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| 00:51.33 | herlo | whoa, lots of coming and going |
| 00:54.11 | atoponce | seems to be pretty common in this channel |
| 01:01.21 | tensai | on weekends anyway |
| 01:19.45 | emcnabb | especially on Sunday evenings |
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| 01:23.12 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 01:25.10 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: smart |
| 01:25.12 | nick125 | very smart |
| 01:26.37 | xbmodder_lappy | lol |
| 01:26.38 | xbmodder_lappy | I now |
| 01:26.40 | xbmodder_lappy | know |
| 01:27.15 | nick125 | hahah |
| 01:27.23 | herlo | atoponce/tensai: I usually am logged in on weekends, I think sundays are particularly dead..... |
| 01:27.37 | emcnabb | ~lart herlo |
| 01:27.47 | herlo | ~pimpslap emcnabb |
| 01:28.02 | emcnabb | ~whaleslap herlo |
| 01:28.13 | herlo | ~cook emcnabb |
| 01:28.28 | herlo | ~lart emcnabb |
| 01:28.38 | herlo | ha! |
| 01:28.41 | emcnabb | doh |
| 01:29.06 | herlo | that "unspecified client" is gonna have some fun.... |
| 01:29.42 | herlo | s/is/his |
| 01:29.59 | herlo | mmmm, firefox |
| 01:34.04 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: do you know how to read PM? :/ |
| 01:34.09 | nick125 | or do you just choose not to |
| 01:45.15 | herlo | its sad |
| 01:45.33 | nick125 | LOL |
| 01:46.07 | nick125 | hahah |
| 01:46.12 | herlo | yeah, he's now asking for someone to give him more details. The guy he's talking to keeps asking what operating system it runs on |
| 01:46.14 | nick125 | qwest tech support is retarded as hell |
| 01:46.44 | herlo | and he keeps saying its not OS related...but the tech keeps trying to send him to linux support |
| 01:46.46 | Supaplex | that's a requirement, isn't it? |
| 01:46.50 | herlo | I think so |
| 01:46.54 | nick125 | LOL |
| 01:47.11 | herlo | ~lart qwest, the damned idiots |
| 01:48.05 | herlo | otis holds.... |
| 01:48.18 | herlo | and holds |
| 01:48.26 | nick125 | did qwest tell him to call linux and ask them for help? |
| 01:48.43 | herlo | yeah, but he just wants to know if they support the rfc |
| 01:49.09 | herlo | not related at all to linux/unix. Otis keeps saying that he could do the same thing on windows, but the guy is not getting it.... |
| 01:49.37 | herlo | for those interested: http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1483.html |
| 01:49.41 | brac | [RFC 1483 (rfc1483) - Multiprotocol Encapsulation over ATM Adaptation Layer] |
| 01:50.35 | herlo | otis asks for a network engineer, tech doesn't understand. Why can't you just call linux support? |
| 01:50.48 | herlo | otis asks again |
| 01:50.58 | herlo | this is funny |
| 01:52.31 | herlo | otis says "there's a half hour of my life that I am never gonna $%$%^ get back!!!" |
| 01:52.46 | nick125 | LOL |
| 01:52.48 | herlo | Otis: I want a public IP address please? |
| 01:53.07 | herlo | Tech: Okay, here's your public IP address; 192.168... |
| 01:53.13 | herlo | Otis: --- NO |
| 01:53.15 | nick125 | LOL |
| 01:53.23 | nick125 | poor guy :( |
| 01:53.41 | herlo | Otis: that's private darnit!! (expletives changed to protect the innocent) |
| 01:54.04 | nick125 | Tech: No, it's a public IP address |
| 01:54.34 | herlo | LOL |
| 01:54.52 | herlo | nick125: is that because anybody in the public can use that address?> |
| 01:55.00 | nick125 | yes |
| 01:55.31 | herlo | so out of that call, Otis got a number to call, for linux support!!! |
| 01:55.38 | herlo | IDIOTS!!! IDIOTS!!!! |
| 01:55.51 | nick125 | hahahahhahahaahahahahahahahahahahhaahahahahahhahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahah |
| 01:59.04 | tensai | w00t. we rock |
| 01:59.35 | goozbach | you know of what I refer, then? |
| 01:59.55 | tensai | we kicked numist's trash |
| 02:00.13 | goozbach | oh yeah!!! |
| 02:00.15 | goozbach | 18:23 <@OldleBot> tensai, goozbach, and FaeAngelique [2259/2361] have team battled Myon, brimstone, and numist [347/2425] and won! 1 day, 17:53:21 is removed from their |
| 02:00.40 | goozbach | in your face!!! |
| 02:00.57 | goozbach | 2259 to 347 |
| 02:01.04 | nick125 | lol |
| 02:01.12 | goozbach | they collectivly rolled a 347 |
| 02:01.24 | goozbach | that's how you do it |
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| 03:56.29 | flyboy^ | Does anyone here run fedora core 5? |
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| 04:00.28 | flyboy^ | Is wpa_supplicant the only wpa supplicant for Linux? |
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| 04:50.34 | flyboy^ | WiFi is in pretty bad shape under GNU/Linux isn't it? |
| 04:50.57 | goozbach | flyboy^: not exactly |
| 04:51.03 | goozbach | it depends on the card |
| 04:51.11 | flyboy^ | I'm having a terrible time. I wonder what I'm missing then. |
| 04:51.53 | flyboy^ | I have the ipw3945 driver working, and I can see networks. |
| 04:52.07 | flyboy^ | I also have wpa_supplicant running, a hopefully configured correctly (no errors). |
| 04:52.33 | flyboy^ | Now, the trick seems to be to tell iwconfig to use WPA-PSK for encrypting, ideas? |
| 04:55.54 | herlo | flyboy^: You will most likely need the firmware stuff from intel. Once you have that installed, NetworkManager works great for me. I have the ipw2200 (thinkpad T42) and it works perty good |
| 04:56.11 | flyboy^ | Yeah, doesn't work for me. |
| 04:56.22 | flyboy^ | I can set it up manually, but NetworkManager won't work. |
| 04:56.42 | flyboy^ | It can see wireless networks, but can not connect to them. |
| 04:57.14 | herlo | I tend to have that problem once in a while too |
| 04:57.25 | herlo | usually with 128bit WEP keys |
| 04:57.35 | herlo | it will act like its connecting, but it won't |
| 04:57.43 | herlo | however, otherwise I don't have much trouble |
| 05:00.49 | flyboy^ | Humm, now the card seems to be "bouncing" --- connecting for a few seconds then disconnecting. |
| 05:01.08 | flyboy^ | nick125: You have one? |
| 05:01.26 | nick125 | I'm getting one in a week or so, depends on when the compusa in el paso sends it to the store up here |
| 05:01.44 | flyboy^ | nick125: Well, be sure and pay attention if you get it working so I can get mine working. :) |
| 05:02.23 | nick125 | it wasn't bad priced |
| 05:02.44 | nick125 | $1349 for a core duo 1.66ghz, 1gb ram, 128mb nvidia geforce go 7400, 100gb hd |
| 05:04.05 | nick125 | pretty hard to find a lappy with nvidia in it these days |
| 05:04.15 | nick125 | and, usually, only the multimedia laptops have them |
| 05:04.35 | flyboy^ | Sheesh! Finally! |
| 05:04.49 | flyboy^ | This is going to be a huge pain to do for every network though. |
| 05:05.18 | flyboy^ | *sigh* |
| 05:05.29 | flyboy^ | Don't you love it after you work for like SIX HOURS on something you finally figure it out? |
| 05:05.50 | nick125 | I usually say screw it before then..:P |
| 05:06.10 | flyboy^ | Well, getting this thing to work has taken that long. |
| 05:06.33 | nick125 | I think 4G should be good enough disk space for a gentoo router/firewall... |
| 05:06.56 | flyboy^ | Now, what happens if I reboot? >:` |
| 05:07.23 | nick125 | *kablooy* |
| 05:09.06 | flyboy^ | Well, the bad thing so far is it looks like for WPA networks I'll have to add a config line for each one. |
| 05:09.12 | flyboy^ | And then reload the thing. |
| 05:09.21 | nick125 | sounds like fun |
| 05:12.42 | nick125 | since my firewall is using a lot of power, and, it's idle 99.999% of the time, why not consolidate it to my server that is idle 98% of the time? |
| 05:15.52 | nick125 | I'm debating on having two gateway VMs...hrm |
| 05:17.24 | mheath | Ew. |
| 05:18.58 | mheath | levi, around? |
| 05:19.49 | mheath | Meh. Wanted to explain FlexNet to him. |
| 05:26.30 | flyboy^ | nick125: FYI - NetworkManager clobbers the WPA connection if you want to use it. |
| 05:27.00 | findlay | hello |
| 05:27.07 | findlay | how is everyone? |
| 05:27.22 | flyboy^ | sick and tired, and sick and tired of being told that I am. |
