| 00:00.48 | *** join/#utah jnbek (n=jnbek@c-24-10-178-17.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 00:13.17 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@128.123.63.88) |
| 00:31.55 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 00:36.25 | Sargun | pokey |
| 00:44.07 | *** join/#utah calvarez (i=calvarez@lawn-128-61-124-152.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 00:44.10 | calvarez | hullo |
| 00:55.42 | emcnabb | calvarez: hello |
| 00:56.27 | calvarez | hello Evan |
| 00:56.35 | calvarez | it's Evan, right? |
| 00:56.38 | emcnabb | yeah |
| 00:56.42 | calvarez | k |
| 00:56.51 | emcnabb | you go to Georgia Tech? |
| 00:56.53 | calvarez | yes |
| 00:57.04 | emcnabb | my wife is from Alpharetta |
| 00:57.09 | calvarez | nice area |
| 00:57.19 | calvarez | I went to a BBQ there a few weeks ago |
| 00:57.32 | emcnabb | cool |
| 01:03.40 | mheath | These conversations always seem weird. Like calvarez is talking to himself. To either emcnabb or Sargun...got both of them on ignore. :P |
| 01:04.06 | mheath | calvarez: you originally from #utah, or live here at some point? |
| 01:04.27 | calvarez | I went to BYU |
| 01:04.28 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-24-10-162-63.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 01:04.42 | calvarez | in fact, I took one or two classes with amcnabb |
| 01:04.45 | Sargun | yum |
| 01:04.50 | calvarez | but I'm originally from Chile |
| 01:04.56 | Sargun | your real name calvarez? |
| 01:05.08 | calvarez | Cristobal Alvarez |
| 01:05.16 | mheath | oh, I don't have Sargun on ignore. Not in this client at least. |
| 01:05.16 | calvarez | I go by Chris though :p |
| 01:05.26 | Sargun | oh |
| 01:05.27 | amcnabb | hey, calvarez |
| 01:05.32 | calvarez | hey |
| 01:05.38 | mheath | calvarez: Great. When did you come to the USA? |
| 01:05.40 | Sargun | well, hi mheath |
| 01:05.43 | calvarez | 2001 |
| 01:06.00 | Sargun | Do you like chile better, or USA? |
| 01:06.02 | calvarez | just graduated from the Y, moved to Atlanta |
| 01:06.04 | calvarez | USA |
| 01:06.27 | calvarez | I miss a few things from Chile (extended family, bread, etc) |
| 01:06.33 | calvarez | but I like it here much better |
| 01:06.49 | mheath | calvarez: Yeah. Family relationships are a lot different here in the USA, and on top of that your away from your family. |
| 01:07.02 | calvarez | well, my immediate family lives in Utah |
| 01:07.05 | mheath | I should say, they tend to be a lot different |
| 01:07.23 | calvarez | I don't know about family relationships being that different, under what perspective? |
| 01:07.49 | mheath | calvarez: thats whats always impressed me by southern american cultures, though....better extended family relationships. I mean, I see my Grandma maybe twice a year and I live 15 minutes away from her. |
| 01:07.50 | Sargun | bread? |
| 01:08.10 | calvarez | mheath, in my case, it wasn't much different when I lived in Chile |
| 01:08.13 | calvarez | oh yea, bread |
| 01:08.20 | calvarez | 100x bread in the US |
| 01:08.40 | mheath | calvarez: Wonderbread doesn't quite cut it :-) |
| 01:08.47 | calvarez | haha wonder bread |
| 01:09.05 | calvarez | I'm not criticizing American bread, but Chilean bread is just different |
| 01:09.42 | Sargun | lol |
| 01:09.45 | Sargun | like, how so? |
| 01:09.56 | Sargun | can you bake some bread, and send it cross country? |
| 01:09.56 | calvarez | like, better ;) |
| 01:10.00 | mheath | calvarez: Feel free to criticize. We've managed to take probably the oldest and most common food still in use today and bleach it bright white, remove the flavor, and make every single slice and loaf look identical. |
| 01:10.01 | Sargun | :-P |
| 01:10.04 | calvarez | calvarez, I don't know how :) |
| 01:10.11 | Sargun | mheath, yup |
| 01:10.19 | calvarez | mheath, lol, I don't argue that :) |
| 01:10.25 | Sargun | mheath, Thats why you get friends and family who bake to share. |
| 01:10.26 | elg | calvarez: you should criticize american bread. it's the sorriest excuse for bread you'll ever see |
| 01:10.48 | calvarez | elg, I don't want to be harsh, but American bread is better than bread in Uruguay (where I served my mission) |
| 01:11.09 | calvarez | I love many things in Uruguay (especially the people), but man, the bread... |
| 01:11.10 | *** join/#utah mheath[laptop] (n=mheath@c-67-182-231-23.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 01:11.21 | elg | wow, that is harsh. poor uruguayans |
| 01:11.29 | calvarez | nah, they're nice and cool |
| 01:11.34 | calvarez | but their bread sucks :p :) |
| 01:11.41 | Sargun | Everything at the supermarkets sucks |
| 01:11.53 | elg | calvarez: america does have some very good bread |
| 01:12.00 | Sargun | go down to the city to get good bread |
| 01:12.04 | elg | it's just not usually at the supermarket |
| 01:12.08 | Sargun | Citizen Cake! FTW! |
| 01:12.21 | mheath | Citizen Cake? |
| 01:12.26 | calvarez | elg, there is *some*, I've tried many, and they're good, but they don't compare to the kind of bread you can find at your local neighborhood store in Chile |
| 01:12.29 | mheath | That's an unbelievably stupid name. |
| 01:12.37 | mheath | Please tell me no one named their cake/bread/store that. |
| 01:12.44 | calvarez | rofl |
| 01:13.00 | calvarez | ok, I gotta get back to blendering |
| 01:13.06 | mheath | ~blender calvarez |
| 01:13.14 | Sargun | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:13.18 | mheath | calvarez: the 3d modelling program or the kitchen utensil? |
| 01:13.24 | Sargun | baked goods in general |
| 01:13.26 | calvarez-blender | 3D modelling program |
| 01:13.30 | Sargun | ack! |
| 01:13.37 | calvarez-blender | it rocks man |
| 01:13.39 | mheath | calvarez-blender: blender is awesome. Have fun. |
| 01:13.46 | calvarez-blender | blender >> Maya |
| 01:13.56 | mheath | Sargun: Yes, but they could have tried not making their name a rather stupid hack of a classic movie that has nothing to do with cake. |
| 01:15.18 | mheath[laptop] | I bet you Sargun's off trying to figure out what movie "Citizen Cake" is based on. |
| 01:17.26 | mheath2 | yo |
| 01:20.20 | Sargun | lol |
| 01:21.01 | mheath2 | I think I'm going to install Windows Vista |
| 01:21.22 | mheath2 | then I'm going to make some lasagna |
| 01:21.23 | amcnabb | meath2, you're so cool. |
| 01:21.32 | mheath2 | after that I'm going to complain about something |
| 01:21.58 | Sargun | lol |
| 01:22.12 | mheath2 | ouch, my knee is hurting tonight |
| 01:22.22 | mheath2 | go Marines! |
| 01:22.28 | mheath[laptop] | mheath2: If you don't stop, I'll contact a Freenode op telling them that, despite my attempts to ignore you and a recommendation that you do the same to me if you don't like what I have to say, you have continued to harass me, including impersonation attempts. |
| 01:22.34 | mheath2 | haha |
| 01:22.43 | amcnabb | Wow. |
| 01:23.08 | mheath2 | I'm sure they'll really want to hear from you |
| 01:23.11 | amcnabb | Someone's happy. |
| 01:23.19 | mheath[laptop] | You don't like me. I get it. There IS an ignore command. |
| 01:23.35 | mheath2 | but it's so fun... |
| 01:23.43 | mheath2 | can't resist... |
| 01:23.55 | amcnabb | mheath[laptop], will you please put me on your blocklist so I don't accidentally offend you. I don't want to get told on. |
| 01:24.47 | mheath2 | amcnabb: he's going to call your mommy and tell on you |
| 01:24.53 | mheath[laptop] | amcnabb, I'm happy as can be. Your brother/relative/whatever is the one that insists on continuing a conversation that ended hours ago while he keeps up his childish longing to attempt to insult me. |
| 01:25.43 | amcnabb | mheath[laptop], you could call both of our mommies in one call. |
| 01:25.55 | mheath[laptop] | He also insists on either childishly attempting to get around my ignore, or insulting me behind my back. |
| 01:26.58 | mheath2 | you should tell everyone to stop PMing me then |
| 01:27.23 | Sargun | who is mheath2? |
| 01:27.43 | Sargun | hahah! |
| 01:27.46 | Sargun | nice evan |
| 01:27.51 | mheath2 | I am an impersonator |
| 01:28.07 | amcnabb | mheath[laptop], you said "childish longing to attempt to insult me." |
| 01:28.13 | amcnabb | Is attempt really the right word? |
| 01:28.20 | amcnabb | I think he's doing a fine job. |
| 01:28.29 | mheath2 | in about 5 minutes the Marines will be at my door, so I better run away |
| 01:28.33 | mheath2 | night all |
| 01:28.54 | amcnabb | hey emcnabb |
| 01:29.15 | emcnabb | hey amcnabb |
| 01:29.36 | mheath[laptop] | emcnabb, I thought you were joking when you said you didn't believe I was actually in the Marine Corps. Go call the FBI then and have them arrest me for forgery, for the scan of my DD214 I put on my blog. |
| 01:29.40 | amcnabb | Wow. You sure are saying some crazy stuff behind his back. |
| 01:29.56 | Sargun | emcnabb, great. |
| 01:30.05 | Sargun | mheath, hah |
| 01:30.40 | mheath[laptop] | Not to mention the scan of my enlistment contract I posted on here when I entered the DEP. |
| 01:31.01 | amcnabb | mheath[laptop], you have no right to call emcnabb childish. |
| 01:31.35 | mheath[laptop] | amcnabb, are you going to tell me that its hypocritical because _I'm_ childish? Of course I am, I'm not even an adult yet. |
| 01:32.14 | emcnabb | someone's angry tonight |
| 01:32.42 | amcnabb | mheath[laptop], okay. If your not an adult yet, I guess you're okay. |
| 01:32.49 | amcnabb | s/your/you're/ |
| 01:35.12 | calvarez-blender | lol |
| 01:35.35 | calvarez-blender | BTW, I figured out how to do animation in Blender in 1 hr!! :) |
| 01:35.49 | Supaplex | ~lart network latency |
| 01:35.55 | Sargun | calvarez-blender, nice |
| 01:36.00 | Sargun | Supaplex, eh? |
| 01:36.01 | calvarez-blender | lol, MUD-like larts |
| 01:36.03 | Sargun | whats lagging? |
| 01:36.33 | Supaplex | my connection |
| 01:36.55 | *** join/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 01:38.15 | mheath[laptop] | Does the U's CS program use OSS stuff a lot, or is it mostly Windows and Visual Studio centric like Weber State's? |
| 01:39.39 | mheath[laptop] | Ah, and if anyone's interested, I'm compiling a big editorial review of my experiences with Vista that I've had wihle running it over the last few weeks on my laptop here. Highs, lows. Some of the new features and some of the problems. Should be on my blog tomorrow evening. |
| 01:39.59 | beandog | cool |
| 01:40.03 | beandog | there were highs? |
| 01:40.31 | calvarez-blender | yea, high level of exasperation at the 989078980 pop-ups whenever you wanna save a file |
| 01:40.36 | Sargun | Supaplex, from you to gateway? |
| 01:40.36 | calvarez-blender | that was a high |
| 01:41.47 | Supaplex | I think it's this storm in the area. It's behaving now. i just needed some bot sponsored fun. :) |
| 01:41.51 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, Yeah. Like I already discussed, I think the security improvements are a big help (though, like calvarez-blender says, they can introduce a lot of popups)...Hardware detection and the included driver database has grown A TON. The Windows Update interface is improved a lot. IE got some cool new jailed security features. |
| 01:42.12 | beandog | That reminds me, isnt ie7 going live tomorrow? |
| 01:42.53 | mheath[laptop] | Sidebar isn't anything new compared to most GUI gadget tools, but its nice to see something for windows so cleanly integrated into the desktop |
| 01:43.17 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, no idea. I run some beta software, but I really don't keep on the beta rumours |
| 01:43.35 | mheath[laptop] | I do know that MS pulled the Vista RC2 download today or late yesterday. |
| 01:44.33 | mheath[laptop] | When announced, RC2 was supposed to be somewhat generally available but less so than RC1 is, and with less official support (RC1 gets security updates from Windows Update, and is guaranteed to be compatible to upgrade to final) |
| 01:44.49 | mheath[laptop] | But then they put it up for general, free download for about a day |
| 01:45.05 | mheath[laptop] | Then took it down. The old download page just redirects to www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/ |
| 01:45.39 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, the graphics system is resource intensive and not anything really impressive compared to XGL and Compiz, but it's nice too. |
| 01:45.51 | mheath[laptop] | I really like the filesystem hierarchy redesign |
| 01:46.07 | beandog | Im not big on eye candy anyway. |
| 01:46.20 | Sargun | they have a /etc |
| 01:46.27 | mheath[laptop] | C:\Users\Mike rather than C: |
| 01:46.28 | mheath[laptop] | erm |
| 01:46.36 | mheath[laptop] | rather than C:\Documents and Settings\Mike |
| 01:46.41 | beandog | thank goodness for that. |
| 01:46.51 | Sargun | that seems like |
| 01:46.56 | Sargun | that other crappy OS |
| 01:47.23 | mheath[laptop] | And C:\Users\Mike doubles as the root for documents AND application data (in a hidden folder called AppData) rather than having another folder (My Documents) for documents |
| 01:47.42 | mheath[laptop] | They did away with the "My" naming scheme |
| 01:47.48 | mheath[laptop] | It's just Documents now, for example. |
| 01:48.20 | beandog | is it more stable? |
| 01:48.23 | beandog | thats the real question. |
| 01:48.28 | beandog | Although XP was never that bad for me. |
| 01:48.57 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, I have had ONE stability problem with Vista itself: Attempting to hibernate produces a BSOD. |
| 01:49.02 | Sargun | does it have a decent shell/terminal |
| 01:49.14 | mheath[laptop] | Other than that, I haven't even had any Vista components lock up on me |
| 01:49.24 | mheath[laptop] | Internet Explorer never stops responding, nor does anything else. |
| 01:49.28 | Supaplex | it's not even a unix wannabe |
| 01:49.49 | beandog | Well ACPI is almost always buggy anyway. |
| 01:50.24 | mheath[laptop] | It by no means compares with Linux, but for a Microsoft product, I came out very impressed. |
| 01:50.32 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@c-24-10-162-63.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 01:50.36 | beandog | hmm |
| 01:50.46 | beandog | Im more concered with IE, myself. |
| 01:50.54 | beandog | Id like to see them do regular updates not just security patches. |
| 01:51.07 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, Security isn't nearly as big of a concern for IE7 in Vista. |
| 01:51.16 | mheath[laptop] | IE7 in Vista operates in a special jailed setting |
| 01:51.22 | Sargun | heh |
| 01:51.35 | mheath[laptop] | Meaning that remote exploits can't effect the machine nearly as easily |
| 01:51.54 | findlay | ~exploit mheath[laptop] |
| 01:51.59 | beandog | Hmm. |
| 01:52.00 | beandog | thats cool. |
| 01:52.19 | findlay | because they couldn't figure out how to write it securely |
| 01:52.23 | findlay | ~rimshot |
| 01:52.25 | ibot | ch-ch-chhh |
| 01:52.45 | mheath[laptop] | If you do any gaming, they have a new game organization and launching tool / API. |
| 01:53.13 | beandog | I gotta put together a new gaming box. |
| 01:53.27 | mheath[laptop] | and heres a big one, because I don't think this has happened since Windows 95: All the included games (Solitaire, etc) got their GUIs redesigned, and a few new games are included |
| 01:53.28 | beandog | Is stuff written for Vista gonna work on XP |
| 01:53.36 | mheath[laptop] | including a 3D chess program and Mahjong |
| 01:53.36 | beandog | its about time |
| 01:53.39 | beandog | what about notepad? |
| 01:53.51 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, notepad is the same. |
| 01:54.06 | beandog | meh. |
| 01:54.08 | beandog | morons. |
