| 00:16.43 | *** join/#sc2mapster Dustin_Hendricks (~Dustin_He@216.240.30.25) |
| 00:23.08 | *** join/#sc2mapster Ahli (6d5ae956@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.109.90.233.86) |
| 00:29.23 | DeadZergling | Guess Bounty died from ODing on Ativan |
| 00:35.10 | *** join/#sc2mapster purl_ (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 00:35.10 | *** topic/#sc2mapster is http://sc2mapster.com | http://wiki.sc2mapster.com | sc2mapster bnet2 channel | WCS Partnership for eSports g0g0! | We want your broken maps! http://bit.ly/aU9AgC | This channel is logged, via purl |
| 00:49.17 | Bounty | That would be pretty messed up if it actually happened DeadZergling |
| 00:49.23 | Bounty | and I'm out of Ativan actually >.< |
| 00:50.09 | DeadZergling | wasn't sure, you haven't been responding lately :) |
| 00:50.26 | Bounty | pulled a muscle in my neck/chest |
| 00:50.37 | Bounty | so been just relaxing |
| 00:50.47 | Bounty | hurts to move my head lol |
| 00:50.59 | Bounty | Its always something.... |
| 00:51.02 | DeadZergling | ah man, you just riddled with issues lately |
| 00:51.17 | DeadZergling | my right shoulder been hurting pretty bad, but it is bearable |
| 00:52.14 | DeadZergling | So I did something possibly silly lately |
| 00:52.18 | Bounty | I'm drinking a beverage that contains kava and california poppy extract to treat the muscle pain |
| 00:52.47 | Bounty | Seems to be working, doesn't get rid of the pain 100% but the positions I am able to move my head in without pain is greater. |
| 00:53.27 | DeadZergling | That's good, not able to move your head at all would be really bad |
| 00:54.45 | Bounty | Yeah, it was a pain in the ass lol |
| 00:55.01 | Bounty | Thankfully, muscle pain is so easy to self diagnose |
| 00:55.09 | DeadZergling | so I went and hired a LPer to play my maps for me |
| 00:55.15 | Bounty | So I didn't panic when it started (because its in my chest) |
| 00:55.22 | Bounty | hired? |
| 00:56.05 | DeadZergling | well, in a manner of speaking, if you support him through patreon for 10 $ a month, he will play whatever you want for at least half an hour every week. It will probably be more, but that is the minimum |
| 00:57.18 | Bounty | how many views does he get? |
| 01:01.08 | DeadZergling | not a ton, like typically 40-50 per video, but as far as I'm concerned it is really cheap testing, I probably couldn't get away with just 10 $ if he was more popular. He seems to be interested in growing his channel more lately too. Actually been watching his videos last couple years anyways |
| 01:01.57 | DeadZergling | I figure at worst, I am more motivated to work on my maps for awhile and it doesn't make any other impact :) I don't mind supporting the guy anyways |
| 01:03.40 | DeadZergling | Oh, so I put a few hours into reducing lag on Death TV last night, boosted move speeds and health some, reduced wave amounts and max on screen by 20-40 % all over |
| 01:04.13 | Dustin_Hendricks | Played Renee's WC3 mod today |
| 01:04.14 | Dustin_Hendricks | Shit is legit |
| 01:04.32 | DeadZergling | well it is renee's shit |
| 01:04.35 | DeadZergling | of course it is |
| 01:04.49 | Bounty | What is it? a WC3 remake? |
| 01:04.53 | Dustin_Hendricks | Ya |
| 01:05.03 | Bounty | Nice |
| 01:05.03 | Dustin_Hendricks | Shit was straight up a WC3 experience |
| 01:05.17 | Bounty | did it use SC2 textures? |
| 01:05.19 | Dustin_Hendricks | She has the first mission of the campaign and mp melee map |
| 01:05.21 | Bounty | wait nvm, its a mod |
| 01:05.25 | Dustin_Hendricks | for some terrain I think |
| 01:05.26 | DeadZergling | now, this might be more exciting if I could handle playing melee, ever... |
| 01:05.33 | Dustin_Hendricks | but everything is using the new WC3 art pack |
| 01:05.37 | Dustin_Hendricks | which is sexy |
| 01:05.54 | Bounty | Only thing I don't like about the WC3 pack is the low amount of animations |
| 01:06.04 | Bounty | but I expected that |
| 01:06.14 | Bounty | bc those are the animations that the WC3 versions had lol |
| 01:06.21 | Dustin|Work | Ya lol |
| 01:06.33 | Bounty | So.... WoW models are still superior :( |
| 01:06.35 | DeadZergling | more animations would be good, I'd totally make a Warcraft Smash Brothers for the hell of it |
| 01:07.06 | Bounty | The WC3 animations are very.... RTS styled if that makes sense |
| 01:07.08 | Dustin|Work | I actually made a Smash type map in WC3 back in the day using RTCmod's keyboard registry |
| 01:07.09 | Bounty | not much you can do with them |
| 01:07.24 | Dustin|Work | Shit was crazy hard to do back then lol |
| 01:07.32 | Bounty | I betr |
| 01:07.34 | Bounty | bet* |
| 01:07.51 | DeadZergling | yea, not serene and simple like it is now with the starcraft 2 editors |
| 01:07.53 | Bounty | I am trying to come up with a concept for the WC3 assets though |
| 01:07.59 | Bounty | no idea what to do |
