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01:40.48goozbachhttp://spikedhumor.com/Article.aspx?id=1447
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01:48.39goozbachemcnabb:
01:48.41goozbachhttp://spikedhumor.com/Article.aspx?id=1447
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01:50.54emcnabbhaha
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01:58.07sargunhey
01:58.13sargunthis is Xbmodder
01:58.14sargun:)
01:58.26sargunok, were are thinking about it....
01:58.27sargunneed to think of something you could do.
01:58.53sargunwhen someone replies with that after the resume has been sent is that yes-ish
01:58.55sargunor no.
01:59.34RyanEit's 'don't know'.
02:00.00RyanEI had a company string me along for 2 weeks telling me they'd be hiring me any day now, until finally they said "the board informed us that we do not have an open position".
02:00.16RyanEI hope yours turns out better.  :)
02:00.44sargun:(
02:00.47sargunHope fully
02:01.20sargunWell these guys are in deep.
02:01.44sargunthey delivered the product about 2 months late and the investors are tired.
02:02.08sargunBecause they need to release the "professional" edition of their product
02:30.34xbmodderanyone in here have orkut?
02:51.36goozbachhttp://194.112.40.188/trev2.swf
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02:55.39leviGood evening.
02:57.30goozbachgood evening
02:59.29leviHeh.  What have you been doing in the classroom?
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03:07.21xbmodderLinus' daughter's are not too much younger than me :)
03:07.32xbmodder5 years
03:08.08xbmodder;)
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03:19.41xbmodderyour not doing a redhat course teaching are you?
03:19.42xbmodderI didn't know there where any redhat facilities in Ogden, Utah
03:22.20Supaplexhttp://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,68492,00.html What happens when FedEx gets uptight about your gratious use of boxes for furniture. funny :P
03:42.07goozbachI'm doing a redhat class in Phoenix
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03:52.57xbmodderoh :-/
03:53.13xbmodderSSHing into your system at home?
03:53.18xbmodderwell work
03:53.28xbmodderIs orkut invites not working for anyone right now?
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04:20.21goozbachthe answer is yes... i did set off the alarm.
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04:48.51leviI don't know why anyone would want to get invited to orkut these days.
04:50.10bonez41I don't know what orkut is.....these days or anytime..
04:51.04leviA 'social networking' sort of site, in the same vein as friendster.
04:51.23leviLaunched by a guy who works at google, though.
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04:54.39bonez41is 'social networking' akin at ALL to 'social engineering' ? or only when it doesn't involve actual engineer types?
04:57.42leviNo..
05:23.41xbmodderlike social networking for engineers
05:23.44xbmodderlinus is on it
05:24.32bonez41linus torvalds?
05:24.40bonez41linus is on orkut?
05:25.29leviA lot of people are on it.
05:25.40leviSome of them are well-known.
05:26.32leviBut the well-known people generally have public email addresses, so it's not like it's a big deal.
05:29.19bonez41oh, I guess I  seeemed surprised....in comparing it to other high profile peoople....like you'd never run into some top rpogrammer from Microsoft or Novell on something like that.....
05:29.42leviPerhaps you would, though.
05:30.00leviIt does have google-dust sprinkled on it, after all.
05:30.17bonez41I have written email to peopl elike Eric (guy who wrote the Bazaar and the Cathedral) and received responses...direct...that's what's great about open source...open access to the authors...
05:31.55bonez41Eric Raymond
05:31.58bonez41is that his name?
05:32.20tensaiyes
05:32.28bonez41cool
05:32.35tensaiaka ESR
05:33.05tensaimmm, homemade sausage and onion pizza...
05:33.48bonez41there ya go
05:34.36Maquis~lart OIT
05:34.37Maquis~beat OIT
05:34.37ibotACTION beats OIT with a large stick.
05:34.40Maquis~kill OIT
05:34.40ibotACTION shoots a excited anti-photon gun at OIT
05:34.46tensaiand my wife hates sausage, especially when I add rosemary so it's all mine. mua ha ha ha
05:34.48Maquis~destroy OIT
05:34.49ibotno
05:35.04tensaiMaquis: what is it this time?
05:36.26Maquisnewsome's fixed this problem at least 10 times in the past 2 days, and the server still claims not to exist
05:36.28bonez41oit?
05:37.06Maquisoffice of it
05:37.07Maquisbyu
05:38.20tensaithis is the problem with phantom?
05:38.27Maquisyeah
05:38.33Maquisphantom claims not to exist
05:38.41tensaiquite appropos, no?
05:40.17bonez41it's been a while since I spent any time at BYU....... do they have file sharing police and the porn police....and the hacker police....policing the internet activity of all the students and faculty?
05:41.14Maquiswell, if they have file-sharing police, they're amazingly ineffective...
05:41.27Maquisi'd say that at least 80% of my floor back in the dorms used Kazaa
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05:43.05bonez41ah....I have used gtk-gnutella now and then.....
05:43.19bonez41not sure if it's monitored or tracked, ....
05:43.54Maquisi'm sure all tpes of things are monitored, etc...
05:44.25bonez41no doubt
05:44.49Hhhhhhello
05:48.39bonez41Hhhhh, hello there
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06:19.38leviWell, I've finished my Lisp hacking for the night.  I got basic web-based entry and comment administration stuff done on my blog engine.
06:22.39Hhhhh((()(_(()(()()()()()(())lisp())(()(()(())())()(_)())()
06:23.00Hhhhh((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( 'Hello World" )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
06:23.06Hhhhh:p
06:23.43leviMore like: (format nil "Hello World")
06:25.26leviWhich has exactly the same number of parentheses as: printf("Hello World"); :P
06:26.31Hhhhhlol
06:26.46Hhhhhwell, sorry, I like the power of Lisp-like languages but not their syntax
06:26.52Hhhhhgot enough from Scheme in CS330
06:26.56leviSo, use Dylan.
06:27.10Hhhhhnah, C++ serves my purposes best
06:27.20leviIt's essentially Common Lisp with an algolish syntax.
06:27.33leviComplete with macros!
06:27.38Hhhhhyea, I heard of Dylan
06:27.41Hhhhhthat's nice
06:30.25leviI'd never use C++ on a hobby project, but I wish I had a working C++ cross-compiler for my embedded system at work.
06:31.43leviC is a bit lacking in some regards, and while C++ is overly complicated and nasty in numerous ways, I would like to have some of its features in my daily work.
06:33.39HhhhhI guess I am more used to C++. It is the language of preference in graphics and game development, which is what I do both for school and hobby
06:33.52mheathC isn't lacking. Programers are just getting lazier. That and employers are driving their programmers to be lazier.
06:35.24levimheath: Uh, whatever, dude.  Go make a useful program completely in a RISC assembly language, then come back and tell me how useful you think higher-level languges are.
06:35.57HhhhhI've found C to have all the features I'd like except by some nice tricks you can do in functional programming
06:36.02mheathlevi: I'm not talking about Assembly Vs. .NET
06:36.24mheathI'm talking about C versus C++, C++ versus .NET
06:36.30Hhhhhwhat does RISC have to do with that?
06:36.34levimheath: You are talking out of your ass is what you're doing.
06:36.46Hhhhhheh, calm down dude, nobody is bashing your lisp
06:37.09leviI'm not defending lisp, I'm defending all the programming language research done since C.
06:37.22Hhhhhand that's cool
06:37.30Hhhhhnobody is bashing that
06:37.35leviWhich mheath has essentially declared useless.
06:37.49leviLisp is lacking in some ways, too.
06:37.51mheathlevi: no. I've personally talked to and read through code of some of the best coders out there. Their code is an art, and uses C or some simlar language.
06:37.56HhhhhI prefer C++ because I like it, and I like the way it lets me do my own optimizations in the code itself
06:38.08mheathBut, at the same time, I get college representatives coming into my highschool programming class and telling me that "Java is the future!"
06:38.15Hhhhhand I do believe C isn't lacking
06:38.25Hhhhhnah, Java is dying
06:38.32leviC is indeed lacking, and anyone who believes it isn't hasn't got much of an imagination.
06:38.33Hhhhhit's nice but other factors are killing it
06:38.49mheath"Object oriented programming is the future!" They speak with pride that some ignorant guy who graduated from a 2 year college can write a program simply by laying it out in a GUI program.
06:38.55Hhhhhok, feel free to keep thinking they way you do, I'll do the same
06:39.18leviThe C type system is awful, and you have to circumvent it to do anything useful.
06:39.24xbmodderI like python print 'hello, world'
06:39.32HhhhhI personally like OOP a lot, and I believe it does not make things more bloated or troublesome
06:39.46Hhhhhbut I guess it is because I started out with OOP
06:39.58leviWell, not 'anything useful' but anything beyond your basic procedural programming paradigm.
06:40.36Hhhhhit is possible to work around that through some interfaces, but I personally think that OOP is a lot cleaner than the pure C approach
06:40.52HhhhhI don't like the way C is worked around that
06:41.05leviHhhhh: And C is lacking in its ability to do OOP cleanly.
06:41.25HhhhhC was created without OOP in mind
06:41.30Hhhhhthat's why I do C++
06:41.53leviIndeed.  Which is fine, but its inability to deal with it cleanly shows its weakness.
06:42.35Hhhhhif you want to do OOP stuff with C, it indeed is a weakness. Most stuff out of what it was intended to work on will show their weaknesse
06:43.09HhhhhI personally like the OOP approach a lot, and C++ or other OOP languages are already better suited for that than C
06:43.11leviSo, C is lacking there.
