| 00:06.47 | bonez39 | what is an .odt file? |
| 00:37.09 | *** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@216-190-206-130.customer.csolutions.net) |
| 00:37.49 | goozbach | WOOT!!! |
| 00:37.58 | goozbach | one step closer to a yum install openacs |
| 01:14.49 | hans | ~seen jsmith |
| 01:14.53 | ibot | jsmith <n=jsmith@64.50.35.114.2O7.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #uphpu, 4h 59m 37s ago, saying: 's/smaked/smacked/'. |
| 01:57.55 | levi | Yay, I finally have my blog theme un-broken in IE and Opera. |
| 01:58.17 | levi | hans: See http://lifeoflevi.com/blog/ if you haven't seen the new theme. |
| 01:58.24 | levi | Time for me to head home. |
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| 02:06.00 | *** join/#utah wps (n=wade@65.73.113.199) |
| 02:06.54 | goozbach | MLB++ |
| 02:06.59 | RyanE_ | levi: xmission must've bumped their NS or something, it seems to resolve your website again. |
| 02:12.00 | goozbach | levi: it evdn looks good on the treo |
| 02:13.01 | goozbach | er even |
| 02:14.09 | goozbach | slow night |
| 02:14.42 | RyanE_ | yep |
| 02:20.33 | goozbach | blargfooblarg |
| 02:27.39 | goozbach | boring |
| 02:27.58 | goozbach | even this game is boring |
| 02:36.33 | *** join/#utah markl (i=mark@dsl093-225-128.slc1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 02:37.12 | goozbach | ~entertain me |
| 02:37.40 | goozbach | ~dance |
| 02:37.40 | ibot | "ah, ah, ah, ah, stayin' alive, stayin' alive" |
| 03:11.53 | xbmodder | scary. |
| 03:12.41 | mheath | xbmodder: keep your bot off the channel from now on, please! |
| 03:13.00 | xbmodder | what'd he do? |
| 03:13.27 | mheath | xbmodder: kept telling random people that he was experiencing errors, and to contact you for more information |
| 03:13.44 | xbmodder | oh that error |
| 03:13.47 | xbmodder | stupid bot |
| 03:13.54 | xbmodder | Need to wack it |
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| 03:20.33 | xbmodder | amcnabb, amcnabb_ sup? |
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| 05:35.55 | *** join/#utah Hhhhh (n=cristoba@c-67-169-244-47.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 05:36.25 | Hhhhh | hello |
| 05:52.27 | tensai | hi |
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| 06:12.57 | xbmodder | ~lart kechub |
| 06:13.07 | xbmodder | ~insult kechub |
| 06:14.01 | xbmodder | ~urbandict rofhs |
| 06:14.06 | xbmodder | ~dict rofhs |
| 06:15.58 | Hhhhh | ~insult xbmodder |
| 06:16.00 | xbmodder | Microsoft Proposes Cooperative Research With OSD w00t! |
| 06:16.07 | xbmodder | wow... |
| 06:16.09 | Hhhhh | lol |
| 06:16.10 | xbmodder | ~lart ibot |
| 06:16.14 | xbmodder | lol |
| 06:16.24 | xbmodder | ~lart Hhhhh |
| 06:16.34 | xbmodder | !say roulette |
| 06:16.45 | xbmodder | ~roulette |
| 06:16.46 | ibot | ACTION watches xbmodder pull the trigger: Click! |
| 06:16.55 | xbmodder | ~say ~roulette |
| 06:16.55 | ibot | ~roulette |
| 06:16.58 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 06:16.58 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 06:17.14 | xbmodder | ~roulette |
| 06:17.14 | ibot | ACTION watches xbmodder pull the trigger: Click! |
| 06:17.23 | xbmodder | Hhhhh, your turn |
| 06:17.26 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 06:17.26 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: Click! |
| 06:17.40 | xbmodder | ~roulette |
| 06:17.40 | ibot | ACTION watches xbmodder pull the trigger: BANG! |
| 06:17.49 | Hhhhh | R.I.P. |
| 06:17.56 | xbmodder | thank you |
| 06:17.59 | Hhhhh | ~roulette |
| 06:17.59 | ibot | ACTION watches hhhhh pull the trigger: BANG! |
| 06:18.04 | Hhhhh | AHHHHH! |
| 06:18.04 | xbmodder | lol |
| 06:20.33 | xbmodder | Hhhhh, how are thee? |
| 06:20.52 | Hhhhh | *dead* |
| 06:21.05 | xbmodder | sounds... dead |
| 06:21.09 | Hhhhh | I guess we're in the spirit world |
| 06:24.10 | *** join/#utah dataw0lf- (n=dataw0lf@c-24-10-173-249.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 06:30.16 | xbmodder | cool |
| 06:30.24 | xbmodder | dataw0lf, hello --from the spirit world |
| 06:39.55 | dataw0lf- | ... |
| 06:40.15 | dataw0lf- | righto. |
| 06:41.08 | xbmodder | lol |
| 07:24.25 | *** join/#utah ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 07:24.25 | *** topic/#utah is The source for OSS focused discussion in Utah. See sllug.org, uphpu.org, plug.org, uug.byu.edu, uvlug.org, fslc.usu.edu, nupm.org, utwaa.org, oalug.com. See planetutah.adelantellc.com for aggregate feed |
| 07:24.25 | *** mode/#utah [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
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| 13:23.25 | hans | this whole ubuntu's apt complaining about everyone else's md5 sums is getting old. this has to be a FAQ - how do you turn md5 checking off? |
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| 13:25.02 | usynic | hans: I wouldn't mind knowing that either... |
| 13:43.41 | dataw0lf | usynic / hans: tried a --force-yes? |
| 13:44.15 | hans | still |
| 13:44.16 | hans | Failed to fetch http://kanotix.com/files/debian/./pool/n/nx/nx_1.4.92+1.5.0.orig.tar.gz MD5Sum mismatch |
| 13:44.20 | hans | E: Failed to fetch some archives. |
| 13:44.24 | hans | tried this too: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=20839&highlight=gpg |
| 13:44.38 | hans | apt-get update doesn't complain anymore, but same end result. |
| 13:45.01 | dataw0lf | you can't just download them and manually install them? |
| 13:45.34 | hans | that's what I'm doing. I downloaded it manually and untarred/patched/chmod'ed bin/rules |
| 13:46.11 | hans | it's just annoying. it's also annoying to have to say yes I really want to install such and such package (but at least it asks me in that case) |
| 13:46.33 | hans | i think gpg signing is great, but it's obviously broken and I would just as soon not test it. |
| 13:47.32 | graphyx | wait... Did someone just suggest a "Just click yes" approach to installing software on linux? |
| 13:47.58 | hans | what do you mean? |
| 13:48.25 | dataw0lf | yes, a ubuntu contractor just suggested to use --force-yes to force md5 sum check auth... anything else? |
| 13:48.41 | dataw0lf | hans: yeah, it's annoying, and a problem. |
| 13:49.08 | graphyx | Just amused at the parallels to windows philosophy. |
| 13:49.12 | hans | i don't even mind that it's on by default (since it (hopefully) always works with ubuntu repositories) |
| 13:49.22 | hans | i'd just like to know how to turn it off |
| 13:49.24 | dataw0lf | there are no parallels, you're just trolling. try again. |
| 13:50.00 | dataw0lf | hans: I honestly, off the top of my head, have no idea how to turn it off. I'll look into it and hit you back up. |
| 13:50.13 | hans | thanks |
| 13:50.32 | dataw0lf | np |
| 13:52.52 | resplin | hans: if I'm understanding your problem (I just came into the conversation) you want to set GPG-Check: false in /etc/apt/apt.conf |
| 13:53.13 | resplin | On second thought, you want to leave out the colon. |
| 13:53.56 | resplin | I haven't tried it, but yum uses something similar and Google suggests that this should work. |
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| 14:01.12 | dataw0lf | aha, thanks for jogging my memory resplin. |
| 14:01.55 | dataw0lf | hans: you can create a file called 00Gpg or 00Local or whatever to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/ and add the line GPG::Check false |
| 14:02.06 | resplin | I'm glad to help. I get much assistance on this channel (especially from hans) and it's a pleasure to return the favor when I can. |
| 14:04.17 | dataw0lf | oops, add a semi colon after, like so: GPG::Check false; |
| 14:04.19 | dataw0lf | and it'll work |
| 14:04.34 | dataw0lf | resplin: that's certainly the best part about the Linux community. |
| 14:04.51 | dataw0lf | exchange of information. |
| 14:05.04 | resplin | Absolutely. |
| 14:10.02 | dataw0lf | Me and the morning are rather disagreeable with each other. |
| 14:10.34 | graphyx | Well if you get into a fight with morning, I'd say just give in and take a nap.. ;) |
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| 14:19.06 | dataw0lf | graphyx: I'm at work, that's not a possibility. |
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| 14:19.26 | dataw0lf | osynic: I'm assuming you didn't catch that solution to the GPG signing. |
| 14:19.36 | osynic | dataw0lf: nope |
| 14:19.47 | dataw0lf | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:20.07 | dataw0lf | semi colon at the end : GPG::Check false; |
| 14:20.14 | osynic | cool |
| 14:21.05 | hans | fugalh@jebarlow:/tmp$ cat /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/00gpg |
| 14:21.05 | hans | GPG::Check false; |
