| 00:02.44 | tyce | ok |
| 00:13.10 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (~emcnabb@byu176783wks.rn.byu.edu) |
| 01:29.11 | brailsmt | graphviz is cool |
| 01:51.38 | Bradipo | What is it? |
| 02:07.33 | brailsmt | a cool little directed graph drawer... |
| 02:07.40 | brailsmt | or undirected... |
| 02:14.38 | brailsmt | example "digraph { a->b->c; a->c; }" will draw the expected graph with edges from node a to b to c, and from node a to c |
| 02:14.47 | brailsmt | that simple |
| 03:00.05 | Bradipo | Ahh, that kind of graph. |
| 03:13.12 | Hanuman | anyone know of an mp3pro plugin for xmms? |
| 03:13.20 | Hanuman | Or a way to get xmms to play mp3pro files? |
| 03:16.54 | brailsmt | did you try asking Dr. Google? |
| 03:17.55 | Hanuman | tried - nothing |
| 03:18.04 | Hanuman | I'm checking mp3pro.com right now |
| 03:20.46 | Hanuman | looks like licensing restrictions keep it from coming to linux - too bad |
| 03:20.59 | Hanuman | looks like ogg and flac for me |
| 03:30.32 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (~emcnabb@12-255-28-7.client.attbi.com) |
| 03:30.58 | brailsmt | saves disk space over mp3 |
| 03:31.05 | brailsmt | generally |
| 03:31.20 | Hanuman | mp3pro is much better and saves even more space, but the licensing is terrible from what I'm reading |
| 03:31.37 | Hanuman | the problem with ogg is its lack of support in mp3 players, etc |
| 03:33.32 | brailsmt | actually i have read about mp3 players adding support for ogg... |
| 03:34.19 | brailsmt | there was an article on slashdot about one in particular, and then the official website made mention of possibly more... |
| 03:34.33 | brailsmt | official ogg website that is |
| 13:30.47 | Hanuman | brailsmt: when you wake up - I know there are a few supported mp3 players, but just not enough at the moment - that's my biggest frustration with ogg (well, it actually should be called vorbis) - it will get there, though |
| 13:30.59 | Hanuman | There's actually one that supports flac right now |
| 13:31.27 | Hanuman | Handspring Treo 600 was released today |
| 13:31.41 | Hanuman | :-D |
| 14:29.56 | Hanuman | okay - my submission to /. about the Treo 600 was just rejected. How much do you want to bet that Later on today or tomorrow they finally post someone else's story about it? |
| 14:30.15 | levi | Heh. |
| 14:30.16 | Hanuman | I need to figure out their approval/rejection process sometime |
| 14:30.26 | levi | I want to get one. |
| 14:30.30 | Hanuman | me too |
| 14:30.42 | Hanuman | My wife asked me "Do you want that or a Mac?" |
| 14:30.47 | Hanuman | that's a tough decision |
| 14:33.08 | levi | Well, the Treo will be a bit cheaper, unless you're considering a really low-end Mac. |
| 14:34.49 | Hanuman | yeah - I'm going for the Treo for the moment. It will just be longer before I can get a Mac. I'm looking at the 12" PowerBook for the Mac |
| 14:43.29 | levi | Hmm. Sprint doesn't seem to be selling the Treo yet. |
| 15:00.12 | Hanuman | levi: you might have to get it directly from Handspring's site. |
| 15:08.57 | levi | Hanuman: Not if I want to use it with Sprint. |
| 15:09.34 | *** join/#utah tensai (~tensai@dsl.dyn.02-59.budget.net) |
| 15:09.45 | levi | Oh, maybe it will work. |
| 15:11.18 | levi | Hrm. $600. |
| 15:11.20 | levi | That's expensive. |
| 15:20.43 | Hanuman | Yeah - you have to buy it from Handspring's site, then if you sign up with a 2-year contract w/ sprint after you get it, you get a $150 rebate |
| 15:21.15 | Hanuman | you have to think of it as a nice PDA, plus a webcam, plus a cellphone, plus an mp3 player to be worth the price |
| 15:25.06 | levi | I already have a contract with Sprint, though. |
| 15:26.03 | Hanuman | Don't know how that would work, then |
| 15:26.13 | Hanuman | You could call Sprint and ask them |
| 15:27.02 | brailsmt | Stay away from Sprint |
| 15:27.29 | Hanuman | I've never had a bad experience with them |
| 15:27.53 | Hanuman | why do you say that? |
| 15:27.55 | brailsmt | they just laid off a few thousand ppl and shortly thereafter announced it was moving a lot of development to india... |
| 15:28.08 | Hanuman | niiice... |
| 15:28.20 | brailsmt | don't support companies that do that crap... IMO of course |
| 15:28.39 | Hanuman | so now when we call we get abu answering the phone - I can never understand those CSRs |
| 15:28.44 | brailsmt | since those jobs are our livliehood |
| 15:29.40 | levi | I wonder what the quality of the camera is. |
| 15:29.43 | brailsmt | i have nothing against india or southeast asia, but when companies do crap like laying US workers and hiring workers over there, it pisses me off... |
| 15:29.53 | Hanuman | levi: .3 megapixels, 640x480 |
