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| 00:09.15 | *** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 00:11.00 | goozbach | SELinux++ |
| 00:11.19 | goozbach | SELinux just saved my butt |
| 00:11.31 | tene | howso? |
| 00:11.46 | *** join/#utah bigdog_ut (n=bigdog_u@shylonhunter.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 00:11.50 | goozbach | an unpatched exploit in BIND was targeted on my system |
| 00:12.00 | goozbach | and SELinux didn't let it through |
| 00:12.07 | tene | Yay! |
| 00:12.22 | goozbach | ~lart goozbach for not patching |
| 00:26.07 | *** join/#utah ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 00:26.07 | *** topic/#utah is The source for OSS focused discussion in Utah. See sllug.org, uphpu.org, plug.org, uug.byu.edu, uvlug.org, fslc.usu.edu, nupm.org, utwaa.org, oalug.com. See planetutah.adelantellc.com for aggregate feed |
| 00:26.07 | *** mode/#utah [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
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| 01:37.56 | goozbach | bah! you are all boring |
| 01:39.42 | tene | ~dance |
| 01:39.43 | ibot | "ah, ah, ah, ah, stayin' alive, stayin' alive" |
| 01:43.10 | goozbach | that's all you got? |
| 01:43.18 | tene | ~explode |
| 01:43.23 | ibot | BOOOM |
| 01:46.39 | goozbach | ~scare maquis |
| 01:46.41 | ibot | ACTION puts on a hockey mask and jumps out at maquis |
| 01:57.08 | *** join/#utah markl_ (i=mark@dsl093-225-127.slc1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 01:57.31 | *** join/#utah Maquis (n=Maquis@c-24-2-72-158.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 01:57.47 | Maquis | Newsome: sounds like you had an exciting day in the cs office... |
| 01:58.04 | tene | The resnet at SUU blocks all incoming connections. |
| 01:58.12 | tene | And the majority of outgoing connections. |
| 02:01.09 | Newsome | Maquis: yep, lots of fun! |
| 02:02.39 | Maquis | your office is actually quite responsible, from what i can see |
| 02:05.56 | *** part/#utah harleypig (n=Clint@65.73.113.162) |
| 02:45.43 | *** part/#utah bucky (n=bucky@170-215-92-119.bras01.mob.ut.frontiernet.net) |
| 03:03.56 | *** join/#utah levi (n=levi@levi.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 03:04.16 | levi | Good evening. |
| 03:06.34 | mheath | By the way, in case anyone was wondering.... |
| 03:06.43 | mheath | The beta (OpenOffice 2.0) version of Impress is very, very buggy |
| 03:06.45 | mheath | at least for me |
| 03:07.16 | levi | Alas. That doesn't surprise me. |
| 03:07.52 | mheath | Actually, Writer is fine |
| 03:08.15 | mheath | I've been using the beta version of Writer for a while. I never really have a need for presentations..... |
| 03:08.20 | mheath | But I can't even get this done |
| 03:13.54 | mheath | Can someone please assure me that college isn't as much busy work as high school? =( |
| 03:14.33 | levi | Depends on the class. |
| 03:14.41 | *** join/#utah Maquis (n=Maquis@c-24-2-72-158.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 03:15.55 | levi | Hi, Maquis. |
| 03:16.28 | levi | Maquis: Started classes yet? |
| 03:28.46 | *** join/#utah Maquis (n=Maquis@c-24-2-72-158.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 03:42.36 | *** join/#utah tiwula (n=lane@208-186-97-26.customer.csolutions.net) |
| 03:57.57 | *** join/#utah Maquis (n=Maquis@c-24-2-72-158.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:08.03 | xbmodder | hey |
| 04:16.02 | *** join/#utah Maquis_ (n=Maquis@71-36-83-231.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 04:22.38 | *** join/#utah Hhhhh (n=cristoba@c-67-169-244-47.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:30.25 | xbmodder | hey Hhhhh |
| 04:30.28 | xbmodder | hey Maquis |
| 04:30.31 | xbmodder | hey levi |
| 04:30.33 | xbmodder | hey mheath |
| 04:30.36 | xbmodder | lol |
| 04:30.38 | levi | Hey, xbmodder. |
| 04:30.50 | levi | You're not scripting your hellos, are you? |
| 04:30.51 | xbmodder | sup? |
| 04:30.55 | xbmodder | no |
| 04:31.02 | xbmodder | thats an excellent idea! |
| 04:31.12 | levi | No, it's not. |
| 04:31.28 | xbmodder | That was a excellent joke! |
| 04:31.35 | goozbach | ~wack levi |
| 04:31.42 | Maquis | ~whack levi |
| 04:31.43 | ibot | ACTION whacks levi upside the head. |
| 04:31.50 | Maquis | spelling helps |
| 04:32.05 | goozbach | yeah THAT whack... |
| 04:34.30 | xbmodder | lol |
| 04:35.09 | goozbach | ~spel spell |
| 04:35.21 | goozbach | see I'm hopeles |
| 04:35.31 | goozbach | ~spel hopless |
| 04:35.44 | Maquis | ~lart goozbach |
| 04:36.37 | levi | Maquis: So, have you started classes? |
| 04:36.59 | Maquis | levi: yup |
| 04:37.05 | levi | How are they? |
| 04:37.07 | goozbach | ~spel hopless |
| 04:37.08 | ibot | G-O-O-Z-B-A-C-H |
| 04:37.28 | Maquis | levi: they're going to be pretty cool |
| 04:37.33 | xbmodder | ~spell goozbach |
| 04:37.47 | Maquis | security looks way fun... |
| 04:38.00 | tene_ | ~spell tene |
| 04:38.01 | Hhhhh | anybody here taking CS470? |
| 04:38.15 | Maquis | Hhhhh: i will in spring |
| 04:38.30 | Hhhhh | yea, you told me earlier |
| 04:38.38 | Maquis | yeah |
| 04:39.23 | levi | Maquis: What are you taking? |
| 04:39.59 | Maquis | security, "essentials of programming languages", civ, d&c, and bio |
| 04:40.03 | Hhhhh | Maquis, I guess the question in your case is "who are you taking it from?" |
| 04:40.10 | Maquis | Hhhhh: no idea |
| 04:40.21 | Hhhhh | Maquis, who do you have for 330? |
| 04:40.23 | Maquis | i'm guessing they probably only have one teacher in spring |
| 04:40.28 | Maquis | for 330, i have morse |
| 04:40.31 | Maquis | i think |
| 04:40.32 | goozbach | WOO! fireworks |
| 04:40.33 | Hhhhh | good |
| 04:40.45 | Hhhhh | he is the "good" 330 teacher |
| 04:40.50 | Hhhhh | bio 100? |
| 04:40.55 | Maquis | Hhhhh: bio 220 |
| 04:40.56 | Hhhhh | i'm taking that right now too |
| 04:41.01 | Maquis | to fill all the requirements |
| 04:41.08 | Maquis | i don't want to go tomorrow morning |
| 04:41.10 | Maquis | it's early |
| 04:41.22 | Hhhhh | what civ you taking? |
| 04:41.24 | RyanE | I had it from beus, but I'm sure he's looooong gone. What languages do they use in 330 now? |
| 04:41.30 | goozbach | Woo! LAG!!! |
| 04:41.31 | Hhhhh | scheme |
| 04:41.33 | Maquis | history of creativity |
| 04:41.40 | Maquis | RyanE: scheme |
| 04:41.51 | levi | Hhhhh: Who's the 'bad' one? |
| 04:41.51 | Maquis | although they claim that the class is not about scheme |
| 04:41.52 | Hhhhh | Maquis, I took a class that was far easier than Mfg 200 |
| 04:42.02 | Maquis | levi: i've heard "don't take geary" |
| 04:42.03 | RyanE | just scheme? 330 used to use 4 languages to show concepts. APL, Common Lisp, C, and something else. |
| 04:42.10 | levi | Maquis: Ahh, okay. |
| 04:42.13 | Hhhhh | no, it's all Scheme no |
| 04:42.15 | Hhhhh | now* |
| 04:42.37 | goozbach | my eyelashes itch |
| 04:42.40 | levi | RyanE: It's been Scheme since I took it, using the text 'Essentials of Programming Languages' |