06:43.15mheathI personally dislike OOP, because it dumbs down new programmers.
06:43.16Hhhhhof course
06:43.28levimheath: You're talking out of your ass again.  Stop it.
06:43.32Hhhhhmheath: hmm, it depends, some people catch it right away
06:43.39mheathlevi: no I'm not
06:43.46Hhhhhmheath: I've seen all kinds of cases when TAing CS142
06:43.46mheathI was in a class with a bunch of high school students
06:43.56mheatha year long class on introduction to object oriented programming
06:43.59Hhhhhand I always tried to make sure people understood that part
06:44.00xbmodderI like OOP it makes everything SOO much easier
06:44.20levimheath: OOP does not dumb down new programmers.
06:44.25mheathGuess what? At the end of the year, no one in the class knew what an "integer" was.
06:44.35Hhhhhlevi: it depends, some people are indeed dumbed down
06:44.46leviHhhhh: Sure, but it's not OOP's fault.
06:44.47mheathThe class was in VB
06:44.51Hhhhhmheath: that means nothing
06:45.00Hhhhhlol, VB isn't OOP
06:45.08levimheath: VB may indeed dumb down new programmers.  That's got nothing to do with OOP.
06:45.12mheathHhhhh: .NET VB isn't?
06:45.18HhhhhVB.NET is
06:45.32Hhhhhbut teachers that teach VB.NET are not teachers, if you get what I mean
06:45.33mheathHhhhh: thats what the class was using.
06:46.03Hhhhhwell, back in the day I would have used Java, and now I would use C# or something like that for a OOP class
06:46.10mheathHhhhh: no, the teachers that teach VB.NET are forced to becaus the state department of education agrees with you that OOP is the best, that its the future
06:46.18mheaththey switched the introductory class from C to VB
06:46.32levimheath: Where's this class?
06:46.53mheathYes, I know VB is a horrible example of OOP. But unlike us linux users here, the state department of education is in Microsoft's pocket
06:46.55Hhhhhmheath: no, you're wrong. VB.NET is what dumb programmers use, so if the state department think VB.NET is the best for teaching OOP, then that's where the problem is
06:47.15Hhhhhmheath: well, i'd go for C# any day
06:47.24Hhhhhwhether i'm in M$'s pocket or not
06:47.49HhhhhVB.NET is NOT a good language to teach OOP
06:47.50mheathlevi: I believe in every highschool in Utah that wants to offer programming
06:47.57Hhhhhwell that's sad
06:48.08levimheath: None of which has anything to do with OOP as a concept, so my assertion that you were talking out of your ass has not been refuted.
06:48.32Hhhhhthey can teach C# and still kiss M$'s butt
06:49.02HhhhhI agree with levi there, it's VB.NET that complicated things, it is not an easy language to teach unless you come from VB
06:49.11HhhhhOOP was not the problem there
06:49.20mheathThey can only teach VB and Java now (COmp Programming1 is VB and Comp Programming2 is Java)
06:49.21HhhhhVB.NET is really very useless
06:49.40Hhhhhhmm, Java is somewhat nice but it is dying
06:49.43Hhhhhthey should teach C#
06:49.43leviIt'd be sad for anyone to force classes to use VB, but a competent teacher could still teach correct programming principles with it despite the nastiness.
06:49.51Hhhhhthat's the best language to teach newbies
06:49.59mheathHhhhh: oh, but they thing C# is too advanced for beginning programmers. And Comp Programming2 has to be Java, because its an AP class and thats what the AP test is on.
06:50.03mheath*think
06:50.06Hhhhhwhat!
06:50.11leviHhhhh: Java is dying in the same way C++ is.  Meaning, it'll still be around and useful for a long time.
06:50.14Hhhhhif they teach java they can teach C#
06:50.30Hhhhhnah, C++ is pretty strong man, no signs of it dying
06:50.33Hhhhhjava IS dying
06:51.01Hhhhhlots of linux users are preferring python or perl nowadays, but believe me, C++ is still very strong
06:51.17leviC++ had a huge chunk of its marketshare taken away by Java, and I'm sure plenty of people thought it was dying at the time.
06:51.24Hhhhhnot a huge chunk
06:52.04HhhhhI think C++ is still the most used language for non-web stuff
06:52.16Hhhhhactually, I'm pretty confident about that
06:52.51Hhhhhthere are many cases in which people would be better off using something different
06:53.12leviHhhhh: What makes you confident about it?  The fact that you like to use C++?
06:53.31Hhhhhnope, the fact that most companies are still hiring C++ developers
06:53.40Hhhhhand the amount of resources out there
06:53.58Hhhhhjava's market decreases a lot, and C# is pushing strong
06:54.05Hhhhhbut still C++ rules
06:54.26Hhhhhi'm not saying it is the best language, there is no such thing as a "best" language
06:54.27leviA lot of companies are still hiring Java programmers, too.
06:54.41Hhhhhit all depends on what you're trying to do and also in your background
06:54.45Hhhhhnot many
06:54.52Hhhhhpretty much is all J2EE
06:55.09leviWhich is... Java.
06:55.29Hhhhhwhat I meant is that J2EE is most of the Java offers out there
06:55.42Hhhhhyou don't see many desktop java programming outside of schools nowadays
06:55.48leviWhich may be true, but is irrelevant.
06:56.06leviMost programming is /not/ desktop programming.
06:56.11Hhhhhstill, j2EE isn't a huge share of the market either
06:56.19Hhhhhtrue
06:56.33Hhhhhin that real PHP is pretty big
06:56.43Hhhhhwhich is pretty much a mix between perl and C
06:57.04Hhhhhs/real/realm
06:57.44Hhhhhwhen I said "most used language" I mentiones "non-web"
06:57.56Hhhhhso it is probable that PHP is most used than C++
06:58.35Hhhhhanyways, in my area, C++ is a huge share
06:58.49Hhhhhnot many games are in a language other than C++
06:59.01leviJava beats C++ in jobs listed at Dice.com
06:59.03Hhhhhand when they are, it's usually some zealot trying to make a point
06:59.16leviSo, now your slanted perspective comes out. :)
06:59.28Hhhhhlol, that is one instance at a given time
06:59.55leviJava also sells more books than C++ does.
06:59.57Hhhhhalso make sure you're looking in non-web jobs,
07:00.05Hhhhhbleh, that is irrelevant
07:00.08leviI just did a search on 'Java' and 'C++'
07:00.15Hhhhhi'm sure C# sells more books than java
07:00.17leviI don't care what they're related to.
07:00.22leviI'm sure it doesn't.
07:00.37Hhhhhwell, then you're not paying attention to what I'm saying
07:00.59HhhhhI specifically said and repeated that C++ is the most commonly used language in non-web stuff
07:01.02levihttp://radar.oreilly.com/archives/2005/06/the_rise_of_ope.html
07:01.15Hhhhhsearching for java will simply give j2ee stuff
07:01.28Hhhhhoreilly, the most knowledgable guy in the internet ;P
07:01.38Hhhhhyou need better sources
07:01.45Hhhhhnuff' said about that
07:02.31Hhhhhnow, if you want to go through the trouble of filtering web-related java stuff from your searches, we'll see what happens
07:02.56leviSearching 'java and not j2ee' on dice.com returned a similar number as c++
07:03.04leviI don't care enough to research beyond that.
07:03.16leviObviously the impending death of java is greatly exaggerated.
07:03.27Hhhhhyup, of course you wouldn't, because most j2ee are listed as java
07:03.35Hhhhhor they'll put servlets instead of j2ee
07:03.46Hhhhhor java web services
07:03.51Hhhhhor jsp
07:04.09Hhhhhtry looking for swing or something more desktop-ish
07:04.21leviRegardless, that doesn't mean Java is dying, which is the statement I am trying to refute, not your assertion that java isn't used outside web programming.
07:04.43Hhhhhwell, whatever
07:04.52Hhhhhmany people migrated from java to C#
07:04.56Hhhhhit took a huge share
07:05.05leviI think your perception of that is skewed.
07:05.11Hhhhhand most people that stayed were or moved to j2ee
07:05.33Hhhhhman, just think of the beauty of making guis in swing
07:05.48Hhhhhthat should be enough reason to justify massive migrations to C#
07:06.00leviMaking guis in swing isn't that bad.  It's just /using/ them that is.
07:06.16Hhhhhhave you made complex guis in swing?
07:06.38Hhhhhwithout spending $1000+ in JBuilder enterprise?
07:06.39leviNot complex ones, no.
07:06.51Hhhhhok, then try it first, and then tell me your opinion
07:06.58Hhhhhbecause they're extremely tedious
07:07.02Hhhhhand a pain
07:07.06HhhhhVERY tedious
07:07.24Hhhhhcan't compare to forms in C#
07:07.28Hhhhhby any means
07:07.48Hhhhhgtk is a lot easier and nicer than swing
07:07.56leviOkay, maybe making guis in swing /is/ bad.  Most people are indeed probably using j2ee with Java and not swing.  But there's a LOT of j2ee.
07:08.10HhhhhI agree with that and I don't dispute it
07:08.53Hhhhhand I did say that most java programming nowadays is web stuff
07:08.53leviFrankly, I wouldn't be too sad to see Java die, or at least fade from popularity.