| 01:54.25 | mheath[laptop] | notepad, obviously, uses the Windows GUI library, so since it was upgraded Notepad looks a bit different. |
| 01:54.44 | findlay | beandog: I heard notepad will be replaced with gvim!1 |
| 01:55.09 | beandog | findlay: heh |
| 01:55.12 | beandog | right on. |
| 01:55.29 | Supaplex | heck ye, typing i when I open nodepad will make sense for once. ;) |
| 01:55.39 | mheath[laptop] | My home folder now has: Contacts, Documents, Favorites, Music, Saved Games, Videos, Desktop, Downloads, Links, Pictures, and Searches as the subfolders. |
| 01:56.02 | beandog | is it still case insensitive? |
| 01:56.06 | mheath[laptop] | (AppData is there too, but hidden) |
| 01:56.12 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, yeah |
| 01:56.17 | beandog | meh. |
| 01:56.19 | beandog | -_- |
| 01:56.27 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, they completely redesigned the start menu |
| 01:56.35 | beandog | I think I saw that |
| 01:56.40 | *** join/#utah PrincessCaitlai (n=chatzill@cpe-065-184-033-164.ec.res.rr.com) |
| 01:56.49 | findlay | although it was amusing to hear Alan Kay, the guy who pretty much invented the modern X display environment and therefore "windows" castigate microsoft for total lack of innovation |
| 01:56.56 | *** part/#utah PrincessCaitlai (n=chatzill@cpe-065-184-033-164.ec.res.rr.com) |
| 01:56.59 | mheath[laptop] | none of those pop-out submenus that spread across your entire screen anymore |
| 01:57.33 | mheath[laptop] | findlay, I agree. Windows is very noninovative. Everything that I'm complementing, infact, is obviously directly inspired by other software or other operating systems. |
| 01:58.46 | beandog | well one of my biggest annoyances is how windows dont get a taskbar. |
| 01:58.50 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, one thing that really bugs me, though, is that Windows hides folders from you even when you select to View Hidden Files and Foolders. |
| 01:58.50 | beandog | bah. |
| 01:58.54 | beandog | the whole inconsistency drives me insane. |
| 01:59.01 | Supaplex | drm-- |
| 01:59.19 | mheath[laptop] | and I've had some weird problems downloading large files with IE |
| 01:59.44 | findlay | ah, that's why |
| 01:59.57 | mheath[laptop] | I choose to Save As, and IE in its stupidity copies the folder to a temporary location like it normally does, then attempts to copy the file to the download location |
| 02:00.04 | findlay | mheath[laptop]: you selected View Hidden *Foolders* |
| 02:00.35 | mheath[laptop] | This produces some weird error about not enough quota (there are no filesystem quotas enabled) to complete the operation, an error I can't find any information about |
| 02:00.49 | findlay | I've *never* had any motivation to go back |
| 02:00.53 | mheath[laptop] | findlay, I'm about to start school. I really need a windows computer. |
| 02:00.54 | beandog | findlay: me either. |
| 02:01.03 | beandog | its been about 3 years for me I think. |
| 02:01.07 | findlay | mheath[laptop]: sure |
| 02:01.08 | findlay | (: |
| 02:01.28 | findlay | ~gentoo++ |
| 02:01.36 | mheath[laptop] | I have to take two semesters of foreign language during my freshman year |
| 02:01.37 | beandog | yay :) |
| 02:01.41 | mheath[laptop] | Didn't take it during highschool |
| 02:01.51 | mheath[laptop] | It would have been so much easier to have taken it during highschool |
| 02:01.58 | mheath[laptop] | Foreign language classes are a joke in highschool |
| 02:02.27 | mheath[laptop] | I know people who took 5 years of Spanish classes in junior high / high school, and I can speak more from working in the kitchen at applebees for a year. |
| 02:02.34 | beandog | what do you need a windows puter for |
| 02:02.39 | calvarez-blender | but I speak better than ALL |
| 02:02.42 | calvarez-blender | muahahahaha |
| 02:02.45 | calvarez-blender | bwahahaha |
| 02:03.06 | calvarez-blender | as a matter of fact, I can't type Spanish anymore |
| 02:03.13 | beandog | que cosa. |
| 02:03.20 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez-blender, I'm sure you do. The limit of my spanish is somewhere around "Yo quero doce camerones-fritas, por favor" (and I'm sure I butchered the spelling, as I only really know how to speak it) |
| 02:03.36 | calvarez-blender | heh, I was just kidding, mheath[laptop] |
| 02:03.59 | calvarez-blender | I'm sure you do well for not having taken classes |
| 02:04.13 | Sargun | creepy stalker girl on IRC :-/ |
| 02:04.20 | mheath[laptop] | I'm about to show my complete ignorance to most geography, but: what is the main language in chile? |
| 02:04.31 | Sargun | wait |
| 02:04.33 | beandog | spanish |
| 02:04.37 | Sargun | I have another chile-an |
| 02:04.42 | Sargun | around here somewhere |
| 02:05.03 | beandog | viva la argentina |
| 02:05.03 | mheath[laptop] | Ah, thats what I thought. I guess I misunderstood when calvarez-blender said he was joking about speaking spanish well. |
| 02:05.57 | calvarez-blender | the language in Chile is: some dialect of Spanish |
| 02:06.15 | mheath[laptop] | haha. I hate dialects |
| 02:06.21 | calvarez-blender | we speak Spanish very differently than Mexicans, Spanish or even Argentinians |
| 02:06.46 | calvarez-blender | in fact, I can speak Spanish and most people in the US will think I'm speaking Arabic or something like that |
| 02:06.47 | mheath[laptop] | when I worked with some Mexicans, one would teach me some words, and I'd try to use it when talking to others and they couldn't understand me |
| 02:06.53 | calvarez-blender | nothing at all like the way Mexicans speak |
| 02:06.56 | mheath[laptop] | because it would be somewhat local to some region |
| 02:07.22 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez-blender, did you understand what I (attempted) to type? |
| 02:07.40 | calvarez | mheath[laptop], oh yea |
| 02:07.43 | mheath[laptop] | "Yo quero doce camerones-fritas, por favor" =P |
| 02:07.57 | calvarez | it's "camarones fritos" |
| 02:08.10 | calvarez | but very close, it was perfectly understandable |
| 02:08.24 | mheath[laptop] | That comes out as "I would like 12 fried shrimp, please.", right? |
| 02:08.49 | calvarez | "I want twelve fried shrimp, please" |
| 02:09.37 | calvarez | "yo quiero" = "I want" |
| 02:09.49 | mheath[laptop] | Ah. I was always taught to translate "yo quero" in that context as "I would like to have" because I was told "Yo Quero" is interchangeable between "I would like to have" and "I like" (As in, I enjoy) |
| 02:09.53 | calvarez | "yo quisiera" = "I would want" |
| 02:10.13 | calvarez | there is no real, accurate, literal translation of "to like" in Spanish |
| 02:10.24 | mheath[laptop] | I never learned much of the grammer or rules of Spanish |
| 02:10.30 | beandog | its easy. |
| 02:10.33 | beandog | its logical, too. |
| 02:10.44 | beandog | makes it easy for a geek. |
| 02:10.58 | beandog | gotta learn the exceptions of course but theres not that many. |
| 02:11.04 | mheath[laptop] | I learned quite a bit, but it was always functional, in the present tense |
| 02:11.11 | beandog | a mi me gustaria saber mas castellano |
| 02:12.18 | mheath[laptop] | Necessito uno mas poyo fritas por ensalada de "Santa Fe", por favor. |
| 02:12.36 | mheath[laptop] | I need one more piece of fried chicken for the Santa Fe Salad, please. |
| 02:12.37 | calvarez | it's logical, but, as with most languages, there are lots of weird caveats |
| 02:12.49 | beandog | like haber. |
| 02:12.55 | calvarez | yea |
| 02:13.05 | calvarez | it's a weird verb |
| 02:13.07 | beandog | que has hecho |
| 02:13.10 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez, it would be hard for me to learn, for English is very illogical. |
| 02:13.24 | beandog | Actually thats the great part |
| 02:13.29 | calvarez | I'd say English is very simple in its structure |
| 02:13.29 | beandog | la linguas es muy romantica |
| 02:13.31 | beandog | suave |
| 02:13.33 | beandog | rica |
| 02:13.36 | beandog | :) |
| 02:13.36 | calvarez | lol |
| 02:13.41 | beandog | er, lingua. |
| 02:13.52 | calvarez | I like English because I can convey more ideas with less words and work |
| 02:13.53 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez, not when it comes to the specifics of the grammer. |
| 02:14.06 | mheath[laptop] | I speak a bit of Japanese, too |
| 02:14.15 | mheath[laptop] | Can't write Japanese at all, except for Romanji |
| 02:14.19 | beandog | I like English because it is dirty. |
| 02:14.25 | beandog | And you can cram things up badly and still make sense. |
| 02:14.31 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, Anata wa baka desu ne. |
| 02:14.33 | beandog | know whot im sayin yo |
| 02:14.38 | mheath[laptop] | Oh, ugly like that :P |
| 02:14.44 | beandog | heh |
| 02:14.49 | beandog | tell u whot. |
| 02:14.59 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, Yeah. Thats why I HATE Japanese |
| 02:15.00 | calvarez | I think Spanish allows the user to have a greater variety of words for slightly different ideas, so it makes a great language for poetry or other forms of narrative where a word needs to have more than one meaning |
| 02:15.08 | beandog | calvarez: totally. |
| 02:15.09 | calvarez | but Spanish requires more words in general |
| 02:15.10 | mheath[laptop] | especially written Japanese. the kanji. |
| 02:15.25 | calvarez | watashiwa Cu-ri-tsu des |
| 02:15.26 | mheath[laptop] | Literally a tiny extra flick added on to the tail of a character can make a world of difference |
| 02:15.48 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez, Curitsu ka? Curitsu wa eigo de nan desu ka? |
| 02:15.59 | calvarez | heh, that's about all I know |
| 02:16.07 | calvarez | besides a few cuss words ;) |
| 02:16.08 | mheath[laptop] | thats about all I know, too |
| 02:16.19 | calvarez | dama-re? nande! |
| 02:17.01 | mheath[laptop] | nande? "nande" wa "nan desu" desu? |
| 02:17.08 | calvarez | beandog, yea, you can do nice dirty word-saving tricks in English that you can't do in Spanish |
| 02:17.15 | calvarez | I like that :) |
| 02:17.25 | beandog | :) |
| 02:17.33 | calvarez | as far as I know, "nande" means "why" |
| 02:17.43 | calvarez | I may be wrong, that was loong ago |
| 02:18.13 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez, that might be a local slur/simplification of "nani desu" which is both why, or what |
| 02:18.18 | calvarez | oh |
| 02:18.29 | calvarez | yea, I heard Japanese has a lot of local dialects as well |
| 02:18.33 | mheath[laptop] | I only got far enough to learn the formal, polite way of speaking |
| 02:18.40 | mheath[laptop] | Never got around to simplifying my speech |
| 02:18.47 | calvarez | yea |
| 02:18.50 | calvarez | well, similar in Chile |
| 02:19.02 | mheath[laptop] | That might not even be a dialect, just a common method of simplification |
| 02:19.10 | calvarez | the formal, polite way of speaking in Chile is proper Spanish |
| 02:19.18 | calvarez | but we use a dialect in everyday speaking |
| 02:19.19 | mheath[laptop] | Japanese often leaves big junks of sentences out, and leaves them up to context |
| 02:19.37 | calvarez | well, it's bedtime for me |
| 02:19.47 | calvarez | enough Blendering for tonight |
| 02:19.50 | mheath[laptop] | calvarez, yeah, getting kind of late there |
| 02:20.00 | beandog | calvarez: youre in GA? |
| 02:20.03 | calvarez | yes |
| 02:20.05 | beandog | right on |
| 02:20.05 | calvarez | Atlanta |
| 02:20.06 | beandog | where doy ou live |
| 02:20.08 | calvarez | Hotlanta |
| 02:20.11 | beandog | woots. |
| 02:20.13 | beandog | Im from Duluth. |
| 02:20.23 | calvarez | GATECH on-campus family housing |
| 02:20.23 | beandog | and Norcross. |
| 02:20.32 | beandog | and Tucker :) |
| 02:20.32 | calvarez | Go Yellow Jackets! |
| 02:20.38 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, what university did/do you go to? |
| 02:20.47 | beandog | mheath[laptop]: uh, about 6. |
| 02:20.59 | beandog | school is like a revolving door for me. |
| 02:20.59 | Sargun | how did you meet emcnabb? |
| 02:21.03 | calvarez | hmph, that's 4 more than me |
| 02:21.06 | calvarez | I mean, 2 more |
| 02:21.12 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, any here in Utah? |
| 02:21.18 | beandog | ricks, byu, uvsc, slcc, suu |
| 02:21.19 | beandog | uh |
| 02:21.21 | beandog | what else. |
| 02:21.27 | calvarez | slcc and byu here too |
| 02:21.33 | calvarez | wife went to ricks |
| 02:21.42 | calvarez | siblings go to uvsc |
| 02:21.43 | beandog | back in the day. |
| 02:21.48 | mheath[laptop] | bah, trying to find someone who went to UoU so I can ask them some questions. |
| 02:21.57 | beandog | gwinnett tech :) |
| 02:21.59 | beandog | great school. |
| 02:22.01 | beandog | I think thats it. |
| 02:22.17 | mheath[laptop] | ~graduate beandog |
| 02:22.32 | mheath[laptop] | I tried. |
| 02:22.36 | beandog | thanks |
| 02:22.45 | beandog | I'm worthless. No education. :C |
| 02:22.52 | beandog | that's why I learned PHP. |
| 02:23.15 | findlay | mheath[laptop]: I've been there |
| 02:23.30 | beandog | and Gentoo. |
| 02:23.33 | mheath[laptop] | findlay, did you like the CS program for the most part? |
| 02:24.05 | mheath[laptop] | findlay, and is the atmosphere, housing, people, classes, for the most part pretty nice?? |
| 02:24.15 | findlay | mheath[laptop]: didn't take any CS classes, but IMO it's the best in the state |
| 02:24.28 | findlay | BYU and USU are good too |
| 02:24.43 | findlay | mheath[laptop]: yes |
| 02:25.01 | findlay | not as expensive as WSU but a little more than BYU and USU |
| 02:25.24 | mheath[laptop] | My dad doesn't understand why I want to live in on-campus housing for a while |
| 02:25.24 | beandog | oh, thats the best. |
| 02:25.24 | beandog | :) |
| 02:25.34 | mheath[laptop] | It's not necessarily for the convenience....On-Campus housing is an..experience. One that I want to have |
| 02:26.02 | beandog | yahps. :) |
| 02:26.10 | beandog | like getting locked out of your room in your underwear |
| 02:26.15 | beandog | on a holiday weekend. |
| 02:26.20 | beandog | when everyones gone. |
| 02:26.25 | beandog | Not that that's ever happened to me... |
| 02:26.28 | mheath[laptop] | beandog, uh. heh :P |
| 02:28.11 | calvarez | hmm, PS3 will come with Linux pre-installed |
| 02:28.44 | calvarez | mheath[laptop], I gotta tell you one thing |
| 02:29.01 | calvarez | mheath[laptop], choose a school for the program, not for the friends that will go there |
| 02:29.06 | calvarez | skru the friends |
| 02:29.12 | calvarez | you can always get more :) |
| 02:29.52 | Sargun | lol |
| 02:30.22 | calvarez | beandog, I suggest the Beijing Institute of Technology |
| 02:30.29 | beandog | go to SUU, thats a *great* school. |
| 02:30.31 | beandog | a little tiny, but great. |
| 02:30.38 | beandog | You know whats cool |
| 02:30.42 | calvarez | http://www.bit.edu/ |
| 02:30.43 | beandog | University is free in Argentina. |
| 02:30.54 | calvarez | yes, and worthless |
| 02:31.02 | calvarez | you get what you pay for |
| 02:31.06 | beandog | well I didnt get much out of it anyway |
| 02:31.11 | beandog | might as well not pay anything at the same time |
| 02:31.37 | calvarez | beandog, seriously, http://www.bit.edu/ is a good option to you |
| 02:31.47 | beandog | lol |
| 02:31.50 | beandog | Beijing? |
| 02:31.55 | beandog | I dont like oriental food. |
| 02:32.06 | beandog | oh man, this website is a shot from 1995. |
| 02:32.19 | calvarez | well, you wanted a school really far from home |
| 02:32.23 | calvarez | that's the one :) |
| 02:32.31 | calvarez | and chinese food rocks :p |
| 02:32.31 | beandog | oh, Im already far enough |
| 02:32.38 | beandog | bleh, cant stand it |
| 02:32.53 | calvarez | man, you're missing out |
