| 00:13.25 | maquis | but... alas |
| 00:13.39 | maquis | i'm stuck 2 states away, trying to fix the damage i did yesterday |
| 00:13.42 | maquis | and this whole week |
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| 02:58.07 | Kemotaha | Evening |
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| 03:39.00 | Zelut | evening |
| 03:39.09 | Zelut | atoponce: speed demon |
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| 04:02.57 | Zelut | jfrome: evening |
| 04:04.29 | Zelut | Hunding: ping |
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| 04:16.02 | inerspaceone | cool meeting thanks guys |
| 04:17.30 | Kemotaha | anytime |
| 04:47.33 | Zelut | we found a great place for the release party next month |
| 04:47.47 | Zelut | should be a lot of fun. food. drinks. big screen. wifi. |
| 04:47.53 | Zelut | what else do you need? :) |
| 05:00.15 | herlo | Zelut: where? |
| 05:00.53 | Zelut | herlo: Orbit Cafe. 540W 200S in SLC |
| 05:01.09 | Zelut | herlo: we went there after the meeting to check it out. I think it'll be nice |
| 05:01.24 | herlo | Oh, I've heard of that place, supposedly it's quite hip |
| 05:01.39 | Zelut | yeah, really trendy hip inside. |
| 05:01.52 | herlo | Do they have a separate meeting room? |
| 05:01.58 | Zelut | they've got a lounge that'll easily do 30 people, yeah |
| 05:02.11 | Zelut | it's kind of separated.. with thi TV, wifi, etc. |
| 05:02.35 | herlo | very nice |
| 05:03.01 | Zelut | if we want to get food we'll have to pre-order but I don't think that'll be a big deal. |
| 05:03.09 | Zelut | still about a month away anyway.. |
| 05:03.21 | Zelut | ahh, the good old interweb |
| 05:03.25 | herlo | no biggie for sure.... |
| 05:04.00 | Zelut | herlo: I bought a new machine today.. |
| 05:04.16 | herlo | Yeah? |
| 05:05.02 | herlo | I read your article (post) to plug (was it?) |
| 05:05.04 | Zelut | ordered a macbook, yeah. |
| 05:05.20 | herlo | yeah, good stuff... |
| 05:05.38 | Zelut | I looked again at the Thinkpad but I just can't pay for Vista/XP. |
| 05:05.57 | Zelut | if they would just have a non-M$ option... |
| 05:06.14 | herlo | They will soon enough, just not soon enough for you... |
| 05:06.43 | Zelut | herlo: talking to Joey from colo, who's been working for IBM for a decade says they scrapped the whole idea. |
| 05:06.49 | herlo | besides, I don't think it's a "MS" tax per se. It's something you'd pay for, whether it be MS, Linux or Mac... |
| 05:07.37 | herlo | Zelut: I understand they scrapped the idea, but you can't refuse that market forever and expect to last... |
| 05:07.39 | Zelut | and despite thought that I'd be paying an OSX overhead it was still cheaper than even system76 |
| 05:08.22 | Zelut | yeah, I'm sure they'll do it eventually.. but I don't want to wait that long :) |
| 05:08.43 | herlo | I think the geeks will win out, it's just a matter of time. The only reason Lenovo didn't go with it, is because they are bound to MS for another lifetime or two |
| 05:08.46 | herlo | :-( |
| 05:09.12 | Zelut | Well |
| 05:09.24 | Zelut | *I'm going to head home now. |
| 05:09.32 | Zelut | I'll bbiab |
| 05:10.24 | herlo | I am heading to bed. ttytomorrow... |
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| 05:45.09 | inerspaceone | any good admin interfaces for Apache ? |
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| 06:23.07 | Zelut | ~yawn |
| 06:23.08 | jbot | *YAWN* I get *YAWN* tired just thinking of large boxes of unknown substances being poured into nooks and crannies and eaten by little monsters that like to kill fluffy bunnies and oh god I'm tired.. |
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| 15:33.43 | Zelut | morning |
| 15:35.03 | Sir_Brizz | YEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS |
| 15:35.12 | Sir_Brizz | my son slept all night for the first time in three weeks! |
| 15:47.42 | Zelut | that must be nice. |
| 16:36.09 | Zelut | atoponce: ping |
| 18:20.09 | maquis | Sir_Brizz: nice |
| 18:20.15 | maquis | Zelut: it is morning... |
| 18:20.21 | maquis | but it was morning when i went to bed too |
| 18:20.37 | Zelut | maquis: i'm glad to hear you survived your week.. barely |
| 18:20.45 | maquis | Zelut: the week is still going |
| 18:20.54 | maquis | went to bedat 1:45 this morning |
| 18:21.06 | maquis | considered staying up the last 15 minutes |
| 18:21.17 | maquis | and decided i really didn't want to know if anything broke |
| 18:21.35 | maquis | turns out our on-call got paged for something unrelated |