| 14:21.10 | hans | still no dice |
| 14:21.21 | dataw0lf | hans: it's not working? |
| 14:21.53 | hans | nope |
| 14:23.50 | graphyx | dataw0lf: I figured... Just trying to be funny.. |
| 14:29.03 | *** part/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@216-190-206-130.customer.csolutions.net) |
| 14:29.15 | dataw0lf | graphyx: Sorry, wasn't trying to come off short. |
| 14:29.24 | ralphsnart | are any of you network or server administrators? |
| 14:29.37 | dataw0lf | hans: let me check with a friend to see if he has some reference for the apt.conf.d options available. |
| 14:29.42 | dataw0lf | ralphsnart: Yes, I am. |
| 14:29.48 | resplin | ralphsnart: most of us have some experience there. |
| 14:30.00 | ralphsnart | very nice i have questions |
| 14:30.07 | ralphsnart | oops a question |
| 14:30.32 | ralphsnart | what type of any monitoring software or shell scripts do you use to check on the status of your servers? |
| 14:31.30 | resplin | I found an excellent introduction to this by reading "man rrdtutorial" |
| 14:31.40 | resplin | Once you figure out that stuff, check out the Cacti project. |
| 14:33.49 | ralphsnart | excellent thank you. i'm presently just using a cron job pinging the server every 30 seconds or so, if it's not reachable, it emails my phone |
| 14:34.33 | dataw0lf | any redundancy? |
| 14:34.49 | ralphsnart | nope, that's why i was looking for a better way :) |
| 14:35.15 | resplin | Other valuable tools: smokeping, syslog-ng, and sec. |
| 14:35.26 | ralphsnart | smokeping? |
| 14:35.49 | resplin | It does pretty much what you are doing now (ping a server), but with pretty graphs. |
| 14:36.04 | ralphsnart | neato - reading now... |
| 14:36.12 | graphyx | with pretty graphs... |
| 14:36.25 | graphyx | This computer case is exactly the same as this other one.. but it has a neon light.. |
| 14:36.28 | ralphsnart | thank you guys for the info |
| 14:36.37 | graphyx | It is a cool feature, just makes me laugh. |
| 14:36.38 | resplin | ralphsnart: glad to be useful. |
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| 14:45.27 | dataw0lf | hans: argh, the best I can find is /usr/share/doc/apt/examples/configure-index.gz and there doesn't seem to be much that's relevant. |
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| 14:48.13 | *** mode/#utah [+o Jayce^] by ChanServ |
| 14:49.47 | dataw0lf | mrawr. |
| 14:49.57 | dataw0lf | hans: try APT::Get::AllowUnauthenticated 1 ; |
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| 14:56.12 | hans | ralphsnart: I use cacti for graphs and mon for notifications |
| 14:57.22 | dataw0lf | cacti is nice. |
| 15:00.45 | levi | Good morning. |
| 15:10.13 | ralphsnart | sweet, i'm going to check each of them out. mon? another new one to me.. |
| 15:16.37 | dataw0lf | morning levi |
| 15:16.37 | levi | dataw0lf: What's up? |
| 15:17.51 | dataw0lf | levi: Surprisingly, nothing too pressing at work, so I'm relaxing. |
| 15:17.52 | hans | ralphsnart: like nagios without the brain damage |
| 15:18.05 | levi | That's always nice. |
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| 15:18.22 | *** mode/#utah [+o Jayce^] by ChanServ |
| 15:18.51 | dataw0lf | levi: Yes, yes it is :) |
| 15:22.00 | jsmith | hans: But does it scale?!? |
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| 15:26.11 | ralphsnart | hans: so nagios is no good? |
| 15:31.15 | levi | Heh, nice: http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Dance_party_broken_up_by_police_in_Utah%2C_USA |
| 15:31.28 | jsmith | ralphsnart: Nagios is OK, up to a few hundred hosts. If you're trying to monitor more than that, it doesn't scale well. |
| 15:31.39 | jsmith | ralphsnart: Also, the configs are somewhat complex, and take a while to grasp. |
| 15:32.56 | ralphsnart | gotcha, thanks. we have 1 webserver i'll be using this on that runs like a VW beetle but i just purchased a shiny new server and i'd like to keep an eye on it |
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| 15:37.12 | neybar_work | levi, lol |
| 15:38.19 | levi | I sympathize with the poor ravers, but Utah County is really not a good choice for a venue. |
| 15:40.59 | JoshH | i saw a video of it getting broken up |
| 15:41.10 | JoshH | the cops were pointing their guns right at the dj's |
| 15:41.32 | JoshH | telling them to back away |
| 15:41.39 | JoshH | like the table was a bomb or something |
| 15:42.15 | JoshH | in my opinion its a ridiculous waste of law enforcement resources and an abuse of police power |
| 15:43.11 | JoshH | and it was in utah county, but it wasn't in the middle of some sleepy neighborhood or anything... it was in the mountains, away from the city |
| 15:44.06 | levi | Sure, but the people in Utah County don't really care where it takes place, just that they have jurisdiction to do something about it. |
| 15:44.09 | JoshH | on private property of course |
| 15:45.07 | levi | Utah County really hates the idea that kids might go dancing at night. |
| 15:45.09 | JoshH | the people in utah county shouldnt care what happens on someone elses private property unless it affects them somehow |
| 15:45.23 | levi | Sure, they shouldn't, but they do anyway. |
| 15:45.31 | Jayce^ | levi, I think the bigger problem is what goes on besides dancing at reves.. |
| 15:45.41 | Jayce^ | (spoken as somebody who used to go to a lot of them) |
| 15:45.50 | JoshH | but it wouldnt matter, even if it was in salt lake county the same thing would have happened |
| 15:45.52 | levi | Jayce^: Yeah, but that stuff goes on at legitimate concerts too. |
| 15:46.03 | JoshH | it goes on every night in every club |
| 15:46.13 | JoshH | raves are just on a larger scale |
| 15:46.26 | Jayce^ | true, but legitimate ones are *supposed* to have controls to stop it (we know that's crap of course) |
| 15:46.34 | JoshH | Jayce^: do you think a huge police force should have broken up woodstock because there were drugs there? |
| 15:47.12 | Jayce^ | JoshH, gotta understand, I actually like raves, and am a big proponent of property rights :) |
| 15:47.44 | Jayce^ | I do admit that we have some lame laws banning the stuff here, even on private property, so they have the right to stop it... |
| 15:47.45 | JoshH | also i heard from someone who was there that the story of the 17 year old girl overdosing on ecstasy was a lie, she had one pill and was fine |
| 15:47.55 | dataw0lf | c'mon |
| 15:48.02 | dataw0lf | national guard going to a rave? |
| 15:48.10 | dataw0lf | this is from a guy who's gone to alot of raves too. |
| 15:48.22 | dataw0lf | and every rave I've been to that's been broken up, the police are polite and the ravers leave fine. |
| 15:48.27 | dataw0lf | quietly, under control. |
| 15:48.29 | JoshH | nobody should have a police rifle pointed at them because they are spinning a record at a party that doesnt have a permit and has some kids taking pills |
| 15:48.35 | JoshH | dataw0lf: did you go to sequence5? |
| 15:48.37 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, usually, yes, I agree |
| 15:48.49 | dataw0lf | JoshH: Nope. |
| 15:48.55 | dataw0lf | JoshH: I know they wanted to shut it down but couldn't. |
| 15:48.58 | Jayce^ | course, I've never been to a utah rave |
| 15:49.03 | JoshH | ya, they didnt have enough cops available |
| 15:49.17 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: they're nowhere near as big as, say, Cincinnati or Chicago raves. |
| 15:49.30 | RyanE | if someone is going to hold a legit activity, they should pull the permits, though. The 'organizers' of this didn't pull any permits, from what I understand. |
| 15:49.34 | Jayce^ | can't see Spanish fork, or the sherrif's having enough.. |
| 15:49.40 | dataw0lf | RyanE: Actually, they did. |
| 15:49.52 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, yeah, I would expect that.. Seattle had a decent crowd. |
| 15:49.54 | RyanE | hum. I must've missed the news organizations correcting themselves. :) |
| 15:50.10 | JoshH | they had a permit from the health department, but no utah mass gathering permit |
| 15:50.13 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, depends on who you talk to apparently... seems that had some, not all |
| 15:50.13 | JoshH | its in the article |
| 15:50.22 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: Yeah, they didn't have the mass gathering permit. |
| 15:50.22 | RyanE | yeah, if they pulled the permits and had rights to be on the private property, I think the cops should've only busted illegal activity. |
| 15:50.35 | Jayce^ | RyanE, agreed |
| 15:50.39 | dataw0lf | Personally, if they wanted to just prevent it, they could've busted it before it happened. |
| 15:50.41 | dataw0lf | they knew it was going down. |
