| 01:20.08 | synic | huh. Perl's OO interface is ... different ... |
| 01:20.39 | sjansen | Can anyone say: bolted on after the fact? |
| 01:21.08 | sjansen | Nice in some ways, ugly in others. |
| 01:23.38 | Jayce^ | I love it |
| 01:23.49 | Jayce^ | makes OO easy :) |
| 01:23.58 | Jayce^ | but it doesn't force you to use it |
| 01:25.35 | synic | it looks pretty cool |
| 01:26.00 | synic | hans: no, they probably don't have any free positions, but my old employer will probably be looking for someone. |
| 01:26.11 | synic | they pay nothing... and he probably won't be programming much |
| 01:27.37 | *** join/#utah skidd (~skidd@12-255-45-104.client.attbi.com) |
| 01:30.17 | sjansen | synic: What a great job description! Where can I apply? |
| 01:30.57 | synic | :) propeller - 20 S 1500 W in Orem. |
| 01:31.25 | synic | the people there are pretty cool, that's about the only benefit. |
| 01:34.19 | sjansen | Yeah, actually my co-workers and the convenient location are the only thing keeping me at my current employer. |
| 01:34.38 | sjansen | That, and no desire to find a new job at the moment. ;-) |
| 01:36.24 | synic | I've made my life difficult. I live in Highland and just accepted a job that's on 33 S in Salt Lake |
| 01:41.55 | neybar | yeah, you are commuting in the wrong direction... you get horrible traffic both ways |
| 01:43.27 | *** part/#utah skidd (~skidd@12-255-45-104.client.attbi.com) |
| 01:44.32 | Jayce^ | ahh, I've known a few people that have worked there.. |
| 01:45.07 | synic | any of them still work there? |
| 01:45.18 | Jayce^ | synic, I did that once, lived in orem, worked near parley's... |
| 01:45.22 | Jayce^ | no, not for a long time |
| 01:45.45 | neybar | anyone know how to extract one file from a rpm? |
| 01:47.30 | Jayce^ | http://www.businessweek.com/technology/cnet/stories/5070583.htm |
| 01:47.36 | Jayce^ | for all those interested in a sco fix :) |
| 01:48.51 | synic | bleh... doesn't oreilly have a perl/gtk book? |
| 01:49.43 | Jayce^ | no, perl/TK though |
| 01:50.08 | Jayce^ | I've asked about the gtk one.. they weren't doing one at the time because it was just starting to switch to gtk2 which is still stabilizing.. |
| 01:50.26 | synic | hrmm... too bad Tk is so ugly |
| 01:50.35 | Bradipo | I don't think tk is that ugly. |
| 01:50.55 | Jayce^ | you could try perlQT too :) |
| 01:51.00 | synic | I think it looks alright on Windows... |
| 01:51.01 | Jayce^ | or any other wm.. |
| 01:51.05 | Bradipo | It can actually look pretty decent if the programmer uses the correct settings for the widgets. |
| 01:51.39 | synic | how much of a pain is it to install perlQT on Windows/Linux ? |
| 01:51.49 | synic | Bradipo: have an example by chance? |
| 01:52.23 | Bradipo | Let me fetch one... |
| 01:53.02 | Jayce^ | http://perlqt.sourceforge.net/ |
| 01:53.14 | Jayce^ | http://www.perlqt.com/ |
| 01:53.32 | Jayce^ | haven't tried it on windows, was easy in linux, depending on your kde version of course.. |
| 01:53.34 | Bradipo | http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Campus/6846/index.html |
| 01:53.48 | Jayce^ | the perlqt for the recent qt's is pretty new, but nice.. |
| 01:54.21 | Bradipo | http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Campus/6846/xwordpad.tgz |
| 01:54.35 | Bradipo | Hmm, link is broken. |
| 01:55.58 | Bradipo | I have used that before though and it looks pretty good. |
| 01:56.15 | Bradipo | As far as looks can go. |
| 01:56.55 | synic | hrmm, it looks pretty good |
| 01:57.20 | Bradipo | It was actually kind of scary because it looked to much like notepad. |
| 01:57.31 | Jayce^ | no kidding |
| 02:01.40 | sjansen | Bradipo: Look out for Qt license limitations on Windows. |
| 02:02.47 | Bradipo | Hehe, I don't use qt anyway. |
| 02:02.57 | Bradipo | And Windows? What's that? |
| 03:00.21 | neybar | does anyone know of a pager for xwindows? |
| 03:01.43 | Bradipo | Is xwindows a new window manager? |
| 03:02.14 | neybar | take your pick of wm... gtk qt tk it doesn't matter :-P |
| 03:02.26 | Bradipo | http://www.ntlug.org/~cbbrowne/xwindows.html |
| 03:03.12 | neybar | and those are tool sets obviously |
| 03:03.50 | Bradipo | Well, some WMs already have pagers built in. |