| 18:21.54 | maquis | and and my messenger client hadn't gone idle yet |
| 18:23.19 | Zelut | why don't you get some sleep today then. :) |
| 18:27.55 | Zelut | does anyone have any suggestions on ubuntu-specific topics to present to PLUG this week? |
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| 19:27.51 | stuporglue | Does anyone have a favorite SVN tutorial and/or SVN GUI tool? I've never used it except for check outs, but want to learn it. |
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| 19:34.27 | sontek | =) |
| 19:47.58 | Zelut | sontek: missed you at the meet yesterday :) |
| 19:48.37 | Zelut | anyone have much experience with drupal? |
| 19:53.06 | sontek | Zelut: yeah, I couldn't convince myself games were worth the time :P |
| 19:55.07 | Zelut | I'm thinking about porting my blog to drupal |
| 19:55.30 | sontek | whats it running on right now? |
| 19:57.05 | Zelut | wordpress |
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| 19:59.52 | sontek | I think wordpress and drupal are comparable in regards to their blog engines |
| 20:00.12 | sontek | but I don't use either daily, I've only played with them for curiousity |
| 20:00.35 | sontek | But I don't think you'd gain anything from porting it |
| 20:02.35 | Zelut | I'm going to tinker with it for a bit |
| 20:22.37 | Zelut | maybe I should just break down and hire someone to design my blog the way I'd like. |
| 20:27.59 | sontek | but that doesn't teach you anything =) |
| 20:29.12 | Zelut | I just don't have the time to try and fight with the design |
| 20:29.26 | sontek | Wordpress has lots of themes |
| 20:30.11 | Zelut | maybe I need to look deeper but I've been thru everything or themes.wordpress.net & Alex Kings list. |
| 20:31.24 | sontek | totem is so bad, I don't know why ubuntu chose to have it as its default |
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| 21:48.14 | atoponce | Zelut: pong |
| 21:56.10 | *** topic/#ubuntu-utah by atoponce -> Ubuntu Utah LoCo Team | http://ubuntu-utah.org | http://ubuntu-utah.ubuntuforums.org | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UtahTeam | https://launchpad.net/~utahteam | https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-utah | Next Meeting: Feisty Release Party April 21 @ Orbit Cafe in SLC- Ping Zelut, atoponce or HoneyShiv for details |
| 21:56.31 | Zelut | back |
| 21:56.44 | Zelut | had to go put on the spare tire. Cat managed to get a flat this morning |
| 21:56.56 | atoponce | nice |
| 21:59.17 | Zelut | I ran into this today which looks interesting: http://www.metalinker.org/ |
| 22:00.01 | Zelut | only a couple of *nix clients but the idea is interesting |
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| 22:02.00 | atoponce | interesting |
| 22:02.25 | *** mode/#ubuntu-utah [-o atoponce] by ChanServ |
| 22:03.46 | Zelut | I'm looking for a client now.. curious how well it works or if it speeds things up. |
| 22:04.54 | atoponce | what's the license on it? |
| 22:05.57 | Zelut | well aria2 (client) looks like OSS and the metalinker just looks like an open standard so far too.. |
| 22:06.09 | Zelut | still checking the details |
| 22:06.53 | atoponce | oh, i see |
| 22:07.09 | atoponce | metalink is a protocol? that other file transfer clients utilize |
| 22:07.15 | Zelut | yeah |
| 22:07.39 | Zelut | looks like it combines http, ftp & p2p into one giant pipe. |
| 22:07.45 | atoponce | nice |
| 22:08.05 | atoponce | so, basically, just another implementation of torrents then? |
| 22:08.05 | Zelut | sounds like its kind of building on the distributed idea of torrent by adding http and ftp sources too. |
| 22:08.11 | atoponce | yeah |
| 22:08.46 | Zelut | doesn't seem faster than my normal connection so far, but that is probably due to being on the same network as the ISP that mirrors the ISOs. |
| 22:09.12 | atoponce | i would have a tough time justifying using it |
| 22:09.24 | atoponce | i get ~600KB average downloads |
| 22:09.39 | atoponce | currently downloading edubuntu at ~500KB |
| 22:10.11 | atoponce | i've seen my bandwidth peak at 2MB before |
| 22:10.15 | Zelut | yeah. incoming on UTOPIA for me screams |
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| 22:19.39 | Zelut | this aria2 client looks kind of cool. CLI downloader supports http, ftp, metalink & torrents. |
| 22:20.39 | Zelut | or any/all at the same time by specifying paths. ie; aria2 http://filename.zip ftp://filename.zip |
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| 22:34.39 | atoponce | cli clients rock |
