| 00:00:05 | Russ | I really hate the code style |
| 00:00:12 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster:yes you could say Inferno was full of it! |
| 00:00:16 | SpaceCoaster | SpaceCoaster: I think they were overcome by gradually increasing expectations, when they started an 8M phone was pretty fancy! |
| 00:01:00 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: It has every sign that they worked around bugs which were solved elsewhere but never revisited it, if it works don't fix it. |
| 00:02:02 | CosmicPenguin | SpaceCoaster: Don't judge too hard... our own beloved kernel does much of the same... :) |
| 00:02:38 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: exactly! no wonder they had giant cost over-runs and a fialed product. I recently got 2 Audrys, what a difference in the construction of the product. the difference between amateurs and pro's. Didn't matter both were failures. |
| 00:03:30 | SpaceCoaster | True and it is developed with different goals, I'm astonished how well it hangs together, patches on patches on patches on patches and it boots! |
| 00:03:45 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: is the audrey well put together then? |
| 00:04:28 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: in comparison to the Tux, yes. |
| 00:05:53 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: the Tux looks like it was only half done, the CPU board has some silkscreen, but not to the standards that the I/O board. The I/o board has legends in Spanish. and hot melt glue instead of connectors. |
| 00:06:37 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: yet the DSP was finished to the point that Lucent did a masked ROM version. |
| 00:07:31 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: I just glad that BZ got a hold of them, and is getting them to people who can deal with hardware & software hacking. |
| 00:07:39 | SpaceCoaster | Uneven and expensive and surprising incomplete. Good enough for us though. Gonna buy 4 more. |
| 00:08:50 | GPSFan | I'm probably going to have to get another so I don't have to rely on the one I used to do the schematics. BTW more updates comming this weekend. |
| 00:09:06 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: the group of people here are very good, a fine mix of skills, lots of contribution, it's fun |
| 00:09:35 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: ok what about my question is it high or is it low, are you feeling lucky? |
| 00:10:20 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: it is, you do what you can to contribute... Please ask question again. ;>) |
| 00:11:40 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: the WP pin on the ATMEL flash is a write protect, low and we can't reprogramme the first 256 pages, high and we can, it is connected, but to what? |
| 00:12:05 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: wait 1.... |
| 00:12:39 | ProtWork | oof. |
| 00:13:44 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: is an oof good or bad? |
| 00:14:00 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: WP# is tied to nRESET. So when the CPU is in the process of reseting the serial flash is write protected. when nRESET goes high (+3.3) and is no longer resetting, the write protect is removed. ( ie. you can write to it.) |
| 00:14:41 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: hmm, I wish I could :-(, Ok must be broken software. |
| 00:15:08 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: hmmm indeed, let me look at the Atmel spec... |
| 00:15:22 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: hang on resetting the serial flash, how does that happen, the CPU doesn't do it. |
| 00:16:58 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: Depends on the mood. Right now, it's bad. |
| 00:17:50 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: well this is a happy place, so sod off :-) |
| 00:18:17 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: just kidding. |
| 00:18:58 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: I just did all of my bus timing for a V3 coldfire to my peripherals, and hard-coded my wait states. Now, we're moving to a V4 coldfire, so I've got to re-calculate all my bus accesses. |
| 00:19:40 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: oof indeed |
| 00:19:55 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: When I've got about 20 peripherals tied to 8 chip selects, that is a DEFINATE oof. :-) |
| 00:22:12 | ProtWork | Anyways, that's how it goes right now. Not bad, just hate tearing up old work to replace it later. |
| 00:22:54 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: emphasising the positive, what does a V4 coldfire give you that the V3 didn't |
| 00:24:08 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: nRESET is tied to RESET# and WP#, just read over the Atmel, docs I cant find anything obvious, I'll look closer. How are you "reseting" the serial flash? and what programming modes are you using? |
| 00:24:50 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: 162MHz over 90MHz, higher bus speed, higher CPU speed, optimized ALU, dual pipelined hardware MAC, and lower power. |
| 00:26:22 | SpaceCoaster | Well a GPIO line is tied to chip select on the Atmel, and we clear it and wait 1us, no resetting that we know about. We use command 0x52 for reading (which works) and 0x82 for writing, which doesn't, we are using the SSP bus on the SA-1100. |
| 00:26:57 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: can't argue with that, more for less |
| 00:27:07 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: For $6 more, it's worth it. |
| 00:27:16 | ProtWork | Then again, a 200MHz Embedded PowerPC is just as cheap... |
| 00:27:44 | SpaceCoaster | ProtWork: how are you setup for manufacturing boards? |
| 00:27:59 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: We aren't. We outsource manufacturing. |
| 00:28:14 | ProtWork | SpaceCoaster: I've got a small home shop for assembly, which is how I'll do the VoIP boards. |
| 00:28:32 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: do you look at the status register to see if 1) the chip is ready, and 2) if it has finished the command? |
| 00:29:00 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: page 5 in the datasheet. |
| 00:29:09 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: er, no, too lazy, we don't give it any commands so it must be ready! |
| 00:30:18 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: it's a good idea though |
| 00:33:13 | ProtWork | But, it's time for me to get home. |
| 00:33:17 | ProtWork | Cya all later. |
| 00:35:47 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: so you can write to all other pages but the first 256? |
| 00:36:44 | SpaceCoaster | No, nothing writes, we think it is a protocol problem, on the wiki it is documented that the Atmel chips sometimes need an extra bit. |
| 00:38:36 | GPSFan | Sorry I mis-understood, I thought you could write to some but not all of it. |
| 00:39:06 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: where was the reference on the wiki? |
| 00:39:28 | SpaceCoaster | Oops found it, the data is in bits 15..8 not 7..0, we were writing zeros, which is what was in the blocks. The reference is the SPI pages, I did the bottom but. |
| 00:39:45 | SpaceCoaster | s/but/bit/ or maybe butt |
| 00:42:06 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: so I take it that that oops was the sound of the light comming on above your head. |
| 00:42:15 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: I think that it's a doc bug, 11.12.7.3 talks about left justified data, it is for output but not for input. |