| 01:08.09 | DeadZergling | No editor is simpler or funner to use, than the Starcraft 2 editor |
| 01:08.42 | Bounty | Warcraft 2 editor |
| 01:08.43 | Bounty | =P |
| 01:08.53 | DeadZergling | crap out a squadron defense game? |
| 01:09.08 | Bounty | Nah, I wanna do something new |
| 01:09.20 | Dustin|Work | I kinda want to remake my Battle Tactics map from WC3 |
| 01:09.22 | Bounty | Does suck that the only HD buildings are towers.... |
| 01:09.23 | DeadZergling | war2 editor, I think I touched on that slightly, didn't it only allow placing units, lol |
| 01:09.30 | Bounty | That kinda upset me lol |
| 01:09.41 | Dustin|Work | Ya and circles of power! |
| 01:09.46 | Dustin|Work | It was supppper basic |
| 01:09.58 | Bounty | I had fun with it |
| 01:10.08 | Dustin|Work | Yeah you could make some fun "RPGs" |
| 01:10.13 | Bounty | I used to create pretend missions lol |
| 01:10.22 | Dustin|Work | Give a unit a shit ton of health and then map a big map with units he had to go through and kill |
| 01:10.38 | DeadZergling | this sounds like a korean style rpg in brood wars |
| 01:11.05 | DeadZergling | they were common as fuck on the pacific servers, just make one unit really tough, place a shit ton of units, good luck killing them all |
| 01:11.37 | Dustin|Work | ya lol |
| 01:13.37 | DeadZergling | how about those brood war style inns though |
| 01:13.48 | DeadZergling | almost always the freaking academy, you go in, and tele-heal! |
| 01:15.43 | DeadZergling | you know, besides the BS that is terraining, I could almost remake my old brood wars RPG in a week or two if I really wanted to |
| 01:16.00 | DeadZergling | There really wasn't a lot to it besides the ridiculous trigger count necessary to implement levels back then |
| 01:16.40 | DeadZergling | As much as people complain about the editor, it isn't the editor's fault, our requirements just got a lot higher for an acceptable map |
| 01:19.23 | DeadZergling | Oh well, enough talk, now for silly links: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnOyMSEWNTs and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nO-HbqdTRd0 |
| 01:23.06 | Bounty | Rhet and Link eh? |
| 01:24.23 | DeadZergling | yea, they have some pretty good episodes |
| 01:24.36 | DeadZergling | Will it Cereal, Will it Taco, Will it Donut, etc |
| 01:24.41 | DeadZergling | are also really good |
| 01:25.47 | DeadZergling | they start off with reasonable, but odd ingredients |
| 01:26.01 | DeadZergling | and move on to why the fuck would you ever do that ingredients |
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| 02:43.47 | DeadZergling | so you doing much editing now Dustin|Work , or you still working too much? |
| 02:47.02 | Dustin|Work | Working too much :( |
| 02:48.22 | DeadZergling | yea, that can drain you too much to really have the energy to do any real editing later. I'm hoping hiring a LPer to play my stuff has the desired motivating effect on me here, cheapest motivation ever if it does work, lol |
| 02:53.11 | DeadZergling | now if only I could hire someone to needlessly complicate things for me so I could spend less time on that |
| 02:53.18 | DeadZergling | I'm overthinking my stupid quest system big time |
| 02:58.19 | *** join/#sc2mapster purl (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 02:58.19 | *** topic/#sc2mapster is http://sc2mapster.com | http://wiki.sc2mapster.com | sc2mapster bnet2 channel | WCS Partnership for eSports g0g0! | We want your broken maps! http://bit.ly/aU9AgC | This channel is logged, via purl |
| 02:59.05 | DeadZergling | oi Merc, you about? |
| 03:05.09 | DeadZergling | Oh well, if anyone sees Merc doing something other than idling, let him know I want to talk to him |
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| 11:25.43 | Merc | DeadZergling: I'm here |
| 11:26.19 | Merc | I just tend to be asleep in the middle of the night, hue hue |
| 11:26.42 | DeadZergling | time zone differences, I should be asleep now too, lol |
| 11:26.51 | Merc | what do you need? |
| 11:27.29 | DeadZergling | anyways, was wondering if you're still up for updating that how to play thing for Death TV later on, I'll probably enable some new weapons in the next few weeksish |
| 11:27.41 | DeadZergling | or at least send the stuff you used to make it so I could update it |
| 11:28.14 | Merc | sure man I can do that |
| 11:28.56 | DeadZergling | cool, just know if I add 3 new weapons, that has to change too :) |
| 11:28.57 | Merc | the files gotta be here somewhere |
| 11:29.09 | DeadZergling | well it isn't urgent, just wanted to check ahead of time |
| 11:30.36 | Merc | I got the latest pics here at least |
| 11:30.46 | Merc | and I just found the psd files as well |
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| 11:32.33 | DeadZergling | cool, will let you know when I've added the things. One is working exactly as intended, and I've decided I hate the gun, lol |
| 11:32.39 | DeadZergling | so I need to think up a new one |
