| 00:00.03 | ethical | has anyone seen this before |
| 00:00.13 | ethical | # ls -al boot/ |
| 00:00.13 | ethical | total 1 |
| 00:00.13 | ethical | drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 96 May 4 2004 . |
| 00:00.13 | ethical | drwxr-xr-x 21 root root 480 Dec 1 2004 .. |
| 00:00.14 | ethical | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Aug 28 2005 .keep |
| 00:00.16 | ethical | lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 1 May 4 2004 boot -> . |
| 00:00.38 | ethical | that boot -> . is trippy |
| 00:00.54 | ethical | you keep cd boot |
| 00:01.00 | ethical | and you are back to where you started |
| 00:07.16 | Hhhhh | emcnabb, lol |
| 00:07.24 | Hhhhh | emcnabb, that sucks |
| 00:14.15 | *** join/#utah RyanE_ (n=ryan@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 00:20.44 | unum | I've seen the -> . link on some boot disks |
| 00:27.54 | ctr` | hi |
| 00:32.39 | unum | hi |
| 00:33.05 | ctr` | :) |
| 00:33.23 | ctr` | i wish my 3.9 disk would get here soon :( |
| 00:35.31 | ctr` | i may just install a snapshot the week before release |
| 00:35.35 | ctr` | since I'm tired of waiting |
| 00:36.14 | *** join/#utah jsmith (n=jsmith@199.227.185.58) |
| 00:46.55 | *** join/#utah dilvie (n=dilvie@c-67-161-253-245.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 00:52.07 | goozbach | wow arizona |
| 01:03.24 | *** join/#utah synic (n=synic@pdpc/supporter/student/synic) |
| 01:07.18 | Hhhhh | what about Arizona? |
| 01:09.39 | ctr` | it's wow |
| 01:14.58 | mheath | Wonder how long this upgrade is going to take |
| 01:15.30 | ctr` | is it windows or gentoo? |
| 01:15.37 | mheath | Neither. |
| 01:15.43 | mheath | Massive upgrade of a Ubuntu system |
| 01:15.47 | ctr` | ahh |
| 01:15.47 | mheath | Breezy -> Dapper |
| 01:16.01 | ctr` | no clue; haven't ever used that |
| 01:16.10 | mheath | been going on for a couple hours |
| 01:16.21 | mheath | to be expected; its upgrading over 1,000 applications. |
| 01:16.42 | ctr` | yikes |
| 01:16.46 | ctr` | that's a lot of kruft |
| 01:16.59 | mheath | Indeed. I'll be trimming a lot of that |
| 01:17.12 | mheath | Ubuntu has some courtesy packages. Meta packages that simply depend on a large category of software |
| 01:17.27 | mheath | ubuntu-desktop, for example, depends on all the desktop stuff. |
| 01:18.06 | mheath | These meta packages are also used to better facilitate upgrades. You upgrade ubuntu-desktop, it will force it to install any new stuff it wouldn't otherwise catch |
| 01:18.25 | mheath | I had ubuntu-destkop removed because I had my system cleaned a bit, but I reinstalled it for this upgrade. |
| 01:18.37 | ctr` | that's the downside to a distro like ubuntu |
| 01:18.44 | ctr` | you're gonna have kruft no matter what |
| 01:18.52 | ctr` | but in return for that, you get a generally usable system |
| 01:18.55 | mheath | Technologies have a habit of growing on me |
| 01:19.02 | Hhhhh | rofl |
| 01:19.05 | mheath | I started off hating Java, now I program in Java almost exclusively |
| 01:19.10 | Hhhhh | ever heard of Geroge P. Burdell? |
| 01:19.13 | Hhhhh | http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?method=4&dsid=2222&dekey=George+P.+Burdell&curtab=2222_1&linktext=George%20P.%20Burdell |
| 01:19.20 | mheath | I started off hating apt-get and DEBs, now I kind of like it. |
| 01:19.28 | ctr` | hmm |
| 01:19.46 | Hhhhh | I started loving Java, I ended up hating it though |
| 01:20.00 | Hhhhh | I started using KDE, I still love it |
| 01:20.06 | Hhhhh | save with rpm-based tools |
| 01:20.12 | Hhhhh | s/save/same |
| 01:20.18 | ctr` | you like rpm tools? |
| 01:20.25 | Hhhhh | I like RPMs |
| 01:20.27 | ctr` | oh man |
| 01:20.31 | ctr` | that's weird |
| 01:20.36 | Hhhhh | and related tools, like yum or yast |
| 01:20.37 | Hhhhh | why? |
| 01:20.50 | mheath | RPMs are decent. The problem is, distribution utilization of its support is horrible, and third party support is even worse. |
| 01:20.51 | Hhhhh | there is no such thing as RPM hell |
| 01:20.52 | ctr` | becaue rpm based systems are so 90's |
| 01:20.55 | mheath | The format is nice |
| 01:21.04 | mheath | The problem is, no one uses its dependency features |
| 01:21.13 | maquis | Hhhhh: you ever tried installing software on redhat 7.2? |
| 01:21.15 | mheath | Which is one of the highlights of the format |
| 01:21.28 | Hhhhh | RPM hell was caused in older versions of RPM-distros by people who were not used to them, trying to do things the way they would in a different distro |
| 01:21.41 | Hhhhh | maquis, no, I used RedHat 9.0 and after |
| 01:21.49 | Hhhhh | and since then, there is no such thing as RPM hell |
| 01:22.10 | Hhhhh | mheath, huh? |
| 01:22.17 | Hhhhh | mheath, most RPMs use dependencies |
| 01:22.19 | ctr` | urpmi is probably the best thing to happen to rpm |
| 01:22.23 | ctr` | but it's still crappy if you ask me |
| 01:22.59 | mheath | Hhhhh: you're saying that the dependency tree of a given piece of software off of a random site will be perfect like that of the dependency tree of software in the Ubuntu and Debian repositories? |
| 01:23.47 | Hhhhh | I don't know about Ubuntu and Debian repositories. All I can say is that repositories for Fedora and SUSE DO NOT give "RPM hell" |
| 01:24.24 | maquis | Hhhhh: i've hit it in the distributions i've used... rh 7.2, 8, and 9... |
| 01:24.27 | Hhhhh | again, RPM hell happened in 1) older RPM-based distros (e.g. RedHat 7.2) AND 2)when people try to do things the way they would in a different distro |
| 01:24.50 | Hhhhh | maquis, I did not run into in in 9.0 |
| 01:24.56 | maquis | Hhhhh: what if they want to install something that's not available in any apt or yum repositories? |
| 01:25.06 | Hhhhh | then compile it |
| 01:25.20 | maquis | so, source-based is better than pure rpm |
| 01:25.23 | Hhhhh | and make sure you install the libraries that are necessary (in RPM format, of course) |
| 01:25.31 | Hhhhh | "better" *sigh* |
| 01:25.35 | maquis | well.. |
| 01:25.47 | maquis | i've had times where i can find rpms for something that's not in apt/yum |
| 01:25.49 | Hhhhh | if better means you're willing to put up with 2+ days of compiling, sure |
| 01:25.58 | maquis | if you try to install it from the rpms, it's hell |
| 01:26.11 | Hhhhh | if "better" means you can install somethinhg quick and not scare your friend that you're trying to introduce to Linux, no |
| 01:26.12 | maquis | you'll be tracking down rpms forever... |
| 01:26.35 | maquis | plenty of times, you find the right rpm, but for the wrong version of fedora/redhat |
| 01:26.38 | ctr` | Hhhhh: at the end of the day, package management is a solved problem and not because of rpms |
| 01:26.40 | Hhhhh | maquis, I don't know what distro you are using, but repositories for SUSE and Fedora have 5000+ packages or so |
| 01:27.07 | maquis | Hhhhh: that still isn't all of them... even on fedora, i had some problems with some software i like |
| 01:27.36 | maquis | sure, it's great for some things |
| 01:27.39 | Hhhhh | maquis, so you are likely to run into about the same number of problems installing underground, unheard-of software in an RPM distro than in a source-based distro |
| 01:28.16 | Hhhhh | maquis, also I am not worried about having "all of them" available |
| 01:28.18 | ctr` | fedoras packages are dated |
| 01:28.22 | Hhhhh | lol |
| 01:28.24 | ctr` | not all of them |
| 01:28.25 | ctr` | but a lot of them |
| 01:28.27 | maquis | Hhhhh: i haven't had any problems with any of it in gentoo or freebsd... maybe the software i like is just more popular, but in my experience, it appears to be more because it's easier to make the packages |
| 01:28.29 | Hhhhh | haha |
| 01:28.32 | Hhhhh | sorry ctr` |
| 01:28.38 | Hhhhh | that got a laugh |
| 01:28.47 | ctr` | why? |
| 01:28.49 | maquis | Hhhhh: another problem i had was, i needed a particular version of certain software |
| 01:28.51 | Hhhhh | if Fedora is dated... |
| 01:28.58 | maquis | or i needed it with certain things compiled in |
| 01:29.09 | maquis | so, i ended up having to install it from source |
| 01:29.30 | maquis | which meant i had to pull tricks to get apt/yum to recognize that the software already existed on the system |
| 01:29.38 | Hhhhh | maquis, yea, that's the trick, you can install from source if you want, and it is not harder than if you were doing it in a source distro |
| 01:29.54 | maquis | Hhhhh: it is, if you want something that depends on it |
| 01:30.05 | Hhhhh | but if you don't want the overhead, you can use an RPM and voila |
| 01:30.29 | Hhhhh | maquis, you can compile things from source in an RPM distro |
| 01:30.41 | Hhhhh | maquis, it is recommended you always use RPMs if you can |
| 01:31.00 | maquis | Hhhhh: but then you have to convince yum or apt that the program is installed so it doesn't try to install it later when it's installing something that depends on it |
| 01:31.32 | Hhhhh | that all comes to organization |
| 01:31.54 | Hhhhh | if something depends on it, THEN there IS an ROPM, and why would you be compiling fron source then? |
| 01:32.04 | Hhhhh | there is already an not necessary |
| 01:32.09 | Hhhhh | oops |
| 01:32.16 | maquis | Hhhhh: it can exist, but it oculd be a different version/compile options than what i need |
| 01:32.18 | Hhhhh | there is already an RPM -> no need to compile from sourc |
| 01:32.43 | maquis | Hhhhh: i've had to do it before |
| 01:33.02 | Hhhhh | personally, I have not run into this problem |
| 01:33.12 | Hhhhh | personally, and I install A LOT of software usually |
| 01:33.21 | maquis | Hhhhh: anyway... we probably just have different needs |
| 01:33.25 | Hhhhh | with zillions of dependencies |
| 01:33.36 | ctr` | <3 |
| 01:33.38 | maquis | i've just found that i've had enough times that rpm-based distros just don't let me do things i need to do |
| 01:33.42 | maquis | so, i use freebsd :) |
| 01:33.46 | Hhhhh | it seems so...I don't see why you would run into version problems though |
| 01:34.04 | Hhhhh | I prefer to stay with latest version |
| 01:34.18 | maquis | ~lart ctr` |
| 01:34.24 | ctr` | hahahahaha |
| 01:34.27 | ctr` | you think that's a lart |
| 01:34.29 | ctr` | i <3d it |
| 01:34.32 | ctr` | again again |
| 01:34.36 | ScytheBlade1 | ~lart ctr` |
| 01:34.36 | maquis | Hhhhh: me too... recent versions are great |
| 01:34.40 | ScytheBlade1 | Tada |
| 01:34.43 | ctr` | :( |
| 01:34.45 | ScytheBlade1 | :) |
| 01:34.49 | Hhhhh | ~lart ctr` |
| 01:34.53 | Hhhhh | hahahaha |
| 01:35.01 | ScytheBlade1 | I'm telling you, I have the touch |
| 01:35.03 | ScytheBlade1 | -roulette |
| 01:35.07 | ScytheBlade1 | Was that it? |
| 01:35.09 | ScytheBlade1 | What was it? |
| 01:35.11 | ScytheBlade1 | ~roulette |
| 01:35.18 | ibot | ACTION watches scytheblade1 pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:35.18 | ScytheBlade1 | Bah |
| 01:35.18 | maquis | ScytheBlade1: brac's not here |
| 01:35.24 | ScytheBlade1 | Oh |
| 01:35.25 | ScytheBlade1 | Hey! |
| 01:35.26 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot does it |
| 01:35.28 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 01:35.29 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:35.30 | maquis | yeah... |
| 01:35.30 | ScytheBlade1 | I win |
| 01:35.33 | maquis | ibot does it differently |
| 01:35.34 | maquis | :) |
| 01:35.38 | ScytheBlade1 | maquis, How so? |
| 01:35.40 | ctr` | ~roulette |
| 01:35.42 | ibot | ACTION watches ctr` pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:35.42 | ScytheBlade1 | What's the difference? |
| 01:35.47 | ctr` | phew |
| 01:35.49 | maquis | ScytheBlade1: he doesn't tell you how many you have left |
| 01:35.51 | maquis | ~roulette |
| 01:35.54 | ibot | ACTION watches maquis pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:35.54 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah-ha |
| 01:36.00 | ScytheBlade1 | That's creepy ;) |
| 01:36.02 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 01:36.03 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:36.03 | ctr` | he seems buggy |
| 01:36.07 | ScytheBlade1 | Well |
| 01:36.08 | ctr` | he/it/her |
| 01:36.08 | ScytheBlade1 | Up to 5 |
| 01:36.09 | Hhhhh | phew |
| 01:36.10 | ScytheBlade1 | It's the end |
| 01:36.11 | ScytheBlade1 | :) |
| 01:36.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Go ctr` ! |
| 01:36.17 | maquis | ~roulette |
| 01:36.19 | ibot | ACTION watches maquis pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:36.21 | ctr` | :) |
| 01:36.23 | ScytheBlade1 | Huh |
| 01:36.25 | ScytheBlade1 | Look at that |
| 01:36.33 | Hhhhh | phew |
| 01:36.33 | ctr` | ~roulette |
| 01:36.34 | ibot | ACTION watches ctr` pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:36.34 | Hhhhh | phew |
| 01:36.37 | ctr` | hahaa |
| 01:36.40 | ctr` | ibot has a toy gun |
| 01:36.46 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 01:36.47 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:36.48 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 01:36.51 | ctr` | hahaha |
| 01:36.51 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dsl-13-17.zianet.com) |
| 01:36.51 | ScytheBlade1 | toy gun wins |
| 01:36.56 | ctr` | <3 |
| 01:37.02 | maquis | elg: when does brac get back? |
| 01:37.07 | ctr` | kay guys I really need to get back to work |
| 01:37.09 | ctr` | later guys |
| 01:37.09 | maquis | ~roulette |
| 01:37.10 | ibot | ACTION watches maquis pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:37.12 | maquis | ctr`: later |
| 01:37.15 | ScytheBlade1 | What the |
| 01:37.25 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 01:37.26 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:37.35 | ScytheBlade1 | Toy gun indeed |
| 01:37.53 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 01:37.55 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:37.56 | ScytheBlade1 | 10 so far |
| 01:37.57 | ScytheBlade1 | 11 |
| 01:38.21 | maquis | ~roulette |
| 01:38.23 | ibot | ACTION watches maquis pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:38.35 | maquis | ibot: load gun |
| 01:38.41 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 01:38.42 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 01:38.48 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 01:38.50 | ScytheBlade1 | I'd laugh |
| 01:38.50 | *** join/#utah brac (i=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 01:38.51 | Hhhhh | meh |
| 01:38.55 | elg | -lart meh |
| 01:38.55 | Hhhhh | brac!! |
| 01:38.59 | brac | Hhhhh: 'sup? |
| 01:39.01 | ScytheBlade1 | -roulette |
| 01:39.01 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 01:39.01 | brac | ScytheBlade1: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:39.03 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 2 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:39.03 | maquis | -roule |
| 01:39.04 | ScytheBlade1 | haha |
| 01:39.05 | maquis | er |
| 01:39.05 | ScytheBlade1 | I win |
| 01:39.07 | maquis | -roulette |
| 01:39.07 | brac | maquis: chamber 3 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 01:39.10 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 01:39.11 | Hhhhh | hahahaha |