| 00:43:31 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: it contradicts 11.12.11 which is correct |
| 00:44:44 | sammy | morning all ... |
| 00:45:10 | SpaceCoaster | hi sammy, sun still shining? |
| 00:46:18 | sammy | today is an overcast sky ... |
| 00:47:06 | SpaceCoaster | same here too, misty as well |
| 00:47:47 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: we wrote to the flash, 1 block from the front of /etc/services!! |
| 00:48:04 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: I see.... Whooooo |
| 00:48:10 | SilverBullet | SpaceCoaster: your welcome |
| 00:48:35 | SpaceCoaster | SilverBullet: indeed it was your legendary killing power that did it :-) |
| 00:48:40 | GPSFan | Clear & cold here in Colorado. |
| 00:48:56 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: do you have snow yet? |
| 00:49:32 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: in the mountains across the valley, yes for about 3 weeks now. Here at 6200' none yet... |
| 00:51:14 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: we are at 620' feet but we did get about 90inches of snow last winter. |
| 00:52:44 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: that's NH for you, the most we had on the ground at once was about 24". it was a pretty dry year, we ran out of irrigation water in mid September. |
| 00:54:03 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: did you read about wear leveling in the Atmel docs? |
| 00:55:37 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: sounded sortof like tyre rotation, we don't have to worry we will be using JFFS2 which garbage collects and compacts, it uses all the flash evenly, it is an append log which compacts when it hits the front. |
| 00:56:37 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: I run the SSP bus at full speed, seems to work great. |
| 00:57:09 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: that sounds like what they want you to do. Flash file systems sure have come a long way, Congrat's on full speed! |
| 00:58:30 | SpaceCoaster | 130KBytes/sec read, 8-16Kbytes write |
| 00:59:14 | GPSFan | Inferno be damned, here come the penguins! |
| 00:59:58 | SpaceCoaster | Indeed, we are giving these for Xmas so we are motivated! |
| 01:01:10 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: what are your thoughts on 3.3V - 5V PCMCIA? |
| 01:02:07 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: not much, isn't 5V more flexible, don't all cards support 5V? |
| 01:03:18 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: the spec says that all cards start out at 5V, and if the card wants 3.3v the controller can OPTIONALLY switch it over. |
| 01:03:52 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: I don't know how 3.3v only cards operate under thoes rules. |
| 01:04:08 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: Ahh, and if we don't they fry? Could we use a GPIO from somewhere to switch it? |
| 01:04:53 | bhima | are you sure that there are 3.3v-only cards? |
| 01:05:29 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: that's what prplague & I were discussing a week or so ago, but now with this Mod from Lucent I don't know. |
| 01:06:08 | GPSFan | bhima: the cards have been refered to as 3.3v only, I don't know what that really means, Haven't seen any real specs. |
| 01:06:12 | bhima | (3.3v-only as in only work on 3.3v, not as in only need 3.3v) |
| 01:06:26 | Alehaz | bhima: I suspect that there are 3.3v-only cards, because Toshiba recently released a warning that ToPIC95 cardbus bridges sometimes fry the hell out of 3.3v only cards |
| 01:06:41 | bhima | alehaz: oops. *ouch* |
| 01:06:54 | Alehaz | bhima: if the card is already inserted when the notebook is powered up from being completely dead - ie, no battery and no external power |
| 01:07:08 | Alehaz | the bridge will query the card, the card will say "3.3v please", and the bridge will apply 5v |
| 01:07:11 | Alehaz | *poof* |
| 01:07:14 | Alehaz | they swear it's very rare |
| 01:07:33 | bhima | they'd better hope it is, cause it'll cost them :) |
| 01:07:45 | bhima | actually, I think that some Newton ethernet cards have had problems if you leave them in when you reboot. |
| 01:07:52 | bhima | it doesn't seem to be a frequent problem. |
| 01:07:58 | bhima | I have just heard rare reports of it. |
| 01:08:06 | bhima | in that case, it's probably 12v doing it. |
| 01:08:15 | bhima | (older flash memory cards need 12v write) |
| 01:08:26 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: I would like a good solution, one with some neat hardware and software doing the right thing! |
| 01:08:37 | Alehaz | I have a 12v flash card here |
| 01:08:53 | bhima | in fact, that might be worth talking to somebody I know about. the first newtons _only_ work with 12v write/5v read. |
| 01:09:07 | bhima | mp2k works with 5v/5v and 12v/5v. emate is 5v/5v only. |
| 01:09:20 | Alehaz | on the subject of newtons, I think i have a couple linear flash cards too . . . or maybe one of them is linear sram |
| 01:09:33 | bhima | guy I know is writing an ATA driver for the Newton, so I suspect he knows a lot about those issues :) |
| 01:09:39 | bhima | alehaz: wanna sell some? :) |
| 01:10:14 | Alehaz | bhima: I might - I pulled 'em out of an old HP Omnibook 300 which looked like a neat piece of equipment but doesn't work |
| 01:10:30 | Alehaz | 'bout the size of a VHS tape in a rental box, 386sx, runs on AA batteries |
| 01:10:34 | Alehaz | 'cept this one doesn't run :) |
| 01:10:56 | bhima | has an NCR 31xx device. |
| 01:11:01 | Alehaz | I'm not certian where that box of parts is now. |
| 01:11:06 | bhima | 386SL/20, Windows for Pen Computing. |
| 01:11:18 | Alehaz | bhima: remind me on saturday and I'll dig 'em up |
| 01:11:27 | Alehaz | and then i can figure out what they actually are |
| 01:20:10 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: just had the desert call, MMMmmmm. I have some old Intes series 2 flash that needed 12V, so did earily sandisks. |
| 01:21:29 | GPSFan | there is a spare GPIO which could be used to reset the card, and with a Linear 1470 oe 1472 3-5v switching could be done. then you could have hot plugging. |
| 01:24:08 | GPSFan | s/Intes/Intel |
| 01:27:03 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: We sound like we are assembling a bandaid board for this thing? |
| 01:28:35 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: the original concept was to just have the LTC1470/1472 and cut & jumper the board as neccessary to provide the Reset & VCC switching functions. |
| 01:29:36 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: now it looks like we need re-routed audio and other things as well. I like what GoRk did with the audio, but it may not need the auxiliary board. |
| 01:30:12 | thekernel | is downloading data for his GPS maps from census.gov |
| 01:30:38 | thekernel | I'm over 200MB and I'm only on the 3rd state |
| 01:33:23 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: early days for the hw mods. |
| 01:34:33 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: yep, but that is why this is such a cool project, lots of good people learning neat stuff. |
| 01:36:50 | Alehaz | thekernel: but do Tiger maps include coordinates? |
| 01:38:08 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: both myself and SilverBullet have worked on all these areas in the past, but never with this type of access to such knowledgeable and friendly folk. |
| 01:40:32 | thekernel | Alehaz: do they, It's great they are in NAD83 format |
| 01:40:43 | Alehaz | thekernel: ah |