| 05:27.51 | mheath | Haha. |
| 05:28.20 | mheath | I'm feeling so lazy. And I'm scared thinking that soon |
| 05:28.34 | mheath | *that soon 'lazy' won't been in my vocabulary :P |
| 05:29.15 | flyboy^ | Only the truley lazy can find a way to remain so. |
| 05:29.30 | flyboy^ | I love my fingerprint reader deal to log me in. |
| 05:29.37 | flyboy^ | Tons O' Fun |
| 05:29.55 | mheath | flyboy^, Then I suppose I'm not truly lazy, because I'm forcing myself to be unlazy |
| 05:30.51 | flyboy^ | I loved reading the comments on the /. article about HP stopping the telecommunting stuff. |
| 05:31.20 | xbmodder_lappy | flyboy^, ! |
| 05:31.36 | xbmodder_lappy | use VPN |
| 05:31.37 | xbmodder_lappy | sick? |
| 05:31.40 | xbmodder_lappy | how are the kids? |
| 05:31.50 | xbmodder_lappy | What happened to slashdot? |
| 05:32.11 | flyboy^ | yeah, tis' the new page. |
| 05:32.47 | flyboy^ | Probably just a test, I think they announced it some time ago however. |
| 05:33.20 | mheath | VPNs, sticking gateways in Xen VMs, WPA....networking is some messy business today :( |
| 05:33.29 | findlay | haha |
| 05:33.43 | findlay | I always used the 'light' version anyway |
| 05:33.52 | findlay | much better and less uglier |
| 05:34.19 | xbmodder_lappy | yeah I loved slashdot how it was a year ago |
| 05:36.27 | flyboy^ | I loved it how it was 5 years ago. |
| 05:36.31 | flyboy^ | It was much better. |
| 05:36.36 | flyboy^ | Now I find it mostly a waste of time. |
| 05:36.56 | xbmodder_lappy | heh |
| 05:38.31 | findlay | I guess I mostly read the slashdot headlines out of habit now |
| 05:39.29 | mheath | I really need to go on my run tomorrow. |
| 05:40.53 | herlo | flyboy^: you figured out the wireless? I didn't quite catch how... |
| 05:41.05 | flyboy^ | herlo: I'm still trying to lock down the step.s |
| 05:41.22 | herlo | okay, when you get it, will you let me know, tx |
| 05:41.29 | flyboy^ | herlo: It's a little sketchy as I am not sure what layer provides the wireless -> if connection. |
| 05:41.38 | herlo | mm, k |
| 05:41.48 | flyboy^ | herlo: So, more knowledge would certainly help explain what I am doing. :) |
| 05:42.12 | flyboy^ | I do have DHCP working, and hopefully all is mostly well. |
| 05:42.15 | herlo | like what, are you running iwconfig or NetworkManager |
| 05:42.28 | herlo | or are you beyond that nowq |
| 05:42.42 | scottj | any mythtv users here? |
| 05:43.08 | flyboy^ | herlo: Well, first off - I am running FC5 - so your milage may vary. |
| 05:43.18 | herlo | same here |
| 05:43.35 | flyboy^ | herlo: I started by recommpiling the ieee80211 stuff and replacing the stuff that was in there. |
| 05:43.37 | herlo | and that's what I plan to run on my new lappy I just bought from lenovo |
| 05:44.02 | flyboy^ | herlo: That allowed me to then compile the intel stuff. The stuff from the SF site didn't work, so I am using the older version directly from the intel .tgz |
| 05:44.21 | flyboy^ | herlo: That got me a working interface in iwconfig |
| 05:44.30 | herlo | wow, I haven't gotten that far into it yet.... |
| 05:45.00 | herlo | mostly, I have just dl'd the firmware, got that working and then ran iwconfig or NetworkManager... |
| 05:45.04 | flyboy^ | herlo: iwlist eth1 scanning shows networks, to prove the card is working. |
| 05:45.10 | herlo | right |
| 05:45.52 | herlo | I understand how to use it, but rebuilding the 802.11 stuff just to get wireless working, I haven't ever done that before.... |
| 05:45.53 | flyboy^ | herlo: Then I hacked up the load script that came with intel to get rid of './' and I set up a ROOTDIR var instead that references my install dir. |
| 05:46.07 | flyboy^ | herlo: It was a simple make, make install |
| 05:46.13 | herlo | okay,. cool |
| 05:46.19 | herlo | thought it might be something more |
| 05:46.23 | flyboy^ | herlo: If you have a working radio - don't screw with it. |
| 05:46.49 | flyboy^ | herlo: then I ran ntsysv to start up the Network* stuff and wpa_supplement |
| 05:47.07 | herlo | yeah, but my next lappy will be (I believe) the 3945 wifi stuff |
| 05:47.10 | flyboy^ | then I hacked the wpa_supplement startup to load the ipw3945 drivers BEFORE it loads. |
| 05:47.16 | flyboy^ | and also to unload it. |
| 05:47.35 | herlo | okay, doesn't sound that hard, just so many steps is all |
| 05:47.44 | herlo | of course, order IS important here |
| 05:47.52 | flyboy^ | Then - I had to screw around with the NetworkManager configuration to 'activate' the dumb link between wirless and 'eth1' |
| 05:48.08 | herlo | yeah, had to do that on this one too |
| 05:48.27 | herlo | btw, can anyone help me identify what I am doing wrong in this find command |
| 05:48.29 | herlo | find * -name "*.php" -ok "sed 's/herlo_LARDWARS/herlo_LWI/g' {} > {}.orig" \; |
| 05:48.32 | flyboy^ | So, all in all it took 6 hours to get it to work.... but I knew NUTHIN aobut running wifi under linux before then. |
| 05:48.45 | herlo | flyboy^: that's not bad |
| 05:49.46 | herlo | I can't seem to figure out what's missing there. I tried escaping the > and also tried with/without "s everywhere, still no luck |
| 05:50.00 | herlo | anyone have any idears? |
| 05:50.35 | flyboy^ | herlo: I usually call it with xargs or write a smaller wrapper script to get away from -exec weirdness. |
| 05:50.59 | herlo | yeah, that's what I was thinking, but I am not extremely familiar with xargs syntax |
| 05:51.24 | herlo | I tried a simple for loop, and that will probably work with some more tweaking, but I wanted to try to do it this way |
| 05:52.00 | flyboy^ | herlo: The most flexible way is to write a smaller script and pass the file name in as a argument. |
| 05:52.10 | flyboy^ | herlo: It allows you to grow it easily as your needs change. |
| 05:52.17 | herlo | yeah |
| 05:52.29 | flyboy^ | Especially when doing find/replace regex stuff. |
| 05:52.52 | flyboy^ | You don't always wanna be trying to figure out which chars to replace in a double nested command. |
| 05:52.55 | herlo | flyboy^: I have a simple for loop in mind, its just that I thought a one liner would've done it....pissed me off!! |
| 05:53.16 | herlo | now I want it to work that way so I don't have do it another way...but I digress |
| 05:53.32 | flyboy^ | herlo: I've found that either find's -exec is weak, or I am weak at using it. I frequently have problems doing things I think are simple. |
| 05:54.00 | herlo | flyboy^: yeah, me too, but I'd like to be better, that's why I keep trying |
| 05:57.56 | herlo | flyboy^: problem solved, but I don't like this way as much, not as elegant.... |
| 05:58.26 | flyboy^ | herlo: What was the problem? |
| 05:58.41 | herlo | I did a simple for loop, worked perfectly |
| 05:59.11 | herlo | except that stupid redirection is being a pain |
| 05:59.13 | flyboy^ | herlo: like a for x in `ls`; do done ? |
| 05:59.19 | herlo | yeah |
| 05:59.26 | herlo | when I run this command |
| 05:59.35 | herlo | sed 's/herlo_LARDWARS/herlo_LWI/g' $i > $i |
| 05:59.43 | nick125 | wee |
| 05:59.50 | herlo | it decides that it should overwrite $i with a blank file |
| 05:59.52 | nick125 | xen vm gateway and vpn in one night! |
| 05:59.58 | flyboy^ | herlo: Yeah, you might have a hard time doing that. |
| 06:00.10 | herlo | because apparently redirection doesn't work with sed |
| 06:00.13 | flyboy^ | herlo: I think you have to redirect it like cmd < infile > infile |
| 06:00.23 | herlo | hmm, maybe that would work |
| 06:00.34 | herlo | k, I'll try it... |
| 06:00.36 | herlo | makes sense |
| 06:00.39 | flyboy^ | or cat infile | sed /stuff/ > infile |
| 06:01.32 | herlo | flyboy^: nope, cmd < infile > infile doesn't still work |
| 06:01.36 | flyboy^ | k |
| 06:01.49 | herlo | trying piping now |
| 06:02.30 | flyboy^ | What's the project that adds GL to X windows? |
| 06:02.38 | flyboy^ | And adds all the window effects, etc? |
| 06:02.50 | herlo | flyboy^: yeah, pipes work, was the project xgl? |
| 06:03.09 | flyboy^ | Yeah, xgl - has anyone got it working in fc5? |