| 02:33.09 | calvarez | anyways |
| 02:33.17 | calvarez | night-night time for me |
| 02:33.20 | beandog | alright |
| 02:33.23 | beandog | g'nit calvarez |
| 02:33.25 | calvarez | lata |
| 02:33.27 | beandog | buenas. |
| 02:40.08 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 02:40.58 | tensai | cat /dev/random >/home/elg |
| 02:42.15 | levi_home | Time to finally get around to putting my chess program in a DLL. |
| 02:42.46 | mheath[laptop] | levi_home, you should build a patch for the Windows Vista chess program :P |
| 02:43.07 | levi_home | No thanks. |
| 02:45.51 | mheath[laptop] | Heh. |
| 02:46.02 | mheath[laptop] | Why did UoU give me an acceptance _certificate_? |
| 02:46.21 | levi_home | Being accepted makes you special, and the certificate proves it! |
| 02:46.26 | mheath[laptop] | Apparently. |
| 02:46.37 | elg | -lart tensai |
| 02:46.38 | mheath[laptop] | I mean, I expected the letter, but this is a bit silly and rather worthless |
| 02:46.47 | mheath[laptop] | Woohoo, I was accepted at a state university. |
| 02:46.51 | Sargun | lol |
| 02:47.02 | Sargun | but its UU! |
| 02:47.13 | mheath[laptop] | CERTIFICATE OF ADMISSIONS - This is to certify that Michael T. Heath has been admitted to the University of Utah for Spring 2007 Semester |
| 02:47.21 | Sargun | whats your middle name? |
| 02:47.24 | elg | T |
| 02:47.33 | mheath[laptop] | Signed, Signature I Can't Read, Director of Admissions |
| 02:47.59 | tensai | Tolstoy? |
| 02:48.10 | tensai | Tangy? |
| 02:48.10 | levi_home | Terrence? |
| 02:48.19 | levi_home | Tivoli? |
| 02:48.20 | elg | I shall also attempt to be patient about the arrival of the new macbook |
| 02:48.25 | tensai | Timpani? |
| 02:48.26 | levi_home | Tyson |
| 02:48.32 | levi_home | Tad |
| 02:48.36 | levi_home | Ted |
| 02:48.38 | levi_home | Todd |
| 02:48.46 | elg | Torphe |
| 02:48.47 | tensai | Torvalds |
| 02:48.56 | elg | Targ |
| 02:49.01 | levi_home | Tev |
| 02:49.06 | elg | Tevye |
| 02:49.17 | elg | Transformer |
| 02:49.40 | levi_home | T'Lan |
| 02:50.36 | mheath[laptop] | "There are some who call me......Thomas?" |
| 02:52.17 | tensai | Twinkle-toes |
| 02:52.53 | mheath[laptop] | ERROR - The student ID number you entered is incorrect |
| 02:53.11 | levi_home | I knew a guy whose first name was J. It didn't stand for anything; his name was a letter. |
| 02:53.16 | mheath[laptop] | Its the one they gave me! |
| 02:53.17 | tensai | sounds like it's time to break in |
| 02:53.49 | mheath[laptop] | haha, I had a relative who's middle name was "Junior" because the doctor misunderstood when filling out the birth certificate |
| 02:56.31 | elg | mheath[laptop]: that's why you need the certificate |
| 02:57.08 | elg | to prove to IT that you are accepted |
| 02:58.36 | mheath[laptop] | elg, thats what the letter is for |
| 02:58.39 | mheath[laptop] | But their website is broken |
| 02:58.52 | elg | the letter is for you to attempt to login |
| 02:58.54 | mheath[laptop] | Every other website knows my Student ID is that, except for the page to sign up for orientation |
| 02:59.12 | elg | the certificate is for when you go in to get your account enabled. the IT director will need proof |
| 02:59.52 | levi_home | It's fun watching my chess program trounce the stupid random opponent. |
| 03:00.16 | goozbach | grr |
| 03:00.16 | levi_home | ls |
| 03:00.19 | levi_home | Whoops. |
| 03:00.24 | goozbach | nother evening wasteed |
| 03:00.29 | mheath[laptop] | elg, haha |
| 03:00.47 | goozbach | goodnight moon |
| 03:00.50 | mheath[laptop] | ooh fun |
| 03:01.09 | mheath[laptop] | Sorry, there was an error in processing your last request. This error has been logged; please return later to submit your request again. |
| 03:01.15 | elg | levi_home: that does sound fun |
| 03:01.32 | elg | I'm sitting here studying lambda calculus, operational and denotational semantics |
| 03:01.43 | levi_home | elg: That sounds interesting, if not quite fun. |
| 03:01.44 | elg | and doing my best not to give in to the temptation to write a lambda calculus interpreter |
| 03:01.46 | mheath[laptop] | https://housing.sa.utah.edu/ |
| 03:01.48 | mheath[laptop] | Under Construction |
| 03:02.06 | levi_home | elg: You should write a lambda calculus interpreter for your HP48. |
| 03:02.07 | mheath[laptop] | The site you are trying to view dow not currently have a default page. It may be in the process of being upgraded and configured. |
| 03:02.18 | elg | levi_home: you're not helping. :) |
| 03:02.40 | levi_home | Okay, okay. You should hunker down and do your studying! |
| 03:02.42 | elg | luckily I have no interest in programming my hp48. |
| 03:03.43 | mheath[laptop] | wtf is going on with this website |
| 03:03.51 | mheath[laptop] | Broken link one time |
| 03:03.52 | elg | not until I've figured out how to use it to its full potential, anyhow |
| 03:04.00 | mheath[laptop] | the next time I click it, it says my session has expired |
| 03:04.14 | mheath[laptop] | I go to relogin and now it says my uNID and/or password are invalid |
| 03:04.32 | levi_home | Yay for emacs in X on Windows via cygwin. |
| 03:05.02 | mheath[laptop] | The link to the "Signon Page" refuses to give me anything but an error saying my username or password is invalid |
| 03:05.10 | mheath[laptop] | and I never entered a username or password on said page |
| 03:06.14 | levi_home | Whoops, I don't have an ocaml mode installed on here. |
| 03:06.20 | elg | did you leave your certificate where the page could see it? |
| 03:06.56 | elg | levi_home: what I really want to do is write a RPN calculator with handy CS-related features |
| 03:07.13 | elg | and built-in units |
| 03:07.51 | levi_home | elg: That would be slick. Then you could port it to a microcontroller and build a hardware calculator out of it. |
| 03:08.06 | findlay | levi_home: how hard would that be? |
| 03:08.24 | elg | hmm, could you cannibalize an existing calculator? |
| 03:08.41 | elg | like a $10 TI scientific calculator or something |
| 03:08.47 | findlay | an old HP with those rock solid buttons |
| 03:09.10 | levi_home | You could possibly use the keypad and display from an existing calculator. |
| 03:09.22 | levi_home | But you'd probably want a bigger display than an el-cheapo. |
| 03:09.25 | elg | an HP 12C perhaps |
| 03:09.34 | levi_home | This would not be a cheap thing to do, btw. |
| 03:09.51 | elg | how much is a microcontroller? how do you program them? |
| 03:10.21 | findlay | and some flash memory |
| 03:10.22 | levi_home | Unless you could get samples for all your parts and put everything together on a protype board or a simple two-sided etch board. |
| 03:10.24 | findlay | and some RAM |
| 03:12.01 | elg | I think I'll stick with REP |
| 03:12.16 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166.70.238.250) |
| 03:12.19 | elg | and readline |
| 03:12.24 | elg | maybe curses if I'm ambitious |
| 03:12.41 | findlay | maybe things like that will be cheap and easy to do in the future |
| 03:12.46 | elg | maybe a GUI if I'm masochistic, but it would have to be secondary to the keyboard |
| 03:13.09 | fozzmoo | That's an almost atoponce attitude, elg. :) |
| 03:13.41 | fozzmoo | Well, he'd insist on a specific make and model of keyboard. |
| 03:13.50 | fozzmoo | And if you didn't use that keyboard too, well, you just suck. |
| 03:14.35 | levi_home | findlay: It actually is really cheap compared to what it used to be, but probably outside of an elg-sized budget. |
| 03:14.40 | elg | but for now, it's backburner. though I would like to get the rudimentary arithmetic part up and running soon |
| 03:15.19 | elg | well, technically an elg-sized budget would probably be sufficient, but elg's budget would not |
| 03:16.20 | findlay | levi_home: I imagine a moose's budget is larger than mine, a diminuitive human |
| 03:16.59 | *** join/#utah atoponce (n=aaron@c-24-2-85-66.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 03:17.09 | levi_home | findlay: Moose don't typically carry money, though. They could probably indimidate a human out of his wallet, though. |
| 03:17.20 | fozzmoo | How about those... things?! |
| 03:21.02 | levi_home | Heh, a file named LISEZMOI. |
| 03:22.40 | mheath | This is rediculous. |
| 03:22.41 | levi_home | findlay: No such thing. |
| 03:22.42 | mheath | Gah |
| 03:22.59 | findlay | ~rediculate mheath |
| 03:23.08 | mheath | If I had been in the Marine Corps for literally 1 more day, I would be elligible for $1,034 in GI Bill money. |
| 03:23.25 | mheath | that is freakin rediculous |
| 03:23.28 | mheath | literally 1 more day! |
| 03:23.37 | levi_home | If I had never agreed to let an old roommate move in with me, I'd be over $1000 richer today as well. |
| 03:23.44 | findlay | ha |
| 03:24.07 | mheath | no...this just plain pisses me off. This sucks so bad. |
| 03:24.09 | findlay | levi_home: and then you could make an elg calculator |
| 03:25.08 | mheath | I wonder what the DoD characterizes as "one month" |
| 03:25.15 | mheath | Erm, the VA that is. |
| 03:25.35 | mheath | Because there's an error on my DD214 |
| 03:25.52 | mheath | I served 29 active days of service, this says it was 27. |
| 03:27.16 | mheath | Does 29 days qualify as "One month"? |
| 03:27.49 | Sargun | yeah |
| 03:29.34 | findlay | nothing is fun when your system works as expected |
| 03:29.54 | findlay | much to the chagrin of levi_home |
| 03:30.34 | levi_home | Heh. |
| 03:32.29 | mheath | jeez, not even the DD214 Preperation Instructions define what a month is. |
| 03:33.02 | elg | a month is 5 days, unless there's a thursday in there |
| 03:33.23 | tensai | ~rlart |
| 03:33.32 | findlay | I thought months were depreciated at y2k |
| 03:33.34 | tensai | ~month |
| 03:34.02 | findlay | everybody uses internet time now, right? |
| 03:34.44 | tensai | ibot: month is 5 days, unless there's a thursday in there |
| 03:34.45 | ibot | tensai: okay |
| 03:35.20 | goozbach | great mashup: http://www.q-unit.net/ |
| 03:35.49 | Sargun | levi_home, what is he doing? |
| 03:37.02 | findlay | Sargun: he's thinking up a diabolical plan to replace all drum "music" with lemons |
| 03:37.52 | Sargun | uhh |
| 03:38.00 | Sargun | his rejected room mate |
| 03:38.07 | tensai | ~lart CSI: Miami |
| 03:38.30 | levi_home | Sargun: I have no idea what you're talking about. |
| 03:38.41 | Sargun | levi_home If I had never agreed to let an old roommate move in with me, I'd be over $1000 richer today as well. |
| 03:38.54 | levi_home | Sargun: He didn't pay rent. |
| 03:39.04 | levi_home | Sargun: And he never paid me back after I kicked him out. |
| 03:39.08 | Sargun | oh |
| 03:39.14 | Sargun | lol |
| 03:39.19 | findlay | indeed |
| 03:39.23 | Sargun | the suck |
| 03:39.32 | levi_home | He broke one of my bikes, too. |
| 03:39.50 | levi_home | Because he was obese. |
| 03:40.02 | findlay | but did he ever become diabolical? |
| 03:40.07 | levi_home | And he tried to ride it on icy roads. |
| 03:40.15 | findlay | or at least hyperbolical? |
| 03:40.16 | Sargun | uhh |
| 03:40.29 | findlay | ~uhh |
| 03:40.38 | findlay | ~uh |
| 03:40.40 | ibot | rumour has it, uh is gay |
| 03:40.43 | findlay | ~u |
| 03:40.45 | ibot | It's YOU. Y-O-U. Not *U*. U is a letter. YOU is a word. See ne1.. See http://wooledge.org/~greg/uf20041201.png |
| 03:40.47 | goozbach | gay! |
| 03:40.58 | findlay | ~v |
| 03:40.59 | ibot | Portable C++ GUI Framework. URL: http://objectcentral.com/ |
| 03:41.02 | findlay | ~w |
| 03:41.04 | ibot | hmm... w is http://new.linuxnow.com/docs/content/XWindow-User-HOWTO-html/XWindow-User-HOWTO-2.html |
| 03:41.07 | levi_home | ~x |
| 03:41.10 | findlay | ~y |
| 03:41.12 | ibot | somebody said y was 2 |
| 03:41.15 | findlay | ~z |
| 03:41.16 | ibot | z is, like, zaurus, or the disease bzflag admins get when they play too much |
| 03:41.33 | findlay | ~Fermat |
| 03:41.51 | levi_home | ~x en de I would like some sausage. |
| 03:42.11 | findlay | ibot: Fermat is the Prince of Amateurs |
| 03:42.13 | ibot | okay, findlay |
| 03:42.34 | elg | ~x en es I would like to kick a horse |
| 03:42.45 | levi_home | El pie! |
| 03:42.47 | findlay | ibot: Gauss is the Prince of Mathematicians |
| 03:42.48 | ibot | findlay: okay |
| 03:42.53 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en jp Test |
| 03:43.04 | mheath[laptop] | Oh yeah |
| 03:43.04 | elg | wouldn't that be prince of mathematics |
| 03:43.11 | elg | ~x en jp Paperclip |
| 03:43.17 | mheath[laptop] | haha |
| 03:43.27 | elg | ~x en jp moose |
| 03:43.35 | findlay | ~x en cn duh |
| 03:43.42 | levi_home | Silly elg, they don't have moose in Japan! |
| 03:43.48 | Sargun | lol |
| 03:43.53 | elg | 21:43 -!- アメリカヘラジカ Erroneous Nickname |
| 03:43.55 | findlay | ~x en cn heh |
| 03:43.57 | mheath[laptop] | Apparently they have more moose than paperclips |
| 03:43.57 | tensai | elg: it translates as american deer |
| 03:44.11 | levi_home | ~x en jp house |
| 03:44.13 | elg | tensai: hehe |
| 03:44.25 | tensai | which reads as "ie" |
| 03:44.30 | findlay | ~x en jp ? |
| 03:44.33 | elg | ~x en jp lol |
| 03:44.44 | levi_home | Alas, putty doesn't display unicode. |
| 03:44.46 | mheath[laptop] | ka. |
| 03:44.51 | mheath[laptop] | erm |
| 03:44.56 | findlay | so ? in English is ?? in Japanese |
| 03:45.00 | elg | levi_home: it can, with some persuasion |
| 03:45.01 | mheath[laptop] | What is that? |
| 03:45.03 | elg | and the right fonts |
| 03:45.11 | levi_home | elg: I'm not that concerned about it. |
| 03:45.11 | atoponce | hmmm |
| 03:45.24 | levi_home | ~x en fr Would you like some cheese? |
| 03:45.27 | mheath[laptop] | tensai, what is that character it spat out for ? |
| 03:45.37 | tensai | that would be "ka" |
| 03:45.41 | elg | ~x en es the sink is old and moldy |
| 03:45.42 | levi_home | ~x en fr I would like some cheese please. |
| 03:45.49 | atoponce | how can i list the users under a given hostname? it seems to me to use nickserv, but i can't remember the syntax |
| 03:45.52 | elg | y moldy, huh |
| 03:45.52 | levi_home | svp? |
| 03:46.08 | levi_home | I guess I'm supposed to expand that. |
| 03:46.11 | mheath[laptop] | tensai, eh? I didn't think that ka had any added punctuation. Hmmm. |
| 03:46.35 | levi_home | ~x en fr I like frogs. |
| 03:46.45 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en fr I do not care for Mister Levi's cheese. |
| 03:46.49 | levi_home | ~ex en fr Run away! |
| 03:47.07 | tensai | mheath[laptop]: you can add "ka" to turn a statement into a question. it's not punctuation, per se, but similar. |
| 03:47.09 | levi_home | ~x en fr Run away! |
| 03:47.26 | levi_home | ~x en fr I surrender! |
| 03:47.47 | elg | ~x en fr I shall ever be in your debt, my lady, for the fact that you expunged the riffraff from the kitchen. |
| 03:47.49 | mheath[laptop] | tensai, I know thats what ka did, I know a bit of Japanese....I learned most of the katakana symbols at one time, and I thought ka didn't have the extra circle or tick mark (who's names escape me at the moment) |
| 03:48.06 | levi_home | ~x en fr Go away or I will taunt you a second time. |
| 03:48.15 | elg | hehe |
| 03:48.21 | tensai | mheath[laptop]: the circle is a period. the tick is part of the character. it's hiragana, not katakana |
| 03:48.42 | mheath[laptop] | agh, hiragana. Shows how much I forgot :P |
| 03:48.59 | levi_home | I used to have all the hiragana and katakana characters memorized. |
| 03:49.05 | levi_home | They went away pretty quickly. |
| 03:49.16 | mheath[laptop] | levi_home, same here :P |
| 03:49.29 | levi_home | ~en fr I have no desire to learn them again. |
| 03:49.37 | levi_home | ~x en fr I have no desire to learn them again. |
| 03:49.56 | levi_home | ~x en fr I can speak French! |