| 01:40:54 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: agreed. ;>) |
| 01:41:06 | thekernel | These maps are good enough to be sources for all of the major companies that produce maps. |
| 01:41:23 | SpaceCoaster | thekernel: I looked at that data before, what can you load it into to display it? |
| 01:41:25 | Alehaz | The last time i looked at a tiger map of my area i wasn't impressed |
| 01:42:15 | thekernel | I'm going to make a selection program that will distill all the info I need for a trip into something small enough for a CF |
| 01:42:39 | thekernel | major roads to my destination and finer grained data for the areas I'll be visiting. |
| 01:42:54 | thekernel | I'm also going to get a special case for my tuxscreen made. |
| 01:43:11 | thekernel | 8x8x1.5 inch |
| 01:43:39 | SpaceCoaster | thekernel: cool, keep us posted, RedBaron is doing the same, he has a friend who does such things. |
| 01:44:11 | thekernel | I'm going to get about 5 cases made and maybe get another tuxscreen. |
| 01:44:53 | thekernel | The cases will be for if anyone likes what I'm doing and would like to get one for their tuxscreen. |
| 01:45:19 | SpaceCoaster | thekernel: how do you get cases made? |
| 01:45:47 | thekernel | There is a sheet metal shop down the street from where I work. |
| 01:46:12 | thekernel | I'm going to draw up a design and take it there and get some made. |
| 01:47:13 | thekernel | I'll also be painting them so they look nice. |
| 01:50:55 | thekernel | I may be looking at 5GB for all of this map data |
| 01:51:29 | thekernel | It's a good thing I bought that 60GB drive a few weeks ago :) |
| 01:51:33 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: still around? |
| 01:52:55 | GoRK | hello |
| 01:53:17 | SpaceCoaster | says hi to the Music Man |
| 01:53:25 | GoRK | just dropped by for a bit to say hi |
| 01:53:31 | GoRK | is in dallas now |
| 01:53:52 | SpaceCoaster | Did you pick up the serial flash I posted, contained some params for you! |
| 01:53:57 | GoRK | what's the good word? any new fun developments since last night? |
| 01:54:21 | GoRK | spacecoaster yeah i downloaded it... im gonna check it out at some point during the trade show tomorrow with a hex editor whenever i get bored |
| 01:54:29 | SpaceCoaster | Yeah been I am now a serial flasher |
| 01:54:33 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: yep I'm just looking at the Lucent 5v mod trying to make sense out of it. |
| 01:55:07 | GoRK | spacecoaser: is that permData[] array that is referenced in inferno code acually the serial flash itself |
| 01:55:08 | GoRK | ? |
| 01:55:22 | SpaceCoaster | Be careful, some of those hardware mods are carrying a health warning, remember smoking can kill |
| 01:55:59 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: if you let the magic smoke out of the chips they stop working. |
| 01:56:39 | GoRK | i want to now what kurt mahan did that was different than the photos? they were sort of unclear though... |
| 01:56:42 | thekernel | Is anyone here working on anything for microwindows? |
| 01:56:45 | thekernel | asside from Cosmic |
| 01:57:00 | GoRK | GPSFan: that smoke is electricity... rather electricity is smoke... |
| 01:57:18 | GoRK | if you let the smoke out of electric stuff it stops working! |
| 01:57:30 | GPSFan | or anti-matter ;>) |
| 01:58:13 | SpaceCoaster | The file is called spkrdata.cfg and contains approx 149 bytes until the next file, looks like your data is in there but it might me a filesystem |
| 01:58:25 | SpaceCoaster | s/me/be/ |
| 01:58:40 | GoRK | is that file a filesystem of some sort orwhat? |
| 01:58:50 | GoRK | the data should be 500 bytes long |
| 01:58:54 | SpaceCoaster | GoRK: so where do the mirrors come into this? |
| 01:59:17 | GPSFan | With the smoke... nite all... |
| 01:59:31 | GoRK | SpaceCoaster: no mirrors.just wire pipes that carry smoke fromone chip to another. .. just dont melt a hole in the top.. you'll let the smoke out and the chip will stop working |
| 01:59:36 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: thanks for the memories |
| 01:59:44 | GoRK | nite gpsfan |
| 02:00:49 | SpaceCoaster | GoRK: Hmm, your task is to find the 500 bytes, most of the flash is 0xff |
| 02:01:39 | GoRK | spacecoaster cool:) |
| 02:02:28 | SpaceCoaster | GoRK: at least we are pretty sure it's in there this time, you will have fun finding it |
| 02:03:15 | SpaceCoaster | GoRK: the serial flash is behaving, wrote that MTD driver as you suggested, easy peasy, astonishing read speeds |
| 02:05:03 | SpaceCoaster | GoRK: GPSFan has given good pointers to 32MB memory issues, seems a case of just fixing up the memory registers and the kernel virtual memory map, hmm, but hopeful |
| 02:05:20 | GoRK | so i heard.. on both issues |
| 02:05:51 | SpaceCoaster | GoRK: what takes you to Dallas? |
| 02:06:31 | GoRK | trade show and some meetings |
| 02:07:28 | SpaceCoaster | Hmm I wonder how I initialise a 512k JFFS2 filesystem, any ideas? |
| 02:08:30 | GoRK | you probably need to just write an image to it |
| 02:19:03 | Alehaz | doesn't make sense to write compressed audio to a compressed filesystem . . . |
| 02:19:43 | Alehaz | still, jffs2 on the chip sounds cool, increases our total storage by 1/6th |
| 02:21:00 | SpaceCoaster | Alehaz: it might not be just for audio, and a filesystem is the right way and jffs2 handles all the funky write leveling etc. |
| 02:21:19 | SpaceCoaster | Alehaz: and it just paniced the kernel :-( |
| 02:21:26 | Alehaz | yeah |
| 02:21:38 | Alehaz | oof |
| 02:22:19 | SpaceCoaster | Alehaz: your task, should you choose to accept it, is to name the mount point, always the most contentious part. |
| 02:23:11 | Alehaz | waits for the messenger to self-destruct |
| 02:23:21 | Alehaz | lemme think for a bit |
| 02:25:05 | DeepThought | ponders this most interesting problem |
| 02:25:28 | GoRK | so use jffs2 without compression.. you can do it |
| 02:25:37 | GoRK | anyway i gotta go.. bbiab |
| 02:25:49 | GoRK | err |
| 02:25:59 | GoRK | not bbiab.. probalby more like talk to you all tomorrow |
| 02:26:06 | DeepThought | see ya |
| 02:26:11 | Alehaz | DeepThought: /bran |
| 02:26:15 | GoRK | he. bye |
| 02:26:19 | GoRK | eh |
| 02:26:21 | GoRK | heh |
| 02:26:31 | GoRK | this laptop kbs sucks. i need to clean it |
| 02:26:32 | GoRK | later |
| 02:26:41 | Alehaz | later gork |
| 02:27:19 | DeepThought | sortof a pun of wheaties and "cereal" flash, hmmm |
| 02:27:43 | Alehaz | yeah |
| 02:32:13 | DeepThought | I think I'll open this competition up to the general public tomorrow, so sleep on it Alehaz |
| 02:32:40 | Alehaz | DeepThought: Ask a silly person, get a silly answer |
| 02:33:18 | DeepThought | Alehaz: no it was a good answer, I just didn't like it :-) |
| 02:34:41 | Alehaz | heh |
| 02:35:25 | Alehaz | toast is a possibility |
| 02:35:31 | Alehaz | part of this complete breakfast, all that |
| 02:36:14 | hypaStyle | . |
| 02:36:37 | DeepThought | Ahh, a theme |
| 02:38:37 | Alehaz | I have an aversion to mongoose themes, since the mongoose was the pathetic mascot of my pathetic highschool |
| 02:40:16 | Alehaz | but don't let that stop you - i just won't ponder stuff along those lines myself |
| 02:41:32 | DeepThought | It's a tricky one but I suspect that the mongoose is not in the running either. |
| 02:43:59 | DeepThought | Hmm, was that a contribution from hypaStyle, very minimalist but I think . is already taken. |
| 02:46:11 | Alehaz | it's atmel serial data flash on SPI? |
| 02:46:24 | DeepThought | correct |
| 02:47:06 | Alehaz | that's not particularly inspiring :) |
| 02:47:08 | SilverBullet | DeepThought: maybe something from flash gordon, ie. /mondo |