| 15:30.17 | Hanuman | brailsmt: as long as I'm the person managing those workers, I'm fine with it |
| 15:30.39 | brailsmt | Hanuman: that's short sighted thinking |
| 15:30.47 | Hanuman | I know, I know |
| 15:31.20 | brailsmt | since why would want a manager in the US that manages an IT dept/division/team/etc. that is half a world away? |
| 15:31.44 | Hanuman | I wouldn't mind moving to Thailand where I served my mission |
| 15:31.52 | brailsmt | i would |
| 15:32.00 | Hanuman | I hear labor's even cheaper |
| 15:32.04 | Hanuman | there |
| 15:33.23 | Hanuman | brailsmt: actually, that happens all the time - companies always have US divisions to manage their teams overseas and try to filter money from those companies back to the US |
| 15:33.42 | Hanuman | My dad works for a Dutch company that does that for Holland |
| 15:34.20 | brailsmt | in the end the vast majority of developers in the US will be working defense contracts... |
| 15:34.44 | brailsmt | some ppl don't care about the US job market... |
| 15:35.05 | Hanuman | jobless claims were down 23000 today |
| 15:35.24 | brailsmt | i do, and I say don't support companies that lay off US developers and hire cheaper developers overseas, it undermines the US economy and US sovreignty... |
| 15:35.31 | Hanuman | there will always be jobs, just those jobs will evolve into other things |
| 15:36.16 | Hanuman | The US is even more powerful when it expands to a world market |
| 15:36.51 | brailsmt | Hanuman: how do you know that? |
| 15:37.13 | Hanuman | Because other countries' economies have failed by not relying on the world market |
| 15:37.30 | brailsmt | which ones? |
| 15:37.45 | Hanuman | Many countries in South America |
| 15:39.59 | brailsmt | in manufacturing in the 80's the same thing happened, a lot of US manufacturing jobs went overseas, a lot to China... |
| 15:40.06 | Hanuman | The fact of the matter is its cheaper to not do all of your business in the US. There are some advantages to keeping certain things in the US, but you have to have variety for a global economy to succeed |
| 15:41.03 | brailsmt | especially if it makes it harder to find a job here |
| 15:41.40 | Hanuman | That's one of the disadvantages of a capitalistic society |
| 15:42.25 | Hanuman | You have to constantly compete with its evolving nature |
| 15:42.44 | brailsmt | anyway, China could put a big hurt on us if they stopped shipping us our Nikes, our clothes, our toys, etc... and that is no small fact, and one which certainly is discussed here and abroad... |
| 15:42.59 | levi | Hanuman: The number of pixels is not the ultimate determination of image quality. |
| 15:43.01 | brailsmt | in the highest levels gov't |
| 15:43.18 | Hanuman | levi: what is? |
| 15:44.06 | Hanuman | brailsmt: China relies on Nike and the many other companies being over there. Without them China is isolated to themselves. |
| 15:44.16 | Hanuman | brailsmt: the internet |
| 15:44.25 | Hanuman | and ease of communication and travel |
| 15:45.24 | levi | Hanuman: There's no one factor. The number of pixels is part of it. Also the quality of the lens, the quality of the photosensor, the color/contrast/balance firmware, etc. |
| 15:46.04 | Hanuman | I don't know what the quality of the camera is then - if you find out, please let me know |
| 15:48.38 | brailsmt | Hanuman: i just don't share your optimism about tech jobs going overseas... |
| 15:50.37 | Hanuman | I've lived overseas for half my life so I've just got a different opinion |
| 15:53.26 | hans | brailsmt: I see your disgust, panic, fear, etc. but the world ain't what it used to be |
| 15:54.15 | Hanuman | the world would be a better place for me too if I had lotr tickets ;-) |
| 15:54.27 | hans | When I was a freshman I realized a lot of people were in CS because that's where the money is, and I said uh-oh |
| 15:54.33 | hans | because I was there for the love of it |
| 15:54.41 | levi | Hanuman: It seems that the camera is similarly crappy to my current phone cam. Which means it takes pictures that look okay at best in bright outdoor light. |
| 15:54.43 | Hanuman | hans: I said the same thing |
| 15:54.59 | hans | Now I laugh at those people because here they were hoping to rake in the $$$ and the job market is tough |
| 15:55.00 | Hanuman | levi: that's about what I expected - it's meant to be a phone cam |
| 15:55.13 | levi | Yeah. Not a big deal to me. |
| 15:55.15 | hans | meanwhile I'm happy, and even if I get a non-tech job somewhere and hack on my off time life would be nice |
| 15:55.50 | hans | anyway, off to school now. lotr took a big chunk of my week and I gotta get back on top of things. :) |
| 15:55.55 | Hanuman | hans: yet you will always have the tech skills to improve the job you are currently working in no matter what it is |
