| 00:33:12 | | mallum was last seen on #handhelds.org 8 hours, 23 minutes and 37 seconds ago, saying: Kero: :) [Mon Jun 10 17:09:35 2002] |
| 00:33:12 | prpplague | ibot: seen mallum |
| 01:16:39 | jacques | watches the eclipse. |
| 01:33:32 | Morn | is away: tv.watch(); |
| 06:09:36 | | tomw was last seen on #tuxscreen 2 days, 9 hours, 51 minutes and 35 seconds ago, saying: Aelhaz: ?? jacques and I had tinyx working *with* touchscreen as well, it is now broken? [Sat Jun 8 21:18:01 2002] |
| 06:09:36 | jacques | ibot: seen tomw |
| 06:09:56 | TomW | eh? |
| 06:10:17 | TomW | jacques: what's up? |
| 16:31:25 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: just kidding |
| 16:44:59 | TomW_ | ahhh... Finally got the touchscreen working with tinyx + dillo on debian. |
| 16:51:32 | | fontenot was last seen on #tuxscreen 3 days, 21 hours, 12 minutes and 14 seconds ago, saying: lol [Fri Jun 7 20:39:18 2002] |
| 16:51:32 | TomW_ | ibot, seen fontenot |
| 17:00:28 | Aelhaz | Howdy, tim |
| 17:40:32 | fontenot | hi TomW_ |
| 17:41:22 | TomW_ | hey |
| 17:41:40 | TomW_ | You recall that "blue" color problem with tinyx? |
| 17:41:58 | fontenot | yep |
| 17:42:15 | TomW_ | it is still there under debian (libc). |
| 17:42:22 | fontenot | grrr |
| 17:43:01 | TomW_ | BUT, I can launch tinyx from a runlevel 5 script and it comes up fine on boot. |
| 17:43:09 | file | Russ|werk!!!!! you alive in there? |
| 17:44:22 | fontenot | TomW_: yah tinyx and the shell fighting over something I guess |
| 17:44:42 | fontenot | i mean, what's not there when run from init? |
| 17:46:18 | file | pokes people |
| 18:07:17 | file | hey Russ |
| 18:11:55 | russ_ | hey file |
| 18:12:19 | file | what's up? |
| 18:12:46 | Russ|werk | realized that outlook doesn't see [ or ] as a token seperator in a mime filename when the filename isn't quoted |
| 18:13:13 | file | oh dear me |
| 18:13:39 | Russ|werk | so my stripper by extension won't see Whats_New[1].pif |
| 18:13:49 | Russ|werk | I changed it, but I worry about the opposite attack |
| 18:13:59 | Russ|werk | I think I'll start going by content |
| 18:14:07 | file | nods |
| 18:14:14 | Russ|werk | uudecode the first 100 or so bytes |
| 18:15:01 | Russ|werk | I think I'll flag any mutliple levels of encoding as unsafe |
| 18:36:16 | CosmicPenguin | Russ|werk: what are you working on (if I may be so bold to ask) |
| 18:36:44 | Russ|werk | its an email sanitation/strip by extension thing |
| 18:36:56 | Russ|werk | uses transparent proxy |
| 18:45:03 | CosmicPenguin | Russ|werk: cool |
| 18:50:11 | CosmicPenguin | time to buy a new computer... :) |
| 18:50:12 | CosmicPenguin | is happy |
| 19:15:09 | macbar | BZFlag: are you here ? |
| 19:54:22 | BZFlag | sorta |
| 19:54:41 | macbar | BZFlag: aha |
| 19:54:52 | macbar | BZFlag: do you have any tuxscreen left ? |
| 19:56:58 | file | russ_... |
| 19:59:54 | BZFlag | notices that not can't macbar read the topic he also can't read web pages. |
| 20:01:02 | macbar | BZFlag: hmm, you do have a point there :) |
| 20:01:45 | macbar | BZFlag: I have read the website, but it seemed out of date, not having been updated since somewhere in april and the such |
| 20:02:32 | macbar | BZFlag: I'd like to order 6 pieces, but a friend of mine would pay them using his paypal account |
| 20:02:39 | macbar | BZFlag: is that okay for you ? |
| 20:04:34 | BZFlag | fine |
| 20:04:48 | BZFlag | just include the shipping name and address in the comments. |
| 20:04:49 | jacques_gone | macbar: does it matter which 6 pieces you get? |
| 20:05:08 | BZFlag | jacques: I was planning the 6 batteries. |
| 20:05:11 | file | paypals BZFlag $0.00 |
| 20:05:11 | CosmicPenguin | I've got a broken serial port I can donate... :) |
