| 14:17:37 | han_solo | anyone know a good reference defending latex's indentation? specifically not indenting the first paragraph |
| 14:17:50 | han_solo | TA keeps marking my papers telling me to indent |
| 14:25:08 | CosmicPenguin | has neverused latex |
| 14:25:13 | CosmicPenguin | or spaces, apparently |
| 14:48:06 | han_solo | anyone know what ksoftirqd_CPU0 would be? and why it would take 90% of my cpu? |
| 14:49:13 | CosmicPenguin | SMP? |
| 14:49:19 | han_solo | it only has one processor |
| 14:50:05 | han_solo | pid 3, pri 20, nice 19, stat RWN |
| 14:51:07 | CosmicPenguin | Its an internal process used to handle software interrupts better - what version of the kernel are you running? |
| 14:55:15 | han_solo | 2.4.18. it's an hppa |
| 15:07:23 | CosmicPenguin | hmm.... interesting - do you have any interesting modules attached, or is it pretty standard? |
| 15:07:59 | han_solo | as standard as an hppa gets. only modules loaded are iptables modules |
| 15:10:22 | CosmicPenguin | Thats weird.... I can't find any complaints about softirq on hppa... Can you upgrade to 2.4.19? |
| 15:12:13 | han_solo | yeah. I'll do that. it doesn't seem to affect performance, I just noticed that it was taking so much cpu in top |
| 15:13:52 | han_solo | what are the implications when depmod complains about unresolved symbols in modules? |
| 15:16:11 | CosmicPenguin | the indicated modules won't be loaded |
| 15:16:34 | CosmicPenguin | ie, insmod or modprobe will refuse to load 'em |
| 15:16:56 | han_solo | hmm. "There was a problem running depmod. This may be benign, |
| 15:16:57 | han_solo | (You may have versioned symbol names, for instance). |
| 15:16:57 | han_solo | Or this could be an error. |
| 15:16:57 | han_solo | " |
| 15:17:11 | CosmicPenguin | Is that it? |
| 15:17:19 | han_solo | lots of modules had unresolved symbols. |
| 15:17:22 | han_solo | depmod: *** Unresolved symbols in /lib/modules/2.4.19-32/kernel/net/ipv4/netfilter/iptable_nat.o |
| 15:17:27 | han_solo | for example |
| 15:17:38 | han_solo | (this before rebooting) |
| 15:17:43 | CosmicPenguin | Are your modules versioned? |
| 15:17:48 | CosmicPenguin | Because that will do it |
| 15:17:54 | han_solo | i don't know. how would I check? |
| 15:18:05 | han_solo | (using standard debian kernel packages here) |
| 15:26:00 | CosmicPenguin | do the symbols in the modules have lots of jiberish attached to them? |
| 15:26:20 | CosmicPenguin | Kind of like C++ mangling, but slightly different? |
| 15:29:33 | han_solo | how do I check the symbols? |
| 15:30:09 | han_solo | like this: ip_conntrack_protocol_register_Ra65af873 ? |
| 15:30:25 | CosmicPenguin | exactly |
| 15:30:36 | han_solo | ok, they are. I assume it's not a problem then |
| 15:30:38 | han_solo | thanks |
| 15:30:56 | CosmicPenguin | probably not, but prepare for issues when you reboot. But because you don't have many modules installed, you should be ok |
| 15:31:59 | CosmicPenguin | BTW: versioned modules are a bad thing - I *alway* turn them off |
| 15:33:27 | han_solo | i might get around to rolling my own, but haven't done that on hppa yet |
| 15:35:45 | han_solo | well, it's installed. don't have time to deal with issues now though so I'll defer reboot |
| 15:36:14 | Jayce^ | so anyways.. for anybody who hasn't tried it.. the full ut2003 runs *very* well in linux |
| 15:36:30 | CosmicPenguin | what video card did you run it with? |
| 15:40:13 | Jayce^ | geforce 4 ti4200 |
| 15:40:25 | Jayce^ | nvidia's drivers.. |
| 15:40:40 | Jayce^ | runs better on my box than my friends (better) box with windows.. |
| 15:40:43 | han_solo | kicks the dirt. I want a 3d card |
| 15:41:10 | Jayce^ | heh... |
| 15:41:27 | Jayce^ | even has a 32mb tnt2 in his gateway machine.. that's headless right now.. |
| 15:41:52 | Jayce^ | course that one can't play UT2003.. the tnt2 doesn't have one specific call that it uses heavily.. |
| 15:42:26 | han_solo | i'm only interested in armagetron and flightgear. oh and this class that uses gl libraries for no apparent reason |