| 03:50.11 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en fr No! It is Edmond Dantes returned from the dead! He is here to kill Villefort. |
| 03:50.25 | tensai | mheath[laptop]: the double tick marks that e.g. turn ka into ga are called "ten ten" the circle which turns ho into po is called "maru" (circle). |
| 03:50.31 | levi_home | ~x en fr Would you buy me a baguette? |
| 03:50.43 | mheath[laptop] | tensai, Ahh! thanks. Stuff I learned before and forgot :P |
| 03:51.00 | mheath[laptop] | Maybe I'll take Japanese at the UoU to satisfy my foreign langauge requirement. |
| 03:51.08 | *** part/#utah beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 03:51.11 | levi_home | ~x en fr mheath should learn French instead. |
| 03:51.18 | mheath[laptop] | If their website ever gets unbroken and lets me sign up for orientation |
| 03:51.27 | mheath[laptop] | I am "the mheath" now? |
| 03:51.52 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en fr Levi is correct. Then I could read The Count of Monte-Christo in the original French. |
| 03:52.14 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en fr I seem to have lost a period somewhere. |
| 03:52.59 | levi_home | ~x en it Does this work? |
| 03:53.18 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en ru Come my comrade! |
| 03:53.37 | levi_home | ~x en it Or you could learn Italian and read Dante in his native tongue. |
| 03:53.38 | Sargun | why is my bandwidth dying? |
| 03:54.05 | levi_home | ~x en it Plus, you would know how to order when you went to a restaurant in Italy. |
| 03:54.14 | mheath[laptop] | ~xn en ru Because, Sargun, you are getting flooded with nasty UTF-8 characters! An extra few bits! |
| 03:54.16 | ibot | mheath[laptop]: what are you talking about? |
| 03:54.28 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en ru Because, Sargun, you are getting flooded with nasty UTF-8 characters! An extra few bits! |
| 03:54.41 | levi_home | ~x en it I'm the operator of my pocket calculator. |
| 03:54.50 | Sargun | lol |
| 03:54.59 | Sargun | /ignore mheath[laptop] |
| 03:55.04 | Sargun | /ignore mheath |
| 03:55.04 | Sargun | /ignore ibot |
| 03:55.06 | Sargun | /ignore levi |
| 03:55.07 | Sargun | /ignore levi_home |
| 03:55.13 | levi_home | ~x en it When I press a special key it plays a little melody. |
| 03:55.14 | findlay | ~x it en Giuseppi Verdi |
| 03:55.34 | findlay | ibot: no, it's joe Green |
| 03:55.54 | levi_home | That's enough tormenting the poor bot with translation duties. |
| 03:56.07 | findlay | ~~ |
| 03:56.08 | ibot | Every moment in which im called upon is torture |
| 03:57.11 | mheath[laptop] | ~free ibot |
| 03:57.29 | elg | ~malloc ibot |
| 03:57.36 | mheath[laptop] | ~it ibot |
| 03:57.38 | ibot | So we want to be stupid, right, ibot ? Fine, pushups, right now. OK, side straddle hops, right now. OK, run in place, right now. I didn't say stop! |
| 03:58.00 | elg | ~x en de I am the operator of my pocket calculator |
| 03:58.05 | findlay | ~done |
| 03:58.35 | elg | levi_home: I remember now, I might needn't write that calculator after all |
| 03:58.39 | elg | someone did it in OCaml already |
| 03:58.51 | elg | http://www.eecs.umich.edu/~pelzlpj/orpie/ |
| 03:58.53 | levi_home | elg: Ahh, nifty. |
| 03:58.58 | mheath[laptop] | ~x en de findlay, you are under arrest for excessive use of the robot. |
| 03:59.34 | levi_home | elg: That looks pretty slick. |
| 04:00.26 | elg | it is. I'm trying to remember why I didn't get in the habit of using it last time I found it |
| 04:00.40 | elg | probably because I wasn't doing much number crunching then, and couldn't remember the name after time |
| 04:00.49 | elg | I'll alias rpn=orpie in my .bashrcs |
| 04:01.48 | mheath[laptop] | elg, I saw something a LOT like that...... |
| 04:01.54 | elg | wow, it even remembers the stack between invocations |
| 04:01.57 | mheath[laptop] | but I can't for the life of me remember where it was |
| 04:02.06 | mheath[laptop] | it was a GUI app, and it had graphing support |
| 04:03.41 | mheath[laptop] | elg, ah. Power Calculator. Part of the MS Windows XP PowerToys. |
| 04:05.45 | mheath[laptop] | Bah |
| 04:05.50 | elg | actually a gui calculator would be a lot unlike orpie |
| 04:05.59 | mheath[laptop] | elg, no, its the same concept |
| 04:06.04 | mheath[laptop] | text entry with keyboard characters |
| 04:06.26 | levi_home | mheath[laptop]: Reverse polish notation? |
| 04:06.28 | elg | kind of like how word is the same concept as vim |
| 04:06.54 | mheath[laptop] | elg, it has GUI strictly so it can support graphing. |
| 04:07.07 | mheath[laptop] | The expression entry is all text based |
| 04:07.18 | mheath[laptop] | with a text buffer, with responses returned in said buffer |
| 04:07.30 | mheath[laptop] | there are no simulated buttons to click like the standard XP calculator |
| 04:07.31 | levi_home | But does it use reverse polish notation? |
| 04:07.38 | levi_home | That's the key point. |
| 04:12.36 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-8-157.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 04:13.02 | atoponce | /who <pattern> |
| 04:13.04 | atoponce | got it |
| 04:13.49 | levi_home | Anyone know of a utility to spin down a hard drive in Windows? |
| 04:14.31 | fozzmoo | Power switch? |
| 04:14.37 | tensai | can't you set the power control features? |
| 04:14.59 | levi_home | Yeah, I just found that. |
| 04:15.15 | levi_home | I don't know if it will leave my inactive drives spun down, though. |
| 04:17.33 | tensai | until they're accessed again I would think |
| 04:17.39 | elg | trust is an entirely separate issue |
| 04:18.10 | levi_home | I would like to spin them down and unmount them, but I may just have to shut down and unplug them. |
| 04:21.44 | *** join/#utah calvarez (n=calvarez@r82h185.res.gatech.edu) |
| 04:21.48 | calvarez | argh |
| 04:21.53 | levi_home | Well, I think that's enough fiddling with ocaml for one night. |
| 04:21.54 | calvarez | can't go to sleep |
| 04:22.13 | elg | dream of llamas |
| 04:22.28 | elg | that will help you sleep |
| 04:22.57 | calvarez | talking about llama-like animals, I went to the Thanksgiving Point petting farm a couple of months ago and I got spit by a guanaco |
| 04:23.05 | elg | wow |
| 04:23.10 | calvarez | it was funny |
| 04:23.12 | elg | how did it get you in its mouth? |
| 04:23.25 | elg | did you ever go to the llama festival? that was cool |
| 04:23.26 | calvarez | meh |
| 04:23.36 | calvarez | I was spit at by a guanaco |
| 04:23.57 | elg | still a nice story. not nearly as sensational though |
| 04:24.01 | elg | I say stick with the first one |
| 04:24.18 | calvarez | I stretched my hand at it (it worked well with sheep, they thought I had food and they would come), but the guanaco spit at my hand |
| 04:25.55 | elg | what part of chile? |
| 04:35.01 | *** join/#utah el_gaucho (n=bigdog@zeus.thebigdog.biz) |
| 04:36.21 | Sargun | porque to hablas espanol en el channel de utah? |
| 04:37.45 | elg | porque utah ya esta parte del mejico |
| 04:37.52 | atoponce | sì |
| 04:41.08 | calvarez | lol |
| 04:41.12 | calvarez | I'm from Santiago |
| 04:41.29 | calvarez | ooo, gaucho |
| 04:42.11 | elg | chilean is nice. I heard just about every country's accent |
| 04:42.19 | elg | ecuatoriano is my favorite |
| 04:43.23 | elg | mexican is silly, but not nearly as silly as los boricuos |
| 04:43.48 | elg | (the ricans) |
| 04:45.50 | elg | well I'm off to join the deli llama |
| 04:47.11 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-75-0-136-70.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 05:06.58 | mheath[laptop] | Wow. Theres still archives of that on the internet... |
| 05:07.17 | mheath[laptop] | Its really scary what stuff you can find in a google search that you never expected to find. |
| 05:18.10 | Sargun | Nuclear weapons! |
| 05:22.31 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, or bad internet radio shows I put together when I was 13 years old. |
| 05:22.44 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:22.50 | Sargun | linkage? |
| 05:23.03 | mheath[laptop] | No. |
| 05:23.22 | mheath[laptop] | And, thank god, I don't think there is any google query that would connect 'mheath' with it. |
| 05:23.35 | mheath[laptop] | Went by a different nick back then. |
| 05:30.50 | mheath[laptop] | yah, I'm safe. even if you google for mheath and the actual name of it, it doesn't show up |
| 05:31.16 | Sargun | why'd you change nicks? |
| 05:31.32 | mheath[laptop] | Something more professional. |
| 05:32.06 | mheath[laptop] | My previous one I'd used for YEARS. My nickname on Blizzard's Battle.net to play warcraft II and starcraft back when I was around 8 or 9 years old. |
| 05:33.41 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:33.53 | Sargun | you played starcraft? |
| 05:34.01 | Sargun | you don't seem like a star craft guy |
| 05:34.07 | Sargun | CIV IIV maybe |
| 05:34.09 | mheath[laptop] | I kicked butt at starcraft. |
| 05:40.21 | Sargun | heh |
| 05:40.31 | Sargun | what race did you play? |
| 05:40.34 | mheath[laptop] | jeez, awkward pauses. this is the worlds worst radio show. |
| 05:40.39 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:40.40 | Sargun | c'mon |
| 05:40.44 | Sargun | let #utah see! |
| 05:40.45 | mheath[laptop] | And this is a marathon episode. 4 hours long. |
| 05:41.18 | Sargun | Is rsimpkins stupid or just asking too many questions? 40.9% lines contained a question! |
| 05:41.19 | Sargun | lol |
| 05:41.31 | mheath[laptop] | I have a cohost, but because our method of connecting was a $5 microphone duct taped to a $10 walmart telephone, things didn't always work out. |
| 05:41.56 | Sargun | ~bake emcnabb |
| 05:41.58 | ibot | I think you mean ~cook emcnabb, sargun |
| 05:42.03 | Sargun | ~cook emcnabb |
| 05:42.04 | ibot | ACTION throws emcnabb in a big pan with veggies inside and cooks emcnabb on 350 for an hour |
| 05:42.34 | Sargun | mheath, why didn't you use a Y-connector |
| 05:42.38 | Sargun | and join them? |
| 05:42.52 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, because I was 13 years old and a moron? |
| 05:42.59 | Sargun | heh |
| 05:43.04 | mheath[laptop] | Most active nicks |
| 05:43.11 | mheath[laptop] | 1. mheath |
| 05:43.13 | mheath[laptop] | hahah! |
| 05:43.17 | Sargun | 2 there 39 Sargun |
| 05:43.17 | Sargun | 3 think 29 Sargun |
| 05:43.17 | Sargun | 4 people 21 Sargun |
| 05:43.23 | Sargun | Thing |
| 05:43.24 | Sargun | heath |
| 05:43.26 | Sargun | google! |
| 05:44.16 | Sargun | Nobody is foul-mouthed in #Utah! Get out much? |
| 05:44.53 | mheath[laptop] | No. |
| 05:44.59 | Sargun | me neither |
| 05:45.05 | Sargun | how was being a host? |
| 05:45.11 | Sargun | meet any interesting people? |
| 05:45.18 | mheath[laptop] | mheath spoke a total of 1934 words! |
| 05:45.34 | mheath[laptop] | mheath's faithful follower, elg, didn't speak so much: 969 words. |
| 05:45.35 | Sargun | scott wrote an average of 42.00 words per line. |
| 05:45.43 | Sargun | scott is the answer to the universe |
| 05:50.42 | Sargun | heh |
| 05:50.54 | Sargun | what audio editor did you use? |
| 05:50.57 | Sargun | audacity |
| 05:51.02 | Sargun | or did you use windows? |
| 05:51.07 | Sargun | er |
| 05:51.11 | Sargun | window's sound recorder |
| 05:51.20 | mheath[laptop] | I'm now recommending that my cohost microwaves a video card live on the air. |
| 05:51.36 | Sargun | LOL |
| 05:51.36 | mheath[laptop] | "A little friendly radiation won't hurt you." |
| 05:51.41 | nick125_lappy | a nvidia geforce 7950GTX |
| 05:51.44 | Sargun | please! |
| 05:51.46 | Sargun | send that clip |
| 05:51.55 | nick125_lappy | definitely! |
| 05:52.13 | mheath[laptop] | No. |
| 05:52.27 | Sargun | 2 against 1! |
| 05:52.48 | mheath[laptop] | I'm a complete moron in these. the only people who deliver any decent content or interesting conversation is my cohost and guests. |
| 05:52.52 | mheath[laptop] | this was like 4 years ago. |
| 05:53.04 | Sargun | c'mon you've heard me be a complete moron |
| 05:53.15 | Sargun | mheath, "The father of podcasting" |
| 05:53.16 | Sargun | er |
| 05:53.24 | Sargun | the "The podcasting boy wonder" |
| 05:56.44 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, I'm trying to get together with my old cohost to do a new episode of this. |
| 05:57.08 | Sargun | you still keep in contact with him? |
| 05:57.26 | Sargun | or is like one of those life-long journey things :-P |
| 05:58.29 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, He ended up hating me, and we never talked for a long time. Talked to him recently,though |
| 05:59.06 | Sargun | :-/ |
| 05:59.12 | Sargun | Can I ask what happened |
| 05:59.29 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, I was 13 the last time I talked to him. |
| 05:59.33 | mheath[laptop] | I don't remember or care. |
| 05:59.37 | mheath[laptop] | I was a freakin kid then |
| 05:59.52 | Sargun | pre-teen :-P |
| 06:00.35 | mheath[laptop] | Sorry, no. |
| 06:06.20 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166.70.238.250) |
| 06:19.58 | mheath[laptop] | Sigh. This thing goes on for like 3 more hours |
| 06:20.00 | mheath[laptop] | Goodnight. |
| 06:20.02 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=mrpull@205.158.184.126) |
| 06:20.13 | mheath[laptop] | Sargun, really want a link? |
| 06:26.48 | Sargun | yeah |
| 06:26.52 | Sargun | :-) |
| 09:40.56 | *** join/#utah dilvie (n=chatzill@c-67-166-126-133.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 12:28.41 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@000-242-432.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 12:45.40 | *** join/#utah graphyx (n=graphyx@205.208.245.105) |
| 12:51.15 | goozbach | GOOD MORNING #utah! |
| 12:51.22 | goozbach | what is wrong with me? |
| 12:52.22 | graphyx | you are up early? |
| 13:00.26 | goozbach | and I'm in a good mood |
| 13:00.37 | goozbach | I actually said "good morning" |
| 13:00.37 | graphyx | There isn't anything wrong with that. |
| 13:00.41 | graphyx | I didn't get a lot of sleep. |
| 13:08.12 | redbeard1 | i never get a lot of sleep |
| 13:09.19 | graphyx | well I went to bed at 11:00 |
| 13:09.24 | graphyx | my wife woke me up at 2:20 |
| 13:10.25 | graphyx | And through a bit of insomnia and a long string of other things including (With the window open) the paperboys cell phone, a bird that sounded like a car alarm, a loud truck that didn't drive off for a long time, my kid who wasn't sleeping well (got out of bed 5 times) my daughter needing a klenex and couldn't find one... |
| 13:10.42 | graphyx | It was a long night. |
| 13:19.51 | redbeard1 | dude, that does suck |
| 13:21.27 | graphyx | oh I forgot to add I live .5 miles from the train track (There is a small hill between the house and the tracks. |
| 13:21.33 | graphyx | And .5 from the highway. |
| 13:22.07 | graphyx | It's a smaller city so the trains blow their horns the entire way through town since the roads all cross the tracks. |
| 13:22.13 | graphyx | very few overpasses. |
| 13:22.18 | graphyx | so that didn't help either. |
| 13:25.43 | *** join/#utah atoponce (n=aaron@c-24-2-85-66.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 13:30.55 | maquis | ~lart goozbach |
| 13:39.03 | emcnabb | goozbach: did you did you ever figure out your FDS/RHDS problems? |
| 13:45.28 | graphyx | Fds = Fedora something.. RHDS = Redhat somethig, whats the DS mean? |
| 13:51.05 | emcnabb | directory server |
| 13:51.45 | graphyx | Ok. |
| 13:52.20 | goozbach | emcnabb: no but I've got a band-aid on it |
| 13:52.36 | goozbach | a cron job that attempts to re-start the server every minute |
| 13:52.47 | graphyx | ouch... |
| 13:52.47 | goozbach | so it's down at most one minute each time |