| 15:50.43 | Bradipo | JoshH: What's a mass gathering permit? |
| 15:50.51 | Bradipo | Whatever happened to the right to assembly... |
| 15:50.54 | RyanE | probably a permit to prevent raves. :) |
| 15:50.56 | dataw0lf | Bradipo: +250 people. |
| 15:51.06 | Bradipo | That's rediculous. |
| 15:51.07 | Jayce^ | Bradipo, utah country thing to allow a large party to take place.. |
| 15:51.08 | levi | I think the mass gathering permit was explicitly created to discourage big parties. |
| 15:51.10 | JoshH | Bradipo: apparenty its something that our wonderful freedom loving government requires if you are going to have a lot of people on your private property |
| 15:51.22 | Jayce^ | requires that you put in place security, sanitation, etc |
| 15:51.27 | Bradipo | Interesting. |
| 15:51.27 | Jayce^ | levi, it was |
| 15:51.27 | synic | nice. talk.google.com is running jabberd |
| 15:51.35 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: Which they did have all that. |
| 15:51.40 | dataw0lf | the security guards got arrested. |
| 15:51.42 | synic | it's not a rumor - woot. |
| 15:51.44 | levi | Jayce^: I think I remember when they created that. |
| 15:51.46 | JoshH | dataw0lf: were you there? |
| 15:51.48 | dataw0lf | because they had drugs that they had confiscated off the kids. |
| 15:51.51 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, right, it's just the permit :) |
| 15:52.01 | dataw0lf | JoshH: no, but I just found out yesterday I actually know the organizers. |
| 15:52.20 | Jayce^ | I have no problems with the cops busting those with drugs... but I hate them busting the party |
| 15:52.36 | dataw0lf | Personally, I think it got out of control because of the way the cops approached it. |
| 15:52.46 | dataw0lf | there's an officer in SLC who busts numerous raves. |
| 15:52.49 | dataw0lf | always peaceful. |
| 15:52.57 | dataw0lf | they could've taken a page from his book. |
| 15:52.59 | JoshH | im friends with the guys who organize sequence, but i dont know did that rave. but i work with a guy was dj'ing there and almost got arrested. |
| 15:53.32 | dataw0lf | JoshH: I am acquantances with one of the guys who got 'subdued' (butt stroke to the head) |
| 15:53.40 | dataw0lf | and this guy is, like, the biggest pacifist I know. |
| 15:53.43 | JoshH | basically there is a right way and a wrong way to do it. they could have let hte party go on, busted people they saw doing drugs, and pulled over suspicious drivers who were leaving. |
| 15:53.51 | dataw0lf | from what I hear (haven't actually talked to him) he just asked what was going on |
| 15:54.02 | dataw0lf | or they could've even busted the party. |
| 15:54.04 | JoshH | but instead they handled it like this... it seems like something that would happen in iran. |
| 15:54.18 | dataw0lf | but they didn't need to act like it was a foreign invasion. |
| 15:54.24 | Jayce^ | JoshH, I wouldnt' go that far, in Iran you wouldn't have heard from them again :-p |
| 15:54.59 | JoshH | heh, "A source inside the Utah government reports that this action was undertaken out of fear that the Rave would be used to rally support for the protest against Bush's upcoming Utah visit." |
| 15:55.16 | dataw0lf | JoshH: I think that's semi plausible. |
| 15:55.23 | dataw0lf | I don't find that hard to believe at all. |
| 15:55.30 | dataw0lf | there were alot of out of towners at the rave. |
| 15:55.34 | Jayce^ | Utah country has always been anti rave, quite strongly... |
| 15:55.44 | Jayce^ | I think the rave itself is enough if it's known about |
| 15:55.44 | JoshH | i don't put anything past the utah government, having witnessed their shenanigans for years |
| 15:55.51 | dataw0lf | yeah, but I've been to three parties here in the past year that've been busted. |
| 15:55.57 | dataw0lf | and they were handled completely differently. |
| 15:56.40 | Bradipo | dataw0lf: Don't you know that We the People are enemies of the state? The people have always been at odds with the government that would claim sovereignty over them. |
| 15:56.50 | Jayce^ | probably not in SF though.. southern Utah county vs SL county handles things quite different |
| 15:56.52 | dataw0lf | Bradipo: it's a shame. |
| 15:57.04 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: Yeah, you're probably right. |
| 15:57.08 | Bradipo | Sure it is, but that's what happens when people are not vigilant. |
| 15:57.50 | dataw0lf | Bradipo: well, it's the whole attitude now that the people aren't responsible for keeping their government in check. |
| 15:57.55 | Jayce^ | and if you tout the 2nd ammendment along with that, you wind up getting lumped with super-dell the moron |
| 15:58.01 | Bradipo | lol |
| 15:58.06 | JoshH | its also the attitude of a lot of people who probably think the cops did hte right thing |
| 15:58.13 | JoshH | because they dont mind things that they dont agree with being illegal |
| 15:58.52 | Bradipo | But if it weren't such a pain to carry weapons, maybe someone would have done us as service that day and shot him on sight for threatening the life, liberty and happiness of that individual. |
| 15:59.01 | dataw0lf | I certainly don't agree with drugs being illegal, personally. But that has nothing to do with me thinking the cops handled the situation in an incredibly stupid way. |
| 15:59.18 | Bradipo | dataw0lf: Cops are, after all, just human like us. |
| 15:59.33 | dataw0lf | Bradipo: that's why people who want to be cops shouldn't be cops. |
| 16:00.28 | RyanE | so dataw0lf, what would you propose instead of a 'volunteer' police force? :) |
| 16:00.46 | Bradipo | RyanE: I can see alternatives. His statement isn't so far fetched. :-) |
| 16:00.50 | RyanE | in Brasil, they have mandatory military service, and you have Military Police keeping the peace. |
| 16:00.50 | JoshH | it reminds me of when the cops used excessive force to bust the harmless weed smokers at liberty park a long time ago |
| 16:00.51 | dataw0lf | RyanE: I don't have anything to 'propose' I just think the guys who're so keen on being cops aren't the type you want in. |
| 16:01.04 | Jayce^ | RyanE, I was remembering the same force.. |
| 16:01.07 | RyanE | dataw0lf: agreed, somewhat. |
| 16:01.16 | Jayce^ | policia civil, militar, e federal |
| 16:01.24 | Bradipo | dataw0lf: There are good cops and there are bad cops. |
| 16:01.27 | dataw0lf | I wouldn't be opposed to mandatory military service for males. |
| 16:01.31 | *** join/#utah tahooie (n=tahooie@66.239.17.226.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 16:01.32 | dataw0lf | Bradipo: Of course. |
| 16:01.42 | dataw0lf | Bradipo: that doesn't invalidate my statement though ;) |
| 16:01.43 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, sexist pig! :-p |
| 16:01.55 | dataw0lf | Jayce^: I'm also a gay basher, keep that in mind ;) |
| 16:01.56 | levi | Damn, Jayce beat me to it. ;) |
| 16:02.03 | Jayce^ | dataw0lf, true, true |
| 16:02.24 | Bradipo | Indeed most people are good natured at heart and desire to do a good job, however, many are also gullible and easily deceived. |
| 16:02.26 | Jayce^ | self-proclaimed at that :) |
| 16:02.45 | RyanE | and power-hungry. |
| 16:02.57 | dataw0lf | RyanE: aye, that's the point I was trying to make. |
| 16:03.22 | RyanE | I used to hate getting pulled over by Spanish Fork city cops. They for the most part LOVED pulling people over, and trying to humiliate them. |
| 16:03.31 | Jayce^ | one of the funniest things I saw on my mission, was 5 policia civil in a Fiat Uno Mille (thing Ford Festiva) running on alcohol (brasil has that), attempting to chase a guy on a motorbike.... |
| 16:03.34 | RyanE | the Sheriff's office officers, on the other hand, always treated you with respect. |
| 16:03.54 | hans | ralphsnart: my personal opinion is nagios is messed up and I have a personal quest to eradicate it from the known universe. but lots of people use and like it |
| 16:03.58 | dataw0lf | RyanE: I got arrested by quite the SLC police officer. He was a complete arse. |
| 16:04.13 | Jayce^ | hans, we use it, I hate it :) |
| 16:04.15 | dataw0lf | RyanE: Not more than a week later I was stopped walking down 21st near sugarhouse, shopping. |
| 16:04.17 | hans | he was quite the SLC police officer. |
| 16:04.19 | JoshH | ive met slc cops who were really cool and ones who were total pricks |
| 16:04.22 | ralphsnart | hans: i'll take that into consideration |
| 16:04.25 | Bradipo | hans: You would replace nagios with mon? |
| 16:04.33 | hans | Bradipo: I did, in my situation |
| 16:04.41 | dataw0lf | RyanE: matching the description of some guy who tried to pass off a stolen check to a T. |
| 16:04.52 | dataw0lf | RyanE: the officer was a great guy, I didn't have any problem with him. |