| 01:39.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Sucker ;) |
| 01:39.19 | Hhhhh | k, ScytheBlade1 |
| 01:39.21 | ctr` | 13:33 < ScytheBlade1> Sucker ;) |
| 01:39.21 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 01:39.21 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:39.25 | ctr` | hahaha |
| 01:39.30 | mheath | I'm going to setup a blog so my dad can post portions of my letters while I'm in boot... |
| 01:39.30 | ScytheBlade1 | -roulette |
| 01:39.30 | brac | ScytheBlade1: chamber 2 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:39.32 | maquis | -roulette |
| 01:39.32 | brac | maquis: chamber 3 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:39.33 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 01:39.33 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 4 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:39.36 | Hhhhh | :) |
| 01:39.46 | Hhhhh | DIE :x |
| 01:39.46 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath, go! |
| 01:39.49 | Hhhhh | lol |
| 01:39.53 | mheath | eh? |
| 01:39.54 | mheath | :) |
| 01:39.58 | ScytheBlade1 | Type in "-roulette" |
| 01:40.03 | mheath | -roulette |
| 01:40.03 | brac | mheath: chamber 5 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 01:40.06 | ScytheBlade1 | haha |
| 01:40.07 | Hhhhh | hahahahaha |
| 01:40.08 | mheath | :( |
| 01:40.08 | ScytheBlade1 | -roulette |
| 01:40.09 | brac | ScytheBlade1: chamber 1 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 01:40.11 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 01:40.11 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 01:40.11 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:40.13 | mheath | HA! |
| 01:40.18 | maquis | -roulette |
| 01:40.19 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 01:40.19 | brac | maquis: chamber 2 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:40.19 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 3 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:40.21 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 01:40.21 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 4 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 01:40.28 | mheath | -roulette |
| 01:40.28 | brac | mheath: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 01:40.35 | maquis | -roulette |
| 01:40.35 | brac | maquis: chamber 2 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 01:40.43 | ScytheBlade1 | Now that we've all killed ourselves... |
| 01:40.44 | mheath | brb |
| 01:42.38 | mheath | mm, caramel custard |
| 01:42.40 | mheath | flan :) |
| 01:43.27 | mheath | Its delicious :) |
| 01:43.35 | mheath | Its like....milk and caramel and custard all combined |
| 01:44.33 | mheath | You know that new girl I was talking about? |
| 01:44.43 | mheath | The one who I liked, but was unsure of because she has a boyfriend? |
| 01:44.56 | Hhhhh | skru bf |
| 01:45.06 | ctr` | yeah |
| 01:45.10 | ctr` | let's fight him |
| 01:45.15 | mheath | Turns out its not a serious relationship, and its been declining - she never sees him anymore, as he's been in a juvenile detention center. Not a good guy. |
| 01:45.23 | Hhhhh | no, just don't care if she has a bf |
| 01:45.33 | mheath | And, apparently, she told my friend (her friend) that she finds me very attractive :) |
| 01:45.43 | ctr` | who doesn't!:!:!!??!?!?! |
| 01:45.50 | mheath | Indeed! :) |
| 01:45.52 | mheath | ;-P |
| 01:45.55 | ctr` | :) |
| 01:45.59 | Hhhhh | mheath, ctr`wants to make out with you |
| 01:46.03 | ctr` | it's so true |
| 01:46.20 | mheath | *sigh* My motivation is all wrong, though |
| 01:46.33 | mheath | I mean, I like her. I love her, I love being around here, I love her personality... |
| 01:46.35 | ScytheBlade1 | So who was it that was a BSD knowledgable person in here? |
| 01:46.42 | ScytheBlade1 | erm, sorry, not to take that off topic |
| 01:46.47 | Hhhhh | ScytheBlade1, how rude |
| 01:46.50 | mheath | lmao =P |
| 01:47.06 | Hhhhh | ScytheBlade1, you're off-topic |
| 01:47.10 | ScytheBlade1 | I noticed |
| 01:47.14 | mheath | w00t its on to configuring |
| 01:47.21 | mheath | See how long this takes... |
| 01:47.30 | mheath | I should have dropped down to console first =\ |
| 01:47.42 | *** join/#utah hans (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 01:48.11 | ScytheBlade1 | ctr`, was it you who happened to be an OBSD guy? |
| 01:48.20 | ctr` | are you going to make fun of me |
| 01:48.24 | ScytheBlade1 | No |
| 01:48.27 | ScytheBlade1 | I promise |
| 01:48.32 | ctr` | then yeah |
| 01:48.47 | ScytheBlade1 | For my dad's office, I've already installed one, but in the end |
| 01:48.59 | ScytheBlade1 | There will be two computers to route their internt + P2P T1 line they're getting installed |
| 01:49.03 | ScytheBlade1 | VPN to locations together |
| 01:49.10 | ctr` | ok |
| 01:49.11 | ScytheBlade1 | *internet, how embarassing |
| 01:49.15 | ctr` | two* |
| 01:49.22 | ScytheBlade1 | I've heard glowing reviews of pf |
| 01:49.30 | ctr` | that's because it rocks |
| 01:49.30 | ScytheBlade1 | (compared to iptables/etc) |
| 01:49.32 | ctr` | yeah |
| 01:49.51 | ScytheBlade1 | But I never knew enough about BSD in general to actually use it (never installed it) |
| 01:50.00 | ctr` | ok |
| 01:50.06 | ctr` | first time for everything, I suppose |
| 01:50.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Recommendations on where to start out? Because I'm interested |
| 01:50.24 | ctr` | well ok |
| 01:50.34 | ctr` | first note: obsd is unlike the other bsd's for a lot of reasons |
| 01:50.51 | ctr` | you'll almost be better off thinking of it as either being the only real BSD or NOT BSD at all |
| 01:50.55 | ctr` | take your pick,I don't care |
| 01:51.00 | ctr` | but it's different in a ton of ways |
| 01:51.01 | ScytheBlade1 | 'k |
| 01:51.19 | ctr` | second: obsd is probably the easiest install I've ever done besides win98 back in the day |
| 01:51.34 | ScytheBlade1 | Wow |
| 01:51.37 | ctr` | so there's really no reason to hesitate, it's really something you can just jump right into |
| 01:51.38 | ScytheBlade1 | Quick question |
| 01:51.41 | ctr` | sure |
| 01:51.50 | ScytheBlade1 | How about installing onto software RAID on SATA? |
| 01:52.06 | ScytheBlade1 | (Likewise, OBSD has to setup software raid, somehow) |
| 01:52.39 | ctr` | I haven't done either of those, so I can't talk from experience, but the raid support is phenomenal in most cases. What you need to watch out for is vender problems |
| 01:53.01 | ctr` | We run into a lot of problems with venders not handing over the documentation needed to write adequate drivers |
| 01:53.01 | ScytheBlade1 | The mobo in question is an Intel ICH5R |
| 01:53.08 | ctr` | well look on their site |
| 01:53.17 | ctr` | supported hardware list is somewhere up there |
| 01:53.19 | ScytheBlade1 | Good idea, haha |
| 01:53.30 | ctr` | One thing to note |
| 01:53.45 | ScytheBlade1 | Good, it's supported |
| 01:53.48 | ctr` | is that OBSD may not support everything right away, maybe it never will on some hardware platforms, but when they do support it |
| 01:53.52 | ctr` | when they finally do say it's supported |
| 01:54.02 | ScytheBlade1 | It's actually supported |
| 01:54.04 | ScytheBlade1 | yeah |
| 01:54.07 | ctr` | yeah |
| 01:54.14 | ctr` | They do a great job |
| 01:55.25 | ctr` | :) |
| 01:55.55 | ScytheBlade1 | My "I boot it all" computer (win 2k/XP/2k3/gentoo) is on a 60GB drive |
| 01:56.01 | ScytheBlade1 | I need to fix that to add more |
| 01:56.20 | mheath | Why the excessive amounts of virtually compatible Windows versions? |
| 01:56.45 | ScytheBlade1 | Reference points, when people call and say "help me" |
| 01:57.02 | ctr` | ew |
| 01:57.05 | ScytheBlade1 | Testing software that I re-package in .msi format for domain deployment |
| 01:57.06 | ctr` | I try to shy away from support |
| 01:57.08 | ScytheBlade1 | etc |
| 01:57.11 | ctr` | generally |
| 01:57.15 | ctr` | I'm a nice enough dude |
| 01:57.17 | ScytheBlade1 | I *try* to |
| 01:57.20 | ScytheBlade1 | But that's not what happens ;) |
| 01:57.25 | ctr` | but I got tired of spending all my time helping friends |
| 01:57.41 | ScytheBlade1 | This isn't friends, this is my dad's office |
| 01:57.41 | ctr` | well you'd probably be more successfull once you drop those ms partitions |
| 01:57.48 | ScytheBlade1 | Small business, you know |
| 01:57.50 | ScytheBlade1 | Puts food on the table |
| 01:57.53 | ctr` | fo sho |
| 01:58.13 | ScytheBlade1 | They've been vendor-locked since day 1 |
| 01:58.17 | ScytheBlade1 | And that really can't change |
| 01:58.22 | mheath | come on, this has to be getting close.... |
| 01:58.29 | mheath | Then, the reboot... |
| 01:58.37 | mheath | Will it work? Thats the question. |
| 01:58.43 | mheath | Gnome 2.14! Beautiful things! |
| 01:59.01 | ctr` | I've really been impressed by gnome and kde as of late |
| 01:59.05 | ScytheBlade1 | That KDE 3.4 just added! :O |
| 01:59.07 | ctr` | but alas, they're still too much for me |
| 01:59.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Wait, KDE is at 3.5 |
| 01:59.12 | ScytheBlade1 | ;) |
| 01:59.29 | mheath | linux-image-2.6.15 :) |
| 01:59.39 | ScytheBlade1 | Nice |
| 01:59.44 | ScytheBlade1 | Linux cerberus 2.6.15.6 #4 SMP Mon Mar 20 23:29:20 MST 2006 i686 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2600+ AuthenticAMD GNU/Linux |
| 02:00.06 | ScytheBlade1 | Haha, I forgot that I was on .15.6 |
| 02:00.07 | ctr` | OpenBSD angel.method9.org 3.8 TylersL33TKernel#0 i386 Intel(R) Celeron(R) M processor 1.40GHz ("GenuineIntel" 686-class) |
| 02:00.12 | mheath | I can remember how neat 2.6 was at first... |
| 02:00.34 | mheath | I was using the 2.6.0 tests and RCs |
| 02:00.38 | ScytheBlade1 | Compared to 2.4, it's still really neat |
| 02:01.33 | ctr` | I wish lenovo would switch to amd hardware |
| 02:01.37 | ctr` | and quit effin around with intel |
| 02:02.04 | mheath | I wonder what the policy on private laptops over in Iraq is. |
| 02:02.06 | mheath | Hmm. |
| 02:02.13 | mheath | I'm guessing its probably "No."... |
| 02:02.17 | ctr` | haha |
| 02:02.22 | ctr` | i sort doubt that |
| 02:02.56 | ctr` | i've seen pictures where people had their tv's shipped there and computers and all sorts of things |
| 02:03.00 | ScytheBlade1 | ctr`, what do *you* use BSD for? |
| 02:03.09 | mheath | ctr`: but internet access! |
| 02:03.23 | mheath | And I'm going to be a marine. A front liner. Not some guy in a cozy living space and office. |
| 02:04.35 | ctr` | ScytheBlade1: everything really, thought flash support is crappy (wants linux emulation, which I refuse to use) and software development |
| 02:04.35 | ctr` | when I was working at kozoru |
| 02:04.35 | ctr` | our cluster ran off obsd |
| 02:04.35 | ctr` | so I had to have it installed on my crap so that I could develop for that same platform |
| 02:04.35 | ScytheBlade1 | My focus is networking, in all forms |
| 02:04.35 | ctr` | well then it's probably a good choice |
| 02:04.39 | ScytheBlade1 | Namely now, IPSec + routing + traffic QoS/etc |
| 02:04.51 | ScytheBlade1 | Everything else pretty much has to be windows ;) |
| 02:05.26 | ctr` | that sucks :( |
| 02:06.13 | ctr` | I have been using it here recently to hone(sp?) my c skillz |
| 02:06.16 | ScytheBlade1 | To open up this other office, they had to upgrade their access-based software to a newer version |
| 02:06.20 | ctr` | and of course, I'm sorta obsessed with security |
| 02:06.23 | ctr` | so that's largly it too |
| 02:06.47 | ScytheBlade1 | access doesn't work well over the internet, especially when the database would wind up being in two places and then copied back and forth like a word doc |
| 02:07.06 | ScytheBlade1 | So... we also had to get 2 copies of SQL server + another copy of 2k3 + that new software |
| 02:07.38 | mheath | Wow, our network techs at school finally got it write |
| 02:07.51 | ScytheBlade1 | But there's no chance that the routers are going to have windows touch their HDs :) |
| 02:07.58 | mheath | After outdated software and workstations that somehow managed to take 10+ minutes to login, they (after years) fixed the problem |
| 02:09.01 | ScytheBlade1 | ctr`, how would you recommend going about and poking with OBSD's networking stuff? |
| 02:09.11 | ctr` | install it and toy with it |
| 02:09.16 | ctr` | that's really all I can suggest |
| 02:09.20 | ScytheBlade1 | That's what I figured |
| 02:09.26 | ScytheBlade1 | Know of any good BSD resources? |
| 02:09.40 | ctr` | yeah: openbsd.org; undeadly.org; and *@ |
| 02:09.47 | ctr` | you really need to watch yourself though |
| 02:09.54 | ScytheBlade1 | *@? |
| 02:09.58 | ctr` | obsd mailing lists |
| 02:10.01 | ScytheBlade1 | ah k |
| 02:10.07 | ctr` | misc@ is probably the most popular |
| 02:10.16 | ctr` | you need to be extremely careful |
| 02:10.19 | ctr` | if you ask a question |
| 02:10.23 | ctr` | make sure you researched like a mother |
| 02:10.29 | ctr` | because they will eat you alive |
| 02:10.35 | ctr` | if you didn't read everything you could |
| 02:10.36 | ScytheBlade1 | I'm okay with being eaten alive |
| 02:10.38 | ctr` | ok |
| 02:10.47 | ctr` | that's a common hold up with most people coming to openbsd |
| 02:10.50 | ScytheBlade1 | Typically because that process involves a lot of learning, very quickly |
| 02:10.57 | ctr` | yeah |
| 02:11.12 | ctr` | well, and even if you ask a good question |
| 02:11.20 | ctr` | be prepared to be eaten anyways |
| 02:11.29 | ctr` | the guys on misc@ are ruthless |
| 02:12.07 | ScytheBlade1 | As long as they're ruthless and willing to point me at a man page to read or some better search terms |
| 02:12.08 | ScytheBlade1 | That's fine |
| 02:12.54 | ctr` | they will |
| 02:13.00 | ctr` | they can just come across as very |
| 02:13.02 | ctr` | rude |
| 02:13.18 | ctr` | they just don't put up with anything; or at least, very little |
| 02:13.26 | ctr` | but that's one reason I like them so much |
| 02:13.49 | ScytheBlade1 | If I do wind up posting there |
| 02:13.55 | ScytheBlade1 | My e-mail sig will be pretty simple |
| 02:13.56 | ScytheBlade1 | "http://despair.com/elitism.html" |
| 02:15.22 | ctr` | that rocks |
| 02:15.29 | ctr` | it'll totally hit home with them too |
| 02:15.32 | ctr` | since most people using it |
| 02:15.32 | ScytheBlade1 | Subtle, isn't it? ;) |
| 02:15.35 | ctr` | are elitists |
| 02:15.38 | ctr` | :) |
| 02:15.48 | ctr` | yeah |
| 02:16.35 | ctr` | you'll have to steer clear of all the "wtf? you use kde? you should use nothing but virtual consoles and vi (vim is a pos)" |
| 02:16.49 | ctr` | A lot of them don't understand that at the end of the day, a lot of use like to be productive |
| 02:17.38 | ScytheBlade1 | I know how to phrase questions as needed ;) |
| 02:17.47 | ctr` | k? |
| 02:17.52 | ctr` | -? |
| 02:17.56 | maquis | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/effort.jpg |
| 02:17.56 | ctr` | .* |
| 02:18.10 | ScytheBlade1 | maquis, the despair.com products are ALL amazing. :) |
| 02:18.27 | maquis | ScytheBlade1: yeah... that's just one of my favorites |
| 02:18.30 | maquis | that and the penguin one |
| 02:18.36 | ScytheBlade1 | which penguin one? |