07:09.10Hhhhhthat's what i'm saying it is happening
07:09.19HhhhhC# took too big of a bite from java
07:09.22leviI don't think it's fading very quickly, though.
07:09.39Hhhhhi believe C# is already more used than java
07:09.55Hhhhhand in desktop stuff, C++ is by far more used than java
07:09.58leviWhere do you get that idea?
07:10.00Hhhhhwhich are the claims I made
07:10.12leviWell, I agree C++ is used far more in desktop stuff.
07:10.15Hhhhhsurfing the internet, looking at books available
07:10.18Hhhhhjob offers, etc
07:10.28Hhhhhthat is the first claim I made
07:10.37Hhhhhthe second one, that java is dying, is also true
07:10.54Hhhhhit is in the process of being replaced by C#
07:11.10Hhhhhthat process is not finished though
07:11.20levidice.com lists about a 1/3 of the jobs for C# as it does for Java.
07:12.09Hhhhhwell, include ASP.NET in the search, since you're including j2ee in the search as well
07:12.18Hhhhhpretty much all ASP.NET is done in C#
07:12.22leviI just searched 'Java' and 'C#'
07:12.36Hhhhhwell, java includes j2ee and web stuff, C# might not
07:12.46Hhhhhso no wonder you get those results
07:13.14leviWell, including asp.net adds another 1000, so it's now 4000 to 10000.
07:13.17Hhhhhif you're gonna search in both desktop and web, then you need to include ASP.NET for C# to compensate for j2ee in java
07:13.39Hhhhhall right, there you see a process going on ;)
07:14.34leviJava and C# will both decline in the future, though C# will probably grow quite a bit first.  Java will be around for a long time, though.
07:14.49HhhhhI agree with that
07:16.01levi'java is dying' kind of implies that it will go away sometime in the near future, and although I agree it will diminish in marketshare, I don't think it will diminish far enough to be considered 'gone away' in the near term.
07:16.51tensaidon't forget, BSD is dying
07:17.08Hhhhhwell, cobol is considered dead, and I know people looking for cobol developers
07:17.56Hhhhhif you see a decreasing trend in java's market share, you can see that it is dying
07:17.57leviMaintenance is not quite the same as new development.
07:18.15Hhhhhand recent business policies by Sun will ensure and accelerate that
07:18.31leviAnd decreasing market share is not quite the same as dying.
07:19.06xbmodderanything wrong with this apache config stanza:
07:19.06xbmodderNameVirtualHost tjrestaurants.com:80
07:19.07xbmodder<VirtualHost tjrestaurants.com:80>
07:19.07xbmodder<PROTECTED>
07:19.07xbmodder<PROTECTED>
07:19.07xbmodder#       ServerPath /var/web/thebrokenwargames.gotdns.com/tajay/
07:19.09xbmodder<PROTECTED>
07:19.11xbmodder</VirtualHost>
07:19.29levixbmodder: Yes, you just crapflooded the channel with it.
07:19.58Hhhhhok, everybody do the finger attack to tjrestaurants.com
07:20.10Hhhhhj/k
07:20.27xbmodderI don't mind
07:20.38xbmodderits godaddy's site right now :)
07:20.58xbmodderbut seriously what the hell is wrong with that?
07:22.12xbmodder[Fri Aug 19 00:21:55 2005] [warn] NameVirtualHost tjrestaurants.com:80 has no VirtualHosts
07:22.35xbmodderlevi, anybody?
07:24.21leviI don't know what's wrong with it.
07:53.57goozbachuse the ip
07:56.11xbmodderhttp://pastebin.com/340560
07:56.15xbmodderno avail?
08:35.46*** join/#utah colera (n=colera@158.91.203.5)
10:07.08*** join/#utah RyanE_ (n=ryan@rberick.dsl.xmission.com)
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13:31.50sjansenYay! Sanity might be winning. SUSE might be switching to NetworkManager.
13:32.14sjansenNow if only we could get the distros to agree on a configuration tools...
13:32.37sjansen(Ubuntu has also been flirting with NetworkManager. Don't know about Debian.)
13:35.05dataw0lfUbuntu isn't going to stick with NetworkManager, unfortunately.
13:36.45sjansenOh? Do you know what the plan is?
13:39.39emcnabbsjansen, Fogo de Chao was very yummy last night
13:39.49sjansen~beat emcnabb
13:39.49ibotACTION beats emcnabb with a large stick.
13:39.55sjansen~stab emcnabb
13:39.55ibotACTION runs at emcnabb with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut.
13:39.58emcnabbhaha
13:40.01sjansen~kill emcnabb
13:40.01ibotACTION shoots a   anti-graviton gun at emcnabb
13:40.05sjansen~torture emcnabb
13:40.10emcnabbrofl
13:40.13sjansen~destroy emcnabb
13:40.14ibotno
13:40.19sjansenyes!!!
13:40.25emcnabbibot loves me!
13:40.34sjansen~knife emcnabb
13:40.49sjansen~lart emcnabb
13:40.53sjansen~bzfrag emcnabb
13:40.53ibotACTION blindsides emcnabb with an invisible bullet
13:40.57sjansen~whaleslap emcnabb
13:40.57ibotACTION slaps emcnabb upside and over the head with one freakishly huge killer whale named hugh
13:41.01sjansen~funkybomb emcnabb
13:41.01ibotACTION blows away emcnabb in a psychedelic flash
13:41.36dataw0lfsjansen: they're trying to get a half decent solution out of SoC
13:43.13sjansenI kill you emcnabb! I kill you dead!
13:43.26sjansenAnd then I dance on your grave sprinkling farofa!!!
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14:07.29*** join/#utah Jayce^ (n=Jayce_@pollux.northsky.com)
14:07.29*** mode/#utah [+o Jayce^] by ChanServ
14:11.10sjansenJayce^: emcnabb ate at a churrascaria last night and rubbed it in this morning, would you please kickban him?
14:14.48dataw0lfI saw it!1!
14:15.49emcnabbso full...
14:16.06emcnabbit was worth the $58 though
14:22.23*** kick/#utah [emcnabb!n=Jayce_@pollux.northsky.com] by Jayce^ (Jayce^)
14:24.04*** join/#utah emcnabb (n=emcnabb@64-190-250-2.client.cypresscom.net)
14:24.15emcnabbdang you Jayce^!!!
14:26.36Jayce^:)
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14:45.18sjansen<PROTECTED>
14:45.50sjansenalthough I seem to remember requesting a kickban, not a simple kick...
14:46.05dataw0lf=]
14:46.36sjansendataw0lf: wow, those are some pretty amazing cheek muscles you've got there :-P
14:47.04dataw0lfbotox buddy
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15:02.07sjansenhttp://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/front/3301862 <-- Presented as an argument for why not to shop at WalMart.
15:02.59dataw0lfthe culture that frequents WalMart is enough for me.
15:02.59sjansenThinking like that really ticks me off. Don't like WalMart's employment and supplier relationship policies? Fine, don't shop there.
15:03.27sjansenArguing that WalMart is evil because it hires stuipd people is, well, stupid.
15:03.59sjansenMight as well stop shopping anywhere else. In fact, stop interacting with humanity in general. There's alot of stupid people out there and you wouldn't want to accidentally support them either.
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15:07.24*** part/#utah mindjuju (n=mindjuju@216.20.238.225)
15:10.37jsmithsjansen: Excellent point.
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15:20.48sjansenargh!!!
15:21.33vontrapp~squeeze sjansen
15:21.33ibotACTION squeezes the juice out of sjansen until there just ain't nothin left
15:30.10Maquis~squeeze vontrapp
15:30.10ibotACTION squeezes the juice out of vontrapp until there just ain't nothin left
15:30.28sjansen~hug vontrapp and Maquis
15:30.28ibotACTION hugs vontrapp and Maquis
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15:37.13vontrappawww, gee
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15:46.03*** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ
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16:07.38vontrappis there a php function to strip enclosing quotes off the ends of a string, if existant?
16:09.24BradipoI'm sure there must be a regex substitution function of some kind.
16:10.44vontrappyeah, but a regex in php is not nearly beautiful like perl
16:10.58vontrappit's a long named function call with parens and quotes and values and ahhh
16:11.06leviDude, you're using php.  You're just going to have to deal with ugliness. ;)
16:11.10vontrappguess i'll just buck up and do it
16:12.57Jayce^levi, that quote was worthy of sjansen!
16:13.41leviUgliness is somewhat subjective, of course.
16:15.50goozbachunless you're sjansen, then it's a way of life :)
16:25.17sjansenhttp://www.windley.com/archives/2005/08/vacations_and_h.shtml
16:25.30sjansennow there's a good approach to vacations and email
16:27.38vontrappthat's awesome
16:27.44vontrappexcellent idea
16:28.21bonez39how does one detach a file that has been attached, with 'a'   in mutt?
16:28.43bonez39found it...D
16:29.56vontrapp~lart DST
16:30.04Maquis[sharmahd sharmahd] ssh erins@phantom.cs.byu.edu                                         1
16:30.07MaquisLocal: Bad packet length 1349676916.
16:30.27Maquiswhat the ***** does that mean/
16:31.16dataw0lfMaquis: turn up the verbosity please?
16:31.23sjansenMaquis: either my vocabulary is too small, or you have one too many * in your last comment
16:31.41Maquisdataw0lf: taht's about as verbose as it gets
16:31.51vontrappwhat the laser does that mean, dataw0lf
16:31.51dataw0lfMaquis: ssh 1 client connecting to ssh 2 server ?
