| 00:06.09 | Utah_Dave | later, guys |
| 00:06.11 | *** join/#uphpu beandog_ (n=sdibb@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 00:06.27 | timinator | thanks mgeary |
| 00:06.37 | mgeary | ? |
| 00:06.43 | mgeary | what'd i do? |
| 00:06.49 | mgeary | oh, right |
| 00:06.50 | mgeary | errors |
| 00:06.51 | mgeary | :) |
| 00:06.54 | timinator | error_reporting(E_ALL) |
| 00:06.58 | timinator | yep |
| 00:07.00 | timinator | :) |
| 00:07.00 | thebigdog | we're glad you are here |
| 00:07.08 | timinator | very glad |
| 00:07.11 | thebigdog | that timinator is a slacker |
| 00:07.18 | thebigdog | ops...wrong window |
| 00:07.18 | timinator | for shure |
| 00:07.21 | timinator | LOL |
| 00:07.28 | thebigdog | ;) |
| 00:07.32 | timinator | ;) |
| 00:16.40 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh man. I never should have let my sister get my IM name. |
| 00:16.59 | Lone_Wanderer | Now I'm tech support :( |
| 00:17.33 | Lone_Wanderer | "What client are you using?" "What?" "The program you're using to talk to me, what's it called?" "I don't know." "Okay, are you on Windows?" "Probably..." |
| 00:21.52 | timinator | LOL |
| 00:22.03 | timinator | we all feel for ya man |
| 00:24.45 | beandog_ | hee hee hee |
| 00:24.47 | beandog_ | that's grea.t |
| 00:26.05 | beandog_ | thats why you always lie when a stranger asks if you know a lot about computers |
| 00:26.08 | beandog_ | :) |
| 00:26.31 | mgeary | that's one great aspect of Macs. Fewer people have 'em, so fewer people to bug you for support :) |
| 00:29.20 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh, I know, beandog_. If you tell people you're a programmer, you can automatically fix anything. |
| 00:29.46 | bradym | it doesn't matter what OS I use... I will ALWAYS be tech support... |
| 00:30.24 | beandog_ | Fortunately Ive turned all my friends off on asking me since I'll just advocate using Linux |
| 00:30.40 | beandog_ | "how do you do this in Word?" "just use linux" |
| 00:30.43 | beandog_ | :) |
| 00:30.54 | bradym | lol - nice :) |
| 00:32.23 | jsmith | beandog_: I thought that would work too... but now my father-in-law is using Linux! |
| 00:32.32 | jsmith | beandog_: Of course, that makes it easier to fix his problems |
| 00:33.25 | beandog_ | heh, nice |
| 00:35.49 | beandog_ | Just tell people that the only OS you use is one you wrote yourself and it only runs on your cell phone. |
| 00:36.40 | thebigdog | or pda |
| 00:37.04 | thebigdog | i like the guys that ask tell you there are a developer/engineer too and they do .NET all day |
| 00:38.16 | synic | doesn't that still qualify as a developer? |
| 00:39.48 | beandog_ | I feel really bad for developers who are still maintaing ASP code. |
| 00:40.08 | synic | I've never even seen ASP |
| 00:40.12 | Lone_Wanderer | ~lart vapid spirituality |
| 00:40.30 | beandog_ | its a horrible backwards, buggy language. |
| 00:41.11 | beandog_ | basically vb6 for the web |
| 00:41.23 | beandog_ | well, its the same runtime language |
| 00:41.36 | beandog_ | so, vb6 minus buttons. |
| 00:41.37 | synic | heh, I haven't even seen VB since like 98 |
| 00:41.37 | beandog_ | :) |
| 00:41.51 | bradym | lucky you :) |
| 00:42.02 | synic | sort of. I do perl for a living |
| 00:42.28 | synic | perl is a horibble backwards language as well |
| 00:42.48 | bradym | perl scares me |
| 00:43.04 | bradym | not in the "i'm scared to use it" kind of way.. |
| 00:43.21 | bradym | in the "i'm scared that it really exists" kind of way |
| 00:43.36 | beandog_ | heh |
| 00:44.32 | synic | I'll stop here with my comments though, as I don't like php much either, hehe. |
| 00:44.41 | beandog_ | synic: what do you like |
| 00:44.50 | synic | I like python |
| 00:44.55 | beandog_ | meh. |
| 00:45.06 | beandog_ | Ive looked at python briefly, and found it slightly annoying. |
| 00:45.10 | beandog_ | I dont remember why, now, so dont ask. |
| 00:45.21 | synic | I did at first too, but now I'm all over it |
| 00:45.24 | beandog_ | Im sure its nice though. |
| 00:45.28 | beandog_ | learning curve, and all that. |
| 00:45.37 | beandog_ | Besides, If I were going to learn a new language, that wouldnt be it. |
| 00:45.44 | synic | what would it be? |
| 00:45.45 | mgeary | python rocks |
| 00:45.48 | beandog_ | C++ |
| 00:45.49 | bradym | I like python.. at least I think i do ;) I haven't really done enough with it to have much of an opinion yet |
| 00:46.04 | mgeary | or was it "Rock Python" |
| 00:46.28 | synic | C++ is also a horrible, backwards language |
| 00:46.31 | beandog_ | I enjoy writing really strict and anal code, so I think it would be right up my alley |
| 00:46.35 | synic | tierra: am I right? |
| 00:47.01 | bradym | C++ is the reason I didn't major in CS.. |
| 00:47.03 | thebigdog | fortran++ |
| 00:47.15 | synic | beandog_: I dunno. I've written some apps in C++. |