| 13:52.58 | goozbach | I'm working on it though |
| 13:57.36 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@000-242-432.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 14:00.04 | levi | Good morning. |
| 14:05.56 | redbeard1 | today's lesson: if you really want to be popular with the referer spammers, make sure to blog about mod_security |
| 14:06.27 | elg | -lart tensai |
| 14:06.43 | redbeard1 | ~lart elg |
| 14:07.50 | redbeard1 | ever since i blogged about mod_security last month, i've been getting one hit an hour (at the same time every hour) from three different pr0n sites, on my mod_security post |
| 14:08.56 | redbeard1 | but i didn't notice they were still hitting me until i grepped my logs for 406 status codes (generated by mod_security) |
| 14:08.57 | elg | what does mod_security have to do with pr0n |
| 14:09.27 | redbeard1 | elg: maybe the pr0nsters have been having a lot of security issues lately? |
| 14:10.45 | emcnabb | maybe there's some stuff on redbeard1's blog I don't want to look at :-) |
| 14:11.21 | redbeard1 | emcnabb: there used to be some stuff in redbeard1's stats that you wouldn't want to look at... until mod_security was installed |
| 14:12.29 | graphyx | redbeard1: Did the sites publish links to their sites on the blog or something? |
| 14:12.54 | redbeard1 | graphyx: nope. they're just using a spider with pr0n sites as the referer |
| 14:13.08 | graphyx | What does that accomplish? |
| 14:13.10 | *** join/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 14:13.16 | graphyx | People visit the refering site to see who spidered them? |
| 14:13.20 | graphyx | or who is linking to them? |
| 14:13.34 | redbeard1 | graphyx: yeah |
| 14:13.41 | levi | Some people publish their referrer lists. |
| 14:13.53 | graphyx | levi interesting. |
| 14:13.54 | redbeard1 | what's interesting tho is that ever since i started adding sites like learnonline-degrees.com and getajob-employment.com to my mod_security blacklist, those ones have stopped trying. but that is about when the pr0n sites started showing up. so maybe they're getting revenge? |
| 14:13.55 | levi | Apparently, enough to make widespread referrer spam profitable. |
| 14:14.21 | graphyx | redbeard1: What do you do with the mod_security? |
| 14:15.02 | graphyx | Just strip out the referrer tag for the listed sites? |
| 14:15.28 | redbeard1 | graphyx: i added a blacklist. they have a default one linked to from their site, it's mostly spam sites and pr0n sites. mod_security returns "406 Not acceptable to client" to any site on the blacklist. |
| 14:16.08 | graphyx | so that would mean that any site on the list wouldn't be able to link to your site. IE if referer: site.xxx, => 406, right? |
| 14:16.34 | redbeard1 | exactly |
| 14:16.59 | graphyx | Ok. |
| 14:17.07 | redbeard1 | unfortunately, *.blogspot.com was apparently on the list, so i found a handful of sites (including a couple of friends) that tried unsuccessfully to link to me |
| 14:17.23 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 14:17.23 | graphyx | Gotta check the defaults. |
| 14:17.32 | graphyx | So it's like a rule based IPS for the web server. |
| 14:17.37 | redbeard1 | yeah |
| 14:17.45 | redbeard1 | that default blacklist is huge tho |
| 14:17.48 | graphyx | can you do whitelisting security? |
| 14:17.54 | redbeard1 | sure |
| 14:18.11 | graphyx | IE, don't accepted get requests with fields or POSTS except for the following pages? |
| 14:18.21 | redbeard1 | yeah, you can do that |
| 14:18.30 | graphyx | I always thought that would be the ideal way of doing a web server application firewall. |
| 14:18.31 | graphyx | Whitelist it. |
| 14:18.46 | graphyx | And then only add the expected content for the application pages. |
| 14:18.57 | redbeard1 | bonus: since those sites still show up in your logs, you can also whitelist and blacklist sites in awstats |
| 14:18.58 | graphyx | so that you can't inject php or sql or whatever. |
| 14:19.14 | graphyx | What does awstats really do? |
| 14:19.20 | redbeard1 | graphyx: there's a php/sql/etc injection set of rules that you can download too |
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| 14:19.27 | graphyx | cool. |
| 14:20.06 | redbeard1 | awstats is just a stats program. but it took me by surprise the first time i found an explicit domain name in it while i was looking at my stats at work |
| 14:20.55 | graphyx | Oh.. |
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| 14:24.37 | redbeard1 | i'm doing an awstats presentation tomorrow too... thanks to all that, there shouldn't be any surprise domain names popping up in the middle of my presentation |
| 14:25.10 | elg | redbeard1: where's all the fun? |
| 14:25.28 | elg | I could arrange for harley's web site to show up, for example |
| 14:26.13 | redbeard1 | heh |
| 14:26.48 | mheath[laptop] | ~lart UoU's broken website |
| 14:29.32 | goozbach | elg: makethebadmanstop.info? |
| 14:29.55 | goozbach | harley in a dress doing the m. Monroe vent pose? |
| 14:29.59 | graphyx | redbeard1: That would be a bit interesting. |
| 14:30.52 | graphyx | redbeard1: reminds me of the defcon presentation where Fyodor decided to do an nmap scan of playboy and found a webserver with lots of images. There were only navigation images, but his crowd was very focused.. |
| 14:33.23 | *** join/#utah scothoser (n=scothose@wifi-177145.aoce.utah.edu) |
| 14:33.29 | scothoser | Morning everyone! |
| 14:36.19 | mheath | scothoser: good morning. I just signed up an orientation up there. |
| 14:36.54 | mheath | *up for an |
| 14:37.13 | scothoser | Sweet! It's generally pretty boring, but you do get the chance to meet one of the professors from the department you want your major in. That's always pretty cool. |
| 14:38.10 | mheath | scothoser: I'm sure it will be boring, but the process of registering and such is foreign to me, and I've never been on the UoU campus really |
| 14:38.26 | mheath | I'd have no idea what to do or who to talk to without orientation. Besides, apparently it's mandatory at UoU |
| 14:39.13 | mheath | scothoser: I'm going to apply for housing soon, too, but their website says they won't have very many rooms avaialble until December. |
| 14:39.22 | mheath | (when people tell them they won't be returning) |
| 14:39.41 | scothoser | Yes, it is. I had to go through it back in the day.. It's a good time to take a nap during the incredibly biased speeches. ^_^ But once you get to the tour and get to meet the professors, it's worth it. |
| 14:39.57 | scothoser | Yes, this is actually the first year that housing has been full. |
| 14:40.28 | mheath | The only rooms they list as open ATM are a few rooms in "813 Sage Point" |
| 14:41.02 | mheath | scothoser: I was trying to do this stuff last night, but I discovered that the UoU website is VERY broken late at night |
| 14:41.17 | mheath | Their availability statement said everything should work until midnight daily |
| 14:41.29 | mheath | But I was browing at around 10PM and their entire login system was crippled |
| 14:42.01 | scothoser | Hmm. Interesting.. |
| 14:42.01 | mheath | (Invalid IDs when it was valid, error pages that would just take you back to themselves when you clicked on 'log in again') |
| 14:43.20 | scothoser | I'll check with one of the web developers.. See what the problem may have been. |
| 14:43.46 | graphyx | redbeard1: I am getting frustrated with this dev group. |
| 14:44.06 | graphyx | I told them that their password generation was bad. I sent them a code snip that would have done the job properly. |
| 14:44.18 | graphyx | They send me back the patch that they are putting in place which isn't any better. |
| 14:45.04 | graphyx | They send srand with time('s') and that only generates 1 password per time unit. |
| 14:45.07 | graphyx | second. |
| 14:45.16 | graphyx | so back to the board. |
| 14:49.05 | redbeard1 | graphyx: i hate that. i had that problem with a client in orem. they were using vb on their end and couldn't figure out how to do an md5. i even sent them a direct code snippet in vb, with instructions on how to use it, and they still couldn't do it |
| 14:49.40 | graphyx | Time to find new people to work with. |
| 14:49.57 | redbeard1 | no kidding |
| 14:50.05 | redbeard1 | vantage, that was the company's name |
| 14:50.32 | redbeard1 | their web guy had just come from marketing... was only a month or two into learning how to code |
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| 14:51.24 | scothoser | redbeard1: That explains why they were using vb. |
| 14:52.02 | redbeard1 | scothoser: they were a total microsoft shop, and it showed. they'd ask us for something and i'd have it for them in an hour. i'd ask them for something, and it would take a week. |
| 14:53.53 | scothoser | ^_^ Sounds like the programmers of our main tools at eBay. That's why a portion of the team started developing their own tools on Linux... They needed the tools sooner than 3 months in the future. |
| 14:54.08 | scothoser | And, interestingly enough, the Linux tools worked better.. No VB garbage. |
| 14:54.28 | scothoser | And they were all in PHP or Perl. |
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| 15:12.59 | goozbach | buhahahaha |
| 15:13.09 | goozbach | Caos is now running on my system |
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| 15:35.51 | mheath[laptop] | Oh, fun. |
| 15:36.07 | mheath[laptop] | North Korea is now threatening an eminent nuclear attack. |
| 15:37.22 | mheath[laptop] | We're going to war in the next 5 years. I guarantee yu. |
| 15:37.23 | mheath[laptop] | *you. |
| 15:37.32 | mheath[laptop] | Probably much, much less |
| 15:38.23 | graphyx | You trying to find a scenario in which you get drafted? |
| 15:38.31 | mheath[laptop] | graphyx, yes :P |
| 15:38.52 | mheath[laptop] | I'm wondering if I could minimalize my problems and get drafted, if they ever had a draft |
| 15:39.01 | mheath[laptop] | But, seriously, I think we will go to war with N. Korea soon. |
| 15:39.12 | mheath[laptop] | They're supposedly outright threatening a nuclear attack now. |
| 15:39.15 | ^Migs^ | It's inevitable |
| 15:39.23 | ^Migs^ | War with Korea makes this whole thing World War III |
| 15:39.32 | mheath[laptop] | Two scenarios as I see it |
| 15:39.38 | mheath[laptop] | If they launch a successful nuclear attack |
| 15:39.51 | graphyx | IT's the end of the world. |
| 15:39.56 | mheath[laptop] | 1) We nuke + bomb them, flattening their country; China will get pissed off, and start a war with us |
| 15:39.57 | mheath[laptop] | or |
| 15:40.00 | graphyx | Everyone break out Revelations!! |
| 15:40.04 | mheath[laptop] | 2) We start a tedious long ground attack |
| 15:40.06 | ^Migs^ | why would China get pissed off? |
| 15:40.16 | ^Migs^ | it's Revelation. Singular. HTH. |
| 15:40.23 | mheath[laptop] | ^Migs^, their friends with China and always get pissed off when we try to do something even as major as trade sanctions. |
| 15:40.36 | ^Migs^ | they're not THAT friendly with China |
| 15:40.39 | mheath[laptop] | ^Migs^, I thought he had several revelations? |
| 15:40.50 | ^Migs^ | the book itself is called Revelation, not Revelations. |
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| 15:42.04 | mheath[laptop] | Gah, I really wish I could find out who made this pen |
| 15:42.04 | ^Migs^ | I think North Korea is more likely to launch chemical attacks if anything |
| 15:42.20 | mheath[laptop] | I love this pen for work...Its so reliable, writes well. And its just a cheap ballpoint pen |
| 15:42.21 | levi | NKs 'friends' are unhappy about the nuclear test, too. |
| 15:42.39 | ^Migs^ | yeah, even they realize that NK shouldn't have nukes |
| 15:42.41 | mheath[laptop] | levi: Yes, I know. My point was that they'd be even more unhappy with a major retaliation by the USA |
| 15:42.51 | levi | mheath: Plus it says USMC on it, or something like that. That makes it better automatically. :P |
| 15:43.09 | mheath[laptop] | levi: Nah. It has NO branding on it, actually |
| 15:43.14 | mheath[laptop] | meaning I can't figure otu who made it |
| 15:43.31 | mheath[laptop] | But it is one of the inksticks I got in boot |
| 15:43.31 | levi | Just plain black with a metal band around the middle? |
| 15:43.40 | levi | And a metal clicker? |
| 15:43.43 | mheath[laptop] | levi: yeah. |
| 15:44.16 | levi | Those are probably standard gov't issue pens. |
| 15:44.49 | mheath[laptop] | levi: Any idea where I could get some more? |
| 15:46.33 | ^Migs^ | how many nukes does the U.S. have? |
| 15:47.38 | mheath[laptop] | ^Migs^, still, a whole bunch. |
| 15:47.54 | redbeard1 | north korea has one less. |
| 15:48.34 | ^Migs^ | if NK actually launched a nuke against the U.S., would the U.S. retailate with nukes? |
| 15:49.01 | ^Migs^ | it would be so easy to wipe NK off the face of the planet |
| 15:49.09 | mheath[laptop] | ^Migs^, NK can't launch a nuke against the USA |
| 15:49.23 | mheath[laptop] | their 'long range missile' (that could barely hit SOME parts of Japan), failed its test a while back |
| 15:49.29 | ^Migs^ | no no, I'm thinking way down the road |
| 15:49.29 | mheath[laptop] | South Korea would be the likely choice |
| 15:49.32 | ^Migs^ | like, years and years |
| 15:49.37 | jsmith | Or Japan |
| 15:49.48 | ^Migs^ | keep in mind that many U.S. troops are in South Korea, too |
| 15:50.11 | ^Migs^ | different scenario then. If they launched one against SK, would the U.S. retaliate with nukes? |
| 15:50.42 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@c-24-10-162-63.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 15:52.40 | maquis | N Korea is one of the most politically interesting countries in the world, imho |
| 15:54.19 | levi | maquis: It helps that it's run by a madman. |
| 15:55.36 | ScytheBlade1 | haha, awesome |
| 15:55.57 | ScytheBlade1 | intRadius = (int)0.5+radius; |
| 15:56.38 | levi | mheath: It seems they are made by Skilcraft |
| 15:56.46 | maquis | levi: a madman who is practically worshipped |
| 15:57.09 | Jayce^ | not 'practically' |
| 15:57.13 | Jayce^ | he has been deified |
| 15:57.38 | levi | As things have been for mad dictators through the ages. |
| 15:57.50 | maquis | it makes things interesting |
| 15:58.05 | maquis | i guess the interesting part is that it's the only place in the world where things are quite the way they are |
| 16:00.09 | levi | mheath: https://www.ibmilw.com/products.php?itemno=7520-00-935-7135&category=Pens |
| 16:00.13 | levi | mheath: Is that the pen? |
| 16:01.57 | ^Migs^ | haha, is that a daily WTF, ScytheBlade? |
| 16:02.33 | levi | Skilcraft is the mandatory source of supply for office supplies for the Army, at least. I imagine the Marines use them too. |
| 16:03.38 | mheath[laptop] | levi: No, thats not it |
| 16:03.50 | mheath[laptop] | the body is a cheaper |
| 16:04.00 | mheath[laptop] | a black plastic.....almost a very, very dark blue |
| 16:04.18 | mheath[laptop] | The "metal band" isn't painted on stripes, it is a thick solid metal band (that slips off if you unscrew the pen) |
| 16:04.29 | levi | Right. I know the ones you're talking about. |
| 16:04.42 | tensai | what's the preferred way to add static routes on a linux box? |
| 16:04.46 | levi | I imagine Skilcraft must make them, but I don't know how you'd get one. |
| 16:07.39 | levi | mheath: They're on this page: http://www.nib.org/JWOD_Catalog/write/ball.html |
| 16:07.49 | ^Migs^ | omg |
| 16:07.59 | ^Migs^ | I hate it when "fake" women chatter together |
| 16:08.12 | ^Migs^ | there's a bunch of them doing something a table in the same room as me, and it's annoying |
| 16:08.21 | rsimpkins | RIP Ray Noorda |
| 16:09.10 | *** join/#utah elg_ (n=fugalh@128.123.63.88) |
| 16:10.53 | tensai | -lart elg_ |