| 15:56.37 | levi | Hanuman: I made a rectangle on a piece of paper with approximate dimensions. Looks like a nice form-factor, but I'd like to hold one before buying. I wonder if CompUSA will have them... |
| 15:56.41 | brailsmt_ | that would be fine if there was spare time for hacking... |
| 15:57.26 | hans | brailsmt: you might find there would be if you aren't in the IT profession and are happy with a lower lifestyle |
| 15:57.26 | Hanuman | levi: I agree - would be very nice to see one in person. They were showing demos of one in a persons hand, etc - much smaller than their last treo. |
| 15:57.52 | Hanuman | not quite as small as a cellphone, but great for a PDA/cellphone mix |
| 15:57.57 | hans | I met a guy in line that is a 'professional student' at USU. going on 7 years. You know, long hair camping/rock climbing/outdoorsy type |
| 15:57.58 | brailsmt_ | i am in CS because I love to make computers do what I tell them, I have always been a computer geek, but that doesn't mean I have to like the prospects of potential employers shipping jobs I might be applyuing for off shore |
| 15:58.28 | hans | those people live happy lives. Now of course family complicates things (but makes one more happy still), but the principle of being happy with what you have |
| 15:59.03 | hans | computers permeate our society and will do so at an ever increasing rate. Computer skills will always be needed onshore. You just have to know which ones. |
| 15:59.31 | Hanuman | hans: that's exactly my point |
| 15:59.37 | brailsmt_ | two kids kind tempers the everything will be ok in the end thoughts I might have... |
| 16:00.20 | brailsmt_ | if it was just myself, then I would actually love to move to Chile and live and work there |
| 16:00.58 | hans | yeah, responsibility does bring things here and now doesn't it? |
| 16:01.04 | hans | no doubt about that |
| 16:01.17 | Hanuman | Actually, I lived in Indonesia when I was 8 - it was one of the best things my parents could have done for me. Taught me of new cultures, etc |
| 16:01.25 | brailsmt_ | but in the end, it is rather personal, when I face the prospects of my kids going to crappy schools just because I can't afford private schools for them because someone offshore has a job that used to be in the US and used to pay more... |
| 16:01.27 | hans | in case nobody noticed, I'm in a particularly blunt mood this week. Nothing personal to anyone. ;-) |
| 16:01.39 | hans | brailsmt: homeschool |
| 16:02.06 | Hanuman | hans: I'm always blunt - nothing personal either |
| 16:02.08 | brailsmt_ | hans: no, that isn't an option for my wife and I... |
| 16:02.34 | brailsmt_ | we lack the patience..., and she is going to finish her degree while the kids are in sdchool... |
| 16:03.07 | brailsmt_ | at least until then, home school will not really be an option... unless we still live in Provo with the uber crappy schools here... |
| 16:03.39 | brailsmt_ | then anything would be better than Jaoquin, Maeser or Timpanogos elementary |
| 16:04.12 | brailsmt_ | jaoquibn scores lower than 20th percentile on nationwide standardized tests... |
| 16:04.32 | Hanuman | brailsmt: I'm currently working a job that may not be my favorite thing to do, but I get to use my knowledge in technology and programming to help a company make wise business decisions. We hire all of our developers and administrators elsewhere. My job pays enough, I have 2 kids, am still in school, but life is good. |
| 16:04.40 | brailsmt_ | maeser scores in the 20's, and timpanogos in the low 30s |
| 16:05.37 | Hanuman | I had to leave Utah because of the lack of employment opportunities there. |
| 16:10.40 | brailsmt_ | i was raised with the value of getting a job doing something that will feed the kids and making a hobby of what you love to do... so I will work in other areas if need be, but it doesn't need to be that way... |
| 16:11.13 | brailsmt_ | unless jobs continue to be shipped overseas... |
| 16:12.42 | Hanuman | Just program OpenSource - then a job won't matter. You will always have work to do |
| 16:13.06 | brailsmt_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:13.53 | Hanuman | brailsmt: in reality, I agree with you. It would certainly be much nicer to be able to work in programming jobs. |
| 16:14.36 | Hanuman | brailsmt: I used to be a music major until I decided it couldn't feed my family. Computers were my equally next love |
| 16:14.40 | Hanuman | luckily |
| 16:15.17 | Hanuman | I'm minoring in E-business, though so I can get into management and not worry about whether my job gets shipped overseas or not |
