| 00:04.48 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp25.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 00:05.56 | *** part/#utah xbmodder (i=nobody@unaffiliated/xbmodder) |
| 00:05.56 | *** join/#utah xbmodder (i=nobody@unaffiliated/xbmodder) |
| 00:06.29 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-24-10-236-93.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 00:07.02 | mrpull- | emcnabb: i'm going to buy that for the bean counters around here |
| 00:16.49 | xbmodder | Do you guys think that for 400 cubic feet 1200 bucks is worth it? |
| 00:18.13 | xbmodder | do you guys know of anybody with a datacenter that is in need of money, has a room available, indoor plumbing, and 24/7 access |
| 00:18.50 | QBFreak | xbmodder: looking to move in? :) |
| 00:19.27 | nick125 | LOL |
| 00:19.31 | nick125 | yeah he is.. |
| 00:19.36 | xbmodder | err, it was nick125's idea |
| 00:19.42 | nick125 | LOL |
| 00:19.50 | nick125 | we both collaborated on it |
| 00:19.50 | nick125 | :) |
| 00:20.18 | jsmith | xbmodder: In San Jose, the datacenter space is more expensive than rent :-( |
| 00:20.51 | QBFreak | 400 cubic feet, thats what a 5x10 room? |
| 00:20.52 | jsmith | xbmodder: All the old datacenters that have sat dormant since the implosion are being bought up and retrofitted. |
| 00:20.53 | *** join/#utah findlay_work (n=justin@71-36-74-27.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 00:21.35 | findlay_work | why do I get a 403 when I try to access 127.0.0.1/~justin/ ? |
| 00:21.49 | xbmodder | a 90 inch high, 60 inch wide, and about 50 inches long |
| 00:21.57 | jsmith | findlay: Permissions problem? |
| 00:22.26 | findlay_work | jsmith: I changed the permissions to 'chmod 777 -R ~/public_html' |
| 00:23.23 | findlay_work | (UserDir is public_html) |
| 00:23.38 | mrpull- | xbmodder: indoor plumbing!? |
| 00:24.12 | tene | mrpull-: he wants to water-cool his servers |
| 00:24.23 | tene | findlay_work: you don't have Options +Indexes set |
| 00:24.29 | xbmodder | mrpull-, yeah |
| 00:24.46 | mrpull- | what datacenter doesn't have plumbing? what the hell are you talking about? |
| 00:25.05 | emcnabb | findlay_work: what distro? |
| 00:25.15 | xbmodder | a datacenter without plumbing... |
| 00:25.21 | findlay_work | emcnabb: FC4 |
| 00:25.28 | emcnabb | it could be SELinux |
| 00:25.36 | emcnabb | run sestatus |
| 00:25.48 | emcnabb | there is a bool that deals with home dirs |
| 00:25.59 | findlay_work | httpd_enable_homedirs active |
| 00:26.05 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@hfugal.NMSU.Edu) |
| 00:26.32 | emcnabb | togglesebool to turn it off |
| 00:26.54 | tene | I really think that he needs an Options +Indexes |
| 00:26.57 | emcnabb | (or use setsebool) |
| 00:27.12 | emcnabb | tene: yeah |
| 00:27.20 | emcnabb | nevermind, it's active |
| 00:27.24 | emcnabb | I'm out of it |
| 00:27.46 | findlay_work | tene: where? in /home/*/public_html? |
| 00:27.55 | tene | sure |
| 00:28.01 | tene | or even a .htaccess file |
| 00:28.32 | findlay_work | still forbidden |
| 00:28.48 | jsmith | findlay_work: Do the apache logs give you any indication of why it's throwing a 403? |
| 00:28.52 | tene | look at your errorlog |
| 00:29.14 | findlay_work | [Mon Feb 06 17:28:26 2006] [error] [client 127.0.0.1] (13)Permission denied: access to /~justin/index.html denied |
| 00:29.20 | findlay_work | that's it |
| 00:29.38 | mrpull- | perms? |
| 00:29.41 | mrpull- | :-) |
| 00:29.49 | findlay_work | mrpull-: it's all 777 |
| 00:29.58 | tensai | what about directories leading up to it? |
| 00:30.19 | tensai | /home, /home/justin, /home/justin/public_html |
| 00:30.42 | findlay_work | what perms should they be? |
| 00:30.51 | tensai | o+rx |
| 00:32.09 | *** join/#utah Carrus85 (n=Carrus85@host-38.pl107867-3.fiber.net) |
| 00:32.14 | tene | checked perms on index.html? |
| 00:32.32 | findlay_work | index.html is 777 |
| 00:32.46 | findlay_work | /home/ and /home/justin are 755 |
| 00:33.07 | mheath | Blockbusters completely stopped renting VHS tapes :( |
| 00:33.23 | tensai | impressive. it was bound to happen I suppose. |
| 00:33.55 | xbmodder | cool |
| 00:33.59 | emcnabb | fine with me |
| 00:34.02 | mheath | Its sad |
| 00:34.09 | mheath | I'm the last generation of VHS users |
| 00:34.21 | tensai | my son broke our vcr last year and I doubt we'll replace it |
| 00:34.25 | mheath | I can see my kids looking at my VHS tapes like kids look at records now |
| 00:34.51 | mheath | "Whats that?". "OH, it has some of my favorite music on it..." "But it's so *oldfashioned*" |
| 00:34.56 | findlay_work | records and VHS are more reliable mediums than CD/DVD |
| 00:35.15 | mheath | if you take care of them. |
| 00:35.25 | findlay_work | because CD/DVD uses organic material that decays |
| 00:35.31 | mheath | Its easier to abuse a record than it is to abuse a CD (though both are pretty easy) |
| 00:35.50 | mheath | You put the needle down wrong, and you've ruined your record. |
| 00:36.02 | tensai | records and vhs are deteriorated by the act of using them. cd/dvd can at least be moved to a new medium with zero loss in quality. |
| 00:36.29 | maquis | tensai: although, these days, it's unfortunately not fully legal... |
| 00:36.35 | findlay_work | tene: yeah, but you can't put CDs in a vault for 100 years and expect them to be usable |
| 00:36.48 | findlay_work | tensai, I meant |
| 00:37.05 | maquis | see! i'm not the only one that does that! |
| 00:37.23 | tene | ?? |
| 00:37.43 | Bradipo | findlay_work: I don't think I would expect VHS to be usable after 100 years either. |
| 00:37.46 | mheath | Westinghouse is being sold to *Toshiba*?! |
| 00:37.49 | tensai | findlay_work: are records like wine now? you're right, but what's the point in that? |
| 00:38.01 | tene | what do you do, maquis? |
| 00:38.05 | mheath | "Westinghouse - famous for making blenders and LCD televisions, but principally in the business of building nuclear reactors" |
| 00:38.18 | mheath | Have these people only been alive for 10 years? |
| 00:38.22 | findlay_work | tensai: because otherwise, digital media has no passive archival possibilities |
| 00:38.55 | tensai | findlay_work: like Linus said, publish your files and let the whole world mirror them :) |
| 00:39.00 | mheath | Westinghouse, competition against Edison......He failed at that, but his company went on to make home appliances, electronics, etc |
| 00:39.40 | mheath | Theres a gas powered Westinghouse refrigerator up in our cabin in Colorado. Westinghouse appliances and electronics used to be common |
| 00:39.53 | findlay_work | tensai: doesn't necessarily work for stuff only libraries are willing to/can archive |
| 00:39.59 | mheath | Go to Telluride, Colorado |
| 00:40.00 | jsmith | Westinghouse make some sweet LCD screens now, FWIW... |
| 00:40.06 | jsmith | s/make/makes/ |
| 00:40.15 | mheath | Theres a powerplant there, on the top of a waterfall |
| 00:41.13 | mheath | DC power :) |
| 00:41.14 | tensai | findlay_work: wouldn't mag tape be an appropriate medium then? my DLT tapes are guaranteed to last 40 years. |
| 00:41.14 | mheath | That was owned by westinghouse |
| 00:41.14 | findlay_work | tensai: the're better than optical discs |
| 00:42.29 | mheath | Trying to compete with Edison's AC |
| 00:42.42 | mheath | First largescale powerplant in the united states |
| 00:43.07 | mheath | It still powers portions of Telluride, Colorado today |
| 00:43.39 | mheath | Westinghouse is deeply rooted in modern electricity, appliances, and electronics. Its stupid and shallow for them to say they make "blenders, LCDs, and nuclear reactors". |
| 00:44.28 | tensai | wait, edison was vehemently behind DC. used to run around electrocuting animals to "prove" how dangerous AC was. |
| 00:45.11 | mheath | Erm, my mistake. AC. |
| 00:46.01 | findlay_work | plasma tv's decay too, same idea |
| 00:47.16 | mheath | Wow |
| 00:47.22 | xbmodder | woW |
| 00:47.29 | findlay_work | wOw |
| 00:47.35 | mheath | I found a website that still tries the "right click disable" thing to "protect their rights" |
| 00:48.59 | xbmodder | URL? |
| 00:49.59 | Bradipo | mheath: I see them all the time. |
| 00:50.16 | Bradipo | Makes browsing those sites less than pleasing. |
| 00:50.53 | mheath | "In 1892, George Westinghouse, L.L. Nunn, and Nikola Tesla built the world's first alternating current (AC) power plant here. Telluride was the first town on earth to have electric street lamps, earning it the name "City of Lights." The electical power was an enormous boost to the region's mining profitability and success." |
| 00:51.16 | mheath | Even today, theres remains of powerlines going from the power plant to nearby mines. |
| 00:51.34 | mheath | They were extremely successful at mining, being that they were the only ones in the world who could light their mine shafts well :) |
| 01:03.58 | maquis | http://hacks.mit.edu/Hacks/by_year/1998/talking_elevator/ <-- i want one! |
| 01:04.14 | tene | steal it! |
| 01:05.06 | jsmith | maquis: Wouldn't be that hard... |
| 01:05.15 | jsmith | maquis: A furby or two and a soldering iron... |
| 01:05.22 | maquis | :) |
| 01:12.20 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 01:12.56 | elg | ibot, onjoin -elg |
| 01:12.56 | ibot | ok, elg |
| 01:17.39 | findlay | ibot: that means you get to stay |
| 01:25.10 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wps@65.73.113.199) |
| 01:36.55 | tene | http://teddyb.org/~rlpowell/media/regular/britney_wumpscut.jpg |
| 01:36.58 | tene | >.> |
| 01:37.35 | *** join/#utah SpecialZ (n=Sco--@128.187.144.176) |
| 01:40.42 | maquis | tene: ????? |
| 01:40.48 | maquis | how'd you get that? |
| 01:41.43 | tene | I didn't, actually. It was shown to one of my friends. He *has* actually purchased wumpscut. On some of its pages it claims that he has purchased Britney, but not on others. |
| 01:41.52 | maquis | wow |
| 01:42.12 | maquis | there should be something down at the bottom of the page to report an error.... |
| 01:42.13 | maquis | :) |
| 01:42.45 | tene | Heh. |
| 01:58.32 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_lappy (i=nobody@xbmodder.us) |
| 02:01.34 | *** join/#utah Leilas (n=1802511e@yossman.net) |
| 02:05.33 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@d53-64-13-210.nap.wideopenwest.com) |
| 02:24.00 | xbmodder_lappy | ~logs |
| 02:24.01 | ibot | apt/ibot/jbot/purl all log to http://ibot.rikers.org/<channelname>/ where channelname is html encoded ie: %23debian | lines that start with a space are not shown | some channels have stats at http://ibot.rikers.org/stats/<channelname>.html.gz, or updated "nightly" |
| 02:28.27 | emcnabb | is anyone here an Active Directory admin? |
| 02:28.55 | xbmodder_lappy | Does anyone here know how to strip an HTML document of tags? |
| 02:29.11 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-24-10-236-93.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 02:29.33 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: remove everyting between the <>? |
| 02:29.33 | xbmodder_lappy | ah, crap |
| 02:30.10 | xbmodder_lappy | why are people are many think-headed idiots (me included)? |
| 02:31.16 | nick125 | think-headed? |
| 02:31.35 | nick125 | i need my palm charger |
| 02:31.47 | xbmodder_lappy | mheath, hello, are you there? |
| 02:32.09 | xbmodder_lappy | is ibot's logger screwed? |
| 02:32.41 | xbmodder_lappy | anyone here have logs of this channel for december, janurary, and feburary |
| 02:33.56 | xbmodder_lappy | erh |
| 02:35.53 | xbmodder_lappy | Do you think this is valid enough for a very strange coincidence |
| 02:36.46 | xbmodder_lappy | leilas and mheath live in the same town, leilas' brother's e-mail address is the same as mheath's girlfriend's brother's e-mail address |
| 02:36.52 | xbmodder_lappy | umm lets see what else |
| 02:37.04 | xbmodder_lappy | leilas and mheath's girlfriend are the same person.. |
| 02:37.56 | xbmodder_lappy | same age |
| 02:38.00 | xbmodder_lappy | both have fathers |
| 02:38.25 | xbmodder_lappy | both moving to bay area during the summer |
| 02:38.27 | xbmodder_lappy | umm.. |
| 02:38.42 | xbmodder_lappy | why do I have a feeling that I am being +i-ed |
| 02:39.01 | xbmodder_lappy | +qed |
| 02:40.15 | tensai | emcnabb: much more so than I want to be, although I don't really know that much about AD |
| 02:42.39 | xbmodder_lappy | ok.. |
| 02:43.09 | xbmodder_lappy | mheath, why do you hate me? |
| 02:43.23 | emcnabb | tensai: I was just curious about what your opinion is about AD vs OpenLDAP (performance, scalability, ease of use, etc) |
| 02:43.33 | emcnabb | if you've used OpenLDAP that is |
| 02:44.48 | tensai | we use openldap quite a bit. we have 7 of them, in fact. they seem to work really well for us. |
| 02:45.34 | tensai | we use phpldapadmin for administration and it's a beauty. course, that would be usable with AD was well I guess. |
| 02:45.45 | emcnabb | I wish I knew more about AD; I hear a lot of AD administrators rave about it |
| 02:45.56 | tensai | our AD is just a single box for our win2k domains. we don't use it for anything more serious. |
| 02:46.06 | tensai | frankly we're pretty biased :) |
| 02:46.13 | emcnabb | phpldapadmin is really the best tool out there from what I can see |
| 02:46.24 | emcnabb | and it was made by a local :-) |
| 02:46.27 | tensai | I whole-heartedly swear by it |
| 02:46.33 | emcnabb | in fact, I was the second person to ever use it :-) |