| 16:11.47 | spr | tensai, route? |
| 16:12.11 | tensai | lemme clarify. I want them to be permanent. I can add the routes easily enough. |
| 16:12.25 | tensai | I think I settled on adding them to /etc/network/interfaces with the "up" directive |
| 16:12.45 | spr | yeah, that works too. |
| 16:12.57 | spr | More debian specific though |
| 16:13.41 | ^Migs^ | good grief. All these women are using the "everything is so happy in my life and no one knows I'm a pill-popping severely depressed housewife" voices. |
| 16:13.52 | ^Migs^ | there's a guy in the mix, too. Poor fella. |
| 16:14.06 | levi | Heh, Iceweasel. |
| 16:14.11 | elg_ | -lart tensai |
| 16:14.41 | tensai | ^Migs^: are you watching The View? |
| 16:15.28 | ^Migs^ | no, there's a bunch of women working at a table behind me squirrel-chattering about what a joy and delight all their kids are |
| 16:16.45 | levi | ^Migs^: You don't have kids? |
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| 16:17.10 | elg | -lart harleypig |
| 16:17.24 | ^Migs^ | yes I do, but I don't gather and talk about them like this |
| 16:18.06 | levi | ^Migs^: You've never got together with friends and swapped kid stories? |
| 16:18.07 | harleypig | tha's a lotta bacon |
| 16:18.11 | ^Migs^ | earlier one of these ladies was harassing our warehouse guy saying "Been keeping busy?" "Uh, I guess." "Oh, not really busy then huh?" "Well...yeah, I've been busy." "That's GREAT!" in that fake voice they have. |
| 16:18.16 | ^Migs^ | No. Never. |
| 16:18.22 | ^Migs^ | Especially not with chattering women. |
| 16:18.43 | ^Migs^ | I avoid chattering phonies. |
| 16:18.49 | levi | ^Migs^: Clearly you are antisocial! |
| 16:18.52 | ^Migs^ | No I'm not. |
| 16:19.04 | harleypig | says the person with a pseudonym in a chat room |
| 16:19.07 | elg | chattering and phony are independent |
| 16:19.08 | ^Migs^ | I talk about kids with my neighbors, but I'm not an idiot when I do it, and I don't do it in a high-pitched voice. |
| 16:19.14 | ^Migs^ | What are you talking about? This is my real name. |
| 16:19.32 | ^Migs^ | okay, it's not, but that's beside the point |
| 16:19.48 | ^Migs^ | yes they are, elg. Which is why I stated them both. |
| 16:20.15 | ^Migs^ | I honestly think women can't help it. |
| 16:20.27 | elg | women can't help the chattiness |
| 16:20.34 | elg | the phoniness, the jury's still out |
| 16:20.41 | findlay | ~chat ^Migs^ |
| 16:20.49 | ^Migs^ | no, they feel this need to put on this fake appearance and pretend everything is okay in their lives. |
| 16:21.07 | elg | it's common in utah |
| 16:21.12 | ^Migs^ | Yes. Yes, it is. |
| 16:21.24 | elg | but it's not necessarily the norm elsewhere |
| 16:21.27 | maquis | it's what they're expected to do |
| 16:21.27 | ^Migs^ | oh great. Now they're all saying "How fun!" every 2 seconds. |
| 16:21.39 | maquis | and what they're taught to do when they're little |
| 16:21.50 | ^Migs^ | I'm so glad I'm not a girl |
| 16:21.55 | elg | so why is spamhaus losing its domain name? |
| 16:22.03 | ^Migs^ | I don't know how you girls even manage this life |
| 16:22.05 | elg | I think the /. story is amusing. spamhaus obviously thinks its the savior of the internet |
| 16:22.12 | herlo | maquis: "expected"!, they're EXPECTED to do that? what happened to women's rights, the whole ERA movement, feminism? |
| 16:22.30 | herlo | aren't they supposed to be free to choose whatever they like? |
| 16:22.34 | spr | I'd be upset if spamhaus loses it's name. I find them quite handy |
| 16:22.36 | elg | those things are good at attacking concrete goals,policies, etc. |
| 16:22.43 | elg | but it's really hard to change culture |
| 16:22.59 | maquis | herlo: it's a bit complicated... there's a lot of cultural norms about what girls are supposed to do and what they're not supposed to do |
| 16:23.02 | herlo | :-) |
| 16:23.11 | findlay | no way |
| 16:23.18 | maquis | certain things are "feminine" and other things are "masculine", and it's bad for a girl to be too masculine |
| 16:23.33 | ^Migs^ | but it's okay for a men to be feminine? i.e. metrosexual? |
| 16:23.40 | ^Migs^ | *man |
| 16:23.41 | elg | this story is awesome: http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/35659820/article.pl |
| 16:23.50 | herlo | maquis: I agree, I was just having a bit of fun at your expense!! :-D |
| 16:23.57 | elg | what you see here, folks, is competition |
| 16:23.57 | maquis | herlo: i understand... |
| 16:24.40 | maquis | herlo: yeah... but it is also sometimes a rather serious issue... |
| 16:24.53 | herlo | maquis: agreed! |
| 16:25.45 | maquis | i'm not sure why, but computer programming is a "masculine" task, and i've known people who don't think women should go into it |
| 16:25.53 | herlo | that's why it made it a good thing to have fun with, because I knew it is an important issue. I believe women should have the right to choose their way. |
| 16:26.02 | ^Migs^ | wow |
| 16:26.03 | maquis | yeah |
| 16:26.05 | herlo | I think its ultra-sexy if a woman is in the Tech world... |
| 16:26.06 | ^Migs^ | what a bunch of whiny retailers, elg |
| 16:26.19 | ^Migs^ | depends entirely on the woman, herlo |
| 16:26.27 | herlo | ^Migs^: agreed |
| 16:26.30 | maquis | i just find it weird that people have those ingrained ideas... |
| 16:26.35 | maquis | and i'm not sure where they come from |
| 16:26.52 | herlo | but I think it still makes a woman more attractive |
| 16:26.52 | maquis | i think it's probably the fact that cs is considered non-social |
| 16:27.02 | herlo | maquis: probaby |
| 16:27.06 | ^Migs^ | we have a few female techs. Most of them are actually rather attractive, but 90% of the dept is male |
| 16:27.24 | fozzmoo | ^Migs^: where do you work? |
| 16:27.27 | rsimpkins | My wife is a nurse. A female dominated carrer. She wanted to be nurse. She likes it. She hates the computer. We would not be happy switching job titles. |
| 16:27.29 | ^Migs^ | Weber School District |
| 16:27.33 | herlo | ^Migs^: you gotta love the odds |
| 16:27.38 | herlo | :-) |
| 16:27.47 | maquis | rsimpkins: as long as it's what she likes, though |
| 16:27.47 | levi | The women here are either foreign or in technical management positions. |
| 16:28.01 | maquis | levi: that's what i've seen, generally, as well |
| 16:28.08 | fozzmoo | I haven't hired a woman... yet. |
| 16:28.12 | fozzmoo | Would love to, tho. |
| 16:28.23 | fozzmoo | (That sounded bad.) |
| 16:28.38 | tensai | elg: so the deal with spamhaus is that they didn't show up to an Illinois court because they're a UK company. the judge issued a default judgement and is threatening to force ICANN to revoke their domain. |
| 16:28.43 | fozzmoo | I think I'll stop right there. |
| 16:29.04 | herlo | fozzmoo: HAHAHA |
| 16:29.39 | elg | who took them to court? |
| 16:29.50 | ^Migs^ | elementary and secondary teaching is predominantly female, too |
| 16:29.52 | rsimpkins | elg: A spammer. |
| 16:29.53 | tensai | e360, a spamhaus |
| 16:30.31 | tensai | as far as them being the savior of the internet, I think I understand what Linford means. "If the domain got suspended, it would be an enormous hit for the net." |
| 16:30.54 | tensai | at least half of our mail is rejected by the SBL-XBL. if that was unavailable, that would be a problem. |
| 16:31.07 | rsimpkins | I honestly believe there are jobs that tend to be wired to male/female brains. There are excpetions and we shouldn't expect anyone to conform. |
| 16:31.59 | rsimpkins | I recommend reading spamhaus's response to the whole mess. |
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| 16:33.33 | maquis | rsimpkins: i don't deny that... although i wonder to what extent it's that issue and to what extent things are affected by social pressures |
| 16:35.14 | ^Migs^ | This is so stupid. I just got an IM from someone saying "Will you call me? I need to talk to you about our webpage." |
| 16:35.17 | rsimpkins | maquis: I think in our state the pressure from the LDS church for mothers to stay home puts undue strain on certain women who really would enjoy a career. The fact is you can be both a good mother and a successful career woman, if that is what you would like to do. |
| 16:35.45 | graphyx | ^Migs^: why did they page you? |
| 16:35.52 | mrpull- | ^Migs^: sounds like you have a bad attitude :) |
| 16:35.57 | ^Migs^ | So that I could call them, apparently. |
| 16:35.58 | maquis | rsimpkins: yeah... i saw that a lot at the Y |
| 16:36.01 | rsimpkins | And I don't want to seem like that is official pressure. I think a lot of the pressure comes from other women. |
| 16:36.04 | ^Migs^ | It never dawns on them to just tell me what they need in the IM. |
| 16:36.15 | maquis | rsimpkins: like... 90% of the pressure... |
| 16:36.23 | rsimpkins | maquis: Agreed. |
| 16:37.00 | rsimpkins | My wife got tore a new one by our neighborhood women when she decided she wanted to go back to work - one night a week. |
| 16:37.25 | levi | I believe it's still up in the air how much of male/female differences are based on nature and how much on nurture. |
| 16:37.26 | graphyx | I would say that women staying at home versus work is to be decided by the wife and husband. |
| 16:37.28 | maquis | that's silly |
| 16:37.28 | rsimpkins | There were two or three that came by and 'bore their testimony' about staying home. |
| 16:38.05 | maquis | levi: i'd say it's an interesting question... |
| 16:38.12 | levi | A lot of secondary sex characteristics seem to be determined by hormones in the womb. |
| 16:38.23 | jsmith | My opinion is that too many times well intentioned people try to influence others to believe the same way they've come to believe, and end up doing more damage than good |
| 16:38.31 | levi | It's not strictly a matter of chromosomes. |
| 16:39.00 | rsimpkins | jsmith: So true. |
| 16:39.03 | ^Migs^ | on another occasion, this same person emailed me to tell me that she needed to send me a floppy disk with some images on it. |
| 16:39.10 | ^Migs^ | why not just email it? |
| 16:39.15 | levi | There have been several cases of XY people who have broken testosterone receptors that develop as (infertile) females. |
| 16:39.43 | findlay | jsmith: thanks for the arrivaltel.com suggestion. They seem great so far |
| 16:39.43 | graphyx | I am sending you this text message to inform you of the emial that requested you to call me so that I can hand you a diskette with some files on it. |
| 16:39.45 | graphyx | ;) |
| 16:40.06 | ^Migs^ | haha |
| 16:40.28 | ^Migs^ | clearly, some people are still breaking in |
| 16:40.36 | maquis | i've spent a good amount of time with the question of nature vs nurture and women in technical fields and such... it's very interesting to me |
| 16:40.58 | *** join/#utah Cleetus (n=Cleetus@63-253-43-10.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 16:41.03 | levi | And then there's the case of the twin boys, one of which was genitally mangled during circumcision and then given a sex change with the belief that being raised as a girl would bring about femaleness. It didn't. |
| 16:41.03 | graphyx | ^Migs^: Breaking in? I missed the former conversation. |
| 16:41.06 | Cleetus | lart ibot |
| 16:41.09 | Cleetus | -lart ibot |
| 16:41.19 | ^Migs^ | I think maybe just ugly women should have careers, and attractive women should stay home and make babies. That way, only good genes get passed to the next generation. |
| 16:41.32 | mrpull- | ^migs^: make sure to act like an elitist prick rather than coach them in the right direction. Otherwise, you wont have anything left to complain about :) |
| 16:41.34 | ^Migs^ | "breaking in" to the world of computers. |
| 16:41.35 | graphyx | ~flamebait ^Migs^ |
| 16:41.44 | graphyx | ^Migs^: who is breaking into what? |
| 16:41.50 | ^Migs^ | I was actually going to call her up to tell her to IM me with the requirements she needed |
| 16:41.54 | ^Migs^ | some people |
| 16:41.59 | ^Migs^ | some who aren't tech-savvy |
| 16:42.07 | ^Migs^ | Sorry, I thought my statement was clear. |
| 16:42.12 | graphyx | oh ok. |
| 16:42.20 | ^Migs^ | I tend to ramble, though |
| 16:42.44 | graphyx | it's hardly noticable. |
| 16:42.50 | ^Migs^ | well, that's good |
| 16:43.02 | ^Migs^ | yeah, I try to be discreet |
| 16:43.08 | harleypig | We refused to treat our children in a gender specific way for a long time (and we still don't--it's just hard to see sometimes). |
| 16:43.43 | harleypig | My oldest son used to take sticks and make swords and guns out of them, even though we refused to buy him toy guns and weapons. |
| 16:43.44 | graphyx | My daughter likes to try to hit softballs, and my son likes to play ponies with his sister. |
| 16:43.46 | graphyx | so what... |
| 16:44.17 | harleypig | My oldest daughter loves barbies, even though both my wife and I hate that line. |
| 16:44.33 | graphyx | and despite my wifes best efforts my daughters favorite color is PINK. |
| 16:44.35 | levi | There has been a lot of research done on differences in brain structures between people with certain characteristics, and it has generally shown that differences in brain structure do correspond to the characteristics. This doesn't answer the question of whether they were born with different brain structures, or if they simply developed differently. I think recent research supports the latter hypothesis. |
| 16:44.40 | graphyx | and she didn't get that from TV either. |
| 16:44.42 | maquis | i have to say, it's probably a lot harder socially for a guy to be feminine than it is for a girl to be masculine... |
| 16:45.04 | harleypig | I think the problem with the nature vs nurture debate is that it doesn't take the pre-existence into account. |
| 16:45.16 | maquis | harleypig: that's definitely true |
| 16:45.24 | graphyx | harleypig: Careful, you are letting your religion show... ;) |
| 16:45.37 | harleypig | maquis: You've never been in a locker room where someone was effeminate |
| 16:46.01 | harleypig | graphyx: I only believe in separation of church and state where laws are concerned. |
| 16:46.02 | maquis | harleypig: nope... |
| 16:46.08 | elg | what, IRC is a state? |
| 16:46.10 | graphyx | harleypig: I was totally kidding. |
| 16:46.10 | elg | are there taxes? |
| 16:46.27 | maquis | elg: yeah... you are supposed to be paying the ops once a month |
| 16:46.35 | *** mode/#utah [+o elg] by ChanServ |
| 16:46.38 | harleypig | graphyx: yeah ... missed the ;) |
| 16:46.49 | maquis | elg: except... you are an op... |
| 16:46.50 | elg | I'll take your taxes now |
| 16:46.51 | levi | harleypig: This is true, but that isn't necessarily relevant. The nature of a human being is clearly dependant on the physical body, even if there is a spirit that has a different nature within. |
| 16:46.57 | harleypig | shouldn't that be 10% of the month? |
| 16:46.58 | maquis | haven't you been collecting the money you're owed? |
| 16:47.01 | *** kick/#utah [maquis!n=fugalh@128.123.63.88] by elg (tax evasion) |
| 16:47.07 | *** join/#utah maquis (n=maquis@joanna.zmonkey.org) |
| 16:47.14 | *** mode/#utah [+o maquis] by ChanServ |
| 16:47.18 | ^Migs^ | lol |
| 16:47.33 | harleypig | levi: I disagree. The nature of a human is *affected by* the physical body. |
| 16:47.34 | *** kick/#utah [elg!n=maquis@joanna.zmonkey.org] by maquis (ops don't pay taxes... they just collect them) |
| 16:47.36 | graphyx | Wouldn't kicking someone out of the channel for tax evasion result it less taxes collected? |
| 16:48.05 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@128.123.63.88) |
| 16:48.07 | graphyx | s/it/in/ |
| 16:48.26 | maquis | ~grouphug |
| 16:48.28 | ibot | ACTION hugs everbody and makes it all better... |
| 16:48.33 | elg | -lart ibot |
| 16:48.38 | graphyx | ~travolta maquis |