| 02:18.54 | maquis | until you spread your wings to fly, you'll never know how far you can walk |
| 02:18.59 | maquis | i think that's what it was |
| 02:19.04 | ScytheBlade1 | haha |
| 02:19.07 | ScytheBlade1 | Yeah, that one is gold |
| 02:19.18 | ScytheBlade1 | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/apathy.jpg <-- I've always been fond of that one |
| 02:19.27 | maquis | they even mention that it's for linux users :) |
| 02:19.35 | ScytheBlade1 | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/indifference.jpg<-- and that one |
| 02:19.37 | maquis | :) |
| 02:19.37 | ScytheBlade1 | haha, yeah :D |
| 02:19.52 | maquis | and, i'm a college student so... |
| 02:19.52 | maquis | :) |
| 02:19.59 | ScytheBlade1 | I will be, so hey! |
| 02:20.15 | ScytheBlade1 | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/power.jpg <-- and I know a large number of people who want that one |
| 02:20.33 | maquis | :) |
| 02:20.35 | maquis | yeah |
| 02:20.37 | maquis | i want that one :) |
| 02:20.48 | maquis | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/quality364.jpg |
| 02:20.53 | ctr` | <3 |
| 02:21.00 | ScytheBlade1 | haha |
| 02:21.27 | maquis | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/sacrificet.jpg <- oh wow... i need to get that one! |
| 02:21.56 | ctr` | http://despair.com/humiliation.html |
| 02:21.58 | brac | [Humiliation] |
| 02:22.09 | maquis | :) |
| 02:22.10 | ScytheBlade1 | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/ambition.jpg |
| 02:22.16 | ScytheBlade1 | I really do just need them ALL |
| 02:22.19 | maquis | :) |
| 02:22.29 | maquis | do they sell a set of "all demotivators" anywhere? |
| 02:22.35 | ScytheBlade1 | Not that I know of |
| 02:22.40 | ScytheBlade1 | And that'd be amazingly expensive |
| 02:22.53 | maquis | http://despair.com/gettowork.html |
| 02:22.54 | brac | [Get To Work] |
| 02:23.04 | ScytheBlade1 | Haha, it's true |
| 02:23.20 | maquis | http://despair.com/goals.html <-- so good! |
| 02:23.22 | brac | [Goals] |
| 02:23.25 | ScytheBlade1 | http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/doitlater.jpg <-- as is that one |
| 02:23.35 | maquis | :) |
| 02:23.44 | ScytheBlade1 | You know that by the time we're done, we'll have linked them all, right? |
| 02:23.46 | ScytheBlade1 | -urls |
| 02:23.46 | brac | [2006/03/28 19:23:26] <ScytheBlade1> http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/doitlater.jpg |
| 02:23.46 | brac | [2006/03/28 19:23:21] <maquis> http://despair.com/goals.html |
| 02:23.46 | brac | [2006/03/28 19:22:54] <maquis> http://despair.com/gettowork.html |
| 02:23.46 | brac | [2006/03/28 19:22:11] <ScytheBlade1> http://images.despair.com/products/demotivators/ambition.jpg |
| 02:23.57 | maquis | ScytheBlade1: :) |
| 02:24.26 | ScytheBlade1 | I really don't have a favorite |
| 02:24.30 | ScytheBlade1 | *Way* too hard to pick |
| 02:25.08 | maquis | :) |
| 02:27.00 | ScytheBlade1 | Out of all the places to get a gift card to |
| 02:27.04 | ScytheBlade1 | I'd have to pick despair.com |
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| 02:31.15 | maquis | i think i need to get some of the bitersweets for myself for valentine's day next year |
| 02:31.25 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 02:31.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Those are equally amazing |
| 02:32.27 | ScytheBlade1 | Supplies are limited. But the pain that accompanies them may not be. |
| 02:32.27 | ScytheBlade1 | Available in six different flavors, including: Banana Chalk, Grape Dust, Nappy-Citric, You-Call-This-Lime?, Pink Sand and Fossilized Antacid. |
| 02:32.54 | maquis | :) |
| 02:33.13 | ScytheBlade1 | and some years down the road |
| 02:33.22 | ScytheBlade1 | I really want to walk in, sit down at a desk with my name on it |
| 02:33.29 | ScytheBlade1 | And have the "This glass is now half-empty" glass on it |
| 02:33.43 | maquis | :) |
| 02:34.10 | ScytheBlade1 | http://despair.com/pessimistsmug.html |
| 02:34.12 | brac | [The Pessimist's Mug] |
| 02:34.19 | ctr` | who plays the dark haired chick in resident evil: apocolypse? |
| 02:34.27 | ctr` | anyone know? |
| 02:34.35 | ScytheBlade1 | "It makes everything taste bitter." |
| 02:34.39 | ScytheBlade1 | A haha, that's just so amazing |
| 02:34.50 | ScytheBlade1 | ctr`, never seen it |
| 02:34.56 | ScytheBlade1 | I recommend imdb.com |
| 02:53.44 | mheath | <blutkind> np: Nine Inch Nails - Love is Not Enough |
| 02:53.49 | mheath | <mheath> Now Playing: The Beatles - All You Need is Love |
| 02:53.58 | mheath | <blutkind> np: Strapping Young Lad - Love? |
| 02:54.04 | mheath | <mheath> Now Playing: The Beatles - To Know Her is To Love Her |
| 02:54.09 | mheath | haha =P |
| 02:55.20 | ctr` | haha |
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| 04:01.37 | lukfugl | slow night? :) |
| 04:07.22 | ctr` | I was attacked by a race camel |
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| 04:10.39 | ScytheBlade1 | heh, I just got my selective service card in the mail |
| 04:11.16 | ctr` | I threw mine away |
| 04:11.37 | ScytheBlade1 | Oh really? What'd you do instead? |
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| 04:12.47 | ctr` | nothing, I just threw it away |
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| 04:18.20 | ctr` | ENVY or OCEANS TWELVE |
| 04:18.24 | ctr` | I haven't seen either |
| 04:18.29 | ctr` | which should I watch |
| 04:18.32 | ctr` | they are on at the same time |
| 04:20.07 | ctr` | nevermind |
| 04:20.12 | ctr` | they both play again a few hours later |
| 04:20.19 | ctr` | so I'll just watch envy tonight |
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| 05:27.14 | emcnabb | resplin on #utah |
| 05:27.18 | emcnabb | there are miracles |
| 05:29.44 | resplin | I need to restart X |
| 05:29.46 | resplin | brb |
| 05:30.06 | maquis | -lart emcnabb |
| 05:31.28 | *** join/#utah resplin (n=richard@63-226-92-22.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 05:31.41 | resplin | Darn, it didn't work again. |
| 05:32.08 | resplin | I pop into #utah every so often, but most the time it's during the non-busy hours (late at night, early Saturday morning, etc) |
| 05:32.24 | resplin | How're you emcnabb? |
| 05:33.10 | resplin | I'm on line tonight because I'm trying to get my laptop to use an external monitor. It worked out-of-the-box with Gentoo and Fedora, but it hasn't worked since I switched to Debian testing. |
| 05:34.36 | resplin | Is this thing on? |
| 05:34.46 | ^Migs^ | meh |
| 05:34.55 | resplin | :) |
| 05:35.12 | ^Migs^ | craigslist didn't help me give that room away :( |
| 05:35.30 | ^Migs^ | only 13 people have even viewed my site so far |
| 05:37.08 | ^Migs^ | atoponce? |
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| 05:57.11 | ^Migs^ | hey fishyfire |
| 05:57.15 | fishyfire | hey |
| 05:58.42 | ^Migs^ | where do you live? |
| 05:59.15 | fishyfire | ummm... why do you ask? |
| 05:59.28 | ^Migs^ | I'm giving away free room and board |
| 05:59.41 | ^Migs^ | to anyone who is willing to spend a couple hours a day cleaning my house |
| 05:59.54 | ^Migs^ | not even that much, really |
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| 06:04.27 | xbmodder_lappy | goozbach, you there? |
| 06:04.36 | findlay | where? |
| 06:04.43 | xbmodder_lappy | here |
| 06:04.57 | findlay | here? |
| 06:05.01 | xbmodder_lappy | yes |
| 06:05.10 | findlay | 1 |
| 06:05.32 | xbmodder_lappy | anyone an iptables god, or have some nice graphics to explain chains/tables? |
| 06:06.07 | QBFreak | hmm, I could use a decent PDA but price is a huge issue and I know pretty much nothing about PDAs... |
| 06:06.18 | QBFreak | mostly looking for a nice scheduler |
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| 06:06.44 | findlay | xbmodder_lappy: what's wrong with iptables? Seems pretty self explanatory to me |
| 06:06.46 | xbmodder_lappy | like calendar? |
| 06:06.47 | QBFreak | really nice if it could be synced with something open, say through iCal although outlook is acceptable |
| 06:07.05 | QBFreak | well, maybe outlook isn't acceptable if I intend to one day dump windows..... |
| 06:07.10 | QBFreak | yes, a calendar |
| 06:07.51 | findlay | QBFreak: me too, but I've never found a suitable device. Perhaps it's because I haven't looked hard enough |
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| 06:08.00 | QBFreak | I havn't looked at all :) |
| 06:08.21 | QBFreak | I have a $10 or $20 cheap thing that will sync with outlook, but it has a really crappy way of displaying things |
| 06:08.48 | QBFreak | mostly due to a lack of a 'real' graphical LCD |
| 06:09.30 | QBFreak | and the batteries appear to have died |
| 06:09.33 | xbmodder_lappy | QBFreak, you want a smart phone? |
| 06:09.48 | QBFreak | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:09.56 | QBFreak | is that a "here, its free" question? :) |
| 06:11.58 | QBFreak | this is freaky, afaik I don't so much as have an (online) account with verizon but when I visited their site the phone selected in the tech support section was the one I have, which I believe they no longer carry... |
| 06:12.44 | xbmodder_lappy | lol |
| 06:17.18 | levi | xbmodder_lappy: dataw0lf is apparently quite well-versed with iptables, if you can wait until he's around. |
| 06:17.59 | findlay | are iptables rules like lines in verse? |
| 06:20.16 | QBFreak | xbmodder_lappy: when I said cheap I was thinking $100ish |
| 06:20.28 | QBFreak | I suspect what I want is not available in my price range :) |
| 06:20.40 | QBFreak | less is better btw :) |
| 06:21.25 | levi | QBFreak: You could probably find an old Palm on eBay. |
| 06:21.36 | findlay | less as in less UI? |
| 06:21.44 | QBFreak | heh, less money :p |
| 06:21.57 | findlay | oh, well, that's good too |
| 06:23.25 | QBFreak | $30 to ship a PDA from canada? somehow I think they're making some money off of that |
| 06:23.29 | xbmodder_lappy | anyone here understand ebtables? |
| 06:24.12 | levi | Anyone want to buy an eMac? |
| 06:26.23 | ctr` | got one already, sorry :( |
| 06:28.01 | QBFreak | "...the only thing missing is the serial number patch on the back" |
| 06:30.33 | levi | Nah, I've still got the 'proof of purchase' cards and the manuals. :) |
| 06:30.45 | QBFreak | heh no, that was a quote from an auction |
| 06:34.25 | levi | Huh, they're going to make Ocean's 13. |
| 06:34.32 | QBFreak | wonderful |
| 06:34.40 | QBFreak | at least Toy Story 3 got axed |
| 06:35.42 | QBFreak | hmm, I assume pretty much any of the Palm devices would fit my needs? |
| 06:35.47 | QBFreak | the ones I stated anyway |
| 06:35.55 | xbmodder_lappy | levi, PPC? |
| 06:36.13 | levi | xbmodder_lappy: There isn't any other kind of eMac. |
| 06:37.13 | xbmodder_lappy | oh |
| 06:37.14 | xbmodder_lappy | ok... |
| 06:37.17 | xbmodder_lappy | levi, how much? |
| 06:37.30 | xbmodder_lappy | are they |
| 06:37.30 | levi | $400 |
| 06:37.33 | xbmodder_lappy | ouchy... |
| 06:37.42 | xbmodder_lappy | hmm.. |
| 06:38.28 | levi | Ouchy? Just borrow some cash from daddy. :P |
| 06:39.13 | QBFreak | levi: the thing with borrowing is you usually have to repay it |
| 06:40.45 | xbmodder_lappy | levi, very funny... |
| 06:41.02 | xbmodder_lappy | QBFreak, or in this case, disconnect some other services |
| 06:41.17 | xbmodder_lappy | like: cell phone, internet, voip |
| 06:41.26 | xbmodder_lappy | and no compy upgrade for another 3 years |
| 06:42.02 | levi | I'd really rather have a local buyer so I don't have to deal with shipping it. |
| 06:47.11 | xbmodder_lappy | :-( |
| 06:54.10 | QBFreak | anyone ever buy from etech4sale.com? |
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| 07:10.21 | QBFreak | "universal customized case" |
| 07:10.43 | xbmodder_lappy | :-/ |
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| 07:15.57 | QBFreak | I found a Palm i705 for $35 + $4, gonna think about it a little bit |
| 07:16.36 | QBFreak | thinking because I'm not sure if I should get something that covers what I'm looking for, or something that might last me longer :) |
| 07:25.07 | Hhhhh | QBFreak, |
| 07:25.14 | Hhhhh | you just want a Palm? |
| 07:26.02 | xbmodder_lappy | QBFreak, How much is an older tungsten? |
| 07:27.02 | Hhhhh | QBFreak, Zaurus PDAs are nice... |
| 07:27.16 | Hhhhh | you can get one around $150 off eBay |
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| 07:36.13 | ethical_ | >: |
| 07:39.31 | xbmodder_lappy | hey ethical |
| 07:39.54 | xbmodder_lappy | iptables will still monitor an interface, even if it isn't up, right? |
| 07:41.29 | ethical | i dont know anything about iptables |
| 07:41.35 | ethical | sadly |
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| 08:46.09 | QBFreak | Hhhhh: $150 is more than I really want to spend |
| 10:36.15 | QBFreak | Mulder is crazy |
| 10:37.50 | QBFreak | and so am I for watching X-Files at 5:30am |
| 10:51.55 | ctr` | mulder is a mother fu*$#( cash money millionaire |
| 10:52.32 | QBFreak | *blinks* |
| 10:52.52 | ctr` | oh i mean, hi |
| 10:52.56 | QBFreak | uh |
| 10:52.58 | QBFreak | hi |
| 10:53.05 | ctr` | i'm going to try and sleep now |
| 10:53.11 | ctr` | so my day tomorrow isn |
| 10:53.13 | ctr` | ugh |
| 10:53.15 | QBFreak | you sound like you need it |
| 10:53.17 | ctr` | isn't spent sleaping |
| 10:53.20 | ctr` | sleeping |
| 10:53.22 | ctr` | yeah badly |
| 10:53.29 | ctr` | night night sugar |
| 10:53.31 | ctr` | <3 |
| 10:53.35 | QBFreak | uh |
| 10:53.46 | QBFreak | I think we might have a misunderstanding as to my gender :p |
| 10:54.07 | ctr` | I think we might have a misunderstanding as to whether or not I care at this point |
| 10:54.11 | QBFreak | heh |
| 10:54.15 | ctr` | laterz |
| 10:54.18 | QBFreak | later |
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| 13:47.22 | sjansen | mc++ |
| 13:47.24 | sjansen | ~mc |
| 13:47.30 | ibot | i heard mc is Midnight Commander, a file browser for GNU. Monaco |
| 13:47.36 | sjansen | ~botsnack |
| 13:47.36 | ibot | sjansen: aw, gee |
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| 14:19.25 | goozbach | well into ne |
| 14:19.49 | goozbach | well into new mexico now |
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| 14:31.02 | atoponce | ^Migs^: ping |
| 14:36.51 | ^Migs^ | hey atoponce |
| 14:37.24 | atoponce | what's up? |
| 14:37.34 | ^Migs^ | nuthin |
| 14:37.40 | ^Migs^ | just sitting here being awesome |
| 14:37.46 | atoponce | nice. |
| 14:38.02 | atoponce | i noticed you wanted me earlier? |
| 14:39.23 | ^Migs^ | not really. I think you're that weenie that sent me a critical email about my Weber School District web site awhile ago *g* |
| 14:39.39 | atoponce | ahh. probably :) |
| 14:39.51 | atoponce | us web guys |
| 14:39.59 | ^Migs^ | meh, if only you knew what crap the previous webmaster made me have to work with when I came here |
| 14:40.27 | atoponce | so what was the issue? |
| 14:40.35 | atoponce | with not viewing it in firefox? |
| 14:40.35 | ^Migs^ | actually, you did point one thing about the User-Agent string. Our network guy was fooling around earlier but forgot to fix that. |
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| 14:40.54 | atoponce | cool. i'm glad i helped. D |