| 02:46.49 | tensai | was it davedap back then? |
| 02:46.51 | emcnabb | tensai: thanks for the info |
| 02:47.16 | emcnabb | what type of data do you store in OpenLDAP? |
| 02:47.22 | tensai | openldap is a pain to write any sort of complicated ACLs |
| 02:47.30 | emcnabb | tensai: true |
| 02:47.38 | tensai | email, radius, and pam configs |
| 02:48.15 | tensai | the slaves work so wonderfully. they never cause a problem. |
| 02:48.48 | tensai | we've found problems if the master doesn't shut down properly. it seems to corrupt the database, which obviously isn't good. |
| 02:48.54 | emcnabb | we had good luck overall w/ our OpenLDAP servers in the CS dept |
| 02:49.02 | tensai | it's easy to restore from the slaves, though |
| 02:49.27 | tensai | master doesn't shut down properly == power outage, etc. |
| 02:49.27 | emcnabb | I guess I just wonder about the validity of what Windows admins claimj |
| 02:49.31 | emcnabb | claim |
| 02:49.38 | tensai | yeah, I really can't say |
| 02:49.59 | emcnabb | but you know, when it comes down to it, AD is over most Windows admins heads |
| 02:53.07 | tensai | mcse == minesweeper champion, solitaire expert |
| 02:56.00 | emcnabb | haha |
| 02:56.02 | emcnabb | nice |
| 03:10.52 | nick125 | lol |
| 03:11.04 | nick125 | i could get a MCSE then ^_^ |
| 03:12.23 | nick125 | gah i suck at HTML |
| 03:12.51 | maquis | nick125: whatcha tryin to do? |
| 03:14.14 | nick125 | maquis: make a LCD frame (the standard 8) using tables in HTML |
| 03:15.12 | nick125 | then i can just change the colors of each little table object to make different numbers |
| 03:16.18 | nick125 | this might not be as easy as i originally thought |
| 03:19.49 | amcnabb | tensai, use syncrepl, not slurpd. |
| 03:19.54 | amcnabb | Openldap is much better that way. |
| 03:20.23 | tensai | amcnabb: I've heard hints to that regard. what specifically is better? |
| 03:20.55 | amcnabb | The problems you are talking about. |
| 03:21.17 | amcnabb | The slaves never fall behind the master. |
| 03:22.04 | tensai | perhaps you misunderstood. our slaves are replicating fine. |
| 03:22.33 | amcnabb | We always had stuff where the slaves would lose updates, especially if something happened to the master. |
| 03:22.37 | tensai | if the master crashes it will corrupt its own local database. sometimes a db_restore will help, sometimes not |
| 03:23.15 | amcnabb | I'm not a big BDB fan, but unfortunately, there's not anything better yet. |
| 03:25.28 | tensai | I set options for more frequent checkpoints. I think that should help with the db_restore. |
| 03:26.10 | tensai | I could easily be convinced to switch from bdb if something better came along |
| 03:26.14 | *** part/#utah fungus (n=fungus@2001:470:1f00:645:20a:95ff:fec5:636a) |
| 03:28.46 | amcnabb | For the record, LDBM is worse, if that's possible. |
| 03:30.05 | nick125 | mm..any ideas on how to set the height of a cell in a table? |
| 03:34.53 | nick125 | yay figured it out |
| 03:47.09 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=misterpu@xmjake.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 03:50.03 | *** join/#utah ScytheBlade1 (n=kyle@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 03:51.30 | xbmodder_lappy | hey mrpull |
| 03:51.31 | xbmodder_lappy | hey scottj |
| 03:51.34 | xbmodder_lappy | hey ScytheBlade1 |
| 03:51.50 | mrpull | xbmodder_lappy: hey. what's up? |
| 03:53.56 | ScytheBlade1 | heh |
| 03:54.02 | ScytheBlade1 | We have mrpull, mrpull-x, and mrpull- |
| 03:54.40 | xbmodder_lappy | cool |
| 03:55.00 | maquis | mrpull-x must be a special thread just to hear things from xbmodder_lappy and xbmodder |
| 03:55.29 | maquis | mrpull- is taking a nap at the moment |
| 03:55.34 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah |
| 03:55.48 | mrpull | heh... i'm lazy and use multiple nicks |
| 03:56.04 | mrpull | -x is a screen session, mrpull is home, mrpull- is at work |
| 03:56.05 | brac | alright |
| 03:56.21 | mrpull | brac -x is not what I just said |
| 03:56.22 | brac | done |
| 03:56.26 | maquis | -x |
| 03:56.36 | mrpull | -x |
| 03:56.53 | maquis | -x? |
| 03:56.53 | brac | x is a screen session, mrpull is home, mrpull- is at work |
| 03:57.05 | mrpull | oh boy |
| 03:57.09 | mrpull | what have we dont |
| 03:57.27 | *** part/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@d53-64-13-210.nap.wideopenwest.com) |
| 03:57.30 | mrpull | s/don't/done |
| 03:57.31 | maquis | ~onjoin mrpull -x? |
| 03:57.31 | ibot | maquis: ok |
| 04:00.14 | nick125 | lol |
| 04:00.45 | mrpull | maquis: what should it do? nothing? |
| 04:02.18 | maquis | mrpull: if you leave and then join again, ibot should tell brac to explain everything to us |
| 04:02.44 | mrpull | ahhh... now I see the space |
| 04:02.57 | mrpull | oh boy. i've got some chatting to do with brac. silly bots. |
| 04:03.17 | xbmodder_lappy | -hi |
| 04:03.18 | brac | yo xbmodder_lappy! |
| 04:03.21 | xbmodder_lappy | -sup |
| 04:03.21 | brac | hey xbmodder_lappy :) |
| 04:03.27 | maquis | mrpull: you want to test it? |
| 04:04.00 | *** part/#utah mrpull-x (i=xmjake@xmission.xmission.com) |
| 04:04.04 | *** join/#utah mrpull-x (i=xmjake@xmission.xmission.com) |
| 04:04.05 | nick125 | gah this stinks now my LCD has huge borders :( |
| 04:04.27 | mrpull | oh whoops |
| 04:04.29 | *** part/#utah mrpull (n=misterpu@xmjake.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 04:04.36 | *** join/#utah mrpull (n=misterpu@xmjake.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 04:04.36 | brac | x is a screen session, mrpull is home, mrpull- is at work |
| 04:04.48 | xbmodder_lappy | -delete |
| 04:04.50 | xbmodder_lappy | -delete x |
| 04:04.53 | mrpull | ~onjoin mrpull |
| 04:04.53 | ibot | onjoin for mrpull set by maquis on Mon Feb 6 20:57:31 2006: -x? |
| 04:04.54 | xbmodder_lappy | -del x |
| 04:04.57 | xbmodder_lappy | -x |
| 04:05.03 | xbmodder_lappy | yay |
| 04:05.06 | xbmodder_lappy | :-D |
| 04:05.06 | nick125 | -del xbmodder_lappy |
| 04:05.10 | maquis | -x? |
| 04:05.11 | brac | x is a screen session, mrpull is home, mrpull- is at work |
| 04:05.12 | nick125 | -x? |
| 04:05.12 | brac | x is a screen session, mrpull is home, mrpull- is at work |
| 04:05.13 | xbmodder_lappy | ~xbmodder |
| 04:05.15 | ibot | hmm... xbmodder is a moose. |
| 04:05.25 | xbmodder_lappy | ~xbmodder |
| 04:05.26 | ibot | methinks xbmodder is a moose. |
| 04:05.27 | nick125 | -xbmodder |
| 04:05.38 | xbmodder_lappy | who played with me... |
| 04:05.39 | maquis | -maquis? |
| 04:05.40 | brac | maquis is the touch of death |
| 04:05.46 | nick125 | -nick125 |
| 04:05.50 | nick125 | ~nick125 |
| 04:05.51 | ibot | you are probably lame |
| 04:05.52 | nick125 | :p |
| 04:05.55 | nick125 | LOL |
| 04:06.17 | *** join/#utah ScytheBl1de1 (n=kyle@c-67-186-244-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:06.40 | nick125 | ScytheBl1de1: you missed me taking ibot, tieing him up and throwing him in a closet |
| 04:06.47 | *** join/#utah Hhhhh (n=Hhhhhhhh@158.91.201.220) |
| 04:06.51 | xbmodder_lappy | Hhhhh, sup |
| 04:06.55 | nick125 | i think i threw ibot into xbmodder_lappy's closet :D |
| 04:07.23 | nick125 | ~you |
| 04:07.24 | ibot | i'm a broken bot |
| 04:07.24 | Hhhhh | hi, namuch |
| 04:07.31 | xbmodder_lappy | ~ibot |
| 04:07.32 | ibot | somebody said ibot was a blootbot written in perl run by TimRiker on his server. logs on http://ibot.rikers.org/<chan>/ , ibot, jbot, apt are all the same process. It uses sqlite, but mysql or other SQL storage is also supported. |
| 04:07.39 | xbmodder_lappy | umm |
| 04:07.41 | xbmodder_lappy | ~gender |
| 04:07.42 | ibot | I'm lesbian |
| 04:07.46 | nick125 | nice |
| 04:07.46 | xbmodder_lappy | :-) |
| 04:07.56 | nick125 | that should be lbot then heh |
| 04:07.57 | maquis | ~gender |
| 04:07.59 | ibot | I'm not sure |
| 04:08.09 | nick125 | ~gender |
| 04:08.10 | ibot | I'm female |
| 04:08.19 | nick125 | wewt female bot... |
| 04:08.21 | xbmodder_lappy | :-) |
| 04:08.23 | maquis | ~gender |
| 04:08.25 | ibot | I'm pregnant |
| 04:08.29 | xbmodder_lappy | I think ibot likes nick125 |
| 04:08.39 | maquis | ~gender |
| 04:08.41 | ibot | I'm female |
| 04:08.47 | nick125 | :D |
| 04:08.53 | maquis | gotta wait a few seconds |
| 04:08.55 | herlo | ~gender |
| 04:08.57 | ibot | I'm female |
| 04:09.23 | maquis | i think timriker must've removed a couple of the options there |
| 04:09.26 | nick125 | .:21:08:34:. <ibot> Someone already said that 3 seconds ago |
| 04:09.26 | nick125 | .:21:08:44:. nick125 so? |
| 04:09.27 | maquis | ~gender |
| 04:09.29 | ibot | I'm gay |
| 04:09.33 | nick125 | .:21:09:04:. <ibot> so what? |
| 04:09.43 | herlo | ~gender |
| 04:09.44 | ibot | I'm not sure |
| 04:09.54 | xbmodder_lappy | ~gender |
| 04:09.56 | ibot | I'm sexless |
| 04:09.56 | herlo | me either |
| 04:10.08 | maquis | ~gender |
| 04:10.10 | ibot | I'm sexless |
| 04:10.12 | herlo | hermy? |
| 04:10.15 | nick125 | who the hell let ibot out of the closet? |
| 04:10.24 | herlo | lol |
| 04:10.30 | xbmodder_lappy | where else is ibot? |
| 04:10.30 | maquis | ~gender |
| 04:10.31 | ibot | I'm hermaphroditic |
| 04:10.32 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, me |
| 04:10.40 | maquis | herlo: you guessed it |
| 04:10.44 | herlo | sweet |
| 04:10.45 | herlo | !!! |
| 04:10.51 | goozbach | ok so that was fun |
| 04:10.57 | xbmodder_lappy | lol |
| 04:11.01 | herlo | ~lart goozbach |
| 04:11.18 | goozbach | ~cyberhack herlo |
| 04:11.25 | goozbach | ~punk herlo |
| 04:11.26 | ibot | ACTION kicks herlo in the shins |
| 04:11.29 | xbmodder_lappy | ~lart nick125 |
| 04:11.32 | herlo | ~cook goozbach |
| 04:11.33 | ibot | ACTION throws goozbach in a big pan with veggies inside and cooks goozbach on 350 for an hour |
| 04:11.45 | xbmodder_lappy | ~kill nick125 |
| 04:11.46 | ibot | ACTION shoots a ionized fluxneutrino gun at nick125 |
| 04:11.46 | nick125 | ~fry xbmodder_lappy |
| 04:11.48 | ibot | ACTION grabs xbmodder_lappy and fries him on his BFCooker9000 |
| 04:11.54 | xbmodder_lappy | ~shoot nick125 |
| 04:11.55 | ibot | ACTION shoots nick125 in the ear with a frozen turkey cannon! |
| 04:11.57 | xbmodder_lappy | ~eat nick125 |
| 04:11.59 | ibot | ACTION eats nick125 and falls over dead |
| 04:12.00 | nick125 | ~murder xbmodder_lappy |
| 04:12.01 | ibot | ACTION shoots xbmodder_lappy in his sleep |
| 04:12.02 | xbmodder_lappy | ~quote |
| 04:12.08 | *** join/#utah ScytheBl1de1 (n=kyle@c-67-186-244-23.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:12.12 | nick125 | ~stab xbmodder_lappy |
| 04:12.13 | ibot | ACTION runs at xbmodder_lappy with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut. |
| 04:12.14 | nick125 | :D |
| 04:12.15 | herlo | about time maquis |
| 04:12.22 | nick125 | maquis: lol |
| 04:12.24 | herlo | your work is never done |
| 04:12.26 | xbmodder_lappy | !maquis, mheath leilas, and something else that I cannot remember |
| 04:12.39 | nick125 | ~beat maquis back to his chair |
| 04:12.40 | ibot | ACTION beats maquis back to his chair with a large stick. |
| 04:12.44 | goozbach | I knew it was worth it to go by FSU |
| 04:12.53 | maquis | herlo: it's never completely done, but i did get plenty of trouble started... |
| 04:12.58 | herlo | goozbach: y? |
| 04:13.06 | nick125 | ~shoot this stupid HTML |
| 04:13.07 | ibot | ACTION shoots this stupid HTML in the head with a spitwad! |
| 04:13.07 | emcnabb | we're being overrun by kiddies! |
| 04:13.09 | herlo | maquis: yes you did |
| 04:13.14 | emcnabb | no more kiddies! |
| 04:13.16 | mheath | O.o |
| 04:13.19 | nick125 | lol |
| 04:13.21 | maquis | emcnabb: sorry... i didn't think it would cause that much trouble |
| 04:13.22 | herlo | maquis: its well worth it.... |
| 04:13.24 | nick125 | this is fun :) |
| 04:13.27 | emcnabb | go to #utahkiddies! |
| 04:13.42 | maquis | nick125: that's my corner... get out! |
| 04:13.54 | nick125 | maquis: no, your corner is on the *other* side of the room |
| 04:14.10 | herlo | nick125: that's my corner!! |
| 04:14.29 | herlo | don't send HIM over here |
| 04:14.29 | mheath | emcnabb: I'll be in a position to possibly die for my country in less than a year. Average people who meet me (off the net) think I'm around 19. IRC is a place for me to mentally relax. |
| 04:14.36 | mheath | I don't consider myself a "kiddie". |
| 04:14.47 | herlo | mheath is a 34 year old mail |
| 04:14.54 | herlo | s/mail/male |
| 04:14.58 | nick125 | mail..lol |
| 04:15.05 | herlo | bad habit |
| 04:15.10 | mheath | USPS held on to me for a very long time. |
| 04:15.23 | herlo | mheath used to run the ACM |
| 04:15.27 | herlo | for uvsc |
| 04:15.27 | emcnabb | mheath: do you talk about anything besides the military? |
| 04:15.34 | emcnabb | we're all excited for you |
| 04:15.35 | goozbach | some cute girls |
| 04:15.39 | nick125 | lol |
| 04:15.42 | herlo | goozbach: sweet |
| 04:15.43 | emcnabb | but don't put me on a guilt trip |
| 04:15.50 | goozbach | we're all going bowling thursday |
| 04:15.52 | emcnabb | I respect what you're doing for my country |
| 04:15.54 | emcnabb | thank you |
| 04:15.59 | xbmodder_lappy | mheath, do you think it is pure coicence that your girlfriend and leilas are 15, moving to bay area in summa, both have fathers, both fathers are the reason of movement, brothers' e-mail addy is the same, live in the same town go out with guys name micheal... |
| 04:15.59 | herlo | goozbach: I am in ohio, nothing good here girlwise |
