| 00:12.49 | Fate_ | is there a way to not display the shadow of a model? |
| 00:22.27 | Kueken | yeah, you can turn them off with an actor message |
| 00:22.39 | Fate_ | thanks |
| 00:22.45 | Kueken | CastShadows 0 |
| 00:22.48 | Kueken | or something |
| 00:27.59 | JademusSreg | Thanks gamming professional, much appreciated. |
| 00:29.23 | Zolden | is gaming and playing synonimous? |
| 00:30.26 | JademusSreg | http://www.thefreedictionary.com/gamming |
| 00:30.39 | JademusSreg | "To hold a visit, especially while at sea." |
| 00:30.39 | progammer | appriciate, jademus :) |
| 00:30.43 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 00:32.10 | JademusSreg | "appriciate" returns 492000 results on google. Awesome. |
| 00:32.57 | JademusSreg | The 4th result: "I'd appriciate it if the mcdonalds workers spoke english at the drive thru" |
| 00:35.26 | Zolden | progammer what was your "uploading videos" mean? have you uploaded the panels? |
| 00:35.49 | progammer | where ? |
| 00:35.53 | progammer | i'm done for today |
| 00:36.00 | progammer | i never record entire panels |
| 00:36.05 | Zolden | alright |
| 00:36.26 | Zolden | I realy enjoyed watching the funny looking geeks asking questions |
| 00:36.33 | Zolden | and would like to see more on different panels |
| 00:36.38 | progammer | its plenty on youtube |
| 00:36.42 | Zolden | pretty characters |
| 00:36.44 | progammer | their panels this time though |
| 00:36.48 | progammer | has quite little time for QA |
| 00:36.56 | progammer | they have a lot of stuff on their plate |
| 00:37.24 | Zolden | sad, there were long lines |
| 00:38.23 | Ahli | the hidden base :D |
| 00:41.19 | Lajjla | Ahli, don't you miss taintedwisp? |
| 00:43.02 | Ahli | he is gone? |
| 00:43.06 | Ahli | really? |
| 00:49.43 | Lajjla | Ahli, klar |
| 00:50.32 | Ahli | well, he came back like 3-4 times |
| 00:51.23 | *** join/#sc2mapster Triceron (~Triceron@S0106000c41aae21d.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 00:52.06 | Triceron | progammer, found any links to heroes game #1? |
| 00:52.47 | progammer | havent looked, try youtube or reddit |
| 00:54.13 | Stewox | holy shit wcs finals ... |
| 01:01.53 | Zolden | made another little art tools tutorial http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je7VR5kXb90 |
| 01:11.36 | Triceron | very nice Z! |
| 01:11.53 | Triceron | highfives Zolden |
| 01:13.15 | Vindicator | why did you make the ball and change the scale of it instead of just changing the scale of the heart itself? |
| 01:14.04 | Vindicator | i'm a beginner with 3ds max so i can't understand the benefits of stuff like that i guess |
| 01:21.34 | Ahli | sos wins |
| 01:21.51 | Triceron | bleh |
| 01:21.53 | Kueken | tongue-kissing the trophy |
| 01:22.27 | Triceron | death by a thousand papercuts |
| 01:22.34 | Kueken | well, probably better than what Jaedong would have done to it :D |
| 01:24.47 | Zolden | Vindicator if we animate meshes, it will work too, but sometimes it's buggy |
| 01:24.53 | Zolden | while bones are usually stable |
| 01:25.12 | Zolden | sevenfives Triceron |
| 01:25.19 | Zolden | or highsevens |
| 01:37.46 | Stewox | WCS grand finals omg |
| 01:37.52 | Stewox | congratz SOS |
| 01:38.00 | Stewox | but i was cheering for zerg |
| 01:39.40 | JademusSreg | I ♥ Zerg |
| 01:41.42 | Zolden | I ♥ sleep and going to show it |
| 01:46.59 | Stewox | holy smokes |
| 01:47.10 | Stewox | perfect thing i found for ya G0A |
| 01:47.42 | Stewox | nice and all calm, constructive any 10 year old could understand |
| 01:48.00 | Stewox | to learn some good ethics http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTJqnnKHR2k |
| 01:48.58 | Stewox | hm i guess he already left :( |
| 03:42.42 | JademusSreg | From what I see, Blizz is going in a great direction with Herostorm. The design impresses. |
| 03:59.17 | Ahli | the only thing it lacks is complexity |
| 03:59.59 | JademusSreg | How so? My knowledge is incomplete, so I wouldn't know. |
| 04:01.33 | Ahli | skill depth: communication speed with team (which objective, etc), pick of hero and talents of the hero... |
| 04:01.55 | JademusSreg | Elaborate? |
| 04:03.04 | Ahli | low customization amount of your play. that's not a part of "skill" anymore. Other games have builds of items... |
| 04:03.31 | Ahli | oh well, other games have a few best builds, so they don't differ that much |
| 04:03.51 | Ahli | and xp and leveling replacing buying items... |
| 04:06.39 | Ahli | ah well, forget it... usage of items that you can chose is terrible, too, as there are only a few builds that would be used anyway |
| 04:07.28 | Ahli | so the whole thing is really replacable and choice of skills grants more hero diversity than having a fixed amount of skills just with different strength because of items |
| 04:07.57 | Ahli | talents seem to define if a hero is more tanky or more dps anyway... |
| 04:10.39 | Ahli | so, heroes is a moba where you pick your build before the game, have abilities to pick from and objectives to follow instead of only push X Y or kill Z for gold or a buff... |
| 04:11.16 | JademusSreg | I observe that stat buff items are pretty dull. Where stat buffs are made necessary by the design, the subset of viable choices from the option set makes the choices meaningless; one can only make mistakes, fail to choose the optimal set. This "mistake space" presents a major hurdle to new players, steepening the learning curve, serving only to (counterproductively) cull new players from |
| 04:11.16 | JademusSreg | experienced players who've learned the optimal set. |
| 04:11.55 | Ahli | yeah... I made that mistake in LoL at start :D |
| 04:12.17 | Ahli | because spamming spells was more fun than right lcicking the enemy and waiting |
| 04:13.43 | JademusSreg | Yeah, it's a design problem few HACF games have attempted to address, instead taking item builds as a given. |
| 04:15.41 | *** join/#sc2mapster Bommes (~Bommes@ipkn-70.koenigsnet.rwth-aachen.de) |
| 04:19.00 | Ahli | I'm interested if they use force effects for their knockback effects |
| 04:19.16 | Ahli | or triggered physics :D |
| 04:19.20 | JademusSreg | Launch missile, I'm assuming. |
| 04:20.04 | Ahli | hmmm, works, too... true |
| 04:20.42 | Ahli | another thing I was asking myself was the outline around the hero only on the areas that were blocked by other models |
| 04:21.16 | Ahli | so, the hidden parts behind a doodad like a tree receive an outline, but the visible part doesn't |
| 04:21.28 | JademusSreg | Image? |
| 04:23.24 | Ahli | mom |
| 04:23.34 | JademusSreg | Yes dear? |
| 04:23.53 | Ahli | http://i.snag.gy/fI4Xe.jpg |
| 04:24.04 | Ahli | mom = one moment |
| 04:24.50 | Ahli | one is completly as you can see and one is only partially |
| 04:26.35 | JademusSreg | I suspect they coded shaders specifically for that, because I've not seen that functionality in SC2. |
| 04:34.36 | JademusSreg | Yeah, that kind of selective glow/highlight would be handled by shaders. SC2 might still support custom shaders (was tested during SC2 WoL beta), but it's not been tested much since. |
| 04:38.26 | Vindicator | wtf, the mount behind the tree looks like a pony |
| 04:38.35 | Ahli | heroes should receive an editor someday :) yay, we can mod 2 games |
| 04:38.52 | Ahli | it's a D3 pony, yes |
| 04:39.03 | Ahli | there are different models for mounts |
| 04:40.16 | Ahli | pink pony, wolf, horse... hmmm what else |
| 04:42.56 | Ahli | I don't remember more |
| 04:43.12 | Ahli | but you should assume that they will add rockn roll racecars |
| 05:04.27 | *** join/#sc2mapster Ahli (~asdaaaaa@dslb-188-101-189-036.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 05:16.07 | JademusSreg | Ahli, I'm gonna double check the information I extracted from the client and editor, see if I can find something relevant to the occlusion highlight. |
| 05:17.42 | Ahli | k, because the rest I saw in the panels and live matches was doable in the editor right now |
| 05:17.53 | JademusSreg | Yep, I concur. |
| 05:18.26 | Ahli | the most advanced thing might have been the model that was a camera to the mine entrace |
| 05:18.35 | Ahli | which was a clever usage of that aspect |
| 05:21.27 | *** join/#sc2mapster progammer (629c3aa1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.156.58.161) |
| 05:52.38 | progammer | oh cool there's an interview with carbot animations http://youtu.be/8PKEVkGroJ8 |
| 05:54.38 | Ahli | soooo, now my ranged monsters don't follow heroes anymore, but they move around after loosing all targets. Monsters following the hero to the last seen position will wander around, too. The difference is that archers will turn into a random direction and melee starts to run into the direction they are facing |
| 05:55.30 | Ahli | moving around means that they turn only a max amount of degrees while running... dungeon walls can make them turn more, though... |
| 05:55.36 | JademusSreg | From what I can tell, it's using screen space ambient occlusion, but I've not found specific actor events to that effect, so it's using some other term -if- it's done using a comparable build. |
| 05:56.16 | Ahli | 2.1 PTR build might have infos about it |
| 05:56.21 | JademusSreg | Yar. |
| 05:56.36 | Ahli | they wouldn't make a PTR if they didn't change stuff for arcade maps |
| 05:57.00 | Ahli | I guess the only reason for the PTR is to have compatible maps when arcade opens its doors |
| 05:58.01 | Ahli | spitting terrors try to go melee and should spit acid on range... I just need to find a good value for their random chance now |
| 06:05.37 | Ahli | my current AI checking function is super costly ^^ |
| 06:06.14 | JademusSreg | Why not use Tactical AI functions or Tactical AI data? |
| 06:09.38 | JademusSreg | Tactical AI data is most performance efficient, but doesn't have the flexibility to Tactical AI functions. |
| 06:09.46 | JademusSreg | *flexibility of |
| 06:10.03 | Ahli | I've no experience with that :S |
| 06:10.15 | JademusSreg | Tactical AI functions can even be defined in GUI, and work properly if the function prototype matches. |
| 06:10.40 | Ahli | when does it execute its checks? |
| 06:11.40 | ArcanePariah | Scanning |
| 06:11.43 | ArcanePariah | When unit scans |
| 06:11.59 | Ahli | how often does a unit scan? |