| 15:44:07 | Jayce^ | heh... well the tnt2 handles that w/o a problem.. as well as unreal tournament 1, soldier of fortune, and a few others.. |
| 15:44:13 | han_solo | oh, and I'd like to try bzflag |
| 15:45:00 | Jayce^ | hehe.. |
| 15:45:12 | Jayce^ | well you can pick up cards like that one for next to nothing now. |
| 15:45:37 | han_solo | yeah. now I just need to get next to nothing. i'll drop hints for my birthday though. :) |
| 18:18:12 | Jayce^ | begins what could become a Plug-UT server.. |
| 18:53:55 | bbeattie | growls 2 weeks is all it took for a new e-mail of mine to get harvested. |
| 18:54:24 | Jayce^ | ouch.. |
| 18:54:29 | Jayce^ | where all have you used it? |
| 18:54:40 | Jayce^ | is reading on bayesian filters right now.. |
| 18:54:50 | bbeattie | i put bbeattie@sllug.org instead of bbeattie(at)sllug.org in one article. |
| 18:55:13 | bbeattie | darn harvesting bots. |
| 18:56:03 | bbeattie | I'm also going to abandon what was my "permentant" e-mail address I've had for 7 years because of an average of 80 spam messages a day to it. |
| 18:56:10 | Jayce^ | heh.. doesn't nuke change those automatically? or was it in the body? |
| 18:56:29 | Jayce^ | bbeattie: what SMTP do you use? |
| 18:56:35 | bbeattie | body of an article for contact information. |
| 18:56:39 | bbeattie | sendmail |
| 18:57:10 | Jayce^ | there is a spamassasin plugin for sendmail.. article on oreillynet... check it out, could save you serious hassles.. |
| 18:58:03 | bbeattie | yes, I don't have root access and the person who does to the system tried that and "couldn't get it to work" and I can't get root to fix it *points to his father who took over his domain name* heh :-) |
| 18:58:49 | bbeattie | I know for sure I've deleted around 10+ very important e-mails I've miss-scanned for spam. |
| 18:59:23 | Jayce^ | ouch.. |
| 19:00:00 | CosmicPenguin | we use spamassasin.... its pretty good, but it still false positives about 10% of the time |
| 19:00:12 | CosmicPenguin | which is much better than any of the other systems we've tried, though.... |
| 19:01:40 | CosmicPenguin | and it does take a high amount of maintaince - more and more spams are slipping through these days |
| 19:03:19 | bbeattie | I'm stuck with "0% false possitive or no filtering" |
| 19:04:47 | bbeattie | It's too time consuming to go through around 50 spam mails for about 1-5 real e-mails when I check my mail in the mornings :-/ |
| 19:05:12 | CosmicPenguin | All my spams get a 5 day stay of execution before they are sent to the bit bucket - that way I can check the spam folder if I want, but I usually don't have to |
| 19:06:10 | bbeattie | any way evolution can filter? (I still prefer ssh'ing in and mutt'ing) |
| 19:09:25 | CosmicPenguin | bbeattie: evolution can do filters pretty well |
| 19:09:47 | CosmicPenguin | though I hated Evolution so much, I perfered to use procmail to do my filtering so I could use a more sane e-mail client |
| 19:10:41 | Jayce^ | you can plug spamassasin into kmail I know.. |
| 19:10:56 | CosmicPenguin | Jayce^: without procmail? |
| 19:10:57 | CosmicPenguin | cool |
| 19:11:27 | Jayce^ | yeah.. use kmail's execute on delivery function |
| 19:11:43 | Jayce^ | I remember the POD had some documentation about that.. |
| 19:13:13 | bbeattie | CosmicPenguin: what's wrong with evolution's e-mail? |
| 19:13:34 | CosmicPenguin | bbeattie: it was too resource intensive, and it was dirt slow, IMHO |
| 19:13:57 | CosmicPenguin | Plus, I didn't need any of the other stuff - just e-mail |
| 19:14:14 | CosmicPenguin | I use Sylpheed now, and it is a world of difference |
| 19:14:34 | bbeattie | CosmicPenguin: alright. I think it's possible to sync a pda with evolution, so I'll give that a try, especially if evolution can filter. |
| 19:16:53 | CosmicPenguin | bbeattie: yep - Evolution can do pilot... does the Z use pilot too? |
| 19:18:17 | bbeattie | comsicpenguin: and zaurus syncing too. |