| 06:03.34 | nick125 | XGL is coool... |
| 06:03.39 | herlo | flyboy^: not me, but I did read somewhere that it had been done. Might have been on openplanet |
| 06:03.39 | nick125 | (I haven't tried FC5 yet though) |
| 06:03.58 | herlo | http://openclue.org/ut/ |
| 06:03.59 | flyboy^ | I saw a guy that got it working in a couple hours in gentoo. |
| 06:04.01 | nick125 | you should still have to compile from scratch |
| 06:04.41 | nick125 | it took me around an hour or two to get it working on here (I don't use it any more since it uses alot of resources) |
| 06:05.16 | herlo | yeah, I think I will get it running on my new lappy.... |
| 06:05.27 | flyboy^ | Well, it's a great first step. |
| 06:05.36 | flyboy^ | I imagine version 3 or 4 will be pretty amazing. |
| 06:07.17 | nick125 | bye bye smoothwall :D |
| 06:07.28 | herlo | flyboy^: I think its very nice, xgl... |
| 06:08.04 | nick125 | blah |
| 06:08.09 | flyboy^ | I would imagine that it's buggy. |
| 06:08.16 | herlo | probably |
| 06:08.16 | nick125 | I just unpacked /usr/portage, then, I accidently rm'ed it |
| 06:08.17 | nick125 | :( |
| 06:08.29 | nick125 | it was slightly buggy in my month or so in testing |
| 06:08.38 | nick125 | I don't think I got it to crash though |
| 06:09.01 | nick125 | and, once I changed the color depth, I actually found it very stable |
| 06:10.08 | xbmodder_lappy | I wonder if you had pepsi and mentos (enough) your stomach would rupture |
| 06:10.30 | nick125 | it would be impossible |
| 06:10.37 | flyboy^ | xbmodder_lappy: You have to much time on your hands. :) |
| 06:10.39 | nick125 | since it would go out one way or another |
| 06:10.54 | xbmodder_lappy | I need to get someone stupid, and hungry |
| 06:11.18 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: they tested it on TV before on that health channel before.. |
| 06:11.39 | flyboy^ | Is there a CISCO compatible VPN client for Linux? |
| 06:11.40 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, they tested pop rocks and soda |
| 06:11.52 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: no, I think it was on dr know or something |
| 06:12.07 | nick125 | if it was possible for someones stomach to explode |
| 06:12.14 | flyboy^ | nick125: Sounds like a good topic for myth busters. |
| 06:12.26 | nick125 | remember, if it ever did get enough pressure to pop, it would go out one end or another |
| 06:13.37 | mheath | if(shareObjectOffer(start, dest).accepted) { |
| 06:13.44 | mheath | oops, pasted into the wrong window |
| 06:16.17 | mheath | I hope to have a working FlexNet implementation done before I leave..... |
| 06:28.18 | xbmodder_lappy | dr know? |
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| 06:28.48 | maquis | dilvie: howdy |
| 06:29.11 | mheath | Though FlexNet is really only a stepping stone, a necesity for what I really want to work on... |
| 06:29.25 | mheath | I don't know if I'll ever get a chance to finish any of this though :( |
| 06:35.23 | flyboy^ | Man, I have to say desktop linux has come A LONG way. |
| 06:45.00 | Kuyaedz | flyboy^: sure has and it keeps moving fast |
| 06:48.38 | scottj | it's moved slower than I ould have thought a few years ago |
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| 11:05.43 | emcnabb | good morning all |
| 11:26.50 | Supaplex | morning |
| 11:27.11 | Supaplex | daylight went away, and it looks like it's on its way back again. |
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| 12:09.42 | goozbach | anyone else having trouble with the planetutah feed? |
| 12:23.29 | linuxalien | There's a planetutah feed? |
| 12:23.33 | linuxalien | I'm gonna check that out |
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| 12:49.48 | goozbach | linuxalien: openclue.org/ut |
| 12:50.02 | linuxalien | thanks |
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| 13:43.18 | tristanbob | everybody NEEDS to look at the virtual appliances that were entered for the vmware virtual appliance competition |
| 13:44.37 | tristanbob | http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/ |
| 13:45.04 | tristanbob | There is such great stuff, and it they were just released today |
| 13:45.18 | tristanbob | I will definately be blogging about this |
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| 13:59.10 | hans | -lart vontrapp_ |
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| 14:31.15 | [Utah]tristanbob | looks like the vmware site is down (too many connections) |
| 14:34.07 | [Utah]tristanbob | http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/cat/51/ |
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| 14:39.11 | ^Migs^ | OH NOES |
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| 14:49.20 | ^Migs^ | A man is dying of cancer. His son asks him, "Dad, why do you keep telling people you're dying of AIDS?" Dad responds, "So when I'm dead no one will dare touch your mom." |
| 14:50.30 | levi | ~lart ^Migs^ |
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| 15:25.05 | tensai | ~rlart |
| 15:25.44 | redbeard1 | anyone here have any experience with webcams in linux? |
| 15:28.15 | graphyx | yeah, check out my site. Me and my roommates like it when it gets hot... |
| 15:28.16 | graphyx | j/k. |
| 15:29.28 | redbeard1 | oh man. i must be tired. i didn't even see that coming. |
| 15:30.28 | spengy | haha |
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| 15:31.24 | redbeard1 | i just managed to hard-lock my notebook just trying to query the webcam |
| 15:32.44 | graphyx | ouch. |
| 15:33.21 | redbeard1 | this would explain why my brother was so willing to give it to me |
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| 16:09.03 | elg | anyone know the C++ compiler magic that makes this possible? http://rafb.net/paste/results/ry5KWo82.html |
| 16:09.32 | elg | I want to leverage this make-an-object-from-a-native-type-automatically magic |
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| 16:11.57 | levi | elg: I'm not sure what magic you're talking about there. |
| 16:12.13 | elg | passing "hello, world" where std::string is expected |
| 16:13.05 | levi | Ahh, an automatic coercion of a string literal to std::string. |
| 16:13.38 | elg | right |
| 16:13.57 | Kuyaedz | Anyone have any suggestions for *nix compatible laser printer? |
| 16:13.58 | elg | i'd like to set up a coercion to my own class |
| 16:14.16 | levi | Kuyaedz: Any postscript laser printer would be compatible. |
| 16:14.30 | levi | elg: Hmm. |
| 16:14.36 | tensai | Kuyaedz: my lj 1300 works nice |
| 16:15.32 | Kuyaedz | I've got an inkjet now but I need a laserjet for my home office. Tired of spending so regularly on ink. |
| 16:19.01 | levi | elg: It looks like there are conversion operators that you can overload. |
| 16:20.05 | levi | elg: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/C++_Programming/Operator_Overloading#Conversion_operators |
| 16:20.31 | Kuyaedz | Do you think its worth +$30 to get 16M mem + ethernet connection on the printer? |
| 16:20.45 | elg | levi: cool, thanks |
| 16:20.55 | elg | Kuyaedz: depending on your needs it might be worth the ethernet connection |
| 16:20.58 | levi | no problem. :) |
| 16:21.07 | elg | I couldn't say whether the extra ram would be worth anything |
| 16:21.12 | levi | Extra memory in a printer is always nice, too. |
| 16:21.21 | elg | i guess that depends on how complicated the stuff you print is. |
| 16:21.21 | levi | Makes the print jobs faster. |
| 16:21.45 | Kuyaedz | right now I just use printer sharing, which seems to work well enough. Ethernet would be nice though--won't rely on any one machine. |
| 16:21.46 | levi | Unless you're really pinching pennies, I'd say go for it. |
| 16:22.05 | levi | I have ethernet on my inkjet, and I really like it. |
| 16:23.04 | elg | yeah, ethernet is really nice |
| 16:23.24 | levi | Kuyaedz: What printer are you looking at? |
| 16:23.43 | Kuyaedz | Brother HL-2040 or HL-2070 |