16:31.55Maquissjansen: sorry... my vocabulary is too small to know how many *s to add
16:32.12Maquisdataw0lf: i'm just trying to connect to 1 server
16:32.26Maquisoh...wait...  that's what you meant by verbosity
16:32.28dataw0lfssh version 1 client to ssh version 2 server
16:32.41Maquishmmm...
16:32.41vontrappMaquis: ssh -v bla blah
16:32.42dataw0lfyou might have an older client in your path
16:32.48dataw0lfbefore a newer client
16:32.52Maquisdataw0lf: completely possible
16:32.57Maquiseverything on rh7.2 is old
16:33.12Maquisok...
16:33.16Maquisi found the other client...
16:35.05sjansenssh -vvv is more verbose
16:35.30Maquisbut i don't get ti
16:35.40vontrappwhat about do?
16:35.44vontrappor fa?
16:36.09vontrappo/~ do, the stuff, that buys me beer o/~
16:37.40*** join/#utah decriptor_work (n=decripto@67.108.235.2.ptr.us.xo.net)
16:37.56decriptor_workhey all
16:38.14Jayce^liar, you don't actually _work
16:38.30decriptor_worklol
16:38.36decriptor_workI can fake it
16:39.21decriptor_workif I can learn perl then I can get a better job :)
16:40.45decriptor_workso you take a stab at me and run   I see how it is
16:40.52Jayce^yup
16:41.10goozbachsjansen: never... I was refering to the fact that you deal with TeX and XML on a daily basis
16:42.59decriptor_workman I really wish I could get copies of that perl meeting
16:43.21decriptor_workI can only remember a fraction of what he talked about
16:48.03Jayce^so you're saying you tried to dd a 120gb drive onto a 10gb one? :)
16:48.29MaquisGRRRRR
16:49.12vontrappnaw, he was running off a live cd, and realized to late the only rw he had was a usb thumb drive
16:49.31Maquisbah
16:49.57Maquisif anybody sees anything from uug-list show up in your inbox, please let me know
16:50.03Maquisi tried to send something
16:50.29sjanseno/~ Hoy es un dia normal, pero yo voy hacerlo intenso. ~/o
16:50.29sjanseno/~ Hoy puede apagarse el sol, pero no la luz de mi alma. ~/o
16:50.30*** join/#utah spr (n=spr@byu291693wks.byu.edu)
16:50.36sjansenhttp://www.nomorelyrics.net/song/154028.html
16:50.46sjanseno/~ Porque nunca sabes lo que quieres, hasta que lo pierdes. ~/o
16:50.46sjanseno/~ Lamentablemente nunca vuelve. ~/o
16:51.29tensaiMaquis: not likely. Host uug.byu.edu not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
16:52.28coleraso i need suggestions for a file manager for *nix i think it's really the only thing i miss about windows
16:52.44emcnabbJayce^, you kick me off for talking about good food, and you let sjansen crapflood like that?
16:52.45sjansenlet go of Windows, use nautilus
16:52.50tenewhat's important to you for a file manager, colera?
16:52.53Jayce^konq
16:52.53emcnabbkick sjansen!!!
16:53.03colerai like the list view in windows
16:53.05Jayce^true, it was *gag* spanish..
16:53.07tensairxvt!
16:53.17*** kick/#utah [sjansen!n=Jayce_@pollux.northsky.com] by Jayce^ (Jayce^)
16:53.20coleragood drag drop etc
16:53.24emcnabboh yeah!!!
16:53.26vontrappvim!!
16:53.32*** join/#utah sjansen (n=sjansen@66-163-12-54.ip.tor.radiant.net)
16:53.35Jayce^colera, konqueror
16:53.40coleraand that everything opens in the same window
16:53.50emcnabbjustice is served!
16:53.58tenecolera: rox, nautilus, konqueror, evidence, xfe, gentoo
16:54.01tenecheck those out
16:54.01sjansennautilus has a browse filesystem version if you want, but why?
16:54.06tensaikonqueror does well, I use the quick browser most of the time though
16:54.15coleragentoo isn't a file manager : )
16:54.19teneyes it is
16:54.27tenethere is a file manager called 'gentoo'
16:54.30colerareally?
16:54.32coleracool
16:54.37sjansenthere's a name collision between the two projects
16:54.37colerai'll have to check it out
16:54.38Maquistensai: i know that uug.byu.edu is not found
16:54.39teneno relation to the linux distribution
16:54.43Maquisthat's what the email is announcing
16:54.53Maquisi'm telling people that the officers do know about the problem and are trying to fix it
16:54.59Maquisemcnabb: sup?
16:55.39colerais there a way to make nautilus launch everything in the same window?
16:55.44sjansenyup
16:56.11vontrapp--browser or something i think it was
16:56.55tensaiMaquis: if the list is set up like it used to be, the return path is uug-list-bounces@phantom.byu.edu. since phantom.byu.edu doesn't resolve either, many mail servers are going to reject it.
16:57.03sjansenthere's some "advanced tweaking" app you can install that has a checkbox for that, but really you just want to use gconf-editor
16:57.03tensaiall of my mail servers would
16:58.04colerahow do i change the icons displayed in nautilus?
16:58.25colerait's wierd the folders are being displayed as a piece of paper : (
16:58.40JoshHthe gnome icon theme
16:59.21sjansencolera: gconf-editor, apps>nautilus>preferences>{always_use_browser,default_folder_view}
17:00.14tenecolera: you need to run, like, gnome-session or some such, I think
17:00.15emcnabbMaquis, nothing really
17:00.37sjansennautilus is really intended to be used as a part of the entire gnome desktop, not by itself
17:00.50Maquistensai: yeah...  phantom.cs.byu.edu is theonly thing that resolves
17:00.53Maquisthat's the problem right now
17:00.54sjansen~warn emcnabb
17:01.11Maquisbut phantom.cs.byu.edu doesn't accept much of anything from off-campus computers
17:01.15colerasjansen do you have a suggestion as to a file manager that is free standing?
17:01.20Maquisit won't return pings, and it won't accept telnet connections
17:01.30tensaiMaquis: if you change the return path, it should probably work
17:01.31tenecolera: I personally like evidence
17:01.32emcnabbI use nautilus every once in a while with fluxbox
17:01.34emcnabbalias nautilus='nautilus --no-desktop --sm-disable'
17:01.38tenecolera: rox is quite nice too
17:01.47Maquistensai: don't know how...
17:01.58sjansenemcnabb: the problem is that you still need to setup gnome themes, mime-mapping, etc.
17:02.12coleraemcnabb: hey thanks for the --no-desktop i was wondering how to do that
17:03.01emcnabbsjansen, yeah, I know
17:03.19emcnabbI usually just use it if I want to look at a bunch of image thumbnails
17:03.22emcnabbcolera, np
17:03.30vontrappwhat is evidence?
17:03.55tensai~dict evidence
17:04.13tenevontrapp: a file manager
17:04.19RyanEman, I must be old.  When I started reading this, I was thinking I should suggest 'mc'.  :)
17:04.33sjansenevidence is?
17:04.39tenefile manager developed by people associated with the enlightenment project.
17:04.43tenesjansen: yeah
17:04.44vontrappno package for it
17:04.49tenevontrapp: what distro?
17:04.54vontrappdebian/ubuntu
17:04.55sjansenevince is a document display program that integrates well with nautilus, right now it's mostly a pdf/ps viewer
17:05.15tenesjansen: it sure is.
17:05.28sjansenevince rocks the house
17:05.32teneQuite.
17:05.38vontrapprox doesn't use the mailcap?
17:05.40sjansensjansen is a genius
17:06.14colerai launched nautilus and it changed my desktop i ctrl-c'ed it now i am trying to find which process it started so i can kill it because my dektop is still swapped
17:06.23tenecolera: 'killall nautilus'
17:06.24vontrapprox is slicky fast
17:06.27sjansenpkill nautilus
17:06.30tenesjansen: maybe!
17:06.32emcnabbum, sjansen, you'll be waiting a while
17:06.39Jayce^pkill sjansen
17:06.50emcnabbkick sjansen
17:06.57colerai tried killall naut* nothing
17:06.58emcnabbkickban sjansen
17:07.17tenecolera: 'killall nautilus'
17:07.31Jayce^and here I thought sjansen would lose his violent side after getting married
17:07.34colerano yeah that's what i did
17:07.42Jayce^emcnabb :)
17:07.54Jayce^like the other case will *ever* happen
17:08.15colerai just restarted fluxbox
17:08.21colerathat did it
17:09.00colerahey all what distro?
17:09.04coleradebain - sarge
17:09.07teneeh?
17:09.10tenewhat distro is what?
17:09.23colerawhat distro are you running?
17:09.35vontrappubuntu mixed with sarge (insane, i know)
17:09.39emcnabbsjansen got married?
17:09.54vontrappand mixed with some unstable, too
17:09.54emcnabbI knew he shouldn't have taught that class in Vegas!
17:10.25coleravontrapp: lol, you installed ubuntu then installed sarge packages? or the other way around?
17:10.43vontrappubuntu, then sarge/unstable packages
17:10.47vontrapponly a few
17:10.52coleralike?
17:10.57vontrapppretty much only what i need for the latest alsa
17:11.00coleraxfce4.2?
