| 00:00.19 | bonez39 | aptget is installing sawfish now..I tried apt-get install gnome, and it said that package was not available |
| 00:00.37 | bonez39 | but apt-get would install gnome-session and gnome-common, then a host of other stuff along with those.. |
| 00:00.56 | bonez39 | ok, logging out...brb |
| 00:01.03 | *** part/#utah bonez39 (~david@67.177.39.156) |
| 00:04.02 | *** join/#utah bonez39 (~david@67.177.39.156) |
| 00:04.59 | bonez39 | byronc: again, thanks...didn't know i needed a windows manager...to allow me to resize and move child windows... |
| 00:05.03 | bonez39 | or windows at all |
| 00:05.28 | byronc | not a problem |
| 00:07.28 | bonez39 | ok, next question...what allows alt-tab to switch between running applications? |
| 00:10.33 | byronc | that should be your window manager |
| 00:11.08 | byronc | But you may need to configure it... I think gnome 1.4 had a way to do it in the window manager properties |
| 00:12.07 | bonez39 | very well |
| 00:13.07 | bonez39 | I'll have my hdd filled in no time, now that I am running....;) |
| 00:17.17 | spr | stupid not accepting POST varibles.. |
| 00:21.21 | bonez39 | any of you play chess online? |
| 00:21.56 | bonez39 | I am trying to get a chess game set up that I can play with my kids over the net...if I am at work..and they are on....something were we can have an ongoing game.... |
| 00:29.39 | Maquis | question for the masses (hopefully not sparking any type of flame war... |
| 00:29.56 | Maquis | people have suggested that i learn perl and C in the reasonably near future |
| 00:30.13 | Maquis | does anybody have any reasoning why i should learn one of them before the other? |
| 00:36.45 | byronc | Maquis: what other languages do you use? |
| 00:37.08 | Maquis | php, a little java, a little c++, and unfortunately, a lot of VB and ASP at work |
| 00:37.19 | Maquis | and sql (if that counts for anything) |
| 00:38.08 | Maquis | pretty much, as far as java and c++, i passed all the 100- and 200- level courses at byu... :) |
| 00:38.20 | Maquis | and i'm about to start the 300s this next year |
| 00:39.30 | byronc | Maquis: how do you feel about memory management, a la new and delete in c++? |
| 00:39.40 | Maquis | i actually don't mind it that much |
| 00:39.50 | Maquis | i prefer c++ to java... |
| 00:40.12 | Maquis | although i think that might have something to do with the fact that in general, the projects in 240 were much more interesting than the projects in 235 or 236 |
| 00:40.14 | Maquis | :) |
| 00:41.15 | byronc | well, I only took one of the 300 level courses, but from my understanding some (324, 345) are incredibly c intensive, with a bit of assembly, 330 is scheme, 312 is pick your own language... |
| 00:41.39 | Maquis | how did you get by with only one of the 300-level courses? |
| 00:41.39 | byronc | I would learn c first... but that's probably because I still think c is a great language and enjoy coding in it. |
| 00:41.54 | Maquis | both of them sound fun... |
| 00:41.57 | Maquis | :) |
| 00:42.28 | byronc | I was an electrical engineering major, where the only languages are c, matlab, and vhdl with maybe a little bit of perl or python tossed in |
| 00:42.34 | Maquis | hmmm... if 324 is primarily scheme, and 312 is pick-your-own, then i s |
| 00:42.48 | Maquis | i mean 324 is c |
| 00:42.48 | spr | 312 is C# now if i remember right.. |
| 00:42.49 | byronc | no no 324 is c and x86 assembly... |
| 00:42.49 | Maquis | wow... |
| 00:42.57 | Maquis | yeah... i can't type |
| 00:43.02 | Maquis | or read... |
| 00:43.04 | Maquis | :) |
| 00:43.08 | Maquis | i should probably get c first... |
| 00:43.26 | byronc | perl is a lot of fun and I found it pretty easy to pick up, but (watch out for flames) I found C to be more useful |
| 00:43.37 | Maquis | cool :) |
| 00:43.52 | Maquis | what would i ever do without IRC? |
| 00:44.06 | Maquis | honestly... you guys are great at giving advice :) |
| 00:45.33 | byronc | well since I'm in advice mode now, if you're sticking with computer science at least take 450 |
| 00:45.51 | Maquis | which one's 450? |
| 00:46.29 | Maquis | and btw, you're an EE major... i've considered taking the robot soccer class, since you can take it after taking cs470... do you know anything about it from people who've taken it? |
| 00:47.11 | Newsome | 450 is Digital Signal Processing (or whatever they officially call it) |
| 00:47.44 | Maquis | what exactly does that mean? |
| 00:48.10 | Newsome | ever wondered what all those things in Photoshop or Gimp actually do? |