| 04:42.53 | levi | It really isn't /about/ Scheme, though. |
| 04:43.02 | RyanE | yeah, I think I took it in '90 or '91. :) |
| 04:43.20 | *** part/#utah dataw0lf- (n=dataw0lf@c-24-10-173-249.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 04:43.41 | RyanE | our 330 teacher used to read poetry at the beginning of each class. Some found it enlightening, most found it annoying. |
| 04:44.06 | Maquis | RyanE: in 345, dr roper did little puzzles and such at the beginning of class... |
| 04:44.23 | RyanE | cool. |
| 04:44.24 | Maquis | i have to say the best one was a winner of the ioccc with the question "what does this do?" |
| 04:45.05 | RyanE | even though I love C and have programmed in it for years, those things throw me for a loop. :) |
| 04:45.28 | Maquis | RyanE: this particular one was using the actual code in an array to create the output |
| 04:45.30 | mheath | I'm trying to decide if I should go to college.... |
| 04:45.31 | Maquis | it was interesting |
| 04:45.37 | Maquis | mheath: yes |
| 04:45.39 | Maquis | you should |
| 04:46.00 | RyanE | mheath: only if you want to improve your lot in life. If you have a chance, definitely do it. |
| 04:46.15 | mheath | Maquis, heh, the choices are enlisting in the Navy and doing online classes or going to college |
| 04:46.19 | mheath | I'm getting a degree either way |
| 04:46.26 | mheath | going to college and doing ROTC |
| 04:46.28 | Maquis | mheath: go to college |
| 04:46.46 | RyanE | the few people I know who short-circuited it (went straight to work with relatively high-paying jobs at the time), regretted it later. |
| 04:47.06 | mheath | Maquis, not sure I can afford it...thats the big problem. |
| 04:47.18 | Maquis | mheath: good grades? |
| 04:47.23 | RyanE | but if you get a college degree either way, you have to take other factors into account, definitely. |
| 04:47.24 | Maquis | fastweb.com |
| 04:47.37 | Maquis | ^^^ look for scholarships |
| 04:47.40 | mheath | Maquis, mediocre |
| 04:47.46 | mheath | 3.0GPA currently\ |
| 04:47.56 | mheath | Very good test scores, though |
| 04:47.56 | Maquis | mheath: that's good enough for a couple scholarships |
| 04:48.02 | RyanE | mheath: you're a senior then? |
| 04:48.11 | Maquis | particularly if you're willing to write some essays and such |
| 04:48.25 | Maquis | what schools are you looking at? |
| 04:48.26 | mheath | RyanE, yes. |
| 04:48.34 | mheath | Maquis, WSU. |
| 04:48.36 | RyanE | are you taking AP classes? |
| 04:48.46 | mheath | RyanE, I have and I am. |
| 04:48.51 | Maquis | keep an eye on price, look for scholarships, and work during the school year |
| 04:49.02 | RyanE | if you take AP classes and have a 3.0, and do well on tests, I think they take that into account. |
| 04:49.03 | Maquis | doesn't ROTC pay for large portions of it anyways? |
| 04:49.24 | mheath | Maquis, not necessarily. |
| 04:49.26 | RyanE | definitely apply for scholarships. the worst that can happen is you *don't* get them. |
| 04:49.44 | Maquis | mheath: what's involved in rOTC paying for things? |
| 04:49.46 | RyanE | include any extra-curricular activities in the applications. |
| 04:49.51 | mheath | Maquis, ROTC has some scholarships you can apply for. |
| 04:49.59 | Maquis | ah |
| 04:50.16 | Maquis | how was your experience at the boot-camp-ish thing? that should be a factor too |
| 04:50.18 | mheath | I really wanted to work towards my MBA, too..... |
| 04:50.20 | levi | I dropped out of school and regretted it later. |
| 04:50.24 | mheath | Something I *can't* do with ROTC |
| 04:50.40 | levi | mheath: I thought you wanted to do CS research? |
| 04:50.58 | mheath | levi, eh? I think you have me confused with someone else. |
| 04:51.37 | levi | mheath: No, you talked about wanting to go to some foriegn university to study some concurrency stuff. |
| 04:51.51 | *** part/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@216-190-206-130.customer.csolutions.net) |
| 04:52.04 | mheath | levi, you still have me confused with someone else. |
| 04:52.17 | levi | I wonder who I have you confused with? |
| 04:52.27 | mheath | levi, I've always wanted to join the military, and have plans to start my own business eventually..\ |
| 04:52.30 | goozbach | Woah... bad seafood... |
| 04:52.52 | Maquis | goozbach: ick |
| 04:53.00 | xbmodder | Maquis, true dat. |
| 04:53.03 | Maquis | shrimp? or what? |
| 04:53.10 | xbmodder | Maquis, make a boyfriend on the computer |
| 04:53.11 | Maquis | xbmodder: you have no idea |
| 04:53.25 | xbmodder | all he has to say is "I dono", "I don't understand" lol |
| 04:53.25 | levi | mheath: Right, but I thought you wanted to go to this school after your military stint. |
| 04:53.29 | xbmodder | just kidding |
| 04:53.39 | Maquis | xbmodder: i doubt you understand the culture in utah with regards to marriage/engagement |
| 04:53.45 | xbmodder | :-/ |
| 04:53.47 | mheath | levi, not me.. |
| 04:53.53 | xbmodder | I like California. |
| 04:54.14 | levi | mheath: Are you the guy who likes HURD? |
| 04:54.28 | Maquis | levi: that one's right |
| 04:54.48 | mheath | levi, yes. |
| 04:54.49 | xbmodder | lol |
| 04:55.06 | levi | Where are the channel logs? I want to figure out who I was talking to, if not mheath. |
| 04:55.23 | Maquis | ~logs |
| 04:55.26 | ibot | apt/ibot/jbot/purl all log to http://ibot.rikers.org/<channelname>/ where channelname is html encoded ie: %23debian | lines that start with a space are not shown | some channels have stats at http://ibot.rikers.org/stats/<channelname>.html.gz, or updated "nightly" |
| 04:56.25 | levi | Hrm, not exactly set up for easy searching. |
| 04:56.38 | mheath | haha, yeah, have fun with that one.... |
| 04:56.56 | mheath | I'm sure after the 100th or so .tar.gz and some nice grep commands..... =P |
| 04:58.26 | goozbach | shrimp |
| 04:58.31 | goozbach | at the house of blues |
| 04:58.42 | goozbach | it tasted yumy |
| 04:58.56 | mheath | Maquis, my experience at that boot camp was interesting. |
| 04:59.03 | goozbach | but now it no likey me, my tummy |
| 04:59.31 | goozbach | http://www.squarefree.com/htmledit/ |
| 04:59.34 | mheath | As interesting as getting up at 5:15, walking a mile each way to eat, doing massive amounts of PT, and hours of the dullest classroom instruction you've ever experienced can be :D |
| 04:59.36 | Maquis | goozbach: be careful with shrimp |
| 04:59.56 | Maquis | mheath: is that really what you want to do after high school? |
| 05:00.10 | mheath | Maquis, thats boot camp. |
| 05:00.17 | Maquis | yes... |
| 05:00.19 | mheath | Theres boot camp, and theres the rest of your military career. |
| 05:00.32 | Maquis | but is the army what you want to do after high school? |
| 05:00.48 | Maquis | i mean, you got a very brief glimpse of some small piece of it, right? |
| 05:00.51 | RyanE | goozbach: I feel for you. Being sick on the road is the worst. I will never forget the KFC in Stamford, CT. I will die with eternal hatred for that place, and still avoid KFC to this day. |