| 16:15.19 | brailsmt_ | i was a pyschology major until i realized that Icould make the same amount of money with a BS in CS as I could with a PhD in psych... |
| 16:15.36 | brailsmt_ | since I liked both equally as well, I decided to program computers instead of humans |
| 16:15.43 | brailsmt_ | :) |
| 16:15.47 | Hanuman | lod |
| 16:15.51 | Hanuman | lol |
| 16:15.52 | Hanuman | sorry |
| 16:16.11 | brailsmt_ | computers are at least deterministic :) |
| 16:17.08 | Hanuman | I still think computers will always have a good potential of making money, whether jobs are shipped overseas or not. |
| 16:17.31 | brailsmt_ | yeah, they will, but there is no need for jobs to go overseas... |
| 16:17.57 | brailsmt_ | no offense to democrats... :) |
| 16:18.19 | brailsmt_ | s/democrat/liberal/ |
| 16:18.39 | Hanuman | As long as we're in a capitalistic society with worldwide communication and travel it's essential for jobs to go overseas, and jobs from overseas to come over here |
| 16:18.49 | Hanuman | I don't agree with it, but I have to live with it |
| 16:19.44 | Hanuman | personally, I like the idea of not working for money at all, but rather the benefit of society (no, I'm not communist, but Carl Marx had some good points) |
| 16:20.02 | Hanuman | I am strongly against government enforcing that, though |
| 16:20.50 | brailsmt_ | hence the reason, I suggested not supporting companies that ship jobs overseas... |
| 16:20.54 | Hanuman | the problem is humans today are too selfish for that system to work |
| 16:21.10 | Hanuman | depends on your definition of society |
| 16:21.19 | brailsmt_ | humans today, or humans in general? |
| 16:21.54 | Hanuman | the problem lies where society's boundaries begin. Is society today a nationwide society, or are we now a global society? |
| 16:22.17 | Hanuman | I personally think there would be more peace in the world with nation supporting nation. |
| 16:22.37 | Hanuman | rather than keeping to themselves |
| 16:23.47 | brailsmt_ | i am generally in contrary with things which reduce US sovreignty... |
| 16:23.59 | brailsmt_ | s/with/to |
| 16:25.07 | Hanuman | I am for defense and strength of our country and land, but for our country to exist we must reach out beyond our borders. Our country does not have all of the resources in the world. |
| 16:25.32 | brailsmt_ | i don't trust someone who isn't familiar with US history and culture with decisions which affect me |
| 16:26.01 | Hanuman | how is that? |
| 16:26.40 | brailsmt_ | i mean directly affect me, lots of decisions made by world leaders affect me but not directly... |
| 16:28.01 | brailsmt_ | i should have said that I am not comfortable with someone who isn't familiar with US hisotry and culture to pass/enforce laws that US citizens must abide by |
| 16:29.18 | Hanuman | How are other countries passing laws that US citizens must abide by? |
| 16:31.03 | brailsmt_ | they aren't yet... but there have been several attempts to make US citizens subject to world courts... |
| 16:31.33 | Hanuman | that has nothing to do with global economy, does it? |
| 16:33.06 | brailsmt_ | i see the US economy and US sovreignty as very tightly coupled... |
| 16:33.11 | Hanuman | My dad has worked with international taxes most of his career, and his job has been to work with the Tax laws within the countries he's in in order to save his company money. The fact of the matter is - his company is in those countries because it's cheaper for them to be there. Our companies would not be overseas would it not make US companies more money, therefore benefiting the US economy. |
| 16:33.58 | Hanuman | Building the US's corporations globally only increases US sovreignty, and improves our economy, making us a more powerful nation. |
| 16:34.35 | brailsmt_ | but hand in hand with that is the fact the our economy is then linked with the welfare of other nations, and many of the nations to which these jobs are going are not stable... |
| 16:34.58 | Hanuman | yes - those nations fail, the company moves elsewhere. |
| 16:35.50 | Hanuman | even if they fail as long as the nations laws allow it, our country can still make money from those nations through corporations remaining there. |
| 16:36.10 | brailsmt_ | in the event that China for example disaproves of one of our policies, they can and probably have played the 'we will stop shipping to you' card in negotiations... that runs directly against sovreignty |
| 16:36.10 | Hanuman | as the laws change, the company either changes its practices or moves elsewhere |
| 16:36.45 | Hanuman | That has to do with importing goods, not exporting and outsourcing resources |
| 16:37.10 | brailsmt_ | yes it does have to do with outsourcing... |