| 00:48.16 | byronc | Umm... most people I knew that did robot soccer weren't too happy with the results... spent way too much time on a problem that they didn't find a good solution for |
| 00:48.25 | Maquis | hmmm... |
| 00:48.29 | Maquis | that's good to hear... |
| 00:48.39 | Maquis | the only other person i've talked to about it was on the winning team |
| 00:48.55 | Maquis | and so he had a slightly different view about it... :) |
| 00:48.58 | byronc | 450 was the best CS class I ever took though |
| 00:49.06 | Maquis | cool! |
| 00:49.18 | Maquis | so the things in the gimp being all the different options and such? |
| 00:49.21 | byronc | a little more math than usual, but fun |
| 00:49.28 | Maquis | :) |
| 00:49.35 | spr | byronc: was that the one you took from Salvador? |
| 00:49.48 | Maquis | honestly, i'd be interested in about 90% of the 400-level classes... |
| 00:49.59 | Maquis | spr, salvador gutierrez or a different salvador? |
| 00:50.17 | spr | Maquis: same one. Unfortunatly he's headed to upstate NY to teach |
| 00:50.42 | spr | I didn't think I could pull off spelling his last name. |
| 00:50.43 | byronc | spr: yep, that's the one |
| 00:50.44 | Maquis | he's a nice teacher, but didn't do very well with 252 |
| 00:51.08 | Maquis | our class didn't cover a number of the things that were on the tests (ie, didn't cover _at_all_ |
| 00:51.42 | Maquis | and there were certain things about his teaching style that rather rattled the girls in the class... |
| 00:51.47 | Newsome | Maquis, the Filters and Tools in Gimp |
| 00:52.03 | Maquis | cool! |
| 00:58.28 | bonez39 | what rattled the girls? |
| 00:58.41 | bonez39 | I have lots of tricks for rattling the girl I share a house with... |
| 00:58.51 | bonez39 | just wondered what new tricks I could learn, to land in the doghouse |
| 00:59.35 | Maquis | the main thing that rattled us (annoyed us might have been a better word) was that he taught differently to the girls than to the guys |
| 00:59.48 | Maquis | that is one thing that really annoys cs girls |
| 01:00.30 | Maquis | another thing was that he kind of focused in on the girls... if we were discussing a difficult comment, he'd specifically ask the girls in the class if we understood... |
| 01:00.47 | bonez39 | Maquis: ah.....for some stupid and culturally based reason..I never assumed you were a girl, Maquis |
| 01:00.52 | Maquis | that's ok |
| 01:01.05 | bonez39 | dumb of me, I know...rare to find girls, or women in here.... |
| 01:01.11 | Maquis | i deliberately have a non-gender-specific nick... :) |
| 01:01.47 | Maquis | i've found that many guys will react differently to a girl in a situation like this differently when they know first that it's a girl |
| 01:01.50 | Maquis | (if that makes any sense) |
| 01:01.53 | bonez39 | smart..... |
| 01:02.15 | Maquis | but if i start out as an unknown, and then people find out later that i'm a girl, that doesn't happen |
| 01:02.15 | Maquis | :) |
| 01:02.34 | bonez39 | very smart.. |
| 01:02.43 | bonez39 | I admire you |
| 01:02.49 | Maquis | thanks :) |
| 01:03.19 | Maquis | the majority of the time, i don't hit too many problems, but there are a few things that get annoying after a while about being a girl in CS... |
| 01:03.34 | Maquis | i generally find them funny |
| 01:03.40 | bonez39 | what are your favorite annoyances in CS? |
| 01:04.08 | Maquis | when i'm at barnes and noble, looking at computer books, and there's some 14-year-old kid (or adults sometimes) that give me that "what are you doing looking at these books" look :) |
| 01:04.13 | Maquis | it cracks me up every time |
| 01:04.48 | Maquis | one time it was some kid looking at books on starting with linux, so i started talking to him, and ended up giving him some advice on which distros were the best for newbies and such |
| 01:04.53 | Maquis | poor kid was traumatized... :) |
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| 01:07.22 | Maquis | in general, the girls in CS get annoyed primarily when teachers assume that they have to teach differently to the girls than to the guys in the class |
| 01:12.52 | Newsome | For a while, the CS Department was trying to get all the females in the department together for regular socials or to discuss post-college employment opportunities. My wife was never very interested in any of the things they tried to put together. |
| 01:13.38 | Maquis | i don't know that that would interest most of the girls i know |
| 01:14.14 | Newsome | She didn't think so either |