| 05:01.10 | Maquis | goozbach: hugs |
| 05:01.25 | mheath | Maquis, ...........No, the ARMY is NOT what I want to do after highschool -_- |
| 05:01.55 | Maquis | mheath: there must be some way to get around it, if that's not what you want to do, then |
| 05:02.14 | mheath | Maquis, ...........I'm a sailor, not a ground pounder. |
| 05:03.35 | mheath | Navy != Army |
| 05:03.49 | Maquis | mheath: right... sorry... is navy what yu want to do after high school? |
| 05:03.55 | Maquis | is that the life you want? |
| 05:04.19 | Maquis | (not trying to dissuade you... if that's what you want to do, go for it... if not, you might want to look for other options, though) |
| 05:04.51 | mheath | Yes, it is what I want to do. |
| 05:05.15 | mheath | Maquis, you probably think I'm nuts, and I can understand that...military people are different. |
| 05:05.43 | mheath | But yes, I'm sure its what I want to do. And to be honest, I really don't know what I'd do with the next few years of my life if I wasn't going to be a sailor. |
| 05:05.50 | mheath | But anyway, I need to head to sleep. |
| 05:05.53 | mheath | G'night. |
| 05:06.41 | Maquis | mheath: i don't think you're nuts |
| 05:06.48 | Maquis | i admire anyone who's willing to go and do that |
| 05:06.58 | Maquis | i really admire the armed forces |
| 05:07.08 | Maquis | i'm just saying "think about it and make sure that's what you want to do" |
| 05:10.33 | Maquis | goozbach: because thunderbird is trying to do you a favor |
| 05:10.41 | Maquis | get over her |
| 05:18.33 | levi | <mheath> I hope that a distributed and parallel processing degree plus and electronics engineering degree will get me an awesome job as an engineer for an electronics co. |
| 05:19.18 | Maquis | levi: you found it |
| 05:19.21 | Maquis | but he's gone |
| 05:19.43 | levi | But, much later: <mheath> and rather than getting a distributed computing related degree and being some grunt engineer somewhere, I'm planning on getting my MBA and starting a business |
| 05:21.42 | RyanE | Maquis: What's tomorrow? |
| 05:28.21 | Supaplex | Aug 30 |
| 05:30.11 | levi | <mheath> I'm looking at going to Weber State next fall full time, then (after I get my bachelors) going to Vrije Universiteit in Amsterdam. |
| 05:30.23 | levi | I knew I wasn't thinking of someone else. |
| 05:30.28 | levi | Little punk. |
| 05:32.12 | levi | He talked about that as recently as April. |
| 05:34.16 | levi | What bugs me most about mheath is that he automatically assumes that everyone else is wrong, and works from there. He doesn't even try to figure out how what he's thinking and what he hears might fit together. |
| 05:35.50 | Maquis | RyanE: bio at 9am |
| 05:36.13 | levi | Maquis: I don't suppose you might know if Dan Hersam is in your CS330 class? |
| 05:36.14 | Maquis | ok... |
| 05:36.20 | Maquis | levi: no |
| 05:36.22 | Maquis | i don't know |
| 05:36.38 | Maquis | could somebody please explain to me why people watch "Sweet Sixteen"? |
| 05:36.54 | levi | Well, look out for him. He's tall, has short curly blonde hair, and is about 29. |
| 05:37.10 | levi | He's a friend of mine, an ex-coworker, and a former roommate. |
| 05:37.11 | Maquis | personally, i don't see what is so exciting about watching spoiled brats be given giant, 10,000$ birthday parties |
| 05:37.26 | Maquis | and then having them complain that things aren't being done their way |
| 05:37.32 | levi | I haven't even heard of it, and I'd prefer to not hear any more. |
| 05:37.45 | Maquis | i hadn't heard of it until i moved in here |
| 05:38.01 | levi | Sounds like you have non-geek roommates. |
| 05:38.17 | levi | Which are hard to avoid if you don't pick them yourself. |
| 05:38.39 | Maquis | levi: even if i picked my roommates myself, it'd still be hard to avoid non-geek roommate |
| 05:38.42 | Maquis | s |
| 05:38.50 | levi | Well, that's true. |
| 05:39.21 | Maquis | question 2: how does a girl go about catching the attention of a guy? it's a geek guy... and... yeah |
| 05:39.44 | levi | Say hi, I suppose. |
| 05:40.08 | levi | I was never very good at the social maneuvering thing, and I only had to worry about the male end of it. |
| 05:40.34 | levi | My most successful approach was just to walk over and introduce myself to everyone, though. |
| 05:40.37 | Maquis | i've been trying the "say hi" thing for a while |
| 05:40.45 | Maquis | he knows me pretty well... |
| 05:40.49 | Maquis | i just... well... |
| 05:40.57 | Maquis | yeah |
| 05:41.08 | levi | When I found someone I was interested in, I just went and talked to them a lot, and then eventually asked them on a date. |
| 05:41.27 | Maquis | levi: i've done the first half of that... |
| 05:41.36 | Maquis | unfortunately, the second-half isn't my part |
| 05:41.42 | Maquis | and i'm not having a whole lot of luck |
| 05:42.25 | levi | Well, if you've given ample opportunity, sometimes the guy just isn't interested. It sucks, but that's how it usually is from both ends. |
| 05:42.58 | Maquis | :( |
| 05:43.01 | Maquis | :'( |
| 05:43.08 | levi | Other times, you just have to be patient, or maybe suggest something low-key, like going to get some ice cream together at the creamery. |
| 05:43.51 | levi | My wife initially dismissed me as a romantic interest, but I won her over through persistent friendship. |
| 05:45.27 | levi | My advice is to continue to be friendly with this person, even if he doesn't initially respond romantically. Make lots of good friends, and hopefully one of them will turn to something more. |
| 05:46.26 | goozbach | because, it's meant to be dificult |
| 05:46.32 | levi | Try not to focus on your attraction, and don't focus it on one person, either. Be on the lookout for other options, and pursue many simultaneously. |
| 05:47.20 | Maquis | levi: yeah |
| 05:47.24 | Maquis | thanks for the advice |
| 05:47.34 | levi | The chances of one person you're attracted to being attracted back are slim. If you find lots of people you're attracted to and try to get to know them all at the same time, your chances of finding one who clicks with you go up greatly! |
| 05:47.42 | levi | Plus you have a much better time. |
| 05:48.13 | levi | And you don't get as discouraged when one doesn't work out. |
| 05:48.53 | levi | Yeah, I know. |
| 05:49.21 | levi | Trust me, I was pretty darn discouraged for most of my 'dating' life. |
| 05:50.03 | levi | Something clicked a couple of years ago, though, and I was able to make some changes in myself and what I felt comfortable with that made a huge difference. |
| 05:50.30 | levi | Part of it was just being comfortable around attractive girls just as friends. |
| 05:50.56 | Maquis | yeah |
| 05:52.40 | levi | Another part is that my wife (who was just a friend at the time) and a friend of hers gave me a 'man makeover' and helped me get some fashionable clothes and generally gave me confidence that I could be attractive myself. I'd never really believed it before, and it probably showed. |
