| 00:01.19 | redeeman | that is already set |
| 00:01.56 | jasonb | If it is set properly, then it will automatically be precompiled and loaded when Tomcat starts up. |
| 00:03.35 | *** join/#tomcat golqm-noob (i=poisoner@11383.unitednetworx.com) |
| 00:05.38 | redeeman | the jsp files do not get compiled into .class |
| 00:07.40 | yassine | hi jasonb |
| 00:07.45 | jasonb | hi yassine |
| 00:08.05 | yassine | shall i say good morning or its late for ? |
| 00:08.41 | jasonb | redeeman: Post your web.xml on a paste server so we can see how you configured it. Then, tell us details about the versions of the software you're running: OS, JVM, Tomcat. |
| 00:08.52 | jasonb | yassine: It's after 5pm here. |
| 00:09.06 | jasonb | yassine: What time is it there? |
| 00:09.23 | yassine | 02:09 morning |
| 00:09.32 | jasonb | Wow, you're up late too. |
| 00:09.51 | yassine | yep just like you today morning :) |
| 00:10.21 | *** join/#tomcat redeetop (n=redeeman@83.97.96.100) |
| 00:10.33 | redeetop | sorry, my vnc connection home is very bad right now |
| 00:10.53 | jasonb | redeeman: Post your web.xml on a paste server so we can see how you configured it. Then, tell us details about the versions of the software you're running: OS, JVM, Tomcat. |
| 00:11.18 | redeetop | i run latest tomcat, on ubuntu 6.06, java 1.5 06 |
| 00:13.59 | redeetop | the war file do get unextracted, but the .class files are not created before i try to use the jsp files via http |
| 00:17.24 | redeetop | http://sh.nu/p/2714 |
| 00:18.53 | redeetop | that is the web.xml |
| 00:22.00 | jasonb | redeeman: You do not have your webapp properly configured as per the Java Servlet Specification for this particular feature. |
| 00:30.26 | redeetop | im sorry, but i do not know anything about this, i am just trying at the request of others |
| 00:30.41 | jasonb | redeeman: Read the Java Servlet Specification.. search for "load-on-startup". |
| 00:31.17 | redeetop | i googled for that, and found it a site telling me to set it to a public value |
| 00:32.13 | redeetop | positive value* |
| 00:32.38 | jasonb | redeeman: http://java.sun.com/products/servlet/reference/api/index.html |
| 00:32.46 | jasonb | redeeman: Scroll down to "Specifications". |
| 00:35.03 | redeetop | now before i go download this, and spend long time read it, are you absolutely sure its an option in web.xml? |
| 00:35.30 | jasonb | You don't have to take my advice if you don't want it. |
| 00:36.58 | redeetop | well, its not that i dont want your advice, but reading a 300 pages pdf, is a little excessive for an option you could most likely tell me as easy as snapping your fingers |
| 00:44.15 | Uviz | Woola. Off to eat. |
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| 00:55.52 | yassine | Uviz, happy meal |
| 00:56.04 | yassine | okay guys good night im off to bed |
| 01:56.47 | Uviz | G'night. |
| 01:57.12 | Uviz | I missed Wallace's interview with Ahmadinejad. |
| 01:58.01 | Uviz | C-SPAN, 11 PM EST, 08/14/2006, edited and raw... Woohoo. |
| 02:00.28 | Uviz | Wallace said he was surprised to find that the Iranian president was still a college professor who taught a graduate-level course. "You'll find him an interesting man," he said. "I expected more of a firebrand. I don't think he has the slightest doubt about how he feels ... about the American administration and the Zionist state. He comes across as more rational than I had expected." |
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| 02:59.40 | ted__ | hello |
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| 04:50.02 | fedx | do you guys answere api questions, or just tomcat tech stuff? |
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| 05:52.19 | fallacy | is there a way to share resources between two different web applications? |
| 06:03.53 | jasonb | What kind of resources exactly, and define "share". |
| 06:03.55 | jasonb | ? |