| 11:32.50 | Merc | harsh |
| 11:32.58 | Merc | what did the gun ever do to you |
| 11:33.06 | DeadZergling | wasn't fun enough |
| 11:33.25 | Merc | don't you know it's the man behind the gun you should hate |
| 11:33.30 | Merc | it was you all along |
| 11:33.38 | Merc | M. Night Shimalinglong |
| 11:33.42 | DeadZergling | yea yea, I know you don't actually care, lol |
| 11:34.16 | Merc | how did you get that from my excellent jokery |
| 11:34.44 | DeadZergling | well, you didn't make much effort to hide it :) |
| 11:34.58 | Merc | huh |
| 11:35.52 | Merc | damn dude, what did I say? |
| 11:36.30 | Merc | obviously I dont care as much as you do about your own project |
| 11:36.39 | Merc | but.. wut |
| 11:37.13 | DeadZergling | Think you are taking it a little too far. I just mean you aren't mourning the gun or anything :) |
| 11:37.43 | Merc | oh |
| 11:37.48 | Merc | was I supposed to be? |
| 11:38.12 | Merc | I must have been away too long, forgot all about modder etiquette |
| 11:38.43 | DeadZergling | Well anyways, the gun idea was, it teleports your guy to a spot, and fries everyone where you warp |
| 11:38.56 | DeadZergling | Sounded fun, but in practice, it really isn't that fun |
| 11:38.59 | Merc | I shall refrain from making jokes about design changes in the future |
| 11:39.13 | DeadZergling | Naw, your joke was fine man |
| 11:39.41 | Merc | I thought you meant the appearance of the gun or something |
| 11:40.08 | DeadZergling | No, the appearance is okay, but it isn't that fun to use |
| 11:40.29 | DeadZergling | so need to think of some other strange thing to make a gun do |
| 11:40.38 | Merc | well if it's only text I gotta update on that thing it's gonna be a fairly quick edit |
| 11:41.09 | DeadZergling | will be a couple new graphics |
| 11:41.13 | Merc | how about if you let it still blink but does something else after blinking |
| 11:41.40 | Merc | like speed increase or something |
| 11:41.51 | Merc | something that might encourage the player to switch weapons after blinking |
| 11:41.58 | Merc | suddenly you got combos in your game |
| 11:42.29 | DeadZergling | yea, I kind of thought of it as an oh shit gun anyways, since you can warp out of danger |
| 11:42.40 | DeadZergling | but doesn't seem so practical now that I have a working one |
| 11:44.08 | DeadZergling | wonder if it'd be possible to do that weird orange paint off the portals knockoff |
| 11:44.26 | DeadZergling | do slight damage and slow enemies, speeds contestants up |
| 11:45.25 | DeadZergling | anyways, sure I'll come up with something :) Don't worry about the joke, seriously |
| 11:45.30 | DeadZergling | I was just counter-joking :) |
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| 11:50.37 | Ahli | I've implemented a short that is kind of similar to BW's valkyrie... missiles will track points offset of the target unit... |
| 11:50.43 | Ahli | *shot |
| 11:51.28 | DeadZergling | still crashing SC2 as well? |
| 11:52.17 | Ahli | no... but I've made missiles that shoot missiles |
| 11:52.40 | Ahli | because I can only redirect once, so the second time, the missile launches a missile.... it's a loop :D |
| 11:54.08 | Ahli | the solution only requires like 10 times the amount of effects than the approach that required redirect to work multiple times |
| 11:56.41 | Ahli | 95 effects atm because the "missile shooting missile"-loop needs to preserve the offset... so, for 9 offsets, I had to duplicate that thing 8 times |
| 11:58.58 | Merc | u hert my feels dz |
| 11:59.18 | Merc | a portal gun could be fun though |
| 12:03.03 | DeadZergling | just not sure how I'd appropriately make the paint thing work, considering I'm already using creep for a boss |
| 12:04.16 | DeadZergling | anyways, time for me to get some sleep, see you around Merc |
| 12:04.46 | DeadZergling | Ahli, I can relate, I had to add several more layers of crap to lightning bolt at one point because it didn't work quite the way I wanted... |
| 12:06.01 | Ahli | :D |
| 12:06.16 | DeadZergling | 95 effects just to achieve BW valkyrie though, that's quite a lot :) |
| 12:06.55 | DeadZergling | anyways see you both around later, be good if I can at least wake up by about 1 pm tomorrow :) |
| 12:08.02 | Ahli | BW valk has 14 positions, not only 9 :X ... I need to add moar to match that |
| 12:08.44 | Ahli | so, attachmethodpattern, how do you work :X |
| 12:09.31 | Ahli | I've 9 launch effects... why do you use a launch effect... :X why not per actor, argh |
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| 14:04.38 | *** join/#sc2mapster Zolden (Zolden@88.135.4.202) |
| 14:24.11 | Ahli | wants to add a better hierarchy... adds parent definitions.... wants to save, editor crashes |
| 14:26.48 | Merc | rip |
| 15:48.30 | Zolden | Merc when's your map playable? |
| 15:48.53 | Merc | when blizzard lets us add races to the lobby |
| 15:48.57 | Merc | and when I finish it |
