| 00:00.06 | landley | Combination Linux expo and science fiction convention. |
| 00:00.56 | landley | Year 1: Terry Pratchett's and Rob Malda of slashdot lost a quake deathmatch to Pete Abrams of sluggy freelance and Illiad of user friendly. |
| 00:01.02 | landley | Still hard to top that... |
| 00:01.15 | landley | (there was a word "team" in there that got lost...) |
| 00:03.09 | solar | SpanKY: http://geekz.co.uk/schneierfacts/ |
| 00:09.33 | landley | solar: yes, we were pondering printing some of those in the program book. |
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| 06:17.08 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17238 10buildroot/package/xorg/ (Config.in xorg-config.patch xorg.mk): more updates to ensure subsequent packages build |
| 06:17.25 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17239 10buildroot/package/ (6 files in 2 dirs): Add pango |
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| 07:25.03 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17240 10buildroot/package/expat/expat.mk: fix dependancies and install paths |
| 07:25.30 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17241 10buildroot/package/jpeg/jpeg.mk: be explicit about not doing X |
| 07:26.03 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17242 10buildroot/package/libpng/libpng.mk: be explicit about not depending on X, dep should go the other way |
| 07:27.39 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17243 10buildroot/package/ (Config.in tiff/ tiff/Config.in tiff/tiff.mk): add tiff package |
| 07:36.01 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17244 10buildroot/package/cairo/cairo.mk: fix build deps |
| 07:36.46 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17245 10buildroot/package/pango/pango.mk: use a slightly more sensible dep, strip the correct library names |
| 07:44.15 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17246 10buildroot/package/ (Config.in atk/ atk/Config.in atk/atk.mk): add atk package |
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| 08:42.38 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17247 10buildroot/package/ (19 files in 2 dirs): add Gtk+ version 2 |
| 08:45.29 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17248 10buildroot/package/cairo/cairo.mk: it seems pdf and ps support are required for gtk2 |
| 10:38.12 | CIA-10 | 03andersen * r17249 10buildroot/package/xorg/ (mcookie.c xorg.mk): a copy of mcookie will come in handy... |
| 11:32.17 | whirm | hi all |
| 12:38.04 | *** join/#uclibc sjhill (n=sjhill@real.realitydiluted.com) |
| 13:39.58 | whirm | I need UCLIBC_HAS_LOCALE enabled in uclib to be able to build dbus, what's the "right way" to check for it/enable it if dbus is selected BR2_PACKAGE_DBUS is enabled? |
| 13:40.34 | whirm | should I grep for it in the dbus makefile and add the optiond,rebuild uclibc, etc...? |
| 13:40.47 | whirm | or there's a cleaner way? |
| 13:43.17 | blindvt` | dbus has to cope with locale support turned off. If it doesn't then you have to fix it (turning on locale support just because dbus is broken is not a reasonable solution) |
| 13:45.08 | whirm | pufff, that can't be easy to do :-/ |
| 13:45.48 | blindvt` | very exciting. compilation took about 9.5 hours, now it's starting the final linking.. *holds thumbs* |
| 13:47.22 | whirm | blindvt: compiling X? |
| 13:49.13 | blindvt` | nope, that'd take about 20 minutes |
| 13:49.35 | whirm | then ooffice? |
| 13:49.37 | whirm | XDDD |
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| 15:53.43 | whirm | dbus needs iconv.h |
| 15:54.12 | whirm | and I only can use iconv.h from uclibc if I enable locales at compile time :-( |
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| 16:07.02 | solar | work around it. make dbus no longer need it :) |
| 16:07.32 | *** join/#uclibc rob____ (i=rw@217.22.94.106) |
| 16:07.40 | rob____ | hello |