| 19:18:26 | bbeattie | have to reboot, lost usb mouse somehow |
| 19:50:07 | bbeattie | is imap superior to pop3? |
| 19:52:10 | CosmicPenguin | Tough question |
| 19:52:16 | bbeattie | how do they differ? |
| 19:52:31 | Bradipo | IMAP has more features than POP |
| 19:52:32 | CosmicPenguin | Personally, I think it is slower, more bloated and evil, but it does help when you have multiple machines in different locations |
| 19:52:44 | Bradipo | But I wouldn't say it is superior. |
| 19:52:45 | bbeattie | which I do, |
| 19:52:47 | Bradipo | Each has it's use. |
| 19:53:41 | bbeattie | what are the biggest differences? |
| 19:55:04 | CosmicPenguin | simply, IMAP stores all of your mail on the server (with folders and everything), whereas POP3 only has a single INBOX |
| 19:55:53 | CosmicPenguin | Most people use IMAP to have multiple folders on a remote system that can be accessed from anywhere |
| 19:56:57 | CosmicPenguin | whereas most POP users get their mail from a server, and typically store it their local machine |
| 19:57:47 | CosmicPenguin | I use IMAP so I can read my work email at home |
| 19:58:04 | CosmicPenguin | I get lots of mail from mailing lists, so I like to have lots and lots of different folders |
| 19:58:20 | CosmicPenguin | scared him away |
| 19:58:56 | Bradipo | IMAP is scary stuff. |
| 20:10:05 | fugalh | cosmicPenguin: kernel upgrad success, no change. I guess it's normal operation - like I say it doesn't effect performance |
| 20:10:22 | fugalh | fwiw everyone, I got alsa working |
| 20:10:32 | Jayce^ | cool.. using that on my laptop.. |
| 20:10:43 | CosmicPenguin | fugalh: it shouldn't affect performance - but its odd that it gets called so much... there must be some drivers that use it more than they should |
| 20:10:52 | CosmicPenguin | anyway, no harm no foul |
| 20:11:08 | fugalh | is a penguin considered a foul? |
| 20:11:10 | fugalh | i wonder |
| 20:11:18 | Jayce^ | d'oh |
| 20:11:46 | fugalh | this weekend I pick up the midi keyboard and then the real fun begins. :) |
| 20:14:14 | Jayce^ | ack... never mention midi around a web developer :) |
| 20:14:35 | fugalh | midi midi midi |
| 20:14:48 | fugalh | i'm not talking cheap sound effects and background web music. :) |
| 20:15:17 | fugalh | I'm talking serious music. of course many musicians consider midi an abomination anyway |
| 20:15:28 | fugalh | not the least of which Vince Clarke of Erasure |
| 20:16:24 | fugalh | but maybe I'll upload the smurfs theme in midi to plug.org with my vim notes. ;-O |
| 20:16:26 | Jayce^ | trembles at the name of the synth god.. |
| 20:16:33 | Jayce^ | is a huge erasure fan |
| 20:16:56 | fugalh | I once read in a magazine an interview with him |
| 20:17:16 | Jayce^ | in his 'cave'.. the totally spherical sound room |
| 20:17:16 | fugalh | he would take an analog synth, (the Moog, iirc) and play around with it until he got a cool sound, |
| 20:17:35 | fugalh | then record the track with it. He wouldn't even save the sound |
| 20:17:40 | fugalh | each one was unique |
| 20:18:25 | Jayce^ | nope.. that guy has so much 'old school' systems.. he loves analog |
| 20:19:38 | fugalh | That's what I love - electric music that is just that: electric music. I despise all of this sampled stuff, and approximations of real instruments. If you want it to sound real then use real instruments. duh. |
| 20:19:58 | fugalh | now, samples that are tweaked, effect-ized, etc... that's cool |
| 20:20:14 | Jayce^ | yeah... love the stuff.. real music.. |
| 20:20:49 | Jayce^ | you ever see the 'lucky-bastard' cd that vince put out.. all samples to play with.. had a couple example tracks on it too.. |
| 20:21:03 | fugalh | no. sounds cool |
| 20:21:29 | Jayce^ | tons of samples.. used to have a few dozen of them.. |
| 20:21:54 | Jayce^ | you hear about the latest erasure album (coming soon) |