| 16:37.39 | brailsmt_ | without the outsourcing in the first place of those jobs off shore, there could not be the possiblilty of such threats... |
| 16:39.29 | brailsmt_ | an embargo is a big tools that can used to force a country to making policy decisions which may have a direct adverse affect on its citizens... |
| 16:39.56 | Hanuman | It's not our corporations outsourcing those jobs offshore. It is our country allowing the importing of those goods rather than promoting corporations from within our own country to manage those jobs, and produce goods within our own country. The other problem lies in where we're allocating the resources we import - if we diversified and imported from more countries, China would not have so much influence. |
| 16:41.09 | Hanuman | anyway, gotta get back to work...we can discuss again later if you want |
| 16:45.08 | brailsmt_ | it is the corps 'off shoring' those jobs, and the gov't shouldn't be the one behind a change to bring back jobs that were once in the US, it is the US customer's job to do buy goods from corporations that don't ship jobs off shore, and i just want to get the word out about one company that is moving jobs off shore at the expense of workers in the US in the hopes that you will agree with me and not support Sprint a company which just laid o |
| 16:49.02 | *** join/#utah hans (fugalh@128.187.246.176) |
| 16:58.49 | *** join/#utah hans (fugalh@128.187.246.176) |
| 17:05.19 | *** join/#utah hans (fugalh@128.187.246.176) |
| 17:06.27 | *** join/#utah sjansen (~sjansen@128.187.245.46) |
| 17:06.30 | brailsmt_ | 1065719171: === (25 of 211) Compiling/Merging (/usr/portage/dev-perl/Test-Simple/Test-Simple-0.47-r1.ebuild) |
| 17:06.39 | brailsmt_ | its been a while since I updated world :| |
| 17:07.48 | levi | Ow, I have 80 config files to update. |
| 17:08.21 | brailsmt_ | i have like 77... :( |
| 17:09.00 | brailsmt_ | that is on my desktop that I rarely use... my laptop ois only about 5 pkg to update world, and 0 configs to update... |
| 17:22.54 | brailsmt | not exactly the way a machine should be run, huh? :) |
| 17:24.24 | levi | Well, I don't like to update all that frequently. |
| 17:26.30 | sjansen | So what's the word my ticket brothers? |
| 17:26.43 | brailsmt | hans said he had his tickets... |
| 17:30.08 | Jayce^ | sjansen, got your ticket |
| 17:30.17 | Jayce^ | along with dan's |
| 17:33.21 | sjansen | Cool beans. |
| 17:33.41 | hans | Jayce^: how long did you stick around? |
| 17:33.43 | sjansen | Guess that means I have to come to the next meeting. |
| 17:34.38 | hans | Jayce^: how many tickets did you give Dan? |
| 17:34.44 | hans | or rather did he pay for |
| 17:41.32 | *** join/#utah bonez39 (~doc@64.122.114.148) |
| 17:41.43 | bonez39 | greetings |
| 17:41.54 | sjansen | greets |
| 17:42.32 | bonez39 | thanks for the help the last few days..I need so much more but at least I am on the right track |
| 17:44.00 | bonez39 | stuart? is anyone else on now, or just you, and I? |
| 17:53.43 | sjansen | brailsmt and Jayce^ have also made appearances |
| 17:56.02 | hans | not drinking? |
| 17:56.30 | brailsmt | lol |
| 17:56.52 | brailsmt | how much were the lotr tickets? |
| 17:57.03 | sjansen | $35 |
| 17:57.38 | hans | oh, sjansen, Jayce^ didn't tell you? They increased the price at the last minute to $50 |
| 17:58.16 | brailsmt | for that, I will buy the second extended filesy... uhm, DVD and have my own lotr party, and I can pause it go to the bathroom :) |
| 17:59.02 | hans | sjansen: are you still there? do I need to call an ambulance? I was just teasing! |
| 17:59.22 | brailsmt | and the popcorn will be cheaper too |
| 17:59.32 | hans | I dialed 911 once on accident, trying to call someone in my ward whose (internal BYU) extension started with two 1s, out of habit for dialing 9 to get out |
| 17:59.44 | brailsmt | though $35 is really good for 12-ish hours of movie at a theatre |
| 18:00.04 | hans | brailsmt: plus $12.50 in a meal/movie/whatever card |
| 18:01.16 | brailsmt | and i can watch them over and over and over... and waste lots of time... |
| 18:01.17 | brailsmt | :) |
| 18:02.06 | hans | oh yeah, that. I should have done more of that on Tuesday, too. :) |
| 18:03.29 | hans | Jayce^: how about you give dan tyler's ticket too (in exchange for moola of course) and I'll give stuart his |
| 18:03.51 | hans | (in exchange for moola or undying eternal devotion to debian) |
| 18:04.07 | brailsmt | free tickets? |
| 18:05.29 | hans | brailsmt: no, Free tickets |
| 18:05.38 | hans | you still have to pay for them |
| 18:06.50 | brailsmt | yes, debian devotion could be considered non-free |
| 18:06.51 | brailsmt | :) |
| 18:07.13 | Hanuman | actually, debian devotion is very expensive |
| 18:07.15 | Hanuman | ;-) |