| 06:08.45 | fallacy | like a HashMap for instance |
| 06:08.56 | fallacy | that exists in one application, I want to be able to access that same instance from another one |
| 06:12.35 | fallacy | say I want to read or write elements to it for instance |
| 06:13.26 | jasonb | There are two ways you could do that. 1) Make it a JMX MBean, and register it with Tomcat's MBeanServer, and from the other webapp, use it by getting access to it through Tomcat's MBeanServer. 2) Register it in JNDI and allow another webapp to pull it out of JNDI.. that requires some Tomcat internals magic that most people can't do. |
| 06:14.12 | jasonb | 2) requires forcing Tomcat's JNDI naming context to be read/write for webapps instead of the normal read-only. |
| 06:14.37 | jasonb | (and they don't give any easy way of doing that because it's not what the Servlet spec wants you to do) |
| 06:14.53 | fallacy | so 1 would be the standard way I guess |
| 06:14.56 | jasonb | So, 1) is preferable.. |
| 06:14.58 | jasonb | Yes. |
| 06:15.02 | fallacy | ok |
| 06:15.07 | fallacy | I'll look into that, thanks |
| 06:15.11 | jasonb | You're welcome. |
| 06:41.53 | yassine | good morning :) |
| 06:47.40 | jasonb | good morning yassine |
| 06:48.08 | yassine | hey jasonb you still awake |
| 06:48.21 | jasonb | Yup. |
| 06:48.50 | jasonb | But, it's nearing my bedtime. |
| 06:49.06 | yassine | what time is it then ? |
| 06:49.27 | jasonb | Nearly 12:00am. |
| 06:49.41 | yassine | yep |
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| 07:23.56 | yassine | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:25.10 | jasonb | Ouch. I've tried to stay clear of that.. it saves me money at least. :) |
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| 07:30.24 | yassine | :) the stange thing is that i hated it in earlier ages specially the one my dad use to drink it was strong as hell |
| 07:31.02 | yassine | jasonb, i wish you a good night my friend im going to work now |
| 07:31.12 | yassine | see you in later time |
| 07:31.36 | jasonb | Okay.. have fun at work! |
| 07:31.56 | yassine | merci |
| 07:33.35 | *** join/#tomcat RockT (n=tr@gw1.awaro.com) |
| 07:38.55 | RockT | hi, I'm having trouble with 'tomcat native' library |
| 07:39.32 | RockT | I installed with: ./configure --with-apr=/usr/local/apache2/ --with-ssl=/usr/include/openssl/ |
| 07:40.04 | RockT | and when starting tomcat I exported LD_LIBRARY PATH to /usr/local/apr/lib |
| 07:40.33 | RockT | but tomcat still complains that the natove library cannot be found |
| 07:40.57 | RockT | though it looks in right path: /usr/local/apr/lib |
| 07:41.14 | RockT | any help is appreciated |
| 07:42.36 | jasonb | RockT: First, why do you believe you should use the APR connector? |
| 07:43.29 | RockT | from my understanding it helps performance |
| 07:43.58 | jasonb | Do you plan to use HTTPS? Or, just HTTP? |
| 07:45.01 | RockT | we use apache with proxy_ajp_module to tomcat, apache does https |
| 07:45.24 | jasonb | Also, does your web site currently receive more than 200,000 HTTPS requests per day on the average? |
| 07:46.19 | RockT | might be half of this, but we have to do sometimes debugging of tomcat |
| 07:46.38 | RockT | and then we have perfomrance problem with 503 errors |
| 07:46.46 | jasonb | And, do you run your Tomcat instance(s) on a fast machine that isn't used for anything else? Or is the CPU of the Tomcat machine also doing other CPU intensive things? |
| 07:47.50 | RockT | we have two asp servers, one is apache/tomcat alone, but the other has oracle 10 |
| 07:48.08 | RockT | so one is doing other things |
| 07:48.25 | jasonb | So does your site use HTTPS for everything right now, via apache httpd? Or, does it only do HTTPS for some requests, and HTTP for others? If both, what percentage of requests for HTTP and what percentage for HTTPS? |
| 07:48.38 | RockT | evrything https |