17:11.03xbmodderhttp://pastebin.com/340931 < any ideas whats wrong with that?
17:11.09vontrappno xfce
17:11.14colerai wish that wasn't marked unstable ^
17:11.39vontrappcolera: and occasional packages that ubuntu just doesn't have
17:11.46colerai really like xfce but i have been using fluxbox, i really like it
17:12.06RyanEcombining the conversations, *sjansen married* would definitely be marked unstable.
17:12.11coleralol
17:12.24vontrappxbmodder: not allowed to relay
17:12.54emcnabbRyanE, rofl
17:12.59vontrappRyanE: :)
17:13.29coleraxbmodder: you excited for x-box 360?
17:13.40emcnabbxbmodder, are you going to mod it?
17:13.51vontrappxbmodder: don't let it mod you
17:13.58emcnabbyou'll need a new handle: xb360modder
17:13.59coleravontrapp: lol
17:14.19emcnabbor xbmodder360
17:14.28emcnabbI kind of like the latter
17:15.04vontrappxb360with_a_double_twist_half_pike_modder
17:15.07xbmodderlol
17:15.33vontrapps/twist/flip/
17:15.37xbmodderxb360modder
17:15.38xbmodder:-/
17:15.52xbmodderxbmodder360 :)
17:15.56emcnabbor something more general like xbmodderhacker360
17:16.05emcnabbor something more general like xbmodderhacker360.com
17:16.05sjansenthank goodness for tab completion
17:16.12xbmodderthats like a double wammy
17:16.12emcnabbor something more general like xbmodderhacker360.com.trig.dll
17:16.22xbmodderhaha
17:16.44xbmodderthough microsoft might get its lawyers out on me
17:16.52xbmoddersuprised they have not already
17:16.53emcnabbfight the system
17:17.14emcnabbyou better watch out, they know where sleep
17:17.16sjansen_com_trigbah
17:17.21xbmodderlol
17:18.55xbmodder360I don't know if I'd eat quesadillas made by someone with the nick of colera
17:19.23coleraemcnabb: i didn't invite you
17:19.26coleraemcnabb: i didn't invite you:
17:19.29coleralol
17:19.30colerasorry
17:19.35emcnabbhaha
17:19.37coleradidn't mean to post twice
17:19.55sjansenkick colera for double posting!!!
17:20.15xbmodderIntestinal acute bacterial infection characterized by a severe watery diarrea that produces a great dehydration and loss of minerals. < I really don't want that.
17:20.30coleraxbmodder: actually that is cholera
17:20.31emcnabbsjansen gets colera
17:20.50xbmoddercouldn't you have come up with a nice name like happy-pie?
17:20.51emcnabbyum
17:21.00emcnabbor xbmodder360?
17:21.07xbmodderlol
17:21.42emcnabbnothing shows your hacker spirit than with a nick like xbmodder360
17:22.05sjansenhacker?
17:22.18emcnabboh yeah, hacker
17:22.32rmsnow this is a hacker's nick
17:22.46emcnabbno, rms360 is a hacker's nick
17:22.53emcnabb_poserposer
17:23.18colerawhy does my floor get stickier when i clean it?
17:23.19coleralol
17:23.41Jayce^coke really isn't that good of a cleaner man
17:23.45colerakitchens are eternally dirty
17:24.08vontrappquesadillas don't make very good mops, either
17:26.31*** join/#utah mhartebot (i=nobody@dsl092-015-136.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
17:27.02xbmodder!nick-o-meter xbmodder360
17:27.02mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "xbmodder360" is 40.7%.
17:27.07xbmodderwow.
17:27.10xbmodder!nick-o-meter emcnabb
17:27.11mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "emcnabb" is 0.0%.
17:27.15Maquis!nick-o-meter maquis
17:27.16mhartebotMaquis: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "maquis" is 0.0%.
17:27.18Maquishaha
17:27.19vontrapp!nick-o-meter vontrapp
17:27.20mhartebotvontrapp: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "vontrapp" is 0.0%.
17:27.27vontrapp~nickometer vontrapp
17:27.31tene!nick-o-meter tene
17:27.32mhartebottene: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "tene" is 0.0%.
17:27.53colera!nick-o-meter colera
17:27.54mhartebotcolera: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "colera" is 0.0%.
17:27.58coleranice
17:27.59Maquis!nick-o-meter 1337|-|4(|<3|2
17:27.59mhartebotMaquis: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "1337|-|4(|<3|2" is 99.95%.
17:28.07xbmodder!nick-o-meter bzob_
17:28.09mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "bzob_" is 0.0%.
17:28.56vontrapp~nickometer xbmodder360
17:28.59xbmodder!lart Maquis
17:29.38xbmodder!lart Maquis 2
17:29.40vontrappibot has more significant digits, but less accuracy
17:29.47xbmodder!lart Maquis 1
17:31.02co13r4!nick-o-meter co13r4
17:31.03mhartebotco13r4: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "co13r4" is 86.4%.
17:31.06spr~nick-o-meter spr
17:31.06co13r4nice
17:31.15spr~nickometer spr
17:31.22xbmodder~nick-o-meter ChanServ
17:31.30xbmodder!nick-o-meter ChanServ
17:31.32mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "ChanServ" is 0.0%.
17:31.47co13r4!nick-o-meter mhartebot
17:31.48mhartebotco13r4: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "mhartebot" is 0.0%.
17:31.50sjansen~nickometer 13373^
17:31.55co13r4of course it is
17:31.56tene~nick-o-meter |\/|/-\O,|_|15
17:31.58co13r4lol
17:32.04sjansenwhat?! I was robbed!
17:32.45sjansen~nickometer |_33+3|^
17:33.01co13r4!nick-o-meter lame
17:33.02mhartebotco13r4: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "lame" is 61.6%.
17:33.09co13r4should be 100
17:33.15sjansen!nick-o-meter |_33+3|^
17:33.17mhartebotsjansen: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "|_33+3|^" is 99.8%.
17:33.55sjansen!nick-o-meter |_
17:33.55mhartebotsjansen: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "|_" is 14.4%.
17:34.01sjansen!nick-o-meter |
17:34.03mhartebotsjansen: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "|" is 14.4%.
17:34.06xbmodder!leet Maquis
17:34.07tene!nick-o-meter 1337
17:34.08mhartebotxbmodder: M4qu!z
17:34.09mhartebottene: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "1337" is 95.0%.
17:34.18xbmodder!super-1337 Maquis
17:34.19sjansenthanks lame, it ranks invalid nicks
17:34.19mhartebotxbmodder: Error: "super-1337" is not a valid command.
17:35.09co13r4i am going to stick with my new nick : ) 84 % is way better than 0
17:36.41xbmodder!leet colera
17:36.43mhartebotxbmodder: c013r4
17:37.26sjansen~nickometer Ι_|Ξ|ΞϮ5τϒεετ
17:37.35sjansenyay!
17:37.49sjansen!nick-o-meter  Ι_|Ξ|ΞϮ5τϒεετ
17:37.50mhartebotsjansen: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "Ι_|Ξ|ΞϮ5τϒεετ" is 99.994%.
17:37.57sjansenI win!
17:38.07xbmodderdamn
17:38.17xbmodder!nick-o-meter !
17:38.17mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!" is 14.4%.
17:38.21xbmodder!nick-o-meter !!!!!
17:38.22mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!!!!!" is 99.93%.
17:38.24xbmodder!nick-o-meter !!!!!!
17:38.26mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!!!!!!" is 99.96%.
17:38.29xbmodder!nick-o-meter !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
17:38.30mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" is 99.994%.
17:38.33xbmodderlol
17:38.36xbmodderi win/
17:38.39xbmodder!nick-o-meter !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
17:38.41mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" is 99.995%.
17:38.50xbmodderyay i win!
17:38.58xbmodder!nick-o-meter !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
17:38.59mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" is 99.996%.
17:39.02sjansen!nick-o-meter  Ι_|Ξ|ΞϮ5τϒεετ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
17:39.03mhartebotsjansen: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "Ι_|Ξ|ΞϮ5τϒεετ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1" is 99.996%.
17:39.10xbmodder!nick-o-meter !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
17:39.11vontrapp!nick-o-meter វន់ត្រាផ់
17:39.11mhartebotxbmodder: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1" is 99.996%.
17:39.13mhartebotvontrapp: The "lame nick-o-meter" reading for "វន់ត្រាផ់" is 99.995%.
17:39.13co13r4we are too easily amused
17:39.26xbmodderyes we are
17:39.28co13r4if our parents could see us now. soo proud
17:40.13co13r4anyone got suspend to work in linux for a laptop?
17:40.47sprcolera, which suspend? to-disk?
17:40.50colerayeha
17:40.54sprI have swsusp2 running quite nicely
17:40.57coleralike hibernate in window
17:41.03coleraspr ?
17:41.12vontrappspr: that takes kernel modules, right?
17:41.16sprsoftware suspend 2 (hibernate)
17:41.30sprvontrapp, takes kernel patching (but I hear it'll be in 2.6.14)
17:42.04colera: P
17:42.14sjansenso get to work writing the code
17:42.15sprwork's like a charm, all I did was follow the instructions, patch my kernel, edit a conf file, and it was working
17:42.24sjansenif you try hard, you might be able to finish be tonight
17:42.32sjansenthen again... you might not
17:42.38sprcolera, suspend2.net
17:43.47coleralol
17:44.03*** join/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/active/bucky)
17:44.28sprsjansen, here's all I did: cd <kernel-src-dir>; <path-to-swsusp2>/apply; make menuconfig; vim /etc/hibernate/hibernate.conf; /usr/local/sbin/hibernate
17:44.44coleracorrection till he
17:44.53sprafter installing the hibernate script and downloading the source.