| 18:07.21 | Hanuman | hans: and being merry |
| 18:07.31 | Hanuman | (see above) |
| 18:07.49 | Hanuman | Hey - anyone tried jfs? |
| 18:07.58 | brailsmt | java filesystem? |
| 18:08.01 | brailsmt | :p |
| 18:08.13 | brailsmt | betcha is performance blows... |
| 18:08.15 | brailsmt | :) |
| 18:08.17 | Hanuman | Is that what it is? |
| 18:08.34 | brailsmt | no... |
| 18:08.36 | Hanuman | I saw it in the benchmarks on /. - it was the best performing fs of all |
| 18:09.51 | Hanuman | I've never even heard of it until now |
| 18:10.37 | brailsmt | jfs stands for Journaled File system |
| 18:10.50 | brailsmt | http://oss.software.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/jfs/ |
| 18:11.10 | brailsmt | or alternately www.jfs.org |
| 18:11.51 | Hanuman | that's one of the things I was thinking... |
| 18:12.01 | Hanuman | I'll have to try it sometime |
| 18:12.07 | Hanuman | are there plans for an ext4? |
| 18:12.13 | brailsmt | take a look at jfs.org, it has some good info |
| 18:12.38 | Hanuman | brailsmt: tnx |
| 18:14.05 | Hanuman | I've been a devoted ext3 user for awhile now, but I'm having second thoughts after seeing those benchmarks |
| 18:23.02 | Hanuman | jfs.org is "Jewish Family Services" |
| 18:23.23 | brailsmt | :) |
| 18:23.28 | brailsmt | i know |
| 18:23.29 | brailsmt | :) |
| 18:23.32 | Hanuman | lol |
| 18:24.06 | brailsmt | good info though just not JFS (the filesystem) related :) |
| 18:24.38 | Hanuman | :) |
| 18:24.48 | Hanuman | I like what IBM is doing for OSS |
| 18:25.00 | Hanuman | I think |
| 18:26.19 | brailsmt | make no mistake, IBM is using linux for its own benefit... they aren't in it for the betterment of linux for its own sake, but in the process of ibm using linux, they improve it for everyone |
| 18:26.37 | brailsmt | and that I like |
| 18:27.26 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (~emcnabb@byu176783wks.rn.byu.edu) |
| 18:28.27 | brailsmt | T - 6.5 hours |
| 18:28.30 | brailsmt | till kickoff |
| 18:29.22 | Hanuman | agrees |
| 18:30.01 | brailsmt | sucks to be on the east coast and have your football team two timezones away... |
| 18:30.22 | Hanuman | yup, especially when you can't see all the games |
| 18:30.44 | Hanuman | I'm having a bunch of friends over all who don't have cable because this is the only way they can see it |
| 19:45.42 | *** join/#utah bonez39 (~doc@64.122.114.148) |
| 19:49.07 | bonez39 | hans? |
| 19:50.45 | bonez39 | are there any IRC networks devoted to business? I want to figured out how to find other doctors, or others in various business interests here |
| 19:51.42 | Hanuman | not sure |
| 19:52.07 | Hanuman | yahoogroups probably has some good groups like that |
| 19:52.13 | Hanuman | but that's not IRC |
| 19:52.29 | Hanuman | is /. being /.'ed right now? I can't get to it |
| 19:52.33 | Hanuman | ~slashdot |
| 19:52.48 | Hanuman | ibot: why? |
| 19:52.49 | | wish i knew, Hanuman |
| 19:55.00 | brailsmt | i got tere just fine |
| 19:55.47 | Hanuman | ~slashdot |
| 19:55.55 | Hanuman | must be up now |
| 19:57.54 | Hanuman | cool - itunes for Windows |
| 19:58.00 | Hanuman | that could mean Linux support |
| 19:58.02 | Hanuman | maybe? |
| 19:59.51 | brailsmt | naw, itunes for Mac OSX would be more likely be more significant to producing a linux itunes, just because Mac OSX is linux's technological cousin |
| 20:00.03 | bonez39 | when is the salt lake meeting? I thought it was the 3rd wed even. every month |
| 20:00.12 | brailsmt | at least that is waht I would think makes more sense |
| 20:01.28 | Hanuman | yeah - makes sense |
| 20:01.36 | Hanuman | wonder if they'll allow a Linux version |
| 20:02.33 | bonez39 | that'd be like the Pope allowing Utah's finest, sporting white shirts and ties to proselyte in the vatican... |
| 20:03.17 | brailsmt | or like the taliban becoming golden investigators :) |
| 20:04.10 | bonez39 | yeah |
| 20:13.18 | Hanuman | lol |
| 20:13.46 | Hanuman | Guess I'll just have to get a Mac then, won't I? |
| 20:14.01 | Hanuman | Then I'll have to get an ipod just to complete the suite |
| 20:14.16 | Hanuman | man I've got an expensive year ahead of me |
| 20:39.17 | bonez39 | what's a good source of information/help/tutorial about networking? my access problem persists..I can access the net running 2.4.18 kernel, but not when I boot up 2.4.20 |
| 20:44.31 | Jayce^ | hardware via IP? :) |
| 20:48.16 | bonez39 | hardware via IP ? ae you saying to search on that? |
| 20:48.41 | hans | bonez39: did we have trouble with the stock debian 2.4.20 kernel? |
| 20:48.49 | levi | Hrm, apparently it will not run without being associated with a cluster host from which to download its boot image. |
| 20:48.55 | Jayce^ | nah, snag his computer :) |