| 16:13.22 | whirm | solar: I just saw that dbus doesn't need iconv.h but libxml2 does, buildroot includes /usr/include/libxml2/libxml/encoding.h (yup, from the host system) |
| 16:13.46 | whirm | and this header is the one that includes iconv.h |
| 16:17.04 | sjhill | whirm: i am reaching a point where i can submit the buildroot changes for dbus |
| 16:17.10 | sjhill | i had to upgrade and merge |
| 16:17.32 | sjhill | udev is also being changed |
| 16:18.11 | whirm | sjhill: great! |
| 16:18.22 | whirm | then Ill drop the attempt |
| 16:18.37 | whirm | when do you think the changes will be up? |
| 16:19.57 | sjhill | tonight |
| 16:20.32 | whirm | ok, then Ill continue coding other stuff. ;-) |
| 16:23.56 | solar | whirm: I got both libxml2 and dbus installed in a uClibc devel env which has no locales/iconv/nls support |
| 16:25.18 | whirm | solar: yes, but buildroot is including my local libxml2 headers, i supose because I have not libxml2 in buildroot env.... |
| 16:26.18 | solar | perhaps.. either way just letting you know what you want can be accomplished without the bloat |
| 16:26.21 | rob____ | how do i go about compiling busybox against uclibc? I've compiled and installed uclibc and have configured busybox 1.3.1 how i'd like it but when i run make it / |
| 16:26.39 | rob____ | attempts to link against glibc |
| 16:27.24 | solar | the suggested normal method is to use buildroot for such things |
| 16:27.51 | whirm | solar: Ill wait for sjhill commit and continue my work from there, now I'm reinventing the wheel, and I'm doing it worse than the first :-) |
| 16:28.16 | rob____ | buildroot uses busybox 1.2.2.1 |
| 16:30.12 | solar | buildroot is a series of Makefiles that the end user can edit as he/she sees fit |
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| 16:45.05 | rob____ | i'd prefer not to use the buildroot scripts as im not exactly sure how they work |
| 16:46.40 | landley | rob: What are you trying to accomplish? |
| 16:46.52 | rob____ | following this guide: http://gentoo-wiki.com/SECURITY_System_Encryption_DM-Crypt_with_LUKS#Creating_initramfs_image |
| 16:47.10 | rob____ | i dont have this option in menuconfig for busybox: (/usr/i386-linux-uclibc/bin/i386-uclibc-) Cross Compiler prefix |
| 16:47.23 | rob____ | which seems to be the only thing related to uclibc and busybox in this article |
| 16:50.25 | CIA-10 | 03vda * r17250 10busybox/ (5 files in 4 dirs): |
| 16:50.25 | CIA-10 | ipv6-ization efforts continue. Few bugs are found, |
| 16:50.25 | CIA-10 | unknown number likely introduced... |
| 16:51.22 | CIA-10 | 03vda * r17251 10busybox/ (4 files in 2 dirs): fix verbose output; remove commented-out includes. |
| 16:51.25 | rob____ | i cant find any documentation what-so-ever on compiling busybox against uclibc on a glibc system |
| 16:51.53 | rob____ | which is wierd since most people would be in the same situation as me - wanting to compile busybox on a glibc system |
| 16:52.41 | rob____ | ive tried modifying the Makefile as follows: HOSTCFLAGS = -Wall -Wstrict-prototypes -O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -I/usr/i386-linux-uclibc/usr/include /usr/i386-linux-uclibc/usr/lib/libc.a -nodefaultlibs -static -static-libgcc |
| 16:52.48 | rob____ | but this didnt seem to help |
| 16:52.50 | Bertl | AFAIK, the uclibc developers suggest to use the buildroot stuff |
| 16:53.14 | Bertl | which provides the entire uclibc toolchains and libraries |
| 16:53.43 | Bertl | (if you succeed to create the buildroot or find one to download, that is :) |
| 16:53.46 | rob____ | ive built buildroot but by default it seems to use an old version of busybox |
| 16:54.16 | Bertl | you can select the versions in the config, IIRC |
| 16:54.44 | Bertl | and you could download a specific version yourself and compile it _inside_ |
| 16:55.24 | rob____ | ah ok :) |
| 16:55.27 | rob____ | i think i see now |
| 16:56.52 | rob____ | the problem i have is |
| 16:57.14 | rob____ | i want to configure busybox using menuconfig to set some specific options |