| 06:12.51 | ArcanePariah | Fairly constantly I believe. For your AI, are you trying to govern how a single ability targets, or which ability to use vs another? |
| 06:13.12 | Ahli | well, I've no abilities in play |
| 06:13.13 | JademusSreg | (Once Tactical AI data was developed, tactical AIs were moved away from script; now even campaign units like Maar have their own tactical AI data.) |
| 06:13.24 | ArcanePariah | Not even attacks? |
| 06:13.30 | Ahli | other than attack and move |
| 06:14.07 | Ahli | got any example maps for that usage? |
| 06:14.20 | ArcanePariah | Well tactical AI data control what orders are issues, and with Target Finds (which alos can use validators), and Targets Sorts, one can control targeting of abilites |
| 06:14.35 | ArcanePariah | Look in Advanced -> Tactical AI, at the Hight Templar, and the Stlaker Blink |
| 06:14.53 | JademusSreg | (AI-controlled Stalkers will use blink, attack until blink cools, then blink away. All handled via data.) |
| 06:16.24 | ArcanePariah | Basically you can use validators to control when an ablity is used (Order Tactical AI) and if you need multiple abilites, you combine them into sets |
| 06:16.33 | ArcanePariah | Then for each order you can have a target find |
| 06:16.45 | ArcanePariah | Target finds are how High Templar AI land fairly accurate storms |
| 06:16.53 | ArcanePariah | and wait till its more then 1 unit to use it |
| 06:17.30 | ArcanePariah | Also Tactical AI data controls how zeerg units burrow |
| 06:17.38 | ArcanePariah | And Ghosts using Sniper and EMP |
| 06:18.05 | JademusSreg | Since move and attack are sufficient for controlling your units, you'd only need the tactical AI data to make them move and attack as is appropriate with conditional logic and such. Easy enough. |
| 06:18.13 | *** join/#sc2mapster Delphinium (~Delphiniu@60.166.102.78) |
| 06:18.31 | JademusSreg | Plus, plenty of examples and I reiterate performance efficient, far more than tactical AI scripts. |
| 06:18.48 | Ahli | well... it has no connection to my custom sight checking function |
| 06:19.08 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 06:19.18 | Ahli | I'm simulating per unit vision with that |
| 06:19.22 | JademusSreg | Care to paste the script for it? =D |
| 06:19.59 | Ahli | it's checking unit types of structures within a line... |
| 06:20.07 | ArcanePariah | Well sight on a per unit can be simulated by validators, via enumerate area |
| 06:20.21 | JademusSreg | To a limited degree, absolutely. |
| 06:20.24 | ArcanePariah | Enumerate area with arc set to 1 or 0 |
| 06:20.37 | ArcanePariah | will give you a narrow line directly in front of the unit |
| 06:21.02 | JademusSreg | (Gets more difficult checking for intersecting cliffs, but yeah, otherwise it's perfect, shown in my LoS demo.) |
| 06:21.15 | Ahli | I've no cliffs |
| 06:21.20 | JademusSreg | Perfect. |
| 06:21.26 | Ahli | yes, that would be an optimization for AI stuff |
| 06:21.59 | JademusSreg | looks for demo. |
| 06:22.10 | ArcanePariah | Also a very key thing for enumerate area validtors.. it can validate all units found as well |
| 06:24.15 | JademusSreg | Here's some pictures to entertain until I find it: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/l0qc7fq98rnio92/RmJ9x5aP1l |
| 06:26.00 | JademusSreg | Hm, slow uploading. |
| 06:27.11 | JademusSreg | Wonder what silly shit I put in the map to bloat the file size... |
| 06:27.35 | JademusSreg | Anyway, here's the link. Should be uploaded soon: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1049551/Starcraft%202/KopruluFactions.SC2Map |
| 06:27.41 | JademusSreg | Might even work properly. |
| 06:27.56 | JademusSreg | brb |
| 06:44.24 | *** join/#sc2mapster Delphinium (~Delphiniu@60.166.102.78) |
| 06:59.25 | Ahli | JademusSreg: so, uhm... the map only has a marine when I test it, but it has the enumerate area stuff and an example of a function validator |
| 06:59.44 | JademusSreg | makeunit is a handy command. |
| 07:01.41 | Ahli | how do I add a player parameter to that command? |
| 07:01.58 | JademusSreg | I should point out my approach for line-of-sight weapon fire depends on effect tree root validation, and it fails validation if it detects a friendly unit in the line of fire. Anyway, using a similar apporach to validation should serve your purposes. |
| 07:02.15 | JademusSreg | makeunit Marine 12 1 |
| 07:02.22 | Ahli | oh works |
| 07:04.27 | Ahli | well, they look like stupid at the enemy |
| 07:04.39 | Ahli | when they can't shoot |
| 07:05.06 | Ahli | doesn't that mean that they would stare at enemies through walls when that one is closer than the one they could fire at? |
| 07:06.02 | JademusSreg | Ah, depends on which build that is, but yes. In your case, if the LoS validation fails, you can make them do something else. Since this demo doesn't use tactical AI, I didn't have that luxury. =D |
| 07:06.14 | JademusSreg | *yes, they can't shoot |
| 07:06.28 | JademusSreg | That was the point of the system; proper positioning and such. |
| 07:06.31 | Ahli | oh that seems to be the "warface" behavior ordering to turn I assume |
| 07:06.49 | JademusSreg | Yes, without it, they do something much stupider. |
| 07:07.57 | JademusSreg | A strange bug, if it failed validation at any point evar, even once the unit became valid by moving into line of fire, they wouldn't acquirew. |
| 07:08.20 | JademusSreg | Turns out that it would only start checking for acquisition again if they moved in some way. |
| 07:08.22 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 07:08.27 | JademusSreg | Thus, Warface. |
| 07:09.10 | Ahli | hmm, I found old copy pasted stuff about tactical AI functions |
| 07:09.27 | Ahli | what you explained here a few months ago |
| 07:10.05 | JademusSreg | Anyway, none of the stuff outside of the approach to validation is applicable, but that's the only demo I had relating to LoF/LoS. |
| 07:10.19 | Ahli | http://pastebin.com/rM73mGLV |
| 07:11.27 | Ahli | I need an example of a working, little unit AI to see how that stuff works.... |
| 07:11.46 | Ahli | my goal would be to create things like a circle walk around target units casting spells |
| 07:12.00 | Ahli | or approaching targets in a non-linear path |
| 07:13.19 | JademusSreg | So if you insisted on code, the function signature must be void SomeFunction (int player, unit theUnitDoingShit, unitgroup scanGroup). Or in GUI terms, an action with no return, takes a player, unit, and unitgroup in that order. Then you'd get the script identifier (if not in a library, gf_SomeFunction) and put that into the unit data Tactical AI function field, which takes a raw string. |
| 07:13.53 | Ahli | void AIThinkHellion (int player, unit aiUnit, unitgroup scanGroup) { |
| 07:14.15 | JademusSreg | Yup. |
| 07:15.03 | Ahli | but if I just plug my code in for every unit its performance will be bad. I kind of need to turn AI on and off for units |
| 07:15.23 | ArcanePariah | There is a trigger action to enable and disable Tactica AI for a unit |
| 07:15.29 | JademusSreg | Yep. |
| 07:15.31 | Ahli | ah great |
| 07:15.49 | ArcanePariah | You can also disable it, but force it to run on a one time basis |
| 07:16.46 | ArcanePariah | Also, for the attacks coming in on multiple vectors, I will write up an example in the next few minutes for you |
| 07:21.48 | Ahli | I hope my zombie units will now receive text tags above their heads :D |
| 07:22.09 | Ahli | does the player need to be a computer? |
| 07:22.18 | Ahli | or can e very player run tactical AI? |
| 07:22.30 | ArcanePariah | Players needs to be computer |
| 07:22.46 | ArcanePariah | And you need to start the Campaign AI, its a trigger action |
| 07:23.13 | JademusSreg | Well, technically don't need Campaign AI, but it works. |
| 07:26.57 | Ahli | works with hostile.... pffff computer players |
| 07:27.33 | JademusSreg | Haha |
| 07:27.58 | JademusSreg | Glad it does. |
| 07:28.07 | Ahli | I enable it for the unit, though |
| 07:28.10 | Ahli | not sure if required |
| 07:28.15 | Ahli | but I would assume that |
| 07:28.30 | JademusSreg | Enabled by default for players running an AI. |
| 07:29.17 | Ahli | also, it checks every game second |
| 07:30.46 | Ahli | oh, the tactical AI function is even changable on the fly?, cool |
| 07:31.25 | JademusSreg | Catalogs are magic. |
| 07:31.26 | JademusSreg | brb |
| 07:31.50 | Ahli | well, it's a GUI function |
| 07:32.06 | *** join/#sc2mapster Bounty (45f8f26f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.248.242.111) |
| 07:32.14 | Bounty | pew |
| 07:32.19 | Ahli | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:40.22 | ArcanePariah | Yep |
| 07:40.41 | ArcanePariah | One word of caution tho |
| 07:41.24 | ArcanePariah | The Tactical AI in data will work always, but any script based AI using AI functions ans waves will only work on units that are NOT script controlled, IE, if you use Issue Order |
| 07:41.54 | ArcanePariah | There is a AI Issue Order you use instead |
| 07:43.50 | ArcanePariah | Here is a simple example of using attack waves |
| 07:43.52 | ArcanePariah | https://www.dropbox.com/s/yz2s9jpjgi9oz3o/Trigger%20AI%20Example.SC2Map |
| 07:44.11 | Ahli | hmm, my zombie was script controlled, but had AI think function called... |
| 07:44.11 | ArcanePariah | The zerglings will follow semi randomized attack paths to the marine in the middle |
| 07:44.29 | Ahli | but I reenabled the AI before ordering the unit |
| 07:44.45 | Ahli | or did I reenable it every turn |
| 07:45.07 | Ahli | well, thanks :D |
| 07:45.32 | ArcanePariah | I'll now show an example of using escorts |
| 07:45.36 | ArcanePariah | Gimme a few minutes |
| 07:45.59 | Ahli | ArcanePariah: the AI think function is called despite me using trigger orders |
| 07:46.09 | Ahli | no, me stupid again |
| 07:46.32 | Ahli | well, I'm too lazy to add the AI activation thing in the dungeon loading code ^^ |
| 07:46.45 | JademusSreg | Arc, I think that AI stuff might not be a good fit for Ahli's Diablo-like map. |
| 07:47.09 | Ahli | can I raise the checking frequency? |
| 07:48.04 | Ahli | the think frequency |
| 07:48.30 | JademusSreg | It's the reserved AI threads, so I expect not, but there might be something to control it in the data. |