| 04:16.20 | mheath | xbmodder_lappy: thanks for giving me a reason to put you on ignore again. |
| 04:16.21 | mheath | Bye. |
| 04:16.45 | xbmodder_lappy | ~say Why are you ignoring me? |
| 04:16.47 | ibot | Why are you ignoring me |
| 04:16.57 | herlo | lol |
| 04:17.07 | xbmodder_lappy | Are you just to afraid think of that? |
| 04:17.19 | xbmodder_lappy | ~say Are you just to afraid think of that? |
| 04:17.20 | ibot | Are you just to afraid think of that |
| 04:17.20 | mheath | I hardly ever talk about the military, at least in here. Which is, unfortunately, how I get into so many stupid arguments about GNU software. |
| 04:17.37 | mheath | maquis: indeed. Temp ban for ibot :( |
| 04:17.39 | herlo | GNU...mmm, yummy |
| 04:17.40 | mheath | ibot: sorry |
| 04:17.42 | ibot | ACTION appologizes profusely to everyone, points at the spammers, and says: "IT'S THEIR FAULT, I DIDN'T WANNA DO IT!!!" |
| 04:17.48 | nick125 | LOL |
| 04:18.01 | xbmodder_lappy | ! She thinks you'd tell her if you were on IRC on irc.freenode.net on #utah... |
| 04:18.12 | emcnabb | maquis: haha |
| 04:18.20 | herlo | ~say mheath, you love the USA, admit it!! |
| 04:18.21 | ibot | mheath, you love the USA, admit it!! |
| 04:18.32 | herlo | adios, goozbach |
| 04:19.00 | mheath | I really don't discuss it much. |
| 04:19.01 | emcnabb | goozbach is never truly gone from IRC |
| 04:19.05 | mheath | emcnabb: indeed |
| 04:19.10 | mheath | He's always here in spirit! |
| 04:19.30 | herlo | agreed emcnabb |
| 04:19.43 | herlo | goozbach is never really gone... |
| 04:19.55 | goozbach | even when I'm not paying attention I SEE YOU! |
| 04:20.05 | mheath | Big brother is watching us. |
| 04:20.25 | mheath | *sigh* I'm sad that I have xbmodder_lappy, Uncle_Jesse, and ibot ignored. All because of abuse. |
| 04:20.33 | mheath | Uncle_Jesse and ibot will just be temporary. |
| 04:20.41 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, say: mheath, I know someone who wants to in the milatary, they might like that program your in, can they contact you to ask you about it? |
| 04:20.47 | herlo | AHHH, goozbach is watching!!! |
| 04:20.52 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, mheath: Why don't you just accept it? |
| 04:21.06 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, mheath or at least proove to me that I am wrong? |
| 04:21.20 | xbmodder_lappy | nick125, ... |
| 04:21.23 | xbmodder_lappy | great. |
| 04:21.26 | herlo | bueller? |
| 04:21.36 | mheath | I was wondering that myself :D |
| 04:21.37 | ScytheBl1de1 | Bah |
| 04:21.48 | ScytheBl1de1 | ...success? |
| 04:21.50 | mheath | Wow, I'm officially the worlds biggest procatinator. |
| 04:21.51 | ScytheBl1de1 | Huh? |
| 04:21.55 | ScytheBl1de1 | I didn't type that... |
| 04:22.03 | *** join/#utah mheathIsDumb (i=[sYn5aLl@bolt.sonic.net) |
| 04:22.05 | ScytheBlade1 | Ooookkkkkkaaaaaaaayyyyyyy........ |
| 04:22.06 | mheathIsDumb | hi. |
| 04:22.12 | nick125 | mheath: i think i could take you in that seat though :D |
| 04:22.14 | mheathIsDumb | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:22.19 | mheathIsDumb | mheath or at least proove to me that I am wrong? |
| 04:22.23 | herlo | lololo |
| 04:22.31 | herlo | nice mheathisdumb |
| 04:22.32 | mheathIsDumb | mheath, I know someone who wants to in the milatary, they might like that program your in, can they contact you to ask you about it? |
| 04:22.43 | xbmodder_lappy | this is going to get really boring after a while |
| 04:22.46 | mheath | mheathIsDumb: Please stop spamming me. I'm about to talk to a freenode IRC op, and get that nickname as well as all of yours banned |
| 04:22.50 | xbmodder_lappy | I have to get alotta shell accounts |
| 04:22.57 | herlo | xbmodder_lappy: agreed |
| 04:23.06 | findlay | whatever |
| 04:23.07 | maquis | xbmodder_lappy: if you're ignored, accept it |
| 04:23.10 | mheathIsDumb | why must you cry to someone, solve your own problem |
| 04:23.15 | ScytheBlade1 | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:23.15 | findlay | you guys are boring |
| 04:23.18 | ScytheBlade1 | It's a fun command |
| 04:23.22 | maquis | xbmodder_lappy: otherwise, all your nicks may get kicked |
| 04:23.25 | ScytheBlade1 | It lists staffers |
| 04:23.28 | ScytheBlade1 | And only lilo is on |
| 04:23.30 | xbmodder_lappy | ScytheBlade1, I know |
| 04:23.31 | goozbach | everybody take a break |
| 04:23.38 | *** mode/#utah [+o maquis] by ChanServ |
| 04:23.39 | findlay | *break* |
| 04:23.44 | nick125 | xbmodder_lappy: just leave mheath alone |
| 04:23.44 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: thats local server stats |
| 04:23.45 | *** mode/#utah [+o goozbach] by ChanServ |
| 04:23.49 | ScytheBlade1 | :O @ +o |
| 04:23.49 | emcnabb | I'm out of here |
| 04:23.54 | emcnabb | this is lame |
| 04:23.59 | findlay | (: |
| 04:24.00 | mheath | emcnabb: Indeed. |
| 04:24.01 | maquis | emcnabb: it's going to calm down |
| 04:24.12 | ScytheBlade1 | I missed all of the lead up to that |
| 04:24.15 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: I think I still have you beat as far as procastination |
| 04:24.22 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: oh? |
| 04:24.26 | mheath | I've had, oh, 4 years to do some online classes |
| 04:24.30 | *** mode/#utah [-o maquis] by maquis |
| 04:24.34 | ScytheBlade1 | ... |
| 04:24.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Yeah |
| 04:24.37 | ScytheBlade1 | You win |
| 04:24.38 | mheath | I've put it off until the last 2 months |
| 04:24.52 | mheath | It won't be hard. The classes are easy |
| 04:24.54 | mheath | But still... |
| 04:25.25 | nick125 | i think images would be way easier then doing LCD numbers in pure HTML :/ |
| 04:26.16 | mheath | I'm just glad |
| 04:26.24 | mheath | A few more months, and I'm done with highschool |
| 04:26.34 | mheath | Off pursuing a career I'm interested in |
| 04:27.19 | xbmodder_lappy | and then dead! :-D |
| 04:27.24 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 04:27.25 | xbmodder_lappy | (hopefully) |
| 04:27.26 | ScytheBlade1 | So optimistic |
| 04:27.29 | xbmodder_lappy | Just kidding! |
| 04:27.42 | goozbach | xbmodder_lappy: that's enough |
| 04:27.50 | xbmodder_lappy | goozbach, he cannot see it.. |
| 04:27.54 | *** mode/#utah [+b *!*i=nobody@xbmodder.us] by goozbach |
| 04:28.27 | *** kick/#utah [xbmodder_lappy!n=goozbach@207.108.175.219] by goozbach (and he can't see this either) |
| 04:28.47 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_lappy (i=nobody@unaffiliated/xbmodder) |
| 04:28.49 | herlo | anyone ever heard of a "San Francisco Social"? I guess the concept is that those who travel can meet up in some pre-designated place in an airport while waiting for a flight and socialize...I am looking for leads on how to accomplish this. It would be really a cool networking tool for those of us in the tech industry... |
| 04:28.53 | xbmodder_lappy | ok. |
| 04:29.00 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: O.o "So optimistic"? Yeah, I am. |
| 04:29.03 | xbmodder_lappy | didn |
| 04:29.15 | *** mode/#utah [+b *!*i=nobody@unaffiliated/xbmodder] by goozbach |
| 04:29.18 | mheath | I'm hoping that after these couple months of crunch time, my life will be in equilibrium. For a little bit. |
| 04:29.25 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: at xbmodder there |
| 04:29.30 | mheath | Ah. |
| 04:29.31 | *** mode/#utah [+b *xbmodder*!*@*] by goozbach |
| 04:29.35 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: "and dead" "so optimistic" |
| 04:29.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Yeah |
| 04:29.43 | *** kick/#utah [xbmodder_lappy!n=goozbach@207.108.175.219] by goozbach (goozbach) |
| 04:30.00 | ScytheBlade1 | goozbach: now /nick go0zbach |
| 04:30.03 | ScytheBlade1 | So he can't PM you back ;) |
| 04:30.34 | mheath | Oooh, I like it. Hmmm. |
| 04:30.46 | nick125 | damnit ok screw this im gonna just use images for LCD digits |
| 04:30.47 | mheath | I've been coming up with lots of neat ideas for software for these tablets lately |
| 04:31.04 | nick125 | doing it in pure HTML is way too much hassle |
| 04:31.07 | ScytheBlade1 | (I've had to do that before on other channels. They start conversing with you in PM about why, and you just /nick part way through the PM. Good times.) |
| 04:31.07 | mheath | Ways to make the display entirely controled by the server, but have private data that the servers can't see/touch for example... |
| 04:31.24 | goozbach | ScytheBlade1: I'll handle this |
| 04:31.29 | goozbach | nothing to see here |
| 04:31.32 | goozbach | move along |
| 04:31.34 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 04:31.36 | nick125 | lol |
| 04:31.40 | ScytheBlade1 | sorry, didn't mean it like that |
| 04:31.47 | goozbach | drop it |
| 04:31.56 | ScytheBlade1 | drop... 'it'? Drop what? |
| 04:32.05 | mheath | Each tablet has two public/private key pairs |
| 04:32.12 | goozbach | the little punk and his antics |
| 04:32.23 | goozbach | if you make a deal of it it just gets worse |
| 04:32.24 | mheath | One, only the tablet manufacturer has the public key for, in order to authenticate firmware upgrades |
| 04:32.26 | ScytheBlade1 | (As in, it's dropped. I don't know what you're talking about. :)) |
| 04:32.46 | mheath | The other is distributed to all trusted servers that are storing your private data, files, etc. |
| 04:32.48 | goozbach | the secondary conversation we're currently having |
| 04:33.11 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@cobra.mcnabbs.org) |
| 04:33.18 | ScytheBlade1 | lol, never mind. Consider it dropped. |
| 04:33.24 | mheath | Wow |
| 04:33.37 | mheath | "Turkish Hackers" attacked the OALUG website |
| 04:33.40 | mheath | Heh. |
| 04:34.01 | mheath | Anyway |
| 04:35.40 | mheath | The server gives the tablet a GUI using an XML file that outlines it, and updating the GUI via simple commands (update button1.text "new text for example) and using simple text commands for the client to pass interaction events to the server |
| 04:36.12 | mheath | It will leave certain "holes" in the GUI for private data |
| 04:36.26 | nick125 | how would that be used? any example usage of that? |
| 04:37.12 | goozbach | mheath: xmlrpc for the updates? |
| 04:37.12 | mheath | IE, in the case of a word processing program, the "hole" would be the blank text entry area |
| 04:37.12 | mheath | goozbach: Indeed. Or something similar. I'm still refining the details of that |
| 04:37.27 | nick125 | mheath: how would that be useful though? the users data would be "locked" on the device |
| 04:37.45 | mheath | Its the clients ability to contact its data provider host, which will encrypt the private data using the clients public key |
| 04:37.48 | goozbach | there's probally a little more effecient transport |
| 04:37.59 | mheath | The client decryptes it to varify its integrity |
| 04:38.03 | *** join/#utah levi (n=levi@levi.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 04:38.04 | goozbach | I don't know like X |
| 04:38.06 | goozbach | :) |
| 04:38.18 | goozbach | X is bloated, yes |
| 04:38.31 | mheath | goozbach: MInimal use of bandwidth is an absolute requirement of this |
| 04:38.31 | nick125 | it uses too much b/w too |
| 04:38.32 | goozbach | but xmlrpc is really bloated |
| 04:39.02 | mheath | Keep in mind, you're going to have potentially hundreds of users getting the same GUI update data, via wireless |
| 04:39.17 | goozbach | ohh a one to many update... |
| 04:39.19 | goozbach | I see |
| 04:39.31 | nick125 | plus imagine having to maintain that many X sessions on the server |
| 04:40.02 | goozbach | X over multicast |
| 04:40.10 | goozbach | xineram |
| 04:40.31 | findlay | a? |
| 04:40.32 | mheath | No |
| 04:40.46 | mheath | Because the server is controling the entire GUI of every client |
| 04:40.57 | mheath | Individual components of that GUI will be updated in mass |
| 04:41.11 | mheath | but most will be personalized in some way |
| 04:41.35 | mheath | Think of it as my computer running a web browser |
| 04:41.49 | nick125 | why not have little "GUI" servers that just maintain the UI for the devices, while leaving the main servers for processing stuff |
| 04:41.54 | mheath | I'm controlling the entire look of the program, but the main area is being frequently updated by remote sources. |
| 04:42.11 | mheath | nick125: Too much lag |
| 04:42.20 | nick125 | mheath: it would be less server load though |
| 04:42.31 | mheath | And with my scheme, GUI processing on the servers part is very minimal |
| 04:42.32 | goozbach | I can't believe there hasn't been other try this |
| 04:42.40 | goozbach | but your ideas sound good |
| 04:42.48 | goozbach | I'd still like to see it |
| 04:42.53 | goozbach | it has promise |
| 04:43.19 | ScytheBlade1 | You could always just send specific events to the broadcast address |
| 04:43.19 | mheath | goozbach: Ooh, you haven't even seen my "Metainfo intensive Objects" ideas :) |
| 04:43.45 | mheath | Metainfo included wiht objects that allows you to do limitless things with them, remotely, on a global scale |
| 04:43.51 | mheath | A simple example....... |
| 04:43.59 | mheath | Say you're running a web browser |
| 04:44.32 | mheath | You drag the web browser to an icon that represents your friends computer (or a folder representing a classroom of kids, or whatever) |
| 04:44.45 | mheath | Depending on your settings, a popup will come up |