| 07:49.54 | jasonb | Taking apache httpd out of the request path will speed up Tomcat's response time.. as long as Tomcat can do HTTPS near as fast as your apache httpd is currently doing it. |
| 07:50.18 | jasonb | Sounds to me like you're nearing the threshold where you would need the APR connector to get apache httpd out of the way. |
| 07:50.46 | jasonb | But, you may not need it, considering your traffic level isn't really that high. |
| 07:51.49 | RockT | thx for that jasonb , maybe the traffic is increasing |
| 07:51.51 | jasonb | Now, when you use Tomcat's Coyote (pure-Java) HTTPS server, initiating HTTPS connections is slower than doing that with Apache httpd, but it may not be so slower that you would have performance problems. |
| 07:52.27 | jasonb | You do need to measure the amount of traffic you have, and base decisions on real data like that. |
| 07:52.49 | jasonb | If it is increasing, you need to know by how much, in what unit of time. |
| 07:53.36 | RockT | sorry, I have not quite understood, what's that with Coyote, if Coyote is slower? |
| 07:54.03 | RockT | do I need it, if tomcat can do all the things? |
| 07:54.07 | jasonb | But, I believe that if you have less than about 200,000 HTTPS requests per day, you don't really need the APR connector.. the Coyote HTTPS connector would do okay. The very first HTTPS request for a client would be slower, but subsequent requests by the same client wouldn't be slow. |
| 07:54.26 | jasonb | Coyote is part of Tomcat. |
| 07:54.32 | RockT | :) |
| 07:54.34 | RockT | ok |
| 07:54.42 | jasonb | Coyote is Tomcat's pure Java high performance HTTP and HTTPS server code. |
| 07:54.44 | RockT | coyote is the webserver part |
| 07:54.48 | jasonb | Yes. |
| 07:55.04 | jasonb | So, you must decide to use *either* Coyote or APR. |
| 07:55.08 | jasonb | (not both) |
| 07:55.25 | jasonb | APR is a native code (non-Java) HTTP and HTTPS server for Tomcat. |
| 07:56.22 | RockT | ok, so in my config it's no difference if apr is used or not? |
| 07:57.31 | RockT | only if I run the native https server of tomcat? |
| 07:58.48 | jasonb | No, by default Tomcat comes configured to use Coyote as its web server. In order to use a different one, including the APR web server, you must change server.xml. |
| 07:59.02 | jasonb | That is the same whether you use HTTP or HTTPS. |
| 08:03.43 | jasonb | My suggestion is: try using the Coyote web server for HTTPS first and see if that is sufficient. If it turns out not to be, then you should look into using the APR web server. |
| 08:05.02 | RockT | that is the scenario if omitting apache (so to use either APR or Coyote), but with the current config apr is of no use, right? |
| 08:06.17 | RockT | it is of no help if I'm talking ajp to tomcat? |
| 08:10.16 | jasonb | It can also be used for that, but there is no significant performance gain, and there is a very large price to pay in the form of build breakage, code immaturity, and the lack of good docs (currently). |
| 08:11.22 | jasonb | The biggest performance gain you could have is to remove Apache httpd from the request chain. Tomcat's requests would have less latency, and the load on your machine per request would be lower. |
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| 08:12.27 | jasonb | The only thing in question is the HTTPS performance of either configuration. If it's just Tomcat, then probably the APR is fastest at doing HTTPS. But, Coyote probably would also work well for you. |
| 08:20.24 | RockT | we are making use of rewriteengine in apache and compression in html documents, is coytoe capable of doing this? |
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| 08:21.14 | jasonb | RockT: What kind of document compression? Are you using mod_deflate? |
| 08:21.33 | RockT | yes |
| 08:22.33 | jasonb | You can set compression="on" for Coyote, and it will do gzip compression for the responses, which is the same as what mod_deflate does. |