| 00:47.20 | beandog_ | bradym: hows that |
| 00:47.23 | synic | it's not the anal part about it that I didn't liike |
| 00:47.35 | synic | it's that everything is implemented really whack |
| 00:48.04 | synic | crap, I'm out. Later. |
| 00:48.13 | thebigdog | mono+++ |
| 00:48.48 | bradym | it turned me off to programming when i spent ~20 hours on something and got a little black box that said something a little more complex than hello world... |
| 00:49.14 | beandog_ | heh |
| 00:49.17 | beandog_ | sounds like GTK+ to me. |
| 00:49.55 | bradym | even more than that though was the lack of useful examples and assignments.. |
| 00:49.57 | thebigdog | gtk rocks |
| 00:50.37 | mgeary | i'm outta here. later folks |
| 00:50.41 | *** part/#uphpu mgeary (n=mgeary@166.70.44.49) |
| 00:50.52 | beandog_ | Thats what I wanna learn too |
| 00:50.54 | beandog_ | well, gtkmm |
| 00:51.28 | *** join/#uphpu eco (n=eco@gnuk.net) |
| 00:57.51 | *** part/#uphpu bradym (n=bradym@bradym.agsci.usu.edu) |
| 01:01.29 | thebigdog | what no kde or qt |
| 01:02.20 | beandog_ | nah |
| 01:02.29 | beandog_ | I like GTK's look and feel better |
| 01:02.58 | thebigdog | i have a really nice osx look'n'feel going at home |
| 01:03.13 | beandog_ | that reminds me |
| 01:03.22 | beandog_ | I put some theme in the tree today that apparently works on both GTK and Qt apps |
| 01:03.38 | thebigdog | xfce my man |
| 01:04.42 | beandog_ | ++ |
| 01:04.44 | beandog_ | nothing but. |
| 01:04.55 | thebigdog | well im heading home |
| 01:05.03 | thebigdog | until a few |
| 01:05.05 | beandog_ | nite doggie |
| 01:34.47 | *** part/#uphpu dragonleech (n=jason@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 02:38.49 | tierra | the only reason people are ever afraid of C++ is because it's a "batteries not included" language, and it takes a good amount of initial effort to not only learn the language, but to also research what C++ libraries exist, what they offer, how to link them into your application, and how to use them |
| 02:40.24 | tierra | it's arguably more powerful than any other language, but learning to harness that power takes time and skill |
| 02:43.53 | jsmith | The same could be said for C, or assembly... or a variety of languages |
| 03:32.49 | dataw0lf | C++ is a more scalable C. When used correctly, with the STL. |
| 03:33.11 | dataw0lf | once again, it comes down to what you want to do |
| 03:34.13 | *** join/#uphpu jsmith (n=jsmith@70.5.224.60) |
| 03:34.13 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v jsmith] by ChanServ |
| 03:36.25 | dataw0lf | http://www.x-tremegeek.com/templates/searchdetail.asp?productID=12890 |
| 03:57.59 | timinator | freakin' awesome |
| 03:58.56 | timinator | I'm out |
| 03:58.58 | timinator | later guys |
| 04:56.53 | *** join/#uphpu burnin (n=burnin@hongkong.machinage.com) |
| 06:29.39 | *** join/#uphpu xilch (n=xilch@c-24-10-225-124.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 07:39.13 | *** join/#uphpu gibba (n=gibbawho@209-253-35-18.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 12:36.13 | *** join/#uphpu jsmith (n=jsmith@h460523f0.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 12:36.13 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v jsmith] by ChanServ |
| 14:11.58 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 14:11.58 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o Utah_Dave] by ChanServ |
| 14:12.27 | *** join/#uphpu timinator (n=timinato@c-67-171-118-199.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 14:12.27 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v timinator] by ChanServ |
| 15:32.30 | timinator | mornin' all |
| 15:35.35 | *** join/#uphpu thebigdog (n=bigdog@208.177.146.102.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 15:35.35 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o thebigdog] by ChanServ |
| 15:50.23 | thebigdog | dataw0lf, you around? |
| 15:55.19 | Utah_Dave | morning, timinator |
| 15:55.38 | *** join/#uphpu _psychic_ (n=_psychic@71.32.228.156) |
| 15:55.38 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v _psychic_] by ChanServ |
| 16:06.47 | *** join/#uphpu drip|h (n=ben@c-67-171-119-121.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 16:10.25 | thebigdog | jsmith you familiar with zip on linux? |
| 16:10.36 | jsmith | Uh... yeah... sort of |
| 16:10.37 | jsmith | Why? |
| 16:10.46 | thebigdog | you ever use zipsplit |
| 16:14.50 | jsmith | nope |
| 16:19.09 | drip|h | gm everyone |
| 16:21.10 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v drip] by ChanServ |
| 16:26.15 | *** join/#uphpu mgeary (n=mgeary@166.70.44.49) |
| 16:30.35 | timinator | mornin drip |
| 16:36.58 | mgeary | hiya |
| 17:12.13 | timinator | hello mgeary |
| 17:12.18 | timinator | yawn |
| 17:12.22 | timinator | need more coffee |