| 07:48.41 | JademusSreg | Check Game data, I figure. |
| 07:48.46 | JademusSreg | bbl |
| 07:51.50 | Ahli | AI waves use a-moves |
| 07:59.35 | *** join/#sc2mapster MoonEater916 (~Thunderbi@108-88-97-1.lightspeed.mtryca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 07:59.52 | Bounty | Paaaeeeooowww |
| 08:00.45 | Ahli | 9am... should I even bother trying to sleep? |
| 08:00.56 | Bounty | 3am here |
| 08:01.03 | Bounty | I tried to sleep, thought the same thing |
| 08:01.06 | Bounty | screw it lol |
| 08:01.17 | Bounty | How long have you been awake Ahli? |
| 08:02.49 | Ahli | ~ 17 hours |
| 08:03.07 | Bounty | hmm |
| 08:03.14 | Bounty | tough choice honestly |
| 08:03.16 | Bounty | lol |
| 08:03.29 | Ahli | well, anyway, time to buy breakfast stuff |
| 08:03.31 | Bounty | Depends if you plan on using the time wisely |
| 08:05.52 | ArcanePariah | Oh he is, I'm giving him a primer on Trigger AI |
| 08:06.11 | Bounty | Ah |
| 08:06.12 | Bounty | >.< |
| 08:06.42 | ArcanePariah | Which, given that I'm already creating the example code, I really ought to post on SC2 Mapster for people to use |
| 08:10.24 | ArcanePariah | Here is a revised file Ahli (and anyone else who is interested). The first trigger demonstrates basic attack waves. The 2nd one incorporates wave escorts |
| 08:10.27 | ArcanePariah | https://www.dropbox.com/s/yz2s9jpjgi9oz3o/Trigger%20AI%20Example.SC2Map |
| 08:29.28 | progammer | 6 minute with Chris Sigaty, absolutely no interesting information http://youtu.be/D0_RaCABNfo |
| 08:32.06 | JademusSreg | Hahah |
| 08:32.52 | ArcanePariah | Welp, looks like I might as well build an entire tutorial to AI while I'm at it |
| 08:35.56 | ArcanePariah | jade, 2 questions. Any further thoughts on NotD code? And also thoughts on the AI tutorial that is a now a WIP :P |
| 08:36.58 | ArcanePariah | Latest Revision of the Trigger AI. Has examples of Attack Waves, Attack waves with escorts, and Attack Waves with groups targeting groups |
| 08:37.01 | ArcanePariah | https://www.dropbox.com/s/yz2s9jpjgi9oz3o/Trigger%20AI%20Example.SC2Map |
| 08:39.01 | JademusSreg | I've not looked at the code again, rather busy. But I can take a look once proffered with an updated script. |
| 08:39.03 | Ahli | ok, why did I watch that knowing that there are no new infors inside? |
| 08:39.14 | Ahli | *infos |
| 08:39.30 | Ahli | *info (has no plural) |
| 08:40.35 | ArcanePariah | Curiosity Ahli |
| 08:40.57 | ArcanePariah | Also, is my example map a bit helpful in terms of understanding the trigger AI? |
| 08:42.17 | JademusSreg | As for AI, makes sense to cover The Standard AI module-based implementation, then tactical AI scripts and data, followed by Melee AIs and an errata section covering cool shit you can do with AI code. |
| 08:42.43 | ArcanePariah | Well then, I guess I'm off to a good start |
| 08:43.10 | ArcanePariah | I probably should also delve into how one can include custom AI data into a map |
| 08:43.36 | ArcanePariah | Since you can include trigger libraries for AI exlcusively, under the Gameplay data object |
| 08:44.05 | ArcanePariah | In fact, with multiple libraries, you can create customized AI on a player to player basis |
| 08:44.15 | JademusSreg | How Melee AI scripts work is fascinating in its own right, and probably the most difficult part. |
| 08:44.17 | ArcanePariah | Since you select which AI library to use as part of player properties |
| 08:44.31 | Ahli | escort seems pretty cool |
| 08:45.40 | JademusSreg | Also, make very clear the difference between AttackWave and Wave. =D |
| 08:45.43 | ArcanePariah | Yes, you can do it 2 ways. The way I have it presented has the units escorting a specfic unit in the wave, with assigned positions, but you also can simply add the unit to the attack wave and send the wave, the unit will then just tag along. |
| 08:48.02 | Ahli | attack waves are interesting, if I do something like D3's elite groups |
| 08:48.17 | Ahli | where lesser monsters protect a stronger leader one |
| 08:48.20 | ArcanePariah | Well an attack wave is a object, constructed from a base Wave template. I had not entirely figured out how one can customize waves with wave objects. I assume it serves the purpose of have generic wave template (IE, 2 zealots, a stalker and an archon) that you can use to rapidly create and send waves with, instead of the 5 lines repeated in a function to do the same thing, plus such objects... |
| 08:48.22 | ArcanePariah | ...are variables, so one can alter on the fly |
| 08:48.48 | ArcanePariah | Ahil, yes, at map intialization, when spawning somelike like a D3 champion mob, that is how I would do it as well |
| 08:50.53 | Ahli | well, for me it wouldn't be map init... that group would receive an ID which is stored with them in the data table and after loading the units, they are recreated |
| 08:51.00 | JademusSreg | AttackWaves provide a subset of Wave features, easier to work with for campaign-style unit coordination. |
| 08:51.31 | ArcanePariah | Another trigger action I should bring to your attention is the AI Flee action, which allows one to order a AI unit to move away from another unit up to a certain distance |
| 08:52.08 | ArcanePariah | Which can be useful for AI casters possibly, moving in to cast a spell and then falling back, or retreating from the player to gain room to cast spells, or perhaps archers to get range to fire on the player |
| 08:52.28 | Ahli | indeed |
| 08:52.49 | ArcanePariah | I had observed in D2 and D3 that skeleton archers would sometimes retreat before attacking again, esepcially corrupt Rogues |
| 08:54.06 | Ahli | when you are in closer range, not on far distance? |
| 08:54.23 | Ahli | D1's archers retreat, too. |
| 08:54.33 | ArcanePariah | A key thing I must also remind you of, is that one can add some realism/gameplay by introducing random values for the paramateres of those actions, such as making it flee a random distance of 5 - 10, as to make for more dynamic gameplay |
| 08:55.26 | Ahli | I don't think anyone needs to remind me using random :D |
| 08:55.34 | ArcanePariah | In the perfect world, you would have a Tactical AI function, and in that function, it would do a area search around the archer, and then probablistically decide to either attack or to flee, if a player is found to be close |
| 08:56.05 | ArcanePariah | With fleeing becoming a more likely action the closer the player is |
| 08:58.11 | ArcanePariah | Speaking of custom functions, JademusSreg, what do all the flags for action/function definitions do? |
| 08:58.29 | ArcanePariah | Create Thread is pretty self explanatory |
| 08:58.58 | ArcanePariah | But the Custom AI flag, is that the flag to set so the proper function definition is created for writing a tactical AI function? |
| 09:03.47 | ArcanePariah | Ok, dumb question of the hour, is there a complete listing of all the Galaxy library functions? |
| 09:04.32 | JademusSreg | Sure. |
| 09:05.46 | JademusSreg | As for GUI shit, such things tend to be either editor-used data or script macros. |
| 09:06.15 | JademusSreg | I've got all the scripts, though. |
| 09:07.09 | ArcanePariah | I also take it, because of the UI, there isn't exactly anything like Eclispse/VS for Galaxy |
| 09:07.23 | ArcanePariah | With function autocompletion/sugguestion, etc. |
| 09:08.08 | JademusSreg | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1049551/Starcraft%202/StandardGalaxy.7z |
| 09:08.37 | JademusSreg | And no, various attempts at making IDEs or such for galaxy have perished. |
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| 10:14.04 | *** join/#sc2mapster kingTD (~Administr@78-60-26-40.static.zebra.lt) |
| 10:19.08 | *** join/#sc2mapster Zolden (~a@88.135.0.21) |
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| 10:37.32 | G0A | Zolden bitcoin is at 400$ |
| 10:38.21 | G0A | ahh its back at 340 |
| 10:40.39 | Zolden | :) |
| 10:41.35 | Zolden | what if it will never stop growing? |
| 10:42.23 | Zolden | are there buttcoins? |
| 10:56.30 | Otixa | eh |
| 10:56.34 | Otixa | bitcoins at 400?! |
| 10:56.46 | Zolden | kingTD you have those resource icons, right? |
| 10:56.46 | Otixa | I better start up my miner again |
| 10:57.03 | kingTD | which ones? |
| 10:57.14 | Zolden | for the jew map |
| 10:57.50 | Zolden | I want metal, food, gold, mana, crystals, oil and subdolak resources icons |
| 10:58.04 | Zolden | they are not from wow, right? |
| 10:58.32 | kingTD | well have wood gold and iron icons made myself |
| 10:58.52 | Zolden | ok, just send me the ones I mentioned |
| 10:58.54 | *** join/#sc2mapster Bommes (~Bommes@ipkn-70.koenigsnet.rwth-aachen.de) |
| 10:59.31 | kingTD | how about you give me candy first? |
| 10:59.36 | Zolden | i won't use them for sure, just to have something to pick from |
| 11:00.16 | EmperorZolden | I COMMADN YOU, SEND ME THE ICONS! |
| 11:00.28 | kingTD | <.< |
| 11:05.02 | kingTD | sent you in sc2mapster message |
| 11:05.33 | Zolden | ty |
| 11:06.46 | *** join/#sc2mapster Raziel (Raziel@2a01:388:201:4190:a5dd:e37b:2440:563e) |
| 11:17.38 | Zolden | G0A don't you remember, can we change button's icon via catalog? |
| 11:23.29 | G0A | yes, you can |
| 11:23.44 | G0A | I use that in my heroes of entropy map |
| 11:27.33 | Zolden | good |
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| 12:12.18 | *** join/#sc2mapster Kueken (~Kueken@brsg-4dbbdc88.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 12:33.16 | kingTD | 2 cant win 5 matches in HS |
| 12:33.22 | kingTD | 2h* |
| 12:35.13 | Zolden | HS - Heart (of the) Swarm? |
| 12:35.21 | kingTD | head shit! |
| 12:36.17 | kingTD | now its time to find those golden DnB songs from 800 songs list |
| 12:47.15 | kingTD | ffs let me win for the last time Im bored of this shit :\ |
| 12:51.25 | Zolden | Otixa there's "text" tool in photoshop, and I wnat numbers to have 1 pixel black outer border, how to do it? |
| 12:53.56 | kingTD | yay finally 60g |
| 12:54.21 | kingTD | now how to make AoK more enjoyable |
| 12:54.44 | Zolden | mages |
| 12:58.05 | kingTD | it would make it better but what to change that it would be more exciting to play it even without mages.. |
| 12:58.34 | *** join/#sc2mapster sc2println (~flo@2a02:810d:1680:60a:f66d:4ff:fe93:2e29) |