| 03:04.22 | Bradipo | In fact, most WMs that use pages have their own. |
| 03:04.27 | Bradipo | I don't know of a generic pager. |
| 03:04.42 | neybar | how bout kde, or gnomw |
| 03:04.42 | Bradipo | But I'm not a super big X guru either. |
| 03:04.45 | neybar | gnome |
| 03:04.55 | Bradipo | Don't they both have one already? |
| 03:05.18 | neybar | perhaps |
| 03:05.49 | neybar | I am looking for a pager like less or more |
| 03:05.59 | neybar | not to organize windows |
| 03:06.06 | neybar | or desktops |
| 03:06.25 | sjansen | neybar: So why didn't you say so? |
| 03:07.08 | neybar | I thought pager was fairly plain, until google wasn't helping... :-P |
| 03:07.16 | neybar | It made perfect sense to me |
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| 03:08.50 | sjansen | xless |
| 03:09.08 | sjansen | In an X environment, pager means something different from $PAGER. |
| 03:10.03 | Bradipo | Yeah, there's a big difference |
| 03:10.34 | sjansen | neybar: http://freealter.org/doc_distrib/xless-1.7/ |
| 03:10.51 | Bradipo | What's wrong with xterm and less ? ;- |
| 03:10.53 | Bradipo | ) |
| 03:10.58 | neybar | lucky me... mandrake doesn't seem to have xless or a package for it. |
| 03:11.28 | neybar | I want to be able to open up a gvim like session for a man page and be able to use my mouse wheel on it... |
| 03:13.51 | sjansen | Oh, well why not use yelp? |
| 03:14.34 | neybar | I tried that, I just spent an hour trying to get yelp to work and it looks like mandrake foo bar'ed that one too. |
| 03:15.09 | neybar | snip strace yelp : |
| 03:15.18 | neybar | write(2, "\nYelp-ERROR **: ???? ????? ?????"..., 107 |
| 03:15.18 | neybar | Yelp-ERROR **: ???? ????? ?????? 'Failed to execute yelp-base: 2 (No such file or directory)' |
| 03:15.18 | neybar | aborting... |
| 03:15.24 | Bradipo | Why not use xman? |
| 03:15.27 | sjansen | Bummer. |
| 03:15.27 | neybar | that doesn't help much |
| 03:15.39 | sjansen | I don't think xman supports the mouse wheel. |
| 03:16.17 | Bradipo | Hmm, it might. |
| 03:16.19 | Bradipo | xterm does. |
| 03:16.24 | neybar | I don't seem to have xman either |
| 03:17.06 | neybar | xterm does support the mouse wheel, but it won't go forward and backwards in the man pages, it just scrolls what has already been displayed in your terminal |
| 03:17.24 | Bradipo | Right, I didn't mean for man page reading. |
| 03:17.31 | sjansen | Right, but he's arguing that they might have added to mouse wheel support to xman also. |
| 03:17.38 | Bradipo | I meant to indicate that since xterm works, xman may also with the right tewaking... |
| 03:17.45 | Bradipo | tweaking. |
| 03:18.02 | neybar | ah |
| 03:18.45 | Bradipo | Like some X resource setting. |
| 03:18.56 | Bradipo | Netscape doesn't work by default with a scroll mouse either. |
| 03:19.45 | sjansen | xman might be part of the XFree86-progs or XFree86-tools packages. |
| 03:20.25 | sjansen | Or even X11R6-contrib. |
| 03:20.42 | Bradipo | I wonder if gtk/qt as their own xman program. |
| 03:21.12 | Bradipo | Are you using imwheel? |
| 03:21.13 | sjansen | I tried to find a Gnome version of xman but couldn't. |
| 03:22.27 | neybar | they have gman, but it relies on yelp which I can't get working |
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| 03:26.22 | neybar | anyone here use redhat 9? |
| 03:29.20 | sjansen | export PAGER="col -b | gview -" |
| 03:29.35 | sjansen | Try using that for you man paging pleasure. |
| 03:29.44 | sjansen | neybar: Yes, I'm using RH9. |
| 03:31.37 | neybar | can you check and see if you have /usr/share/locale/en_US/LC_MESSAGES/yelp.mo |
| 03:36.41 | neybar | sjansen: man -P "col -b | gview -" $manpage is exactly what I wanted |
| 03:36.44 | neybar | thanks |
| 03:37.05 | neybar | I had tried that earlier with just -P vi, and gvim and that didn't work |
| 03:40.59 | sjansen | neybar: I do not. |
| 04:07.08 | brailsmt | what local place has the best prices on computers/ |
| 04:07.13 | brailsmt | ? |
| 04:08.21 | sjansen | brailsmt: EBC is good for parts. |
| 04:08.32 | sjansen | Not sure about whole computers. |
| 04:14.21 | neybar | I like Aroma |