| 16:23.43 | elg | but may be moot depending on your setup. e.g. if you always have one computer on and can share it there |
| 16:23.57 | elg | always check at linuxprinting.org |
| 16:24.25 | levi | My inkjet is a brother MFC. It's got pretty good Linux and OS X support, IIRC. |
| 16:24.59 | Kuyaedz | From what I read Brother is good about supporting Linux. Specs on this site showed : XP, OSX, Linux (redhat, suse, debian) |
| 16:25.29 | elg | levi: that doesn't help me going from int to Foo |
| 16:25.32 | elg | only from Foo to int |
| 16:26.19 | levi | Hmm, yes, I guess so. |
| 16:27.33 | levi | elg: Is there a standard library example you could look at in the library source code? |
| 16:28.27 | elg | std::string probably. I wonder what source package that would be |
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| 16:28.37 | elg | or if it would be in the header |
| 16:29.10 | levi | No idea, sorry. |
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| 16:40.45 | macnewbold | ~rlart |
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| 16:41.18 | Kuyaedz | I hate mail-in-rebates |
| 16:41.42 | Kuyaedz | Found the HL-2040 for under $100 after a rebate. I usually pass those just on principle |
| 16:41.59 | elg | levi: huh. I guess it's automatic. http://rafb.net/paste/results/QDHPvQ61.html compiles and does the magic |
| 16:42.23 | tensai | redbeard1: http://www.cookingforengineers.com/article.php?id=181 |
| 16:42.29 | brac | [Cooking For Engineers - Recipe File: Cheesecake Cupcakes] |
| 16:42.39 | tensai | redbeard1: his proportions for cheesecake are exactly the same. you rock! |
| 16:42.57 | elg | you styrofoam! |
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| 16:47.29 | elg | redbeard1: you creme brulee! |
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| 16:48.10 | redbeard1 | tensai: the really cool thing was, when i first came up with that ratio, it was based on a bunch of others, like i said. about 5 minutes after i came up with it, i stumbled across nick malgieri's basic new york cheesecake recipe, and it was exactly the same. w00t! |
| 16:48.43 | elg | redbeard1: I think nick stole it from you |
| 16:48.46 | elg | time machine |
| 16:49.09 | tensai | wouldn't that destroy space time? |
| 16:49.28 | elg | speaking of time machines, watch Primer (http://www.primermovie.com/) |
| 16:49.46 | findlay | how come fungus gets an ip6 address? no fair |
| 16:49.48 | elg | very highly recommend it |
| 16:50.20 | fungus | http://tunnelbroker.net |
| 16:50.24 | tensai | findlay: I will give you fec8:0001::/96 |
| 16:50.24 | brac | [Hurricane Electric IPv6 Tunnel Broker] |
| 16:50.30 | elg | and speaking of movies, don't watch monster in law |
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| 16:53.35 | mheath | Good morning! |
| 16:55.13 | levi | elg: The craziness of C++. |
| 16:55.29 | levi | elg: Why would anyone in their right mind watch monster in law? |
| 16:55.53 | elg | i don't know. but just in case |
| 16:56.57 | ^Migs^ | why not watch it? |
| 16:57.06 | mheath | I love Java....mmmmm... |
| 16:57.37 | ^Migs^ | hmmm |
| 16:57.45 | ^Migs^ | are there any Java gurus in here? |
| 16:58.02 | ^Migs^ | because we might have a position opening up soon here |
| 16:58.24 | ^Migs^ | keyword is MIGHT |
| 16:58.30 | elg | ^Migs^: every j-lo movie nightmare you ever had... not even close |
| 16:59.19 | mheath | ^Migs^, I'm a highschool grdauate with college experience in Java programming :) Problem is, I'm only going to be here for a nother 2.5 months at the _most_ |
| 16:59.50 | findlay | tensai: thanks |
| 17:00.17 | levi | We probably have some java positions open here, too. |
| 17:00.56 | mheath | ^Migs^, but if you'd be willing to have me for that long, I'd love to work in a job that doesn't suck so much! :P |
| 17:01.59 | findlay | isn't the netmask redundant? |
| 17:02.34 | ^Migs^ | no, that's no good, mheath |
| 17:03.04 | ^Migs^ | we'd need a major java expert, actually. I have other responsibilities beside Java development, and have mostly been learning it as I've gone along |
| 17:03.15 | levi | findlay: I'm pretty sure no one wants to hire a java programmer for 2.5 months. |
| 17:03.19 | levi | Er. |
| 17:03.22 | levi | That was to mheath. |
| 17:03.30 | ^Migs^ | unless it was a 2.5 month contract gig |
| 17:03.51 | mheath | levi: I could just come in, get hired, and _then_ inform you I'm leaving so soon and that it's a federal offense to fire me because of that :) |
| 17:04.24 | ^Migs^ | it would probably work better if you didn't announce your plan to do so, mheath |
| 17:04.32 | levi | mheath: I would be sure to inform my friend, who is hiring the java programmers, that you were a short-timer. |
| 17:04.40 | levi | So that he would not hire you. |
| 17:04.45 | findlay | levi: you can keep all your icky 2.5 month java jobs (: |
| 17:05.33 | levi | findlay: What's your opinion on how Debussy's Arabeseque #1 in E Major should be played? |
| 17:06.07 | findlay | levi: I don't know that wwork by name, sorry |
| 17:06.15 | findlay | s/ww/w/ |
| 17:06.31 | findlay | s/ww/f/ |
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| 17:06.37 | findlay | ha |
| 17:06.41 | mheath | FlexNet is implemented in Java currently.... |
| 17:06.58 | mheath | ('currently' used loosely, because I 'm no where done with the implementation) |
| 17:07.04 | levi | findlay: Why not? It's probably one of his most well-known works! |
| 17:07.06 | mheath | Though I plan to work on bindings for other languages |
| 17:07.43 | mheath | I enjoy some classical music, but I know very few works by name |
| 17:08.04 | mheath | Despite being immersed in it constantly. By dad constantly has his radio tuned to Classical 89, etc. |
| 17:08.05 | levi | mheath: : you're not findlay, though. He's a classical music freak! ;) |
| 17:08.26 | mheath | a couple hundred classical music records too |
| 17:08.34 | mheath | A huge shelf full.. |
| 17:08.53 | findlay | I know a guy why has a couple thousand records |
| 17:09.06 | levi | mheath: I'm sorry you haven't bothered to learn the names of many works, then. |
| 17:09.36 | mheath | levi, No, its just music that I hear on and off on the radio. They don't always announce the names, and I have a bad memory for such things. |
| 17:09.56 | levi | mheath: That's too bad. |
| 17:10.01 | findlay | levi: as much as I love Debussy I haven't studied him as much yet |
| 17:10.30 | mheath | levi, I do enjoy it, though. |
| 17:12.17 | levi | findlay: My wife has this CD of mostly classical piano pieces, and it includes a couple of Debussy pieces as well as all three movements of Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata. |
| 17:12.36 | levi | findlay: And the piano playing in it bugs me, for some reason that I've been trying to put my finger on. |
| 17:13.16 | findlay | Beethoven's piano sonotas, now there's something worth studying |
| 17:13.43 | levi | The third movement is wonderful. Very energetic. :) |
| 17:13.47 | findlay | levi: I can't say that I have a prefrential French pianinst |
| 17:14.03 | findlay | and very difficult |
| 17:15.07 | findlay | I guess there's always Jean-François Latour, but I've never heard him |
| 17:15.08 | levi | Whoever played these was very technically proficient, but everything sounded a bit 'clipped'. |
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| 17:17.12 | Ash | anybody want a job in vegas |
| 17:17.21 | levi | No. |
| 17:17.30 | Ash | the correct response is 'Yes' |
| 17:17.35 | tyce | does it envolve removing my clothing? |
| 17:17.46 | findlay | I'll take a job in vegas |
| 17:17.49 | findlay | (where's vegas?) |
| 17:17.52 | Ash | heh |
| 17:18.02 | mheath | tyce: the correct response is 'Yes' |
| 17:18.06 | Ash | I'm leaving a sr. linux admin position open here |
| 17:18.16 | ^Migs^ | hmmm |
| 17:18.23 | Ash | it's telecommute, but you have to be in vegas |
| 17:18.23 | ^Migs^ | where in Vegas? |
| 17:18.27 | findlay | isn't tux only like 16? |