| 15:49.22 | Merc | the war3 assets will help a bunch, spells and whatnot |
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| 16:41.07 | *** join/#sc2mapster Dustin|Home (~Dustin@ip72-209-140-214.ks.ks.cox.net) |
| 16:41.19 | Ahli | hmm, my missiles are waaaay too high or too low around huge cliffs :< |
| 16:41.36 | Merc | I know I should be modding, but I am watching a cute mini pig compilation on youtube |
| 16:42.19 | Dustin|Home | Im playing hearthstonee |
| 16:43.39 | Zolden | Merc lol, you! |
| 16:44.02 | Merc | I never realized how fucking cute piglets were, man |
| 16:44.05 | Merc | that little oinking |
| 16:44.16 | Zolden | pigs are cool |
| 16:44.21 | Merc | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8f3RkpTnS7I |
| 16:44.56 | Dustin|Home | Soooo |
| 16:44.58 | Merc | look at that little shit |
| 16:45.14 | Dustin|Home | The dude who made mafia wants me to takeover development for him |
| 16:46.01 | Zolden | why u? u buddies? |
| 16:46.33 | Dustin|Home | No, I just got a skype message asking if I wanted to as he knew I was a good programmer |
| 16:47.02 | Zolden | why isn't it finished after all those years? |
| 16:49.22 | Zolden | htat pig is on reddit's front page, Merc |
| 16:49.30 | Dustin|Home | Itd just be updates and fixes or some shit |
| 16:49.50 | Zolden | does it still bring donations cash as i use to? |
| 16:50.13 | Dustin|Home | No ideaa |
| 16:50.30 | Dustin|Home | But I can use it to plug my other maps a bit :) |
| 16:50.37 | Dustin|Home | Get more people to play smash tv |
| 16:51.19 | Zolden | i tried it dustin, and it has zero long term effect |
| 16:51.47 | Zolden | only map's addictivity and fun it brings can make it be playable, not even if it will be on google front page |
| 16:52.38 | Dustin|Home | Well I have a group of people who play it a lot |
| 16:52.49 | Dustin|Home | So if I can expand that a bit id be happy |
| 17:00.14 | Zolden | and why the guy leaving it? |
| 17:00.17 | Zolden | moving to unity? |
| 17:01.03 | Dustin|Home | no idea |
| 17:08.53 | Zolden | lol, blizzard doesn't maintain Crimea accounts anymore |
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| 17:31.36 | Zolden | TwoDie how moving to unity going? |
| 17:33.14 | ArcanePariah | Good morning all |
| 17:33.19 | ArcanePariah | Dustin|Work: that's intereting |
| 17:33.23 | ArcanePariah | interesting* |
| 17:33.55 | ArcanePariah | Dustin|Home* |
| 17:34.34 | ArcanePariah | Though not entirely surprising, people get bored and pass things on. To my knowledge, many maps both in SC2 and War3 were passed around, one person taking up where another left off and iterating on it. |
| 17:35.00 | TwoDie | zolden stale.. im in the mood being counter productive |
| 17:35.17 | ArcanePariah | NOTD 1/2 are somewhat... weird in that regard I guess, having the same dev team for nearly 3 years. |
| 17:36.06 | ArcanePariah | Ok, random dumb question for those in here who do terrain... how many are aware of how to generate foilage? |
| 17:36.07 | Ahli | I hate movers... why can't I tell them to just always fly around the air height instead of going bonkers around cliffs |
| 17:36.32 | ArcanePariah | Ahli: what's going bonkers? |
| 17:36.38 | Ahli | arc, draw foliage areas and generate it |
| 17:36.48 | Ahli | or draw areas where it shouldn't be placed |
| 17:36.57 | duckies | you mean that auto generate foilage? |
| 17:37.01 | duckies | *button |
| 17:37.12 | ArcanePariah | Yes, I'm aware of how it works but apparently some are not. I'm assuming you know how to alter what gets generated? |
| 17:37.12 | ArcanePariah | Yes |
| 17:37.33 | Ahli | missiles go far into the air or they go downwards into the deep sea in front of a cliff |
| 17:37.40 | Dustin|Home | ya the foilage layer |
| 17:37.49 | Ahli | desired: make them explode around the air-mover plane |
| 17:37.50 | duckies | I have never bothered to look, can you tell me |
| 17:39.01 | ArcanePariah | Well, in data, in Terrain Textures, there is an array field called Doodads, that is where you specify for the given texture what models are to appear. You can set the probability it gets generated for a given cell (density controlled in terrain editor). Since it is an array, you can have many models. Also you can specify that they have random rotations. In this way, one can very rapidly generate a forest. |
| 17:39.36 | ArcanePariah | By specifying a tree model (which the model data will have the variations). Then could add rock models as well, with low probabitly or other things. |
| 17:39.53 | Zolden | ArcanePariah I can understand leaving a map, paying too much attention to it may make the author hating it and vomiting every time he percepts it |
| 17:40.32 | ArcanePariah | Zolden, that is the case I find, when the person does work in bursts with less planning. Planning + steady work = less likely to vomit. |
| 17:40.49 | Merc | that's probably why I am not doing anything now |