| 04:45.24 | mheath | Do you want to copy the program? Your view of the program (add an observer)? Or share the program? |
| 04:45.28 | mheath | Say you drag a game |
| 04:45.48 | goozbach | just see it in action |
| 04:45.52 | goozbach | it's a cool idea |
| 04:45.54 | mheath | Would you like to share the view? Or invite the user to share a multiplayer session? |
| 04:46.01 | mheath | Thats what got people |
| 04:46.11 | ScytheBlade1 | Hahahaha |
| 04:46.14 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: ... |
| 04:46.16 | mheath | I did a presentation on this in an entrepreneurship class |
| 04:46.21 | ScytheBlade1 | You've created true multiplayer notepad :) |
| 04:46.29 | mheath | Its a product of a business I plan to start |
| 04:46.46 | mheath | A lot of people thought "Boring. Theres these geeky kid talking about objects and stuff" |
| 04:46.55 | mrpull | mheath: shouldn't you keep your secret sauce... um secret? |
| 04:47.17 | mheath | But most of them were, also, left thinking: *Hey!* This is Cool! Imagine just being able to drag a game to my friends computer, to share play it..... |
| 04:47.33 | findlay | nah, because everybody knows only findlay has the true secret sauce |
| 04:48.06 | herlo | mheath: you are going to have a hell of a time convincing anyone who wants to make a profit on it to do something like this without some sort of licensing for each version... |
| 04:48.16 | herlo | I like the idea though, its cool |
| 04:48.30 | mheath | Everything on your system is modular, an object. Shareable and manipulatible on a global scale. |
| 04:48.42 | *** mode/#utah [-b *xbmodder*!*@*] by goozbach |
| 04:49.05 | *** mode/#utah [-b *!*i=nobody@unaffiliated/xbmodder] by goozbach |
| 04:49.12 | *** mode/#utah [-b *!*i=nobody@xbmodder.us] by goozbach |
| 04:49.13 | mheath | Theres some neat backend concepts I'm working on too, that even make data you've saved on servers accessible in some neat ways |
| 04:49.33 | findlay | what about in un-neat ways? |
| 04:49.45 | mheath | A cleaner, object oriented naming scheme |
| 04:49.55 | mheath | s/scheme/scheme, too/ |
| 04:50.10 | herlo | yeah, that works when you don't have lawyers methinks. Its tough to sell though. I think that as an open source project with open source software, a prototype could be just what you need to show those crappy meatheads that new things work well and make life easier. Its not always about the almighty buck |
| 04:50.13 | ScytheBlade1 | I love that feature the most :P |
| 04:50.33 | mheath | For example, say I had one of these on my dad's internet connection |
| 04:50.44 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_lappy (i=nobody@unaffiliated/xbmodder) |
| 04:50.52 | xbmodder_lappy | sorry mheath |
| 04:51.38 | mheath | net.comcast.slc.fheath.tablet01.programs.browser.instance01.gui |
| 04:51.41 | findlay | you have to give him a hug |
| 04:51.47 | xbmodder_lappy | java |
| 04:51.55 | xbmodder_lappy | ~hug mheath |
| 04:51.57 | ibot | ACTION hugs mheath |
| 04:52.16 | mheath | Thats the full resource locator for the GUI of the first browser running on the tablet |
| 04:52.42 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: just make IPv6 required, and I'll be happy :) |
| 04:52.46 | mheath | It can be collapsed in some obvious ways, and all but the advanced users wouldn't ever need to touch that string |
| 04:53.23 | xbmodder_lappy | what is this exactly? |
| 04:54.29 | mheath | And, in reference to your questions about distributed applications......the licensing issues and such.... |
| 04:54.49 | mheath | Theres lots of websites that are starting to host free, advanced, distributed applications. Look at google. |
| 04:55.11 | ScytheBlade1 | Pfft |
| 04:55.15 | mheath | My product, while maintaing backwards compatability with traditional Linux (and, via WINE, Windows) software products, will, hopefully, encourage a new wave of such products. |
| 04:55.29 | ScytheBlade1 | Just drop $4k on a quad-proc dual core Opteron box with 32GB of RAM |
| 04:55.30 | ScytheBlade1 | ;) |
| 04:56.01 | findlay | mheath: so do you mean to be using ajax? |
| 04:56.46 | xbmodder_lappy | mheath, you have a prototype? |
| 04:56.49 | mheath | findlay: No. My GUIs are distributed over the network using an XML-based GUI description syntax (comparable to Mozilla's Chrome), follwed by updates using a simple text based message system |
| 04:57.28 | findlay | like avalon? |
| 04:58.39 | findlay | XUL then |
| 04:58.51 | ScytheBlade1 | xbmodder_lappy: in his head |
| 04:59.00 | xbmodder_lappy | heh |
| 04:59.09 | levi | mheath: Did you ever look at erights.org? |
| 04:59.45 | findlay | AJAX/XUL |
| 05:00.03 | mheath | findlay: I guess comparable on some levels, but my concept is optomized in some interesting ways for the unique situation its designed to be used in |
| 05:00.36 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_ (n=xbmodder@shell2.sea5.speakeasy.net) |
| 05:00.45 | *** join/#utah xbmodder1 (i=[JOVjc4E@bolt.sonic.net) |
| 05:00.52 | mheath | And, the entire GUI system is object oriented, via an object distribution system that forms the core of the tablets software |
| 05:00.53 | xbmodder_lappy | sea? |
| 05:01.04 | findlay | mheath: but what's the effective difference between running a remote X app and a rich AJAX client off of the same server? |
| 05:01.17 | goozbach | xbmodder do you NEED all those nicks |
| 05:01.34 | findlay | xbmodder: yeah, give me one |
| 05:01.35 | levi | mheath: It's orthogonal to the GUI thing, but has some interesting things to ponder regarding security. |
| 05:01.42 | amcnabb | findlay, are you from Utah? |
| 05:01.43 | goozbach | methinks que no |
| 05:01.57 | findlay | amcnabb: yeah |
| 05:02.01 | amcnabb | which part? |
| 05:02.04 | amcnabb | just curious |
| 05:02.36 | findlay | amcnabb: did I say something invariant to the Utah class of dialects (: |
| 05:02.52 | findlay | West Jordan |
| 05:03.12 | xbmodder_lappy | goozbach, yeah |
| 05:03.16 | xbmodder_lappy | que no?> |
| 05:03.25 | maquis | findlay: my cousins live there |
| 05:03.28 | xbmodder_lappy | 3 things |
| 05:03.28 | goozbach | "I think not" |
| 05:03.51 | findlay | goozbach: if you were Descartes, you'd be dead by now |
| 05:03.52 | mheath | findlay: Mine is a system for defining the initial content of and then updating a GUI system. Individual components (be they single items or containers) are updatable individually, with no entire-GUI-overhead. The entire system is also designed to allow massive updates of individual components of the GUI on thousands of clients efficiently. |
| 05:04.00 | xbmodder_lappy | hmm to ping my speakeasy host its 1.32 seconds ping delay |
| 05:04.08 | xbmodder_ | umm ok |
| 05:04.24 | findlay | mheath: how is that different from ajax? |
| 05:05.26 | xbmodder_ | how is it better than Asyncronous javascript and XML? |
| 05:06.03 | mheath | From java, my server can call, for example: hcp.jeg.updateGroup(AGroupOfClients, "container1", newContainer1Contents) |
| 05:06.13 | mheath | And I have to propegate a single string. |
| 05:06.37 | mheath | For one component of the GUI on thousands of machines to be updated instantly |
| 05:07.27 | mheath | findlay: Why are you trying to draw a comparison? How is an abstracted, network accessible hierarchy of GUI components comparable to javascript manipulation of web browser contents? |
| 05:07.30 | *** join/#utah SpecialK (n=sjk36@fruits.cs.byu.edu) |
| 05:07.31 | ScytheBlade1 | I like levi's earlier question though |
| 05:07.32 | nick125 | any ideas on this stupid HTML LCD digits using a table? |
| 05:07.33 | ScytheBlade1 | Security |
| 05:07.40 | SpecialK | ~lart maquis |
| 05:07.49 | levi | ScytheBlade1: Which earlier question? |
| 05:08.11 | ScytheBlade1 | levi: it wasn't really a question, actually. more of an open-ended statement about how secure it would be. |
| 05:08.13 | mheath | s/javascript/advanced javascript/ |
| 05:08.30 | levi | ScytheBlade1: Well, I asked if he'd looked at erights.org |
| 05:08.54 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: Your individual client is protected in several ways |
| 05:08.58 | mheath | The tablets firmware cannot be tampered with |
| 05:09.07 | ScytheBlade1 | levi: I must have confused you with someone else then. irssi in a 80x25 terminal as I re-install gentoo isn't exactly friendly to my buffer (and I'm too lazy to page up) |
| 05:09.08 | levi | ScytheBlade1: You should look at erights.org, too, if you're interested in distributed systems, secure systems, message-passing concurrency, etc. |
| 05:09.31 | mheath | It is hardcoded to allow updates only from the tablet manufacture, which is authenticated by data encrypted using a public/private key pair which only the tablet manufacturer has the public key of. |
| 05:09.42 | levi | ScytheBlade1: I also said that the erights.org stuff was related to security |
| 05:09.46 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: not quite what I mean. |
| 05:09.51 | mheath | Beyond that |
| 05:10.08 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: as in, could anyone enumerate that net.comcast.slc.blah.blah.tablet01.browser.gui? |
| 05:10.14 | ScytheBlade1 | Who can send messages to what/etc? |
| 05:10.51 | mheath | The security protocol is set by the servers, which are running the bulk of the application processes (and transfering the GUI to the client) |
| 05:11.07 | xbmodder_ | mheath: and the hardware is going to propatary I assume? This technology will only be available on the tablets, and these tables will be useless the day you go out of business? |
| 05:11.10 | mheath | Certain servers could allow the client to set a particular security protocol. |
| 05:11.29 | ScytheBlade1 | All right. From what I recall months ago, this was intended for a school setting, but now you're moving a little larger, so let me give you a question about this |
| 05:11.57 | mheath | It was intended with schools as a primary market, but has always been intended for the market in general too. |
| 05:12.10 | nick125 | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:12.12 | ScytheBlade1 | Little Timmy takes his tablet to school and home, owning it personally. While at school, the teacher has the option to lock his display. While at home, teacher doesn't. |
| 05:12.30 | ScytheBlade1 | How can you make sure that teacher is teacher and not random pissant kid Johnny who's out to mess around? |
| 05:12.45 | mheath | Because of different server contexts |
| 05:13.02 | mheath | When I'm at school, my server/context is net.uen.weber.bhs |
| 05:13.27 | mheath | When I'm at home, my server/context is net.comcast.slc |
| 05:13.32 | ScytheBlade1 | Okay. That's more or less what I'm saying as-is |
| 05:13.42 | mheath | The server sets the security protocol |
| 05:14.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Say Timmy goes to school with Johnny. What's to stop Johnny from swapping with teacher's and going beserk on everyone? |
| 05:14.12 | mheath | Your private data is stored in third-party servers, encrypted in a way that makes it only accessible for the "real you" |
| 05:14.46 | xbmodder_ | ok.. |
| 05:14.49 | xbmodder_ | and bandwidth? |
| 05:14.54 | mheath | password authentication, ScytheBlade1 |
| 05:15.08 | ScytheBlade1 | I just see this core problem |
| 05:15.16 | mheath | Initial login, periodically, and for certain key operations, password authentication is a requirement. |
| 05:15.21 | nick125 | mheath: what would prevent someone from cracking the WiFi connection and sniffing the key |
| 05:15.26 | ScytheBlade1 | At school, teacher has access to Timmy's tablet |
| 05:15.32 | mheath | No. |
| 05:15.43 | ScytheBlade1 | To an extent, though |
| 05:15.54 | mheath | The teacher has the ability to control what is *displayed* on Timmy's tablet |
| 05:16.09 | mheath | The teacher does *not* have the ability to tamper with Timmy's private data, nor to alter the firmware on the tablet. |
| 05:16.20 | mheath | The teacher can control if he's editing or viewing his private data while at school |
| 05:16.25 | mheath | But can not view or alter it |
| 05:16.43 | ScytheBlade1 | I had a flashback of the browser issues a while ago, with a website underneath the active website, popping up JavaScript stuff, pretending to be the active website |
| 05:17.10 | mheath | There is no Windows or processes on the tablet |
| 05:17.30 | mheath | And the firmware is authoritively from the tablets distributor |
| 05:17.54 | mheath | The Tablet is, mostly, a tool for displaying whatever its told to display. |
| 05:18.23 | mheath | There are some added features of encryption/decryption and temporary local storage that allow it to safely and securely access private/protected/personal data |
| 05:18.45 | mheath | But thats it |
| 05:19.14 | amcnabb | emcnabb, did you like that Grieg classical music mp3 I sent you? |
| 05:20.38 | mheath | Its an advanced terminal for displaying GUIs, for the most part. Thats what it boils down to. |
| 05:21.00 | xbmodder_ | Again with the question of: if your company fails these tablets are useless, right? If your service goes down, bandwidth issues, etc.. |
| 05:21.43 | mheath | You can't hack the firmware; you can't access my private data; all you can do is, when I'm by your WAP and have it turned on, make it display what you want it to display. |
| 05:21.55 | mheath | You can abuse me, pretend to be me, or access my personal data. |
| 05:23.18 | mheath | There *is* the ability to autoritively distribute components of some kinds of programs to the tablets, though |