| 22:34.55 | atoponce | which is why i would love to get centericq working on dapper |
| 22:35.19 | atoponce | maybe i just need to try a different jabber cli client that has pgp/gpg encryption, if that's possible |
| 22:36.13 | Zelut | I like sontek's idea that we, as a team, create an application. |
| 22:36.35 | Zelut | maybe a console based jabber client that *doesn't* use libgaim could be just the thing :) |
| 22:37.15 | sontek | we could write it in python =) |
| 22:37.23 | atoponce | centericq doesn't. :) |
| 22:37.27 | atoponce | sontek: ?1 |
| 22:37.32 | atoponce | s/?/+/ |
| 22:38.04 | Zelut | of course I don't know how hard that would be being one of the few people who *can't* code in the room. |
| 22:38.28 | sontek | working with jabber api is pretty easy |
| 22:38.32 | atoponce | if only i had time to develop on a project.... |
| 22:38.40 | atoponce | that'd be a lot of fun, i think |
| 22:40.40 | Zelut | well synic did jbother, right? that's a gui jabber client. I wonder how hard it'l be to work from that source. |
| 22:41.24 | atoponce | that's java, though |
| 22:41.37 | atoponce | no offense, but i won't code in java. :) |
| 22:41.44 | atoponce | just not my cup of tea |
| 22:41.53 | Zelut | ohh, didn't know |
| 22:42.06 | atoponce | although, it is the 1st language i learned |
| 22:43.00 | atoponce | it's just after learning other languages, i don't have a need for it any longer |
| 22:43.09 | atoponce | the implementation of java is bad, i think |
| 22:43.28 | atoponce | i need to update my mail ssl cert... |
| 22:43.36 | sontek | Theres a few things I don't like about java (mainly their generics) but its not the worse language I've used =) |
| 22:44.12 | atoponce | agreed. :) |
| 22:44.16 | atoponce | at least it's oop |
| 22:44.51 | atoponce | unlike c, which should die |
| 22:44.59 | sontek | objective c? ;) |
| 22:45.31 | atoponce | both |
| 22:45.39 | atoponce | :) |
| 22:46.16 | Zelut | I think it'd be a good idea but do you think any of us have enough time to do it? |
| 22:46.41 | Zelut | ...I kind of see it falling on the good c0d3rs while the rest do bugs and complain :) |
| 22:46.50 | sontek | My idea was to have an hour after hour monthly meeting where we chill together and code |
| 22:47.08 | sontek | so even if its slow it'd get done =) |
| 22:47.37 | Zelut | would that mean you'd come to the monthly meeting? :) |
| 22:47.46 | sontek | It'd give me a reason to =) |
| 22:47.55 | sontek | I'm not interested in gaming ;) |
| 22:48.33 | Zelut | yeah, I'm not a big gamer either but it seems to be a popular topic. |
| 22:49.06 | Zelut | I'd love to be a developer even on a small project.. and that might be the only way I'm ever going to learn to code is to actually do it. |
| 22:49.40 | sontek | yeah, everyone games, I just see lugs as a way for sharing knowledge and learning new things, and gaming doesn't go with that :P |
| 22:49.57 | sontek | yeah, it'd be nice because you could sit down with us and code too |
| 22:50.26 | Zelut | you mean sit down and ask too many questions for anyone to get anything done? |
| 22:50.41 | sontek | for the first few months ;P |
| 22:52.29 | Zelut | I'd love to sit down right now and start learning but I have no idea where to start. |
| 22:52.36 | atoponce | yeah. if we could set it up, so an hour after the meet, we code, and work on the project, i could help |
| 22:52.53 | Zelut | what language to use. what editor/IDE. what to actually try and create.. |
| 22:52.53 | atoponce | other than that, i'm just too busy |
| 22:53.30 | atoponce | Zelut: of course, differing people will have differing opinions, but i would say to jump into python or ruby as a 1st language |
| 22:53.44 | atoponce | both are oop, and both are easy to read and learn |
| 22:53.47 | sontek | i'd say ruby/python because they both have ncurses bindings so it'd easy to make a decent CLI gui |
| 22:53.55 | sontek | but for editor/ide thats personal choice |
| 22:54.17 | atoponce | yeah. spe (stani's python editor) is really nice, but nothing beats vim |
| 22:54.19 | sontek | soo.. atoponce and I agree ;p |
| 22:54.24 | Zelut | well I've got a python book lying around here somewhere |
| 22:54.26 | atoponce | ~w00t! |
| 22:54.31 | jbot | There it is! |
| 22:54.50 | Zelut | sontek: and python is supported in mono, yes? |
| 22:54.56 | sontek | The whole reason I learned vi was to stop having to learn a new IDE every language I wanted to learn |
| 22:55.23 | sontek | Zelut: yes |