17:45.00sproh so terribly hard.
17:45.21vontrappwhat about after i have a new kernel and my nvidia breaks?
17:45.42buckyvontrapp, are you helping hans move today?
17:45.58vontrappkinda
17:46.02sjansen~break vontrapp's nvidia drivers
17:46.07vontrappi'm leaving with them when they're done packing the truck
17:46.22sjansenso you're helping to drive?
17:46.33vontrappyeah
17:46.46coleraspr: i need practice rebuidling my kernel i have only done it once so maybe i will do that
17:46.48vontrappand i did load the piano this morning
17:47.12buckyvontrapp, so are you sure you want to take the back way or just drive down there like everyone else thru Cortez
17:47.16vontrappbucky: know a kathie or karen patterson?
17:47.17sjansenbut don't tell hans, 'cuase he thinks it was stolen
17:47.47buckyvontrapp, no
17:47.57vontrappthey're from blanding
17:48.07vontrappkaren is who i'm picking up the book for
17:48.14vontrappbtw, is that like lots of volumes?
17:48.38buckyvontrapp, my mom is still trying to get it from the library.. she's working on it
17:48.54*** join/#utah Utah_Dave (n=boucha@0-1pool139-24.nas28.salt-lake-city1.ut.us.da.qwest.net)
17:48.54vontrappok
17:49.15vontrappwhy take it from the library?
17:49.16Utah_Davedataw0lf:  can you recommend a couple of good Python books?
17:49.25buckyvontrapp,  my mom was in the hospital for a week last week
17:49.49buckyvontrapp, there are no blind people here.. and my friend donated the books
17:50.30buckymy friend John Stroebel the vista worker
17:50.51dataw0lfUtah_Dave: diveintopython.org
17:50.54coleraokay i need help
17:50.56dataw0lfUtah_Dave: byteofpython.info
17:51.09dataw0lfUtah_Dave: and then the Python 2.4 documentation
17:51.25vontrappricky-ticky-tavy
17:51.26colerai have a printserver on my network and i need to connect to it through linux
17:51.27sjansenbah, not deposited yet
17:51.36dataw0lfUtah_Dave: I also highly recommend ipython as an alternate interactive python interpreter
17:51.39sjansenseeing that number go up instead of down makes me so happy too...
17:51.40vontrappin case you want to fight the python
17:51.42colerait has a SMB name
17:51.58colerawhat packages do i need?
17:52.38vontrappgnome-cups-manager is good
17:53.06coleraso i needs cups right?
17:53.07coleralol
17:53.29buckysmbclient ?
17:53.42*** join/#utah RyanE_ (n=ryan@rberick.dsl.xmission.com)
17:56.12coleraokay after installing cups and smbclient what do i need to do?
17:57.40buckycheck /usr/share/doc/smbclient for any docs
17:57.54RyanEhas anyone seen where the DOM Inspector in Firefox (Windows) does not work?  I try it on all sites, get no 'DOM Nodes'.
17:58.33sjansenreload the page
17:58.44sjansenthe dom inspector needs to see the page being loaded
17:59.46RyanEI've reloaded the page, restarted firefox.
17:59.48RyanEnada
18:03.52buckyi've got good news... IBM is donating all it's dhtml code over to FF
18:16.23Maquissjansen: it's payday?  you must have a weird payday schedule
18:17.06sjansenI don't know, by-weekly-friday's seems pretty common.
18:17.32sjansenAnd, bi-weekly-friday's seems even more common.
18:18.17sprbyu's a bi-weekly-friday
18:19.23xbmodderany ideas why qmail is not relaying?
18:23.37sjansenI'm starting to think it'd be a good idea to comment my new sig. Any ideas?
18:23.46sjansenStuart Jansen                 e-mail/jabber: sjansen@buscaluz.org
18:23.46sjansen:0
18:23.46sjansen* ^From:.*sjansen@
18:23.46sjansen*/dev/null
18:26.43buckyvontrapp, i just got the books
18:28.33bucky~seen Bradipo
18:28.34ibotbradipo is currently on #utah (15h 8m 58s).  Has said a total of 1 messages.  Is idling for 2h 19m 10s
18:28.40sjansendecriptor_work just quit his job?!
18:29.02Jayce^nah, just quit working, it's friday after all
18:29.07Jayce^surprised he made it that long
18:29.33sjansenbut, but
18:29.53sjansen[12:23]    <-- decriptor_work has quit ()
18:30.04Jayce^you're just jealous
18:30.11sjansenyeah, probably
18:31.47vontrappbucky: ok, we'll be calling you then
18:31.56buckyBible Stories for Young Latter-Day Saints Vol. I, Vol. II and Vol. III
18:32.03buckyyou want them?
18:32.51buckyvontrapp, BTW i'm glad you'll be calling me because you can get something out of me
18:35.21buckywhere does [kathie | karen] patterson live ?
18:35.52vontrappkathie is still in blanding, her daughter karen is here in provo
18:36.45vontrappwe may have called anyway ;)
18:38.49buckyvontrapp, so Karen is blind?
18:40.36buckyBTW.. you've got about a one hour window to get on the road if you want to set up camp in daylight
18:42.28tenethis code refers to tables that don't exist.
18:42.31tene:/
18:42.37vontrappshe's moslty blind
18:42.42Maquisasdf
18:43.02vontrappbucky: we're leaving pretty soon here
18:43.04buckyvontrapp, well.. i hope she'll enjoy this.. they're really nice
18:45.46sjansen:0                            # copy & paste for your convenience
18:45.46sjansen* ^From:.*sjansen@
18:45.46sjansen/dev/null                     # /ignore sjansen!*@*
18:46.30*** join/#utah TimRiker (n=timr@12.110.19.201)
18:46.30*** mode/#utah [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ
18:47.04Jayce^sjansen, dont' forget to add an /ingore sjansen
18:47.09Jayce^bah, /ignore
18:47.17Jayce^need to go home :)
18:47.29sjansenJayce^: me points at the new comments
18:47.36buckyvontrapp, my mom remembers Karen.. she wants her to have these books
18:50.17goozbachfunky USB keyboards
18:50.25goozbachsome freaking network issue
18:50.39goozbacha FREAKING LOUD switch fan right by my ear
18:52.16sjansenha ha
18:52.33goozbachthere ya go stuart
18:52.40goozbachreply away
18:53.14vontrappaway i go...
18:53.51goozbachsorry I didn't change my email address, it got rejected
18:53.54goozbachbut I re-sent
18:54.50goozbachbut that's what happens when you're hyped up on cough syrup
18:54.57goozbachummmm cough syrup
18:55.37*** join/#utah colera (n=colera@158.91.203.5)
18:56.01coleraanyone know how to connect to a windows shared printer over a network on a linux box?
18:56.39goozbachyup
18:56.47goozbachuse samba
18:56.50goozbachand cups
18:56.51coleragoozbach: could you help me out?
18:57.13colerayeah, how though? do you know a good site?
18:57.20goozbachI've only ever done it with system-config-printer on a RH box
18:57.36sjansenwhich works very nicely
18:57.37goozbachI'm not quite sure the syntax of the printers.conf
18:57.38colerayeah, love config utils : )
18:58.08coleraman cupsd isn't all that helpful : (
18:58.22tensaithe cups web admin will walk you through it
18:58.32tensaiI usually use the kde cups config tool though
18:58.38goozbachthe cups web interface may be able to help as well
18:58.47colerawhere is that?
18:58.58tensailocalhost:631
18:59.13sjansenjust login as root
18:59.24sjansenand disable it when you're done
18:59.53coleraoh that's cool i didn't know that existed cool
19:00.40tensaithe syntax for the url is smb://[username:password@][workgroup/]server[:port]/printer
19:01.08coleraw00t i like this web interface, great idea
19:01.39colerawhat if there is no user name or password?
19:03.10sjansen*sigh*
19:03.29tensaicolera: leave it off. that's what the [] means. they're optional.
19:03.36sjansenInstalling kernel upgrades beside the previous is so logic. Why don't Ubuntu and SUSE do it?
19:05.10goozbacheek!
19:05.40colerais there a way to browse the samba network? i could do it in ubuntu but how do i do it with just samba and none of those fancy gui apps
19:05.43colera?
19:06.36sjansensmbclient/smbtree/nmblookup
19:08.06coleraso i can just type smbtree into command line?
19:08.22sjansenman smbtree
19:10.14colerait asks me for a password i guess i set that with -U?
19:10.48coleracause my root password isn't working nor the password for my user
19:11.24sjansendepending on how your configured samba, none of your system accounts will work
19:12.13colerahmm okay, i guess i need to find my smb password file ?
19:12.30tenecolera: it's a username and password to identify yourself to the other systems on the network with
19:12.40sjansensmbtree -N will browse as guest
19:14.56coleratene: where do i set that?