| 17:19.55 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 17:19.56 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o Utah_Dave] by ChanServ |
| 17:24.44 | *** join/#uphpu wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230) |
| 17:24.44 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 17:27.01 | macnewbold | who hates rebates? http://digg.com/business_finance/An_Open_Letter_To_Centon_Electronics |
| 17:30.21 | thebigdog | man man man |
| 17:30.46 | thebigdog | i hate ripping dvds and getting the wrong audio |
| 17:38.08 | *** join/#uphpu bradym (n=bradym@bradym.agsci.usu.edu) |
| 17:53.43 | *** join/#uphpu dragonleech (n=jason@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 17:56.05 | thebigdog | ~lart timinator |
| 17:56.13 | thebigdog | ty jbot |
| 17:56.32 | timinator | ~timattack thebigdog |
| 17:56.41 | jbot | ACTION uses a 2 handed log saw and starts to chase thebigdog! |
| 17:56.45 | thebigdog | ~tunafart timinator |
| 17:56.47 | jbot | ACTION eats a week-old tuna sandwich with relish and walks over to timinator, leg raised, to let 'em rip. |
| 17:57.00 | timinator | ~nuk thebigdog |
| 17:57.02 | thebigdog | ~melvin timinator |
| 17:57.03 | jbot | ACTION pulls timinator underwear up to the ceiling...and smiles |
| 17:57.22 | timinator | ~nuyk thebigdog |
| 17:57.28 | timinator | hmmph |
| 17:57.35 | thebigdog | yeah |
| 17:57.38 | timinator | ~lart thebigdog |
| 17:57.44 | timinator | take that |
| 17:58.14 | timinator | ~whaleslap thebigdog |
| 17:58.15 | jbot | ACTION beats thebigdog upside and over the head with a freakishly huge killer whale named Hugh |
| 17:58.29 | thebigdog | ~slap timinator |
| 17:58.31 | jbot | ACTION slaps timinator, keep your grubby fingers to yourself! |
| 17:58.39 | timinator | ~lart thebigdog |
| 18:00.23 | thebigdog | ~fart timinator |
| 18:00.24 | jbot | ACTION farts in timinator's general direction |
| 18:00.44 | timinator | ah man |
| 18:00.56 | timinator | ~lart thebigdog |
| 18:01.17 | thebigdog | ~lart timinator |
| 18:01.29 | thebigdog | lol...just great |
| 18:01.35 | timinator | aaahhhhh |
| 18:02.10 | timinator | ~lart thebigdog |
| 18:03.56 | drip | sure thebigdog.. push back lunch. |
| 18:04.09 | drip | =P |
| 18:04.20 | thebigdog | hey, got to make the $$$ |
| 18:07.10 | mgeary | jasperreports, huh? Looks like a Java-only solution. Can you hook into it from PHP |
| 18:07.11 | mgeary | ? |
| 18:07.31 | thebigdog | sure |
| 18:07.58 | mgeary | is it a client-side app? Or serverside? |
| 18:15.04 | thebigdog | serverside |
| 18:15.17 | thebigdog | or clientside if you have an app for it |
| 18:15.20 | thebigdog | like ireport |
| 18:23.07 | mgeary | cool. |
| 18:23.11 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuju: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SaFTm2bcac&drum=loop |
| 18:23.20 | Lone_Wanderer | video about the amen beat |
| 18:23.24 | Lone_Wanderer | amen break* |
| 18:23.45 | mgeary | anyone here have kids in elementary school? |
| 18:25.29 | *** join/#uphpu jsmith (n=jsmith@216.194.124.228) |
| 18:25.29 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v jsmith] by ChanServ |
| 18:25.53 | Lone_Wanderer | (language alert on that clip) |
| 18:26.46 | mgeary | no elementary kid owners here, huh? :/ |
| 18:38.13 | macnewbold | mgeary: I've got one who is elementary aged, but he's home schooled |
| 18:39.13 | mgeary | macnewbold, i admire your wife |
| 18:39.28 | macnewbold | me too |
| 18:44.59 | jsmith | My wife was looking at some website today... utah association of homeschoolers or something like that |
| 18:45.09 | jsmith | Their motto was "So, when do I find time to clean the house" |
| 18:45.48 | Lone_Wanderer | That's gym class. |
| 18:48.13 | mgeary | heh |
| 18:51.39 | *** join/#uphpu burnin (n=burnin@hongkong.machinage.com) |
| 19:13.23 | jsmith | w00t! |
| 19:13.33 | jsmith | I get to do more SOAP programming from PHP on this project! |
| 19:13.48 | Lone_Wanderer | That's... goood? |
| 19:13.50 | Lone_Wanderer | -o |
| 19:14.20 | jsmith | Beats being bored |
| 19:14.26 | Lone_Wanderer | This is true. |
| 19:14.27 | jsmith | (not that I'm ever bored) |
| 19:16.11 | dataw0lf | you should use more |
| 19:16.50 | Lone_Wanderer | Heh, I was going to send you a bar of soap on facebook, DW. |
| 19:16.54 | Lone_Wanderer | brb |
| 19:28.20 | mgeary | if i want to no longer have a (sub)directory in source control, but i don't want to delete that directory, should i just delete that folder's .svn folder? Or is there a more graceful way? |
| 19:31.38 | macnewbold | try svn rm subdir |
| 19:31.43 | macnewbold | or if that doesn't work |
| 19:31.49 | macnewbold | svn ; rm -rf subdir |
| 19:32.00 | macnewbold | just kidding, mgeary, don't do that last one |
| 19:32.20 | macnewbold | actually, I was kidding about the first one too |
| 19:32.23 | mgeary | using svn rm will remove the local files |
| 19:32.26 | mgeary | uh, yeah :) |
| 19:32.26 | macnewbold | sorry :) |