| 17:41.01 | Merc | not really sure what to do next |
| 17:41.04 | ArcanePariah | Shouldn't spend 8 hours one day on it, then 2 hours then 0. Should try to budget time and work steadily. |
| 17:41.12 | Merc | got a bit overwhelmed with the war3 assets I guess |
| 17:41.20 | ArcanePariah | Like, I try to do just 1 - 3 hours on NOTD 2 each day. |
| 17:41.35 | Zandose | pass the work onto someone else to think through |
| 17:41.35 | ArcanePariah | Also, hello Merc, how have you been? |
| 17:41.44 | duckies | oh wow, that's very handy arcanePariah |
| 17:42.03 | ArcanePariah | Mmhmm, was showing Wargirl last night how it worked. |
| 17:42.05 | Merc | hey there ArcanePariah |
| 17:42.21 | ArcanePariah | Can be quite powerful for altering mass amounts of terrain. |
| 17:42.26 | Merc | been afk for holidays and then work has been pretty time consuming |
| 17:42.30 | duckies | tho there is no way to add pathing blockers for so that your forest also auto-blocks units, right? |
| 17:43.18 | Merc | finally got a day off now and I'm spending it playing starcraft and watching piglet videos |
| 17:43.22 | ArcanePariah | I'm not sure duckies, it depends how they are created. I have a feeling what happens is a generic actor is used and the model is substituted in. I do not know if the pathing footprint is applied as well. |
| 17:43.39 | Zolden | ArcanePariah will that forest be a bunch of actors, or foliage is something defferent? |
| 17:43.51 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: Everything is actors. |
| 17:44.02 | ArcanePariah | Even the very terrain is an actor of sorts |
| 17:44.11 | duckies | I think you can sometimes burn foliage so.. |
| 17:44.16 | ArcanePariah | There is a scene manager, a global config. |
| 17:44.19 | Zolden | so, creating actors with triggers wou be equal to what you described? |
| 17:44.22 | duckies | that sure can be pretty useful |
| 17:44.59 | ArcanePariah | duckies: foilage burning is a product of actor messages, when a nuke lands it does a query in the aoe and filters by tree doodads and sends them a signal which sets off their burn/death animation |
| 17:45.28 | duckies | you did a tutorial on that, didn't you? :D |
| 17:45.46 | Zolden | duckies you can use a bread model as foliage to create a duck heaven |
| 17:45.49 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: it should but that is time consuming and must be done at run time. Also, one would have to run test document to see results, this method (generate foilage) you can see live and tweak to your desire. |
| 17:45.56 | Zandose | look at actors like this... they are just a storage container for all the information, like models, unit stats, etc |
| 17:46.06 | ArcanePariah | duckies: Yes i did, I sorted out region and query response actors. |
| 17:46.50 | duckies | I thought you'd make more tutorials about hidden things almost nobody knows about but you didn't t_t |
| 17:46.53 | Zolden | ArcanePariah you said there's probability of foliage appear at a tile. But after it is generated - can we adjust positions of those bushes? |
| 17:47.14 | ArcanePariah | I do not know, I don't think so. |
| 17:47.19 | ArcanePariah | I never tried |
| 17:47.36 | ArcanePariah | But you can control the distribution of the models, both in terrain editor and in data. |
| 17:47.40 | Zandose | does foilage block paths? |
| 17:47.49 | ArcanePariah | I am not sure, I never tested. |
| 17:48.05 | Zolden | random generator is a troll, I'd prefer doing some code to check the resulats of random creation and adjusting |
| 17:48.06 | Zandose | why not just use triggers to generate foilage |
| 17:48.18 | ArcanePariah | Zandose: 2 reasons |
| 17:48.27 | ArcanePariah | 1) Triggers = run time generation = performance hit |
| 17:48.46 | ArcanePariah | 2) Triggers = need to test to see results, so test, exit, tweak, test, repeat. |
| 17:48.58 | ArcanePariah | With this, can see results live and tweak as you see fit. |
| 17:49.08 | Zandose | oh... |
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| 17:49.43 | TwoDie | tits |
| 17:49.48 | Zolden | ArcanePariah doing it once on init is not performance hit, jsut a tiny delay at start |
| 17:49.51 | Zandose | it never took that much time to generate terrain stuff at the start of the map for me |
| 17:50.09 | ArcanePariah | In the terrain editor, there are brushes to allow/disallow foilage, so you could texture an entire area, generate the foilage, then use the brushe to paint paths, open areas, etc. Then hit generate foilage to see results, and tweak as needed. |
| 17:50.16 | Zandose | i use small batches and waits of 0 |
| 17:50.22 | Zolden | ArcanePariah and 2) test results may be better than leaving it as is, quality worth testing and tweaking |
| 17:50.45 | ArcanePariah | Zolden agreed, it is just, with this, you can adjust things more easily, and let the game engine handle the rng of creating stuff. |
| 17:51.28 | Zolden | i wouldn't trust pure rng |