| 16:04.53 | RyanE | well, dataw0lf, right or wrong, you're quite the imposing figure. You don't exactly 'fly below the radar' for most of these cops. |
| 16:05.00 | hans | not having tried mon in a large setup, I wouldn't say whether it can replace nagios in every situation |
| 16:05.06 | hans | or if it might scale better than nagios |
| 16:05.20 | dataw0lf | RyanE: he was completely confused on why I had been arrested for interfering with an arresting officer a couple days before. |
| 16:05.30 | dataw0lf | RyanE: oh, I can understand that, though. |
| 16:05.43 | Bradipo | I haven't looked at mon in many years so I don't know if it has changed much. |
| 16:05.51 | dataw0lf | RyanE: he just communicated alot better and wasn't looking to, like, 'take me down'. |
| 16:05.55 | RyanE | now, a balding fat guy like myself, I wouldn't get a second look. :) |
| 16:06.07 | dataw0lf | bah, you're not fat. |
| 16:06.10 | JoshH | i once got pulled over by an slc cop who thought i got on i-15 on 4th south (the carpool ramp) when i really got on at 5th south, and he accused me of using the carpool ramp and threatened to give me an 800 dollar ticket, but i kept arguing with him and telling him i didnt use that ramp, he was so pissed he looked like his head was going to explode. but finally he just told me not to use the carpool ramp and walked away. |
| 16:06.10 | Jayce^ | gotta say, the sherrifs up by our neck of the woods are a lot better than the ones I had growing up... |
| 16:06.46 | RyanE | I think the worst are the BYU university rent-a-cops, though. |
| 16:06.55 | dataw0lf | meh, rent-a-cops. |
| 16:07.55 | levi | I got pulled over late at night by a cop who thought I was running from him, when I was really just playing with my new turbo and I hadn't seen him behind me (lights weren't on at the time, and he was in a SUV). I stopped at the next intersection, turned, and drove only slightly above the limit down the hill, so when he caught me, he just gave me a warning. |
| 16:08.28 | levi | He told me he'd almost initiated a chase, though, which would have been really bad. |
| 16:08.35 | Bradipo | lol |
| 16:08.43 | Bradipo | Always looking for some action they are eh? |
| 16:09.20 | Bradipo | What a waste of taxpayer money, initiating a chase on poor levi who was only enjoying his new toy... |
| 16:09.50 | levi | I'm not complaining about him, just pointing out an instance of very reasonable police behavior. |
| 16:09.57 | Bradipo | Yeah. |
| 16:09.57 | emcnabb | My license plate says "Linux64" on it; I got pulled over by a cop because "my license plate lights weren't bright enough", then he started asking me questions about a problem with his cdrom drive on Mandrake |
| 16:10.07 | dataw0lf | haha, you're kidding, right? |
| 16:10.10 | emcnabb | nope |
| 16:10.14 | dataw0lf | that's awesome. |
| 16:10.15 | emcnabb | happened in Provo last year |
| 16:10.32 | xbmodder | emcnabb, dude seriously? |
| 16:10.39 | xbmodder | emcnabb, thats frickin' cool |
| 16:10.40 | RyanE | and you told him to switch to a non-pink distro, right? :) |
| 16:10.41 | emcnabb | yup |
| 16:10.49 | emcnabb | RyanE, I didn't :-) |
| 16:11.03 | dataw0lf | haha |
| 16:11.12 | dataw0lf | trolling a cop |
| 16:11.16 | xbmodder | lol |
| 16:11.27 | *** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@hq-nat2.gurulabs.com) |
| 16:11.27 | dataw0lf | 'Dude, Mandrake? Pfft. You fix it by installing Debian, duh' |
| 16:12.02 | RyanE | I got pulled over by a Provo cop for having 15 people in my 67 Ford Galaxy at BYU. Only a warning. rent-a-cops would've ticketed, for sure. |
| 16:12.15 | emcnabb | that's a lot of people |
| 16:12.18 | dataw0lf | Wow. |
| 16:12.21 | RyanE | big boat of a car |
| 16:12.37 | RyanE | FHE activity. :) |
| 16:12.59 | emcnabb | haha |
| 16:13.10 | levi | RyanE: See how closely crammed with the cute girls you can get? ;) |
| 16:13.18 | Jayce^ | RyanE, '67.. pfft, wuss :) |
| 16:13.34 | Jayce^ | RyanE, my bro had a '65, 352 Cleveland 4 barrel baby... 2dr |
| 16:13.36 | xbmodder | anyone here have an english major? |
| 16:13.42 | RyanE | I didn't say it was a *great* car. It was my grandpa's old car. |
| 16:13.49 | dataw0lf | hehe. |
| 16:14.01 | Jayce^ | my bro had that boat, and I drove a nash.. talk about opposite |
| 16:14.05 | RyanE | it *did* have a 390 in it, but only the stock carb. sucked wind. |
| 16:14.12 | mheath | xbmodder: Whats your question? Most of us speak english good ;) |
| 16:14.14 | Jayce^ | 352 Cleveland, vs my 1500 CC austin Healey |
| 16:14.51 | xbmodder | mheath, http://bose.perfectprize.com/qccontest/index.php?src=EM154698&dartsourceid=EM154698 < not really english, but if you convey it well I am sure that they will choose yours over others |
| 16:15.31 | sjansen | Any ruby heads awake at the moment? I'm trying to think of a way to express a RelaxNG Compact format schema in Ruby syntax. |
| 16:15.51 | mheath | ugh |
| 16:15.53 | xbmodder | yuck |
| 16:16.17 | mheath | So if I write an over emotional story about experiences with..headphones? (That I don't even own)....I win a prize. |
| 16:16.21 | mheath | Tempting, but....no. |
| 16:16.38 | xbmodder | mheath, c'mon |
| 16:16.48 | mheath | I'll write a story about where they can stick those headphones. |
| 16:16.53 | xbmodder | You can do it, you can do it all nice long |
| 16:16.55 | xbmodder | ! |
| 16:17.13 | levi | sjansen: I could probably help if you were using Smalltalk instead of Ruby, but I'm not all that familiar with Ruby syntax. |
| 16:17.15 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@dhcp189.openinternet.gurulabs.com) |
| 16:17.49 | xbmodder | maybe about how you got stuck on an abandoned island and said all you had is your head phones. thats what let you live |
| 16:19.04 | xbmodder | STUPID RHAT AND AMD! |
| 16:19.59 | mheath | Why in the world would you be using something as stupid as redhat? |
| 16:20.20 | xbmodder | because I invested in them |
| 16:20.39 | xbmodder | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:20.47 | xbmodder | this system is really dumb |
| 16:20.48 | mheath | ..... |
| 16:21.04 | mheath | Your kidding right? Please tell me you don't have redhat stock. |
| 16:21.23 | xbmodder | mheath, haha yeah |
| 16:21.44 | sjansen | mheath: So do you enjoy a good flame war, or are you just a fanboy? |
| 16:22.02 | xbmodder | wow people are sad... |
| 16:22.24 | tene__ | That's a fact of life, xbm. |
| 16:22.38 | tene__ | People often aren't happy. |
| 16:22.40 | mheath | sjansen: I'm not flaming. I spent ages poring over Redhat's financial reports and investment publications last year as part of a project for a business class |
| 16:22.54 | mheath | I know what I'm saying when I say investing in redhat is a stupid thing to do. |
| 16:23.21 | tene__ | ... or is it?!?! |
| 16:24.23 | xbmodder | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:24.25 | xbmodder | wow |
| 16:24.29 | xbmodder | sad-- |
| 16:24.55 | xbmodder | comtex should burn. |
| 16:24.59 | xbmodder | ~lart comtex |
| 16:25.05 | mheath | xbmodder: ignore that, that doesn't mean much. |
| 16:25.18 | mheath | Redhats problem is that they just sit there |
| 16:25.20 | xbmodder | mheath, I know but alotta people sold rhat |
| 16:25.29 | xbmodder | mheath, exactly! |
| 16:25.46 | xbmodder | mheath, rumour has it that there planning something really cool though. |
| 16:26.37 | mheath | xbmodder: Why did you invest in redhat? Was it simply because it was the first linux-related company that popped into your head? |
| 16:26.51 | xbmodder | no |
| 16:27.00 | xbmodder | because earlier they made me 500 dollars |
| 16:27.17 | mheath | How? |
| 16:27.52 | xbmodder | mheath, I put about 50*13 dollars into them and they made me 500+ profit |
| 16:28.01 | xbmodder | your a smart guy what should I invest in? |
| 16:29.27 | mheath | xbmodder: at what time did redhat stock almost double in value? |
| 16:31.20 | mheath | You say you invested $650 (50*13) and that it climbed in value by $500+. Thats almost doubling the value. |
| 16:32.46 | mheath | You made some lucky trade decisions for that to happen |
| 16:33.13 | mheath | Looking at the charts, they always plummet following a climb like that |
| 16:37.23 | *** join/#utah amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-24-10-237-76.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 16:37.50 | mheath | xbmodder: We have an investment in BP right now. Its really nice. |
| 16:38.20 | mheath | Its been climbing continuosly and surely for the past 3 years |
| 16:40.46 | *** join/#utah WoodsDog (n=woodsdog@216.194.125.132) |