| 16:57.21 | rob____ | but when you make buildroot it seems to automatically do this |
| 16:58.21 | whirm | rob____: use make busybox-menuconfig |
| 16:59.41 | rob____ | excellent, thanks |
| 17:01.00 | whirm | rob____: but thake in account that the config file is in the source tree, so if you change busybox version you will have to copy it to the new dir |
| 17:02.29 | rob____ | thanks for the advice! |
| 17:07.19 | Mirell | info rob____ |
| 17:07.23 | Mirell | Ack. |
| 17:07.39 | Mirell | Stupid wrong window and tab completion and... |
| 17:11.58 | landley | rob: I've got a build system of my own that creates a cross compiler you can use to build uClibc stuff on x86. |
| 17:12.07 | landley | http://landley.net/hg/firmware |
| 17:20.04 | CIA-10 | 03vda * r17252 10busybox/ (48 files in 19 dirs): Trailing whitespace removal over entire tree |
| 17:20.09 | solar | rob____: if using gentoo the suggested method is to use crossdev to build a proper cross compiler then either cross compile busybox or simp;y just grab the current uclibc-stageball and build in a chroot |
| 17:20.28 | solar | depending on the arch |
| 17:20.36 | rob____ | im not using gentoo, its an LFS system im developing |
| 17:21.26 | rob____ | i think if i use the buildroot makefiles then I can make menuconfig;make busybox-menuconfig; make and just disregard everything apart from the busybox stuff i need |
| 17:21.54 | rob____ | i basically just need a statically compiled busybox executable |
| 17:22.30 | rob____ | and since it wont compile against glibc i was faffing about trying to get it to compile with uclibc, but buildroot seems to take care of that |
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| 17:34.34 | landley | Sorry, I'm distracted in other windows... |
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| 17:35.28 | landley | You can download a cross compiler tarball (prebuilt) from the download directory of http://landley.net/code/firmware/downloads |
| 17:35.58 | landley | Grab cross-compiler-i686.tar.bz2, extract it, and add its' "bin" directory to your path. The use i686-gcc as your cross compiler. It'll build against uClibc. |
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| 17:36.19 | landley | haven't tried it on other Linux distros yet, I dunno if it depends against specific libc versions or some such from the ubuntu I built it on. |
| 17:36.29 | landley | (That's a function of the host toolchain, really.) |
| 17:36.44 | landley | If it does, you'll need to build it from source yourself. But try the binary first. |
| 17:37.55 | landley | With busybox you can go "make CONFIG_STATIC=y CROSS_COMPILE=i686-" |
| 17:38.16 | landley | With 1.2.2, anyway. Dunno about 1.3.0, they might have renamed CROSS_COMPILE to just CROSS when the new build system went in... |
| 17:40.04 | rob____ | i thought cross-compiling was just for building different architectures? |
| 17:45.20 | landley | rob: cross compiling means building something that won't run on the host. |
| 17:45.30 | landley | If you dynamically link and don't have uClibc installed on the host, it won't run. |
| 17:45.34 | landley | Therefore, we're cross compiling. |
| 17:45.53 | landley | Building i486 code on an i686 is also sort of cross compiling. |
| 17:46.12 | landley | It'll run on the host, but if you're not careful you'll leak i686 bits into what you're building, and then it won't run on a real 486. |
| 17:46.52 | landley | Basically, we're using a specially prepared compiler that does something specific, rather than the compiler your system comes with that does any old thing. |
| 17:47.14 | landley | This compiler outputs i686 code linked against uClibc. |
| 17:47.37 | landley | Using the headers and libraries and stuff contained in its directory, _NOT_ the stuff contained in /usr and /lib and such. |
| 17:48.42 | rob____ | ok, that what i originally thought but my lodger told me I was wrong! |