| 02:47:19 | Alehaz | mathmos |
| 02:47:52 | Alehaz | no wait, that's from barbarella |
| 02:48:01 | Alehaz | different corny old scifi movie |
| 02:48:04 | Alehaz | sorr |
| 02:48:06 | Alehaz | y |
| 02:48:13 | Alehaz | I don't even remember flash gordon |
| 02:48:45 | DeepThought | not even the song, we sing it a lot here lately |
| 02:49:06 | DeepThought | "flash, aaaahhh" |
| 02:49:36 | Alehaz | heh |
| 02:49:44 | Alehaz | i only remember that part of the song |
| 02:51:38 | DeepThought | See you on the morrow, Mr Alehaz |
| 02:52:17 | Alehaz | cya |
| 05:55:16 | BZFlag | nite |
| 09:14:03 | scanline | is away: zzzzz |
| 13:18:52 | CosmicPenguin | Morning all |
| 13:19:04 | prpplague | morning CosmicPenguin |
| 13:19:54 | Geyz | hi CP |
| 13:20:13 | GPSFan | 'mornin CP et al. |
| 13:21:59 | CosmicPenguin | Any fun stuff happen last night? |
| 13:23:54 | GPSFan | BZ was busy updating wiki pages. |
| 13:26:00 | CosmicPenguin | GPSFan: Any news on the mod? Has someone come up with some prices? |
| 13:26:47 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: what mod? pcmcia? |
| 13:27:42 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: Is there another mod? |
| 13:29:29 | SpaceCoaster | CosmicPenguin: audio |
| 13:31:15 | Geyz|||||||||||||||||||||||||T | argh! |
| 13:31:40 | GPSFan | CosmicPenguin: there wassome banter last night about the audio board mod costing ~$30US, but still too early to tell. I have no comment as yet, since GoRK seemed to be able to achieve the same effect without all the circuitry. |
| 13:36:15 | CosmicPenguin | Thats the second time in as many days that X has locked up when the screensaver comes back.... |
| 13:38:35 | thekernel | CosmicPenguin: I'm 2.3GB into my downloads of the census data for my GPS, I also found the file record format data for all of it. |
| 13:39:19 | thekernel | This should be easy to parse, they are all fixed length records. |
| 13:39:28 | CosmicPenguin | thekernel: Wow...... I guess thats why most GPS units have a CD/DVD huh? |
| 13:40:15 | thekernel | Yes, but I don't think I'll be keeping all the political boundaries and zoning and little roads that you need a 4x4 to go on. |
| 13:41:00 | thekernel | There is penty of stuff to compress out |
| 13:41:02 | CosmicPenguin | thekernel: Why else have a GPS? |
| 13:41:31 | thekernel | I can keep all that crap for my destination, but the roads getting there I only need highways. |
| 13:42:28 | thekernel | Thats the A1? and A2? records I don't need A[3-6]? and H[1-6]? records are just if I want to know where my bodies of water are. |
| 13:44:03 | AlHaz | it's why most gps units use vector maps instead of raster maps . . |
| 13:44:07 | thekernel | anyway, I gotta go and come in to work |
| 13:44:57 | thekernel | AlHaz, that's reasonable enough. I may consider making them vector maps. |
| 13:45:15 | CosmicPenguin | thekernel: Yeah, you know, most of us usually show up about 8:00....... especially when we have to release in two days |
| 13:45:32 | AlHaz | thekernel: iirc census.gov offers them in their own vector format, just gotta have a progam that can render 'em |
| 13:46:01 | thekernel | AlHaz: I'm downloading my files from census.gov |
| 13:46:43 | thekernel | www.census.gov/geo/www/tiger/tiger2k/ |
| 13:46:53 | AlHaz | thekernel: yeah, that's what i mean - tiger maps are available as a raster image and in their own vector format |
| 13:46:57 | thekernel | I have a php script doing it all for me, it's been running since last night. |
| 13:47:28 | thekernel | didn't I say I was leaving? bbl |
| 13:48:44 | AlHaz | hmm, those files are in some vector format . . . |
| 13:53:36 | mallum | do you guys not have your own internal irc server ? ;) |
| 13:54:43 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: you want us to leave???? :) |
| 13:55:03 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: of course not ! |
| 13:55:40 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: Nah, we talked about an internal IRC, but since we're all on openprojects anyway, we just hang out here.... we have our own room that we mess around in too.... |
| 13:56:26 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: cool, there alot of tech's at your co ? |
| 13:57:09 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: Yep... we do embedded linux, so we've got a lot of geeky folks walking around |
| 13:58:48 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: nice |
| 14:12:07 | CosmicPenguin | AlHaz: Tell me something.... I can either either run 3 daemons and get PPP at 115200 across bluetooth, or I can plug in a 802.11B module and instantly get 11Mbs.... who was the idiot that thought bluetooth would work? |
| 14:18:44 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: I think bluetooth is doomed |
| 14:19:31 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: I think so too..... |
| 14:19:53 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: Apparently alot of bluetooth devices wont speak to each other cos different manufacturers implement the spec differently |
| 14:20:32 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: I think the 802.11 underdog has now slipped to far ahead |
| 14:21:20 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: BTW do use use the beast that is emacs ? |
| 14:22:06 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: The only thing is that Bluetooth is alot like Java.... its not very useful, but everyone talks about it in very hushed tones.... |
| 14:22:17 | CosmicPenguin | So I think it will survive.. |
| 14:22:28 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: I do use Emacs, and I am proud... :) |
| 14:23:19 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: cool :), tried emacs21 yet ? |
| 14:23:34 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: Can't get the damn thing to compile from CVS.... you? |
| 14:25:16 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: apt-get install emacs21 :) |
| 14:25:42 | CosmicPenguin | ahhh.... |
| 14:25:47 | CosmicPenguin | anyway, you like it? |
| 14:26:49 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: yeah, really nice |
| 14:27:02 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: still trying to figure out exactly what new stuff it does |
| 14:27:40 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: apart from color terms, artistic mode is novel and re-builder is interesting |
| 14:27:48 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: the new eshell is nice too |
| 14:30:52 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: I like the idea of the image viewers... |
| 14:32:22 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: yeah, you use emacs for mail too ? |
| 14:34:01 | Alehaz | I think bluetooth had some potential to become a sortof desktop bus |
| 14:34:13 | Alehaz | ericsson is being a bastard about it, tho |
| 14:34:29 | Alehaz | and it's not nearly a cheap as they say it is |
| 14:35:43 | Alehaz | i certianly wouldn't use it for networking computers, tho it might have been nice to use it in lieu of irda on my handheld |
| 14:36:42 | mallum | Alehaz: yeah as long as different devices from different manufacturers will speak to each other |
| 14:37:17 | mallum | Alehaz: like I dont think an errison bluetooth phone will speak to a sony bluetooth laptop |
| 14:37:37 | Alehaz | mallum: not surprising |
| 14:38:45 | Alehaz | i think a good comparison here might be USB . . . . |
| 14:39:12 | Alehaz | I think USB is a pretty reasonable way of eliminating the ps/2 ports, printer port, serial ports, etc |
| 14:39:34 | Alehaz | joysticks, too |
| 14:39:55 | Alehaz | but then people jumped on it and started cranking out cd-rw drives, network interfaces, etc |