| 12:59.54 | Zolden | do you have counter system? |
| 13:00.11 | Zolden | like spearmen kill mounted |
| 13:40.03 | Zolden | lol |
| 13:40.04 | kingTD | y spearman > horsman, Horsman > Ranged/Siege, melee > ranged |
| 13:40.06 | Zolden | http://icdn.lenta.ru/images/2013/11/10/17/20131110171307901/pic_e342d3356dd554338425ddbf836a346b.png |
| 13:40.09 | Zolden | this guy |
| 13:40.27 | kingTD | penis stuck in the bricks? |
| 13:40.31 | Zolden | he nailed his scrotum to red square in moscow |
| 13:59.52 | Zolden | kingTD http://vk.com/video38682_166800778?hd=3&t=1s |
| 14:00.15 | Zolden | though, not sure if this vid will work for you |
| 14:00.16 | kingTD | requires sign in |
| 14:00.20 | Zolden | ok, forget it |
| 14:00.57 | Zolden | kingTD http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11SvlzJRaWs |
| 14:01.36 | Stewox | great stuff from blizzcon |
| 14:01.49 | Stewox | really want to see reconnect for starcraft 2 |
| 14:02.31 | Stewox | hey g0a |
| 14:02.36 | kingTD | :D |
| 14:02.37 | Stewox | you weren't here at the time |
| 14:03.00 | Stewox | here's a great summary of an ethics lesson |
| 14:03.36 | Stewox | here you are G0A http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTJqnnKHR2k |
| 14:04.07 | Stewox | anyways |
| 14:04.23 | Stewox | i've been dreaming about reconnect since forever for RTS games |
| 14:04.37 | Stewox | finally somethings moving but the sound of it at blizzcon |
| 14:04.47 | Stewox | looks like it won't be in this year, early next year |
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| 14:53.40 | kingTD | playing SpellForce the tutorial is so annoying and slow, it cant keep up with me... |
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| 16:12.47 | *** join/#sc2mapster Delphinium (jifengxian@60.166.102.78) |
| 16:14.56 | Delphinium | Wow， printIn is here |
| 16:16.05 | sc2println | hi |
| 16:16.33 | Delphinium | Hi |
| 16:16.37 | Zolden | omg sc2println is here! no way! wow! |
| 16:17.10 | sc2println | Zolen: :p, you saw me yesterday ;) |
| 16:17.33 | Zolden | omg, I saw you yesterday! |
| 16:18.12 | Delphinium | You taught me last year about the animation ID transformation. |
| 16:18.26 | Ahli | hmm damned, I can't see anything that speeds up the AI think period |
| 16:18.50 | Delphinium | Now new models and new questions, I need your help angain~ |
| 16:18.52 | Zolden | Ahli they think too slow? |
| 16:18.53 | *** join/#sc2mapster eglz (5796a27c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.150.162.124) |
| 16:18.54 | Delphinium | XD |
| 16:18.54 | Kueken | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:19.03 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:19.32 | Kueken | and the rest of the channel is unable to help you, naturally? :D |
| 16:19.35 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:19.36 | Ahli | Zolden, once per game second isn't much... basically I need them to think after an action ;D |
| 16:20.08 | Kueken | Ahli: maybe there is a command to force a "think step"? |
| 16:20.10 | Zolden | Ahli guess, you're using built-in AI? |
| 16:20.22 | Kueken | eglz: that sounds strange |
| 16:20.25 | Ahli | I'm testing it for Zombies, yes... well build in ^^ |
| 16:20.27 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:20.42 | Kueken | what exactly do you mean by that, disappears? |
| 16:20.44 | Ahli | it's calling a function I defined and I put my AI trigger code into it |
| 16:20.53 | Delphinium | How to make two different m3a files which are created base on same model, merge together into one m3a file. |
| 16:20.55 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:21.00 | Kueken | do you mean it doesn't show up in the list anymore so no more people can join? |
| 16:21.12 | Kueken | or do you mean you don't see any teams anymore? |
| 16:21.22 | Kueken | or do you get disconnected? |
| 16:21.40 | Ahli | so, currently I assume I will continue with my own AI thread approach |
| 16:22.04 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:22.12 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:22.14 | Delphinium | It seems burn daylight but do useful to my current work flow, single m3a can be easier to produce than multiple ones |
| 16:22.20 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:22.48 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:22.59 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:23.21 | Kueken | well, I am afraid I cannot help you with that |
| 16:23.28 | Ahli | at least the error has a name :D |
| 16:23.35 | Kueken | never experienced that issue, no idea what could cause it |
| 16:24.38 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:25.32 | Ahli | log out, log in, is that repeatable? |
| 16:35.26 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:35.45 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:36.15 | Ahli | which server which map? |
| 16:37.12 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:37.35 | eglz | <PROTECTED> |
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| 16:39.37 | Zolden | JademusSreg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZlJxWhvkUk |
| 16:39.46 | Zolden | today in moscow |
| 16:40.11 | Zolden | Kueken you watch too |
| 16:40.16 | Zolden | all watch |
| 16:41.02 | Ahli | why does a person do that? |
| 16:41.20 | Delphinium | What happened? |
| 16:41.23 | Zolden | it's an art |
| 16:42.06 | Zolden | Delphinium you can't watch youtube? |
| 16:42.33 | Delphinium | I can |
| 16:42.41 | Delphinium | OMG... |
| 16:43.02 | Delphinium | It must be very cold at this moment |
| 16:43.46 | Zolden | not very, warm winds from gulfstream making it tolerable |
| 16:45.47 | Kueken | just like I assumed, if Zolden linked it I don't want to watch it |
| 16:46.30 | Kueken | or is it the guy who nailed his penis to the floor? then I already saw that, was posted in here yesterday |
| 16:47.25 | Ahli | no, he did that with his other private parts |
| 16:47.50 | Kueken | yeah, don't know the translation |
| 16:48.04 | Kueken | could have said "balls" I guess |
| 16:48.13 | Kueken | but didn't came to mind |
| 16:48.23 | Kueken | you know, I am penis-fixated |
| 16:48.41 | Ahli | I assume it's just skin, but getting an infection there wouldn't be... desirable |
| 16:49.43 | Zolden | I think he desinfected it |
| 16:49.47 | Kueken | a smart guy would have disinfected the nail |
| 16:50.03 | Ahli | he still put it into the ground |
| 16:50.09 | Ahli | he needs to take it off again, too |
| 16:50.11 | Kueken | but assuming he nailed his balls to the floor, I doubt "smart" is the word of choice here |
| 16:50.52 | Zolden | not smart, at least art |
| 16:51.30 | Ahli | for me it's crossing the border between art and stupidity |
| 16:52.05 | A1win | it can be both |
| 16:52.11 | Zolden | artists have to do it sometimes, to shock ppl and be cool |
| 16:53.34 | Kueken | and cool he is |
| 16:54.19 | Ahli | filtering inside unit groups should be faster than searching units in an area with a lot of filtered out units, correct? |
| 16:55.10 | Kueken | intuitively I would say yes |
| 16:55.36 | Kueken | if its critical, you can test it easily |
| 16:55.58 | Kueken | I would assume it doesn't make much of a difference |
| 16:56.07 | Ahli | I think I will use a group containing all AIcontrolled units alive and a group that is checked depending on being active or within an activation distance to a hero unit (need to cycle through all player units that could activate, atm just hero and golem) |
| 16:56.19 | Kueken | internally it might even execute the same functions |
| 16:56.36 | Ahli | well, I've a ton of walls on the map |
| 16:57.32 | Ahli | well, I just do it that way... |
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| 17:23.31 | *** part/#sc2mapster G0A (~hookah604@91.82.135.84.pool.invitel.hu) |
| 17:48.09 | Zolden | guyes, the "Info-Cooldown-Location" field. Should I pick there "Global" or "Player" value to make the abil to have cooldowns on all units of the player? |
| 17:49.20 | *** join/#sc2mapster dvzon (4bb6268b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.75.182.38.139) |
| 17:49.57 | dvzon | Hello, I just have a quick question. |
| 17:52.06 | dvzon | if I have, for example, 100 marines on the map, what specific trigger can I use to make something happen for all of them instead of making 100 triggers. for example, if i want to increase their speed if something happens, I don't want to do make 100 different triggers for each marine, how would I do it with 1 trigger? |
| 17:52.30 | dvzon | there are other different units in the map too, but the marines are one type of them. |
| 17:53.02 | dvzon | I was testing pick each unit in unit group, but that's not doing it |
| 17:53.05 | A1win | use a for loop |
| 17:53.12 | Zolden | first, you gan do it in data, vai upgrade |
| 17:53.55 | A1win | *for each loop |
| 17:54.05 | Zolden | but if you insist on a trigger, there's pick units in a group of "all units in location matching condition", and condition has filter, also you can set a specific unit type |
| 17:54.21 | dvzon | ah |
| 17:54.28 | A1win | you just need to set it up right |
| 17:54.30 | dvzon | Im going to test that out, Thank u, very much |
| 17:54.52 | A1win | but use For Each Unit In Unit Group instead of Pick Each Unit In Unit Group |
| 17:55.02 | Ahli | Zolden: player? |
| 17:55.11 | Ahli | global would be for all units |
| 17:55.14 | Zolden | Ahli i guess |
| 17:55.27 | Ahli | of all players |
| 17:55.46 | Zolden | sounds sensible |
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| 17:59.41 | Ahli | note to self: make sure that you don't use the same variable in 2 nested loops |
| 17:59.55 | A1win | <.< |
| 18:00.26 | A1win | I wanna make something with procedural generation D: |
| 18:00.54 | A1win | Moorhsum, make a sentence |
| 18:00.55 | Moorhsum | What map balancing problem. >_< |
| 18:01.58 | Zolden | A1win like terrain geenration? |
| 18:02.15 | A1win | for example |
| 18:02.37 | Zolden | make river generation |
| 18:02.47 | A1win | why :E |
| 18:03.05 | Zolden | because it's an interesting thing to make |
| 18:03.14 | A1win | doesn't sound very interesting :P |
| 18:04.26 | Zolden | there can be objects like buildings or hills, and river shouldn't touch them, it also shouldn't cross itself, and look natural, and be long and have bends |