| 19:33.06 | dataw0lf | mgeary: use ignore |
| 19:33.17 | macnewbold | he means on me I think |
| 19:33.20 | mgeary | but that won't delete the .svn files that are there for the subfolder |
| 19:33.22 | mgeary | hahaha |
| 19:33.40 | mgeary | should i delete the .svn folder, and *then* ignore? |
| 19:34.07 | dataw0lf | svn delete <subdir> |
| 19:34.38 | mgeary | dataw0lf: no, 'cause that will nuke the files i want to keep |
| 19:34.59 | dataw0lf | cp them out, delete them, then put them back without an svn add |
| 19:35.50 | mgeary | yeah, that's what i'm doing now. it's just not very graceful |
| 19:35.54 | mgeary | but thanks |
| 19:47.16 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuju: did you get the amen break video link? |
| 19:55.18 | mgeary | hey, is there a client-side way to see what other domains live on an IP address? |
| 19:55.18 | mgeary | i don't have access to the apache config |
| 19:55.45 | mgeary | the LDS Church blocks my domain. says it's a sex site. <chuckle> |
| 19:57.04 | Lone_Wanderer | what's the domain? |
| 19:57.15 | Lone_Wanderer | They block mathsex.livejournal.com too. |
| 19:57.37 | mgeary | michaelgeary.com |
| 19:57.46 | Lone_Wanderer | huh, weird |
| 19:57.57 | mgeary | i figure it's because their filters probably work on an IP basis |
| 19:58.02 | mgeary | ip address, that is |
| 19:58.11 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh |
| 19:58.13 | mgeary | and there's probably some naughty site(s) on the same IP |
| 19:58.19 | mgeary | hence my question |
| 19:58.22 | Lone_Wanderer | and you share an IP with some porn sites? |
| 19:58.24 | Lone_Wanderer | gotcha |
| 19:58.39 | Lone_Wanderer | I've heard of a few, but I don't think they work directly. |
| 19:58.57 | macnewbold | mgeary: there are some places that will tell you a partial list of who shares an IP |
| 19:59.01 | Lone_Wanderer | That is, they just passively monitor domains and when they get two with the same IP, they make a note of it. |
| 19:59.07 | mgeary | macnewbold: got any links? |
| 19:59.18 | macnewbold | not off the top of my head - I can't remember where I saw them |
| 19:59.19 | macnewbold | but they're out there |
| 19:59.27 | macnewbold | and very incomplete |
| 19:59.46 | burnin | unless the LDS church is blocking all dreamhost sites. |
| 19:59.55 | burnin | dig -x 208.113.163.152 |
| 20:00.03 | burnin | 152.163.113.208.in-addr.arpa. 5725 IN PTR apache2-emu.frappe.dreamhost.com. |
| 20:00.15 | mgeary | yeah |
| 20:00.26 | mgeary | not very useful |
| 20:01.52 | macnewbold | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:01.54 | macnewbold | try that |
| 20:02.28 | *** join/#uphpu gibbawho (i=gibbawho@209-253-35-21.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 20:03.04 | macnewbold | mgeary: here it is: http://www.robtex.com/dns/michaelgeary.com.html |
| 20:03.07 | macnewbold | ton of sharing going on |
| 20:03.22 | mgeary | holy cow |
| 20:03.38 | mgeary | ton is an understatement |
| 20:04.05 | mgeary | ah, the larger list is just domains with the same NS |
| 20:04.08 | mgeary | but still |
| 20:04.11 | mgeary | 106 domains |
| 20:04.15 | mgeary | very useful. thanks, macnewbold |
| 20:04.29 | mgeary | althgough |
| 20:04.38 | mgeary | that's just domains using the same mailserver, which isn't exactly the same thing |
| 20:04.44 | mgeary | but it's a decent start |
| 20:04.45 | Lone_Wanderer | ton is an understatement? how much does one domain weigh, and are 106 of them really more than one metric ton? |
| 20:04.47 | Lone_Wanderer | ;P |
| 20:04.50 | macnewbold | http://www.robtex.com/ip/208.113.163.152.html |
| 20:04.55 | macnewbold | correctoin |
| 20:05.11 | macnewbold | the smaller list is mailserver sharing, the long one was nameserver sharing, |
| 20:05.21 | macnewbold | this is a list of known domains on that IP |
| 20:05.26 | macnewbold | apparently it doesn't know of any |
| 20:05.46 | bradym | http://www.seologs.com/ip-domains.html |
| 20:06.06 | bradym | that one says there's 7 domains with your same ip |
| 20:06.08 | mgeary | yeah |
| 20:06.17 | mgeary | but doesn't list mine, so it's obviously a subset |
| 20:06.19 | mgeary | still, useful |
| 20:10.47 | macnewbold | mgeary: I tried an IP of a shared hosting server I know of, and it didn't list _any_ domains on that IP at all, out of at least mid-sized double digits I know are on there |
| 20:11.04 | mgeary | :/ |
| 20:11.06 | mgeary | ah well |
| 20:11.07 | macnewbold | so if it lists 7 for it, you could be one of 700 |
| 20:11.48 | mgeary | thanks for the effort |
| 20:14.22 | macnewbold | you might be able to get to it through google translate :) |
| 20:14.31 | macnewbold | if they allow google translate from wherever you are blocked, |
| 20:14.42 | macnewbold | request the page translated from en to en |
| 20:14.45 | Lone_Wanderer | heh, from English to English? |