| 22:56.01 | Zelut | my 'myths about mono' article comes out tomorrow. |
| 22:56.32 | sontek | yay =) |
| 22:56.45 | atoponce | for a cli, we wouldn't need the mono framework, i think... |
| 22:57.08 | atoponce | that would be overkill for our needs |
| 22:57.50 | Zelut | so I popped out my python book but I don't really know what I'd even like it to do lol |
| 23:02.52 | Zelut | yeah, this is where the discouraging / completely lost feeling sets in :) |
| 23:03.16 | atoponce | :) |
| 23:03.34 | atoponce | just start with chapter 1, read the entire chapter, then try the exercises at the end |
| 23:03.42 | atoponce | of course, if you have questions, just ask |
| 23:04.04 | atoponce | but after the first chapter, i think you'll realize that it's a pretty easy language to learn |
| 23:04.41 | sontek | Zelut: skim through it and look at code, figure out the syntax for basic stuff (while/for/if/etc) and then just do some simple tasks |
| 23:04.48 | sontek | have it parse your webserver logs and give you some stats |
| 23:04.52 | sontek | or something like that |
| 23:05.08 | Zelut | seems like this covers a lot of principles but not real world examples |
| 23:06.32 | atoponce | that's what the exercises are for. they are just portions of code that you will write in the real world, even if their examples suck |
| 23:09.11 | sontek | did you ever play sports in highschool? Its kind of like practice |
| 23:09.29 | Zelut | should I be using IDLE for this basic practice? |
| 23:10.24 | atoponce | yeah. idle is fine. anything with a python interactive prompt |
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| 23:18.01 | Zelut | ok. a bit of practice with input & raw_input and printing results. That seems basic enough. |
| 23:20.57 | Zelut | and apparently there is a difference in ' & `... |
| 23:28.33 | atoponce | yeah |
| 23:29.00 | atoponce | but there isn't a difference between ' & " |
| 23:29.17 | Zelut | ok |
| 23:34.09 | Zelut | can you explain some real usage of indexing? it's talking about defining a value on an index 0 - X or -1, etc. |
| 23:35.02 | Zelut | ie; example = 'hello' : example[0] to display h.. |
| 23:40.17 | sontek | Its to store a collection. So if you want the 3rd student you'd say students[2] |
| 23:42.24 | sontek | http://monoport.com/2010 |
| 23:42.36 | sontek | Theres an example of a hack I had to do the other day using indexing |
| 23:43.13 | sontek | we have a bunch of grids that show tabular data and my boss wanted to show totals on the final row for some of the grids |
| 23:43.49 | sontek | so I looped through each row/column and added them up and created the row with indexes |
| 23:44.17 | Zelut | its not making a whole lot of sense to me yet :) |
| 23:46.50 | Zelut | urg |
| 23:47.03 | Zelut | I think I'm getting it a bit |
| 23:48.01 | Zelut | I'm seeing I can define list = [1, 2, 3, 4, 5] but not list = [name1, name2, name3, name4] |
| 23:48.02 | sontek | hm.. well, lets say you want to parse your rss feed, you'd grab the nodes <channel><item>..</item><item>..</item></channel> |
| 23:48.13 | sontek | then you could say grab the 1st entry via item[0] |
| 23:48.16 | Zelut | do I have to use strings for that? 'name1', 'name2, etc? |
| 23:48.44 | atoponce | no |
| 23:49.08 | atoponce | if you 'name1','name2', etc, then you are putting strings in your list |
| 23:49.30 | atoponce | if name1, name2, name3, etc, then you are putting vars in your list that are already predefined |
| 23:49.38 | atoponce | such as: name1="christer" |
| 23:50.37 | atoponce | or, whatever. name1 could be an object, string, dictionary, list, etc. really anything |
| 23:51.05 | atoponce | the point is, if you put the ' or " around it, then python treats it as a string of text, rather than another type |
| 23:51.30 | Zelut | ok, so I just defined name1, 2 & 3 and then did list = [name1, 2, 3] and I can output those values from the index. |
| 23:52.34 | atoponce | yeah. then if you 'print list[0]', it will spit out whatever, in this case, name1 was holding |
| 23:53.08 | Zelut | ok.. but putting 'value' in that index is actually defining that index value right there? |
| 23:53.32 | Zelut | list = [name1, name2, 'somethingrandom', name3]. ? |
| 23:54.31 | atoponce | right. so, 'print list[2]' = 'somethingrandom' while 'print list[1]' = whatever name2 is holding |
| 23:54.33 | Zelut | making a bit more sense I think.. |
| 23:58.50 | Zelut | using 'in' to see if something is included in a list how would I tell it to return to the input if false? |