| 14:41.22 | ^Migs^ | the issue is that the site uses Postnuke, and it blows. When I actually have time, I'm going to redo the entire site from scratch. |
| 14:41.45 | atoponce | yeah. my wife is a school teacher at west haven elementary |
| 14:41.48 | ^Migs^ | cool |
| 14:42.04 | atoponce | she noticed it while her students were in lab, and asked me what she could do |
| 14:42.14 | atoponce | i said email. she said you do it |
| 14:42.21 | atoponce | and that's that |
| 14:42.23 | atoponce | :) |
| 14:42.24 | ^Migs^ | very nice |
| 14:42.37 | ^Migs^ | the policy, for some reason, is that we support IE first, other browsers second |
| 14:42.51 | atoponce | well, it makes sense. ie does hold the market share |
| 14:42.52 | ^Migs^ | I just have too much on my plate to completely revamp everything, so I'm doing it slowly |
| 14:43.04 | ^Migs^ | the policy SHOULD be that web sites at least validate |
| 14:43.32 | atoponce | i can't even remember what i said in the email. |
| 14:43.35 | ^Migs^ | I think when I launched that new site in January, I fixed about 200 validation errors |
| 14:43.38 | ^Migs^ | yeah, me neither |
| 14:43.41 | atoponce | was i rude? i hope not. |
| 14:43.56 | ^Migs^ | oh no no no, don't worry |
| 14:44.00 | atoponce | ok. cool |
| 14:44.26 | ^Migs^ | I've just never known anyone who puts their registered linux user number in their signature ;) |
| 14:44.43 | atoponce | :) yes sir! proud to use linux |
| 14:45.26 | atoponce | actually, there are a few sites that i have sent emails about |
| 14:45.36 | atoponce | i think it's my inner web dev geek |
| 14:45.40 | ^Migs^ | hehe |
| 14:45.58 | ^Migs^ | loads of fun |
| 14:46.38 | atoponce | speaking of which, i have an issue with a drupal theme that is driving me nuts |
| 14:46.54 | atoponce | you can't select text with your mouse if using ie |
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| 14:47.07 | atoponce | not that i really care, but interesting nonetheless |
| 14:47.34 | ^Migs^ | what's drupal? |
| 14:47.36 | atoponce | i'm using it for the cs page at wsu |
| 14:47.38 | atoponce | cms |
| 14:47.47 | ^Migs^ | ah, gotcha |
| 14:47.57 | ^Migs^ | is it a commecial CMS? |
| 14:48.22 | ^Migs^ | I really do need something other than Postnuke |
| 14:48.44 | atoponce | not sure. i know mambo is, but i don't like it's implementation |
| 14:48.50 | ^Migs^ | although it's almost not worth it, since our web site has had so much time invested into its modifications |
| 14:49.11 | ^Migs^ | no, I don't either. I've only seen the Nukes and Mambo |
| 14:49.14 | ^Migs^ | *only used |
| 14:49.34 | atoponce | i'm using mambo for OALUG, and i hate it |
| 14:52.06 | ^Migs^ | sometimes it makes sense to write your own, I think |
| 14:53.02 | ^Migs^ | I'll try Drupal |
| 14:53.04 | atoponce | definitely |
| 14:53.08 | atoponce | drupal is good |
| 14:53.19 | atoponce | a little odd to navigate the admin menus, but not bad |
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| 15:31.21 | elg | -lart finnicky tape libraries |
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| 16:02.35 | jsmith | ~lart stupid hardware |
| 16:08.01 | maquis | jsmith: i don't think that's going to help |
| 16:08.15 | maquis | speaking of which, someone was trying to convince me of that last week.... |
| 16:18.28 | harleypig | http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/14.04/learn.html |
| 16:18.29 | brac | [Wired 14.04: You Play World of Warcraft? You're Hired!] |
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| 16:35.17 | mrpull- | Good mornin! |
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| 16:36.41 | harleypig | http://thedailywtf.com/ |
| 16:36.51 | harleypig | Today's post is a must read. |
| 16:37.24 | Jayce^ | get to work! |
| 16:39.00 | harleypig | I am. :P |
| 16:39.39 | mrpull- | harleypig: That is priceless |
| 16:42.00 | maquis | harleypig: that was yesterday's :) |
| 16:43.01 | harleypig | oh ... well, the one at the top then. :] |
| 16:43.05 | maquis | :) |
| 16:43.09 | maquis | it's a good one :) |
| 16:43.41 | harleypig | I've had a hard time convincing boss' that it was necessary to go further than just check a cookie for security, but this has never happened to me. |
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| 16:44.35 | Bradipo | harleypig: The problem most people have is that they think everyone uses computers in the same way as they do. |
| 16:44.49 | Bradipo | They think that, logically, someone must do this to be able to achieve that... |
| 16:45.01 | Bradipo | Simply because that is how they do it. |
| 16:45.47 | harleypig | Yeah ... it's the same reason people say "Linux? What version of Windows is that?" |
| 16:46.33 | harleypig | Hey! Is reallifecomics down? |
| 16:47.40 | ctr` | 04:39 < harleypig> Yeah ... it's the same reason people say "Linux? What version of Windows is that?" |
| 16:47.45 | ctr` | not to rain on your parade |
| 16:47.56 | ctr` | but I've NEVER heard anything remotely close to that before |
| 16:48.09 | ctr` | have you really heard that? |
| 16:49.20 | unum | I've had people look at my computer that was running linux and ask what version of windows it was running |
| 16:49.55 | harleypig | ctr`: Yeah, I've had customer/tech support on the phone say that to me. |
| 16:51.19 | harleypig | I've had a number of freinds and acquaintenances not realize there was any os out there besides Windows. |
| 16:51.57 | Jayce^ | harleypig, yeah, but Jesse doesn't count.... :) |
| 16:52.16 | Bradipo | ctr`: I've heard similar statements. |
| 16:52.17 | Jayce^ | guess he's going by obfuscated now :-p |
| 16:52.17 | harleypig | I've asked them what they thought was used before 1993 (Windows 3.1) and the response has been "well, personal computers didn't really exist before then". |
| 16:52.19 | emcnabb | I have a friend who works for HP; whenever he mentions that to people, he very commonly gets the response: "Oh, I'm having problems with my HP printer; can you help?". In their mind, HP only makes printers and desktop/laptop systems |
| 16:52.21 | harleypig | Jayce^: heh |
| 16:52.23 | emcnabb | same idea |
| 16:55.32 | dataw0lf | I've noticed that there's alot more people who're aware of Linux then, say, 5, 10 years ago. |
| 16:55.36 | dataw0lf | My Dad knows what Linux is. |
| 16:56.49 | emcnabb | dataw0lf: I agree |
| 16:59.25 | dataw0lf | Trying to find even fellow Linux users in 96, 97 was alot harder than it is now. And I think there are both positive and negative effects on the swelling popularity of Linux and OSS OSes in general. |
| 16:59.45 | dataw0lf | or just open source software. |
| 16:59.51 | harleypig | Apple is taking on the Beatles ... I was wondering when this would blow up. |
| 17:00.21 | Jayce^ | they've been paying them off for years on that stupid trademark... |
| 17:00.33 | ctr` | I've seen many cases where people didn't know other OS's existed, so I guess it's not that far fetched after all. I called IBM for support once, and had to argue with the guy that his download would not run on my machine since I had obsd installed. He informed me that since I was not using the right version of windows, I needed to call Mr. Openbeeehsdee and ask for help. |
| 17:00.35 | harleypig | dataw0lf: Yeah ... it's lot harder to find people willing to do the hard work, but it's a lot easier finding people willing to consider something besides windows. |
| 17:00.46 | Jayce^ | Yoko and Paul just keep wanting more money so they can fight each other |
| 17:01.17 | dataw0lf | harleypig: As elitist as it may sound, the quality of the open source community in general has taken a sharp turn downhill. |
| 17:01.18 | harleypig | There animosity is really a front for their torrid love affair. |
| 17:01.24 | dataw0lf | and it kind of annoys me. |
| 17:01.47 | harleypig | I wouldn't say 'downhill' ... I'd say 'diluted' ... but I'm probably splitting hairs. |
| 17:02.07 | dataw0lf | point. You're right. |
| 17:02.39 | dataw0lf | I mean, finding people who remember pre Google days when you actually had to really _work_ for a solution to various problems is becoming harder and harder. |
| 17:04.13 | dataw0lf | I mean, the internet itself had an effect on research. But I think Google itself has had an even larger impact in some ways. |
| 17:04.35 | ctr` | I don't knwo if it would be larger per se |
| 17:04.36 | levi | Back when I was a kid, you had to install Linux off floppy disks! Compiling a kernel took all day! Uphill, both ways, in the snow! |
| 17:04.45 | ctr` | because google uses the internet to deliver its services |
| 17:04.47 | harleypig | No, google took an idea and ran with it ... it was alta vista that really had the revolutionary idea. |
| 17:04.57 | Bradipo | levi: That was my first install. Slackware on 15--20 floppies! |
| 17:05.09 | Bradipo | levi: It really sucked when floppy number 8 was corrupted. :-) |
| 17:05.13 | dataw0lf | I'm not talking about the technology itself. |
| 17:05.34 | Jayce^ | Bradipo, c'mon, you know it was always one of the last 2 or 3 that would fail.. |
| 17:05.42 | levi | Bradipo: I think my first install was SLS, which Slackware was based on. I'm pretty sure my subsequent installs were Slackware, though. And yeah... floppy corruption was a nightmare! |
| 17:05.43 | dataw0lf | i'm talking about the social impact it had on amateur researching for relatively simple problems. |
| 17:05.44 | harleypig | Bradipo: #8?! #17 *always* got corrupted ... and I'd only ever find out after 30 hours of downloading and swapping. |
| 17:07.45 | dataw0lf | levi: SLS? That was a long, long time ago. |
| 17:07.53 | levi | Yeah. |
| 17:08.12 | ctr` | you guys are old |
| 17:08.24 | dataw0lf | SLS spawned both Slackware and Debian. |
| 17:08.24 | levi | No, you're just young. |
| 17:08.30 | dataw0lf | I'm not that old. |
| 17:08.34 | ctr` | maybe, but mostly you're old |
| 17:08.40 | Jayce^ | or we just all got nice early starts |
| 17:08.46 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: exactly. |
| 17:08.47 | Jayce^ | now harleypig, he's old |
| 17:08.51 | ctr` | hahaha |
| 17:08.58 | dataw0lf | I started using Linux exclusively when I was 14 |
| 17:09.01 | dataw0lf | 10 years ago. |
| 17:09.03 | dataw0lf | so I'm not old. |
| 17:09.22 | levi | At least I don't look old. |
| 17:09.29 | dataw0lf | levi: hehe. |
| 17:09.46 | dataw0lf | I look like I'm 17, except for the tattoos. |
| 17:09.52 | dataw0lf | I think it's my inability to grow real facial hair. |
| 17:10.01 | ctr` | *gasp* |
| 17:10.07 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, that one always hits me too |
| 17:10.10 | ctr` | too bad it's on your back |
| 17:10.32 | ctr` | oh |
| 17:10.34 | ctr` | misread that |
| 17:10.38 | Jayce^ | everybody claims I'm younger than I am just because I still shave only once a week |
| 17:10.39 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: I can grow a beard kinda. and a moustache kinda. But I can't connect em! |
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| 17:11.55 | dataw0lf | Has anyone ever played with Progeny? |
| 17:12.06 | dataw0lf | (Murdock's commercial distro) |
| 17:13.53 | harleypig | Katrina was a blessing for some: http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-03-21-katrina-cash_x.htm |
| 17:13.54 | brac | [USATODAY.com - More than $30,000 in cash found in New Orleans home] |
| 17:14.30 | mrpull- | dataw0lf: the old debian derivative with a GUI installer? |
| 17:15.10 | dataw0lf | mrpull-: Yea. I think Murdock's company tried to market it and now they just do patches for RH. |
| 17:15.58 | atoponce | is there a plugin for gaim that allows the user to send a message to multiple contacts? |
| 17:16.00 | mrpull- | i installed it a few years back, but found it no better than debian proper |
| 17:16.23 | atoponce | 'cuz it's bugging the crap out of me. ;) |
| 17:16.50 | dataw0lf | atoponce: no, but you could easily do it with PyGaim |
| 17:17.21 | atoponce | dataw0lf: how so? |
| 17:17.38 | Jayce^ | export TERM=xterm-color |
| 17:17.43 | Jayce^ | erghhh |
| 17:17.47 | dataw0lf | atoponce: PyGaim exposes the GAIM plugin api to Python. |
| 17:17.58 | atoponce | ahh- i see |
| 17:17.59 | dataw0lf | I'm sure it'd be like a 5 line script in PyGaim. |
| 17:18.05 | harleypig | Jayce^: at least it wasn't a password. |
| 17:18.05 | dataw0lf | I could probably hack it up for you. |
| 17:18.59 | atoponce | that'd be cool |
| 17:21.06 | dataw0lf | Linux or Windows? |
| 17:24.30 | atoponce | windows |
| 17:24.39 | dataw0lf | k |
| 17:26.10 | dataw0lf | atoponce: you're going to need to install the pygaim plugin |
| 17:26.16 | dataw0lf | and Python, I assume |
| 17:27.41 | atoponce | yeah. i have them both |
| 17:27.48 | dataw0lf | k |
| 17:27.53 | dataw0lf | which version of Gaim? |
| 17:27.54 | atoponce | althouh, the plugin is not showing in my plugins on gaim... |
| 17:27.57 | atoponce | 2.0 beta 2 |
| 17:28.05 | dataw0lf | ack, alright |
| 17:29.42 | dataw0lf | is there a Windows binary for 2.0 beta 2 or am I going to have to build it? |
| 17:29.55 | atoponce | there's a binary |
| 17:30.11 | atoponce | it's on the gaim.sourceforge.net page |
| 17:31.09 | dataw0lf | ah, duh |
| 17:31.49 | atoponce | :) |
| 17:31.55 | atoponce | it's for work |
| 17:32.12 | atoponce | i use trillian mainly, but thought gaim 2.0 might have the ability |
| 17:32.15 | atoponce | builtin |
| 17:32.52 | dataw0lf | I've never done any PyGaim development so this should be fun. |
| 17:33.09 | dataw0lf | my KVM needed the exercise changing to my windows dev box anyways |
| 17:33.37 | levi | Hah, I love this little rant. Henry Baker is awesome: http://catless.ncl.ac.uk/Risks/21.84.html#subj10 |
| 17:33.41 | ctr` | i'm going back to sleep |
| 17:33.45 | ctr` | later doodz |
| 17:34.11 | dataw0lf | f0r sur3 |
| 17:34.39 | levi | (He wrote a bunch of awesome CS papers, and later apparently got rich and founded a VC company) |
| 17:43.14 | dataw0lf | atoponce: Huh. I don't see any way to load the Python plugin in 2.0 |
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| 17:45.02 | atoponce | yeah- that's what i'm finding out |
| 17:45.22 | atoponce | i guess back to 1.5, which works just fine anyways |
| 17:45.36 | dataw0lf | so want me to code you up something for 1.5? |
| 17:47.43 | atoponce | sure. if you feel so inclined. :) |
| 17:47.53 | dataw0lf | hehe, k, let me go back to 1.5 |
| 17:49.42 | atoponce | same here |
| 17:56.01 | atoponce | i still can't load the plugin in 1.5 |
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| 17:57.53 | atoponce | python 2.4 should work |
| 17:58.05 | atoponce | it's not a version issue, is it? |
| 18:01.51 | dataw0lf | man |
| 18:01.53 | dataw0lf | I don't know |
| 18:01.59 | dataw0lf | I'm not installing 2.3 to find out. |
| 18:02.01 | dataw0lf | it shouldn't be |
| 18:02.11 | dataw0lf | Python is very backwards compatible |
| 18:02.28 | dataw0lf | Unless they're explicitly importing 2.3 somewhere |
| 18:08.04 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@firebat.aros.net) |
| 18:08.19 | atoponce | yeah. i'm not installing 2.3 either |