| 20:14.47 | macnewbold | and it is totally browsable |
| 20:14.54 | macnewbold | yep, works like a charm |
| 20:14.54 | Lone_Wanderer | Does it do anything to it? |
| 20:14.58 | macnewbold | nope |
| 20:15.00 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 20:15.05 | macnewbold | en to en is a no-op thankfully |
| 20:15.17 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 20:15.21 | macnewbold | but it fixes all the links to point to google translate links of those pages, |
| 20:15.33 | Lone_Wanderer | Now to print up my angry email and submit it in actual physical letter form. |
| 20:15.36 | macnewbold | so you end up being able to browse the whole site without doing each page manually |
| 20:15.39 | Lone_Wanderer | oh cool |
| 20:15.50 | macnewbold | so what's the anger about? What'd MACU do now? |
| 20:16.03 | Lone_Wanderer | well, several things actually |
| 20:16.17 | macnewbold | (or what did they not do) |
| 20:16.19 | Lone_Wanderer | but the big one is that they deactivated my card for buying something online (from the UK) |
| 20:16.24 | Lone_Wanderer | didn't get a call about it |
| 20:16.37 | macnewbold | oh joy |
| 20:16.37 | Lone_Wanderer | went in to get it turned back on and the PFY at the counter didn't do it right |
| 20:16.44 | macnewbold | double joy |
| 20:17.08 | Lone_Wanderer | then (of course) I had to wait forever on the phone today to get someone who claims they fixed it |
| 20:17.30 | Lone_Wanderer | and explained in a somewhat condescending tone the process by which a card gets deactivated |
| 20:17.53 | macnewbold | "it's called online shopping, you idiot... the site was in the UK, but I still shop there..."' |
| 20:18.09 | Lone_Wanderer | but there are also various other annoyances like their online banking thing requiring Super Duper Extra Security, which basically prevents me from logging on to it |
| 20:18.20 | mgeary | condescension is the refuge of a small mind |
| 20:18.22 | Lone_Wanderer | aaaand... I forgot the others. |
| 20:18.36 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: how does it prevent you? not compatible with safari/firefox? |
| 20:18.40 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh, the ATM fee for checking my balance from a non-MACU ATM. |
| 20:19.08 | macnewbold | serious? that's only half their fault though. the atm owner sets a fee, and so can the receiving institution |
| 20:19.11 | Lone_Wanderer | They put a cookie on your machine when you log in from it, so if you log in from the same machine again it "remembers" it as being okay |
| 20:19.29 | macnewbold | if you find any Credit Union Co-Op ATM (almost all CUs in utah belong to it from what I've seen) there's never any fee |
| 20:19.35 | Lone_Wanderer | but if you use a different machine, you have to go through an additional barrage of tests to make sure it's REALLY you |
| 20:19.42 | macnewbold | oh, serious? |
| 20:19.44 | macnewbold | that's insane |
| 20:19.46 | Lone_Wanderer | (which is really just answering a "secret question" in addition to your password) |
| 20:19.52 | Lone_Wanderer | (but still, it annoys me) |
| 20:20.08 | macnewbold | so does it end up keeping you locked out, or after the annoyance, can you get in? |
| 20:20.34 | Lone_Wanderer | After you log in from the machine you can tell it (by going somewhere on the online branch) to remember that computer, but it doesn't do it automatically |
| 20:20.38 | Lone_Wanderer | just in case it's a public machine |
| 20:21.04 | Lone_Wanderer | I wouldn't mind it so much if there were a way to just opt out completely. |
| 20:21.29 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh, also, all of the ways to contact them online involve filling out numerous forms first. Just give me a box where I can type out my rant already. |
| 20:22.48 | Lone_Wanderer | So anyway, it's no frustration that's really unique to MACU, but it's been a long time since I've had any problems with a corporation of any sort. |
| 20:35.08 | mindjuju | anybody know a good place to buy tires? |
| 20:35.54 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, the place with the red sign whose name I can't recall gives you a pretty decent warranty. |
| 20:35.56 | Lone_Wanderer | Big O |
| 20:36.12 | Lone_Wanderer | I had my tires replaced once at Discount Tire and they did the alignment wrong |
| 20:36.30 | mindjuju | yuck, did they fix it? |
| 20:36.49 | mindjuju | what do you think about Sam's club or Costco tires? |
| 20:36.49 | mindjuju | are those cheaper? |
| 20:46.37 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't know anything about them. |
| 20:46.57 | Lone_Wanderer | Google "tires", you'll probably find an explanation of what the difference is between them all. |
| 20:52.05 | Utah_Dave | I recently bought four tires for my wife's car at Discount Tire and I was pretty happy with their service and price |