| 16:41.05 | *** part/#utah resplin (n=richard@dsl092-197-123.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 16:43.20 | mheath | xbmodder: Of course, I've got to ask...why are you looking into just plain stock? Have you looked into mutual funds or some *better* way of investing? |
| 16:43.29 | mheath | just buying up stock isn't the smartest or best thing |
| 16:46.39 | xbmodder | mheath, then it musta been 500 and not 50 yeah |
| 16:46.54 | xbmodder | maybe bp is a good idea |
| 16:48.13 | mheath | xbmodder: read the last thing I said |
| 16:48.42 | xbmodder | My account at etrade does not let me |
| 16:48.53 | mheath | You shouldn't just be buying up stock. Not with how unfamiliar you are with the stock market, not with how little money your investing. |
| 16:49.26 | mheath | xbmodder: then don't use etrade. |
| 16:49.46 | levi | 'Cause if you're going to lose money on the stock market, you gotta lose LOTS of money, or people will laugh at you. :P |
| 16:50.35 | Bradipo | sjansen: That's sure to keep any interested parties away from your money. :-) |
| 16:51.06 | xbmodder | levi, and if you make money then you get stalker-ish girls calling you all night asking you for money :-/ |
| 16:51.08 | RyanE | sjansen is heavily invested in the sock market. |
| 16:51.15 | mheath | xbmodder : I mean, we invest in BP, and thats nice. But we're seeing the benefits because we've had stock in BP (or companies that merged into BP) in our family for 40 years |
| 16:51.15 | sjansen | Once a week, I buy a large block of cheese and leave it out for the money gnomes. I figure if I make them my friends, some day they'll start adding money to my sock. |
| 16:51.35 | xbmodder | mheath,cool. |
| 16:51.56 | Bradipo | sjansen: Might I inquire as to the nature of the cheese? |
| 16:51.56 | mheath | and we have a heck of a lot of money invested in them. You're not going to get much out of investing like that by buying a couple hundred dollars worth of stock. |
| 16:52.04 | xbmodder | sjansen, what kind of cheese is it? |
| 16:52.35 | xbmodder | mheath, I've bought ~10,000 dollars of stock? |
| 16:52.42 | xbmodder | not a couple hundred dollars? |
| 16:52.52 | mheath | ....... |
| 16:52.58 | mheath | Wait, how old are you? |
| 16:53.01 | xbmodder | 14 |
| 16:53.06 | xbmodder | 14 years |
| 16:53.21 | mheath | Where in the world are you getting $10,000 to invest? |
| 16:53.27 | xbmodder | dad |
| 16:53.47 | Bradipo | mheath: Indeed BP does have an impressive chart, however, I believe GDW has it beat. |
| 16:53.58 | xbmodder | 14 years 8 months 20 days 9 hours 52 minutes |
| 16:54.33 | sjansen | Bradipo: Extra Sharp Cheedar, although that might not be there favorite as money hasn't started appearing yet |
| 16:54.53 | xbmodder | sjansen, where do you put this cheese? |
| 16:54.58 | mheath | xbmodder: what companies have you been investing in other than redhat? |
| 16:55.02 | dataw0lf | morning sjansen |
| 16:55.10 | Bradipo | mheath: Compare: http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/charts/big.chart?symb=GDW&compidx=aaaaa%3A0&ma=0&maval=9&uf=0&lf=1&lf2=0&lf3=0&type=128&size=4&state=8&sid=2221&style=320&time=20&freq=3&comp=NO%5FSYMBOL%5FCHOSEN&nosettings=1&rand=114&mocktick=1 |
| 16:55.18 | Bradipo | To: http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/charts/big.chart?symb=BP&compidx=aaaaa%3A0&ma=0&maval=9&uf=0&lf=1&lf2=0&lf3=0&type=128&size=4&state=8&sid=127362&style=320&time=20&freq=3&comp=NO%5FSYMBOL%5FCHOSEN&nosettings=1&rand=310&mocktick=1 |
| 16:55.22 | sjansen | dataw0lf: morning |
| 16:56.01 | xbmodder | amd, chevron, agelent, google, intel |
| 16:57.06 | mheath | xbmodder: and your dad is aware of what your investing in? |
| 16:57.11 | xbmodder | mheath, no |
| 16:57.35 | xbmodder | mheath, my dad invested 30,000 dollars as his accountant asked him to, he has something like ~10,000 left :( |
| 16:57.55 | Bradipo | sjansen: I've been trying with gorgonzola but to no avail... |
| 16:58.05 | xbmodder | mheath, do you believe teenagers are incapable of doing such things |
| 16:58.23 | emcnabb | xbmodder, mheath will be your personal financial advisor |
| 16:58.38 | levi | xbmodder: I hope not, since he's a teenager himself. :P |
| 16:59.01 | mheath | xbmodder: Yes, I do. |
| 16:59.30 | mheath | Teenagers aren't incable of investing, but teenagers don't have the experience with the stock market to be going and directly buying stock |
| 16:59.51 | Bradipo | mheath: However, the way people invest today, a teenager has just as much chance. :-) |
| 16:59.56 | mheath | Look into mutual funds. Really. |
| 17:00.32 | xbmodder | mheath, A. I don't have an account which allows me to. B. My dad won't give me the account |
| 17:00.40 | emcnabb | I think that for most people, mutual funds are the best way to go |
| 17:00.46 | xbmodder | Teenagers are capable of doing such things. |
| 17:00.52 | Bradipo | Indeed, the majority of people invest for all the wrong reasons which make a teenager just part of the norm. |
| 17:01.46 | mheath | xbmodder: watch your google stock very very carefully |
| 17:01.52 | xbmodder | mheath, I am |
| 17:02.03 | xbmodder | it just went up ~10 cents :) |
| 17:02.11 | mheath | alot of financial advisors are concerned that the big google climb is another ".com boom" phenomenon |
| 17:02.26 | mheath | and is likely to plummet soon |
| 17:02.34 | xbmodder | mheath, looks like it |
| 17:02.48 | xbmodder | mheath, google is raising alotta money though |
| 17:02.53 | sjansen | google's price is insane |
| 17:02.57 | xbmodder | the google tank seems to be hard at work |
| 17:03.07 | mheath | When you said you have $10,000 invested, do you mean YOU have $10,000 invested, or your dad does? |
| 17:03.07 | emcnabb | there's no way it will last at those levels |
| 17:03.09 | xbmodder | just hope they don't make it burst |
| 17:03.20 | xbmodder | m |
| 17:03.22 | xbmodder | *me |
| 17:03.24 | mheath | xbmodder: yes, but what does google DO? |
| 17:03.35 | mheath | How does google make money? |
| 17:03.42 | mheath | Google has a miniscule revenue |
| 17:03.44 | xbmodder | advertisments |
| 17:03.50 | xbmodder | search ads |
| 17:03.52 | Bradipo | mheath: Who cares about that? Isn't the stock price going up? :-) |
| 17:03.58 | RyanE | google makes money by investors. :) |
| 17:03.58 | xbmodder | lol |
| 17:04.02 | xbmodder | exactly! |
| 17:04.08 | RyanE | and that's about it. |
| 17:04.12 | xbmodder | there raising what? 4.2 billion dollars |
| 17:04.15 | xbmodder | 42 |
| 17:04.21 | xbmodder | wow thats scary-- |
| 17:04.23 | mheath | xbmodder: look at it this way |
| 17:04.25 | RyanE | ok, they *do* make small revenues, but nothing in comparison with the value. |
| 17:04.41 | mheath | Investors have pumped *BILLIONS* of dollars now into a company that only makes small *millions* |
| 17:04.43 | xbmodder | Snapbridge Software Offering Free ``Google Sitemap`` Application, Powered by New XML-Echo Language |
| 17:04.51 | xbmodder | sitemaps seem the new wave |
| 17:05.34 | RyanE | it's like people were saying before the .com boom... "It's a new economy, value of the company is not measured by their *profit* at all! It's a *miracle*!" |
| 17:05.40 | Bradipo | All I know is google has a very good search engine and they have a decent webmail service. Oh, google maps is great, as is google earth and they sure do have a lot of other nifty tools on their website. |
| 17:06.29 | xbmodder | Bradipo, people buy google earth all the time |
| 17:06.34 | Bradipo | There aren't many other sites that I visit so regularly. |
| 17:07.11 | mheath | xbmodder: say I came up to you, and said.. |
| 17:07.30 | mheath | "I'd like to start a business. If you'd only invest 10 billion dollars, I'm sure I could be making a whole 10 million a year." |
| 17:07.35 | mheath | What would you think? |
| 17:07.43 | xbmodder | http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?q=&url=google.com < i like |
| 17:07.44 | Bradipo | xbmodder: I didn't have to pay for google earth, why would others? |
| 17:07.51 | xbmodder | mheath, I'd say your crazy |
| 17:07.55 | xbmodder | Bradipo, google earth pro |
| 17:07.58 | mheath | xbmodder: thats the way google is! |
| 17:08.04 | mheath | Google is now worth billions of dollars |
| 17:08.09 | sjansen | On paper. |
| 17:08.13 | mheath | yet only has a revenue of a few million dollars |
| 17:08.13 | xbmodder | mheath, they've raised 4.2 million |
| 17:08.19 | xbmodder | *billion |
| 17:08.51 | xbmodder | what are all the engineers going to move the the moon and abandon earth for ever in 2007? |
| 17:08.57 | xbmodder | 27.90 |
| 17:08.59 | Bradipo | I think with all the traffic google gets, advertisers would be willing to invest something in them. |
| 17:09.02 | tene__ | yes, but where did that money come from? |