19:17.00teneerr
19:17.09teneman smbtree
19:17.41goozbachhttp://www.bullshitjob.com/titles.html
19:18.00sjansenHoy puede apagarse el sol pero no la luz de mi alma
19:18.00sjansenEn un día como hoy caminaré más despacio
19:18.00sjansenEn un día como hoy defenderé mi verdad
19:18.00sjansenEn un día como hoy te amarraré con mis brazos
19:18.00sjansenEn un día como hoy
19:20.31Jayce^goozbach, the sad thing is that came out on a click with a title that was almost exactly the same as mine :)
19:22.11goozbachJayce^: in other words "your job is bullshit"
19:22.27Jayce^:)
19:22.30neybar_workgoozbach, that sums up his job pretty well :p
19:22.51Jayce^Sr. Billing Operations Engineer
19:24.30*** join/#utah Newsome (n=sorenson@72.255.20.100)
19:28.08*** join/#utah linuxalien (n=bastage@c-24-2-80-89.hsd1.ut.comcast.net)
19:29.14jsmithsjansen: What you listening to?
19:29.43sjansennot listening, but have a juanes song (un dia normal) stuck in my head
19:29.47buckyvonnzie and hannzie
19:30.11jsmithsjansen: That's ok -- I've got La Oreja de Van Gogh songs stuck in my head...
19:30.19*** part/#utah linuxalien (n=bastage@c-24-2-80-89.hsd1.ut.comcast.net)
19:30.35buckyjsmith, cut your ear off.. that will make it go away
19:30.58jsmithbucky: That didn't work for Van Gogh, now did it.
19:31.37buckythe jury is still out on that one... maybe not because he still did great art work afterward.. something about the tortured genius
19:33.34jsmithbucky: That's it -- my new band will be called Tortured Genius!
19:33.46buckyexcellent
19:34.09buckyi get a royalty and residuals
19:35.04dataw0lfI'll take a couple groupies, plz.
19:36.04buckyTortured Genius groupies... there are a lot of those around
19:37.20buckyjsmith, think about it... that creative well spring drys up when you get into therapy.. look at Alanis Morrisette
19:37.56buckyif you're not disturbed... you don't have anything worth saying
19:40.39jsmithbucky: Yeah... well, I see Alanis Morrisette as being a lot like Elivs... You had the young, skinny Elvis, and then you had the old fat Elvis.
19:40.52jsmithbucky: With Alanis, you have the young bitter Alanis, and the old happy Alanis.
19:41.33buckyi'll go along with that
19:41.41goozbachhttp://www.local6.com/news/4861458/detail.html
19:42.41buckyInvestigators said the man was on his stomach when he entered the restaurant
19:42.46buckyspider man
19:43.40buckyElvis didn't get into therapy... he just became a drug addict... "Cilla, bring me the barbituates"
19:47.45colerahmm adding windows network printer with cups proving difficult
19:53.01*** join/#utah lars-ut (n=me@67.137.31.58)
19:59.51*** part/#utah Jayce^ (n=Jayce_@pollux.northsky.com)
20:03.31goozbachhttp://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/96/open_boss.html
20:04.28bonez39colera: let me know if you figure that out...
20:04.54bonez39colera: I have two pc's...the linux box prints fine to my windows networked laser jet, but won't print to my locally attached deskjet printer
20:06.09tenebonez39: what kind of deskjet?
20:07.24buckycolera, which distro ?
20:09.06buckyhttp://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-mini/Debian-and-Windows-Shared-Printing.html
20:11.56goozbachwho's scrany-looking?
20:12.21levi"Who're you calling scruffy looking?!"
20:13.38buckygoozbach,  Is Your Boss a Psychopath?
20:14.23buckyvontrapp, you guys on the road yet... looks like rain down here
20:18.45MaquisNewsome: stuporglue asked me if he should just assume that we're permanently going to be located at phantom.cs.byu.edu instead of uug.byu.edu or phantom.byu.edu
20:18.48Maquisi told him i'ad ask you
20:19.17Maquisdo we know why your changes haven't been sticking?
20:19.23tenehttp://osx.portraitofakite.com/
20:25.49Newsomeno idea
20:26.11Newsomethey're definitely not sticking, though, and it's not just uug/phantom
20:32.18buckyvontrapp, you around?
20:39.13bonez39tene: deskjet 550c...
20:39.42bonez39it has worked well with this setup, but something changed and now I can't print to it, either natively from linux or from my win4lin virtual windows machine on the linux box..
20:45.55tenebonez39: produced by who?
20:45.55teneHP, etc.
20:49.00Maquisi think it's probably hp
20:49.56teneinvestigate hpoj
20:50.32goozbachhooray! I get to chill out till 6:45 tonight
20:50.44goozbachmaybe I'll go eat or something
20:50.46Maquisgoozbach: fun
20:52.05jsmithgoozbach: Food is so overrated.
20:52.50goozbachjsmith has never had an expense acount I take it...
20:52.55goozbach:D
20:53.46jsmithgoozbach: Yes, I have.  And I'm on the road a ton, like you.  But there are only so many places you can eat.
20:54.29jsmithgoozbach: Don't get me wrong, I like food.  It just gets old after a while.  Most of the time I just crave home-cooking now...
20:54.31goozbachever been to downtown SF?
20:54.49goozbachif you've run out of places to eat there, I'm impressed
20:54.54mheathhahah
20:56.32jsmithgoozbach: Eaten at Palamino yet?  It's nice...
20:57.18jsmithgoozbach: http://local.google.com/local?q=Palomino&hl=en&lr=&sa=G&near=San+Francisco,+CA&rl=1&sc=1&radius=0&latlng=37775000,-122418333,3082325028518677862
20:57.25mheathactually I agree with jsmith right now. Food is overrated....but I think thats primarily the fact that I'm a bit sick right now, and haven't had much of an appetite for the past few days.
20:58.52jsmithThere's only so many times you can eat at Cheesecake Factory, III Forks, etc. before you just get sick of it.
20:59.54goozbachbroaden your horisons
21:00.00mheathjsmith: start eating at small places
21:00.03colerabonez39: how did you set up the to print to the windows networked laserjet??
21:00.08colerabucky: debian
21:00.10goozbachthere's many a hole-in-the-wall places that are awesome
21:00.13mheathjust little out-of-the-way places
21:00.19goozbachand it's an adventrue finding them
21:00.24buckycolera, http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-mini/Debian-and-Windows-Shared-Printing.html
21:00.41mheathLike, when I was in California, we were lost in the middle of Oxnard trying to find the freeway...
21:00.46jsmithgoozbach: I'm one who *loves* trying new restaurants and new kinds of food -- but right now I'm just sick of restaurants in general.
21:01.03colerabucky: i'm there
21:01.08mheathand we just stopped at this little place, Henri's Cafe, for breakfast, and I had one of the best and most unique breakfasts of my life
21:01.44buckycolera, what part of the world are you in?
21:01.52colerautah right now
21:01.57colerawhy?
21:02.11buckyyour ip addy is not familiar
21:02.23colerait's iprovo
21:03.04buckycolera, are you a school teacher?
21:03.24*** join/#utah mindjuju (n=mindjuju@216.20.238.225)
21:03.49coleralol, no why>?
21:03.58mheathbucky: "iProvo Telecom Project"
21:04.31buckymheath, Provo School District PROVO-EDU (NET-158-91-0-0-1)
21:04.36*** part/#utah mindjuju (n=mindjuju@216.20.238.225)
21:05.05mheathbucky: I get both that and "iProvo Telecom Project PSD-IPROVO (NET-158-91-192-0-1)"
21:05.25buckyit's interesting when you find out who owns what around here
21:06.17colerait was probably the pSD node before they extended to residential clients
21:06.27coleraand didn't want to change all the names
21:06.53mheathbucky: apparently the Provo School District offers internet service?
21:07.11coleraiprovo is owned by the city
21:07.53mheathcolera: oh, they probably just borrowed the IPs from Provo School District
21:08.30mheathcolera: your IP is in a range that a whois search says is part of the Provo School District, but also part of a the iProvo Telecom Project, incase your wondering =P
21:10.14buckycolera, do what that how-to says.. apt-get those packages, lpadmin using InkJet instead of Laser if that's the case, if it's an HP apt-get hpijs, use the rest of the doc
21:10.26Bradipoxbmodder: Get your qmail problem solved?
21:20.20levitene: That FlyakiteOSX thing is crazy.
21:21.08JoshHi just saw someone using that on my lunch hour
21:21.32JoshHimo its kinda pointless to make xp look like osx though.
21:23.07leviJoshH: I didn't realize there was actually some desktop software involved, I was just impressed by the crazy javascript on the web page.
21:23.49JoshHi havent seen their page, but my friend was using it on his windows laptop.  it looks exactly like osx, but it just doesn't seem right without a terminal or anything
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21:32.57MaquisTimRiker: close the door
21:33.25Maquisand stop tracking in mud from outside
21:51.15tensaimheath: if it's been reassigned then iProvo now owns that block, as opposed to just borrowing.
21:51.31tensaimost likely PSD had more addresses than they needed and iProvo was able to convince them to part with a few. easier than getting them from ARIN.
21:52.20mheathtensai: no, ARIN knows of it
21:52.46tensaimheath: yes, but iProvo didn't have to get them directly from ARIN
21:53.15tensaiand therefore didn't have to prove it needed them, etc. just had to get PSD to part with a few and fill out the paper work
22:06.36*** join/#utah bucky (n=bucky@pdpc/supporter/active/bucky)
22:07.56bucky~seen vontrapp
22:07.58ibotvontrapp is currently on #utah (6h 49m 39s).  Has said a total of 61 messages.  Is idling for 3h 14m 44s
22:25.34tensaicool. quake3 arena source code was GPL'd
22:26.19colerareally?