| 05:23.23 | mheath | Say you're playing a 3D game |
| 05:23.48 | mheath | It would be too intensive for the server to run that, and the bandwidth issues would make it unplayable |
| 05:24.25 | mheath | modules of the game can be distributed to your tablet |
| 05:24.37 | levi | Mmm, Grieg. |
| 05:24.46 | ScytheBlade1 | What kind of a processor would these have in them then? |
| 05:24.55 | ScytheBlade1 | I can't see this thing you have envisioned playing UT2k4 |
| 05:25.12 | mheath | No. Definately not. The initial models will not be made for intensive gaming. |
| 05:25.18 | findlay | levi: I've got the complete orchestral music of Grieg |
| 05:25.24 | mheath | ~500mhz embedded procs. |
| 05:25.25 | ScytheBlade1 | Okay, heh, you had me wondering for a while |
| 05:25.39 | levi | findlay: I just have a couple of things. |
| 05:25.47 | mheath | You could do some limited gaming on them, and I'm also just trying to design the system for future scalability. |
| 05:25.56 | findlay | levi: but you're not surprised? |
| 05:26.05 | mheath | They will also form mesh networks, too. |
| 05:26.12 | levi | findlay: That you have the complete orchestral music of Grieg? Not at all. |
| 05:26.17 | findlay | (: |
| 05:26.18 | mheath | Limited capabilities and applications are built into the firmware |
| 05:26.43 | levi | I have the Peer Gynt Suites. |
| 05:26.43 | xbmodder_ | will you try to put out multiple servers, such as selling the school a license for a low price? |
| 05:26.44 | mheath | expandable by upgrade slots specific to these |
| 05:26.51 | ScytheBlade1 | lol I can see it now |
| 05:27.11 | ScytheBlade1 | "Boost your tablet, buy this expansion slot and have +1GHz and +1GB of RAM!" |
| 05:27.16 | xbmodder_ | hehe |
| 05:27.17 | ScytheBlade1 | s/slot/card/ |
| 05:27.29 | amcnabb | I have the complete orchestral works of Tiny Tim. |
| 05:27.38 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: Indeed |
| 05:27.41 | xbmodder_ | Tiny Tim? |
| 05:27.46 | mheath | Keep in mind, a primary market is schools |
| 05:27.51 | mheath | I'm trying to keep upgrade costs down |
| 05:27.55 | amcnabb | xbmodder_, he's awesome. |
| 05:28.28 | mheath | Think about how nice it would be to only pay $50 every *10 years* per student, for all your computer costs. |
| 05:28.43 | ScytheBlade1 | And, as you mentioned a few months back |
| 05:28.45 | mheath | The only other costs would be slightly more frequent server upgrades |
| 05:28.48 | ScytheBlade1 | Books, paper, etc |
| 05:28.52 | mheath | Yep. |
| 05:28.58 | levi | I also have his Holberg Suite. |
| 05:29.32 | mheath | No more books. No more paper. A reduction in your tech support costs. |
| 05:29.49 | mheath | Cheaper computer costs, and *every student* has a computer! |
| 05:29.54 | levi | Heh, "No more paper." |
| 05:30.11 | mheath | levi: Well. A massive reduction in paper. |
| 05:30.21 | mheath | Oh |
| 05:30.27 | mheath | No more projectors for classrooms |
| 05:30.33 | mheath | Just show it on the students tablet |
| 05:30.39 | findlay | levi: http://www.deutschegrammophon.com/catalog/product.htms?PRODUCT_NR=4713002&COMP_ID=GRIED&WIDTH=985&HEIGHT=654&COLORS=&PLAYER=yellow |
| 05:31.10 | mheath | I know in my school alone, that would remove the requirement for at least $30,000 worth of electronics |
| 05:31.34 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: just add IPv6 as default, IPSec, and have the remote storage be PGP/GPG protected |
| 05:31.40 | mheath | It is |
| 05:31.48 | mheath | The PGP protection is a core attribute of your security |
| 05:31.57 | ScytheBlade1 | And the former two? |
| 05:32.03 | ScytheBlade1 | s/two/two points/ |
| 05:32.13 | mheath | It's currently network protocol abstracted. No requirement. |
| 05:32.28 | ScytheBlade1 | Well, make IPv6 and IPSec the requirement ;) |
| 05:32.45 | mheath | IPSec isn't necessary. |
| 05:32.55 | mheath | Again, tampering with the firmware is protected on a hardware level |
| 05:33.06 | ScytheBlade1 | ... data privacy ... |
| 05:33.10 | mheath | And access to your remote storage is protected via strong GPG encryption |
| 05:33.28 | mheath | Meh, I guess it might be helpful |
| 05:33.39 | mheath | Not nearly as helpful as it is on traditional platforms, though |
| 05:33.47 | ScytheBlade1 | No, but still |
| 05:33.53 | mheath | Anyway, enough ranting about my future business ideas. |
| 05:34.00 | ScytheBlade1 | Add IPSec, and business could become a big target |
| 05:34.04 | mheath | Time to catch Jay Leno's headlines, read a bit, and hit the rack. |
| 05:34.52 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: I could offer a product that would literally be unhackable and immune to viruses unless very strong encrpytion is broken. |
| 05:35.13 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: wow... |
| 05:35.29 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: that's not in awe, or disbelief, but another feeling that I just can't quite name |
| 05:35.46 | xbmodder_ | like? |
| 05:35.59 | xbmodder_ | mheath: didn't microsoft say that about the xboxen? |
| 05:36.12 | ScytheBlade1 | Like... wait for the first person to reverse engineer it and see what happens |
| 05:36.18 | mheath | I know a lot of places make claims like "this is unhackable" |
| 05:36.21 | mheath | But think about it |
| 05:36.25 | mheath | Theres nothing running on it |
| 05:36.31 | mheath | Nothing *to* hack |
| 05:36.32 | ScytheBlade1 | erm |
| 05:36.43 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: the protocol. the data streams. |
| 05:36.44 | mheath | Beyond the firmware, and the channels accessing your private data |
| 05:37.03 | mheath | Which are both protected by strong encyption |
| 05:37.18 | ScytheBlade1 | Which, I'd imagine, that you didn't create |
| 05:37.33 | mheath | There might be vulnerabilities beyond that. Someone could easily make your tablet display vulgar letters in big letters for as long as they wanted. As long as your in their network/context. |
| 05:37.39 | ScytheBlade1 | And if you did, no offense, but I'd trust it less as you're not a professional cryptographer (to my knowledge) ;) |
| 05:37.45 | xbmodder_ | mheath: umm.. |
| 05:37.56 | ScytheBlade1 | End result, if just as much as ONE of your things break... there goes it all |
| 05:38.06 | mheath | But no access to your data or longterm damage to the fimware on the tablet unless they can break strong encryption |
| 05:38.16 | xbmodder_ | umm yeah |
| 05:38.29 | ScytheBlade1 | Too bad I don't have a GUI now, I'd pull up an exact quote |
| 05:38.32 | ScytheBlade1 | But I can paraphrase |
| 05:38.33 | maquis | mheath: A) i don't think there's such thing as perfect security, B) if you take hardware-hacking into account (people doing stuff different from what is intended), i think it's definitely hackable... |
| 05:38.43 | xbmodder_ | I wish someone would relay this "If mheath's company goes down, the tablets go with him" |
| 05:38.44 | mheath | maquis: I didn't say it was perfect |
| 05:38.49 | mheath | look at the condition |
| 05:38.52 | maquis | mheath: you said it's unhackable |
| 05:39.07 | mheath | maquis: What is there to hack? |
| 05:39.09 | ScytheBlade1 | As it stands now, it would take 2^3 septillion years to break currently known "military grade encryption" |
| 05:39.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Why is this concerning? |
| 05:39.25 | ScytheBlade1 | Because ten years ago, it was 2^36 septillion years. |
| 05:39.36 | maquis | mheath: it's a tablet that can do something... which means that someone can make it do something different |
| 05:39.49 | mheath | Yes! |
| 05:39.53 | xbmodder_ | ScytheBlade1: but in 10 years we can figure out how to crack it in 2**-3 septillion years |
| 05:39.57 | mheath | If I'm in your context, under your WAP, maquis |
| 05:40.01 | maquis | it has a network connection... which means that someone could take advantage of that... |
| 05:40.05 | mheath | You can make it do anything you want |
| 05:40.13 | mheath | I walk into your house, and my tablet its YOURS TO CONTROL! |
| 05:40.26 | maquis | mheath: what if you do something to your tablet to make it do something else? |
| 05:40.27 | mheath | The thing is, theres nothing to steal. Nothing you can alter. |
| 05:40.46 | mheath | I walk out of your house, and the tablet is exactly like it was before I walked in |
| 05:40.51 | mheath | There is no data stored on the tablet |
| 05:40.53 | maquis | so, while i think that you're seeing whatever i have in my context, and in actuality, you're seeing something different |
| 05:40.54 | mheath | Nothing running on it |
| 05:41.01 | maquis | what if someone changes that? |
| 05:41.04 | maquis | that's a hack, right there |
| 05:41.08 | maquis | just waiting to be done |
| 05:41.14 | mheath | What is? |
| 05:41.26 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: I think maquis's point is this: "you can't change the firmware" <-- mheath "anything can be hacked" <-- maquis |
| 05:41.27 | *** join/#utah grrr (n=xbmodder@tor/session/x-eca1d2e79c94186c) |
| 05:41.34 | maquis | yeah |
| 05:41.40 | mheath | You missed my discussion on how the firmware is upgraded |
| 05:41.46 | ScytheBlade1 | Doesn't matter |
| 05:41.59 | ScytheBlade1 | Some guy with a screwdriver, soldering iron, and too much spare time. |
| 05:42.02 | maquis | yes... i did... but i still think that anything can be hacked to do something different |
| 05:42.16 | maquis | and i think that anything with a network connection can be hacked the other way... |
| 05:42.16 | mheath | It is *hardcoded* to only accept firmware upgrades encrypted using a public key individual to the tablet. |
| 05:42.29 | maquis | open it up and chnage the hardcoding |
| 05:42.34 | ScytheBlade1 | one of the more "recent" xbox mods |
| 05:42.45 | ScytheBlade1 | Involve re-writing that which was said to be unchangable |
| 05:42.48 | mheath | maquis: You've created something else, though |
| 05:42.58 | maquis | mheath: that doesn't change the fact that i've hacked it |
| 05:43.07 | mheath | The minute you walk into a legitimate network with fake firmware, you raise security flags and are locked out. |
| 05:43.09 | maquis | and i can now use it in class to play games instead of listening to the teacher |
| 05:43.21 | mheath | maquis: Yeah |
| 05:43.25 | maquis | what if i hack it so that it sends the same signature that the good firmware did |
| 05:43.28 | mheath | Except the teacher can see that you're not paying attention |
| 05:43.29 | maquis | but it does other stuff |
| 05:43.43 | mheath | Because the software will report that you're not connected to the network (as it locks out bad firmware) |
| 05:43.53 | mheath | And, yes, you can mess around....But, yes, you also have an F. |
| 05:44.16 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: so? buy two tables. |
| 05:44.18 | maquis | mheath: i still think there's ways around it... |
| 05:44.24 | ScytheBlade1 | Reverse engineer one. |
| 05:44.52 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: Thats the same thing as bringing a gameboy into class. |
| 05:44.56 | ScytheBlade1 | *tablets |
| 05:44.59 | mheath | You're not accomplishing anything. |
| 05:45.03 | ScytheBlade1 | No, you are |
| 05:45.08 | maquis | reengineer it so that it sends the same signals that the original did, but does something different |
| 05:45.22 | ScytheBlade1 | Because once you've got the one down to a science, you can fix the one you bring to school, to be accepted |
| 05:45.31 | ScytheBlade1 | exactly what maquis said |
| 05:45.45 | mheath | maquis: What happens when the server sends you a random hash and asks you to checksum your tablets currenty memory with it? |
| 05:46.00 | maquis | then you send back whatever itwants to see |
| 05:46.04 | mheath | No |
| 05:46.08 | mheath | Read what I said |
| 05:46.10 | mheath | Its current *memory* |
| 05:46.20 | mheath | If you alter the firmware, the checksum of the memory will be different |
| 05:46.31 | ScytheBlade1 | So you *send back what it wants to see* |
| 05:46.44 | ScytheBlade1 | Keep an image of the original firmware around |
| 05:46.44 | ScytheBlade1 | Tada |
| 05:47.11 | ScytheBlade1 | Amazingly hard, difficult, time consuming to change anything in it? |
| 05:47.16 | ScytheBlade1 | Sure, I'll give you that in a heartbeat |
| 05:47.27 | maquis | i don't think it's perfect, though |
| 05:47.31 | ScytheBlade1 | But... again, someone in a garage with a screwdriver, soldering iron, and too much time.. |
| 05:47.40 | mheath | You'd have to be running a perfect emulation of the actual tablet |
| 05:47.45 | mheath | Listening to everything it says |
| 05:47.49 | maquis | and the closer you get to getting everybody fixed, the more and more complex your system will be, which will open other holes |
| 05:48.05 | mheath | and having no network connectivity and almost no useful RAM |
| 05:48.10 | ScytheBlade1 | 'Tablet in a tablet' |
| 05:48.15 | mheath | Keep in mind the early models only have 32MB of RAM. |
| 05:48.24 | mheath | Most of which will be needed for the firware itself |
| 05:48.25 | maquis | mheath: it would have to have some sort of network connectivity |
| 05:48.29 | maquis | and it's possible to add RAM |
| 05:48.49 | *** join/#utah jnbek (n=jnbek@c-67-166-97-223.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 05:49.05 | ScytheBlade1 | This may be due to my lack of knowledge concerning the subject, but I've always thought it funny when people say they built a program that no one can reverse engineer |