| 08:22.49 | jasonb | Also, if you need URL rewriting, there are ways of doing that as well. |
| 08:23.16 | jasonb | URL Rewrite Filter |
| 08:23.17 | jasonb | http://tuckey.org/urlrewrite |
| 08:24.05 | jasonb | There's also a rewrite valve for Tomcat here: http://anonsvn.labs.jboss.com/labs/jbossweb/trunk/src/share/classes/org/jboss/web/rewrite/ |
| 08:24.05 | RockT | thx jasonb |
| 08:24.11 | jasonb | You're welcome. |
| 08:24.33 | RockT | you rock ;) |
| 08:24.42 | jasonb | So yes, everything you've told me you're using Apache httpd for, Tomcat can do without Apache httpd. |
| 08:24.45 | jasonb | Thanks. :) |
| 08:26.06 | jasonb | RockT: You're getting a preview of the second edition of the O'Reilly book right here, in real time. :) |
| 08:26.17 | jasonb | O'Reilly Tomcat book I mean. |
| 08:26.27 | RockT | when will it be out? |
| 08:27.03 | jasonb | My goal is to finish writing by Christmas, and then it will take a couple of months to edit it and print copies to sell. |
| 08:27.33 | jasonb | But, the good news is: you're already getting lots of answers that you would otherwise be waiting for. :) |
| 08:30.09 | RockT | ok, it's on my wish list now, as it is to kick apache out |
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| 09:45.34 | yassinework | gschnei, heya :) |
| 09:46.45 | eNEMY^x | I`m trying to post a form on a servlet running under tomcat. This works nicely when using a regular client. But when using perl/LWP I get a NPE in the tomcat logs. I`m pretty sure I`m posting everything including the cookies etc. from my perl client, but still it throws an expection. Anyone have any good qlues on how I can pursue this? |
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| 13:33.31 | longbeach | hi |
| 13:34.14 | longbeach | why did you shadow the jsp index.jsp in ROOT by the servlet org.apache.jsp.index_jsp ? |
| 13:34.21 | longbeach | in web.xml of course |
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| 13:58.52 | dcorpataux | Hi |
| 14:01.18 | dcorpataux | I got my fresh tomcat4 install and tried to log onto the manager using tomcat/tomcat before setting its role in tomcat-user.xml -- now I'm stuck in this 403 error. Is there a way to "logout" ? |
| 14:03.55 | dcorpataux | Shutting down the service and starting it again won't do the trick..... |
| 14:04.11 | yassinework | dcorpataux, did you restarted ? |
| 14:06.21 | dcorpataux | it run the shutdown.sh, then the startup.sh script... doesn't helps :-S |
| 14:07.45 | dcorpataux | looks like sessions persist when restarting tomat (i'm in a standalone mode9 |
| 14:07.47 | dcorpataux | ) |
| 14:15.28 | dcorpataux | Okay, I found a bad solution: clearing cookies on the browser-side :-F |
| 14:20.41 | dcorpataux | Mea culpa, I could login because I gave my tomcat user the bad role (admin instead of manager) |
| 14:24.48 | yassinework | lol |
| 14:24.56 | yassinework | so now you solved it |
| 14:26.23 | dcorpataux | yep, and this problem didn't desserve bothering this channel :-S |
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| 14:36.44 | jbalint | so |
| 14:37.16 | jbalint | eNEMY^x: can you show the error in the pastebin site? |
| 14:38.24 | yassinework | heya jbalint |
| 14:40.24 | jbalint | hey yassinework |
| 14:40.34 | jbalint | how goes it? |
| 14:44.05 | *** join/#tomcat Nik_ (n=chatzill@207.164.171.221) |
| 14:44.53 | Nik_ | Anyone having problems with the shutdown.sh? |
| 14:45.10 | jbalint | nope |
| 14:45.14 | dcorpataux | neither |
| 14:45.15 | kenneo | Nik_: ? |
| 14:45.18 | Nik_ | Seem to execute correctly but tomcat it still running... |
| 14:45.23 | kenneo | yup |
| 14:45.36 | kenneo | it waits for your connections to die first |
| 14:46.15 | Nik_ | OK. The default wait time is set to what? |
| 14:46.23 | kenneo | seconds? |
| 14:46.39 | Nik_ | Whatever. You know where this setting is? |
| 14:46.41 | kenneo | dunno ;) |