| 20:49.16 | hans | apt-cache search kernel-image-2.4.22 |
| 20:49.26 | hans | then install the one that looks like it fits your cpu |
| 20:49.27 | bonez39 | hans? perhaps? I don't remember now... |
| 20:49.35 | hans | then see if that will work. |
| 20:49.36 | levi | It's a node like the ones in ASCI Lightning. |
| 20:49.38 | brailsmt | yipee, only 177 pkgs left in this world update :) |
| 20:49.47 | bonez39 | well, the img file was a key to getting it to boot up and run right before..I know that |
| 20:50.39 | bonez39 | I am running a pentium II 266... is that a pentium classic? |
| 20:50.47 | hans | yeah, I think so |
| 20:50.55 | brailsmt | bonez39: that is a pentium dinosaur... |
| 20:51.00 | bonez39 | ok, I guess I will run that.. |
| 20:51.11 | brailsmt | pII isn't pentium classic... |
| 20:51.25 | brailsmt | pentium classic was naything before pII, IIRC |
| 20:51.30 | bonez39 | brailsmt: yeah yea yea...I know..it is ancient..ok? ok? that's my system and it's working right now..it's no screamer... |
| 20:51.42 | hans | actually looks like you should use the 686 flavor for a pII |
| 20:51.58 | bonez39 | ok, I'll apt-get that one |
| 20:52.07 | brailsmt | bonez39: i thought I had the oldest slowest piece of...hardware..., mine is only a pentium celery 300 |
| 20:52.20 | brailsmt | but i beat you!!!!! |
| 20:52.26 | brailsmt | sucker!!! |
| 20:52.28 | brailsmt | :) |
| 20:52.35 | bonez39 | good for you... |
| 20:52.46 | bonez39 | hans: should I just apt-get that one then? |
| 20:53.01 | brailsmt | though your pII 266 prolly runs faster than my celery... |
| 20:53.12 | hans | bonez39: yeah |
| 20:53.23 | hans | kernel-image-2.4.22-1-686 |
| 20:55.13 | bonez39 | ok..it's installing now... |
| 20:55.35 | bonez39 | when it does..it's not necessarily doing much on my /home directory, right? |
| 20:55.44 | hans | nope, not touching it |
| 20:57.04 | bonez39 | here's a question in the meantime..I wanted to run aptitude..yet, when I try to..it return an error about xterm |
| 20:57.14 | bonez39 | says the terminal and x can't do something |
| 20:58.17 | hans | bonez39: do you try to run it from the menu? just fire up a terminal and type aptitude |
| 20:58.22 | hans | (as root) |
| 20:58.44 | bonez39 | it's asking me now about initrd images...and whether I want them or not..seems like I DO need them to run right |
| 20:59.01 | bonez39 | hans: that's how I tried to run it...as root, from terminal |
| 20:59.06 | hans | yeah. are you using lilo or grub? |
| 20:59.10 | hans | bonez39: that's odd |
| 20:59.26 | Bradipo | and initrd is only needed if your kernel doesn't have all necessary drivers for booting (i.e. SCSI drivers) built into it directly. |
| 20:59.29 | bonez39 | hans: I much prefer grub..that's what I am using..and will use |
| 20:59.48 | hans | bonez39: then you don't have to worry about initrd stuff. just run update-grub |
| 21:00.17 | bonez39 | hans: you mean, when it finishes installing, right? |
| 21:00.42 | brailsmt | who was it that posted the treo thing to slashdot and had it rejected? |
| 21:00.43 | hans | yeah |
| 21:00.44 | bonez39 | or, do I need to stop, and update-grub first? |
| 21:00.45 | brailsmt | ~slashdot |
| 21:00.49 | hans | after |
| 21:00.57 | bonez39 | ok |
| 21:00.57 | Hanuman | ibot: I told you so about the Treo 600 |
| 21:01.00 | | Hanuman: are you using Windows? |
| 21:01.11 | hans | be sure and tell lilo to buzz off too if it asks |
| 21:01.17 | Hanuman | ibot is psychic |
| 21:01.19 | | Hanuman: are you using Windows? |
| 21:01.38 | *** join/#utah emcnabb (~emcnabb@12-255-28-7.client.attbi.com) |
| 21:01.38 | hans | lol |
| 21:01.50 | bonez39 | hans: I get errors |
| 21:02.01 | hans | what say they? |
| 21:02.05 | brailsmt | ibot blows |
| 21:02.07 | | Me luv u long time. |
| 21:02.08 | Hanuman | I submitted that article about the Handspring Treo article this morning |
| 21:02.11 | brailsmt | lol |
| 21:02.28 | Hanuman | guess someone either has more influence than I or they beat me to it |
| 21:03.50 | Hanuman | well, cya guys later... |
| 21:03.57 | Hanuman | Happy BYU Game day... |
| 21:04.50 | brailsmt | cya |
| 21:05.25 | hans | gag, is there a game tonight? |
| 21:05.32 | brailsmt | yes |
| 21:05.35 | brailsmt | BYU v CSU |
| 21:05.38 | brailsmt | at BYU |
| 21:05.48 | hans | what time? |
| 21:05.50 | brailsmt | thats your neck of the woods |
| 21:05.51 | brailsmt | :) |
| 21:05.54 | brailsmt | 7:00 pm |
| 21:07.39 | hans | i'll be sure not to try and drive around this evening then |
| 21:10.22 | *** join/#utah brailsmt (~michael@12-254-250-249.client.attbi.com) |
| 21:13.45 | *** join/#utah synic_ (~synic@cpe-66-87-26-56.ut.sprintbbd.net) |
| 21:19.59 | *** join/#utah sjansen (~sjansen@128.187.245.46) |