| 17:51.32 | ArcanePariah | Plus, unless I'm terribly mistaken, if you want foilage in on place but not another, you would need to create regions and alter regions each time. |
| 17:51.42 | Zolden | rng + control -> ok; pure rng -> shitty chaos |
| 17:51.57 | ArcanePariah | Well you do have control, you can vary the density of the foilage. |
| 17:52.27 | Zolden | it would be a patchy sick forest |
| 17:52.46 | Zolden | forest has hexagon pattern in nature, rng would never be able to do it alone |
| 17:53.45 | Zolden | it's like asking rng to define tits size not by pair, but one by one, so all tits holders have tits of noticeably different size in 90% cases |
| 17:55.20 | Zolden | ArcanePariah you just never tried to create a decently looking terrain with proc gen, didn't you? that would explaine your naive belief in rng |
| 17:56.27 | Zolden | and sorry, I'm not a soft duckies who would just praise you for bringing new knowledge, I'd rather criticise |
| 17:57.21 | ArcanePariah | I don't believe in pure RNG, but I would assume the game engine uses the parameters in both data and terrain to generate it. So you can tweak it a bit. And ironically, proc gen was done not to look pretty but purely as a tech limit. |
| 17:57.22 | duckies | I think you're misunderstanding the purpose of foilage generator >_L |
| 17:57.52 | ArcanePariah | Proc gen arose due to the fact that CPU was more available then disk space. |
| 17:58.06 | Zolden | yea, using "forest" word made me think of a system rather than shaotically spread bushes |
| 17:58.40 | ArcanePariah | Well that's the thing, with the array list of doodads and the probability of each one being spawned and altering the density, you get a system. |
| 18:00.34 | Merc | I wonder if terrain could be randomly generated |
| 18:00.49 | Merc | symmetrically |
| 18:01.02 | Merc | for two people to play against each other on completely new and unexplored maps |
| 18:01.02 | Zolden | system is a set of interacting components, so, if spawning a tree at point would be dependant on surroundings of that point, or if trees' positions would be adjusted after initial spawn, that would be interaction between them. Spawning system isn't what I mean. I mean system of spawnable objects. |
| 18:02.00 | Zolden | Merc one of my prog gen systems for sc2 was doing it symmetrically, becasue I was thinking of a system that would be appropriate for melee |
| 18:03.04 | Zolden | but I was using terrain deformers, and they had too many disadvantages |
| 18:03.24 | Merc | deformers? |
| 18:03.41 | Zolden | yea, it's actors used by buildings or banelings to modify terrain |
| 18:03.54 | Merc | oh that stuff |
| 18:04.04 | Merc | the stuff that makes the ground level |
| 18:04.12 | Merc | banelings do that too? |
| 18:04.16 | Zolden | Merc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olTnThhzcA0 |
| 18:04.23 | Zolden | my old vid that shows them in work |
| 18:04.29 | Merc | hahaha |
| 18:04.30 | Merc | damn |
| 18:04.46 | Merc | hahahaha |
| 18:05.07 | Merc | that could be hilarious if you added something really subtle |
| 18:05.38 | Zolden | it could be a pretty nice thing if was improved, many gameplay ideas arise from this simple functionality |
| 18:05.52 | Merc | the visual effect itself is pretty cool |
| 18:06.12 | Merc | if the terrain could turn into a darker texture as well it could look really good |
| 18:07.17 | Merc | could set up siege tanks to attack ground and create a ditch that cant be crossed or something |
| 18:07.38 | ArcanePariah | Perfectly doable |
| 18:07.42 | Merc | incredibly imbalanced |
| 18:08.08 | ArcanePariah | Create invisible unit at impact point. Unit birth -> Create terrain deformer. Unit has footprint preventing ground pathing. |
| 18:08.11 | Zolden | that's another problem: path blockers spawning doesn't work runtime |
| 18:08.53 | Zolden | unit is a workaraound, but they are slow, ask TwoDie |
| 18:09.06 | ArcanePariah | Ok, so this is interesting, foilage generated = terrain only, no actors. |
| 18:09.25 | Zolden | foliage are not actors? you checked? |
| 18:09.59 | ArcanePariah | Yes |
| 18:10.08 | Zolden | what is it then? models without actors? aren't they equal? |
| 18:10.18 | ArcanePariah | I thought so myself, but apparently not. |
| 18:10.33 | ArcanePariah | if you type actorinfodisplay while testing, it shows number of actors on map |
| 18:10.40 | Zolden | or the abscence of actor part makes them less performance heavy? |
| 18:10.42 | ArcanePariah | ANd show info about actor you hover mouse over. |
| 18:10.46 | ArcanePariah | I would assume so. |
| 18:11.18 | Zolden | well, that is something |
| 18:14.11 | ArcanePariah | I don't know when, but there is also an option in the terrain editor to add objects to the terrain, like foilage, one at a time, and they are not actors either, so not doodads quite, they replace the terrain. |