| 01:14.27 | Maquis | it sounds like they're trying to make it more of a "social" event... :) |
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| 02:09.35 | Tene | ibot loves away his life savings to charity, and devotes his life to making sure that every lonely geek gets |
| 02:09.36 | ibot | Tene: You are moron #4 |
| 02:10.01 | Tene | ack |
| 02:10.07 | Tene | ibot likes away his life savings to charity, and devotes his life to making sure that every lonely geek gets |
| 02:10.12 | ibot | ACTION runs and gives away his life savings to charity, and devotes his life to making sure that every lonely geek gets a big bear-hug. |
| 02:10.21 | Tene | There we go. |
| 02:11.00 | Tene | Hrmm... I somehow read "moron" as "mormon" and was *very* confused... |
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| 02:22.39 | mhalcrow | Are fireworks illegal in Utah? |
| 02:22.46 | Tene | newp |
| 02:22.51 | Maquis | they are in large portions of washington |
| 02:22.53 | Maquis | hmmm... |
| 02:22.56 | synic | the good ones are. |
| 02:23.04 | mhalcrow | Out here in Austin suburbia, things are going nuts. |
| 02:23.09 | Tene | four days before and after the 4th and 24th, as well as new year's eve. |
| 02:23.13 | mhalcrow | It's like I'm in the middle of a huge fireworks show. |
| 02:23.14 | Maquis | i see something strange about the fact that dry utah can have fireworks, and raining washington can't... |
| 02:23.27 | mhalcrow | Everyone and their dog is letting off huge fireworks all over the place. |
| 02:23.36 | Tene | Yeah, the good ones are illegal, but there's still some allowed. |
| 02:23.43 | mhalcrow | The constant sound of fire engines... |
| 02:23.44 | Maquis | i'd like to see the dogs lighting off the fireworks... |
| 02:24.10 | mhalcrow | pop, pop, crackle, pop, pop ... all night long... |
| 02:24.29 | Tene | or the fireworks lighting off the dogs? |
| 02:24.36 | mhalcrow | People are just plopping down chairs in their driveways and enjoying the show. :-) |
| 02:26.23 | Maquis | smart |
| 03:08.01 | byronc | figures, we watch the fireworks on the one lawn in Illinois that has sprinklers, and they turn on |
| 03:08.23 | byronc | cool fireworks though |
| 03:15.06 | Maquis | haha |
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| 03:30.12 | bonez39 | Happy 4th.... |
| 03:30.34 | bonez39 | anyone around right now? what does it mean when I get a 403 forbidden ip address error? running apt-get |
| 03:34.28 | Maquis | no idea |
| 03:34.38 | Maquis | but it sounds like one of the more interesting errors :) |
| 03:36.43 | bonez39 | thanks...at least you aren't snapping my head off..I posted same question in #debian and they climbed down my throat |
| 03:42.21 | bonez39 | do you live here too, maquis? |
| 03:44.42 | Maquis | i'm a provo resident during school year |
| 03:44.50 | Maquis | seattle area during the summer |
| 03:45.10 | Maquis | byu student :) |
| 03:45.10 | bonez39 | ah...up north....;) cooler there..it's hot here |
| 03:45.24 | Maquis | we consider it hot here... :) |
| 03:45.32 | Maquis | hasn't rained much at all in the past two years... |
| 03:46.39 | bonez39 | wow....the dry side of the state? or the wet side? |
| 03:46.57 | Maquis | wet side |
| 03:47.06 | bonez39 | really..that is bad... |
| 03:47.13 | bonez39 | I need to log off a minute...back soon |
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| 04:40.10 | bonez39 | Maquis? |
| 04:40.15 | Maquis | howdy |
| 04:40.48 | bonez39 | what distro do you like? |
| 04:40.52 | bonez39 | I run debian.. |
| 04:41.21 | bonez39 | at work, I have the latest and greatest, but I run testing and unstable there..not just pure woody...here...this is just woody so far...so I don't get all the really cool updates |
| 04:42.02 | Maquis | i currently have fedora |
| 04:42.16 | Maquis | but i'm going to reformat and switch to gentoo at the end of the summer |
| 04:42.29 | bonez39 | ah, that's right..I asked you that earlier.. |
| 04:43.03 | Maquis | :) |
| 04:43.14 | Maquis | i always lose track of who said what on irc :) |
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| 04:52.49 | bonez39 | what does fedora do, to keep itself up to date? anything similar to apt-get in fedora? |
| 04:54.26 | Maquis | yeah |
| 04:54.33 | Maquis | apt-get works great in fedora :) |
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| 05:25.50 | Maquis | ~lart Tene |
| 05:25.56 | Maquis | and how in the world do you do that Tene? |
| 05:26.43 | Tene | Also, /msg ibot help lart |