| 14:46.55 | Nik_ | Ok. Let me check... Thanks for the info! |
| 14:47.01 | kenneo | no problem :) |
| 14:48.01 | dcorpataux | might be a problem with the env variables? (eg. set the variable by hand in a shell, execute startup.sh -> ok ; then close the shell, loosing the env var, and executing shutdown.sh in a new shell withtout the right env vars set) ? |
| 14:49.01 | Nik_ | Usually, the error when the ENV is not right is pretty obvious |
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| 22:36.08 | *** topic/#tomcat is http://tomcat.apache.org Latest stable versions of Tomcat are 5.5.17 and 4.1.31. If you are a newbie, use the official distribution on Jakarta's site, or use an RPM package from http://www.webdroid.org:8080/archives/tomcat-package. Be sure to check your log files before you attempt to search for a solution. SLOW MOTION CHANNEL (we all have jobs): Ask your question, then wait; check back often to see if anybody answered. |
| 22:36.36 | rhizmoe | hey, what isn't? |
| 22:37.15 | jasonb | yeah.. |
| 22:43.16 | mers | do you guys think EJBs are worth researching if all i need is a simple way to represent my database in java objects that my servlets can work with? |
| 22:45.12 | jasonb | jpox! |
| 22:45.20 | jasonb | http://www.jpox.org |
| 22:45.33 | jasonb | EJB is not worth wasting your time on. |
| 22:48.04 | mers | i should probably read up on JDO first then |
| 22:48.09 | mers | i already have a schema though |
| 22:49.33 | pfn | ibatis is what I use |
| 22:49.39 | pfn | entity beans are teh suck, utter suck |
| 22:50.38 | pfn | I didn't like jpox so much... if you didn't have to bytecode enhance beforehand, I'd like it a lot more |
| 22:51.36 | mers | i'll look into all this stuff |
| 22:51.43 | jasonb | mers: It's okay to already have a schema. JPOX is flexible enough to work with it. |
| 22:51.53 | mers | though at a higher level, i'm curious if all this stuff is worth it |
| 22:52.10 | pfn | if all what stuff is worth what? |
| 22:52.29 | jasonb | mers: If you're doing a small project, it may not be, but if your db schema is somewhat large, or you expect it to be in the future, it's worth it. |
| 22:52.52 | pfn | if you're doing a large project, investigating JDO, hibernate or EJB3 are worthwhile |
| 22:52.54 | mers | having a set of classes accessible to your context to modify your persistent data is nice and all, but that assumes that you'll be modifying the same data in multiple places. if your data gets modified or displayed in mainly one, maybe two places, is all the middleware good? |
| 22:53.22 | jasonb | pfn: I haven't researched ibatis yet, but it's on my todo list. For now I'm happy enough with jpox. |
| 22:54.31 | jasonb | mers: Yes.. there are reasons to use it still. |
| 22:54.53 | pfn | jasonb ibatis isn't really orm, it just provides a way to map resultsets into pojos |
| 22:55.03 | pfn | so you retain full control over your queries and updates |
| 22:55.28 | pfn | so if you're a control freak, ibatis is great, gives you the necessary control without making ones code messy |
| 22:55.51 | jasonb | pfn: does ibatis try to offer you db implementation independence? Or, does it make you write sql queries and then that ends up db implementation specific? |
| 22:56.11 | pfn | your db queries are abstracted as a separate resource |
| 22:56.18 | pfn | what you write with ibatis is actual sql |
| 22:56.52 | jasonb | pfn: separate or not, if you have to write your sql queries for just about everything, then it does not offer db independence abstraction. |
| 22:57.28 | jasonb | (not everyone wants that, granted) |
| 22:57.34 | pfn | indeed, it doesn't |
| 22:57.47 | jasonb | That's a "must have" feature for me. |
| 22:57.52 | pfn | I don't count on 100% db abstraction, it's a pain in the ass |
| 22:58.21 | pfn | I mean who the hell wants to deploy to all of db2, oracle, mysql, informix, postgresql, etc. |