| 18:05.04 | Zolden | not too simple, but not too hard |
| 18:05.10 | Ahli | I've made rivers :D |
| 18:05.35 | Zolden | Ahli how? what approach used? |
| 18:05.35 | A1win | it needs to be something that I can actually use for something when it's done ;> |
| 18:06.39 | Zolden | A1win name what you want to do and i'll try to sugests, what can be generated |
| 18:06.56 | Ahli | find starting location, extend the river into a random direction where it can continue, build end parts if it fits the river ending condition |
| 18:07.25 | Ahli | but my rivers can run into other rivers |
| 18:07.29 | A1win | dunno ;p |
| 18:07.34 | Zolden | Ahli i did the same in civ |
| 18:07.53 | Ahli | and bridges to make sure everything can be accessed |
| 18:08.26 | Zolden | is blizzcon ended? |
| 18:09.12 | Zolden | also, is the finals of sc2 fights also ended? |
| 18:09.20 | Zolden | if yes, who became the champion? |
| 18:09.25 | A1win | sOs |
| 18:09.35 | A1win | Jaedong got yet another 2nd place, his 5th now |
| 18:09.43 | Zolden | ha, noob |
| 18:10.39 | A1win | sOs had some pretty insane strategies, he was one step ahead of jaedong almost all the time |
| 18:10.47 | A1win | knew how he was going to respond to stuff and countered that |
| 18:12.43 | Zolden | definitely will watch it later today |
| 18:13.02 | *** join/#sc2mapster bob_____ (46bb4dab@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.187.77.171) |
| 18:14.47 | bob_____ | my editor keeps crashing when i vew a model in the import view |
| 18:14.54 | bob_____ | anyone else get this problem or know how to bypass it? |
| 18:15.14 | Zolden | is it a custom model? |
| 18:15.28 | Zolden | there are ways to make a model crash the editor |
| 18:15.39 | bob_____ | yes it is a custom model, trying to delete it |
| 18:15.53 | bob_____ | dont know any ways to delete it than through the import view though |
| 18:16.09 | A1win | can't you disable preview in import view? |
| 18:16.18 | bob_____ | is there an option to do that? |
| 18:16.26 | A1win | that's what I'm asking ;p |
| 18:16.29 | A1win | there might be |
| 18:16.35 | bob_____ | oh heh, i thought so to, couldnt find it |
| 18:17.13 | A1win | you could always just remove it from the map file itself, easiest way is to save it as component folder, delete the model, and then resave as sc2map |
| 18:17.15 | Zolden | you can export marine model, rename it to the model you want to delete, import. It will replace. Save. Close and start the editor. Then remove it. |
| 18:17.56 | bob_____ | ah, both of those are good ideas, nice |
| 18:19.31 | Ahli | yeah, only checking like 10 units' surrounding is better than checking 100+ units' surrounding :D |
| 18:19.42 | bob_____ | its weird that all custom models are crashing it now.. wasn't before |
| 18:19.57 | bob_____ | had the same models in there for couple years |
| 18:20.06 | A1win | the editor has changed a lot |
| 18:21.24 | bob_____ | how do i resave a component folder to an sc2map after removing the data (never done this before) |
| 18:21.36 | A1win | open the folder as sc2 map in the editor |
| 18:22.03 | A1win | (close the map first) |
| 18:22.14 | A1win | and then just save normally |
| 18:23.56 | bob_____ | nice, worked perfectly |
| 18:24.09 | bob_____ | thanks for the help - useful to know |
| 18:24.35 | Zolden | A1win about that space map |
| 18:24.58 | Zolden | A1win what if you make weapons work like it's usually wirking in games like lost vikings in sc2 |
| 18:25.12 | A1win | how do you mean? |
| 18:25.16 | Zolden | you kill a bonus or a player, it releases a weapon upgrade |
| 18:25.31 | A1win | hmm |
| 18:25.43 | Zolden | if you have weapon A and upgrade +A, you'll have upgraded weapon A |
| 18:25.54 | Zolden | and there will be a few stages of the each weapon |
| 18:26.10 | A1win | or maybe just one upgrade that you lose when you die |
| 18:26.12 | Zolden | like more balls, bigger balls, stronger balls, you know |
| 18:26.31 | Zolden | if you die, you lose all, and have basic simple weapon |
| 18:26.39 | Zolden | then slowly start to gain |
| 18:26.53 | A1win | you mean also gain weapons during game? |
| 18:27.08 | A1win | or just have 4 basic weapons that will get upgraded/modified |
| 18:27.37 | A1win | hmmh |
| 18:27.44 | Zolden | yea, so base weapon is shit and any upgrade you pick will switch the weapon ot the first level of the class A, B, C or D |
| 18:27.56 | Zolden | and base has no calss an no upgrades |
| 18:28.29 | Zolden | then next upgrade will up the weapon if it's from the class you have, and will reset the weapon to 1st level of the class if it's a different class |
| 18:29.10 | A1win | you mean there would be more than 4 types of weapons? |
| 18:29.28 | Zolden | yea, 4 classes, and each could have 3-5 levels |
| 18:29.44 | A1win | wouldn't it be better that each player always have all weapon types (4 different ones), and you pick up upgrades that modify those |
| 18:30.11 | Zolden | and switch between? maybe, dunno |
| 18:30.20 | A1win | no I mean how it's right now |
| 18:30.31 | A1win | mouse1, mouse2, and two keys to use each different weapon |
| 18:30.35 | Zolden | by some reason I like the idea with only 1 weapon, and if you pick the wrong upgrade, weapon resets to 1st level |
| 18:30.51 | A1win | but then you can't have stuff like defensive shields |
| 18:31.19 | Zolden | also, you could add a couple of unique unupgradable weapons, rare and strong (maybe with a limited amount of attacks, like 5) |
| 18:31.24 | A1win | or maybe have 1 weapon and 1 defensive ability |
| 18:31.56 | Zolden | maybe 1 weapon and 1 abil; and abil can be defencive or speed-uping |
| 18:32.04 | Zolden | or fire uping |
| 18:32.12 | A1win | mmm |
| 18:32.21 | Zolden | and abils can also have levels |
| 18:32.27 | Zolden | to pick the upgrades for it |
| 18:32.50 | Zolden | usually rpg elements make the game more addictive |
| 18:32.54 | A1win | could be cool, then if someone snowballs too much, others can just gang up against him to balance it out |
| 18:33.01 | A1win | that's one strength of FFA |
| 18:33.08 | Zolden | yea |
| 18:33.09 | A1win | while a downside at the same time |
| 18:33.52 | A1win | yeah that could be really nice, would make development easier too |
| 18:33.54 | Zolden | also, you could make a game mod team vs team with planet capturing |
| 18:34.03 | A1win | not having to come up with lots of stuff for 4 different slots |
| 18:34.16 | A1win | I'll think about the game modes later |
| 18:34.26 | A1win | I already tried some planet capturing, wasn't very interesting |
| 18:34.40 | A1win | but it might be different now that ships are slower |
| 18:34.46 | A1win | but anyway I'll still do that later down the road |
| 18:34.53 | A1win | just want to get one game mode functional for now ;p |
| 18:34.58 | A1win | otherwise this will never get done |
| 18:35.42 | A1win | I wonder if the weapons should come from destroyed players or as pickups on planets |
| 18:35.43 | A1win | like the healthkits are now |
| 18:35.44 | A1win | or both |
| 18:36.06 | A1win | just wouldn't make much sense to loot some weapon from a player who didn't have that weapon |
| 18:36.24 | A1win | or could make players drop the weapon they had when they die |
| 18:36.49 | A1win | but what if you accidentally pick up a weapon you don't want? |
| 18:37.02 | A1win | make the weapon crates destructible o: |
| 18:37.16 | A1win | so you can shoot them before you hit one ;p |
| 18:38.46 | A1win | Zolden, are you still up for making some models for this? |
| 18:44.28 | Bibendus | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNrJyGVuxWo |
| 18:44.31 | Bibendus | omg that phasing |
| 18:45.41 | Ahli | model + camera texture thing |
| 18:45.50 | Ahli | zolden has the tech for that |
| 18:50.09 | A1win | hmm could also make a "press Q to accept new weapon" thing to make accidental pickups not hurt |
| 18:50.46 | A1win | add a small icon above the weapon slot with an arrow pointing down, and when you press the hotkey, it replaces your current weapon with the new one |
| 18:51.24 | A1win | and E for the equipment slot |
| 18:54.54 | Zolden | A1win if player has weapon A of any level, he drops +A upgrade if destroyed |
| 18:55.14 | Zolden | And yes, I'm ok about making models, just need to finish my map, it eats all time |
| 18:55.56 | A1win | I'm not sure about upgrades of different types, could just have one universal weapon upgrade and one equipment upgrade (if that's even needed) |
| 18:56.43 | Zolden | And I think that picking the wrong weapon upgrade whould be possible, players should avoid it an not be able to kill it |
| 18:57.33 | A1win | it just doesn't make much sense that you're forced to take a weapon you don't want :P |
| 18:58.15 | Zolden | in most fly'n'kill games I played it was like this |
| 18:58.45 | A1win | that doesn't mean it's a good feature ;p |
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| 18:59.24 | *** join/#sc2mapster sc2println (~flo@2a02:810d:1680:60a:f66d:4ff:fe93:2e29) |
| 19:01.22 | *** join/#sc2mapster Blub\w (~wry@unaffiliated/blubw/x-6625061) |
| 19:02.40 | A1win | http://a1win.pp.fi/ss/sc2/ph/a75/SC2%202013-11-10%2021-01-43-39.jpg |
| 19:04.29 | *** join/#sc2mapster sc2println (~flo@2a02:810d:1680:60a:f66d:4ff:fe93:2e29) |
| 19:17.59 | Bibendus | ahli I tought the same :P |
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| 19:26.43 | *** join/#sc2mapster CryptRat (440a90ef@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.10.144.239) |
| 19:26.51 | CryptRat | I'm running into a weird problem. |
| 19:26.57 | CryptRat | I have an ability with cooldown linked to player. |
| 19:27.18 | CryptRat | Previously, if the ability was queued, it would go on cooldown immediately. |
| 19:28.14 | A1win | the Wait To Spend flag controls that |
| 19:28.24 | CryptRat | Yes, I did that. |
| 19:28.32 | CryptRat | Sorry I was trying to find what that flag's name was. |
| 19:28.51 | CryptRat | But now, if the ability is queued multiple times, they are all executed at once before the ability goes on cooldown. |
| 19:29.25 | CryptRat | Rather than being executed sequentially with the cooldown between uses. |
| 19:29.31 | A1win | odd |