| 05:49.19 | ScytheBlade1 | "Yes, yes you can... you run the binary, you can watch the ASM... tada" |
| 05:49.20 | mheath | maquis: the network connectivity is controlled by the network context. |
| 05:49.29 | ScytheBlade1 | Some guy with a soldering iron, and too much spare time. |
| 05:49.36 | mheath | Regardless of what firmware you're running, it will only let you run what you could be accessing with the legitimate firmware. |
| 05:49.42 | maquis | doubt it |
| 05:50.24 | findlay | darn |
| 05:50.31 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: And what happens when you hear the ad on TV that says "Time for the first major firmware upgrade of your LiteTablet. This requires a hardwired connection - bring it in to any authorized retailer for a free upgrade" |
| 05:50.35 | findlay | my jury meeting for tomorrow was cancelled |
| 05:50.44 | maquis | jury meeting? |
| 05:50.46 | mheath | And all the sudden, your tablet is worthless on many networks |
| 05:50.48 | findlay | guess who the judge is? |
| 05:50.58 | maquis | ?? |
| 05:51.01 | maquis | findlay: who? |
| 05:51.09 | findlay | maquis: is that your guess? |
| 05:51.14 | maquis | sure |
| 05:51.14 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: look at CD copy protection. look at the xbox, look at WMA, look at the iTunes DRM. |
| 05:51.21 | ScytheBlade1 | They can all release a new version |
| 05:51.27 | findlay | Kimball, same as SCO case |
| 05:51.29 | ScytheBlade1 | And given a month, they'd have to release another |
| 05:51.34 | maquis | findlay: ooh... interesting |
| 05:51.45 | maquis | were you on jury duty? or what? |
| 05:51.54 | findlay | although you can imagine how dissapointed I was that it wasn't the sco case ): |
| 05:52.00 | maquis | :) |
| 05:52.03 | findlay | maquis: still am |
| 05:52.04 | ScytheBlade1 | lol @ findlay |
| 05:52.07 | ScytheBlade1 | Power to you though ;) |
| 05:52.10 | ScytheBlade1 | And it's almost 11:00 |
| 05:52.13 | ScytheBlade1 | I need my sleep |
| 05:52.16 | maquis | yeah... that'd be an interesting case to be on jury duty for |
| 05:52.22 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: What happens, though, when a hardwired firmware upgrade is being done and it detects alterations? |
| 05:52.30 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: buy a new one. |
| 05:52.49 | findlay | maquis: considering that I'm typing this into irssi on fluxbox in gentoo wearing a linux shirt and a red fedora |
| 05:52.54 | ScytheBlade1 | "hardwired firmware upgrade" <-- so it can be changed. |
| 05:52.58 | maquis | "i dropped it" |
| 05:53.18 | maquis | findlay: yup |
| 05:53.19 | maquis | :) |
| 05:53.34 | findlay | SCO? what is that? Is it a cleaner? |
| 05:53.41 | maquis | you should wear linux stuff to jury duty every day... |
| 05:53.46 | maquis | just to make a good point |
| 05:54.00 | ScytheBlade1 | Agreed! |
| 05:54.03 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: How about this, for an idea....... |
| 05:54.31 | mheath | Required hardware firmware upgrades. You need to get a new chip every so often |
| 05:54.42 | ScytheBlade1 | Have fun with that money hole! ;) |
| 05:54.57 | mheath | ScytheBlade1: How much does it cost for a 32MB ROM? :) |
| 05:55.10 | mheath | Flash ROM |
| 05:55.12 | ScytheBlade1 | mheath: times 2300 students for my school alone. |
| 05:55.12 | mheath | recyclable |
| 05:55.13 | findlay | maquis: you're not supposed to wear t-shirts to court |
| 05:55.18 | mheath | "Drop it off here, we'll give you a new one" |
| 05:55.31 | mheath | bbiab |
| 05:55.36 | ScytheBlade1 | heh |
| 05:55.38 | ScytheBlade1 | bb tomorrow ;) |
| 05:55.39 | ScytheBlade1 | night all |
| 05:55.46 | maquis | findlay: yeah... true |
| 05:55.50 | maquis | but it'd be cool |
| 05:55.52 | xbmodder_lappy | bbbf |
| 05:55.58 | xbmodder_lappy | be back by friday! yay! |
| 05:56.02 | maquis | or... just get a linux sign or something |
| 05:56.23 | findlay | maquis: the point is though the counsel for SCO doesn't want *anyone* on the jury who has even heard of groklay |
| 05:56.33 | findlay | considering how weak their claims are |
| 05:56.38 | maquis | yeah.. |
| 05:56.58 | maquis | but you're doing a different case |
| 05:56.59 | jnbek | get a tattoo of Tux :-D |
| 05:57.13 | maquis | so, you just need to make sure that the judge knows about groklaw... |
| 05:57.18 | findlay | on the other hand, IBM's general counsel is actually a bishop in New York somewhere |
| 05:57.39 | findlay | SCO just wants a hometown jury to awe |
| 05:57.44 | findlay | I think |
| 05:58.23 | maquis | see if newsome has any ideas for you... heknows more about court stuff, particularly with the sco case, than i do |
| 05:58.57 | findlay | newsome knows more about the sco case than anyone except PJ herself |
| 06:00.16 | xbmodder_lappy | PJ? |
| 06:04.10 | findlay | PJ! |
| 06:09.14 | findlay | xbmodder_lappy: ever played with X resources? |
| 06:10.21 | xbmodder_lappy | no |
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| 06:20.59 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 06:21.46 | xbmodder_lappy | Does anyone here know of any good VPS providers with unlimited bandwidth? |
| 06:56.11 | levi | Yow, it took 13.2 seconds to delete the spam comments in my mysql db. |
| 06:56.36 | levi | There were nearly 20k of them, all unpublished. |
| 06:56.51 | levi | There are less than 1k legitimate comments left. |
| 06:57.18 | findlay | levi: how did you ever come about 20k spam comments in a mysql db? |
| 06:57.28 | levi | findlay: A blog. |
| 06:57.42 | levi | findlay: Spam comments are the bane of bloggers. |
| 06:58.09 | findlay | oooooh, where is it? The URL, please, so I can get you some of your spam back. (: |
| 06:58.35 | levi | I turned off comments a while ago, since my anti-spam measure was no longer effective. |
| 06:58.55 | findlay | it's not trogdor's rantings on the ideal programming environment is it? |
| 06:59.25 | levi | I had kept the unpublished ones there because there was a bayesian filter that might need to be re-trained, or something. But it was mostly useless. |
| 06:59.36 | levi | http://lifeoflevi.com/drupal/ |
| 06:59.43 | levi | And http://lifeoflevi.com/blog/ |
| 06:59.57 | levi | The latter is my Lisp blog, which is the one that's more active now. |
| 07:00.04 | levi | The former is the one that had 20k spam comments. |
| 07:00.28 | findlay | do you thalk thwith a thlisp? |
| 07:00.40 | levi | I wrote the latter because the former is written in php and I didn't want to mess around with php code. |
| 07:01.47 | levi | And I wanted the experience of writing Common Lisp code. |
| 07:41.16 | dataw0lf | mmm clisp |
| 07:41.39 | levi | Speaking of which, I'm nearly finished with my Markdown implementation. |
| 07:41.47 | findlay | is it like crisp, as in apple crisp? |
| 07:42.04 | dataw0lf | levi: Nice. |
| 07:43.32 | levi | It was a pain. |
| 07:46.32 | findlay | these headphones I have are so good you can hear every cue in |
| 07:46.44 | dataw0lf | levi: I've been wanting to play with Markdown. |
| 07:46.44 | findlay | which is kind of painful |
| 07:48.19 | findlay | speaking of which, I learned a useful command today: ' /sbin/hdparm -E 1 /dev/cdrom' |
| 07:48.29 | dataw0lf | I just implemented a trivial templating system for my own CGI web 'framework', and looked into Markdown for a bit. |
| 07:48.51 | dataw0lf | -E... speed? |
| 07:48.51 | brac | don't ask me |
| 07:49.15 | dataw0lf | heh |
| 07:49.39 | findlay | it spins down the drive, because you don't need to read an audio CD at 56X |
| 07:51.13 | levi | My Markdown implementation is, unfortunately, rather slow. |
| 07:51.23 | findlay | levi: in lisp? |
| 07:51.31 | levi | Yes |
| 07:51.44 | levi | That's not /why/ it's slow. |
| 08:14.38 | levi | Aha. It's slow because of a function that joins a list of strings rather inefficiently. :) |
| 08:16.32 | levi | Gotta love profilers. |
| 08:56.20 | levi | There, now it takes roughly the same amount of time as the perl and python versions do. |
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| 11:31.40 | dataw0lf | man all nighters are not as fun as I previously thought. Oh, wait, I never thought they were fun. |
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| 13:33.59 | maquis | *grumble* |
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| 13:39.43 | elg | ibot, shut up |
| 13:39.44 | ibot | yes, Master elg |
| 13:42.54 | mheath | If he stays there will be trouble |
| 13:42.59 | mheath | If he goes it will be double |
| 13:55.58 | ScytheBlade1 | so should I stay or should I go no |
| 14:01.01 | elg | ibot, onjoin 3lg |
| 14:01.07 | elg | ibot, onoin elg |
| 14:01.19 | elg | ibot, onjoin #utah elg |
| 14:01.29 | elg | ~onjoin |
| 14:01.32 | elg | ~help onjoin |
| 14:02.09 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 14:02.14 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 14:02.19 | elg | stupid bot |
| 14:02.26 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 14:03.26 | SpecialK | ~lart maqiuis |
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| 14:21.33 | lars-ut | If I go there will be trouble |
| 14:21.54 | lars-ut | listauth ScytheBlade1 |
| 14:21.57 | lars-ut | ~listauth ScytheBlade1 |
| 14:21.58 | ibot | factoid author list by 'ScytheBlade1' returned no results. |
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| 14:28.39 | *** join/#utah lars-ut (n=me@70.103.228.158) |
| 14:29.06 | lars-ut | ~snack |
| 14:29.07 | ibot | ACTION snack? yes yeaaas yeaaaaaaaaaaas pleaaase :P |
| 14:29.17 | lars-ut | ~snack |
| 14:29.18 | ibot | ACTION snack? yes yeaaas yeaaaaaaaaaaas pleaaase :P |
| 14:44.11 | maquis | ~botsnack |
| 14:44.11 | ibot | maquis: thanks |
| 14:44.44 | maquis | lars-ut: no point in teasing her... |
| 14:45.11 | lars-ut | ibot, you're useless |
| 14:45.12 | ibot | ACTION starts crying and hides from lars-ut in the darkest corner of the room. :( |
| 14:45.45 | lars-ut | ~botsnack |
| 14:45.45 | ibot | lars-ut: thanks |
| 14:46.18 | lars-ut | with any luck she'll turn out to be a tamagothi hybrid |
| 14:46.22 | maquis | haha |
| 14:46.25 | lars-ut | :) |
| 14:47.02 | maquis | lars-ut: it hasn't gotten posted yet |
| 14:47.18 | lars-ut | k - thx |
| 14:47.22 | maquis | torrie needs to give it to me so i can stick it up someplace |
| 14:48.07 | maquis | something like that |
| 14:48.17 | maquis | we'll post a link on the list when we get it up |
| 14:48.22 | lars-ut | groovy. |
| 14:56.14 | maquis | http://arstechnica.com/journals/microsoft.ars/2006/1/7/2393 |
| 14:56.36 | maquis | ^^ my debate coach from high school was one of the guys on the team that created the sidebar |
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| 14:56.41 | maquis | it was originally called sideshow |
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| 15:00.49 | maquis | internally, m$ was doing some pretty sweet stuff with the sidebar...judging from this article, they weren't showing it all off, so i'm not sure if they're releasing all of it |
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| 15:11.16 | goozbach | tired |
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| 15:19.06 | maquis | goozbach: agreed |
| 15:38.15 | lars-ut | Anybody here used Hamachi? |
| 15:38.16 | lars-ut | http://www.hamachi.cc/ |
| 15:38.17 | brac | [Hamachi : Stay Connected] |
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| 15:41.31 | Jayce^ | spigster |
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| 15:51.58 | spig | hey jayce |
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| 16:10.29 | levi | Oooh, new release of Programming Languages -- Application and Interpretation |
| 16:10.59 | lars-ut | a better bookend? |
| 16:17.58 | levi | It's a book-in-progress that Shriram Krishnamurthi uses to teach his class. The parts of it I've read are very interesting. (Shriram is the guy who did the Swine before PERL talk) |
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| 16:27.34 | goozbach | note to self: / filling up is bad |
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| 16:31.45 | goozbach | cool google talk can save your chat in gmail |
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| 17:21.46 | levi | Heya, elg. |
| 17:22.10 | elg | howdy |
| 17:22.54 | maquis | ~onjoin default -elg |
| 17:22.54 | ibot | ok, maquis |
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| 17:31.14 | jsmith | Oh really... |
| 17:31.50 | lars-ut | I was searching for the word hangover in my board game night messages |
| 17:32.17 | lars-ut | no results. But when I input 'hangovers' - voila! |
| 17:34.34 | lars-ut | 'hangover*' doesn't return 'hangovers' either |
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| 17:56.28 | Uncle_Jesse | hola |
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| 17:58.55 | Uncle_Jesse | mheath: am I still being ignored ;-) |
| 17:59.42 | lukfugl | question: I'm trying to optimize a mysql query and am looking at the explain output. Moving a table around in the join order can switch it from a type=ref/ref=const join to a type=eq_ref/ref=other_table.foreign_key join... which is better? |
| 18:05.36 | jlp_work | lukfugl: try it both ways with an "EXPLAIN ANALYZE" (which should actually execute the query)... compare the timings both ways |
| 18:05.46 | jlp_work | lukfugl: assuming mysql understands EXPLAIN ANALYZE |