| 18:08.25 | atoponce | 2.4 should be just fine |
| 18:13.14 | findlay | python is very backwards? |
| 18:13.14 | findlay | (: |
| 18:14.22 | dataw0lf | pshaw. Selective listening! |
| 18:14.22 | dataw0lf | :D |
| 18:14.53 | atoponce | findlays smilie is backwards... |
| 18:15.04 | ctr` | and it gave me a huge headache |
| 18:15.11 | ctr` | which caused me to vomit |
| 18:15.20 | findlay | :( |
| 18:15.36 | ctr` | <3 vomit <3 |
| 18:15.36 | findlay | I only have a left '(' on my keyboard |
| 18:15.36 | dataw0lf | it takes more than a handful of brain cells to process it, I know. |
| 18:15.53 | dataw0lf | findlay: you kid. |
| 18:16.06 | findlay | I do, I know |
| 18:16.08 | dataw0lf | how do you write lisp?!?! |
| 18:16.10 | dataw0lf | :D |
| 18:17.12 | dataw0lf | atoponce: Any luck? |
| 18:17.34 | dataw0lf | I'm hoping you'll fix it, I'm trying to share code objects between PHP and Python here so that takes a bit of precedence. |
| 18:17.37 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=csavage@64.56.123.161) |
| 18:18.18 | RyanE | dataw0lf: how come you didn't come down to Springville last night? It was fun. |
| 18:18.49 | Jayce^ | I was telling lars you guys should try playing munchkin there some night.. |
| 18:18.52 | dataw0lf | RyanE: putting out fires that the jr admins couldn't handle. |
| 18:18.57 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: Munchkin rocks! |
| 18:19.13 | Jayce^ | lars had never heard of it |
| 18:19.22 | Jayce^ | http://www.sjgames.com/munchkin/game/ |
| 18:19.27 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: Have you played any of the expansions? |
| 18:19.33 | dataw0lf | or Munchkin Blender? |
| 18:19.38 | Jayce^ | yeah, a friend had several of them |
| 18:20.05 | Jayce^ | usually would play the deck with star munchkin and munchkin fu, along with unnatural axe |
| 18:20.14 | dataw0lf | Munchkin Bites is pretty good as well |
| 18:20.15 | levi | I bought Munchkin for a friend of mine, and we played it, but it seemed to be missing some important cards. I can't remember the details anymore, though. |
| 18:20.25 | Jayce^ | never played the blender |
| 18:20.35 | dataw0lf | I need to pick up Need for Steed |
| 18:21.19 | Jayce^ | I need the miniatures for the desk here |
| 18:21.35 | dataw0lf | I want to introduce these guys to miniature wargaming |
| 18:22.03 | dataw0lf | something cheap like Warmachine |
| 18:22.10 | dataw0lf | skirmish type games are a good intro. |
| 18:22.31 | dataw0lf | Nobody wants to drop a grand on a decent Warhammer army when they're first starting out. |
| 18:23.00 | levi | I wouldn't want to drop a grand on a decent Warhammer army anyway. |
| 18:23.16 | levi | Though it would undoubtedly look really cool. :) |
| 18:23.23 | dataw0lf | They definitely do :D |
| 18:23.30 | dataw0lf | I got rid of most of mine when I got engaged. |
| 18:23.39 | Jayce^ | yeah, cost always kills that game |
| 18:23.47 | Jayce^ | battletech :) |
| 18:23.49 | dataw0lf | But Warmachine, if you haven't looked into it, it's pretty sweet. |
| 18:24.05 | dataw0lf | you can drop alot on it, but 100 bucks will get you by fine. |
| 18:24.08 | levi | The only 'wargaming' game I have is Renegade Legion: Interceptor |
| 18:24.20 | dataw0lf | I think the starter pack is only like 30 bucks and that will keep you fine for a while too. |
| 18:24.26 | ^Migs^ | I never got into Warhammer. It looks like fun. |
| 18:24.32 | ^Migs^ | I played loads of Magic, though, years ago. |
| 18:24.33 | dataw0lf | I usually play Warmachine and historical wargames. |
| 18:24.37 | levi | I don't have anyone to play with now. |
| 18:25.00 | levi | Nor any time I'd like to devote to playing. |
| 18:25.04 | ^Migs^ | you're boring, levi |
| 18:25.11 | dataw0lf | I can supply probably enough Warmachine figures for 5 to 6 people to play, if anyone's interested. |
| 18:25.15 | dataw0lf | ^Migs^: What's your problem? |
| 18:25.17 | dataw0lf | Honestly. |
| 18:25.20 | ^Migs^ | ? |
| 18:25.25 | dataw0lf | What's your problem? |
| 18:25.28 | ^Migs^ | you mean why don't I play Warhammer? |
| 18:25.30 | ^Migs^ | I dunno |
| 18:25.38 | dataw0lf | With all these personal attacks on everyone. |
| 18:25.43 | ^Migs^ | I could've gotten into it, but I was at a point in my life when I wasn't able to |
| 18:25.48 | dataw0lf | you don't get out much, do you? |
| 18:25.51 | ^Migs^ | do you find me offensive? |
| 18:25.54 | dataw0lf | Yes. |
| 18:25.59 | ^Migs^ | perhaps you should lighten up then |
| 18:26.03 | ctr` | dataw0lf: you like men |
| 18:26.10 | ctr` | <dataw0lf> I like men. |
| 18:26.12 | ^Migs^ | and not take me so seriously |
| 18:26.18 | dataw0lf | I'm out. |
| 18:26.20 | Jayce^ | uhm... hello mini-trolls |
| 18:26.20 | *** part/#utah dataw0lf (n=dataw0lf@70.103.239.58) |
| 18:26.20 | ctr` | finally |
| 18:26.20 | ^Migs^ | cya |
| 18:26.30 | levi | Yeesh. |
| 18:26.31 | ^Migs^ | he didn't have to go |
| 18:26.35 | *** join/#utah drewbono (n=andrew@66.7.127.212) |
| 18:26.40 | ctr` | he's a bit on edge |
| 18:26.54 | ctr` | no sense of humor or something |
| 18:26.54 | ^Migs^ | he needs to take a xanax |
| 18:26.58 | ctr` | no joke man |
| 18:27.15 | ^Migs^ | everyone should take a xanax once a day. Then there'd be no war in the world. |
| 18:27.19 | ctr` | agreed |
| 18:27.30 | levi | Well, when one is annoyed by the company of others, it is a sensible decision to leave. |
| 18:27.42 | ^Migs^ | he's free to put me on ignore, too |
| 18:27.43 | levi | Regardless of whether the annoyance was intended or not. |
| 18:28.02 | ctr` | i generally read what he says and chuckle inside |
| 18:28.11 | ctr` | it's for my personal enjoyment |
| 18:32.47 | findlay | nobody here takes me seriously. I'm way too sarcastic and joking. If you said something to try to irritate or provoke me I'd probably have great fun with it |
| 18:33.12 | ctr` | ditto that |
| 18:33.29 | ctr` | i like that dataw0lf dude well enough |
| 18:33.32 | ^Migs^ | I actually find you quite boring, findlay |
| 18:33.44 | ctr` | :) |
| 18:33.56 | findlay | nu uh, I'm not boring! |
| 18:34.03 | ctr` | it's true he's not |
| 18:34.08 | ctr` | I was there, I saw it |
| 18:34.16 | findlay | see, look how loudly I'm willing to complain!!@@!!1 |
| 18:34.42 | ctr` | heh |
| 18:35.16 | ^Migs^ | I find that boring |
| 18:35.35 | ctr` | it's the '@'s isn't it? |
| 18:35.42 | ctr` | that always does it for me |
| 18:35.43 | findlay | what would make the load average converge onto 1.0 when nothing is going on? |
| 18:35.52 | findlay | that seems really wierd |
| 18:35.54 | ctr` | findlay: top |
| 18:36.23 | findlay | nothing, no CPU or anything |
| 18:37.28 | maquis | rootkit? :) |
| 18:37.48 | ctr` | haha |
| 18:38.35 | elg | a zombie |
| 18:40.30 | elg | well, maybe not technically a zombie - but some process that you can't kill which is in some sort of uninterruptible sleep |
| 18:40.39 | findlay | aha: bittorrent-curs <defunct> |
| 18:40.46 | elg | i can't remember if there's a concise term for it or if zombie is the right word |
| 18:40.48 | elg | defunct, yeah |
| 18:41.14 | elg | good luck getting rid of it. in my experience you can't without reboot |
| 18:41.35 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@66.239.25.80.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 18:42.01 | maquis | http://tuxgirl.com/photography/flower_tree_1.jpg <-- /me wishes the power lines would disappear... |
| 18:43.30 | findlay | aha maquis, now I'll be able to triangulate your position |
| 18:43.33 | mrpull- | maquis: wish hard enough and someone with photoshop could probably take them out |
| 18:43.46 | mrpull- | but then the roof should probably go too |
| 18:43.55 | mrpull- | and the sky should be more blue |
| 18:44.02 | ^Migs^ | I like this one: http://tuxgirl.com/photography/lions_gate_bridge_2.jpg |
| 18:44.27 | maquis | mrpull-: yeah... except the sky |
| 18:44.33 | maquis | i kinda like the color of the sky there |
| 18:44.42 | ^Migs^ | what do you mean "more blue" |
| 18:44.51 | maquis | ^Migs^: that's from vancouver |
| 18:44.52 | mrpull- | i'll be sailing under the golden gate bridge tomorrow :) |
| 18:45.22 | maquis | http://tuxgirl.com/photography/branch-snow.jpg <-- my favorite :) |
| 18:45.38 | ^Migs^ | yeah, that's a good one, too |
| 18:46.21 | maquis | wish i could get more good pics on a regular basis, but oh well... |
| 18:46.30 | maquis | the raccoon one is kinda funny |
| 18:46.45 | maquis | i wish icould've gotten him straight on, but he was on the other side of the fence |
| 18:47.09 | ^Migs^ | why's it funny? |
| 18:47.33 | ^Migs^ | what kind of camera do you have? |
| 18:47.34 | maquis | it just would've been a bit less weird if i was actually looking *at* him... |
| 18:47.40 | maquis | ^Migs^: canon powershot |
| 18:47.44 | maquis | really nice... |
| 18:48.01 | maquis | it's hard to take a bad picture with it (when it's in auto...) |
| 18:48.15 | ^Migs^ | you live in the Vancouver area? |
| 18:48.22 | maquis | ^Migs^: no... seattle area |
| 18:48.25 | ctr` | maquis: http://tuxgirl.com/photography/branch-snow.jpg |
| 18:48.25 | ^Migs^ | or were you just visiting Lion's Gate? |
| 18:48.26 | ^Migs^ | ah |
| 18:48.28 | ctr` | that one is very awesome |
| 18:48.41 | maquis | went to vancouver for a couple days over christmas break |
| 18:48.42 | ctr` | man those two words don't go well together |
| 18:48.49 | ^Migs^ | I agree. That picture has more approved stamp of awesomeness. |
| 18:48.50 | maquis | ctr`: thanks :) |
| 18:49.36 | RyanE | maquis: which powershot? |
| 18:49.47 | maquis | RyanE: a620 |
| 18:50.11 | RyanE | our little s400 and older s110 are also hard to take a bad picture. |
| 18:50.48 | ctr` | moral of this story: canon powershots are rockin |
| 18:50.52 | maquis | :) |
| 18:50.52 | maquis | yeah |
| 18:51.11 | maquis | http://tuxgirl.com/breakage/uug-server-drive1.jpg <-- it took that one too |
| 18:51.17 | ctr` | i really like those flower tree ones |
| 18:51.27 | ctr` | yeah the powerlines are there, but it's still pretty |
| 18:52.19 | ctr` | wow |
| 18:52.22 | ctr` | how'd you pull that one off |
| 18:52.53 | maquis | ctr`: not sure... michael was trying to set up uug elections, and the server stopped responding |
| 18:53.08 | maquis | the next morning, we rebooted, and the magic smoke decided to come out |
| 18:54.08 | findlay | maquis: you lost the smoke? |
| 18:54.12 | maquis | findlay: yeah |
| 18:54.13 | ctr` | hahaha |
| 18:54.14 | findlay | that's not good |
| 18:54.19 | maquis | findlay: we noticed :) |
| 18:54.21 | ctr` | maquis: are you collecting errors? |
| 18:54.21 | *** join/#utah Robdor (n=rob@208.187.196.58) |
| 18:54.27 | ctr` | cause I can probably contribute |
| 18:54.45 | maquis | ctr`: haha... i'm mainly collecting errors that i've hit at one point or another... |
| 18:54.55 | maquis | i'm somewhat accident-prone on my computer.... |
| 18:55.07 | maquis | and sometimes people don't believe me about that |
| 18:55.10 | ctr` | nah, computing in general is a very accident-prone action |
| 18:55.40 | maquis | ctr`: true... |
| 18:56.22 | findlay | why would doxygen cause the kernel to seg fault? |
| 18:56.42 | maquis | although, i don't know too many people who've cd'd into a directory, ran a program in that directory, cd'd back out, and had the directory be gone (for no comprehensible reason... it wasn't rm that i ran or anything like that) |
| 18:57.03 | maquis | i still haven't figured out why links seg-faults.. |
| 18:57.04 | maquis | etc |
| 18:58.09 | ctr` | not that you could rm that directory while it's cwd |
| 18:58.14 | ctr` | at least on obsd you can't |
| 18:58.20 | ctr` | i can't speak for linux; i don't remember |
| 18:58.29 | findlay | I've done it before |
| 18:58.35 | ctr` | on which? |
| 18:58.41 | findlay | linux |
| 18:59.04 | ctr` | oh |
| 18:59.09 | maquis | ctr`: you can... but generally not by running freemind :) |
| 18:59.18 | ctr` | what's that? |
| 18:59.21 | ctr` | a term, isn't it? |
| 18:59.24 | findlay | I had two terminals open working on the same thing and when I was done and ready to rm the directory it did, even if the other terminal was inside |
| 18:59.34 | ctr` | oh |
| 18:59.39 | ctr` | i have done that |
| 18:59.40 | ctr` | i mean |
| 18:59.40 | maquis | ctr`: freemind is a java mind-mapping program |
| 18:59.41 | findlay | I thought it was a filesystem thing |
| 18:59.50 | ctr` | maquis: oh, that's right; I've used that |
| 19:00.02 | maquis | ctr`: yeah... it didn't delete your cwd, did it? |
| 19:00.04 | ctr` | findlay: you couldn't do a 'rm -rf .' though |
| 19:00.07 | findlay | it recovers gracefully I think, so I don't see what the big deal is |
| 19:00.17 | ctr` | maquis: not that I recall.. |
| 19:00.18 | findlay | ctr`: haven't tried that |
| 19:00.26 | ctr` | rm -rf . shouldn't do anything |
| 19:00.35 | maquis | ctr`: i've been in ~/foo/bar and rm -rf'd ~/foo accidentally before :) |
| 19:00.36 | ctr` | rm by nature wont remove a cwd |
| 19:00.49 | ctr` | in the same terminal? |
| 19:00.54 | maquis | ctr`: i think so |
| 19:00.56 | ctr` | wow |
| 19:00.57 | findlay | but you can do the two terminal trick |
| 19:01.03 | ctr` | i would think they'd have that locked down |
| 19:01.11 | ctr` | findlay: yeah I've done that plenty of times |
| 19:01.20 | ctr` | using two terms, I can screw myself up pretty hXc |
| 19:01.22 | maquis | [amon-re erins] mkdir foo |
| 19:01.22 | maquis | [amon-re erins] cd foo |
| 19:01.22 | maquis | [amon-re foo] mkdir bar |
| 19:01.22 | maquis | [amon-re foo] cd bar |
| 19:01.23 | maquis | [amon-re bar] rm -rf ~/foo |
| 19:01.25 | maquis | [amon-re bar] cd .. |
| 19:01.27 | maquis | cd: no such file or directory: .. |
| 19:01.31 | ctr` | haha sweet |
| 19:01.46 | ctr` | man, that's sorta crappy |
| 19:01.48 | maquis | so, yes... you can :) |
| 19:01.54 | ctr` | maybe I'll write a patch for linux rm |
| 19:02.17 | findlay | maquis: UFS? |
| 19:02.26 | maquis | findlay: i'm assuming so |
| 19:02.29 | maquis | because this is on freebsd |
| 19:02.35 | maquis | but iv'e done it in zsh before |
| 19:03.45 | ctr` | $ mkdir -p foo/bar |
| 19:03.45 | ctr` | $ cd foo/bar/ |
| 19:03.45 | ctr` | $ rm -rf ~/foo |
| 19:03.45 | ctr` | $ cd .. |
| 19:03.45 | ctr` | ksh: cd: /home/ctr/foo - No such file or directory |
| 19:03.51 | ctr` | $ same thing on obsd |
| 19:04.00 | ctr` | i wonder if there's a good reason why this hasn't been locked down |
| 19:04.20 | maquis | findlay: i've heard that in some shells, rm -rf .* will match . and .., causing the equivalent of rm -rf / |
| 19:04.31 | maquis | i'm not sure if that's *still* the case, but at least it was for a while |
| 19:04.46 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@128.187.149.55) |
| 19:04.54 | findlay | I don't see what the big deal is |
| 19:05.16 | findlay | to dumbify the terminal for the careless user (: |
| 19:05.30 | ctr` | which I'll be the first to admit: i'd benefit from |
| 19:05.40 | maquis | hmmm... |
| 19:06.01 | maquis | if you use the full path, you can also rmdir the directory you're currently in |
| 19:06.29 | findlay | maybe it's because we think too much as operating the terminal from a directory when really the terminal should be viewed as a command interface with a 'current directory' as just a conveinent environment variable |