| 19:31.36 | A1win | Zolden, I'm not actually sure about the upgrades resetting whenever you pick up a new weapon... would most likely end up just using one weapon until you die |
| 19:45.09 | CryptRat | What does Defer Cooldown do? |
| 19:45.44 | A1win | dunno |
| 19:50.40 | Ahli | http://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/general/general-chat/59341-whiteout-my-blizzcon-2013-movie-contest-entry-machinima/ |
| 19:51.49 | Ahli | http://www.polygon.com/2013/11/10/5087768/blizzard-warcraft-and-warcraft-2-working-on-modern-pcs |
| 19:57.30 | Zolden | A1win more problems for a player - more fun |
| 19:57.43 | Zolden | if it's not too hard, you can implement it and we'll test |
| 19:57.50 | Zolden | just make the upgrades cool |
| 19:59.45 | A1win | I mean it wouldn't be a very meaningful feature to switch weapons if you're only going to do it once each life |
| 20:00.31 | Zolden | so you want a player to upgrade only the weapon he picked first? |
| 20:02.53 | A1win | I mean I don't want the upgrades to reset whenever the player picks up a new weapon |
| 20:03.08 | A1win | because if you have a level 5 pew pew gun, why would you want to pick up a level 1 blop cannon |
| 20:07.05 | Zolden | you will try to avoid it, it supposed to add some drama to the game |
| 20:07.26 | Zolden | it's good to force players to deal with the circumstances he doesn't want |
| 20:07.46 | Zolden | it's how all games, stories, movies are done |
| 20:08.20 | Zolden | sources of negative affection, hero solves the problem, all have fun |
| 20:09.14 | Zolden | problems bring emotion, prosperous state is boring |
| 20:09.23 | A1win | yeah but it's a stupid problem to solve :P |
| 20:09.41 | A1win | "sir, we accidentally installed a weapon that we found floating around in space" |
| 20:10.03 | Zolden | maybe stupid, but the fact that it's widely used may be a reason to at least consider this idea |
| 20:10.10 | Zolden | lol |
| 20:10.17 | Zolden | in terams of real life it's stupid indeed |
| 20:10.34 | Zolden | but games are abstract, stupid things may be sensible |
| 20:10.57 | A1win | should portray the ship crew with derpy faces |
| 20:11.52 | Zolden | yea, derpy faces |
| 20:11.59 | A1win | anyway it probably wouldn't even be very hard to avoid them, there's quite a lot of room in space |
| 20:12.20 | A1win | it's not an arcade space game like lost viking, it has more space |
| 20:12.56 | Stewox | what kind of a noob wants WC2 on tablets |
| 20:13.05 | Stewox | and an RTS |
| 20:13.17 | Stewox | waste of time for blizzard |
| 20:13.32 | Stewox | game wasn't designed for touchshit screen |
| 20:14.12 | Stewox | a guy there in polygon article comments is what i'm referring to |
| 20:14.31 | Zolden | oh yea, found a bug in trigger gui |
| 20:14.48 | Zolden | little easily fixable bug |
| 20:17.07 | Zolden | if this "Unit - Any Unit research progress is Completed" event happens, "Triggering unit" is grey. While "Triggering upgrade unit" is available and doesn't work. But if we pick "Triggering unit", it returns the unit that had the upgrade on it |
| 20:17.48 | Zolden | A1win aren't ships attract pickups? |
| 20:17.54 | Zolden | with a kind of gravity? |
| 20:17.58 | A1win | well yeah |
| 20:18.31 | A1win | I still don't like the idea that it resets upgrades if you pick up a new weapon |
| 20:18.41 | Zolden | this may cause some funny unwanted pickups of a wrong upgrade |
| 20:18.43 | A1win | but it wouldn't be good that the upgrades transferred to the new weapon either... |
| 20:19.10 | Zolden | ok, don't like - don't do it |
| 20:19.35 | A1win | but now I need something else to replace that idea ;p |
| 20:19.47 | A1win | I do like the idea of picking up new weapons that replace the old one |
| 20:22.26 | Zolden | btw, weapon idea: melee weapon. Maybe short range line of something. Maybe low radius high damage aura. |
| 20:23.11 | A1win | how about making all ships automatically shoot at other ships in melee range? :P |
| 20:23.14 | A1win | with lazors |
| 20:23.40 | A1win | in addition to the actual weapon and equipment slots |
| 20:24.12 | A1win | maybe make it slightly random so that it's not always the same amount of damage to both ships |
| 20:25.38 | Zolden | you can make it a pickupable passive abil |
| 20:26.05 | A1win | hmmh |
| 20:26.08 | Zolden | it's cool to pick up passive abils: players will see the bonus flying and will try to pick it up, will fight for it |
| 20:26.13 | Zolden | fight and die |
| 20:26.38 | A1win | yeah could be nice, unless there will already be too many different pick up types |
| 20:27.15 | Zolden | maybe just balance the defences to make a shit to survive an intense battle, not die in every fight |
| 20:27.39 | Zolden | 3-4 weapons + 3-4 passives + 3-4 abils |
| 20:27.45 | Zolden | is it too much? |
| 20:27.58 | A1win | something like that I suppose |
| 20:28.02 | Zolden | if passives and abils will affect attack and defence tactics, it will be ok |
| 20:28.59 | Zolden | for example, ability to temporary boost engines + melee weapon -> fastly approach, rape at low distance |
| 20:29.33 | A1win | passive that increases defenses but also increases mass |
| 20:29.37 | Zolden | if combinations will be different enough, their bigger amount will be a rather positive factor |
| 20:29.50 | Zolden | yea |
| 20:30.06 | A1win | passive that increases attack rate |
| 20:30.35 | A1win | or maybe that's a bit too simple |
| 20:30.42 | A1win | if one is the pew pew melee laser |
| 20:31.07 | A1win | the melee laser can also shoot at incoming projectiles that can be destroyed :> |
| 20:31.22 | A1win | (just not very efficiently) |
| 20:31.59 | A1win | it can be like a laser that shoots for a second and goes on a 2 sec cooldown |
| 20:32.38 | Zolden | yea, interesting idea |
| 20:33.01 | Zolden | another weapon can be strong, but also strongly punch the ship back |
| 20:33.37 | A1win | mm could be nice, a huge aoe nuke that shoots slowly |
| 20:35.15 | JademusSreg | Joop. |
| 20:35.43 | A1win | JademusSreg, that's finnish for "yep", kind of |
| 20:36.24 | JademusSreg | accidentally speaks Finnish. |
| 20:37.55 | JademusSreg | So besides Herostorm being awesomely designed and possibly supporting custom maps, anything of interest come out of DQ Blizzcon so far? |
| 20:39.01 | A1win | jaedong achieved his 5th 2nd place |
| 20:40.12 | JademusSreg | Jaedong: "#1 at #2." |
| 20:41.39 | JademusSreg | "Mess with the best, place second to the rest." |
| 20:43.08 | JademusSreg | "Brought to you by the letters GG, and the number 2." </sesamestreet> |
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| 20:49.41 | Zolden | kingTD guess, why is this message edited? http://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/general/general-chat/59341-whiteout-my-blizzcon-2013-movie-contest-entry-machinima/?post=3 |
| 20:50.13 | kingTD | missing penis |
| 20:53.14 | *** join/#sc2mapster kingTD1 (~Administr@78-60-26-40.static.zebra.lt) |
| 20:53.26 | kingTD1 | kicked or what? :d |
| 20:55.31 | Zolden | kingTD1 waht do you think about these icons and the whole command card? http://i.snag.gy/I0Z85.jpg |
| 20:55.54 | kingTD1 | i see only precentages |
| 20:56.01 | kingTD1 | whats up with the background |
| 20:56.10 | A1win | looks like they are from a web page from the 90s |
| 20:56.32 | kingTD1 | yeah that looks kinda bad |
| 20:56.44 | A1win | too big and too bright |
| 20:56.54 | kingTD1 | those numbers in purple.... |
| 20:57.08 | kingTD1 | way out of context |
| 20:57.08 | JademusSreg | clicks |
| 20:57.49 | JademusSreg | Question: wat r dem numerals? |
| 20:58.12 | Zolden | hmm, so numbers aren't a good idea? |
| 20:58.20 | JademusSreg | What is their purpose? |
| 20:58.54 | Zolden | they are for mine upgrades, some add absolute res income, some add a percentage multiplier to absolute income |
| 20:59.27 | JademusSreg | So they display the... bonuses? |
| 20:59.32 | Zolden | kinda |
| 20:59.39 | JademusSreg | Use the tooltips. |
| 20:59.47 | Zolden | yea, looks so |
| 20:59.58 | JademusSreg | I assume they are dialog-based or otherwise triggered? |
| 21:00.05 | kingTD1 | or add those number in the conner like bottom or top with smaller font |
| 21:00.35 | Zolden | yea, i could use triggers to modify tooltips |
| 21:00.46 | Zolden | instead of having those numbers on the icons |
| 21:00.47 | JademusSreg | Actually, there's an easier approach. |
| 21:00.58 | JademusSreg | UserType data in the data editor. |
| 21:01.07 | JademusSreg | Tooltips can make data references to them. |
| 21:01.33 | JademusSreg | So use the UserData API in the trigger shit to modify the values, tooltips automagically update. |
| 21:01.58 | Zolden | JademusSreg will it let me to change tooltips based on unit abils or requirements? |
| 21:02.03 | Zolden | *on unit behaviors |
| 21:02.12 | JademusSreg | Gotta be more specific. |
| 21:02.27 | JademusSreg | Like a hypothetical example. |
| 21:04.20 | Zolden | I want to have a passive abil button, which will show building's income. It can have, for example, 10 absolute income and +20 bonus, so it will generate 12 resources. My plan is to edit that button's tooltip, so player will see the income. (Or it will be text tag near the building). |
| 21:04.47 | Zolden | But now you mentioned UserType, and the question is: can it help me here, to avoid using triggers? |
| 21:06.40 | JademusSreg | Nope. It just makes the dynamic tooltips easier./ |
| 21:06.54 | A1win | JademusSreg, Zolden had this idea for my space map that you have only one weapon slot (and one equipment slot), and you pick up new weapons like you do in arcade space games (like lost viking), get upgrades for those weapons (one pew, two pews, faster pews, etc), but I haven't figured out how to let players get upgrades but not have them just reset when they pick up a new weapon |
| 21:07.10 | A1win | it wouldn't also be that cool if the upgrades just transfer between weapons |
| 21:07.24 | A1win | so atm it seems that upgrades wouldn't really fit |
| 21:07.43 | A1win | but I like the idea of gaining new weapons by picking them up more or less at random during the game |
| 21:08.06 | JademusSreg | Store the count as behaviors, which can also be used in validation for forks in the effect tree. |
| 21:08.38 | A1win | JademusSreg.RequestInput("what I just said"); |