| 04:14.43 | neybar | I have never had a problem with then and they have a good return policy. |
| 04:15.04 | neybar | Had a motherboard that I had to replace three different times... try that with EBC. |
| 04:19.42 | sjansen | I've only had to return a DVD drive. Didn' |
| 04:19.52 | sjansen | Didn't have a problem with them. |
| 04:24.02 | synic | how do you install modules with the perl command line? something like perl -mcpan ? |
| 04:32.09 | sjansen | G'night. |
| 05:27.11 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_ (~michael@12-254-250-249.client.attbi.com) |
| 05:27.39 | brailsmt_ | has anyone ever seen a grub error 18? and how might one fix it without a floppy drive? |
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| 13:03.48 | *** join/#utah elg (fugalh@byu080777wks.byu.edu) |
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| 13:09.57 | Hanuman | elg: can't remember if you said you had this or not, but here's a good barebones system for $49: |
| 13:10.00 | Hanuman | http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=146975&sku=s450-3010&SRCCODE=WEM532RW |
| 13:10.22 | Hanuman | And here's 256Mb ddr RAM for your system: |
| 13:10.29 | Hanuman | http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=578020&sku=U10-1900&SRCCODE=WEM532RW - $14.99 |
| 13:11.19 | Hanuman | doh - the ram is after a $20 mail-in rebate |
| 13:11.56 | *** join/#utah elg_ (fugalh@byu080777wks.byu.edu) |
| 13:21.41 | Hanuman | elg_: did you get my last message? |
| 13:45.23 | elg_ | which one? |
| 13:48.48 | elg_ | wow, xmission is doing a linux installfest |
| 13:48.53 | elg_ | that's cool |
| 13:50.20 | Hanuman | elg_: about the barebones system and RAM |
| 13:53.16 | elg_ | i guess not |
| 13:57.45 | Hanuman | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:57.50 | Hanuman | here's a good barebones system for $49: |
| 13:57.57 | Hanuman | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:58.06 | Hanuman | And here's 256Mb ddr RAM for your system: |
| 13:58.13 | Hanuman | http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=578020&sku=U10-1900&SRCCODE=WEM532RW - $14.99 |
| 13:58.19 | Hanuman | doh - the ram is after a $20 mail-in rebate |
| 14:00.10 | elg_ | I found (but haven't ordered yet) what I was looking for at newegg.com |
| 14:00.41 | elg_ | Power supply, mobo (shuttle), cpu (Athlon XP 2000+) for $158 after shipping |
| 14:01.19 | elg_ | and the motherboard will use either SDRAM or DDR |
| 14:01.24 | elg_ | so I don't have to buy ram yet. |
| 14:02.15 | elg_ | The best I could do locally was about $220 |
| 14:05.15 | Hanuman | Note bad - what speed front-side bus? |
| 14:05.19 | elg_ | 266 |
| 14:05.22 | elg_ | iirc |
| 14:05.37 | elg_ | oughta check. It's a shuttle AK32E board |
| 14:06.14 | Hanuman | not too bad - I just got a P4 2.5GHz system at the beginning of this year |
| 14:06.30 | Hanuman | It's amazing how fast computers have gotten |
| 14:06.54 | elg_ | http://secure.newegg.com/app/specification.asp?item=13-150-043 |
| 14:08.02 | elg_ | the board will handle up to an XP 2400+, so not as upgradable as others may be, but I figure by the time I need an upgrade I'll have a job and can save up for a mac. :) |
| 14:08.16 | elg_ | (famous last words, yeah yeah) |
| 14:08.53 | Hanuman | Good luck - are you married? |
| 14:10.15 | elg_ | Hanuman: yeah |
| 14:10.35 | Hanuman | okay - then you're already in the same situation as me |
| 14:10.46 | Hanuman | I'm working and I'm still saving up for a Mac |
| 14:11.19 | Hanuman | I think it's an unknown secret that every Linux user wants to own a Mac |
| 14:13.53 | Hanuman | I also need a laptop, so I'm trying to determine if I should just get a Mac laptop |
| 14:14.05 | elg_ | yeah, that's my plan |
| 14:14.45 | elg_ | anyone know how to change the font of an xterm on-the-fly? |
| 14:15.35 | Hanuman | On Linux I use Eterm - used to know how to do it on there |
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| 14:44.40 | Jayce^ | elg_, after the 2400 the go to a higher bus speed (333), that's why there is a difference and most boards won't do both, except newer ones. |
| 14:46.03 | elg_ | ahh, good to know |