| 17:09.09 | levi | xbmodder: Do you know the difference between 'raising' money and 'making' money? |
| 17:09.15 | xbmodder | 276.90 about 5 minutes ago it was 276.64 |
| 17:09.23 | xbmodder | levi, yes-- |
| 17:09.38 | xbmodder | levi, They have to be getting ready for something |
| 17:10.51 | xbmodder | the average alexa user uses google 6.1 times a day |
| 17:12.09 | Bradipo | xbmodder: How fairly do alexa users represent the entire commnity? |
| 17:12.40 | xbmodder | Bradipo, thats the major internet statistics source. |
| 17:13.17 | Bradipo | Right, but what I mean is, how representative of the Internet are those users with respect to the rest of the Internet's users? |
| 17:16.32 | *** join/#utah scott (i=scott@crackaddict.com) |
| 17:17.09 | tene__ | xbmodder: so they visit google. what do they do there/ |
| 17:17.10 | tene__ | ? |
| 17:17.28 | tene__ | How does just visiting the page give money to google? |
| 17:17.38 | tene__ | I use google often, but I don't give any money to them. |
| 17:17.49 | Bradipo | No, you don't, but advertisers may. |
| 17:18.24 | Bradipo | Not only that, but providing a much more targetted advertisement would also be of some value. |
| 17:18.41 | Bradipo | They certainly have a knack for providing relevant results in their searching. |
| 17:18.42 | xbmodder | yeah |
| 17:18.49 | tene__ | Yes. |
| 17:18.56 | xbmodder | for every 1000 display of an ad |
| 17:18.57 | tene__ | but once again, that only provides millions. |
| 17:19.00 | xbmodder | google gets money |
| 17:19.34 | emcnabb | I think Google has a good business model, but they are not worth millions |
| 17:19.42 | emcnabb | (I mean billions) |
| 17:19.45 | tene__ | yeah |
| 17:20.00 | tene__ | Their revenue is measured in single-digit millions. |
| 17:20.06 | Bradipo | I think I would agree with that. Eventually the excitement will wear off and they will settle down. |
| 17:20.12 | RyanE | now, they have been pretty agile, and it's altogether possible that they could invent a way to make money that would make them value in the billions, but not yet... |
| 17:20.41 | RyanE | they certainly have the cash for research. |
| 17:20.44 | tene__ | If the Google Talk thing takes off, that would be pretty big. |
| 17:20.58 | tene__ | Provided it exists at all. |
| 17:20.59 | RyanE | yeah, but *billions*? |
| 17:21.09 | xbmodder | any day now we don't know if there going to come out with a new computer arch or a new way to search for porn |
| 17:21.11 | sjansen | That's part of the excitement. Apps like gmail are convincing people that maybe the OS really finally can be replaced by the Web giving Google the chance to become the new Microsoft. |
| 17:21.14 | emcnabb | when I'm searching on Google about product information (i.e. going to buy something and am looking for good prices, reviews, etc), I often click on their ads |
| 17:21.38 | xbmodder | http://www.google.com/intl/en/services/index.html |
| 17:21.49 | tene__ | RyanE: live google ads in IM conversations. |
| 17:21.54 | sjansen | But if it is _possible_, it's still a long way in the future and a bigger player (like, say, Microsoft) has a better chance of becoming the Microsoft. |
| 17:22.14 | tene__ | If they can come up with enough benefit to actually use it. |
| 17:22.39 | RyanE | the only argument against Microsoft becoming the next Microsoft is that they aren't nearly as agile. |
| 17:22.45 | xbmodder | they charge 3k for the prettiest search appliance on the market |
| 17:22.54 | xbmodder | what 800 dollars of hardware? |
| 17:23.05 | sjansen | First mover advantage is largely a fallacy. |
| 17:23.10 | xbmodder | thats about 2 thousand dollars on each of those |
| 17:23.17 | emcnabb | and how many do they sell? |
| 17:23.26 | scott | tene, revenue single-digit millions? uhh, they made over 3 billion in revenue last year |
| 17:23.30 | emcnabb | does that add up to billions? |
| 17:23.33 | tene__ | scott: oh? |
| 17:23.51 | xbmodder | emcnabb, no idea -- but they sold one to a huge company on the 27th |
| 17:24.00 | xbmodder | of last month |
| 17:24.05 | scott | google is definitely valued in the billions. how not when they make profit of 400 million last year? |
| 17:24.08 | sjansen | But what did they make in profit? |
| 17:24.15 | levi | When you say "google gets money", you mean people are investing money in them. This isn't a gift. They expect to get their money back out, with interest. That can't come from other people's investments for long. |
| 17:25.12 | RyanE | levi: not exactly true. it *IS* a gift if they blow it all, and go out of business... :) |
| 17:25.41 | levi | RyanE: Well, yeah, but then it turns out very badly for the people who thought they were investing. :) |
| 17:26.02 | RyanE | levi: agreed. I've given gifts to too many companies. :) |
| 17:26.21 | emcnabb | RyanE, would you like to give a gift to me then? |
| 17:27.20 | tene__ | ~stock emcnabb |
| 17:27.23 | xbmodder | emcnabb, do you have pretty search appliances? do you have a chance of giving my money back with interest? |
| 17:27.36 | scott | last quarter google made over a billion in revenue, and only made 8 million from selling stock. I'd say they have a pretty good business model besides just selling ownership in their company |
| 17:28.33 | tene__ | I was taking my information from mheath. I guess I shouldn't do that in the future. |
| 17:28.50 | tene__ | ~lart mheath |
| 17:29.42 | xbmodder | ~kill mheath ? |
| 17:29.43 | ibot | ACTION shoots a ionized graviton gun at mheath |
| 17:31.53 | scott | "This year the combined advertising revenues of Google and Yahoo! will rival the combined prime-time ad revenues of America's three big television networks, ABC, CBS and NBC, predicts Advertising Age." |
| 17:32.02 | levi | tene__: mheath should generally be taken with a grain of salt. |
| 17:32.19 | tene__ | And now I know. |
| 17:32.32 | tene__ | I'm not around here enough to know much about most people. |
| 17:32.55 | scott | anyone happen to know of a good online phone card? I had one a few years ago that was pretty cool but I can't remember the name of the company for the life of me |
| 17:33.19 | levi | tene__: The other night he was telling me that OOP makes programmers lazy, because Utah schools are teaching VB and the students aren't learning what an integer datatype is. |
| 17:33.28 | tene__ | Hmm. |
| 17:34.12 | xbmodder | scott, online phone card? |
| 17:34.16 | tene__ | I'd have to add more salt than I'm comfortable with consuming to accept that. |
| 17:34.33 | xbmodder | like a card so you hook your phone to the computer |
| 17:34.43 | scott | xbmodder: yeah, it was a nice site where you just logged in, added a few bucks to your account, and then got super cheap rates |
| 17:34.59 | xbmodder | scott, net2phone? |
| 17:35.02 | tene__ | xbm: no |
| 17:35.07 | scott | no, it just gives you a number to call. it's a substitute for going to walmart and buying an actual card |
| 17:35.12 | xbmodder | scott, how much did you usually spwnd a month? |
| 17:35.22 | xbmodder | *spend |
| 17:35.42 | scott | xbmodder, I just make a few calls, so about a dollar or so |
| 17:36.03 | scott | I don't remember the rates but they were a lot less than mainstream phone cards |
| 17:39.45 | xbmodder | http://www.iconnecthere.com/nonmembers/eng/pc_to_phone/index.htm < maybe? |
| 17:40.05 | xbmodder | 1.1 cents |
| 17:40.12 | xbmodder | I don't see how you can much lower than that |
| 17:40.36 | xbmodder | There is a minimum starting balance of $10, but if you signup with $25 or more, we?ll add $5 for free. < sounds like a good deal |
| 17:40.55 | tene__ | that's a voip-to-landline setup, right? |
| 17:41.26 | tene__ | yeah |
| 17:41.32 | tene__ | that's totally not even close to what he wants |
| 17:41.42 | xbmodder | # Virtual Calling Card |
| 17:41.42 | xbmodder | Use your account as a virtual calling card from a regular phone. |
| 17:41.51 | xbmodder | tene, ? |
| 17:41.53 | xbmodder | tene__, ? |
| 17:42.05 | tene__ | yeah |
| 17:42.11 | tene__ | that's a different page on that site |
| 17:42.15 | tene__ | and what he wants |
| 17:42.23 | tene__ | but really expensive |
| 17:42.30 | xbmodder | I must have copied the wrong page |
| 17:42.42 | xbmodder | tene, 1.1 cents a minute? |
| 17:42.58 | xbmodder | thats 15 hours in 10 bucks |
| 17:43.35 | tene__ | yeah |
| 17:43.45 | xbmodder | if he were to spend 25 dollars and get the 5 dollars++ he would get 454 hours |
| 17:43.50 | tene__ | that's rather high for such things, as I recall |
| 17:44.06 | tene__ | I remember getting a 2,000 minute one at 7-11 once |
| 17:44.15 | xbmodder | tene__, how much? |
| 17:44.34 | tene__ | err |
| 17:44.35 | tene__ | sorry |
| 17:44.36 | tene__ | $20 |