| 21:08.50 | JademusSreg | So each "upgrade" powerup adds to the behavior count, and the weapon/ability/trigger code can validate the behavior count. |
| 21:09.35 | A1win | I'm not talking about implementation |
| 21:09.41 | JademusSreg | Oh, pardon. |
| 21:12.40 | JademusSreg | Sounds like a good progression mechanic, adds to the spectacle and intensity and so forth. Random weapon on spawn, plus weapon swap powerups + weapon upgrades. Adds variation and cumulative power, more interesting. |
| 21:13.13 | JademusSreg | I notice though that it can't decide if it should be Quake or Counter-Strike. |
| 21:14.12 | A1win | what's Counter-Strikeish about it? |
| 21:15.23 | JademusSreg | Is it fast-paced twitch-reflex action or a strategic contest of precision and tactical adaptation? It sounds like something in the middle, unable to decide between the two. =D |
| 21:15.50 | JademusSreg | OR rather, it has sounded like it's unable to decide over the history of its development. |
| 21:16.04 | JademusSreg | Currently, it's leaning more toward the spirit of Quake. |
| 21:16.07 | A1win | that's because bnet lag has affected it so much |
| 21:16.17 | JademusSreg | Yup. |
| 21:16.25 | Bommes | Ahli, your map needs more destructible barrels |
| 21:16.35 | JademusSreg | Which is why I pose the question. |
| 21:16.35 | A1win | did you see the multiplayer video I linked a while ago? |
| 21:16.40 | JademusSreg | I have not. |
| 21:16.44 | A1win | it's a lot slower now than it used to be |
| 21:16.55 | A1win | and now even slower than in that video |
| 21:16.56 | Ahli | Bommes: more? catacombs has a lot |
| 21:17.04 | A1win | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuOO37PtS_o |
| 21:17.23 | Ahli | Bommes: the huge barrels in the cathedral aren't destructible |
| 21:19.05 | JademusSreg | Regarding barrels: original Crate Review System http://www.oldmanmurray.com/features/39.html ; contemporary example http://starttocrate.tumblr.com/ |
| 21:19.16 | kingTD1 | MY OWNAGE EXPOSEED!!!!!! |
| 21:19.58 | kingTD1 | lol those crates :d |
| 21:21.18 | A1win | now there's more room for strategy, but the current weapons don't really allow it |
| 21:21.35 | Ahli | damned, the time until the first crate appears is very small |
| 21:21.38 | JademusSreg | Note: games that feature crates (or crate analogues) before gameplay begins receive a negative score. |
| 21:21.39 | A1win | or rather, more time for strategy |
| 21:21.55 | Bommes | Ahli: Oh yeah, just reached the catacombs |
| 21:22.00 | *** join/#sc2mapster ArcanePariah (~ArcanePar@99-8-167-11.lightspeed.futnca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:22.10 | Bommes | yeah I know, cathedral needs destructible barrels |
| 21:22.18 | Bommes | it's like 80% of what diablo is |
| 21:22.24 | Bommes | clicking on barrels and stuff |
| 21:23.09 | JademusSreg | Plus some bonus RPS coverage of the subject: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/03/04/the-remarkable-notability-of-old-man-murray/ |
| 21:24.49 | Bommes | also, is the butcher in there somewhere? did i miss him? |
| 21:26.10 | JademusSreg | A1, I figure you would benefit from deciding if it is principally a strategy game or an action game. Ought to help make further design decisions. But seems to me like it wants very much to be an action game. |
| 21:26.22 | A1win | yeah, it does |
| 21:26.35 | Zolden | kingTD1 http://i.snag.gy/MBbkC.jpg |
| 21:26.40 | Zolden | better, isn't it? |
| 21:26.52 | Zolden | even +10 can abe tolerated? |
| 21:26.53 | A1win | hmm... I wonder how it would look if field of view slightly changed based on velocity |
| 21:26.54 | kingTD1 | yeah |
| 21:27.07 | kingTD1 | its too big |
| 21:27.12 | kingTD1 | it covers all the image |
| 21:27.24 | Zolden | ieamge means nothing |
| 21:27.24 | kingTD1 | background then could be just one color |
| 21:27.49 | Zolden | kingTD1 btw, what resources could you name based on the icons? |
| 21:27.50 | kingTD1 | would look like shit (now looks bad too) but what you can do |
| 21:28.34 | kingTD1 | meat oil gems crystal-gem balls black-snow |
| 21:29.00 | Zolden | close enough |
| 21:29.07 | Zolden | you're my focus group |
| 21:29.15 | A1win | can I query camera data values in triggers? maybe with catalog? |
| 21:29.53 | kingTD1 | why me as stupid muppet for you? :( |
| 21:30.02 | JademusSreg | The value of button icons is that they contribute to readability, a readable interface requires less think-meat effort to process, evaluate and respond, better engagement. |
| 21:30.27 | Zolden | kingTD1 it's not you or not you, it's you or no one, so i don't have much choice |
| 21:31.14 | kingTD | a |
| 21:31.43 | JademusSreg | Hell, you could use the unit tip displayed below the name (the way destructible rocks and shit display messages) to display such information. |
| 21:31.43 | Zolden | JademusSreg do numbers on icons reduce readability of interface? |
| 21:32.03 | Zolden | hmm, good idea |
| 21:32.05 | JademusSreg | They reduce readability of that part of the interface. |
| 21:32.17 | Ahli | damned, grisworld has a barrel, so my StC is 0 or 1 |
| 21:32.23 | kingTD | make the small |
| 21:32.27 | Zolden | what if the number is th only information the button supposed to represent? |
| 21:32.28 | kingTD | like units upgrades number |
| 21:33.52 | Zolden | ok, if tooltips work good enough, i'll get rid of numbers |
| 21:33.59 | JademusSreg | Zugzug |
| 21:34.20 | ArcanePariah | Yoink |
| 21:34.25 | kingTD | but even if you add the notice of the amount it gives something it doesnt really matter for player if that info is properply vissually accessable for the player |
| 21:34.40 | kingTD | the only thing that i would look on the button for the text is the cost |
| 21:41.18 | kingTD | that crate thing is ftw :]] |
| 21:41.33 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 21:41.33 | kingTD | i need to make that happen for my maps :d |
| 21:42.47 | Zolden | has it always been there that we can change resource icons in game ui data entry? or they added it in one of the patches? |
| 21:43.58 | JademusSreg | Added a while ago. |
| 21:46.20 | A1win | in the patch where they changed the menu to the smaller button |
| 21:46.38 | A1win | instead of being a huge bar at top left |
| 21:46.50 | JademusSreg | If Arcade is moving toward becoming a legit platform & service, it may revitalize the Blizz content communities, and I'd take a more active role, such as pushing for open source documentation and localizations. Until then, I'll observe. |
| 21:47.32 | A1win | yay this fov thing feels gooood man |
| 21:47.41 | A1win | just had to make the transition slow enough |
| 21:48.12 | Ahli | hmm I could start to check out hots assets now... that limitation will be removed... |
| 21:49.09 | JademusSreg | Oh, got some delicious beta? |
| 21:49.31 | A1win | I think he means heart of the swarm |
| 21:49.42 | A1win | free arcade -> can use hots assets in maps |
| 21:49.47 | A1win | without limiting player base |
| 21:50.38 | ArcanePariah | ^ |
| 21:50.41 | Ahli | ^ |
| 21:51.39 | JademusSreg | The art direction they've gone with HotS and Herostorm (and Diablo 3 to a lesser extent) has been highly readable. =D |
| 21:51.40 | JademusSreg | brb |
| 21:51.59 | ArcanePariah | I think it is interesting that SC2 is now basically a F2P game, with the hook being the actual stuff that costs stuff to make (Campaigns and 1v1 Balancing) |
| 21:52.09 | ArcanePariah | Which you have to pay for |
| 21:55.47 | kingTD | so when we all be able to use hots assets and shit? |
| 21:55.53 | ArcanePariah | Patch 2.1 |
| 21:56.02 | ArcanePariah | PTR drops next week, patch released before end of year |
| 21:56.10 | ArcanePariah | So less then 6 weeks |
| 21:56.33 | ArcanePariah | Wild guess says PTR for 2 weeks, patch comes december |
| 21:56.54 | kingTD | hmmm then the rising money for HotS expansion is bad excuse :d |
| 21:57.00 | Ahli | I would assume 4 weeks, problems over christmas resolved next year :D |
| 21:57.48 | Ahli | 2 weeks might be really short :S |
| 21:58.16 | Ahli | I guess it depends how many problems the testers recognize |
| 21:58.41 | Ahli | if I create another thread with 80 bugs, it might take a while ^^ |
| 21:59.53 | ArcanePariah | I just want to see the PTR, because my gut feeling is there were a decent number of changes to the editor, just like last time |
| 22:00.19 | ArcanePariah | They just didn't mention them at Blizzcon because such things are not sexy marketing material |
| 22:01.30 | kingTD | yeah those soulless gamers |
| 22:01.34 | kingTD | gg wp gn |
| 22:01.59 | Ahli | we are the minority :S and they wouldn't be able to answer questions about these changes |
| 22:27.27 | *** join/#sc2mapster Stewox (~chatzilla@cpe-86-58-34-166.static.triera.net) |
| 22:30.48 | A1win | whee added impact actors for projectiles hitting planets and satellites too, not just ships, much more fun to shoot around again 8x |
| 22:33.22 | Zolden | does anyone have a successful experience of using a validator that checks player requirement? |
| 22:33.36 | A1win | player requirement? |
| 22:34.18 | Zolden | yea |
| 22:34.22 | Zolden | it's validator type |
| 22:34.35 | A1win | ah, no idea |
| 22:38.03 | Bommes | hmm, I'm suddenly getting crit errors and I don't know where they are coming from. |
| 22:38.17 | Bommes | not cool |
| 22:38.21 | Zolden | I actually want to validate upgrade level, but requirement seems to be the only way to do it, and it doesn't work by unknown reason |
| 22:39.26 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: I sort of have, let me get back to you on that |
| 22:41.09 | A1win | hmm, some weird stuttering when a ship is on a planet and orbits it |
| 22:41.23 | A1win | camera stutter that is |
| 22:41.43 | Fate_ | when does the new patch go online? |
| 22:41.55 | A1win | this year |
| 22:42.22 | A1win | after it's been on PTR for some time |
| 22:42.35 | A1win | not sure if it's already there |
| 22:42.38 | Fate_ | when does the ptr start? |
| 22:42.40 | Fate_ | ah |
| 22:44.08 | Islaminati | A1win, vieläkö olet vihainen mulla? |
| 22:44.48 | A1win | could you just stick to english here ;p |
| 22:46.22 | Zolden | ArcanePariah does it work for you? |
