 | graphyx | got it now. Thanks a ton. |
| 23:07.10 | Jayce^ | yeah, the man has some useful options you'd want |
| 23:07.21 | graphyx | Checking it out now. |
| 23:08.11 | graphyx | Sweet. |
| 23:08.13 | graphyx | Thanks a ton again. |
| 23:08.16 | graphyx | Its just what I needed. |
| 23:10.18 | rsimpkins | FYI - we have a new user coming to the meeting tonight. |
| 23:10.29 | Jayce^ | -e is a really useful option too |
| 23:10.30 | brac | fine |
| 23:10.36 | rsimpkins | He's a Windows programmer that is trying to get CVS working as a code repo on Linux. |
| 23:10.40 | graphyx | I'd love to come to one, but I doubt anyone is going to volunteer to pay for the flight. |
| 23:10.45 | Jayce^ | rsimpkins, nice |
| 23:11.04 | rsimpkins | So no one laugh at his windows laptop! :) |
| 23:11.30 | graphyx | Burn him a knoppix cd and help him boot it before the meeting. |
| 23:12.09 | rsimpkins | It was a lot of work just to be sure we can ssh to his box from the meeting. :) |
| 23:22.56 | *** join/#utah calvarez (n=calvarez@r82h185.res.gatech.edu) |
| 23:29.53 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@atarack/staff/xbmodder) |
| 23:30.00 | Sargun | hi |
| 23:30.27 | Sargun | could any spanish speaker explain me the difference between conocer and saber |
| 23:33.01 | Jayce^ | aquaint, KNOW |
| 23:33.07 | Jayce^ | same as in PT |
| 23:33.16 | Jayce^ | conhecer, saber |
| 23:33.36 | Jayce^ | the first is to be familiar with... |
| 23:33.54 | Jayce^ | and of course, to know a person is in the biblical sense |
| 23:35.00 | Sargun | conhecer? |
| 23:35.34 | Sargun | oh |
| 23:35.36 | Sargun | nevermind |
| 23:35.50 | Sargun | thanks |
| 23:37.28 | *** join/#utah redbeard2 (n=redbeard@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 23:43.05 | bonez39 | Tene, sorry for the delay..I finally pasted my lspci -vvv to #flood |
| 23:44.04 | bonez39 | emcnabb, or you are welcome to check it too.... |
| 23:53.19 | emcnabb | sorry, I joined too late, and I'm not really sure what you're working on |
| 23:53.55 | bonez39 | emcnabb, was wondering about memory on my video card.... |
| 23:54.00 | bonez39 | I'll paste again..hold on |
| 23:55.26 | bonez39 | emcnabb, did you see that? |
| 23:55.30 | emcnabb | yeah |
| 23:55.42 | emcnabb | how much memory you have? |
| 23:56.20 | Sargun | 64MB! FTW! |
| 23:56.21 | Sargun | :-P |
| 23:56.51 | Sargun | bonez39, |
| 23:56.57 | Sargun | what do you get on a "lspci|grep VGA" |
| 23:56.58 | emcnabb | yeah, looks like 64MB |