| 00:58.26 | mindjuju | ~rlart |
| 00:58.59 | mindjuju | weird. that's like the third tierra hit from a rlart today |
| 01:09.49 | tierra | jbot just hates me |
| 01:10.16 | tierra | I notice he really likes throwing CDs at me for some reason |
| 01:17.43 | mindjuju | yup |
| 02:06.04 | *** join/#uphpu RyanE_ (i=Piadas@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 13:21.30 | *** join/#uphpu RyanE (i=Piadas@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 13:36.59 | *** join/#uphpu RyanE_ (i=Piadas@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 14:05.10 | *** join/#uphpu wps (n=wps@64.72.210.10) |
| 14:05.10 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 14:09.13 | *** join/#uphpu xilch|w (n=xilch@66.236.72.101.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 14:18.51 | mindjuju | ~rlart |
| 14:22.25 | mindjuju | anybody around? |
| 14:24.00 | synic | yup |
| 14:24.23 | mindjuju | just wanted to take a quick poll to see what languages people were writing web services in |
| 14:24.41 | synic | web services such as? |
| 14:25.51 | mindjuju | instead of specifing all the web services possible, let's just say a web service that collects variables runs a database query and returns results |
| 14:26.21 | synic | ah. Unfortunately, we use perl. |
| 14:26.48 | mindjuju | if you had your choice, what language would it be in? |
| 14:27.04 | synic | python or ruby |
| 14:29.59 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 14:54.07 | mindjuju | anybody know if the visibone stuff came in or will it be in for next meet? |
| 15:01.52 | macnewbold | mindjuju: it hasn't shown up yet, though it might today I guess |
| 15:01.56 | macnewbold | sending email shortly |
| 15:02.31 | mindjuju | that's ok, i know it was a big order and it's not your fault since you kept on getting tons of orders, even on the last day |
| 15:02.34 | mindjuju | was just wondering |
| 15:11.42 | *** join/#uphpu _psychic_ (n=_psychic@71.32.228.156) |
| 15:45.35 | xilch|w | I work with synic, and so perl also |
| 15:45.39 | xilch|w | migrating to python |
| 15:46.35 | xilch|w | but synic hates life, that's why he's so sad that we use perl right now |
| 15:47.06 | *** join/#uphpu synic_ (n=squish@66.236.72.104.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 16:05.10 | macnewbold | mindjuju: on your web services poll: I'd use PHP |
| 16:26.27 | bigdog_ut | poll: python or java |
| 16:29.02 | synic_ | python! |
| 16:29.12 | bigdog_ut | statement for me |
| 16:29.35 | _psychic_ | java-- php++ |
| 16:38.08 | drip | ~lart bigdog_ut |
| 17:12.14 | bigdog_ut | ~lart drip |
| 17:12.30 | bigdog_ut | ~pimpslap drip |
| 17:12.31 | jbot | bigdog_ut pimpslaps drip. ouch! |
| 17:13.35 | drip | careful I'm fragile. |
| 17:14.09 | bigdog_ut | i know you are |
| 17:14.28 | bigdog_ut | can i just say how much i hate myfaces sometimes |
| 17:14.39 | drip | oh yeah? |
| 17:14.48 | drip | sounds like a bundle of joy. |
| 17:14.52 | bigdog_ut | actually i hate how it adds the context to everything |
| 17:15.13 | bigdog_ut | has some apache+tomcat issues that i was dealing with |
| 17:15.21 | bigdog_ut | turned out to be myfaces issue |
| 17:15.26 | drip | nice |
| 17:15.49 | bigdog_ut | so i had to redo the tomcat deploy for virtual hosting with apache vhosts |
| 17:15.54 | bigdog_ut | works killer though now |
| 17:16.38 | bigdog_ut | when you inviting me over for the the other pink meat - salmon |
| 17:16.58 | macnewbold | hehe |
| 17:17.16 | bigdog_ut | fish is so good |
| 17:17.50 | macnewbold | I usually like various kinds of whitefish better, but salmon is really good too |
| 17:17.52 | drip | I've had people who hate fish asking for seconds on my salmon |
| 17:17.52 | drip | =) |
| 17:17.59 | macnewbold | is that an offer? |
| 17:18.04 | macnewbold | cause bigdog_ut won't hesitate... |
| 17:18.08 | drip | lol |
| 17:18.09 | bigdog_ut | no doubt |
| 17:18.29 | drip | too bad they dropped our limits this year |
| 17:18.30 | macnewbold | we're bbq'ing tonight, but I don't think it's fish |
| 17:18.33 | drip | =/ |