| 17:44.43 | tene__ | I meant to include that. |
| 17:46.11 | xbmodder | but what 25 dollars you get: 2272 minutes |
| 17:46.28 | xbmodder | more like 2727 |
| 17:47.23 | xbmodder | 45.45 |
| 17:47.24 | tene__ | That was complete gibberish to me. |
| 17:47.36 | tene__ | I have no idea at all what you were trying to say there. |
| 17:48.19 | xbmodder | 45 hours for 25 bucks |
| 17:48.33 | xbmodder | for 20 bucks 33 hours only |
| 17:49.12 | tene__ | wait, I miscalculated something, I think. |
| 17:49.19 | xbmodder | or I did |
| 17:53.33 | xbmodder | http://www.informit.com/articles/article.asp?p=402221&seqNum=3 |
| 17:53.38 | xbmodder | oops wrong window! |
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| 18:10.32 | xbmodder | TimRiker, jahowl! |
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| 18:15.54 | Lone_Wanderer | What languages should someone learn if they want to become a Better Programmer and increase their Marketability? |
| 18:16.38 | Jayce^ | all of them |
| 18:17.15 | Lone_Wanderer | right, I'll tell him to learn Fortran, Brainf@#$, and that one other language that resembles a cryptography problem. |
| 18:17.55 | zzzirk | oh, you mean perl? ;) |
| 18:18.35 | tene__ | Lone_Wanderer: don't forget malbolge |
| 18:18.41 | Lone_Wanderer | what's what? |
| 18:19.11 | tene__ | a programming language designed to be extremely difficult to program in |
| 18:19.28 | tene__ | the 'hello world' source had to be machine-generated. |
| 18:19.39 | Lone_Wanderer | zzzirk: no there's a language where the actual effect that any given operator has on the program flow depends on where in the program it is, how many operations have been executed previously, etc. |
| 18:19.47 | Lone_Wanderer | malbolge is probably it |
| 18:19.55 | tene__ | yeah |
| 18:20.07 | tene__ | I thought you were directing that question to me. |
| 18:20.10 | Lone_Wanderer | programming in it resembles solving a cryptography problem |
| 18:20.22 | Lone_Wanderer | tene__: I was ;) |
| 18:20.28 | zzzirk | yeah, it looks like it |
| 18:21.15 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh, okay |
| 18:21.23 | zzzirk | :) |
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| 18:26.00 | goozbach | ~kill sponsored links |
| 18:26.02 | ibot | ACTION shoots a fluxelectron gun at sponsored links |
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| 18:36.57 | xbmodder | ~kill goozbach |
| 18:37.00 | ibot | ACTION shoots a super-inverse fluxneutrino gun at goozbach |
| 18:37.00 | xbmodder | TimRiker, whats wrong with ibot? |
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| 19:12.33 | hans | anyone know if you can map caps->ctrl on the linux console w/o root? |
| 19:12.44 | tene__ | I think so |
| 19:16.39 | hans | hmm, but how |
| 19:18.40 | emcnabb | do dumpkeys and loadkeys work? |
| 19:19.10 | emcnabb | If I remember correctly, they don't require root |
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| 19:23.30 | tene__ | http://kittenwar.com/ |
| 19:29.59 | dataw0lf | I hear they're pretty tasty. |
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| 19:31.52 | gthornock | I don't think loadkeys requires root. There's a bit about remapping caps and ctrl at http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-HOWTO/Keyboard-and-Console-HOWTO.html |
| 19:32.13 | lars-ut | ~emulate Ms Bitters |
| 19:32.14 | ibot | So, young man, now you see that there's a price to pay for eating paste. Would you say that losing the use of your mouth was worth it? |
| 19:35.30 | lars-ut | Anyone/Everyone: What is your favorite Invader Zim episode? |
| 19:37.30 | tene__ | hmm |
| 19:37.37 | tene__ | tough question |
| 19:37.43 | tene__ | I should kill you for making me think. |
| 19:39.19 | lars-ut | Maybe I'll find the ep names & do a gratuitous paste to refresh your memory... |
| 19:40.56 | tene__ | Only if you include a summary with each name. |
| 19:43.23 | lars-ut | http://www.epguides.com/InvaderZIM/ |
| 19:43.35 | tene__ | clicking on a link is too much work. |
| 19:43.42 | hans | ~click tene |
| 19:43.50 | tene__ | ~clock lars-ut |
| 19:44.14 | lars-ut | ~chainsaw tene__ |
| 19:44.39 | lars-ut | ibot just isn't violent enough yet. |
| 19:45.20 | lars-ut | "Lice" has my vote for best Invader Zim episode. |
| 19:50.41 | tene__ | I didn't like it. |
| 19:51.09 | tene__ | hmm |
| 19:51.18 | tene__ | I need a webcam that works well with linux |
| 19:52.12 | hans | hmm, what's the x.org equiv of ~/.Xresources |
| 19:54.17 | lars-ut | "A Room With A Moose" is my runner-up. |
| 19:56.33 | tene__ | that one's good |
| 19:56.57 | tene__ | The one where Zim goes on that military training thing and kills his teammates wasn't bad. |
| 19:57.37 | tene__ | Or where Zim tries to crash Mars into th earth. |
| 19:57.38 | lars-ut | Hobo 13 |
| 19:57.44 | tene__ | yeah |
| 19:58.09 | lars-ut | not sure about the second reference - Planet Jackers? |
| 19:59.14 | tene__ | no, that's where the earth is taken by aliens wanting to throw it into their dieing sun as fuel. |
| 19:59.28 | lars-ut | tene: A friend of a friend was wearing a Gir shirt the other day - I told her she was very cool. Major geek points there. |
| 20:00.13 | tene__ | The one I'm referring to has Zim discovering that the face on mars is an interface to pilot the planet, and that the martians drove their civilization into extinction transforming their planet into a giant spacecraft or something. |
| 20:00.50 | lars-ut | Wow - don't thnk I've seen that one. Do you have it? |
| 20:02.21 | tene__ | the halloween and christmas specials are both good |
| 20:02.46 | tene__ | it's "Battle of the Planets" |
| 20:02.50 | lars-ut | just watched the christmas one last night |
| 20:03.50 | Bradipo | hans: Is .Xresources the same as .Xdefaults? |
| 20:15.06 | lars-ut | I'm still confused about today's Inetl announcement. Is there an on-die memory controller like AMD? |
| 20:15.20 | lars-ut | Inetl=Intel |
| 20:18.11 | jsmith | lars-ut: Probably not, knowing Intel :-) |
| 20:20.45 | sjansen | What's a good ruby general purpose (read: not html only) template library? |
| 20:23.38 | tene__ | Template Toolkit, except that's for perl, so you lose. |
| 20:23.40 | dataw0lf | rdoc? |
| 20:24.48 | Jayce^ | I read the other day there is a TTK-alike for ruby now.. at least somewhat similar |
| 20:27.33 | lars-ut | jsmith: I'm inclined to say they don't, the new designs appear to be able to transfer L1 cache data from one die to another, but still suffer from bus bottlenecks compared to AMDs approach. Looks like the marketing team found another way to use the word "memory" though, in reference to "speculative load capability" - it's called "memory disambiguation". |
| 20:28.24 | lars-ut | When I play Settlers tonight with a certain Intel employee, I'm gonna give him a hard time about this. |
| 20:28.59 | graphyx | anyone play Carcassonne? |
| 20:29.05 | Bradipo | lars-ut: I'm jealous about the game. |
| 20:29.08 | graphyx | or Tigris and Euphraties? |
| 20:29.22 | Bradipo | lars-ut: Do you just play the standard or do you use Cities and Knights or Seafarers as well? |
| 20:29.28 | graphyx | I have played Settlers but not with any of the cool expansions. |
| 20:29.32 | lars-ut | Bradipo: Cities & Knights. |
| 20:29.36 | Bradipo | Cool. |
| 20:29.41 | lars-ut | takes about 3 hours. |
| 20:29.50 | Bradipo | Depends on the people. |
| 20:30.04 | lars-ut | yeah. we're meeting at 8:30pm in Springville. |
| 20:30.10 | Bradipo | I play C&K with my sister and her husband and it doesn't take that long. |
| 20:30.41 | lars-ut | Bradipo: Well, there's a lot of trash talking going on as well, and lots of snacks of course. |
| 20:30.51 | Bradipo | Ahh, true gaming. :-) |
| 20:30.51 | lars-ut | and tech discussion. |
| 20:31.13 | lars-ut | Bradipo: Consider yourself invited. |
| 20:31.26 | Bradipo | Thanks, but I'll have to pass this week. |
| 20:31.28 | lars-ut | k |
| 20:31.29 | Bradipo | Got a lot going on. |
| 20:31.46 | Bradipo | Where do you play? (city)? |
| 20:32.07 | lars-ut | Springville. When/if you do decide to come, I just hope you're not the 7th person. |
| 20:32.12 | Bradipo | lol |
| 20:32.14 | Bradipo | That many eh? |
| 20:32.20 | Bradipo | We usually only play in 4, but sometimes 5. |
| 20:32.26 | lars-ut | yeah - we've had to split games before. |
| 20:32.33 | lars-ut | only one time though |
| 20:32.48 | lars-ut | haven't played seafarers yet. |
| 20:32.50 | Bradipo | graphyx: I've played Carassonne. |
| 20:33.00 | Bradipo | seafarers is pretty cool too. |
| 20:33.08 | Bradipo | I have Seafarers and my sister has C&K. |
| 20:33.18 | Bradipo | Never combined them all yet though. |