| 14:40:06 | Alehaz | which all suck, because the bus just isn't fast enough |
| 14:40:39 | Alehaz | and wasn't even designed with that sort of thing in mind |
| 14:41:01 | Alehaz | I've got a usb tv tuner here i picked up at a thrift store for $5, uses 100% of the available usb bandwidth to send compressed video |
| 14:41:12 | Alehaz | and the audio is out of sync 'cause it's not sent over usb |
| 14:41:42 | mallum | heh |
| 14:42:45 | Alehaz | IIRC, after all the overhead, usb has less bandwidth than 10baseT ethernet |
| 14:42:57 | Alehaz | and it's a polled interface, sheesh |
| 14:44:00 | Alehaz | if apple hadn't been so fickle with firewire, we'd all be using that instead |
| 14:44:22 | Alehaz | at this point most motherboard makers won't integrate it even if it's free just out of spite |
| 14:45:03 | Alehaz | ericsson's being a hundred times worse with bluetooth than apple was with firewire |
| 14:45:54 | Alehaz | I've only seen one reasonable application of bluetooth and it's that silly looking headset |
| 14:46:06 | prpplague | has anyone found a pdf spec sheet for the lm8v31 lcd panel on the tuxscreen? |
| 14:49:47 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: Is nanox what microwindows is based on ? |
| 14:50:48 | Alehaz | http://www.sharp.co.jp/e-device/ctlg/lcd/lm8v31.pdf |
| 14:52:23 | Alehaz | hmm, 404, sorry |
| 14:52:33 | prpplague | ya already ran into that |
| 14:52:43 | Alehaz | http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:qytEsVFytbs:www.sharp.co.jp/e-device/ctlg/lcd/lm8v31.pdf+lm8v31 |
| 14:53:23 | prpplague | damm didn't even think about checking the cached version |
| 15:01:24 | prpplague | collord: howdy, i'm working on the pics now |
| 15:01:36 | prpplague | collord: should have a page up in 20minutes |
| 15:03:03 | collord | prpplague: you boot linux? |
| 15:03:41 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: Microwindows is actually a collection of a few things..... |
| 15:04:02 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: There is the microwindows engine, which then has a number of APIs on top of it |
| 15:04:22 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: Including Nano-X (which is the XLIB like API) and then win32 api (which is win32 compatible) |
| 15:05:11 | prpplague | collord: negative not yet, had a handle and emergency network issue since wed, |
| 15:05:50 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: ok, I was just checking a page about running Mozilla on top of nanox |
| 15:06:31 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: from Tuxia? |
| 15:07:00 | mallum | yep |
| 15:08:47 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: Yeah, I guess they have it all working.... they haven't bothered to tell us how they did it, though.... |
| 15:08:56 | CosmicPenguin | One of the problems with the MPL, I guess.... :( |
| 15:09:54 | mallum | CosmicPenguin: There a different company ? |
| 15:13:43 | CosmicPenguin | mallum: yep |
| 15:16:18 | prpplague | collord: you have the link on compgeeks page for the ceiva unit? |
| 15:17:28 | collord | prpplague: sold out... http://www.compgeeks.com/additem.asp?invtid=PHOTOFRAME |
| 15:17:49 | prpplague | doh |
| 15:18:02 | prpplague | did you get one? |
| 15:19:18 | collord | prpplague: good question... should be... |
| 15:20:21 | collord | prpplague: you can get them for $99 a lot of places |
| 15:27:03 | collord | prpplague: yes, after a mixup with cc addresses and such, they're coming |
| 15:52:13 | prpplague | collord: http://www.abcsinc.com/small-linux/ceiva/ceiva.htm |
| 15:54:33 | AlHazWork | it uses the same lcd as the tux? |
| 15:54:35 | collord | prpplague: awesome... ooh, the magic board |
| 15:54:58 | prpplague | collord: you know the "magic board" ? |
| 15:55:48 | collord | prpplague: no, just thought it was funny. ala "forbidden donut" |
| 15:56:21 | AlHazWork | homer's soul donut? |
| 15:56:33 | AlHazWork | wonder if one of those unpopulated headers is a debugger port |
| 15:57:25 | collord | prpplague: how many layer pcb? |
| 15:58:27 | AlHazWork | so, how much ram & flash? |
| 15:58:42 | prpplague | collord: i'm no pcb expert, but it looks like 6 |
| 15:59:12 | prpplague | but it doesn't look like they are using all 6 layers |
| 16:00:39 | prpplague | lot of the empty headers look like maybe the board might have been intended orginally to used as a battery power mobile device |
| 16:06:14 | prpplague | i'm off to lunch |
| 16:06:44 | prpplague_lunch | if you guys think of anything you need as far as info on the ceiva put on the web page let me know |
| 16:10:36 | collord | so is that 6MB RAM on the ceiva? |
| 16:13:43 | prpplague_lunch | there are three ram chips however the third one seems to be wired to the epson lcd controler |
| 16:16:10 | collord | prpplague_lunch: oh right. pitiful. wonder if any of they left the serial line exposed... |
| 16:26:58 | EduardoB | hello |
| 16:27:04 | EduardoB | I'm Eduardo from Brazil. |
| 16:27:54 | EduardoB | :) |
| 16:39:02 | Lenolium | *plong* |
| 17:11:07 | sekn | could the tuxscreen be used as a serial terminal? |
| 17:11:24 | AlHazWork | yes |
| 17:11:26 | AlHazWork | but why? |
| 17:11:50 | AlHazWork | it would make an annoying serial terminal due to the silly infrared keyboard |
| 17:15:22 | AlHazWork | and real serial terminals are so widely available . . . . usually in dumpsters |
| 17:16:34 | MacAtack | hey hey Just got me two TuxScreens TODAY |
| 17:17:35 | AlHazWork | neat |
| 17:20:47 | Niddix | I'm hoping that mine will be waiting on my front porch when I get home. |
| 17:21:14 | MacAtack | now i just gota figure out how to get linux on it ;) |
| 17:50:52 | CosmicPenguin | Gmate sez they will start shipping Yopy's next month.... |
| 17:50:59 | CosmicPenguin | I'll believe it when I see it, but good luck to em... :) |
| 17:51:45 | AlHazWork | sharp says the same thing about the us version zaurus |
| 17:57:35 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: ya i have two yopy's and gmate's "tech support" has been terrible |
| 17:57:59 | ctr | is kernel hack0ring |
| 17:58:14 | prpplague | i like the design, i just wish it had a pcmcia slot instead of cf |
| 17:58:58 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: I don't mind the CF... I like it because it forces manufactuers to come out with a CF version of whatever PCMCIA card they have..... |
| 17:59:10 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: true |
| 17:59:45 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: the other big thing for me is that i want a pda with a 640x480 display |
| 17:59:50 | CosmicPenguin | AlHazWork: The sharp has a JVM on it doesn't it? |
| 18:00:01 | AlHazWork | CosmicPenguin: Yeah |
| 18:00:06 | BZFlag | prpplague: still a small screen? or a large pad? |
| 18:00:20 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: Like a web pad? |
| 18:00:36 | prpplague | BZFlag: ya small screen not like a web pad |
| 18:01:41 | prpplague | i've been playing with the sharp lm64 series lcd's |
| 18:02:12 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: So, its pretty readable? |
| 18:05:41 | prpplague | ya reads great, its the same lcd panel that telxon/symbol uses - http://www.symbol.com/products/mobile_computers/mobile_pen_touch_ptc-2134.html |
| 18:07:08 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: color or bw? |
| 18:07:48 | prpplague | that one is bw, but the color series is available for only ~$10 more |
| 18:08:14 | prpplague | i'd buy one of those symbol units to use, but at $6795, thats not happening |
| 18:11:27 | CosmicPenguin | Is the same lcd on this one: http://www.symbol.com/products/mobile_computers/mobile_ppc_ppt2800.html |