| 18:15.05 | ArcanePariah | From the looks of it, it was added with Swarm, since with just liberty dependencies, there are not terrain objects, but adding swarm dependencies gives you a massive list |
| 18:15.16 | ArcanePariah | And many are doodads formerly from Wings |
| 18:15.20 | Merc | likewise you could have night elf druid or something being able to plant trees that spread into a forest over time |
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| 18:15.36 | ArcanePariah | like the artifact dig site from WoL 2nd mission |
| 18:16.02 | Merc | that laser was awesome |
| 18:16.32 | Merc | or wait, that was something else |
| 18:17.26 | ArcanePariah | That's the drakken laser. In any case, with foilage and terrain ojbects, you can place models on the map without them being actors. Upside is they are not actors and no performance hit, downside is that they won't react to any actor things, so no playing animations. |
| 18:19.02 | ArcanePariah | In the data editor, you can create your own, define how large they are, how they affect sight, their collision radius, how much they alter the cliff level where they are placed, and what footprint they use. |
| 18:19.22 | ArcanePariah | (This is terrain objects) |
| 18:20.21 | ArcanePariah | Also, for terrain objects, you can tell it what cliff set to use, thus if it raises the cliffs at where it is placed, it will autogenerate the cliffs to accomadate it. |
| 18:22.03 | ArcanePariah | So it does appear that if you want static objects that do not play animations, use terrain objects. If animations desired, use doodads |
| 18:33.12 | Dustin|Home | anyone want to get on ptr and play wc3? |
| 18:37.57 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, gimme a sec |
| 18:39.27 | Dustin|Home | im literally the only person on the ptr i think |
| 18:40.37 | TwoDie | dont have +10gb space ;< |
| 18:40.52 | Dustin|Home | what! |
| 18:41.00 | Dustin|Home | what size hdd you got a 100gig? |
| 18:42.37 | TwoDie | 500 |
| 18:42.42 | ArcanePariah | Dustin, what chat room you in? |
| 18:42.46 | Dustin|Home | none |
| 18:42.49 | Dustin|Home | I got the only game up |
| 18:42.51 | Dustin|Home | lol |
| 18:42.56 | TwoDie | few games already gets to 100gb |
| 18:43.04 | TwoDie | then there is every game install on hdd |
| 18:43.25 | Dustin|Home | i need to get a couple terrabytes and raid them |
| 18:43.26 | TwoDie | and some 1080p pron quality |
| 18:43.30 | ArcanePariah | Well, I can't find your game |
| 18:43.55 | Dustin|Home | im in general |
| 18:44.29 | TwoDie | ohh there is anoter 100gb for music |
| 18:44.31 | ArcanePariah | lol 68 mb |
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| 19:03.24 | TwoDie | ohhh i just need to delete HotS |
| 19:22.01 | Repo | New map: Old Turtle Island - http://www.sc2mapster.com/maps/old-turtle-island/ |
| 19:34.06 | Zolden | and install TwodS |
| 20:41.06 | TwoDie | finally killed all barbarians in rome total war |
| 20:43.42 | TwoDie | wow whole 2 arcade maps |
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| 21:20.28 | *** join/#sc2mapster DeadZergling (322e866d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.50.46.134.109) |
| 21:20.39 | Zolden | so, who of you is MAGNUSIFENT on reddit? someone posted a video I linked here |
| 21:20.50 | DeadZergling | Hi Zolden, got a question for you when you got time |
| 21:22.01 | Zolden | ok, i'm listening |
| 21:23.03 | DeadZergling | So I'm wanting to make zergling, hydralisk, and larvae look like they are made out of hot blown glass. I know for a fact you have enemy waves of glasslings and such, what do I need to do to achieve that look? |
| 21:23.39 | Zolden | create a special material in art tools |
| 21:24.03 | Zolden | how do you imagine hot blown galss? |
| 21:24.20 | Zolden | transparent, but glowing red? |
| 21:24.29 | DeadZergling | hrrrmm, blackish/orangish, but still transparent |
| 21:26.33 | DeadZergling | I'll find a pic |
| 21:26.43 | Zolden | won't look much cool btw |
| 21:26.59 | Zolden | they must be either not transparent ol hardly recognizable |
| 21:27.08 | Zolden | so, you want to know how to do it or me to do it? |
| 21:31.00 | DeadZergling | Well, let me explain my thinking, I'm thinking kind of this color: http://i.vimeocdn.com/video/446406121_640.jpg , is similar to the glowing tendril doodad |
| 21:31.21 | DeadZergling | Well, if I had the base glass material, I could just recolor some to get the desired look, no? |
| 21:37.09 | Zolden | yes, if you have a model with both glass and color put together, you can affect the glass component with set opacity, and the color component with set tint color |
| 21:37.56 | Zolden | I could create you a ling for experiment |
| 21:38.19 | DeadZergling | that'd be helpful, I don't understand how one makes a glass texture |
| 21:38.53 | Zolden | it's easy, a couple of clicks in art tools |
| 21:49.17 | Zolden | DeadZergling do you want fire particles or just glow? |
| 21:49.42 | DeadZergling | glow would make more sense in this case, but wouldn't mind seeing both |