| 05:54.29 | Maquis | levi: :) |
| 05:55.01 | Maquis | tis ok |
| 05:55.52 | levi | Anyway, I hope I have given you some useful advice, and perhaps some hope. |
| 05:56.02 | Maquis | :) |
| 05:56.05 | Maquis | thanks |
| 05:56.17 | levi | If you have questions about scheme, I am much better about answering those! |
| 05:56.24 | Maquis | haha |
| 05:56.30 | Maquis | i'm sure i will in a week or two : |
| 05:56.31 | Maquis | :) |
| 05:56.39 | levi | (Scheme is easy, human relationships are hard!) |
| 05:56.54 | goozbach | amen levi |
| 05:56.56 | Maquis | although, i think i'll be better at figuring those questions out on my own... |
| 05:57.14 | goozbach | scheme qustions? |
| 05:58.04 | levi | One hint when programming in a lisp of any sort: use an editor that will auto-indent and match parentheses! It makes life much easier to follow the canonical indentation style. |
| 05:59.58 | levi | You'll probably be using drscheme, which has a built-in editor. I think it does indentation and paren-matching. I know vim does paren matching with %, but I don't know about auto-indentation. Emacs has scheme modes that do both, among other things. |
| 06:00.15 | goozbach | vim can autoindent |
| 06:00.21 | goozbach | :set autoindent |
| 06:00.31 | levi | Yes, but does it autoindent scheme properly? |
| 06:00.56 | levi | If it does, great! If not, it's not as helpful as it could be. |
| 06:01.28 | goozbach | I think so |
| 06:01.43 | goozbach | hmm /me tries |
| 06:02.39 | levi | http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/dorai/scmindent/scmindent.html |
| 06:02.47 | levi | That ought to be helpful. |
| 06:06.14 | levi | http://www.lisp-p.org/15-vim/ |
| 06:09.52 | levi | And there's always viper-mode in emacs. :) |
| 06:25.02 | levi | This may also be useful to you: http://community.schemewiki.org/ |
| 06:25.20 | levi | There's some good introductory stuff there. |
| 06:29.57 | goozbach | ~lart bad seafood... |
| 06:30.02 | levi | Ooh, here are scheme indentation/formatting rules: http://community.schemewiki.org/?scheme-style |
| 06:30.08 | goozbach | ohh this better clear up by tomorrow |
| 06:53.58 | Supaplex | I'm so excited for scheme |
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| 13:33.29 | graphyx | morning |
| 13:33.39 | Maquis | morning |
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| 14:28.25 | xbmodder | morning |
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| 15:03.29 | hans | levi: for the record vim does auto paren matching and auto indentation for lisp/scheme |
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| 15:04.15 | levi | hans: Cool, that will probably make Maquis' life easier, since I assume she will be unwilling to go back to emacs to edit her Scheme code. |
| 15:04.16 | hans | I used it for 330, rather than learn emacs, and it worked pretty well. I think if I were to do it again I'd at least try emacs for a week or so - the in-editor evaulation would have been nice. |
| 15:04.34 | levi | Not to mention editor commands that act on s-expressions. |
| 15:05.29 | levi | The command that re-indents a s-exp is very handy. |
| 15:06.08 | levi | And being able to kill/yank a s-exp at a time is very handy, too. |
| 15:07.11 | hans | lisp editing is definitely one area that emacs may very well be the right tool for the job |
| 15:07.47 | hans | similarly, if I were doing visual basic I'd probably use visual studio or whatever depressing editor because it would probably minimize the agony |
| 15:08.41 | levi | paredit.el is supposed to give additional structural editing support for lisp languages, but I haven't tried it. |
| 15:10.28 | hans | not familiar with that one |
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| 15:15.31 | levi | http://www.bloodandcoffee.net/campbell/paredit.el |
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| 15:17.59 | jsmith | Why didn't they do this when I was a kid? http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000333056413/ |
| 15:18.41 | *** join/#utah harleypig (n=Clint@65.73.113.162) |
| 15:18.44 | tensai | jsmith: why do I get calls that have a CID of "asterisk"? |
| 15:19.03 | goozbach | freaking cool!!! |
| 15:19.04 | harleypig | Your installation is calling you. |
| 15:19.20 | tensai | harleypig: heh. that |
| 15:19.32 | hans | jsmith: and why does setcidname(NuFone) (because I hate "Toll-Free Number" make it so that my phone doesn't show the number anymore? |
| 15:19.33 | tensai | er, that's what I thought too. but these are real calls. |
| 15:19.53 | hans | tensai: calls going through asterisk to something like my sipura? |
| 15:19.54 | harleypig | tensai: I dunno. I was being smart alecky. |
| 15:20.57 | tensai | harleypig: you, a smart aleck? no way! |
| 15:21.25 | harleypig | Well, I'd use a shorter word than 'aleck' but we're in #utah after all. |
| 15:21.26 | tensai | hans: I don't think my calls are going through your sipura... |
| 15:21.38 | hans | well you know what I mean :) |
| 15:21.53 | hans | how is asterisk in line with your phone/ |
| 15:22.13 | hans | anyone here familiar with mod_auth*_ldap? |
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| 15:33.48 | jsmith | hans: Not sure... |
| 15:34.20 | jsmith | hans: You could try putting quotes around the name, but I'm not sure that would help. |
| 15:35.17 | hans | I'll have to fiddle with it. Maybe I'll just live with "Toll-Free Number" |
| 15:35.31 | hans | and hopefully someday nufone will support cid name |
| 15:35.40 | jsmith | No kidding... |
| 15:35.58 | jsmith | I think I know why they don't, but... |
| 15:36.05 | hans | why is that? |
| 15:36.15 | hans | i mean, it comes in doesn't it? |
| 15:36.27 | jsmith | I'll bet they're not using PRI lines for their incoming lines... |
| 15:36.46 | jsmith | I'll bet they're just channelized T1s (CAS lines) with some sort of DID/ANI hack... |
| 15:37.18 | hans | ah, fun |
| 15:37.39 | hans | i wonder if there's a way to look up names from number online and substitute that. :) |
| 15:38.49 | vontrapp | http://whitepages.com/10001/search/Reverse_Phone?phone=<number> |
| 15:38.58 | vontrapp | but then you have to parse through a crapload of html |
| 15:39.21 | hans | yeah, need some sort of api. maybe google has one |
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| 15:45.13 | vontrapp | ~roll jebar |
| 15:45.17 | ibot | ACTION stuffs jebar in a hamster ball and rolls it down a steep, snow-covered mountain |
| 15:55.46 | hans | how does one make firefox forget my http basic auth credentials without restarting? |
| 16:02.44 | graphyx | hack the source code and put in a forget credentials button? |
| 16:12.29 | jebar | hans: need to chat |
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| 16:46.56 | *** join/#utah macnewbold (n=mac@69.2.248.251) |
| 16:48.52 | macnewbold | are there any good programmers in here who are looking for a part-time to full-time opportunity? small company, lots of fun, doing php/mysql web database applications. Good pay and no PHP experience required. |