| 16:48.39 | ibot | ACTION replaces maquis with several craters in a multi-colored display of superior fire power |
| 16:48.40 | levi | harleypig: The physical body is the entire manifestation of a person to other persons, barring spiritual phenomena that can't really be measured. |
| 16:49.24 | harleypig | Again, I have to disagree ... ever made eye contact with someone through sunglasses? |
| 16:49.45 | levi | Can you measure that? |
| 16:49.48 | elg | if I say yes am I cool? |
| 16:50.12 | harleypig | Not in the traditionally accepted scientific method, but what about the phrase "Take his measure"? |
| 16:50.20 | elg | fwiw I'm with harleypig. |
| 16:50.27 | elg | now about this pin |
| 16:51.39 | levi | I don't think we fundamentally disagree, really. I'm just saying that science /can't/ take the spiritual component of personality into account, so scientific discussions must necessarily leave it out. |
| 16:52.37 | harleypig | levi: Again, I disagree. I think science *must* take the spiritual component of personality into account, in order to have a fuller understanding of the universe that we inhabit. |
| 16:53.00 | levi | Science discusses the things that are objectively measurable, and it is the case that personality is affected by things that are objectively measurable in the body. |
| 16:53.10 | harleypig | Otherwise we would never be able to answer the question of how to convert water into wine with just a thought. |
| 16:53.11 | elg | whether you call it spiritual or not, science has very little idea of what makes up our personalities, yet it would be silly to deny their existence |
| 16:53.22 | levi | This does not mean that those objectively measurable things are the only determination of personality. |
| 16:53.28 | elg | to wave our hands and say "well we can't take that into account because it's not scientific" is silly |
| 16:54.09 | harleypig | It's quite possible to objectively measure a personality, even our own. |
| 16:54.18 | elg | the same views were easily taken against radiation back in the day |
| 16:54.21 | levi | Well, you can certainly guess about things, or gain knowledge about them from other ways, but you will never scientifically verify them. |
| 16:54.24 | harleypig | The problem is that too many people believe "if I can't touch it, it's not real" |
| 16:54.53 | harleypig | levi: |
| 16:54.56 | harleypig | oops |
| 16:55.05 | levi | elg: Well, radiation became objectively measurable through the development of tools. If the spirit should become measurable, it will be fall into the realm of science as well. |
| 16:55.06 | harleypig | levi: That's what people said about electricity. |
| 16:55.20 | elg | levi: precisely. is it a chicken and the egg problem? |
| 16:55.38 | *** join/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 16:56.07 | harleypig | That's the wrong way to look at it. The spirit cannot *become* measurable ... the tools must become sophisticated enough to measure the spirit. |
| 16:56.15 | elg | ~induce phinux |
| 16:56.38 | *** join/#utah ^Migs^ (n=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 16:56.39 | levi | I don't have any problem with that wording, though that is what I meant. |
| 16:56.56 | *** join/#utah vex (n=vex@c-67-161-240-108.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 16:57.19 | maquis | phinux: sup? |
| 16:58.22 | levi | I'm not saying that science is the only way of knowing things, but that science is necessarily limited in the kinds of things it can describe. |
| 16:59.26 | levi | Unless you can set up an experiment that will confirm or deny the influence of a spirit on a personality, there's nothing science can do about it. This is where religion and faith come in. |
| 17:00.32 | elg | science could recognize, however, the inability of the observable factors to predict personality |
| 17:01.09 | levi | To completely predict personality, yes. |
| 17:01.14 | elg | and would be forced in that case to attribute influence on personality to some external influence. be it spirit, chaos, some as-yet-undiscovered spatial anomaly orbiting earth |
| 17:01.26 | elg | aliens |
| 17:01.26 | levi | It has become clear that the structure of the brain affects the manifested personality of a human being. |
| 17:01.29 | elg | you get the idea. |
| 17:01.38 | elg | affects, sure |
| 17:01.42 | levi | Consider a person before and after severe brain damage. |
| 17:01.57 | harleypig | levi: How is observing quantum particles any more real than observing personality? |
| 17:02.05 | levi | elg: That's all I've been saying. |
| 17:02.10 | elg | consider a car before and after an accident. doesn't mean traffic creates the car |
| 17:02.37 | harleypig | levi: On my mission, we had a member who some years previous was in an industrial accident that destroyed a part of his brain. |
| 17:02.37 | elg | i agree we're in close agreement |
| 17:03.09 | harleypig | It turned out that, for him at least, the section that was destroyed was the part of the brain that allowed him to control his impulses. |
| 17:03.51 | elg | sounds like the setup for a star trek episode |
| 17:03.54 | levi | It is also clear that the structure of a healthy person's brain changes throughout life, and that those changes closely correspond with their skills and at least some aspects of personality. |
| 17:03.57 | harleypig | But after some time (quite some time) he was able to retrain himself to not just do the impulses that came into his head. |
| 17:04.18 | harleypig | even though he no longer understood why he couldn't do them. |
| 17:04.35 | findlay | impulse is the integral of force over a delta t |
| 17:04.37 | elg | how do you mean? |
| 17:04.49 | levi | elg: Are you asking that of me? |
| 17:04.55 | elg | of harleypig |
| 17:05.01 | elg | "no longer understood..." |
| 17:05.15 | elg | as in he didn't understand the power by which he didn't do them |
| 17:05.22 | findlay | having the same units of momentum but defined differently |
| 17:05.25 | elg | or as he stopped himself fromdoing them he didn't understand why he was doing it? |
| 17:05.43 | harleypig | elg: He no longer understood why he couldn't just do whatever the heck he wanted to. |
| 17:05.50 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (i=linuxali@gateway/tor/x-a709a9569f8b9517) |
| 17:05.57 | elg | so why did he retrain himself not to do whatever the heck he wanted to? |
| 17:09.51 | findlay | in fact Newton defined force in terms of the momentum |
| 17:10.14 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-24-10-162-63.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 17:10.51 | findlay | F = dp(t)/dt = m(t)a(t) |
| 17:12.13 | elg | ~reject amcnabb |
| 17:12.37 | ^Migs^ | http://news-info.wustl.edu/news/page/normal/7800.html |
| 17:15.05 | spr | yay, I have a working interpolated bigram model! |
| 17:17.37 | harleypig | He still loved his wife and children and they convinced him that he needed to learn. |
| 17:17.44 | harleypig | sorry ... rl discussion interfered. |
| 17:22.07 | harleypig | ^Migs^: that is *cool* |
| 17:24.49 | amcnabb | What does ~reject do? |
| 17:25.00 | elg | nothing apparently |
| 17:25.06 | amcnabb | :) |
| 17:29.48 | ^Migs^ | the technology is only going to improve, too. Imagine multitasking in a game with your brain. |
| 17:35.35 | emcnabb | ~slay elg |
| 17:35.39 | ibot | ACTION brandishes Excalibur! "With this sword, I vanquish thee, elg!" apt lops off elg's head. |
| 17:36.19 | findlay | ~play Elgar's Enigma Variations |
| 17:36.37 | findlay | and then Bruckner's 8th symphony |
| 17:47.07 | ^Migs^ | you know what would be cool, is if I could play musical instruments with my mind |
| 17:47.54 | emcnabb | findlay: we played Enigma Variations in high school |
| 17:47.57 | emcnabb | loved it |
| 17:50.33 | *** join/#utah vex (n=vex@c-67-161-240-108.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 17:52.18 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 17:58.06 | findlay | ~enigmate emcnabb |
| 17:58.24 | findlay | emcnabb: what part did you play? |
| 17:58.44 | elg | freedom horn |
| 17:59.03 | findlay | did it have an American Flag engraved on the bell? |
| 17:59.21 | elg | no, it had french fries stuffed in the mouthpiece |
| 17:59.28 | elg | er, freedom fries |
| 17:59.30 | elg | so sorry |
| 17:59.46 | levi | Mmmm, fries. |
| 17:59.48 | findlay | couldn't fit many fries in one of those |
| 18:00.09 | levi | I'd prefer fries stuffed in the bell. |
| 18:04.53 | elg | hard to eat during a performance if they'r ein the bell |
| 18:06.50 | emcnabb | findlay: it's been a while; don't remember exactly |
| 18:08.20 | emcnabb | I remember the first (and last) time I tried to play my trumpet with food in my mouth |
| 18:09.12 | *** part/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-68-22-220-206.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 18:09.46 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@71-219-8-157.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 18:12.24 | findlay | hope it wasn't an expensive trumpet |
| 18:21.52 | emcnabb | nope |
| 18:37.20 | redbeard1 | ~lart radioshack |
| 18:45.04 | ^Migs^ | great |
| 18:45.09 | ^Migs^ | now one of the chattering women brought their baby to work |
| 19:05.18 | findlay | ~lol ^Migs^ |
| 19:10.29 | emcnabb | findlay: oh, I thought you meant which parts of the music we played. Don't remember that. As to the instrument, it was French Horn (or like elg said, freedom horn) |
| 19:11.34 | goozbach | freedom horn?! pfft! that's funny |
| 19:14.54 | elg | i'm psychic |
| 19:20.41 | Tene | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IceWeaselIcon |
| 19:23.28 | levi | "Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come." |
| 19:23.49 | levi | Iceweasel is a way cooler name than firefox. |
| 19:24.21 | harleypig | what is iceweasel? |
| 19:24.27 | harleypig | I'm not seeing anything on it in the thread |
| 19:24.28 | elg | is iceweasel what debian and ubuntu want to call firefox? |
| 19:24.38 | findlay | sounds like a kernel rev name |
| 19:24.52 | elg | from the icons it's clear that it's related to firefox |
| 19:25.04 | levi | Yes, that's what they want to call firefox. |
| 19:25.08 | elg | and I know that debian has been threatening to change the name due to mozilla's silly trademarking |
| 19:25.22 | elg | have they decided then? |
| 19:25.23 | findlay | debian didn't like firefox' license on their artwork |
| 19:25.31 | elg | trademark |
| 19:25.33 | elg | not license |
| 19:25.35 | elg | and it goes for the name too |
| 19:25.46 | elg | hence iceweasel |
| 19:26.01 | levi | Well, Mozilla didn't want it called Firefox if it didn't have the official icon. |
| 19:26.28 | elg | it's the other patches also |
| 19:26.49 | elg | it's two way. debian doesn't like that mozilla trademarked the name and icon, because that hinders free distribution, in their eyse |
| 19:27.13 | levi | I'd only heard about the icon, but I can see the issue with patches as well. |
| 19:27.21 | elg | and mozilla doesn't want people distributing modified versions of their products and using the icon and name (which is why they trademarked it in the first place) |
| 19:28.05 | elg | mozilla wants to maintain the integrity of their brand, but all they're going to get is fragmentation |
| 19:28.23 | elg | nobody notices the patches debian puts on for its own reasons (probbaly mostly to do with file hierarchy) |
| 19:28.29 | elg | everyone will notice "Iceweasel" |
| 19:28.48 | goozbach | icy |
| 19:29.06 | levi | Iceweasel is way cool, though. |
| 19:29.39 | elg | actually I misspoke above. I think the reason they originally trademarked the name firefox was because they were sick of changing names |
| 19:30.25 | findlay | elg: that's interesting about mozilla |
| 19:31.33 | Robdor | Iceweasel sounds a little devious for some reason... |
| 19:31.59 | elg | ibot, force harleypig to wear this shirt: http://www.red-bean.com/ospowiki/ChakraShirt |
| 19:33.48 | levi | http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,20548077-13762,00.html |
| 19:35.51 | findlay | TimRiker: when you talked about it being possible to make a BZFlag like game in a short time from popular game libraries do you think you'd ever redo BZFlag like that? |
| 19:36.45 | elg | levi: ok, two questions. why would it kill her if it went through her feet, but leaving out her backside is ok? |
| 19:36.55 | elg | oh, I guess I only have one question |
| 19:36.59 | elg | the other is a warning |
| 19:37.11 | elg | this is a warning to never brush your teeth in a lightning storm |
| 19:37.14 | elg | under no circumstances |
| 19:37.58 | levi | Probably more current would have gone through her if it grounded through her body. |
| 19:38.32 | levi | Why that would be, I don't know. |
| 19:39.19 | levi | http://on-ruby.blogspot.com/2006/10/improving-ruby-performance-one-library.html |
| 19:40.22 | levi | Avoiding message dispatch in Ruby to get performance seems like a bad decision to me, considering the nature of the language. |
| 19:41.41 | levi | Given its smalltalk-like semantics, it will always be slow until it gets a type-inferring dynamic compiler such as the Self and Strongtalk systems have. |
| 19:41.58 | harleypig | Oh, that would be a cool shirt |
| 19:43.47 | levi | At least YARV has polymorphic inline caches, which should help quite a bit. |
| 19:45.14 | elg | ok, this is weird. why is there a cursor in the body of the page in firefox 2 rc2? |
| 19:45.38 | elg | and how do I get rid of it? I want up/down to scroll up and down, not move a silly cursor |
| 19:46.42 | *** join/#utah fozzmoo (n=fozz@166.70.238.250) |
| 19:46.49 | Tene | elg: press F7 |
| 19:47.01 | fozzmoo | itsatene |
| 19:47.09 | goozbach | fozzmoo: press alt-f4 |
| 19:47.09 | Tene | itsafozz |
| 19:47.11 | goozbach | :) |
| 19:47.42 | *** join/#utah redbeard1 (n=redbeard@pollux.northsky.com) |
| 19:47.47 | elg | levi: I think it's on the same level as talking about avoiding unnecessary malloc in C or avoiding unnecessary I/O |
| 19:48.00 | harleypig | crisco party? |
| 19:48.05 | findlay | ~konqueror++ |
| 19:48.18 | findlay | kohqueror has vim navigation keybindings |
| 19:48.20 | elg | Tene: thanks. is that a permanent change? is it a setting? |
| 19:48.23 | findlay | s/h/k/ |
| 19:48.30 | findlay | whatever |
| 19:48.36 | elg | konquerer is for pansies |
| 19:48.51 | harleypig | elg: Only the real thing, thanks. |
| 19:48.55 | Tene | elg: it's a setting. cursor navigation on/off |
| 19:48.58 | findlay | elg: you've never wanted to scroll down a page with 'j'? |
| 19:49.03 | levi | elg: Sure, but just about everything in Ruby is message dispatch. Though I suppose it's less so than in Smalltalk, where absolutely everything is conceptually message dispatch. |
| 19:49.08 | Tene | http://visearch.com/ ! |
| 19:49.28 | findlay | j,h,k,l they're all there |
| 19:49.42 | levi | elg: That's like 'avoid unnecessary function calls' in C. |
| 19:49.53 | elg | i'm not sure what zenspider was talking about exactly, but probably along the lines of doing something common in an efficient way vs an inefficient way |
| 19:50.07 | elg | levi: you're right |
| 19:50.28 | elg | it's conceivable that you can do some thing in a tight loop with way more "message dispatch" than you needed |
| 19:50.39 | elg | and I'm not talking about clever bumming |
| 19:50.46 | elg | I'm talking about anticlever waste |
| 19:50.47 | findlay | in many ways konqueror is superior to firefox |
| 19:51.06 | elg | findlay: no, I can't say I have. I'm sure if I really did want to do that I could find a firefox extension that does it |
| 19:51.09 | levi | Right, but it should be the compiler's job to remove message dispatch overhead for tight loops. |