| 19:06.35 | maquis | [amon-re foo] mkdir bar |
| 19:06.35 | maquis | [amon-re foo] cd bar |
| 19:06.35 | maquis | [amon-re bar] rmdir ~/foo/bar |
| 19:06.35 | maquis | [amon-re bar] cd .. |
| 19:06.37 | maquis | cd: no such file or directory: .. |
| 19:06.42 | ctr` | $ mkdir -p foo/bar |
| 19:06.42 | ctr` | $ cd foo/bar/ |
| 19:06.42 | ctr` | $ rm -rf ~/foo |
| 19:06.42 | ctr` | $ ls |
| 19:06.42 | ctr` | ls: .: No such file or directory |
| 19:06.44 | ctr` | $ |
| 19:06.50 | ctr` | as you can see, my rm -rf got it |
| 19:07.00 | jlp_work | maquis, findlay: that's why rm -rf .??* is preferred... you still might end up with files called, e.g. .a, but hey, it's quick and easy |
| 19:07.20 | maquis | jlp_work: yeah |
| 19:07.25 | maquis | you'd think they'd prevent that, though |
| 19:07.48 | maquis | ctr`: you got it so that ls doesn't even work? |
| 19:08.00 | jlp_work | unix not only gives you enough rope to hang yourself, it ties the noose for you. if you choose to slip it over your head, that's not unix's fault :-) |
| 19:08.02 | maquis | ctr`: ls works fine in non-existent directories for me :) |
| 19:08.07 | ctr` | it does? |
| 19:08.09 | ctr` | what does it show? |
| 19:08.10 | findlay | referring to my previous comment, I don't see why the current should be given any special treatment |
| 19:08.19 | findlay | current directory |
| 19:08.20 | maquis | ctr`: nothing |
| 19:08.24 | maquis | even ls -a shows nothing |
| 19:08.25 | ctr` | no . or .. even? |
| 19:08.33 | maquis | ctr`: right |
| 19:08.34 | ctr` | wow |
| 19:08.36 | ctr` | that's nutty |
| 19:08.49 | jlp_work | hmmm, I think ls should have trouble opening . in order to do the ls... it should at least give you an error about that |
| 19:08.49 | findlay | but once you leave, it's gone |
| 19:08.50 | maquis | it won't let me mkdir, though :) |
| 19:09.00 | ctr` | haha |
| 19:09.01 | maquis | jlp_work: not for me :) |
| 19:09.18 | ctr` | jlp_work: it does on obsd |
| 19:09.22 | ctr` | as shown above |
| 19:10.00 | jlp_work | huh, it exhibits maquis's broken behavior on my linux box. I think obsd is more correct |
| 19:10.15 | maquis | jlp_work: as far as rm -rf .*, i can see a lot of people doing that accidentally to get rid of .-files and such... |
| 19:10.37 | jlp_work | yeah, bad :-) |
| 19:10.42 | ctr` | I'm patching rm right now |
| 19:10.51 | ctr` | I'm gonna see if there is any good reason why it's left that way |
| 19:11.13 | jlp_work | I learned long ago to type .??* unless I wanted to match .. |
| 19:15.18 | ctr` | in rm.c on openbsd, maquis' little .* match would never fly |
| 19:15.21 | ctr` | they check for that |
| 19:15.30 | jlp_work | curious... in your removed directory, try running "ls -ald ." |
| 19:15.44 | findlay | rm.c from which shell? |
| 19:16.12 | ctr` | the rm.c for the rm binary |
| 19:16.13 | jlp_work | it looks like . still exists after the rm (presumably since your shell still has it as it's cwd) |
| 19:16.22 | jlp_work | drwxr-xr-x 0 jlp jlp 0 Mar 29 12:10 . |
| 19:16.31 | jlp_work | note the link count is zero. wild |
| 19:16.36 | findlay | so, rm is not builtin |
| 19:16.58 | ctr` | $ mkdir -p foo/bar |
| 19:16.58 | ctr` | $ cd foo/bar |
| 19:16.58 | ctr` | $ rm -rf ~/foo |
| 19:16.58 | ctr` | $ ls -lad |
| 19:16.58 | ctr` | ls: .: No such file or directory |
| 19:17.00 | ctr` | $ ls |
| 19:17.03 | ctr` | ls: .: No such file or directory |
| 19:17.05 | ctr` | $ ls -lah |
| 19:17.08 | ctr` | ls: .: No such file or directory |
| 19:17.10 | ctr` | $ |
| 19:17.13 | ctr` | 07:10 < findlay> so, rm is not builtin |
| 19:17.16 | ctr` | what? |
| 19:17.18 | ctr` | builtin? |
| 19:17.22 | jlp_work | try ls -ald . |
| 19:17.24 | ctr` | rm is not a shell feature |
| 19:17.27 | ctr` | if that's what your asking |
| 19:17.28 | findlay | ctr`: to the shell |
| 19:17.30 | ctr` | no |
| 19:17.49 | ctr` | is there any shells where rm is a feature? |
| 19:18.02 | ctr` | generally speaking rm is it's own thing |
| 19:18.07 | jlp_work | (perhaps obsd does it differently and doesn't preserve it for the current process and it's children, which I would think would be more correct than the linux and fbsd way) |
| 19:18.24 | ctr` | I couldn |
| 19:18.26 | ctr` | oops |
| 19:18.27 | findlay | I can use rm in just about any shell I've ever used, so, yes, it's a feature of all of those shells (: |
| 19:18.29 | ctr` | I couldn't agree more |
| 19:18.46 | ctr` | findlay: you're executing /bin/rm |
| 19:18.54 | ctr` | it's not a shell feature |
| 19:19.00 | findlay | ctr`: no, I'm executing /usr/bin/rm (: |
| 19:19.22 | ctr` | bah stupid linux lack of standards |
| 19:19.33 | findlay | on my box rm is from c\GNU coreutils |
| 19:19.36 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@66.239.25.80.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 19:19.52 | ctr` | whatever that is |
| 19:20.16 | findlay | bah BSD and their obsession with conformity (: |
| 19:20.20 | jlp_work | findlay: what ctr` is saying is that it's still not part of the shell... it's avilable in the posix shell environment, but it's not an integral part of the shell |
| 19:20.23 | ctr` | haha |
| 19:20.25 | jlp_work | (but I'm sure you knew that) |
| 19:20.32 | ctr` | posix2/4.4bsd baby |
| 19:20.36 | ctr` | and that's not just BSD in generally |
| 19:20.40 | ctr` | that's typically just openbsd |
| 19:20.59 | ctr` | freebsd is more or less like linux |
| 19:21.05 | findlay | jlp_work: indeed and I was saying that because ctr` decided to ask whether rm was a 'feature' I decided it was if I could use it in that shell (: |
| 19:21.05 | ctr` | at least, it'd like to think it was |
| 19:21.07 | ctr` | (served) |
| 19:22.19 | findlay | ctr`: actually /usr/bin/rm is a symlink to /bin/rm for some wierd reason |
| 19:22.28 | ctr` | no |
| 19:22.30 | ctr` | that's the linux way |
| 19:22.32 | findlay | yes |
| 19:22.38 | ctr` | system binaries go in /bin |
| 19:22.48 | ctr` | so it makes sense to put rm in there |
| 19:22.57 | ctr` | I imagine that symbolic link is there as a hack job |
| 19:23.06 | ctr` | to keep compatability around |
| 19:23.22 | findlay | binaries you want in the root partition perhaps before other partitions are mounted go in /bin |
| 19:23.32 | findlay | specifically /usr |
| 19:23.48 | findlay | just something that I've observed in practice |
| 19:23.51 | jlp_work | yeah, unfortunately, on linux, /bin/rm is dynamically linked :-( |
| 19:24.06 | ctr` | I'd imagine most things were |
| 19:24.20 | ctr` | of the core set of system binaries that is |
| 19:24.49 | jlp_work | I'd expect stuff in /bin to be statically linked. what if you don't have /usr mounted? now you can't use any of your stuff in /bin |
| 19:25.41 | findlay | jlp_work: no, /usr/bin is symlinked to /bin |
| 19:26.03 | findlay | at least it is on this system |
| 19:27.07 | jlp_work | hummm, on my gentoo box, I find a single statically linked binary in /bin: sash... turns out sash is a "stand alone shell" and includes "built in" to it, among other things, rm! |
| 19:28.30 | ctr` | lame |
| 19:28.32 | findlay | I have lots of stuff in /bin that aren't linked elsewhere |
| 19:28.37 | ctr` | I wont paste it |
| 19:28.40 | ctr` | but in my /bin |
| 19:28.43 | ctr` | nothing is dynamically linked |
| 19:29.25 | jlp_work | on my fbsd box, only /bin/rmail is dynamically linked |
| 19:29.33 | jlp_work | (in /bin) |
| 19:29.44 | findlay | OK, duh I must have confused what you meant by 'statically linked' from plain old file linking (: |
| 19:30.25 | jlp_work | findlay: I mean does it require shared libraries or not. dynamically linked requires shared libraries to run, statically linked has all of the libs included. think the "ld" linker, not "ln" |
| 19:30.43 | findlay | jlp_work: yes, I understand now (: |
| 19:31.18 | ctr` | so for those on linux boxes |
| 19:31.27 | ctr` | how much of /bin is dynamic linked |
| 19:31.32 | ctr` | dynamically* |
| 19:31.56 | jlp_work | on my gentoo box, everything except for that sash guy |
| 19:32.04 | findlay | wait a second, on my gentoo system nothing in /bin is dynamically linked to anywhere outside of /lib64 |
| 19:32.41 | ctr` | wow |
| 19:32.45 | ctr` | two gentoo systems |
| 19:32.49 | ctr` | yet totally different |
| 19:32.57 | findlay | are they? |
| 19:33.04 | ctr` | 07:25 < jlp_work> on my gentoo box, everything except for that sash guy |
| 19:33.06 | ctr` | 07:25 < findlay> wait a second, on my gentoo system nothing in /bin is dynamically linked to anywhere outside of /lib64 |
| 19:33.09 | ctr` | sounds like it |
| 19:33.15 | jlp_work | findlay: do something like cd /bin; sudo file * | grep -v dynamic | grep -v symbolic | grep -v script |
| 19:33.36 | ctr` | what is all that fancy stuff for? |
| 19:34.37 | jlp_work | you need to be root to run file on, e.g. /bin/su, so sudo takes care of that for you. there are a lot of shell scripts and symbolic links you don't want to see, and all of the dynamically linked stuff |
| 19:35.08 | jlp_work | it prints out just the statically linked executables, and on my gentoo box, that's only /bin/sash |
| 19:35.13 | findlay | jlp_work: sudo file /bin/* -F ^ | grep ELF | cut -f 1 -d ^ |
| 19:35.15 | findlay | now what? |
| 19:35.33 | ctr` | in /bin is dynamically linked |
| 19:35.33 | ctr` | 07:26 <@ctr> and what isn't |
| 19:35.38 | ctr` | oops |
| 19:35.46 | ctr` | grr |
| 19:35.53 | ctr` | http://tsl.uct.ac.za/~jnklan001/bin.txt |
| 19:36.12 | findlay | # sudo file /bin/* -F ^ | grep ELF | grep -v dynamic | cut -f 1 -d ^ |
| 19:36.12 | findlay | /bin/bb |
| 19:36.12 | findlay | /bin/cryptsetup |
| 19:36.51 | ctr` | jlp_work: why are you having him do that |
| 19:37.02 | ctr` | i don't understand what all that huffing and puffing is for |
| 19:37.06 | findlay | ctr`: that's the stuff that isn't dynamically linked |
| 19:37.14 | ctr` | why not just use ldd |
| 19:37.20 | jlp_work | you want to know what is statically linked in /bin, right? |
| 19:37.22 | findlay | indeed |
| 19:37.48 | findlay | jlp_work: but all the stuff that is dynamically linked links against /lib rather than /usr/lib |
| 19:37.59 | ctr` | is /lib a symlink though |
| 19:38.01 | ctr` | i bet it is |
| 19:38.25 | findlay | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:38.33 | jlp_work | findlay: I never though about it being dynamically linked against /lib, good point |
| 19:38.33 | ctr` | hrm |
| 19:38.45 | findlay | nothing wrong with that |
| 19:38.58 | ctr` | except it doesn't conform to any real logical standards |
| 19:39.10 | ctr` | other than the standard of no standards |
| 19:39.12 | jlp_work | standards are wonderful, there are so many to choose from |
| 19:39.16 | findlay | ctr`: yes, it's a hack to allow for multilibs |
| 19:39.25 | ctr` | lame |
| 19:39.27 | ctr` | anyways guys |
| 19:39.30 | ctr` | i need to work |
| 19:39.34 | jlp_work | yeah, me too |
| 19:39.35 | ctr` | i will catch you all latas |
| 19:39.36 | findlay | perhaps ther's no standard |
| 19:40.09 | findlay | seems pretty intuitive to me to have lib32 and lib64 |
| 19:40.18 | findlay | work, ha |
| 19:42.22 | ctr` | there was a point when I first started using linux, where I went nuts for weeks trying to track down the 'cd' binary |
| 19:42.28 | ctr` | thought I was going insane |
| 19:42.31 | ctr` | turns out I was |
| 19:42.40 | ctr` | anyways, I'm out for reals |
| 19:42.42 | ctr` | lates |
| 19:43.27 | ^Migs^ | hey, ctr |
| 19:43.40 | ctr` | yeah? |
| 19:43.41 | findlay | that one's builtin |
| 19:43.47 | ctr` | yeah I know :) |
| 19:43.52 | ^Migs^ | why don't you leave now? |
| 19:43.52 | ctr` | it took me forever to figure that one out |
| 19:44.02 | ctr` | ^Migs^: I'm trying :( |
| 19:44.07 | ctr` | i wanna shower and get up and do things |
| 19:44.08 | ctr` | but meh |
| 19:44.09 | findlay | ~leave ctr` |
| 19:44.13 | ctr` | fine. |
| 19:44.26 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@c-67-169-251-185.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 19:44.26 | findlay | just seeing if it would do anything |
| 19:57.01 | ^Migs^ | is he anyone here reasonably fluent in Java and JSP/servlets? |
| 19:57.08 | *** join/#utah RyanE_ (n=ryan@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 20:02.16 | *** join/#utah gthornock (n=gthornoc@209.210.58.54) |
| 20:08.56 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 20:11.19 | findlay | ~whaleslap monster thumb |
| 20:11.21 | ibot | ACTION beats monster thumb upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 20:17.10 | emcnabb | sjansen cowers before most things |
| 20:42.33 | ^Migs^ | hey ctr |
| 20:43.01 | ctr` | yeah? |
| 20:43.08 | ^Migs^ | you REALLY should go now |
| 20:43.14 | ctr` | ugh |
| 20:43.21 | ^Migs^ | oh and ctr? |
| 20:43.25 | ^Migs^ | perhaps you should leave or something |
| 20:43.25 | ctr` | yeah? |
| 20:43.30 | ctr` | i'm trying dude |
| 20:43.33 | ctr` | I said I was gonna shower |
| 20:43.37 | ctr` | like two hours ago |
| 20:43.40 | ctr` | and I still haven't |
| 20:43.44 | ^Migs^ | yeah, you stink |
| 20:43.50 | ctr` | it's hard to motivate myself with no one else to make me |
| 20:47.08 | ^Migs^ | stinky |
| 20:47.26 | ctr` | :) |
| 20:52.38 | Jayce^ | hey levi you see tewk's post about s-expressions with XPath |
| 20:52.50 | levi | Nope, didn't see that. |
| 20:53.15 | Jayce^ | made it up on openclue.org/ut an hour ago or so |
| 20:53.31 | Jayce^ | seemed like one that would get your attention... especially since he is in here |
| 20:55.14 | findlay | this stupid switch randomly kills all ssh sessions |
| 20:55.35 | findlay | ~lart qwest hardware |
| 20:56.09 | ctr` | ~lart ibot |
| 20:56.14 | ctr` | pwnt |
| 20:56.27 | levi | Jayce^: I was out eating lunch an hour ago. :) |
| 20:56.46 | Jayce^ | levi, :) was mentioning that so you knew it was recent :) |
| 20:57.02 | levi | Mmm, Cafe Trang. |
| 20:58.36 | levi | Jayce^: Wow, someone else who hangs out here and doesn't hate Scheme. :) |
| 20:59.23 | *** join/#utah bigdog_ut (n=bigdog@207.135.132.13) |
| 20:59.36 | *** join/#utah gthornock (n=gthornoc@209.210.58.54) |
| 21:00.33 | levi | That particularly blog entry is pretty opaque to me, though, since I'm not well-versed in XML-related things. |
| 21:01.34 | findlay | can you really trust a language called scheme? |
| 21:02.21 | levi | It was originally called Schemer, actually, after previous systems like Planner. |
| 21:02.47 | levi | It was truncated, like so many other old software names, by filename length restrictions. |
| 21:05.29 | *** join/#utah dataw0lf (n=dataw0lf@70.103.239.58) |
| 21:05.48 | levi | Welcome back, dataw0lf. |
| 21:05.54 | ctr` | dataw0lf: you like men |
| 21:06.00 | dataw0lf | sup levi |
| 21:06.20 | levi | ctr`: Dude, you really don't need to be intentionally annoying. |
| 21:06.26 | ctr` | it's a gift |
| 21:06.28 | ctr` | what can I say |
| 21:06.59 | ctr` | there's no humor like juvennile humor |
| 21:07.00 | dataw0lf | Not really. Imposed alienation will just hurt you in the long run. |
| 21:07.06 | ctr` | will it? |
| 21:07.11 | dataw0lf | the open source community is much smaller than it appears. |