| 21:28.49 | sjansen | Bad news for me. I just got my Zaurus (PDA) working again. Now I've got another toy to steal my time... |
| 21:29.42 | emcnabb | no, Andrew got your Zaurus working for you :-) |
| 21:30.24 | sjansen | Told me he saw it working. I've still had to play with it. |
| 21:30.57 | sjansen | Wiped the CF card. Upgrade to a newer image. Got networking working. |
| 21:31.22 | *** join/#utah tomr (~tomr@67.50.205.34) |
| 21:31.31 | sjansen | I'm going to have to do something nice for him. |
| 21:32.56 | emcnabb | bring US pizza :-) |
| 21:40.20 | sjansen | PDA turns on. PDA turns off. PDA turns on. PDA turns off. |
| 21:51.42 | emcnabb | the simple joys in life |
| 21:53.20 | hans | lol |
| 21:53.27 | hans | sjansen: now I'm jealous |
| 21:53.46 | hans | well, my pda turns on and off too, it just doesn't run linux |
| 22:04.01 | sjansen | Hmmm, just sshed into my PDA. Still got some things to work out, but liking it. |
| 22:09.07 | levi | I don't use my Zaurus very much. It's too big for me to carry around all the time. |
| 22:09.08 | *** join/#utah tyce (~tyce@ts64.vps2.iserver.net) |
| 22:09.15 | hans | levi: I'll take it. ;-) |
| 22:09.30 | levi | Oh, I still have some plans for it. It's just not useful for me as a PDA. |
| 22:09.38 | hans | firewall? :) |
| 22:09.57 | levi | Nah, I'm going to use it for datalogging from my new car engine computer. |
| 22:10.07 | hans | ooh |
| 22:10.10 | hans | fun |
| 22:10.20 | levi | With enough hacking, I could make cool digital gauges and stuff. |
| 22:10.26 | levi | But I don't know if I'll have time for that. |
| 22:11.07 | levi | I have to actually install the new engine computer, too. :) |
| 22:11.13 | levi | It's been sitting on my desk for a couple of weeks. |
| 22:14.06 | tyce | umm... engine computer |
| 22:14.13 | tyce | that just has a nice ring to it |
| 22:14.23 | levi | It replaces the factory ECU. |
| 22:15.15 | levi | It allows programming of fuel and ignition timing based on input from the engine sensors, like manifold pressure, RPM, temperature, etc. |
| 22:15.48 | levi | It also dumps all its sensor input out into a log file. |
| 22:16.42 | sjansen | Wow. |
| 22:18.09 | levi | Pretty nifty stuff. I'm going to try to start installing it today. |
| 22:21.37 | tyce | yep yep, got one on my car already |
| 22:21.51 | tyce | thats why I like the sound of that |
| 22:21.53 | levi | What kind of car? And what kind of computer? |
| 22:22.09 | tyce | I have a subaru impreza 2.5 RS |
| 22:22.28 | tyce | my fuel computer is an Apexi S-AFC 2 |
| 22:22.41 | tyce | what kind of car do you drive? |
| 22:23.24 | levi | Mazda Miata, and I've got a MiataLink with software updates from Flyin' Miata. |
| 22:25.41 | tyce | cool |
| 22:27.51 | levi | I got the computer so I can better tune my aftermarket turbo. |
| 22:33.09 | tyce | yep, definately a must if you want to see a real increase in performance |
| 22:35.22 | hans | think it'd do anything for an old mercury capri? :) |
| 22:35.47 | Jayce^ | double its value? |
| 22:37.39 | levi | Is it a turbo model? |
| 22:39.57 | hans | no |
| 22:41.31 | levi | Probably not a whole lot, then. It depends, though. |
| 22:41.37 | levi | Anyway, I gotta go for a haircut appointment. |
| 22:47.05 | hans | mostly i was being fecicious or however you spell it |
| 22:47.11 | hans | ibot, how do you spell facetious? |
| 22:47.12 | | no idea, hans |
| 22:47.20 | hans | ibot: thankx |
| 22:47.20 | | no problem, hans |
| 22:57.50 | *** join/#utah bonez39 (~doc@64.122.114.148) |
| 23:01.44 | bonez39 | anyone? |
| 23:03.05 | Jayce^ | ~spell fecetious |
| 23:03.08 | | possible spellings for fecetious: facetious factious facetiously fractious feces facets fellatios |
| 23:07.09 | bonez39 | facetious |
| 23:07.25 | bonez39 | lots of fun and intriguing words there |
| 23:26.50 | emcnabb | http://www.nicejerks.com/ |
| 23:26.58 | emcnabb | this is pretty funny |
| 23:30.33 | synic_ | http://zapatopi.net/afdb.html |
| 23:30.39 | synic_ | this is pretty funny too :) |
| 23:41.15 | sjansen | Ah, much better. I've managed to kill my PDA again. |
| 23:41.26 | Jayce^ | what'd you do? |
| 23:41.40 | sjansen | Flashed a new image. Now it refuses to turn on. |
| 23:43.18 | sjansen | Bummer, removing the battery, pressing hard reset a few times, and letting it sit seems to have fixed the problem. |
| 23:43.37 | sjansen | Finicky piece of hardware. |
| 23:43.59 | emcnabb | sjansen, I still want our pizza |
| 23:44.19 | sjansen | Go find a girl to practice being a jerk to. |
| 23:44.37 | emcnabb | oh, I have lots of practice |
| 23:44.52 | emcnabb | that's why I'm single :-) |
| 23:47.37 | Jayce^ | anybody try that new "savage" demo game? |