| 17:18.33 | ^Migs^ | I need a good telecommute job |
| 17:18.40 | findlay | that's a junior as far as I can recon |
| 17:18.59 | Ash | you just have to live in vegas so you can drive over to the colo facility every now and then |
| 17:19.01 | mheath | findlay, The rest of the GNU/Linux OS is closer to 25 :) |
| 17:19.20 | mrpull- | mheath: what is GNU/Linux? |
| 17:19.26 | findlay | mheath: t |
| 17:19.28 | Ash | it's mostly going to be systems automation work, so strong perl knowledge (or some other thing like python/ruby/whatever) is good |
| 17:19.42 | findlay | mheath: stallman's manifesto was in 1983, so 23 |
| 17:19.44 | mheath | mrpull-: The GNU Operating System with the Linux kernel. |
| 17:20.00 | mheath | findlay, "closer" to 25 :) I chose my wording carefully |
| 17:20.13 | findlay | mheath: an operating system properly defined *is* a kernel |
| 17:20.20 | mrpull- | ;-) |
| 17:20.59 | findlay | can pythons and rubies live in the desert climate surrounding Las Vegas? |
| 17:21.17 | Ash | the desert sucks |
| 17:21.59 | mheath | findlay, from http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_System : An operating system (OS) is a software program that manages the hardware and software resources of a computer. The OS performs basic tasks, such as controlling and allocating memory, prioritizing the processing of instructions, controlling input and output devices, facilitating networking, and managing files. |
| 17:22.29 | mheath | From that basic definition: Number one, Linux includes no method of memory allocation other than protected slab allocation. You need a lib c for proper memory allocation |
| 17:22.33 | mheath | Number two, |
| 17:23.05 | mheath | pthreads is, while partly a kernel land feature, iimplemented in LIB C. It plays a lage pard in "Prioritizing .... instructions" |
| 17:23.15 | mheath | s/lage pard/large part/g |
| 17:23.47 | mheath | "Processing of instructions". Because of its protected mode of operation, the kernel is unable to process very much at all, really. |
| 17:24.06 | mheath | This is chiefly the job of the LibC, which makes calls to the kernel when necessary. |
| 17:24.22 | tensai | why do I suddenly feel like I'm subscribed to a Hurd mailing list? |
| 17:25.05 | mheath | tensai, if you were subscribed to a Hurd mailing list, you'd be enjoying conversations like "Why did you create inflammatory CVS reivision tag names making fun of my changes?!" |
| 17:25.53 | mheath | tensai, besides, I'm talking about GNU/Linux, which (rather specifically) doesn't include the Hurd. |
| 17:26.09 | mheath | GNU/Linux = GNU - Hurd + Linux |
| 17:26.17 | Ash | anyway |
| 17:26.23 | findlay | mheath: so an operating system is linux + glibc |
| 17:26.25 | Ash | come work down here! |
| 17:26.26 | mrpull- | Hurd is a stupid name |
| 17:26.27 | Ash | hehe |
| 17:26.34 | mrpull- | Hird is stupid too |
| 17:26.45 | mheath | mrpull-: Agred. |
| 17:26.47 | macnewbold | Hord wouldn't be any better |
| 17:26.51 | findlay | Heard? |
| 17:26.53 | Ash | HORDE |
| 17:26.59 | Ash | like in Masters of the Universe |
| 17:27.13 | mheath | findlay, Well, your forgetting a linker...and your compiler...and the binutils |
| 17:27.26 | mheath | Those are ESSENTIALS for a system to be useful, really |
| 17:27.44 | mrpull- | mheath: windows isn't useful? it doesn't include a compiler. |
| 17:27.45 | findlay | mheath: you don't need a linker, compiler, and binutils to manage hardware and software |
| 17:28.10 | findlay | mheath: we're not talking about useability here, we're defining an operating system |
| 17:28.35 | mheath | findlay, A lot of this, too, isn't just "All our stuff is necessary to make a complete operating system" |
| 17:29.09 | mheath | It's "This is our operating system. It includes all these parts we made. You removed our kernel and replaced it with something else, so we still feel like its our operating system, and should be called the same name." |
| 17:29.33 | findlay | This bickering is pointless. Once Vader retrives the stolen data tapes we will crush the Rebellion with one swift stroke. |
| 17:31.24 | mheath | You could almost compare it to...someone taking your open source project, replacing one part, and then not acknowledging through citation or name that a large part of it came from another system. |
| 17:31.38 | ^Migs^ | http://www.bash.org/?650276 |
| 17:31.43 | brac | [QDB: Quote #650276] |
| 17:32.05 | findlay | The regional governers have direct control now. Fear is what will keep the local systems in line, fear of this microkernel. |
| 17:32.28 | findlay | mheath: yup that's about what it's like |
| 17:32.35 | tensai | when FSF releases a Linux distribution they can call it GNU/Linux, but my Linux install contains quite a lot more than just GNU + Linux |
| 17:32.41 | findlay | I don't dispute that |
| 17:32.57 | tensai | it's pointless to try to list the contributors of everything in a distribution |
| 17:33.05 | Ash | LOL/Linux |
| 17:33.31 | tensai | so we call it Linux because it's sexy |
| 17:33.34 | mheath | tensai, Well, I know that a lot of modern Linux systems manage packages in an extremely modular way |
| 17:34.05 | mheath | Which makes it conceptually difficult to think that GNU should be included.....Yes you have the "binutils" package and the "gcc" package....but you also hav ethe xorg package |
| 17:34.14 | mheath | Why not include it in the name? |
| 17:34.15 | mheath | 1 sec, phone |
| 17:34.32 | findlay | did somebody prank call mheath? |
| 17:34.55 | Ash | it was the only way I could think of to make him shut up, findlay |
| 17:35.05 | tensai | ~Ash++ |
| 17:35.51 | mheath | OK, what people fail to forget is that GNU is (though components are modular), for the most part, a monolithic release. |
| 17:35.55 | mheath | Its meant to have all the parts. |
| 17:36.17 | mheath | The creators of all those parts have labeled them as a complete operating system |
| 17:36.55 | tensai | well la-dee-freakin-da for them. when they release it, they can call it whatever they want. |
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| 17:37.40 | mheath | This complete operating system provides basic (And, in some cases, advanced) functionality in a lot of categories.....It is, in essence, an extremely large block of stuff necessary for your computer to be useful on their platform |
| 17:37.57 | mheath | tensai, they've made releases, several times |
| 17:38.35 | mheath | It provides the basics necessary for you to install and use other software - A critical characteristic of an operating system's ablity to, according to Wikipedia, manage software.. |
| 17:40.45 | mheath | tensai, thats why people advocate the GNU/Linux name. They see their software as a fairly molithic release of all the software necessary for your computer to be useful - all the software necessary to use any other software, basically. I know that some of you advocate that the Linux kernel alone is an operating system - but, a lot of people feel that Linux + GNU is an operating system. Hence the name. |
| 17:42.51 | levi | elg: Have you heard of the SuperCollider language? |
| 17:43.00 | elg | yeah |
| 17:43.25 | levi | I just came across it, and it looked like something you might find interesting. |
| 17:46.43 | levi | mheath: I use Linux with uClibc instead of glibc. |
| 17:48.00 | *** part/#utah phinux (n=phinux@iocane.cs.byu.edu) |
| 17:48.42 | mheath | levi, I was actually thinking of bringing that up as an exception, but I figured that most people here wouldn't use that. Apparently I was wrong :) |
| 17:48.56 | levi | Probably some portions of the (rather minimal) system are GNU, but it's not largely GNU by any means. |
| 17:50.33 | levi | And uClibc is statically linked into the binaries, too, so it's not really an operating system facility. |
| 17:52.18 | levi | Anyway, the C library is an important part of POSIX-compatible operating systems, but not operating systems in general. |