| 18:13:24 | BZFlag | CosmicPenguin: no, that one says 1/4 VGA |
| 18:14:16 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: Ok, because the display on that on sucks... |
| 18:14:58 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: ya that one is terrible |
| 18:15:42 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: you've seen one? Do you like them? |
| 18:16:30 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: ya our symbol rep keeps trying to sell them to us |
| 18:17:37 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: symbol won't co-operate on putting linux on it and the screen is too small for us, and the a price of around $4k is just not attractive |
| 18:17:40 | CosmicPenguin | The only cool thing about them is the bar code reader... I swear, if you stand back, that thing can scan a barcode 5 feet wide.... |
| 18:17:59 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: Symbol won't co-operate with putting linux on it? |
| 18:18:25 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: they just laughed and said "ya right..." |
| 18:21:19 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: the bastards! |
| 18:23:03 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: http://home.intermec.com./eprise/main/Intermec/Content/Products/Products_ShowDetail?section=Products&Product=CMPTR700&Category=CMPTR&Family=CMPTR2 |
| 18:24:03 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: that unit is about $1700 and is very nice |
| 18:24:21 | CosmicPenguin | they put linux on it? |
| 18:24:49 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: intermec doesn't but they are interested in getting someone to put it on the unit |
| 18:25:28 | CosmicPenguin | Cool...... |
| 18:26:25 | CosmicPenguin | Looks like it has 64MB on board with a 32MB CF? |
| 18:26:52 | CosmicPenguin | We should get one and see how far familiar gets.... |
| 18:28:17 | prpplague | my problem is i still think $1700 for that unit is too high |
| 18:28:33 | prpplague | i want to get something around $1k |
| 18:43:16 | prpplague | i want to see what the quality of HNT's handheld's lcd will be |
| 18:44:40 | AlHazWork | HNT? |
| 18:48:52 | BZFlag | we should start a wiki page with links to other hardware. thoughts? |
| 18:49:39 | BZFlag | stuff like the cerfpod, yopy, zaurus, ipaq, hnt, symbol, lart, etc. |
| 18:50:18 | BZFlag | OtherToys ? ;-) |
| 18:51:54 | BZFlag | started, hack away |
| 18:54:24 | Niddix | Can you unprotect the tux with the JTag without 12v? |
| 18:54:41 | BZFlag | no |
| 18:54:55 | BZFlag | you can with jtag and 12v though. |
| 18:55:02 | Niddix | right. |
| 18:55:04 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: Shouldn't that be OtherARMToys/ |
| 18:55:18 | Niddix | I guess you'd only need to do that if you can't get inferno running? |
| 18:55:19 | BZFlag | CosmicPenguin: no, I plan to add Audrey links too. |
| 18:55:28 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: Ok.... :) |
| 18:55:35 | BZFlag | Niddix: right. |
| 18:56:12 | BZFlag | CosmicPenguin: I will reorg it, I;m just dumping in links as reminders now. |
| 18:57:12 | BZFlag | link to HNT ? |
| 18:57:30 | prpplague | BZFlag: http://www.abcsinc.com/small-linux/platforms.htm |
| 18:58:03 | prpplague | BZFlag: stand by i'll get a link for HNT |
| 18:58:44 | prpplague | BZFlag: http://www.hntek.com |
| 19:03:48 | BZFlag | well, I'm done for now. we should add basic summaries and such. I gotta get to work. ;-) back later. |
| 19:15:53 | MacAtack | i dont' wana turn my tuxscreen into a slick looking paperweight... what is the best method to unlock this device? |
| 19:16:09 | AlHazWork | MacAtack: Make certian you hooked up the 12v correctly and go for it |
| 19:16:20 | AlHazWork | if you hook up 12v to the wrong lines you can fry it |
| 19:16:23 | MacAtack | AlHazWork: ok |
| 19:16:34 | AlHazWork | otherwise, jtag can alwyas save it |
| 19:18:31 | CosmicPenguin | MacAtack: Its really easy |
| 19:18:34 | MacAtack | i havn't read much on jtag yet.. |
| 19:19:01 | MacAtack | i just got these sweeet devices today.. so i think i'm gonna read everything i can get my mitts on and then go hacking on it when i know WTF is going on |
| 19:21:04 | MacAtack | i plan on using this device for a VoIP Phone :) |
| 19:22:30 | MacAtack | stupid newbie question: what is WIKI? |
| 19:25:04 | prpplague | MacAtack: just a way of providing collabrative information |
| 19:28:19 | MacAtack | ahh ok |
| 19:31:30 | prpplague | MacAtack: http://www.tuxscreen.net/wiki/ |
| 19:37:14 | MacAtack | BZFlag: just received my two tuxscreens today.. thanks |
| 19:37:55 | MacAtack | prpplague: yeah i saw that there just didn't know what WIKI really ment |
| 19:39:36 | collord | MacAtack: the original... http://c2.com/cgi/wiki |
| 19:42:42 | MacAtack | collord: cool thanks |
| 19:43:02 | scanline | is back (gone 10:28:59) |
| 19:43:39 | scanline | is away: class |
| 20:14:33 | CosmicPenguin | Ok, well.... I've got 60Kb/s on the bluetooth... only 240Kb/s to go... :) |
| 20:20:55 | scanline | is back (gone 00:37:16) |
| 20:48:23 | CosmicPenguin | Anyone know if mallum put his keyboard code on the web somewhere? |
| 20:56:01 | as_ | Evnin all. |
| 21:02:05 | scanline | good evening |
| 21:02:24 | CosmicPenguin | scanline: as_: How are all of you doing? |
| 21:03:03 | scanline | happy friday! |
| 21:03:18 | scanline | (I'm glad it's friday, but not looking forward to the math test next week) |
| 21:19:43 | as_ | Hiya CP, looking at thermopile detectors. |
| 21:20:03 | as_ | Along with a few other weird and wonderful things. |
| 21:20:10 | CosmicPenguin | as_: A great way to spend the evening???? |
| 21:20:34 | as_ | I agree, wonder why other people dont do this. |
| 21:20:45 | as_ | There loss I suppose. |
| 21:21:34 | scanline | I think compiling these Japanese fonts will use all my memory... |
| 21:21:56 | CosmicPenguin | scanline: you suport unicode? |
| 21:22:16 | scanline | CosmicPenguin: As of yesterday, yes |
| 21:22:25 | CosmicPenguin | wow.... |
| 21:22:48 | scanline | Still debugging the UTF-8 decoder, but I've got it displaying some Japanese text right now |
| 21:23:07 | scanline | Darn Japanese font is huge though |
| 21:23:21 | CosmicPenguin | Well, yeah... there are like 260 charaters aren't there? |
| 21:24:11 | scanline | I don't know... |
| 21:24:15 | scanline | this font is 1.5 MB |
| 21:24:50 | scanline | I don't know anything about the language, I'm just comparing PicoGUI's output to Mozilla |
| 21:29:26 | BZFlag | CosmicPenguin: I assume you meant 2600 characters? that would be closer. |
| 21:29:43 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: Really? I was just guessing |
| 21:29:54 | CosmicPenguin | I know there were more than 26 and less than a million.... |
| 21:30:18 | BZFlag | yeah, 600 characters required for like 12th grade, close to 3000 in common usage. |
| 21:31:07 | scanline | CosmicPenguin: doesn't microwindows support unicode? |
| 21:31:16 | BZFlag | plus the phonetics which have, hmm... not sure, perhaps like 40 each? |
| 21:31:46 | CosmicPenguin | scanline: It supports unicode, but it has to be patched.... we have so many asian folks on the mailing list that play with that |
| 21:33:14 | AlHazWork | hm, another one of my friends is unemployed. Anybody know anyone in texas who needs a java programmer who doesn't suck? |
| 21:52:30 | scanline | is away: food |
| 21:53:28 | BZFlag | heh, check out the awesome Galleo web site: http://www.galleo.com/ |
| 21:53:52 | ctr | BZFlag: know much about linux+usb? |
| 21:54:06 | BZFlag | ctr: quite a bit, yeah. |
| 21:54:29 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: whats up with that? |