| 17:05.32 | vontrapp | ~lart hans |
| 17:06.31 | mheath | macnewbold, yes! |
| 17:07.41 | macnewbold | mheath: send me an email w/some info about yourself (portfolio/resume/whatever) and what your interests/expectations would be, to info@codegreene.com, subject "part-time position" |
| 17:08.35 | mheath | macnewbold, can this wait until around 2:30 this afternoon? |
| 17:08.44 | mheath | I'm on lunch right now, and in a hurry |
| 17:08.52 | macnewbold | sure, no rush |
| 17:09.01 | macnewbold | it's not like we're going to fill the position before the end of the day |
| 17:09.05 | macnewbold | :-D |
| 17:09.20 | mheath | macnewbold, I'll e-mail you in a few hours then :0 |
| 17:09.23 | macnewbold | we don't have an urgent need (yet), but we do have a growing need |
| 17:09.23 | mheath | * :) |
| 17:10.53 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@byu291094wks.byu.edu) |
| 17:12.12 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@209.210.254.169) |
| 17:12.23 | mheath | macnewbold, oh, one quick question before I get my hopes up....where is your company located? |
| 17:12.59 | macnewbold | SLC - what are your requirements? |
| 17:13.08 | macnewbold | telecommute could be a possibility for the right person |
| 17:15.57 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@byu291932wks.byu.edu) |
| 17:20.18 | mheath | macnewbold, what area of SLC? |
| 17:20.26 | mheath | I'm in Ogden, but don't mind a commute. |
| 17:21.03 | mheath | ...as long as its for a good job :) |
| 17:21.09 | macnewbold | mheath: we're in Foothill Village, so you come down I-15 and then up I-80, and we're about 3 minutes down the road. |
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| 17:21.26 | macnewbold | everyone here thinks it's a good job :) |
| 17:21.47 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@128.187.220.69) |
| 17:22.47 | mheath | macnewbold, pay? |
| 17:24.32 | *** join/#utah spr (n=spr@128.187.222.39) |
| 17:24.49 | macnewbold | depending on the person, $15-20/hr for a more entry-level position, or probably up to $30/hr for a more experienced person |
| 17:25.05 | macnewbold | then moving up from there with raises and such |
| 17:25.24 | mheath | wow, I'll discuss this more with you when I get back |
| 17:25.27 | mheath | I'm running a bit late... |
| 17:25.30 | macnewbold | sorry :) |
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| 17:32.14 | vontrapp | macnewbold: what kind of stuff are you working on? |
| 17:32.46 | macnewbold | one of our big clients is this site: www.3-form.com |
| 17:32.48 | macnewbold | for example |
| 17:33.01 | macnewbold | quite a bit of e-commerce stuff, and other database-driven sites |
| 17:33.24 | macnewbold | see www.codegreene.com for links to some of the sites we've done |
| 17:33.56 | macnewbold | if you and hans are both interested, we may consider a Fugal tag-team for the position(s) |
| 17:33.59 | macnewbold | ;) |
| 17:35.37 | *** join/#utah Maquis (n=Maquis@71-36-83-231.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 17:35.52 | Maquis | howdy all |
| 17:36.14 | vontrapp | that's a lot of flash |
| 17:37.25 | Maquis | ?? |
| 17:37.39 | Maquis | wow... lots of people today |
| 17:37.51 | macnewbold | our home page has a flash thing on it that my partner liked, but we rarely touch flash |
| 17:38.07 | macnewbold | and even when the customer insists, we minimize it as much as possible |
| 17:38.18 | jebar | what type of e-commerce are you working on |
| 17:38.43 | jebar | store front? backend stuff? |
| 17:38.54 | macnewbold | the normal type... product database, shopping cart, and either on-line or off-line CC processing or PayPal integration |
| 17:38.59 | macnewbold | all of the above, jebar |
| 17:39.15 | macnewbold | most of our stuff includes a custom cart and such |
| 17:39.24 | macnewbold | php db-driven web site, etc. |
| 17:39.40 | macnewbold | take a look at some of the sites on our home page for examples |
| 17:39.41 | vontrapp | macnewbold: yeah, the code green page is just an effect, no functionality depends on it |
| 17:39.47 | macnewbold | yeah, exactly |
| 17:39.50 | vontrapp | the 3-form one though |
| 17:39.50 | jebar | cool stuff, worked with a company doing that same stuff but in C |
| 17:40.00 | macnewbold | yeah, I do'nt like the 3form home page either |
| 17:40.03 | jebar | will do |
| 17:40.22 | macnewbold | there are very few places where they actually made the flash do something important, like be the menu or something |
| 17:40.29 | macnewbold | and we tried to talk them out of it, |
| 17:40.42 | macnewbold | but they used to have a graphic designer that thought flash was the cat's pajamas and all that |
| 17:41.25 | vontrapp | well then the cat goes to bed and what've you got? |
| 17:41.26 | macnewbold | luckily we know a guy who does flash that uses the FlashVars thing to pass in variables from the php/html into the flash script, so we can often get a flash that we can control and tweak from the outside |
| 17:41.34 | macnewbold | vontrapp: exactly |
| 17:43.07 | *** join/#utah Maquis_ (n=Maquis@monsters.cs.byu.edu) |
| 17:44.03 | vontrapp | and being comfortable in those flashy pajamas, the cat will resist change, esp taking his pajamas ;) |
| 17:44.31 | vontrapp | ~lart macnewbold |
| 17:44.46 | vontrapp | heh, oops, that was meant for Maquis |
| 17:44.47 | macnewbold | ~shakespeare vontrapp |
| 17:44.48 | ibot | ACTION stands up and quotes Shakespeare: vontrapp - Thou tottering pottle-deep moldwarp! |
| 17:45.07 | macnewbold | ~greet Maquis |
| 17:45.10 | ibot | ACTION says Hi to Maquis with a smirk |
| 17:45.16 | Maquis | howdy |
| 17:49.26 | vontrapp | macnewbold: you're tempting me, i'll send a resume when i get it dusted, updated, and spiffed |
| 17:49.43 | Maquis | macnewbold: you trying to recruit? |
| 17:49.51 | macnewbold | sure, or send us a dusty unspiffed one |
| 17:49.55 | macnewbold | either way |
| 17:50.19 | macnewbold | Maquis: yep, you interested? |
| 17:50.23 | Maquis | for what? |
| 17:50.35 | macnewbold | I said: are there any good programmers in here who are looking for a part-time to full-time opportunity? small company, lots of fun, doing php/mysql web database applications. Good pay and no PHP experience required. |
| 17:50.47 | macnewbold | if anyone is interested, send me an email w/some info about yourself (portfolio/resume/whatever) and what your interests/expectations would be, to info@codegreene.com, subject "part-time position" |
| 17:51.09 | macnewbold | see www.codegreene.com for links to some of the sites we've done |
| 17:51.17 | macnewbold | depending on the person, $15-20/hr for a more entry-level position, or probably up to $30/hr for a more experienced person |
| 17:51.18 | Maquis | is it flexible/ |
| 17:51.27 | macnewbold | yep |
| 17:51.39 | Maquis | where would it be? |
| 17:52.24 | macnewbold | SLC, Foothill Dr. - but telecommute may be an option after the first little while |