| 17:19.10 | bigdog_ut | :( |
| 17:21.39 | _psychic_ | BBQ salmon is heaven on earth |
| 17:22.02 | bigdog_ut | as is smoked tooo |
| 17:22.13 | bigdog_ut | ~fishslap wps |
| 17:22.14 | jbot | ACTION slaps wps up side the head with a wet fish. |
| 17:22.22 | bigdog_ut | nice jbot |
| 17:22.30 | wps | sick |
| 17:22.37 | wps | now I am going to stink all day because fish touched me |
| 17:22.38 | _psychic_ | even cooked fish you don't like? |
| 17:22.55 | wps | fish is the stinkiest stuff on the planet |
| 17:23.02 | wps | nasty, nasty, nasty |
| 17:23.06 | macnewbold | no, old/rotten fish is much worse than normal fish |
| 17:23.16 | macnewbold | decomposing flesh of any kind is worse than fish |
| 17:23.27 | macnewbold | especially once it gets the flies and maggots on it |
| 17:23.28 | wps | my mother cooks salmon and it stinks up the entire house for days |
| 17:23.52 | _psychic_ | don't like sushi either, I take it. |
| 17:26.49 | _psychic_ | makizushi is good |
| 17:26.59 | _psychic_ | not too hot on the super-fishy kinds as much |
| 17:27.11 | _psychic_ | but bigdog_ut is right: smoked salmon is pretty good stuff |
| 17:39.34 | *** join/#uphpu synic_ (n=squish@66.236.72.104.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 18:13.33 | *** join/#uphpu mindjuju (n=Administ@65-121-75-195.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 18:16.05 | mindjuju | macnewbold |
| 18:16.23 | mindjuju | i can serve as distribution point for Utah County if you need help |
| 18:16.35 | mindjuju | i'm 5 minutes from the linux networx building |
| 18:17.03 | mindjuju | plus i'm glad to announce that accounts payable just handed me a crisp check with money for you so i'll have mine tonight |
| 18:22.06 | macnewbold | k |
| 18:38.58 | *** part/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 18:43.50 | _psychic_ | why is that job announcements never have the salary range included? |
| 18:43.57 | _psychic_ | that's the first thing people want to know... |
| 18:44.31 | macnewbold | hehe |
| 18:44.40 | macnewbold | yeah, and the last things employers want to admit |
| 18:44.52 | _psychic_ | at least give a ballpark |
| 18:44.59 | _psychic_ | even if you plan to hand people the bottom level |
| 18:45.14 | macnewbold | the problem, from an employer's standpoint, is if you give a higher range, everyone jumps on it, even if they're not qualified |
| 18:45.22 | macnewbold | cause they want the money |
| 18:45.24 | _psychic_ | salary is the biggest discerning characteristic |
| 18:45.30 | macnewbold | yeah, I think so too |
| 18:45.37 | macnewbold | I make my partner put them in every announcement we send out |
| 18:46.45 | _psychic_ | he was impressive |
| 18:49.15 | macnewbold | my partner? how so? |
| 18:49.33 | _psychic_ | he seemed like he was in tune to what developers like |
| 18:49.40 | _psychic_ | but also had the business saavy |
| 18:49.48 | _psychic_ | savvy, rather : |
| 18:50.11 | macnewbold | yeah, after 5 years working with me, he hears a developer's perspective quite frequently |
| 18:50.27 | _psychic_ | :) |
| 18:50.28 | macnewbold | he's more interested in the business side though |
| 18:50.35 | _psychic_ | and that's probably good |
| 18:50.41 | macnewbold | yeah, it makes a good match most of the time |
| 18:50.47 | _psychic_ | i bet |
| 18:51.12 | macnewbold | yeah, cause he gets stuck with the tasks none of the developers want to handle |
| 18:51.21 | macnewbold | working with bothersome clients and such |
| 18:51.22 | macnewbold | :) |
| 18:51.30 | macnewbold | not that we have many like that, but a few from time to time |
| 18:53.09 | _psychic_ | there's always some of those |
| 18:53.40 | macnewbold | how are things going for you? |
| 18:53.44 | mindjuju | wait! clients with unreasonable expectations? |
| 18:53.49 | mindjuju | who ever heard of that? |
| 18:54.01 | macnewbold | you must be in the wrong business, mindjuju... everyone's doing it |
| 18:54.49 | mindjuju | you mean you can't run a webserver and database on the same 386 computer with an estimated 1000 hits per hour? |