| 21:55:07 | ctr | BZFlag: ok, i am trying to hack together a device driver for my mp3 player |
| 21:55:24 | ctr | BZFlag: i dont know the specs of the protocol used - any ideas hopw i could find out? |
| 21:55:27 | BZFlag | CosmicPenguin: no idea. I was just saw a picture of ELJ with the galleo on the cover and thought I'd check it out. |
| 21:55:58 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: That was an older copy, wasn't it? |
| 21:56:09 | CosmicPenguin | I haven't heard boo about the galleo since it gca |
| 21:56:14 | BZFlag | ctr: you have tried all the different serial drivers? you know the usb id, and it's not listed anywhere? You have searched the net for other folks working on it? |
| 21:56:18 | CosmicPenguin | s/gca/came/ |
| 21:56:38 | CosmicPenguin | ctr: Hook it up to a windows box and use Snoopy..... |
| 21:56:50 | CosmicPenguin | I used it for my TuxPal project, and it worked awesome.... |
| 21:56:58 | CosmicPenguin | http://cosmic.linuxhost.cc |
| 21:57:41 | CosmicPenguin | USB snoopy: http://home.jps.net/~koma/ |
| 21:58:26 | collord | CosmicPenguin: that is sooooooooo cool |
| 21:58:56 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: cool |
| 21:59:39 | collord | ctr: aren't those mp3 players just mass-storage? |
| 21:59:43 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: you rock |
| 21:59:50 | collord | ctr: i mean, most |
| 21:59:54 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: thats what i wanted |
| 22:00:49 | ctr | collord: there are no devices in the kernel for it |
| 22:00:51 | BZFlag | http://embedded.linuxjournal.com/magazine/issue04/ <- july 2001 |
| 22:01:06 | ctr | collord: and i'd rather hack out a driver than have to reboot ecery time i want to copy some music onto it |
| 22:01:30 | CosmicPenguin | Snoopy is the very best... My boss used it to write a USB driver for his Lego robot controller too.... |
| 22:01:31 | ctr | ok |
| 22:01:32 | ctr | brb |
| 22:01:41 | ctr | i am going to reboot :) |
| 22:08:59 | ctr | ok |
| 22:09:03 | ctr | am in 2k |
| 22:09:03 | ctr | :) |
| 22:09:07 | ctr | going to do some snooping |
| 22:09:43 | CosmicPenguin | ctr: Godspeed... :) |
| 22:12:15 | ctr | fuck me cp |
| 22:12:18 | ctr | this rocks |
| 22:12:21 | scanline | is back (gone 00:19:50) |
| 22:12:23 | ctr | this is just what i am looking for |
| 22:12:38 | AlHazWork | Bah. |
| 22:13:28 | ctr | 0000: 01 00 00 00 00 00 cf 07 |
| 22:13:33 | ctr | ^^^i take it thats the packet |
| 22:18:45 | CosmicPenguin | Yeah, thats the pyload.... you know how USB works, right? |
| 22:20:09 | ctr | give me a quick run through so that i can tell if i have got it right |
| 22:20:47 | ctr | (if you dont mind) |
| 22:21:35 | CosmicPenguin | Its really easy - you've got your two types of packets called URBs |
| 22:21:42 | ctr | ok |
| 22:22:06 | CosmicPenguin | One is a control packet, basically it has a payload, a value, and an index.... |
| 22:22:18 | ctr | ok |
| 22:22:20 | CosmicPenguin | THe other is a bulk packet, it just sends raw data... |
| 22:22:20 | ctr | like |
| 22:22:23 | ctr | start comms |
| 22:22:26 | ctr | end comms |
| 22:22:46 | ctr | and that would be used for shipping data over to it |
| 22:22:50 | CosmicPenguin | Exactly.... the control packets send some of control to the device, while a bulk packet is like a write(fd, buffer, size) |
| 22:23:37 | CosmicPenguin | so, for example, the DotPal gets a series of control packets, each one with a command saying how homer should move (ie, shake his head, move his arms) |
| 22:26:31 | ctr | ok |
| 22:27:29 | ctr | and the stuff is just a block of bytes |
| 22:27:33 | ctr | ? |
| 22:27:57 | BZFlag | heh, msystems wants another 13 phones. ;-) |
| 22:28:42 | GPSFan | BZFlag: Hi, I think I've found a way to unlock the flash without using 12v. |
| 22:28:52 | ctr | GPSFan: oh? |
| 22:28:54 | BZFlag | GPSFan: explain? |
| 22:28:56 | Russ | GPSFan: how's that? |
| 22:29:00 | ctr | heh |
| 22:29:06 | ctr | notes the ears pick up in here |
| 22:29:11 | scanline | GPSFan: You've found a great way to get our attention |
| 22:29:58 | GPSFan | Looking at the schematics, I noticed 2 things, 1) the Flash doesn't need 12v. and 2 the 12V detector is just an inverter with a voltage divider on its input. |
| 22:30:36 | GPSFan | So, if you jumper the gate input to 3.3V you get the same effect as if you connected 12V to the top of the divider. |
| 22:30:59 | GPSFan | Here is where you need connect the jumper: http://tuxscreen.net/download/schematics/12v.jpg |
| 22:31:52 | GPSFan | The pad on the left is 3.3V, the one on the right is the gate's input. |
| 22:32:07 | scanline | Have you tested it? |
| 22:32:07 | Russ | GPSFan: when the flash receives 12V, it can be unlocked |
| 22:32:13 | Russ | the 12V detect is for inferno |
| 22:32:24 | Russ | afaik |
| 22:34:10 | GPSFan | No, not yet, remember my tux is in pieces. To be safe when testing I would use a 100-200 ohm resistor in place of the jumper. that way if you accidently touch ground with either end you are safe. BTW I got left & right backwards, the left pad in the pix is the gate. |
| 22:34:53 | CosmicPenguin | BZFlag: Msystems? as in the DOC people? |
| 22:35:10 | BZFlag | CosmicPenguin: yep. |
| 22:35:13 | GPSFan | The unlock signal is purely an indication to Inferno that you really want it unlocked. Linux can do as it pleases. |
| 22:35:14 | CosmicPenguin | Wow... |
| 22:35:28 | CosmicPenguin | GPSFan: Yeah, I've seen code that checks for the 12V... :) |
| 22:36:17 | scanline | So it should be theoretically possible to go from new flash-locked Tux to Linux using only software... |
| 22:36:35 | GPSFan | There jumper options to allow the use of flash that does require 12V, but the parts on the list and on my Tux don't. |
| 22:36:47 | BZFlag | http://www.amd.com/products/nvd/techdocs/22358.pdf <- flash data sheet is missing. |
| 22:37:43 | Russ | BZFlag: I have local copies |
| 22:37:53 | Russ | BZFlag: I use the same flash on my board |
| 22:38:00 | BZFlag | GPSFan: too many negatives in that.... the parts on the tux do not need 12v to unlock? what voltage do they need? |
| 22:38:35 | BZFlag | Russ: scp to tuxscreen.net downloads? |
| 22:38:41 | GPSFan | None. it is a command you send to the flash, I'm posting the datasheet now... |
| 22:39:07 | BZFlag | there is a flash unlock pin on the chip, no? |
| 22:39:12 | GPSFan | http://tuxscreen.net/download/schematics/am29lv160.pdf |
| 22:39:50 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: thats really useful btw :) |
| 22:40:07 | BZFlag | what's on WE# now? |
| 22:40:51 | GPSFan | Page 24 is the command reference, WE# goes to nWE of the CPU. |
| 22:42:34 | GPSFan | Schematic of the flash is: http://tuxscreen.net/download/schematics/flash.pdf |
| 22:42:44 | BZFlag | V IH is 12v +- 5v no? |
| 22:43:32 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: thanks once again |
| 22:44:05 | Russ | BZFlag: grab the DCC |
| 22:44:14 | CosmicPenguin | ctr: No problem...... like Space Coaster says, share and enjoy |
| 22:44:19 | BZFlag | GPSFan: do the schematics include the 2 test points we are using at 12v now? |
| 22:44:25 | Russ | if RESET# has 12V, then you have temporary sector unprotect |
| 22:44:40 | GPSFan | BZFlag: VIH for what pin, page 30 says VCC+ .3v, page 1 says single supply operration. |
| 22:44:55 | Russ | VIL |
| 22:44:58 | BZFlag | Russ: no can do from here. |
| 22:45:51 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: i reckon by the end of the weekend i should have a driver that can query information and what not |
| 22:46:03 | ctr | CosmicPenguin: then it's time to create a /dev entry so files can be written to it |