| 20:05:22 | jacques | BZFlag: lol that's what I thought |
| 20:05:46 | macbar | jacques: ;p |
| 20:05:47 | jacques | i have a stylus and a battery cover |
| 20:06:04 | macbar | you guys know perfectly well what I'm trying to say |
| 20:06:08 | BZFlag | heh |
| 20:06:15 | file | I can donate 2 video cards, various RAM ,2 mice, and 2 modems |
| 20:06:29 | BZFlag | file: that's more that 6 ;-) |
| 20:06:29 | file | mmm... food |
| 20:06:33 | macbar | BZFlag: ok, tnx |
| 20:06:39 | BZFlag | macbar: np |
| 20:06:59 | BZFlag | s/that/than/ |
| 20:10:11 | file | I seriously will donate those PC parts |
| 20:13:34 | file | anybody want anything? |
| 20:15:54 | file | bbl |
| 20:25:06 | prpplague | what are we talking about? |
| 20:26:40 | prpplague | reads buffer |
| 20:27:11 | prpplague | hmm, i have two tux dsp boards to donate, lol |
| 20:29:10 | prpplague | howdy ThomasFromParis |
| 20:29:34 | ThomasFromParis | hi everyone |
| 20:30:27 | jacques | prpplague: if you have dsp boards to donate, does that mean you have a way of running the cpu board alone? |
| 20:30:41 | prpplague | jacques: sure |
| 20:30:51 | prpplague | jacques: based on help from TomW_ |
| 20:31:40 | TomW_ | yup, even get an 8 bit i/o port in the bargain. |
| 20:33:27 | jacques | HOW???? :-D |
| 20:33:30 | jacques | i want it!!!! |
| 20:33:33 | jacques | i need it!!! |
| 20:33:53 | jacques | assuming it's available :-) |
| 20:34:14 | TomW_ | jacques: what? The 8 bit port? |
| 20:35:02 | jacques | i just mean if the info is not prprietar |
| 20:35:04 | jacques | y |
| 20:36:25 | TomW_ | No, it is available. It is J602 on the CPU board, a memory mapped 8 bit port with 256 unique addresses. You have some simple cuts & jumpers on the CPU board that you have to do to correct a mistake in the logic, but it is already there. |
| 20:36:47 | jacques | i would like to run at least one of my tuxes just the cpu board |
| 20:37:10 | TomW_ | http://www.openhardware.net/TuxScreen/J602WriteMod.pdf |
| 20:37:34 | TomW_ | http://www.openhardware.net/TuxScreen/TuxIDE.pdf |
| 20:39:24 | prpplague | TomW_: give him the url with the pic |
| 20:39:42 | jacques | how are you guys getting power and serial port to the cpu board? |
| 20:39:51 | jacques | also, have you experimented with using the sa11x0 builtin sound like the ipaq does? thre is already a driver |
| 20:39:52 | prpplague | jacques: custom pcb |
| 20:40:11 | prpplague | doesn't do sound |
| 20:40:35 | prpplague | is audio challenged |
| 20:40:52 | TomW_ | jacques: http://www.openhardware.net/TuxScreen/DriveLocation.jpg |
| 20:41:53 | TomW_ | sorry, wrong picture. |
| 20:41:56 | jacques | heh |
| 20:42:15 | TomW_ | jacques: this one: http://www.openhardware.net/TuxScreen/StrongARM-perf.html |
| 20:43:06 | TomW_ | jacques: you have to solder stuff... |
| 20:43:17 | TomW_ | got to run... |
| 20:43:18 | prpplague | TomW_: ha, mine is prettier |
| 20:43:22 | TomW_ | is away: I'm busy |
| 20:43:28 | prpplague | TomW_: later |
| 20:46:38 | | file is a happy Philips Nino/VTech Helio user |
| 20:46:38 | russ_ | yes file? |
| 20:52:58 | CosmicPenguin | And he admits it! |
| 20:54:11 | CosmicPenguin | Toy overload! |
| 20:54:26 | CosmicPenguin | has gotten Linux for PS2, a new PS2 game, and a new computer all in the space of a week |
| 21:00:04 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: lol |
| 21:00:59 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: i got 3 new thin clients to play with this week, does that count for anything? |
| 21:09:55 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: mmm..... any running linux? |
| 21:46:56 | lyakh_home | Hi all, need some help from hardware experts... |