| 20:54.09 | macnewbold | I've mostly liked Discount |
| 20:54.30 | macnewbold | though the $12/tire replacement fee and the $10/tire lifetime balancing/rotation fee are a bit tricky |
| 20:55.01 | macnewbold | whenever you _do_ need to get a tire replaced, they bill you the $12 again for a new tire replacement warranty certificate, and the $10 for the balancing/rotation on the new tire |
| 20:56.05 | macnewbold | so even though you paid up front for free tire replacement for the life of the tire, |
| 20:56.14 | mindjuju | that IS tricky! |
| 20:56.18 | macnewbold | they still charge you $22+tax (+ maybe a $2 disposal fee?) to replace it |
| 20:56.20 | mindjuju | bunch of jerks! |
| 20:56.28 | Lone_Wanderer | tricksy hobbits! |
| 20:56.45 | macnewbold | but ~$25 for a replacement of a $70-80 tire is worthwhile I suppose |
| 20:57.18 | macnewbold | about 4 years ago I bought a set of 4 tires for about $300-350, with 70K mile warranty on them |
| 20:57.29 | macnewbold | during that time had 2 of them replaced, for another $50 or so, |
| 20:57.41 | Lone_Wanderer | That's not bad. |
| 20:57.42 | macnewbold | then went to get them rotated and they insisted I replace them, |
| 20:57.59 | macnewbold | and credited me $25/tire since they were still 25K miles under the 70K warranty |
| 20:58.30 | macnewbold | and got me in a set that was a few bucks per tire more, but he says he's actually seen them last the 80-85K miles that they're warranteed for, |
| 20:58.35 | macnewbold | for about $300 again |
| 20:58.53 | macnewbold | (the lame tires that came on the brand new mazda only lasted 25K miles) |
| 20:59.00 | macnewbold | so I should be good until about 150K miles now |
| 20:59.53 | macnewbold | they've got a bunch of stores here in utah |
| 20:59.56 | macnewbold | and all over too |
| 21:00.16 | mgeary | Les Schwab is supposed to be decent and cheap, but i've not first-hand experience |
| 21:01.06 | macnewbold | I've used Big O Tires before, and they were good too |
| 21:01.13 | macnewbold | even bent the rim on our spare back into shape |
| 21:06.38 | mgeary | i'm trying to craft a "find" command. i want to recursively retrieve all files in a directory that are NOT in .svn folders, that end with "pdf". Any tips? I'd prefer not to use grep as a filter... |
| 21:11.20 | jsmith | mgeary: Why not this: find . -name \*.pdf | grep -v \.svn |
| 21:11.42 | jsmith | What's wrong with grep? |
| 21:11.58 | mgeary | nothing, just didn't want to use 2 tools when i could use 1 |
| 21:12.28 | mgeary | but thanks, that'll do. wasn't familiar with the -v option for grep |
| 21:13.30 | jsmith | OK.... hold on... I'll do it in one |
| 21:18.08 | mgeary | no worries |
| 21:18.13 | mgeary | don't hurt yourself... ;) |
| 21:18.57 | jsmith | Sorry... trying to juggle two phone calls and do the regex in my head |
| 21:19.13 | Lone_Wanderer | Don't hurt yours... oh, someone already said that. |
| 21:19.19 | jsmith | I'll leave it up to someone smarter than me and show me the regex I can use in: find . -regex <foo> |
| 21:19.41 | mgeary | i know you can use ! in find |
| 21:19.53 | mgeary | but i cannot get -path to work as i understand it should |
| 21:20.18 | mgeary | my thinking was along the lines of: find . -name .pdf ! -path .svn |
| 21:25.57 | jsmith | find . -iregex '.*\.pdf' ! -iregex '.*\.svn/.*' |
| 21:26.03 | jsmith | There you go |
| 21:26.07 | jsmith | My brain can rest now |
| 21:26.53 | mgeary | very nice. thanks. i didn't know that iregex operated on the entire path |
| 21:27.45 | mindjuju | "i am Nitro! ... my brain is bigger than yours!" - that beats the heck out of any RATM lyrics! |
| 21:47.20 | *** join/#uphpu timinator_ (n=timinato@67.171.118.199) |
| 21:53.38 | *** join/#uphpu beandog_ (n=sdibb@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 21:53.57 | beandog_ | hawoo |
| 21:55.28 | mindjuju | hawoo ? |
| 21:56.21 | Lone_Wanderer | Hey, beandog_, when are y'all going out to the salt flats to drive at breakneck speeds? |
| 21:56.32 | beandog_ | the 17th |
| 21:56.57 | beandog_ | you gonna come? |
| 21:57.06 | Lone_Wanderer | yes |
| 21:57.12 | beandog_ | sweet, what you driving |
| 21:57.31 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, either my oldanbusted 99 Mystique (it's actually decent) or a rented sports car. |
| 21:58.16 | Lone_Wanderer | But I'm not sure if they'd like me driving their rented sexymachine on the salt flats. |
| 21:58.16 | beandog_ | heh |
| 21:58.17 | beandog_ | yah I was wondering about that too. |
| 21:58.17 | Lone_Wanderer | I'll probably just stick with my own car |
| 21:58.17 | beandog_ | what make is a Mystique? |
| 21:58.17 | Lone_Wanderer | Mercury, it's just like a Ford something or other |
| 21:58.23 | beandog_ | oh okay |
| 21:58.24 | beandog_ | right on |
| 21:58.24 | Lone_Wanderer | only it doesn't have the Ford name on it, so I don't have to kill myself for owning it |