| 17:49.49 | rob____ | im going to come back to this tomorrow as i have to go out |
| 17:49.57 | landley | ok. |
| 17:50.00 | rob____ | but the stuff on your site looks interesting so i'll have a read tomorrow :) |
| 17:51.03 | landley | Let me know what you think. :) |
| 17:51.32 | rob____ | will do, what im doing is a continuation of a project i was doing at my old job |
| 17:51.40 | landley | Join the club. :) |
| 17:51.57 | rob____ | building a linux distribution build system based on the LFS project and netbsd pkgsrc |
| 17:52.14 | rob____ | mainly as a personal project but i've been thinking about documenting it recently |
| 17:52.37 | rob____ | ive just been trying to add encrypted filesystem stuff because its nerdy |
| 17:55.26 | Mirell | Speaking of encrypted filesystems, when I first got the MacBook, I went, "Oh, FileSafe! Encrypted home directory! Spiffy!" Then realized it was totally worthless. |
| 17:56.01 | rob____ | since someones just going to modify your binaries and do a man in the middle attack :) |
| 17:56.02 | Mirell | I used to have a Gentoo system though with encrypted swap and encrypted root partitions though. |
| 17:56.07 | Mirell | dm-crypt is marvelous for that. |
| 17:56.19 | rob____ | yeah, im using dm-crypt with LUKS |
| 17:56.34 | rob____ | im a bit skeptical of luks though, the bloke who writes it seems to be a bit mad |
| 17:56.41 | Mirell | Then my hard drive decided to slightly crash. |
| 17:56.48 | Mirell | Which is why I no longer encrypted my stuff. |
| 17:56.58 | rob____ | did you disable write caching? |
| 17:57.35 | rob____ | it shouldnt matter if your machine crashes |
| 17:58.13 | landley | rob: where do you get working dm-crypt source? The stuff I found was ancient and out of date. |
| 17:58.29 | landley | I want to add dm-crypt support to toybox, but the calls you make don't seem particularly documented... |
| 17:58.34 | rob____ | dm-crypt is in the kernel |
| 17:58.45 | landley | rob: I'm talking about the userspace utilities to use it. |
| 17:58.59 | landley | What command do you configure it via? |
| 17:59.07 | landley | dmsetup? |
| 17:59.25 | rob____ | http://luks.endorphin.org/dm-crypt |
| 17:59.29 | rob____ | cryptsetup |
| 17:59.51 | landley | Hmmm... I think I tried that one and couldn't get it to build on ubuntu, but I'll try again. Thanks. |
| 18:00.07 | rob____ | it compiled ok here |
| 18:00.34 | rob____ | yep, just checked |
| 18:01.10 | rob____ | toybox is your cut down version of busybox right? |
| 18:01.22 | landley | rob: sort of. |
| 18:01.33 | landley | It's me starting over from scratch with a project that doesn't have Bruce Disease. |
| 18:01.46 | landley | Firmware LInux has taken up most of my time for the past couple months, but I'm coming back to toybox now. |
| 18:02.18 | rob____ | im going to take a look at your firmware linux stuff tomorrow i think |
| 18:02.34 | rob____ | my original intention was to build my system to run off compact flash |
| 18:02.37 | Mirell | I need to install Gentoo in Parallels now... |
| 18:02.50 | rob____ | fed up of dying harddisks |
| 18:03.08 | Mirell | I initially was going to dual-boot the MacBook, but just read the MadWifi bug report, and they *still* don't have access to the new HAL for the wireless |
| 18:12.41 | sjhill | whirm: you will be getting dbus, dbus-glib and hald |
| 18:40.34 | Bertl | landley: just read your forensics analysis ... are you still planning to rewrite the init? |
| 18:40.58 | Bertl | (or did that already happen? :) |
| 18:43.05 | landley | bertl: I'm not touching busybox anymore. |
| 18:43.08 | landley | It has Bruce Disease. |
| 18:43.15 | landley | But I plan to put an improved init into toybox. |
| 18:43.28 | landley | Haven't decided if it should be a system v style init, or more like upstart. |
| 18:43.36 | landley | Possibly I should just implement both... |
| 18:45.42 | Bertl | was not talking about busybox stuff :) |
| 18:45.52 | landley | But I have about 100 other applets to add to toybox. |