| 18:55.17 | macnewbold | 1000 per hour, sure |
| 18:55.26 | macnewbold | 1000 per min, probably not |
| 18:56.32 | mindjuju | do you really think a 386 could handle it? |
| 18:57.11 | mindjuju | i've never had anything less than a P2 since i've been doing web dev |
| 19:01.37 | macnewbold | a 386? I know people who use them for their home firewall and such |
| 19:01.54 | macnewbold | I've got a 500mhz box at home as a web/ssh/file server |
| 19:02.12 | macnewbold | it can't handle windows (too bloated) but does fine with FreeBSD |
| 19:02.25 | macnewbold | but yeah, a 386 might not take it |
| 19:02.30 | macnewbold | they're under 50mhz |
| 19:02.50 | mindjuju | yeah, you scared me there for a sec |
| 19:03.16 | mindjuju | ugh, i'm hungry for chinese food |
| 19:03.23 | mindjuju | but don't want to leave the office |
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| 19:19.51 | *** join/#uphpu macnewbold (n=mac@69.2.248.251) |
| 19:19.51 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o macnewbold] by ChanServ |
| 19:41.30 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
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| 20:50.10 | mindjuju | who gonna get the lart? |
| 20:50.13 | mindjuju | ~rlart |
| 20:50.34 | mindjuju | the fates have spoken |
| 20:50.45 | beandog | probably gonna get me for all the DVD ripping |
| 20:51.10 | mindjuju | dvd ripping should fall under fair use |
| 20:51.29 | mindjuju | or they should make it not so easy to scratch |
| 20:51.47 | beandog | Actually scratching DVDs have always been the least of my problems. |
| 20:52.03 | beandog | but then again, I dont have kids |
| 20:52.05 | beandog | or pets. |
| 20:52.18 | mindjuju | ah, that explains it |
| 20:52.49 | beandog | At the very least, Im breaking the "license" on the DVD |
| 20:52.55 | beandog | Since I'm making a reproduction in part or whole. |
| 20:53.25 | beandog | But, if they wanna force closed firmware down my throat that makes me watch 17 minutes of commercials Disney's Tween Twit of the Year |
| 20:53.29 | beandog | then Im taking drastic measures. |
| 20:53.32 | mindjuju | actually, i *think* in that case, you backing up your DVD electronicaly for your use is considered Fair Use |
| 20:53.39 | mindjuju | but don't quote me on that yet |
| 20:53.45 | mindjuju | i'll see if i can find where I saw it |
| 20:53.47 | beandog | Yah, Ive heard both ways. |
| 20:55.41 | *** part/#uphpu brasto (n=brasto@71-36-67-124.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 20:56.42 | mindjuju | i know that the RIAA isn't a big fan of fair use |
| 20:57.02 | beandog | Well, they can go screw themselves too. |
| 20:57.22 | beandog | Im unconventional though. I *only* buy CDs, so all this fair use DRM rights garbage doesnt hassle me as far as audio goes. |
| 20:57.51 | beandog | That is, it doesnt affect me directly. |
| 20:58.13 | macnewbold | I think they've always found that a single backup copy falls under fair use |
| 20:58.27 | mindjuju | and the crazy thing, as a far as Microsoft is concerned, if you buy a computer from Dell, and it catches fire and goes down in a blaze of glory, if you build a new box, your not suppose to transfer the license from the dead crispy box to the new box |
| 20:58.31 | mindjuju | that's absolutely nuts |
| 20:59.07 | beandog | Ive resorted to cracking my *purchased* license of Windows because Im getting sick of calling <random country> everytime I reinstall to get a freaking sixty-char key. |
| 21:00.04 | macnewbold | see, now when there's competition, inflicting pain and suffering like that tends to send your users to your competitors |
| 21:00.20 | macnewbold | and many are moving to osx, but not that many |
| 21:00.32 | mindjuju | you know, they should write an Elseworld comic of What if Bill Gates liked poetry instead |
| 21:00.41 | mindjuju | and it was just Steve Jobs |
| 21:00.47 | beandog | I cant even remember the last time I used windows on a regular basis. At home, that is. |
| 21:00.53 | beandog | Mmm ..... *warm fuzzies* |