| 18:06.29 | lukfugl | jlp_work: good point :) I'm hesitant to compare by experimentation though since I know the unoptimized query takes on the order of 1-2 hours |
| 18:06.47 | lars-ut | http://larsrasmussen.blogspot.com/ |
| 18:06.48 | brac | [Musings from Lars] |
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| 18:12.47 | harleypig | http://www.mtekweaponsystems.com/video/X5.wmv |
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| 18:13.22 | harleypig | face armour takes a .44 magnum from 1 meter |
| 18:13.34 | harleypig | err ... takes a .44 magnum round |
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| 18:28.45 | lars-ut | harleypig: That's amazing. |
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| 18:31.55 | Uncle_Jesse | bet you it hurts when the .44 mag hits you |
| 18:32.32 | lars-ut | not as bad as without the armour |
| 18:33.01 | RyanE | lars-ut: actually probably hurts *less* without the armor. Of course, you're dead, so pain isn't such a bad deal... |
| 18:33.14 | lars-ut | lol |
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| 18:34.11 | harleypig | lars-ut: Yeah, I was pretty amazed by it ... although I don't think the armour stops the force, your head'll still ring. |
| 18:34.21 | harleypig | But at least it won't be spattered all over your buddies. |
| 18:37.24 | Uncle_Jesse | you won't suffer from a shattered skull and brain, but you could still die from a broken neck ;-) |
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| 18:38.31 | lars-ut | I remember firing a .44 magnum that had like a 10 inch barrel - that was wild. |
| 18:39.33 | lars-ut | Then I tried one with a shorter barrel - mucho kick. |
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| 18:59.34 | nick125-treo | mmm |
| 18:59.42 | nick125-treo | hi everyone |
| 19:01.12 | findlay | heh, DIM |
| 19:01.15 | findlay | ~DIM |
| 19:01.17 | ibot | methinks dim is a flathead gravelmonkey with an iq slightly larger than his mums penis |
| 19:01.28 | findlay | ibot: you're retarded |
| 19:01.59 | findlay | ibot: forget dim |
| 19:02.00 | ibot | findlay: i forgot dim |
| 19:02.17 | findlay | ibot: dim is Digital Inconvenience Management |
| 19:02.18 | ibot | findlay: okay |
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| 19:33.20 | sjansen | http://weirdbabe.typepad.com/threadbared/2006/01/_things_never_t.html |
| 19:34.47 | jsmith | sjansen: Good one :-) |
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| 19:50.03 | RyanE | sjansen: that reminds me of a blog my wife reads, "You Knit What?" http://youknitwhat.blogspot.com/ |
| 19:50.04 | brac | [You Knit What??] |
| 19:50.34 | jsmith | Did you guys hear about the Knitting Olympics? |
| 19:50.37 | dataw0lf | good lookin girl on the front page. |
| 19:50.49 | jsmith | They've got more people participating in the Knitting Olympics that the real Olympics. |
| 19:53.20 | jsmith | "Any broadcast, telecast, or discussion of this game, without the express written consent of the NFL, is strictly prohibited"? |
| 19:54.54 | lars-ut-away | yep. |
| 19:55.09 | lars-ut-away | it was pretty close to that. |
| 19:56.23 | lars-ut | seems like a difficult problem to tackle - how do I refer to my discussion of the Super Bowl w/o owing the NFL yet more money? |
| 19:56.50 | lars-ut | oops - I did it again. |
| 20:06.10 | jsmith | Did you watch "the big game"? |
| 20:06.31 | jsmith | I didn't watch any particular football games this last Sunday... |
| 20:06.41 | jsmith | You know, be vague... |
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| 20:42.02 | RyanE | QBFreak: they only charge you in brain cells. |
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| 20:53.35 | fanta204 | hi folks |
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| 21:03.17 | dataw0lf | lars-ut: I'm trying to get over there tonight |
| 21:04.11 | lars-ut | sweet. |
| 21:04.28 | lars-ut | Hope you can make it. |
| 21:05.15 | lars-ut | dataw0lf: It's quite likely we'll be playing Carcasonne btw. |
| 21:06.14 | dataw0lf | word. |
| 21:06.32 | dataw0lf | I pulled an all nighter here at work but I think I should still be ok for some gaming |
| 21:08.51 | jsmith | dataw0lf: Just bring a little caffiene |
| 21:12.02 | lars-ut | A co-worker just sent me a link to those controversial Muhammad cartoons that almost seemed to be censored of late: http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/698 |
| 21:12.28 | lars-ut | Now would be a good time to pipe up with some buzzwords in the channel |
| 21:12.37 | dataw0lf | >_> |
| 21:12.38 | dataw0lf | <_< |
| 21:12.40 | dataw0lf | AJAX! |
| 21:12.43 | lars-ut | lol |
| 21:12.49 | dataw0lf | :-) |
| 21:13.09 | lars-ut | I was thinking more along the lines of... |
| 21:13.09 | lars-ut | centrifuge |
| 21:13.40 | lars-ut | dirty bomb |
| 21:15.49 | jsmith | New Texas? |
| 21:17.49 | dataw0lf | how'd we switch the topic to Iraq? |
| 21:18.00 | dataw0lf | >_< |
| 21:19.31 | lars-ut | 51st state? |
| 21:19.40 | lars-ut | cheaper oil? |
| 21:19.55 | lars-ut | Mr Fusion in my car? |
| 21:20.06 | jsmith | Just throught I'd throw that out there, and get everyone riled up. |
| 21:20.50 | lars-ut | jsmith: Aren't you supposed to be in a meeting? |
| 21:21.11 | jsmith | lars-ut: Yeah... waiting for an OS to finish installing. |
| 21:25.36 | RyanE | dang. Carcassonne. One of my favs. Maybe one of these weeks I'll make it down there. |
| 21:28.10 | levi | I need to try out Carcassonne sometime. |
| 21:28.54 | dataw0lf | I hate purchasing DEC workstations from people who don't know the difference between system ram and texture memory |
| 21:28.55 | lars-ut | RyanE: We play every Tuesday. There is a signup for the mailing list here: http://mail.herlo.org/mailman/listinfo/boardgames_herlo.org |
| 21:29.07 | RyanE | I have only played Carcassone once, a few years ago. |
| 21:29.12 | RyanE | lars-ut: yeah, I'm on the mailing list... |
| 21:29.22 | lars-ut | D'oh! |
| 21:29.22 | RyanE | just haven't made it down for a game yet. :) |
| 21:29.25 | dataw0lf | man, I'm going to need to find a way down there now |
| 21:29.38 | dataw0lf | lars-ut: where exactly is it at? |
| 21:29.45 | lars-ut | Springville |
| 21:29.50 | dataw0lf | I thought I had the car tonight |
| 21:29.54 | dataw0lf | where's springville? |
| 21:29.55 | dataw0lf | :) |
| 21:29.56 | lars-ut | http://boardgames.herlo.org/?q=node/1 |
| 21:30.05 | RyanE | south of Provo |
| 21:30.20 | dataw0lf | ahh, that's pretty far, hmmm. might not make it tonight |
| 21:30.26 | dataw0lf | thought I |
| 21:30.28 | RyanE | dataw0lf: south of anything you would consider civilization. :) |
| 21:30.32 | dataw0lf | 'd just go ahead and take the car anyways. |
| 21:30.43 | dataw0lf | RyanE: that's anything past 45th south |
| 21:30.47 | RyanE | exactly. |
| 21:30.49 | dataw0lf | :) |
| 21:33.10 | dataw0lf | I'm from Chicago so I feel weird without large buildings around me. |
| 21:33.22 | dataw0lf | and the culture of Utah Valley is a bit of a shocker too. |
| 21:33.43 | lars-ut | that it is. |
| 21:34.01 | lars-ut | it's a bubble. |
| 21:34.29 | dataw0lf | hehe, yea, and as RyanE can attest I stand out in areas like that. |
| 21:35.09 | lars-ut | but I'm okay with that - we have a good time, and I predict that there will be enough Chicago-like language to make you feel at home. |
| 21:35.16 | lars-ut | :) |
| 21:35.18 | dataw0lf | hehe |
| 21:35.58 | dataw0lf | argh I really want to make it. |
| 21:36.05 | dataw0lf | I might just steal the car from my roommate anyway. |
| 21:36.43 | nick125-treo | hello everyone :) |
| 21:36.56 | dataw0lf | afternoon |
| 21:37.23 | nick125-treo | 2:47pm here :D |
| 21:37.57 | lars-ut | dataw0lf: don't stress over it - attend when you're able. |
| 21:38.16 | nick125-treo | what's everyone up to? |
| 21:38.19 | dataw0lf | lars-ut: yea, I just need to have some fun sometime, I've been working 60 hour+ weeks and need the break. |
| 21:39.19 | lars-ut | dataw0lf: Make sure you bring good snacks when you do come. Sounds like you need a break. |
| 21:39.33 | *** join/#utah bzob_l (n=bzob_l@nat.myfamilyinc.com) |
| 21:39.59 | lars-ut | dataw0lf: Last week we all chipped in for BBQ |
| 21:40.15 | lars-ut | dataw0lf: this week everyone is just bringing stuff |
| 21:40.27 | nick125-treo | brb |
| 21:40.47 | dataw0lf | lars-ut: alrighty |
| 21:41.43 | dataw0lf | dang, I really need to learn less, apparently |
| 21:41.48 | dataw0lf | capital F is great |
| 21:42.02 | lars-ut | lol |
| 21:42.45 | lars-ut | dataw0lf: If it works out for you, we'll see ya' tonight. |
| 21:43.20 | dataw0lf | yup, hopefully |
| 21:49.02 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 21:50.09 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: you should go. :) |
| 21:51.28 | ScytheBlade1 | s/features/feature/ |
| 21:52.22 | nick125 | lol |
| 21:52.26 | *** mode/#utah [+o elg] by ChanServ |
| 21:52.35 | *** kick/#utah [ibot!n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net] by elg (you should go) |
| 22:07.32 | *** join/#utah ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 22:07.32 | *** topic/#utah is The source for OSS focused discussion in Utah. See sllug.org, uphpu.org, plug.org, uug.byu.edu, uvlug.org, fslc.usu.edu, nupm.org, utwaa.org, oalug.com, utaug.org. See planetutah.adelantellc.com for aggregate feeds. |
| 22:07.32 | *** mode/#utah [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
| 22:07.41 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin elg |
| 22:07.53 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin #utah elg |
| 22:07.59 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin #utah elg default |
| 22:07.59 | ibot | goozbach: ok |
| 22:08.09 | elg | heh |
| 22:08.12 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:08.14 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:08.17 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin default #utah elg |
| 22:08.17 | ibot | goozbach: ok |
| 22:08.21 | elg | well at least that's funny |
| 22:08.51 | xbmodder_lappy | dataw0lf, cool.. very cool... |
| 22:09.17 | *** part/#utah default (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:09.20 | *** join/#utah default (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:09.41 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin -default |
| 22:09.41 | ibot | ok, goozbach |
| 22:09.44 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:09.50 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:09.50 | goozbach | ibot onjoin -elg |
| 22:09.50 | ibot | ok, goozbach |
| 22:09.58 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:10.00 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:10.04 | goozbach | hmmm |
| 22:10.10 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:10.13 | goozbach | TimRiker: what's the syntax for the default? |
| 22:10.18 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:10.28 | *** part/#utah xbmodder_lappy (i=nobody@xbmodder.us) |
| 22:10.28 | *** join/#utah xbmodder_lappy (i=nobody@xbmodder.us) |
| 22:10.33 | xbmodder_lappy | /CYCLE |
| 22:10.55 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin #utah -onjoin |
| 22:10.55 | ibot | ScytheBlade1: ok |
| 22:10.58 | ScytheBlade1 | Try that |
| 22:11.00 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:11.03 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:11.04 | xbmodder_lappy | -onjoin |
| 22:11.07 | ScytheBlade1 | Bah, lies |
| 22:11.12 | xbmodder_lappy | -braf |
| 22:11.14 | xbmodder_lappy | -brac |
| 22:11.17 | elg | i think tensai hardcoded it |
| 22:11.24 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:11.25 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin #utah elg -onjoin |
| 22:11.25 | ibot | ok, ScytheBlade1 |
| 22:11.30 | goozbach | could be |
| 22:11.30 | ScytheBlade1 | Hmm |
| 22:11.30 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:11.31 | xbmodder_lappy | -onjoin, is cool |
| 22:11.31 | brac | okay |
| 22:11.38 | xbmodder_lappy | -onjoin |
| 22:11.47 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: -onjoin #utah elg |
| 22:11.48 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 22:11.48 | ScytheBlade1 | There |
| 22:12.01 | ScytheBlade1 | Either way, heh |
| 22:12.03 | elg | or maybe he has a virus |
| 22:12.07 | xbmodder_lappy | brac doesn't know what onjoin is... |
| 22:12.11 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:12.12 | goozbach | ibot: do you have a virus? |
| 22:12.13 | ibot | yes, I have a virus. |
| 22:12.15 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:12.18 | elg | brac, onjoin? |
| 22:12.19 | brac | no idea |
| 22:12.19 | ScytheBlade1 | Doh |
| 22:12.25 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: help onjoin |
| 22:12.26 | goozbach | ibot: do you have a virus? |
| 22:12.27 | ibot | yes, I have a virus. |
| 22:12.34 | nick125 | :o |
| 22:12.37 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:12.38 | goozbach | elg: mething you correct |
| 22:12.40 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:12.44 | ScytheBlade1 | LIES |
| 22:12.48 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@2001:470:1f00:645:20a:95ff:fec5:636a) |
| 22:12.50 | nick125 | :D |
| 22:13.03 | nick125 | i dont need that copy of antivirus anyways :) |
| 22:13.06 | ScytheBlade1 | Usage: onjoin [chan] [-]<nick> [message] |
| 22:15.00 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:15.05 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:15.34 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin elg " " |