| 18:46.11 | landley | At the moment, I'm working on mke2fs/gene2fs because I've found a need for it in firmware linux. |
| 18:46.31 | Bertl | I can probably test that in 'unusual' setups, if you are interested in feedback ... |
| 18:46.40 | landley | (There's been a new release of the old genext2fs from sourceforge in the last few days, for the first time in a loooong while.) |
| 18:46.53 | landley | But of course it happened _after_ I started writing my own, and I've got up a head of steam, so... |
| 18:47.48 | landley | I'm also halfway through adapting my bunzip2 code and mdev to busybox. (Both of which I wrote, so I can use 'em without worrying about Bruce showing up years later and going "I claim this project in the name of my ego, everything you've done has been in the name of Bruce Almighty.".) |
| 18:47.52 | landley | Which is a movie I still haven't seen yet... |
| 18:49.46 | Bertl | well, I do not care that much about Bruce as you seem to do ... but as I said, if you are interested in feedback (i.e. actually want to fix issues/bugs) in toybox, it shouldn't be a problem for me to testdrive it ... |
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| 19:14.00 | landley | Bertl: I'm always interested in feedback. :) |
| 19:16.12 | Bertl | good to hear ... |
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| 19:48.13 | Bertl | landley: web page says I should bug you regarding tinygcc (as I'm interested :) |
| 19:50.45 | landley | bertl: ah yes. |
| 19:50.51 | Mirell | That project is pretty much dead methought. |
| 19:50.55 | landley | I need to update the web page: I wound up doing a wrapper script instead. |
| 19:51.13 | landley | Basically, chopping unnecessary crap out of the gcc front-end turned out to be a heroic underdaking. |
| 19:51.29 | Bertl | like uClibc used to have? |
| 19:51.33 | landley | I gave up after 10,000 lines removed with no end in sight. I don't want to maintain a patch that big with no chance of going upstream. |
| 19:51.43 | landley | Bertl: actually based on the old uClibc wrapper script. |
| 19:51.46 | Bertl | (before it was decided that it cannot be maintained) |
| 19:51.53 | landley | It's in firmware linux, sources/toys/ |
| 19:51.57 | landley | I'm maintaining it. |
| 19:52.05 | Bertl | ah, good! appreciate that! |
| 19:52.07 | landley | Basically the wrapper overrides all the glibc path searching logic. |
| 19:52.23 | landley | Starts with --nostdlib --nostdinc and works its way back up from there with "ok, now look HERE". |
| 19:52.40 | landley | Creating a command line at runtime with the correct paths based on where the wrapper executable lives. |
| 19:52.57 | Bertl | trying to build your firmware toolchain for sparc as we speak |
| 19:53.01 | landley | That's how firmware linux is generating a relocatable toolchain. |
| 19:53.10 | landley | Bertl: I don't think I ever made a sparc config file for it. |
| 19:53.17 | landley | (The config files are in packages/configs I think.) |
| 19:53.20 | Bertl | np, I made one :) |
| 19:53.31 | landley | I really need to get the miniconfig stuff into the kernel and uClibc. |
| 19:53.43 | landley | The big evil part of those config files is that the uClibc and kernel .config files are here documents. |
| 19:53.57 | landley | Which makes sense as miniconfig (they're a couple dozen lines, tops. Generally smaller than that.) |
| 19:54.04 | landley | But makes very little sense as full-sized config files. |
| 19:54.05 | Bertl | sparc is more or less my 'hard test case' as it constantly fails with various issues |
| 19:54.10 | landley | There's an implicit todo item in there. :) |
| 19:54.20 | landley | Bertl: If you get a working sparc config, please send it my way and I'll include it. |
| 19:54.48 | Bertl | will do so, once the thing boots with qemu :) |
| 19:54.48 | landley | If you need to disable the qemu application emulation sanity test, look at x86_64 to see how to do that. |
| 19:54.54 | landley | Bertl: woot. |