| 22:46:38 | Russ | GPSFan: dcc/ |
| 22:46:40 | Russ | ? |
| 22:47:14 | BZFlag | ah, sorry. I meant VID for RESET# |
| 22:47:14 | GPSFan | BZFlag: they are not labeled as such, the CPUpwr.jpg page has the 12V flash unlock signal labeled. |
| 22:48:40 | GPSFan | Russ: my ISP's firewall won't let dss in/out. |
| 22:49:21 | Russ | ctr? |
| 22:50:02 | BZFlag | so, 12v is required to change protect status, but it is possible to write to a protected page without 12v? |
| 22:50:19 | BZFlag | just by jumpering the 3.3v? |
| 22:50:22 | Russ | ok, ctr has it, gtg |
| 22:50:38 | ctr | thanks |
| 22:51:13 | BZFlag | Russ: that's just the data sheet at http://tuxscreen.net/download/schematics/am29lv160.pdf right? |
| 22:51:42 | pattieja | is away: home |
| 23:01:59 | Russ | ya |
| 23:02:03 | GPSFan | BZFlag: I see the diagram on page 40 showing RESET# tied to 12V to do temproary sector unprotect. The Schematic shows the circuits to isolate nRESET from the 12V Flash Unlock voltage. I think I jumpped to the wrong conclusion, please accept my appologies for getting everyone's hopes up. |
| 23:02:40 | Lenolium | *pling* |
| 23:03:57 | CosmicPenguin | alright, all time to head for the homestead... have a good weekend, ya hear? |
| 23:06:10 | Tangent | Evening all |
| 23:06:28 | scanline | good evening |
| 23:07:28 | SpaceCoaster | What's your angle, Tangent |
| 23:07:41 | scanline | It's a good sine |
| 23:07:57 | SpaceCoaster | lol |
| 23:08:17 | SpaceCoaster | Are we on the slippery slope? |
| 23:08:34 | Tangent | I hope so COS I NEed the slope |
| 23:08:43 | scanline | i think so... sliding down puns |
| 23:10:28 | Tangent | Anything interesting happened? 5V PCMCIA? |
| 23:11:49 | SpaceCoaster | scanline: What's the status of phoned etc? |
| 23:12:12 | scanline | SpaceCoaster: I sent GoRK a working tuxphone daemon (with TCP/IP), he was going to put it in CVS\ |
| 23:12:28 | scanline | I've got a very basic PicoGUI frontend for it in the picogui CVS |
| 23:12:52 | Lenolium | scanline: Did you look at the daemon I had already written? |
| 23:12:54 | scanline | lemme see if he actually got it in CVS before he left... |
| 23:13:20 | scanline | Lenolium: Yeah... |
| 23:13:34 | scanline | It just accepted raw wheaties data via a socket, right? |
| 23:14:45 | scanline | It looks like GoRK didn't get the new tuxphone into CVS |
| 23:14:50 | scanline | want me to send it to someone? |
| 23:15:06 | cory | does the dsp work in linux now? |
| 23:15:12 | scanline | cory: yes |
| 23:15:17 | cory | cool! |
| 23:15:19 | SpaceCoaster | scanline: yes please |
| 23:15:42 | SpaceCoaster | cory: hmm, what do you mean work? |
| 23:15:52 | cory | spacecoaster: hehe |
| 23:16:19 | scanline | cory: We've got it working as a telephone, and there's a daemon that lets applications monitor the status of the phone, dial it, etc. |
| 23:16:33 | cory | nods |
| 23:16:37 | scanline | Though so far I think I'm the only one who has that daemon :) |
| 23:16:43 | scanline | Shall I send it to the list? |
| 23:16:45 | cory | hehe |
| 23:17:00 | SpaceCoaster | cory: it plays tones and recognises tones, and the things connected to it lights and switches work |
| 23:17:21 | SpaceCoaster | scanline: why not! |
| 23:17:27 | scanline | cool |
| 23:17:30 | scanline | tars it up... |
| 23:20:14 | SpaceCoaster | scanline: I guess it is working, what more could it do? |
| 23:20:45 | scanline | SpaceCoaster: it could use more commands. there are still many things the DSP does that you can't modify from the socket inferface |
| 23:20:57 | SpaceCoaster | scanline: e.g.? |
| 23:21:04 | scanline | plus, it would be nice to trap events, so a client could replace the normal ring handling with its own |
| 23:21:16 | scanline | like the happy tone :) |
| 23:21:51 | SpaceCoaster | or trigger events, popup windows etc.? |
| 23:22:06 | scanline | right |
| 23:22:21 | scanline | well, clients are already notified when the phone rings, or the reciever is picked up |
| 23:22:58 | SpaceCoaster | but I guess they can't stop the daemon doing the default operations? |
| 23:23:01 | scanline | thinks like turning on the speaker phone and changing the volume from the client interface are not supported yet |
| 23:23:05 | scanline | right |
| 23:23:13 | scanline | you'll see when you get the code... |
| 23:24:07 | SpaceCoaster | cool, gonna go eat, I think we chased Tangent away, too many puns |
| 23:24:15 | scanline | haha |
| 23:24:25 | Tangent | Still here... just browsing crap on the web |
| 23:27:16 | GPSFan | SpaceCoaster: hi SC, boy is my face red! |
| 23:27:18 | Tangent | phoned stuff sounds cool |
| 23:27:19 | BZFlag | Tangent: you saw the 5v and VoIP hardware hacks right? (in the channel topic) |
| 23:27:39 | Tangent | BZFlag : Nope... too dumb to notice teh topic... |
| 23:32:13 | scanline | mmmkay, tuxphone has been sent to the list |
| 23:32:33 | scanline | Maybe someone here with CVS access will commit it :) |
| 23:33:07 | Tangent | Heh... the 5V PCMCIA hack looks a little less than subtle :) |
| 23:33:41 | BZFlag | scanline: SF account name? |
| 23:33:49 | scanline | BZFlag: micahjd |
| 23:33:56 | scanline | ooh, CVS access? :) |
| 23:35:11 | BZFlag | scanline: commit it yourself. ;-) |
| 23:35:19 | cory | heh |
| 23:35:21 | scanline | yay |
| 23:35:26 | cory | 31337 |
| 23:37:00 | BZFlag | and go peer rank each other for pete's sake. |
| 23:41:06 | SpaceCoaster | GPSFan: I saw, I think you're well in credit. |
| 23:42:15 | Tangent | <- Zzzzzz |
| 23:42:36 | BZFlag | GPSFan: hey, if it worked you would be praised. ;-) no worries. It's good to challenge the status quo |
| 23:44:18 | cory | I hate windows |
| 23:45:47 | andersee | scanline: the tuxphone app looks pretty sweet |
| 23:46:07 | scanline | andersee: Thanks. It's in CVS now, hopefully I'll be adding more capability to it |
| 23:48:21 | andersee | cool. So if I rebuild, that daemon will now startup on boot allowing me to use DTMF dialing and such? |
| 23:48:31 | scanline | It's not in buildroot |
| 23:48:36 | andersee | Ahh |
| 23:48:42 | scanline | I don't have the code-foo capability to mess with that yet... |
| 23:48:45 | scanline | ;) |
| 23:48:50 | andersee | :-) |
| 23:49:10 | scanline | But it's easy to compile ;) |
| 23:50:16 | cory | heh |
| 23:50:20 | cory | I got paid today |
| 23:50:27 | andersee | It requires kerenl patches to run as well.... |
| 23:50:36 | andersee | Are those in CVS yet, or just the mailing list? |
| 23:51:01 | scanline | I dunno... I got them from GoRK. I could check CVS to see if it's in there yet |
| 23:51:38 | SpaceCoaster | andersee: CVS but not integrated into buildroot, buildroot-tux/sources/wheaties.patch |
| 23:51:57 | scanline | SpaceCoaster: thanks |
| 23:52:12 | BZFlag | makes the TuxScreen-commits list actually do something.... |
| 23:53:25 | andersee | BZFlag: thanks! |
| 23:53:32 | andersee | that will be very helpful |
| 23:53:34 | scanline | more email :) |
| 23:53:38 | BZFlag | ok, somebody do a commit ;-) |
| 23:54:00 | BZFlag | there are only 5 people on the list now... |
| 23:54:28 | BZFlag | http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tuxscreen-commits <- subscribe here. |
| 23:56:25 | SpaceCoaster | arrghh X server croaked. |
| 23:56:52 | BZFlag | hmm... didn't get syncmail yet... |
| 23:57:38 | SpaceCoaster | scanline: I found the volume control, neat this was the only phone that insisted on ringing, any other magic? |
| 23:58:07 | scanline | magic?/ |
| 23:58:26 | scanline | I had some fun dialing my tuxscreen over 802.11b |
| 23:58:51 | andersee | scanline: you have 802.11b working on the tuxscreen? |
| 23:59:06 | scanline | andersee: No, on my laptop |
| 23:59:20 | andersee | ahh |
| 23:59:23 | andersee | me too |