| 21:47:13 | file | anybody want some hardware? |
| 21:47:20 | lyakh_home | Russ|werk was helping me (very efficiently) yesterday |
| 21:47:27 | file | Paypal me the shipping amount and it's yours |
| 21:47:27 | lyakh_home | yep - JTAG-dongle |
| 21:47:32 | file | video cards, mice, modems, RAM |
| 21:47:35 | file | you choose! |
| 21:47:38 | jacques | sorry i was at lunch |
| 21:48:29 | lyakh_home | so, I did it - after a couple of re-blobbing attempts (without recycling the power) it locked. |
| 21:49:41 | lyakh_home | Now, I have a Keith & Koep dongle, which works with their SA1110-boards, I built a cable for it, and their flashing software - DOS-binary and sources |
| 21:50:28 | lyakh_home | When I try using it naively with tux it says wrong CPU-ID (is it SA1110 / 1100 mismatch?) |
| 21:51:17 | lyakh_home | so, I can try to figure out if a simple CPU-id adjustment would work, then - I don't think I can easily re-compile it for DOS... |
| 21:52:02 | lyakh_home | I could try porting it to Linux, orusing / modifying jflash (their dongle is connected to pins 1,3,5,7 of pp...) |
| 21:52:27 | CosmicPenguin | lyakh_home: the Tuxscreen uses the 1100 |
| 21:52:54 | file | somebody buy it all! |
| 21:53:04 | file | pretty please? |
| 21:53:07 | CosmicPenguin | file: I've got one word for you -- ebay |
| 21:53:09 | CosmicPenguin | :) |
| 21:53:13 | lyakh_home | Also, if I port it to linux - ideally a char-driver, so just cat blob > /dev/jtag does the thing, I am not quite sure how to use /dev/mem or whatever to access it from user-space... |
| 21:53:19 | file | I can't sell on EBay |
| 21:53:25 | file | nocredit card or checking account |
| 21:53:29 | CosmicPenguin | doh |
| 21:53:35 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: they are running linux now |
| 21:53:38 | CosmicPenguin | how do you paypal then? |
| 21:53:48 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: what software you using these days? |
| 21:53:49 | file | I don't |
| 21:53:51 | file | I can only receive |
| 21:53:55 | file | I withdraw to my savings account |
| 21:53:56 | CosmicPenguin | file: ahhhh...... |
| 21:54:00 | CosmicPenguin | file: tough |
| 21:54:15 | file | help... me |
| 21:54:48 | CosmicPenguin | file: sorry... I've already got all the useless computer gear I need .... you should see my office - it looks like a robot exploded in here |
| 21:55:08 | lyakh_home | so, any suggestions? |
| 21:55:36 | lyakh_home | file: do you have any of Tux-supported PCMCIA-cards (wired-network, IDE)? |
| 21:55:56 | CosmicPenguin | lyakh_home: there is a list of supported cards somewhere on the Wiki |
| 21:56:31 | lyakh_home | yeah, I know, now I want to get some of them (to be more precise - when and if I manage to bring it back to live...) |
| 21:56:52 | BZFlag | gcc builds in buildroot do not recover well from partial builds, new snapshots etc. |
| 21:57:06 | BZFlag | I end up rebuilding all of gcc/uclibc each time. ugh |
| 21:58:03 | jacques | BZFlag: i hear ya |
| 21:58:15 | lyakh_home | I thought 90% of the public here were hardware experts (at least when compared to me:-)) |
| 21:58:30 | lyakh_home | TomW_: you here me?:-) |
| 21:58:42 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: its a custom dist we have for our customer who generally qualify in the same catagory as neandrathal |
| 21:58:48 | lyakh_home | They even have schematics of this dongle |
| 21:59:53 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: its has a quick menu which does serial terminal emulation or console ssh/telnet or X server/client |
| 22:01:20 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: wow..... :) |