| 19:55.08 | Mirell | qemu is the current killer in the whole thing now. |
| 19:55.18 | landley | I'm working on adding a gene2fs to toybox as we speak, so I can have the script package up a hard drive image for qemu to boot system emulation from. |
| 19:55.25 | landley | Mirell: yup. |
| 19:55.32 | landley | Extremely cool project but darn brittle at the moment. |
| 19:55.47 | Bertl | landley: my problem up to now was/is the uclibc, I have working kernel toolchains for all linux archs (well, except fvr atm) |
| 19:56.03 | landley | After they get 0.8.3 out, they're merging Paul Brook's qops rewrite of the code generator, and _that_ should finally make the dependencies on gcc 3.3 go away. |
| 19:56.12 | Bertl | (cross compiling toolchains, that is) |
| 19:56.29 | landley | Bertl: in theory I've beaten uClibc into submission. In practice, 0.9.29 is a bit untested on some platforms still. |
| 19:56.51 | landley | (Although the armv4 segfault fix went in yesterday and I should upgrade to last night's snapshot to see if I can drop the fix patch.) |
| 19:57.21 | landley | That's in download.sh. |
| 19:57.41 | landley | That one has the sha1sum check disabled (blank) so if you just point it at a new URL, it should download and use that instead. |
| 19:57.54 | landley | It automatically makes version independent symlinks for the build to use, so you don't have to adjust anything else. |
| 19:58.22 | landley | Did I mention there's a mailing list? (Very low traffic at present...) |
| 20:06.43 | Bertl | url to subscribe? |
| 20:07.10 | Bertl | nevermind, just found it :) |
| 20:09.53 | Bertl | landley: is there an IRC channel too? :) |
| 20:10.08 | landley | Bertl: afraid not. |
| 20:10.17 | landley | If they start complainign here I'm happy to start one, though. :) |
| 20:10.29 | Bertl | how about making one on oftc or freenode right now? |
| 20:10.36 | landley | (I hang out here when I'm online. Here, #cross-lfs, #gentoo-embedded, occasionally a few others.) |
| 20:10.46 | landley | I don't have a server set up to do a bot to stay logged in. |
| 20:10.54 | landley | And I'm not sure of the procedure for registering channels. |
| 20:11.21 | Bertl | I can do that for you if you like |
| 20:11.30 | landley | Both #fwl and #firmware seem free at the moment. |
| 20:11.45 | Bertl | (at least for oftc I know the procedures :) |
| 20:11.57 | landley | probably #firmware is the better choice. |
| 20:12.09 | landley | I don't hang out on oftc, though. |
| 20:12.23 | landley | Isn't that the one Debian started because freenode wasn't idealogically pure enough? |
| 20:12.32 | landley | I vaguely remember reading about that on lwn... |
| 20:12.59 | Bertl | at some point it was freenode vs oftc |
| 20:13.35 | Bertl | but shouldn't be too hard on freenode either ... |
| 20:15.29 | Bertl | landley: okay, please join #firmware, so you 'own' it atm |
| 20:19.59 | *** join/#uclibc Gerrath (n=Shane_@unaffiliated/gerrath) |
| 20:20.42 | landley | Bertl: done |
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| 22:39.17 | CIA-10 | 03jocke * r17253 10uClibc/ (7 files in 5 dirs): |
| 22:39.17 | CIA-10 | Peter Mazinger pointed out that my last commit was faulty. |
| 22:39.17 | CIA-10 | This should fix it. |
| 22:39.28 | CIA-10 | 03vda * r17254 10busybox/networking/ftpgetput.c: fix my own breakage |
| 22:47.01 | *** join/#uclibc KhemHome (n=KhemHome@adsl-71-146-3-195.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:52.26 | CIA-10 | 03jocke * r17255 10uClibc/TODO: I fixed that item long ago. |
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| 23:26.14 | CIA-10 | 03vda * r17256 10busybox/ (include/usage.h networking/fakeidentd.c networking/inetd.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 23:26.15 | CIA-10 | fakeinetd: attempted ipv6-ization (and it's done) |
| 23:26.15 | CIA-10 | but entire applet can be orders of magnitude smaller |
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