| 22:15.34 | ibot | ok, goozbach |
| 22:15.48 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:15.53 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.04 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin elg |
| 22:16.05 | ibot | onjoin for elg set by goozbach on Tue Feb 7 15:15:34 2006: " " |
| 22:16.14 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin -elg |
| 22:16.14 | ibot | goozbach: ok |
| 22:16.21 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin elg |
| 22:16.22 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.25 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.32 | goozbach | methinks it's hard coded |
| 22:16.35 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.36 | goozbach | or that's the default |
| 22:16.38 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.45 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin #utah -elg |
| 22:16.45 | ibot | ok, ScytheBlade1 |
| 22:16.47 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.51 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:16.54 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 22:16.55 | ScytheBlade1 | It has to be |
| 22:16.57 | goozbach | cursed bot |
| 22:17.00 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin -elg |
| 22:17.00 | ibot | ScytheBlade1: ok |
| 22:17.03 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin default -elg |
| 22:17.03 | ibot | ok, ScytheBlade1 |
| 22:17.11 | ScytheBlade1 | That's all of the possible variations I can see |
| 22:17.21 | elg | ~onjoin -elg* |
| 22:17.21 | ibot | elg: ok |
| 22:17.21 | xbmodder_lappy | hehe |
| 22:17.38 | xbmodder_lappy | maybe it has something to do with the "-" |
| 22:17.40 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:17.44 | ScytheBlade1 | the - means to remove it |
| 22:17.45 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:17.57 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin -default -elg |
| 22:17.57 | ibot | goozbach: ok |
| 22:18.01 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:18.04 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:18.09 | goozbach | cure |
| 22:18.19 | ScytheBlade1 | Maybe.. |
| 22:18.19 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@2001:470:1f00:645:20a:95ff:fec5:636a) |
| 22:18.26 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin #utah elg hihi |
| 22:18.26 | ibot | ScytheBlade1: ok |
| 22:18.30 | ScytheBlade1 | Now try it |
| 22:18.33 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:18.34 | goozbach | /re/se/ |
| 22:18.37 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:18.42 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin #utah elg |
| 22:18.42 | ibot | onjoin for elg set by scytheblade1 on Tue Feb 7 15:18:26 2006: hihi |
| 22:18.44 | *** part/#utah elg (n=fugalh@falcon.fugal.net) |
| 22:18.47 | ScytheBlade1 | ibot: onjoin #utah -elg |
| 22:18.47 | ibot | ScytheBlade1: ok |
| 22:18.51 | goozbach | it's the default |
| 22:18.59 | ScytheBlade1 | Oh |
| 22:21.29 | goozbach | ibot: botmail tensai how you turn off a default onjoin? |
| 22:21.59 | goozbach | ibot: botmail for tensai: how you turn off a default onjoin? |
| 22:22.33 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@2001:470:1f00:645:20a:95ff:fec5:636a) |
| 22:22.50 | goozbach | ibot: onjoin goozbach |
| 22:23.22 | goozbach | sorry for the botspam everyone |
| 22:23.53 | *** mode/#utah [-o goozbach] by goozbach |
| 22:25.53 | ScytheBlade1 | Come on gentoo! Compile! |
| 22:27.23 | mheath | Its just a penguin...what do you expect? |
| 22:27.33 | mheath | Emporer's are much faster than Gentoo's. |
| 22:27.45 | SpecialZ | ~lart maquis |
| 22:27.55 | goozbach | mheath: yeah but they're bigger |
| 22:28.04 | ScytheBlade1 | But... it's also better than all of the other ones |
| 22:28.29 | mheath | Heh |
| 22:28.36 | mheath | What a misguided moron |
| 22:28.48 | mheath | Ever since I found out that a kid in my class is a son of Linspire's CEO... |
| 22:28.50 | xbmodder_lappy | who? |
| 22:28.53 | mheath | And he found out I'm into Linux... |
| 22:28.56 | xbmodder_lappy | haha |
| 22:29.05 | mheath | He won't stop making these stupid comments about how Linspire is the best distro. |
| 22:29.07 | ScytheBlade1 | Oh k, lol, I was wondering why my statement deserved that |
| 22:29.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Linspire has it's points. |
| 22:29.47 | ScytheBlade1 | It's just that.... all of the reasons to use it, I don't care for ;) |
| 22:30.10 | xbmodder_lappy | Don |
| 22:30.16 | xbmodder_lappy | 't hate on linspire |
| 22:31.15 | xbmodder_lappy | it is impossible... |
| 22:31.43 | xbmodder_lappy | the only way I could think of doing it is that the server actually has ALL the processing on it... |
| 22:31.55 | ScytheBlade1 | Then how does the tablet run? |
| 22:32.13 | mheath | xbmodder: It does. |
| 22:32.19 | xbmodder_lappy | the server has to set ever pixel on the screen via solid-state electronics |
| 22:32.32 | mheath | erm, were'd my ignore go?! |
| 22:32.38 | ScytheBlade1 | rofl |
| 22:32.44 | mheath | There we go. |
| 22:32.44 | ScytheBlade1 | That's what I thought had happened last night |
| 22:32.46 | xbmodder_lappy | its a bad idea |
| 22:32.54 | xbmodder_lappy | but i was just saying.. |
| 22:33.07 | tene | mheath: no input devices! |
| 22:33.15 | mheath | Haha. |
| 22:33.32 | xbmodder_lappy | my major thought would be, what happens if your server fails! |
| 22:34.24 | mheath | Thats weird, I don't know where my ignore of xbmodder_lappy went |
| 22:34.32 | xbmodder_lappy | :-/ |
| 22:34.37 | mheath | Maybe I'd accidentally made it temporary, and someone restarted the computer |
| 22:34.39 | mheath | *shrug* |
| 22:35.28 | tene | I bet he haxxorzed you and removed it. |
| 22:35.34 | mheath | He just keeps coming up with this bizzare story about how I know someone on here. |
| 22:35.41 | mheath | More, how I'm dating them. |
| 22:35.43 | mheath | I don't get it. |
| 22:35.49 | xbmodder_lappy | lol |
| 22:35.52 | tene | xbm does? |
| 22:36.18 | mheath | tene: Yeah. Its this random weirdness that he keeps bugging me about. |
| 22:36.21 | xbmodder_lappy | I just wanted to tell the person he is dating that he is on IRC and his IRC information, nothing more. |
| 22:36.21 | mheath | You're as lost as I am. |
| 22:36.33 | xbmodder_lappy | and once mheath would say, yeah... I'd be happy |
| 22:36.44 | goozbach | xbmodder_lappy: are you stalking mheath? |
| 22:36.50 | ScytheBlade1 | xbmodder_lappy: to do that, you'd have to have things like a name, and address of some sort |
| 22:36.51 | xbmodder_lappy | goozbach, umm |
| 22:36.54 | xbmodder_lappy | ~stalking |
| 22:36.56 | ScytheBlade1 | Which I doubt has been disclosed |
| 22:37.03 | xbmodder_lappy | ScytheBlade1, IP address |
| 22:37.14 | ScytheBlade1 | Um. |
| 22:37.16 | ScytheBlade1 | Have fun with that. |
| 22:37.20 | xbmodder_lappy | hehe |
| 22:37.22 | goozbach | how's a bout we all change the subject |
| 22:37.25 | xbmodder_lappy | sure |
| 22:37.31 | goozbach | good! |
| 22:37.36 | mheath | It's weird seeing one side of this conversation anyway |
| 22:37.37 | xbmodder_lappy | goozbach, where are you? |
| 22:38.00 | goozbach | Tallahassee FL |
| 22:38.09 | xbmodder_lappy | fun |
| 22:38.11 | xbmodder_lappy | florida |
| 22:38.15 | goozbach | very |
| 22:38.18 | goozbach | it's nice down here |
| 22:38.21 | goozbach | warm an such |
| 22:38.54 | xbmodder_lappy | what class? |
| 22:43.19 | levi | Sweet, Alan Kay is speaking at the U this month. I'm so there. |
| 22:43.26 | levi | http://www.cs.utah.edu/info/organick.shtml |
| 22:43.27 | brac | [U of U School of Computing _ Organick Lecture Series] |
| 22:43.51 | xbmodder_lappy | ~google "Alan Kay" |
| 22:45.12 | goozbach | GL250 |
| 22:46.25 | levi | xbmodder_lappy: You know those stories about Apple 'stealing' the GUI ideas from Xerox? |
| 22:46.35 | xbmodder_lappy | yeah... |
| 22:46.48 | xbmodder_lappy | Alan Kay stole them> |
| 22:46.51 | xbmodder_lappy | ? |
| 22:46.52 | levi | Well, Alan Kay is one of the guys developing them at Xerox. |
| 22:47.03 | xbmodder_lappy | oh, oops |
| 22:47.11 | levi | s/developing/who developed/ |
| 22:47.11 | xbmodder_lappy | cool. |
| 22:47.21 | xbmodder_lappy | very cool. |
| 22:47.50 | levi | He envisioned the laptop computer, coined the term 'object-oriented programming', created the Smalltalk language, etc. |
| 22:48.25 | xbmodder_lappy | very cool. |
| 22:49.31 | *** join/#utah bzob_l (n=bzob_l@nat.myfamilyinc.com) |
| 22:49.50 | xbmodder_lappy | bzob_l Keeps timing out and reconnecting |
| 22:51.06 | bzob_l | xbmodder_lappy, only when moving access points. |
| 22:51.20 | xbmodder_lappy | :-( |
| 22:54.14 | mheath | xbmodder_lappy: pm. |
| 22:57.17 | scottj | anyone know of a really good web frontend for hosting files that you can run on your own server? |
| 22:58.30 | goozbach | hosting files? |
| 22:58.40 | goozbach | like an upload and manage frontend? |
| 22:58.58 | *** join/#utah Leilas (n=1802511e@yossman.net) |
| 22:59.03 | xbmodder_lappy | hey Leilas |
| 22:59.16 | Leilas | hi |
| 22:59.38 | goozbach | nevermind I un-summon him |
| 22:59.52 | goozbach | (he's not on jabber) |
| 22:59.58 | xbmodder_lappy | how are you Leilas |
| 23:00.17 | Leilas | ok i guess |
| 23:00.51 | harleypig | anyone know how to fix kde so it doesn't do focus follows mouse in apps? (not window focus follows mouse, but elements in the app focus follows mouse) |
| 23:03.06 | *** join/#utah herlo (n=csavage@12.176.97.59) |
| 23:03.15 | herlo | ibot: its both |
| 23:05.07 | harleypig | scottj: http://search.cpan.org/~pmc/Apache-FileManager-0.19/FileManager.pm |
| 23:10.03 | xbmodder_lappy | Wow, I feel sorry for mheath |
| 23:10.43 | xbmodder_lappy | good thing I don't live near him |
| 23:10.51 | levi | Why? |
| 23:11.16 | mheath | ..... |
| 23:11.23 | mheath | O.o |
| 23:12.15 | ScytheBlade1 | why? |
| 23:12.23 | xbmodder_lappy | mheath, May I say? |
| 23:12.34 | mheath | More of xbmodder_lappy's fantasy world. |
| 23:13.36 | levi | Yeesh. |
| 23:16.21 | xbmodder_lappy | I'm hungry |
| 23:17.12 | goozbach | do I have to seperate you two!? |
| 23:17.50 | scottj | goozbach: yeah, something to manage my files now that I'm selling my laptop and will be computer-less |
| 23:18.32 | scottj | levi: thanks for the link. alan kay is amazing and I'll definitely have to attend. I hope he uses squeak in the presentation--I can't wait to see him use it |
| 23:18.55 | levi | The video I've seen of some of his past presentations uses Squeak. |
| 23:19.15 | levi | With embedded video clips and nifty stuff like that. |
| 23:20.18 | goozbach | scottj: probally not the answer you're looking for but... http://www.projectblackdog.com/ |
| 23:20.30 | scottj | there's tons of cool squeak tricks experienced squeakers know about |
| 23:20.42 | levi | scottj: Are you a squeaker? |
| 23:22.00 | scottj | levi: used to use it a bit, haven't for years |
| 23:22.36 | levi | I played with it for a bit, wrote a few simple things, and then got sidetracked with Lisp. |
| 23:22.45 | levi | I plan on returning to it, though. |
| 23:22.54 | levi | So little time! |
| 23:23.05 | xbmodder_lappy | goozbach, I saw some blackdogs, there friggin' insane |
| 23:23.05 | xbmodder_lappy | :-D |
| 23:23.11 | scottj | I used it to write a commercial app for pocket pcs, and it worked really well |
| 23:23.20 | xbmodder_lappy | Insane, but expensive |
| 23:23.34 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@c-24-10-236-93.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 23:23.43 | levi | scottj: Nifty. What app? |
| 23:23.49 | goozbach | xbmodder_lappy: realmsys (my friend's company) makes them |
| 23:24.21 | goozbach | I played with a pre-beta over a year ago, they are cool |
| 23:24.24 | levi | I know some people at Realm. I'm skeptical about their business model, but I hope it works for them. |
| 23:24.57 | goozbach | levi: what makes you sceptical? |
| 23:25.09 | goozbach | s/sceptical/skeptical/ |
| 23:25.39 | levi | goozbach: Well, I just have a hard time seeing a reason to buy their devices. |
| 23:26.26 | scottj | levi, it was called EchoLink when I wrote it, but the company that makes the hardware and bought it changed the name I believe |
| 23:27.35 | scottj | it was a little app that did soil moisture data collection via radio out in fields, and it would display all sorts of junk on the screen about your field |
| 23:28.08 | levi | Sounds pretty cool. |
| 23:28.10 | scottj | the nice thing about using squeak back then for pocket pc apps was you could write them and run them on a normal pc and they'd work just like on a pocketpc |
| 23:28.27 | scottj | instead of developing on a pc and having to always test your stuff on a pocket pc |
| 23:29.26 | levi | Yeah, that makes things a lot easier. |
| 23:29.59 | *** join/#utah elg (n=fugalh@dhcp25.cs.nmsu.edu) |
| 23:38.55 | *** join/#utah ScytheBlade1 (n=Death@about/pxe/ScytheBlade1) |
| 23:52.42 | tensai | ~onjoin _default elg |
| 23:52.43 | ibot | onjoin for elg set by sjansen on Fri Feb 3 15:12:12 2006: o/~ Should I stay or should I go? ~/o |
| 23:52.48 | tensai | ~onjoin _default -elg |
| 23:52.48 | ibot | ok, tensai |
| 23:52.53 | tensai | ~onjoin _default elg |
| 23:53.03 | tensai | goozbach: that's the syntax |
| 23:53.17 | elg | might add that to the help blurb |
| 23:53.53 | tensai | ~help onjoin |
| 23:54.06 | tensai | elg: will do |
| 23:55.05 | tensai | as soon as cvs.sf.net comes back up, that is |