| 20:22:38 | fugalh | i haven't kept up since i say... I used to be the biggest erasure fan. loved i say too... heard 'erasure' and it didn't really strike a chord so I stuck to the old stuff |
| 20:22:39 | levi | I love sample-based music when the samples are ripped off of old LPs or whatnot. |
| 20:23:36 | fugalh | jayce^: any idea how I can get my hands on "Linux Music & Sound" (book) without forking out the money? You seem to know how to do that sort of thing. :) |
| 20:29:01 | bbeattie | CosmicPenguin: odd, I just did an imap get mail and it's downloading my entire ~ directory on the mail system. :-) |
| 20:29:37 | fugalh | uw-imapd? |
| 20:29:57 | bbeattie | no idea, what's uw-imapd? |
| 20:30:02 | fugalh | an imap server |
| 20:30:11 | CosmicPenguin | bbeattie: thats an remote IMAP server issue... they have indicated that your maildir is ~ |
| 20:30:18 | fugalh | it has the 'feature' of using ~ as your imap directory |
| 20:30:19 | CosmicPenguin | I have the same problem with XMision |
| 20:30:21 | CosmicPenguin | XMission |
| 20:30:23 | bbeattie | it's whatever is standard on caldera OpenLinux, |
| 20:30:31 | fugalh | and so scans the whole directory recursively |
| 20:30:36 | fugalh | which can take a long time |
| 20:31:04 | bbeattie | yes, and is a lot more than i want, I did select to get all folders, so I'll get all then go back and select my mail directories? |
| 20:31:23 | fugalh | yeah |
| 20:31:34 | fugalh | if you're lucky it won't always scan your entire ~ |
| 20:31:45 | bbeattie | kinda of nice, but a bit anoying too. |
| 20:31:59 | fugalh | but in some situations it does. i.e. I think when mutt is the client it always does |
| 20:32:03 | bbeattie | watches as it pulls down all his netscape cache files, great....... |
| 20:32:59 | bbeattie | this is evolution, |
| 20:38:13 | Jayce^ | fugalh: what book? |
| 20:38:19 | CosmicPenguin | you are using this with a remote IMAP server, right? |
| 20:38:38 | bbeattie | yes |
| 20:39:03 | fugalh | jayce^: http://www.nostarch.com/lms.htm |
| 20:39:07 | bbeattie | I'm trying to figure out how to not get it to download my entire ~ folder |
| 20:39:34 | Jayce^ | bbeattie: not sure on that too.. |
| 20:40:12 | CosmicPenguin | it should be a remote option - I don't really understand why ~ is specified as your INBOX |
| 20:41:43 | fugalh | ~ is probably the folder root, not the INBOX. INBOX is probably the spool file |
| 20:42:40 | bbeattie | there is an option to "override server-supplied folder namespace", but ~/Mail in that didn't help. |
| 20:44:16 | bbeattie | would that be the correct option to modify, though it appears it's not working? |
| 20:45:45 | bbeattie | or will that have to be changed on the server? |
| 21:08:22 | CosmicPenguin | bbeattie: I'm not sure how to fix that problem.... like fugalh said, you should be pointing at your mail namespace but you aren't for some reason |
| 21:08:33 | CosmicPenguin | I would have to think that is a remote issue |
| 21:12:02 | HarleyPig | Does anyone here know proftp? |
| 21:31:55 | Jayce^ | hey HarleyPig |
| 21:35:24 | HarleyPig | 'lo |
| 21:55:41 | Bradipo | Is there another tool like cheops for *nix? |
| 22:10:23 | BZFlag | http://wwwhome.cs.utwente.nl/~schoenw/scotty/ ? |
| 22:13:07 | han_solo | from /.: "If RMS speaks, but nobody listens, does he make a sound?" |
| 22:15:59 | Bradipo | BZFlag: Thanks, I'll give it a look. |
| 22:30:15 | han_solo | says something derogatory about spews. |
| 22:46:05 | CosmicPenguin | hehe... leave it to Erik to bring up the Utah anti-spam law on the LKML |
| 22:47:21 | bbeattie | BZFlag: are ucsims/uclinux the cheapest way to get a small embedded decice, or are there cheaper options for something that's less than 2x10x10? |
| 23:00:45 | BZFlag | bbeattie: hmm. they are the cheapest I'm aware of. I bet there are others around if you look though. |
| 23:15:50 | Bonez39 | is away: I'm busy, but please, leave a message. I'll be right back! |
| 23:38:57 | CosmicPenguin | off to home |
| 23:38:59 | CosmicPenguin | is away: Uh, oh.. the weasel got out again... |