22:26.33tensaihttp://www.linuxgames.com/news/feedback.php?identiferID=7750&action=flatview
22:27.11colerai woder if i even have the right ati drivers to support opengl
22:27.35mheathcolera: opengl is really the only accelerated graphics method in Linux
22:27.54mheathIf you have accelerated graphics drivers in Linux, you have OpenGL support
22:27.54mrpullQ3 disappointed me.
22:28.03colerayeah but i wonder if i even have good ati drivers or if they are like generic or something
22:28.05mrpulliD is cool for GPL'ing old code tho
22:28.52tensaiq3 wasn't a spectacularly innovative game, but I played it a lot. well worth my $50 6 years ago.
22:28.59mrpullId / ID / id / iD ???
22:29.11tensaiI would still be playing it if my video card hadn't died :(
22:29.20mrpulli played quake 2 till my hands hurt
22:29.30mrpullQ3 got boring quickly.   maybe I just got old.
22:29.32mheathcolera: ATI has their own drivers for new Radeon cards in Linux. They work well, for the most part, but have some cross-distro support problems (You'll have the easiest time with them on some redhat-ish RPM-based distro, I think)
22:29.35tensai"id Software", I believe
22:29.44mrpulltensai:  I think you are right
22:29.47mheathcolera: for older Radeons and other cards, the DRI project produces outstanding drivers.
22:29.59mheathWhich are now integrated into the latest versions of X.Org
22:30.58*** part/#utah Utah_Dave (n=boucha@0-1pool139-24.nas28.salt-lake-city1.ut.us.da.qwest.net)
22:31.36coleramheath: where can i get them?
22:31.42colerado they have debian packages?
22:32.21mheathcolera: I have no experience with Debian, and can't comment. I'd imagine that, as long as Debian's X.org packages are up to date, it would be included with the X.org package (or part of an optionl addon package) and you'd just have to change the drive in the xorg.conf
22:32.31mheath*driver
22:32.45mheathcolera: your speaking of the DRI driver, right?
22:33.01colerayeah
22:33.03tensaihas debian even released x.org yet?
22:33.52colerano
22:34.05coleradebian is like an old man
22:34.10colerait might be in unstable
22:34.14levix.org is in unstable, yes.
22:34.21tensaithat's what I meant
22:34.23mheathugh
22:34.25leviI'm running it now.
22:34.33mheathXFree86 is still the default in Debian?
22:34.37coleralol
22:34.37colerayeah
22:35.00mheathWhether or not you were concerned by the whole licensing issue, XFree86 is just crumbling, old, and horrible compared to X.org now
22:35.16mheathDo they even have any serious active maintainers?
22:35.18coleracrumbling no
22:35.27mheathX.orgs almost the exact same thing, but leaps and bounds ahead of them
22:35.38coleraold, yes, horrible, maybe
22:35.44mheathcolera: I mean the project is crumbling
22:35.57tensaiyeah, you could say branden robinson is active. he's the debian project leader after all.
22:36.54buckyi hate linux
22:36.54*** join/#utah tahooie (n=tahooie@66.239.17.226.ptr.us.xo.net)
22:38.10mheathI always wondered why Debian GNU/Hurd used Xfree86 despite the fact that its licensing isn't GPL compliant
22:38.43buckythat's why it's migrating to x.org
22:39.06mheathbucky: read my statement carefully =P
22:39.11buckyi'm trying to think of the other x
22:39.29buckyoh... that's right CLI
22:40.35buckythat's ok.. we're all going to the HURD kernel after all the lawsuits
22:41.01mheathbucky: HURD isn't a kernel
22:41.20mheathbucky: GNU Mach is the GNU projects kernel (well, microkernel)
22:41.49mheathL4-Pistachio is soon to be the GNU operating systems microkernel
22:42.09buckyAustralian companies have been asked to pay a licence fee for Linux software in a move apparently backed by the software?s eminence grise, Linus Torvalds.
22:42.29buckyLetters demanding US$5000 for use of the Linux name were originally dismissed as a hoax. But according to the Sydney Morning Herald, the Open Sauce king is dead serious.
22:42.43buckyhttp://www.theinquirer.net/?article=25529
22:44.01mheathMach+Hurd is worth taking a look at, at least. I mean, you all already use the rest of the GNU Operating System =P
22:44.30buckysure.. someday
22:47.04buckythere's a couple of debian-bsd's
22:47.19buckyif you just can't live without apt-get
22:49.14buckyhow about pcbsd.. a desktop bsd  http://www.pcbsd.org/
22:49.22mheathThis latest "You have to pay for your company to use the Linux trademark" ties in oddly with our discussion about the death of XFree86
22:50.02mheath"4. Except as contained in this notice, the name of The XFree86 Project, Inc shall not be used in advertising or otherwise to promote the sale, use or other dealing in this Software without prior written authorization from The XFree86 Project, Inc."
22:50.06buckywell.. i think linus is joking around
22:50.18mheathThats the segment of the XFree86 license that caused all these problems
22:50.26buckyright
22:50.35jsmithbucky: He's not joking around.
22:50.56buckyau passed some weird copywrite law and now he's giving them greif
22:50.59mheathI just find it kind of odd that this Linux issue is almost identical to the Xfree86 issue that made everyone abandon it
22:51.09jsmithbucky: Wrong, again.  Get your facts right...
22:51.29mheathhttp://www.smh.com.au/news/breaking/linus-backs-trademark-charge-says-maddog/2005/08/19/1123958221375.html?oneclick=true
22:51.33mheathyou'll need a free registration
22:51.42buckyjsmith, if i want your opinion.. i'll give it to you
22:51.54jsmithbucky: This is *trademark* law, not copyright.
22:52.22buckyoh good... that's better
22:52.39buckyeither way.. linus is going to have the last laugh
22:52.56tensaiplease. linus has been enforcing the linux trademark for years.
22:53.06buckywhat if he gets tired of playing American yuppie and just goes home?
22:53.23jsmithExactly... and trademark law says you have to defend your trademark, or you have no protection under the law.
22:53.27mheath"We are not trying to limit the use of the name Linux. We are only asking that people help us protect the quality of the Linux name, and ultimately their trademark by both giving proper attribution (everyone) and by helping us fund the cause (the actual sub-licence holders)," he said.
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22:59.53bonez39colera: still here?
23:00.25bonez39colera: I have the networked laser setup, with ldadmin...to route all print jobs to the laserjet by default.....
23:00.56*** join/#utah tahooie (n=tahooie@66.239.17.226.ptr.us.xo.net)
23:08.49buckylevi you around?
23:09.31*** join/#utah linuxalien (n=bastage@c-24-2-80-89.hsd1.ut.comcast.net)
23:09.43levibucky: Yes.
23:09.46buckywhat's your lisp set up now with your new intsall?
23:10.13leviWhat new install do you mean?
23:11.03buckylevi  what kind of lisp are you using?
23:11.11buckystill using emacs?
23:11.13leviI'm running openmcl on my Mac laptop, and sbcl on my linux machines.
23:11.21buckyci
23:11.31leviI do editing with emacs, yes.
23:11.43leviAnd I use slime.el for lisp programming.
23:12.36buckyok
23:13.31leviThough the mcclim stuff is moving along.  It has a nice listener, inspector, and debugger.
23:15.29buckylevi i'm going to try writing a fibonacci number program from an example in a java course in lisp called faster fibonacci
23:15.35*** part/#utah linuxalien (n=bastage@c-24-2-80-89.hsd1.ut.comcast.net)
23:16.03buckyit stores the last number and starts from there instead of starting from 0, 1
23:16.19leviYou're going to memoize it?
23:16.25buckylol
23:16.31levi...
23:16.43levimemoizing is a programming technique.
23:16.55buckyit store the last time it computed a number and stores it in memory
23:17.19leviWhen an algorithm has to perform a lot of redundant calculations, memoizing stores them in a hash table and uses the stored result instead of doing the calculation again.
23:17.40buckythen the next time you ask the program to compute a fibonacci number it checks to see if it's been computed before
23:18.45buckyi think the hash thing is what the java example did because memory is stored in a heap anyway.. at least according to the lesson
23:19.06leviLisp has hashes, too.
23:19.11buckyright
23:19.40buckythat was interesting to me... to store something so the program wouldn't have to calculate it again
23:20.00buckyor to start at a point where it left off and continue
23:20.33buckyi feel like trying to program again
23:21.47levibucky: Scheme can capture continuations, which is the general concept behind starting at a point where you left off before.
23:22.06buckythat's powerful
23:22.50leviEspecially since you can start again at that point as many times as you'd like.
23:27.12buckylevi, all i can find is sources for scheme48-scm in my repos... is that the common scheme?
23:30.13buckyBTW the 1000 billionth binary digit for pi is 1
23:31.03buckythis is funny! lisp for musicians http://ccrma.stanford.edu/CCRMA/Courses/LispWorkshop/Lisp-06.html
23:31.07buckyit's good
23:31.16levibucky: scheme48 is a good scheme implementation.
23:31.29buckyi'll look into it tnx
23:33.54leviThat Lisp for Musicians page was using Common Lisp, though, not Scheme.
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