| 17:53.12 | findlay | some operating systems might even have a latin library |
| 17:58.26 | tensai | or ascii art |
| 17:59.36 | tensai | it's fun to use aalib for watching movies. entirely useless, but fun |
| 18:03.28 | findlay | tensai: and I bet gzipped ascii movies are a lot smaller too |
| 18:03.58 | findlay | than that overrated mpeg encoded stuff |
| 18:04.08 | tensai | how do I tell apt to skip kernel-image-2.4.18-1-686-smp for upgrade? |
| 18:04.15 | findlay | too much realism in our modern culture |
| 18:32.09 | spengy | If you use libcaca you can get color ascii movies ;) |
| 18:37.41 | ^Migs^ | http://www.techcrunch.com/2006/06/05/find-out-when-your-friends-become-single/ |
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| 18:56.06 | spengy | haha poop library |
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| 19:09.24 | goozbach | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/03/30/all_your_data_and_biz |
| 19:09.37 | tyce | http://chuck-d.net/vids/Fuzzy.Zoeller.avi |
| 19:09.41 | Uncle_Je1se | ahhh...feels good to be back on my server again |
| 19:11.39 | Uncle_Je1se | I made the plunge to Gentoo |
| 19:11.45 | Uncle_Je1se | I'll never do it on my desktop though |
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| 19:29.26 | tyce | http://eepybird.com/dcm1.html |
| 19:29.29 | brac | [EepyBird.com] |
| 19:30.03 | tyce | that was nuts |
| 19:30.10 | tyce | remind me not to eat mentos while drinking diet coke |
| 19:37.45 | Uncle_Je1se | I think Coke needs to buy the rights to that and market it as advertising |
| 19:37.52 | tyce | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRBkQe_lwak |
| 19:38.04 | tyce | what happens when you put it in your stomach ;) |
| 19:38.16 | Jayce^ | hadn't seen that one, but we've had a bit of fun with those around here |
| 19:45.32 | herlo | mplayer keeps crashing my firefox.... |
| 19:51.20 | goozbach | herlo: don't let it drive |
| 19:51.39 | goozbach | http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,70933-0.html?tw=rss.index |
| 19:51.42 | brac | [Wired News: GNU Radio Opens an Unseen World] |
| 19:52.49 | [Utah]tristanbob | If anybody runs a Cisco network and want to try a neat open source management tool - try NeDiVA (Network Discovery Virtual Appliance) |
| 19:52.49 | [Utah]tristanbob | http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/184 |
| 19:53.10 | [Utah]tristanbob | I created that - uses an app called Nedi |
| 20:00.16 | Kuyaedz | I wish the band "Live" would have chosen an easier searchable name :) |
| 20:03.27 | [Utah]tristanbob | wow - there are 1,297 bittorrent seeds for Ubuntu 6.06 LTS Desktop |
| 20:03.45 | herlo | goozbach: what do you mean "don't let it drive" with regard to mplayer? |
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| 20:06.35 | *** mode/#utah [+o Jayce^] by irc.freenode.net |
| 20:07.29 | *** part/#utah Robdor (n=rob@208.187.196.58) |
| 20:07.29 | ^Migs^ | gah |
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| 20:13.27 | xbmodder | :-| |
| 20:13.32 | xbmodder | netsplits suck |
| 20:13.50 | nick125 | lol |
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| 20:18.31 | goozbach | herlo: yup |
| 20:18.36 | goozbach | I was being stupid |
| 20:18.44 | goozbach | how's the new gig treating you? |
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| 20:25.35 | redbeard1 | i love engrish |
| 20:25.37 | redbeard1 | "Accessing to card. Do not eject the medium." |
| 20:26.43 | goozbach | ohh do not ejecting the medium |
| 20:28.44 | herlo | goozbach: GL is very nice. I am learning a ton man |
| 20:28.54 | herlo | there is so much to learn!! |
| 20:30.52 | xbmodder | nick125: hey, can you get the site up? I figured that I can move it at the end of next week. Set the site up today. We might be stuck at vr.org for some time actually... |
| 20:31.12 | goozbach | herlo: got your certs yet? |
| 20:31.18 | goozbach | RHCI I can see. |
| 20:31.22 | goozbach | RHCX? |
| 20:32.13 | xbmodder | RHCX == cool; |
| 20:34.18 | herlo | no RHCX yet |
| 20:34.19 | herlo | soon |
| 20:34.27 | herlo | RHCI? what's that one? |
| 20:34.44 | herlo | do you mean RHCE? |
| 20:35.40 | herlo | ~bonk goozback |
| 20:35.51 | herlo | ~bonk goozbach |
| 20:35.53 | xbmodder | Red hat certified instructor! |
| 20:35.58 | herlo | ahh |
| 20:36.01 | xbmodder | that sounds cool. |
| 20:36.52 | herlo | xbmodder: I didn't realize they had that specific one. I just understood you had to have your RHCE to teach any of the courses. To give exams you needed the RHCX... |
| 20:37.55 | xbmodder | does anyone have an RHCX? |
| 20:37.58 | xbmodder | RHCA? |
| 20:38.00 | xbmodder | here |
| 20:38.17 | herlo | goozbach is/was RHCX for sure |
| 20:38.35 | herlo | RHCA would be another cool one |
| 20:38.37 | herlo | to have |
| 20:38.39 | xbmodder | Yeah he is an RHCX |
| 20:38.49 | xbmodder | RHCA=Expensive and time consuming |
| 20:39.02 | *** part/#utah linuxalien (n=linuxali@tor/session/external/x-cd21895774503452) |
| 20:39.03 | ^Migs^ | this is hilarious. The Pirate Bay is back up. |
| 20:39.07 | herlo | yeah, true, but it means a lot in the RedHat world... |
| 20:39.22 | xbmodder | if someone payed for me I'd so do it |
| 20:39.37 | ^Migs^ | the day after their servers were raided by the police, they put up a notice on their web site: "Experiencing downtime. Will be up again in a day or two." They were prepared, and simply relocated to another country. |
| 20:40.55 | herlo | yeah, xbmodder, that's me.... |
| 20:41.46 | xbmodder | herlo: isn't it like 5*2.5*10**3 dollars |
| 20:43.09 | nick125 | yeah, I think its actually more though.. |
| 20:50.41 | herlo | xbmodder: I work for a place that I think I could convince them to go that way. It will be awhile though for me as I am still working on other certs.... |
| 20:53.52 | xbmodder | I think I am going to work on my CCNA |
| 20:55.03 | Tene | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_prime |
| 21:02.04 | xbmodder | tene: yes.... |
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| 21:14.38 | *** join/#utah lars-ut (n=lars-ut@70.103.228.158) |
| 21:14.41 | goozbach | I'll have the money to start on my RHCA come October |
| 21:15.08 | findlay | RedHat Certified Archmonkey? |
| 21:15.17 | goozbach | I'm going to convince the DOH to pay for the directory services class so I won't have to. |
| 21:15.22 | redbeard1 | there's a cert to be an archmonkey? |
| 21:15.25 | redbeard1 | sweet! |
| 21:15.29 | goozbach | Arcitech |
| 21:15.31 | findlay | redbeard1: evidently so |
| 21:15.35 | goozbach | redbeard1: yup |
| 21:15.46 | goozbach | it just costs ~$10k |
| 21:15.53 | redbeard1 | what _is_ an archmonkey, anyway? |
| 21:15.56 | goozbach | all certs considered |
| 21:16.02 | goozbach | architect |
| 21:16.48 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@66.239.25.106.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 21:17.18 | lars-ut | I'm looking for a "click to chat" solution to allow clients to chat with company reps. I've dragged my feet on deploying some type of jabber server internally, and thought that a web gateway might dovetail with jabber internally. Thoughts? |
| 21:17.33 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@66.239.25.106.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 21:18.20 | macnewbold | lars-ut: there are web-based IRC clients you can get pretty easily |
| 21:18.35 | macnewbold | I bet you could find a jabber thing like that too |
| 21:18.59 | macnewbold | if you're going with an entirely web-based and isolated system for both users and reps, |
| 21:19.13 | macnewbold | you could set up a pretty simple one with some PHP and a database |
| 21:21.07 | Uncle_Je1se | http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/9342 |
| 21:21.59 | findlay | an archmonkey is an overmonkey. Basically he |
| 21:22.03 | findlay | 's a demigod |
| 21:22.05 | nick125 | there are things like help center live that do the same.. |