| 22:01:45 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: when you guys think about opening a SLC office, give me a call, eh??? :-) |
| 22:01:58 | CosmicPenguin | needs to go and get some computer components |
| 22:02:04 | CosmicPenguin | is away: Off to spend some $$$ |
| 22:02:30 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: will do |
| 22:02:34 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: http://www.abcsinc.com/yopy/tcsx1-rootfs.tar.gz |
| 22:02:50 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: your welcome to have a look at one of the earlier rootfs |
| 22:04:38 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8485254374.html |
| 22:08:38 | lyakh_home | Hi, Russ|werk, have a couple of minutes to give me another advise (or two)?:-) |
| 22:11:42 | as_ | Evnin all. |
| 22:13:29 | Russ|werk | lyakh_home: I have to make a trip to hat shack to pick up some jtag stuff (ironically enough) |
| 22:13:55 | lyakh_home | yeah... you're in the States? |
| 22:13:59 | Russ|werk | yes |
| 22:14:29 | lyakh_home | anyway, take a notice of ftp://www.keith-koep.com/pub/arm-tools/jtag/ |
| 22:14:48 | lyakh_home | there they have schematics of the dongle, sources of a DOS-flash prog... |
| 22:15:28 | lyakh_home | My problem now seems to be mismatch - their board has SA1110, tux - SA1100, so, it complains about the wrong CPU-ID... |
| 22:17:05 | as_ | Is the pinout of the two CPUs the same? |
| 22:17:24 | lyakh_home | don't think so... |
| 22:17:26 | Russ|werk | you need to get a version of jflash for sa1110 |
| 22:17:37 | Russ|werk | the layout of the jtag registers is different |
| 22:17:49 | Russ|werk | and make sure you hold nTRST high while you are making writes |
| 22:18:02 | as_ | What are you trying lyakh? |
| 22:18:02 | lyakh_home | I have one - for their board, but tux has SA1100. |
| 22:18:15 | Russ|werk | the original jflash was for sa1110 |
| 22:18:19 | lyakh_home | resue my Tux:-) |
| 22:18:25 | Russ|werk | then it was modified for sa1100 |
| 22:18:35 | Russ|werk | then special modifications were made for the tux |
| 22:18:39 | Russ|werk | and thats what you have |
| 22:18:45 | as_ | Ahh. Not fun, died as a result of bootloader currupt? |
| 22:19:10 | lyakh_home | aha, so, by diffing them I can see what I have to modify in KnK flasher |
| 22:19:10 | Russ|werk | I was backwards |
| 22:19:10 | Russ|werk | ok |
| 22:19:23 | | Russ|werk: that doesn't look right |
| 22:19:23 | Russ|werk | well, change the jflash for th tux to use the dongle |
| 22:19:29 | | Russ|werk: i'm not following you... |
| 22:19:29 | Russ|werk | ibot: screw you |
| 22:20:02 | lyakh_home | as_: yeah, repeated flashing without power recycling:-( |
| 22:20:04 | Russ|werk | lyakh_home: you need to bit shift TMS, TCLK, and TDI the right number of places, and put nTRST in there, because if you don't it will stay low |
| 22:20:16 | Russ|werk | lyakh_home: I do plan to fix that this week |
| 22:20:32 | lyakh_home | fix? is it broken now? |
| 22:20:47 | Russ|werk | having to reboot between flashing is broken |
| 22:20:53 | Russ|werk | anyway, gtg |
| 22:21:09 | lyakh_home | ah, ok, thanks for the help |
| 22:21:12 | as_ | I usually wire nTRST inactive perminantly. |
| 22:21:25 | as_ | Its redundant in any case. |
| 22:21:55 | lyakh_home | its short to nRESET on wiki... |
| 22:22:34 | lyakh_home | Russ|werk - I wish you fixed it last week:-))) |
| 22:23:09 | as_ | Hmm, I havnt used JTAG on the tux, I use it with other things. |
| 22:23:32 | file | I need an auction site to sell my computer hardware junk on, suggestions? |
| 22:23:49 | lyakh_home | the dongle I've got is from Keith and Koep and works with their SA1110 trizeps boards... |