| 20:34.39 | lars-ut | oh, let me paste in a bit re: local retailer of Settlers... they sell all 3 games plus expansion for $125. |
| 20:34.44 | lars-ut | My Fun Family Store (http://tinyurl.com/c7kwb) is a great local store for board games in Springville (197 South Main St). Their web business accounts for the majority of their customers, but the folks that run the store like to let customers open up games, etc. - very friendly/customer oriented. |
| 20:35.16 | lars-ut | I pasted that from tonight's game announcement - henced the "canned" tone. |
| 20:35.30 | tene__ | There's a game store right behind my house that I discovered a few days ago. |
| 20:35.36 | tene__ | It's been there for a year, but I never saw it. |
| 20:35.48 | tene__ | They have all the settlers stuff, and they let people come in and play games in the store. |
| 20:36.13 | lars-ut | I've seen a few stores come & go - I hope the one to which you're referring sticks around. |
| 20:36.28 | Bradipo | I would be careful walking into that store. They may not have their permits in order... |
| 20:36.47 | lars-ut | I like the idea of having brick & mortar _after_ having built a successful fulfillment business on the web. |
| 20:37.01 | tene__ | Whatwhat, Bradipo? |
| 20:37.10 | lars-ut | My Fun Family seems pretty solid. |
| 20:37.20 | Bradipo | Well, they have obviously kept their business low profile, which is why you never noticed it behind your house. |
| 20:37.33 | tene__ | well, it's more that I haven't been over there for a long time. |
| 20:37.38 | Bradipo | They must be conducting some kind of illegal activity... |
| 20:37.43 | Bradipo | Oh. |
| 20:37.45 | tene__ | I just haven't noticed. |
| 20:38.10 | Bradipo | </sarcasm> |
| 20:38.16 | tene__ | ... |
| 20:38.19 | tene__ | Oh, sarcasm. |
| 20:38.29 | tene__ | Heh. |
| 20:39.13 | lars-ut | jsmith: I'd be impressed if Intel decided to deploy this new design and announces separate one with on-die memory controllers a la AMD. Seems like they are comiing up with the motherboard/socket of the month lately. |
| 20:39.51 | lars-ut | I'll bet they delay integrating memory controllers for another year. |
| 20:42.18 | lars-ut | The good designs will probably be held back until the Intel OSX release. A slashdotter made a comment about the commonality of the timelines based on Jobs' 2 years comment. |
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| 20:58.38 | lars-ut | jsmith: pm me |
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| 21:15.04 | lars-ut | Can anybody deduce what program made these pretty diagrams? http://www.dsslink.net/pfsense/pfsense.htm |
| 21:17.40 | mrpull | the kde visio clone maybe? kivivio or something like that? |
| 21:17.45 | mrpull | I like to use Visio :-/ |
| 21:18.44 | tene__ | could be any vector drawing app |
| 21:18.50 | tene__ | or any drawing app at all, for that matter |
| 21:19.05 | mrpull | true. it isn't that complicated. |
| 21:19.07 | sjansen | although a diagramming app like visio would make it easier |
| 21:19.15 | tene__ | gif doesn't store information about how the image was created |
| 21:20.24 | xbmodder | lars-ut, I can't rmember that |
| 21:20.33 | xbmodder | lars-ut, It uses XML mark-up |
| 21:21.11 | lars-ut | I just like the stencils & shadows. |
| 21:21.24 | xbmodder | lars-ut, oh for that |
| 21:21.38 | xbmodder | lars-ut, Maybe google image search? |
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| 21:22.16 | lars-ut | not a bad idea. |
| 21:22.37 | lars-ut | I'm guessing these are built-in to an open-source app though. |
| 21:23.27 | lars-ut | I like Visio, but don't remember its networking stencils having this much color. |
| 21:24.13 | mrpull | the stencils do have a flavor like some other GPL'ed art |
| 21:25.35 | lars-ut | agreed |
| 21:25.50 | lars-ut | like Fedora |
| 21:26.16 | sjansen | don't see them on openclipart.org |
| 21:27.30 | lars-ut | gotta go away - I'll continue looking for this tomorrow. |
| 21:32.23 | dataw0lf | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:37.15 | goozbach | that specific gif image didn't store that information, or it was removed |
| 21:37.30 | goozbach | but gif does have a specification to store creation info |
| 21:38.01 | goozbach | those stencils are nice |
| 21:38.50 | tene__ | oh, it does? |
| 21:38.59 | tene__ | thought it didn't for some reason. |
| 21:40.41 | mheath | dataw0lf: what qualifications are you looking for? |
| 21:42.14 | dataw0lf | mheath: Windows (2000, XP, 2003) knowledge, basic troubleshooting skills, etc. The position will primarily just be assisting employees with whatever problems they might have, it's pretty easy stuff. If they last for a while, they might get to play with client Tru64 unix machines, and Tru64 Unix and Linux servers. |
| 21:43.37 | mheath | dataw0lf: I'm very familiar with basic troubleshooting, and actually have some brief experience doing it (an internship at a major computer sales/repair shop)....then again, I'm just a highschool student. Would I stand a chance of getting hired there? |
| 21:44.23 | mheath | *basic Windows troubleshotting |
| 21:47.09 | dataw0lf | mheath: If you've got school during the day? No. |
| 21:48.25 | mheath | dataw0lf: what hours would be required? |
| 21:49.07 | dataw0lf | We're willing to work with you, and willing to accept fulltime, but all hours will be M-F somewhere between 8:30 - 5:30 |
| 21:50.24 | mheath | dataw0lf: 11:00AM-* would be workable for me. |
| 21:50.50 | dataw0lf | Email me your resume then. |
| 21:51.00 | mheath | I'm tired of working in a deadend barely-above-fast-food job, and would do anything for a position like this. |
| 21:52.08 | mheath | dataw0lf: It will be a few minutes....what format do you prefer? Plain text? |
| 21:52.40 | dataw0lf | or OO.o |
| 21:53.04 | dataw0lf | the boss might not like the plain text. PDF is a good fallback. |
| 21:53.14 | tene__ | PDF is always good. |
| 21:57.02 | mheath | dataw0lf: oh, where exactly is this business located, by the way? |
| 21:57.50 | dataw0lf | Salt Lake City, 40 W Oakland Ave. |
| 21:59.56 | tene__ | Where's Oakland Ave? |
| 22:00.14 | synic | 2500s ish. |
| 22:28.58 | mheath | dataw0lf: Sent. Thank you. :) |
| 22:29.37 | dataw0lf | Yup. |
| 22:29.59 | *** join/#utah bzob (n=bzob@nat.myfamilyinc.com) |
| 22:30.43 | mheath | dataw0lf: I have no chance, right? =D |
| 22:31.55 | *** join/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/active/bucky) |
| 22:47.48 | sjansen | mheath: perhaps a bribe would help |
| 22:49.13 | mheath | Hahaha. |
| 22:49.36 | *** join/#utah Lone_Wanderer (n=chatzill@graphics.sendsations.com) |
| 22:49.43 | Lone_Wanderer | Does anyone here use putty? |
| 22:52.13 | jce | only when I'm on some random windows box... |
| 22:54.07 | Lone_Wanderer | wondering if it's possible to put the name of the document I'm editing in its title bar (the one that windows uses) so I can know what's editing what when I alt-tab to it. |
| 22:54.59 | sjansen | What editor? |
| 22:55.02 | sjansen | Vim can do that. |
| 22:55.03 | Lone_Wanderer | vim |
| 22:55.25 | tene__ | yeah |
| 22:55.28 | Lone_Wanderer | can it do it to putty? |
| 22:59.07 | *** part/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@obelix.cs.byu.edu) |
| 22:59.20 | sjansen | I would think so. It's part of various terminal standards. |
| 22:59.43 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 22:59.47 | Lone_Wanderer | any idea how I'd do that? |
| 23:00.08 | sjansen | I'm looking but not finding it. |
| 23:00.16 | Lone_Wanderer | what would it be called? |
| 23:00.17 | sjansen | It's just an option you need in your vimrc. |
| 23:00.29 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm looking in Putty for it |
| 23:00.46 | Lone_Wanderer | ah hah |
| 23:01.00 | Lone_Wanderer | "Disable remote window title querying (SECURITY)" |
| 23:15.47 | *** join/#utah resplin (n=richard@dsl092-197-123.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 23:27.05 | *** part/#utah resplin (n=richard@dsl092-197-123.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 23:48.06 | goozbach | sweet! I'm logged into talk.google.com |
| 23:48.31 | goozbach | somebody add me as a buddy: goozbach@gmail.com |
| 23:51.00 | mheath | goozbach: what kind of server is it? |
| 23:51.17 | mheath | Someone said it was jabber, but my gaim isn't liking it. |
| 23:52.03 | goozbach | jabber |
| 23:52.16 | goozbach | gaim worked like a charm for me |
| 23:52.36 | mheath | goozbach: weird port or something? |
| 23:53.47 | mheath | nevermind |
| 23:53.57 | mheath | before it wouldn't connect, but now I'm getting a Stream Error |
| 23:55.19 | goozbach | I just used the defaults |
| 23:55.44 | goozbach | just the username |
| 23:55.47 | goozbach | server is talk.google.com |