| 17:52.29 | macnewbold | hours are pretty flexible - we're here from 8am-6pm typically, so those are the most productive times, |
| 17:52.32 | macnewbold | but working in off-hours wouldn't be unheard of |
| 17:52.36 | macnewbold | it is a big plus if you're at least available in an urgent situation that may arise during work hours |
| 17:53.14 | Maquis | slc is a long ways away |
| 17:53.26 | macnewbold | you in Orem or Provo? |
| 17:53.30 | macnewbold | or further? |
| 17:53.32 | Maquis | provo |
| 17:53.55 | macnewbold | we're not far off the freeway, it's a few exits up I-80 from the I-15 junction |
| 17:54.25 | RyanE | That's still about 40 minutes from Provo, though. |
| 17:54.33 | RyanE | with good traffic. |
| 17:59.36 | macnewbold | yeah, more or less |
| 18:00.05 | macnewbold | but if you want to come in at 10am instead of 8am, that's fine with us |
| 18:00.06 | *** part/#utah jebar (n=jebarlow@2.wencor.com) |
| 18:00.34 | macnewbold | and after things are rolling, telecommute is very possible |
| 18:04.57 | *** join/#utah Hhhhh (n=cristoba@c-67-169-244-47.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 18:05.39 | Hhhhh | hello |
| 18:10.28 | tene | Hhhhhi |
| 18:21.21 | *** join/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/active/bucky) |
| 18:28.28 | Jayce^ | ugh, worked up in that area for a while, that's a lousy commute from orem |
| 18:28.48 | vontrapp | ~commute Jayce^ |
| 18:52.11 | harleypig | vontrapp turns Jayce^ into a quivering mass of green jello |
| 19:04.55 | harleypig | If I want ibot to monitor a channel, how can I get it to do that? Or do I have to put in a request to its master? |
| 19:10.20 | harleypig | Oh. I see +chan |
| 19:16.07 | macnewbold | harleypig: I think you also have to have TimRiker tell the bot that it's okay to be in that channel |
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| 19:17.25 | *** part/#utah macnewbold (n=mac@69.2.248.251) |
| 19:20.20 | levi | Man, is everyone at class now or something? |
| 19:22.14 | Maquis | levi: i'm here |
| 19:23.28 | levi | How's it going? |
| 19:23.33 | Maquis | ok |
| 19:23.38 | Maquis | network's really slow |
| 19:23.51 | Maquis | still don't have a network connection in our appartment |
| 19:24.08 | levi | Bummer. How come? |
| 19:24.18 | Maquis | so, it's knd-of annoying |
| 19:24.34 | Maquis | my roommate has the internet/cable under her name, so she has to be the one to go pick up the cable modem from comcast |
| 19:24.37 | Maquis | i tried, and they wouldn't let me get it |
| 19:24.40 | Maquis | she doesn't see why we need it |
| 19:24.53 | tensai | Maquis: they've got AOL disks at walmart. why not try that out? I hear it's awesome. |
| 19:25.15 | bucky | what kind of nutcase pays for DSL and then doesn't use it? |
| 19:25.17 | Maquis | i've been trying to convince her that yes, we do actually need internet in our apartment if for no other reason than that my server doesn't have wireless |
| 19:25.32 | Maquis | bucky: it's cable... |
| 19:25.41 | Maquis | and i don't think she's actually added the internet to the bill yet |
| 19:25.49 | Maquis | but yeah |
| 19:26.15 | Maquis | i can catch a couple wireless networks from here, but they go in and out and i have to run kismet about once an hour to figure out which one to use |
| 19:26.24 | graphyx | Just tell them that you have to get the modem for your report to turn in on your online class, that your friend would have picked it up, but she just got in a car crash and can't come down for a couple more days when they let her out the hospital and that she wrote up this note to give you permission to pick it up and it only looks really bad cause she did it with her other hand cause her right hand is in a cast and that if you could just get the homework turned |
| 19:26.27 | Maquis | it'd be nice if i actually understood the output from kismet |
| 19:26.39 | graphyx | and then break into tears.. |
| 19:26.41 | graphyx | always works. |
| 19:26.51 | bucky | it's the "I'm the center of the Universe" syndrome... I don't need it.. why would you? |
| 19:26.59 | Maquis | bucky: yeah |
| 19:27.19 | Maquis | really |
| 19:27.26 | Maquis | i'm putting a lot of effort into it |
| 19:27.30 | Maquis | it's just... hard |
| 19:27.54 | Maquis | why it's hard, or why i'm putting effort into it? |
| 19:28.00 | bucky | both |
| 19:28.14 | levi | Ew, this ointment for my eczema is greasy. |
| 19:28.31 | Maquis | bucky: it's hard because i don't have much at all in common with them |
| 19:28.54 | Maquis | i'm putting effort into it because we're going to be living together for 12 months |
| 19:29.07 | bucky | i've run into that problem... i don't need a note from Hinckley everytime i should share |
| 19:29.29 | Maquis | bucky: huh? |
| 19:29.50 | jsmith | But c'mon, this is happy valley... doesn't everyone get along? |
| 19:30.12 | Maquis | jsmith: when was the last time you shared an apartment with a bunch of girls? |
| 19:30.13 | Maquis | :) |
| 19:30.17 | bucky | i just got one mass mailing done here from Hinckley that said treat bucky fair and that lasted one day |
| 19:30.48 | bucky | they all got a CTR ring |
| 19:30.55 | bucky | all i got was this shirt |
| 19:30.59 | jsmith | Maquis: Good question... |
| 19:31.28 | Maquis | jsmith: try it some time... you might have a better understanding of the "doesn't everyone get along?" point |
| 19:31.50 | bucky | i have four sisters... we grew up in a two bedroom mobile home |
| 19:32.06 | bucky | no problems |
| 19:32.24 | jsmith | Maquis: I can only imagine... see, I don't even have any sisters, so I have a hard time relating |
| 19:32.42 | Maquis | see, here's something i've noticed over time |
| 19:32.47 | bucky | i don't think gender has much to do with it |
| 19:33.04 | Maquis | when two guys get mad at each other, they generally go and talk to each other (or beat each other up), and then they get over it |
| 19:33.11 | jsmith | Maquis: Why can't you just act like guys, punch each other for a few minutes, and then be firends the rest of the year? |
| 19:33.12 | bucky | of course women can't hold the priesthood.. maybe that makes a difference |
| 19:33.39 | bucky | men are morally superior |
| 19:33.51 | Maquis | ~lart bucky |
| 19:35.56 | jsmith | Maquis: It is interesting that females in general seem to hold grudges a lot longer than males, from what I can tell |
| 19:36.37 | bucky | what doe that have to do with this bitch going and getting the dam modem? |
| 19:36.51 | Maquis | bucky: language |
| 19:37.04 | Maquis | and it is just yet another thing that's bugging me right now |
| 19:37.21 | Maquis | and me trying to remember that i'm working on getting along with them |
| 19:37.25 | bucky | good.. my turn |
| 19:37.43 | Maquis | your turn |
| 19:38.05 | bucky | my Aunt comes down here and moves in with my mom because she can't get along with her son's (the radiologist) wife |