| 22:24:28 | as_ | You are probably better off wiring or getting a holly/lart dongle, they are pretty simple devices. |
| 22:24:39 | file | suggestions... please... |
| 22:24:43 | lyakh_home | ok, will look into jflash sources, not sure though that just shifting the bits will work... |
| 22:24:56 | lyakh_home | ideas where I can get one in Europe (Germany)? |
| 22:25:15 | as_ | If you can make a simple PCB you can make one yourself. |
| 22:26:16 | lyakh_home | not myself... Only if I ask at work to help me... And I need the chip and the passive stuff... I am (virtually) with bare hands now (in terms of soldering) |
| 22:27:13 | as_ | All the chip is, is a buffer to step the levels down to 3.3V. The output from a glitch free LPT port does all the work. |
| 22:27:53 | as_ | Depending on how complicated the dongle you have is, you might be able to rewire thepport plug. |
| 22:28:13 | lyakh_home | I also have a custom-built jtag-board, consisting only of passive elements - didn't try it even, might work? |
| 22:28:31 | as_ | Dont. |
| 22:28:34 | lyakh_home | no, can't rewire it - it's not mine |
| 22:28:42 | as_ | 5V will fry a strongarm. |
| 22:29:10 | lyakh_home | ok, won't |
| 22:29:43 | as_ | You can use LED/diodes to drop the voltage, but its a messy method. |
| 22:31:35 | lyakh_home | :-) I'm no good at that - my last experiments with soldering (and mainly analog stuff) were about 10 years back, I know very little about the modern digital element base... |
| 22:32:24 | as_ | ITs hardly modern though. 1 pport line per JTAG line, and all the clever stuff is in software. |
| 22:32:36 | file | software? O.O |
| 22:33:04 | as_ | In jflash. |
| 22:34:01 | lyakh_home | Well, have to go now, will continue my attempts tomorrow. Will start with an attempt to modify jflash to use other pp-bits. |
| 22:34:14 | lyakh_home | BTW, what do they use Strobe for?... |
| 22:34:23 | as_ | Do you have a circuit diagram of the jtag dongle? |
| 22:35:00 | as_ | I'm not sure offhand, that might be TDO. |
| 22:35:40 | as_ | TMS, TCLK, TDI are outputs from the computer, TDO is the only input. |
| 22:36:15 | as_ | nTRST is a redundant pin, I wire it, err , high I think. |
| 22:36:16 | lyakh_home | ftp://www.keith-koep.com/pub/arm-tools/jtag/ |
| 22:36:43 | lyakh_home | yep, it's an output from TDO, do I have to re-program that too?... |
| 22:36:57 | as_ | Unlikley. |
| 22:37:34 | as_ | I'm sure how Russ intended you do it, but you should be able to just modify which pin each bit. |
| 22:37:43 | as_ | Err, Not sure how Russ intended. |
| 22:38:02 | lyakh_home | ok, will try tomorrow, thanks, cu |
| 22:38:48 | as_ | Hmm, this isnt right. |
| 22:38:58 | as_ | Strobe isnt TDO. |
| 22:39:13 | lyakh_home | how wrong is it?:-)... |
| 22:39:56 | as_ | I'm not sure, the interface I use is different to both this and holly/lart. I'll look up the lart schematic and work out the differences. |
| 22:40:09 | as_ | If you leave an email I'll mail them you. |
| 22:40:49 | lyakh_home | gvlyakh@mail.ru Thanks again! |
| 22:41:50 | file | droolz |
| 22:41:51 | file | so much space |
| 22:41:53 | file | dev/md0 453G 154G 276G 36% /navi |
| 22:47:07 | file | Gigabit ethernet |
| 22:47:07 | file | droolz more |
| 22:49:42 | Aelhaz | GigE nics are getting cheap, the switches are still a tad expensive tho |
| 22:50:06 | file | this fileserver box still has one though... |
| 22:50:15 | file | hugs it |
| 23:31:31 | Russ|werk | lyakh: I'm back |
| 23:32:29 | as2_ | Has he said anything since he left? |
| 23:33:17 | Russ|werk | nope |
| 23:33:32 | Russ|werk | see, his main problem is nTRST, which is an output from the parallel port |
| 23:33:41 | Russ|werk | so he has to pull that up in software |