| 21:07.15 | ctr` | so can I ask how being alienated in #utah is gonna hurt me |
| 21:08.04 | dataw0lf | you'll just gain a reputation as a unsuccessful troll who's rude and obnoxious. |
| 21:08.05 | ^Migs^ | wb, dataw0lf |
| 21:08.22 | ctr` | 09:01 < dataw0lf> you'll just gain a reputation as a unsuccessful troll who's rude and obnoxious. |
| 21:08.27 | ctr` | awww |
| 21:08.30 | ctr` | that'd suck |
| 21:08.31 | ^Migs^ | why do you have to quote everyone, ctr? |
| 21:08.41 | ctr` | i didn't mean to on that one |
| 21:08.56 | ^Migs^ | yes you did, and you do it all the time |
| 21:09.11 | *** join/#utah gthornock (n=gthornoc@209.210.58.54) |
| 21:09.15 | ctr` | i do, but that one was an accident, i assure you |
| 21:09.17 | dataw0lf | ctr`: it will if you want to get a job. I'll assume that you're similarly obnoxious everywhere you go. |
| 21:09.29 | ctr` | dataw0lf: maybe you'd be assuming wrong |
| 21:10.10 | ctr` | most people I've worked with have some sort of sense of humor |
| 21:10.16 | ctr` | even if it is childish |
| 21:10.18 | ^Migs^ | dataw0lf, it's pretty easy to put on a good face for job interviews |
| 21:10.32 | *** join/#utah gthornock (n=gthornoc@209.210.58.54) |
| 21:10.33 | ^Migs^ | if I was hiring someone, I wouldn't expect their interview personality to be the same as their workplace personality |
| 21:10.57 | dataw0lf | ^Migs^: I'm not talking about an interview. |
| 21:11.20 | ctr` | you did say 'if you want to get a job' |
| 21:11.21 | ^Migs^ | but I am. Please pay attention. |
| 21:11.22 | dataw0lf | I'm talking about if ctr` goes to get a contract with someone I know in the open source community, and they'll likely look into his online behavior. |
| 21:11.35 | ctr` | oh please |
| 21:11.37 | ctr` | i doubt that |
| 21:11.40 | ctr` | and if they did so what |
| 21:11.40 | dataw0lf | *shrug* |
| 21:11.44 | dataw0lf | believe what you will. |
| 21:11.49 | ctr` | what are they gonna do |
| 21:11.56 | ^Migs^ | I highly, highly, highly doubt that, dataw0lf |
| 21:11.58 | ctr` | ask me what name I use when I irc |
| 21:12.02 | dataw0lf | your online behavior as a member of the open source community is much more important than some Yahoo chat kiddie. |
| 21:12.03 | ctr` | and then spend hours researching me |
| 21:12.08 | ^Migs^ | in fact, you're just being silly now |
| 21:12.14 | ctr` | dataw0lf: quite frankly you're talking out your butt |
| 21:12.15 | dataw0lf | You don't have to believe me. |
| 21:12.19 | ctr` | and I dont |
| 21:12.22 | ctr` | that's the nice thing about that |
| 21:12.23 | dataw0lf | Ok. |
| 21:12.25 | ^Migs^ | no one believes you, dataw0lf |
| 21:12.28 | ^Migs^ | you're just silly |
| 21:12.37 | ^Migs^ | hehe, he's a butttalker |
| 21:12.47 | ctr` | :) |
| 21:13.05 | findlay | I have a wierd problem here. If I rsync a local directory against another local directory and then try to cvs update that directory it doesn't work |
| 21:13.13 | findlay | why? |
| 21:13.46 | ctr` | are the cvs tags still in place |
| 21:13.49 | ctr` | or whatever they call them |
| 21:14.00 | tensai | findlay: do you have a CVS directory with its relevant files? |
| 21:14.19 | ^Migs^ | I think you have a few lessons to learn about the way the real world works, dataw0lf |
| 21:14.25 | dataw0lf | haha. |
| 21:14.27 | dataw0lf | Ok. |
| 21:15.37 | ^Migs^ | I don't mean that in a bad way, of course. You're just young and perhaps blissfully naive. |
| 21:15.51 | findlay | tensai: the local rsync directory doesn't have any CVS directories so the CVS directories in the directory that is to be cvs updated aren't touched at all by rsync. Is that confusing? (: |
| 21:16.14 | findlay | at least I don't think rsync touches them |
| 21:16.36 | dataw0lf | ^Migs^: I assure you, I'm not naive in any way. The life experiences I've had up to now most likely are exponentially more than yours. |
| 21:16.47 | findlay | I'm eleventy-one |
| 21:16.51 | tensai | findlay: yes, quite. without a CVS directory, cvs doesn't know where the repository is. but with CVS it's not really a workarea anyway, so there's nothing to update. |
| 21:16.57 | dataw0lf | But don't bother talking to me, I'm not going to spare the time indulging you. |
| 21:17.11 | findlay | let me explain it a little better |
| 21:17.27 | tensai | s/with/without/ |
| 21:17.32 | ^Migs^ | I would actually prefer it if you refrain from addressing me any further, dataw0lf. You're rather incorrigible. |
| 21:17.35 | dataw0lf | you rsyncing from the CVS directory to another local directory, correct? |
| 21:17.36 | tensai | ~lart ibot |
| 21:17.52 | ctr` | dataw0lf: I'm sure you're naive in SOME way |
| 21:18.03 | ctr` | surely you're not well educated and informed and experienced in everything |
| 21:18.13 | findlay | dataw0lf: no other way around |
| 21:18.23 | ^Migs^ | I doubt he is, ctr |
| 21:18.27 | ctr` | who knows |
| 21:18.29 | ctr` | he may be |
| 21:18.31 | ^Migs^ | indeed |
| 21:18.33 | ctr` | he knows more than I do |
| 21:18.34 | ctr` | that's for sure |
| 21:18.35 | ^Migs^ | he may be omniscient |
| 21:18.39 | ^Migs^ | he knows more than all of us |
| 21:18.51 | ^Migs^ | agreed |
| 21:18.53 | findlay | whatever. I know more than both you guys |
| 21:18.57 | ^Migs^ | dataw0lf is our new god |
| 21:19.13 | dataw0lf | Ok, I gotta ignore you, now, ^Migs^. Bye. |
| 21:19.14 | ^Migs^ | knowing more than me doesn't change the fact I'm still more awesome |
| 21:19.38 | ^Migs^ | was that "bye" because you're actually leaving, or because I'll only "appear" to be "leaving" because I'm "supposedly" on "ignore"? |
| 21:20.07 | ctr` | dataw0lf: :( |
| 21:20.12 | *** join/#utah utah_prole (n=jeremiah@c-67-186-243-196.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 21:20.39 | ^Migs^ | I don't really see the point to ignoring, unless perhaps the person is flooding or spamming or something. |
| 21:20.45 | findlay | rsync -r rsync.dir cvs.dir && cvs update cvs.dir |
| 21:20.46 | ^Migs^ | It only gives them license to talk about that person behind their back. |
| 21:20.46 | ctr` | ^Migs^: did you use your fingers to quote those words? |
| 21:20.55 | ctr` | findlay: what does it do? |
| 21:20.56 | ctr` | nothing? |
| 21:20.58 | ^Migs^ | they can say anything they want without rebuttal |
| 21:21.02 | ctr` | or is there an error? |
| 21:21.12 | dataw0lf | findlay: strange. |
| 21:21.22 | findlay | dataw0lf: did I do it wrong? |
| 21:21.23 | ^Migs^ | it actually speaks volumes about a person who baleets others |
| 21:21.40 | ctr` | ^Migs^: I think he wants to give it a rest |
| 21:21.42 | tensai | findlay: wouldn't you have to cd cvs.dir ; cvs up? |
| 21:22.05 | ^Migs^ | I could, hypothetically, go into this diatribe about how I actually know dataw0lf (he lives a few houses away from me) and from their concoct all sorts of bizarre stories that thoroughly denigrate him. Most people would be more than happy to believe me. I'm quite good at making people believe what I say. |
| 21:22.15 | ^Migs^ | *from there |
| 21:22.16 | dataw0lf | tensai: no, you can specify a CVS directory to update. |
| 21:22.21 | ctr` | does he really live that close to you? |
| 21:22.29 | dataw0lf | oh wait |
| 21:22.29 | findlay | tensai: nope, not even that works |
| 21:22.33 | dataw0lf | no you can't. |
| 21:23.01 | ^Migs^ | yes. He's a nice enough neighbor. |
| 21:23.16 | ^Migs^ | he doesn't keep his lawn mowed very often, and he still hasn't taken down his Christmas lights (lol) |
| 21:24.04 | ^Migs^ | see, then from there I'd get into more and more bizarre details about how his personal life, unveiling "secrets" about him |
| 21:24.17 | RyanE_ | The difference is that I actually *know* dw both in RL and on here, and if I were looking for some python help, or sysadmin help, I'd ask. If I were looking for clowns for my kids' birthday parties, maybe I'd look into ^Migs^ or ctr`. |
| 21:24.23 | ^Migs^ | and none of it would be true. This is all hypothetical, of course. I wouldn't really do that. |
| 21:24.30 | ctr` | haha |
| 21:24.35 | dataw0lf | RyanE_: talking about me still? |
| 21:24.38 | dataw0lf | hehe |
| 21:24.44 | ctr` | RyanE_: you're funny |
| 21:24.46 | RyanE_ | babbling is more like it. |
| 21:24.53 | ctr` | I like the part where you called me a clown |
| 21:24.56 | ctr` | that was really good |
| 21:25.09 | ^Migs^ | I can make balloon animals |
| 21:25.10 | ctr` | I was laughing like this --> lawlzypoo |
| 21:25.11 | dataw0lf | RyanE_: Don't even bother with them. If ^Migs^ did know me, he wouldn't be talking smack. |
| 21:25.59 | ^Migs^ | that's what all sexual predators say. |
| 21:26.04 | RyanE_ | dataw0lf: I'm not worried about you. :) However, I agree with your proposition that acting like an idiot online can have RL consequences. |
| 21:26.04 | ctr` | RyanE_: I like how you assume those with humor different from your own, are less intelligent or informed in the areas of python or sys admin stuff |
| 21:26.30 | ctr` | less informed* |
| 21:26.36 | ^Migs^ | only if you happen to meet those people |
| 21:26.43 | ^Migs^ | perhaps a little more likely in this channel, since we're quite localized |
| 21:26.46 | RyanE_ | no, I assume that idiots are idiots. trolls are trolls. |
| 21:26.56 | ctr` | right |
| 21:26.56 | RyanE_ | haven't met a troll who actually has anything valuable to contribute. |
| 21:27.00 | dataw0lf | RyanE_: Of course it does. The open source community is BASED online. It has serious RL repercussions. They obviously haven't been involved in it long enough to know that. |
| 21:27.02 | ^Migs^ | I can go into ##java, however, and be myself and probably not reap the consequences |
| 21:27.19 | ctr` | dataw0lf: for sure |
| 21:27.28 | ctr` | i don't even know what open source is |
| 21:27.29 | ^Migs^ | that's another point. If you're ignoring me, I could suddenly say something completely relevant to you, or something you needed to here at this point in your life, and you'd miss it. |
| 21:27.51 | findlay | dataw0lf: cvs co dir && cp -r dir dir1 && rm -r dir && mv dir1 dir && cvs update dir will fail also |
| 21:27.55 | ^Migs^ | I can often give very good advice when I want to |
| 21:28.05 | ^Migs^ | and make very poignant statements |
| 21:28.08 | dataw0lf | findlay: *boggle* |
| 21:28.34 | RyanE_ | hehe. I seriously doubt that you have anything to say that dw 'needs to here' at this point in his life. |
| 21:28.37 | ctr` | dataw0lf: can i ask what you do for the open source community |
| 21:28.44 | dataw0lf | findlay: Are you certain that the CVS server is up? |
| 21:28.46 | RyanE_ | I don't think dw comes here for validation or life advice. |
| 21:28.50 | ctr` | RyanE_: hear* |
| 21:28.55 | maquis | RyanE_: :) |
| 21:29.00 | dataw0lf | findlay: Can you try with a different, reliable CVS source? |
| 21:29.01 | RyanE_ | ctr`: no freakin' kidding. |
| 21:29.09 | findlay | dataw0lf: if I copy the cvs source tree to a new directory and remove the original dir then copy it back, it doesn't work |
| 21:29.22 | tensai | dataw0lf: if the cvs co works, so should the update |
| 21:29.44 | dataw0lf | I dunno, I'd still try a different CVS source. |
| 21:29.52 | findlay | dataw0lf: nope. I'm force to use the cvs version (heh) of cvsnt because I have to use freepository which requires cvsnt |
| 21:30.03 | RyanE_ | conference call time. :( |
| 21:30.09 | findlay | and I can't compile any of the versions of cvsnt except the cvs version |
| 21:30.21 | dataw0lf | findlay: how is that update failing right after you checkout? |
| 21:30.33 | dataw0lf | the last command string you tried. |
| 21:30.44 | findlay | dataw0lf: it fails if I move the source tree to a new dir then back |
| 21:30.54 | tensai | what's the error message when it fails? |
| 21:30.55 | findlay | which is really wierd |
| 21:31.03 | dataw0lf | yea, I'm just wondering what it spits out when it does fail. |
| 21:31.08 | dataw0lf | or if it just silently doesn't update |
| 21:31.21 | tensai | cvs isn't inode based, it's all name based |
| 21:31.30 | findlay | there's no error. cvsnt just starts sending a lot of data out interminably |
| 21:31.33 | *** mode/#utah [+o maquis] by ChanServ |
| 21:32.19 | maquis_power_tri | doh! |
| 21:32.29 | dataw0lf | hehe |
| 21:33.09 | findlay | ok, so that was wierd |
| 21:33.13 | dataw0lf | ? |
| 21:33.20 | maquis_powertrip | findlay: what? |
| 21:33.44 | nick125 | lol |
| 21:33.47 | findlay | I let it go this time and after about 40 seconds it finally updated after sending about 2 megabytes to the cvs server |
| 21:34.10 | findlay | why would it do that? |
| 21:34.14 | dataw0lf | ... |
| 21:34.29 | ctr` | 2mb of what? |
| 21:34.59 | ctr` | and why is an update even pushing stuff to the server anywho |
| 21:35.10 | tensai | findlay: try it again and see if it does the same thing |
| 21:35.11 | findlay | ctr`: exactly my questions |
| 21:35.23 | findlay | tensai: already did and it works normally now |
| 21:35.32 | ctr` | wierd |
| 21:35.38 | findlay | I even did my rsync deal and it works normally |
| 21:35.41 | dataw0lf | findlay: blame it on Windows. |
| 21:35.45 | tensai | findlay: sending a ton of deltas is my only guess. I dunno. |
| 21:35.46 | ctr` | dataw0lf: werd |
| 21:36.11 | tensai | ~lart maquis_powertrip for messing up tensai's display with her long username |
| 21:36.15 | findlay | I blame Windows ... and doughnuts!!@! |
| 21:36.15 | dataw0lf | tensai: 2 mbs worth? |
| 21:36.22 | dataw0lf | findlay: :-) |
| 21:36.33 | maquis_powertrip | -lart tensai for daring to disagree with maquis_powertrip |
| 21:36.38 | tensai | findlay: how large is this cvs dir? |
| 21:36.51 | findlay | 13M |
| 21:36.55 | ctr` | odd |
| 21:37.13 | ctr` | can you do a check out of that same repository somewhere else |
| 21:37.28 | dataw0lf | he can co it fine. |
| 21:37.47 | ctr` | and nothing is different since the 2mb were pushed? |
| 21:37.49 | tensai | sounds kinda fishy. were there a lot of updates since you updated? what if you checkout that specific rev again? |
| 21:38.06 | ctr` | findlay: I guess the question now is how you know thta you were sending data |
| 21:38.08 | ctr` | and not recieving |
| 21:38.09 | dataw0lf | I'd go into paranoid mode if you're sending 2 mbs of data. |
| 21:38.20 | dataw0lf | were you watching it with tcpdump or anything? |
| 21:38.20 | findlay | if I cp the source tree to a new dir and then update it sends the data to the server again |
| 21:38.25 | dataw0lf | oh, windows. |
| 21:38.27 | findlay | dataw0lf: no |
| 21:38.35 | findlay | neither windows (: |
| 21:38.37 | findlay | FC4 |
| 21:38.39 | ctr` | how do you know it cps? |
| 21:38.41 | dataw0lf | oh. |
| 21:38.43 | ctr` | er |
| 21:38.47 | ctr` | how do you know it sends |
| 21:38.49 | dataw0lf | try another co |
| 21:38.54 | ctr` | sorry, I can't read and type at the same time |
| 21:38.57 | dataw0lf | and try the 'broken' way again |
| 21:39.00 | dataw0lf | while tcpdumping it. |
| 21:39.03 | findlay | I have a feeling it's the server that's fishy |
| 21:39.06 | findlay | now |
| 21:39.31 | tensai | I blame Canada |
| 21:39.42 | dataw0lf | I blame svn for spoiling me. |
| 21:39.52 | findlay | because once I "establish" a new CVS target it doesn't send a hard drive's worth of data to the server |