| 21:22.50 | findlay | somebody put this huge <enter> key on this keyboard and it jumps out of it's way to be hit |
| 21:25.13 | lars-ut | macnewbold: on the IRC web-based... you're saying to run our own irc server & use a web-based client? |
| 21:25.34 | lars-ut | macnewbold: I did find a flash interface for jabber |
| 21:25.57 | macnewbold | yeah, you can run your own irc daemon and use a web based interface to it, like XMission does |
| 21:26.02 | nick125 | running your own little IRC server would be nice.. |
| 21:26.06 | macnewbold | that sounds pretty cool |
| 21:26.10 | lars-ut | I'm still looking for a good demo. |
| 21:28.14 | lars-ut | http://chat.xmission.com/ |
| 21:28.24 | macnewbold | yep |
| 21:28.26 | macnewbold | I think that's it |
| 21:28.33 | macnewbold | try joining #xmlounge if you'd like |
| 21:28.36 | lars-ut | looks like they use http://cgiirc.sourceforge.net/ |
| 21:28.38 | macnewbold | there's a bit of traffic in ther enow |
| 21:28.41 | brac | [CGI:IRC - Web based IRC Client] |
| 21:32.54 | macnewbold | s/jeti/jedi/ |
| 21:32.59 | lars-ut | nope |
| 21:33.10 | lars-ut | 500k client java applet |
| 21:33.18 | macnewbold | s/je/wi/ |
| 21:33.27 | macnewbold | ~s/i/a/ |
| 21:33.33 | macnewbold | ~ping jbot |
| 21:33.42 | macnewbold | ~wake jbot |
| 21:33.47 | macnewbold | arg |
| 21:33.49 | macnewbold | not even in here |
| 21:34.04 | redbeard1 | hey, *nix question |
| 21:34.04 | macnewbold | aha, here he's ibot |
| 21:34.22 | redbeard1 | i have a bunch of files, filename.txt.001 to filename.txt.127 that need to be joined into one file, filename.txt |
| 21:34.37 | redbeard1 | i have a program to do it in windows, but not one in linux |
| 21:34.42 | macnewbold | like the reverse of split, it sounds like |
| 21:34.47 | macnewbold | I'd try cat |
| 21:34.49 | findlay | cat filename.txt.* > the_one_big_file |
| 21:34.54 | macnewbold | cat filename.txt* > filename.txt |
| 21:34.57 | macnewbold | yep |
| 21:35.05 | redbeard1 | hang on, let me try that |
| 21:35.48 | findlay | to be more precise `cat filename.txt.??? > the_one_big_file` |
| 21:35.58 | *** join/#utah [Utah]tristanbob (i=tristanb@137.190.3.107) |
| 21:36.16 | lars-ut | careful with > as you can del files with it |
| 21:36.35 | redbeard1 | noted |
| 21:36.36 | findlay | yeah, probably should use >> |
| 21:36.49 | herlo | or you could use a different output file |
| 21:36.58 | findlay | if the file exists, then >> appends and > overwrites |
| 21:37.06 | redbeard1 | um. this is actually a binary file, will cat be a problem? |
| 21:37.07 | herlo | when you are happy with it, copy it over the original, plus you could make a backup first..... |
| 21:37.31 | findlay | redbeard1: nope |
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| 21:39.39 | redbeard1 | par2verify says it's good now, sweet |
| 21:39.41 | redbeard1 | thanks all |
| 21:40.48 | redbeard1 | so much easier than doing it manually in dos too. |
| 21:40.57 | *** join/#utah dilvie (n=dilvie@c-67-166-126-133.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 21:42.08 | Uncle_Je1se | TimRiker: ping |
| 21:42.16 | Tene | why not? |
| 21:43.27 | elg | -lart vontrapp_ |
| 21:44.49 | xbmodder | :-? |
| 21:45.55 | Uncle_Je1se | TimRiker: if you get this, cvs seems to be down on blootbot.sf.net |
| 21:46.02 | findlay | lars-ut: dilvie has some kind of web chat thing going, you might ask him |
| 21:46.15 | findlay | Uncle_Je1se: sourceforge CVS goes down a lot |
| 21:47.57 | Uncle_Je1se | it says it's "turned off for this project" |
| 21:49.05 | dilvie | Ask me what? |
| 21:49.37 | lars-ut | dilvie: I'm looking for a web interface to chat |
| 21:49.48 | lars-ut | clients to reps sontext |
| 21:49.57 | lars-ut | s/sontext/context |
| 21:50.02 | dilvie | http://knobtweakers.net/chat/ |
| 21:50.10 | dilvie | I use lace |
| 21:50.35 | dilvie | persistent, flat-file server-side logging, and ajax I/O |
| 21:50.48 | dilvie | pretty cool, for the most part. |
| 21:51.10 | Uncle_Je1se | anyone know of a good OSS equivalent to liveperson (http://www.liveperson.net) |
| 21:51.20 | lars-ut | dilvie: very fast |
| 21:52.13 | Tene | link to lace? |
| 21:52.16 | dilvie | Uncle_Je1se: not really. |
| 21:52.47 | Uncle_Je1se | we would kill for a replacement for them - they are totally incompliant with web 2.0/ajax systems |
| 21:53.03 | dilvie | http://socket7.net/lace/ |
| 21:53.06 | brac | [Lace - Ajax Chat] |
| 21:53.22 | dilvie | What does LivePerson provide? |
| 21:54.46 | Uncle_Je1se | dilvie: their main purpose is customer service via chat |
| 21:55.47 | Uncle_Je1se | but they also provide the ability to track if you're on certain items too long, or if certain criteria that may need CS help occurs it detects that |
| 21:56.31 | dilvie | Uncle_Je1se: it shouldn't be too difficult to interface something like Lace to a database back-end and attach incident tracking IDs to logged sessions. |
| 21:56.33 | Uncle_Je1se | lars-ut: I think that one heads in the right direction |
| 21:57.03 | lars-ut | Uncle_Je1se: which? |
| 21:57.17 | dilvie | but it's not a turn-key solution for customer service, by any means. |
| 21:57.41 | lars-ut | It's a great web chat client though |
| 21:57.53 | lars-ut | re: Lace |
| 21:59.29 | dilvie | I like it. =) |
| 22:01.47 | Uncle_Je1se | dilvie: I think we want something with analytics already built in though |
| 22:02.49 | dilvie | Uncle_Je1se: I don't blame you. =) |
| 22:03.16 | TimRiker | Uncle_Je1se: yes indeedy-doo. |
| 22:03.22 | TimRiker | Uncle_Je1se: we moved to svn. |
| 22:03.33 | Uncle_Je1se | TimRiker: ah - that would be why then |
| 22:03.36 | TimRiker | :) |
| 22:03.56 | dilvie | So, what are the major advantages of svn? |
| 22:04.02 | Uncle_Je1se | lars-ut: that livehelp doesn't look OSS |
| 22:04.13 | Jayce^ | dilvie, it sucks slightly less than cvs |
| 22:05.07 | lars-ut | Uncle_Je1se: it isn't - but I've already spent 3 hours total looking at OSS alternatives |
| 22:05.47 | Uncle_Je1se | lol - nothing found eh? |
| 22:06.08 | lars-ut | nothing that seems to fit the bill as closely so far. |
| 22:06.20 | findlay | typing in CVS so much gets boring over a decade or so. SVN looks much more apealing as a cluster of 3 letters |
| 22:07.02 | lars-ut | Uncle_Je1se: I don't have a problem with paying for software that meets specific business needs |
| 22:07.04 | Uncle_Je1se | lars-ut: we almost had permission to build one in our spare time here for a nice bonus, but they changed their minds |
| 22:07.10 | lars-ut | :( |
| 22:07.28 | Uncle_Jesse | ah - much better |
| 22:07.51 | lars-ut | our Perl hacker would love to build it I'm sure. |
| 22:07.58 | lars-ut | but it would take a month |
| 22:08.22 | Uncle_Jesse | yeah - it's not as easy as it sounds unfortunately |
| 22:08.31 | lars-ut | I could likely spend less than $100 & have this other app up in < one day |
| 22:08.55 | Uncle_Jesse | yup |
| 22:09.15 | harleypig | -urls |
| 22:09.15 | brac | [2006/06/05 15:53:09] <lars-ut> http://livehelp.stardevelop.com/documentation/introduction.htm |
| 22:09.15 | brac | [2006/06/05 15:53:06] <dilvie> http://socket7.net/lace/ |
| 22:09.15 | brac | [2006/06/05 15:50:07] <dilvie> http://knobtweakers.net/chat/ |
| 22:09.16 | brac | [2006/06/05 15:28:41] <lars-ut> http://cgiirc.sourceforge.net/ |
| 22:09.38 | Uncle_Jesse | but don't forget the extra $100-$1000 for the pain you'll have to go through to customize it for your companies needs |
| 22:09.41 | Uncle_Jesse | :-) |
| 22:09.46 | Uncle_Jesse | company's |
| 22:10.07 | lars-ut | they probably won't care. |
| 22:10.08 | dilvie | Uncle_Jesse: If you're lucky. |
| 22:10.14 | lars-ut | just another marketing itch. |
| 22:10.14 | harleypig | lars-ut: you looking to make an online help/chat system? |
| 22:10.28 | lars-ut | yes |
| 22:10.36 | lars-ut | but I don't want to roll my own |
| 22:10.58 | harleypig | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:10.59 | Uncle_Jesse | harleypig: know of a good OSS one? |