| 19:39.07 | bucky | she washes one garment at a time in my moms washer on high water level-hot wash/warm rinse on my mother's propane |
| 19:39.15 | *** join/#utah jebar (n=jebarlow@2.wencor.com) |
| 19:39.45 | bucky | my mother lives in a 500 sq ft apt because my aunt crowded her out |
| 19:40.18 | bucky | her son has more money than God.. he should be taking care of his own mother instead of leaving it up to my mother |
| 19:40.55 | bucky | that's just for starters |
| 19:43.02 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@128.187.134.171) |
| 19:45.20 | tene | bucky: are you going to continue? |
| 19:45.53 | bucky | i have enough for a couple of years... we'll spread it out |
| 19:51.49 | graphyx | that must be a lot of money... |
| 19:58.27 | goozbach | just think of the poker hands you could play with that kind of money |
| 20:02.22 | hans | poker would be boring. starship racing. |
| 20:06.01 | levi | Woo, starship racing! |
| 20:06.44 | levi | My ship can make the Kessel run in less than 12 parsecs! |
| 20:08.11 | levi | Maquis: It's a Han Solo quote. |
| 20:08.12 | Jayce^ | actually, not time (according to the official breakdown)... |
| 20:08.20 | Jayce^ | we've actually had this discussion :) |
| 20:08.24 | Maquis | parsecs are a measure of distance! |
| 20:08.28 | Jayce^ | yes |
| 20:08.33 | Maquis | that's like saying that i can drive the course in less than 10 miles |
| 20:08.38 | Jayce^ | and that's what he's describing, is disctance |
| 20:08.46 | Jayce^ | and yes, that's what he's doing |
| 20:08.57 | levi | The quote makes no sense, and it didn't make any sense in the movie, but I quoted it nonetheless. |
| 20:09.02 | hans | remember hyperspace is an instantaneous thing |
| 20:09.17 | hans | but you can't jump through stuff, or land in bad stuff |
| 20:09.22 | Jayce^ | hans, weren't you the one repeating the explination last time we covered this? |
| 20:09.35 | hans | so you have to plot a course. the more "maneuverable" your ship is, the shorter the course, and the faster the time |
| 20:09.40 | hans | probably |
| 20:10.01 | Maquis | man... if that's the explanation, how long is the kessel run? |
| 20:10.10 | graphyx | makes sense that hans would know it.. |
| 20:10.28 | levi | hans: Except 'parsec' is defined in relation to the Earth's orbit around the sun, and Star Wars is in a galaxy far, far away. |
| 20:10.38 | graphyx | and perhaps "only" hans knowing makes sense to.. since hans would then be solo on that fact. |
| 20:10.53 | hans | the kessel run is a jog around a portion of the galaxy through/near some particularly nasty nebulas, black hole clusters, etc. |
| 20:10.55 | graphyx | levi: it would be a translation of units into our terms. |
| 20:11.08 | hans | levi: universal translator. ;-) |
| 20:11.27 | hans | i can't remember if lucas claimed he made that line on purpose or if the justification is after-the-fact |
| 20:11.38 | Maquis | 12 parsecs is around 40 light yeras |
| 20:11.39 | levi | Well, if it's just a homophone for our 'parsec', it could be a unit of time! |
| 20:11.43 | Maquis | s/yeras/years |
| 20:12.00 | hans | personally I think it's more likely he just goofed, but it sounds like a perhaps plausible way to describe things in that world |
| 20:12.13 | levi | hans: Yeah, I think the explanation is a retcon. |
| 20:12.19 | hans | no homophone. wisiwim |
| 20:13.43 | hans | or maybet hat should be wyhiwim |
| 20:13.44 | tensai | why wouldn't they use the word parsec? English itself is very Earth-based but somehow Han can speak that. |
| 20:17.20 | dataw0lf | hans: actually, the kessel run is a straight of space outside the Kessel system where they export spice, where Imperials lurked. It was one of the known harder smuggling runs in the Galaxy. |
| 20:18.33 | hans | my hasty description comes from what I remember in the solo books (actually I have yet to read the third) |
| 20:18.46 | dataw0lf | smugglers would have to navigate through a cluster of black holes, using the gravitational pull to sling themselves quicker. |
| 20:19.01 | hans | probably hutt gambit. I remember a nebula of some sort and skirting the black hole cluster |
| 20:19.01 | dataw0lf | well, I'm a Star Wars aficionado ;) |
| 20:19.08 | levi | That's almost certainly a retcon to cover for his slip. |
| 20:19.20 | hans | but wasn't the point that they had to go around the black holes? |
| 20:19.40 | hans | or around something. it wasn't straight. |
| 20:19.40 | Maquis | grr... can anybody get to the information on what time various lots open/close at byu? |
| 20:19.45 | Maquis | i'm particularly trying to get info about the lot by the cannon center |
| 20:19.59 | Maquis | (or if anybody happens to know what time it's open for people without a permit for the lot? |
| 20:20.03 | Maquis | i can't get to the site |
| 20:20.13 | dataw0lf | hans: yeah, they used the black hole cluster to go faster |
| 20:20.15 | hans | Maquis: probably 8pm. every semester more and more lots are closed until 8 |
| 20:20.16 | dataw0lf | smugglers that is |
| 20:20.24 | Maquis | hans: :( |
| 20:20.40 | Maquis | i think heritage is still open at 4 |
| 20:20.47 | Maquis | i was hoping the cannon center would be that way too |
| 20:20.55 | Maquis | since i'm meeting some friends there at 6 tonight |
| 20:20.58 | hans | but don't you have one of them free y stickers? |
| 20:21.20 | Maquis | it's not a y lot |
| 20:21.41 | Maquis | and i haven't bothered to get a free parking sticker, because my apartment is closer to campus than most Y lots |
| 20:21.45 | goozbach | are there any gpg key management guis out there? |
| 20:21.57 | Maquis | goozbach: i've heard of some |
| 20:22.01 | Maquis | never used any, though |
| 20:22.14 | hans | gpa I think is the good one |
| 20:22.21 | hans | gnu privacy assistant or something |
| 20:22.27 | Jayce^ | he'll teach you better than to use one of those :-p |
| 20:22.39 | Jayce^ | kgpg is pretty good for kde though :) |
| 20:27.16 | goozbach | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Falcon |
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| 20:58.05 | jebar | hans: data moved |
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| 21:26.44 | *** join/#utah brandon_ (n=brandon@beatties.us) |
| 21:28.31 | brandon_ | .. so I need to access a nfs share behind a firewall. Is it better to connect with some sort of vpn or secure tunnel, or remap nfs going out this system to say port 80, then when the packets get to the firewall, have it change the port back to 4 from 80 when coming from a specific ip? |
| 21:29.07 | *** join/#utah fungus (n=fungus@2001:470:1f00:645:20a:95ff:fec5:636a) |
| 21:31.21 | tene | brandon_: use a VPN |
| 21:31.56 | brandon_ | tenetene: what ports will a vpn run on? I'm limited for which outbound and inbound ports are usable |
| 21:37.47 | graphyx | any port you set it up on. |
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| 22:02.35 | mrpull__ | whoa. WinFS is in beta now. I thought it wasn't going to be finished for years. |