| 21:40.34 | findlay | tensai: no differences between rsync and cvs dirs yet |
| 21:40.50 | ctr` | dataw0lf: werd. svn is sick |
| 21:41.20 | maquis_powertrip | svn is nice |
| 21:41.26 | ctr` | it's way nice |
| 21:41.36 | dataw0lf | it's better than CVS. |
| 21:41.39 | findlay | Mozart symphonies are the way to go, especially at work |
| 21:41.41 | ctr` | dataw0lf: why? |
| 21:41.42 | dataw0lf | that's as far as I'll go. |
| 21:41.44 | mrpull- | levi: what is worse parentheses or mandated whitespace? |
| 21:41.55 | tensai | svn rm maquis_powertrip; svn co -m 'nick too long' |
| 21:41.57 | dataw0lf | ctr`: Why? |
| 21:42.44 | dataw0lf | svn is noticeably faster, metadata, transactions |
| 21:42.49 | levi | mrpull->: That implies that either is inherently bad. |
| 21:42.55 | dataw0lf | setting up a svn repo isn't like going to the dentist. |
| 21:43.09 | maquis_powertrip | tensai: why you using xchat? irssi handles it fine :-P |
| 21:43.16 | dataw0lf | mrpull-: better question is which is better. |
| 21:43.30 | mrpull- | levi: not that either are bad, they are both often misliked |
| 21:43.43 | levi | misliked? |
| 21:43.48 | findlay | dataw0lf: tcpdump would deluge any session with uninteresting packets |
| 21:43.49 | dataw0lf | It took me all of 15 minutes to get used to enforced whitespace. |
| 21:43.50 | ctr` | dataw0lf: I agree with all that; just wanted to see what you had to say |
| 21:43.50 | levi | I don't dislike either, particularly. |
| 21:43.58 | findlay | at least as far as I know how to use it |
| 21:44.00 | findlay | (: |
| 21:44.14 | dataw0lf | findlay: hehe, gotta use it's filtering mechanisms. |
| 21:44.35 | ctr` | anyone want me to make some food for them? |
| 21:44.40 | ctr` | i'm going to get icecream |
| 21:44.42 | levi | Mostly I'm watching this movie because it's REALLY BAD. :) |
| 21:44.53 | maquis|power | tensai: better? |
| 21:44.56 | dataw0lf | levi: Yeah. |
| 21:45.05 | tensai | I dislike Python's use of whitespace, although I appreciate that it's consistent |
| 21:45.06 | mrpull- | levi: link? |
| 21:45.10 | findlay | power is defined as the derivitive of work by time |
| 21:45.12 | tensai | maquis|power: somewhat |
| 21:45.27 | dataw0lf | mrpull-: http://www.ibiblio.org/obp/pyBiblio/pythonvideo.php |
| 21:45.28 | brac | [Python Bibliotheca] |
| 21:45.34 | maquis|power | tensai: better enough that you won't killall irssi or anything? |
| 21:45.41 | tensai | :) |
| 21:46.12 | findlay | thanks everybody for talking me through the 2 megabytes |
| 21:46.27 | ctr` | it was all me |
| 21:46.30 | dataw0lf | have I mentioned don't use killall as root on Tru64? |
| 21:46.35 | findlay | I knew it |
| 21:47.28 | tensai | dataw0lf: why? |
| 21:47.29 | dataw0lf | and HP-UX, too |
| 21:47.40 | ctr` | dataw0lf: you're on hp's testdrive? |
| 21:47.46 | dataw0lf | tensai: In Tru64 killall kills every process owned by the user except for the calling process |
| 21:47.53 | dataw0lf | HP-UX it kills all processes |
| 21:48.04 | dataw0lf | I've learned that the hard way |
| 21:48.05 | dataw0lf | ... |
| 21:48.06 | dataw0lf | several times |
| 21:48.08 | dataw0lf | like |
| 21:48.09 | ctr` | haha |
| 21:48.11 | ctr` | several times? |
| 21:48.13 | tensai | eek. that would be a nasty surprise. |
| 21:48.13 | dataw0lf | half an hour ago |
| 21:48.36 | findlay | ha |
| 21:48.41 | findlay | fun command |
| 21:48.59 | dataw0lf | ctr`: jumping between Linux, BSD, Tru64, and HP-UX all day can get confusing. So yes, several times. |
| 21:49.06 | mrpull- | killall is one I avoid... it works too differently on different platforms |
| 21:49.12 | findlay | standards, man |
| 21:49.14 | levi | ESR has seriously sunken eyes in this video. |
| 21:49.24 | dataw0lf | levi: hehe no kidding. |
| 21:49.30 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp40.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 21:49.45 | ctr` | dataw0lf: are you giving HP's testdrive a run? |
| 21:50.06 | dataw0lf | ctr`: No. I'm working. |
| 21:50.44 | ctr` | i see |
| 21:51.02 | findlay | ~spell sea |
| 21:51.14 | findlay | or it may not |
| 21:51.19 | dataw0lf | iSea |
| 21:51.20 | dataw0lf | ! |
| 21:51.21 | ctr` | ibot what do you know anyways |
| 21:51.22 | ibot | who? |
| 21:51.31 | dataw0lf | findlay: weird* |
| 21:51.32 | ctr` | is that possible? |
| 21:51.39 | findlay | ~spell wierd |
| 21:51.52 | ctr` | weed! |
| 21:51.54 | ctr` | bbiab |
| 21:52.43 | dataw0lf | Argh. |
| 21:53.02 | dataw0lf | I knew this would happen. For some reason Tru64 has a huge problem with my new four port KVM. |
| 21:53.20 | dataw0lf | I can switch to it but I can't switch out. |
| 21:53.28 | dataw0lf | (via home and up arrows) |
| 21:53.32 | levi | Hmm. |
| 21:54.15 | dataw0lf | Hopefully Alpha Debian won't have this problem when I lug this beast home and hook it up. |
| 21:55.07 | findlay | is it possible to generate an ssh key pair for two machines with different users, like for "user1@hostA $ ssh user2@hostB"? |
| 21:56.46 | tensai | findlay: an ssh key is not tied to a specific user. it can be used by whatever account has it in the correct .ssh/authorized_keys file. |
| 21:56.54 | tensai | findlay: is that what you where asking? |
| 21:57.06 | findlay | tensai: I think so |
| 21:57.17 | findlay | I tried it before and it didn't work |
| 21:57.28 | tensai | findlay: did you have the permissions on the file correct? |
| 21:57.39 | tensai | syslog will often say what the error is |
| 21:58.06 | dataw0lf | http://phonese.cx/comments.php?1760 <-- my new DEC machine! |
| 21:58.07 | brac | [phonese.cx] |
| 21:58.51 | dataw0lf | haha. |
| 21:58.58 | dataw0lf | it's safe, I promise. |
| 21:59.27 | *** join/#utah hatchmt (n=mhatch@66.239.25.2.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 21:59.36 | dataw0lf | findlay: what version of OpenSSH do you have? I think older versions you had to put some keys in authorized_keys2... |
| 21:59.40 | findlay | ~cx |
| 21:59.42 | ibot | A platform independant, interface independant, programming language independant,. URL: http://ds.dial.pipex.com/shallow/ |
| 21:59.43 | dataw0lf | my memory fails me. |
| 21:59.50 | dataw0lf | ~goatse |
| 21:59.51 | ibot | goatse is at http://www.goatse.cx, or (E@3), or http://www.jurito.net/otro/soldatogoatse.jpg, or http://www.hick.org/goat/, or http://www.fugly.com/media/IMAGES/funny/fugly40316227.jpg |
| 21:59.54 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, you should pick up my old alpha, it's just sitting around now |
| 22:00.53 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: I get alot of Alpha equipment from my work, I have so much now I don't know what to do with it. |
| 22:00.53 | dataw0lf | I'm pondering on whether I should illegally keep Tru64 on here so I can play some more with AdvFS |
| 22:01.02 | tensai | I know what I'd do, pawn it off to an unsuspecting schmuck |
| 22:01.11 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, but this is just a wee bitty one... |
| 22:01.12 | Jayce^ | http://halls.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Computers/dsc00608.jpg |
| 22:01.13 | brac | [Viewing /gallery/jayce/Computers/dsc00608.jpg at 640 x 480] |
| 22:01.14 | Jayce^ | :) |
| 22:01.26 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: hehe |
| 22:01.49 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: you can barely make out my new Indigo behind that tape rack too :-) |
| 22:01.52 | dataw0lf | well |
| 22:02.03 | dataw0lf | new is a relative term here |
| 22:02.09 | Jayce^ | new to you.. |
| 22:02.13 | dataw0lf | right |
| 22:02.43 | findlay | this stupid quest squitch |
| 22:02.55 | findlay | switch |
| 22:03.03 | dataw0lf | findlay: ? |
| 22:03.24 | findlay | dataw0lf: it keeps dropping ssh sessions |
| 22:03.32 | dataw0lf | ah |
| 22:03.46 | dataw0lf | what model? |
| 22:04.03 | tensai | why are you sshing to a qwest switch? |
| 22:04.48 | ^Migs^ | I've been Googling all day, and I'm tired of googling |
| 22:04.52 | findlay | I'm not. It routes the traffic out of here into the Internet(TM) |
| 22:05.09 | *** join/#utah RyanE_aw1y (n=ryan@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 22:05.18 | dataw0lf | I thought you were talking about one of the Actiontecs hehe. |
| 22:05.29 | findlay | I think it is |
| 22:05.33 | dataw0lf | probably. |
| 22:07.21 | dataw0lf | ok, 36 hours, and I'm done. |
| 22:07.23 | dataw0lf | cya guys tomorrow. |
| 22:08.43 | ^Migs^ | oh do leave, dataw0lf |
| 22:09.52 | *** join/#utah drewbono (n=andrew@128.187.176.186) |
| 22:11.09 | goozbach | texas is huge |
| 22:20.23 | goozbach | ~lart Jayce^ |
| 22:20.43 | Jayce^ | ~paint goozbach |
| 22:20.44 | ibot | ACTION rains a tape stream of paintballs on goozbach |
| 22:25.59 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (i=Migs@205.122.50.21) |
| 22:30.37 | goozbach | ~lart texas |
| 22:32.13 | elg | -lart texas |
| 22:32.31 | ctr` | har har har |
| 22:33.53 | Hhhhh | ~lart brac |
| 22:33.56 | Hhhhh | -lart ibot |
| 22:34.03 | Hhhhh | make them fight |
| 22:34.06 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:34.07 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:34.11 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:34.11 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 2 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:34.14 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:34.15 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 3 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:34.17 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:34.17 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 4 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:34.20 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:34.20 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 5 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:34.23 | Hhhhh | hehe |
| 22:34.24 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:34.25 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 6 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 22:35.23 | ctr` | can I try? |
| 22:35.38 | ctr` | -roulette |
| 22:35.38 | brac | ctr`: chamber 1 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:35.39 | Hhhhh | sure |
| 22:35.43 | ctr` | sorry; slober |
| 22:35.44 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:35.44 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 2 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:35.49 | ctr` | -roulette |
| 22:35.49 | brac | ctr`: chamber 3 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:35.53 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:35.53 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 4 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:35.56 | ctr` | -roulette |
| 22:35.56 | brac | ctr`: chamber 5 of 6 => +click+ |
| 22:35.56 | Hhhhh | ;) |
| 22:35.59 | Hhhhh | argh |
| 22:36.00 | ctr` | haha sucks to be you |
| 22:36.01 | Hhhhh | -roulette |
| 22:36.01 | brac | Hhhhh: chamber 6 of 6 => *BANG* |
| 22:36.04 | ctr` | :) |
| 22:36.08 | ctr` | i'm done |
| 22:36.26 | ctr` | there was a cute little squirrel out back eating the bird food |
| 22:36.27 | brac | BANG! You're all dead. |
| 22:36.28 | ctr` | so i chased it away |
| 22:36.30 | findlay | brac: duh, you put it in chamber 6 twice in a row |
| 22:37.15 | Hhhhh | ibot, you suck |
| 22:37.19 | Hhhhh | brac, you too |
| 22:37.24 | ctr` | not me? |
| 22:37.26 | ctr` | :( |
| 22:37.28 | brac | whatever dude |
| 22:42.13 | *** join/#utah levi_ (n=levi@66.239.25.41.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 22:49.58 | *** join/#utah nick125 (n=nick@unaffiliated/nick125) |
| 23:07.55 | findlay | I can't think anymore |
| 23:08.02 | ctr` | i never could |
| 23:08.17 | ctr` | i generally do this |
| 23:08.27 | ctr` | cat /dev/urandom | brain |
| 23:08.32 | ctr` | it sorta works |
| 23:08.39 | ctr` | every now and thenaksdps i have problems |
| 23:08.52 | ctr` | time for a shower |
| 23:08.53 | ctr` | bbiab |
| 23:12.57 | sjansen | ~lart sjansen |
| 23:13.09 | sjansen | ibot: Good luck! |
| 23:14.48 | *** join/#utah drewbono (n=andrew@128.187.176.186) |
| 23:21.46 | sjansen | So I had steak the night before, and BBQ last night... What should I have tonight? |
| 23:22.53 | levi | sjansen: Thai curry |
| 23:23.06 | levi | Mmm, new Neko Case. |
| 23:24.10 | sjansen | Thai does sound good... |
| 23:24.19 | maquis|power | indian! |
| 23:24.28 | findlay | stupid css |
| 23:24.34 | findlay | ~lart css |
| 23:24.36 | tensai | sjansen: duck confit |
| 23:26.06 | maquis|power | thankfully no quiche |
| 23:26.14 | sjansen | http://www.eucliddiscoveries.com/press_release.php#032806 <-- That has _so_ got to be hoax. |
| 23:26.15 | brac | [| Euclid Discoveries |] |
| 23:27.01 | *** join/#utah ^Migs^ (n=Stuff@71-37-66-168.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 23:27.05 | *** part/#utah ^Migs^ (n=Stuff@71-37-66-168.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 23:27.10 | *** join/#utah ^Migs^ (n=Stuff@71-37-66-168.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 23:27.12 | ^Migs^ | whoopsydoops |
| 23:27.45 | findlay | ~lart maquis|power's apartment |
| 23:28.26 | findlay | from now on, every other thing I say will start with ~lart until Nixon goes to China |
| 23:28.33 | tensai | sjansen: it could happen, for a certain set of movies shot in the dark |
| 23:29.21 | sjansen | heh |
| 23:29.23 | tensai | findlay: psst. Nixon is dead |
| 23:29.38 | findlay | really? oh well |
| 23:29.43 | sjansen | ~lart findlay: psst. Nixon is dead |
| 23:32.00 | findlay | ~lart my brain is full of defunt procs, keeps seg faulting, need to reboot to get the kernel out of an exceptionable state |
| 23:32.24 | findlay | thanks for flooding ibot. You're always there fore me, and I appreciate that |
| 23:33.04 | *** join/#utah levi_ (n=levi@66.239.25.2.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 23:33.49 | maquis|power | fore? |
| 23:34.35 | jlp_work | isn't that what you yell when golfing and you are about to bean someone? |
| 23:34.52 | findlay | ~lart four, 4, 0000 0100, 2^2 |
| 23:35.21 | findlay | bean? |
| 23:35.31 | jlp_work | bean == hit them on the head with the ball |
| 23:35.44 | mheath | How does this relate to a bean bag? |
| 23:35.57 | jlp_work | no no, no, no |
| 23:36.16 | mheath | yah! I'm going out on a date with her! :) |
| 23:36.47 | findlay | her? |
| 23:36.49 | maquis|power | erm... /me points out htat if she's the subject of that statement, mheath is completely wrong |
| 23:37.00 | findlay | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:37.13 | maquis|power | findlay: yup |
| 23:37.20 | findlay | yup? |
| 23:37.24 | mheath | maquis|power: No, you're not. But if you'd like to..... ;-P |
| 23:37.37 | findlay | ;-p? |
| 23:37.52 | maquis|power | mheath: no thanks |
| 23:38.18 | mheath | !!!!! I love her! Jamie :-) |
| 23:38.25 | mheath | Boo, off to work. But I'll have a date tomorrow! |
| 23:39.02 | findlay | whatever |
| 23:39.12 | findlay | ~date |
| 23:39.14 | ibot | It is now 2006.03.29 23:39:14 GMT |
| 23:41.47 | findlay | ~rain |
| 23:41.49 | ibot | Seattle has too much of it this year! |
| 23:41.57 | findlay | whatever |