| 22:11.39 | harleypig | Well, I've used cgi:irc for that in the past |
| 22:11.51 | harleypig | but I don't know what the business requirements are. |
| 22:12.12 | Uncle_Jesse | harleypig: I was just hoping for an already-made one that has the analytics, etc. already built in |
| 22:12.22 | harleypig | what analytics? |
| 22:12.31 | harleypig | or, rather, what are analytics? |
| 22:12.56 | lars-ut | well, in my case clients will be talking about finances with a Loan Officer |
| 22:13.12 | lars-ut | so I need the option of security |
| 22:13.37 | lars-ut | re: bus reqs that is. |
| 22:13.40 | dilvie | analytics = use tracking and analysis |
| 22:13.53 | lars-ut | ssl would be good enough |
| 22:14.35 | lars-ut | because by the time a client has disclosed a certain amoutn of info & foregoes anonymity they'll likely be on the phone |
| 22:15.25 | lars-ut | this app is supposed to give a potential client the option for anonymity while giving them good info that makes them want to do business |
| 22:15.50 | lars-ut | not much of an excuse I know |
| 22:16.32 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 22:16.38 | lars-ut | thanks for the help, especially dilvie, Uncle_Jesse, & macnewbold |
| 22:17.02 | lars-ut | dilvie++ |
| 22:17.08 | lars-ut | ~dilvie++ |
| 22:17.31 | macnewbold | no prob |
| 22:17.34 | macnewbold | hope you found what you wanted |
| 22:18.11 | Uncle_Jesse | harleypig: I want it to detect, say, when a user has been idle on a particular product for a specified amount of time, or if a user does something specific that indicates the user needs help, a popup should occur |
| 22:18.53 | dilvie | =) |
| 22:18.54 | harleypig | Uncle_Jesse: you want specialized software ... I know of no such os project that handles that for live chat. |
| 22:19.05 | dilvie | Happy to help. |
| 22:19.18 | Uncle_Jesse | harleypig: thanks |
| 22:19.22 | harleypig | I do know, however, a number of companies that are you using oss to do that, in combination with proprietary software. |
| 22:19.26 | Uncle_Jesse | I think it would be cool |
| 22:19.33 | harleypig | but they all rolled their own. |
| 22:19.47 | macnewbold | so lars-ut, what did you decide to go with? liveperson? |
| 22:25.09 | *** join/#utah ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 22:25.09 | *** topic/#utah is The source for OSS focused discussion in Utah. See openclue.org/ut, sllug.org, uphpu.org, plug.org, uug.byu.edu, uvlug.org, fslc.usu.edu, nupm.org, utwaa.org, oalug.com, utaug.org || InterLUG BBQ Sat June 17 http://uvlug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=bbq2006 |
| 22:25.09 | *** mode/#utah [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
| 22:26.12 | lars-ut | macnewbold: "Live Help Messenger" |
| 22:26.17 | macnewbold | fun |
| 22:26.19 | macnewbold | oss? |
| 22:26.23 | lars-ut | nope |
| 22:26.30 | macnewbold | how much $? |
| 22:26.30 | lars-ut | php & mysql though. |
| 22:26.33 | lars-ut | $90 |
| 22:26.37 | macnewbold | ah, so you can customize it if desired? |
| 22:26.42 | lars-ut | for $330 |
| 22:26.49 | lars-ut | which I won't do. |
| 22:26.53 | macnewbold | ah, so for $90 you use it, for $330 you get source |
| 22:27.11 | lars-ut | nope. |
| 22:27.15 | lars-ut | no source |
| 22:27.38 | lars-ut | although I think it would be difficult to hide php & mysql |
| 22:27.59 | macnewbold | we found an app that does that recently |
| 22:28.02 | findlay | unless they hosted it? |
| 22:28.05 | lars-ut | shhh! |
| 22:28.20 | macnewbold | they make a closed-source php app available in either a Zend Optimizer package or an IonCube package |
| 22:28.33 | findlay | lars-ut: did you say something? Must have been the wind |
| 22:28.43 | lars-ut | :) |
| 22:28.48 | lars-ut | macnewbold: does your shop use Zend? |
| 22:29.59 | lars-ut | I listened to a really cool Tim O'Reilly presentation this morning in the car - http://www.itconversations.com/shows/detail716.html |
| 22:30.13 | findlay | lars-ut: do you think you could mathematically explain the nature of hydrogen bonding? |
| 22:30.14 | macnewbold | no, no zend for us |
| 22:30.39 | lars-ut | findlay: I don't think so, even if the answer were a prime number. |
| 22:31.07 | findlay | chemistry has an interesting poroblem set |
| 22:31.08 | macnewbold | hydrogen bonding: 1+1=2 |
| 22:31.19 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@c-67-169-251-207.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 22:31.47 | lars-ut | ~lart brac |
| 22:31.58 | findlay | "a hydrogen bond is a type of attractive intermolecular force that exists between two partial electric charges of opposite polarity" --wikipedia |
| 22:32.40 | findlay | one of the consequences of hydrogen bonding is ice the floats |
| 22:32.50 | lars-ut | brac - don't tease me by _sometimes_ reading the title of the referenced URL! |
| 22:33.02 | lars-ut | IT Conversations: Tim O'Reilly - The O'Reilly Radar [runtime: 00:30:18, 13.9 mb, recorded 2006-03-06] |
| 22:33.02 | lars-ut | 'In this talk subtitled “Watching the Alpha Geeks” Tim applies his unique insight to the communities of people who are pushing the envelope in terms of what is possible with technology. These are the people exploring the frontiers of network applications, collaborative intelligence and hacking the physical world.' |
| 22:33.02 | lars-ut | http://www.itconversations.com/shows/detail716.html |
| 22:33.59 | lars-ut | any other IT converstaions recommendations? I'm getting ready for another car ride. |
| 22:40.22 | lars-ut | findlay - you need to find a sweetie at MIT |
| 22:41.36 | *** join/#utah RyanE (n=ryan@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 22:41.36 | findlay | lars-ut: no good. I have little sense of finery in olfaction |
| 22:41.49 | lars-ut | oh really? |
| 22:41.55 | findlay | yeah |
| 22:42.17 | findlay | make that gustation, duh |
| 22:42.24 | findlay | ~slap forehead |
| 22:42.26 | ibot | ACTION slaps forehead, keep your grubby fingers to yourself! |
| 22:42.26 | lars-ut | lol |
| 22:42.41 | findlay | lars-ut: (: |
| 22:56.49 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@208.64.90.18.utahbroadband.com) |
| 23:00.18 | Uncle_Jesse | Jayce^: did you see Jesse V's announcement about SVK? |
| 23:11.29 | *** join/#utah JoshH_ (i=josh@josh.xmission.com) |
| 23:22.07 | nick125 | hahahaha |
| 23:22.30 | nick125 | OK, I think I'm lost. With all this talk of Python, Rails and Java, either "LAMP" means different things to us or I missed the memo when it became a generic term for "web application stack". |
| 23:22.34 | nick125 | I thought everyone knew that LAMP stood for Lighttpd, Adabas & Modula 2 on PalmOS. |
| 23:33.27 | Uncle_Jesse | its definition has definitely evolved since its inception |
| 23:33.52 | Ash | 'LAMP' is recruiter-speak for "do you know this crazy linux thing" |
| 23:34.54 | nick125 | lol |
| 23:36.11 | harleypig | isn't someone in here using clacc? |
| 23:37.44 | harleypig | or maybe it's clacct |
| 23:38.20 | nick125 | grrr |
| 23:38.28 | nick125 | why the heck can't I unmount this partition! |
| 23:38.37 | nick125 | lsof says nothing is using it |
| 23:38.52 | nick125 | oh..whoops |
| 23:38.56 | findlay | nick125: pwd? |
| 23:38.57 | nick125 | forgot I had proc mounted |
| 23:39.09 | Ash | harleypig: clacc? |
| 23:39.55 | harleypig | command line accountant |
| 23:53.31 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_lappy (i=nobody@xbmodder.us) |
| 23:54.43 | xbmodder_lappy | bzflag noc.atarack.com |
| 23:55.44 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, |
| 23:55.53 | xbmodder_lappy | server: atarack.com |
| 23:56.20 | nick125 | I think I might know how to move my firewall from smoothwall to my quagga/iptables (maybe shorewall, dunno) setup without much downtime.. |
| 23:57.13 | *** join/#utah Kuyaedz (n=Kuyaedz@kuyaedz.fttp.xmission.com) |
| 23:57.18 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: I'm on |
| 23:58.14 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: where are you |