| 21:58.30 | beandog_ | heh |
| 21:58.44 | beandog_ | its really fun, since the flats are so wide |
| 21:58.48 | beandog_ | something like 11 miles across |
| 21:58.52 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 21:58.53 | beandog_ | and you can just drive and drive and drive |
| 21:59.06 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah, it'd be fun to see how hard I can corner and things without spinning out |
| 21:59.17 | Lone_Wanderer | in an environment that I don't need to worry about crashing in |
| 21:59.22 | beandog_ | yah |
| 21:59.26 | Utah_Dave | I know "SELECT * " is frowned upon for performance reasons, and you should specify which columns you actually need. |
| 21:59.29 | Lone_Wanderer | although, is cornering too hard potentially bad for things? |
| 21:59.30 | beandog_ | plus you go even just a little bit out and you cant see anyone |
| 21:59.30 | Utah_Dave | But what if you do actually need to retrieve all of the columns? Is is still faster to specify each column name in the query? |
| 21:59.46 | beandog_ | Utah_Dave: no, its not faster |
| 22:00.03 | Lone_Wanderer | Utah_Dave: I would suspect that it's slower, as specifying the names makes it th ink it's not grabbing them all right up front. |
| 22:00.07 | Lone_Wanderer | But maybe it makes no difference. |
| 22:00.18 | Lone_Wanderer | Contour. It's the Mercury version of the Contour. |
| 22:00.21 | beandog_ | SELECTs are only going to be a problem if you are doing lots of joins and doing * |
| 22:00.23 | jsmith | It's been my experience that it's more efficient to show the column names yhou need |
| 22:00.25 | beandog_ | or if you dont have things properly indexed |
| 22:00.39 | jsmith | It makes the query planner eliminate a lot of unneeded indices |
| 22:00.48 | Utah_Dave | no joins, just one table. |
| 22:00.56 | Utah_Dave | OK, I'll type the column names all out then |
| 22:01.27 | Utah_Dave | thanks beandog Lone_Wanderer jsmith |
| 22:01.52 | jsmith | Utah_Dave: If you really do need all (or almost all) of the columns, then a * is fine |
| 22:01.57 | beandog_ | yah |
| 22:02.03 | Lone_Wanderer | beandog_: tidbit - the Mystique has been nicknamed the Mistake because of various problems plaguing it's marketing and hardware |
| 22:02.12 | beandog_ | its good to specify them though if you can |
| 22:02.19 | beandog_ | Lone_Wanderer: really? that sucks. |
| 22:02.54 | beandog_ | well youre supposed to have the schema memorized anyway, duh |
| 22:02.57 | beandog_ | :) |
| 22:03.07 | mgeary | dang. i always forget to do that |
| 22:03.36 | mgeary | i hope you did it BACKWARDS, so i can read it in a mirror |
| 22:03.39 | Lone_Wanderer | beandog_: It's a good car, handles well, and is "fast" for a family sedan, but there were a few recalls for it and they didn't position it well in the market. It cost almost as much as the next car up, but was not much larger than the next car down. |
| 22:03.41 | mgeary | doh!! |
| 22:05.24 | beandog_ | theyre cool looking and fast |
| 22:05.30 | Lone_Wanderer | mmkay |
| 22:05.41 | Lone_Wanderer | I used to know a girl whose AIM name was Tsubieracer |
| 22:05.43 | beandog_ | http://www.autobischof.ch/images-2005-audi/2005-09-Audi-TT-Coupe-autobischof-800x479.jpg |
| 22:05.44 | Lone_Wanderer | She was a car nut. |
| 22:05.47 | beandog_ | theres a TT |
| 22:05.58 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh, nice |
| 22:06.10 | Lone_Wanderer | not blatantly sporty, no idiotic spoiler that's larger than the car itself |
| 22:07.10 | beandog_ | http://www.cherryhilltriplex.com/franchises/cherry_hill_mitsubishi/images/eclipse.jpg |
| 22:07.19 | beandog_ | ^^ somewhat crappy picture of a new Eclipse |
| 22:08.41 | Lone_Wanderer | http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/cc/images/95impala_ss-1.jpg |
| 22:09.10 | beandog_ | heh |
| 22:09.12 | beandog_ | Lone_Wanderer: nice |
| 22:09.19 | Lone_Wanderer | They're huge |
| 22:09.26 | Lone_Wanderer | with a correspondingly large engine |
| 22:09.39 | beandog_ | we used to have a station wagon growing up |
| 22:09.43 | beandog_ | one of those old school ones |
| 22:09.47 | beandog_ | that sucker had a v8 in there |
| 22:09.50 | beandog_ | *that* was fast. |
| 22:09.50 | Lone_Wanderer | lol yeah, so did we. a caprice. |
| 22:10.13 | Lone_Wanderer | was it the 5.7, or the smaller I don't remember what size they were engine? |
| 22:10.21 | beandog_ | I dunno |
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| 22:50.03 | mindjuju | hey macnewbold |
| 22:50.57 | mindjuju | utah_dave |
| 22:51.22 | Utah_Dave | what's up, mindjuju? |
| 22:52.03 | mindjuju | hey, when you bought those tires at discount tires, did you buy that certificate for free replacement at 17.00 per tire? |
| 22:52.35 | mindjuju | looks like an extended warranty, but for tires |
| 22:52.45 | mindjuju | eh, i think i'll be cheap today and skip it |