| 21:05.28 | wps | macnewbold: I am proud of you |
| 21:05.35 | wps | I noticed that gradefix is XHTML strict |
| 21:05.37 | wps | you're a good man |
| 21:06.03 | *** topic/#UPHPU by wps -> meeting tonight @ 7: Internationalization and localization | Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org |
| 21:06.20 | macnewbold | wps: some of it is :) |
| 21:06.28 | mindjuju | wow! wps is doing site inspections on uphpu members! |
| 21:06.33 | macnewbold | I'm not the only one doing html/css on it unfortunately |
| 21:07.22 | macnewbold | one of the guys is an html/css idealist/purist who has divitis and doesn't know what a flexible layout is, wants to put fixed widths/heights on everything, etc. |
| 21:07.28 | beandog | i18n |
| 21:08.22 | wps | html/css idealist/purist != coder with divitis |
| 21:08.48 | wps | those are contradictory demeanors |
| 21:09.11 | wps | I am so sick of people jumping on the "CSS" bandwagon and getting divitis |
| 21:09.12 | wps | ug |
| 21:09.34 | beandog | divitis? |
| 21:09.41 | wps | ~divitis |
| 21:10.44 | mindjuju | divits means you wrap EVERYTHING into DIVS for no good reason |
| 21:10.50 | beandog | oh |
| 21:10.58 | wps | divitis is when people forget how to code semantically and only use divs |
| 21:11.24 | wps | which _works_, but is bad |
| 21:11.41 | wps | it is technically possible only use divs… and to then declare _everything_ in your style sheet |
| 21:11.52 | wps | but then the code is impossible to read and has no defaults |
| 21:24.09 | Utah_Dave | how was the exam, _psychic__? |
| 21:24.37 | _psychic__ | not bad |
| 21:24.41 | _psychic__ | some nit-picky questions |
| 21:24.43 | _psychic__ | but I passed |
| 21:25.11 | _psychic__ | I don't do stream stuff much, so I think I missed those ones |
| 21:25.17 | _psychic__ | but the rest I had some clue on |
| 21:26.12 | Utah_Dave | how much do they charge to take it? |
| 21:26.18 | _psychic__ | dunno |
| 21:26.27 | _psychic__ | Company paid for it |
| 21:29.21 | drip | have a good weekend everyone |
| 21:37.12 | Utah_Dave | thank goodness for CSS |
| 21:37.33 | _psychic__ | agreed |
| 21:37.44 | Utah_Dave | a co-worker and I have been creating an intranet/portal for work |
| 21:37.47 | _psychic__ | (have a long weekend, drip) |
| 21:38.35 | Utah_Dave | I spent about 2 hours today integrating an old php app I wrote a couple of years ago, and luckily I was able to edit the CSS to match the fit and feel of the new portal. |
| 21:39.08 | Utah_Dave | it would have been a 2 week project otherwise |
| 21:40.36 | _psychic__ | nice |
| 21:44.37 | *** join/#uphpu synic (n=squish@pdpc/supporter/student/synic) |
| 22:15.40 | Utah_Dave | see you all at the meeting. |
| 22:15.43 | *** part/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 22:30.44 | *** join/#uphpu bradym (i=bradym@bradym.agsci.usu.edu) |
| 22:56.30 | _psychic__ | anyone good at php inheritance? |
| 22:56.39 | _psychic__ | I want to skip a middleman given a global value |
| 23:12.44 | macnewbold | _psychic__: so you're in a class that inherits from a class, and you want to access a global from within its methods? |
| 23:56.12 | macnewbold | anyone in here still that will be at the meeting tonight? RyanE_? mindjuju? anyone? |
| 23:56.58 | mindjuju | i am |
| 23:58.29 | macnewbold | will you apologize for me for being absent? I'm not going to be able to make it |
| 23:58.36 | mindjuju | will do |
| 23:58.41 | mindjuju | what about your money? |
| 23:58.46 | macnewbold | but if you or someone else (fungus if he's there) wants to accept money for visibone, that would be cool |
| 23:58.50 | macnewbold | I don't have anything to deliver yet, |
| 23:58.59 | macnewbold | so I'll probably be seeing everyone then too |
| 23:59.06 | macnewbold | but some were going to come give money this time |
| 23:59.19 | mindjuju | i'll just mail it directly |
| 23:59.22 | macnewbold | if you accept it for me, I'll come by and pick it up from you or something |
| 23:59.29 | mindjuju | can do that oo |
| 23:59.34 | mindjuju | s/oo/too |