| 22:58.26 | pfn | it's lame |
| 22:58.32 | jasonb | Well, with JPOX it's nowhere near such a pain anymore. But, it may not do 100% of it for you.. maybe 98% or something. But, it does try to make the rest easy. |
| 22:58.51 | pfn | I mean, sure, there should be an easy way to switch between databases, and it shouldn't be locked into code |
| 22:59.09 | pfn | and ibatis provides that |
| 22:59.21 | pfn | modify your configuration file to point to another set of queries |
| 22:59.47 | jasonb | For me at work we use Oracle.. but in my dev machine(s) I want to use either Derby or hsqldb. Because we used JPOX, it is very easy for me to set up the same application on Derby, develop that way, and then in production run on Oracle. Almost all of it was abstracted for me automatically by using JPOX. |
| 23:00.28 | mers | i'm sceptical. at the end of the day, if you're not just mapping one row to one object, what sql queries are these frameworks going to come up with? |
| 23:00.33 | jasonb | pfn: But, then you have to write a new set of queries for the new DB (and learn how to do that for the new DB) before your app will run against the new DB. You don't have to do that with JPOX. |
| 23:00.54 | pfn | jasonb or you can use mostly db agnostic sql... |
| 23:01.20 | jasonb | Then, you would need to know all about where sql becomes db specific, and avoid all those random spots. |
| 23:01.28 | jasonb | I'm not a DBA, and I don't play one on TV. :) |
| 23:01.38 | pfn | indeed |
| 23:01.50 | pfn | I haven't played with jpox much, besides reading the docs, I got turned off when I had to do bce |
| 23:01.57 | mers | pfn: i'm looking at the SQL maps java tutorial, right? |
| 23:02.25 | pucko_ | there's always suns blueprints and the dao classes ;D |
| 23:02.56 | jasonb | pfn: I admit that the largest disadvantage of jpox as it stands today is the bytecode enhancement you must do.. but, you can do it at build time, and only build when you need to. At work we have Eclipse auto-do it for us whenever it thinks it needs to.. and it's not a problem for us. |
| 23:07.55 | pucko_ | funny that the mailinglist archives of july resulted in 3496 in tomcat-dev |
| 23:08.22 | pucko_ | highest sofar :) |
| 23:09.29 | jasonb | looking back how far though? |
| 23:09.39 | jasonb | I think the traffic has been higher.. some years back. |
| 23:10.16 | jasonb | I would guess 2001. |
| 23:10.42 | pucko_ | nope, not according to MARC :) http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=tomcat-dev&b=20068 |
| 23:11.26 | jasonb | OH.. I know why. |
| 23:11.39 | pucko_ | cvs reports I guess |
| 23:11.48 | pucko_ | err... svn |
| 23:11.51 | jasonb | One of the developers did something dumb in Eclipse and sent one svn change email for each file in the entire tree one day. |
| 23:12.00 | pucko_ | oh... hahah |
| 23:12.23 | jasonb | It was probably some thousands of emails.. one copy of each sent to every user on the tomcat-dev mailing list (including me.. ugh). |
| 23:12.41 | pucko_ | one happy listserver |
| 23:13.21 | jasonb | Otherwise, I'm right... 2001-09-01 - 2001-10-01 (2119 messages) |
| 23:13.57 | pucko_ | yup, silly svnchanges don't count :) |
| 23:14.02 | jasonb | That was the Great Tomcat-Dev Flame War of 2001. |
| 23:14.31 | pucko_ | sounds like something dangerous to dig into :) |
| 23:15.26 | jasonb | It was Remy and Craig vs. Costin. Remy and Craig won. |
| 23:16.21 | pucko_ | 2 vs 1 usually does |
| 23:17.20 | jasonb | It was a very large event though.. each side had a team. |
| 23:18.11 | pucko_ | what was the issue discussed? |
| 23:27.01 | *** join/#tomcat bdudney (n=bdudney@01153bhost90.starwoodbroadband.com) |
| 23:29.03 | *** join/#tomcat bdudney (n=bdudney@01153bhost90.starwoodbroadband.com) |
| 23:31.21 | Uviz | What on POJO is going on in here? |
| 23:31.29 | Uviz | All these JDO talk made me hungry. |
| 23:47.32 | mers | sleep time |
| 23:47.33 | mers | night ppl |