| 22:52.53 | Utah_Dave | I did buy the extended warranty. I'm not sure exactly how much I paid for it |
| 22:53.15 | mindjuju | you did? hmmm... maybe i SHOULD buy it |
| 22:53.25 | Utah_Dave | supposedly they're replace the tires no matter what happens as long as the tire has tread |
| 22:53.26 | macnewbold | hi mindjuju |
| 22:53.35 | Utah_Dave | s/they're/they'll |
| 22:53.36 | mindjuju | yeah, that's what i was reading |
| 22:53.44 | mindjuju | macnewbold, was going to ask you the same question too |
| 22:53.45 | macnewbold | yeah, that's the replacement warranty |
| 22:53.56 | mindjuju | did you get the replacement warranty when you went to discount tire |
| 22:53.59 | Utah_Dave | and they'll rotate and do flat repair for free too |
| 22:53.59 | macnewbold | my tires were about $80 each and $12/tire for the replacement warranty |
| 22:54.08 | macnewbold | earlier ones were $70 + $10/tire |
| 22:54.23 | macnewbold | I guess for bigger more expensive tires, the replacement is more per tire |
| 22:54.28 | Utah_Dave | I took down my other car and they fixed a slow leak on it even though I had bought the tires for the other car |
| 22:54.33 | macnewbold | how about this, mindjuju: just get the $17 policy on one tire :-D |
| 22:54.39 | mindjuju | dataw0lf, do you want to opine on tire warranties? |
| 22:55.02 | mindjuju | yeah, i wonder what' they'd do |
| 22:55.03 | dataw0lf | mindjuju: I just buy the most expensive tires from Costco *shrug* |
| 22:55.24 | mindjuju | i looked at costco, they only sell michelin and takes 5 days |
| 22:55.36 | macnewbold | yeah, the rotation, flat repair, balancing, etc are handy - but remember on the flat repair, that if there's any sidewall damage or a puncture bigger than 1/4" they'll make you replace it completely, at either the cost of a new tire (1/4 of what you're paying today), |
| 22:55.43 | dataw0lf | I usually gauge my performance based on price. Bad idea, I know, but I don't know enough about cars, nor care enough to really invest time in investigation. |
| 22:55.46 | macnewbold | or $10+$17 if you buy that cert. for each tire |
| 22:55.53 | dataw0lf | I trust Costco for that. |
| 22:56.31 | macnewbold | mindjuju: also, the longer the warranty on the tires (i.e. mileage rating), the more likely you'll have an irreparable flat during that time, and usually the more expensive the tire too |
| 22:56.46 | mindjuju | yeah, the tires are 126 a piece |
| 22:56.48 | mindjuju | yuck |
| 22:57.07 | macnewbold | on my last set I had to replace 2 tires of the four (or was it 3 and one of the replacements had to be replaced) |
| 22:57.15 | macnewbold | $17*4 = $58, right? |
| 22:57.33 | mindjuju | yeah |
| 22:57.38 | macnewbold | so if you've got a 50% chance of replacing at least one tire in the that many miles, oyu'll save money with the certificates |
| 22:57.38 | mindjuju | but i'm only buying 2 wheels today |
| 22:57.42 | macnewbold | ah, okay |
| 22:57.50 | mindjuju | but still, your logic follows |
| 22:57.59 | mindjuju | i'll be buying the other 2 in like 4 months |
| 22:58.42 | macnewbold | actually it would be $17*4 ($58) is the cost up front, then $17+10=$27 is the cost at the time of replacement, to replace one tire, and an additional $27 per tire for each add'l tire replaced |
| 22:59.08 | *** topic/#UPHPU by thebigdog -> Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org | Call For Papers - Utah Open Source Conference |
| 22:59.13 | macnewbold | also, remember that in a four wheel drive vehicle (or all-wheel drive) they'll make you replace all the tires if there's more than 1/8" difference in the tread :( |
| 22:59.33 | macnewbold | they have to keep equal tread on all the drive-axle tires, or all 4 in those cases |
| 22:59.53 | macnewbold | and they won't use the replacement certs for replacing the 3 that weren't damaged, you have to replace them at full price :( |
| 23:00.07 | mindjuju | yuck! |
| 23:00.07 | macnewbold | unless they get damaged too ;) |
| 23:00.19 | macnewbold | yeah, very yuck - my parents had to buy like 3 sets for their van |
| 23:00.33 | macnewbold | though I think they ought to pro-rate them due to the warranty, but you'd better check on that too |
| 23:00.50 | macnewbold | 3 full sets of tires when they should have only needed one set to last for that many miles |
| 23:01.24 | macnewbold | I guess he doesn't like tire talk... |
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| 23:34.42 | *** part/#uphpu bradym (n=bradym@bradym.agsci.usu.edu) |
| 23:59.22 | beandog_ | ugh |
| 23:59.34 | beandog_ | I cant remember the differences between MyISAM and InnoDB |
| 23:59.44 | Lone_Wanderer | You want InnoDB. |
| 23:59.49 | Lone_Wanderer | That's how I remember it. |
| 23:59.52 | beandog_ | aside from fulltext indexes and transactions |
| 23:59.52 | beandog_ | he |
| 23:59.53 | beandog_ | heh |