| 22:06.13 | *** part/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@obelix.cs.byu.edu) |
| 22:10.48 | brandon_ | I thiIsn't ext3 still considered beta? it's 7 years old? |
| 22:14.40 | fungus | WinXP should still be considered beta. |
| 22:16.16 | mrpull__ | fungus: bah, i've had way fewer crashes with XP than with my linux _desktops_ |
| 22:17.27 | mheath | mrpull, how'd you manage that? |
| 22:17.43 | mheath | I run huge amounts of beta, and large amounts of alpha, software on this desktop |
| 22:17.48 | mheath | and almost never have any problems |
| 22:19.45 | mrpull__ | mheath: crappy wifi drivers |
| 22:19.59 | levi | mheath: The other day when I was wondering what had happened to your plans to do CS research, I wasn't thinking of someone else after all. |
| 22:20.50 | levi | mheath: Though, I also found where you announced that you'd changed your mind. |
| 22:22.55 | levi | Remember, you were planning on going to Weber State or something and then transferring to a school in Amsterdam for a graduate degree that involved distributed operating systems. Because that's where the Amoeba people are. |
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| 22:23.59 | *** part/#utah mindjuju (n=mindjuju@216.20.238.225) |
| 22:23.59 | levi | Anyway, that's what I was referring to (in rather vague terms, I admit) when you were claiming I was thinking of someone else. |
| 22:24.55 | dataw0lf | fungus: How should XP still be considered beta? It's a half decent operating system. |
| 22:25.12 | dataw0lf | or is that just a blind attack on Microsoft? |
| 22:25.38 | fungus | exactly, only half decent. (actually just a stupid joke.) |
| 22:26.12 | dataw0lf | I see. |
| 22:26.19 | levi | Speaking of Microsoft, apparently the project manager for Visual C++ or something like that is going to come speak to my UVSC lecture series class. |
| 22:26.26 | levi | I wonder what he's going to talk about. |
| 22:26.43 | dataw0lf | probably will desperately try to sell .NET |
| 22:27.49 | levi | I don't think the whole CLR idea is fundamentally flawed, but I'm not crazy about the particular implementation tradeoffs they made. |
| 22:29.14 | dataw0lf | I'd rather use it than Java. |
| 22:31.27 | levi | You'd rather use C# than Java, or the .net CLR than the JVM? |
| 22:35.38 | levi | They both define enough language semantics into the virtual machine that their flexibility is limited when bringing semantically different languages to them. |
| 22:36.51 | RyanE | levi: I'm just a lazy typist, I'd rather do C#, only because my hands hurt less. :) |
| 22:38.04 | levi | I would rather see something that works more like Parrot. |
| 22:38.25 | RyanE | levi: and Java left a bad taste in my mouth from: 1) deprecating functions left and right and 2) Swing being really bloated. Of course, there are now likely solutions to both of those problems, since last time I tried Java for work was... 3 jobs ago (~6 years) |
| 22:39.08 | Maquis | struts is still painful |
| 22:39.22 | levi | RyanE: No, Java is even more bloated than ever. |
| 22:39.48 | RyanE | I was specifically referring to a graphical toolkit. There's alternatives to Swing, from what I understand, that aren't as bloated and slow as swing was. |
| 22:40.10 | RyanE | I'm certain Java is still bloated, and *anything* 'Enterprise' is painful, no matter the language. |
| 22:40.21 | levi | I don't want to program in either C# or Java, though, so I'd like a virtual machine that supports something other than C# and Java clones. |
| 22:40.48 | levi | Nor do I really want to program "Enterprise" software. |
| 22:40.56 | RyanE | wise decision, that last one. |
| 22:41.16 | levi | Unless it's somehow Star Trek related, and maybe not even then. ;) |
| 22:41.27 | RyanE | I don't know what I'd program in if I had my choice, but generally, the employer decides, so now I do C# and C++. |
| 22:41.44 | RyanE | only because I haven't tried Ruby or Python |
| 22:42.10 | levi | I program in whatever I can get to run on my embedded device, so currently C, though we're using Python and Perl for C code generation. |
| 22:42.27 | RyanE | and I still have scars from Lisp in College. |
| 22:42.47 | Maquis | RyanE: be careful saying that around levi |
| 22:42.54 | levi | I code in Lisp for fun. :) |
| 22:43.06 | RyanE | yeah, some of our C++ code runs on embedded controller devices, but you really can't call them 'embedded', since they actually run Linux and are pretty full-featured.. |
| 22:43.10 | RyanE | levi: I know. :) |
| 22:43.38 | levi | Well, my code runs on fairly full-featured Linux systems too, but they're still embedded. |
| 22:43.44 | RyanE | like everyone, my opinions are based on my experiences, which for Lisp and Java was NOT under ideal conditions. |
| 22:43.57 | RyanE | s/was/were |
| 22:44.17 | levi | It's just that the current one has some funky CPU, and I can't even get a g++ cross-compiler built. |
| 22:44.25 | Maquis | d |
| 22:45.00 | RyanE | I had separate experiences with Java and Lisp, is what I was trying to convey, that each of those caused my opinions of them individually. |
| 22:46.03 | bucky | you can generate wrapper code for thirteen different languages with swig |
| 22:46.14 | levi | Thanks to scott, I now have way cool Lisp books with which to increase my Lisp mastery. Paradigms of Artificial Intelligence Programming, by Peter Norvig, is just amazing. |
| 22:47.16 | Maquis | (in case you didn't notice) |
| 22:47.25 | levi | Maquis: Hack some code! |
| 22:47.38 | Maquis | levi: i would... but i'm trying to do homework |
| 22:47.44 | RyanE | Smack some roommates! |
| 22:47.47 | mheath | I'm trying to come up with a project to work on in Java... |
| 22:47.54 | levi | Maquis: Oh, well, no excuse for getting bored, then. |
| 22:48.07 | Maquis | RyanE: they ran away for an hour! |
| 22:48.07 | mheath | I've had a lot of ideas floating around, but I'm notsure what to work on, and I'm feeling kind of unmotivated lately. |
| 22:48.34 | Maquis | mheath: remove the "in Java" from the sentence and i'll have a bit more respect for you... |
| 22:49.05 | mheath | Maquis, remove the java programming class from my schedule and I will. |
| 22:49.13 | levi | Java works much better when you have a pretty good idea of what you want to code. |
| 22:49.22 | Maquis | mheath: is the project for class? |
| 22:49.41 | mheath | Yeah, sort of *shrug* |
| 22:55.21 | tene | mheath: ask yourself this: what is Java *good* for? |
| 22:56.09 | bucky | LimeWire |
| 22:59.33 | Maquis | tene: ooh! i know! bogging down a system? |
| 23:01.10 | Supaplex | wake up juice |
| 23:01.42 | *** join/#utah Bucky_ (n=chatzill@66.207.116.158) |
| 23:01.49 | Maquis | Supaplex: can i have some? it could really come in handy |
| 23:02.09 | Supaplex | sure, help yourself |
| 23:02.15 | Bucky_ | hrm |
| 23:02.26 | Maquis | Bucky_: you have a tail! |
| 23:02.28 | *** part/#utah Bucky_ (n=chatzill@66.207.116.158) |
| 23:03.08 | Supaplex | heh |
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