| 21:54.47 | Zolden | DeadZergling how about this? http://i.snag.gy/S07M0.jpg |
| 21:55.02 | Zolden | it's only glow from highly emissive material |
| 21:56.41 | DeadZergling | looks good, curious how it'd look leaning a little more towards white/yellow |
| 21:58.55 | Zolden | http://i.snag.gy/F1WRl.jpg |
| 21:59.23 | Zolden | it doesn't look like transparent, but it is |
| 22:00.04 | Zolden | good transparency only look with pale colors |
| 22:00.07 | Zolden | and look dim in game |
| 22:01.36 | Zolden | gave it more specularity for glassish look http://i.snag.gy/jkIhi.jpg |
| 22:01.38 | DeadZergling | What I'm going for is zerg units who got their powers from these: http://img.ctrlv.in/img/15/02/07/54d68b1529a7d.jpg |
| 22:02.28 | Zolden | so, you want colors to be closer to this? |
| 22:02.39 | DeadZergling | Yea, at least the tips of the tendrils |
| 22:02.59 | DeadZergling | I really like the third one, if the colors matched that, it'd be perfect |
| 22:05.07 | Zolden | http://i.snag.gy/Riffc.jpg |
| 22:05.10 | TwoDie | zolden then it should have specular reddish not that purple |
| 22:06.07 | DeadZergling | Yea, although those other ones wouldn't be bad for 'hell zerglings', look like they are pure brimstone, lol |
| 22:06.35 | Zolden | TwoDie coloring specular would require additional material, which is gpu heavier, i'd just make it white |
| 22:07.11 | Zolden | DeadZergling so, anyhing else to change? |
| 22:07.48 | DeadZergling | No, that one is great, will it work for hydras/larvae like that? Can just texture swap to save you work if so |
| 22:08.27 | Zolden | it will for hydra, I guess, but it's material thing, texture swap works only within existing material |
| 22:09.11 | DeadZergling | well that's what I'm asking I guess, does it require a special model to use an extra texture? |
| 22:09.23 | Zolden | yea, special model |
| 22:09.42 | Zolden | if you could take one model's material and put it on another, it would work, but you can |
| 22:10.15 | Zolden | 't |
| 22:12.35 | TwoDie | zolden ohh noes, dont change texture if ur gpu will be set on fire by making changes to texture |
| 22:13.32 | DeadZergling | I see, one of these days I should force myself to start modeling |
| 22:13.43 | Zolden | TwoDie it's fucking ling, millions of them are expected to be on one screen, and it's already heavy with its glass |
| 22:13.57 | Zolden | TwoDie but I agree with your note, as usual |
| 22:14.57 | DeadZergling | well, there might be 10-20 larvaes on the screen at once, maybe 30-50 assorted hydras/lings |
| 22:15.07 | DeadZergling | I'll probably put a timed life on the hydra/lings so they don't get too out of control |
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| 22:18.28 | Zolden | DeadZergling it's only a hypothesis about performance may be affected |
| 22:18.28 | pirate | ahoy |
| 22:18.31 | pirate | me pretties |
| 22:18.44 | DeadZergling | Hello black beard |
| 22:20.06 | Zolden | DeadZergling this ok? http://i.snag.gy/S7W2S.jpg |
| 22:20.34 | DeadZergling | yea, that looks great :) |
| 22:20.46 | Zolden | ok |
| 22:21.47 | pirate | did you take that hydra to chernobyl? |
| 22:22.32 | DeadZergling | I wanted see throughish hydra/ling/larvae that had colors similar to http://img.ctrlv.in/img/15/02/07/54d68b1529a7d.jpg , pirate |
| 22:22.50 | DeadZergling | Is for a boss fight |
| 22:23.11 | Zolden | pirate radiation is green, didn't you see ninja turtles? |
| 22:24.41 | Zolden | actually I'll make a green one for reddit, they like uranium glass |
| 22:26.42 | Zolden | DeadZergling http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/55/312/dz_hot_glass_ling.m3 and http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/55/313/dz_hot_glass_hydra.m3 |
| 22:27.50 | DeadZergling | Do they need any textures? |
| 22:28.22 | Zolden | they use standard ones |
| 22:28.49 | DeadZergling | Okay, would larvae also be possible, or should I just do texture swap for them. You have helped a lot already, don't want to ask too much |
| 22:29.23 | Zolden | i'd need to import it |
| 22:29.30 | Zolden | these were included as art tools examples |
| 22:29.37 | Zolden | i'll try tomorrow maybe |
| 22:30.23 | DeadZergling | okay cool, I just want the larvae to be ridiculously visible, since I want the players to be able to kill larvae to stop the hydra/lings from showing up |
| 22:31.58 | DeadZergling | wife and kids are out of the house today, so trying to force myself to get boss3 out of the way today |
| 22:43.56 | Zolden | upvote -> http://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/2v4vbz/inherited_this_uranium_hydralisk_from_my/ |
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| 22:50.46 | DeadZergling | upvoted and left a comment too |
| 22:52.55 | Zolden | wow, u ain't a redditor at all |
| 22:53.11 | DeadZergling | nope |
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