| 22:46.58 | A1win | and I don't get angry, I just don't care o: (to talk nonsense in Finnish on this channel) |
| 22:50.58 | Islaminati | A1win, so you don't want to murder me and shove your cock up my eye socket as it lays dying to decegrade my body? :D |
| 22:51.01 | Islaminati | We're still friends? |
| 22:51.36 | A1win | if that's your definition of friendship |
| 22:53.16 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: Yes for behavior check |
| 22:54.03 | Zolden | ArcanePariah could you please give me its xml code? or you'd rather check mine? |
| 22:56.14 | Zolden | http://pastebin.com/1A1CW5Hu |
| 22:56.29 | Zolden | validator and its upgarde |
| 22:56.41 | *** join/#sc2mapster Zandose (Zandose@24-246-78-228.cable.teksavvy.com) |
| 22:56.59 | Zandose | hi |
| 22:59.13 | ArcanePariah | Zolden, for the Validator, set the Find Field to Enabled |
| 22:59.36 | ArcanePariah | Find = Validator passes if requirement met, Find not enabled = validator passes if requirement NOT met |
| 22:59.55 | Islaminati | A1win, it is deeper than friendship |
| 22:59.57 | Zolden | ArcanePariah it doesn't help: with disabled it always returns true, with disabled it always returns false |
| 23:00.10 | Islaminati | Some of my closest friends I still long to murder and violate their corpses sexually. |
| 23:00.13 | Zolden | doesn't matter, what research level I have |
| 23:00.32 | ArcanePariah | Ok, well, set it to Enabled for now |
| 23:00.45 | Islaminati | True bromantic friendship is when you only long to murder someone but fuck their dead body tenderly afterwards |
| 23:00.48 | ArcanePariah | Because we want the validator to pass when the requirement is reatched |
| 23:00.54 | ArcanePariah | met* |
| 23:00.55 | Islaminati | Which is what we share. |
| 23:02.17 | A1win | sleep time |
| 23:02.25 | Zolden | ArcanePariah ok, and what next? now it always returns false |
| 23:02.53 | Zolden | funny thing is that I used it earlier and it worked |
| 23:03.00 | Zolden | and i don't see the difference |
| 23:03.57 | ArcanePariah | Ok, for your requirement, is it a GreaterThanOrEqual node, with Count Upgrade and a Constant as sub nodes? |
| 23:04.39 | ArcanePariah | Paste the expression |
| 23:05.08 | Zolden | CountUpgrade(crystals,CompleteOnly) >= 4 |
| 23:05.30 | Islaminati | A1win, älä poistu multa |
| 23:06.20 | Islaminati | Meidän on rakkaus joka on suurimpi kuin ahlin saksalainen ja musta kyrpä |
| 23:06.29 | ArcanePariah | Ahh, I see the issue, Count Upgrade Completed, counts how many units have done the actual upgrade, which for you is probably only 1 |
| 23:06.46 | ArcanePariah | If you are trying to compare against how many times the upgrade has been run, you need to use CompletedAtUnit |
| 23:07.35 | Zolden | I want to check upgrade level |
| 23:07.44 | ArcanePariah | Then use CompletedAtUnit |
| 23:08.06 | ArcanePariah | That should do the trick |
| 23:09.28 | Zolden | but units don't research this upgrade |
| 23:09.35 | Zolden | I set its level with triggers |
| 23:10.50 | Zolden | and maybe I found where is the problem |
| 23:11.04 | ArcanePariah | Doesn't matter, it checks the upgrades that have been applied to the unit |
| 23:11.04 | Zolden | maybe I used a wrong action to set the upgrade level |
| 23:11.41 | ArcanePariah | How it is set doesn't matter, it just checks: What is the level of the given upgrade that has been applied to this unit |
| 23:12.47 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 23:14.34 | Zolden | (no, setting upgrade level and adding upgrade levels does no difference) |
| 23:14.49 | Zolden | and "comleted at unit" didn't help |
| 23:15.04 | ArcanePariah | Hmm |
| 23:15.12 | Zolden | and why "at unit" should differ from "completed"? |
| 23:15.30 | ArcanePariah | TBH, I have no idea why it was done that way |
| 23:15.31 | Zolden | Completed is how many upgrades a plyer has |
| 23:15.54 | ArcanePariah | I really need to do some testing to sort them all out |
| 23:16.25 | ArcanePariah | The only thing I can think of to make sure, and how it worked for me is, copy everything in the Use part of the requirement to the Show part |
| 23:17.33 | Zolden | :) |
| 23:17.48 | Zolden | it's like I had it in my other map where it worked |
| 23:17.51 | ArcanePariah | Did that work? |
| 23:17.54 | Zolden | lemme try |
| 23:18.41 | *** join/#sc2mapster MoonEater916 (~Thunderbi@108-88-97-1.lightspeed.mtryca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:19.01 | MoonEater916 | im having issues with a sprite |
| 23:19.09 | MoonEater916 | Kueken! |
| 23:19.22 | MoonEater916 | wake up |
| 23:22.08 | Zolden | ArcanePariah no, didn't help |
| 23:22.35 | Zolden | MoonEater916 try coke |
| 23:25.33 | Islaminati | Kueken, it is time to exact vengeance on Ahli |
| 23:26.51 | Zandose | hello all |
| 23:29.11 | Zandose | anyone know how I can make it so when I tell a unit to move it wont change its animation speed to match its movement speed, and how to stop the units model from rotating to whatever direction its going? |
| 23:31.23 | Zolden | ArcanePariah i found waht's wrong: despite the fact, that I set upgrade level, it's "complete" level is still 0 |
| 23:31.37 | Zolden | so, the validator probably worksworks |
| 23:31.39 | Zandose | did i piss someone off? |
| 23:31.45 | ArcanePariah | Ahh, so setting it via triggers doesn't update it |
| 23:32.08 | JademusSreg | Zan, it's doable. |
| 23:32.09 | Tolkfan | Zandose, to stop the instant rotating, uncheck the "turn before moving" flag for the unit. |
| 23:32.09 | Zolden | probably... but I think it should |
| 23:32.20 | ArcanePariah | Zandose: In the actor events of a unit, there is a message for Movement update |
| 23:33.29 | JademusSreg | Regarding not rotating in the direction of movement, I can think of several ways. Which direction should it face? A static one like the Mothership? |
| 23:33.53 | Zandose | hmm. one min please |
| 23:36.35 | Zolden | ArcanePariah and the funnies thing: I had upgrade's max levl = 255. And it didn't work, as I described. But after I changed upgrade's max level to a smaller value, it started to work |
| 23:37.57 | Ahli | use triggers for upgrades.... => thousands of upgrade levels |
| 23:38.26 | Ahli | 107 is max level that works I believe |
| 23:39.25 | Zolden | 127 is max level that works seems like |
| 23:40.42 | Zolden | Ahli the thing is: I have 7 resources. So, 3 of them should be imitated. My idea was to use upgrades as resource amount holder, to validate for build abils, like it's a cost |
| 23:41.31 | Zolden | so, probably I can't have costs more than 127 |
| 23:41.49 | JademusSreg | would sooner use Attributes or player properties. |
| 23:42.12 | JademusSreg | Hmmmm. |
| 23:42.36 | Zolden | and how to use them as a cost that will not allow an abil to be used with data? |
| 23:43.03 | JademusSreg | Attributes are a behavior type, can be validated. |
| 23:43.15 | JademusSreg | Player stuff can be validated as well. |
| 23:43.32 | Zandose | im back. @Tolkfan the "turn before moving" was already unselected. |
| 23:44.00 | Zolden | JademusSreg could you explain more? Attributes of what? Where to find these? |
| 23:44.16 | Zandose | @ArcanePariah i tried searching for it but couldnt find it. I also looked under the units actor but couldnt find it either |
| 23:44.16 | Zolden | where are those player properties? |
| 23:44.51 | Zandose | @JademusSreg I perfer a simple method. I love using simple actor messages if possible. |
| 23:46.13 | Tolkfan | Zandose: you want the unit to never rotate when moving, so for examplea siege tank would move sideways, right? |
| 23:46.30 | Tolkfan | I did that by accident yesterday, I try to remember how :p |
| 23:47.20 | JademusSreg | points in the general direction of colossus, immortal, mothership. |
| 23:47.44 | Zandose | @Tolkfan: I want the unit to still be able to rotate using a trigger to change its facing but I don't want the movement command/order to cause the unit to rotate |
| 23:48.46 | *** join/#sc2mapster Dogmai (~Dogmai@106-68-95-174.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:49.21 | JademusSreg | Zol, Attribue is a behavior type, same sense Buff is a behavior type. |
| 23:49.25 | JademusSreg | *Attribute |
| 23:49.34 | Zandose | unit should a) not rotate from a move order b) a trigger can be used to rotate the unit |
| 23:49.36 | JademusSreg | But would only use it if resources are stored locally. |
| 23:50.34 | JademusSreg | Anyway, even better would be to use player score in some way. |
| 23:51.00 | MoonEater916 | jade i have a complex question |
| 23:51.09 | MoonEater916 | got a second? |
| 23:52.25 | Zolden | JademusSreg and what about player properties? |
| 23:52.37 | JademusSreg | (Attribute and Buff stack maxes at 65536, so it's suboptimal.) |
| 23:52.49 | JademusSreg | Moon, wat? |
| 23:53.00 | MoonEater916 | well i have my 2D link sprite |
| 23:53.08 | JademusSreg | Zol, I'll open the editor and check if it's viable. |
| 23:53.12 | MoonEater916 | and im going to add the attack frames |
| 23:53.30 | MoonEater916 | the issue is that the moddel and attack frames will cause warping |
| 23:53.40 | JademusSreg | Warping is not a thing. |
| 23:53.44 | MoonEater916 | well |
| 23:53.45 | Tolkfan | Zandose, uncheck the "turnable" flag, i tested it on marines |
| 23:53.59 | Tolkfan | triggers rotate them, movement doesnt |
| 23:54.13 | MoonEater916 | the initial size is 1x2 this will make it 3x3 on a 1x2 tile |
| 23:54.25 | MoonEater916 | i would have to scale akwardly on the fly |
| 23:54.37 | MoonEater916 | i was wondering if its possible to detach the sword |
| 23:56.19 | JademusSreg | Detaching the sword just makes you manage layer priority (height offsets) instead of scale, either way it's work. |
| 23:56.39 | MoonEater916 | how would i do it? |
| 23:57.16 | MoonEater916 | some ability missle thingy? |
| 23:57.44 | JademusSreg | Insufficient information. Do what with what? |
| 23:57.57 | MoonEater916 | the sword |
| 23:58.01 | MoonEater916 | how would i do it? |
| 23:58.26 | MoonEater916 | make the sword detatched from the actor and spin and damage properly |
| 23:59.22 | JademusSreg | Ah, you'd attach it to the model at a site with site mover. |
| 23:59.33 | Zandose | @Tolkfan: it works, thank you. you said something different before instead of turnable |