| 19:51.23 | findlay | probably |
| 19:51.58 | elg | what about interpreters? :) I think it would be awesome for YARV or whatever to be smarter than the coder and do that kind of thing automatically |
| 19:52.20 | levi | elg: Well, advanced interpreters blur the lines between interpreting and compilation. |
| 19:53.04 | nick125_lappy | 2 |
| 19:53.13 | elg | sweet. I just got back 40 points wholesale on my last homework |
| 19:53.15 | elg | stupid TA |
| 19:53.35 | levi | elg: Strongtalk does that sort of thing. It starts out interpreting, but once a method is run a couple of times with the same types, it gets compiled. |
| 19:53.57 | elg | interesting |
| 19:54.03 | levi | elg: Not only compiled, but the message dispatch turns into a jmp followed by a cmp to ensure its type assumptions were correct. |
| 19:54.14 | elg | makes me glad I'm not a compiler/interpreter guy for a living. |
| 19:54.23 | elg | I like that sort of thing, but at the uncomplicated basic level |
| 19:55.06 | levi | It can also inline code dynamically. |
| 19:55.28 | findlay | does it outline code too? |
| 19:55.40 | elg | that's your job |
| 19:55.44 | levi | So, it can run Smalltalk code, in which every computation involves message dispatch, at about half the speed of optimized C. |
| 19:55.44 | findlay | darn |
| 19:56.01 | levi | Actually, yes, it can deoptimize code if it finds that an invocation was made that violated its assumptions. |
| 19:56.50 | levi | It is limited in the optimizations it can make due to the fact that it must compile extremely quickly. |
| 19:57.01 | levi | So it can't do fancy register allocation and such. |
| 19:58.39 | levi | The methods can get large once a bunch of things have been inlined, so it can't do too much analysis. |
| 19:59.31 | levi | But still, that's pretty darn fast compared to where other Smalltalk implementations are at now, and makes Ruby's current implementation look like a snail. |
| 20:00.15 | elg | that's neat |
| 20:02.02 | levi | Anyway, I'd like to poke around in Strongtalk and help get it ported to Linux and such, but my time for such things is too limited. |
| 20:04.00 | levi | It would mean messing around with C++, but it looks like fairly clean C++ from what I've seen of it. |
| 20:04.17 | *** join/#utah bonez39 (n=bonez@drjones.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 20:05.19 | *** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
| 20:05.19 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 20:09.25 | tensai | ~lart spam |
| 20:12.39 | bonez39 | if I include the line '10.0.0.6 seth' in my /etc/hosts file....shouldn't that resolve the name 'seth' to that machine? |
| 20:19.19 | jsmith | Yes, that should |
| 20:23.37 | elg | yes, except when it doesn't |
| 20:26.07 | bonez39 | what might it mean if I can't connect to either a local machine, or a networked machine, to print..using lpadmin? a la fyrenice:/home/scott# lpadmin -p scottdesk -v parallel:/dev/lp0 -P /etc/cups/ppd/scottdesk.ppd lpadmin: Unable to connect to server: Connection refused |
| 20:27.12 | elg | it might mean your dog got loose again, but probably not |
| 20:27.47 | elg | more likely, your cups daemon isn't running |
| 20:27.48 | bonez39 | elg, likely not since we have no dog but me....and I usually still get to sleep inside.....only rarely in the car or the doghouse...! |
| 20:27.54 | bonez39 | ah..... |
| 20:28.03 | bonez39 | would that be /etc/init.d/cupsys star? |
| 20:28.09 | bonez39 | .er.. start |
| 20:28.10 | elg | couldn't hurt |
| 20:29.31 | bonez39 | OK, I started cupsys....still same response as before... |
| 20:29.41 | bonez39 | does ps ax list which daemons are running? |
| 20:30.03 | bonez39 | I don't see cupsys in that listing |
| 20:30.44 | mheath | just try cups |
| 20:30.51 | mheath | I think the executable might be cupsd or something |
| 20:30.55 | mheath | ps aux | grep cups |
| 20:31.41 | *** join/#utah mheath[laptop] (n=mheath@c-67-182-231-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 20:32.11 | mheath | I wish people wouldn't make stupid assummptions about my laptop |
| 20:32.17 | mheath | Like "Oh, its OK to close this and unplug it" |
| 20:32.31 | bonez39 | nothing with cups running..cept a gnome icon... |
| 20:34.33 | mheath | bonez39: in a terminal and as root, type: |
| 20:34.46 | mheath | cupsd -f |
| 20:34.54 | bonez39 | if I attempt to load cups via http://localhost:631/ and it won't load..isn't that a good indicator it's not running? |
| 20:35.16 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott# cupsd -f |
| 20:35.16 | bonez39 | cupsd: relocation error: cupsd: undefined symbol: cups_strlcpy |
| 20:35.19 | bonez39 | it gives this... |
| 20:35.29 | mheath | bonez39: sounds like you have a bad install. |
| 20:35.37 | mheath | How did you install cups? From a package? And what distro? |
| 20:36.36 | bonez39 | I ran this: apt-get install cupsys cupsys-bsd cupsys-client foomatic-bin samba smbclient gs-esp a2ps smbldap-tools cups-pdf hplip gtklp cupsys-pt xpp |
| 20:36.54 | bonez39 | those all installed ok..no errors.... |
| 20:37.55 | bonez39 | I am trying to enable networked printing, a la : http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-mini/Debian-and-Windows-Shared-Printing.html |
| 20:38.08 | bonez39 | but despite my following the instructions, it doesn't want to work |
| 20:38.52 | mheath | bonez39: Try just 'emerge cups' |
| 20:38.59 | mheath | erm |
| 20:39.00 | mheath | heh |
| 20:39.02 | mheath | apt-get cups |
| 20:39.39 | elg | vontrapp was saying something about a broken cupsys-client in debian testing or unstable |
| 20:39.45 | elg | or was it ubuntu? I can't remember |
| 20:40.20 | mheath | It sounds like its a broken lib |
| 20:40.24 | mheath | something cups specific |
| 20:43.28 | mheath[laptop] | Haha |
| 20:43.48 | mheath[laptop] | Introducing Gnu Bunnies - the worlds first crossbreed between a Gnu and a Rabbit! |
| 20:48.04 | nick125_lappy | uhhh |
| 20:51.04 | mheath[laptop] | Yes.e |
| 20:51.06 | bonez39 | mheath, back..emerge cups |
| 20:51.06 | mheath[laptop] | Yes.* |
| 20:51.16 | mheath[laptop] | bonez39, I meant apt-get =P |
| 20:51.40 | mheath[laptop] | I'm watching a movie. I might be inactive for a bit. |
| 20:52.10 | bonez39 | mheath[laptop], where, ...did you mean including 'apt-get'? |
| 20:52.23 | mheath[laptop] | bonez39, apt-get install cups |
| 20:52.24 | TimRiker | findlay: me? probably now. though a BZFlag game in SecondLife might be fun. |
| 20:52.43 | TimRiker | s/now/not/ |
| 20:53.19 | mheath[laptop] | TimRiker, I'd put it together, if freakin Second Life would give me an adult account -.- |
| 20:53.44 | tensai | bonez39: emerge is the apt-get equivilant for gentoo |
| 20:54.01 | harleypig | Is second life maturing? Last I saw of it it was a little to ... stoopid for me to get interested in it. |
| 20:54.26 | levi | I tried it once, but my iBook wasn't up to it. |
| 20:54.32 | harleypig | I mean, the idea of a SnowCrash type virtual world is really cool, but it wasn't implemented very well. |
| 20:54.42 | bonez39 | tensai, ok...... |
| 20:54.54 | bonez39 | mheath, it's already the newest version..... |
| 20:55.21 | tensai | bonez39: that error is a daemon/library mismatch. it needs to be recompiled. |
| 20:55.32 | tensai | what distro and version are you running? |
| 20:55.45 | bonez39 | debian 3.1 |
| 20:56.03 | bonez39 | neither the localhost:631 approach works, nor foomatic-gui..nor lpadmin at the console |
| 20:56.33 | tensai | correct, they won't. the daemon is failing to start because it can't resolve a symbol in its library. |
| 20:56.50 | tensai | what version is cupsys? dpkg -s cupsys |
| 20:56.55 | bonez39 | oh.....and despite a clean, error-free apt-get installation..... |
| 20:56.57 | bonez39 | ok, hold |
| 20:58.41 | bonez39 | Version: 1.1.23-10sarge1 |
| 21:02.15 | bonez39 | does the version tell you anything? |
| 21:02.28 | tensai | just wanting to compare. that's the version I'm running. |
| 21:03.39 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# enscript --word-wrap file_name_not_shown lpr: error - scheduler not responding! |
| 21:03.45 | tensai | strings /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 |grep cups_strlcpy |
| 21:03.48 | bonez39 | I try enscript to print a text document and get that error.. |
| 21:04.04 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# strings /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 |grep cups_strlcpy |
| 21:04.04 | bonez39 | _cups_strlcpy |
| 21:04.08 | bonez39 | there ya go |
| 21:04.20 | tensai | weird. _cups_strlcpy? |
| 21:04.30 | tensai | it should be just cups_strlcpy |
| 21:04.35 | bonez39 | yeah, that's the response... |
| 21:04.49 | bonez39 | with the leading '_' |
| 21:05.05 | tensai | well, that's the reason |
| 21:05.12 | tensai | dpkg -s libcupsys2-gnutls10 |
| 21:06.28 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# dpkg -s libcupsys2-gnutls10 Package: libcupsys2-gnutls10 Status: install ok installed Priority: optional Section: libs Installed-Size: 160 Maintainer: Kenshi Muto <kmuto@debian.org> Architecture: i386 Source: cupsys Version: 1.1.23-10sarge1 |
| 21:06.32 | bonez39 | that's the response |
| 21:07.01 | bonez39 | I am doing all these as root, right? |
| 21:07.06 | tensai | hmm. that's the right version. let's try to reinstall it. |
| 21:07.12 | tensai | dpkg -s is okay to do as non-root |
| 21:07.23 | tensai | apt-get install --reinstall libcupsys2-gnutls10 |
| 21:07.47 | tensai | actually, first run md5sum /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 |
| 21:08.16 | bonez39 | already started the reinstall |
| 21:08.21 | tensai | ah, well |
| 21:08.33 | bonez39 | does it matter to run it after? |
| 21:08.47 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# md5sum /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 |
| 21:08.47 | bonez39 | fc2ce6f5806c36ab000b0a5296ad7233 /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 |
| 21:09.01 | tensai | that matches mine. try the strings command again. |
| 21:09.35 | bonez39 | ok |
| 21:09.46 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# strings /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 |grep cups_strlcpy |
| 21:09.46 | bonez39 | cups_strlcpy |
| 21:09.50 | bonez39 | better now, with the _ |
| 21:09.52 | tensai | much better |
| 21:09.58 | tensai | now /etc/init.d/cupsys start |
| 21:10.50 | bonez39 | ok, the moment that ran, my deskjet printer which is attached local to my linux box....responded with its normal boot up thing.....it hasn't done that in a few days.... |
| 21:11.01 | tensai | netstat -lntp |grep 631 |
| 21:11.03 | bonez39 | should I check localhost:631 now? |
| 21:11.05 | bonez39 | ok |
| 21:11.20 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# netstat -lntp |grep 631 |
| 21:11.20 | bonez39 | tcp 0 0 0.0.0.0:631 0.0.0.0:* LISTEN 4811/cupsd |
| 21:11.26 | tensai | bingo. cups is running |
| 21:11.43 | bonez39 | so it was the one package that somehow didn't get installed correctly before? |
| 21:14.10 | tensai | that library must have been different somehow. it was the same version, but clearly not the exact same. md5sum would have told us for sure but I didn't think of it in time. |
| 21:14.25 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# lpadmin -p sethlaser -v smb://seth/sethlaser -P /etc/cups/pps/sethlaser.ppd |
| 21:14.26 | bonez39 | lpadmin: add-printer (set model) failed: client-error-not-found |
| 21:14.46 | bonez39 | I get this now, when attempting to set up to print to laser, attached to my windows machine, named 'seth' |
| 21:16.02 | bonez39 | I can print to that printer just fine....from a virtual windows session on this machine...running under win4lin.....no problem...but can't from linux... |
| 21:16.47 | *** join/#utah tuxd00d (n=tuxinato@128.187.128.38) |
| 21:22.15 | bonez39 | fyrenice:/home/scott/mydata/dox/letters# lpr: error - unable to print file: server-error-service-unavailable |
| 21:39.06 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (n=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 21:39.49 | findlay | is there a way to reload irssi's config? |
| 21:40.45 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@67.137.24.115) |
| 21:44.26 | *** join/#utah coolblade (n=gray|@208.64.89.10.utahbroadband.com) |
| 21:57.37 | redbeard1 | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16833701001 |
| 21:58.19 | Jayce^ | redbeard1, copycat :) |
| 21:58.40 | redbeard1 | Jayce^, you're just jealous you didn't post it first |
| 21:59.01 | Jayce^ | redbeard1, I got it *from* here back when I showed it to *you* |
| 21:59.26 | redbeard1 | ah, well, there's egg on my face |
| 22:04.16 | findlay | eggnogg? |
| 22:05.10 | redbeard1 | eggnoggin |
| 22:06.12 | *** join/#utah findlay (n=justin@67.137.24.115) |
| 22:07.09 | levi | That would be cool if my wireless had reasonable fidelity to where my room is. |
| 22:07.30 | levi | I haven't even got streaming mp3s to work well. |
| 22:09.55 | findlay | can you get those air spray cans at walmart? |
| 22:12.04 | redbeard1 | findlay: i think you can |
| 22:12.16 | redbeard1 | i saw them at harmons this morning as well |
| 22:13.20 | levi | findlay: You can get hair spray cans at walmart. |
| 22:15.15 | tensai | redbeard1: I really enjoyed the weekend challenge |
| 22:23.58 | redbeard1 | tensai: awesome, duder. i had a lot of fun with it too |
| 22:25.04 | tensai | redbeard1: for a while I've wanted to stage a challenge with somebody. each team has $20 and 2 hours to make a dish or two. |
| 22:25.35 | redbeard1 | tensai: dude, next time you're down here, i'm up for it. would need to build up teams, though. |
| 22:28.16 | tensai | "next time"... I haven't been to provo since 2002. it might be a while |
| 22:29.13 | tensai | I went to Logan last spring though. we're getting closer |
| 22:37.10 | redbeard1 | tensai: oog, i stay away from provo too |
| 22:37.43 | tensai | ok, utah county then |
| 22:38.07 | findlay | neither of you want me on your team |
| 22:39.39 | tensai | findlay: you can serenade while we cook |
| 22:40.10 | redbeard1 | findlay: wait, how well do you sing? |
| 22:40.18 | levi | How about he just chooses the music? |
| 22:40.28 | levi | So long as you like classical music, that should work great. |
| 22:44.16 | findlay | yeah, you don't want me singing either |
| 22:44.25 | findlay | how about some Verdi? |
| 22:44.37 | findlay | ~x it en Verdi |
| 22:46.24 | goozbach | ~x |
| 22:46.58 | goozbach | hmm |
| 22:51.26 | tensai | this is hilarious. if you've ever wondered if the statistics on senderbase.org is accurate, well wonder no longer |
| 22:51.58 | tensai | 199.104.80.150 is shown as having increased 20,000% over the last month |
| 22:52.32 | tensai | but strangely enough, it's null routed in my router |
| 22:52.40 | tensai | >sh ip route 199.104.80.150 |
| 22:52.44 | tensai | * directly connected, via Null0 |
| 22:53.05 | tensai | that's an interesting trick to send mail from that IP |
| 22:57.20 | *** join/#utah Sargun (n=xbmodder@69-12-240-206.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) |
| 22:57.58 | findlay | hi |
| 22:58.11 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@adsl-75-0-136-70.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:11.49 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp08.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 23:12.04 | elg | thanks boti |
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| 23:17.33 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 23:18.07 | elg | -lart goozbach |
| 23:19.44 | *** part/#utah harleypig (n=harleypi@pollux.northsky.com) |
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| 23:48.00 | Sargun | mheath[laptop], hows it going? |