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| 15:02.12 | Hanuman | Unfortunately there aren't any in Richmond |
| 15:02.19 | elg_ | mmmmmmm |
| 15:02.24 | elg_ | I love macaroni grill |
| 15:02.41 | Hanuman | me too - I have to travel 2 hours north to the DC area to go to one |
| 15:03.03 | Hanuman | That bread they serve before the meal is enough to make my meal worth it |
| 15:03.56 | levi | Mmm, Macaroni Grill. |
| 15:15.39 | neybar | I second that... mmm |
| 16:01.56 | Hanuman | I had an interesting thing happen to me the other day which was a bit promising |
| 16:02.18 | Hanuman | A guy actually came to me about Perl freelance work, having found my name on Google |
| 16:02.31 | Hanuman | I haven't had anyone come to me since the internet slump started |
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| 17:44.52 | *** join/#utah brailsmt_work (michael@byu080718wks.byu.edu) |
| 17:45.13 | brailsmt_work | anyone seen "Error 18" during stage 1.5 in grub? |
| 18:15.02 | *** join/#utah Hanuman (~jstayii@pool-141-152-11-130.rich.east.verizon.net) |
| 18:15.14 | Hanuman | dang power - I really need a UPS for my house |
| 18:16.36 | Hanuman | I had a 2 mo uptime, too |
| 18:16.52 | Hanuman | I want a year before I'm proud of myself |
| 18:18.13 | brailsmt_work | especially with 2.6 on the horizon |
| 18:18.50 | brailsmt_work | until linux gets the ability to switch kernels while running, I don't forsee myself with uptimes much over a month... |
| 18:22.03 | Hanuman | why is that, unless it's a security vulnerability? |
| 18:22.37 | brailsmt_work | Hanuman: that and advances and bug fixes |
| 18:23.36 | Hanuman | I can live for a year if it's just bug fixes and advances, as long as it works |
| 18:30.47 | elg_ | Hanuman: I could on a server, but probably not on a desktop |
| 18:32.33 | Hanuman | elg_: yeah - I was about to say - it would depend on my machine I guess |
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| 18:59.58 | elg_ | blast. ready to order and newegg.com is inaccessible (at least from here) |
| 19:02.54 | Hanuman | where are they based? There are thunderstorms all along the east coast |
| 19:03.57 | elg_ | CA I think |
| 19:04.10 | elg_ | but maybe my link goes through the east coast. It's not resolving dhcp |
| 19:07.52 | sjansen | I've been having connectivity problems too. Are you on campus? |
| 19:08.23 | elg_ | sjansen: yeah |
| 19:08.37 | sjansen | elg_: You're Hans, right? |
| 19:09.01 | elg_ | sjansen: I are |
| 19:21.14 | Hanuman | weird |
| 19:26.24 | Jayce^ | almost got the entire mr bean collection :) |
| 19:27.37 | sjansen | Oh to be old and have too much money. ;-) |
| 19:29.37 | elg_ | no kidding |
| 19:30.20 | elg_ | (not to mention the DVDs and special edition DVDs of the lotr movies) |
| 19:36.40 | *** join/#utah levi_ (~levi@208.177.141.226) |
| 19:37.31 | Jayce^ | they had babylon 5 season 3 there... man I wish I could afford that (as well as the new simpsons season 3) |
| 19:44.30 | *** join/#utah levi__ (~levi@208.177.141.226) |
| 20:11.47 | Jayce^ | lol.... |
| 20:35.51 | *** join/#utah levi_ (~levi@208.177.141.226) |
| 20:55.31 | Hanuman | holy cow - check out the current bid on this item: |
| 20:55.32 | Hanuman | http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2555673237 |
| 20:55.52 | Hanuman | Quick - everyone sell their itunes music! |
| 20:58.06 | Hanuman | When all is said and done this guy should have enough money to defend the RIAA when they sue him for copyright infringement (don't know how, but they will) |
| 20:58.07 | Jayce^ | wow |
| 21:04.02 | Hanuman | gtg - cya guys later |
| 21:28.43 | levi | Somehow, I don't think the winner is really going to pay up. |
| 21:29.47 | Jayce^ | really? I had the check ready.. :D |
| 21:35.05 | brailsmt_work | i think it is funny :) |
| 21:36.03 | brailsmt_work | maybe i will bid $100,000 just to get my name in the guiness bok of wrold records... either for the Most Stupid Consumer, or for the Highest Price Paid for a 4 minutes song... |
| 21:36.06 | brailsmt_work | :) |
| 21:40.22 | levi | To get the latter, though, you would have to actually pay. |
| 21:40.25 | levi | That would suck. |
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