| 23:34:59 | file | want... independence one prepaid mastercard... |
| 23:35:29 | Russ|werk | file: ya, I think the person I know is in the process of moving from portland, to washington |
| 23:35:36 | Russ|werk | caus they've been mia |
| 23:35:44 | file | just my luck! |
| 23:35:46 | as2_ | He could just not wire it to the dongle and wire it high. |
| 23:36:17 | as2_ | Simpler than altering jflash. |
| 23:36:46 | Russ|werk | as2_: or just add a 1 << nTRST_BIT |
| 23:36:54 | Russ|werk | as2_: he has to alter jflash anyway |
| 23:37:15 | Russ|werk | he just has to change two lines of cohe |
| 23:37:15 | Russ|werk | er, code |
| 23:37:26 | as2_ | Ahh, true, I avoid using that line at all. |
| 23:37:35 | Russ|werk | well, its on the dongle |
| 23:38:18 | as2_ | Makes me wonder why people add that lines to chips at all. |
| 23:38:54 | as2_ | IT is after all completely redundant. |
| 23:38:55 | Russ|werk | why not, its free |
| 23:39:13 | Russ|werk | makes a free hardware reset if its also hooked ot nRESET |
| 23:40:10 | as2_ | You have to reset the state machine seperatly anyway. |
| 23:40:34 | Russ|werk | maybe there are multiple devices on the board |
| 23:41:00 | file | bah!!!!!!!!! |
| 23:41:13 | as2_ | Then you put the ones not in use in BYPASS. |
| 23:41:56 | as2_ | Which you get to a known state with in parralel. |
| 23:44:06 | as2_ | (with multiple devices the TDI/TDO is daisychained and TMS/TCK are all in parallel so they reach known state together without nTRST) |
| 23:45:42 | Russ|werk | as2_: what if you have a device that behaves badly |
| 23:47:25 | as2_ | Hmm, how do you mean badly. If the state machine isnt working then its broken and cant be used for anything. |
| 23:48:48 | TomW_ | is back (gone 03:05:26) |
| 23:48:56 | TomW_ | lyakh: what is up? |
| 23:49:31 | as2_ | He isnt awake we think, he wants to use a non holly jtag dongle with his tux by modifying jflash. |
| 23:49:38 | file | i'm unhappy |
| 23:49:55 | as2_ | Whys that file? |
| 23:50:07 | file | because I want something, but it's only available in certain areas |
| 23:50:29 | as2_ | Like broadband? |
| 23:50:37 | file | that too |
| 23:50:44 | file | http://www.mycardstatus.com/ mostly |
| 23:52:08 | file | as2_ : still alive? |
| 23:53:23 | as2_ | Only just. |
| 23:53:34 | file | uh huh |
| 23:53:34 | as2_ | Double check the JTAG pinout. |
| 23:54:40 | as2_ | Why is that giving you grief file? |
| 23:54:52 | file | as2_ : because I can't buy stuff online that I'd like |
| 23:55:26 | file | as2_ : can you help? |
| 23:55:33 | as2_ | Err, so get someone elses master card, or a visa... |
| 23:55:46 | file | are you nuts? |
| 23:55:52 | file | prpplague : hello monsieur |
| 23:56:01 | as2_ | I dont see what the problem is. |
| 23:56:16 | | niihau, prpplague |
| 23:56:16 | prpplague | howdy |
| 23:56:21 | file | as2_ : me'sa want buy stuff online, me'sa can't |
| 23:56:24 | prpplague | is heaven with a new mouse |
| 23:56:41 | file | prpplague : bah hum bug |
| 23:56:53 | prpplague | file: not bug, mouse |
| 23:57:00 | as2_ | file, so why dont you get someone elses mastercard or a visa file? |
| 23:57:07 | file | as2_ : because I'm 15. |
| 23:57:24 | file | is young and not trustworthy apparently |
| 23:57:49 | as2_ | I thought you said you couldnt get it because of your location. |
| 23:57:55 | file | correct. |
| 23:57:57 | file | it's in the US |
| 23:58:18 | file | the card is a prepaid thing |
| 23:58:25 | file | they are only doing a test in certain areas |
| 23:58:34 | file | North Carolina, Oregon, Vancouver, and one more... |
| 23:59:22 | as2_ | I see. |
| 23:59:39 | as2_ | Wont you be eligable for a normal card when your 16? |
